[00:00:15] <_W_> glad you're enjoying it
[00:01:03] <rdancer> better than being hit with a blunt object
[00:01:40] <joed> I guess we failed.
[00:02:13] <joed> But if you don't want to download from eclipse, take it to your favourite ubuntu channel.
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[00:13:50] <kavon> wow i'm getting really pissed off: http://pastebin.com/d4964af2b
[00:13:57] <kavon> why does it print null i can't find anything wrong with that!
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[00:15:13] <rdancer> kavon: new Account[3]() // parens
[00:15:17] <sukuri> ~pastebin
[00:15:17] <javabot> http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
[00:15:23] <sukuri> ~pastebin
[00:15:23] <javabot> http://rifers.org/paste  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
[00:15:43] <[TartY]> val = this.val;  --->> this.val = val
[00:15:53] <[TartY]> this.val = object atribute
[00:15:56] <kavon> [TartY]: oh crap
[00:15:57] <rdancer> val = this.val;
[00:15:58] <[TartY]> val = paramete
[00:16:01] <[TartY]> r
[00:16:03] <_W_> oh Sun, why must your code suck so? http://pastebin.stonekeep.com/5505
[00:16:14] <rdancer> kavon: as [TartY] says
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[00:16:18] <sukuri> I'd read that pastebin.com isn't the best for pasting code, is there a separate, better place for pasting code that's just as easy?
[00:16:20] <_W_> (like 31 to 34 is currently causing me grief)
[00:16:25] <_W_> *line
[00:16:34] <_W_> ~~sukuri pastebin
[00:16:35] <javabot> sukuri, http://rifers.org/paste  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
[00:16:46] <kavon> ugh lol 30 mins and i reversed what should be on the other side of =
[00:16:53] <kavon> thanks [TartY] for noticing that
[00:16:54] <sukuri> _W_: are all of those good?
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[00:17:29] <r0bby> rdancer: ...
[00:17:40] <r0bby> new Account[3];
[00:17:58] <rdancer> that legal?
[00:18:03] <r0bby> Account[] a = new Account[3]; a[1] = new Account();
[00:18:11] <r0bby> ~~ rdancer arrays
[00:18:11] <javabot> rdancer, arrays is http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/java/nutsandbolts/arrays.html
[00:18:34] <r0bby> kavon: disregard rdancer
[00:18:49] <rdancer> disregard me
[00:19:17] <r0bby> kavon: when you instantiate your array and it's a reference type, the default value is null until you instantiate it
[00:19:51] <kavon> r0bby: ya i was dumb with the assignment operator there, wrong sides
[00:20:02] <_W_> anyone have any good idea why Sun isn't chaining the exceptions that occur on program launch?
[00:20:46] <r0bby> s/with.*//
[00:20:48] * r0bby ducks
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[00:23:24] * bearded_oneder just woke up and scanned the scroll history
[00:23:37] <sukuri> _W_: thank you
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[00:23:48] * bearded_oneder chuckling @ MyName, funny n00b
[00:23:55] * bearded_oneder proud of r0bby
[00:24:31] <r0bby> I'm making a new years resolution to not be a tool
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[00:25:08] <r0bby> bearded_oneder: he's something alright
[00:27:16] <bearded_oneder>  String.concat("funny", ", but irritating")
[00:27:41] <svm_invictvs> WTF? "Exception in thread "main" java.lang.Error: Unresolved compilation problems:"
[00:28:17] <svm_invictvs> This had better not be another case of eclipse breaking the build.
[00:28:29] <bearded_oneder> svm_invictvs ->  did you inherit some else's code?
[00:28:38] <bearded_oneder> someone*
[00:28:48] <svm_invictvs> bearded_oneder: inherit as in extends?
[00:28:55] <svm_invictvs> or inherit as in takeover existing code?
[00:29:02] <bearded_oneder> the latter
[00:29:26] <svm_invictvs> It's a colaborative effort...except...he's out of the office...has been since christmas.
[00:29:37] <svm_invictvs> I do a maven build
[00:30:03] <svm_invictvs> then run th eresulting jar
[00:30:05] <svm_invictvs> and that happens
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[00:31:45] <svm_invictvs> bearded_oneder: I just replaced a bunch of busy waiting with actual condition variables.
[00:32:30] <svm_invictvs> DOUBLEU-TEE-EFF!
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[00:33:16] <amine> hey
[00:33:22] <svm_invictvs> hey
[00:33:27] <amine> what's up?
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[00:34:01] <amine> svm = support vector machines?
[00:34:20] <svm_invictvs> no
[00:34:23] <amine> ah okay
[00:36:35] <tazle> sum invictus, obviously
[00:37:04] <amine> obviously
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[00:37:46] <amine> I got a question - I want to create a daemon that will be running all the time on a linux machine, and it should be listening on a big amount of port (~500 for example), and it will be accepting multiple connections per port (~20), and it will generate a few short-lived connections for each of these multiple connections per port (~2/second).. there will be no file input/output, only database access, and they must not be slowed down by others (so must be
[00:37:46] <amine> threaded). How would java scale on this sort of project?
[00:37:55] <amine> Is it a good idea to use java for it?
[00:38:43] <ilyak> amine: I guess, no
[00:38:56] <bearded_oneder> amine ->  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invictus
[00:38:59] <ilyak> If you would, you'll wind up doing most work in native wrapper
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[00:39:25] <ilyak> wrapper around epoll, kqueue and stuff
[00:40:05] <amine> ilyak, there is no multithreading in java?
[00:40:08] <ilyak> So I woudn't really use java for that kind of task
[00:40:15] <ilyak> amine: There is
[00:40:24] <ilyak> But you shouldn't do 10000 threads
[00:40:30] <ilyak> That would be an epic fail
[00:40:49] <mibocote> but does he need to spawn a new thread per connection?
[00:41:17] <amine> mibocote, pretty much
[00:41:21] <ilyak> Well, or spend a lot of time in the same wrapper
[00:41:30] <ilyak> s/same/said
[00:41:38] * ilyak would try to use erlang for that
[00:41:43] <amine> So why does java have a problem with 10,000 threads?
[00:41:45] <ilyak> but it's ok with C too
[00:42:00] <ilyak> amine: Because it can even use the system threads
[00:42:06] <amine> I was going to use C or C++ initially, but I was afraid it would cause me more problems with memory leaks than anything else
[00:42:11] <ilyak> And linux wouldn't like having 10000 its threads
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[00:42:15] <ilyak> It would grind to halt
[00:42:22] <ilyak> scheduler wouldn't thank you for that
[00:42:30] <ilyak> Try erlang or c with event loop
[00:42:56] <mibocote> I am confused why a few worker threads with a selector wouldn't work here?
[00:43:01] <mibocote> but I also like the erlang idea
[00:43:08] <amine> I have not used erlang before
[00:43:14] <bearded_oneder> amine ->  NIO http://www.onjava.com/pub/a/onjava/2004/09/01/nio.html
[00:44:01] <tazle> amine: sounds like something you could write in an hour with MINA if you're familiar with the asynchronos model and don't care about error handling too much
[00:44:07] <tazle> amine: or Netty
[00:44:43] <amine> tazle, haven't used those :(
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[00:45:50] <amine> Think of the project as 500 ftp servers.. listening on 500 ip/port combinations, accepting 20-30 users on each port, and every connection spawns more connections for listing, file transfer, etc (but tehre is no file access in this case)
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[00:46:00] <tazle> amine: you seem to be saying that there would be about 10k long-lived connections, each of which would produce a few events per second leading to short-lived connections elsewhere
[00:47:19] <amine> I could create 500 processes for the main listening sockets, would that be better?
[00:47:59] <tazle> I don't see why it would
[00:48:18] <amine> Ok
[00:48:20] <bearded_oneder> amine ->  NIO critique:   http://technfun.wordpress.com/2008/04/21/critique-of-java-nio-frameworks/ ;  Uber-brief case study: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/java/library/j-perf03174.html
[00:48:27] <amine> I'll take a look at bearded_oneder link
[00:48:42] <tazle> amine: also, go write some code and see what comes out of it - pure theorizing is silly
[00:49:41] <amine> tazle, I'm still planning everything
[00:49:57] <tazle> amine: you obviously don't know enough to do good planning
[00:50:23] <amine> which is why I'm here..
[00:50:27] <svm_invictvs> ~php
[00:50:27] <javabot> svm_invictvs, php is the solution of choice for relaying mysql errors to web users.
[00:50:48] <tazle> amine: yes, and I'm telling you you should be checking things out yourself
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[00:51:03] <tazle> amine: also, establishing 20k connections per second seems unlikely, do you really need to do that?
[00:51:14] <amine> tazle, look, programming before doing research is the silly idea
[00:51:33] <amine> tazle, it's unlikely but I would like to be prepared for it
[00:51:59] <svm_invictvs> amine: and you're asking how tod eal with that?
[00:51:59] <tazle> amine: I mean "unlikely" in the sense that "you are unlikely to be able to achieve that"
[00:52:15] <svm_invictvs> you'r enot talking about using thread-per-connection are you?
[00:52:22] <prophet05> Is there any example/tutorial how JFace TreeViewer as a TableTree?
[00:52:41] <amine> svm_invictvs, no, I would do it with a select() on the array of connections and handle it from there one reply at a time
[00:52:50] <amine> I don't know java's alternative to select()
[00:53:08] <tazle> amine: I can tell you that handling 10k connections and a few messages per second on each connection is no problem, go pick your framework and start reading experienting with them to see which you like the best, and try to avoid creating 20k connectiosn per second because it doesn't sound achievable
[00:53:20] <svm_invictvs> amine: nio
[00:53:28] <svm_invictvs> amine: SlectorChannel or something.
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[00:53:32] <svm_invictvs> Selector
[00:54:10] <svm_invictvs> ~javadoc Selector
[00:54:10] <javabot> http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/nio/channels/Selector.html
[00:54:11] <bearded_oneder> amine ->  naive, but interesting tomcat benchmarks, "Tomcat Scales to 16,000 Concurrent Connections - WHOA!":  http://www.javalobby.org/java/forums/t92965.html
[00:54:22] <svm_invictvs> ~~amine javadoc Selector
[00:54:22] <javabot> amine, http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/nio/channels/Selector.html
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[00:54:46] <svm_invictvs> amine: Yeah, it's for nonblocking IO.  It's pretty badass.
[00:55:07] <svm_invictvs> amine: Also, I think dmlloyd wrote a library that gives java more unix-like IO functionality.
[00:55:22] <dmlloyd> ~~amine xnio
[00:55:23] <javabot> amine, xnio is an NIO replacement framework, which keeps Channels but does away with Selectors, developed by ##java's very own dmlloyd.  The project can be found at http://www.jboss.org/xnio - have fun!
[00:55:24] <dmlloyd> :)
[00:56:06] <svm_invictvs> 20k connections sounds reasonable for a big time server app, no?
[00:56:15] <svm_invictvs> like for an enterprise server app.
[00:56:27] <svm_invictvs> I mena, we get much much more than that here.
[00:56:28] <aceofspades19> its OVER 9000 connections
[00:56:59] <svm_invictvs> aceofspades19: huh?
[00:56:59] <tazle> svm_invictvs: 20k on-going connections certainly, but establishing 20k connections per second sounds fantastic
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[00:57:15] <amine> sorry, I'm writing down all these links.. still reading bearded_oneder's first one. I don't really know about sockets in java, or multithreading in java as I'm reading a book (thinking in java) and haven't arrived there yet, still got a couple hundred pages until I reach concurrency. Bear with me :P
[00:57:34] <svm_invictvs> amine: read about Channels, selectors and xnio
[00:57:36] <tazle> ~jcip
[00:57:37] <javabot> tazle, jcip is Java Concurrency In Practice, a book focused on implementing threaded and concurrent applications in Java.  http://jcip.net/
[00:57:41] <svm_invictvs> and jcip
[00:57:43] <svm_invictvs> good book
[00:58:05] <bearded_oneder> amine ->  the folks at resin claim to beat NIO performance with JNI calls to low level I/O, but that appraoch is a bit too masochistic to me.: http://pceye.com.cn:8080/resin-doc/performance/faq.xtp
[00:58:06] <amine> The main reason I want to do it in java is because of the gc to avoid any memory leaks
[00:58:32] <svm_invictvs> amine: java can leak memory.
[00:58:41] <dmlloyd> if you code to XNIO then you can later plug in JNI implementations (when they're done)
[00:59:07] <amine> svm_invictvs, sure, but it probably won't be as often or as bad as c or c++ do, and won't be as hard to find
[00:59:24] <svm_invictvs> amine: that's a myth.
[00:59:32] <amine> svm_invictvs, which part?
[00:59:39] <svm_invictvs> amine: what you just said.
[01:00:05] <svm_invictvs> amine: Garbage collection is not somethingyou can rely on as some magic wand for memory management.
[01:00:19] <svm_invictvs> You have to think about responsible resource usage.
[01:00:53] <tazle> svm_invictvs: it's just the magic wand that takes away the resources you don't use anymore
[01:01:01] <amine> I know, but when push coems to shove and resource need to be cleared, I could call System.gc() (I think that's the function) or let it be done automatically instead of just keep using up memory until it starts page, and then some
[01:01:03] <tazle> svm_invictvs: well, memory resources anyway
[01:01:51] <amine> It's not like I'll be manually allocating memory, so gc should help clear out anything that isn't used anymore (eventually)
[01:02:32] <amine> .. at least that is what I've read
[01:02:36] <amine> I could be wrong
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[01:03:02] <svm_invictvs> tazle: and if you know the proper idoms of memory management in C++ and you dont' deviate from well established practices you can manage memory very effectively.
[01:03:13] <bearded_oneder> amine ->  finally, Grizzly is a NIO framework, designed "to help developers to build scalable and robust servers using NIO": https://grizzly.dev.java.net/
[01:03:14] <svm_invictvs> amine: yeah
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[01:03:38] <tazle> svm_invictvs: certainly
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[01:03:43] <prophet05> Is there any example/tutorial how JFace TreeViewer as a TableTree?
[01:03:46] <svm_invictvs> btw, our servers get millions of concurrent connections, so 20k connectsion isn't unreasonable.
[01:04:06] <tazle> svm_invictvs: which servers would those be?
[01:04:11] <svm_invictvs> tazle: www.veoh.com
[01:04:31] <svm_invictvs> I think we have 60 servers, tho
[01:04:46] <amine> svm_invictvs, is there a shared database between these servers?
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[01:05:04] <tazle> svm_invictvs: that's some tens of thousands of concurrent connections per server
[01:05:09] <svm_invictvs> amine: I think so, theres an oracle cluster.
[01:05:12] <svm_invictvs> tazle: yeah
[01:05:21] <tazle> svm_invictvs: which is entirely reasonable, as long as everyone doesn't connect at the same time
[01:05:34] <amine> We could have multiple servers, but I've never done shared databases before so I wouldn't know where to begin
[01:05:47] <svm_invictvs> amine: We have different databases for different htings
[01:05:53] <tazle> svm_invictvs: even a modern desktop PC handles tens of thousands of connections with one message per second per connection
[01:05:59] <svm_invictvs> we also have a shit load of data in hadoop
[01:06:00] <amine> bearded_oneder, thank you lots
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[01:06:17] * bearded_oneder nods
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[01:08:53] <amine> thanks everyone
[01:09:03] <r0bby> hey
[01:10:08] * bearded_oneder mocking Keanu Reeves, "hey".
[01:10:40] <svm_invictvs> r0bby: hey
[01:11:01] <amine> .. is for horses
[01:11:11] <r0bby> no that's hay.
[01:11:17] <r0bby> Common mistake.
[01:11:59] <amine> I have text-to-speech so it sounds the same to me
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[01:17:07] <Haris`> I'm new to Java.
[01:17:18] <Haris`> And I would like to express my opinion about it in one line.
[01:17:20] * Haris` loves Java
[01:17:22] <Haris`> :D
[01:17:33] <Haris`> Java Programming
[01:17:41] <chowmeined> lol
[01:18:12] <Haris`> Hehe.
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[01:20:45] <kavon> i'm a big fan of Java too, wonderful little country
[01:21:40] <Haris`> kavon: I'm glad to be a part of the community. :D
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[01:22:14] * kavon thinks Haris` missed his joke.
[01:22:30] <svm_invictvs> protected void finalize() {shutdown();}
[01:22:30] <svm_invictvs>
[01:22:38] <svm_invictvs> DOULBE-YOU-TEE-EFF!
[01:23:12] <aceofspades19> I dislike how in java there are no destructors
[01:23:27] <Meshezabeel> I can set the minimum and maximum size of a JFrame, When I try to resize a JFrame smaller, it won't let me, but when I try to make it larger, it lets me. How do I dissallow resize larger than the maximum size?
[01:24:16] * bearded_oneder just got svm_invictvs' "DOULBE-YOU-TEE-EFF".
[01:24:29] <bearded_oneder> svm_invictvs ->  poking fun at the aolbonics police?
[01:24:35] <kavon> Meshezabeel: JFrame.setMinimumSize(new Dimension(x, y));
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[01:25:05] <kavon> Meshezabeel: change minimum to maximum for that option
[01:25:30] <Meshezabeel> kavon: no, that does not work, I am still able to resize the frame to a larger size
[01:26:13] <svm_invictvs> bearded_oneder: heh
[01:26:18] <svm_invictvs> another one that's tons of fun:
[01:26:22] <svm_invictvs> #  EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION (0xc0000005) at pc=0x6d9f01d3, pid=2668, tid=1992
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[01:27:45] <kavon> Meshezabeel: JFrame.setMaximizedBounds(new Rectangle(x, y));
[01:27:48] <kavon> Meshezabeel: try that
[01:28:26] <kavon> Meshezabeel: that keeps you from dragging it larger, maybe the other one keeps you from maximising with the button to fullscreen to a certian size
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[01:29:25] <svm_invictvs> You know I dont' see a specific problems with this code
[01:29:42] <svm_invictvs> but I seee alot of multithreaded code w/o any usage of thread-safe practices
[01:29:53] <svm_invictvs> eg, synchronized, or concurrent queues
[01:30:01] <svm_invictvs> er, concurrent data structures.
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[01:31:40] <kavon> svm_invictvs: that could be dangerous to your health
[01:32:39] <Meshezabeel> kavon: that more or less works, thanks. The only problem is that it seems that setMaximumSize includes the Window Decoration (title bar etc.) and setMaximizedBounds does not, so if I set both to 800x600, MaximizedBounds size is slightly larger than MaximumSize.
[01:34:09] <kavon> Meshezabeel: i thought setMaximumSize didn't work earlier?
[01:34:42] <svm_invictvs> I love this solution...
[01:35:03] <svm_invictvs> Just use maven-shade-plugin for everything so there's 30 billion classes in your jar
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[01:37:30] <Meshezabeel> kavon: sorry, I mean setMinimumSize will set it to 800x600 when I issue a pack(), setMaximizedBounds is also set to 800x600, but will enlarge it slightly more than 800x600 because it does not take into account the window decoration.
[01:38:13] <kavon> Meshezabeel: why are you setting the maximum and minimum size of the frame to the same value?
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[01:39:08] <kavon> Meshezabeel: if you don't want the user changing the size, use  JFrame.setSize(x, y) and JFrame.setResizable(false)
[01:39:14] <Meshezabeel> kavon: Just doing some experimentation right now to see if it stopped me from resizing it, which it does not
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[01:40:25] <Meshezabeel> I still find it strange that both setMinimumSize and setMaximizedBounds both operate on a JFrame, but one includes the window decorations in the size, and the other does not. It doesn't make sense to me.
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[01:42:18] <Meshezabeel> thanks kavon, setResizable will work for now anyhow
[01:42:21] <kavon> Meshezabeel: http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/awt/Component.html#setMaximumSize(java.awt.Dimension)
[01:42:32] <kavon> Meshezabeel: http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/awt/Frame.html#setMaximizedBounds(java.awt.Rectangle)
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[01:44:15] <kavon> Meshezabeel: one is from component, which jframe inherits (i think thats the correct term)
[01:44:27] <kavon> Meshezabeel: other is jframe only
[01:46:08] <r0bby> inheritance++
[01:46:12] <r0bby> it's the way to get rich.
[01:46:43] <kavon> r0bby: easiest*
[01:47:27] <kavon> man i've downed 2 diet cherry vanilla Dr Peppers already, i needs MORE
[01:47:31] <Meshezabeel> okay, thanks kavon :)
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[01:49:33] <r0bby> kavon: Jolt.
[01:49:36] <r0bby> red bull
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[01:49:58] <kavon> r0bby: i want something tasty, i don't need that much caffeine
[01:50:12] <r0bby> ?!?!?!
[01:50:30] <Meshezabeel> get some miracle fruit then down an iced tea ;)
[01:50:31] <kavon> r0bby: have you TRIED cherry vanilla dr pepper?
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[01:52:40] <Meshezabeel> is there such a thing as Cherry Vanilla Dr. Pepper, or are you mixing your drinks?
[01:54:06] <kavon> Meshezabeel: oh there is
[01:54:14] <kavon> Meshezabeel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr_Pepper
[01:54:24] <kavon> Meshezabeel: check the column on the right, under Variants in the box
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[02:14:35] <Shirik> Okay, strange question. I'm not sure if I'm going crazy or what, but I'm getting a NullPointerException on the highlighted line, but the only way I see that should happen should be if "refs" is null, right? http://java.pastey.net/105347
[02:15:36] <Shirik> Um, sorry... ignore me. That error was from yesterday and has already been fixed >.> I think I need to go drink some more
[02:16:21] * cheeser bows.
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[02:17:50] <Meshezabeel> Shirik: maybe you need some Cherry Vanilla Dr. Pepper ;)
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[02:23:27] <r0bby> cheeser! :)
[02:23:31] <r0bby> I lub you
[02:23:41] <r0bby> in a non sexual way I mean.
[02:24:09] <zomg> How could it be sexual when "lub" isn't even a word to begin with? ;)
[02:24:41] <_W_> might be an abbreviation of "lube"
[02:25:16] <zomg> humbug
[02:25:36] <r0bby> it is
[02:25:40] <zomg> no 1 uses abbrevs on irc
[02:25:41] <zomg> *cough*
[02:25:58] <r0bby> zomg: don't make me get my spork out.
[02:26:12] <zomg> *grabs his sporkfe* EN GARDE!
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[02:26:46] <cheeser> r0bby: what'd I do this time?
[02:27:11] <r0bby> cheeser: nothing
[02:27:27] <r0bby> Must you always do something to warrant my ass kissing? :P
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[02:43:43] <HideousNashimoto> HEy
[02:43:50] <HideousNashimoto> Weird, How I didn't autologin
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[03:09:12] <MarkT-> What happens when an older compiler comes to an @Override annotation?  Will it puke on it?  Or ignore it?
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[03:10:42] <Shirik> It would have to be a very old compiler, but it will basically go "wtf is this" and spit up errors
[03:11:20] <MarkT-> well, say 1.4
[03:11:52] <Shirik> I consider that very old :)
[03:12:06] <Shirik> but maybe I'm just optimistic about upgrades
[03:12:17] <MarkT-> hmmm...
[03:13:04] <MarkT-> so that makes a good argument for not using annotations... in case somebody wants to compile it with a previous version of the compiler.
[03:14:52] <MarkT-> that sorta bites..
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[03:18:22] <lordmetroid> Is it stupid to import java.io.* rather than just the specific classes I need to use?
[03:18:48] <Shirik> Most people, including myself, argue against "star imports" as being poor practice
[03:18:59] <Shirik> i.e., import java.io.InputStream, etc.
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[03:19:08] <lordmetroid> why?
[03:19:29] <Shirik> Using a star import is lazy and can set yourself up for trouble, e.g., when two packages have the same named class
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[03:20:02] <Shirik> And with today's IDEs that can auto-import for you, there really isn't a good argument to say that it takes too much time, imho
[03:20:31] <bearded_oneder> lordmetroid ->  the compiler only compiles the classes you actually use anyway. imports just tell the compiler where to look for symbols.
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[03:20:38] <lordmetroid> ok...
[03:21:03] <Shirik> You won't see any runtime difference, but it's argued as just being sloppy
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[03:24:09] <bearded_oneder> lordmetroid ->  aside from purist notions of good form, the only real concern is as Shirik said, anem collision, but that's easily remedied by just using the fully qualified class name in such cases (e.g. javax.swing.JPanel instead of just JPanel).
[03:24:18] <bearded_oneder> name*
[03:24:56] <lordmetroid> mmm
[03:25:31] <Shirik> It can also help in reading code. E.g., if I have 10 import foo.*; statements, and then I do "Bar bar;" and I want to go find out what Bar is, it may be difficult to find out exactly where Bar comes from (though most of todays IDEs can figure that out for you)
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[03:28:30] <lordmetroid> alright, I think I'll keep importing everything even though the IDE does it for me, cause I just like it better
[03:28:30] <Shirik> lordmetroid, given that most IDEs have a capability like this, it is hard to argue that you're saving time by using a star import :) http://images.gammatester.com/pics/51fe337bd7774963270c38f70aba0ae4.jpg
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[03:32:40] <lordmetroid> Yes I am using eclipse but I just prefer *
[03:33:13] <Shirik> so long as you don't have a boss that tells you not to do that, that's your perogative :)
[03:33:22] <lordmetroid> I like that
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[03:36:29] <bearded_oneder> lordmetroid ->  to further illustrate Shirik's point about IDE automation, in this example, i type, "InputS" and press [Ctrl]+[Space], [Enter]. The IDE automatically adds all of the code that i've commented with "//IDE added":   http://pastebin.com/d28b3fa98
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[04:04:22] <mike8901> javachannel.net is down :O
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[04:04:49] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: No, it's not.
[04:05:09] <mike8901> Hmmm - not loading for me and pinging it doesn't work.
[04:05:16] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: Hrm...
[04:05:23] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: I know the server is up.
[04:05:28] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: Or I wouldn't be here :)
[04:05:33] <mike8901> :P
[04:05:41] <mike8901> I'm using OpenDNS
[04:05:51] <mike8901> PING javachannel.net (74.0.125.28): 56 data bytes
[04:06:07] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: Ping is disabled.  I don't like ICMP pings ;)
[04:06:13] <mike8901> ah
[04:06:27] <mike8901> working now
[04:06:27] <mike8901> hmm
[04:07:05] <pr3d4t0r> ~is the server up?
[04:07:05] <javabot> http://istheserverup.net
[04:07:11] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: ^^^^^^^
[04:07:19] <mike8901> hmm darn that page is taking a while to load too
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[04:07:43] <mike8901> the weird thing is it's not like the page is slow to load the content - it's like there's a huge amount of latency and then it finally loads
[04:07:49] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: I'd check my own connectivity.
[04:08:03] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: I know the server is up and very responsive because I'm here ;)
[04:08:10] <mike8901> yep :P
[04:08:10] <mike8901> well
[04:08:11] <mike8901> anyway
[04:08:15] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: So are a number of other ##java denizens.
[04:08:26] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: http://istheserverup.net and check the time to respond.
[04:08:45] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: The server is up and responding to web browser (http) requests in 1.370 milliseconds.
[04:08:47] <mike8901> 0.940 ms :)
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[04:08:57] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: I'd go bitch at my ISP :*
[04:09:01] <mike8901> my ISP is awesome
[04:09:04] <pr3d4t0r> OKi, Happy New Year peepz.
[04:09:10] <mike8901> if anything, it's my router
[04:09:19] <mike8901> or my ethernet wiring
[04:09:35] * CodeWar /clears his screen
[04:09:38] <mike8901> anyway
[04:09:57] <daedra> my method overload only needs one line changed - is there any way I can save repeating code?
[04:10:08] <mike8901> sorry if this is off topic - but what framework(if any) would you guys recommend for building a scalable web application(in Java, obviously)?
[04:10:19] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: Wicket.
[04:10:30] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: Robust and fast development.
[04:10:34] <mike8901> scalable?
[04:10:35] <r0bby> grails *duck* ...though not sure if that scales
[04:10:37] <daedra> I could make a subclass and do overriding...
[04:11:05] <pr3d4t0r> mike8901: Very much so.  We're slamming it with a few hundred thousand sessions/day on only 3 servers in production right now, just fine.
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[04:11:25] <pr3d4t0r> Anyway...
[04:11:29] <pr3d4t0r> javabot: r0bby++
[04:11:29] <javabot> r0bby has a karma level of -7, pr3d4t0r
[04:11:34] <pr3d4t0r> r0bby: Happy New Year, Bob.
[04:11:35] <pr3d4t0r> :)
[04:11:45] <r0bby> don't take this the wrong way: bite me.
[04:11:57] <r0bby> I hate 2008 with a passion.
[04:12:01] <whaley> r0bby: go suck a turdbreath
[04:12:13] <mike8901> pr3d4t0r: I take it wicket isn't particularly friendly towards AJAX.
[04:12:13] <flippo> r0bby, and 2008 hated us.
[04:12:15] <r0bby> whaley: bite me too :)
[04:12:22] <r0bby> flippo: apparently so :)
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[04:12:46] <johannesh> r0bby is actually online
[04:12:46] <whaley> mike8901: it is fine with ajax, based on what little I know about it
[04:13:11] <r0bby> mike8901: wicket can use ajax...
[04:13:20] <mike8901> whaley: the reason I make that comment: "refreshing lack of XML," "plain Java and HTML"
[04:13:22] <r0bby> in fact javabot's admin web ui uses it.
[04:13:27] <johannesh> I thought that IRC party was a joke.
[04:13:36] <r0bby> johannesh: like you?
[04:14:06] <flippo> IRC parties lack something I expect from most parties.
[04:14:10] <johannesh> Touché
[04:14:18] <r0bby> flippo: booze?
[04:14:24] <r0bby> tail?
[04:14:37] <r0bby> the ability to punch people in the face?
[04:14:46] <r0bby> family fights (if it's a family party)
[04:15:02] <johannesh> r0bby: Don't worry, I'm just drunk.
[04:15:06] <r0bby> (all of the above in some cases)
[04:15:14] <r0bby> johannesh: oh that's perfect, come here.)
[04:15:16] <r0bby> :>
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[04:15:33] <r0bby> Okay, i seriously have to stop flirting with the regulars, it's creepy
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[04:16:52] <aTypical> r0bby, you've always been creepy.
[04:17:11] <r0bby> so you just tell me this now?
[04:17:43] <aTypical> I guess I just hoped a self-realization would come your way.
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[04:18:44] <r0bby> It never does
[04:19:05] <r0bby> Since cats out the bag now, come here
[04:19:10] <r0bby> I have some candy
[04:19:26] <flippo> I'm so glad I've never seen your picture, r0bby
[04:19:41] <flippo> At least I don't have to visualize.
[04:20:06] * aTypical reaches for the candy.
[04:20:11] <r0bby> pr3d4t0r  has
[04:20:19] * johannesh is listening.
[04:20:22] <flippo> In any event, a ideal party should involve dancing.  Ascii dancing doesn't cut it.
[04:20:30] <r0bby> he's on my facebook.
[04:20:36] <r0bby> as is joed and cheeser
[04:20:51] <r0bby> and i believe whaley is as well
[04:20:55] <r0bby> I'm quite sexy
[04:21:07] * johannesh coughs
[04:21:10] <aTypical> r0bby, can I be on your facebook?
[04:21:28] <r0bby> waiiit johannesh == joed
[04:21:37] <johannesh> Barely.
[04:21:43] <r0bby> okay
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[04:21:46] <r0bby> sure find me :P
[04:22:20] <r0bby> you actually have my full name already if you're not incredibly stupid :>
[04:24:21] <aTypical> I see the name, but there are so many of you.  ;-)
[04:25:20] <johannesh> Anonymous.
[04:25:45] <r0bby> aTypical: next piece of info: Poughkeepsie,NY
[04:26:07] <r0bby> my secondary network.
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[04:31:34] <aTypical> Can't find anyone by that name/location.  I guess I'll just have to harass you here.  ;-)
[04:31:57] <johannesh> He's clever, isn't he.
[04:32:10] <aTypical> Which he?
[04:32:33] <johannesh> The r0bbyhe.
[04:32:40] <r0bby> :P
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[04:42:43] <aTypical> OK, I'm tired.  johannesh, sing me a song.
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[04:43:01] * johannesh sings a song. -.-
[04:43:17] * aTypical swoons
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[05:46:59] <r0bby> I really do love IntelliJ IDEA
[05:48:18] <chowmeined> whats the commonly used design strategy for tcp network clients in java
[05:49:18] <chowmeined> some framework built on nio
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[05:51:02] <Laurus> If in a method signature I put a return type of String, and then in that method I write "return null;" the code still compiles. Does this mean null is a String?
[05:51:27] <FauxFaux> That causes a NPE.
[05:51:48] <rainmann> no it doesn't
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[05:52:11] <rainmann> Laurus, yes null is a bottom type - assignable to any reference type, including String
[05:52:27] <r0bby> Laurus: why not?
[05:52:33] <r0bby> a String is a reference type.
[05:53:37] <Laurus> rainmann: So I could put any return type in the method signature and it would be fine if it returned null?
[05:53:45] <rainmann> Laurus, any reference type, yes
[05:54:02] <Laurus> Okay thank you both :)
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[05:54:17] <r0bby> public Object foobar() { return null; }
[05:54:24] <r0bby> also valid :)
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[05:55:08] <Laurus> r0bby: Heh, interesting ;)
[05:55:46] <Laurus> Thank you very much :) Take care.
[05:55:50] <Laurus> Happy New Year!
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[06:03:32] <kavon>  HAPPY JANUARY 1ST EVERYONE
[06:04:03] <flippo> Oh no, my bus pass expired.
[06:04:16] <tazle> "everyone" in some parts of US anyway
[06:04:37] <kavon> flippo: lol
[06:06:17] <scorchsaber_> tazle: It is January 1st for the majority of the humans on the planet, sir.
[06:06:51] <tazle> scorchsaber_: well, yes, but there's no point in wishing "Happy January 1st" at 4 PM, now is there?
[06:07:23] <whaley> new years is a crock of a holiday
[06:07:32] <whaley> can we please get back on topic
[06:07:38] <scorchsaber_> tazle: Sure there is, if it's the first time you've seen the person you're saying it to that day.
[06:07:46] <scorchsaber_> Yes, we can.
[06:07:46] <scorchsaber_> My mistake.
[06:09:29] <r0bby> Okay a crap year is over, time to starta new crap year
[06:09:32] <r0bby> moving on
[06:09:44] <pragma_> r0bby: stfu
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[06:09:55] <r0bby> Now I need to stick to my plan to not be a tool
[06:09:59] <r0bby> except to pragma_
[06:10:08] <r0bby> he's gonna be my new pet project to be a total tool towards
[06:10:19] * pragma_ status.
[06:10:39] * pragma_ has gained a level.
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[06:21:20] <kavon> how do i check my karma level
[06:21:29] <kavon> and other people's karma
[06:25:17] <m0> javabot: kavon
[06:25:18] <javabot> m0, I have no idea what kavon is.
[06:25:21] <m0> javabot: kavon++
[06:25:25] <javabot> kavon has a karma level of 3, m0
[06:25:39] <kavon> yearg there it is
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[06:28:43] <scorchsaber_> I should try that trick.
[06:28:44] <javawizard2539> javabot: karma kavon
[06:28:44] <javabot> kavon has a karma level of 3, javawizard2539
[06:29:01] <javawizard2539> You can check karma by using "javabot: karma" without having to change it
[06:29:17] <javawizard2539> m0, kavon: ^
[06:29:37] <kavon> javawizard2539: thanks you good wizard sir
[06:29:43] <javawizard2539> :D
[06:29:45] <javawizard2539> no problem
[06:30:11] <kavon> so, would the KDE guys get mad if I used their Oxygen icons in my program? how should I give them credit?
[06:30:26] <javawizard2539> See what license they are under
[06:30:27] <kavon> or can I not even do that? does it have to be open source if i do this?
[06:30:30] <kavon> GPL
[06:30:43] <javawizard2539> Then I think you can use them (without crediting them or anything)
[06:30:59] <javawizard2539> You just can't change them or else you have to distribute the changed versions under the GPL as well
[06:31:04] <javawizard2539> But don't take my word for it
[06:31:45] <kavon> http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/
[06:31:56] <kavon> there thats the 2nd lisence
[06:32:06] <javawizard2539> But that's creative commons
[06:32:11] <javawizard2539> Oh, is it creative commons sharealike?
[06:32:16] <kavon> and GPL yes
[06:32:20] <kavon> on the website
[06:32:44] <kavon> seems i can do whatever i want as long as I don't claim its mine, i plan to give them credit
[06:37:04] <javawizard2539> kavon: I think so
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[06:54:50] <MyName> hi
[06:54:53] <MyName> happy new year
[06:58:13] <r0bby> aw damn
[07:01:30] <MyName> how are you tonight
[07:02:02] <r0bby> good so long as you don't ask any stupid questions :)
[07:02:15] <r0bby> by that i mean, tried googling :)
[07:02:21] <r0bby> before asking :>
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[07:03:24] <r0bby> MyName: let's leave 2008 behind and be merry :)
[07:03:31] * r0bby passes out drunk
[07:03:50] <MyName> ok
[07:03:56] <MyName> can i say something
[07:04:39] <r0bby> So long as it's not something you've been told 5000 times sure
[07:05:01] <kavon> lol
[07:05:18] <r0bby> ie "How do i find out if I have a jdk installed"
[07:06:49] * Shirik passes r0bby some champagne, seems like he needs it
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[07:07:51] <r0bby> Shirik: I'm trying the approach don't be a tool
[07:07:52] <MyName> Freddy Got Fingered is pure masturbation, and I'm sorry to say I mean that both literally and figuratively.
[07:07:53] <r0bby> :)
[07:07:57] <MyName> sorry wrong post
[07:08:01] <MyName> i meant to say smething else
[07:08:06] <r0bby> HAHAHA
[07:08:13] <MyName> and while watching the curious case of benjamin button today in the theaters, i could not control myself, i cried. all the throughts about this past y ear, thoughts on life, on death, on love, all them gushed up and overwhelmed me, bested me....
[07:08:13] <r0bby> totally irrelevent.
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[07:08:21] <r0bby> MyName: again
[07:08:27] <r0bby> how the FUCK is this java?
[07:08:27] <MyName> that was what i wanted to say
[07:08:33] <cybereal> ~~MyName blog
[07:08:34] <javabot> MyName, Look, buddy, pal, friend: ##java is not your personal blog.  Please take your inner thoughts, fears and ruminations back to the LiveJournal.
[07:08:35] <MyName> wel its new year's eve
[07:08:39] <r0bby> point?
[07:08:43] <cybereal> so go be drunk in #perl where they can't tell
[07:08:43] <MyName> i was overwhelmed with emotion/
[07:09:12] <r0bby> cybereal: ouch that's an insult to perl programmers, whose programs look like they've been coded by a drunk
[07:09:19] <r0bby> then again, that's any code I write
[07:09:24] <cybereal> or maybe in #haskell where they get drunk by first selecting all the drinks they will drink then drinking the all at once at the end of the party
[07:09:47] <r0bby> cybereal: or he could go to like...the nearest bar
[07:09:54] <cybereal> or the furthest
[07:10:00] <r0bby> that too.
[07:10:10] <r0bby> preferably the furthest
[07:10:15] <r0bby> cybereal: happy new year
[07:10:20] <cybereal> hope so
[07:10:25] <r0bby> Yeh me too
[07:10:33] <r0bby> I hate 2008, it brought me great pain
[07:10:35] <cybereal> another year of stating then completely abandoning some resolutions
[07:10:47] <r0bby> I have one i can keep
[07:10:51] <r0bby> Not be a tool here
[07:10:55] <cybereal> 2008 wasn't that interesting for me, first year in like 6 years that I didn't get a raise, well technically I did but it was very small
[07:11:05] <r0bby> I think I made a similar one last year
[07:11:05] <cybereal> of course I got a huge one the year before but nevermind that :)
[07:11:46] <r0bby> this time i intend on keeping it, cheesemeister is gonna kill me if I don't
[07:11:51] <cybereal> heh
[07:12:01] <cybereal> I need to get my bills paid, that's my only real resolution
[07:12:03] <cybereal> pay off debt
[07:12:15] <r0bby> pffft
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[07:22:04] <kavon> ok, what is the best way to refresh/update/redraw a JPanel
[07:22:13] <kavon> i've run into this problem before :z
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[07:32:43] <Fanook> panel.repaint()   Unless you've added/removed components in which case you need to .revalidate() first
[07:35:27] * r0bby smacks Fanook
[07:35:31] <r0bby> happy new year
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[07:40:55] <Fanook> Happy Birthday!
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[07:43:35] <r0bby> I'm not a new years baby
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[08:21:33] <gloriaC991> hi, i'm having trouble getting java web start to work on my computer. specifically, the arena on topcoder won't launch. i'm running OS X 10.5, and java 1.5.0_16
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[08:39:55] <chowmeined> bah, guice
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[08:51:51] <r0bby> chowmeined: ?
[08:52:04] <chowmeined> r0bby, i dunno, im really tired and have gotten kind of lost
[08:52:21] <chowmeined> im writing a tcp client (blocking sockets), so what i ended up with is 2 threads per socket
[08:52:32] <r0bby> heh
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[08:52:39] <r0bby> and how does guice factor in?
[08:52:39] <chowmeined> but when guice is doing dependency injection
[08:52:49] <chowmeined> it wants to make a new instance of Socket for each stream
[08:52:58] <chowmeined> instead of using input and output streams from a single socket
[08:53:17] <r0bby> that's not quite how DI is used..
[08:53:37] <r0bby> it's typically used to inject DAOS and Service classes
[08:54:05] <chowmeined> oh
[08:54:20] <chowmeined> i thought it was supposed to setup the whole graph
[08:54:30] <r0bby> it COULD potentially be used that way
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[08:55:31] <chowmeined> hm
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[08:56:03] <chowmeined> ive seen the smaller guice samples
[08:56:16] <chowmeined> but i need to look at how something with like 20 classes is put together
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[09:11:30] <Meshezabeel> Happy New Year!!!
[09:12:22] <Fanook> Happy New Beer!
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[09:12:49] <Meshezabeel> haha, I got pulled over by the cops tonight
[09:14:07] <Fanook> congrats. You are officially at least as smart as the people on Cops
[09:16:51] <kavon> i thought everyone got pulled over on new year's eve
[09:20:31] <r0bby> only the idiots
[09:20:46] <r0bby> Meshezabeel: no offense to you of course
[09:21:01] <r0bby> o/
[09:21:04] <r0bby> nini
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[09:28:41] <Meshezabeel> haha, well they actually pulled everyone over that was going down a particular road, they let me go right away, but others they kept detained ;)
[09:31:55] <Meshezabeel> the funny thing is they were pulling people over around 8pm asking if they had been drinking, I would have at least expected it a little later
[09:33:16] <uttumuttu> mehezabeel, you must factor in the traffic density
[09:34:16] <uttumuttu> perhaps there are vastly more people driving at 8pm than at 11pm (on new year's eve)
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[09:49:02] <Meshezabeel> uttumuttu: yeah, but most people probably would not have been drinking by 8pm, though I could be wrong
[09:51:00] <Meshezabeel> I would have thought they'd be checking after midnight,  I came home around 2ish, and never saw any 'road blocks'
[09:51:51] <telexicon> whats the general strategy for writing tcp clients in java these days? non-blocking nio? thread for each socket? or 2 threads (one for each direction) ?
[09:52:08] <telexicon> i wish i could find something online that was more than an introduction
[09:53:22] <Meshezabeel> telexicon: you checked out the Java Trail on Custom Networking?
[09:53:35] <telexicon> yeah thats an introduction
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[09:56:57] <Meshezabeel> how advanced do you need it?
[09:57:47] <telexicon> well the issue was, if its in one thread and im looping, it only works for a non-interactive (reactive) situation
[09:57:59] <telexicon> because read() blocks, so it can only respond briefly then goes back to blocking
[09:58:08] <telexicon> only when the server sends something
[09:59:00] <telexicon> so whats the solution? i mean this must already be all done before
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[09:59:30] <cybereal> choosy moms choose NIO
[09:59:55] <Meshezabeel> choosy moms?
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[10:00:46] <telexicon> its a joke based on a peanut butter ad
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[10:01:02] <Meshezabeel> ah, never saw the ad
[10:01:13] <Meshezabeel> telexicon: would the bottom of http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/networking/sockets/clientServer.html  help you out?
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[10:02:14] <telexicon> the multithreaded server part?
[10:02:21] <Meshezabeel> yes
[10:02:31] <telexicon> no i understand that part
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[10:02:43] <telexicon> im trying to write a client that doesnt hang
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[10:07:20] <Meshezabeel> telexicon: and I suppose a Datagram method is not what you are after
[10:07:35] <telexicon> no thats for udp
[10:08:05] <telexicon> i guess my question is, am i supposed to use 2 threads on the client socket? one for the inputstream and one for the outputstream?
[10:08:36] <cybereal> ~nio
[10:08:37] <javabot> cybereal, nio is http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/technotes/guides/io/example/index.html and http://gee.cs.oswego.edu/dl/cpjslides/nio.pdf
[10:09:43] <telexicon> ive heard there are some issues with nio, its complexity and difficulty with using ssl
[10:09:59] <cybereal> jetty handles it fine
[10:10:27] <telexicon> ok
[10:12:33] <Meshezabeel> ~aot
[10:12:33] <javabot> Meshezabeel, I have no idea what aot is.
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[10:15:43] <CodeWar> took a stab at getting C#'s using in Java using anonymous inner classes this is the syntax using(IBalancedOp...).execute(new Predicate(){ void method(){....}});
[10:15:55] <CodeWar> use case => http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin/pastebin.php?show=38695 implementation => http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin/pastebin.php?show=38696
[10:16:28] <CodeWar> unlinke the C# version this guy can take multiple inputs and has both a before and after ( and is a lot uglier too )
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[10:19:08] <Meshezabeel> well, have a good night all, see ya all in 2010 :)
[10:19:15] <cybereal> 2010?
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[10:19:52] <Meshezabeel> well, yeah, I guess 2009 for you guys
[10:20:23] <cybereal> what, you live one year ahead of everyone else?
[10:20:54] <Meshezabeel> well, yeah, long story, so see ya all in 2009 :)
[10:21:55] <CodeWar> its a trick statement.. he knows there will be no 2010
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[10:22:22] <Meshezabeel> ah, you found me out CodeWar ;)
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[10:35:13] <ruhaan_jslip> hey is there a mobile java irc client?
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[10:54:13] <cybereal> yes
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[10:54:31] <cybereal> but I fail to remember the name, so go back to google
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[11:59:37] <cratos> Hello, folks. Is there a preferred tool that takes in java source code and generates diagrams - class, sequence, activity ?
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[12:00:37] <ernimril> cratos: not that I know of. Also realize that such a tool becomes unusable if your project has more than 10 classes
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[12:03:25] <ernimril> ~dia
[12:03:25] <javabot> I guess the factoid 'applet diagnostics' might be appropriate:
[12:03:26] <javabot> http://lakeaccess.org/classes/JavaTrouble.html
[12:03:30] <ernimril> hmmm
[12:03:51] <ernimril> cratos: dia/autodia could do the reverse a long time ago, not sure what it can do today
[12:04:34] <cratos> ernimril: I've read about argoUML http://argouml.tigris.org/ - it supports reverse engineering from source code. looks complicated to use and there is scanty documentation.
[12:04:59] <ernimril> ~argouml
[12:04:59] <javabot> ernimril, argouml is a free, Java based UML editing tool.  The project page exists at http://argouml.tigris.org/ and you can launch the latest version via Java Web Start with this url: http://argouml-downloads.tigris.org/jws/argouml-latest-stable.jnlp
[12:05:15] <ernimril> cratos: yes, there is that one as well...
[12:05:49] <ernimril> cratos: why do you not just use dia/argouml/visio and just draw the diagrams manually, but stick to the major classes/events/...
[12:06:29] <cratos> ernimril: the code base is huge, i'd like if i could simply import the code and get the diagrams.
[12:07:00] <ernimril> cratos: you realize that you would get like a billion pages if you get some program to work
[12:07:41] <cratos> ernimril: :) yes.. argoUML has some filter support that helps us to decide which code paths need to be traced etc
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[12:09:41] <ernimril> cratos: how big is "huge"? how many source files/classes?
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[12:11:52] <cratos> ernimril: its a internal project(very old codebase) and has ~1000 files including 4 components.
[12:12:17] <ernimril> cratos: ok, almost small then :-)
[12:12:23] <cratos> ernimril: :D
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[12:13:27] <ernimril> cratos: consider asking the developers that made the base to provide documentation
[12:14:26] <cratos> ernimril: :) the friggin developers don't even have a proper HLD or FS!
[12:16:05] <ernimril> cratos: so get them to write some
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[12:17:43] <longbeach> Happy new year to everyone !
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[12:26:29] <hellues> hey
[12:27:02] <hellues> can you suggest any tutorial about arbitrary branching tree
[12:27:15] <hellues> i cannot find any tutorial about that on google
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[12:31:46] <cratos> ernimril: Just browsed through the AutoDia website - saw this comment "Java (some issues with version 1.4) no longer fully supported (it used to work, Java broke its API's now it doesn't, fixes welcome) "
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[12:32:25] <hellues> cratos, do you know anything arbitrary branching tree
[12:34:00] <cratos> hellues: did you mean a tree structure with an arbitrary branching factor?
[12:34:18] <hellues> it must be
[12:34:24] <hellues> yes it is
[12:34:37] <hellues> can you suggest any tutorial for this subject
[12:34:50] <hellues> basic tutorial
[12:37:09] <cratos> hellues: there is a section on branching factor in Wikipedia. I see the page also lists a tutorial. Check it out.
[12:37:54] <hellues> hmm tree branching factor
[12:38:31] <cratos> hellues: if you describe a bit more on the tree structure and contraints, we might be able to help.
[12:38:39] <cratos> constraints*
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[12:40:20] <hellues> hmm actually i dont know what is arbitrary branching.
[12:40:43] <cratos> hellues: :D
[12:40:57] <cratos> hellues: what is it that you wish to learn?
[12:40:58] <hellues> ::D just i know it is about tree
[12:41:26] <cratos> hellues: some context might help in understanding the concept.
[12:41:34] <hellues> what is arbitrary branching what is it about ? i wonna learn all things about atribtrary branching :d
[12:41:47] <hellues> where is such context
[12:42:00] <hellues> i find an address http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=10&url=http%3A%2F%2Fmaxpedia.org%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmp%2Fm.pl%3Fla%3Den%26sw%3Dbranching%2Bfactor&ei=PatcSavZAsaC-gar8KzEDw&usg=AFQjCNGSaZGyjv_OyIZOqtk14_A7R4_hlQ&sig2=_1z5v2yvxwI-kqwWKAAJuw
[12:49:15] <hellues> i need a tutorial arbitrary branching factore onn trere
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[12:53:26] <kakazza> Is this the right place to ask about Java Servlets for Apache Tomcat?
[12:54:50] <cheeser> yes
[12:56:27] <kakazza> Where can I read about the package naming convetions?
[12:56:43] <hellues> radix sort is same with shell sort ?
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[12:57:11] <kakazza> Ah, nvm.
[12:57:36] <kakazza> I think I fixed it (without having a clue why, go go trial-n-error developers!)
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[12:59:54] <kakazza> I have another question. I am using ECS to format my output to proper HTML, do I still add \n and \t by puting exactly that into my servlet, or does ECS have something I can use to add tabs and newlines?
[13:00:02] <kakazza> Basically, my output is now one long line
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[13:08:40] <defenderBG> hi all
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[13:09:42] <defenderBG> now... i am writting a deamon (that means the System.err and System.out are taken down) and I use a self crafted logging tool to report all errors
[13:10:35] <defenderBG> now... my problem is that when I want to exit the program, I need to close the report files as well, which throws an IOException
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[13:11:29] <defenderBG> since I am closing the files, I cant report to them, because it is a deamon, I cant throw a message to the System.err
[13:11:46] <defenderBG> and I am getting kind of confused of how to report the error
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[13:11:53] <defenderBG> anyone got an idea?
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[13:21:06] <hellues> i cannot find anything about arbitrary braching factore on tree did you suggest one.Wikipedia doesnt have lots of thing.
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[13:33:13] <jottinger> morning
[13:33:38] <jottinger> defenderBG: why is it throwing an exception?
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[13:35:23] <kakazza> ~pastebin
[13:35:24] <javabot> http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
[13:35:57] <kakazza> Hi, does anyone know why this is failing? http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin/pastebin.php?show=38697
[13:36:02] <jottinger> what is it
[13:36:08] <kakazza> Java Servlet
[13:36:11] <kakazza> Using TOmcat
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[13:36:18] <jottinger> right, what's teh failure
[13:36:21] <kakazza> I guess it's because of "Anzahl" or so.
[13:36:30] <kakazza> You mean the error?
[13:36:45] <jottinger> yes, no point in looking at the pastebin until there's more information
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[13:37:25] <kakazza> Sec
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[13:38:36] <kakazza> I don
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[13:38:46] <kakazza> 't exactly know how to get the error to show >_>
[13:39:18] <jottinger> ew, that's a SQL Injection attack waiting to happen
[13:39:24] <kakazza> D:
[13:39:34] <kakazza> I am using ECS and all I get is my custom error message
[13:39:41] <kakazza> I don't know how to get exc.printStackTrace(); to show
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[13:39:52] <jottinger> for one thing, one usually doesn't quote the column name once you've determined it
[13:40:04] <jottinger> for another, use a preparedstatement
[13:40:14] <jottinger> and ECS? Really? In 2009?
[13:40:20] <kakazza> :x
[13:40:24] <jottinger> Even the ECS developers don't use ECS any more :)
[13:41:02] <kakazza> heh
[13:41:37] <kakazza> So I removed all the "`" after the first declaration of "Anzahl"
[13:41:51] <jottinger> not even sure you need that one
[13:41:58] <kakazza> I need it in MySQL
[13:42:19] <jottinger> but why aren't you testing this with a console-like DB interface like squirrel-sql or dbvisualiser?
[13:43:05] <kakazza> I tested the query in MySQL console, if that's similiar
[13:43:11] <jottinger> sure
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[13:43:28] <jottinger> and did it work? Once it works there, translate it into a preparedstatement
[13:43:40] <kakazza> It works there, yes
[13:44:10] <jottinger> well, then you need to figure out what your servlet's doing wrong. Write a SIMPLE SERVLET that ignores ECS.
[13:44:16] <kakazza> But I am not sure, maybe I am getting the "anzahl" parameter as a string?
[13:44:37] <jottinger> It wouldn't matter, unless it wasn't a valid comparison in the SQL statement.
[13:44:37] <kakazza> Ah, I am getting it as a string, bah...
[13:44:40] <kakazza> String Anzahl = request.getParameter("Anzahl");
[13:44:56] <jottinger> sure. but if the string is "4", the SQL is still valid.
[13:45:04] <kakazza> Ah ok
[13:45:07] <jottinger> oh, no it isn't - you're quoting it.
[13:45:23] <kakazza> Ah
[13:45:24] <jottinger> you really need to work on your exception handling. :)
[13:45:44] <kakazza> So how do I get this to work before I work on my exception handling?
[13:45:48] <kakazza> Get it as int?
[13:45:59] <kakazza> Or don't quote it?
[13:46:15] <Razec> hello all
[13:46:16] <jottinger> no. 1) Convert to preparedstatement. 2) don't quote the parameter.
[13:46:59] <kakazza> I have no idea what preparedstatement is, but what quoting is
[13:47:03] <kakazza> gonna try 2) first :x
[13:47:24] <jottinger> Sure, leave the SECURITY HOLE first.
[13:47:27] * jottinger sighs
[13:47:31] <kakazza> :x
[13:47:42] <kakazza> Is the ' or the " the quoting which makes it fail?
[13:48:08] <jottinger> which is being used to quote the parameter in the SQL?
[13:49:05] <kakazza> The SQL statement is hardcoded to 3, no quoting there
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[13:51:10] <kakazza> googling preparedstatements
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[13:59:57] <kakazza> jottinger - How do I split the preparedstatement into multiple lines? also like this? "pstmt += "next line of query"; ?
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[14:01:00] <jottinger> you build the preparedstatement from a string
[14:01:03] <Luno> you mean multiple queuries or ?
[14:01:09] <jottinger> you just don't concatenate parameters into the string
[14:01:24] <jottinger> PreparedStatement ps=conn.prepareStatement("select foo from bar "+
[14:01:44] <jottinger> "where bar.baz>?"); ps.setInt(1, 4);
[14:02:17] <jottinger> if the parameter is a string, SQL injection is impossible
[14:02:42] <jottinger> so "select username from users where username=? and password=?" is a safe query, where
[14:03:06] <jottinger> "select username from users where username='"+username+"' and password='"+password+"'" is not
[14:03:27] <kakazza> Cool
[14:03:42] <jottinger> since an attacker might try a username or password like "foo' or 'a'='a"
[14:04:52] <kakazza> Like this? http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin/pastebin.php?show=38698
[14:05:14] <jottinger> yes
[14:05:16] <kakazza> I just don't know whether the Statement and Result lines are not useless
[14:05:29] <jottinger> although you're using tomcat, why are you using manual jdbc connections?
[14:05:30] <kakazza> The Result one is useless, that I know, because query is nonexistant now
[14:05:39] <kakazza> I have to ~_~
[14:05:44] <jottinger> why?
[14:05:48] <jottinger> Tomcat has JNDI
[14:05:56] <jottinger> oh, this is homework, isn't it
[14:06:20] <kakazza> Yes. But they didn't teach us Java at any point.
[14:06:37] <jottinger> Well, I'm sorry that you have crappy teachers
[14:06:45] <kakazza> Me too
[14:07:01] <kakazza> So basically, I just changed their framework.
[14:07:50] <kakazza> So I have a preparedstatement now, how do I execute it? And get it into this... result thing
[14:08:38] <jottinger> have you tried the code you pasted?
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[14:09:25] <kakazza> Nope, but I doubt it can work, ResultSet result = statement.executeQuery(query); is useless without having query now
[14:09:41] <kakazza> And I have no idea what "Statement statement = connection.createStatement();" does ;(
[14:09:46] * kakazza tries the code
[14:10:12] <jottinger> why not pstmt.executeQuery()?
[14:10:25] * jottinger is busy knocking on his screen, saying "Hello? mcFly?"
[14:14:10] <cheeser> how the might have fallen.  terry bowden to coach div II
[14:14:28] <cheeser> whoops.  wrong channel.  but still...  8^)=
[14:14:34] <jottinger> good for him
[14:14:48] <jottinger> now if only bobby will follow him!
[14:16:30] <skoskav> sports :x
[14:16:46] <kakazza> hrm
[14:18:00] <kakazza> Hrm, how do I check whether the int I am trying to read was NULL or 0?
[14:18:12] <cheeser> an int will never be "NULL"
[14:18:18] <kakazza> It says incomparable types: int and <nulltype> when I do if (Anzahl == null)
[14:18:23] <cheeser> not least of it is that NULL isn't a java value
[14:18:36] <cheeser> ints always have values
[14:18:38] <kakazza> Well, the html form can be empty when submitted, what will the value be?
[14:18:54] <jottinger> the string from getParameter will be null if there's no value submitted
[14:19:14] <cheeser> request parameters are always strings
[14:19:17] <kakazza> I set it to "int" now, becauae "setInt(int,int)
[14:19:33] <kakazza> hrm, so I have to convert string to int for setInt?
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[14:20:34] <kakazza> I guess I can't use setString, since SQL wants an int there, no?
[14:20:53] <jottinger> ~docs++
[14:20:54] <javabot> docs has a karma level of 3, jottinger
[14:20:58] <jottinger> ~tutorials++
[14:20:59] <javabot> tutorials has a karma level of 1, jottinger
[14:21:01] <jottinger> ~reading++
[14:21:01] <javabot> reading has a karma level of 10, jottinger
[14:21:27] <kakazza> :x
[14:25:45] <kakazza> kinda hard without having error messages...
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[14:27:19] <kakazza> How do I make this part display the error message instead of "Database error!": http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin/pastebin.php?show=38699
[14:28:56] <cheeser> ~~ kakazza javadoc Exception
[14:28:57] <javabot> kakazza, http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/lang/Exception.html, null
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[14:33:31] <kakazza> I have the exception in exc I think, I just don't know how to retrieve the text of it :x
[14:33:42] <cheeser> so rtfm on Exception
[14:35:48] <kakazza> Ah, inherits getmessage
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[14:37:21] <kakazza> zomg awesome
[14:38:41] <ReAn> can i re-use a Thread?
[14:38:51] <ReAn> i.e. can i reset it's threadstate?
[14:38:53] <cheeser> ReAn: no
[14:39:57] <ReAn> i have to create a new object?
[14:40:01] <Luno> but he can reuse thread, that's what threadpools are for
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[14:40:21] <kakazza> hrm...
[14:40:32] <Luno> maybe "reuse" is not a good word
[14:40:37] <cheeser> it's not
[14:40:40] <kakazza> I guess I can't retrieve things like "'COUNT(slots.TrNr)"
[14:40:50] <kakazza> Since that's not a column...
[14:41:12] <ReAn> yea, well i basically have 4 threads, when one is done, i want it to execute again once i've selected a new file for it to work on
[14:41:19] <ReAn> i guess i have to build that into my object
[14:42:00] <cheeser> or just let the thread run until you tell it to stop and it just does nothing if the File ref it has is null.
[14:42:15] <cheeser> if it's not null, do work, set the file ref to null, wait...
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[14:52:15] <whalberg> hi.
[14:52:43] <whalberg> how can i access jTextArea in fileApp.java that is created in the fileview.java?
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[14:56:54] <mbroeker> whalberg, do you have a reference to the class fileApp in fileView?
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[14:59:31] <whalberg> well the fileApp runs the fileView
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[15:01:19] <whalberg> i feel kinda idiot myself
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[15:07:02] <korisk> hi! can i create vertical tab panel with common swing components?
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[15:15:34] <korisk> ~pastebin
[15:15:34] <javabot> http://pastebin.stonekeep.com  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
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[15:27:41] <mazzachre> 0x48 0x61 0x70 0x70 0x79 0x20 0x4e 0x65 0x77 0x20 0x59 0x65 0x61 0x72
[15:28:00] <cheeser> ?
[15:28:23] <cheeser> happy new year in ASCII?
[15:28:29] <mazzachre> :)
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[15:29:12] <mazzachre> I would say utf-8, but the chars I use, it does not matter...
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[15:48:14] <wfq> hi guys
[15:49:23] <wfq> if I declare a const in java should I treat it via using if-else or switch {}. They all are string. I don't know, this is not recommendable in some languages? What about java?
[15:50:03] <Luno> you can't use strings in switch
[15:50:10] <mazzachre> You can't switch on a string in java... you should perhaps look at enums?
[15:50:24] <cheeser> java doesn't have consts
[15:50:42] <mazzachre> final :)
[15:50:46] <mazzachre> probably
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[15:51:47] <wfq> cheeser, I know. I am using final. I just called consts
[15:52:07] <cheeser> final doesn't mean const either
[15:52:13] <wfq> static final yes
[15:52:23] <cheeser> static final doesn't mean const either
[15:52:33] <wfq> well, I mean, they can do what I am looking for. that is it. :)
[15:52:43] <wfq> thanks
[15:52:59] <mazzachre> wfq: Try look at enumerations... that is probably what you are looking for...
[15:53:38] <wfq> mazzachre. Thanks. checking javadoc.
[15:54:04] <cheeser> enumerations have nothing to do with if/else or switch statements
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[16:05:47] <kakazza> "ORDER BY Anzahl ?;"
[16:05:48] <kakazza> pstmt.setString(2, order);
[16:05:55] <kakazza> You have an error in your SQL syntax; check the manual that corresponds to your MySQL server version for the right syntax to use near ''DESC'' at line 1
[16:05:59] <kakazza> order = ASC or DESC
[16:06:17] <kakazza> Does Java put the ? in ""?
[16:06:20] <jottinger> no
[16:06:30] <jottinger> that's not a valid parameter for preparedstatement
[16:06:44] <jottinger> preparedstatements don't alter the order or source table or column names
[16:06:49] <jottinger> only the parameters
[16:06:57] <kakazza> Ah ok
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[16:07:07] <kakazza> So i cannot exchange DESC with ASC and vice versa?
[16:07:18] <jottinger> not that way, right
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[16:07:29] <kakazza> In which way then?
[16:07:54] <kakazza> if statement which checks for ASC/DESC and replaces the last line of my SQL statement with the correct one?
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[16:09:13] <kakazza> order == ASC ? "ORDER BY Anzahl ASC;"); : "ORDER BY Anzahl DESC;");
[16:09:22] <kakazza> I'm gonna try that, for the fun of it
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[16:21:31] <kakazza>       PreparedStatement pstmt = connection.prepareStatement("SELECT TrName, COUNT(slots.TrNr) AS Anzahl "+
[16:21:31] <kakazza>       "FROM trainer, slots "+
[16:21:31] <kakazza>       "WHERE trainer.TrNr = slots.TrNr "+
[16:21:31] <kakazza>       "GROUP BY TrName "+
[16:21:31] <kakazza>       "HAVING Anzahl > ? "+
[16:21:32] <kakazza>       "ORDER BY Anzahl DESC;");
[16:21:34] <kakazza> arg
[16:21:36] <kakazza> sorry
[16:21:40] <kakazza> Wrong window
[16:21:42] <kakazza> Won't happen again
[16:21:46] * kakazza ducks
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[16:31:22] <Haris`> Hello, what is the difference between constructor and main method?
[16:32:12] <Luno> main method is just  the entry point for execution
[16:32:31] <Luno> jvm calls public static void main(String[]) method of XX class when you run "java XX"
[16:32:35] <Luno> and constructor...
[16:32:42] <Luno> ~tell Haris` about constructor
[16:32:42] <javabot> Haris`, constructors is http://java.sun.com/tutorial/java/javaOO/constructors.html
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[16:35:34] <Haris`> Constructors cannot have return value? :(
[16:35:44] <Luno> yep
[16:36:09] <Haris`> and main can't have any argument except string?
[16:36:19] <Luno> array of strings
[16:36:27] <Luno> it's list of parameters you run program with
[16:38:25] <Haris`> Coool :)
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[16:52:59] <knuthy> Hello
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[16:54:31] <dmlloyd> ~~javahorn pm
[16:54:33] <javabot> javahorn, Use /msg to talk to Drone and javabot, but ask other users first.  See: http://javachannel.net/wiki/pmwiki.php/FAQ/Pm
[16:56:46] <RolandU> Hi all! I am gettin a strange exception from Hibernate I do not understand (while doing a SELECT-query). java.lang.RuntimeException: left and right hand sides of a binary logic operator were incompatibile ... could anyone tell me what that could mean?
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[16:59:41] <odinsbane> I'm trying to setup j2me, should I install Sun Java Wireless Tool Kit 2.5.2?
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[17:12:00] <Russell^^> odinsbane, probably; it includes the emulator etc.
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[17:21:40] <kakazza> If I use a Java Servlet to insert, modify and delete data in a DB, how do I check referential integrity myself?
[17:22:09] <ernimril> kakazza: why do you have to? the db is usually pretty good at checking such things
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[17:26:33] <kakazza> I know, it's required in the assignment I am doing
[17:26:47] <kakazza> And I am kinda lost, because I usually let MySQL handle that stuff
[17:27:16] <kakazza> These servlets should illustrate updating and referential integrity of your database.
[17:27:16] <kakazza> ! Please point explicitly where you check referential integrity (adding rows, modifying rows, deleting rows).
[17:27:42] <ernimril> kakazza: what db?
[17:27:49] <hanen> ~pastebin
[17:27:50] <javabot> http://eugeneciurana.com/pastebin  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
[17:28:13] <kakazza> A DB I am working with
[17:28:21] <ernimril> kakazza: consider talking to your teacher and tell him/her how you use foreign keys and similar
[17:28:35] <kakazza> Ok
[17:28:37] <ernimril> kakazza: what db? oracle/mysql/pgsql?
[17:28:41] <kakazza> mysql
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[17:36:28] <odinsbane> I installed this toolkit and I think... that I should have the libraries javax.microedition... but I can't import them, is it possible they are in one of the jars of this toolkit?
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[17:37:51] <openbysource> wht transient variable role ?
[17:38:28] <Fanook> ~~openbysource transient
[17:38:30] <javabot> openbysource, Variables may be marked transient to indicate that they are not part of the persistent state of an object.  While transient is intended for use by them, the JLS does not specify the details of persistence services; see the specification of java.io.Serializable for an example of such a service.
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[17:41:02] <openbysource> which kind of service, javabot
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[17:46:25] * r1nu- Merry Christmas and Happy new year with more coding! :)
[17:46:41] <Fanook> openbysource: the bot is just a walking dictionary. It doesn't have an intelligence behind it.
[17:46:51] <Fanook> ~~openbysource persistence
[17:46:51] <javabot> openbysource, JPA is the Java Persistence API. For all intents and purposes, it's meant for persisting objects into a relational database, which is usually correct but let's be real, that's sometimes stupid. Lots of implementations of this - Hibernate, cocobase, Toplink Essentials, openJPA are some. Wanna learn more? Google, or read http://java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/J2EE/jpa/
[17:47:14] <Fanook> *sigh* ignore that. openbysource
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[17:47:47] <Fanook> persistence is the conversion to and from a state usable for storage/transmission
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[17:49:19] <openbysource> mean transient  variable can work as a persistent variable n also store value etc
[17:49:55] <Fanook> no, a transient variable is one that you don't want to include in the persisted state of the object
[17:50:10] <openbysource> then wht's it work
[17:50:32] <Fanook> that was not a valid sentence. try again.
[17:51:51] <openbysource> how can I use non persistence  variable into my code like transient
[17:52:30] <openbysource> plz desc any case/example
[17:52:33] <odinsbane> So I have a jar file with javax/microedition, but when I include that jar file in my class path, I still cannot import javax.microedition... to I need to put that tar file with my other javax libs?
[17:53:10] <Fanook> odinsbane: no. you just need to include the .jar file in your classpath
[17:53:26] <Fanook> what is your exact error?
[17:53:46] <Fanook> openbysource: your questions are not making any sense
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[17:54:15] <openbysource> Fanook: but it's making sense for thinking about
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[17:55:08] <Fanook> you mark a variable as transient when you want the persistence API to ignore it. That's it.
[17:56:41] <openbysource> yup
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[17:58:56] <Fanook> ...so did you have a real question?
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[18:00:27] <openbysource> not yet, only for testing
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[18:06:11] <jottinger> well! this thing is starting to come together, but the console-based app is starting to be unwieldy :)
[18:07:30] <waz> thing = ?
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[18:08:51] <jottinger> waz: new article for $payingpublisher
[18:09:00] <jottinger> Basically showing ci-bayes in action
[18:09:07] <waz> nice
[18:09:15] <jottinger> (the app in question: console-based rss reader, machine-learning preferences)
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[18:09:51] <jottinger> I knew rss in console was going to be icky^2 but it's way simpler than weighing the thing down with a webapp going in
[18:10:02] <jottinger> I'm using DB4O for datastorage, it's fun :)
[18:10:23] <ernimril> jottinger: no swing gui?
[18:10:44] <jottinger> ernimril: It could have one, I'm using MVC pretty aggressively
[18:10:55] <jottinger> but I'm not a Swing guy, so I'm not bothering with anything that gets in the way
[18:11:14] <jottinger> the end goal is to actually make it a webapp, distributed via a cloud, and customizable by user
[18:12:04] <jottinger> the console app gets to ignore user management, so it's simpler and has no TX issues :)
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[18:13:57] <jottinger> My end goal is to have a user-downloadable codebase where users can set a notification flag, such that as they train LOCALLY it trains a general-purpose system too
[18:14:24] <jottinger> but that might be a little far-reaching; it might be better just to leave the simple app as what it is to encourage users to use something a little more full-featured
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[18:25:23] <chris_abyi> hi. I wonder if it's possible to have a JTextArea with a ScrollPane which always shows the last entry of the Text (the last Line), like in a chat window, e.g. How can I change the JScrollPane to this setting?
[18:25:48] <ernimril> chris_abyi: change the caret position
[18:26:13] <ernimril> chris_abyi: (on the test area, not the scroll pane)
[18:26:25] <Fanook> chris_abyi: you don't add the scrollpane to the text area. You add the text area to the scrollpane
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[18:27:17] <chris_abyi> Fanook, ernimril: thank you. Just a thing to understand it right: the caret is the position where new text is being inserted or?
[18:27:27] <Fanook> yes. the caret is that blinky line
[18:28:06] <chris_abyi> Fanook, fine - but I still want the new lines to be inserted at the bottom..didn't get that
[18:28:44] <Fanook> *points at ernimril's comments* You can change the caret position. You probably want to do this after appending to the text
[18:28:48] <ernimril> chris_abyi: you append text to it, then you set the caret to the top position
[18:29:00] <ernimril> hmmm, we have some distorted echo in here :-)
[18:29:51] <chris_abyi> ok. And when I want to append a new line, I have to shift the caret to the bottom again? And then up again?
[18:30:03] <chris_abyi> sorry, bit slow today.
[18:30:14] <ernimril> chris_abyi: yes, that is correct
[18:30:41] <chris_abyi> ernimril, ok. So there's no easier method? How do these irc-windows work?
[18:30:43] <chris_abyi> same way?
[18:31:24] <ernimril> chris_abyi: irc-windows? I use ircii, it is an old command line client, no swing here. I think it uses curses internally
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[18:32:02] <chris_abyi> :) I thought there wouldn't be that much people anymore using ircii - so I hit one. :)
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[18:35:02] <chris_abyi> hm. I just recognized that the caret position is no constant like "TOP" or "BOTTOM".. How can I determine where to set a new line at the bottom?
[18:36:50] <chris_abyi> Thinking complicated: I have to get the number of lines and the height of each line..
[18:37:29] <ernimril> chris_abyi: the document has a length
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[18:38:05] <chris_abyi> ernimril, ah for sure. thank you. I use a lot of /n's that's why I was confused.
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[18:43:20] <gocsp_> hello
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[18:53:09] <chris_abyi> bye! Thanks for the advice.
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[19:12:25] <redeeman> hello
[19:12:33] <taraskostiak> hi
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[19:13:23] <redeeman> im attempting to use another provider for jce, but it appears the implementations from sun takes precedence, how can i disable the sun implementations, and use only the ones that comes from other security providers?
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[19:23:43] <drichards> ~pdf
[19:23:44] <javabot> I guess the factoid 'pdf renderer' might be appropriate:
[19:23:45] <javabot> drichards, pdf renderer is a java pdf renderer and viewer, see https://pdf-renderer.dev.java.net/
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[19:31:08] <drichards> ~pdf generator
[19:31:08] <javabot> I guess the factoid 'pdf renderer' might be appropriate:
[19:31:09] <javabot> drichards, pdf renderer is a java pdf renderer and viewer, see https://pdf-renderer.dev.java.net/
[19:32:14] <Shirik> Hi all, I'm going to be taking in a bunch of strings and relating them to objects as an index. I want to then perform a search, looking for those strings to find the right object. There will be a lot of searches, so it needs to be relatively fast. Am I right in choosing a Hashtable to do this?
[19:32:23] <drichards> ~swing
[19:32:24] <javabot> drichards, swing is a windowing toolkit for Java.  Tutorials: http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/uiswing/ and http://www.swingwiki.org/ also check out ##swing
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[19:34:43] <drichards> that's an age-old debate ;)  My advice is start there and with proper abstraction you can implement a different storage retrievable approach if need be
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[19:35:34] <joed> ~~ drichards pm the bot
[19:35:38] <javabot> drichards, You can send me private messages, these annoy other users less.  Note that in private messages, you don't need the "~".
[19:35:55] <ernimril> Shirik: well, Hashtable is not used much in new code, you use Map/HashMap, but it is mostly the same thing
[19:36:16] <Shirik> oh is HashMap preferred over Hashtable?
[19:36:29] <ernimril> Shirik: almost always, yes
[19:36:38] <Shirik> My checkstyle script (which, admittedly, someone else gave me unrelated to the project) warns against HashMap but not Hashtable
[19:36:54] <Shirik> I'm guessing I should take that out then? :)
[19:37:25] <ernimril> Shirik: what is the warning you get?
[19:37:56] <joed> Shirik: This might be interesting http://www-igm.univ-mlv.fr/~lecroq/string/
[19:38:13] <evilgeek> why does it warn against HashMap?
[19:38:24] <Shirik> ...\InterfaceList.java:95:9: warning: Declaring variables, return values or parameters of type 'HashMap' is not allowed.
[19:38:47] <Shirik> I assumed there was a reason for that, so I left it in
[19:38:52] <Shirik> I can take it out just as easily :)
[19:39:03] <ernimril> Shirik: not sure what that warning is about, but you should use Map as left hand value
[19:39:26] <ernimril> Shirik: so methods look like "public Map<Foo, Bar> getSomeData(...)"
[19:39:54] <Shirik> oh!
[19:39:57] <Shirik> I bet that's what it's warning about
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[19:40:09] <Shirik> when I did Map<Foo, Bar> baz = new HashMap<Foo, Bar>(); the warning went away
[19:40:12] <evilgeek> Shirik: your friend is bad at programming.
[19:40:12] <ernimril> Shirik: when you create the map you use HashMap or TreeMap or ...
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[19:40:48] <evilgeek> ernimril: i never understood why people return Map as opposed to HashMap.  HashMap comes with certain guarantees about efficient retrieval.
[19:41:18] <evilgeek> (and youshould never return a TreeMap from something that is supposed to return Map unless you're certain that the domain implements Comparable.)
[19:41:21] <ernimril> evilgeek: most of the time you do not care about that
[19:41:36] <evilgeek> you might not.  but i do.
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[19:42:49] <Shirik> ok well now that I know why this warning exists, I should go convert all my Hashtable instances back to HashMaps ^_^
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[19:43:28] <ernimril> Shirik: Hashtable is synchronized so if you have multi threaded your app, then you may want to be careful about that change
[19:43:39] <Shirik> I made sure to externally synchronize :)
[19:43:46] <ernimril> Shirik: (but use Collections.synchronizedMap instead of Hashtable in that case)
[19:44:12] <ernimril> Shirik: or possibly change to a concurrent map instead
[19:44:30] <evilgeek> java.uril.concurrent.ConcurrentHashMap or whatever is kinda nice.
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[19:45:53] <Shirik> oh wow
[19:45:59] <Shirik> that's better than my solution actulaly
[19:46:19] <Shirik> I was planning to add a ReaderWriterLock to grab on to while accessing the table
[19:48:54] <Shirik> thanks
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[20:05:16] <chuck> hello =)
[20:05:41] <chuck> i'm writing a penlet for my livescribe pulse pen, and I want to make an array and then add a new member to that array every time a new word is recognized
[20:05:59] <chuck> how exactly do I make an array that doesn't have a limit or at least make it so I can increase the limit
[20:06:10] <waz> use a Collection
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[20:10:07] <puppy_sa> try java.util.List
[20:10:23] <puppy_sa> specifically, ArrayList
[20:11:08] <gumpish> Is the method values() for enums actually documented anywhere in the API? It certrainly doesn't seem to be in http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/lang/Enum.html
[20:11:25] <puppy_sa> it's generated by the compiler
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[20:12:10] <gumpish> i see.
[20:12:19] <Fanook> gumpish: it's not in the API, but it's specified in the language spec
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[20:13:16] <chuck> puppy_sa, ArrayList? I'll try it
[20:13:18] <chuck> thanks
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[20:20:44] <ernimril> gumpish: it is a static method, how can it be in the Enum-javadoc
[20:20:59] <ernimril> gumpish: it is in the javadoc you generate for your classes
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[20:26:10] <Sagi22> >	Hi I have question about overloading in java
[20:26:28] <Sagi22> say I have method
[20:26:30] <Sagi22> public int foo (int x)
[20:26:32] <Sagi22> it is possible to declare
[20:26:33] <Sagi22> public int foo (float x)
[20:26:46] <gocsp_> hello
[20:26:58] <puppy_sa> yes
[20:27:08] <gocsp_> happ new year together
[20:27:35] <ernimril> Sagi22: what happen when you try it?
[20:27:42] <puppy_sa> Happy New Year
[20:27:44] <Sagi22> I didn't try it
[20:28:16] <Sagi22> I want to know if it's ambiguous to the compiler
[20:28:18] <Sagi22> or it will be ok?
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[20:28:31] <gumpish> ernimril:  ah, neat. guess I should brush up on that process then.
[20:28:41] <ernimril> ~~Sagi22 tias
[20:28:41] <javabot> Sagi22, Try it and see. You learn much more by experimentation than by asking without having even tried.
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[20:29:06] <Sagi22> ernimril thanks but I want also to understand
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[20:29:52] <gocsp_> anyone knows about TreeModel and Arraylist?
[20:32:32] <puppy_sa> a more specific question might help?
[20:33:21] <gocsp_> :)
[20:33:34] <gocsp_> i have a treemodel with a arraylist as model
[20:34:17] <gocsp_> and the objects of the arraylist have arraylists too
[20:35:41] <gocsp_> puppy_sa: http://rafb.net/p/PExqM344.html
[20:36:42] <gocsp_> with this: http://rafb.net/p/XEiZRQ36.html i get the classes and courses
[20:36:58] <Eyvind> Sagi22: As far as I know, the javac will choose the most specific method possible
[20:37:00] <gocsp_> but then i need the pupils too
[20:37:12] <Sagi22> Eyvind
[20:37:25] <Sagi22> I think it doesn't work with int+double
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[20:37:34] <Sagi22> but with int+float it seems that it works
[20:37:38] <Sagi22> so I don't know why
[20:37:52] <Eyvind> What happens when you do int and double?
[20:38:05] <Sagi22> compiler error
[20:38:20] <Eyvind> pastebin it
[20:38:28] <The_Miso> ~pastebin
[20:38:28] <javabot> http://rifers.org/paste  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
[20:39:02] <Sagi22> http://rifers.org/paste/show/8612
[20:39:07] <Sagi22> error is
[20:39:13] <Sagi22> possible loss of precision
[20:39:41] <Sagi22> oops...
[20:39:52] <Sagi22> The method returns int
[20:39:53] <chuck> So if I want to add a class variable for an ArrayList, what would it look like?
[20:39:58] <chuck> ArrayList words;  << ?
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[20:40:18] <puppy_sa> chuck - uh?
[20:40:28] <The_Miso> I have two constructors in the same class - and I kind of need them both - is that possible?
[20:40:28] <chuck> sorry >< i'm new to java :P
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[20:40:30] <Eyvind> chuck: static ArrayList words; could be a class variable
[20:40:36] <chuck> evilgeek, okay, thanks
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[20:40:59] <The_Miso> This is why: http://rifers.org/paste/show/8613 (and it might be dumb - if so: sorry ;))
[20:41:04] <chuck> Eyvind*
[20:41:45] <puppy_sa> Sagi22 - it's a conversion problem (double -> int)
[20:42:15] <Eyvind> The_Miso: Very possible
[20:42:17] <Sagi22> puppy_sa I saw..thanks
[20:42:19] <Sagi22> so it will take float if I do foo(1.1f) and int if foo(1)?
[20:42:34] <Eyvind> Sagi22: As I said, it will choose the most specific method possible
[20:42:40] <puppy_sa> The_Miso - you can call 'this();' in the second one
[20:43:02] <The_Miso> okay, but still, how do I decide which one to use?
[20:43:21] <The_Miso> I mean .. can I do something like "choose the small one if no variable is set" or so?
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[20:44:08] <Eyvind> The_Miso: It works just like any method overloading, if the compiler will choose the constructor that matches the parameters the actor uses
[20:44:36] <The_Miso> Oh I see
[20:45:06] <The_Miso> So if no parameters are set it should use the small one, in the other case, the big one?
[20:45:29] <The_Miso> set = used
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[20:46:56] <Eyvind> http://java.pastebin.com/d381f6979
[20:47:11] <Eyvind> I think you can take it from there
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[20:50:04] <The_Miso> yeah it works, thank you very much
[20:50:36] <The_Miso> it actually worked before, there was just some other problem which lead me to believe that it didnt.. but thank you very much nevertheless
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[20:52:47] <Eyvind> The_Miso: You're welcome
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[20:57:00] <MyName> is java certification useful for jobs?
[20:57:22] <r0bby> No it's not.
[20:57:34] <MyName> ok
[20:57:35] <puppy_sa> it depends on which one you get
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[20:57:39] <r0bby> show you know your shit
[20:57:43] <MyName> like an entry level java programmer ?
[20:57:51] <MyName> no i mean useful for getting a job
[20:57:55] <r0bby> MyName: show you know your shit.
[20:58:02] <MyName> so it's useful ?
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[20:58:24] <r0bby> MyName: I wouldn't waste my money
[20:58:29] <r0bby> but that's just me.
[20:58:32] <puppy_sa> MyName - it's a formal way to show your employer that you know the language
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[20:58:53] <MyName> what if  i just study for it and not taek the test
[20:59:01] <MyName> is it a good pool of meaning questions
[20:59:04] <MyName> for java
[20:59:06] <MyName> knowledge
[20:59:07] <puppy_sa> mmm
[20:59:11] <r0bby> that's fine but you still should show you know your shit
[20:59:23] <MyName> ok
[20:59:28] <MyName> and what ifi try to do a project myself
[20:59:32] <MyName> like a jsp/servlet project
[20:59:34] <r0bby> MyName:  you're better off contributing to open source projects.
[20:59:35] <puppy_sa> certification exam is the reason why you want to spend the money
[20:59:40] <MyName> or a 3-Tier aplication project ?
[20:59:49] <r0bby> MyName: learn the language first.
[20:59:59] <r0bby> don't even BOTHER going to that level of stuff
[21:00:00] <MyName> r0bby, but if i have no experience, how can i contribute ?
[21:00:03] <MyName> they won't take me
[21:00:10] <r0bby> by contributing patches
[21:00:16] <r0bby> proving yourself.
[21:00:26] <MyName> but i am not smart enough for that
[21:00:31] <puppy_sa> MyName - there are many ways to learn Java language
[21:00:37] <r0bby> no shit... I mean sure you are
[21:00:53] <MyName> puppy_sa, what is a good way. i already know the basic stuff of the lang. and i'm reading effective java now
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[21:01:02] <MyName> and jotting down notes as i read
[21:01:12] <MyName> but i feel the better way is to do a project myself
[21:01:14] <MyName> instead of reading books ?
[21:01:32] <puppy_sa> MyName - a project is good for practice
[21:01:35] <r0bby> MyName: do an IRC client.
[21:01:43] <MyName> is it hard?
[21:02:00] <puppy_sa> as for the usefulness of the certification, it wouldn't hurt your resume/CV if you have it
[21:02:03] <r0bby> no it's piss easy considering irc libs exist to abstract away the irc protocol.
[21:02:17] <r0bby> don't put the IRC client on there.
[21:02:26] <MyName> why not
[21:02:28] <r0bby> it's primarily just a starting point --= pretty much a throw away project
[21:03:56] <waz> certs aren't always a help on a cv
[21:03:58] <r0bby> irc clients aren't hard at all; another good place to start is an IRC bot -- DO NOT place it in ##java (or any other channel which you do not own without explicitly asking the channel owner's permission)
[21:04:12] <r0bby> if you have one, back it up
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[21:04:18] <r0bby> way I say it.
[21:05:01] <puppy_sa> waz - the programmer exam is not as easy as people might assume.
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[21:06:09] <chuck> Hey, I added this to my class, but Eclipse says that it can't be resolved to a type: ArrayList words;
[21:06:10] <joed> That is not what he said. Some compaines may not see certifications as a great plus.
[21:06:16] <chuck> I have java.util.*  imported
[21:06:17] <MyName> r0bby, bot sounds more interesting. what is the working theory behind it ?
[21:06:53] <waz> puppy_sa: it's odd though, folks that have them on their CV are below avg
[21:07:05] <puppy_sa> joed - there is only one formal Java certificate, which is offered by Sun.
[21:07:21] <MyName> what about microsoft java cert ?
[21:07:28] <joed> chuck: Don't do star imports and you need to import : import java.util.ArrayList;
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[21:07:41] <joed> puppy_sa: And?
[21:07:42] <puppy_sa> the standard of the question is pretty high
[21:07:50] <puppy_sa> I know, 'cos I have written one
[21:07:57] <r0bby> so?
[21:07:58] <joed> puppy_sa: Because.
[21:08:05] <chuck> joed, it says the import java.util.ArrayList cannot be resolved
[21:08:25] <joed> puppy_sa: You are arguing a fact. That is usually a fairly dumb thing to do.
[21:08:31] <r0bby> chuck: just for shits and giggles
[21:08:35] <r0bby> type javac -version
[21:08:38] <waz> puppy_sa: why do holders of said certs do so poorly when faced with tough interviews?
[21:08:54] <chuck> javac 1.5.0_16
[21:09:04] <r0bby> java -version now?
[21:09:15] <puppy_sa> waz - Java Programmer Certificate certifies one thing - the knowledge of the core language
[21:09:15] <chuck> java version "1.5.0_16"
[21:09:15] <chuck> Java(TM) 2 Runtime Environment, Standard Edition (build 1.5.0_16-b06-284)
[21:09:15] <chuck> Java HotSpot(TM) Client VM (build 1.5.0_16-133, mixed mode, sharing)
[21:09:20] <puppy_sa> uh
[21:09:21] <r0bby> okay
[21:09:23] <r0bby> that's odd
[21:09:30] <waz> puppy_sa: it means two things
[21:09:38] <chuck> r0bby, how so
[21:09:41] <joed> It is probably something Eclipse is doing weird.
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[21:09:56] <chuck> oh
[21:10:02] <r0bby> chuck: set eclipse to use the sun compiler?
[21:10:24] <MyName> will java lose popularity in the future, as Sun is going to go bankrupt?
[21:10:25] <chuck> where is that option
[21:10:30] <MyName> is c# takign over java?
[21:10:45] <puppy_sa> I know you can set Eclipse to use other JRE, but it uses its own compiler
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[21:11:04] <waz> Sun's going bankrupt eh?
[21:11:09] <MyName> puppy_sa, no, the JRE is the same, u mean u can set eclipse eto use a different compilerr ?
[21:11:14] <MyName> r0bby, am i right?
[21:11:17] <puppy_sa> MyName - the same has been said for C, C++, COBOL, Fortran, and even Smalltalk
[21:11:18] <joed> ~u
[21:11:35] <joed> ~~ MyName aolbonics
[21:11:35] <javabot> MyName, aolbonics is using unnecessary abbreviations such as 'u', 'r', 'ur', 'thx', etc. Using this language depicts you as an imbecile in the eyes of the helpful regulars in this channel, and is generally not tolerated.  If you want intelligent answers, the least you can do is speak intelligently.  Additionally arguing about this rule will get you nowhere except banned.  Have a nice day!
[21:12:00] <r0bby> knowing your tools++
[21:12:10] <MyName> r0bby, am i right?
[21:12:13] <chuck> r0bby, might it be the "Compiler comliance level"? I saw a few errors relating to 1.5
[21:12:19] <chuck> which is what its currently set to
[21:12:28] <MyName> there's only one JRE (aka virtual machine) ,and that is by sun.
[21:12:48] <waz> wrong
[21:12:49] <joed> MyName: Really?
[21:13:12] <MyName> joed, isnt it?
[21:13:19] <MyName> which part is wrong?
[21:13:28] <waz> which part?
[21:13:33] <waz> the whole statement
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[21:13:40] <userek> i've got a problem with printing. I want to use LANDSCAPE page orientation. I draw a table with text in it. It works fine when the text font is Monospaced, but when i change it to Arial it will print only in a PORTRAIT orientation. Any ideas?
[21:13:41] <MyName> what other jre's are there
[21:13:43] <joed> MyName: All you said http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Java_virtual_machines
[21:13:56] <MyName> joed, but i was right about jre is the virual machine
[21:13:58] <joed> ~~ puppy_sa pm
[21:13:58] <javabot> puppy_sa, Use /msg to talk to Drone and javabot, but ask other users first.  See: http://javachannel.net/wiki/pmwiki.php/FAQ/Pm
[21:14:25] <joed> puppy_sa: And it was waz that didn't finish his sentence.
[21:14:34] * waz hides
[21:14:46] <puppy_sa> too many people in one conversation
[21:15:18] <chuck> also, i have a question about "this.", in a penlet guide i was reading, one of its methods uses "this." before its class variables, and another method doesn't use it at all, what's the difference?
[21:15:19] <puppy_sa> isn't that why private message was invented?
[21:15:22] <Teckla> Is Tomcat considered "production quality" (i.e., considered robust enough for professional use)?
[21:15:31] <joed> MyName: Java Runtime Environment would be correct. Yes that has a virtual machine for you.
[21:15:42] <MyName> joed, in that list, how come sun is nto in there???
[21:16:18] <puppy_sa> MyName - you probably need to set up Eclipse to find the JRE
[21:16:39] <MyName> puppy_sa, what do u mean "find"? i already have eclipse.
[21:16:49] <joed> MyName: Hotspot
[21:16:55] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o joed
[21:17:03] <MyName> MyName, what??
[21:17:05] *** MyName was kicked by joed (Stop using aolbonics)
[21:17:14] *** joed sets mode: -o joed
[21:17:38] <userek> ;-D
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[21:17:54] <MyName> ok HotSpot is by Sun. i See.
[21:18:09] <MyName> but what is the diff between on JVm and another? why would one use one vs t he other ?
[21:18:20] <userek> Just use sun's
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[21:18:30] <MyName> and why do most people use Sun 's instead of others'?
[21:18:34] <puppy_sa> someone might write a better JVM than Sun
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[21:18:43] <cheeser> hasn't really happend yet.
[21:18:50] <userek> MyName, because its original
[21:18:52] <cheeser> maybe with jrockit but..
[21:19:01] <puppy_sa> it's a possibility
[21:19:10] <MyName> ok
[21:19:11] <puppy_sa> not a 'fact'
[21:19:14] <Fanook> chuck: "this" is a reference to the object the method was invoked on. It is almost never needed. If, however, your method arguments have the same name as your object members, you need to prefix the member accesses with "this." to tell the compiler which name you mean to use
[21:19:14] <scorchsaber> JVMs used to be built because they wanted an open-source implementation.
[21:19:14] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o waz
[21:19:20] <MyName> but what is the difference between the word "hotspot" and "jre" ?
[21:19:21] <userek> isn't jrockit based on sun's vm?
[21:19:28] <MyName> with regard to Sun that is.
[21:19:36] <scorchsaber> I think Apache is still building theirs, since they want to use the Apache license, and not GPL.
[21:19:36] <chuck> oh, okay
[21:19:45] <cheeser> hotspot is a JIT.  a JRE is more.
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[21:19:49] <Teckla> Never mind, this page ( http://wiki.apache.org/tomcat/PoweredBy ) seems to indicate Tomcat is plenty robust for professional use.  :)
[21:19:56] <cheeser> scorchsaber: harmony is essentially dead
[21:20:00] <Fanook> MyName: JRE is a generic term for the Java Runtime. HotSpot is Sun's implementation of the runtime
[21:20:11] <scorchsaber> cheeser: Google is using it for Android-- doesn't seem dead to me.
[21:20:11] <userek> scorchsaber, i tryied it several months ago and it was slow as hell :P
[21:20:12] <cheeser> Fanook: nothing generic about it.  8^)=
[21:20:22] <cheeser> scorchsaber: oh, are they?  i hadn't heard that.
[21:20:31] <cheeser> interesting.
[21:20:32] <chuck> so if I want to built a "helper" method to build a string from an arraylist, I could make it like, private String buildArrayString() then in another method I can just do this? String fullText = buildArrayString(); (without the this.)
[21:20:33] <MyName> so HotSpot is a type of JRE
[21:20:39] <scorchsaber> I'm not sure what to think of it.
[21:20:44] <cheeser> i knew they had a java-ish environment
[21:20:45] <MyName> so Sun's JRE = Hotspot?
[21:21:08] <puppy_sa> MyName - read Java on Wikipedia
[21:21:20] <MyName> i did
[21:21:23] <cheeser> i thought they were using jamvm
[21:21:30] <MyName> one question: "The JVM, which is the instance of the JRE (Java Runtime Environment), comes into action when a Java program is executed. When execution is complete, this instance is garbage-collected." <--- what does it mean "one instance".
[21:21:45] <cheeser> MyName: no.  sun's JRE can include hotspot
[21:21:57] <maxote> MyName, the older Sun's JREs have only the classic mode, not the server mode.
[21:21:57] <MyName> cheeser, well if it does not include hotspot, it cannot run java programs can it >?
[21:22:10] <cheeser> yes, it can.
[21:22:22] <cheeser> you don't need hotspot to run java code
[21:22:26] <MyName> what is the point of sun not including hotspot in jre, if hotspot is the jvm that can run java programs in th e first place?
[21:22:26] <puppy_sa> it can, with the interpretter mode
[21:22:29] <MyName> what do you need then ?
[21:22:31] <MyName> oh
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[21:22:41] <MyName> how do i know th en if the jre i have has hotspot ?
[21:22:42] <cheeser> which is what id does until the VM invokes hotspot
[21:22:48] <maxote> Hotspot is related to Amhdal
[21:22:57] <cheeser> MyName: stop worrying about it.
[21:23:11] <MyName> i just want to know all these details, or do you think they are unimportant. ?
[21:23:16] <MyName> i should focus on the java language itself?
[21:23:18] <cheeser> they are irrelevant to you
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[21:23:20] <MyName> ok
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[21:23:24] <waz> MyName: at this point in your learning totally irrelevant
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[21:23:54] <cheeser> it's like really wanting one of those Dodge Hemis when you're still on a tricycle
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[21:24:10] <The_Miso> One more problem ... I want to search by a column in a table, and I get the columns title, but this title doesnt match the column in the database - how would you map such a thing?
[21:24:35] <puppy_sa> MyName - it's better if you can find some kind of teacher in real life.
[21:24:37] <cheeser> The_Miso: by the same logic you used to name that column in the JTable to begin with
[21:24:43] <MyName> puppy_sa, can you be my teacher?
[21:24:50] <MyName> also, what about microsoft jvm ?
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[21:24:56] <cheeser> MyName: there isn't one.
[21:25:04] <MyName> therte is
[21:25:05] <Goundy> Hi
[21:25:08] <puppy_sa> there was one
[21:25:09] <The_Miso> Problem is - this is a community project .. and the group that it responsible for that part ... well .. didnt use any logic
[21:25:10] <MyName> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Java_Virtual_Machine
[21:25:11] <cheeser> use sun's vm.  learn java.  stop asking stupid questions.
[21:25:20] <The_Miso> So I have to do it myself somehow
[21:25:27] <Goundy> Java HashTable: How to get the list of objects mapped by the same key X ?
[21:25:32] <Fanook> The_Miso: your data access layer would be responsible for knowing what db name the app name is linked to
[21:25:40] <Fanook> Goundy: there is only one object per key
[21:25:42] <cheeser> The_Miso: they *did* "use logic" unless they generated randomized strings for names.
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[21:26:21] <Goundy> Fanook I've read that HashTable handles collisions by expanding the bucket so one bucket could hold more than 1 object
[21:26:28] <The_Miso> Well they just read the columns titles, but I have to access the names given in the hibernate config
[21:26:30] <chuck> is there a method like PHP's trim to get rid of whitespace at the end of a variable
[21:26:33] <Fanook> yes, but buckets != keys
[21:26:40] <MyName> i am readikng effective java, is that a good book
[21:26:44] <cheeser> The_Miso: not for a sql query you don't.
[21:26:56] <waz> ~~chuck javadoc String
[21:26:57] <javabot> chuck, http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/java/lang/String.html
[21:27:00] <cheeser> MyName: you should read more then ask fewer questions.  write more code.
[21:27:04] <The_Miso> Yeah but it's not an sql query, but an hql query
[21:27:16] <MyName> ok.
[21:27:28] <Goundy> Fanook a Key points to a bucket, and the bucket is a list of objects right ?
[21:27:35] <cheeser> The_Miso: so look where they extracted values for that column to see how they determined the name
[21:27:52] <Fanook> Goundy: no, a key points to a value. Buckets are an implementation detail
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[21:28:11] <The_Miso> I can't access all their source - but I'll try - brb
[21:28:19] <Goundy> Fanook What should I use then to be able to have a key maching several objects ?
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[21:28:35] <Fanook> Map<Key, List<Value>>
[21:28:39] <chuck> waz, so the method is .trim, but I'm not sure how to use it
[21:28:49] <cheeser> how community can it be if you can't access their source?
[21:28:49] <chuck> fullText = fullText.trim  brings up eclipse errors
[21:28:59] <cheeser> methods take ()
[21:29:02] <Fanook> chuck: trim is a method, not a member
[21:29:02] <genesiss> .trim(); ??
[21:29:04] <Goundy> Fanook ah ok thank you man
[21:29:19] <DjZemich> Is it possible to catch two kind of exceptions in a single catch statement?
[21:29:19] <waz> ~~chuck newbie ide
[21:29:19] <javabot> chuck, Newbies shouldn't start with IDEs.  It's important to learn the environment and fundamentals of a language before offloading those to an IDE.  Learn about packages and imports and classpaths.  Learn how to compile and use the JDK tools.  Get some basic grasp of the API layout.  Learn how to do things then switch to an IDE to do them faster.  See http://tinyurl.com/yvks48 and and http://tinyurl.com/2cpn6o for more info.
[21:29:25] <scorchsaber> chuck: Actually read the docs.
[21:29:26] <chuck> oh, there we go, thanks (I'm too used to ruby ><)
[21:29:33] <The_Miso> It's for university - I don't know if you call that a community project
[21:29:34] <Fanook> Goundy: there are also third-party libraries that have multimaps
[21:29:43] <cheeser> i wouldn't, no.
[21:30:23] <The_Miso> well, english isn't my mother's tongue .. sorry if my information was misleading ..
[21:30:37] <Goundy> Fanook hold : Map<Key, List<Value>>
[21:30:41] <Goundy> it says List isn't generic
[21:30:43] <Goundy> oO
[21:30:45] <bobbytek> java is uncool
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[21:31:19] <DjZemich> Is it possible to catch two kind of exceptions in a single catch statement?
[21:31:23] <Fanook> Goundy: assuming you're using Java 5+, java.util.List is definitely generic. on the other hand, java.awt.List is definitely not
[21:31:24] <cheeser> i wanted to do that!
[21:31:25] <cheeser> 8^)=
[21:31:27] <Fanook> DjZemich: not yet
[21:31:34] <DjZemich> Fanook: Okay thanks
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[21:31:43] <Goundy> oh damn
[21:31:52] <Goundy> Fanook nevermind I took another list impl >_< sorry and thanks
[21:31:55] <cheeser> unless they extend a common class
[21:31:57] <cheeser> 8^)=
[21:31:59] <waz> there you go cheeser
[21:32:08] * cheeser licks his chops
[21:32:19] <scorchsaber> Don't screw it up this time!
[21:32:25] <waz> fresh troll on aisle 1
[21:32:29] <puppy_sa> DjZemich - catch Throwable. That catches everything
[21:32:32] <cheeser> i'll do my best, coach!
[21:32:38] <waz> NO!!!!
[21:32:40] <cheeser> bad advice++
[21:32:45] <scorchsaber> Ew. That's just wrong.
[21:32:47] <Fanook> cheeser: if a gui widget and a data structure share a superclass other than Object, I need to hurt some people
[21:32:48] <puppy_sa> he asks a question
[21:32:55] <waz> hahah, typical java cert dude
[21:33:07] <puppy_sa> no, I know it's not a good advice
[21:33:11] <cheeser> Fanook: i was talking about catching exceptions but yes, you're probably right there.
[21:33:13] <waz> then don't give it
[21:33:14] <cheeser> 8^)=
[21:33:29] <puppy_sa> waz - people need to ask a more specific question
[21:33:40] <waz> and you need to not give crappy advice
[21:33:40] <cheeser> puppy_sa: and people need to stop giving stupid advice
[21:33:42] <Fanook> ah, wasn't paying attention to the other convo
[21:34:06] <cheeser> Fanook: i'm jumping around a lot without much notice.  it's not your fault.  entirely.  P^)=
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[21:34:27] <puppy_sa> it's only stupid if that doesn't do what he wants to do
[21:34:35] <cheeser> no, it *is* stupid.
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[21:34:57] <puppy_sa> if you don't care about the exception, then you catch everything
[21:35:04] <cheeser> using a battle axe to chop off the leg at the knee is good advice because it does take care of the ingrown nail.
[21:35:05] <waz> NO
[21:35:07] <puppy_sa> why people don't care, that is another question
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[21:35:31] <cheeser> puppy_sa: then catch Exception and not Throwable.
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[21:36:04] <puppy_sa> see, if you kick me before I even see other people's response, then they need to repeat it
[21:36:14] <androoid> harrrro!
[21:36:18] <scorchsaber> Throwable catches errors, too, which you don't want to catch unless you really want to catch them.
[21:36:26] <cheeser> puppy_sa: i didn't repeat anything.
[21:36:30] <scorchsaber> catching throwable catches*
[21:36:41] <Goundy> how to initialize a List<E> ? ôO obviously I can't instanciate it
[21:36:45] <androoid> anyone doing blackberry apps?
[21:36:49] <waz> puppy_sa: you're right, I'm sorry, next time a ban will solve that problem
[21:36:50] <cheeser> ~~ Goundy collection
[21:36:50] <javabot> Goundy, collection is http://www.darksleep.com/notablog/format.cgi?article=Java_Collections_Tutorial.foo
[21:37:12] <cheeser> ~info collection
[21:37:12] <javabot> collection was added by: who knows?!? on 06-28-2005 at 9:53 PM, EDT and has a literal value of: http://www.darksleep.com/notablog/format.cgi?article=Java_Collections_Tutorial.foo
[21:37:35] <puppy_sa> waz - there is no single answer to every question. Context is important.
[21:38:01] <cheeser> puppy_sa: but there *are* stupid answers as we've seen.  let's move on.
[21:38:03] <Eyvind> And kicks and bans aren't tools of disagreement, at least not on this level
[21:38:58] <cheeser> Eyvind: but they are good tools for silencing the illiterate
[21:38:59] <cheeser> 8^)=
[21:39:07] <puppy_sa> mmm
[21:39:07] <scorchsaber> androoid: Somebody is, hopefully. If not, I feel sorry for the blackberry users and their stagnant platform.
[21:39:56] <Eyvind> I read the javadocs on concurrent collections, but they were woefully vague as to their thread safety guarantees. Do they guarantee anything other than atomicity?
[21:40:27] <cheeser> what more would you like?
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[21:41:09] <Eyvind> It's possible to make individual collections completely thread safe, but I don't want to assume that before I know for certain.
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[21:41:28] <nofilicity> Is it possible to call a function dynamically?
[21:41:37] <r0bby> ~reflection
[21:41:37] <puppy_sa> yes
[21:41:37] <javabot> r0bby, reflection is http://java.sun.com/tutorial/reflect
[21:41:40] <puppy_sa> reflection
[21:41:44] <nofilicity> Thanks
[21:41:57] <r0bby> nofilicity: functions don't exist, methods do tho.
[21:42:12] <nofilicity> erm, right, sorry
[21:42:13] <puppy_sa> you know what he meant
[21:42:23] <nofilicity> Nah, I need to use proper terminology :p
[21:42:30] <Eyvind> Always good to be clear
[21:42:59] <puppy_sa> well, there is no formal body saying that is wrong either
[21:43:07] <r0bby> there is puppy_sa.
[21:43:13] * cheeser sighs.
[21:43:23] <puppy_sa> between method and function?
[21:43:23] <cheeser> who cares?  you know what he wants.
[21:43:26] <scorchsaber> puppy_sa: The spec isn't formal enough?
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[21:43:45] <puppy_sa> let me see
[21:43:47] <Eyvind> Let's move on, I'd rather have someone think about my question than argue about petty things like this
[21:43:53] <cheeser> Eyvind: agreed
[21:43:58] <r0bby> cheeser is right, I'm being a pedantic twat
[21:44:11] <cheeser> s/,.*//
[21:44:13] <cheeser> 8^)=
[21:44:31] <Eyvind> It's good to have one pedantic twat, as long as there aren't more to be pedantic on the twat
[21:44:36] <r0bby> cheeser: don't hear that often do we?
[21:44:52] <cheeser> i hear it all the time!
[21:44:52] <cheeser> 8^)=
[21:44:54] <scorchsaber> s/cheeser is/scorchsaber is/
[21:45:11] <r0bby> scorchsaber: bad move!
[21:45:30] <scorchsaber> I'm not being serious, you know. :(
[21:45:46] <scorchsaber> (also, s/bad/good/)
[21:45:51] <Eyvind> What are the thread safety guarantees of concurrent collections?
[21:47:11] <puppy_sa> what kind of guarantees are you thinking of?
[21:47:46] <r0bby> the api isn't clear enough for you?
[21:48:14] <Eyvind> Any guarantees as far as concurrency is concerned. Internally syncronized collections (like Vector) guarantee (only) atomicity, for example.
[21:49:37] <Eyvind> r0bby: I am still reading, but I haven't found anything definitive yet.
[21:49:37] <r0bby> there are collections in java.util.concurrent
[21:50:18] <Eyvind> Yes, those are the ones I am asking about.
[21:50:36] <joed> http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/essential/concurrency/collections.html
[21:50:40] <Eyvind> "A weakly consistent iterator is thread-safe, but does not necessarily freeze the collection while iterating, so it may (or may not) reflect any updates since the iterator was created."
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[21:50:57] <Eyvind> Wordings like that make me uncertains
[21:50:57] <Eyvind> s
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[21:52:00] <r0bby> so write your own
[21:52:05] <r0bby> since you seem to know more
[21:53:08] <cheeser> and you could answer less since you seem to know less
[21:53:10] <cheeser> 8^)=
[21:53:17] <Eyvind> I usually do write my own, but if there are library collections that provide the guarantees that I require, I would much rather use those.
[21:53:57] <puppy_sa> Eyvind - Vector doesn't offer a stronger guarantee
[21:54:13] <Eyvind> puppy_sa: I'm starting to realize that, which makes me wonder why they named them "Concurrent," and hence why I am still trying to figure it out
[21:54:38] <mikejet> pr3d4t0r, you there?
[21:54:54] <Shirik> Is it thread safe? Yes. It may not behave the way you want it to, but it's thread-safe.
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[21:55:48] <Shirik> Whether or not the iterator is consistent has no bearing on whether or not it's thread safe. It won't break, it just might not return the results you'd like. If it doesn't, write your own.
[21:57:16] <Eyvind> Shirik: Consistency is often crucial to true thread-safety.
[21:58:04] <Shirik> Determinism is crucial to real-time systems, not thread-safety
[21:58:47] <gumpish> o_O is there such a thing as an "abstract" field? That is, I want to say in an interface or an abstract superclass that an implementing/extending class WILL have a field with such and such name, but without giving it a value in the abstract class/interface definition.
[21:58:57] <Shirik> From wikipedia (which we all know is always 100% accurate) "A piece of code is thread-safe if it functions correctly during simultaneous execution by multiple threads. In particular, it must satisfy the need for multiple threads to access the same shared data, and the need for a shared piece of data to be accessed by only one thread at any given time."
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[21:59:02] <Eyvind> Systems with multiple layers of threads always -- at least in my experience -- require consistency in their depending threads, otherwise race conditions pop up constantly.
[21:59:05] <waz> java really isn't the best choice for real time systems
[21:59:10] <cheeser> ~~ gumpish abstract
[21:59:11] <javabot> gumpish, abstract is http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/java/IandI/abstract.html
[21:59:13] <Fanook> gumpish: not in Java, no. Scala has them though
[21:59:27] <Shirik> I wasn't implying it was, waz, only that he's confusing thread safety with determinism
[22:00:29] <gumpish> and I'
[22:00:32] <gumpish> oops
[22:01:03] <gumpish> and I'm guessing there's some overhead in using a getter method versus directly referring to someInstance.someField ?
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[22:01:25] <cheeser> very little
[22:01:29] <Eyvind> Shirik: Even though I have found Wikipedia incorrect on many coutns when it comes to computer science, it does not exclude determinism as part of thread-safety.
[22:02:31] <cheeser> Eyvind: http://is.gd/eniZ
[22:03:22] <Eyvind> cheeser: Hah.
[22:03:25] <Shirik> The comment about wikipedia being 100% correct was sarcastic. That being said, for something to be deterministic, it must be thread-safe. However, for something to be thread-safe, it does not need to be deterministic. (This is exemplified by your quote from the Java documentation)
[22:03:29] <cheeser> 8^)=
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[22:04:34] <mikejet> I can write a not thread-safe program that is deterministic.
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[22:04:43] <Eyvind> Shirik: Okay, I grant that I might be throwing terms around alittle loosely, and I'm glad I'm not the only one with any idea about what I'm talking about, but this is exactly why I want clear guarantees.
[22:05:08] <Shirik> well that's why the documentation specifically states that there is no guarantee, so that you know the limitations and, if you need to, allows you to write them yourself
[22:05:26] <Eyvind> It doesn't specify that there is no guarantee, it just doesn't guarantee anything.
[22:05:30] <Shirik> But that does not exempt itself from being justly in the "concurrent" package
[22:05:48] <Shirik> it guarantees that it's thread safe!
[22:06:24] <Shirik> mikejet: Ok, maybe I should have been clearer, but it's pointless to correct it :P
[22:06:34] <gumpish> lol
[22:06:53] <Eyvind> No it doesn't. I can write code that breaks from race conditions with concurrent collections that you say are guaranteed to be thread-safe
[22:07:07] <Shirik> define "breaks"
[22:07:11] <Eyvind> And I was brought up in a world where race conditions were part of thread safety
[22:07:27] <mikejet> define "define"
[22:07:38] <r0bby> ~~ mikejet troll
[22:07:38] <javabot> mikejet, Please go away.
[22:07:45] <svm_invictvs> What are we talking about?
[22:07:46] <svm_invictvs> Threading?
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[22:07:55] <Shirik> He's concerned about this: "A weakly consistent iterator is thread-safe, but does not necessarily freeze the collection while iterating, so it may (or may not) reflect any updates since the iterator was created."
[22:08:16] <Eyvind> No, I'm concerned about the concurrency guarantees that concurrent collections provide.
[22:08:23] <Shirik> All that should ever happen is that any updates may or may not be reflected when you iterate over the list
[22:08:29] <Shirik> Anything else should be safe
[22:08:46] <Shirik> i.e., anything that ISN'T changed should still be found
[22:08:54] <Eyvind> That quote was in explanation to someone else who was wondering about the guarantees I was asking for, it is not the core of my concern.
[22:09:24] <svm_invictvs> Eyvind: That's a bit vague.  Which ones specifically.  Each of the concurrent safe collections have a very small set of very specific guarantees.  And you should rely only on the specified guarantees
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[22:10:01] <mikejet> The thing that jumps out at me is if you aren't sure, the classes may be doing redundant/superfluous locks which may be messing up performance of your app.
[22:11:01] <redeeman> im attempting to use another provider for jce, but it appears the implementations from sun takes precedence, how can i disable the sun implementations, and use only the ones that comes from other security providers?
[22:11:13] <svm_invictvs> You can iterate a collection but the collection may change during iteration and you may not see the change in the course of hte iteration...
[22:11:29] <ernimril> ~jvm options
[22:11:29] <javabot> ernimril, jvm options is http://blogs.sun.com/roller/resources/watt/jvm-options-list.html
[22:11:44] <svm_invictvs> SO if you have a list with a, b, c your iterator could point to b and right after you get the value for 'b', somebody else could have already erased it.
[22:11:52] <svm_invictvs> So you're left with a stale element.
[22:12:11] <puppy_sa> redeeman - you need to edit a file in JRE's security directory, if I recall
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[22:12:21] <svm_invictvs> The guarantee is only that the behavior is well defined and your program is still in a defined state.
[22:12:27] <redeeman> puppy_sa: no way i can do it with code?
[22:12:36] <svm_invictvs> In other words, it won't crash.  But that doesn't mean it's the behavior that's intended.l
[22:12:42] <mikejet> r0bby, wtf?
[22:12:47] <Eyvind> svm_invictvs: Yes yes yes, I understand that.
[22:13:25] <Eyvind> And I agree that some of the (3) collections have clear guaranteees, but I can't find all of them
[22:13:26] <puppy_sa> redeeman - I think so, but I just changed it in the JRE
[22:13:39] <svm_invictvs> read the javadoc, carefully
[22:13:58] <Eyvind> svm_invictvs: Trust me, I am
[22:14:59] <Eyvind> svm_invictvs: For ConcurrentSkipListMap the closest thing to what I am looking for is: "Insertion, removal, update, and access operations safely execute concurrently by multiple threads."
[22:15:17] <Eyvind> That's not specific enough.
[22:15:28] <svm_invictvs> and
[22:15:29] <puppy_sa> what do you want, then?
[22:15:38] <svm_invictvs> So yeah, what do you want it to do?
[22:15:54] <svm_invictvs> Make Julian Fries, as well?
[22:15:56] <Eyvind> More specific guarantees, of course
[22:16:01] <ernimril> redeeman: can you not just check the Cipher.provider?
[22:16:13] <svm_invictvs> Eyvind: no, that's it.  That's all you get.
[22:16:14] <redeeman> ernimril: yeah i think i found way now, im trying
[22:16:37] <Eyvind> svm_invictvs: Bah! I guess I'm back to writing my own for the foreseeable future
[22:16:38] <ernimril> redeeman: the getCipher takes a Provider, that ought to give you the "right" version
[22:16:48] <svm_invictvs> Eyvind: What do you want it to do?
[22:17:18] <Eyvind> I don't really care what it does, as long as it can make specific guarantees about thread safety
[22:17:27] <Eyvind> "safely execute" can mean oh so many things
[22:18:09] <Eyvind> I mean, of course I care what it does, but I first need to know what it can guarantee
[22:18:28] <redeeman> ernimril: thanks
[22:18:31] <svm_invictvs> It means the map will be in a well-defined state if one or more threads try to insert, remove, or update elements.
[22:18:49] <svm_invictvs> That the map's internal data structure will not fail.
[22:19:19] <ernimril> redeeman: why do you really care? is this other crypto better than the sun one? or are you trying to benchmark them?
[22:19:54] <puppy_sa> ernimril - probably need a stronger cipher
[22:20:01] <redeeman> ernimril: just trying stuff out, right now im having a padding problem it seems
[22:20:12] <redeeman> also that yes
[22:20:24] <ernimril> puppy_sa: stronger? what does sun not provide?
[22:20:38] <redeeman> you need to download an extra file for sun to support 256bit AES
[22:20:47] <puppy_sa> there you go
[22:20:49] <redeeman> which must be installed into the JRE
[22:21:25] <Eyvind> svm_invictvs: Okay, that is a good guarantee. Doesn't help me though. Thank you, though!
[22:21:25] <Eyvind> ~svm_invictvs++
[22:21:27] <javabot> svm_invictvs has a karma level of 29, Eyvind
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[22:26:00] <mikejet> Crypto padding is funny. Its amazing how many bugs that causes.
[22:26:27] <puppy_sa> you can use streaming cipher/mode
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[22:26:37] <puppy_sa> or he can
[22:27:48] <svm_invictvs> crypto padding?
[22:28:06] <puppy_sa> padding a buffer to fit the block size
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[22:28:24] <puppy_sa> if block-mode/cipher is used
[22:30:36] <redeeman> puppy_sa: do you have some link for examples or something?
[22:30:52] <puppy_sa> redeeman - to do what?
[22:30:58] <redeeman> use streaming mode
[22:31:14] <redeeman> im guessing that's something that will allow me to have padding done automatically?
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[22:32:04] <puppy_sa> streaming mode means that the size of the incoming buffer is the same as the outgoing one
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[22:32:27] <puppy_sa> or rather, the result buffer
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[22:39:44] <genesiss> ~threads
[22:39:45] <javabot> genesiss, threads is http://java.sun.com/tutorial/essential/threads
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[22:44:55] <mikejet> Anyone here try running the blu-ray Java VM? What's new with that?
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[22:47:16] <chuck> Does anyone have any ideas on why eclipse is failing to "resolve" java.util.ArrayList and Instance?
[22:47:31] <cheeser> because you're a newbie
[22:47:42] <cheeser> ~newbie ide
[22:47:42] <javabot> Newbies shouldn't start with IDEs.  It's important to learn the environment and fundamentals of a language before offloading those to an IDE.  Learn about packages and imports and classpaths.  Learn how to compile and use the JDK tools.  Get some basic grasp of the API layout.  Learn how to do things then switch to an IDE to do them faster.  See http://tinyurl.com/yvks48 and and http://tinyurl.com/2cpn6o for more info.
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[22:50:40] <r0bby> cheeser: does this happen outside of eclipse?
[22:50:44] <r0bby> er chuck
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[22:50:59] <r0bby> hint: it shouldn't
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[22:51:50] <chuck> r0bby, when I run the ant build scripts, it does, but when i do javac ICRDemo.java, I don't see any errors about the problems I was having with it
[22:54:17] <chuck> Are there any alternatives to ArrayList? I've concluded that eclipse is doing this because the smartpen doesn't have ArrayList or Iterator so it won't let me compile stuff that imports them on my computer
[22:54:44] <r0bby> wait, you're not doing this on a standard JDK?
[22:54:49] <r0bby> (ie Java SE?)
[22:55:01] <waz> haaha
[22:55:11] <rudenstam> sounds like j2me
[22:55:22] <rudenstam> or something similar
[22:55:29] <r0bby> chuck: java ME is stripped down to the bare minimum.
[22:55:30] <waz> you've concluded that Eclipse is failing to do a simple task
[22:55:36] <chuck> r0bby, I'm using an SDK for this smartpen
[22:55:51] <r0bby> chuck: dude you think this information would have been helpful?
[22:55:59] <paulweb515_> waz: no, he's concluded that eclipse is correctly not compiling something that doesn't exist in j2me
[22:56:00] <chuck> >< sorry
[22:56:09] <chuck> paulweb515_, yes
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[22:56:36] <r0bby> chuck: ever consider i don't know...looking at the javadocs to see if that class exists? perhaps looking for an alternative?
[22:56:41] <rubeus80> hi
[22:57:07] <paulweb515_> chuck: when you expanded java.util was Vector there?
[22:57:14] <chuck> paulweb515_, yes
[22:57:18] <chuck> Vector and VectorEnumerator
[22:57:22] <r0bby> so use Vector.
[22:57:42] <r0bby> (Java ME is insanely stripped since it's running in such a small space.
[22:57:48] <paulweb515_> AraryList is the better option, but not  available in CLDC1.0 or Foundation 1.0 ...
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[22:58:58] <rubeus80> i have a problem with an application...i present to the user a html form in a jtextpane..the problem is that reading the content of the pane after the user has introduced the data in the form shows me nothing...i have the html but not the value of the inputs...how could i do to read it?
[23:00:05] <rubeus80> i wouldn't like to use a web server to get the form
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[23:02:19] <rubeus80> is there any listener i could use to listen to the submit button and capture the data? or another solution
[23:02:29] <paulweb515_> And I was wrong about that ... Foundation 1.0 does include ArrayList, just not CLDC 1.0
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[23:06:41] <chuck> i'm sooo close
[23:06:58] <chuck> is there something wrong with this code? (mainly, the fullText parts): http://pastie.org/350220
[23:07:10] <chuck> eclipse says this: The local variable fullText may not have been initialized
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[23:08:11] <cheeser> so initialize the variable.
[23:08:13] <cheeser> duh
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[23:08:46] <chuck> =( how
[23:08:49] <CodeWar> someObject.method( stringVar = new String("this is the input string" )); // this is legal but not ..
[23:08:59] <CodeWar> someObject.method( String stringVar = new String("this is the input string" ));
[23:08:59] <cheeser> give it a value
[23:09:11] <cheeser> ~smack CodeWar
[23:09:11] * javabot smacks CodeWar in the mouth
[23:09:55] <r0bby> String foo = "foo";
[23:10:07] <r0bby> ~~chuck rbi
[23:10:07] <javabot> chuck, reallybigindex is http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/reallybigindex.html
[23:10:14] <CodeWar> r0bby,  sure but I wanted to use the new to highlight a different point
[23:10:29] <cheeser> i can't imaging what point that'd be
[23:10:42] <r0bby> or how it's relevent.
[23:11:17] <CodeWar> that a variable cannot be declared in the method invocation list but can be done so when using for ./ while
[23:11:45] <cheeser> funny.  it's much clearer when you just say that rather than writing that code snippet
[23:11:59] <CodeWar> isnt that why somebody smacked me:)
[23:12:17] <r0bby> chuck: and it's not eclipse that's saying that, it's the compiler. Quit using eclipse and start using a text editor until you realize that.
[23:12:25] * r0bby spanks CodeWar
[23:13:00] * CodeWar slits r0bby's wrists lets him bleed for a while
[23:13:27] <cheeser> i smacked you for writing new String("foo")
[23:13:46] <chuck> r0bby, yeah, I'm going to actually learn java without eclipse after this :P
[23:13:52] <CodeWar> how generous
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[23:14:37] <r0bby> chuck: do it now
[23:14:45] <cheeser> "do it, doug!"
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[23:14:53] <r0bby> DO IT DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO IT
[23:14:54] <chuck> r0bby, well after this *is* now, I think my penlet will finally work this time
[23:15:13] <r0bby> sounds funnier when it's spoken
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[23:17:33] <CodeWar> something more => SomeClass a = null;  method(a = new SomeClass(12));  now the compiler says SomeClass a is never used locally
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[23:18:26] <mikejet> Bob Eubanks is so gay.
[23:18:48] * cheeser eyes mikejet
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[23:26:04] <r0bby> mikejet: favor: don't do that. It's incredibly immature.
[23:26:59] <r0bby> and big fucking deal if he is.
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[23:33:46] <genesiss> how can i past formated (and colored) java code to word?
[23:33:55] <cheeser> ~pastebin
[23:33:55] <javabot> http://pastebin.stonekeep.com  Paste the final url after you've pasted your stuff there.
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[23:34:10] <cheeser> ~topicsmite genesiss
[23:34:11] <javabot> And the wrath of /TOPIC descended with terrible fury upon genesiss.  And all the people marvelled, saying, Behold, we too should read the /TOPIC, lest we be stricken.  And all the people read the /TOPIC, and went away edified.
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[23:35:59] <genesiss> cheeser, how can pastebin help me there?
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[23:37:38] <r0bby> genesiss: google didn't help?
[23:37:55] <genesiss> no
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[23:38:05] <ilyak> Wiw
[23:38:10] <r0bby> what format do you want?
[23:38:12] <r0bby> indented?
[23:38:14] <ilyak> my java've crashed
[23:38:17] <ilyak> under hprof
[23:38:54] <genesiss> r0bby, yes
[23:39:14] <r0bby> http://www.javakb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/java-setup/1921/format-java-source-code-in-M-Word
[23:39:19] <r0bby> found via google.
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[23:43:03] <genesiss> tnx r0bby
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[23:56:22] <Goundy> is there something I could use like that: bool result = evaluate("1>10"); ?
[23:56:37] <pstickne> no.
[23:56:50] <pstickne> although I am sure there are plenty of libraries out there
[23:57:00] <ilyak> Goundy: There is
[23:57:03] <pstickne> (to parse/do math/eval/etc.)
[23:57:05] <Goundy> ah
[23:57:07] <pstickne> ilyak:  standard?
[23:57:09] <ilyak> Read on javax.script
[23:57:13] <ilyak> pstickne: sure
[23:57:16] <pstickne> ilyak:  crazy
[23:57:19] <Goundy> ah
[23:57:19] * pstickne goes to look
[23:57:28] <Goundy> could Java really make coffee ? damn
[23:57:29] <ilyak> ~tell Goundy about javax.script
[23:57:29] <javabot> Goundy, I have no idea what javax.script is.
[23:57:39] <Goundy> ^^
[23:57:47] <ilyak> http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/api/javax/script/package-summary.html
[23:58:17] <ilyak> http://javacook.darwinsys.com/new_recipes/26callingall.jsp
[23:58:34] <pstickne> ilyak:  eww
[23:58:45] <ilyak> pstickne: what?
[23:59:03] <pstickne> ilyak:  nvm.
[23:59:18] <ilyak> there's an example at the second link, just replace print with 1>10 there
[23:59:24] <ilyak> and you've got your engine.eval()
[23:59:32] <ilyak> I guess
[23:59:35] <pstickne> ilyak:  I'm just thinking of all the ways Java tries to extend itself by swinging around JSRs like a mace.
[23:59:44] <Goundy> thanks o

   January 1, 2009  
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