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[09:29:19] <jimklimov> Hi all, got a tricky question: do you know of a modern HP laptop (corporate must be HP) compatible with illumos (OpenIndiana preferably - primarily the video, storage, usb and net devices), extensible with lots of installable RAM and HDD/M2's? And preferably with pass-through possible for the WiFi device into a Windows/Linux/etc. guest VM?
[09:29:42] <jimklimov> My work horse would likely be replaced in half a year, so I'm now researching the market
[09:29:51] <jimklimov> Hope for a native barebone OI setup this time ;)
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[10:29:07] <toasterson> wifi will be the tough nut. Unless you are porting a driver from Freebsd
[10:32:39] <leoric> and port wpa_supplicant...
[10:32:50] <toasterson> other things will depend on CPU generation (last not always imediatly supported) and graphics should be nvidia only or intel only. in case of intel nvidia combo only the intel one will work.
[10:33:11] <toasterson> leoric our network commands support WPA AFAIK
[10:33:17] <toasterson> why wpa_supplicant?
[10:35:49] <leoric> because of WPA2 Enterprise
[10:36:03] <leoric> PEAP/MSCHAPv2
[10:36:21] <leoric> specifically
[10:37:08] <toasterson> ah. Well If you need that you probably cant choose illumos anyway due to corpaorate :)
[10:39:40] <leoric> there were some attempts to do in at 2012 GSoC, but they failed, and existing work https://bitbucket.org/enricop/illumos-gate/wiki/Home seems to be non-usable
[10:52:56] <jimklimov> hm... the WPA personal (as in home routers, caffee and conference hotspots) should be OK by now?
[10:54:35] <jimklimov> as for nvidia+intel combo, have that on my current model and while great under windows (having up to 4 1080p displays IIRC from testing the limits, 3 in daily work) and very performant in gaming under windows, it is a full no-go in native OI... never got it to run beyond a black screen in graphic mode, with apparently invisible greeter windows starting (per X11 log)
[10:54:57] <jimklimov> neither intel, nvidia nor vesa drivers of all sorts I've seen got me a real visible GUI
[10:55:53] <jimklimov> by "WPA Personal" I meant WPA2-PSK - should this work in OI out of the box?
[10:56:33] <jimklimov> as for corporate... here it is mixed
[10:56:59] <jimklimov> we are allowed whatever we want in the dev/lab network because we are strange foss/embedded/... platforms people
[10:58:39] <jimklimov> and for corporate, we may be either on native windows, or with a windows vm and a passed-through dedicated NIC (usually USB dongle)
[11:05:49] <leoric> jimklimov: WPA2-PSK should work
[11:10:17] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10386 pbchk should catch capitalised "illumos" -- Andy Fiddaman <omnios at citrus-it dot co.uk>
[11:10:18] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10462 nightly errors - libmakestate.so.1: open failed -- Andy Fiddaman <omnios at citrus-it dot co.uk>
[11:11:21] <jimklimov> nice to know, thanks
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[11:33:19] <jeffpc> leoric: I thought wpa2 was completely unsupported; wpa-psk works
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[11:40:49] <leoric> jeffpc: don't remember
[11:41:24] <jeffpc> it's been a while since I tried wpa2; but last time I tried, it just didn't work
[11:41:42] <jeffpc> == failed to associate because it doesn't know how to properly mangle the keys, etc.
[11:50:36] <Woodstock> i got it to work in late 2014, but it was far from a state that could be integrated
[11:51:34] <Woodstock> haven't looked at it since due to lack of time, and since we seem to lack drivers for modern hardware anyway i didn't really consider it a priority
[11:59:11] <tsoome> I guess the only way is to get the hw and start writing missing ones:)
[12:04:32] <jimklimov> might help get devs and users onboard our community too
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[12:46:09] <sjorge> AFAIK wpa2 is indeed not working, but most home routers do wpa2+wpa and and silently fallback
[12:46:14] <sjorge> Which sucks
[12:46:18] <sjorge> iMHO
[12:48:00] <jimklimov> ours has explicit settings, and I had an additional WEP network on it, for my older laptop that did have native OI, a few years ago
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[13:06:12] <Woodstock> if y'all keep complaining i may end up picking it up again, but first i want to fix hdmi audio output :->
[13:06:22] <Woodstock> because thats something i actually need
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[13:10:15] * toasterson complains to woodstock to implement awesome things that could drive real world usage of Illumos
[13:18:14] * jimklimov complains to woodstock because he is a coolhacka :)
[13:18:55] * jimklimov wants to run illumos on baremetal laptop as the really usable workhorse
[13:19:36] <jimklimov> I guess then tehre would also be a matter of having laptop sleep (and wakeup) working... but better small steps at a time than no steps at all ;)
[13:20:08] <jimklimov> in other news, what is the NVMe support state nowadays?
[13:20:26] <jimklimov> I saw quite a few affordably-looking M2 NVMe prodcuts in
[13:20:28] <toasterson> Works for me
[13:20:31] <jimklimov> local shops
[13:20:38] <toasterson> out of the box btw
[13:21:06] <jimklimov> I first had the impression that M2 is SATA, at least these sticks are marketed as a replacement for your old SSD
[13:21:52] <jimklimov> but from finer print in the specs it seems the connector (in modern boards at least) allows SATA or PCIe cards to be plugged in; some controllers support only one, some both
[13:22:15] <jimklimov> but it seems that M2 "2280" NVMe's are PCIe, not SATA via some onboard emulator
[13:27:51] <toasterson> hmm that reminds me. tsoome: Does loader follow a specific order when checking for nvme drives? i.e look for PCIe NVME first and then SATA or does loader prfer sata? That could be a reason for my slow computer boot.
[13:27:58] <jimklimov> but the shop's specs are often sketchy, so not sure
[13:28:46] <tsoome> loader only does care about the device you are booting from.
[13:29:27] <tsoome> but, we do probe all devices to be able to assemble the boot pool.
[13:29:52] <toasterson> ah so the capabilities of the MB should already have configured the drives to the proper mode?
[13:30:05] <tsoome> yep.
[13:30:17] <toasterson> ah well it was worth a try.
[13:30:43] <tsoome> bios or uefi boot?
[13:30:58] <toasterson> bios. haven't updated to uefi capability yet.
[13:31:27] <tsoome> that may be it then. we only do use INT13.
[13:31:41] <toasterson> ?
[13:31:50] <tsoome> for disk access
[13:32:22] <toasterson> is that easy to change?
[13:32:32] <tsoome> for?
[13:33:10] <toasterson> using another INT or to access the disk.
[13:33:26] <tsoome> there is no other:)
[13:33:51] <tsoome> the alternate would be to write your own driver:)
[13:34:00] <toasterson> Ok I know so little about Hardware in such low level that I am completely lost.
[13:34:09] <toasterson> Ah int23 is a driver then?
[13:34:13] <toasterson> *int13
[13:34:30] <tsoome> int13 is real mode interrupt interface to access the disk:)
[13:35:02] <toasterson> ah and illumos presumably uses another interface then.
[13:35:17] <toasterson> realmode being loader specific
[13:35:31] <tsoome> once you have the kernel, you have your own drivers.
[13:35:38] <tsoome> realmode is bios specific:D
[13:36:45] <toasterson> ah gotcha. Yeah that sounds pretty much like the problem. I assume then that grub had drivers when the machine had linux on it.
[13:37:09] <toasterson> hmm wait grub was also slow. But it did less with the disk. never mind
[13:37:32] <tsoome> your computer starts in 16-bit real mode, with segmented memory and all that stuff from 80’s. we switch to 32-bit protected mode to be able to use memory in a decent way, but all IO has to go trough real mode interrupts, so you do constant dance switching between real and protected mode.
[13:38:35] <tsoome> with uefi the system starts in 64-bit protected mode…
[13:40:16] <toasterson> ah I'll upgrade the machine soon then to test out UEFI.
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[14:19:32] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10468 __ctype_mask[EOF] has been working by accident -- Bryan Cantrill <bryan at joyent dot com>
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[14:26:00] <andyf> Nice - one step closer to gcc7 :)
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[14:28:45] <jlevon> the question being what is really left
[14:29:03] <jlevon> andyf: have you driven a gcc7 illumos through a whole install cycle?
[14:29:11] <andyf> not for a few months
[14:30:08] <ptribble> well, sparc is obviously lagging behind...
[14:31:27] <andyf> I think the OmniOS plan is to start looking at switching to primary gcc7 in June
[14:35:24] <andyf> so I suppose testing in earnest has to start
[14:35:25] <jlevon> ptribble: we can trivially keep gcc 4 for sparc though?
[14:36:44] <ptribble> well, yes, but that means that intel has to keep support for gcc4 too
[14:37:03] <ptribble> which I suspect it will for a while at least in any event
[14:37:05] <andyf> I think that when the switch to gcc7 as primary is made, gcc4 will remain as a shadow
[14:37:48] <jimklimov> what next, clang? :)
[14:38:14] <ptribble> presumably at some point in the future we'll want to move on from gcc4 though
[14:41:16] <jlevon> yeah but I don't see a major reason to rush there
[14:41:26] <andyf> Seems reasonable.. I don't think it will be long before gcc8 becomes a shadow
[14:41:43] <jlevon> so we'll have gcc4,gcc8,smatch shadow? eek.
[14:42:03] <andyf> jlevon - I'm using smatch on some new source I'm importing; it's finding some good stuff.
[14:42:59] <jlevon> good good
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[17:07:47] <jlevon> tsoome: OK so I got the underflow with our loader too...
[17:08:03] <tsoome> thats good:)
[17:08:10] <jlevon> got a prompt this time
[17:08:15] <jlevon> what command did you want
[17:08:39] <tsoome> efi-show -g global -v ConIn
[17:08:50] <tsoome> efi-show -g global -v ConInDev
[17:09:01] <jlevon> I meant for the underflow, sorry
[17:09:06] <jlevon> I don't have your patches in yet
[17:09:37] <tsoome> is the stack empty? .s
[17:09:54] <jlevon> ok .s
[17:09:54] <jlevon> [data stack has 0 entries, top at 0x00000000b9fda7c0]
[17:09:54] <jlevon> [data stack base at 0x00000000b9fda7c8]
[17:09:55] <jlevon> yup
[17:10:21] <tsoome> so, either it was empty already or it was emptied on error
[17:10:53] <jlevon> menu takes me straight back to underflow again
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[17:11:27] <tsoome> just to check - what is dictionary sie?
[17:11:43] <tsoome> words will show it
[17:11:55] <tsoome> but i do not think thats the issue there
[17:12:03] <jlevon> Dictionary: 710 words, 25209 cells used of 30000 total
[17:12:05] <jlevon> no
[17:12:19] <tsoome> just have to walk throu the changes in code.
[17:12:37] <jlevon> yeah. this is a bit of a mixed bag of old menu bits with the new loader
[17:12:49] <jlevon> can't quite see how that would matter but first thing to do is to update everything properly I tihnk
[17:13:40] <tsoome> if you have efi loader prompt, the efi-show will work too
[17:15:17] <tsoome> but I’m just interested to see if that system will list the serial in ConIn - its supposed to be list of “allowed” devices
[17:15:32] <jlevon> oh even without your patches?
[17:15:36] <tsoome> yes
[17:15:38] <jlevon> one mo
[17:16:32] <tsoome> efi-show does list the variables and values, but the usage info is missing:D
[17:18:17] <jlevon> https://paste.ec/paste/O3zNFh98#C7pimYO7aOnDHYnw9OqBudcMuWZhahU2qZMReyuz1Ot
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[17:19:11] <tsoome> aha.
[17:19:52] <tsoome> input from usb keyboard and serial indeed
[17:19:53] <jlevon> https://paste.ec/paste/p2kgWx7k#Vt2rpaBuKOnHBW0rxl6pd91lvEtW6GBr9j+HD63mqmQ
[17:21:01] <tsoome> yep, and output is on VGA and serial
[17:21:20] <tsoome> AcpiAdr is for VGA display
[17:22:48] <jlevon> malloc()ing the relocator doesn't go well ...
[17:22:52] <jlevon> the kernel boots but
[17:22:58] <jlevon> panic[cpu0]/thread=fffffffffbc470a0: lock_set_spl: fffffe00b7f16181 lock held and only one CPU
[17:23:58] <tsoome> that is one very familiar error
[17:24:37] <jlevon> it is?
[17:25:37] <tsoome> Im trying to remember…
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[17:26:53] <tsoome> where this system does store acpi nvram area? efi memory map should list it
[17:28:28] <tsoome> I think it was related to acpi data structures being lost (trashed)
[17:29:22] <jlevon> ACPIMemoryNVS 0000bea77000 000000000000 00000005 UC WC WT WB
[17:31:33] <jlevon> relocator was at 0xba018fb0-0xba01dfb0
[17:34:12] <tsoome> did the kernel got acpi table?
[17:34:28] <jlevon> hold on I have the verbose boot
[17:35:43] <tsoome> it is also possible, perhaps the relocator still did bust itself — the original location was before the kernel..
[17:36:09] <jlevon> https://paste.ec/paste/6VzF0WAx#03G45GUCH6vHi73AhGzvCOnXXJO92ttBz2ZT7DevAzM
[17:36:25] <jlevon> well for some reason my printf of the kernel range didn't appear
[17:36:32] <jlevon> but even so I think the loaderdata region is too high?
[17:40:34] <tsoome> copying 1543270 bytes from ELF offset 0x1a000 to physaddr 0x16800000 (va=0xfb800000)
[17:40:35] <tsoome> copying 143280 bytes from ELF offset 0x193000 to physaddr 0x16c00000 (va=0xfbc00000)
[17:40:36] <tsoome> zeroing BSS 531712 bytes from physaddr 0x16c22fb0 (end=0x16ca4cb0)
[17:40:50] <tsoome> thats the final place for kernel
[17:41:34] <tsoome> Thats the copy operation I do not particulary like:)
[17:41:57] <jlevon> we put all that effort in copything things down low...
[17:42:30] <jlevon> https://paste.ec/paste/4smvuM7Z#qM-VvzgYWGieLbPMWnywQ6I83LuNPzLd8cL0j54tbwU
[17:42:33] <jlevon> that's the whole memmap
[17:46:25] <tsoome> well, that copy in dboot is done to avoid to head crash to dboot code if we would use 0x800000, 0xc00000 + bss
[17:50:18] <tsoome> um.
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[17:54:20] <jlevon> um?
[17:54:58] <tsoome> we have BootServicesData from 000000100000 - 000004000000
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[17:55:12] <tsoome> the 3f00 pages
[17:56:10] <jlevon> sure
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[17:56:47] <tsoome> and we do copy the kernel to 0xc00000 - sizeof elf header
[17:57:00] <jlevon> yes...
[17:57:09] <jlevon> but only after exiting BS no?
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[17:57:43] <tsoome> yes. but if boot services data still has something ...
[17:58:11] <jlevon> you mean junk instead of zeroes?
[18:00:51] <tsoome> I have seen some hints that even as the BS memory should be safe to re-use, in some cases it actually may be used by some important data
[18:01:07] <tsoome> but its big “may”.
[18:01:37] <jlevon> oh I see what you mean
[18:01:44] <jlevon> an EFI version of RICHMOND-16
[18:01:49] <jlevon> or similar
[18:03:28] <jbk> i'm sure firmware would never do something it's not supposed to
[18:03:29] <jbk> <_<
[18:03:31] <jbk> >_>
[18:03:57] <tsoome> yep. I was thinking - can you try to shift kernel outside this area?
[18:04:26] <jlevon> set a different load address in the kernel build you mean?
[18:04:28] <tsoome> I have no idea how much dboot depends on the location
[18:04:37] <jlevon> me neither offhand
[18:05:47] <tsoome> we do pick the address from elf header of kernel, so we could just add the offset there
[18:06:59] <jlevon> I can try experimenting
[18:07:34] <tsoome> I mean, if we do not trash this area, and the error is gone, then it is clear…
[18:07:48] <jlevon> yeah
[18:08:06] <jlevon> but then we could just have the same problem elsewhere
[18:08:51] <tsoome> yep, thats why the fixed address setup is not playing well with uefi.
[18:11:12] <tsoome> but certainly is a bit nasty surprise to see memory layout like this…
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[18:30:33] <jlevon> booted fine on another machine BTW
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[18:41:16] <kkantor1> LeftWing: re: additional authors on illumos commits. What do you think about using 'Authored by:' lines instead of 'Portions contributed by:' ?
[18:46:06] *** kkantor1 is now known as kkantor
[18:47:01] <jlevon> kkantor: that makes it sound like it's all by that person then?
[18:47:41] <richlowe> in which case, 'git commit --author'
[18:48:09] <jlevon> exactly
[18:49:13] <kkantor> Right. If it's just one author they should definitely be the git commit author. It feels weird to me that we would assign one person as the commit author and attribute other authors in the commit message itself.
[18:49:38] <kkantor> I'm fine with 'portions contributed by,' it just seems wordy to me.
[18:50:15] <kkantor> And I don't really know who I would choose for the actual commit author in some cases.
[18:51:02] <jlevon> I guess you'd always want at least two Authored by: if you used it then?
[18:51:10] <jlevon> is that what everybody else uses?
[18:51:11] <kkantor> That's what I'm saying, yeah
[18:51:38] <kkantor> I don't know if that's what everyone uses. I was looking it up a few days ago. GitHub itself has some integration with 'Authored-by' in commit messages.
[18:52:08] <jlevon> github seems to have support for Co-authored-by:
[18:52:38] <kkantor> ah, yes that's what I was referring to. Sorry.
[18:52:42] <richlowe> is there a reason to worry about this, beyond it seeming a bit odd?
[18:53:17] <kkantor> Worry about multiple authors, or the actual verbiage?
[18:53:48] <richlowe> the actual wording :)
[18:53:53] <jlevon> well regardless you have my +1 for the standard version, though I don't know much weight that has :)
[18:54:04] <richlowe> I mean, if there's more than one other, they _did_ only contribute portions :)
[18:56:46] <kkantor> Yeah, I'm thinking of the case where two (or more) people contributed a significant amount to a change - which name do I use as the commit author, and which goes in the message? The attribution verbiage in the message doesn't matter a ton to me. I thought 'authored by' sounds more like what we already use (reviewed|approved by)
[18:57:40] <kkantor> This is probably bike shedding and I should just stop talking haha
[18:58:03] <kkantor> It's just that we're going to have a lot of these multiple-author commits coming up from ZoL ports, so I thought we should think about it now.
[18:59:40] <richlowe> I think we do Portions ...: because that's what opensolaris did, if there's something _everyone else_ does, we should do that instead.
[18:59:58] <richlowe> update pbchk to accept it/check it's right and such.
[19:00:55] <kkantor> okay, sounds good to me.
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[19:41:27] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10473 zfs(1M) missing cross-reference to zfs-program(1M) -- Jason King <jason.king at joyent dot com>
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[19:54:37] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10456 libstand: arp.c cstyle cleanup -- Toomas Soome <tsoome at me dot com>
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[20:11:06] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10458 libstand: assert.c cstyle cleanup -- Toomas Soome <tsoome at me dot com>
[20:14:00] <LeftWing> kkantor: I'm trying to reduce the proliferation of new line styles we have, and we've used the Portions version several times in the last thousand commits.
[20:16:59] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10460 loader: tem.c cstyle cleanup -- Toomas Soome <tsoome at me dot com>
[20:18:05] <andyf> ZFS commits come in with hyphens too.. Reviewed-by etc.
[20:18:20] <andyf> at least the ones that are merged into illumos (I assume their RTI bot does it that way)
[20:21:22] <richlowe> I think pbchk allows either.
[20:21:46] <richlowe> LeftWing: I'd say there being popular tooling expecting an alternative speaks in its favour.
[20:22:02] <richlowe> but I'm on a roll of being wrong about stuff :)
[20:22:23] <LeftWing> Hyphens are for suckers!
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[20:24:49] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10464 loader: biosdisk.c cstyle cleanup -- Toomas Soome <tsoome at me dot com>
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[20:30:16] <richlowe> LeftWing: more like Hy-_fun_
[20:30:32] * LeftWing twitches
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[20:40:49] <alanc> btw, for those trying to keep sun4v alive, you might find https://web.archive.org/web/20170410000828/http://kenai.com/projects/hypervisor/pages/ReferenceMaterials helpful
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[20:47:33] <kkantor> LeftWing: sure, that sounds good. I wasn't aware that we had actually used the Portions line before.
[20:53:50] <igork> alanc: thanks
[20:57:46] <tsoome> alanc: thats nice collection
[20:58:32] <alanc> unfortunately many of the links are useless, but hopefully you can find the old cases in the internet archive or joyent's arc mirror
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[21:19:31] <richlowe> I may have some of the "Please stop shouting at us OpenBSD" pdf collection somewhere.
[21:22:47] <richlowe> remember when your greatest evil was not describing schizo in public?
[21:32:10] <richlowe> xlate64.c:4581:3: error: suggest parentheses around '+' inside '<<' [-Werror=parentheses]
[21:32:10] <richlowe> *dst = (((((((((((Elf64_Xword)(src)[X_M7]<<8)
[21:32:15] <richlowe> you're just taking the piss, now.
[21:32:34] <jlevon> holy parentheses
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[21:38:30] <jbk> <lisp user> what?
[21:50:38] <tsoome> scheme users are now offended:P
[22:01:11] <gitomat> [illumos-gate] 10459 libstand: stand.h cstyle cleanup -- Toomas Soome <tsoome at me dot com>
[22:05:43] <melloc> https://github.com/illumos/illumos-gate/blob/master/usr/src/cmd/sgs/libelf/common/getarsym.c#L86 seems to be the longest run of "(" in the gate
[22:06:24] <tsoome> it is time to add LP128
[22:07:41] <melloc> The longest run of ")" beats "(": https://github.com/joyent/illumos-joyent/blob/master/usr/src/lib/libshell/common/sh/streval.c#L107
[22:08:23] <jbk> jeesh
[22:10:18] <jbk> ksh... keeping the EBCDIC dream alive apparently
[22:18:23] <alanc> writing a shell must do some weird sort of brain damage: https://minnie.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=V7/usr/src/cmd/sh/mac.h
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[22:58:07] <LeftWing> alanc: Bournegol forever apparently
[23:03:54] <richlowe> LeftWing: is your jenkinsing making progress?
[23:05:52] <richlowe> pmooney: I dunno how to argue in gerrit, so: "No it wasn't?"
[23:06:08] <pmooney> wasn't, but is now?
[23:06:27] <pmooney> maybe I'm misreading
[23:07:27] <LeftWing> richlowe: Some! Will spend some more time this weekend. I think I can create a job which will accept and build a patch file
[23:07:35] <LeftWing> As a first step
[23:17:01] <richlowe> LeftWing: having it run tests (post-integration) would be nice, too
[23:17:56] <LeftWing> Once we have it all automated, it seems reasonable to run them _prior_ to integration
[23:18:22] <LeftWing> The test running is more complicated than the builds though so I'm getting that going first
[23:18:41] <richlowe> arekinath: were you running syzkaller, previously?
[23:18:48] <richlowe> arekinath: if not, you should totally port the native part and do so :)
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[23:19:16] <arekinath> nah, I was running a blind fuzzer, not coverage-guided
[23:19:35] <arekinath> getting coverage on illumos seemed like a lot of work at the time
[23:19:36] <richlowe> the freebsd port seems to do... something, other than have a real kcov implementation.
[23:19:46] <arekinath> we can build with clang now though right?
[23:19:50] <LeftWing> Nuh
[23:19:55] <LeftWing> One day
[23:20:46] <arekinath> the qemu coverage guiding stuff without compiler support was way too slow to be practically useful for a full OS kernel at the time I started doing it
[23:21:13] <arekinath> has syzkaller managed to change that? I can't seem to find on their site what you actually need to do
[23:21:59] <arekinath> ah it looks like it relies on kcov
[23:22:03] <LeftWing> Yes
[23:22:09] <arekinath> without that it's probably pretty shitty
[23:22:18] <LeftWing> Well without that I don't think it works
[23:22:58] <arekinath> it does, see the freebsd thing like richlowe said above
[23:23:13] <arekinath> but it's probably just a slower worse version of a random permutation fuzzer at that point
[23:23:21] <arekinath> and you have to teach the go code how to make all our syscalls :P
[23:23:27] <arekinath> and ioctls and shiz
[23:23:36] <richlowe> it looked like those files were generated.
[23:23:47] <arekinath> freebsd Missing things:
[23:23:47] <arekinath> > System call descriptions. sys/freebsd/*.txt is a dirty copy from sys/linux/*.txt with everything that does not compile dropped. We need to go through syscalls and verify/fix/extend them, including devices/ioctls/etc.
[23:23:55] <arekinath> (from their site)
[23:24:05] <toasterson> ours are in x/sys/unix
[23:24:18] <arekinath> you have to teach these fuzzers all about the syscalls, devices, ioctls, crazy things we can do
[23:24:23] <arekinath> or else they can't try to use them
[23:24:25] <richlowe> oh, huh, their documentation says they use a kcov fallback on freebsd
[23:24:29] <richlowe> but they actually don't, and use kcov
[23:24:36] <richlowe> so presumably somewhere in the history is the fallback
[23:24:48] <richlowe> but I haven't had overmuch success understanding their documentation
[23:25:33] <toasterson> arekinath yes but go has a perl script to generate go code with the bindings. Yes I know how that sounds :)
[23:25:55] <arekinath> this isn't really about go, the code for the fuzzer itself needs to know about all this shiz
[23:26:28] <toasterson> ah. I see. unfortunate then.
[23:26:42] <arekinath> anyway, I'd be more tempted to go do the work I never got around to in Trinity
[23:26:48] <arekinath> and teach it about more of our devices and stuff
[23:27:11] <arekinath> our syscall surface isn't actually as big because we hide a lot of stuff in devices and ioctls
[23:27:12] <richlowe> seems like even a basic pass over standard stuff would be good
[23:29:04] <arekinath> sure, definitely don't let me being a grouch stop you from doing work on syzkaller ;)
[23:29:57] <arekinath> lotta goog pz folks got sticks up their arses though, something something separate art and artist idk
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   March 1, 2019  
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