March 12, 2009 
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March 12, 2009 [00:00:30] <dsch04> OK, so where do I look to find out why it's taking so long for my box to boot?[00:00:45] *** Auralis has quit IRC[00:03:15] <eviljames> Do you boot often?[00:03:28] *** backspace has joined #opensolaris[00:03:36] <dsch04> No[00:03:57] *** Tusk21 has quit IRC[00:04:28] *** ericjray has quit IRC[00:04:30] <dsch04> Looking in /var/adm/messages, I see these two lines:[00:04:32] <dsch04> Mar 11 22:35:53 hero genunix: [ID 936769 kern.info] lx_systrace0 is /pseudo/lx_systrace@0[00:04:32] <dsch04> Mar 11 22:54:52 hero genunix: [ID 454863 kern.info] dump on /dev/zvol/dsk/rpool/dump size 2047 MB[00:05:08] <jmcp> those are normal boot messages[00:05:23] <dsch04> Yes, but they're 20 mins apart[00:05:44] <seanmcg> dsch04, boot with -v can help. dtrace anonymous probes showing timestamps when functions entry/return can help too. the -A flag to dtrace.[00:05:53] <jmcp> dsch04: so boot with -v and see what the module is which identifies itself last before the dumpadm output[00:06:07] <dsch04> OK[00:06:18] * dsch04 off to bed shortly, so a job for another day I think[00:06:56] <dsch04> I notice the snapshot service has transitioned to maintenance mode[00:07:10] <jmcp> have a look at the logfile[00:07:11] <dsch04> I wonder if it's a zfs issue causing the lengthy boot process?[00:07:16] <jmcp> it's possible[00:07:22] <jmcp> but again, use the -v arg on your kernel$ line[00:09:54] <Teltariat> How can I ask pkginfo to give me the file listing of the contents of an SVR4 package?[00:09:55] *** servo- has quit IRC[00:10:31] <Teltariat> or something[00:10:37] <dsch04> man pkgchk[00:10:47] <dsch04> (I think)[00:10:51] <Teltariat> thank you dsch04[00:13:59] *** ry_laptop has quit IRC[00:16:46] *** servo- has joined #opensolaris[00:17:01] *** capaz has left #opensolaris[00:17:21] *** ken1 has quit IRC[00:18:28] <Deiu> Any chance we'll see tcpdump in opensolaris soon? :)[00:19:23] *** BillyBop has quit IRC[00:19:38] <comay> Deiu wireshark is coming[00:20:32] <Deiu> Sweet! But I can always find good use for tcpdump, even with wireshark installed. :)[00:20:58] <Tusk2> mmmh am i suppose to load a x64 kernel to see all my 4Gig ram ?[00:21:02] <nachox> i think there was a tcpdump case in arc-discuss not long ago[00:21:49] <nachox> Tusk2, i'd be surprised if you cant see them with a 32 bit kernel, but why would you load a 32 bit kernel in a 64 bit capable pc?[00:21:51] *** sparc-kly has joined #opensolaris[00:21:51] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o sparc-kly[00:22:16] * dsch04 has wireshark running[00:22:24] *** backspace has quit IRC[00:22:27] * dsch04 doesn't recall where I got it from[00:22:37] *** mirezwer has joined #opensolaris[00:22:51] *** backspace has joined #opensolaris[00:24:43] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[00:24:59] *** axisys has joined #opensolaris[00:25:29] <Tusk2> nachox: actually the i386 kernel is loaded by default, and i don't find any trace of a 64b kernel installed[00:26:34] *** kate21de1 has joined #opensolaris[00:26:35] *** backspace has quit IRC[00:27:10] *** cambazz has joined #opensolaris[00:27:30] <cambazz> hello. parts of the netbeans console gets garbaged. some sort of weird video problem[00:27:43] *** webmink has quit IRC[00:27:44] <jmcp> perhaps talk to netbeans people then[00:27:47] <cambazz> i tried turning off the effects, and problem still did not go away[00:27:55] <cambazz> jmcp: well it does it for other programs[00:28:01] <jmcp> "it" ?[00:28:08] <jmcp> I guess you're running compiz[00:28:15] <cambazz> yes and no[00:28:24] <cambazz> i turned off compiz, i still get the same[00:28:27] *** alain10 has joined #opensolaris[00:28:31] <cambazz> i am using the nvidia driver however[00:28:39] <jmcp> are you up to date with it?[00:29:06] <cambazz> hmmm. i am not sure how to check that. i am up to date with opensolaris update if thats what you mean[00:29:24] <cambazz> also, the computer does not shutdown reboot, properly, but only sometimes. i mean acpi shutdown[00:29:46] <jmcp> so you have a number of problems[00:31:23] <nachox> Tusk2, i dont think you can avoid installing the 64 bit part of solaris in x86, what does isainfo -k return?[00:31:49] *** syd`_ has quit IRC[00:31:58] <jmcp> Tusk2: if your cpu supports 64bit, then by default you will be booted into the 64bit kernel[00:33:46] <jmcp> cambazz: sorry, I can't help you much[00:34:01] <jmcp> cambazz: you could try running pkg info NVDAgraphics to find out what the version is[00:34:01] *** devians has joined #opensolaris[00:35:11] *** Deiu has quit IRC[00:36:14] <cambazz> jmcp: yes, but how do I find which version is latest[00:36:22] <techqbert> Anybody know why my pkg image-update seemingly didn't update. http://pastebin.com/d1008a061[00:36:33] <jmcp> cambazz: you should "pkg refresh"[00:36:44] <cambazz> jmcp: and this updatemanager[00:36:45] <jmcp> which build of OSOL are you running?[00:36:47] <cambazz> does it work[00:36:56] <cambazz> i am running 8 11[00:37:01] <cambazz> the latest i believe[00:37:14] <jmcp> 2008.11[00:37:19] *** sparc-kly has quit IRC[00:37:26] <cambazz> yes, thats it[00:37:32] <jmcp> and you can confirm whether you're running "the latest" by starting with uname -r[00:37:34] <jmcp> uname -a, rather[00:37:39] <cambazz> the package update program, finds no update[00:37:45] <eviljames> cambazz: Are you on dev?[00:38:06] <cambazz> SunOS wizard 5.11 snv_101b i86pc i386 i86pc Solaris[00:38:12] <jmcp> that's not The Latest[00:38:14] <cambazz> eviljames: dev?[00:38:15] <eviljames> cambazz: what does "pkg authority" state?[00:38:33] <cambazz> opensolaris.org (preferred) http://pkg.opensolaris.org/release/[00:38:38] <eviljames> ah, so you're on release then.[00:38:57] <eviljames> cambazz: pfexec pkg set-authority -P -O http://pkg.opensolaris.org/dev/ opensolaris.org[00:39:01] <eviljames> err.[00:39:01] <cambazz> is 2008.11 not the latest[00:39:09] <jmcp> I just told you it isn't[00:39:12] <eviljames> cambazz: pfexec pkg set-authority -P -O http://pkg.opensolaris.org/dev/ dev[00:39:18] <jmcp> it's the latest *liveCD* version, but not the latest build[00:39:25] <eviljames> jmcp: It is the latest release, not the latest available build.[00:39:40] <cambazz> i am just a java developer using and enjoying opensolaris. i have not used opensolaris since university days[00:39:44] <cambazz> i love it[00:39:44] <jmcp> eviljames: that's what I just said[00:39:56] <eviljames> jmcp: Not quite what you just said :D (/me pedant)[00:39:59] *** kleppari has quit IRC[00:40:19] <jmcp> meh[00:40:35] <jmcp> I've got more important things to pedant about today[00:40:38] <techqbert> Has pkg image-update changed much? It doesn't look like my machine updated. http://pastebin.com/d1008a061[00:40:47] <eviljames> cambazz: The command I just pasted to you will move you to a different "repo" to use maybe a more familiar term.[00:41:10] <eviljames> techqbert: read what I've been posting to cambazz and see if it applies? ("pkg authority"[00:41:17] <cambazz> ok i get it. just not gonna do it before i finish the current work, deadline is tomorrow[00:41:20] <jmcp> cambazz: it's similar to "stable" vs "testing"[00:41:29] <cambazz> jmcp: i understand[00:41:33] * eviljames won't get pedantic about that :D[00:41:44] <jmcp> oh, goodie :)[00:41:51] *** sparc-kly has joined #opensolaris[00:41:51] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o sparc-kly[00:41:51] <eviljames> jmcp: What other things are pedant-worthy? CLEARLY I am bored[00:41:51] <cambazz> there are some ubuntu guys at work[00:42:09] <Teltariat> I use Ubuntu on my work machine, OSOL on my laptop[00:42:10] <jmcp> eviljames: code reviews[00:42:15] <cambazz> and i bet them opensolaris is faster for a pizza. i won of course[00:42:16] <jmcp> eviljames: I'm reviewing the code for a new hba driver[00:42:27] <jmcp> cambazz: nice :-)[00:42:41] <eviljames> jmcp: That is certainly more worthy of the pedantry than miscellaneous irc support[00:42:42] <cambazz> Teltariat: amazingly, the gnome in osol works much better then ubuntu. ubuntu is like a snail[00:42:43] <Teltariat> The new b108 release is pretty good[00:42:53] <cambazz> ah, i was going to ask this[00:42:57] <Teltariat> cambazz: I like both, to tell you the truth[00:43:00] <eviljames> techqbert: Was it applicable? yea no?[00:43:02] <techqbert> eviljames: I wish issues were that convergent. I've given up on sound and graphics with my intel d201glya2, i'm only interested in this machine as a file server and NX server. http://pastebin.com/d1008a061[00:43:08] <jmcp> my latest whinge is that I'm pulling 110 across the Pacific to home, and it's taking *forever*[00:43:11] *** kate21de has quit IRC[00:43:17] <cambazz> i think the kernel scheduler latency is set to server.[00:43:17] *** _Lewellyn has joined #opensolaris[00:43:26] <jmcp> last build I pulled in went at around 450kb/sec, this one's going at 140kb/sec[00:43:27] <Teltariat> Build 108 fixed a nasty PCI interrupt bug that was killing me badly and breaking my network autosetup[00:43:32] <cambazz> is there any way to make it more realtime. like in a desktop machine[00:43:36] <eviljames> techqbert: what does pkg authority report? You're on /release or /dev ?[00:43:45] <jmcp> cambazz: that's an annoying thing, that the system isn't intelligent enough to figure out which is better for itself[00:43:54] <cambazz> or is this just a crazy idea? in linux you can change the dispather priority with kernel[00:43:55] <jmcp> cambazz: oh, on your opensolaris box?[00:44:06] <cambazz> yes on my opensolaris box[00:44:14] <jmcp> cambazz: why do you think it's the scheduler?[00:44:17] <techqbert> eviljames: i just removed the japanese one that went down, I have neither release or dev on pkg.opensolaris.org:80/[00:44:32] <cambazz> jmcp: you gonna make fun of me, but I just feel it[00:44:37] * _Lewellyn missed the start of this, but bets the problem isn't the scheduler[00:44:37] <jmcp> cambazz: no, I'm not[00:44:51] <cambazz> jmcp: its like knowing which gear you are on by the sound of the engine...[00:44:53] <cambazz> heh heh heh[00:44:55] <jmcp> I've done a bit of performance analysis in the past, and I'm *very* confident in the scheduler[00:45:02] <jmcp> cambazz: but this is a more complex system[00:45:11] <cambazz> no i dont mean the scheduler is bad[00:45:18] *** ravv has quit IRC[00:45:32] <jmcp> you're assuming that it's the scheduler which is the issue, rather than looking for actual data[00:45:34] *** ravv has joined #opensolaris[00:45:43] <cambazz> just the scheduler is tuned in a server way, where the priorities are more equal, it makes multitasks run more slowly[00:45:55] <cambazz> but takes some time when you fire up firefox no?[00:45:55] <_Lewellyn> in my experience, the scheduler is very smart. i've used solaris for many many different types of things and the scheduler has never done me wrong[00:46:05] <_Lewellyn> firefox sucks[00:46:06] <eviljames> techqbert: above, I pasted to cambazz "pfexec pkg set-authority -P -O http://pkg.opensolaris.org/dev/ dev"[00:46:08] <_Lewellyn> period.[00:46:16] <Teltariat> _Lewellyn: I second you.[00:46:25] <cambazz> _Lewellyn: what do you use for browser?[00:46:26] <jmcp> cambazz: firefox spends *a lot* of its startup time doing SQLite3 stuff[00:46:28] <_Lewellyn> also, yay for osol users getting 109[00:46:30] <Teltariat> But as much as Firefox sucks, its utility outweighs the pain.[00:46:31] <cambazz> dont tell me lynx[00:46:31] *** LordIllpalazo has quit IRC[00:46:34] <jmcp> and that's not a scheduler problem[00:46:35] <_Lewellyn> cambazz: i usually like to use lynx..[00:46:37] <_Lewellyn> oh[00:46:41] <eviljames> techqbert: That should make pkg check the /dev authority (aka repo aka publisher aka whatever) and possibly there are updates waiting for you there[00:46:42] <_Lewellyn> the, failing that, seamonkey[00:46:46] <_Lewellyn> failing that, opera[00:46:53] <eviljames> techqbert: The build that is held in the dev authority is the one marked by IPS: in the topic.[00:46:57] <cambazz> why not firefox man.[00:47:12] <_Lewellyn> cambazz: firefox is bloaty and does lots of useless stuff[00:47:25] <_Lewellyn> seamonkey is firefox, without so much bloat[00:47:54] <cambazz> i wanted to get seamonkey, then i was too lazy because it was not in the package tool[00:48:01] <_Lewellyn> it's in SFE[00:48:13] <cambazz> SFE?[00:48:18] <_Lewellyn> building mozilla by hand blows[00:48:23] <_Lewellyn> spec files extra[00:48:27] <_Lewellyn> google sfe-bootstrap[00:48:55] <nachox> how can seamonkey be firefox without the bloat? it has a mail client and an html editor and ... an irc client[00:48:59] *** tosh has quit IRC[00:49:08] <_Lewellyn> nachox: but it doesn't have the "extensibility"[00:49:23] <nachox> it's based on the same crappy code[00:49:38] <_Lewellyn> also, one program for html + mail takes less ram than two programs with lots of overlapping code[00:50:00] <_Lewellyn> seamonkey is pretty much just the least of the evils for mozilla browsers, that's all[00:50:11] <nachox> who uses thunderbird these days with gmail? :P[00:50:20] * _Lewellyn can't stand gmail[00:50:29] <_Lewellyn> it's now my spamtrap address[00:50:30] <cambazz> me[00:50:35] <_Lewellyn> since all the spam goes into the inbox[00:50:50] <cambazz> gmail spam filter works. imho.[00:51:09] <_Lewellyn> heh. the last time i logged in, the 15 newest messages were 419 and lottery scams[00:51:13] <eviljames> That's what I use hotmail for.[00:51:29] <cambazz> _Lewelyn: do you use the report spam button[00:51:30] <_Lewellyn> eviljames: ironically, do a MX lookup on greenviolet.net :)[00:51:53] <techqbert> eviljames: IPS 109? Might I ask why updates are stuck in /dev?[00:51:54] <_Lewellyn> cambazz: i do for my domain's mail. but i rarely get any in my inbox with my microsoft-hosted email.[00:52:18] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: it's not a "stable" release? :)[00:52:21] <eviljames> techqbert: /release is for the most stable stuff, /dev is like a "testing" repo where less-stable and newer stuff goes.[00:52:33] <cambazz> _Lewellyn: i think it is just the opposite[00:52:36] *** syd`_ has joined #opensolaris[00:52:39] *** dguitar has quit IRC[00:52:49] * cambazz loves gooooooogle[00:52:54] <_Lewellyn> cambazz: you think that i really don't get less than 5 messages of spam in my domains' inboxes per day?[00:53:03] <cambazz> i get 0[00:53:08] <_Lewellyn> this isn't just like 2 or 3 addresses[00:53:15] <cambazz> i get spam like once or twice each month.[00:53:31] <cambazz> i mean i get spam, but spam filter takes them away[00:53:31] <_Lewellyn> i get around 3K messages/day in just my inboxes[00:53:45] <cambazz> and gmail has a colloborative filtering structure[00:53:45] <_Lewellyn> of those, i get literally 1 or 2 spam[00:53:52] <_Lewellyn> so does microsoft ;)[00:54:07] <_Lewellyn> and microsoft's tos aren't as permissive towards the company as google's ;)[00:54:09] <techqbert> ah that was my suspicion. okay. i have 101b here so I guess I'll hold out. What's weird is for once I ran gnome today (svcadm enable gdm) and the GUI came up saying I have all these updates. So that's why I tried pkg image-update and got seemingly nothing but a new BE. http://pastebin.com/d1008a061[00:54:17] <cambazz> how can you be an opensolaris guy and love microsoft at the same time[00:54:27] <_Lewellyn> i don't "love" anyone[00:54:33] <_Lewellyn> i just use the best tool for the job at hand[00:54:37] <eviljames> techqbert: Yeah, I saw that pastebin. use the set-authority command I pasted above, then run pfexec pkg image-update[00:55:07] <cambazz> microsoft blows man[00:55:19] <_Lewellyn> every company blows[00:55:27] <_Lewellyn> (and that doesn't exclude my own)[00:55:33] <techqbert> eviljames: would the GUI have done that all automagical or would it have come up short too? What happens if I hold out?[00:55:45] *** sparc-kly has quit IRC[00:55:47] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: don't use the gnome gui thing, based off reports i've seen[00:56:08] <techqbert> _Lewellyn: Yeah I immediately went to CLI.[00:56:19] <techqbert> good call.[00:56:26] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: upgrade to 109 ;)[00:56:55] <_Lewellyn> though, of course, being a dev release, there's some small issues in it.[00:57:04] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: which video chipset do you use?[00:57:12] <eviljames> techqbert: I don't really know, I don't use the GUI at all, my system runs headless.[00:57:49] *** clyons has joined #opensolaris[00:57:54] *** devians has quit IRC[00:58:08] *** devians has joined #opensolaris[00:58:22] <techqbert> I want to be i'm hesitant to change my pkg authority. I'm a BSD admin who went looking for a stable ZFS implementation over the summer. the intel d201gly2 has the sis662 I believe[00:58:43] <techqbert> I want to but I'm*[00:58:47] <CIA-40> Michael Speer <Michael.Speer at Sun dot COM>: 6813956 nxge for n2niu should validate its configuration parameters[00:59:25] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: think of /dev as -CURRENT :)[00:59:34] *** syd` has quit IRC[00:59:45] <jmcp> techqbert: stable ZFS implementation?[00:59:50] <eviljames> techqbert: The ZFS implementation on Solaris is 8 versions ahead of the one on BSD[01:00:17] <techqbert> eviljames: haha I believe it.[01:00:26] <eviljames> Might be 9 by now.[01:00:37] <techqbert> jmcp: FreeBSD 7 had experimenal ZFS support and piqued my interest.[01:01:22] <techqbert> _Lewellyn: You're going to get me toying tonight I know. Makes me wish I had a non-production machine lying around.[01:01:34] <jmcp> techqbert: VirtualBox[01:01:41] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: i think the most noticeable issues outstanding for most people are related to i915-based stuff[01:01:58] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: revert to your "stable" boot environment, if it goes south ;)[01:02:06] * _Lewellyn deleted his 106 BE a bit ago[01:02:07] <cambazz> question: what should i set the power management in my bios so that my box properly shutsdown[01:02:15] <cambazz> there is apm, acpi, and acpi2 support[01:02:26] <_Lewellyn> acpi2 should do it[01:02:32] <jmcp> I would have chosen acpi[01:02:34] * jmcp shrugs[01:02:37] <jmcp> I haven't heard of acpi2[01:02:46] *** cemerick has joined #opensolaris[01:02:49] <_Lewellyn> acpi2 is what most "modern" systems use, i think[01:02:59] <techqbert> jmcp: I actually have vbox installed. I want another hd so vbox will cache on it not my root drive. Maybe I'll toy around with weekend when I'm done with my econ tests.[01:03:16] <_Lewellyn> oh, btw. found a fun thing earlier.. don't let your zfs datasets return ENOSPC :([01:03:44] *** devians has quit IRC[01:03:44] <_Lewellyn> ironically, deleting a file takes more space ;)[01:03:52] *** devians has joined #opensolaris[01:04:17] <techqbert> _Lewellyn: You know where I can find the best of beadm reading? I read all about liveupdate once but I'd appreciate something indiana-specific and concise.[01:04:36] <_Lewellyn> all i know is liveupdate. i don't know how things like that work in osol.[01:04:38] * _Lewellyn uses sxce[01:04:41] <jmcp> opensolaris.com, look for the documentation link[01:05:14] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[01:05:26] *** Cass has joined #opensolaris[01:05:31] <_Lewellyn> random question: anyone here going to the vmware seminar in san francisco tomorrow? :)[01:05:35] <jmcp> techqbert: http://www.opensolaris.com/use/[01:05:47] <techqbert> jmcp: i'll give opensolaris.com a look for beadm then. lastly, any folk around here get NX server working?[01:05:51] <techqbert> thanks jmcp.[01:05:56] <jmcp> yw[01:06:26] <_Lewellyn> techqbert: a couple of people have asked about it. but i can't admit to knowing more than (vaguely) what it is[01:06:55] *** not-me-guv has joined #opensolaris[01:09:41] *** Disorganized_ has joined #OpenSolaris[01:09:58] *** stewart_ is now known as stewart[01:12:27] *** cwebber has quit IRC[01:13:32] *** JT__ has joined #opensolaris[01:13:44] *** niq has quit IRC[01:13:49] *** coffeetime has quit IRC[01:15:55] *** backspace has joined #opensolaris[01:16:05] *** Cass has quit IRC[01:17:45] *** Disorganized has quit IRC[01:19:26] *** kim0 has quit IRC[01:19:27] <Teltariat> Please help[01:19:32] <Teltariat> I ask for wisdom and enlightenment[01:19:34] <stevel> anyone know how to correct SUNWcsr showing up as "partially installed" after a LU?[01:19:44] <Teltariat> I am running a tool here written in shell, awk and other things[01:19:56] <jmcp> Teltariat: re-write it in python[01:19:58] <Teltariat> that makes assumptions that all the different utilities it requires are GNU tools[01:20:37] *** ggeecko has joined #opensolaris[01:20:55] <Teltariat> jcmp: Thats not a choice. What /is/ a choice is to probably go hunting for and learning an alternative tool.[01:21:06] <_Lewellyn> Teltariat: or changing the path for the tool[01:21:17] <Teltariat> I gotta get all the GNU equivalents, like all of them[01:21:20] <_Lewellyn> PATH=/usr/gnu/bin:$PATH mytool[01:21:22] <Teltariat> and stick them somewhere[01:21:48] <Teltariat> I don't have a /usr/gnu :([01:22:01] <nachox> guys, iscsi volumes use ssd too?[01:22:31] <_Lewellyn> Teltariat: SUNWgnu-coreutils will have the basics[01:22:33] <nachox> then /usr/sfw, what solaris release are you using?[01:22:45] *** Cass has joined #opensolaris[01:22:54] <Teltariat> This is 10 8/06 or something[01:22:59] <Teltariat> Solaris 10[01:23:07] *** Tusk2 has quit IRC[01:23:14] <_Lewellyn> /usr/sfw and /opt/sfw are your friends there[01:24:00] <_Lewellyn> mentioning that in #opensolaris, people kinda assume you're on opensolaris of some sort ;)[01:24:57] <_Lewellyn> stevel: why is it "partially installed"?[01:25:18] *** clyons has quit IRC[01:25:29] <nachox> _Lewellyn, i think you rewrote his question :P[01:25:50] <_Lewellyn> nachox: trying to point him at the answer, subtly ;)[01:26:06] <oninoshiko> ok, dtrace question! is there a probe i can use to see when the zil flushes?[01:26:28] *** alain10 has quit IRC[01:26:34] <oninoshiko> err... "commits to nonvolitile media"[01:26:45] *** syd`__ has joined #opensolaris[01:27:01] <_Lewellyn> stevel: did you start at /var/sadm/install_data/upgrade_log?[01:27:40] <_Lewellyn> nachox: is that better? ;)[01:27:52] *** syd`_ has quit IRC[01:28:00] <nachox> hmm, can iscsi volumes in solaris be bigger than 2tb?[01:28:23] <stevel> _Lewellyn: a bunch of complaints about log files not being 0[01:28:27] <stevel> which makes sense[01:28:42] <oninoshiko> nachox: yes[01:28:55] <_Lewellyn> that's kinda non-helpful info. "a bunch of complaints" doesn't help anyone :P[01:29:03] *** MACscr1 has left #opensolaris[01:29:11] *** syd` has quit IRC[01:29:13] <oninoshiko> but you might hit limits on the initiator side[01:29:15] * _Lewellyn notes a new pastebin in /topic[01:29:16] *** cemerick has quit IRC[01:29:16] *** nrubsig has joined #opensolaris[01:29:16] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o nrubsig[01:29:18] <tsoome> oninoshiko: http://blogs.sun.com/roch/entry/128k_suffice[01:29:29] <nachox> hi roland :)[01:29:36] <nrubsig> nachox: Hi![01:29:43] <oninoshiko> (assuming it's not solaris)[01:29:52] <nrubsig> Anyone here who knows the visa regulations around "I-94" for non-US residents ?[01:29:57] <nachox> is it possible that ksh's tab completion has problems with .'s?[01:30:24] <nrubsig> nachox: dot or quote ?[01:30:55] *** scoffin has quit IRC[01:30:58] <_Lewellyn> nachox: specific?[01:31:03] <nrubsig> nachox: character "dot" or "quote" ?[01:31:27] <nachox> chat .[01:31:46] <_Lewellyn> i can do "ls .ma<tab>" just fine[01:31:55] <nachox> it doesnt happen always, but once in a while it lists my options even though i might have only one option available[01:32:01] <nrubsig> nachox: not that I am aware of. Character "." is not special outside the context of variables.[01:32:13] <_Lewellyn> i get that in files with lots of numbers, sometimes[01:32:27] *** vitorio has joined #opensolaris[01:32:38] *** infomomo has joined #opensolaris[01:32:41] <oninoshiko> thanks, tsoome[01:32:49] <_Lewellyn> let's say i have 1234567890.tgz and 1234567891.tgz, tab gives me 123456789 and i have to type 2 characters to finish completion[01:33:15] <infomomo> i am adding a new user to replace the default "root" user, what group should i put my new "user" in ? sysadmin group ?[01:33:26] <_Lewellyn> i keep meaning to ask if that's desired behavior. but i've dealt with it for enough years that i'm not too worried.[01:34:13] <nachox> infomomo, replace the root in what way? you want root as a role or a system administrator profile? in any of those cases it doesnt matter in which group it is[01:35:19] <infomomo> i don't want to use the "root" account, so i want to create another account, i am not surer what group to add him to?[01:36:34] <_Lewellyn> infomomo: i take it you're used to linux and sudo?[01:37:18] <infomomo> Lewellyn: guilty as charged :([01:37:29] <infomomo> but i am learning UNIX now on Solaris 10[01:37:36] <infomomo> with a book[01:37:54] <infomomo> hell of a book i might add :D[01:38:29] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[01:39:40] <_Lewellyn> well, the book should mention pfexec[01:39:56] <_Lewellyn> and this channel will confuse you if you're learning solaris 10 ;)[01:40:36] <infomomo> whats better for me ? Solaris or Opensolaris ?[01:40:45] <infomomo> i am trying to use a pure UNIX system[01:41:32] <oninoshiko> both are a pure UNIX system, but they are (somewhat) different UNIX systems.[01:41:47] <e^ipi> oninoshiko: actually only S10 is certified UNIX[01:41:54] <_Lewellyn> yup[01:42:01] * oninoshiko stands corrected[01:42:11] <e^ipi> opensolaris is a unix-like operating system[01:42:18] <e^ipi> like *BSD[01:42:23] <_Lewellyn> opensolaris is what osx was for a few years :)[01:42:43] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: i thought fbsd is certified?[01:42:48] <oninoshiko> e^ipi: dont you mean "UNIX system like system" (if you want to get all technical)[01:42:49] *** Disorganized_ has quit IRC[01:42:59] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: no[01:43:28] <e^ipi> _Lewellyn: nope, it's not[01:43:33] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: the official term for non-certified unixy systems is "UNIX-like"[01:43:51] <_Lewellyn> if i had a browser open, i'd give a url :)[01:44:06] *** Odin- has quit IRC[01:44:38] *** Disorganized has joined #OpenSolaris[01:46:02] *** prav33n has quit IRC[01:46:31] <e^ipi> here's a list of the only operating systems which can be called UNIX: http://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/[01:47:47] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: so, technically, SXCE would be UNIX 03[01:48:05] <_Lewellyn> "Solaris 10 Operating System and on"[01:48:49] *** syd` has quit IRC[01:48:51] <_Lewellyn> or not. nevermind[01:48:56] <_Lewellyn> i forgot how to read that list[01:48:57] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[01:48:59] <infomomo> cool thanks, i wasnt too sure of what OS to use to follow with my book[01:49:14] <infomomo> the spoke of S10 and HP-UX and IBM AIX[01:49:23] <_Lewellyn> infomomo: then use solaris 10[01:49:23] *** syd`__ has quit IRC[01:49:23] <e^ipi> no[01:49:31] <e^ipi> solaris10 with that patch level or later[01:49:39] <_Lewellyn> [17:50] <_Lewellyn> or not. nevermind[01:49:48] <e^ipi> fair enough[01:50:15] <infomomo> great thanks guys[01:50:26] <e^ipi> HPUX is also only UNIX on itanic, evidently[01:50:28] <infomomo> back top the #Solaris channel for me :D[01:50:29] *** bizkut has joined #opensolaris[01:50:43] <_Lewellyn> er no[01:50:53] <infomomo> MacOSx is purte UNIX ? :S:S: :D[01:51:09] <e^ipi> infomomo: OSX server is UNIX[01:51:10] <e^ipi> on intel[01:51:32] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: no. the client is, too[01:51:35] <_Lewellyn> as of 10.5[01:51:37] <eviljames> e^ipi: but .. but .. but .... ... why isn't linux on the list?[01:51:41] <_Lewellyn> that was the big thing with leopard[01:51:46] <nachox> eviljames, ...[01:51:51] <infomomo> UNIX 03 Registered Products: Apple Inc.: Mac OS X Version 10.5 Leopard on Intel-based Macintosh computers[01:52:28] <e^ipi> my bad[01:52:35] <e^ipi> so yes... on intel, OSX is UNIX[01:53:12] <oninoshiko> http://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/docs/faq.html "Refrain from hyphenating a Trademark"[01:53:24] <e^ipi> eviljames: because getting certified requires planning... and engineering discipline[01:53:28] <e^ipi> linux has neither[01:53:32] <e^ipi> also money... which linux does have[01:53:45] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: also not forbidden[01:53:53] <oninoshiko> oops, wrong link: http://www.opengroup.org/tm-guidelines.htm[01:54:13] <eviljames> arg.[01:54:17] <oninoshiko> the trademake owner disagrees with you there, _Lewellyn[01:54:18] <eviljames> I was expecting more lulz from that comment.[01:54:23] <oninoshiko> trademark*[01:54:30] * eviljames needs to figure out how to play the audience better ;)[01:54:36] *** qiyong has joined #opensolaris[01:54:38] *** kate21de1 has quit IRC[01:54:40] <infomomo> can we then say that BSD is also pure UNIx or a UNIx derivative ?[01:55:02] <e^ipi> nope[01:55:12] <eviljames> Not at all. BSD == BSD[01:55:17] <infomomo> great[01:55:34] <infomomo> bsd is derivative of UNIX though ?[01:56:19] <eviljames> Not modern ones, I don't think.[01:56:23] <eviljames> ie: FreeBSD, NetBSD, etc.[01:56:38] *** lesterc has quit IRC[01:56:42] <_Lewellyn> infomomo: look at the unix family tree[01:56:56] <_Lewellyn> bsd is a weird incestuous nephew[01:57:10] <e^ipi> it shares lineage[01:57:17] <_Lewellyn> multiple times ;)[01:58:16] <eviljames> Come on guys, we all know the only real UNIX is SCO.[01:58:29] *** ravv has quit IRC[01:58:38] <eviljames> No, wait, that was the only real eunechs are SCO. My bad.[01:58:52] <eviljames> s/eunech/eunuch/[01:59:56] <infomomo> SCO ???[02:00:06] <nachox> that joke isnt even funny[02:00:39] * nrubsig is away - food.[02:01:10] *** e-jat has joined #opensolaris[02:01:31] <eviljames> nachox: None of my jokes are coming across today it seems. I'm in a good mood, just got off work and can't catch a break..[02:01:40] <infomomo> LOL :D[02:01:43] <oninoshiko> _Lewellyn: incest takes two...[02:02:01] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: bell labs gave it up plenty ;)[02:02:22] <e^ipi> infomomo: UNIXWare or OpenServer[02:03:08] <e^ipi> notable mostly for suing IBM over linux[02:03:23] <e^ipi> evidently people used to use them for print servers for a while[02:03:37] <eviljames> Do you think Darl ever thought to himself, while the Nazgul were soaring overhead, "Maybe this isn't a good idea..?"[02:04:16] <nachox> i've seen an old sco unix manage lots and lots of printers just fine, it wasnt a bad unix at that time...[02:04:17] <oninoshiko> lol... yeah... hence the outcome of Unix System Laboratories v. The Regents of the University of Califonia[02:04:34] <e^ipi> eviljames: no because given the rest of the business... it wasn't a bad idea[02:05:49] <e^ipi> unless you think SCOX had something of value still[02:05:59] * eviljames buys stock[02:06:08] *** syd` has quit IRC[02:06:27] <nachox> sco got too distracted with linux and did not invest in their unix variant, it got outdated when compared to both solaris and unix, and it was bad at providing linux services, it basically alienated all its income sources in one blow[02:06:29] <jmcp> iirc, SCO Unix used to be the POS system for KFC in Australia[02:06:54] <oninoshiko> i dont know... the whole thing where Novell realized that SCO didn't own anything was funny[02:07:02] <nachox> s/and unix/and linux/[02:07:53] <_Lewellyn> nachox: the problem is that they tried to force all the SCO OS people to UW :P[02:07:56] <nachox> and aix 6.1 is not a real UNIX :)[02:08:00] <_Lewellyn> so they HAD to focus on linux[02:09:15] <_Lewellyn> OS and UW were totally different products. whoever thought people would migrate was insane[02:09:41] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[02:09:45] <oninoshiko> maybe the same person who though sueing novell was a good idea?[02:10:28] <oninoshiko> (which, if you look at the legal implications was far more stupid then sueing IBM)[02:11:05] <oninoshiko> although i suppose it would have come up in the IBM case anyway[02:11:40] <e^ipi> what's the deal with sco's stock price?[02:11:56] *** cypromis has quit IRC[02:12:03] <e^ipi> it has no intra-day trading ?[02:12:17] <eviljames> I thought they were de-listed?[02:12:36] <_Lewellyn> the novell lawsuit came long after the writing was on the wall[02:12:50] <e^ipi> oh, that might be it[02:13:00] *** Wil has quit IRC[02:13:09] <nachox> i think it was delisted[02:13:17] <eviljames> I'm actually fairly certain it was.[02:14:00] <e^ipi> yep[02:14:04] <_Lewellyn> SCOX is no longer valid. It has changed to SCOXQ.PK.[02:14:10] <e^ipi> and also evidently are in bankruptcy protection[02:14:24] <_Lewellyn> Last Trade: 0.09[02:15:06] *** syd`_ has joined #opensolaris[02:15:12] <oninoshiko> why the Q?[02:15:16] *** inaddy has joined #opensolaris[02:15:29] <e^ipi> delisted... pinksheets...[02:15:38] <e^ipi> *shrug*[02:16:15] *** lesterc has joined #opensolaris[02:17:23] *** alfism has quit IRC[02:17:48] <_Lewellyn> i've never understood OTC symbols[02:19:43] <not-me-guv> and what's a .PK?[02:21:20] <_Lewellyn> again, i just find the symbols, dunno what they mean :)[02:22:22] <e^ipi> not-me-guv: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_Sheets[02:22:53] <_Lewellyn> wow. their 2008 10K makes for some interesting reading[02:24:39] <_Lewellyn> it actually has the best summary of sco's legal woes that i've read[02:25:31] *** wdp has quit IRC[02:25:36] <not-me-guv> with less extraneous gloating than groklaw, I expect :)[02:26:00] <_Lewellyn> it's an SEC filing, they tend to be pretty fair and balanced.[02:26:08] <_Lewellyn> last thing you need is for the sec to come after you[02:26:21] <_Lewellyn> especially if you're barely surviving ;)[02:26:49] <_Lewellyn> oh neat. they're selling openserver[02:27:04] <not-me-guv> to whom?[02:27:09] <_Lewellyn> no one yet[02:27:10] *** erast has quit IRC[02:27:12] <e^ipi> heh[02:27:18] <flyingparchment> they're going to sell their only product that actually matters?[02:27:21] *** erast has joined #opensolaris[02:27:31] <_Lewellyn> On January 8, 2009, the Debtors filed its Amended Reorganization Plan and Disclosure statement. Under the proposed plan, the Debtors intend to hold an open auction to sell certain of their assets including their mobility business assets and their OpenServer operating system assets and business.[02:27:44] <e^ipi> not unixware?[02:27:47] <_Lewellyn> i wouldn't mind doing some fundraising to buy out openserver :)[02:27:51] *** Wil has joined #opensolaris[02:27:54] <not-me-guv> a real company could be interested in that ...[02:27:55] <e^ipi> i'll throw $10 to that fund[02:27:59] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: they've been focusing on unixware for a while[02:27:59] *** vitorio has quit IRC[02:28:06] <sponix2ipfw> _Lewellyn: you still hanging around ?[02:28:08] <_Lewellyn> they EOLed OS after 5[02:28:10] <_Lewellyn> sponix2ipfw: no[02:28:15] <sponix2ipfw> *Grin*[02:28:35] <e^ipi> _Lewellyn: i wonder how much one could buy it for[02:28:36] *** bnitz has quit IRC[02:28:41] <_Lewellyn> hahahaha "(e) ship FCmobilelife and FCtasks for the iPhone with a new pricing structure."[02:28:53] <not-me-guv> what's openserver worth? Is there still a market that wouldn't do better to migrate to linux/bsd/opensolaris?[02:28:54] <e^ipi> like, a dozen of us as a prank could be the legal owners of openserver[02:28:57] <e^ipi> that'd be fun[02:29:00] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: i intend to do some research on that friday[02:29:14] *** mirezwer has quit IRC[02:29:15] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: i'm not thinking "as a prank"[02:29:30] <e^ipi> if it generates revenue bonus, but it'd be an awesome prank[02:29:36] <_Lewellyn> there's certain bits of openserver i really really wouldn't mind having legal rights to do anything i wanted with ;)[02:29:46] <oninoshiko> actually, openserver is not their only product... I thought they had some thing related to mobile phones (which was the most profitable aspect of their busness)[02:29:56] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: and unixware[02:30:12] *** syd` has quit IRC[02:30:17] <_Lewellyn> i think the novell suit kinda killed unixware though[02:30:31] <oninoshiko> just a WEEEEEEEEEE bit[02:31:25] <not-me-guv> sco should just get a banking license, then grab a billion or two of government slush-fund :P[02:32:06] <_Lewellyn> they're late to that ballgame, as usual for them[02:32:09] * oninoshiko is a bit sore over BANKS getting that[02:32:28] <nrubsig> oninoshikyeah, Sun should get all the money :-)[02:32:58] <oninoshiko> nrubsig: lol[02:32:59] * not-me-guv suspects sun benefits from banks getting bailed out[02:33:50] <oninoshiko> here is a thought, they want to fix the mortguage crises... why not bail out the people with mortguages?[02:33:58] <nrubsig> not-me-guv: unlikely. At least in germany the first thing they do is to cut-down investments in new stuff when the state takes banks over.[02:34:03] <oninoshiko> I'll even volenteer![02:34:30] *** cemerick has joined #opensolaris[02:35:00] *** cemerick has quit IRC[02:35:29] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: because that won't keep the financial system solvent[02:36:07] <e^ipi> neither will bailing out the banks really... not so long as nobody trusts the market[02:36:15] <oninoshiko> neither will any of what's being done[02:36:28] <oninoshiko> atleast this way i get my house paid off[02:36:42] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: that's the problem. there's runs on banks, and the market loses even more trust[02:37:08] <oninoshiko> either way my great-great-great gandchildren will still be paying off the loans[02:37:26] <e^ipi> i think we're more or less screwed no matter what happens[02:37:33] <oninoshiko> (presuming they have work then)[02:37:39] <e^ipi> for the next few years anyhow[02:37:53] <not-me-guv> banks would lend. Just not at these below-viable interest rates our politicians are setting[02:39:04] <oninoshiko> not-me-guv: hey! enough of that kinda talk... thats the ONE viable option I have to come out ahead... refinance to 2%[02:39:33] <not-me-guv> think 20% ballpark.[02:39:45] *** syd`_ has quit IRC[02:39:58] <_Lewellyn> niq: that's the problem. we have politicians managing our treasury :P[02:40:13] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[02:40:14] <not-me-guv> unless they keep on pouring good money after bad so long even that will do nothing, and we all turn Zimbabwe[02:40:54] * _Lewellyn moves "get multiple country citizenship, just in case" up his priority list a few ticks[02:41:45] * not-me-guv blames _Lewellyn[02:41:49] <oninoshiko> or maybe the bank holding my loan will go belly-up and i can buy it back at pennys on the dollar[02:43:32] <oninoshiko> (wishful thinking)[02:43:51] *** JT__ has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** CosmicDJ has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** bizkut has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** twisti__ has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** tsoome has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** janil__ has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** mwest has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** noptrix has quit IRC[02:43:51] *** Doc has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** thinko has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** TBCOOL has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** Trident has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** tomww has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** vicmacke1 has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** eklof has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** ilaiho has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** IvanR_ has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** Mazon has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** Caino has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** tg has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** sensei has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** Gman has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** jub has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** m0zzzy has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** segy has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** boyd has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** DerSaidin has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** ofu has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** LuckyLuke has quit IRC[02:43:52] *** dec has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** fraggeln has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** kab3wm has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** free_ has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** Excedrin has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** Tiger^ has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** glance has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** e^ipi has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** Praematura has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** vertigo has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** sejo has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** wereHamster has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** codestr0m has quit IRC[02:43:53] *** barfoed has quit IRC[02:44:40] <_Lewellyn> NICE[02:45:02] * oninoshiko <3s netsplits[02:45:08] *** bizkut has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** JT__ has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** twisti__ has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** tsoome has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** janil__ has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** mwest has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** noptrix has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** Doc has joined #opensolaris[02:45:08] *** thinko has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** CosmicDJ has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** TBCOOL has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** Trident has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** tomww has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** vicmacke1 has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** Mazon has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** IvanR_ has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** ilaiho has joined #opensolaris[02:45:09] *** eklof has joined #opensolaris[02:45:14] * _Lewellyn misses efnet[02:45:15] *** dec has joined #opensolaris[02:45:20] <_Lewellyn> oh wait, freenode's just as bad now ;)[02:45:21] *** DerSaidi1 has joined #opensolaris[02:45:32] *** e^ipi_ has joined #opensolaris[02:45:32] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o e^ipi_[02:45:40] <oninoshiko> _Lewellyn: either that, or someone de-peered Cogent (again)[02:47:14] *** lisppaste3 has quit IRC[02:48:00] *** Tiger^ has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** Gman has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** codestr0m has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** barfoed has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** Caino has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** jub has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** m0zzzy has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** segy has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** boyd has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** ofu has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** tg has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** LuckyLuke has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** sensei has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** Excedrin has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** free_ has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** vertigo has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** kab3wm has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** wereHamster has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** glance has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** Praematura has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** sejo has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** fraggeln has joined #opensolaris[02:48:56] *** irc.freenode.net sets mode: +o Gman[02:49:32] <e^ipi_> lousy freenode[02:49:34] <_Lewellyn> oh yeah. how can i disable the power button on my machine? i'm tired of accidentally hitting it and shutting down[02:49:39] *** infomomo has quit IRC[02:50:11] <_Lewellyn> this last time, the shutdown killed my sessions in opera and firefox, both :P[02:51:01] *** fraggeln_ has joined #opensolaris[02:51:28] <oninoshiko> a screwdriver?[02:51:37] <_Lewellyn> then i can't turn it on ;)[02:51:49] *** Excedrin has quit IRC[02:51:53] *** Excedrin has joined #opensolaris[02:51:55] *** glance_ has joined #opensolaris[02:51:59] <_Lewellyn> and under windows, i have that set to hibernate (which is saner than poweroff, at least)[02:52:02] * oninoshiko had an obnoxish button on a keyboard that was taken care of like that[02:52:07] <piwi> why shut it down?[02:52:17] <_Lewellyn> piwi: there's no S4 support yet?[02:52:41] <piwi> give him something to do[02:52:45] <piwi> and let it run :)[02:53:01] <_Lewellyn> besides, leaving it on in my backpack or briefcase causes thermal shutdown anyhow[02:53:29] <piwi> ok, laptop[02:53:40] <oninoshiko> oh.. you have one of these weird "laptop" thingies ;)[02:53:40] <piwi> thought of a pc[02:54:34] <piwi> system->settings->energy[02:54:49] <piwi> configures the behaviour of acpi power button[02:55:06] *** free_ has quit IRC[02:55:10] <piwi> (don't quote me on the menu path, german opensolaris here)[02:55:13] <oninoshiko> I should get back to what i was asking about dtrace for...[02:55:18] *** free has joined #opensolaris[02:55:27] *** lisppaste3 has joined #opensolaris[02:55:37] *** Rocket2DMn has quit IRC[02:56:00] <_Lewellyn> piwi: power management is broken in 107 and newer for me.[02:56:04] <_Lewellyn> moreso in 109[02:56:28] <oninoshiko> _Lewellyn: you and I are just not having much luck in 107-109, are we?[02:56:38] <piwi> 109 only in vm here, so no powermanagement at all on my side[02:56:44] <skullone> i stopped at 106, last stable build i could get on my x4540's[02:56:54] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: nope. i bet if intel updated that DRM module, i'd be better off[02:57:20] <oninoshiko> mine is a regression, so im stuch[02:57:26] <oninoshiko> stuck*[02:57:29] <_Lewellyn> then i could get back to moaning about nwam[02:57:38] *** syd`_ has joined #opensolaris[02:57:52] * oninoshiko kicks COMSTAR.[02:58:02] <_Lewellyn> will 110 fix it?[02:58:16] <oninoshiko> donno... it was reported last night[02:58:24] *** mroconno1 has joined #opensolaris[02:58:29] <_Lewellyn> so probably not. since 110 should be finalized now[02:58:34] *** mroconno1 is now known as mroconnor_[02:58:45] <oninoshiko> i got someone else to independently conferm it (because I dont have alot a experence with comstar yet)[02:59:57] <oninoshiko> i wanted to make sure it wasnt just me being stupid before i wasted a DB entry in the bugs DB...[03:00:23] <_Lewellyn> the longer you take to report it, the longer you have to wait for it to be fixed ;)[03:00:30] <oninoshiko> (my last bug report was a wasted entry... ended up being a BIOS bug... intel fixed it after my report)[03:01:24] <oninoshiko> _Lewellyn: but if i report somthing that isn't a bug, just an ID-10t error, i waste a developers time. time they could be using to work on something else[03:01:31] *** alvaro1 has joined #opensolaris[03:02:17] *** vertigo has quit IRC[03:02:21] *** JoergB has joined #opensolaris[03:02:27] *** m0zzzy has quit IRC[03:03:04] <oninoshiko> besides... i didnt have captures and whatnot until yesterday anyway[03:03:17] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: conversely, if you don't report a potential bug, others will be suffering longer[03:03:52] <alvaro1> what kind of package manager does open solaris uses[03:03:57] <alvaro1> ?[03:03:58] *** vertigo has joined #opensolaris[03:04:24] *** fraggeln has quit IRC[03:04:46] <_Lewellyn> opensolaris or solaris express community edition?[03:04:56] <alvaro1> opensolaris?[03:05:08] <_Lewellyn> opensolaris uses pkg to manage IPS packages[03:05:15] *** glance has quit IRC[03:05:22] <oninoshiko> I've found that most of the bugs I end up reporting, tend to be obscure enough that most users dont encounter it (this one required useing a Qlogic iSCSI HBA against a COMSTAR target).[03:05:22] <_Lewellyn> it also still has the SVR4 pkg* tools (which is what sxce uses)[03:05:59] * oninoshiko grasps pkgadd "MINE! Grrr!"[03:06:14] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: that's fine. reporting things that you feel are bugs at least keep "this could probably be documented better" on the radar ;)[03:06:17] <alvaro1> does pkg support working with rpm packages ?[03:06:25] * _Lewellyn does not advocate purposely reporting non-bugs[03:06:41] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: no. and there are no RPM packages for opensolaris that i know of[03:06:42] *** barfoed has quit IRC[03:07:02] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: you can build IPS (and SVR4) packages with RPM-like spec files[03:07:37] <oninoshiko> alvaro1: the spec format used by the SFE project to make SVR4 pakages is quite similer to the RH equivilent[03:07:47] * oninoshiko is slow tonight[03:07:59] <alvaro1> is open solaris linux or unix ?[03:08:16] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: you can build IPS with pkgbuild (SFE), too.[03:08:26] *** RavenSlay3r has joined #opensolaris[03:08:28] <oninoshiko> OpenSoalris is a UNIX system.[03:08:29] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: solaris is unix, opensolaris is its child ;)[03:08:40] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: we went through this earlier ;)[03:08:49] *** syd` has quit IRC[03:08:51] <oninoshiko> err Solaris is a UNIX system, OS is a direct direvitive[03:09:14] *** jub has quit IRC[03:09:55] <alvaro1> which are the advantages of using open solaris?[03:09:58] <oninoshiko> I still maintain you arn't suppose to hyphen the trademark.[03:10:08] <nachox> opensolaris has a little bit of both, specially since the gnu tools are the default ones[03:10:28] <_Lewellyn> nachox: gnu != linux[03:10:51] <qiyong> can i show calling stack with dtrace?[03:10:53] <nachox> alvaro1, RBAC, ZFS, zones, good resource management, network virtualization, you pick[03:11:06] <oninoshiko> alvaro1: ZFS offers a higher degree of data reliability from storage. Dtrace offers some impressive monitoring cabilities[03:11:14] <nachox> _Lewellyn, show me a linux that isnt using gnu tools[03:11:30] <_Lewellyn> nachox: wait for the alpha release of the one sitting on my hard disk ;)[03:11:56] <nachox> ...[03:12:07] <oninoshiko> in that case all things containing words are books.[03:12:29] <oninoshiko> "show me a book which does not contain words"[03:12:44] <alvaro1> I suppose there are fewer packages for open solaris availaible as free software than for Unix like Systems, is that true?[03:13:00] <nachox> oninoshiko, what other relevant os uses gnu tools alone? (hurd is not relevant)[03:13:23] <asyd> hurd! <3[03:13:26] *** evocallaghan has joined #opensolaris[03:13:30] <Plazma> simmer down asyd ;)[03:13:58] *** erast has quit IRC[03:14:00] <asyd> well, microkernels are very interesting, about architecture[03:14:00] <oninoshiko> alvaro1: most OSS software sould just recompile[03:14:01] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: open source software is stillbeing packaged for opensolaris. opensolaris is still "new" remember :)[03:14:17] <_Lewellyn> but there's nothing stopping you from configure; make; make install of most things[03:14:22] <Plazma> asyd, yea.. i sitll enjoy them myself form what little i know[03:14:29] <_Lewellyn> asyd: as are 2gb filesystems ;)[03:14:31] <oninoshiko> a large number of packages have already been ported[03:14:40] <Plazma> microkernerl arch rules[03:15:04] *** ofu_ has joined #opensolaris[03:15:10] *** codestr01 has joined #opensolaris[03:15:15] <_Lewellyn> nachox: just because everyone who uses linux is afraid of the wrath of rms is no reason to think that a gnu userland is the only choice[03:15:25] <oninoshiko> but there are some applications which are written in a non-portable way.[03:15:32] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: "most"[03:15:58] <nachox> _Lewellyn, i'm a practical person, right now, if you use gnu tools you look more like linux than solaris[03:16:05] *** boyd_ has joined #opensolaris[03:16:15] <asyd> _Lewellyn: hmm, do you know few things about micro kernels?[03:16:23] <_Lewellyn> asyd: a few things, only.[03:16:28] * _Lewellyn != kernel hacker[03:16:42] <oninoshiko> _Lewellyn: I have not personally review the code for "most" OSS... so i cannot judge it... OTOH i can say "some" with out risking being wrong[03:16:44] <asyd> (and yes, I know hurd is a not a microkernel, especially machs/hurs)[03:17:15] <nachox> ew, i need a cheap netbook... :([03:17:41] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: i've compiled many many things on solaris over the years. i feel confident with "most" :)[03:17:43] <asyd> macbook 13" ;)[03:17:51] <alvaro1> will you have to compile your own software most of cases...?[03:17:59] <_Lewellyn> what's with this trend towards unusably small machines[03:17:59] <evocallaghan> asyd;nachox:Hey long time you two ![03:18:06] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: maybe. depends on what you need.[03:18:09] <evocallaghan> boyd_:Still around ?[03:18:16] <oninoshiko> depends on what you need. alot of things have been added to IPS[03:18:17] <asyd> heya evocallaghan![03:18:18] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: what software are you wondering about?[03:18:21] <asyd> what sup[03:18:31] <evocallaghan> good good and your good self ?[03:18:37] <oninoshiko> has most of SFE made it in there yet?[03:18:41] <alvaro1> tell me something definitively is open solaris linux or Unix ?[03:18:43] <evocallaghan> Still got them zsh scripts[03:18:59] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: no[03:19:11] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: that's why they are "extra" ;)[03:19:11] <oninoshiko> that's unfortuantate[03:19:32] <_Lewellyn> oninoshiko: wait for the software porting project to pick up some steam[03:19:39] <asyd> well, yes[03:19:56] <oninoshiko> alvaro1: I dont understand the question.[03:20:00] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: it is based off the solaris (unix) kernel, not the linux kernel.[03:20:12] <asyd> evocallaghan: hey, do you have some zsh scripts to share? we start to share some scripts with some peoples[03:20:39] <eviljames> If you're sharing zsh scripts, I'd like to know where.[03:20:46] <_Lewellyn> it is not certified "UNIX(tm)", but it is more likely to happen than any linux distro[03:20:46] *** stevel has quit IRC[03:20:51] <alvaro1> unix is a trademark....[03:20:57] <asyd> http://svn.asyd.net/svn/zsh/branches/zan/[03:21:04] <eviljames> asyd: merci.[03:21:04] <asyd> actually just a first try[03:21:05] <alvaro1> protected by author laws[03:21:12] *** Topdeck_ has joined #opensolaris[03:21:16] <eviljames> Trademark != copyright.[03:21:18] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: Solaris 10 and earlier are certified hereditary UNIX versions[03:21:23] *** esok has left #opensolaris[03:21:34] <_Lewellyn> alvaro1: opensolaris reports itself as "Solaris 11"[03:21:41] <evocallaghan> asyd: No we started work on our own shell as part of our distro[03:21:42] * _Lewellyn tries to simplify this some[03:22:10] <oninoshiko> alvaro1: UNIX is a trademark of The Open Group. Sun has The Open Group's permission to use the UNIX trademark to discribe Solaris 10 and earlier[03:22:30] <asyd> evocallaghan:[03:22:34] <_Lewellyn> and iirc, they did a "buy out" from sco once upon a time[03:22:37] <asyd> "our distro" ?[03:22:54] *** ofu has quit IRC[03:23:13] *** codestr0m has quit IRC[03:23:15] <alvaro1> Good i understand , it could be interesting having Unix at home, it seems to be one of first unix for home[03:23:30] <telexicon> huh[03:23:31] <asyd> well, please choose zsh as main shell :)[03:23:33] <_Lewellyn> you've been able to use solaris at home for many years...[03:23:33] <oninoshiko> (the primary qualification for getting that permission is for your system to pass The Open Group's tests)[03:23:50] <telexicon> theres still *bsd which is unixy[03:23:55] <telexicon> and linux which is sorta unixy[03:24:05] <_Lewellyn> telexicon: we're talking "UNIX(tm)" here[03:24:06] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[03:24:14] <telexicon> UNIX(tm) is just a name[03:24:27] <_Lewellyn> it's more than just a name[03:24:28] <alvaro1> i thoght unix was only for powerfull not-home computers[03:24:56] <_Lewellyn> your home computer is more powerful than the supercomputer of 15 years ago ;)[03:25:08] <e^ipi_> alvaro1: OSX is UNIX(R) certifed[03:25:09] <oninoshiko> alvaro1: Apple's OSX also qualifies to use the UNIX trademark[03:25:13] <e^ipi_> so... not really[03:25:16] <telexicon> yeah[03:25:26] <telexicon> so you can tell right there, that UNIX is just a name[03:25:36] <telexicon> if OS X gets to be called UNIX[03:25:37] <_Lewellyn> it's only certified for 10.5 on Intel, though.[03:25:48] <telexicon> with its case-insensitive filesystem[03:25:52] <evocallaghan> Unix by modern day terms I would say 'means' it SUS3/POSIX compliant[03:25:55] <_Lewellyn> telexicon: it can be traced hereditarily[03:26:13] <telexicon> and non-X11 gui[03:26:23] <telexicon> _Lewellyn, really? can it?[03:26:25] <oninoshiko> telexicon: it meets the requirements. there is a list of them... i can link to them if you want to know[03:26:32] <e^ipi_> telexicon: actually UNIX only says that it /can/ pass the tests, not that the default config does[03:26:41] <e^ipi_> telexicon: hence /usr/xpg*[03:26:41] <_Lewellyn> and there have been a few UNIXes over the years which have been case-honoring yet case-insensitive[03:26:48] <_Lewellyn> telexicon: yes you can[03:26:56] <e^ipi_> solaris /can/ pass the tests, but svid interferes with it[03:27:01] <telexicon> oninoshiko, no i understand, but .. thats not very useful[03:27:02] *** e^ipi_ is now known as e^ipi[03:27:33] *** felipe_ has quit IRC[03:27:51] <telexicon> _Lewellyn, a freebsd layer slapped on top of mach, with some embedded c++ driver subsystem, and a userland of primarily objective-c doesnt sound like a UNIX heritage[03:28:19] <alvaro1> that strue computers in the past were very slow, unix commands are different a little from linux[03:28:25] *** boyd has quit IRC[03:28:43] *** Topdeck has quit IRC[03:28:46] <e^ipi> alvaro1: that's because GNU's Not UNIX[03:28:49] <oninoshiko> just the fact that it is connected to bsd at all means there is some code tracing.[03:28:58] <nrubsig> can I get the temperature of the CPUs in a U45 somehow ?[03:29:03] <telexicon> oninoshiko, windows NT is connected to bsd[03:29:13] <e^ipi> telexicon: and POSIX compliant[03:29:28] <e^ipi> which shows you how valuable POSIX is[03:29:59] <nrubsig> e^ipi: grumpf[03:30:01] <telexicon> you dont think they just paid their way into that[03:30:03] <_Lewellyn> extremely, as you can compile posix-compliant code on its posix subsystem )[03:30:12] <nrubsig> e^ipi: it mattes a bit which _part_ of POSIX you are referring to.[03:30:27] <e^ipi> not really, it's a pretty meaningless term[03:30:30] <_Lewellyn> nrubsig: sfu/sua don't suck too bad :)[03:30:31] <e^ipi> hence, SUS[03:32:15] <alvaro1> what is bsd[03:32:17] <e^ipi> HAHA... osnews[03:32:19] <e^ipi> "Ever wanted a simple, compact, small, yet usable and relatively full-featured operating system using a SunOS kernel with most of its utilities written in Ada?"[03:32:22] <e^ipi> no...[03:32:24] <e^ipi> no i have not...[03:32:33] <e^ipi> but thank you for asking[03:32:47] <_Lewellyn> hahahaha wtf[03:32:50] <e^ipi> *shrug*[03:32:52] <_Lewellyn> ADA!?[03:33:02] <alvaro1> try to do an Dert[03:33:10] <_Lewellyn> is it like "solaris for .gov"?[03:33:10] <bda> e^ipi: Wow, er. What's that?[03:33:19] <bda> _Lewellyn: Isn't that A/UX?[03:33:23] <e^ipi> auroraux[03:33:28] <e^ipi> evidently[03:33:33] <alvaro1> A dert is nothing....[03:33:33] <e^ipi> http://osnews.com/story/21123/AuroraUX_Combines_SunOS_with_Ada[03:33:45] <_Lewellyn> a/ux was too reliant on the toolkit :)[03:33:47] <oninoshiko> alvaro1: BSD is a set of OSes based on code originating at the University of California at Berkley.[03:33:49] *** syd`_ has quit IRC[03:33:53] <bda> huh.[03:34:02] <alvaro1> ok[03:34:02] <oninoshiko> A/UX was kinda fun![03:34:09] <bda> Tempest.[03:34:09] <_Lewellyn> auroraux is very... ucky... as a name[03:34:10] <bda> ++[03:34:35] <telexicon> its scooby doo speak[03:34:35] *** bgupta has quit IRC[03:34:43] <telexicon> ruh roh[03:34:56] *** bgupta has joined #opensolaris[03:35:25] <e^ipi> meh, good for them i guess[03:35:41] <oninoshiko> the orginal BSD and SYSV were vary interrelated, causeing a... interesting outcome when it came to legal blows[03:35:53] <_Lewellyn> i need to find a corporate-friendly expansion of "HATE", i think[03:36:09] <e^ipi> home[03:36:10] <e^ipi> and...[03:36:17] <e^ipi> uhh... the enterprise?[03:36:23] <_Lewellyn> no no, i want it to be very enterprisey :D[03:36:27] <e^ipi> Solaris HATE edition[03:36:27] <_Lewellyn> no "home" ;)[03:36:29] *** sponix has quit IRC[03:36:45] <telexicon> Solaris Enterprise Edition[03:36:46] *** Disorganized has quit IRC[03:36:49] <e^ipi> high-availability and the enterprise[03:36:50] <e^ipi> HATE[03:37:00] <_Lewellyn> can't use "High Availablility", since that has legal meanings[03:37:01] *** sponix has joined #opensolaris[03:37:10] <_Lewellyn> i suppose i could disclaim them away[03:37:12] <e^ipi> high-availability telecom enterprise[03:37:14] <oninoshiko> High Avaliblity Telecommunications Edition[03:37:14] <_Lewellyn> it works for big companies :D[03:37:23] <e^ipi> oninoshiko++[03:37:24] <oninoshiko> DAMNIT e^ipi[03:37:34] <oninoshiko> :p[03:37:58] <_Lewellyn> Heritage Access, Terminal Enhanced[03:38:04] *** RavenSlay31 has joined #opensolaris[03:38:16] <_Lewellyn> ugh. that's so stodgy :P[03:38:20] *** RavenSlay31 has quit IRC[03:39:42] <oninoshiko> eh well... you know what my vote is for ;)[03:39:42] <sponix> where do I find the release notes for b109 ?[03:40:02] <oninoshiko> i normally look at the "flag days" myself[03:40:21] <e^ipi> or the ON changelog[03:41:12] <oninoshiko> more comprehensive, but much more time consuming[03:41:40] <alanc> sponix: opensolaris-announce or the "announcements" box on the bottom right corner of the opensolaris.org front page ("pkg updates" is the 2008.11/2009.06 version)[03:41:47] <e^ipi> not really... ON changelogs only track ON bugs[03:41:58] <e^ipi> anything that has to do with X or SFW or whatever isn't necc. in there[03:41:59] *** neoxed has joined #OpenSolaris[03:42:26] *** syd` has quit IRC[03:43:05] <oninoshiko> ahh but i dont always care about all ON bugs... a skim of flag days normally tells me if there is anything i need to REALLY watch out for[03:43:21] <oninoshiko> (although, i have been bit)[03:43:51] *** alvaro1 has left #opensolaris[03:44:08] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[03:44:25] *** kohju is now known as KOHJU[03:44:47] <sponix2ipfw> 6807529 Update NVIDIA graphics driver to 180.29 for OpenGL 3.0 [LSARC/2009/066][03:44:55] <sponix2ipfw> they get this fixed ?[03:44:57] *** cwebber has joined #opensolaris[03:45:27] <e^ipi> is it in the changelog?[03:45:28] <sponix2ipfw> when I tried 180.29 prior straight from Nvidia it had link issues[03:45:38] *** Disorganized has joined #OpenSolaris[03:45:44] <sponix2ipfw> http://opensolaris.org/os/community/x_win/changelogs/changelogs-nv_100/[03:46:00] <e^ipi> if it's in the changelog, it's fixed[03:46:06] *** cambazz has quit IRC[03:46:13] <sponix2ipfw> Not sure, just spotted that so far, notes the upgrade, didn't make mention of anything being modified otherwise that I see...[03:47:39] <sponix2ipfw> It just has bad links where it should be verifying the status, that isn't a good sign aye ;)[03:49:34] <nachox> b109 is about to be released for indiana, right?[03:49:51] <holcomb> already has. and having updated i now feel empty[03:50:01] <alanc> nachox: wrong[03:50:08] <eviljames> holcomb: wow, that was some kind of update...[03:50:09] <alanc> it was already released[03:50:12] *** `Spike has joined #opensolaris[03:50:30] <nachox> how come i miss all the announcements? :P[03:50:30] <alanc> 8-)[03:50:35] <`Spike> okay so still no responses to my post to the zfs discussion list[03:50:40] <`Spike> any zfs experts around?[03:50:42] <eviljames> nachox: check /t[03:50:43] <`Spike> i got a real big problem her[03:50:45] <`Spike> here*[03:50:47] <alanc> not subscribed to opensolaris-announce or @comay on twitter?[03:50:47] <eviljames> nachox: :D[03:50:47] <_Lewellyn> nachox: set a notification for /topic? :)[03:51:03] <_Lewellyn> spike, did you do like i did and end up with ENOSPC? :D[03:51:10] *** Roninkvf has joined #opensolaris[03:51:14] <nachox> ohh, cool, i'll leave this updating then[03:51:28] *** Roninkvf has left #opensolaris[03:51:45] <`Spike> http://pastebin.com/m3d0466bf[03:51:45] *** gnut has joined #opensolaris[03:51:50] <alanc> sponix2ipfw: the links to nvidia bugs from the X changelog don't work because nvidia bugs aren't published on opensolaris.org, not being open source[03:52:29] <alanc> (and because they may have information from nvidia we're not allowed to publish, like details of unannounced hardware)[03:52:40] <_Lewellyn> alanc: what's the best way for me to follow i915-related bugs?[03:52:58] <evocallaghan> alanc:Hi Alan[03:53:06] <_Lewellyn> i figure that since you work with X and most are X-related, you may have a magic bugzilla incantation that i could adapt :D[03:53:25] <gnut> hi[03:53:32] <sponix2ipfw> alanc: so I guess I'll just try it, and if it doesn't work roll back to my prior BE ;)[03:53:43] <gnut> has anyone experienced font issues with build 109?[03:53:44] <`Spike> Can anyone please provide input on my major zfs problems -> http://pastebin.com/m3d0466bf[03:53:51] <alanc> _Lewellyn: the best I know of you can do is set a RSS feed for a bugzilla search for i915, but I've never tried - I just get all desktop bugs, not a subset[03:53:51] <gnut> I get squares when I run some X apps[03:53:54] <oninoshiko> wow spike, howd you do that?[03:54:02] <alanc> evocallaghan: hello[03:54:37] <_Lewellyn> alanc: mmk. fair enough. i'm hoping to see my i915 issues all resolved soon. hopefully i'll have time to lodge bugs against the ones i see that i can't find in bugzilla, on friday.[03:54:41] <alanc> and there's no way for someone outside to subscribe to internal bugs without asking someone inside to add you to each and every one[03:54:55] *** syd`_ has joined #opensolaris[03:54:58] <`Spike> How'd i do which part?[03:55:04] <`Spike> I replaced 2 working drives with 2 new drives[03:55:09] <`Spike> and 1 non working drive with a new drive[03:55:18] <_Lewellyn> all at once?[03:55:20] <eviljames> did you tell the system you were doing so?[03:55:32] <`Spike> but because i did it in safe mode, the replacing's didn't go away, they usually do when I reboot fully into opensolaris[03:55:35] *** RavenSlay3r has quit IRC[03:55:40] <`Spike> yeah the system replaced them all[03:55:52] <`Spike> and I exported/imported/scrubbed/rebooted and scrubbed multiple times[03:55:58] <`Spike> so i know that the data -is- there and -is- intact[03:56:23] <`Spike> just for some reason it won't let me import -f it[03:56:46] *** bizkut has left #opensolaris[03:56:47] <`Spike> even though one vdev is missing, that shouldn't mean that i can't import the pool, if you look, both devices of every vdev except for one device of one vdev[03:56:54] <eviljames> `Spike: did you do any/all of zpool attach/detach/replace[03:57:04] <`Spike> i did zpool replace[03:57:11] <`Spike> attach/detach don't work for raidz pool iirc....[03:57:12] *** alain10 has joined #opensolaris[03:57:17] <`Spike> maybe attach does, but that's not what i was doing[03:57:31] *** piwi has quit IRC[03:57:33] <`Spike> i was replacing 2 ide drives with 2 sata drives, and that went through, then after that i replaced one failing drive with a new one[03:57:38] <`Spike> i was able to access the array[03:57:44] <`Spike> scrub the array, export and import it, etc[03:57:51] <eviljames> `Spike: it looks like there are 2 or more drives that are replaced simultaneously in a raidz1[03:57:59] <`Spike> so then i installed os109 (i had 106) and now i get that error[03:58:09] <eviljames> if you go to previous be, it works?[03:58:14] <`Spike> i don't know[03:58:18] <`Spike> i don't have the previous installed anymore[03:58:21] <`Spike> and no its not doing all 3 at once[03:58:24] <`Spike> all 3 replacements are done[03:58:28] <`Spike> its just not showingit for some reason[04:00:20] *** [JT] has joined #opensolaris[04:01:00] <`Spike> But even with the one vdev not replacing and thus showing as unaccessable, since it's raidz, and every other vdev is fully online, it should be able to import[04:01:16] <nachox> damn. where are arc cases now in src.opensolaris.org? i wanted to read gnureadline's case[04:01:51] <`Spike> anybody got any ideas?[04:01:55] <nachox> i'm wondering whether it was integrated or not because python should have been compiled with readline support[04:02:05] <`Spike> Like I said, previously all vdevs were online and the data was accessible and scrubbed 100%[04:03:29] <evocallaghan> alanc: Prob not your area however has anyone done some work on solaris getting KMS ?[04:03:44] <eviljames> `Spike: Do you still have the drive specified on line 21?[04:03:53] <eviljames> `Spike: and can you put it back into the machine temporarily?[04:04:00] <alanc> Kernel Modesetting? I think the Intel/DRI guys were looking at it[04:04:06] <gnut> X Error of failed request: BadName (named color or font does not exist)[04:04:06] <gnut> Major opcode of failed request: 45 (X_OpenFont)[04:04:10] <gnut> what does that mean?[04:04:13] <`Spike> well[04:04:16] <alanc> but yes, kernel/driver stuff is not my area[04:04:20] <`Spike> yes i have it, but it's been reformatted[04:04:21] <evocallaghan> alanc: Oh really? Any public code yet ?[04:04:33] <`Spike> nothing's been written to it, so that data is probably technically there, but not readily avail[04:04:39] <alanc> evocallaghan: I haven't the vaguest inkling of the slightest clue[04:04:41] <evocallaghan> Any names I can contact would be helpful[04:04:41] <`Spike> isn't there a way to tell zfs that the replace drive is fine[04:04:52] <evocallaghan> I see, ok[04:04:58] <`Spike> like its telling me that the one drive isn't finished replacing or whatever and is thus unaccessable[04:05:00] <`Spike> it is accessable[04:05:06] <eviljames> `Spike: try zpool replace -f[04:05:07] <`Spike> the drive that is in there contains a 100% resilvereed[04:05:14] <eviljames> `Spike: but can't guarantee that will work :/[04:05:19] <`Spike> replace -f?[04:05:24] <alanc> evocallaghan: try asking the people listed on http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/intelgraphics/leaders/[04:05:27] <`Spike> that command won't work on a non-mounted array[04:05:45] <alanc> gnut: it means your program asked for a font the Xserver doesn't have[04:05:51] <evocallaghan> alanc: Will do, thanks for your wisdom once again :)[04:05:57] *** syd` has quit IRC[04:06:05] <eviljames> `Spike: oh, duh. been a long day so far.. :D[04:06:22] <`Spike> that's alright at least you're trying to help[04:06:29] <`Spike> only a couple others have done that and i've been at it all day[04:06:51] <evocallaghan> I know Niveditha so I will talk to her[04:07:07] <eviljames> `Spike: turns out that support contract wouldn't have been such a bad investment after all, eh?[04:07:13] <eviljames> `Spike: (j/k of course)[04:07:24] <`Spike> lol[04:07:31] <gnut> alanc: but this same program worked before in build 105... so maybe the font disappeared. hmm... thanks for the decoding.[04:07:42] <`Spike> at this point i'm really upset (again) that i even played with zfs[04:07:52] <`Spike> this stuff always seems to happen[04:08:03] <`Spike> i upgrade and for some reason a pool that i could export/import/scrub is no longer importable[04:08:09] <`Spike> and it wasn't a major upgrade, only 3 versions.[04:08:28] <alanc> gnut: SXCE build 109 lost a bunch of fonts (well, old programs think they're lost because they're now -iso10646-1 (unicode) instead of -iso8859-1)[04:09:26] <_Lewellyn> alanc: will those be getting remapped? i haven't filed a bug on it, since i figure you plan on dealing with it :)[04:09:34] <eviljames> `Spike: Overall, I think your troubles are largely atypical. I've found that zfs is light years ahead of the competition.[04:09:37] <gnut> alanc: ahhh... okay[04:09:56] <_Lewellyn> and asking on irc is faster than filing a bug, anyhow ;)[04:09:57] <eviljames> `Spike: did you, by change, upgrade while changing disks around? Is it possible that one or more of these disks are running an older/newer version than the rest?[04:10:01] <`Spike> hmmmm well i seem to have alot of them :([04:10:18] <`Spike> naw all the disks should be running the same zfs version[04:10:32] <`Spike> i can't seem to figure out if the zfs version changed between 106 and 109[04:10:39] <`Spike> its at version 14 now, when did 14 come out?[04:10:53] <gnut> do we have to make a font alias to fix this issue then?[04:10:56] *** joanie has joined #opensolaris[04:10:58] <alanc> 6812503 Missing fonts after update to 109.[04:11:07] <_Lewellyn> alanc: thank you much :)[04:11:10] <alanc> fixed in nv_111[04:11:13] <_Lewellyn> sweet[04:11:26] <_Lewellyn> only 3 more weeks :D[04:11:55] * _Lewellyn is really hoping that 110 fixes his i915 graphics issues[04:12:19] <alanc> aliases only work if you only use ASCII characters, since iso8859-1 & iso10646-1 have different characters for values > 128[04:12:27] <_Lewellyn> oh ugh[04:12:29] *** felipe_ has joined #opensolaris[04:12:40] <eviljames> `Spike: couldn't tell you, sorry...[04:12:48] <`Spike> k, thx[04:12:48] <gnut> alanc: thanks...[04:13:10] <eviljames> `Spike: and zpool status -v (pool) doesn't tell you anything intersting?[04:13:15] <evocallaghan> _Lewellyn:Is it heaps slow ?[04:13:22] <eviljames> err[04:13:24] <`Spike> only about mounted pools, i can't mount/import mine[04:13:27] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[04:13:38] <eviljames> `Spike: yea, again, I'm spacing out on the whole "can't import" thing[04:13:48] <`Spike> i know me too, i should be able to.[04:13:51] <evocallaghan> _Lewellyn:The DRI stuff is missing in snv_109 afaik[04:13:52] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: um. 107 and newer have no acceleration, and S3 suspend breaks. and 109 introduces flicker when doing GL operations (which are still unaccelerated)[04:14:06] <evocallaghan> yep[04:14:06] <_Lewellyn> it's fallout from the xorg change, i think[04:14:13] <alanc> really, I thought they fixed i915 DRI in 109?[04:14:15] <evocallaghan> I am willing to bet its too do with this[04:14:20] <_Lewellyn> alanc: it's worse in 109. far worse.[04:14:20] <eviljames> `Spike: i'd be interested to know if/how you get this solved.[04:14:25] <evocallaghan> I think that's 110 alanc[04:14:31] <alanc> can tell I never use any intel machines[04:14:33] * evocallaghan checks again[04:14:42] <alanc> all my x86 boxes have nvidia graphics[04:14:43] <eviljames> `Spike: and what (more specifically) actually caused the problem, if you manage to diagnose it.[04:14:44] <evocallaghan> alanc: Its for the better ![04:15:05] <_Lewellyn> alanc: suspend is totally broken now, in 109. so i suspect that is from the new DRI[04:15:13] <alanc> well, except the Ferrari, which has ATI, but I don't use that much since getting the new Toshiba[04:15:45] <[JT]> Trying to get OpenSolaris to join my Windows domain is driving me crazy. Is there anyone here who is particularly knowledgeable on that process?[04:16:10] *** jfisc has quit IRC[04:16:15] * _Lewellyn is still waiting for toshiba's online store to sell opensolaris machines[04:17:42] <evocallaghan> _Lewellyn: Have you reported your bugs?[04:17:48] <evocallaghan> I would like to have a look please.[04:17:59] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: no. i'm beyond short on time atm[04:18:00] <[JT]> I suspect the domain join within might be broken; I've tried everything I can think of - down to snooping packets off the wire to try to figure the problem.[04:18:10] <_Lewellyn> i have it penciled in for friday[04:18:10] <evocallaghan> ok now worries[04:18:11] <[JT]> within smbd, that is.[04:18:19] <evocallaghan> s/now/no/[04:18:32] <evocallaghan> /poke me ok[04:18:33] *** syd`_ has quit IRC[04:18:35] <_Lewellyn> i wanted to do it today, but i spent a few hours dealing with zfs not being very graceful with ENOSPC[04:18:45] <evocallaghan> else put something on the mailing list and i'll be sure too have a look[04:18:46] <alanc> oh, there is the suspend bug I caused by fixing the IA extension to set the Xserver gid permissions correctly...[04:19:05] <alanc> what was that bug id?[04:19:20] <evocallaghan> alanc: I don't think he has one yet[04:19:21] <_Lewellyn> alanc: i forget. the one i saw was due to be fixed by the new DRM in 109[04:19:42] <alanc> no, I meant the bug id for the bug I was thinking of - I found it[04:19:47] <_Lewellyn> your fix was the one that caused the x server to reset on suspend, right?[04:20:05] <alanc> http://defect.opensolaris.org/bz/show_bug.cgi?id=6927 Xorg (Intel 945GM) aborts on resume from S3 suspend[04:20:08] *** abisen has joined #opensolaris[04:20:18] <_Lewellyn> yeah. that's the one[04:20:25] * evocallaghan tries not to confuse himself again[04:20:40] <_Lewellyn> but i can't even suspend in 109, to see if it's fixed[04:20:40] <abisen> there is a site (i can't recall the URL) from where i can download many different distro's in a tar.gz manner for brandZ[04:21:04] <abisen> can somebody ... tell me the URL to that site (i know it's a weired question)[04:21:34] <_Lewellyn> abisen: i've not heard of such a site[04:21:38] <evocallaghan> abisen:Check the BrandZ project page out for a little more details else someone will get to you I am sure.[04:21:55] <`Spike> Can anyone please provide input on my major zfs problems -> http://pastebin.com/m3d0466bf[04:22:01] <_Lewellyn> the only download i know is from the BrandZ page, which is a CentOS 3.7 image[04:22:01] <alanc> heh, I filed a RFE a few weeks ago about ENOSPC testing... http://bugs.opensolaris.org/bugdatabase/view_bug.do?bug_id=6807906[04:22:27] <evocallaghan> _Lewellyn:Well, if you can provide all them back traces for your two issues and such in bugs on friday I will be sure too look over them ok.[04:22:36] <_Lewellyn> alanc: this was a full zfs filesystem. :)[04:22:41] <abisen> evocallaghan: i have downloaded many different distro's from that site. it's not for brandz it's for brandZ kind of virtualization... do you know the technical acronym for what's brandZ kind of virtulization is known as[04:22:44] <_Lewellyn> turns out that deleting files takes more disk space :)[04:23:09] <evocallaghan> I don't use BrandZ sorry[04:23:10][04:23:16] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: i have far more than 2 issues. and no backtraces for things that don't crash ;)[04:23:20] <alanc> there's a site for virtualbox image downloads, but that's very very different than brandz[04:23:28] <evocallaghan> :([04:23:39] <evocallaghan> I have two main problems at the moment[04:23:52] <_Lewellyn> only centos 3 is officially supported as an lx brand right now, i think[04:24:06] <evocallaghan> e1000g bug I *think* and a big IOMMU bug in Intels code although this is a known problem[04:24:10] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: of course, if you file bugs, ping me.[04:24:42] * _Lewellyn can't wait for 111 so he can have opera look less like ass again :)[04:25:17] <nachox> 111? what integrates then?[04:25:37] <_Lewellyn> <@alanc> 6812503 Missing fonts after update to 109.[04:25:37] <_Lewellyn> <@alanc> fixed in nv_111[04:25:39] *** Cass has quit IRC[04:25:39] <evocallaghan> http://bugs.opensolaris.org/view_bug.do?bug_id=6811593 Intel IOMMU bug[04:25:59] * alanc can't wait for 111 so his Ultra 40 will boot again[04:26:06] <nachox> hehe[04:26:29] <gnut> is 111 coming out in three weeks?[04:26:33] <nachox> i have to learn how to debug suspend and resume bugs...[04:26:36] <_Lewellyn> something like that[04:26:55] <palowoda> That means alanc gets a three week vacation.[04:27:02] <evocallaghan> haha[04:27:04] <alanc> should be 4 weeks from last Friday for SXCE, since last Friday was 109 release[04:27:16] <evocallaghan> palowoda:Hey buddy[04:27:27] <gnut> okay... three weeks from this friday[04:27:31] <alanc> palowoda: I wish - now we start the 111 respins for the 2009.06 RC's[04:27:44] <gnut> now gotta somehow convince the boss I don't need to use that application that has font issues.[04:28:05] <evocallaghan> hot java gone cold[04:28:17] <alanc> you may be able to use the SUNWxwfnt from 105 until then to get the old fonts back[04:28:20] <_Lewellyn> mmm. i liked the hotjava browser[04:28:27] <nachox> 2009/164 CIFS guest access - approved :)[04:28:42] <gnut> alanc: hmmm... that's a thought.[04:29:12] <abisen> _Lewellyn: i found the site :) http://download.openvz.org/template/precreated/[04:29:28] <_Lewellyn> alanc: where can we pull that package without downloading the full iso? ;)[04:29:38] <_Lewellyn> abisen: openvz != solaris[04:29:50] <_Lewellyn> openvz == linux[04:30:08] <abisen> _Lewellyn: I understand and that's what i asked... these precreated tar ball's works perfectly fine with lx Zones[04:30:20] <_Lewellyn> really. i didn't know that.[04:30:38] <abisen> _Lewellyn: these are just tarball's (created just the way brandZ) asks for[04:30:39] *** Disorganized_ has joined #OpenSolaris[04:30:42] <_Lewellyn> i thought the openvz tarballs had things "removed" to work in openvz[04:30:48] <abisen> _Lewellyn: yup ;) saves a lot of time[04:30:52] <alanc> _Lewellyn: from the ISO's you saved from when you ran those builds[04:31:10] *** e1mer has joined #opensolaris[04:31:19] <abisen> _Lewellyn: you might wanna check them out i have tried many centos and fedora tarball's[04:31:21] <_Lewellyn> i haven't touched openvz in quite a while. but i remember the fun of trying to get non-"approved" distros running[04:31:41] <abisen> _Lewellyn: nothing other than fedora and centos[04:31:52] <_Lewellyn> i'm more interested in getting a distro supported by lx that no one yet has :)[04:31:58] *** e-jat has quit IRC[04:32:04] <_Lewellyn> alanc: i started at 106 :P[04:32:20] <alanc> _Lewellyn: 106 should work fine too[04:32:27] * jmcp starts the LU to 1109[04:32:27] <_Lewellyn> that's when lack of wifi on s10 annoyed me[04:32:29] * jmcp starts the LU to 110[04:32:30] <abisen> _Lewellyn: have you tried COMSTAR yet ?[04:32:36] <alanc> I just said 105 since that's what gnut said worked previously for him[04:32:42] <_Lewellyn> abisen: no. i don't think it's viable on a laptop anyhow[04:32:42] <alanc> anything older than 109 should work[04:32:56] <abisen> _Lewellyn: oh i did'nt knew you are on a laptop[04:33:09] <_Lewellyn> yes. that's why things like S3 being broken suck so muchn[04:33:17] <Chipdancer> jmcp: 1109! awesome.. do you give free rides in your TARDIS?[04:33:35] <jmcp> no, they cost moola :-)[04:33:44] * jmcp wonders where that damned wormhole went to....[04:33:58] <Chipdancer> that's ok, I only need 1 trip and I can pay you when I return ;)[04:34:06] <alanc> if LU still works when we get to build 1109, the IPS & Caiman teams will have a lot to answer for...[04:34:29] <evocallaghan> haha[04:34:31] <Chipdancer> alanc: does it work today?[04:34:46] <alanc> mostly[04:35:02] *** DerSaidi1 is now known as DerSaidin[04:35:20] <Chipdancer> my box seems to require I zfs export my large array before I LU :([04:35:22] * evocallaghan has had no problems with LU however lots with IPS[04:35:37] *** KOHJU is now known as kohju[04:36:00] <jmcp> alanc: *that* is for sure. And they'll owe some beer[04:37:00] <nrubsig> mhhh... build 1109[04:37:13] <nrubsig> welcome to year 2026[04:37:56] <evocallaghan> :O[04:38:05] <alanc> build 1109 will contain the EOL notice for 32-bit time_t, since otherwise people will still expect support 12 years later when it runs out of bits[04:38:23] *** Disorganized has quit IRC[04:38:32] <_Lewellyn> alanc: i would hope that'd happen in 500 or so :P[04:38:44] <palowoda> IPS == In Progress Sorta[04:38:56] <nrubsig> alanc: I think the EOL notice will arrive at 2012 when the EU creates an own set of reliabilty criteria all OSes must pass.[04:39:18] <Chipdancer> so how is IPS coming?[04:39:25] <nrubsig> alanc: this is the work my father is currently doing, as part of a joint DIN/ISO/EU effort.[04:39:46] <alanc> which they'll overturn when they find they can't buy a single OS anymore, and end up destroying the EU computer business[04:40:40] <nrubsig> alanc: actually the evaluation showed that it's possible to implement this easily. And I doubt they'll back-off.[04:41:26] <evocallaghan> awesome[04:41:26] <alanc> if it requires dropping support for the vast majority of running applications? possible does not equal commercially viable[04:41:56] <nrubsig> erm[04:42:30] <_Lewellyn> nrubsig: dropping support at the OS level will break lots of apps[04:42:32] <nrubsig> alanc: the point is that the OS is expected to work beyond 2050 without modifications. Support for "legacy applications" is likely allowed.[04:42:53] <alanc> then it's not EOL'ing 32-bit time_t[04:43:32] <alanc> maybe adding more bags on the side like the large file 64-bit-in-32-bit app junk[04:43:34] <`Spike> okay[04:43:36] <`Spike> so fingers crossed[04:43:37] <`Spike> its importing now[04:43:37] *** gnut has quit IRC[04:43:51] <`Spike> but i booted to milax live cd os distro and it shows degraded instead of unavail[04:43:54] <`Spike> and i'm importing...[04:44:02] <`Spike> its imported![04:44:08] <Teltariat> So I've got OpenSolaris[04:44:09] <eviljames> `Spike: Sweet![04:44:09] <`Spike> so something's up with b109[04:44:17] <`Spike> with 106 and milax i'm able to import this array[04:44:18] <Teltariat> How do I got about setting up a plain Solaris 10 zone inside of OpenSolaris?[04:44:20] <eviljames> `Spike: Can you now scrub and export?[04:44:22] <`Spike> with 109 it shows as unavail[04:44:25] <`Spike> i'm scrubbing now.[04:44:28] <`Spike> but its imported[04:44:33] <`Spike> thats better than nothing :)[04:44:35] <_Lewellyn> Teltariat: i don't think you can yet[04:44:52] <`Spike> scrubbing[04:45:01] <Teltariat> _Lewellyn: say it ain't so[04:45:09] <Teltariat> please say it ain't so[04:45:11] * `Spike hugs the ~8TB of data :)[04:45:11] <Teltariat> :([04:45:13] <_Lewellyn> that's what i've been told when i've asked[04:45:21] <Teltariat> That really sucks[04:45:35] <`Spike> okay so first a scrub[04:45:48] <`Spike> then a replace -f to try and get rid of these drives that are stuck in the replacing state[04:46:04] <_Lewellyn> Teltariat: if you find out otherwise, please ping me.[04:46:05] <evocallaghan> Try a fmadm faulty while your at it[04:46:19] <_Lewellyn> Teltariat: you can still make an S8 or S9 zone on sparc tho[04:46:46] <`Spike> all drives are fine, that was part of my prior diagnosis[04:47:16] <Teltariat> _Lewellyn: I only have x86, and I'm only interested in 10 and up[04:52:20] *** uhs has joined #opensolaris[04:54:44] *** gnut has joined #opensolaris[04:56:12] *** krisis has left #opensolaris[04:56:34] <_Lewellyn> Teltariat: that's the best i can offer :([04:56:49] <Teltariat> I thank you for your help anyway, _Lew[04:57:28] *** alain10 has quit IRC[05:00:26] *** gnut has quit IRC[05:00:27] <abisen> anybody has some COMSTAR experience here ?[05:01:08] <abisen> i am getting better throughput on my 5 x Disk RAIDZ using iscsi (iscsitadm) than the fiber-channel based raidZ[05:01:15] <abisen> clearly something is wrong[05:01:38] *** m0zzzy has joined #opensolaris[05:05:15] <evocallaghan> Anyone clued up one Solaris/NIS/NFS ?[05:06:22] <evocallaghan> I just need to find out which packages are safe to remove in regards to RPC/NIS/NFS but keep the in kernel ZFS/NFS function working and any userland stuff needed to mount at the other end[05:06:33] <evocallaghan> Don't really need all the old crud[05:06:54] <e^ipi> umm...[05:06:57] <evocallaghan> Anyone could give me a idea which if at all are the packages to remove for the old crud ?[05:06:58] <e^ipi> do you know how NFS works?[05:07:12] <e^ipi> RPC is kinna part of the package[05:07:12] <Plazma> why are you even messing with stuff you dont understand[05:07:14] <evocallaghan> Only the basics of it[05:07:20] <evocallaghan> I used it[05:07:26] <evocallaghan> If that is what your asking[05:07:32] <Plazma> are you short on space or something?[05:07:34] <evocallaghan> on a debian box mainly[05:07:39] <Plazma> or are you trying to turn it into gentoo[05:07:50] <evocallaghan> space/services cutting down for our distro[05:07:56] <evocallaghan> lol, hell no ![05:08:03] *** devians has quit IRC[05:08:16] *** nrubsig has quit IRC[05:08:17] *** devians has joined #opensolaris[05:08:44] <evocallaghan> Just cutting down service manifests and maybe some space too in order to save boot times as well.[05:09:11] <evocallaghan> Found out where finger and rlogin where hiding and purged them[05:09:29] *** jmcp has quit IRC[05:09:37] *** devians has quit IRC[05:09:47] *** devians has joined #opensolaris[05:10:37] <Plazma> your 'distro'[05:10:39] <Plazma> what is this linux crap[05:11:34] <_Lewellyn> uh oh. Plazma is in here, too. <3[05:11:43] <Plazma> im everywhere[05:11:47] <eviljames> Plazma: I think you were the one who said one of my favorite quotes: "BRB gotta go take a huge ubuntu"[05:11:50] *** Teltariat has quit IRC[05:11:57] <evocallaghan> Don't worry about the application of the question, just answer the question if you can[05:12:01] <eviljames> Plazma: If so, you are an epic, legendary genius and I applaud you.[05:12:16] <Plazma> eviljames, that was me yes[05:12:21] <Plazma> and yes, i am really that awesome[05:12:40] <evocallaghan> That's quite a epic quote however.[05:12:50] <Plazma> i have my moments[05:13:41] <e^ipi> evocallaghan: the answer to the question is "don't fiddle with things that you don't understand"[05:13:54] *** uhs has quit IRC[05:13:56] <e^ipi> read about how NFS works before you start ripping bits out of it[05:14:27] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:In other words you don't know so I should read up on it.[05:14:34] <Plazma> yea.. rpc is one of those things i never really bothered to tweak out[05:14:45] <Plazma> or remove any part of[05:14:55] *** syd` has quit IRC[05:15:03] <e^ipi> evocallaghan: whether I know or not is irrelevant, what's important is if /you/ know[05:15:03] <eviljames> evocallaghan: haha, e^ipi is beyond right in this case.[05:15:07] <Plazma> OMG rpc is such a security vulnerability, they say[05:15:19] <e^ipi> Plazma: RPC is a concept[05:15:30] <Plazma> no,[05:15:30] <e^ipi> some applications and implementations of it are bad... others are good[05:15:33] <Plazma> its a WAY OF LIFE![05:15:41] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[05:15:56] <evocallaghan> I know doc/801-6634 but that's really the only one I've read though properly I believe on the solaris side of NFS which is different from how Linux did it.[05:16:24] <Plazma> you know, there is women in the real world, right?[05:16:30] <evocallaghan> NFS is pritty crappy[05:17:05] <evocallaghan> CIFS was one of them good things that came from M$haft however I don't believe they came up with it maybe wrong[05:17:45] <Plazma> do you ever listen to yourself when you talk?[05:18:00] <evocallaghan> e^ipi: You just always answer a question with a statement about that person rather then try to answer the question.[05:18:05] *** a_k_e has quit IRC[05:18:20] <eviljames> I don't think Plazma == e^ipi[05:18:22] <evocallaghan> I'm not talking I am typing[05:18:24] <evocallaghan> ;)[05:19:15] <evocallaghan> eviljames:No I was speaking to the young one[05:19:44] <eviljames> I happen to have met e^ipi not long ago. He got into the bar, didn't seem that young to me.[05:20:07] <evocallaghan> haha[05:20:14] <evocallaghan> they let him in ;)[05:20:22] <eviljames> then I took him home and had my way with him[05:20:30] <evocallaghan> e^ipi - 1 =0[05:20:39] <eviljames> uh... that last part may or may not have happened.[05:20:43] <Plazma> stop speaking in tounges[05:20:48] * evocallaghan spews up yet more blood[05:20:56] <e^ipi> that sounds serious man[05:21:03] <e^ipi> maybe you should see a doctor or something?[05:21:14] <evocallaghan> Yep[05:21:51] <evocallaghan> Ubuntu comes with pre installed AIDs now don't you know[05:22:16] <e^ipi> what kind of aids? hearing aids ?[05:22:20] <e^ipi> or like, visual aids?[05:22:23] <Plazma> haha[05:22:24] <Plazma> visual aids[05:22:28] <Plazma> my teacher said i had that once[05:22:40] <Plazma> she was my first 'time'[05:22:54] <evocallaghan> John; both ![05:23:21] <evocallaghan> Is that how you got the AIDs ?[05:23:23] <evocallaghan> haha[05:23:28] <evocallaghan> spew'in[05:23:41] <Plazma> so how about ada? isn't it dead in the 1980s?[05:23:59] <e^ipi> way of the future man... way of the future[05:24:30] <Plazma> my piss poor OO is no match for Ada's manliness[05:24:37] <Plazma> like the mexican justice league[05:24:54] <e^ipi> *shrug* turing complete languages are turing complete languages.[05:26:27] <evocallaghan> nope![05:26:36] <evocallaghan> read up on it[05:26:54] <e^ipi> no what? no it's not the way of the future or no it's not turing complete[05:27:02] <e^ipi> ( or both? )[05:27:11] <evocallaghan> just say no[05:27:42] <evocallaghan> "Treat your mother right"[05:27:55] <evocallaghan> ^tm Mr. T[05:27:57] <Plazma> ill treat your mother right[05:28:21] <evocallaghan> I'm sure... you like the dead sort ay ?[05:28:26] <e^ipi> while funny, i can't encourage that ... take it to #solaris[05:28:36] <Plazma> indeed[05:28:40] <evocallaghan> quite[05:28:41] <e^ipi> or as i like to call it, the toilet[05:28:44] <Plazma> i hadn't planned to escalate it any farther[05:28:51] <Plazma> now now, don't hate on my toilet[05:29:24] * evocallaghan plops a few cores out of his ubuntu[05:30:15] <evocallaghan> e^ipi: Didn't you use to work for Starbucks[05:30:43] <evocallaghan> I ask because a friend of mine from the US said he has seen you before O_o[05:31:02] <e^ipi> well, seeing as how i'm not from the US, that's unlikely[05:32:45] <evocallaghan> Hmm, he said he seen someone who looks like you from your pic[05:32:49] <evocallaghan> He travels a lot[05:32:56] <evocallaghan> However he is from the US[05:33:25] <evocallaghan> This was about a year back[05:33:35] <evocallaghan> However I thought it was funny[05:33:48] <e^ipi> because someone looked like me?[05:33:49] <evocallaghan> Coffee is however good[05:33:53] <evocallaghan> Yes[05:33:59] * e^ipi doesn't get it[05:34:02] <evocallaghan> No..[05:34:04] <evocallaghan> rofl[05:34:10] *** barfoed has joined #opensolaris[05:34:27] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: half of the things said in here make little sense[05:34:46] * evocallaghan hands e^ipi a tip[05:35:02] <evocallaghan> _Lewellyn:seems you got it[05:35:05] <evocallaghan> ;)[05:35:25] <e^ipi> tips @ *$ suck, by the way[05:35:29] <e^ipi> nobody tips their coffee monkey[05:36:03] <_Lewellyn> e^ipi: and they're distributed suckily[05:36:52] <e^ipi> _Lewellyn: especially in california, where shift supervisors ( who do everything the under staff do, plus do the books at closing and count-in on open ) are considered management, and don't get tips[05:37:08] <_Lewellyn> yup[05:37:43] <_Lewellyn> i don't like starbucks because of they divvy up tips[05:38:31] <_Lewellyn> i started making it a point to just buy lunch or something occasionally for the baristas that i felt deserved good tips[05:38:39] <evocallaghan> So you _do_ work in Starbucks then ?[05:38:42] <evocallaghan> or did?[05:39:03] <eviljames> That doesn't seem to be implied at all...[05:39:04] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: i think e^ipi and i both have been to many coffee shops ;)[05:39:17] <evocallaghan> hmm, actually must press on with this IOMMU code[05:39:50] <evocallaghan> order in bulk its cheaper[05:39:59] *** syd`_ has joined #opensolaris[05:40:07] <evocallaghan> ok, better jet[05:40:18] <evocallaghan> Thanks for the catch up lads. Have a good one.[05:40:22] * evocallaghan &[05:40:59] <eviljames> Plazma: btw, I'm going to steal that quote. but I'll credit you if I feel like it.[05:40:59] <_Lewellyn> dude. wtf. 9:45pm and i just now am thinking i'm done working for the day[05:41:14] <_Lewellyn> i wasn't intending to have billable hours today[05:41:30] *** syd` has quit IRC[05:41:34] <_Lewellyn> eviljames: don't ask Plazma what he'd like... you may not like the answer :P[05:41:48] <eviljames> _Lewellyn: re-read, then reply :D[05:43:40] <_Lewellyn> just warning you :)[05:44:46] <eviljames> I was telling him what I would like though. Not asking anything[05:46:18] <_Lewellyn> well, you know... one thing leads to another... then, the next thing you know... BAM! you're both pregnant[05:46:53] <oninoshiko> o.0[05:48:20] *** kohju is now known as KOHJU[05:50:45] *** KOHJU is now known as kohju[05:55:01] <evocallaghan> Anyone seen in snv_109 a heap of messages while shutting down " /kernel/bla/bla is neither a 32-bit nor a 64-bit ELF" ?[05:55:06] <lesterc> nachox: nice! (re cifs guest support)[05:55:19] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: not i[05:55:32] <_Lewellyn> i see a bunch of stuff transition to maintenance, however[05:55:36] *** SeanieB has joined #opensolaris[05:55:39] <alanc> 6807370 bootadm emits wrong WARNING messages about ELF endianess[05:55:56] <SeanieB> HEy[05:56:01] <_Lewellyn> alanc++[05:56:03] <SeanieB> I'm trying to install OpenSolaris[05:56:06] *** photon_chac has joined #opensolaris[05:56:10] <SeanieB> And it failed righto ut of the gate[05:56:30] <_Lewellyn> SeanieB: can you give something a bit more specific? :)[05:56:30] <alanc> alanc saw someone complain about that in the internal ON developer channel a few hours ago and still had the answer from the ON developer in his scrollback[05:56:40] <evocallaghan> alanc: Ah thanks ![05:57:00] <_Lewellyn> alanc: :)[05:57:04] <SeanieB> "fdisk: -n -F failed: Cou'dn't create fdisk partition table on disk c4d0[05:57:32] <SeanieB> how I set this up is like this[05:57:41] <SeanieB> someone let me know if this shouldnt work or something[05:57:50] <SeanieB> I used gparted[05:58:09] <SeanieB> Windows XP is on a 345 GB partition, windows 7 on a 120 GB one[05:58:23] <SeanieB> I resize the XP one down another 120 GB[05:58:27] <SeanieB> split that in half[05:58:33] <SeanieB> one 60 GB partition[05:58:43] <SeanieB> I want to use for opensolaris[05:58:52] <SeanieB> it's formatted as ext2[05:58:59] <SeanieB> I picked it in the installer[05:59:02] <SeanieB> and here we are[05:59:03] <_Lewellyn> um. all i'd use gparted for is changing the partition type to solaris[05:59:26] <SeanieB> ...[05:59:33] <SeanieB> I used it to split another partition[05:59:42] <SeanieB> to free up another partition for solaris[05:59:51] <_Lewellyn> the windows 7 disk management snap-in is quite capable at all the other tasks[05:59:58] <_Lewellyn> and it's more likely to do "the right thing"[06:00:13] <SeanieB> but win7 cant resize disks nondestructively[06:00:23] <_Lewellyn> it can't? vista can.[06:00:35] <SeanieB> I know the partition is fine - my problem is opensolaris wont install to it[06:00:44] <_Lewellyn> it will only install onto a primary partition[06:00:46] <SeanieB> I said an error code a few lines back[06:01:46] <SeanieB> it's set as a primary partition[06:01:47] <_Lewellyn> i don't know about the osol installer, but the partitioning screen in sxce sucks. the same suck it's been for years, so i can deal with it, but still it's easier to do outside the installer[06:01:57] <_Lewellyn> and has a type... *thinks* BF?[06:02:08] <SeanieB> but iirc there can only br one primary partition[06:02:09] <_Lewellyn> yeah. bf is solaris[06:02:10] <SeanieB> isnt that right?[06:02:12] <_Lewellyn> no[06:02:16] <_Lewellyn> 4 primary partitions[06:02:16] <SeanieB> I'm using opensolaris[06:02:17] <SeanieB> then[06:02:19] <SeanieB> yes[06:02:26] <SeanieB> I now have four primary partitions[06:02:34] <SeanieB> I'm not going to make any more[06:02:41] <SeanieB> opensolaris will still not work[06:02:46] <SeanieB> two are NTFS[06:02:53] <SeanieB> the other two are ext[06:02:56] <_Lewellyn> you're 110% positive that gparted didn't try to be "smart" and make an extended partition?[06:03:06] <evocallaghan> doesn't solaris have extended partition support now since 106 or something. maybe you can't install to it?[06:03:13] <SeanieB> anyway to check?[06:03:15] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: i dunno.[06:03:27] <_Lewellyn> SeanieB: you could use the solaris fdisk[06:03:28] <oninoshiko> its just fine as long as you only want one OS... and really why would you want more then one?[06:03:30] <_Lewellyn> see what it sees[06:03:42] <evocallaghan> Make sure the solaris partition is at the start of the disk[06:03:49] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: unnecessary[06:03:57] <evocallaghan> I was aware of a bug that this stops the installer[06:03:59] <SeanieB> what?[06:04:11] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: oh. is that an osol bug? wouldn't bite me[06:04:34] <evocallaghan> I believe it hits everyone using ON builds[06:04:42] <SeanieB> oka[06:04:42] <evocallaghan> sxce and osol[06:04:46] <SeanieB> I'mma make it easier[06:04:50] <SeanieB> reboot to gparted again[06:04:53] <SeanieB> and make sure it's extended[06:05:04] <_Lewellyn> SeanieB: you mean not extended[06:05:10] <SeanieB> err[06:05:11] <SeanieB> yeah[06:05:12] <SeanieB> sorry[06:05:21] <_Lewellyn> and has a partition type of 0xbf[06:05:27] <evocallaghan> Can you see if its a the start of the disk[06:05:36] <SeanieB> ...I know it's not at the start of the disk[06:05:40] <_Lewellyn> evocallaghan: i installed 106 just fine onto partition 4 at the end of my disk[06:05:42] <SeanieB> XP is in the 1st partition[06:05:44] <evocallaghan> I am pretty sure this is what your hitting[06:06:04] <evocallaghan> _Lewellyn: Not everyone hits it[06:06:18] <evocallaghan> Can a partition be shifted ?[06:06:24] <_Lewellyn> http://nopaste.info/f3b9c9887d.html[06:06:34] <_Lewellyn> that's about what you should see from solaris fdisk[06:06:55] <SeanieB> oka[06:07:06] <SeanieB> I resetted the machien[06:07:12] <SeanieB> popping in gpared again[06:07:15] <_Lewellyn> if it's sxce, you can abort the installer early on and use fdisk[06:07:18] <_Lewellyn> not sure about osol[06:07:20] *** radsy has quit IRC[06:07:33] <SeanieB> any specific partition type I should format it as to make things easioer while im at it[06:07:57] <_Lewellyn> 0xbf[06:08:02] <SeanieB> im using opensolaris - kinda why I'm here[06:08:15] <_Lewellyn> sxce is "an" opensolaris ;)[06:08:31] <SeanieB> okay[06:08:36] <SeanieB> gparted live is booting up[06:09:16] <SeanieB> okay all booted[06:09:22] <SeanieB> hold on it's scanning the disk[06:09:29] <_Lewellyn> does that machine have net access?[06:09:41] <SeanieB> IT's a wifi card unfortunately[06:09:45] <SeanieB> but in a pinch I could tether it to this one[06:10:00] <_Lewellyn> bah. mmk. i was going to have you pastebin the cfdisk output.[06:10:01] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[06:10:02] <SeanieB> this laptop has wireless and I can use internet connection sharing[06:10:17] *** javatexan has left #opensolaris[06:10:35] <SeanieB> I dont have 0xbf in the format list[06:10:38] <SeanieB> I have[06:11:34] <SeanieB> ext2,ext3,fat16,fat32,hfs,hfs+,jfs,linuxswap,ntfs,reiser4,reiserfs,ufs,xfs[06:11:36] <_Lewellyn> that's because one generally doesn't use gparted :P[06:11:43] *** g4lt-lappy has joined #opensolaris[06:11:47] <_Lewellyn> leave it unformatted and drop to fdisk or cfdisk after[06:11:49] <SeanieB> IT's what I have at hand right now[06:12:09] <SeanieB> it will be the second partition on disk then[06:12:24] <_Lewellyn> if it's the livecd i think it is, you can launch cfdisk from the menu[06:12:35] <SeanieB> okay[06:12:38] <SeanieB> restarting again[06:12:51] <SeanieB> after this unloads I'm gonna boot back up to opensolaris' live CD[06:13:05] <_Lewellyn> um. you don't need to reboot to launch cfdisk[06:13:15] <_Lewellyn> or did you change the type already?[06:13:41] <SeanieB> I didnt change the type[06:13:45] <SeanieB> I just was on gparted[06:13:49] <SeanieB> and I deleted teh partiton[06:13:56] <SeanieB> now I'm going back to the solaris live CD[06:14:05] <SeanieB> isnt that what you meant?[06:14:25] <SeanieB> oh well[06:14:27] <SeanieB> doesn't matter[06:14:31] <SeanieB> did the job anyway[06:14:44] <SeanieB> opensolaris is booting up....[06:14:55] <_Lewellyn> osol won't install on a partition that's not type 0xbf...[06:15:08] <SeanieB> thats why I deformatted the partition[06:15:11] <SeanieB> deleted it[06:15:23] <_Lewellyn> mmk. hope it works :)[06:15:25] <SeanieB> I can format ir properly from the solaris cd, right?[06:15:32] <SeanieB> like right now it's empty space[06:15:35] <_Lewellyn> i don't use osol, but i think so[06:15:35] <SeanieB> see wht I mean?[06:15:45] <SeanieB> X is starting up....[06:16:17] *** cwebber has quit IRC[06:16:23] *** fallenhitokiri has quit IRC[06:16:53] <SeanieB> see[06:16:58] <_Lewellyn> ?[06:17:09] <SeanieB> I wish the installer had a "use largest free space" option[06:17:16] <SeanieB> so it would format it to it's liking and continue[06:17:34] <SeanieB> I'm going to check if it's there now that there is empty space[06:17:35] <_Lewellyn> solaris fdisk is very not-friendly[06:17:39] *** radsy has joined #opensolaris[06:18:07] <_Lewellyn> for a long time, x86 was a "to shut people up" sort of red-headed stepchild :([06:18:16] <SeanieB> I noticed it's also kinda slow[06:18:24] <SeanieB> haha[06:18:27] <SeanieB> that's what I thought[06:18:33] <SeanieB> seemed under maintained imo[06:18:38] <_Lewellyn> but x86 has become a first-class citizen over the past 10 years or so[06:18:55] <SeanieB> see[06:19:03] <_Lewellyn> fdisk is just one of those things that needs love still[06:19:11] <SeanieB> I've used a lot of Linux but I've never seriously used Solaris[06:19:24] <SeanieB> since opensolaris is more up to date I decided to try it[06:19:32] <SeanieB> I have an old solaris dvd somewhere[06:19:36] <SeanieB> I think I used it once[06:20:04] *** kohju is now known as KOHJU[06:20:04] <_Lewellyn> i'd recommend updating your installation to 106 after you're done, btw. if this is 2008.11, it will be 101 or something like that.[06:20:19] *** evocallaghan has left #opensolaris[06:20:38] <SeanieB> how d'ya do that?[06:20:47] <_Lewellyn> if you have an i915/i945-based system, i'd stay at 106 for a couple weeks yet[06:20:59] <_Lewellyn> um i don't know. it's different on sxce and osol. :P[06:21:06] <SeanieB> i915?[06:21:10] <_Lewellyn> sxce still does things "the old, solaris way"[06:21:13] <_Lewellyn> intel chipsets[06:21:13] <SeanieB> is that a chipset or something?[06:21:15] <SeanieB> oh[06:21:21] <SeanieB> I havbe an intel p45 chipset[06:21:31] <_Lewellyn> dunno what a p45 is...[06:21:58] <SeanieB> okay[06:22:03] <SeanieB> so I used the installer[06:22:05] <SeanieB> if this doesnt work[06:22:10] <SeanieB> ten I'll go do it manually[06:22:11] <_Lewellyn> hm. seems p45 may be i915-based[06:22:20] <SeanieB> but I set "unused" to 60 GB[06:22:41] <SeanieB> oh no[06:22:43] <SeanieB> it's broken[06:22:51] <SeanieB> it's trying to use the entire drive[06:22:53] <SeanieB> lol[06:23:30] <SeanieB> dude[06:23:33] <SeanieB> what the hell?[06:23:37] <SeanieB> Iset it to 60[06:23:44] <SeanieB> and it magically goes up to 465[06:23:48] <SeanieB> which is the entire drive[06:23:52] <SeanieB> (500 GB HDD)[06:24:24] <_Lewellyn> manually set a partition as type 0xbf[06:24:26] <SeanieB> this ius bizarre[06:24:42] <_Lewellyn> gparted always does screwy things when i try to do stuff with non-linux OSes[06:25:17] <SeanieB> ...[06:25:21] <SeanieB> it's unused space[06:25:23] <SeanieB> it's gone[06:25:25] <SeanieB> there is nothign there[06:25:40] <SeanieB> thats the point so solaris can set it up however it wants[06:25:54] <_Lewellyn> but gparted seems to do "bad things" to the partition table[06:26:25] <SeanieB> since you said fdisk is "unfriendly[06:26:30] *** gorem has joined #opensolaris[06:26:36] <SeanieB> mind walkin me through?[06:29:08] <SeanieB> wow[06:29:16] <SeanieB> I have to specify all hese atributes?[06:29:20] <SeanieB> that's insane[06:31:27] *** e1kg has quit IRC[06:31:49] <_Lewellyn> attributes?[06:32:17] <_Lewellyn> you should be able to fdisk /dev/rdsk/c0d0p0 (or whatever your hard disk is on)[06:32:21] <SeanieB> I'm looking at fdisk -h and this is insane[06:32:25] <_Lewellyn> then use 1 to create a partition[06:32:37] <_Lewellyn> there's a tui if you just invoke fdisk with a device name[06:33:03] *** radsy has quit IRC[06:33:17] <oninoshiko> you shouldn't need any of those.[06:33:27] <SeanieB> well[06:33:33] <SeanieB> the installer fails[06:33:41] <SeanieB> I set it to use the 60 GB of unused space[06:33:50] <SeanieB> it complains it had to adjust it for the other partitions[06:33:52] *** jmcp has joined #opensolaris[06:33:58] <SeanieB> blows to the entire disk size[06:33:59] <SeanieB> and[06:34:07] <SeanieB> refuses to use the space[06:34:53] *** xy|ox has joined #opensolaris[06:40:35] *** thunderbyte has joined #opensolaris[06:41:38] *** radsy has joined #opensolaris[06:42:21] *** freakazoid0223 has quit IRC[06:42:47] <SeanieB> err[06:42:56] <SeanieB> I cant find what device my drive is[06:44:33] <jmcp> iostat -En[06:44:35] <jmcp> to start with[06:45:15] <SeanieB> c4do?[06:45:24] <jmcp> c4d0[06:45:31] <jmcp> controller #4, disk 0[06:45:34] <jmcp> that's PATA[06:45:35] <SeanieB> okay[06:45:38] <SeanieB> wait[06:45:40] <SeanieB> pata?[06:45:44] <SeanieB> it's on sata[06:45:44] <jmcp> controller number is generated from the PCI bus probe order[06:45:50] <jmcp> operating in legacy mode[06:45:56] <jmcp> what sort of controller is it?[06:46:02] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[06:46:08] <SeanieB> the CD rom drive is on pata, which says it;s on c3[06:46:16] *** syd`_ has quit IRC[06:46:25] <SeanieB> pata = IDE[06:46:28] <SeanieB> right?[06:46:49] <SeanieB> not sure what kind of controller it is[06:47:01] <SeanieB> but is that what I give fdisk[06:47:56] <SeanieB> cannot stat device[06:48:27] *** xRaich[o]2x has joined #opensolaris[06:48:52] <jmcp> SeanieB: how about telling me the actual command line that you typed in, rather than assuming I know what you're talkinga bout[06:49:04] <SeanieB> fdisk c4d0[06:49:46] <SeanieB> fdisk: cannot stat device c4d0[06:49:48] <jmcp> so if you look at /dev/dsk/c4d0*, you'll see a few options[06:49:58] <jmcp> what do you hope to achieve from running fdisk on that disk?[06:50:08] <jmcp> ie, why are you running fdisk rather than format ?[06:50:22] <SeanieB> someone suggested it?[06:50:28] <SeanieB> see[06:50:35] <SeanieB> I have a bit of free space[06:50:40] <SeanieB> I want to partition for solaris[06:50:41] <SeanieB> and[06:50:44] <SeanieB> opensolaris[06:50:52] <SeanieB> the installer is screwing up[06:51:12] <SeanieB> so I want to try doing it maually[06:51:47] <SeanieB> when I tell the installer to use unused space[06:51:54] <SeanieB> it tries to set itself to the entire drive[06:51:56] <SeanieB> size[06:52:08] <SeanieB> when all I want it to use is this 60 GB I set aside[06:52:22] <_Lewellyn> jmcp: i suggested fdisk simply because format's bitten me when i have multiple non-solaris partitions[06:52:31] <SeanieB> yeah[06:52:37] <jmcp> ah, ok[06:53:20] <SeanieB> so what shoudl I do?[06:53:23] <SeanieB> continue with fdisk?[06:53:43] *** radsy has quit IRC[06:53:53] <jmcp> SeanieB: so have a look at /dev/dsk/c4d0p?[06:54:00] <jmcp> you'll see p0, p1, p2, p3, p4[06:54:05] <jmcp> p0 is the entire disk,[06:54:15] <jmcp> p1..4 are the DOS-style Primary Partitions[06:54:16] *** jwk404 has joined #opensolaris[06:54:24] <jmcp> within one of those, you'll install OpenSolaris[06:54:33] <SeanieB> no such file or directory[06:54:57] <jmcp> SeanieB: again with the channeling, geeez[06:55:17] <SeanieB> sorry[06:55:22] *** backspace has quit IRC[06:55:37] <SeanieB> I typed cd /dev/dsk/c4d0p[06:55:47] <jmcp> did you not see the "?" that I put there?[06:55:55] <jmcp> /dev/dsk/c4d0p?[06:55:58] <SeanieB> oh[06:56:09] <SeanieB> I thoguht you were asking a question[06:56:28] <jmcp> nope[06:56:47] <jmcp> it's a regex element -- "?" like that indicates "any _one_ character"[06:56:47] <SeanieB> cd /dev/dsk/c4d0p0: not a directory[06:56:55] <jmcp> correct, it isn't a directory, it's a file[06:57:05] <SeanieB> okay[06:57:12] <SeanieB> so what do I open it on[06:57:14] <SeanieB> fdisk?[06:57:16] <jmcp> "*" would mean "any number of characters" --> /dev/dsk/c4d* means anything that starts with /dev/dsk/c4d[06:57:17] <jmcp> yes[06:57:22] <jmcp> fdisk /dev/dsk/c4d0p0[06:58:15] <SeanieB> fdisk: /dev/dsk/c4d0p0 must be a raw device[06:58:25] *** lewellyn_ has quit IRC[06:58:41] <CIA-40> Ric Aleshire <Ric.Aleshire at Sun dot COM>: 6815404 net_mac_aware priv mistakenly removed from default TX zones[06:58:41] <SeanieB> shold I try p? then?[06:58:44] <CIA-40> John Wren Kennedy <John.Wren.Kennedy at Sun dot COM>: 6420952 rpc.metad hangs in a stat call on a SAM FS mount point causing metaclust to hang, 6675565 metaclust: Could not re-initialise rpc.mdcommd for set oban_20, 6752692 md ioctl code needs to go on a diet[06:58:52] <jmcp> SeanieB: oh, sorry -- /dev/rdsk/c4d0p0[06:59:03] <jmcp> I don't use fdisk very often so I often forget the "r"[06:59:17] *** [JT] has left #opensolaris[06:59:18] <jmcp> "r" in this context means the "raw" device, and it's a character device rather than a block device[06:59:23] <jmcp> you create filesystems on block devices[06:59:57] <SeanieB> fdisk: cannot open device /dev/rdsk/c4d0po[07:00:00] *** niq has joined #opensolaris[07:00:03] <SeanieB> **p0[07:00:05] <SeanieB> sorry[07:00:13] <SeanieB> I'm relaying this manually over here[07:00:16] <SeanieB> not pasting it[07:00:43] <SeanieB> remember: the first partiton is NTFS[07:00:48] <SeanieB> dunno if that is important[07:01:03] <SeanieB> solaris will not be the first partition.[07:01:07] <jmcp> that shouldn't be a problem[07:01:21] *** oxygen-addict has joined #opensolaris[07:01:24] <SeanieB> so I typed[07:01:37] <SeanieB> fdisk /dev/rdsk/c4d0p0[07:02:26] <SeanieB> should I restart after the installer deciding to fail on me or what?[07:02:56] <jmcp> what did fdisk give you?[07:03:17] <SeanieB> I already said it - look up[07:03:21] <SeanieB> fdisk: cannot open device /dev/rdsk/c4d0p0[07:04:06] <SeanieB> This would be so much easier if I had a whole HDD to use for it but alas I just have one big one[07:04:09] <SeanieB> :P[07:04:18] <jmcp> ok, so just run "format" instead[07:04:44] <jmcp> btw, do you have the option of forcing SATA or AHCI in the bios?[07:04:44] *** oxygen-a1dict has quit IRC[07:05:04] <SeanieB> no permission or no disks found[07:05:05] <SeanieB> from format[07:05:09] <SeanieB> does this need sudo?[07:05:25] <SeanieB> how am I supposed to know the password on the livecd's root account[07:05:33] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[07:05:46] <jmcp> SeanieB: the livecd's password is documented - "root" account has "opensolaris" as the password[07:05:47] *** syd`_ has joined #opensolaris[07:05:50] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[07:05:54] <SeanieB> oh okay[07:05:58] <jmcp> the livecd's default login is "jack" with password "jack"[07:06:01] <jmcp> pfexec format[07:06:04] <jmcp> that's what you want[07:06:25] <SeanieB> "jack is not in the sudoers file:[07:06:44] <SeanieB> snd opensolaris doesnt work[07:06:45] <jmcp> I told you, pfexec[07:07:13] <SeanieB> c4d0 drive twpe unknown[07:07:17] <SeanieB> and some long string below it[07:07:22] <SeanieB> okay[07:07:33] <SeanieB> availible drive types: other[07:07:34] <jmcp> the string will be the physical path to the device[07:07:43] <jmcp> what sort of disk is it?[07:07:50] <SeanieB> uhh[07:08:04] <SeanieB> just a normal Segate Barracuda 500 GB hard drive[07:08:09] <SeanieB> connected with SATA[07:08:34] <jmcp> auto-discovery should be successful[07:08:34] <SeanieB> 7200 RPM[07:08:47] <SeanieB> apparently not[07:08:58] <SeanieB> every question has basically been :other[07:09:11] <jmcp> connected to your motherboard?[07:09:11] <SeanieB> now it wants cylinder size[07:09:15] <SeanieB> yeah[07:09:19] <SeanieB> sata port 0[07:09:26] <SeanieB> I have 6 sata ports[07:09:29] <SeanieB> and one ide port[07:09:38] <jmcp> what is the motherboard? can you enable AHCI mode on it?[07:09:49] <SeanieB> ..should be on[07:09:56] <SeanieB> it's a brand new gigabyte[07:09:57] <SeanieB> uh[07:10:01] <SeanieB> hold on[07:10:12] <jmcp> if you can enable AHCI that would be a very good idea[07:10:33] <SeanieB> I'mma reset and go look in the BIOS[07:10:38] <SeanieB> just a sec[07:11:03] <SeanieB> EP45-DS3A[07:11:07] <SeanieB> gigabyte[07:11:10] *** lewellyn_ has joined #opensolaris[07:11:38] <SeanieB> SATA AHCI mode is disabled[07:11:42] <jmcp> enable it[07:11:43] <SeanieB> enable it?[07:11:45] <jmcp> yeah[07:11:46] <SeanieB> What's it do?[07:11:51] <SeanieB> outof curiosity[07:12:01] <jmcp> in this case, it'll make your SATA disk show up as SATA[07:12:04] <jmcp> rather than PATA[07:12:07] <SeanieB> ...oh[07:12:08] <jmcp> (for OpenSolaris)[07:12:17] <jmcp> so ... benefits start with speed[07:12:17] <SeanieB> That won't mess with Windows, will it?[07:12:23] <jmcp> I don't know[07:12:27] <SeanieB> Well[07:12:32] <SeanieB> if it does I can alwyas turn it off[07:12:33] <jmcp> I only run Windows inside VirtualBox[07:12:35] <jmcp> yeah[07:12:46] <SeanieB> ..what the hell[07:12:48] <SeanieB> wow[07:12:55] <SeanieB> that really increases my post time[07:13:00] <SeanieB> it brings up a whole new BIOS[07:13:04] <SeanieB> screen[07:13:12] <SeanieB> okay[07:13:19] <SeanieB> booting solaris back up from CD[07:13:52] <SeanieB> would this possibly be what was screwing the installer up by any chance?[07:14:06] *** nachox has quit IRC[07:14:30] <jmcp> it's possible, but I don't work in that area so can't really comment[07:14:42] <SeanieB> okay[07:14:53] <SeanieB> I'll give the installer one more shot before giving up on it[07:16:10] <SeanieB> x started up...[07:16:18] <SeanieB> waiting for the desktop..[07:16:25] *** syd`__ has joined #opensolaris[07:16:41] <SeanieB> okat[07:16:44] <SeanieB> **okay[07:16:58] *** syd` has quit IRC[07:18:51] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[07:18:54] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[07:19:24] <jmcp> SeanieB: how's it going this time?[07:20:12] <SeanieB> installer's finding disks[07:20:25] <SeanieB> this seems to take quite a few minutes to do each time[07:22:30] * SeanieB head+desk[07:22:39] <SeanieB> now it wants me to install on 0.1 GB![07:22:42] <SeanieB> whee![07:23:29] *** lewellyn has joined #opensolaris[07:23:44] <SeanieB> okay[07:23:48] <SeanieB> now back to the other method[07:25:39] *** _Lewellyn has quit IRC[07:26:19] <SeanieB> now iostat says c4t0d0[07:26:47] <SeanieB> but there's info[07:26:52] <SeanieB> like the drive model number[07:27:01] <SeanieB> and the firmware revision[07:27:16] <SeanieB> jmcp?[07:28:02] *** syd`_ has quit IRC[07:29:10] <SeanieB> hey lewellyn[07:29:55] <SeanieB> fdisk is complaining - it says can't open device /dev/rdsk/c4t0d0p?[07:30:02] <SeanieB> I'll try p0[07:30:17] <lewellyn> jmcp: i suggested fdisk simply because format's bitten me when i have multiple non-solaris partitions[07:30:20] <SeanieB> no[07:30:21] <lewellyn> sorry. getting DDoSed here by a tard in #vbox[07:30:28] <SeanieB> I know[07:30:33] <SeanieB> I'm trying to use fdisk again[07:30:44] <SeanieB> it says "cannot open device"[07:30:57] *** victori has quit IRC[07:31:03] <SeanieB> I got device ID c4t0d0 from iostat -En[07:31:08] *** lewellyn_ has quit IRC[07:31:27] <SeanieB> as per jmcp's advice I added p?[07:31:36] <SeanieB> it defulted to p0[07:31:40] <SeanieB> cannot open device[07:31:45] <SeanieB> any ideas?[07:32:16] <SeanieB> or[07:32:18] <SeanieB> in full[07:32:56] *** lewellyn has quit IRC[07:33:21] <SeanieB> fdisk: cannot open device /dev/rdsk/c4t0d0p?[07:33:24] <SeanieB> fdisk: cannot open device /dev/rdsk/c4t0d0p0[07:33:27] <SeanieB> I meant[07:34:17] *** lewellyn has joined #opensolaris[07:35:15] <SeanieB> well I got format to work and give me a menu[07:35:50] *** estibi_ has joined #opensolaris[07:35:58] <SeanieB> oh![07:36:04] <SeanieB> lewellyn[07:36:08] <SeanieB> the format menu[07:36:09] <SeanieB> had an entry[07:36:11] <SeanieB> run[07:36:14] <SeanieB> fdisk[07:36:17] <SeanieB> I hit it[07:36:39] <SeanieB> "total disk size is 60801 cylinders[07:36:48] <SeanieB> it listed my partitions in a table[07:37:09] *** lewellyn_ has joined #opensolaris[07:39:28] <SeanieB> okay[07:39:30] <SeanieB> so I exited[07:39:46] <SeanieB> I'm running the installer now[07:40:27] *** codestr01 is now known as codestr0m[07:40:57] *** codestr0m is now known as Guest10703[07:41:29] *** Guest10703 is now known as codestr0m1[07:41:55] *** Teltariat has joined #opensolaris[07:44:35] <e^ipi> hmm[07:44:46] *** lewellyn has quit IRC[07:44:52] <e^ipi> a 9 kilo bag of primate food costs $25[07:46:18] <e^ipi> though feeding schedule is ~ 2kg per day at my body weight[07:46:46] *** jmcp has quit IRC[07:47:11] <e^ipi> so like... $5 a day to feed me[07:47:14] *** SeanieB has quit IRC[07:47:24] *** lesterc has quit IRC[07:48:09] *** lewellyn_ has quit IRC[07:48:12] *** lewellyn_ has joined #opensolaris[07:48:26] *** estibi has quit IRC[07:51:53] <oenone> e^ipi: how does it taste?[07:51:59] <e^ipi> dunno[07:53:50] <e^ipi> but it's primate food[07:53:53] <e^ipi> humans are primates[07:54:06] <e^ipi> it's got everything a primate needs to live a healthy life in captivity[07:54:53] <e^ipi> i live in an apartment...[07:55:23] *** Dar has joined #opensolaris[07:55:28] <e^ipi> it's completely rational[07:55:31] <oenone> would be a bit monotonous, wouldn't it?[07:55:40] <e^ipi> maybe[07:56:07] *** lewellyn has joined #opensolaris[07:56:09] <lewellyn> yay ddos :P[07:56:31] <oenone> $5 a day is not that cheap[08:00:58] <e^ipi> cheaper than what i eat now[08:01:04] <e^ipi> i could eat rice[08:01:07] <e^ipi> and nothing but[08:01:26] *** ken has joined #opensolaris[08:01:27] <e^ipi> but that doesn't contain all your nutrients[08:01:40] *** ken is now known as ken-work[08:02:22] <lewellyn> so yeah. my ultra 5 kept up with the ddos's udp traffic just fine :D[08:02:31] <lewellyn> the airport didn't fare as well :P[08:02:51] * lewellyn marks a tick in the solaris column[08:03:30] *** cypromis has joined #opensolaris[08:08:10] *** div111 has joined #opensolaris[08:10:29] *** stewart has quit IRC[08:12:32] *** ruse39[home]_ has quit IRC[08:13:47] *** _setuid_H has joined #opensolaris[08:14:19] *** gaveen has joined #opensolaris[08:15:37] <_setuid_H> Morning all[08:15:52] *** syd` has joined #opensolaris[08:17:32] *** kleppari has joined #opensolaris[08:23:00] <codestr0m1> _setuid_H: morning[08:23:52] *** free has quit IRC[08:24:01] *** free has joined #opensolaris[08:26:50] *** syd`__ has quit IRC[08:27:25] *** ken has joined #opensolaris[08:27:37] *** codestr0m1 is now known as codestr0m[08:27:40] *** Tobbe has joined #opensolaris[08:29:04] <Tobbe> what does the keyword "2009.06-reviewed" mean on a bug report?[08:29:55] <lewellyn> i'd assume it meant it had something to do with the 2009.06 release...[08:30:08] <Tobbe> hehe, yeah :)[08:31:24] <Tobbe> I was hoping for more info than that though[08:31:36] *** sophokles has joined #opensolaris[08:32:15] <Tobbe> does it mean it'll be fixed in 2009.06? Does it mean it's already fixed?[08:32:28] <lewellyn> dunno. just offering my input ;)[08:33:21] *** Tusk2 has joined #opensolaris[08:33:37] *** syd`_ has joined #opensolaris[08:35:28] *** Tusk2 has left #opensolaris[08:35:53] *** ken-work has quit IRC[08:36:33] *** devians has quit IRC[08:38:31] *** abisen has quit IRC[08:38:31] *** Excedrin has quit IRC[08:40:03] *** xy|ox has quit IRC[08:42:02] *** abisen has joined #opensolaris[08:42:02] *** Excedrin has joined #opensolaris[08:42:19] *** phimic has joined #opensolaris[08:44:20] *** ruse39[home] has joined #opensolaris[08:45:35] *** KOHJU is now known as kohju[08:45:38] *** syd` has quit IRC[08:46:20] *** VenerZen has joined #opensolaris[08:46:32] *** `Spike has quit IRC[08:49:12] *** kim0 has joined #opensolaris[08:53:49] *** luc^ has joined #opensolaris[08:56:45] *** joanie has left #opensolaris[08:58:00] *** DTEIT has joined #opensolaris[08:58:41] *** mikefut has joined #opensolaris[08:58:44] <DTEIT> morning[09:00:54] *** niq has quit IRC[09:01:03] *** ruse39[home] has quit IRC[09:01:51] *** e1mer has quit IRC[09:02:11] *** e1mer has joined #opensolaris[09:04:51] *** lblume has joined #opensolaris[09:04:58] *** sophokles has left #opensolaris[09:05:36] <trochej> Coffee[09:05:36] <lblume> 'afternoon, channel.[09:05:58] <lblume> trochej: Want some green tea for a change?[09:06:31] <trochej> lblume: Okay[09:06:40] <trochej> Green tea is good[09:07:16] <lewellyn> 1236845329.073238576[09:07:20] <lblume> I'll share mine with pleasure.[09:07:20] <lewellyn> morning, lblume :)[09:07:54] *** saohh has joined #opensolaris[09:08:06] <lblume> xiaowuhao, lewellyn[09:08:26] <lewellyn> ?? ??[09:09:04] *** ruse39[home] has joined #opensolaris[09:09:32] <trochej> Dobryj den[09:09:41] <trochej> Zdrawstwujtie[09:09:47] <trochej> Guten Tag[09:09:49] <trochej> Dzien dobry[09:09:50] <lewellyn> buenos dias[09:09:57] <trochej> Ave[09:09:57] <lewellyn> aloha[09:10:00] <lblume> Bonjour![09:10:33] <trochej> I know no more "good mornings"[09:11:26] *** e1mer has quit IRC[09:11:40] *** e1mer has joined #opensolaris[09:11:47] <trochej> IPS 109?[09:11:48] <trochej> Hmmm[09:11:55] <trochej> Do I want to?[09:12:21] <lewellyn> what are you on now? :)[09:12:24] <trochej> There are nice changes in the log[09:12:27] <trochej> lewellyn: 101[09:12:45] <trochej> lewellyn: Later won't boot, the bug is supposedly fixed in 109[09:12:49] <lewellyn> my only advice is avoid anything newer than 106, at the moment, if you're using an i915/945 system[09:13:08] <trochej> lewellyn: Will have to check mine,[09:13:19] <trochej> nO, actually 105 booted fine[09:13:23] <trochej> 106 was broken[09:13:36] *** krisis has joined #opensolaris[09:14:36] <lewellyn> only way i know to find out *really* quick is: modinfo | grep i915[09:14:45] <lewellyn> that only works if X is running, though, i think[09:15:33] <c00p> anyone had problems with smb / cifs in 109 ?[09:15:55] <lewellyn> not i, that i know of :)[09:18:01] <c00p> cool :) gonna update my 'backup x4500' to 109 and test :)[09:18:38] <c00p> heard about the bugs in 108 and have waited due to it[09:18:38] *** gorem has quit IRC[09:20:03] *** gaveen has quit IRC[09:20:06] *** joanie has joined #opensolaris[09:20:31] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[09:21:04] *** gaveen has joined #opensolaris[09:21:50] *** javatexan has left #opensolaris[09:21:51] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[09:21:55] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[09:22:36] *** tsoome has quit IRC[09:23:18] <trochej> lewellyn: Will have to wait 'till I'm home[09:29:08] *** carl- has joined #opensolaris[09:30:01] *** linma has joined #opensolaris[09:30:24] *** pjd has joined #opensolaris[09:32:38] *** twisti__ has quit IRC[09:35:02] *** magnon has quit IRC[09:40:13] *** dunc_ has quit IRC[09:46:17] *** wdp has joined #opensolaris[09:47:52] *** tsoome has joined #opensolaris[09:48:38] *** bizkut has joined #opensolaris[09:48:46] *** bizkut has left #opensolaris[09:53:52] *** timsf has joined #opensolaris[09:55:41] *** fftb has joined #opensolaris[09:56:00] <trochej> Coffee![09:56:27] <hrist> "backup x4500" /me gets jealous[09:58:29] *** Erwann has joined #opensolaris[09:58:37] <c00p> yeh - it lives offsite to backup all the data scientists here @ work generate :\[09:58:42] <c00p> 2 much to write to tape[09:59:53] *** krisis has quit IRC[10:01:23] *** dunc has joined #opensolaris[10:01:51] * timsf hates people who file bugs saying "it doesn't work"[10:02:49] <trochej> Well, fillig bugs that way simply doesn't work. :)[10:02:52] <trochej> timsf: Coffee?[10:03:00] <lewellyn> timsf: i tried to do something and it didn't work[10:03:01] <lewellyn> :)[10:03:36] <timsf> Yeah, definitely need coffee. And if you can add useful information to defect 7320, that'd be cool.[10:03:37] *** xRaich[o]2x has quit IRC[10:03:43] <sickness> should there be some staroffice/openoffice installed by default in 2009.04 preview?[10:03:48] <sickness> I can't find the executables...[10:03:50] * lewellyn rants off-topically about the USPTO's sucky web-based tools[10:04:00] <lewellyn> timsf: link, for the lazy? :)[10:05:26] *** kohju is now known as KOHJU[10:05:33] <trochej> timsf: ROTFL. For me suspend works. What doesn't work is wake up. :)[10:05:49] <trochej> But I didn't bother to debug it. :)[10:05:56] <timsf> http://defect.opensolaris.org/bz/show_bug.cgi?id=7320[10:06:10] <trochej> sickness: I think oo needs to be installed manually[10:06:11] <timsf> there may be useful stuff in /var/adm/messages* that could be worth posting.[10:06:35] <trochej> timsf: Will check it next time I try it.[10:06:48] <trochej> timsf: BTW, does suspend have some kind of a blacklist?[10:06:50] <timsf> [ it's likely still there ][10:06:53] <trochej> Like hibernate[10:06:54] <sickness> trochej: oh, k, tnx[10:06:56] <lewellyn> timsf: it doesn't work on my machine, either. sys-suspend tells me: Suspend is not supported.[10:07:11] <lewellyn> it worked (kind of in 108) and before the xorg change, it worked well[10:07:29] <timsf> did you set the goop in /etc/power.conf?[10:07:53] *** KOHJU is now known as kohju[10:08:04] <timsf> yeah, there's a blacklist, which the power.conf setting overrides[10:08:19] <lewellyn> and yes, my power.conf is identical to how it was in 106[10:08:30] <lewellyn> including said override[10:08:43] <lewellyn> nothing gets logged[10:08:54] <palowoda> What blacklist?[10:09:00] <timsf> there you go - useful information for the bug report[10:09:13] *** jteo has joined #opensolaris[10:09:29] <timsf> can't remember the specifics - checks for supported drivers iirc.[10:09:37] <lewellyn> sys-suspend gives the aforementioned message, clicking suspend on the power icon in the panel gives me a blank screen, locked[10:09:52] <lewellyn> so, all i can really say is "it doesn't work", too :([10:09:57] <lewellyn> part of why i've not made a bug for it[10:10:14] <timsf> http://blogs.sun.com/randyf/entry/testing_suspend_and_resume_for may help if you're interested?[10:10:34] *** xRaich[o]2x has joined #opensolaris[10:10:45] *** jollyd has joined #opensolaris[10:10:55] *** jollyd has left #opensolaris[10:11:16] <lewellyn> timsf: playing with uadmin is on my todo for friday, already ;)[10:11:17] <palowoda> Shouldn't blacklist actually print the name model etc that it's not supported realtime?[10:12:31] <timsf> As I say, I can't remember the specifics - just digging for them now[10:13:15] <palowoda> If your digging for them how is that going to work in the future with all the newbie's?[10:13:32] <timsf> Feel free to log a bug.[10:13:37] <lewellyn> the suspend stuff is experimental still, iirc :P[10:14:05] <lewellyn> hopefully S3 will start "just working" for everyone soon enough and manpower can go into S4 support :D[10:14:13] * lewellyn is craving S4 support[10:14:16] <palowoda> Right and some suspend stuff will always be blacklisted. Like some amd dual cores.[10:16:10] <oenone> what exactly is this ON (OS/Net)?[10:17:25] *** KermitTheFragger has joined #opensolaris[10:17:34] <palowoda> It's a group of secret interal Sun developers. It's documented on the opensolaris.org website. Don't tell anyone.[10:18:20] *** Tobbe has left #opensolaris[10:18:36] <timsf> ON is the kernel and core userland of OpenSolaris - the basic operating system[10:18:54] <timsf> minus a few bits to make it work (so just ON on it's own isn't enough to give you a functioning system)[10:18:56] <trochej> timsf: You seem a little bit irritated and tired. :)[10:19:30] <timsf> Need to pack for a 2 week trip to NZ today, and get work done (which is obviously why I'm here on irc, hrm)[10:20:12] <trochej> :P[10:21:41] *** MattMan has joined #opensolaris[10:21:52] <trochej> timsf: Goin to see gman?[10:22:20] <timsf> yeah - he's getting married later this month, so I'm heading over for the wedding, leaving the wife & kids here :-([10:22:29] <trochej> Ah, yes, seem to recall from fb[10:23:50] *** mib_cmjdsm has joined #opensolaris[10:26:36] <jteo> i thought he was married already.[10:27:14] *** VenerZen has quit IRC[10:28:10] <trochej> jteo: Time zones. :)[10:28:41] *** Odin- has joined #opensolaris[10:30:01] *** legolasw has joined #opensolaris[10:30:18] <legolasw> Hi[10:30:19] <legolasw> "zfs create aPool/aName/Another" is like creating normal directories or it is something different?[10:32:13] *** hsp has joined #opensolaris[10:32:14] <monsted> by default, it'll more or less look like a directory structure[10:32:24] <monsted> you can override the mountpoints on each zfs, though[10:32:42] <lewellyn> gah. will 110 come with the new pidgin? :([10:33:37] <palowoda> Easy to check find a psarc or lsarc fast track case for the update.[10:33:55] *** VenerZen has joined #opensolaris[10:34:57] *** Alasdairrr has joined #opensolaris[10:35:16] <lewellyn> i thought the arc stuff was offline, so i didn't look.[10:35:45] <palowoda> No all the arc cases are online. Also check http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/arc-process/PTLtestbed/PTL/[10:35:57] <timsf> Hah. Found it[10:36:00] <timsf> http://src.opensolaris.org/source/xref/onnv/onnv-gate/usr/src/uts/i86pc/io/ppm.conf[10:36:07] <timsf> Now, I'm going to do actual work.[10:36:52] <lewellyn> timsf: do you know the proper way to get machines added to that file? filing a bug seems like a lot of overhead :)[10:37:26] <palowoda> A whitelist?[10:37:28] <saohh> Hi all ;) How can i find out, if my zfs is using the compression?[10:37:55] <seanmcg> zfs get compression $dataset[10:37:58] <trochej> saohh: zfs get compression pool/filesystem[10:38:48] *** mikefut_ has joined #opensolaris[10:38:55] *** tfb has joined #opensolaris[10:39:00] <trochej> Coffee[10:39:03] <trochej> Anyway[10:40:39] <saohh> last two things i need to go with this! How do i activate compression (in case it is deactivated) and how do i change compression level?[10:41:08] <trochej> saohh: zfs set compression and it will give nice help[10:41:38] *** joanie has quit IRC[10:42:00] <trochej> saohh: basically zfs set compression=[true|gzip0-9|somethingelse][10:42:05] <saohh> ok thanks ;)[10:42:08] <trochej> and pool/filesystem[10:42:32] <saohh> where 9 is strongest compression and 0 is none?[10:42:34] <timsf> lewellyn filing a bug would be a good start: I suspect it's a function of what Sun's willing to test/support as well. The S3-support enable flag should override that.[10:42:46] *** arcame has joined #opensolaris[10:42:56] <trochej> saohh: I believe so[10:43:49] <seanmcg> saohh, the man page also has more info.. man zfs[10:44:33] <lewellyn> timsf: yeah, i realize it's a "support" issue, to some degree. but, at least osol should have the option of "community-tested" machines. otherwise, the list will remain short.[10:44:36] <trochej> saohh: And http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/819-5461[10:44:41] <trochej> ZFS Administrator Guide[10:44:45] <trochej> Even more comprehensive[10:44:49] <lewellyn> even if sxce/solaris don't use the "community" entries[10:44:54] <timsf> lewellyn yep, I agree.[10:45:31] *** mikefut has quit IRC[10:45:34] <lewellyn> and, personally, i don't want to be the one filing that bug as it may open a fun can of worms[10:46:11] <timsf> Drop a mail to one of the community aliases perhaps? Less formal than a bug report[10:46:32] *** jteo has quit IRC[10:46:45] <lewellyn> perhaps. let one of them deal with it[10:46:58] <lewellyn> i still need to get my email working properly on opensolaris :P[10:47:19] <lewellyn> right now, i'm limited to the one account that i have on my phone :([10:47:28] <codestr0m> is there a zfs development list where the developers actually post ideas?[10:47:35] <timsf> pm-discuss at opensolaris dot org looks like the best bet.[10:47:37] <codestr0m> I mean the whole thing can't be watercooler talk can it?[10:47:47] <timsf> http://opensolaris.org/os/community/pm/[10:48:02] <timsf> codestr0m: there's zfs-code at opensolaris dot org[10:48:07] <timsf> but it's pretty quiet[10:48:22] <codestr0m> timsf: ok. so there, but not used primarily[10:48:39] <timsf> yeah..[10:49:00] <timsf> they're not as open as other parts of ON.[10:49:21] <seanmcg> opensolaris-code at o dot o can be quite talkative..[10:50:40] *** Odin- has quit IRC[10:51:58] *** bnitz has joined #opensolaris[10:52:57] *** msoul_ has joined #opensolaris[10:53:35] *** gorem has joined #opensolaris[10:54:11] <palowoda> I kind of like that. Talkative source.[10:54:41] *** hsp has quit IRC[10:55:24] <lewellyn> i like my source to stay quiet and compile without chatting ;)[10:56:11] <trochej> :)[10:56:30] * trochej just had psychodelic vision of source files talking to each other. :)[10:56:41] <trochej> And arguing with compiler[10:57:01] <lewellyn> have you ever run gcc in pedantic mode? ;)[10:57:20] <trochej> Yes[10:57:48] <lewellyn> then you've seen arguments, surely :D[10:58:59] <trochej> And mind games[10:59:23] <palowoda> lewellyn: We all know you love lint.[10:59:37] <lewellyn> only in my belly button[10:59:49] *** hsp has joined #opensolaris[10:59:58] *** mib_cmjdsm has quit IRC[11:00:16] *** ericjray has joined #opensolaris[11:00:34] <palowoda> Must mean Solaris is full of belly button lint. :)[11:01:21] *** prdelka has quit IRC[11:01:28] *** prdelka has joined #opensolaris[11:02:11] <palowoda> And GNU is a Wall of crap...[11:02:46] *** niq has joined #opensolaris[11:05:09] *** cemerick has joined #opensolaris[11:07:12] *** stewart has joined #opensolaris[11:10:58] *** mega has joined #opensolaris[11:13:12] *** niq has quit IRC[11:15:02] *** niq has joined #opensolaris[11:15:13] <palowoda> What does the comment on lines 161-165 mean on: http://src.opensolaris.org/source/xref/onnv/onnv-gate/usr/src/uts/i86pc/io/ppm_plat.c[11:16:39] *** kohju is now known as KOHJU[11:16:44] *** tfb is now known as tfb|away[11:17:50] *** tfb|away is now known as tfb[11:18:41] <CosmicDJ> palowoda: http://src.opensolaris.org/source/xref/onnv/onnv-gate/usr/src/uts/common/sys/ppmvar.h#ppm_domain dc = domain control, but I've no idea what that is[11:19:05] <CosmicDJ> palowoda: http://src.opensolaris.org/source/xref/onnv/onnv-gate/usr/src/uts/common/sys/ppmvar.h#ppm_dc[11:19:08] <glance_> something for ldoms on T2 ?[11:19:59] *** hrist has quit IRC[11:20:35] *** linma has quit IRC[11:21:07] <palowoda> Hmm didn't know domains where involved with ppm.[11:21:20] <glance_> im just guessing.[11:21:27] *** dunc has quit IRC[11:21:46] <timsf> don't think so[11:22:10] <timsf> I see references like ppm-domains="domain_cpu", "domain_diskfet", "domain_led", "domain_pciegfx";[11:22:38] <timsf> so I'm guessing it's grouping different sets of power-manageable entities.[11:22:45] <timsf> (but I've no idea really)[11:22:56] <lewellyn> "domain" is always an overloaded term[11:23:02] <trochej> Yup[11:25:00] *** KOHJU is now known as kohju[11:26:29] <CosmicDJ> IIRC the big iron 25k servers supported smth called domains[11:26:38] *** hrist has joined #opensolaris[11:27:15] <trochej> Ldoms[11:29:05] <CosmicDJ> sun fire 25k[11:29:21] *** prdelka has quit IRC[11:29:28] *** prdelka has joined #opensolaris[11:30:49] <asyd> heya[11:31:12] <trochej> asyd: Coffee?[11:31:17] <asyd> yessssssssssssssss[11:31:47] <asyd> I have a f*cking hangover :)[11:31:52] <palowoda> The only reason I asked is further down for ppm_top_speed their was comments related to x86 ACPI, lines 237+[11:35:50] *** noyb has joined #opensolaris[11:40:56] <seanmcg> CosmicDJ, E6500, E10K, E15K has them too. The MX000's have it too. a more physical partitioning of a machine through software, more so than ldoms[11:41:17] <palowoda> Ah I see logical domains has nothing to do with ppm.[11:41:20] <legolasw> I have problem with creating snapshot, the command "zfs snapshot secpool/mstr@today" create nothing[11:41:37] <legolasw> is there any reason that the command does not create the snapshot?[11:41:42] <tsoome> how do you know it does create nothing?;)[11:41:50] <trochej> legolasw: zfs list -t all[11:42:01] <trochej> legolasw: See if it did[11:42:37] <CosmicDJ> tsoome: no error message and a return code of 0 (checked with $?) usually indicates that nothing happend ;)[11:42:53] <CosmicDJ> nothing... bad[11:42:56] <legolasw> oops, I was using a wrong command. I was trying to see the snapshots using "zfs list -r secpool"[11:43:16] <legolasw> "zfs list -t all" shows the snapshots[11:43:17] <legolasw> thank[11:43:22] <legolasw> *thanks[11:43:55] <tsoome> ofc, if something does create nothing, then what is that nothing and how to verify it was indeed created...[11:44:05] <tsoome> :P[11:44:36] <tsoome> ok, this question is actually a sign i need more coffee...[11:45:05] <oenone> true[11:45:14] <palowoda> tsoome: Verify /dev/null is accurate.[11:45:55] *** devians has joined #opensolaris[11:47:49] *** Fullmoon has joined #opensolaris[11:48:34] *** Cass has joined #opensolaris[11:48:50] *** Yves_ has joined #opensolaris[11:52:15] *** stewart_ has joined #opensolaris[11:52:27] *** JT__ has quit IRC[11:54:01] *** Andrew3 has joined #opensolaris[11:59:22] <CIA-40> Jack Meng <Jack.Meng at Sun dot COM>: 6813447 iscsi needs to use ksocket_hold() and ksocket_rele() to prevent hanging[12:00:24] *** BenB has joined #opensolaris[12:00:58] <BenB> hey... is it possible meanwhile to add disks to a raidz vdev in a ZFS pool?[12:01:04] <BenB> I mean really turning a 5-disk raidz into a 6-disk raidz, not adding a second raidz array.[12:01:13] <BenB> last time I checked (~1 year ago), it was "not implemented yet"[12:01:23] *** ken has quit IRC[12:01:41] <oenone> hi again, BenB[12:02:00] <BenB> oenone: hey... I was told to ask here :)[12:02:25] *** ken has joined #opensolaris[12:03:02] *** ken is now known as ken-afk[12:05:09] *** legolasw has quit IRC[12:05:24] *** legolasw has joined #opensolaris[12:06:11] *** g4lt-lappy has quit IRC[12:06:20] *** lesterc has joined #opensolaris[12:11:31] *** Andrew3 has left #opensolaris[12:12:13] *** lblume has left #opensolaris[12:14:17] *** sipior has joined #opensolaris[12:14:43] *** fftb has quit IRC[12:17:31] *** e1mer has quit IRC[12:21:08] *** g4lt-lappy has joined #opensolaris[12:22:14] <seanmcg> BenB, still not implemented..[12:22:46] <BenB> seanmcg: thanks... is there something I can do (apart from writing it) or at least monitor progress?[12:23:00] *** stewart has quit IRC[12:23:07] *** ken-afk is now known as ken-work[12:24:02] <BenB> seanmcg: or any way I can find out whether it's implemented?[12:24:20] <seanmcg> ask on the zfs list ?[12:24:28] *** samc has quit IRC[12:24:37] <BenB> seanmcg: ok....[12:24:45] <BenB> is there a bug tracker?[12:24:46] *** lesterc has quit IRC[12:25:38] <seanmcg> for that feature ? Try lookgin for it via bugs.opensolaris.org[12:26:04] <BenB> ok[12:26:17] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[12:26:34] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[12:26:35] *** samc has joined #opensolaris[12:27:35] *** Fullmoon has quit IRC[12:30:21] <Keso> ALL: how to tell OSOL use 4GB RAM ?[12:30:34] <BenB> http://bugs.opensolaris.org/view_bug.do?bug_id=6718209[12:30:38] <BenB> http://blogs.sun.com/ahl/entry/expand_o_matic_raid_z[12:33:05] <oenone> Keso: shouldn't it do that already?[12:34:19] <trochej> Keso: IIRC OSOL ought to take as much RAM as you put in and your hardware supports[12:35:56] <Keso> well, I have 4GB in bios but prtconf shows only 3328 Megabytes, isainfo output is amd64 i386[12:36:46] <trochej> Keso: The same with my Laptop. It is hardware issue with mine, maybe with yours too[12:37:06] <lewellyn> some chipsets don't remap devices to above the "4gb barrier"[12:37:12] <trochej> Keso: As a note: model is supposed to support 4 GB, but vendor issued a note stating that first models can do less[12:37:20] <oenone> prtconf tells me: Memory size: 3761 Megabytes[12:37:31] <oenone> and that is about 4GB[12:37:38] <lewellyn> Memory size: 2039 Megabytes[12:37:43] <lewellyn> :)[12:38:07] *** Odin- has joined #opensolaris[12:38:07] *** calumb has joined #opensolaris[12:38:21] *** bnitz has quit IRC[12:38:48] * lewellyn has 2560mb installed, but there's a limitation on this machine[12:39:01] <timsf> Not an agp aperture or anything?[12:39:30] <tsoome> i can insert 4GB in my laptop, but since chipset will map pcie devices between 3GB and 4GB, the machine can actually use only 3GB[12:40:36] <trochej> The same[12:40:38] <lewellyn> timsf: in my case? no. toshiba refuses to allow this computer to show more than 2gb to the os[12:40:57] <timsf> 2gb ought to be enough for anyone :-)[12:41:05] <lewellyn> i can pop in 3gb and still only see 2gb[12:41:39] <lewellyn> i suspect it's due to a bug with this cpu and 4gb ram. i'm hoping that upgrading the cpu will trigger some smarts in the bios[12:42:15] <tsoome> check out what chipset you have and digg into docs:)[12:42:33] *** stewart_ has quit IRC[12:43:35] <Keso> hmm so probably no help[12:43:47] *** bnitz has joined #opensolaris[12:44:38] <tsoome> if its bug related to bios, then bios update *can* help. if its limitation of your current hardware, then no help and only solution is to swap hardware.[12:44:59] *** kohju is now known as KOHJU[12:45:09] *** stewart has joined #opensolaris[12:47:03] <lewellyn> tsoome: it's not a hard limitation of anything in my machine, besides possibly the cpu itself, as far as i can tell :)[12:47:33] <BenB> huch.... that was terribly easy, to create a zfs pool, filesystem, set its properties, NFS share it, and mount it on a Linux machine.[12:47:34] <lewellyn> toshiba sold an almost identical computer with the same motherboard and a "better" processor, without this limitation. and it appears to use the same bios.[12:47:50] *** mroconnor_ has quit IRC[12:47:51] <legolasw> is there some encryption support available in 2008.11?[12:48:08] <BenB> I have a serious problem getting adjusted to the Solaris tools, like finding a text editor that I like, but ZFs is really cool and easy.[12:48:31] *** bnitz has quit IRC[12:48:41] <xRaich[o]2x> BenB: just use it for some time. getting adjusted to a system takes a little[12:48:59] <lewellyn> if you're from linux, you'll find most of the same things... like editors :)[12:49:16] <xRaich[o]2x> BenB: what do you want your editor for?[12:49:19] <xRaich[o]2x> programming?[12:49:59] <BenB> xRaich[o]2x: yes... making that learning curve a bit easier by providing nano text editor, and some (c)fdisk-like tool with that name, would go a long way.[12:50:08] <BenB> xRaich[o]2x: to edit system config files.[12:50:18] <BenB> xRaich[o]2x: in this case, sshd_config[12:50:18] <tsoome> use fi for it.[12:50:18] <lewellyn> BenB: you don't like solaris fdisk? ;)[12:50:24] <tsoome> vi*[12:50:33] <xRaich[o]2x> yep vi is the law ^^[12:50:35] <colyte> first thing i did before ever editing a text file was to install nano through blastwave.[12:50:46] *** lisppaste3 has quit IRC[12:51:06] <colyte> I mean common, 2009 without a modeless text editor? Jesus.[12:51:22] <tsoome> it got nothing to do with jesus[12:51:31] <BenB> colyte: yeas, that's what I mean... I don't even know where to find blastwave, or that it exists in the first place. I found the "package manager", but it doesn't have nano (it should!)[12:51:48] <BenB> tsoome: but with the law? :)[12:52:03] <lewellyn> colyte: once you get used to modes on your commandline, you expect the same power from your editor ;)[12:52:05] <xRaich[o]2x> jesus's law :P[12:52:05] *** noyb has quit IRC[12:52:27] <BenB> oh, another thing that would be very helpful for newbies: proper, long descriptions in the package manager. the 2-word description usually doesn't tell me much.[12:52:47] <lewellyn> BenB: check out sfe[12:52:53] <tsoome> quite many config files are using tabs as separator, quite many "modeless" editors are silently replacing tabs with spaces. i have seen loads of people whining why their syslog.conf etc are not working as intended[12:52:54] <lewellyn> and i hear packages are getting love, soon[12:53:00] <BenB> lewellyn: ah, good[12:53:08] <tsoome> hence the suggestion - learn and use vi:P[12:53:24] <lewellyn> tsoome: never mind people editing python with nano :P[12:53:41] <BenB> tsoome: this is an old discussion. no, I am not going to use vi. I am not going to tell my reasons, because I don't want to be insulting :).[12:53:45] <tsoome> sure, there is nothing bad with nano by itself[12:53:49] <lewellyn> emacs, then :)[12:53:55] <colyte> lewellyn: Don't even go there ;) There's no argument for stuff like VI except for "habit".[12:54:00] <BenB> lewellyn: that's what I installed now: emacs[12:54:23] <BenB> colyte: "vi" is the law! (also called "POSIX"-mandated)[12:54:46] *** peteh1 has quit IRC[12:54:47] <lewellyn> colyte: people see me use my vi keys on the command line and think that i'm using some uber-advanced shell with how quickly i can do things[12:55:24] <tsoome> besides, if i compare myself with those "nano" people i have seen, i usually have completed my task with vi ages before them.[12:55:46] <houst0n> vim is essential[12:55:48] <houst0n> :P[12:56:03] <BenB> tsoome: that's not even the question. I hate vi. that's not going to change. if there's only vi, I'm not going to use solaris, simple as that.[12:56:04] <houst0n> I'm a tad biased though, I'm a vim maintainer :P[12:56:09] <lewellyn> but yeah, stock editors are pretty much vi, vim, emacs, gobby, gedit, bluefish[12:56:29] <BenB> I'm simply making suggestions how to make Solaris more friendly to newcomers and how to win over more people.[12:56:31] <tsoome> you dont have to use vi to use solaris[12:56:42] <houst0n> BenB: vi is on every unix box you'll probably ever see, it's a very good thing to spend 5 minutes learning[12:56:50] <lewellyn> BenB: it's best to not give newcomers the tools they would like to use to shoot off both feet ;)[12:56:58] *** lisppaste3 has joined #opensolaris[12:57:04] <houst0n> lewellyn: Bjarne quote?[12:57:13] <lewellyn> a what quote?[12:57:25] <saohh> is wine working on Solaris?[12:57:30] <BenB> stop arguing about how I should vi, please. it's the same answers every time, and they are wrong. because it's all about *me*. *I* don'tr want vi, end of story.[12:57:32] <houst0n> Erm, well.. Ah nevermind[12:57:44] <tsoome> tbh, i am not sure i wanna see people on solaris who cant learn basic tool like vi. i mean, how can they understand and solve more complex issues?[12:57:49] <lewellyn> BenB: i gave you the 6 included editors[12:57:55] <lewellyn> *none* of those are simple enough?[12:58:14] <BenB> there are 3 camps: vi and emacs, and Visual Studio. I am the emacs or eclipse camp.[12:58:18] <BenB> d/emacs or/[12:58:22] <houst0n> BenB: Of course it's personal preference, but if you're planning on using unix/unix-like os's for anything other than a hobby, you're going to _NEED_ to learn it. The idea that my company would hire anyone who gets lost when they open the default editor is laughable[12:58:23] <lewellyn> then use emacs or bluefish[12:58:27] *** CyberBlue has joined #opensolaris[12:58:28] <BenB> lewellyn: which ones?[12:58:36] <lewellyn> <lewellyn> but yeah, stock editors are pretty much vi, vim, emacs, gobby, gedit, bluefish[12:58:44] <lewellyn> in addition, there's things like nano in SFE[12:58:50] <BenB> lewellyn: I only found vi and emacs, for the commandline.[12:59:09] <lewellyn> you may have to install the packages from the repo if you're not using sxce[12:59:19] <houst0n> I have a bad habit of ln -s /opt/csw/bin/vim /opt/csw/bin/emacs on my boxes ;)[12:59:25] <houst0n> Really pisses off this one dev we have :D[12:59:25] *** calumb is now known as calLNCH[12:59:28] <BenB> houst0n: I'm using Linux (which is Unix-like) since 10 years, for hobby and job, and never needed vi, apart from situations like this.[12:59:49] <ofu_> is it possible to detach a zil device when the pool is exported? as far as i understand, the zil is flushed to the pool while exporting[12:59:57] * lewellyn makes a note to only include vi and emacs in his linux distro[13:00:17] <tsoome> ofu_: you cant modify pool if its not imported[13:00:59] <ofu_> uhm[13:01:15] <BenB> I'm sorry, but that's just arrogance. I have achieved quite a lot of serious software development in my life. <tsoome> tbh, i am not sure i wanna see people on solaris who cant learn basic tool like vi. i mean, how can they understand and solve more complex issues?[13:01:26] <tsoome> BenB: I have actually had situations where all those nice shiny editors are just plain unusable because terminal line was too slow and unreliable[13:01:29] <houst0n> BenB: Frankly, I would never have hired you. While you may hate vi/vim, the ability to use what is commonly the ONLY editor installed on a unix machine is a rather important one. It takes 10 minutes to learn it's basic use, anyone who is unwilling to do so, regardless of their "10 years" experience is a fool.[13:01:58] <DerSaidin> vim was one of the first tools I used on linux & solaris[13:02:12] <DerSaidin> now I even use Visual Studio with a VIM plugin[13:02:25] <BenB> houst0n: I *refuse* to learn vi, because I think it's *sick*, and it makes everybody mind-sick who understands it.[13:02:37] <houst0n> Why is that?[13:02:39] *** lesterc has joined #opensolaris[13:02:45] <houst0n> Am I sick minded for using a text editor? are you insane?[13:02:50] <BenB> again, it's a matter of *preference*, so please don't enforce your preference on others, and install nano by default[13:02:52] <tsoome> vi is not the best editor, or most user friendly, granted. but it depends on needs and user experience.[13:02:59] <DerSaidin> BenB: ok. when you get in, press i. Do not press escape until your done, then press :wq to save and quit[13:03:01] <BenB> there cannot be a technical reason against that, because it's 100K or so.[13:03:22] <DerSaidin> not much to learn really[13:03:29] <houst0n> No no no, vi skills aren't a preference for a unix sysadmin, they're a requirement. Preference may be for other editors but you NEED vi skills to be a sysadmin. Even if it's just learning to hit i, esc, hjkl and :wq[13:03:31] <BenB> FWIW, I did manage to edit sshd_config with vi. but it does have the effect of driving me away, and even more so this very disucssion.[13:03:39] <tsoome> i like it because its *fast*, it will do the work regardless you have your mouse or arrow keys or not and its really powerful[13:03:42] <BenB> houst0n: I'm not a sysadmin.[13:03:52] <houst0n> There's nothing stopping you installing another editor[13:04:03] <houst0n> Figured :p[13:04:05] <BenB> houst0n: there is. nano is not in package manager.[13:04:14] <houst0n> www.blastwave.org[13:04:18] <lewellyn> BenB: seriously, there's valid technical reasons for not shipping nano. so don't be surprised if it doesn't happen.[13:04:20] <BenB> houst0n: I'm a developer.[13:04:23] <oenone> ed ftw[13:04:36] <tsoome> but for editing thousans of lines of code is a whole different story obviously - all this syntax highlighting etc[13:04:37] <houst0n> echo ++[13:04:38] <lesterc> I know a OS professor who use emacs to edit config files. :)[13:04:46] <BenB> ok, forget it. I was trying to be helpful, and face ignorance. nevermind.[13:04:51] <lewellyn> oenone: i was good and didn't mention ex ;)[13:04:57] <oenone> i once had to use ed, because no other editor was available[13:05:09] <houst0n> oenone: Arrgghh, that sounds horrible[13:05:12] <tsoome> ed in dos.... ymmw:P[13:05:17] <lewellyn> BenB: it's not ignorance to keep people from being able to easily kill their systems[13:05:26] <seanmcg> theres also cat + sed + mv...[13:05:39] <lewellyn> gsed -i # :D[13:05:43] <BenB> seanmcg: yup, I sometimes use that, to avoid using vi :)[13:05:54] <tsoome> seanmcg: done even that if needed[13:06:02] <oenone> vi is very powerful[13:06:14] <lewellyn> vi is almost too powerful :)[13:06:15] <_setuid_H> Does anybody have Solaris Security Essentials book?[13:06:28] <houst0n> too powerful? Pah![13:06:32] * BenB takes note: opensolaris people don't want to win over linux people.[13:06:51] <houst0n> BenB: that's a little unfounded[13:06:52] <tsoome> wtf, why should we wanna "win" over someone?[13:07:07] <houst0n> But i don't really care about linux people[13:07:10] <_setuid_H> I'm going to buy one of the books (SSE, OpenSolaris Bible or Solaris Performance and Tools)[13:07:16] <houst0n> If they're happy using linux, then use linux[13:07:19] <_setuid_H> but don't know which one to choose[13:07:27] <houst0n> If they want zones, zfs, dtrace and a rock solid abi, use solaris[13:07:45] <houst0n> _setuid_H: #bookz on undernet, get all three for free :P[13:07:49] <_setuid_H> houst0n: I used linux years ago but I changed mi mind :-)[13:07:49] <BenB> houst0n: now, the price question: if you want zfs and nano?[13:08:02] <houst0n> BenB: Then install nano from blastwave.org[13:08:06] <lewellyn> BenB: SFE[13:08:06] <houst0n> I think we have it[13:08:07] <houst0n> 1 sec[13:08:11] <houst0n> If not I can package it for you.[13:08:20] <BenB> houst0n: fine... all I suggested was to make that easier, or even the default.[13:08:39] <tsoome> if you cant download and install nano from net, why are you even bothering to use *any* unix like, or computers at all?[13:08:55] <BenB> because a newbie doesn't know how to "install from blastwave", or that blastwave exists.[13:09:04] <tsoome> you cant really expect to have every piece of sw *you* like installed[13:09:06] <houst0n> BenB: It's not very hard........[13:09:15] <lewellyn> BenB: at least in its current state, opensolaris is VERY not newbie friendly[13:09:21] <houst0n> there are details instructions on the website and an apt-get like tool for installing the software[13:09:25] <BenB> tsoome: your arrogance is so dripping, it's really arkward.[13:09:30] <houst0n> nano-1.2.5,REV=2005.08.14-SunOS5.8-i386-CSW.pkg.gz is there btw, but a little old[13:09:31] <tsoome> newbie will use gnome graphical text editor[13:09:38] <lewellyn> tsoome: exactly[13:09:55] <BenB> lewellyn: yes... therefore my well-minded suggestions to how improve the situation with little effort :)[13:10:04] <houst0n> I suspect a software developer of 10 years can handle installing some packages ;)[13:10:18] <_setuid_H> BenB: opensolaris is user friendly for those who are not lazy to read more than fire lines of text and for people who knows how to form a string which will be processed by google[13:10:20] <houst0n> Unless.... You don't write php do you?[13:10:21] <houst0n> ;)~[13:10:25] <lewellyn> BenB: including a known-problematic editor is not "little effort"[13:10:34] <BenB> houst0n: assuming he knows the source... I only heard about blastwave here.[13:10:52] <tsoome> man google[13:10:55] <tsoome> really[13:10:56] <DerSaidin> lool[13:11:01] <houst0n> We're not hiding, google "solaris packages"[13:11:09] <tsoome> 10 years developer....[13:11:11] <BenB> No manual entry for google.[13:11:40] <oenone> i got in touch with solaris a few days ago.. blastwave was the first thing i was introduced to[13:11:46] <_setuid_H> tsoome: well in the class on high school, my school mates got a simple task, find on the web how to list directory in liux[13:11:48] <_setuid_H> linux[13:11:55] <houst0n> oenone: Good to hear! :D[13:12:07] <_setuid_H> tsoome: they were so stupid so they wrote to the google input box: linux[13:12:09] <tsoome> if you are really developer, you are able to compile from source anything you have need for.[13:12:10] <Stric> lewellyn: what are the known problems with nano btw?[13:12:14] <oenone> okay, i was joining a dev group that used blastwave and sxce as development env[13:12:15] *** wewek has joined #opensolaris[13:12:18] <_setuid_H> :-D[13:12:34] <_setuid_H> some people are just lazy to think[13:12:39] <BenB> tsoome: I talked about making it *easy*, ok?[13:12:42] <BenB> nnevermind, guys.[13:13:08] * oenone used openbsd for >10 years now, so reading manual pages is nothing new[13:13:24] <houst0n> tsoome: fuck that for a game of soldiers, can you imagine compiling _everything_ you use on your desktop?[13:13:28] <lewellyn> Stric: nano makes it really easy to mix up spaces and tabs, for one. i recall, as someone mentioned, that it replaces tabs with spaces, often.[13:13:42] <houst0n> :P[13:13:49] <lewellyn> very bad for things that expect tabs.[13:14:07] <oenone> only thing i miss is apropos (or man -k) - man(1) tells me to run catman(1M), but catman stops with an error[13:14:23] <Stric> lewellyn: ok.. Makefile and sendfile.cf comes to mind.. of which one should die a horrible death ages ago..[13:14:32] <lewellyn> syslog.conf?[13:14:33] <lewellyn> ;)[13:14:33] <houst0n> oenone: I've not used obsd in years, is theo still a total arse?[13:14:48] <oenone> theo is still very polite, yeah ;)[13:14:51] <houst0n> hehe[13:14:58] <lewellyn> various config files expect tabs[13:15:10] <tsoome> houst0n: i did start on sunos 3.2 on sun3/50, university environment; no funding, blocked from access to os upgrades by US export laws... yes, i have done compiling everything i need for desktop and more.[13:15:12] <lewellyn> and sometimes, that's underdocumented[13:15:16] <houst0n> What's the new rev like? I used to like obsd because you can go from booting install media->working webserver in like 10 minutes[13:15:37] <oenone> new rev?[13:15:44] <houst0n> oenone: err, 4.4[13:15:45] <houst0n> ?[13:15:50] <lewellyn> i used to like obsd because it caused my ipc to keep me warm. :D[13:16:00] <oenone> ah.. there is lots of work done[13:16:03] <houst0n> tsoome: Heh, fair enough, that's a shiteload of effort though[13:16:05] <lewellyn> i swear obsd was slower than solaris on my ipc[13:16:23] *** niq has quit IRC[13:16:57] <oenone> damn.. i shouldn't have chosen german as language in the installer[13:17:09] <lewellyn> hahaha[13:17:25] <oenone> all error messages are spit out in german[13:17:28] <tsoome> it was time to ftp and gopher; all sw was distributed as sources you had to port stuff if needed. not just configure;make install[13:17:54] <houst0n> tsoome: I wish it was a case of configure; make install![13:17:57] <BenB> oenone: try LANG=C[13:18:01] * lewellyn never seems to get lucky enough to just configure and make :P[13:18:13] <houst0n> lewellyn: Heh esp with sunstudio[13:18:20] <houst0n> Blehhing linux devs[13:18:32] <lewellyn> esp with these things that use abstraction layers on top of c++ :([13:19:06] <oenone> catman gives an awk-error.. anybody experienced this before?[13:19:14] <houst0n> What's catman?[13:19:28] <BenB> tsoome: I think Mozilla AMiga port is still waiting to be done, if you like porting.[13:19:33] <tsoome> i gave up building stuff on my own when more and more packages were failing to env CC=cc LC_ALL=C ./configure.[13:19:39] <BenB> tsoome: you'll be sure to be the hero for many people[13:19:52] <tsoome> dont have amiga:D[13:20:03] <BenB> tsoome: there are emulators sold for $3[13:20:05] <oenone> houst0n: it builds the database for apropos/man -k[13:20:17] <houst0n> oenone: No idea man sorry >_<[13:20:22] *** calLNCH has quit IRC[13:20:23] <houst0n> rafb the error msg?[13:20:34] <oenone> one moment[13:20:45] <oenone> using LC_ALL=C now[13:20:46] <lewellyn> oenone: thanks for reminding me that i haven't run catman on this box yet :)[13:20:52] * lewellyn is waiting on it now[13:21:28] <oenone> no need for rafb, it's one line: awk: line 3 (NR=128): Record too long (LIMIT: 19999 bytes)[13:21:51] <lewellyn> that sounds like a broken manpage[13:22:01] <houst0n> mmh[13:22:09] <lewellyn> does it tell you which?[13:22:14] <oenone> no[13:22:57] <lewellyn> not even with -p?[13:22:59] <houst0n> pfexec rm -rf /usr/share/man ? who the fsck needs man pages anyway[13:23:03] <houst0n> :P[13:23:23] <houst0n> Just use src.opensolaris.org as man[13:23:57] <oenone> use the source, luke[13:24:21] <oenone> i prefer to use man pages, because sometimes i don't have internet access[13:24:53] <oenone> lewellyn: -p doesn't error[13:24:53] *** stewart has quit IRC[13:25:01] *** krisis has joined #opensolaris[13:25:17] <lewellyn> oh yeah. -p doesn't actually run the commands...[13:25:30] <lewellyn> catman -w? :)[13:25:44] <houst0n> use the ph0rce? We have a running joke with some of the devs[13:25:51] <houst0n> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 8 Mar 12 12:29 /bin/ph0rce -> /bin/dbx*[13:26:09] <tsoome> lol[13:26:16] <oenone> catman -w -> error[13:27:25] <tsoome> yep, i get 2x the same awk error on my 109[13:27:51] <oenone> this is sxce 109[13:28:10] <lewellyn> file a bug :)[13:28:37] <houst0n> Heh[13:28:40] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[13:28:55] *** Yves_ has quit IRC[13:29:27] *** Cass has quit IRC[13:29:39] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[13:30:20] *** tfb is now known as tfb|away[13:30:50] <lewellyn> catman -w # works for me on sxce 109[13:31:20] <tsoome> whats your path=[13:31:21] <tsoome> ?[13:31:29] <lewellyn> my path is hideously long :([13:31:55] <lewellyn> or do you want my MANPATH?[13:31:59] <tsoome> no path[13:32:08] <tsoome> wanna see what awk is it using[13:32:27] <lewellyn> 717 lewellyn@cheshire-cat:/home/lewellyn$ whence awk[13:32:27] <lewellyn> /usr/bin/awk[13:32:33] <saohh> if you were a beginner at open solaris, which book would you choose to buy as a starting point?[13:32:41] *** tfb|away is now known as tfb[13:32:49] <saohh> is this open solaris bible really a good choice? for example ;) ?[13:33:09] <tsoome> go docs.sun.com for start and look into admin guides[13:33:15] <tsoome> and user guides[13:33:44] <tsoome> if its too complicated, check out some books for beginners[13:34:30] <colyte> solaris docs lacks examples. i also feel they lack the beginning of the story, as well as the end of the story as it were.[13:34:42] <colyte> :|[13:36:32] <tsoome> manuals in docs.sun.com are not course textbooks[13:36:51] <tsoome> never meant to be.[13:37:17] <BenB> where are the course textbooks (online)?[13:37:33] <houst0n> whence?![13:37:34] <tsoome> not sure if there are[13:37:41] *** Ramdac_ has joined #opensolaris[13:37:58] <colyte> In comparison to linux docs which is where i come from. Well there's no comparison.[13:37:59] <tsoome> never searched for them myself, so cant really comment[13:38:07] <houst0n> sun docs can be a tad heavy[13:38:23] <Ramdac_> guys i'm gonna install opensolaris any advice before proceeding[13:38:47] <BenB> colyte: yes, Linux has the same problem. I don't know any good, short introduction which I can point linux/nix newbies to.[13:40:31] <Ramdac_> guys i'm gonna install opensolaris any advice before proceeding[13:40:41] <colyte> BenB: Depends on the distribution really.[13:40:54] <tsoome> you can always buy something from http://www.sun.com/training/catalog/operating_systems/sys_admin.xml :D[13:41:02] <BenB> colyte: the GUI stuff, yes. but the commandline is pretty much the same.[13:41:14] <BenB> colyte: (apart from package management)[13:43:05] <lewellyn> houst0n: you don't use whence and typeset? they're wonderful tools :D[13:43:10] *** VenerZen has left #opensolaris[13:43:46] <houst0n> I use which :/[13:44:01] <houst0n> are these built in to your shell?[13:44:16] <Ramdac_> guys do i have to convert my drives into ZFS before the installation?[13:44:25] <houst0n> Ramdac_: Nope[13:44:39] <houst0n> It will overwrite whatever is there though so be sure to back your data up[13:44:46] <tsoome> rofl: seriously = False[13:44:50] <Ramdac_> all of the hard disk??[13:45:02] <houst0n> If it's your first time I would suggest you perhaps unplug any other disks to be sure you write to the correct one[13:45:04] <BenB> tsoome: you misunderstood the = operator[13:45:07] <houst0n> Nah you can install it to a partition[13:45:09] <Stric> Ramdac_: if you tell it to[13:45:11] <tsoome> reading some py script:D[13:45:30] <houst0n> I loathe python[13:45:33] <Ramdac_> the verbose gonna guide me right?[13:45:42] <houst0n> What the hell sort of language determines behaviour by whitespace?[13:45:50] *** dunc has joined #opensolaris[13:45:59] <BenB> houst0n: everybody in his right mind writes programs in |sh|[13:46:04] <houst0n> It's creating a bunch of "programmers" who don't even know how big an int is :[13:46:14] <tsoome> if seriously == False: sys.exit(1) :D[13:46:31] <BenB> srsly?[13:46:32] <houst0n> BenB: I'll stick to c and perl for now, all I need for work =)[13:46:52] <BenB> srsly?[13:47:08] <houst0n> Have you gone into epic troll mode or something?[13:47:14] * xRaich[o]2x got love for C++. But sometimes Ruby does a good job also[13:47:25] *** Garcon_ has joined #opensolaris[13:47:26] *** Andrew3 has joined #opensolaris[13:47:28] <houst0n> Ruby is cute, looking forward to playing with 1.9[13:47:33] <kim0> hey guys .. Does xen work with current osol b109 (with zfs root) ?[13:47:53] *** Andrew3 has left #opensolaris[13:47:54] <houst0n> 5.x {|x| print "#{x+1}\n" } mmmm[13:47:57] <xRaich[o]2x> houst0n: also creates programmers that don't know the size of an int :P[13:48:00] <houst0n> syntax suguh[13:48:14] *** tosh has joined #opensolaris[13:48:18] <xRaich[o]2x> really depends on what you want to do[13:48:45] *** sophokles has joined #opensolaris[13:48:54] <houst0n> It does, yeah[13:49:03] <Stric> For quite a lot of tasks, I have no need what so ever to know the size of an int[13:49:10] <houst0n> Most times you can achieve a task in any number of languages[13:49:13] <Stric> For some, it's crucial[13:49:29] <xRaich[o]2x> Stric: exactly[13:49:37] <houst0n> Have you checked out FalconPL? It's really quite nice[13:49:44] <houst0n> But, "yet another scripting lang? *sigh*"[13:49:50] *** Ramdac_ has quit IRC[13:50:17] <Stric> For most of the stuff I do (sysadmin tasks), I couldn't care less, other than a variable should be able to hold any reasonable sized number I put in there (ie 64bit)[13:50:23] <xRaich[o]2x> i mean: why the hell should i bother with registers when i just have to parse some regex[13:50:28] <lewellyn> houst0n: yes. whence/typeset are part of POSIX[13:50:45] <lewellyn> so any halfway-decent shell should have them[13:50:51] <houst0n> xRaich[o]2x, Stric - I agree, I didn't mean you *NEED* to know these for most tasks[13:51:05] <jzu_> Any good guides for migrating Linux to OpenSolaris/Solaris?[13:51:15] <houst0n> Just that, for me anyway, I feel a programmer *SHOULD* know[13:51:31] <houst0n> I'm living in the past though I guess :P[13:51:34] <Stric> jzu_: see topic[13:51:53] <Stric> jzu_: didn't see that one coming, eh? :)[13:51:59] <xRaich[o]2x> houst0n: yeah that kind of perception is pretty old fashioned since there are a lot of different breeds of programmers[13:51:59] <jzu_> Stric: haha ;)[13:52:28] <houst0n> Old fashioned/elitist w/e :P[13:53:03] <tsoome> xRaich[o]2x: I would say most todays "programmers" should be banned from computer access:P okok, compiler access.[13:53:05] <xRaich[o]2x> houst0n: all programmers are somehow[13:53:24] <houst0n> I just can't consider someone who spends all day writing CSS sheets and php a programmer, no matter how hard I try[13:53:45] <houst0n> I mean, what the hell sort of programmer spends 3 days making some page look the same on 4 diff browsers?[13:53:48] <houst0n> :P[13:53:58] <xRaich[o]2x> tsoome: hrhr yeah. i talked to a friend of mine yesterday and he was totally shocked that i'm pretty pedantic about the C++ standard :P[13:54:07] <wdp> houst0n, 4 days? thats a bad programmer.[13:54:13] <tsoome> :D[13:54:15] <wdp> houst0n, if you need a good one, call me[13:54:18] <wdp> :-P[13:54:22] <xRaich[o]2x> most "programmers" think everything that compiles is good[13:54:23] <houst0n> Hmm, I do actually[13:54:34] <jzu_> Stric: I'm moving to Solaris/OpenSolaris, ditching E450 and setting up Fire V240 & V480[13:54:40] <houst0n> I need someone to write an admin console for a project i'm working on (web based, mysql backend)[13:54:44] *** bam123 has joined #opensolaris[13:54:46] <jzu_> Stric: Migrating Linux-system from E450 to V240 Solaris[13:54:50] <BenB> define "compiles"? does java count? jitted javascript?[13:54:50] <wdp> houst0n, youre paying for it?[13:54:51] <houst0n> We'll prob fill it internally though[13:54:55] <BenB> python?[13:55:05] <BenB> (.pyc)[13:55:09] <tsoome> you had linux on E450?![13:55:17] <wdp> though.. i wouldnt call php programming. doing it since 10 years now.[13:55:20] <houst0n> No no no, you mean you're not willing to write code for me for FREE?[13:55:20] <tsoome> what a waste:([13:55:26] <xRaich[o]2x> BenB: I'm talking about C++ here ;)[13:55:27] <houst0n> pffft[13:55:30] <wdp> and.. php is and will always be a scripting language.[13:55:30] <houst0n> :P[13:55:54] <wdp> its just easier for me to do stuff in php. i even sorted all my audio files using php[13:55:56] <wdp> <- nerd[13:56:05] <houst0n> I use perl for most such tasks[13:56:08] <wdp> houst0n, haha. nice try, nice try :>[13:56:44] <xRaich[o]2x> perl: they only languages that look the same before and after encryption.[13:56:58] <xRaich[o]2x> s/languages/language/[13:57:01] <lewellyn> jzu_: spare e450? i'll take it ;)[13:57:03] <wdp> i really dislike python[13:57:12] *** luc^ has quit IRC[13:57:18] <xRaich[o]2x> wdp: at least it forces beginners to indent :P[13:57:28] <wdp> heh[13:57:51] *** inaddy has quit IRC[13:58:18] <tsoome> throw them into fortran[13:58:20] <lewellyn> xRaich[o]2x: especially helpful since apparently schools no longer teach people to indent things :P[13:58:23] <houst0n> I like the term "swiss army chainsaw" to describe perl[13:58:26] <lewellyn> tsoome: CLIPS! :D[13:58:31] <tsoome> :D[13:58:42] <lewellyn> it's like lisp, but not... ;)[13:59:08] <houst0n> Ugh lisp[13:59:14] <xRaich[o]2x> lewellyn: i remember my time at school.... indented code? what's that?[13:59:16] <lewellyn> houst0n: at least it's on-par with ruby for unlegibility :)[13:59:23] <houst0n> (((I((((I Do not like))))LISP)))))))))))))))))))))))))[13:59:25] *** NoFX_SBC has joined #opensolaris[13:59:27] <houst0n> ((or emacs))[13:59:28] <houst0n> :P[13:59:29] <lewellyn> xRaich[o]2x: i meant even writing paragraphs :)[13:59:35] <xRaich[o]2x> hrhr[13:59:43] <lewellyn> houst0n: unbalanced parens ;)[13:59:49] <tsoome> failed![13:59:54] <lewellyn> and i don't use emacs either[14:00:05] <lewellyn> i usually can remember how to quit if i end up in it somehow[14:00:15] *** servo- has quit IRC[14:00:16] <houst0n> C-cC-x i think[14:00:20] <houst0n> or other way around[14:00:22] <houst0n> kill -9[14:00:22] <lewellyn> usually it's easier to spawn another shell and pkill it :)[14:00:24] <houst0n> :P[14:00:36] <oenone> C-z helps sometimes..[14:00:42] <lewellyn> but it IS hugely configurable[14:00:43] <tsoome> C-x C-c[14:00:44] <xRaich[o]2x> well. gotta go. have fun guys[14:00:47] <houst0n> I used xemacs for a while to settle an editor war[14:00:48] * xRaich[o]2x &[14:00:53] <BenB> Ctrl-X-C (keep holding Ctrl)[14:00:55] <lewellyn> i knew someone who managed to get vi keys working in emacs[14:01:03] <houst0n> so I'm qualified to say it sucks :P[14:01:04] <tsoome> or, if you are lazy, just use mouse and menu....[14:01:20] <tsoome> M-x vi-mode[14:01:28] <lewellyn> tsoome: often if i end up on emacs, i'm lucky enough to be using a shell without job control :P[14:01:30] <BenB> FWIW, I had the same problem with vi when I started with linux 10 years ago.[14:01:30] <houst0n> There's a vi mode? haha[14:01:35] <lewellyn> oh it's a native vimode?[14:01:37] <houst0n> How many mb of lisp do you need for that?![14:01:59] <BenB> I actually rebooted the computer to get out of vi - I knew no other way, given that I was a total n00b. I hate vi ever since.[14:02:01] *** lewq has quit IRC[14:02:07] <lewellyn> BenB: i had issues with vi... god... 15+ years ago?[14:02:17] <houst0n> BenB: I HIGHLY reccomend you spend 15 minutes with vimtutor[14:02:19] <lewellyn> i tried to learn emacs because it "looked" easier[14:02:27] *** krisis has left #opensolaris[14:02:30] <houst0n> Really, 15 mins, you'll realise how powerful it is and how much time it'll save you[14:02:40] <houst0n> And only after you've done this can you decide if it's not for you[14:02:41] <lewellyn> i eventually gave that up because someone was able to prove to me in 5 minutes that vi was superior[14:02:45] <lewellyn> not vim, vi :)[14:02:45] <BenB> I'm fine with eclipse, thank you :)[14:02:57] <BenB> (for writing java code)[14:03:07] <houst0n> Eclispe isn't much use to edit files in /etc[14:03:08] <houst0n> :P[14:03:13] <BenB> and e3em for system config[14:03:15] <jzu_> lewellyn: naah, I'll be selling it to fund some FC-disks for V480 :)[14:03:23] <jzu_> lewellyn: it's an E450 with 4x 480MHz, 4GB[14:03:25] <lewellyn> jzu_: awww :)[14:03:26] <tsoome> :%s/blah/plah/g[14:03:32] *** thunderbyte has left #opensolaris[14:03:36] <jzu_> lewellyn: the V480 is 4x 1.2GHz UltraSPARC III, 12GB[14:03:39] <houst0n> vim with ctags is AWESOME also[14:03:39] <oenone> i usually use nvi (the vi coming with openbsd).. not sure which vi solaris comes with[14:03:46] <lewellyn> jzu_: too bad i don't have the spare money right now and you aren't local :)[14:03:56] <lewellyn> oenone: "real" vi[14:04:00] <tsoome> for vi: http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/806-2902/6jc3b36e2?l=en&a=view&q=vi[14:04:02] <BenB> oenone: vim[14:04:06] <lewellyn> Version SVR4.0, Solaris 2.5.0[14:04:06] <houst0n> Anyone in scotland looking for an old sparc btw?[14:04:07] <oenone> there aint no real vi[14:04:13] *** wbkang has joined #opensolaris[14:04:18] <lewellyn> oenone: there sure is...[14:04:20] <houst0n> I have a netra x1 and a ultra10 going pretty much for free :P[14:04:25] <BenB> oenone: package manager, search for "vi" :)[14:04:29] <houst0n> Both run sol 10 without issues, i'd stick with ufs though[14:04:40] <oenone> BenB: i don't know the package manager[14:04:50] <lewellyn> houst0n: pop in a gig of ram and both will do zfs fine[14:04:51] *** hsp is now known as hsp_away[14:04:55] <BenB> in the GUI, menu System[14:05:00] *** il_padrino has quit IRC[14:05:01] * lewellyn runs with zfs on his v100s and his ultra 5[14:05:26] <oenone> BenB: no gui here, just remote ssh access[14:05:30] <Teltariat> /exit[14:05:34] <lewellyn> also, vi will probably always be the default for solaris[14:05:36] *** tfb has quit IRC[14:05:44] *** Teltariat has quit IRC[14:05:47] <lewellyn> after all, vi was written by bill joy :)[14:05:50] <houst0n> lewellyn: the netra has a gb, it works fine with zfs, the ultra10 really doesn't ;)[14:06:01] *** wbkang has quit IRC[14:06:10] <lewellyn> houst0n: i can't believe that my ultra 5 handles zfs better than your ultra 10 ;)[14:06:18] <houst0n> my ultra10 has 512mb[14:06:25] <lewellyn> that's why[14:06:26] *** servo- has joined #opensolaris[14:06:28] <houst0n> indeed :P[14:06:35] <houst0n> It might have sol9 on it atm actually[14:06:40] <tsoome> ultra 5 and 10 are same machine;)[14:06:48] <lewellyn> tsoome: almost, but not quite ;)[14:06:51] <houst0n> It's got a 450mhz IIe i think[14:06:57] <lewellyn> sounds right[14:07:05] <houst0n> Not powered it on in a while[14:07:34] <lewellyn> oh. it's a IIi[14:07:38] <BenB> why would you use such an old sun machine instead of a new PC for $300? (or $800, if you prefer)?[14:07:42] <houst0n> It's the only box in my flat with a serial port so I need it to get on the x1's lom heh[14:07:54] <lewellyn> houst0n: it uses less electricity and cost less?[14:08:01] <houst0n> BenB: I use these for testing sparc pkgs, I'm a package maintainer[14:08:02] *** cypromis has joined #opensolaris[14:08:05] <lewellyn> houst0n: that's part of the reason for mine ;)[14:08:10] <BenB> houst0n: ah. good reason.[14:08:19] *** Odin- has quit IRC[14:08:21] <houst0n> Heh[14:08:27] <tsoome> depends how old that sun is, but it would probably outlast that new pc anyhow:P[14:08:44] <lewellyn> i expect my v100s to last another few years yet[14:08:47] <houst0n> lewellyn: The netra EATS leccy heh[14:08:59] <houst0n> Noisy too[14:08:59] <tsoome> even if you have 3GHz cpu in pc and 400MHz cpu in sun...[14:09:20] <lewellyn> heh. my v100 only eats about 75W at full steam[14:09:36] <BenB> only?[14:09:36] <houst0n> Anyway, I'm running home, 1/2 day today and need to escape before someone asks me to do something[14:09:43] <BenB> but they make noise like an air plane[14:09:43] <oenone> ah.. solaris uses the AT&T version of vi..[14:09:46] <houst0n> :P cya's later[14:09:47] <lewellyn> BenB: stick your average pc on a watt-o-meter[14:09:55] <houst0n> oenone: Install vim from blastwave.org[14:10:00] <houst0n> :P[14:10:04] <lewellyn> oenone: which is derived from the original 1970s code[14:10:16] <lewellyn> houst0n: SUNWvim exists ;)[14:10:26] <houst0n> Yes, but CSWvim is err, better[14:10:32] <oenone> lewellyn: so is Berkely's version, isn't it?[14:10:37] <lewellyn> we'll disagree there ;)[14:10:40] <lewellyn> oenone: yup[14:10:43] <oenone> openbsd uses berkely[14:10:47] <houst0n> Why?[14:10:47] <lewellyn> sun's is more featureful though[14:10:51] <houst0n> What's wrong with my vim package?[14:10:51] <houst0n> :P[14:10:52] *** ericjray has quit IRC[14:11:02] <lewellyn> houst0n: not your package, but the rest of the blastwave stuff ;)[14:11:11] <houst0n> We're working on that[14:11:12] * lewellyn disagrees with the blastwave philosophies[14:11:19] <houst0n> You and lots of other ppl[14:11:26] <BenB> what particularly?[14:11:29] <houst0n> Things are moving very quickly over there arm[14:11:31] *** wbkang has joined #opensolaris[14:11:31] <houst0n> atm*[14:11:43] <lewellyn> not to say i don't use CSW packages on my solaris 10 machines, but those are when i get upset at something that won't compile for me[14:11:55] <lewellyn> i'm going to be trying SFE on Solaris 10/SPARC soon[14:12:09] <lewellyn> i would prefer having my own package repo anyhow[14:12:12] <houst0n> The advantage is that you can have /opt/csw over nfs, and the pkgs work on sol8->9->10->11[14:12:17] <lewellyn> i hate having different versions of things across machines[14:12:27] <lewellyn> i only need them to work on 10 ;)[14:12:39] <houst0n> Ah, lucky you[14:12:44] <lewellyn> and i don't need all machines to have the same exact software[14:12:45] <houst0n> we have a massive sol 8 estate[14:12:49] <houst0n> as do lots of other companies[14:12:49] <BenB> houst0n: for me, sol10 is old :)[14:12:53] <lewellyn> in fact, it could be a bad thing.[14:13:03] <houst0n> BenB: I'm talking corp hehe =)[14:13:06] <lewellyn> and nfs mounting it breaks having the software in zones[14:13:08] <houst0n> Home users sure 10 is a bit dated[14:13:12] <houst0n> It's rock solid though[14:13:20] <lewellyn> BenB: there's a new S10 coming soon, don't worry :)[14:14:04] <BenB> fwiw, I think it's good that you have the choice between "not changing" and "newest stuff".[14:14:13] <lewellyn> only reason i am not running solaris 10 on this laptop is because i gave up on the ath driver :P[14:14:37] <lewellyn> i usually don't jump on SX early on :P[14:14:49] <houst0n> sxce is _MASSIVE_ and opensolaris is a bit crap really.. belenix is nice[14:14:52] <houst0n> solaris 10 wins out atm[14:15:13] <telexicon> whats wrong with openslowaris[14:15:17] <houst0n> pkg[14:15:37] <wbkang> hahaha 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*** ericjray has joined #opensolaris[14:55:27] *** calumb has joined #opensolaris[15:00:07] *** seanmcg has quit IRC[15:08:02] *** gorem has left #opensolaris[15:08:18] *** victori has joined #opensolaris[15:10:17] *** bam123 has quit IRC[15:10:21] *** Deesl has quit IRC[15:11:03] *** CyberBlue has quit IRC[15:11:46] *** VenerZen has joined #opensolaris[15:13:11] *** sensei has quit IRC[15:13:11] *** tg has quit IRC[15:13:11] *** Caino has quit IRC[15:13:11] *** calumb has quit IRC[15:13:11] *** kab3wm has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** Praematura has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** LuckyLuke has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** segy has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** sejo has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** wereHamster has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** Gman has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** barfoed has quit IRC[15:13:12] *** arcame has quit IRC[15:13:35] *** Gman has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** calumb has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** arcame has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** barfoed has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** Caino has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** segy has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** tg has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** LuckyLuke has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** sensei has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** kab3wm has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** wereHamster has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** Praematura has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** sejo has joined #opensolaris[15:13:35] *** irc.freenode.net sets mode: +o Gman[15:13:49] *** stewart has joined #opensolaris[15:15:15] *** prdelka has quit IRC[15:15:20] *** prdelka has joined #opensolaris[15:16:22] *** LeftWing has quit IRC[15:18:49] *** hsp_away is now known as hsp[15:19:42] <legolasw> I am inside a zone and I want to create a dataset using "zfs create applications" while I am inside /root/opt directory[15:21:12] <legolasw> but it return an error like: "cannot create 'applications': missing dataset name"[15:21:29] *** e-jat has joined #opensolaris[15:21:48] *** wdp has quit IRC[15:22:07] *** wdp has joined #opensolaris[15:23:52] <legolasw> is it possible to use Java runtime installation of global zone in another Solaris zone?[15:24:22] <asyd> svcadm: Unexpected libscf error on line 338: server has insufficient resources.[15:24:25] <asyd> nice[15:24:31] *** arpunk has joined #opensolaris[15:25:25] <trygvis> legolasw: the dataaset has to start with the pool name[15:25:36] <trygvis> legolasw: yes, you can share the installations[15:25:48] <trygvis> the default installation is already shared[15:26:27] <legolasw> When I try java -version inside a zone it return command not found while it works fine in global zone.[15:26:39] <legolasw> maybe i did not configure the zone correctly?[15:27:15] <trygvis> you don't have a /usr/bin/java?[15:27:34] *** jteo has joined #opensolaris[15:28:19] <legolasw> in the zone? No I do not have[15:28:55] <legolasw> but in the global zone I have it.[15:29:14] *** stevel has joined #opensolaris[15:29:14] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stevel[15:29:57] *** LordIllpalazo has joined #opensolaris[15:30:16] *** seanmcg has joined #opensolaris[15:31:05] <trygvis> oh, so you're using whole zones then. not sparse zones?[15:31:51] <legolasw> Yes I think. The zone directory is about 330MB[15:32:23] <trygvis> then you can't share stuff, that is why you would use a whole zoen in the first case[15:32:43] *** VenerZen has left #opensolaris[15:33:34] <legolasw> :( what is the command to create a spare zone?[15:33:58] <trygvis> that is what you get by default[15:34:05] <legolasw> Can I create it from a template zone that I already have or these two zones are completely different?[15:34:41] <trygvis> you better google up some info on sparse vs whole zones[15:36:22] *** syamajala has joined #opensolaris[15:36:38] *** Dar has quit IRC[15:37:27] *** sstallion_work has joined #opensolaris[15:38:17] <legolasw> Thank you.[15:38:20] *** axisys has joined #opensolaris[15:38:25] <legolasw> I think google.com is down :O[15:39:02] <trichobezoar> ...[15:39:30] <turtle> it's not[15:44:40] *** christophsturm has joined #opensolaris[15:45:00] *** saohh has quit IRC[15:46:30] *** alanst has joined #opensolaris[15:46:36] *** tfb has joined #opensolaris[15:51:45] *** jfisc has joined #opensolaris[15:52:42] *** plavcik_ has joined #OpenSolaris[15:53:14] *** Odin- has joined #opensolaris[15:53:54] <plavcik_> csn USB flash disk with ext2 be used in OpenSolaris? or which filesystem I can use for sharing one USB disk on OpenSolaris and Linux?[15:54:06] <trygvis> fat[15:54:14] *** tombhadAC has joined #opensolaris[15:54:42] <Stric> http://blogs.sun.com/pradhap/entry/mount_ntfs_ext2_ext3_in[15:55:04] <Stric> But FAT is easiest (even if it's limited)[15:56:30] <plavcik_> thank you, nice URL[15:58:37] *** il_padrino has joined #opensolaris[16:00:45] *** syamajala has quit IRC[16:00:57] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[16:02:05] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[16:04:23] *** hsp has quit IRC[16:08:45] *** hsp has joined #opensolaris[16:09:39] *** calumb is now known as calAFK[16:09:41] *** alfism has joined #opensolaris[16:12:43] *** fftb_ has joined #opensolaris[16:13:45] *** cypromis has quit IRC[16:15:38] *** abisen has quit IRC[16:21:44] *** stewart has quit IRC[16:21:47] *** cwebber has joined #opensolaris[16:26:17] *** calAFK is now known as calumb[16:26:27] *** bubbva has joined #opensolaris[16:27:43] *** bahumbug has joined #opensolaris[16:28:46] *** dunc has joined #opensolaris[16:29:01] *** prdelka has quit IRC[16:29:03] *** tsoome has quit IRC[16:29:09] *** prdelka has joined #opensolaris[16:31:39] *** cypromis has joined #opensolaris[16:31:46] *** _setuid_H has quit IRC[16:31:57] *** ken-work is now known as ken[16:33:25] *** lewq has quit IRC[16:41:55] *** wewek has quit IRC[16:45:40] *** nsuperbus has joined #opensolaris[16:48:22] *** palowoda has quit IRC[16:48:43] *** palowoda has joined #opensolaris[16:51:26] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[16:51:45] *** javatexan has quit IRC[16:52:03] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[16:52:27] *** javatexan has quit IRC[16:52:44] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[16:53:38] *** javatexan has quit IRC[16:53:54] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[16:54:14] *** javatexan has quit IRC[16:54:22] *** coffeetime has joined #opensolaris[16:54:30] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[16:54:39] *** javatexan has quit IRC[16:55:11] *** sndcrb has joined #opensolaris[16:55:30] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[16:55:43] *** coffeetime has quit IRC[16:56:20] *** niq has joined #opensolaris[16:56:29] *** dguitar has joined #opensolaris[16:57:24] *** jfisc has quit IRC[16:57:51] *** javatexan has left #opensolaris[16:58:30] *** coffeetime has joined #opensolaris[16:59:38] *** BenB has joined #opensolaris[16:59:43] *** kim0 has quit IRC[16:59:53] *** crichardso has quit IRC[17:01:04] *** sponix has quit IRC[17:03:59] *** saohh has joined #opensolaris[17:04:06] *** javatexan has joined #opensolaris[17:04:17] *** crichardso has joined #opensolaris[17:04:23] <BenB> is there a way to treat ZFS subvolumes as directories and not separate filesystems as far as NFS is concerned? I don't want to explicitly mount each ZFS filesystem on every client.[17:04:36] *** e-jat has quit IRC[17:05:02] *** Cass has quit IRC[17:05:03] *** tombhadAC has quit IRC[17:05:12] <BenB> (no, the clients obviously don't support the NFSv4 automount feature, and I may need the ZFS filesystems, to change properties and manage data)[17:05:14] *** inaddy has joined #opensolaris[17:05:41] *** sponix has joined #opensolaris[17:06:01] *** javatexan has left #opensolaris[17:06:30] <trichobezoar> hmmm thunderbird keeps crashing on me every time i try to change my folder subscriptions[17:07:20] <BenB> trichobezoar: deleting client cache (<profile>/ImapMail/) sometimes helps, or restarting the server in case it's the server[17:07:41] <BenB> trichobezoar: if you to the former, don't delete msgFilterRules.dat[17:08:37] *** rovalent has quit IRC[17:09:27] <trichobezoar> it does the same thing...[17:09:47] <trichobezoar> if i put it offline all it does is say "Please wait..."[17:10:12] <BenB> trichobezoar: and you deleted all .msf files?[17:10:28] *** ravv has joined #opensolaris[17:10:38] <trichobezoar> Yes. I purged ~/.thunderbird/*.default/ImapMail/myserver/* (msgfilterrules was empty)[17:11:16] <BenB> trichobezoar: try a fresh profile (keep your existing one, just start TB with -P )[17:11:34] <BenB> trichobezoar: if it still crashes there, it's likely something corrupted on the server.[17:12:12] <BenB> if that doesn't crash, check the other files in your profile (but be careful, there's valuable data like your spam training etc.)[17:12:44] *** niq has quit IRC[17:12:47] <BenB> trichobezoar: I'm assuming you're using the same build that didn't crash earlier.[17:13:25] *** sponix2ipfw has quit IRC[17:13:49] *** KOHJU is now known as kohju[17:14:07] <saohh> hi, how can you adjust the clock under gnome at solaris? i just can choose a location in my example hamburg, but its 9.13h and in reality it is 17.15h ;([17:14:47] *** jfisc has joined #opensolaris[17:15:09] *** phimic has quit IRC[17:18:44] *** tsoome has joined #opensolaris[17:19:48] <trichobezoar> My new profile is still fail ;-([17:20:33] <BenB> trichobezoar: then I bet 90%, it's the server - assuming it worked earlier with the same thunderbird build / client setup[17:20:35] *** tombhadAC has joined #opensolaris[17:20:46] <trichobezoar> im not sure if it ever did. it's exchange[17:21:30] <BenB> you mean that Microsoft product? :)[17:21:41] <trichobezoar> right MS Exchange[17:22:15] <BenB> trichobezoar: I guess you have no control whatsoever over the server?[17:22:49] <BenB> (otherwise you wouldn't be here or it wouldn't be running Exchange)[17:23:41] *** doug_out is now known as doug_outout[17:23:59] <trichobezoar> I'd probably do both ;)[17:26:02] *** capaz has joined #opensolaris[17:27:58] *** doug_outout is now known as doug_out[17:28:17] *** uhs has joined #opensolaris[17:30:24] *** jteo has quit IRC[17:31:22] *** rmesta has quit IRC[17:32:04] <eviljames> trichobezoar: Have you gotten an e-mail client other than Outlook to work well with Exch?[17:32:31] <BenB> Evolution uses the Exchange protocol, not IMAP[17:32:37] <trichobezoar> Not on 2k7[17:32:39] <BenB> s/the/a/[17:33:21] <BenB> I'm trying out Solaris with ZFS as NFS server...[17:33:47] <tsoome> i cant use evolution with our exchange server with exchange protocol...[17:33:50] *** prdelka has quit IRC[17:33:51] <BenB> and it's not working right... when copying files, it works a but, then I get timeouts from the server.[17:33:57] *** prdelka has joined #opensolaris[17:34:06] * BenB wonders whether it's the MTU[17:34:20] <tsoome> what is the client?[17:34:25] <Stric> does the same happen for similar non-NFS transfers?[17:34:31] <Stric> (ie ftp, http, scp, ..)[17:34:50] <BenB> tsoome: linux... server is running in a VM in KVM, so MTU is possible reason[17:35:03] <BenB> Stric: haven't tried that yet.[17:35:14] *** pandarilho has joined #opensolaris[17:35:26] <tsoome> try to mount share with version=3[17:36:48] <BenB> rsync seems to work.[17:37:06] <BenB> tsoome: as mount option?[17:37:23] <tsoome> ye, to force it using nfsv3[17:38:06] <BenB> Bad nfs mount parameter: version[17:38:09] <tsoome> even with v3 you may wanna limit the nfs block size[17:38:18] <tsoome> i have no idea about linux syntax[17:38:19] *** ken has quit IRC[17:38:33] *** JT__ has joined #opensolaris[17:38:43] <BenB> I think "nfs" is version 3. nfs4 would be "nfs4"[17:38:47] <eviljames> BenB: From what I can tell, Evolution uses the Exchange OWA, which is no good for me :/[17:39:17] *** pandarilho has quit IRC[17:39:21] <BenB> eviljames: why no good? (not that I want to encourage evolution)[17:39:28] <eviljames> BenB: Solaris v4 service auto-adapts to v3 iirc[17:39:31] <eviljames> (nfs, that is)[17:40:03] <trichobezoar> I used evolution to change the subscriptions ;)[17:40:18] <BenB> trichobezoar: and that worked, and now it works in TB?[17:41:14] *** sao_hh has joined #opensolaris[17:41:31] <trichobezoar> No, but I can access the folders i Need now[17:41:40] <trichobezoar> in TB[17:42:09] <BenB> trichobezoar: "worked" = TB no longer crashes and can access the folders.[17:42:27] <BenB> so, it indeed was something coming from the server side that TB tripped over...[17:42:43] <BenB> trichobezoar: if you can debug that / narrow it down and file a bug report against TB?[17:43:43] *** coffeetime has quit IRC[17:44:09] <BenB> trichobezoar: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=MailNews%20Core (Product: "Mailnews Core", Component: "Networking: IMAP")[17:45:02] <codestr0m> e^ipi: http://pastealacon.com/2236[17:46:04] *** dynamicproxy has joined #opensolaris[17:46:10] <BenB> trichobezoar: I didn't see a bug filed about that yet.[17:46:24] <trichobezoar> http://pastebin.com/m27deae7f <-- pstack and some version info[17:46:25] *** dynamicproxy has quit IRC[17:47:08] *** Ramdac_ has joined #opensolaris[17:47:27] <BenB> trichobezoar: if you can reproduce the server state causing the problem, it might be useful to get what the server sends, and/or an IMAP log in Thunderbird....[17:47:56] <BenB> https://wiki.mozilla.org/MailNews:Logging[17:48:08] <Ramdac_> guys is it ok that during the installation of sxce it gives warning?[17:48:11] <eviljames> BenB: With your nfs problem is it linux client / solaris server?[17:48:16] <eviljames> BenB: and is it still occurring? :D[17:48:23] <BenB> eviljames: yes, and yes[17:48:44] <BenB> trichobezoar: http://email.about.com/od/mozillathunderbirdtips/qt/et_mail_log.htm[17:49:18] <Ramdac_> hello[17:49:22] *** uhs has quit IRC[17:49:39] <eviljames> BenB: as root on client what does mount.nfs remote/ local/ -v[17:49:41] <eviljames> BenB: what does that show?[17:49:52] *** saohh has quit IRC[17:49:54] <eviljames> Ramdac_: Depends on what the warning says?[17:50:19] <Ramdac_> it is about reading blocks[17:50:28] <Ramdac_> but it proceed normally after that[17:50:55] *** bubbva has quit IRC[17:51:08] <BenB> eviljames: mount: trying 1.2.3.4 prog 100003 vers 3 prot tcp port 2049[17:51:19] <BenB> eviljames: mount: trying 1.2.3.4 prog 100005 vers 3 prot udp port 60095[17:51:38] <eviljames> BenB: And it errors out after that?[17:52:16] *** sophokles has quit IRC[17:52:25] <Ramdac_> eviljames:there is a question right now i'm installing sxce on my laptop[17:53:04] <Ramdac_> eviljames: when in the menu of selecting disks[17:53:29] <eviljames> BenB: I noticed you said rsync worked, so it shouldn't be the network itself.[17:53:37] <eviljames> Ramdac_: I have very little knowledge on SXCE, sorry.[17:53:50] <eviljames> Ramdac_: One of these days I'll start working on it, but just been too busy to investigate it fully.[17:54:02] <BenB> eviljames: the mount works fine, it's a bit flaky, but works for a bit, but after about 10s starts with I/O errors[17:54:10] <Ramdac_> eviljames: ok thanx i'll ask someone else[17:54:14] <BenB> (when I copy lots of files)[17:54:21] <BenB> (or rather big files)[17:54:46] <BenB> I see "nfs: server 1.2.3.4 not responding, timed out" in dmesg on the linux client[17:55:07] *** e-jat has joined #opensolaris[17:55:12] <BenB> eviljames: and yes, I changed the mtu on the server (in the VM), and it didn't help[17:55:41] *** Ramdac__ has joined #opensolaris[17:56:00] <Ramdac__> hello anyone is using SXCE[17:56:48] <eviljames> BenB: It could be particular to the VM setup, your zpool is inside of a file on ext3 I guess[17:56:51] <eviljames> ?[17:57:06] *** esok has joined #opensolaris[17:57:47] <BenB> eviljames: no... the root of solaris is on a virtual disk that's on a XFS partition on ubuntu. but the zpool in question is a RAIDZ of two disks, which are mapped to physical disks.[17:58:03] <jzu_> is there any command to check CPU / mem specs from OBP?[17:58:18] <Stric> jzu_: banner can say some stuff[17:58:31] <tsoome> if mountd is not responding, check if you have rpcbind and mountd up on solaris host[17:58:51] <tsoome> also use snoop on solaris side to monitor traffic with linux host[17:58:53] <seanmcg> jzu_, banner[17:59:15] <jzu_> thanks =)[17:59:23] <tsoome> you may wanna check if nfs/server service is up[17:59:36] <jzu_> ok it says how much theres ram[17:59:38] <jzu_> nothing about CPU's[18:00:03] *** div111 has quit IRC[18:00:56] <tsoome> jzu_: show-dev ?[18:01:28] <BenB> tsoome: I know I saw in services GUI that NFS services are not enabled... I enabled them, but then disabled them again, because I thought there's a reason why they are disabled and they'd be automatically enabled when needed, given that all the rest is automatic. I will try to enable them, though, yes.[18:01:42] *** derchris has quit IRC[18:02:00] <BenB> (wasn't sure about that "legacy" NFS etc.)[18:02:16] <eviljames> BenB: Just be happy he didn't send you into DTrace territory (yet).[18:02:33] <BenB> eviljames: :)[18:03:04] <Ramdac__> hello anyone is using SXCE here?[18:03:09] <BenB> I'll have to DTrace Mozilla anytime soon now... I'm scared.[18:03:11] <Ramdac__> or installed it before?[18:03:40] <Stric> Ramdac__: ask the question instead of a meta question[18:04:41] <eviljames> BenB: DTrace isn't all that bad when you get the hang of it. Start out with the DTraceToolkit from opensolaris.org[18:05:08] <eviljames> BenB: What will happen is after reading a few scripts it will suddenly 'click' and you'll be DTracing all sorts of stuff just for the heck of it.[18:05:09] <xRaich[o]2x> aren't there dtrace probes for firefox?[18:05:12] <BenB> eviljames: yeah, did so. yes, that "getting a hang of it" is the problem and what I'm scared about :)[18:05:25] *** carl- has quit IRC[18:05:28] <BenB> xRaich[o]2x: yes, there are[18:05:32] <xRaich[o]2x> i think firefox has it's own provider[18:05:37] <xRaich[o]2x> but i never used it[18:05:39] <Ramdac__> Stric:at the start of the installation a warning messages appears about reading blocks from the DVD is that ok?[18:05:43] <BenB> xRaich[o]2x: you can even look inside javascript apps, which is terribly cool[18:05:51] <Stric> Ramdac__: probably not[18:05:59] <xRaich[o]2x> BenB: heard of it[18:06:01] *** capaz has quit IRC[18:06:02] <BenB> xRaich[o]2x: (there's special code hooking the JS engine up with dtrace)[18:06:24] *** krdoor has left #opensolaris[18:06:27] *** derchris has joined #opensolaris[18:06:49] <Ramdac__> Stric:but after that the installation proceeds normally ?[18:07:08] <Stric> it might be a recoverable error though[18:07:24] <Stric> ie, the reader fails a few times, then gets the data correctly[18:07:52] <Ramdac__> its Error rate is Retryable only[18:08:09] *** derchris has quit IRC[18:08:35] *** derchris has joined #opensolaris[18:09:01] <Ramdac__> Stric:then it says after that there is an error appeared while decompressing some files[18:09:29] <Stric> so it failed.. either disc or reader might be flakey[18:09:30] *** alfism has quit IRC[18:10:17] <Ramdac__> Stric:but the installation proceeds normally after that[18:12:05] <Ramdac__> Stric: other question i have 80 GB hard disk when the menu of "selectdisk" comes it appears 4 partitions[18:12:10] *** tfb has quit IRC[18:12:35] *** Ramdac_ has quit IRC[18:12:55] *** bahumbug has quit IRC[18:12:55] <Ramdac__> Stric: the first is of type unused and the second i think is the primary partition and the third is for logical partition which contains data[18:13:59] *** perlmongo has joined #opensolaris[18:15:28] <tsoome> BenB: any luck with your nfs?:D[18:15:35] <Ramdac__> Stric:but the problem is i want to install opensolaris on a partition which is on the logical partition i have one choices to delete all the logical partition which contains 67000 MB which i dont want it :([18:15:51] *** tfb has joined #opensolaris[18:16:22] <tsoome> Ramdac__: no really sure if thats supported;)[18:17:34] <Ramdac__> tsoome: what do u mean?[18:17:55] <tsoome> traditional solaris install supports only primary partition[18:18:11] <BenB> tsoome: no.... I tried to reboot the system, because I couldn't graphically login anymore either, thought somethign was strange.... it's still in the process of shutdown, which is strange. it was always very slow, but not that slow.[18:18:23] <BenB> (slow to shut down, not generally)[18:18:40] * BenB kills the VM[18:19:01] <Stric> Ramdac__: the "logical partition" is actually nested partition tables.. and then solaris has its own system on top of that, which would mean 3 nested tables..[18:19:19] <Ramdac__> tsoome: is there a way to hack into the inner partition of the logical partition[18:19:21] <Stric> Ramdac__: and afaik, installing to such nested partition tables is currently not supported[18:21:27] <Ramdac__> Stric:so u say that the only way is to delete the whole logical partition[18:21:44] *** capaz has joined #opensolaris[18:22:00] <Stric> I'm not 100% sure, but I think you need to make room on a primary partition[18:22:11] *** tomo\inai has quit IRC[18:22:51] *** twisti has joined #opensolaris[18:23:08] *** tomo\inai has joined #opensolaris[18:23:47] <Ramdac__> Stric:what about the other distro does they support nested partitions?[18:24:32] <tsoome> why should they?[18:25:13] <Stric> it's the kernel itself that needs to support it[18:25:18] <Stric> http://defect.opensolaris.org/bz/show_bug.cgi?id=1777[18:25:23] <Stric> http://bugs.opensolaris.org/view_bug.do?bug_id=6644364[18:26:28] *** msoul_ has quit IRC[18:26:36] <tsoome> fdisk logical partitions are microsoft invention and for microsoft OS. im not really familiar with fdisk standards, but im not even sure you are supposed to be able to boot from logical partition[18:27:08] <Ramdac__> Stric: from the words u just said u mean that UNIX also doesnt support nested partitions[18:27:28] <Stric> Ramdac__: .. I said what?[18:28:16] <Stric> what definition of "UNIX" are you using in that statement? The trademarked UNIX OS, the "concept" UNIX or the "UNIX-like OS'es" ?[18:28:38] <Ramdac__> Stric: u said that "it's the kernel itself that needs to support it"[18:28:45] <oenone> is it possible to install sxce with only a cd drive?[18:28:47] <Stric> Yes. And (open)solaris doesn't.[18:29:03] <Ramdac__> Stric : but open solaris is UNIX[18:29:42] <Stric> Ramdac__: Did I say that AIX doesn't support it? (it doesn't, since it doesn't run on x86 anyway)[18:29:54] <Stric> I'm not sure what you're trying to say, imply or ask..[18:30:04] <Stric> (AIX is also UNIX)[18:30:19] *** ravv has quit IRC[18:30:37] <g4lt-lappy> no, AIX is the devil[18:30:58] <Stric> Ramdac__: What I am saying is that anything based on the Solaris kernel (such as regular Solaris and OpenSolaris) will not be able to boot from your extended/logical partitions[18:31:09] <Stric> Since the support just isn't in there[18:31:15] <axisys> where can I get the latest filebench ? source or pkg.. sf has 1.3.4[18:32:11] *** webmink has joined #opensolaris[18:32:25] *** kimc has quit IRC[18:32:34] *** aveteam has joined #opensolaris[18:33:34] *** DTEIT has quit IRC[18:33:49] <Ramdac__> Stric: sry for the misunderstand but isn't solaris works under the unix kernel?[18:33:53] *** cwebber has quit IRC[18:33:53] *** sipior has quit IRC[18:33:53] *** legolasw has quit IRC[18:33:53] *** KermitTheFragger has quit IRC[18:33:53] *** ruse39[home] has quit IRC[18:33:53] *** _coredump_ has quit IRC[18:33:53] *** \amethyst has quit IRC[18:34:22] *** cwebber has joined #opensolaris[18:34:22] *** sipior has joined #opensolaris[18:34:22] *** legolasw has joined #opensolaris[18:34:22] *** KermitTheFragger has joined #opensolaris[18:34:22] *** ruse39[home] has joined #opensolaris[18:34:22] *** _coredump_ has joined #opensolaris[18:34:22] *** \amethyst has joined #opensolaris[18:34:26] <Stric> Ramdac__: again, what "unix" are you talking about?[18:34:31] *** \amethyst has quit IRC[18:34:34] *** _coredump_ has quit IRC[18:34:39] *** \amethys1 has joined #opensolaris[18:35:04] *** sipior has left #opensolaris[18:35:09] *** ken has joined #opensolaris[18:35:12] *** \amethys1 is now known as \amethyst[18:35:13] *** ken has left #opensolaris[18:35:31] *** ken has joined #opensolaris[18:35:41] *** doug_out is now known as doug_outout[18:37:06] <Stric> Ramdac__: "Unix" is both a long-dead operating system, and also describes a family of various operating systems.. Solaris is one of those in that group with its own kernel, which lacks what you want[18:37:13] *** tomo\inai is now known as tomochaa[18:37:27] <Stric> Ramdac__: FreeBSD is another, with a totally different kernel with different features[18:37:55] <Ramdac__> Stric:*Scratching Head*[18:38:14] *** _coredump_ has joined #opensolaris[18:38:25] <Stric> So I think you are confusing yourself with definitions, and then using that to confuse others ;)[18:39:17] <tsoome> Ramdac__: what you need to do to install solaris is to make enough space available for 1 primary artition.[18:39:24] <tsoome> +p[18:39:24] *** wbkang has joined #opensolaris[18:40:09] <Stric> "Volvo cars don't do XYZ" "So you are saying that no cars have XYZ, because Volvo is a car?" for a crappy car analogy ;)[18:42:17] <Ramdac__> Stric:so the summary of this lessons that the Unix is the basic OS and after that its kernel is modified to produce branches from OSes which is solaris is part of ,right?[18:42:38] <axisys> how do I download the filebench source code from http://src.opensolaris.org/source/xref/onnv/onnv-gate/usr/src/cmd/filebench ?[18:42:55] <Ramdac__> sry for bad grammer[18:43:29] <BenB> ok, that's fantastic... I had to kill the solaris VM, because it didn't react anymore.[18:43:43] <BenB> now, the zpool I created is gone.[18:43:49] <tsoome> Ramdac__: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix[18:43:53] <BenB> zpool list doesn't show it anymore.[18:44:04] <tsoome> zpool import?[18:44:04] <BenB> or do I need to do something for it to be found?[18:44:14] <tsoome> are the disk devices still there?[18:44:14] *** tfb has quit IRC[18:44:15] <Stric> Ramdac__: No, "Unix" is a concept of which there are multiple implementations that follow the same concept[18:44:38] <cmihai> Ramdac__: UNIX is a trademark and a specification. Systems fully compliant with that specification are called UNIX.[18:44:39] <BenB> tsoome: yes, format lists them[18:44:40] <Ramdac__> tsoome: i was just reading it :)[18:45:12] <cmihai> The latest of those is the Single UNIX Specification, version 3.[18:45:13] *** _Steve_` has joined #opensolaris[18:45:17] *** sndcrb has quit IRC[18:45:20] <tsoome> zpool import ? does it give any hints?[18:45:29] *** ken has quit IRC[18:45:40] <Stric> Ramdac__: Firefox and IE are both web browsers, but they don't share the code. Solaris and Linux are both Unix-like OS'es, but they don't share code (ok, some are used in both, but..)[18:45:43] *** sndcrb has joined #opensolaris[18:45:48] <cmihai> This specification means things will function as expected by developers, users, etc.[18:46:01] <Ramdac__> I understand now[18:46:03] <cmihai> UNIX is, for all intent and purpose, little more than a common standard and a set of certifications.[18:46:13] <BenB> tsoome: yes, zpool import finds it.[18:46:19] <BenB> tsoome: how does that happen?[18:46:24] <cmihai> And it's somewhat vague, as the vendors are free to implement a truck load of features and extras on top.[18:46:42] <tsoome> for some reason the pool cache was broken?[18:46:46] *** AxeZ has joined #opensolaris[18:47:15] <cmihai> So what you'll get is a common set of UNIX certified operating systems like AIX and Solaris. Applications that rely on the UNIX part will run, compile and work seamlessly on all UNIX systems. But each have their own specific extra tools and such.[18:47:23] <BenB> tsoome: why doesn't did it break (it shouldn't lose data, even in face of powerouts), and why didn't it find it automatically, given that zpool import can find it?[18:47:26] <tsoome> im not really sure how *exactly* the zfs will determine if the visible pool should be mounted or not[18:47:32] *** _Steve_` has quit IRC[18:47:47] *** ken has joined #opensolaris[18:47:52] <holcomb> hmmm... fmd just offlined one of my cpus. hope it's not really broken.[18:47:57] <Ramdac__> so Unix is just a standard that other OSes follow[18:47:59] *** _Steve_` has joined #opensolaris[18:48:09] <tsoome> also, since you are using solaris in VM and you did nuke VM, that may confuse things...[18:48:21] <BenB> tsoome: zpool list only shows the root pool. after zpool import, and zpool import <mypoolname>, zpool list shows it again[18:48:34] *** inaddy has quit IRC[18:48:37] <tsoome> yep[18:48:56] <tsoome> zpool import will show you pools what can be imported[18:48:58] <cmihai> Ramdac__: and a certification / test suite that says the OS follows the specification.[18:49:34] <cmihai> For example, every UNIX system will have the "cat" command to concatenate and print files, and will support at LEAST the -u flag to Write bytes from the input file to the standard output without delay as each is read.[18:49:47] <cmihai> The specs defines these things.[18:49:53] *** _Steve_` has quit IRC[18:49:56] <Ramdac__> cmihai:its like quality assurance[18:50:04] <cmihai> The vendor is free to add the "tac" command to print files in reverse.[18:50:09] <cmihai> Or to add the -z flag. Whatever.[18:50:17] *** _Steve_ has joined #opensolaris[18:50:27] <cmihai> Ramdac__: makes it seamless to port applications too.[18:50:30] <oenone> any way to install SXCE without dvd drive?[18:50:39] <tsoome> from network[18:50:45] <cmihai> Your app just needs to use UNIX/POSIX features, and it should run on every UNIX system.[18:51:06] <BenB> Ramdac__: to make matters more complicated, all Unices have a common code root... there was an original unix. it was re-created from scratch, known as "BSD". many other unices used part of that and derived from there. linux is a parly complete rewrite again, but they are all "somewhat" compatible. there's a standard, POSIX, which says what shall be called "compatible"; but it's not really sufficient in practice either. in short,[18:51:06] <BenB> it's a "family" of operating systems.[18:51:07] <Ramdac__> now i understand[18:51:34] <oenone> tsoome: okay, thanks..[18:51:44] <cmihai> Common code isn't mandatory.[18:51:47] <cmihai> It just happens.[18:51:49] *** Tusk2 has joined #opensolaris[18:52:19] <BenB> and SCO owns it all. (not)[18:52:24] <Tusk2> hey[18:52:34] <tsoome> lol[18:52:57] <cmihai> Heck, MacOS managed to pass the certification[18:53:03] <cmihai> So now MacOS _is_ UNIX.[18:53:12] <tsoome> why shouldnt it:)[18:53:18] *** _Steve_ has quit IRC[18:53:19] <BenB> cmihai: there's a Unix subsystem for WinNT[18:53:26] <timeless> hi benb[18:53:38] <BenB> I bet WinNT could pass Unix certification[18:53:39] <timeless> cmihai: Mac OS X, not MacOS[18:53:56] <BenB> hey timeless, the ygu who probably still runs WinNT 3.51[18:53:56] *** timsf has quit IRC[18:54:00] *** _Steve_ has joined #opensolaris[18:54:08] <cmihai> BenB: well, Windows NT is mostly POSIX compatible and so on.[18:54:18] <cmihai> The tools aren't, but the base stuff like say NTFS is[18:54:32] <cmihai> The filesystem is case sensitive for example[18:54:35] <cmihai> the tools aren't[18:54:39] *** ken is now known as ken-1[18:54:45] <cmihai> So getting something like SFU isn't that big a deal.[18:54:53] <timeless> or uwin[18:55:07] <BenB> cmihai: I think you refer to the "subsystem" (WinNT design term, includes libraries) with "tools"[18:55:37] *** _coredump_ has quit IRC[18:55:53] *** sao_hh has quit IRC[18:55:59] *** _coredump_ has joined #opensolaris[18:56:05] <Ramdac__> Mac OS x v10.5 is POSIX right?[18:56:23] <holcomb> it complies with SUSv3. not sure what that means[18:56:32] <BenB> tsoome: what makes me uneasy is that solaris lost files on powerout.[18:56:34] <holcomb> i think there are a lot of people at sun who deal with the standards geekery who could tell you[18:56:40] <CosmicDJ> that means you can call it UNIX ;)[18:56:47] <cmihai> BenB: no, they don't ship the POSIX subsystem anymore, they ship SFU / SUA (Interix stuff)[18:56:51] <tsoome> BenB: did it lost really?;)[18:56:54] <_Steve_> POSIX != UNIX[18:56:56] <tsoome> what files?[18:57:07] <cmihai> holcomb: it means it's just as compliant as Solaris[18:57:09] <_Steve_> but yes, Mac OS is UUNIX[18:57:14] <_Steve_> oops UNIX[18:57:19] <BenB> tsoome: I don't know... I only know that my pool was gone, and I had to semi-manually bring it back, as mentioned.[18:57:35] <cmihai> Solaris 10 is UNIX 03, MacOS X 10.5 on Intel is UNIX 03.[18:57:48] <tsoome> well, it was not automatically mounted, it does not mean you have lost files:D[18:58:04] *** NoFX_SBC has quit IRC[18:58:12] <tsoome> zpool scrub?[18:58:34] *** NoFX_SBC has joined #opensolaris[18:58:50] *** MattMan has quit IRC[18:58:53] <Ramdac__> so guys then looks like i'm gonna give up my windows partition to install OpenSolaris , btw can i dual boot between OpenSolaris and Linux?[18:59:16] <BenB> Ramdac__: yes... I personally would try with a VM first, though.[18:59:34] <BenB> Ramdac__: makes hardware support easier, and partition tables, and boot manager etc.[18:59:46] *** _coredump_ has quit IRC[19:00:09] *** Garcon_ has quit IRC[19:00:11] <BenB> (in fact, that's what I'm doing right now: trying out solaris and ZFS, in a VM)[19:00:12] <Ramdac__> BenB:both uses GRUB but which GRUB version will be used the Linux's or OpenSolaris[19:00:32] <BenB> Ramdac__: probably whoever writes last to (hd0) :)[19:00:43] *** arcame has quit IRC[19:01:09] *** sahX has joined #opensolaris[19:01:28] *** capaz has quit IRC[19:01:41] <Ramdac__> does opensolaris have WINE?[19:02:07] <oenone> tsoome: any more information on how to network install it?[19:02:11] *** _coredump_ has joined #opensolaris[19:02:59] <tsoome> simplest way is to have another solaris to make it boot/install server[19:03:19] <oenone> i have boot env already setup[19:03:21] <tsoome> basically you need dhcp; tftpboot and nfs[19:04:01] *** KermitTheFragger has quit IRC[19:04:22] <oenone> would like to know where to find the boot image and what i need for making it start install[19:05:01] <tsoome> you will find setup scripts in solaris dvd image; from Tools directory inside it[19:05:16] <oenone> hm.. okay[19:05:22] <tsoome> setup_install_server and add_install_client[19:05:33] *** g4lt-lappy has quit IRC[19:08:18] *** webmink has quit IRC[19:08:25] *** wewek has joined #opensolaris[19:08:30] <BenB> tsoome: to your original question: yes, the NFS services are enabled (apparently automatically, as I expected them to be):[19:08:46] *** ry_laptop has joined #opensolaris[19:09:09] <BenB> NFS ID mapper, NFS lock man, NFS server, , NFS status monitor are all running. only NFS client and NFS callback service are not running.[19:09:16] <BenB> tsoome: I still get the I/O errors[19:09:17] <tsoome> well, can you get this share mounted now?[19:09:22] <tsoome> ah[19:10:32] <BenB> any idea what could cause it?[19:11:05] *** alfism has joined #opensolaris[19:11:41] <tsoome> you see NFS responses from server side while the client is getting errors?[19:11:49] <tsoome> with snoop[19:11:57] *** chol_ is now known as chol[19:12:34] *** cypromis has quit IRC[19:12:50] *** Rocket2DMn has joined #opensolaris[19:14:22] <BenB> tsoome: with what? what exactly shall I do?[19:14:47] <tsoome> start snoop in server then try to access share and get errors from it[19:14:55] *** {H} has joined #opensolaris[19:15:08] *** bubbva has joined #opensolaris[19:16:50] *** freakazoid0223 has joined #opensolaris[19:16:58] *** Ramdac__ has quit IRC[19:17:37] *** calumb has quit IRC[19:17:59] <axisys> the filebeck 1.3.4 is pretty old and it unmounts all zpools including root pool .. ouch! how do I get the source code of the this http://src.opensolaris.org/source/xref/onnv/onnv-gate/usr/src/cmd/filebench/[19:18:08] <axisys> filebench[19:18:41] <BenB> tsoome: the solaris system is also not very responsive during the copy to NFS - doesn't react for many seconds[19:18:54] *** alanst has quit IRC[19:19:31] <tsoome> you can run fsstat zfs 1 in another window... or iostat -x 1[19:19:37] <BenB> tsoome: system load is very high[19:19:55] <BenB> I have the gnome load meter, it says system load is 13,7[19:20:07] *** gaveen has quit IRC[19:20:13] <tsoome> it might be the Vm engine isnt exactly best for it:)[19:20:21] <BenB> and continues so even now that I have stopped the client cp[19:20:46] <BenB> tsoome: I'm running almost all my servers in the same KVM, and they're doing fine.[19:21:00] *** gaveen has joined #opensolaris[19:21:04] <tsoome> doesnt mean its good for solaris;)[19:21:21] *** Auralis_ has quit IRC[19:21:36] <BenB> tsoome: right, but responsiveness is a software properly, not a matter of hardware speed[19:21:45] <BenB> (where VM is the hardware)[19:22:06] <tsoome> well, you have virtualization engine there[19:22:21] <BenB> needing 30s to settle down after a file copy can't be blamed on the VM[19:22:51] <tsoome> single file copy should not get os to load 13 on bare metal:)[19:23:47] <BenB> file copy over NFS... and note that I use physical disks.[19:24:01] <BenB> (just passed though by KVM)[19:24:15] <tsoome> set it to real hardware and see the difference;)[19:24:45] <BenB> I did the snoop... I can't see any errors... it seems solaris is simly dog-slow reacting.[19:25:06] <tsoome> might be the reason yep[19:25:49] <BenB> tsoome: well, given what I see (data loss, response times measured in seconds), I am not very hopeful in given solaris real metal.[19:26:15] <tsoome> well, once again, what data loss?![19:26:20] <BenB> I once tried it on bare metal, but solaris didn't like my hardware (nforce chipset)[19:26:46] <BenB> tsoome: the fact that it didn't see my pool after boot.... it must have lost some /etc or cache file[19:27:21] <tsoome> that was *my* guess it might be the reason. but then again, it might not[19:27:26] <BenB> I can try it again on bare metal. some other day.[19:27:53] <tsoome> as i told, im not sure about *exact* mechanism how solaris will determine what to import automatically and what now[19:27:56] <tsoome> not*[19:28:18] <BenB> tsoome: yes, understood. but whatever the mechanism, it failed.[19:28:37] <turtle> or maybe it was just user error[19:28:52] <BenB> and given that I am looking mainly for data reliabilty, I hope you can understand I'm uneasy.[19:29:03] <tsoome> if you just nuke your system, things will happen[19:29:40] <BenB> tsoome: not on Linux with XFS. I had quite a lot of power outages, and didn't notice any data loss in the last 2 years (luckily!)[19:29:52] <tsoome> rofl[19:30:02] <tsoome> not with linux....[19:30:20] <tsoome> linux fails even to detect disk errors in proper way[19:30:50] <BenB> that's my experience, that linux is rock-solid *shrug*.[19:30:51] <ry_laptop> linux rocksers my boxers[19:30:58] <ry_laptop> it is until, it isn't.[19:31:17] <tsoome> i have seen linux running and then just reset[19:31:26] <ry_laptop> I've seen linux lose filesystem commits.[19:31:28] <ry_laptop> once I lost /etc/[19:31:29] <tsoome> reboot, run random amount of time - reset[19:31:47] <ry_laptop> this was a clean shutdown.[19:31:49] <BenB> well, I have just seen that with solaris[19:31:59] <ry_laptop> seen what?[19:32:02] <turtle> BenB: when your pool didn't import on boot what did you do? did you try to manually import it? did you give up? what happend?[19:32:08] <holcomb> wait. are you saying anecdotal evidence cannot be used to extrapolate facts?[19:32:09] <jbk> i live the random ext3 'ooh problem, switching to read only mode, oh and by the way, you have to reboot & fsck to fix'[19:32:10] <tsoome> on top of crappy virtual machine engine[19:32:16] <holcomb> why didn't anybody tell me that![19:32:23] <BenB> you blame it on the VM, but the VM is just hardware towards solaris... your linux problem could just as well also be hardware, I could say... that's not helpful.[19:32:39] <ry_laptop> all oses sucks[19:32:42] <tsoome> VM is *never* just an hardware[19:32:44] <ry_laptop> let's move on.[19:32:52] <ry_laptop> bsd rules[19:32:57] <BenB> holcomb: I think 10 years of expierence allows drawing some conclusions, yes.[19:32:58] <ry_laptop> amiga os forever.[19:33:22] <ry_laptop> I never trust anyone that depends on "their years of expeirence" as an indicator[19:33:32] <BenB> jbk: I don't know ext3... I'm using XFS.[19:33:35] <tsoome> btw my linux issue was HW related, the HW was bad. but instead of reporting it, it just plain reset without any trace[19:33:40] <holcomb> multics4life[19:33:43] <ry_laptop> lol[19:34:26] <BenB> ry_laptop: so, how do you know that solaris is reliable? because of your years of experience? or that of others?[19:34:34] <BenB> or because of statistics (=lies)?[19:34:42] <ry_laptop> I don't trust any os.[19:34:55] <BenB> you use paper, ok.[19:34:57] <ry_laptop> I configure it the job it's suppose to do, test failure conditions. and pray.[19:35:04] <eviljames> BenB: I use XFS as well, I'm in the same boat, never noticed any data loss.[19:35:06] <ry_laptop> benb : stop trying to argue.[19:35:19] <eviljames> BenB: But therein lies the rub. "noticed". You won't notice a silent write error.[19:35:29] <tsoome> btw, regarding to hw - i have s10 + zfs on top of 450 with 2x 400Mhz cpu. its needless to say it just rocks. not blazing fast, but works without any issues.[19:35:38] <ry_laptop> I use ext3 on linux becuase it's well understood by the linux kerne ldevelopers[19:35:40] <eviljames> BenB: Or if the filesystem spontaneously drops a commit, or if you can't remember which files are on your 500GB disk, etc. etc.[19:35:52] <ry_laptop> whenever their's a disconnect in the linux community things break, that's why I tend to avoid linux.[19:35:55] <BenB> eviljames: that's presicely why I want to try solaris.[19:36:08] <ry_laptop> thta and drivers break all the time, making it too costly to maintain linux systems.[19:36:08] <BenB> eviljames: I am concerned about harddisks getting unreliable.[19:36:15] <ry_laptop> not to mention windows has a more advanced filesystem than linux[19:36:22] <ry_laptop> there are just too many strikes against linux.[19:36:31] <eviljames> BenB: All hard disks are unreliable. CERN did a study, and generic disks do something like 3 - 5 *SILENT* write errors per month.[19:36:46] <ry_laptop> benb : the one rub is, I think linux raid-dp is now dependable, but i haven't looked at that in a year.[19:36:47] <BenB> eviljames: yes... that's why[19:36:48] * timeless grumbles[19:36:52] <timeless> ext=pain[19:37:02] <eviljames> BenB: ie: OS sends blocks to disk for writing, disk fails to write, and reports to the OS that it wrote correctly.[19:37:07] <timeless> btw, can someone take some time to walk me through something theoretical w/ zfs?[19:37:29] <eviljames> timeless: Only if it is a conspiracy theory.[19:37:44] *** clebig has joined #opensolaris[19:38:07] <timeless> sorry[19:38:08] <tsoome> if you look on amount of data CERN got, it must hurt them really bad...[19:38:13] <ry_laptop> btw benb : I don't trust zfs 100% either.[19:38:17] <ry_laptop> it's a new fs with issues.[19:38:31] <eviljames> tsoome: They built a fibre network around the world to distribute the multiple TB of data generated per second from LHC iirc[19:38:40] <ry_laptop> doesn't have a fsck. ( would be difficult to do, but netapp has "wafl iron" )[19:38:41] <eviljames> tsoome: A friend of mine works at TRIUMF, and is on said fibre network :D[19:38:54] <ry_laptop> sometimes arrays get into a pickle and it gives up.[19:39:04] <eviljames> ry_laptop: "always consistant on disk"[19:39:07] <ry_laptop> there should be "figure this mess out please" fsck option.[19:39:12] <eviljames> ry_laptop: and it has zfs scrub[19:39:22] <ry_laptop> zfs scrub only works if the filesystem is imported.[19:39:24] <tsoome> i have ex coworker working on cern projects[19:39:31] <ry_laptop> I'm talking about fsck.[19:39:33] <eviljames> ry_laptop: and "figure out this mess" is the admin's job, not the system's.[19:39:51] <ry_laptop> if you have 70 disks, and you have to take over for another admin who is not available.. that arguement falls on the floor.[19:39:58] <ry_laptop> I know you should track everything.[19:40:00] <ry_laptop> but shit happens.[19:40:09] <ry_laptop> netapp does this stuff properly.[19:40:13] <eviljames> ry_laptop: Well, certainly a file system can't be designed for every corner case like that.[19:40:14] <ry_laptop> it's that simple.[19:40:25] <ry_laptop> it has to, and it will be.[19:40:30] <ry_laptop> as zfs is used by more and more people.[19:40:41] <ry_laptop> there will be more robust tools that we can do to fix issues.[19:40:48] <eviljames> It may evolve into it, but designed from the ground up to worry about an edge case? Sounds wasteful to me.[19:40:52] <ry_laptop> I agree[19:41:12] <ry_laptop> It's wasteful, but necessary, becusae the world sucks :)[19:41:15] <BenB> eviljames: question: what does "consistent on disk" mean for ZFS devs? "consistent" for the ZFS filesystem code, or "consistent" for the app?[19:41:15] <eviljames> timeless: What was the Q?[19:41:17] <Tusk2> is c++filt the cpp compiler of sunstudio??[19:41:20] <ry_laptop> I have raid-dp over 6 shelves.[19:41:39] <ry_laptop> if one shelf powers off, then powers up, and another shelf powers off right after that event... things get dicy[19:41:45] <flyingparchment> Tusk2: no, c++filt demangles C++ symbols into human-readable symbols. the C++ compiler is CC[19:41:56] <BenB> eviljames: (assuming the app writes in an order to keep consistency, if the writes stop at any given moment/block)[19:42:00] <eviljames> BenB: Investigate ZFS closely, atomic, transactional, and end-to-end checksums tend to equate to the filesystem not really needing to be checked.[19:42:01] *** yippi has joined #opensolaris[19:42:06] <ry_laptop> zfs handles that case well, but wha thappens if a third shelf goes off ?[19:42:26] <ry_laptop> zfs somtimes can't pull itself together, and it would be nice to say "make all disks I designate play together, in any way possible "[19:42:26] <eviljames> BenB: Maybe not 100% never needs checking.[19:42:47] <BenB> eviljames: I'm not talking about need to check, I'm talking about "what happens, if I pull the power plug at any given moment", including disk write cache[19:42:50] <tsoome> tbh, if there will be fsck for zfs, it means zfs has failed its design goals.[19:42:51] <ry_laptop> it may be time consuming, like a wafl iron, but it's invaluable.[19:42:59] <ry_laptop> not necessarily.[19:43:00] <flyingparchment> BenB: zfs understands how to flush the disk write cache when required[19:43:00] <eviljames> BenB: Either it is 100% committed to disk or 0% committed to disk.[19:43:14] <BenB> eviljames: in the right order?[19:43:34] <ry_laptop> yeah, when the disks are avialble everything works correctly.[19:43:38] <BenB> yeah, wouldn't make any sense otherwise[19:44:11] <ry_laptop> but there are some failure scenarios that seem to give zfs issues.[19:44:19] *** cambazz has joined #opensolaris[19:44:21] <ry_laptop> once it marks a drive deprecated.[19:44:23] <ry_laptop> it gets messy.[19:44:44] <Tusk2> flyingparchment: yay thx how do i declare in variables that it must use CC ? cause cc doesn't seems to fit[19:44:50] <ry_laptop> don't get me wrong.[19:44:52] <ry_laptop> I LOVE ZFS[19:45:12] <ry_laptop> got me back to using solaris from linux, and now I'm replacing all my linux servers with solaris becuase of how well it runs[19:45:28] *** free has quit IRC[19:45:37] <ry_laptop> but, I'd relaly like to see an 'oh shit' tool I think someone will write one if sun doesn't.[19:45:39] *** free has joined #opensolaris[19:45:41] <cambazz> hello. my opensolaris box sometimes shuts down. sometimes does not. sometimes reboots, sometimes does not.[19:45:47] <cambazz> any ideas on how to start debugging[19:46:06] <CosmicDJ> cambazz: are there any files in /var/crash/*/ ?[19:46:19] <turtle> yeah we're down to only one linux box at work now, and that's only because the sotware it runs requires it, and all it's important shit is a network mount from sxce anyway[19:46:32] <ry_laptop> *nod*[19:46:39] <CosmicDJ> Tusk2: CXX=CC; $CXX file.cpp[19:46:40] <ry_laptop> I hope the xvm server binaries are released soon[19:46:43] *** webmink has joined #opensolaris[19:46:51] <cambazz> CosmicDJ: i dont know, let me check. it goes svc.startd: system going down, syncing filesystems ... done[19:46:56] <cambazz> and it wont shutdown then[19:47:20] <Tusk2> CosmicDJ: cheers[19:48:33] <tsoome> cambazz: start it with -k but you really need to know kmdb then;)[19:48:51] <Tusk2> pkgsrc on opensolaris sounds pretty good compiling with sunstudio[19:50:16] <cambazz> CosmicDJ: no there is no /var/crash directory at all[19:50:27] <cambazz> tsoome: what is -k and what is kmdb[19:50:31] *** pjfloyd has joined #opensolaris[19:51:27] <tsoome> kmdb is the debugger[19:51:54] *** mikefut_ has quit IRC[19:52:04] <tsoome> but since you have not heard about it, its quite useless information for you:P[19:52:30] <cambazz> anyone knows what is acpi apic support.[19:52:36] <cambazz> which i disabled right now[19:58:55] *** cypromis has joined #opensolaris[20:03:05] <CosmicDJ> cambazz: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Programmable_Interrupt_Controller[20:03:22] <cambazz> reading that[20:03:30] <cambazz> anyone knows when the next release is coming[20:03:37] <CosmicDJ> april 2009[20:04:02] *** alexus has joined #opensolaris[20:04:05] <CosmicDJ> you can track the development bits if you want[20:04:11] <pjfloyd> not the 1st I hope[20:04:37] *** cambazz has quit IRC[20:05:18] *** cambazz has joined #opensolaris[20:06:12] <cambazz> hmm... if i disable acpi apic support - the machine will say "press any key to reboot"[20:06:33] <cambazz> if i enable "acpi apic" support, then the machine will not shutdown or reboot[20:10:03] *** sommerfeld has joined #opensolaris[20:10:03] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o sommerfeld[20:10:37] *** TBCOOL has quit IRC[20:12:32] *** dunc has quit IRC[20:14:12] <eviljames> CosmicDJ: April? I thought it had been pushed to June? 2009.06 ?[20:14:49] *** clebig has quit IRC[20:14:51] *** {H} has quit IRC[20:16:35] <CosmicDJ> eviljames: "every 6 month a new release"[20:17:17] <CosmicDJ> like openbsd ;)[20:17:58] <eviljames> heh, gotcha.[20:18:07] <ry_laptop> virtualbox and 2008.11 doesn't work with seamless mode :([20:18:48] *** kimc has joined #opensolaris[20:20:54] <kimc> have found that a machine i've been running Opensolaris on will not boot the install DVD[20:22:07] <kimc> was running b101.. tried to install b109 -hangs after printing to the screen the lines indicating its b109 etc[20:22:25] <CosmicDJ> I have a machine that fails to boot the netbsd 5.0 iso, opensolaris 2008.11, fedora doesn't start after installation...[20:22:34] <eviljames> kimc: There have been a few people discussing issues with b109 in here.[20:22:50] <PinkFreud> CosmicDJ: hardware issues?[20:22:52] <kimc> interesting[20:23:09] <CosmicDJ> PinkFreud: ubuntu/windoze/freebsd all run fine...[20:23:13] <kimc> i've got a few 'back issues' of Opensolaris builds here[20:23:36] <kimc> turns out it wont boot b108 or b107 either[20:24:35] <kimc> i can't locate b106 or b105.. but i can install b104[20:24:42] <PinkFreud> CosmicDJ: it all depends on where it fails to boot, of course. I'm surprised to see netbsd on that list, though.[20:25:07] <kimc> in can install FreeBSD 8-CURRENT[20:25:14] <tsoome> if so many systems fail, i would dump that machine really[20:25:25] <CosmicDJ> PinkFreud: well the 4.0 iso (and 3.0, 2.0, 1.6, 1.5) iso's worked fine, 5.0 is broken somehow[20:25:28] <kimc> and it can install WinXP :)[20:25:51] <kimc> and it boots FreeDOS :)[20:25:54] <pjfloyd> kimc: so what are you waiting for?[20:26:04] <kimc> what do you mean?[20:26:04] <PinkFreud> CosmicDJ: of course, I've seen some pretty wonky hardware failures. friend with an ubuntu box tried installing WOW under wine. It'd fail in random places.[20:26:38] <PinkFreud> CosmicDJ: eventually, he found his ps was on it's way out. swapped that out, and suddenly, WOW completed installation without error. :)[20:26:48] <CosmicDJ> PinkFreud: it's a shitty via chipset, but other than that the HW is quite stable and not faulty[20:27:22] <kimc> it hangs the machine after: Use is subject to license terms.[20:27:41] <PinkFreud> CosmicDJ: the ubuntu box appeared perfectly stable other than the WOW install failure, until his ps started causing noticable problems.[20:27:53] <kimc> This is a Supermicro 'server grade' motherboard[20:27:54] <CosmicDJ> kimc: http://blogs.sun.com/dmick/entry/diagnosing_kernel_hangs_panics_with[20:27:55] <PinkFreud> iow, it's entirely possible that you have faulty hardware. :)[20:28:10] <kimc> just updated to the latest bios[20:28:38] <kimc> wonder what changed at b105[20:28:40] *** xRaich[o]2x has quit IRC[20:29:38] <CosmicDJ> PinkFreud: whatever, I can assure you it's not a hardware failed that's causing the netbsd5.0 iso (just iso! netbsd-4 upgraded to -5 boots fine from the harddisk) doesn't boot problem[20:30:11] <kimc> thanks for the pointer to the blog article.. i'll follow up on that[20:31:14] <CosmicDJ> np, good luck[20:31:43] <kimc> hmm.. maybe i've got some bad memory?[20:32:16] <kimc> been running Opensolaris on this, various builds, never a problem[20:32:37] <CosmicDJ> memtest86.org[20:34:04] *** Erwann has quit IRC[20:34:57] *** cambazz has quit IRC[20:37:11] <PinkFreud> heh[20:37:32] *** myosound_ has joined #opensolaris[20:39:06] *** ry_laptop has quit IRC[20:39:29] <Tusk2> i just killed my system by missing a tiny -u to my crle command.... how am i suppose to mount my zpool from the live cd ?[20:39:33] *** stevel_ has joined #opensolaris[20:40:43] <CosmicDJ> lol, that's why I'll never touch crle again ;)[20:40:47] <CosmicDJ> zpool import maybe?[20:40:58] <Tusk2> yeah but import what?[20:40:59] <Tusk2> :P[20:41:04] * Tusk2 OS noob[20:41:21] *** nrich has joined #opensolaris[20:41:28] <CosmicDJ> *your pool* (me also OS noob) :p[20:41:50] <Tusk2> how do i get the pool name lol :D[20:41:51] <nrich> what's a command to install samba?[20:42:15] <CosmicDJ> nrich: man pkg or use the UI[20:43:00] <nrich> No manual entry for pkg.[20:43:20] <pjfloyd> just 'zpool import' should list all pools[20:44:25] <Tusk2> pjfloyd: thx lemme see[20:45:11] <nrich> what else could it be[20:45:33] <CosmicDJ> you're not using OpenSolaris?[20:45:58] <nrich> I don't know, the versions are quite confusing to me[20:46:17] <nrich> how can I check this[20:46:36] <nrich> Kernel version: SunOS 5.11 snv_96[20:46:41] <CosmicDJ> hm I' getting a blank page @ http://opensolaris.org/os/about/faq/[20:47:03] <CosmicDJ> otherwise I'd give you a nice link which explains the diff. between solaris, opensolaris and sxce[20:47:26] <nrich> I just want to know how to install samba on this machine really[20:47:35] *** stevel has quit IRC[20:47:47] <nrich> does that kernel version let you know what I'm using? I'm not sure about that[20:47:52] <CosmicDJ> looks like sxce, samba should already be installed[20:48:35] <nrich> how could I find the config file for it? doesn't seem to be anything for /etc/samba/smb.conf[20:48:40] <CosmicDJ> pkginfo | grep -i samba[20:48:56] *** myosound_ has quit IRC[20:49:34] <Tusk2> pjfloyd: the next part is a bit tricky O_o[20:49:36] <nrich> SUNWsmbar and SUNWsmbau are listed there[20:50:09] <CosmicDJ> find / -name "smb.conf*"[20:52:42] *** AxeZ has quit IRC[20:52:53] <nrich> no locate command =[[20:52:55] *** myosound_ has joined #opensolaris[20:53:01] *** capaz has joined #opensolaris[20:53:42] *** mikefut has joined #opensolaris[20:54:01] *** the-rar has joined #opensolaris[20:54:18] *** _setuid_H has joined #opensolaris[20:54:22] *** setuid_ has joined #opensolaris[20:54:41] <CosmicDJ> Tusk2: hm, I'd try deleting (mv'ing) the crle config file (IIRC it's somewhere in /var/ld/)[20:54:45] <_setuid_H> hi all[20:54:52] <nrich> dang this is taking forever[20:55:00] <nrich> lots of storage on this puppy[20:55:05] <CosmicDJ> ah...[20:55:11] <CosmicDJ> well then replace / with /etc[20:55:28] <nrich> only one file /etc/sfw/smb.conf-example[20:55:52] <CosmicDJ> sounds like that's the path where solaris's samba expects it's config file[20:55:59] <nrich> alright[20:56:17] <nrich> how can I 'restart' the service or whatever, once I change the config[20:56:21] <Tusk2> (20:56:17) CosmicDJ: Tusk2: hm, I'd try deleting (mv'ing) the crle config file (IIRC it's somewhere in /var/ld/) << yeah i'd love to.... if i oculd mount my zfs pool ;)[20:56:21] <nrich> thanks, too[20:56:24] <ottom> CosmicDJ: /var/ld/ld.config and /var/ld/64/ld.config[20:57:11] <CosmicDJ> nrich: man svcadm[20:57:23] <CosmicDJ> Tusk2: zpool import doesn't work?[20:57:40] <Tusk2> it shows my pools[20:57:50] <CosmicDJ> well that's what you wanted to know, right?[20:57:51] <Tusk2> but then.... don't know jack lol[20:58:25] <CosmicDJ> Tusk2: codestr0m knows jack, that's why he wrote http://www.codestrom.com/wandering/2008/10/rescue-boot-sol.html[20:58:46] * codestr0m ears perk up[20:59:30] <CosmicDJ> found some ugly c code that doesn't compile with sun studio (nor gcc 3.4.3)[21:00:13] *** noyb has joined #opensolaris[21:00:14] <codestr0m> CosmicDJ: 3.4 doesn't surprise me.. I mean it's like 10+ years old or something now[21:00:28] <CosmicDJ> uh really? 10 years by now?[21:00:45] <flyingparchment> 4 years[21:00:56] <CosmicDJ> IIRC openbsd still ships with gcc 3.5...[21:01:09] <MindDrive> 3.4.3 was released on November 4th, 2004[21:01:09] <CosmicDJ> and qnx 2.95?![21:01:10] <flyingparchment> i don't think 3.5 exists[21:01:19] <CosmicDJ> flyingparchment: hm wait[21:01:43] <MindDrive> I believe there's work underway to get OpenSolaris on a new gcc?[21:01:47] <CosmicDJ> flyingparchment: 3.3.5[21:02:08] <flyingparchment> CosmicDJ: but that's for the OS, and they have packages for more recent versions for users, right?[21:02:09] <CosmicDJ> MindDrive: well there's gccfss (for sparc systems ;))[21:02:26] <MindDrive> Doesn't that still use part of gcc 3.4.3? :)[21:03:13] <CosmicDJ> flyingparchment: IIRC they haven't switched to anything newer because they still support old hardware (vax or smth like that), which gcc4 don't support anymore[21:05:02] <CosmicDJ> MindDrive: hm, AFAIK gccfss uses the gcc4 frontend, and the sun studio stuff as backend[21:05:20] <MindDrive> Really? Huh, didn't realize that.[21:06:11] <nrich> how can I disable any firewalls on my solaris box[21:06:12] <Tusk2> CosmicDJ: this is f**** doesn't work[21:06:18] <MindDrive> *grumble* 90% into the download part for 'pkg image-update' and the damn thing times out.[21:06:20] <Tusk2> tells me i can't mount it[21:06:46] <eviljames> MindDrive: Fortunately, I believe those things are cached and it should pick up from 89% when you try again?[21:06:52] <nrich> for some reason I can't use the samba share: failed (Error NT_STATUS_CONNECTION_REFUSED)[21:06:58] *** Trident has quit IRC[21:06:58] <MindDrive> I'm hoping so, eviljames. :)[21:07:21] <MindDrive> (Of course, it could be our damn wireless here in the office misbehaving again.)[21:07:58] <CosmicDJ> nrich: did you enable one?[21:08:19] <eviljames> And the service?[21:08:24] <nrich> I ran: svcadm enable samba[21:08:51] <nrich> after renaming the config to just smb.conf[21:08:57] <nrich> and setting it up[21:09:32] <nrich> here's what nmap says of it from another machine[21:09:33] <nrich> http://nopaste.com/p/akYQI5cfab[21:09:37] *** mwest_ has joined #OpenSolaris[21:09:38] <CosmicDJ> nrich: well you need to do some more than just setting up smb.conf, I'd say you google for some samba guides[21:09:52] <nrich> why would I need to do more than that?[21:10:19] <eviljames> Do you have anything shared? What about zfs set sharesmb=on <dataset> ?[21:10:25] <nrich> you just set up the smb.conf and start the service, at least that's how we do it on linux[21:10:41] <eviljames> Just because that's how it's done on Linux doesn't make it correct.[21:11:03] * nrich sighs[21:12:04] <eviljames> nrich: You are using a complicated, well-engineered and extremely well-documented system.[21:12:08] <Tusk2> ok simple question wich part of my pool am i supposed to mount to access my /var dir??[21:13:29] <nrich> fxck this I'm going to just store the files on a different server[21:13:59] <nrich> too much work for such little gain, especially when we have other storage available[21:14:02] <nrich> thanks for your help[21:16:08] <CosmicDJ> Tusk2: well you import your pool and then you should've access to all your files...[21:16:14] *** esok has left #opensolaris[21:16:32] <Tusk2> CosmicDJ: nope not the var[21:16:53] <Tusk2> i got /boot /export and my opensolaris-3[21:17:10] <eviljames> Wouldn't it be opensolaris-3/var ?[21:18:16] <Tusk2> mmmmh[21:18:44] <Tusk2> dataset doesn't exists[21:19:31] <eviljames> Well, var should be a folder in the opensolaris-3 data set[21:21:05] *** mwest has quit IRC[21:22:46] *** Trident has joined #opensolaris[21:23:43] *** Tusk21 has joined #opensolaris[21:24:19] *** nsuperbus has quit IRC[21:25:21] *** yippi has quit IRC[21:25:53] *** webmink has quit IRC[21:28:52] *** myosound_ has quit IRC[21:30:04] *** ravv has joined #opensolaris[21:34:01] *** luizxx has quit IRC[21:35:58] <MindDrive> Holy... 50 new SMF services in b109?? (Coming from b106)[21:36:21] <CosmicDJ> new? are you sure?[21:36:36] <MindDrive> Well, "new" in the sense that my initial bootup loaded that many.[21:36:47] <flyingparchment> probably just updated[21:36:53] <MindDrive> (Previous updates usually only had 3 or 4)[21:37:04] *** master_of_master has quit IRC[21:38:56] *** wbkang has quit IRC[21:39:12] *** dguitar has quit IRC[21:39:53] *** Tusk2 has quit IRC[21:40:02] *** master_of_master has joined #opensolaris[21:40:23] *** jwit_ has joined #opensolaris[21:41:55] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[21:41:59] *** ahe has joined #opensolaris[21:42:21] *** jwit has quit IRC[21:42:39] *** Jiraia has joined #opensolaris[21:42:49] <MindDrive> Woot, the X issue with b107 is definitely fixed in b109...[21:43:41] *** rootard has joined #opensolaris[21:44:07] <codestr0m> trochej: you know how you guys are always drinking so much coffee around here?[21:45:48] <codestr0m> anyway.. when you guys feel you need something refreshing...[21:45:50] <codestr0m> http://want.0xc0ffee.com/[21:47:25] *** Chipdancer_ has joined #opensolaris[21:47:28] <cmihai> codestr0m: caffeine helps prevent suicide.[21:48:00] <codestr0m> cmihai: yes. so does fixing important bugs :P[21:48:39] *** _setuid_H has quit IRC[21:52:55] *** ahe has quit IRC[21:53:10] *** pjfloyd has left #opensolaris[21:54:26] *** Trident has quit IRC[21:56:42] *** Chipdancer_ has quit IRC[21:56:55] <jbk> hmm... i think maybe *solaris is spoiling me when I find a 'stable' release of something that won't even run correctly[21:57:32] <jbk> unless something is radically different with ruby 1.9.1[22:01:59] <lewellyn> MindDrive: *which* x issue? ;)[22:03:21] *** NoFX_SBC has quit IRC[22:04:17] *** neoxed has quit IRC[22:05:19] *** Chipdancer has quit IRC[22:06:39] *** TBCOOL has joined #opensolaris[22:07:56] *** neoxed has joined #OpenSolaris[22:11:42] *** ry_laptop has joined #opensolaris[22:13:24] *** legolasw2 has joined #opensolaris[22:13:24] *** legolasw has quit IRC[22:13:44] *** clebig has joined #opensolaris[22:15:07] *** aveteam has quit IRC[22:16:34] *** perlmongo has quit IRC[22:16:36] *** ken-1 is now known as ken-zZz[22:17:01] *** fftb_ has quit IRC[22:17:25] *** Trident has joined #opensolaris[22:20:35] *** kevpete has joined #opensolaris[22:25:21] *** hsp has quit IRC[22:26:27] *** rootard is now known as radroot[22:26:38] *** stevel_ has quit IRC[22:27:08] *** stevel has joined #opensolaris[22:27:08] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stevel[22:27:29] *** NoFX_SBC has joined #opensolaris[22:28:09] *** christophsturm has quit IRC[22:28:45] *** NoFX_SBC has quit IRC[22:29:37] *** NoFX_SBC has joined #opensolaris[22:32:30] <legolasw2> Is it possible to clone a Sparse zone from a whole zone template to prevent the system from downloading those packages from the internet?[22:33:04] <legolasw2> I have a whole zone template and now I want to create a Sparse zone, but the system has no internet connection to download the packages[22:34:44] *** LeftWing has joined #OpenSolaris[22:34:52] *** ry_laptop has quit IRC[22:35:41] *** radsy has joined #opensolaris[22:35:49] *** axisys has quit IRC[22:36:18] *** Gman_ has joined #opensolaris[22:38:25] *** kevpete has left #opensolaris[22:39:11] <Tusk21> one ever get gmp compiled ??[22:39:13] *** hugohagogo has joined #opensolaris[22:40:07] *** la_mer has joined #opensolaris[22:40:49] *** la_mer has quit IRC[22:41:57] *** scoffin has joined #opensolaris[22:42:52] <MindDrive> lewellyn: All of them! :D Actually, the one that bit me was X wouldn't start at all.[22:43:18] <lewellyn> yay :P[22:43:29] <lewellyn> i hope 110 manages to fix my issues ;)[22:44:02] *** esok has joined #opensolaris[22:44:48] *** cemerick has quit IRC[22:47:04] *** cemerick has joined #opensolaris[22:48:56] *** alexus has quit IRC[22:49:12] *** proberts has quit IRC[22:49:29] *** Gman__ has joined #opensolaris[22:52:02] <e^ipi> Tusk21: yes, it works fine[22:52:09] <e^ipi> compile it with GCC[22:52:28] <Tusk21> mmmh[22:52:33] *** sickness has quit IRC[22:52:43] <Tusk21> i'm trying with sunstudio trough pkgsrc[22:52:57] <e^ipi> well don't do that then, no?[22:53:26] <Tusk21> well kinda suck to not being abble to build the full gcc toolchain from there[22:53:38] <Tusk21> this gmp failing ugglily[22:53:50] *** martman has joined #opensolaris[22:54:03] <oenone> how do i start a dhcp server?[22:54:25] <Tusk21> it's deleting a lib compiled earlier and then complains it doesn't find it....[22:54:31] <Tusk21> weirdo stuff[22:54:34] <e^ipi> Tusk21: compile GMP with /usr/sfw/bin/gcc, then compile MPFR with /usr/sfw/bin/gcc[22:54:51] <e^ipi> then compile gcc4 against both of those. then compile them again[22:55:02] <e^ipi> problem -> solution[22:55:25] <martman> is there a way to customize what software gets installed?[22:56:04] <Tusk21> e^ipi: mmmh could be one[22:56:05] <e^ipi> pkg install/uninstall[22:56:14] <e^ipi> Tusk21: no, it is one[22:56:17] <martman> i ment during the instal process[22:56:20] <e^ipi> that's how i got gcc4[22:56:24] <e^ipi> martman: no[22:56:25] <CosmicDJ> Tusk21: http://wiki.genunix.org/wiki/index.php/Gmp[22:57:07] *** proberts has joined #opensolaris[22:57:08] <Tusk21> believe me or not[22:57:20] <Tusk21> only the make install fails[22:57:25] <Tusk21> compilation went fine[22:57:31] <martman> uggg, lameness....[22:57:32] <lewellyn> i got gcc4 from SFE[22:57:37] <lewellyn> far easier :P[22:57:45] *** sickness has joined #opensolaris[22:57:46] <palowoda> e^ipi: You running 4.3.4 gcc now?[22:57:58] <e^ipi> bugger if i know[22:58:17] <e^ipi> 4.3.2, evidently[22:58:26] <e^ipi> i pull it out when stuff won't compile with studio[22:58:27] <palowoda> cool[22:58:54] <CIA-40> Michael Corcoran <Michael.Corcoran at Sun dot COM>: 6814019 recent kmem_impl.h fix broke ::kmastat[22:59:05] *** Gman_ has quit IRC[22:59:12] <palowoda> Yeah I know.[22:59:28] *** ry_laptop has joined #opensolaris[22:59:32] <ry_laptop> whew, that was a waste.[22:59:42] <ry_laptop> ibm really wants to drive everyone towards mainframe... stupid.[23:00:00] <ry_laptop> they are pitching their remote dongle thing with remote view, which draws 8 watts vs a desktop that draws 100 watts.[23:00:11] <ry_laptop> They don't even mention the LCD panel you are driving, and that intel atom platforms draw about 30 watts.[23:00:43] <ry_laptop> and latency sucks so you need a huge network, ORRRR you can boot something via pxe with a local caching server and be way better off.[23:00:48] <ry_laptop> god, I hate sales heh[23:00:51] <Tusk21> (22:58:01) CosmicDJ: Tusk21: http://wiki.genunix.org/wiki/index.php/Gmp << mmmh trying the --disable-cxx[23:02:08] <palowoda> Strange I just built gmp 4.2.4 and it passed the checks.[23:02:19] <palowoda> No errors during the build.[23:02:33] <lewellyn> ry_laptop: i decided to skip it ;)[23:02:36] *** hugohagogo has quit IRC[23:02:51] <lewellyn> you still in the city?[23:02:51] <ry_laptop> that was a good cohice[23:02:53] <ry_laptop> yup[23:02:58] <ry_laptop> at the burger place across the street[23:02:59] *** jacobs has joined #opensolaris[23:03:02] <ry_laptop> "bistro burger"[23:03:07] <ry_laptop> breakfast of champions[23:03:13] <lewellyn> god bistro burger rocks[23:03:29] <ry_laptop> I was surprised.[23:03:31] <palowoda> White Castle rocks![23:03:33] <ry_laptop> I thought it would suck[23:03:42] <ry_laptop> but the fry's are burger are really fucking good![23:03:47] <lewellyn> nah. bistro burger's the best thing around[23:03:50] <lewellyn> well worth the money[23:04:00] <ry_laptop> lol really?[23:04:02] <ry_laptop> luck[23:04:12] <ry_laptop> I was starving so I didn't look any more deeply[23:04:39] <e^ipi> i always expect to find more good coffee and more good vegetarian food when i go to SF... not sure why, you'd think i'd have learned my lesson by nown[23:04:45] <e^ipi> *now[23:04:46] <ry_laptop> *nod*[23:04:55] <ry_laptop> I live in san jose and use to live in santa cruz and now I"m realizing both sucked.[23:04:56] <ry_laptop> and sucks[23:05:00] <ry_laptop> lew tried to tell me[23:05:03] <ry_laptop> but I'm stubborn[23:05:04] <sickness> someone is DDOSsing me :/[23:05:28] <Tusk21> CosmicDJ: was the way to go gcc-4.3.2 compiling[23:06:41] <ry_laptop> e^ipi: where about's are you based?[23:06:43] *** legolasw3 has joined #opensolaris[23:06:50] *** legolasw2 has quit IRC[23:06:59] <e^ipi> ry_laptop: the damnable tundra[23:07:12] <ry_laptop> eh?[23:07:19] <e^ipi> 800km north of vancouver[23:07:24] <ry_laptop> Aaah[23:07:32] <ry_laptop> thought you were local. by how you talked about sf :)[23:07:36] <eviljames> Rube![23:07:41] <palowoda> And it's cold up there.[23:07:48] <e^ipi> it snowed today[23:07:52] <ry_laptop> Heh[23:07:58] <e^ipi> i'm not joking[23:08:06] <ry_laptop> yeah.[23:08:09] <ry_laptop> late winter this year.[23:08:17] <e^ipi> no, pretty standard[23:08:24] <ry_laptop> *nod* down here we did[23:08:29] <ry_laptop> got a bunch of badly needed rain in the last 2 weeks[23:08:46] *** yarihm has joined #opensolaris[23:08:52] <e^ipi> moving for Jn 1[23:08:57] <e^ipi> ( back home to vancouver )[23:08:59] <ry_laptop> yeah[23:09:01] <colyte> where would I go to ask for a package(s) to be included in OS2009.06?[23:09:06] <ry_laptop> that is one my short list of places to settle down.[23:09:08] <palowoda> At least it's warmer there.[23:09:08] <trichobezoar> Where are the release notes for 109?[23:09:32] <e^ipi> colyte: you'd create a package spec file and submit it to pending/[23:09:33] <ry_laptop> portland, vancouver, Japan.[23:09:40] <ry_laptop> that's the extent of my list :)[23:09:49] <jbk> heh[23:09:55] * jbk prefers warmer climates :)[23:09:56] <palowoda> I think david comay does the release notes in the email announcements on the discuss-indiana list.[23:10:01] *** Yamazaki-kun has quit IRC[23:10:02] <legolasw3> does zfs support encryption in 2008.11?[23:10:08] <palowoda> No[23:10:08] <e^ipi> no[23:10:09] <trichobezoar> no[23:10:13] <jbk> no[23:10:20] <eviljames> e^ipi: It snowed here on Monday.[23:10:21] <ry_laptop> no[23:10:22] <e^ipi> jbk ruined the trifecta[23:10:24] <ry_laptop> damn[23:10:27] <e^ipi> eviljames: seriously?[23:10:30] <colyte> e^ipi: I thing SFE got a few ;) Mind pointing me in the direction of where to submit?[23:10:34] <e^ipi> trippy, it never snows in vancouver[23:10:35] <colyte> s/thing/think[23:10:41] <jbk> no, the goal with those is to get as many people to repeat it without any breaks :)[23:10:47] <e^ipi> colyte: sw-porters-discuss at opensolaris dot org[23:10:49] <eviljames> e^ipi: Yeah, 2cm. PANDEMONEUM ensued. I couldn't even get to work traffic was so bad.[23:11:00] <eviljames> e^ipi: It snowed here for a full month over xmas[23:11:17] <e^ipi> i was only out for 2 weeks of that[23:11:25] <e^ipi> it was hectic though[23:11:27] *** cemerick has quit IRC[23:11:27] <colyte> e^ipi: k :)[23:11:39] <e^ipi> nobody down there knows how to drive in the snow[23:11:43] <legolasw3> Is zfs encryption scheduled to be included in next version? perhaps 2009.6 or something like that?[23:11:50] <trichobezoar> is there something like this for all of opensolaris? http://opensolaris.org/os/community/x_win/changelogs/changelogs-nv_100/[23:11:51] <palowoda> no[23:11:54] *** mm55mm has joined #opensolaris[23:12:32] <oenone> yay, netboot worked[23:12:57] *** sickness has quit IRC[23:13:04] <palowoda> You know there is a zfs-crypto-discuss list you can ask too.[23:13:23] <e^ipi> trichobezoar: google://opensolaris+flag+days[23:13:36] <e^ipi> doesn't give you a changelog, but gives you a heads up on what's new[23:13:55] <e^ipi> eviljames: vancouver rent's gone down a tiny bit though[23:13:59] <e^ipi> i was pretty stoked to see that[23:14:02] <eviljames> Really?[23:14:06] <eviljames> I should renegotiate then[23:14:23] <eviljames> Then again, I'm still under $900. And considering the location I can't really complain too much[23:14:38] <e^ipi> jesus? really?[23:14:40] <jbk> i hope rent around here starts going down[23:14:52] <ry_laptop> Heh[23:14:55] <oenone> wow, a panic..[23:14:59] <e^ipi> christ, we're looking at ~ $2000[23:15:00] <ry_laptop> you would cry if you knew what my mortgage was[23:15:02] <eviljames> e^ipi: Yeah man 850, underground parking included :D[23:15:11] <eviljames> e^ipi: But mine's a 1 bedroom apt.[23:15:21] <e^ipi> ahh[23:15:28] <e^ipi> yeah, i need an office[23:15:34] <e^ipi> so that jacks it up a bunch[23:15:54] <eviljames> Indeed. We're looking to buy 1+den in Richmond (they're under $120k now).[23:16:01] *** hugohagogo has joined #opensolaris[23:16:04] <eviljames> I saw 2 bedroom apartments in Richmond under 150[23:16:13] *** revlo has joined #opensolaris[23:16:59] <e^ipi> yeah, but then you have to live in richmond[23:17:28] <e^ipi> ;)[23:17:32] <eviljames> Once the train line is done (November!) Richmond will be easy to escape from[23:17:36] <Tusk21> and some more patching[23:17:37] <Tusk21> :P[23:17:48] <e^ipi> eviljames: you know if they're running a line through kits?[23:18:04] <e^ipi> i thought I saw one on granville & broadway-ish under construction[23:18:13] <oenone> i did something wrong :([23:18:31] *** hugohagogo has quit IRC[23:18:41] <eviljames> granville / broadway = Canada line (Richmond-Airport-Vancouver), but there is talk of the Evergreen line happening soon (VCC->UBC)[23:18:47] <eviljames> Which, of course, would go right through kits[23:18:51] <ry_laptop> just heard on radio here...organization against california tax raise on property :/[23:18:54] <ry_laptop> I'll be support that shit[23:19:16] *** lesterc has joined #opensolaris[23:19:19] <ry_laptop> now free laptops[23:19:47] <eviljames> I support free laptops, but only for people on welfare.[23:19:48] <palowoda> Tax on Cal property isn't what it was two weeks ago.[23:19:55] <ry_laptop> lol[23:20:08] <oenone> pxegrub gets loaded, but after i select the menu entry, it seems to load (dots filling the line), and then it got a panic and wanted to reboot :/[23:20:24] <e^ipi> eviljames: granville & broadway is kits enough that it opens up a bunch more places i'd live[23:20:46] <eviljames> e^ipi: Yeah, with that train it'll be 2 minutes to downtown, instead of the 5 it would be on the bus[23:21:04] *** moby has joined #opensolaris[23:21:25] <eviljames> It goes from Richmond to Yaletown, I think[23:21:27] <ry_laptop> god I wish this phone charged faster...[23:21:28] <e^ipi> or 15 if you're a damnfool like i am and walk across the bridge[23:21:43] <jbk> do your trains have issues with colliding with people?[23:21:50] <eviljames> jbk: They're elevated or underground, so no.[23:21:51] <ry_laptop> okay, later[23:21:54] <jbk> ahh[23:22:01] <jbk> i was just talking about that to someone[23:22:13] <jbk> they installed light rail a few years ago going through downtown[23:22:19] <e^ipi> i still maintain that the skytrain was idiotic[23:22:26] <e^ipi> a subway would be much more cost-efficient[23:22:30] *** mm55mm_ has joined #opensolaris[23:22:32] <jbk> and it's ground level -- basically they turned one lane in each direction of main st. into train tracks[23:22:36] *** jwk404 has left #opensolaris[23:22:37] <e^ipi> but we had to show off for expo[23:22:45] <jbk> and has 'issues' with that :)[23:22:45] <lewellyn> eviljames: <eviljames> I support free laptops, but only for people on welfare.[23:22:56] <lewellyn> eviljames: so you're all for a secondary income source? :D[23:23:01] <eviljames> e^ipi: The skytrain is a crown jewel, a showoff point, not really an economic concern :D[23:23:12] <eviljames> lewellyn: Yeah, if they 'lose' the laptop, the government should provide them with a new one.[23:23:42] <e^ipi> eviljames: montreal dug a subway because they had some sense, and for a crown jewel turned the dirt in to an island[23:23:42] <lewellyn> time to get on welfare! ;)[23:24:00] <palowoda> That means the goverment has to find a way to stop losing laptops.[23:24:28] <eviljames> e^ipi: And that island is an amusement park now, iirc.[23:24:30] <oenone> next try..[23:24:51] <eviljames> e^ipi: I like the skytrain as it is. On nice days you can ride the train and watch the mountains go by.[23:25:13] <e^ipi> *shrug*[23:25:54] <lewellyn> ok. quick question. how likely is it that i can attach ndiswrapper to my phone's usb interface? :)[23:26:16] <palowoda> Highly unlikely.[23:26:20] <lewellyn> i have the ndis driver,i think i know what it shows up as to the os[23:26:20] <eviljames> lewellyn: very unlikely.[23:26:25] <eviljames> damn palowoda beat me to it. :D[23:26:27] *** proberts has quit IRC[23:26:40] <lewellyn> so usb network adapters are still unsupported?[23:26:52] <palowoda> No some are.[23:27:00] <palowoda> Few models.[23:27:30] <palowoda> Never tested them though.[23:27:30] <lewellyn> as far as the os should be concerned, this is a usb network adapter, requiring a ndis driver[23:27:51] <palowoda> I didn't read anything like that.[23:28:19] <lewellyn> my phone exposes a few interfaces over usb, one of which is a network adapter[23:28:24] <lewellyn> windows has an ndis driver[23:28:37] <lewellyn> opensolaris supports usb and ndis.[23:28:40] <lewellyn> so, i thought... ;)[23:28:51] <palowoda> opensolaris has an ndis driver that sucks if it makes you feel better.[23:29:04] <lewellyn> it's better than not getting online at all[23:29:24] <palowoda> I guess it's a hardware problem.[23:30:15] <lewellyn> and the solution would be figuring out how to use the ndis wrapper on an arbitrary usb interface ;)[23:30:26] <lewellyn> anyhow, shower time[23:30:48] *** cemerick has joined #opensolaris[23:30:56] <palowoda> you could ask the driver-usb discuss list.[23:31:09] <lewellyn> which means getting wine to like my email client, yes[23:31:24] <e^ipi> wine?[23:31:37] <eviljames> Probably is stuck with outlook/exchange[23:31:37] <palowoda> I drink wine and read mail on solaris every day.[23:31:50] <lewellyn> e^ipi: unless you have something that can check mail against 30 hotmail accounts without puking that's native... ;)[23:33:11] *** mm55mm has quit IRC[23:33:22] *** Jondice has joined #opensolaris[23:33:42] *** Gman_ has joined #opensolaris[23:33:54] *** cemerick has quit IRC[23:34:23] <lesterc> lewellyn: probably easier to run your own mail server. ;)[23:34:36] <palowoda> God I remember Sun sent me to Hotmail to talk to them two weeks after MS bought them. What an experience.[23:34:54] <eviljames> palowoda: How so?[23:35:32] <palowoda> The evil atmosphere.[23:35:46] *** glance_ is now known as glance[23:35:54] <eviljames> I figured that would be part of hotmail before the buyout, but amplified after[23:36:04] *** coffeetime has joined #opensolaris[23:37:50] *** piwi has joined #opensolaris[23:37:53] *** clebig has quit IRC[23:38:15] *** mikefut has quit IRC[23:39:11] *** devians has quit IRC[23:39:36] *** sickness has joined #opensolaris[23:40:03] *** ry_laptop has quit IRC[23:40:11] <e^ipi> i still remember when hotmail tried to switch off freebsd in favour of windows 2000 server[23:40:17] <e^ipi> so many 404's[23:41:20] <lewellyn> lesterc: not with the spam volume my domains get :([23:41:36] <lewellyn> e^ipi: heh. yeah. i was sure hotmail was going to die then.[23:41:40] <eviljames> lewellyn: That's exactly what I use hotmail for now. Spamtrap[23:41:44] <lewellyn> but luckily, they've made it more stable[23:41:49] *** stewart has joined #opensolaris[23:41:55] <lewellyn> eviljames: they do an excellent job filtering spam[23:41:56] *** Gman_ has quit IRC[23:42:39] <eviljames> lewellyn: hahaha no they don't.[23:42:43] <lewellyn> i was running a fakehermes as backup mx for a few days... i quickly realized that was a bad idea on a metered line :([23:42:53] <eviljames> lewellyn: My inbox has exactly 3,000 spam messages in it RIGHT NOW.[23:43:10] <lesterc> wow[23:43:24] <lewellyn> as i said, i get at most 1 or 2 pieces of spam per day, out of 3000+ messages in my inboxes[23:43:33] <lesterc> Is that a personal domain lewellyn?[23:43:54] <eviljames> lewellyn: Your results are much better than mine.[23:43:56] <lewellyn> lesterc: i host my personal and business domains with hotmail[23:44:26] <oenone> http://rafb.net/p/wAtf2j52.html[23:44:31] <lewellyn> another benefit is that i don't have to worry about setting up a webmail thing for my users :)[23:44:39] <lesterc> in the new startup I work in (company is roughly 2 years old now) we get about 30k spam in the last 6months only.[23:44:40] <oenone> anybody around who knows how to solve this?[23:45:02] <oenone> actually, it doesn't reboot, but just stays frozen[23:45:33] <lesterc> I'm sure the situation will only get worse as we hire more sales...[23:45:37] <lewellyn> lesterc: i get nearly that per hour.[23:45:46] <eviljames> oenone: Wow that sucks.[23:45:50] <eviljames> oenone: That's from netboot?[23:45:57] <oenone> eviljames: yes[23:46:09] <lewellyn> lesterc: hint: don't let your email addresses sit on the internet for 10+ years ;)[23:46:09] <lesterc> ask your staff to stop surfing p0rn at work. ;D[23:46:31] *** mm55mm_ has left #opensolaris[23:46:41] <eviljames> oenone: tbh, I can't help you.[23:46:57] <lesterc> yeah - this is why everybody use a free webmail for mailing list these days.[23:47:00] <lewellyn> also, i maintain email servers (among other things) for my clients. why the hell do i want to come home and do the same damn thing? :P[23:47:02] *** telexicon has quit IRC[23:47:21] <lesterc> lewellyn: true.[23:47:57] <lewellyn> out of the available email hosts, microsoft brings the most to the table. and the price is right. and their support staff outright rocks.[23:48:45] <lewellyn> i.e. i have some "interesting" SPF records which are totally legit. a quick back and forth and their overly-anal SPF checker was able to deal with them. less than a day.[23:49:02] <lewellyn> well within the grace period they allow before complaining about the records :)[23:51:35] *** NoFX_SBC has quit IRC[23:51:57] *** yarihm has quit IRC[23:51:57] *** nachox has joined #opensolaris[23:52:45] *** Jiraia has quit IRC[23:53:51] *** Chipdancer has joined #opensolaris[23:54:07] *** DiscordianUK has joined #opensolaris[23:54:22] <DiscordianUK> Evening[23:55:15] <DiscordianUK> I've tried 2008.11 but it always seems to baulk with many lines about an unknown pcmcia device config on bootup on my laptop[23:55:21] *** legolasw3 has quit IRC[23:56:11] *** Tusk2 has joined #opensolaris[23:57:09] *** gm152 has joined #opensolaris[23:57:23] *** dunc has joined #opensolaris[23:58:37] *** glance has quit IRC[23:58:39] *** glance has joined #opensolaris[23:58:41] *** sndcrb has quit IRC[23:58:59] <CIA-40> Rajagopal Kunhappan <Rajagopal.Kunhappan at Sun dot COM>: 6810771 increase the number of Tx rings for best OOB performance on a link[23:59:02] <CIA-40> Alan Wright <amw at Sun dot COM>: 6794156 ADS messages in syslog on domain join failure are too vague, 6764265 Share is not published to specified AD site DC., 6810842 idmapd dumped core in list_mappings_cb(), 6812513 idmap show -c -v with inhibited mapping yields garbage, 6812272 Netbench cannot read file login.sem, 6811318 filenames begining with / created in root directory instead of current directory, 6812270 Netbench hangs when running with oplocks enable[23:59:30] *** nrich has quit IRC