February 26, 2018 
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February 26, 2018 [00:03:18] *** ville <ville!~ville@37-136-30-222.rev.dnainternet.fi> has joined ##OpenGL[00:03:30] *** ville <ville!~ville@37-136-30-222.rev.dnainternet.fi> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[00:05:56] <derhass> Dariusz_: no, lookat()^-1 *(0,0,-1,0)^T yields a vector[00:06:46] <derhass> Dariusz_: and lookat()^-1 *(0,0,0,1) yields another vector[00:06:50] <derhass> usually a point[00:07:29] <derhass> by the definition of the matrix multiplication M * (0,0,0,1)^T yields the last column in the 4x4 matrix[00:07:43] <davr0s> does anyone know off hand if any of the cross platform windowing libs (e.g. glfw, SDL2 etc) handle wacom tablets with pressure sensitivity[00:08:52] <derhass> Dariusz_: which is not exactly the same as a translation. if M is an affine transformation, M * (0,0,0,1)^ yields (x,y,z,1) where (x,y,z) is the translation part of M[00:09:09] <derhass> which is probably what you meant, but not exactly the same thing[00:09:23] *** Asu` <Asu`!~sdelang@92.184.101.183> has joined ##OpenGL[00:09:28] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-82s3g7mzgy0p2f49u7u.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[00:09:57] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-82s3g7mzgy0p2f49u7u.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[00:11:05] *** xerpi <xerpi!~xerpi@216.red-83-45-198.dynamicip.rima-tde.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[00:11:46] <Dariusz_> hmm[00:12:31] *** davr0s <davr0s!~textual@host86-152-129-209.range86-152.btcentralplus.com> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[00:13:15] *** Asu <Asu!~sdelang@AMarseille-658-1-121-46.w86-219.abo.wanadoo.fr> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[00:17:29] <isaac__> DarkUranium: It indeed is. Nevertheless, today I was a mess too.[00:18:40] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[00:31:09] <Dariusz_> https://media1.tenor.com/images/ca50f373f728042e548643ce4b4e63da/tenor.gif?itemid=9205869[00:31:52] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@2a01cb0d04c9050045eb97cb79cc4f07.ipv6.abo.wanadoo.fr> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[00:31:53] <derhass> Dariusz_: that's how I felt last friday[00:31:57] <derhass> Dariusz_: just without the computer[00:32:24] <Dariusz_> hahaha :- )[00:34:52] <derhass> well, I'm still depressed[00:34:58] <Dariusz_> how come[00:35:47] <derhass> well, had to read the students' exam answers[00:35:54] <Dariusz_> oh[00:35:57] <Dariusz_> wait are u a teacher?[00:36:04] <derhass> not really[00:36:47] *** Asu` <Asu`!~sdelang@92.184.101.183> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[00:36:54] <derhass> but this year, it made me feel I did lecture in a different universe than they were listening to it[00:37:04] <Dariusz_> huh, so what exam answer was it, math ?[00:37:15] <derhass> Dariusz_: computer graphics[00:37:20] <Dariusz_> uuu[00:37:26] <derhass> Dariusz_: which includes a bit of linear algebra[00:37:29] <Dariusz_> what was it about? - the lecture[00:38:27] <derhass> Dariusz_: well, the basics. transformations and spaces and linear algebra, render pipeline and methods, lighting models, texturing. the really basic stuff[00:38:38] <Dariusz_> uuu nice[00:39:12] *** snyp <snyp!~Snyp@103.56.236.91> has joined ##OpenGL[00:39:31] <derhass> rasterization, clipping, face culling, barycentric and perspective-corrected interpolation, z-buffer and depth sorting, blending[00:39:45] <Dariusz_> wuw thats quite a lot o.O[00:39:58] <derhass> well[00:40:01] <Dariusz_> how long was the lecture?[00:40:09] <derhass> 15x 90mins[00:40:13] <Dariusz_> holy fuck[00:40:42] <derhass> plus 10x90 mins exercise where students build their own software rasterizer[00:40:47] <Dariusz_> wow[00:40:50] <derhass> plus some project they do with that[00:40:52] <Dariusz_> sounds like something I should do o.O[00:41:02] <Dariusz_> is that university level or course?[00:41:10] <derhass> university[00:41:17] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[00:41:19] <Dariusz_> which one if I may?[00:41:35] <derhass> well, some univeristy of technology in germany[00:41:44] <Dariusz_> Germany @_@[00:42:17] <Dariusz_> is that the one that did that advanced metallic paint shader few years ago that they sold off to pi-vr/autodesk later?[00:42:27] <derhass> no[00:42:39] <Dariusz_> duh[00:42:49] <Dariusz_> still[00:42:56] <Dariusz_> sounds like quite "complex" lecture[00:43:02] <derhass> maybe[00:43:05] <Dariusz_> was it in german ?[00:43:14] <derhass> doing it for the third time. results were really good last year[00:43:17] <derhass> Dariusz_: yes[00:43:21] <Dariusz_> uu nice[00:43:29] <derhass> but this year, I wonder what went wrong[00:43:40] <Dariusz_> mmm[00:44:05] <derhass> well, students not knowing sin and cos of 90deg[00:44:15] <derhass> and multiplying matrices by component-wise sum[00:44:27] <Dariusz_> sounds like something I would do[00:45:03] <derhass> and having modelview matrices as output of a fragment shader (which should do simple phong shading)[00:47:13] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[00:48:51] <Dariusz_> mmm[00:49:14] <Dariusz_> not sure, I stopped at fragment shader using normals to just see shape of model, way more than I need for my needs[00:53:00] <derhass> and, apart from everything else, 4 people sending an bit-identical 99MB .rar file (we requested zip, btw.) as "their" programming project. including complete visual studio compiler/linker logs with the full paths containing the full path with user name in it. I really feel offended by that blunt attempt at cheating. how stupid do they think I am?[00:53:24] <Dariusz_> holy fuck[00:53:25] <Dariusz_> really?![00:53:31] <derhass> actually, no[00:53:32] <Dariusz_> jezus why go to uni then :/[00:53:34] <Dariusz_> oh[00:53:37] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@2601:282:4300:3e:dde3:e4d4:ab15:1488> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[00:53:58] <derhass> 3 people did. the fourth file was not bit-identical. it had some additional commented code in it[00:54:07] <Dariusz_> lol[00:54:21] <Dariusz_> crazy[00:55:59] *** Mangy_Dog <Mangy_Dog!Mangy_Dog@05449fa3.skybroadband.com> has quit IRC ()[00:57:00] *** genr8_ <genr8_!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has joined ##OpenGL[00:57:37] <zid> That's incredible[00:57:41] <Dariusz_> so what that entire semester?[00:58:13] <derhass> zid: in a way, it's also funny[00:58:24] <derhass> Dariusz_: huh? I don't get that question[00:58:34] <zid> The audacity is amazing[00:58:56] <Dariusz_> how long did they have to do that exam project[00:59:44] <derhass> zid: were was another group of two where one's solution is an exact subset of the other. interestingly, the subset solution contains references to features which are only implement in the other one in the project documentation[00:59:45] <zid> I should really play with my gl toy some more, I need to think of something to do with it[01:00:06] *** atk <atk!Arch-TK@ircpuzzles/staff/Arch-TK> has quit IRC (Quit: Well this is unexpected.)[01:00:19] *** atk <atk!Arch-TK@ircpuzzles/staff/Arch-TK> has joined ##OpenGL[01:01:55] <derhass> Dariusz_: well, saying "whole semester" would be misleading. the idea is that they make a software rendering in 10 exercise units, and use that one as basis for their project. before the 5th or 6th exercise, there is not much that renderer can do, so "half the semester" is more true[01:02:20] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[01:02:21] <Dariusz_> I see[01:02:26] <Dariusz_> so thats quite few months they have then[01:02:32] <zid> I might add shadowmapping but I'd need to fix my whole "positions translations and rotations are fairly hardcoded" thing, heh[01:02:51] <derhass> Dariusz_: usually. they do it in the last few days before the deadline[01:02:59] <Dariusz_> hehehehe :- )[01:03:13] <Dariusz_> I totally hate them, and here I am fighting with it for past 2 weeks :D[01:04:17] <derhass> that's kind of normal in a way, and I have no problem with that[01:08:40] <Dariusz_> is rotation vector[01:08:41] <Dariusz_> for camera[01:08:45] <Dariusz_> a normalized one?[01:08:54] <derhass> what is a "rotation vector"?[01:12:09] <Dariusz_> (I'm still thinking)[01:12:49] <Dariusz_> I suppose its a vec3 -1 to 1 range vector that defined rotation of an object/camera[01:13:11] <snyp> derhass, in the course, is the clipping done in view space or the 'clip space'? Just curious.[01:14:35] <derhass> snyp: clip space of course[01:14:51] <derhass> isn't that the whole point?[01:15:38] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has joined ##OpenGL[01:15:39] <snyp> I mean one could clip lines and planes against the frustum planes in view space, right?[01:16:01] <derhass> one could certainly do that[01:16:25] <derhass> and a clipping algorthimn works in any space, in principle[01:16:39] <Dariusz_> you mean like here? http://www.lighthouse3d.com/tutorials/view-frustum-culling/[01:17:31] <derhass> snyp: it just doesn't make much sense in the context of a typical render pipeline we have today[01:17:51] <derhass> besides being more work[01:17:55] <snyp> derhass, yeah... idk i've seen a few articles (two iirc) on clipping, all of them do it in view space for some reason. Abrash's book, for example.[01:19:26] <derhass> probably depends on which point one is trying to make[01:22:11] <derhass> Dariusz_: how do you define a 3D rotation with just a vec3? euler angles? rodriguez?[01:22:44] <derhass> Dariusz_: wrapping your head around 3d rotations will take some time[01:23:22] *** isaac__ <isaac__!acf555e1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.172.245.85.225> has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed)[01:23:52] *** BitPuffin <BitPuffin!~isak@c83-248-113-111.bredband.comhem.se> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[01:24:08] <Dariusz_> I think that currently my rotation is defined via position + viewDirection - vec3[01:24:18] <Dariusz_> + UP vector[01:25:11] <Dariusz_> I'm fairly sure its not well defined lol[01:25:29] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@2601:282:4300:3e:dde3:e4d4:ab15:1488> has joined ##OpenGL[01:26:29] <derhass> Dariusz_: well, with _two_ direction vectors, you can define a 3D rotation[01:26:34] *** jeannekamikaze <jeannekamikaze!~jeanne@c-73-223-201-25.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[01:28:24] <Dariusz_> this is what I think happens[01:28:24] <Dariusz_> https://pasteboard.co/H9lG06h.jpg[01:28:46] *** mijo <mijo!~mijowh@75.97.242.215.res-cmts.leh.ptd.net> has joined ##OpenGL[01:28:52] <Dariusz_> so this should look 45degrees to the right, up[01:29:04] <Dariusz_> not sure about local Z rotation tho[01:29:15] <derhass> Dariusz_: no[01:29:43] <derhass> Dariusz_: or maybe[01:29:45] <derhass> well[01:30:01] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[01:30:25] <Dariusz_> I though thats what viewDirection vec3 should do for lookat camera[01:30:35] <Dariusz_> well I dont know if there is a non-lookat camera, so no idea tbh[01:30:37] <derhass> Dariusz_: ok, yes, it does[01:30:53] <derhass> I did interpret the sketch in a wrong way at first[01:30:58] <Dariusz_> oh[01:31:13] *** mijow <mijow!~mijowh@75.97.242.215.res-cmts.leh.ptd.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[01:31:14] <Dariusz_> uno momento[01:31:36] <derhass> this direction vector is just not enough to describe an unique camera orientation[01:32:00] <derhass> you can still rotate the camera around that viewing axis[01:34:12] *** asecretcat <asecretcat!~allisonze@pool-72-77-42-97.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Quit: let us connect our intestines and mutually digest)[01:34:29] <derhass> Dariusz_: "well I dont know if there is a non-lookat camera, so no idea tbh" if there even is a camera or not is just a matter of interpretation[01:34:48] <derhass> Dariusz_: imaging some "virtual" camera is just an intuitive way[01:37:14] <Dariusz_> (still making illustration lol)[01:37:20] <derhass> Dariusz_: of what>[01:37:47] *** asecretcat <asecretcat!~allisonze@pool-72-77-42-97.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[01:38:20] <Dariusz_> camera[01:39:04] *** vtx <vtx!~vtx@cpc76428-belc8-2-0-cust570.2-1.cable.virginm.net> has quit IRC (Quit: vtx)[01:40:53] <Dariusz_> for god sake[01:40:54] *** davr0s <davr0s!~textual@host86-152-129-209.range86-152.btcentralplus.com> has joined ##OpenGL[01:40:56] <Dariusz_> :/[01:41:31] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[01:42:03] <Dariusz_> great I borke maya camera lol[01:45:08] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[01:45:21] <Dariusz_> ok so[01:45:21] <Dariusz_> https://pasteboard.co/H9lMTxh.jpg[01:45:30] <Dariusz_> I have 1 known[01:45:32] <Dariusz_> and 2 unknowns[01:45:39] <Dariusz_> I could possibly get the UP if I pre-defined it[01:45:39] <Dariusz_> so[01:46:26] <Dariusz_> when I rotate camera, I need to get X axis from UP & and the vec3I listed(I should have named it, lets name it direction)[01:47:01] <Dariusz_> so I cross UP & direction = X, I can now rotate left/right around that axis[01:47:17] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[01:47:34] <Dariusz_> once I have X, I can then do X + direction to get adjusted UP, so if my camera is looking top down, or beyond, the UP vector would need to be negative[01:47:48] *** Tobbi <Tobbi!~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[01:48:07] <Dariusz_> so something like this https://pasteboard.co/H9lO03d.jpg[01:48:32] <Dariusz_> I cant use UP(0,1,0) because that would flip the camera up, and we need it to retain the "local up" I take[01:48:41] <Dariusz_> so using cross of X+Direction should accomplish this[01:48:59] <derhass> well[01:49:02] <Dariusz_> so far so good, I calculate delta per mouse move[01:49:06] <derhass> this is still all very confused[01:49:07] <Dariusz_> and adjust +x/+Y[01:49:31] <Dariusz_> really? :- ([01:49:33] <derhass> I think you imagine this in the wrong terms[01:49:57] <Dariusz_> I though I needed to produce a axis + rotation angle/delta for quaternion to work[01:50:16] <derhass> go a step back[01:50:38] <derhass> it totally doesn't matter if you store rotations as matrices, quaternions or something else[01:50:47] <Dariusz_> hmm[01:51:13] <Dariusz_> but I'm getting gimbal lock at the top of the screen[01:51:14] <derhass> what matters is that you can store the orientation of something (any object, as well as the camera) in termos of a 3D rotation[01:51:36] <derhass> *terms[01:52:25] <derhass> and you need to define how you are going to move your camera[01:53:34] <derhass> if you do classical first-person-shooter camera, you have gimabl lock when looking straight uo or down[01:53:48] <Dariusz_> yup[01:54:00] <derhass> but you can as well make a completely free camera as in a flight sim[01:54:10] <derhass> or use a totally different metaphor[01:54:57] <derhass> and you have to translate that - whatever it is - into math[01:55:03] <Dariusz_> are you talking about making q matrix4x4 like lookAt() but not lookat but something else?[01:55:26] <derhass> there is nothing special about a view matrix[01:55:49] <derhass> it is just a composition of rotate and translate[01:55:59] <derhass> lookAt doesn't do anything different[01:56:10] <derhass> it is just a certain way of parametrizing that[01:57:42] <derhass> an odd way, actually, which seems intuitive at first, but is of little use for most camera models[02:00:18] *** snyp <snyp!~Snyp@103.56.236.91> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[02:00:31] *** MrFlibble <MrFlibble!MrFlibble2@2.220.67.202> has quit IRC (Quit: MrFlibble)[02:02:07] <Dariusz_> hmmm[02:02:35] <derhass> Dariusz_: good night[02:02:50] <Dariusz_> :- )[02:02:51] <Dariusz_> you too[02:03:00] <Dariusz_> thanks for all the theory and help![02:03:33] *** derhass <derhass!~derhass@dslb-094-222-155-209.094.222.pools.vodafone-ip.de> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[02:08:00] *** Kane <Kane!~Kane@home.yarg.fr> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[02:13:23] <zid> I really like these "issues" blocks in the ARB docs[02:13:27] <zid> gives you good insights[02:14:13] *** qeed <qeed!~qeed@pool-98-118-249-109.clppva.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[02:17:31] *** tristianc <tristianc!~tristianc@pool-100-36-62-48.washdc.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[02:20:09] *** ciaala <ciaala!~crypt@182.192.6.85.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[02:20:15] *** qeed <qeed!~qeed@pool-98-118-249-109.clppva.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[02:20:15] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-82s3g7mzgy0p2f49u7u.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)[02:21:11] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@modemcable080.164-57-74.mc.videotron.ca> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[02:22:06] *** Gama11 <Gama11!~quassel@p50902C57.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[02:22:40] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@modemcable080.164-57-74.mc.videotron.ca> has joined ##OpenGL[02:25:03] *** nogravityrush <nogravityrush!~textual@2600:1700:89c0:1780:10f0:1f1b:6de8:a790> has quit IRC (Quit: My Mac Pro has gone to sleep. 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The correct thing to do, of course, is to upgrade client code to not use that interface any more; just want to double-check that yes, OpenGL is not meant to work in that situation where a single draw has VBO data bound both pre- and post- orphaning.)[09:06:23] *** AfroThundr <AfroThundr!~AfroThund@h122.170.135.40.static.ip.windstream.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[09:12:47] *** sumyunseal1 <sumyunseal1!~sumyunsea@cpe-75-82-22-197.socal.res.rr.com> has joined ##OpenGL[09:20:49] *** Asu <Asu!~sdelang@AMarseille-658-1-115-240.w86-219.abo.wanadoo.fr> has joined ##OpenGL[09:25:16] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@82.177.144.226> has joined ##OpenGL[09:28:31] *** ekn2 <ekn2!~ekn2@p1180010-ipbf1221akatuka.ibaraki.ocn.ne.jp> has joined ##OpenGL[09:28:31] *** juvenal <juvenal!Elite21271@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-xjcvkymmmmsmqrkj> has joined ##OpenGL[09:28:44] *** davr0s <davr0s!~textual@host86-152-129-209.range86-152.btcentralplus.com> has joined ##OpenGL[09:29:51] *** wuji2016 <wuji2016!~Thunderbi@112.28.178.105> has joined ##OpenGL[09:30:43] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has quit IRC (Quit: groton)[09:31:27] *** sumyunseal1 <sumyunseal1!~sumyunsea@cpe-75-82-22-197.socal.res.rr.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[09:33:35] *** ekn2__ <ekn2__!~ekn2@p1180010-ipbf1221akatuka.ibaraki.ocn.ne.jp> has joined ##OpenGL[09:34:07] *** ekn2__ <ekn2__!~ekn2@p1180010-ipbf1221akatuka.ibaraki.ocn.ne.jp> has left ##OpenGL[09:36:15] *** ekn2 <ekn2!~ekn2@p1180010-ipbf1221akatuka.ibaraki.ocn.ne.jp> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[09:36:52] <Dariusz_> Morning nuggets[09:40:36] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[09:41:02] *** Matthijs <Matthijs!~quassel@unaffiliated/matthijs> has joined ##OpenGL[09:45:50] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@110.54.210.231> has joined ##OpenGL[09:48:29] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[09:52:27] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!c351a8d8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.195.81.168.216> has joined ##OpenGL[09:58:29] *** kasper^ <kasper^!~safaf@82.137.9.151> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[10:08:03] *** kasper^ <kasper^!~safaf@82.137.9.151> has joined ##OpenGL[10:15:03] *** charlie5 <charlie5!~rod@124.171.55.191> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)[10:17:00] *** nogravityrush <nogravityrush!~textual@2600:1700:89c0:1780:19a5:a2d9:96cb:1427> has quit IRC (Quit: My Mac Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[10:20:24] *** Quetzal2 <Quetzal2!~Quetzal2@LFbn-LIL-1-242-190.w90-45.abo.wanadoo.fr> has joined ##OpenGL[10:20:24] *** Quetzal2 <Quetzal2!~Quetzal2@LFbn-LIL-1-242-190.w90-45.abo.wanadoo.fr> has quit IRC (Changing host)[10:20:24] *** Quetzal2 <Quetzal2!~Quetzal2@unaffiliated/quetzal2> has joined ##OpenGL[10:23:43] *** Fig1024 <Fig1024!~Fig@175.117.3.23> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[10:32:29] *** cfoch_ <cfoch_!uid270777@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rotufgioiszhuyux> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[10:32:37] *** Cooler <Cooler!~coolerext@49.15.83.142> has joined ##OpenGL[10:35:01] *** doek <doek!~doek@2.56.62.188.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch> has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)[10:40:08] *** charlie5 <charlie5!~rod@124.171.55.191> has joined ##OpenGL[10:40:16] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[10:40:42] <doomedbunnies> Rendering glitches definitely go away if I do the extra legwork to ensure that all vertex attributes are going to fit into the VBO without orphaning.[10:41:21] *** doek <doek!~doek@2.56.62.188.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch> has joined ##OpenGL[10:42:27] <doomedbunnies> I'm going to assume that that's what the issue was; Bind vertex attribute 1 to a part of VBO a, orphan VBO a, Bind vertex attribute 2 to a part of (post-orphan) VBO a, draw.. that's just not a legal thing to do. :)[10:46:42] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[10:48:06] <ratchetfreak> that's certainly not a lgoical thing to do[10:48:41] <ratchetfreak> the time you draw is when opengl grabs the data from the bound vbos aka it's all "post orphan"[10:49:56] *** Gama11 <Gama11!~quassel@p5DCDBC9F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[10:52:28] <ratchetfreak> the other option is to use a second VBO[10:52:34] <doomedbunnies> Yup, I figured. :)[10:53:41] <doomedbunnies> I just made the rendering system wait to actually bind the vertex attributes until just before the draw call, so it can ensure it has enough space to fit it all into the single "immediate mode" VBO.[10:55:11] *** hampusw <hampusw!~Hampus@37.139.156.40> has joined ##OpenGL[10:55:52] <doomedbunnies> (Whereas previously it was doing it line-by-line, as "Use these vertex positions!" and "Use these normals!" commands were coming in. Which could result in running out of space in between those commands). Also, I'm going to kick some heads to get people to actually use retained geometry properly instead of using this ancient compatibility interface.[10:57:16] <ratchetfreak> you can do it with just 2 VBOs that you flip flop[10:58:17] <ratchetfreak> track which region of the vbo is in use and append data as you do now, when you run out of space you switch over to the other one after coallescing the data still in use on it to the front using buffer copies (rebind as needed)[11:00:25] <doomedbunnies> Oh, awesome, glCopyBufferSubData(); I didn't know about that! Yeah, that would work just fine.[11:05:19] *** iderik <iderik!~idk@h-0-97.A147.priv.bahnhof.se> has joined ##OpenGL[11:07:28] *** wuji2016 <wuji2016!~Thunderbi@112.28.178.105> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[11:13:15] *** neure <neure!~tsuoranta@62.209.167.43> has joined ##OpenGL[11:22:05] *** match_it <match_it!~match_ita@dynamic-adsl-78-14-153-198.clienti.tiscali.it> has joined ##OpenGL[11:24:47] *** Kingsquee <Kingsquee!~kingsquee@d108-180-237-219.bchsia.telus.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Just Monica.)[11:40:42] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[11:41:09] *** krystcich <krystcich!55de511e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.85.222.81.30> has joined ##OpenGL[11:47:29] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[12:02:11] *** wuji2016 <wuji2016!~Thunderbi@112.28.176.97> has joined ##OpenGL[12:17:26] *** xaxxon <xaxxon!~xaxxon@73.109.63.95> has quit IRC (Quit: xaxxon)[12:21:51] *** DarkShin <DarkShin!~DarkShin@191.205.126.67> 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DarkShin <DarkShin!~DarkShin@191.205.126.67> has quit IRC (Quit: DarkShin)[13:17:19] *** slime <slime!~slime73@blk-215-81-93.eastlink.ca> has quit IRC (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)[13:17:53] *** rizzo <rizzo!~RizzoTheR@p54B6B698.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[13:31:11] *** ville <ville!~ville@176-93-118-156.bb.dnainternet.fi> has joined ##OpenGL[13:35:28] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@110.54.133.1> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[13:36:10] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@110.54.133.1> has joined ##OpenGL[13:40:17] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[13:40:53] *** Tobbi <Tobbi!~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi> has joined ##OpenGL[13:48:35] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[13:48:37] *** raynold <raynold!uid201163@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ytoakdwkgqdaduqv> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[13:52:57] <DarkUranium> Is there an AZDO equivalent of glVertexAttribPointer?[13:53:24] <DarkUranium> some variant that directly takes the buffer (and/or the VAO), instead of relying on binding?[13:54:21] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@110.54.133.1> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)[13:54:48] <ratchetfreak> there is separate vertex attributes[13:55:01] <ratchetfreak> and DSA versions of those functions[13:55:12] <ratchetfreak> but you still need to bind the vao for drawing[13:55:26] <ratchetfreak> https://gist.github.com/ratchetfreak/be5d870396c6e43af3372344001e5339#file-version4-3-md[13:55:27] <DarkUranium> yeah, I know I need it for drawing[13:55:56] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@110.54.193.169> has joined ##OpenGL[13:57:31] *** Serpent7776 <Serpent7776!~Serpent77@90-156-68-175.internetia.net.pl> has joined ##OpenGL[13:58:18] *** CoolerX <CoolerX!~coolerext@27.97.208.184> has joined ##OpenGL[13:59:49] <davve> 49[14:00:04] <DarkUranium> davve?[14:00:19] <davve> nvm[14:00:47] <DarkUranium> ratchetfreak, you're missing one.[14:00:54] <DarkUranium> glEnableVertexAttribArray => glEnableVertexArrayAttrib[14:01:40] <DarkUranium> oh right, that's not in the same style[14:01:51] *** Cooler <Cooler!~coolerext@49.15.83.142> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[14:04:31] <ratchetfreak> yeah that snippet uses the bind-to-edit style, but you can translate them literally to DSA though it only makes sense for the init part because it has to be bound anyway in the draw loop[14:05:06] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@110.54.193.169> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[14:05:10] <DarkUranium> ratchetfreak, I don't even care for the perf ATM, I just prefer not dealing with global state where I can help it.[14:05:15] <DarkUranium> perf is just a bonus[14:05:41] <ratchetfreak> well separate vertex attrib is needed to use DSA with VAOs[14:05:55] <DarkUranium> well, all my formats match anyhow, so *shrug*![14:08:26] *** BitPuffin <BitPuffin!~isak@c83-248-113-111.bredband.comhem.se> has joined ##OpenGL[14:11:38] *** nogravityrush <nogravityrush!~textual@2600:1700:89c0:1780:19a5:a2d9:96cb:1427> has joined ##OpenGL[14:16:49] *** lucaswang <lucaswang!~lucaswang@218.1.234.235> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[14:24:29] <DarkUranium> ratchetfreak, what if I'm just making a VAO, without immediately binding a buffer? I don't recall, where am I supposed to call glEnableVertexArrayAttrib?[14:24:33] <DarkUranium> can I call it *before* binding the buffer?[14:24:52] <DarkUranium> also divisor, for that matter.[14:25:27] <DarkUranium> (actually, how do I do the divisor in a DSA manner? Is there a way?)[14:27:11] *** raynold <raynold!uid201163@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hiejsxcvfodecjre> has joined ##OpenGL[14:28:22] *** zeduckmaster_ <zeduckmaster_!~zeduckmas@85.106.1.181> has joined ##OpenGL[14:28:49] *** zeduckmaster <zeduckmaster!~zeduckmas@85.106.1.181> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[14:31:44] <ratchetfreak> glVertexArrayBindingDivisor which uses the vertex binding (the binding index you assigned to the buffer that contains the data)[14:32:11] <ratchetfreak> and those calls are independant just make sure that everything is correct by the time you actually use it to draw[14:32:37] <ratchetfreak> http://docs.gl/gl4/glVertexBindingDivisor[14:39:57] *** stefkos_win <stefkos_win!~Pawel@82.177.144.226> has joined ##OpenGL[14:40:17] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[14:42:25] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@82.177.144.226> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[14:46:03] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)[14:46:09] *** neure <neure!~tsuoranta@62.209.167.43> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[14:47:15] <DarkUranium> ratchetfreak, I do have KHR_debug enabled, FWIW[14:48:06] <DarkUranium> ratchetfreak, is the divisor considered part of the VAO, or part of the buffer attachment?[14:48:17] <DarkUranium> Or, to rephrase, will changing the divisor trigger any sort of a VAO revalidation?[14:50:00] <ratchetfreak> it changes how the vertices are read so I'm pretty sure that it will require a patch of the program if the hardware needs that[14:50:14] <ratchetfreak> though I cannot be sure of that for all hardware[14:50:46] <ratchetfreak> I would consider whether a attribute is per-instance as part of the vertex format[15:07:07] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has joined ##OpenGL[15:11:03] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@2601:282:4300:3e:ecef:5349:54e6:bdf0> has joined ##OpenGL[15:12:26] <DarkUranium> fair enough[15:12:49] <DarkUranium> so, I've noticed that this has offset and all that ... but what about stride?[15:13:16] <DarkUranium> oh wait, that's relativeoffset[15:14:48] <DarkUranium> ratchetfreak, but how do I provide an *offset*?[15:17:33] <Shockk> I have a quick question about rendering with OpenGL for OpenVR; I need to submit an OpenGL texture ID to OpenVR for each eye, and I'm wondering if there's a way to attach a texture to the default framebuffer (to avoid adding an identity post-process stage *just* to get the texture)?[15:18:22] <ratchetfreak> there is an offset per attribute and an offset for the buffer binding[15:18:45] <ratchetfreak> the offset per attribute is from the start of the binding and the offset of the binding is from the start of the buffer[15:19:21] <ratchetfreak> Shockk: render directly to texture instead[15:21:23] <Shockk> ratchetfreak: I'd like a companion window too though, showing what the player is seeing[15:21:48] <Shockk> if I render directly to texture, I still need to render that texture back to the default framebuffer[15:22:01] <ratchetfreak> which doesn't need to be as responsive as the eyes themselves though[15:22:08] <Shockk> ah I see, that's true[15:22:27] <ratchetfreak> you can afford to have some delay/skipped frames for the companion window[15:22:59] <Shockk> right that makes sense[15:23:40] <Shockk> thanks[15:27:29] *** RajRajRaj <RajRajRaj!uid72176@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iuxmalhztgdbtcvy> has joined ##OpenGL[15:35:05] *** AfroThundr <AfroThundr!~AfroThund@h122.170.135.40.static.ip.windstream.net> has joined ##OpenGL[15:35:31] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@2601:282:4300:3e:ecef:5349:54e6:bdf0> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[15:37:58] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[15:40:13] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[15:46:53] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[15:48:24] <DarkUranium> ratchetfreak, but the offset per attribute is the stride, no?[15:51:14] <ratchetfreak> glBindVertexBuffer has offset and stride, the offset here is from start of the buffer and stride is the stride for this binding[15:51:19] <DarkUranium> oh no, right[15:51:21] <DarkUranium> I get it now[15:52:13] <ratchetfreak> glVertexAttribFormat gets a relativeOffset which is from the offset of the associated binding[15:52:23] <ratchetfreak> and moves along with the stride[15:53:31] <DarkUranium> yeah, I get it now[15:53:33] <DarkUranium> so it's[15:54:05] <DarkUranium> `buffer[offset + stride * INDEX + relativeOffset]`[15:55:26] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[15:56:05] *** Guest16356 <Guest16356!~chat@p54B2F157.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[15:56:46] <ratchetfreak> yeah[15:57:32] *** xerpi <xerpi!~xerpi@12.red-83-45-192.dynamicip.rima-tde.net> has joined ##OpenGL[15:58:43] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[16:03:34] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[16:05:33] *** zeduckmaster_ <zeduckmaster_!~zeduckmas@85.106.1.181> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[16:05:45] *** krystcich <krystcich!55de511e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.85.222.81.30> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[16:05:46] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[16:06:03] *** nogravityrush <nogravityrush!~textual@2600:1700:89c0:1780:19a5:a2d9:96cb:1427> has quit IRC (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)[16:07:29] *** xerpi <xerpi!~xerpi@12.red-83-45-192.dynamicip.rima-tde.net> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[16:07:51] *** xerpi <xerpi!~xerpi@12.red-83-45-192.dynamicip.rima-tde.net> has joined ##OpenGL[16:07:58] *** chat <chat!~chat@p54B2F157.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[16:08:23] *** chat is now known as Guest83894[16:14:38] *** hampusw <hampusw!~Hampus@37.139.156.40> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[16:14:38] *** m92 <m92!~m92@178-223-39-199.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs> has joined ##OpenGL[16:18:37] <Shockk> if I have a screen-space coord, like for example (0,0) at the center of the screen, how would I project that forwards into my world by like z=2 for example, and then project the result back into screen space?[16:18:57] *** Simoniou1 <Simoniou1!~simonious@68-113-148-6.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[16:19:40] <Shockk> also brb[16:20:37] *** Orphis_ is now known as Orphis[16:20:54] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[16:21:08] *** Simoniou1 <Simoniou1!~simonious@68-113-148-6.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com> has joined ##OpenGL[16:23:05] <Dariusz_> does gl have any command to check available memory and currently sonsumed memory ?[16:24:55] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has quit IRC (Quit: groton)[16:25:31] <Yaniel> no[16:25:51] <Yaniel> IHVs have their own APIs for that, though[16:27:06] <Dariusz_> IHV?[16:27:18] <Yaniel> Independent Hardware Vendor[16:27:18] <ratchetfreak> independent hardware vendors[16:27:28] <Dariusz_> uh k[16:27:29] <Yaniel> i.e. the GPU makers[16:27:40] <ratchetfreak> even though nearly all of them are khronos members[16:27:57] <Yaniel> maybe we'll get an extension eventually[16:28:12] <Yaniel> although that's more likely to happen with vulkan first I guess[16:28:17] <zid> Does vulkan not expose something like that?[16:28:22] <zid> That's surprising[16:28:35] <zid> I thought you had a fair bit of control over memory with vulkan[16:28:39] <ratchetfreak> it's kinda hard to use though because you can't really know what other apps are using[16:28:56] <Yaniel> well you have to allocate vk memory yourself[16:29:00] <ratchetfreak> there is a set of heaps that you allocate out of each with a max size[16:29:05] <Yaniel> might as well keep track of it yourself while you are at it[16:29:17] <ratchetfreak> but you need to track your own allocs[16:36:49] *** geo5 <geo5!~geo5@2601:601:1800:53a4::54a> has joined ##OpenGL[16:40:15] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[16:41:02] *** davr0s <davr0s!~textual@host86-152-129-209.range86-152.btcentralplus.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[16:41:11] *** krystcich <krystcich!~krystcich@178235146238.dynamic-zab-01.vectranet.pl> has joined ##OpenGL[16:43:30] *** ImQ009 <ImQ009!~ImQ009@unaffiliated/imq009> has joined ##OpenGL[16:45:29] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[16:46:09] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[17:01:06] *** BearishMushroom <BearishMushroom!~BearishMu@82-209-154-59.cust.bredband2.com> has joined ##OpenGL[17:02:51] *** acksys_ <acksys_!~fritz@mail12.shutterfly.com> has joined ##OpenGL[17:03:44] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[17:06:05] *** DonVlad <DonVlad!~Murii@79.113.205.114> has joined ##OpenGL[17:12:04] *** Alcatronh <Alcatronh!~Alcatron@62.28.92.168> has joined ##OpenGL[17:12:28] *** Alcatronh <Alcatronh!~Alcatron@62.28.92.168> has left ##OpenGL ("Leaving")[17:13:40] <Dariusz_> is there a way to estimate how much gpu memory I need for 1 mil triangles?[17:14:33] *** kasper^ <kasper^!~safaf@82.137.9.151> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[17:15:51] <Xeek> im not so sure you need to worry about triangles, probably need to worry more about the textures[17:15:59] <ratchetfreak> 3 vertices*10^6 * number of bytes per vertex[17:16:59] <ratchetfreak> bytes per vertex will probably be a few dozen[17:17:19] <ratchetfreak> so you end up with ~50MB[17:17:47] <Dariusz_> so 1 mil polygons takes just 50mb?[17:17:54] <Dariusz_> humh[17:18:07] <Xeek> like i said ...[17:18:12] <Dariusz_> I dont have textures[17:18:12] <ratchetfreak> depends also on whether you go indexed which will cut it down a lot[17:18:36] <Xeek> then you dont have much to worry about[17:18:40] <Dariusz_> I only need 100-200 mil polyugons[17:18:49] <Xeek> as far as memory goes anyway[17:18:53] <Dariusz_> hmm[17:19:02] <Dariusz_> why on earth 3ds max viewport is so shit in this case o.O[17:19:25] <chrisf> ratchetfreak: you guys and your obese vertex formats ;)[17:19:27] *** Matthijs <Matthijs!~quassel@unaffiliated/matthijs> has quit IRC (Quit: *waves frantically*)[17:19:32] <Dariusz_> hahahaha[17:19:42] <zid> Mine are 32 bytes :([17:19:53] <zid> Fits into cache lines nicely though on x86! :D[17:19:53] <chrisf> "piles of floats"[17:20:15] <zid> float[8] for life, fite me irl[17:20:57] <Dariusz_> wuw[17:21:08] <Yaniel> Dariusz_: 1) it probably uses an immediate drawing API 2) it has to deal with a lot more information than just what is needed for rendering[17:21:26] <Yaniel> 1) possibly without VBOs[17:21:43] <Dariusz_> hmm fascinating, so itake maya viewport must be a lot better, coz maya handles anything u throw at with easy, max dies[17:22:15] <Dariusz_> and raw gpu rendering of geometry seems to be even more crazy, I loaded 70mb model and it was smooth as silk, I mean... @_@[17:22:27] <chrisf> well, im sure competition will sort that one out ... oh wait :)[17:22:29] *** cfoch_ <cfoch_!uid270777@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iwazlrazfgmopdro> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[17:22:32] <Dariusz_> 70mil*[17:25:36] *** geo5 <geo5!~geo5@2601:601:1800:53a4::54a> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[17:28:14] <Dariusz_> what competition :->[17:30:58] <chrisf> Dariusz_: there was a time when autodesk didnt own all the modelers[17:31:13] <Yaniel> they still don't own blender :>[17:31:23] <Dariusz_> hahahaha[17:31:25] <Dariusz_> wait[17:31:30] <Dariusz_> u working on it?[17:31:43] <Yaniel> *on blender?[17:31:51] <Dariusz_> y[17:31:55] <Dariusz_> I mean[17:31:57] <Dariusz_> dev it[17:32:03] <Yaniel> I'm not hacking on blender if that's what you mean[17:32:12] <Yaniel> I do use it for well.. modeling[17:32:15] <Dariusz_> I mean are you developing it?[17:32:19] <Dariusz_> oh k[17:32:21] <Yaniel> no[17:32:37] <Yaniel> following the development of 2.8 very excitedly though[17:32:45] <Dariusz_> me too from time to time[17:32:48] <Dariusz_> its quite awesome app so far[17:32:52] <Dariusz_> wish gimp was getting as much love[17:33:00] <Yaniel> try krita[17:33:19] <Yaniel> it's more for painting though, where gimp is for photo manipulation[17:33:27] <Yaniel> but krita is a lot more polished these days[17:33:32] <Dariusz_> interesting[17:34:12] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[17:40:18] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[17:41:22] <chrisf> Dariusz_: modelers typically have to represent things in a way that's not ideal to render[17:42:34] <ratchetfreak> and keep things in ram so they are easy to change[17:43:11] <ratchetfreak> it is possible to compute shader manip your meshes but that's not trivial[17:44:54] <Dariusz_> interesting[17:45:53] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[17:46:25] *** m92 <m92!~m92@178-223-39-199.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs> has quit IRC (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)[17:52:34] *** cfoch_ <cfoch_!uid270777@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fdtcioslfhegtgmm> has joined ##OpenGL[17:57:43] *** d3x0r <d3x0r!~d3x0r@ip174-72-226-164.lv.lv.cox.net> has joined ##OpenGL[17:58:22] *** CoolerZ 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(www.adiirc.com))[18:45:53] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[18:47:20] *** spear2 <spear2!~spear2@71-95-117-135.dhcp.mdfd.or.charter.com> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[18:47:49] <Yaniel> and here we see backface culling in action[18:53:21] *** antognolli <antognolli!~rantogno@enlightenment/developer/antognolli> has joined ##OpenGL[18:56:56] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[18:57:55] *** Waynes <Waynes!~Waynes@23.94.61.168> has joined ##OpenGL[19:00:06] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-82s3g7mzgy0p2f49u7u.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[19:00:34] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[19:03:31] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@2601:282:4300:3e:2d9b:7d9:5181:5959> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. 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Back when one had to use ASM for shaders?[21:49:32] <Yaniel> but that was like 20 years ago[21:49:40] <nobie> oh, in that case, this solved my problem, thanks everyone[21:50:16] *** CoolerX <CoolerX!~coolerext@42.109.143.14> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:50:27] <Yaniel> DarkUranium: yeah, at least on some older implementations of that extension I think[21:50:29] <DarkUranium> nobie, I mean, if you're doing a modern GL, you can also use compute shaders.[21:50:37] *** CoolerX <CoolerX!~coolerext@42.109.143.14> has joined ##OpenGL[21:52:12] <nobie> I will have a look at compute shaders, thanks[21:52:17] *** nobie <nobie!6eaedcb6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.110.174.220.182> has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed)[22:04:03] <zid> I don't think he understood the answer[22:04:31] *** acksys_ <acksys_!~fritz@mail12.shutterfly.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)[22:07:52] <chrisf> i agree. i think nobie got exactly the wrong idea.[22:09:17] <DarkUranium> yeah, I realized that when he said he'll have a look at them[22:09:22] <DarkUranium> but he left moments later, so oh well.[22:09:50] <zid> Pretty typical "Did you profile it?" "No" "Shut up then" case imo :P[22:10:26] <DarkUranium> zid, to be fair, trying to convert one shader to work in FS+VS instead would be veeery ugly[22:10:37] <DarkUranium> that said, my next question was gonna be what he was trying to do *ANYHOW*[22:11:00] <DarkUranium> e.g. is he generating or processing a texture (FS is fine), or is he doing basically processing of some arbitrary data (compute might be better)[22:16:12] *** threenuc <threenuc!~threenuc@88.156.163.16> has joined ##OpenGL[22:18:45] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[22:18:49] *** qeed <qeed!~qeed@pool-98-118-249-109.clppva.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[22:21:25] <Shockk> if I have coordinates in clip space, i.e. [-1,1] range, and I want to transform them onto a 2D surface in 3D space, how would I go about doing that?[22:21:41] <zid> Shockk: by thinking for half a second? :P[22:22:15] <zid> make up some coordinates in 3D space, 10,10,0 20,20,0 as top left and bottom right corners[22:22:21] <zid> map -1,1 onto that range, done[22:22:53] <zid> 20-10 means it's 10 wide, your thing is 1--1 = 2 wide, so add 1 and multiply by 5, then add 10[22:23:42] <Shockk> oh I see, I've been trying to do things with inverse(projection) and stuff, that makes a lot more sense[22:30:14] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[22:31:06] *** acksys_ <acksys_!~fritz@mail12.shutterfly.com> has joined ##OpenGL[22:35:36] *** RonaldsMazitis <RonaldsMazitis!~quassel@78.84.29.65> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[22:40:25] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[22:43:13] *** ImQ009 <ImQ009!~ImQ009@unaffiliated/imq009> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[22:43:27] *** nogravityrush <nogravityrush!~textual@2600:1700:89c0:1780:69fd:4001:3a89:6be5> has joined ##OpenGL[22:46:02] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[22:46:07] *** slime <slime!~slime73@24.215.81.93> has joined ##OpenGL[22:48:31] *** Kingsquee <Kingsquee!~kingsquee@d108-180-237-219.bchsia.telus.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Just Monica.)[22:55:36] *** Quetzal2 <Quetzal2!~Quetzal2@unaffiliated/quetzal2> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[22:55:57] *** ClaudiusMaximus <ClaudiusMaximus!~claude@unaffiliated/claudiusmaximus> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[22:57:36] *** DonVlad <DonVlad!~Murii@79.113.205.114> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 1.4)[22:57:51] *** ClaudiusMaximus <ClaudiusMaximus!~claude@unaffiliated/claudiusmaximus> has joined ##OpenGL[23:03:27] *** acksys_ <acksys_!~fritz@mail12.shutterfly.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)[23:17:05] *** zid <zid!~zid@cpc112319-pete13-2-0-cust670.4-4.cable.virginm.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)[23:20:08] *** stefkos_win <stefkos_win!~Pawel@82.177.144.226> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[23:20:59] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[23:25:56] *** Asu` <Asu`!~sdelang@92.184.96.87> has joined ##OpenGL[23:27:24] *** Asu` <Asu`!~sdelang@92.184.96.87> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[23:28:27] *** Asu <Asu!~sdelang@AMarseille-658-1-115-240.w86-219.abo.wanadoo.fr> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[23:30:47] <Shockk> I'm having woes[23:31:26] *** suppahsrv <suppahsrv!~mopmop@host66-161-dynamic.59-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[23:33:41] *** irrenhaus3 <irrenhaus3!~xenon@ip-37-201-7-18.hsi13.unitymediagroup.de> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[23:33:59] <derhass> Shockk: clip space is not [-1,1] range[23:35:22] *** suppahsrv <suppahsrv!~mopmop@host66-161-dynamic.59-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has joined ##OpenGL[23:37:48] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@2601:282:4300:3e:2d9b:7d9:5181:5959> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[23:38:08] *** _gr3g_2 <_gr3g_2!~greg@pool-72-80-159-17.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[23:40:23] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has joined ##OpenGL[23:45:04] *** acksys_ <acksys_!~fritz@mail12.shutterfly.com> has joined ##OpenGL[23:45:04] *** doek <doek!~doek@2.56.62.188.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[23:46:33] *** nimitz <nimitz!~ztimin@24.157.180.57> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[23:49:00] <Shockk> derhass: ah right; the coord range I have is definitely [-1,1] though not clip-space then[23:49:18] *** ravior <ravior!~crapitea@38.132.111.173> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[23:50:06] <derhass> view volume in clip space is usually [-w,w] (or [0,w], or something along those lines)[23:50:12] *** immibis <immibis!~chatzilla@222-155-160-32.jetstream.xtra.co.nz> has joined ##OpenGL[23:50:13] <Shockk> I'm starting with an identity matrix, then I'm doing a number of translations and scales on that matrix in order to put text glyphs at the correct place[23:50:38] *** doek <doek!~doek@2.56.62.188.dynamic.wline.res.cust.swisscom.ch> has joined ##OpenGL[23:50:51] <Shockk> but what I'm trying to do now is, before doing the text-specific transformations, translate by (0,0,-zNear) and scale by (width,height,1)[23:51:36] <derhass> looks like you want to set up some standard ortho matrix[23:51:38] <Shockk> and then at the very end I'm using proj * transform, instead of just transform[23:52:50] <Shockk> before these changes, my text stuff was just building a transform matrix through the translations and scales, in order to draw 2D text on the screen[23:53:00] *** DarkUranium <DarkUranium!~DarkUrani@77.38.34.248> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[23:53:14] <Shockk> now though, I'm wanting to draw it a little bit into the screen, using the proj matrix that I've got[23:53:34] <Shockk> because with VR if I just draw on the screen for both eyes, it's impossible for the eyes to focus it into a single image[23:54:12] <derhass> Shockk: uhm.[23:54:43] <Shockk> sorry if that doesn't fully make sense[23:54:53] <derhass> I think I know what you mean[23:55:41] <derhass> but only half of it[23:55:44] <Shockk> ah right[23:55:53] <derhass> I know how stereoscopy works[23:56:04] <derhass> I know how the typical VR glasses work[23:56:20] <derhass> (and the atypical, too)[23:56:40] <derhass> but I'm still not sure what you're trying to do here[23:57:46] <derhass> everything will have some depth in a stereoscopic display. and with HMDs, you do not have a shared display surface for both eyes, so rendering to the same raw position in both eyes will result in a totally wrong effect[23:57:52] <Shockk> currently I draw text on the 2D surface at z=0, with no projection matrix needed, just doing translations and scaling; what I'd like is to project the text onto a 2D surface that's a little bit further away from the screen though[23:58:10] <Shockk> oh I see[23:58:22] <derhass> you need to use a projection matrix mathcing your stereoscopic display[23:58:30] <Shockk> right, I have that[23:58:46] <derhass> Shockk: the z position is totally irrelevan in an ortho seting, apart from the depth test[23:59:45] <Shockk> hmm ah I see