August 31, 2012 
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August 31, 2012 [00:03:46] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[00:08:22] *** Blub\w has quit IRC[00:10:56] *** alexandros_c has quit IRC[00:13:42] *** jayrulez has joined #haiku[00:15:11] *** alexandros_c has joined #haiku[00:16:14] *** Luko has quit IRC[00:19:56] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[00:24:50] *** Negr0_VoP2P has quit IRC[00:28:05] *** vezhlys has quit IRC[00:29:52] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX http://tsyesika.co.uk/u/Vision-colours.png <-- check it out :D[00:30:07] * Tsyesika is proud[00:30:54] * DaaT claps[00:31:02] <Tsyesika> ^.^[00:31:17] <DaaT> :)[00:31:24] <DaaT> looks nice[00:31:49] <Tsyesika> i need to pick a colour for voiced users too[00:33:04] <DaaT> hmmmmmmmmm[00:34:02] <DaaT> brown? pink? blinding yellow?[00:34:19] <Tsyesika> can't do yellow you can't make it out[00:34:25] <Tsyesika> half-ops use to be yellow[00:35:05] <Tsyesika> brown it is[00:35:08] <DaaT> ah[00:35:14] <DaaT> woot \o/[00:39:33] <Tsyesika> ugh no not brown :P it looks crap[00:40:44] <Skipp_OSX> looks good, I don't need to bikeshed the color choices[00:41:08] <Tsyesika> bikeshed? i'm not familiar with that term in that context[00:41:14] <Skipp_OSX> what is the significance of ~ & % and @ ?[00:41:14] <Tsyesika> and i noticed half-ops get ordered wrongly[00:41:27] <Skipp_OSX> Tsyesika, bike shedding means arguing over trivial details[00:41:34] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX ~ is founder, & is a protected op, @ is an op, + is half-op[00:41:44] <Skipp_OSX> okay great[00:43:15] <Tsyesika> right i guess i should update my previous patch to sort out half ops :P[00:47:13] *** DaaT has quit IRC[00:55:32] *** Sikosis has joined #haiku[00:55:32] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Sikosis[00:57:41] *** Xgates has joined #haiku[00:57:44] <Xgates> hi guys[00:57:58] <Tsyesika> hey[00:58:39] <Xgates> by chance anyone running Haiku3 in virtualbox? Because when I try to run; VBoxManage setextradata "Haiku" "CustomVideoMode1" "1366x768x24" it doesn't show up in screen and I assumed since that's my native resolution it should...[00:59:12] <Xgates> I also tried 16 & 24 bit, no luck either...[00:59:24] <mmadia> Xgates -- you'll be better off trying an r1alpha4 release candidate image : http://www.haiku-files.org/haiku/development/[00:59:55] <mmadia> as you'd be helping to make the next release even better :)[01:00:12] <Xgates> ahh ok only thought 3 was out[01:00:15] * Xgates goes to grab[01:00:41] <mmadia> yeah, the main website doesn't advertise the nightly images as well as it should.[01:01:38] <Xgates> ok cool, so hrev44584 is the latest 4?[01:01:52] <Tsyesika> Xgates highest on the list[01:02:02] <Xgates> ok I'll grab that[01:02:41] <mmadia> no. hrevr1alpha4-44576 is the newest r1alpha4 image.[01:03:15] <Tsyesika> mmadia whats wrong with the latest nightly[01:03:20] <Tsyesika> :P[01:03:51] <mmadia> it's not the release branch, which is preferable to test.[01:03:59] <Tsyesika> ah[01:04:09] <Tsyesika> my bad then[01:04:17] *** Barrett has quit IRC[01:04:39] <Xgates> oh I should be grabbing? --> hrevr1alpha4-44576[01:05:14] <Tsyesika> it seems so, sorry about that Xgates[01:05:18] <Xgates> np[01:05:20] * Xgates grabs that[01:06:16] *** radeschi has quit IRC[01:06:46] <Xgates> When I grabbed 3 yesterday, there was one thing in particular I was looking for, not to have the menus looking like old KDE 1.x so old school with the menus popping out many directories deep...[01:07:01] <Xgates> Unless there's some option in Haiku to change this look/layout?[01:10:11] <OmniMancer> hmm?[01:11:43] *** stpere has quit IRC[01:11:47] *** bjz has quit IRC[01:11:50] <Xgates> if that's a hmm for me, if you've run KDE 1x you know what I mean, Haiku's menu layout looks like BeOS meets KDE[01:12:12] <OmniMancer> explain?[01:12:17] * jstressman is curious as well.[01:12:31] <Xgates> well the have you guys ever used KDE 1x?[01:12:41] <jstressman> not in many years.[01:12:45] <Tsyesika> ^+1[01:13:09] <Xgates> if you have then you know what the KDE menu was like, that's all I mean, layers and layers of folders deep[01:13:25] <Xgates> the KDE 1.x menu would spread across and entire desktop[01:13:47] <mmadia> in what scenario are you exposing that many layers of folders?[01:14:06] <jstressman> BeOS/Haiku people take pride in that kind of menu... if you're referring to navigating to folders when you want to copy or move something.[01:14:25] <jstressman> personally I don't care for it... but you don't have to use it if you don't want to.[01:14:42] <Skipp_OSX> best I could find of KDE 1.x menus: http://www.kde.org/screenshots/images/medium/pollux-2.jpg[01:14:51] <Xgates> not so much the applications, more like the system folders[01:15:17] <Xgates> if you guys remember KDE 1x then you know what I'm talking about[01:15:25] <mmadia> but how are you using the context menu folder navigation, Xgates?[01:15:42] <Skipp_OSX> Xgates, Deskbar has 2 levels of menus[01:15:44] <Xgates> I'm just talking about the default menus after you've installed Haiku[01:15:53] <OmniMancer> if you mean the right click on the desktop giving you the folder layout[01:15:54] <mmadia> like are you using it as the main method for launching applications, instead of Deskbar?[01:16:06] <Xgates> I'll take a screen shot when I get it up and running[01:16:08] <Xgates> give me a few...[01:16:10] <Skipp_OSX> oh, the menus in Tracker...[01:16:25] <helf> hola[01:16:29] <OmniMancer> because those are just an alternative navigation means[01:16:41] <OmniMancer> they are not the intended only way of getting to folders[01:17:50] <Xgates> I guess from what I remember, there are two ways...[01:17:52] <Xgates> one sec...[01:19:29] <Xgates> Oh before I forget if anyone here is developer, the 'Enabled Nested Paging' I had to uncheck for Haiku3, maybe 4 will work with it...[01:21:41] <Xgates> someone should change the installer, stills says 3 ;p[01:21:51] <Xgates> ok install underway...[01:24:31] <Xgates> nope 4 doesn't boot with 'Enabled Nested Paging' enabled[01:24:33] * Xgates unchecks it[01:25:45] <Xgates> Guys does it matter if it's; VBoxManage or vboxmange because there's two...[01:25:55] <Xgates> VBoxManage setextradata "Haiku" "CustomVideoMode1" "1366x768x32"[01:26:03] <Xgates> vboxmange setextradata "Haiku" "CustomVideoMode1" "1366x768x32"[01:26:09] <Xgates> vboxmanage...[01:26:23] *** TimKack has quit IRC[01:31:34] *** bjz has joined #haiku[01:31:45] <Skipp_OSX> ahh the artwork in installer has to be updated[01:31:53] <Skipp_OSX> data/artwork/HAIKU logo - black on white - installer.png[01:32:14] <mmadia> yeah, i was going to do that this weekend.[01:32:34] <Skipp_OSX> mmadia, I assume there is a wonderbrush file you just have to change the 3 to a 4 and add another bug[01:32:35] <mmadia> *commit it. earlier in the week, i started.[01:33:20] <mmadia> and a few other bits. e.g., the website button[01:33:30] <Skipp_OSX> right[01:34:46] <Xgates> hrevr1alpha4-44576 with VB no change, when I - VBoxManage setextradata "Haiku4" "CustomVideoMode1" "1366x768x32" the resolution doesn't show up[01:34:52] * Xgates crys[01:35:58] <Xgates> I'm running VB 4.1.14 OSE on Slackware 13.37 x86 on a Sony Vaio Intel i3 Nvidia 410M vid chip, I would of assumed my native resolution would show up in Haiku...[01:36:32] <Xgates> I can't seem to get much of any rez to work with this...[01:37:26] <mmadia> ... if no one has an answer, asking on http://www.freelists.org/list/haiku should help.[01:40:31] <Xgates> never been one for mailing lists, I'll try the forum thanks[01:40:42] <Xgates> ahh this is what I meant by the menu; http://i.imgur.com/hYhyk.png[01:40:53] <Xgates> just rows and rows that sometimes never seem to end, hehe[01:45:04] <OmniMancer> that is just an alternative folder navigation method, it gets long because filesystems are deep[01:46:46] <Xgates> yes I know KDE used this in the past but ditched it[01:47:03] <Xgates> better off to just leave navigation to a file manager[01:47:37] <rootbaron> I like the right-click navigation. Makes working with files so much faster and easier. :)[01:48:16] <rootbaron> Using a file manager window to click on icon after icon to reach my destination feels so clunky when I can smoothly navigate like that instead.[01:49:19] * dreamed prefers the finder list view / icon view in mac os[01:49:23] <Xgates> well I ask myself it was or is a great idea then why did KDE ditch it[01:49:32] <Xgates> myself if it was...[01:49:52] <dreamed> still not sold on column view[01:50:13] <Xgates> it's not so much about what is easy or prefered by a user, it's the fact that sooner or later newbies get drawn to it, look through and get confused by all the clutter[01:50:56] <Xgates> errr the forum isn't working in FF 14.0.1 in Slack[01:51:57] <Xgates> the words on upper right next to 'Replies' -- http://i.imgur.com/xj42w.png[01:52:14] <Xgates> someone might want to let someone know about the broke forum...[01:52:29] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[01:53:02] *** bjz has quit IRC[01:53:43] <rootbaron> Using KDE as an example of a practical desktop is not something I agree with...[01:54:01] *** bjz has joined #haiku[01:55:51] <Xgates> well to be honest I'm not familiar with any other desktop that does, or did this, do you?[01:57:48] *** bjz has quit IRC[01:58:22] <Tsyesika> Ah![01:58:24] <Tsyesika> http://tsyesika.co.uk/u/Vision-colours.png :D[01:58:30] <Tsyesika> colours, sorting .... all done :D[01:59:09] <Anarchos> Tsyesika i would swap + and % colors[01:59:17] <Tsyesika> you think?[01:59:32] <Anarchos> it seems that % should get more emphasis than + so i would swap[01:59:50] * dreamed still fails to understand why people use gui irc clients[01:59:54] <dreamed> also: colours[01:59:57] <Xgates> ok, if anyone hears anything, please reply?[01:59:59] <Anarchos> and you get red , light blue , yellow colors in order[02:00:10] <Tsyesika> alright cool i can switch that[02:00:16] <Anarchos> Tsyesika which separates more than red, yellow, blue[02:00:33] <Tsyesika> ok[02:03:11] <Tsyesika> Anarchos http://tsyesika.co.uk/u/Vision-colours.png now?[02:04:21] <Anarchos> it seems better to me[02:04:50] <Tsyesika> cool[02:05:02] <jstressman> dreamed: because we use GUIs. if we wanted to still be on the console, we'd travel back in time and not use GUIs.[02:05:20] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[02:05:21] <Tsyesika> okay time to update my binary and upload the patches to the tracket[02:05:43] <jstressman> I have multiple tabs open for my many chats... I want to easily see them and be able to switch with the mouse if I want to, just like I can and usually DO do everything else in my GRAPHICAL user interface.[02:05:54] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[02:06:19] <jstressman> the only time I'd use a text only client is if I were more often away from home and was using screen or something similar to stay connected and attach to remotely.[02:06:54] <jstressman> but since I work from home and am always sitting at my computer, using such a fugly client would be counterproductive and pointless.. :)[02:08:01] <Tsyesika> if anyone wants the latest Vision with my two patches http://tsyesika.co.uk/u/Haiku/[02:09:23] * Anarchos wants to try anything, but after he could get his corrupted partition back[02:09:37] <Anarchos> anyway, time to sleep, it is 02:10 AM here[02:09:38] <Tsyesika> :P[02:09:47] <Anarchos> good night to all of you[02:09:50] <Tsyesika> nightt x[02:10:42] <rootbaron> Xgates: (Late) BeOS did it, I think Enlightenment does it, too.'[02:10:50] <Xgates> hmm 1280x800 & 1400x1050 work, not sure why 1366x768 won't...[02:11:03] <rootbaron> And Tsyesika: Awesome work! You made a poor Vision user happy.[02:11:06] <Xgates> I use to run E, don't recall that in E[02:11:14] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[02:11:18] <rootbaron> Must be a recent development.[02:11:24] <Tsyesika> rootbaron :)[02:11:31] <Tsyesika> what's a recent development? :P[02:11:48] <rootbaron> Directory navigating in Enlightenment desktop, I guess.[02:12:01] <rootbaron> Def. remember it last time I used it in Arch last week.[02:13:32] <Tsyesika> ooo[02:13:35] <rootbaron> But I don't think Haiku should be emulating KDE or GNOME. I view Haiku's desktop as superior. It's light-weight and easy to use. Doesn't get in your way. :)[02:13:39] *** oco2 has quit IRC[02:14:43] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[02:14:52] <jstressman> http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/phreadom/guichat1.jpg[02:16:37] <rootbaron> Why do you have Winamp /and/ VLC running at the same time? :p[02:16:51] <jstressman> why not?[02:16:54] <Xgates> is there a way to make all windows open the same size?[02:16:55] <jstressman> I don't watch videos in winamp.[02:17:13] <Xgates> looks like 1280x1024 is the best I'm going to get out of this[02:17:30] <jstressman> I have many many songs in my winamp playlist, which I keep open at all times. and if I opened anything else in it it would wipe that out.[02:17:43] <jstressman> all videos are associated with VLC which is used only for watching videos.[02:18:15] <rootbaron> I just use mplayer and be done with it.[02:18:16] <Xgates> yeah that's right jstressman you got it right video watching VLC, you tell him, LOL, just kidding[02:18:24] <Xgates> sheesh who watches vidoes anyways in winamp hehe[02:18:35] <rootbaron> I used to for NSV streams...[02:18:44] <rootbaron> Nowadays I have mplayer and VLC on Android for that.[02:18:58] <rootbaron> Don't actually use Winamp any more...[02:18:58] <Xgates> also who the heck even uses winamp anymore, much better players out there[02:20:42] <rootbaron> I wish I had some free time to repartition my drive...[02:21:44] *** Tsyesika has quit IRC[02:21:56] <jstressman> http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/phreadom/sysstats1.png[02:22:34] <jstressman> no other application on windows can remotely handle my playlist.[02:22:46] *** Tsyesika has joined #haiku[02:22:48] <jstressman> iTunes is PROFOUNDLY horrible and useless garbage... even for tiny playlists.[02:22:56] <Tsyesika> hazar i'm back[02:22:57] <jstressman> Songbird is likewise bloated useless garbage, etc.[02:23:15] <dreamed> that is the most ridiculous drive/partition layout I've ever laid eyes on heh[02:23:28] <jstressman> winamp in classic mode is the only one that nicely handles it all... quick, responsive, etc.[02:23:49] <jstressman> dreamed: how so? :)[02:24:19] <dreamed> it's craziness[02:24:34] <dreamed> why have so many?[02:24:42] <rootbaron> Clearly they are all for Haiku.[02:24:56] <rootbaron> Yes, iTune is a bloated mess. And so is Winamp with the Bento skins.[02:25:16] <jstressman> as you can see, I have a lot of data. they were added over the years and partitioned for things like different operating systems, etc. the ability to be able to shift data from partition to partition while I redid one of them etc.[02:25:57] <jstressman> so there are things like Haiku, Plan9, Linux, swap partitions, Windows, etc...[02:26:06] <jstressman> it's easier to do testing in virtualbox these days :P[02:26:12] <Tsyesika> hmm i need to work out what next to do regarding Vision[02:26:13] <Tsyesika> :P[02:26:16] <rootbaron> Plan9, eh? Interesting.[02:26:17] <jstressman> but I still have Haiku, Linux, and Windows on bare metal.[02:26:25] <rootbaron> Do you also have eComStation on there?[02:26:50] <jstressman> rootbaron: yeah, I only use winamp classic. the new stuff is bloated too.[02:27:14] <jstressman> and no eComStation :P[02:27:33] <rootbaron> Then your drives are worthless to me. :p[02:28:18] <AlienSoldier> you are not hardcore without an oberon partition :P[02:28:36] <rootbaron> Nah, QNX.[02:28:56] <jessicah> jstressman: your taskbar is a mess[02:29:00] * rootbaron wishes they didn't gut the multimedia stuff from the recent QNX versions...[02:29:06] <jessicah> also, wmp can't handle your playlist?[02:29:10] <dreamed> jessicah: I think that's putting it mildly heh[02:29:15] <rootbaron> WMP? Yuck.[02:29:23] <jessicah> wmp is freaking awesome[02:29:33] <jessicah> lightning fast library search[02:29:42] <rootbaron> Not when I used it...[02:29:52] <jessicah> wmp 12 is the only good version of wmp[02:29:54] <rootbaron> But I abandoned Windows for Linux back in XP, so who knows.[02:29:55] *** LeandroLuiz has joined #haiku[02:30:05] <Tsyesika> jessicah is that old or new? :P[02:30:06] <dreamed> nothing beats itunes on mac. I'll grant you that everything beats itunes on windows though.[02:30:16] <jessicah> Tsyesika: wmp 12 is version in windows 7[02:30:19] <AlienSoldier> i amazingly still like soundplay[02:30:46] <jessicah> itunes sucks for lack of a 'now playing' playlist[02:30:52] <rootbaron> I also use SoundPlay sometimes on BeOS.[02:31:01] <dreamed> now playing?[02:31:02] <rootbaron> It's still an awesome app.[02:31:05] <dreamed> I don't understand[02:31:10] <dreamed> what does that do?[02:31:32] <jessicah> wmp has a 'now playing' playlist which is whatever you're currently listening to, and is entirely editable without having to give it a name or explictly create it[02:31:53] <jessicah> whatever is in your search view, when you double click, becomes your now playing list[02:31:59] <dreamed> fair enough. doesn't sound like something I'd use :P[02:32:08] <jessicah> and then you can drag stuff in, delete tracks[02:32:17] <rootbaron> mplayer /path/to/music/album/*.mp3[02:32:23] <jessicah> without having to actually create a playlist[02:32:23] <rootbaron> That's all I do...[02:32:40] <dreamed> I create very structured playlists, or smart playlists[02:32:45] <dreamed> or just have everything on random[02:33:28] <jessicah> i like being semi-random and being able to prune stuff i don't want to listen to[02:33:42] <jessicah> or be like "oh, i want to listen to that too", do a search, and drag into playlist[02:33:57] <AlienSoldier> what i would like is interaction from the haiku mediaplayer and cortex to be able to send sound on different soundcard and do crazy shit[02:33:58] <jessicah> it's chaotic, and meshes well with how i do stuff :)[02:34:13] <jessicah> AlienSoldier: that'd be cool :)[02:35:02] <AlienSoldier> like having query media node and such[02:36:14] <Xgates> itunes sucks doesn't even support flac[02:36:31] <Xgates> mp3s are lame pun intended LOL[02:36:54] <Xgates> later guys[02:36:56] *** Xgates has quit IRC[02:37:56] <AlienSoldier> today is a great day, i fixed the clothesline, soon i will win my fight with procrastination.[02:39:05] <dreamed> but not too soon[02:39:16] <dreamed> I'm going to wander up the road to visit the barber shortly[02:39:22] <dreamed> just doing some data shuffling[02:46:21] *** letharion_ has joined #haiku[02:47:53] <dreamed> w00t down to <250GB on main drive[02:48:02] <dreamed> time to wander up the road[02:53:00] *** lopsam has joined #haiku[02:53:19] *** Kernel86 has quit IRC[02:53:19] *** letharion has quit IRC[02:53:23] *** nopper has quit IRC[02:53:25] *** munchausen has quit IRC[02:54:53] *** lopsam has quit IRC[02:55:27] *** bjz has joined #haiku[02:57:25] *** Kernel86 has joined #haiku[02:57:25] *** nopper has joined #haiku[02:57:25] *** munchausen has joined #haiku[02:57:56] *** nortti has quit IRC[03:06:58] <jstressman> jessicah: my taskbar is VASTLY more functional than the Haiku one.[03:11:06] <jstressman> if the deskbar actually were more useful... like showing things the way I have it setup, but allowing things like showing the full name of the window on mouseover, allowing show and hide with a single click on the deskbar item, and allow to scroll the task list if it got too long...[03:11:12] <jstressman> those things would make Deskbar nice and functional.[03:11:31] <jstressman> currently it's barely usable at all.[03:11:58] <rootbaron> Enabling the expand option helps. One of the first things I setup.[03:12:02] <jstressman> my taskbar in windows shows me all my running apps/windows... grouped by application.[03:12:06] <jstressman> rootbaron: that's how I do it.[03:12:30] <jstressman> http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/phreadom/mockup-workspaces-bgs5.jpg[03:13:14] <Tsyesika> thanks pretty cool[03:13:21] <Tsyesika> *thats[03:13:24] <jstressman> if I hover over an item on the taskbar I can see the full title (eg; full path for explorer windows)[03:13:28] <Tsyesika> I leave it as default :P[03:13:34] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[03:13:47] <rootbaron> I leave the icons as-is. On a netbook, space is precious.[03:14:04] <jstressman> I can show and hide a window with a single click without having to move the mouse...[03:14:15] <jstressman> I usually turn the icon size up a bit for the deskbar and on the desktop.[03:14:40] <jstressman> 2 notches up on both I think... like 40px on desktop... and whatever 2 notches up on the deskbar is. :)[03:14:53] <jstressman> any bigger messes up the layout on the deskbar. :P[03:15:18] <jstressman> but 2 notches up makes a really nice visual separator for each application and its windows.[03:15:31] *** pseudomind has joined #haiku[03:15:44] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[03:17:57] <jessicah> jstressman: i use standard icon view in taskbar on windows[03:18:17] <jessicah> the text is superfluous usually[03:19:14] <jessicah> jstressman: yeah, i seen your screenshot before. too cluttered... :p[03:22:37] <jstressman> jessicah: which screenshot?[03:22:48] <jstressman> my windows desktop?[03:23:01] <jstressman> like I said, still a lot more useful than haiku, cluttered or not.[03:23:47] <jstressman> as for the text being superfluous, it's not for me. as you can see in the list, I have a bunch of Tracker windows open... but they're almost indistinguishable because there's no way to show what the actual full title is.[03:24:08] <jstressman> and that's after specifically changing the layout to show individual windows like that...[03:24:29] <jstressman> if you do it the default way you can at least see the full titles, but it takes more clicks...[03:24:33] <jstressman> so you're crippled either way.[03:25:17] <jstressman> I can get to any open window I want in windows in a single click... and I can even see it before I go to click on it... so I can navigate directly to it and click it in one quick motion.[03:25:30] <jessicah> jstressman: the haiku one[03:25:40] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[03:25:45] <jstressman> what's cluttered about the Haiku one?[03:26:24] <jessicah> the crud all along the bottom mainly[03:26:32] <jessicah> and the expanded deskbar mode i guess[03:26:48] <jstressman> well, I suppose if you don't actually like using a GUI then... whatever floats your boat. :)[03:26:50] <jessicah> i'm very particular about my desktop though :p[03:27:05] <jessicah> i like using a gui; but i like minimalist too :)[03:27:10] <jstressman> I like being able to see what's going on... not have an opaque system with things on the screen that are night unto useless.[03:27:16] <jessicah> can you use workspaces without the window visible?[03:27:40] <jstressman> so I can see if my CPU is getting pegged at a glance... or mem.. or connection has dropped etc...[03:27:59] <jessicah> can't you also see that from the deskbar?[03:28:02] <jstressman> I can drag apps around on the workspaces, or jump right to one etc.[03:28:19] <jessicah> yeah, it's a kinda nifty feature of workspaces[03:28:28] <jessicah> i just dun like it taking up screen space[03:28:34] <jstressman> deskbar does nothing to show me where apps are.[03:28:40] <jessicah> a shortcut key to toggle it might be nice[03:28:43] <jstressman> I have a big screen.[03:28:45] <jessicah> i meant cpu & mem :p[03:28:58] <jessicah> so do i. doesn't mean i want stuff cluttering it up[03:29:21] <jstressman> (`_` ) to each their own I suppose.[03:29:35] <jstressman> I have a very clean desktop... I just also prefer it to be functional.[03:29:41] <jessicah> i did say i was quite particular about how i like things :)[03:30:04] <jstressman> I don't want to have to go digging to see or do the most basic and common activities.[03:31:08] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[03:31:19] <Skipp_OSX> I think Vision needs to be recompiled for r1a4...[03:31:20] *** mmadia has quit IRC[03:31:30] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX yeh[03:31:35] <Skipp_OSX> It isn't connecting to Freenode for me[03:31:46] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX i have a binary if you wanna ship gcc4 stuff[03:31:48] <Tsyesika> :P[03:31:51] <Skipp_OSX> it just says User not enough parameters[03:31:52] <jstressman> any chance of getting Tsyesika's fixes in? :)[03:32:01] <Skipp_OSX> Server not enough parameters[03:32:18] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX yeh it needs something like USER 8 * ident :realname[03:32:20] <Skipp_OSX> jstressman, no chance, too late for new features[03:32:34] <Skipp_OSX> but, I can get them in after alpha 4[03:32:46] <jstressman> k.[03:33:02] <Tsyesika> woot![03:33:05] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX i added colour too[03:33:40] <Skipp_OSX> I saw that, looked nice[03:34:17] <Tsyesika> :)[03:34:29] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX i re-did some of the code i showed you before[03:34:38] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX i'm not looking at fixing the URL parsing[03:34:58] <Tsyesika> http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_(operating_system) <-- see[03:35:00] <Skipp_OSX> Tsyesika, okay, well, I think AnEvilYak is the person you are ultimately going to have to impress[03:35:08] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[03:35:08] <Tsyesika> :P[03:35:31] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX i don't have to impress anyone :P I give the patches i don't mind if they're not included :P[03:35:33] <Skipp_OSX> but the patch you showed earlier looked good to me once you got the svn diff thing down[03:35:55] <Skipp_OSX> Why am I looking at the Haiku wiki page?[03:36:11] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX if you're in vision you'll notice it doesn't parse the URL right[03:36:17] <Tsyesika> and what you get is wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_[03:37:47] <Tsyesika> http://tsyesika.co.uk/u/parse-fail.png[03:37:50] <Tsyesika> if you don't have vision :P[03:38:10] <jessicah> i don't have clickable links[03:38:36] <Tsyesika> jessicah huh[03:38:53] <jessicah> i'm using irssi/screen/putty[03:39:04] <Tsyesika> odd[03:39:39] <Skipp_OSX> oh, I'm not in Vision... I would be if it ran right[03:39:49] <Tsyesika> :P[03:39:55] <Tsyesika> well you have my screenshot showing the bug[03:40:16] <Tsyesika> Skipp_OSX by the way there is a connection problem depending on certain settings and i can't work out which[03:40:34] <Skipp_OSX> looks like it isn't parsing _'s in URLs correctlyt[03:40:58] <Skipp_OSX> or maybe ('s[03:41:02] <Tsyesika> i think it's ([03:41:13] <Tsyesika> but i plan to fix that :P[03:41:54] <jessicah> Tsyesika: it's probably just removing () from line 71 in URLCrunch.cpp[03:43:10] <Tsyesika> jessicah lets find out eh ;)[03:43:35] <Skipp_OSX> brb[03:43:39] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[03:43:59] <Tsyesika> hazar, jessicah you're right![03:44:04] * Tsyesika makes it into a patch[03:45:35] *** Skipp_Haiku has joined #haiku[03:45:40] <Skipp_Haiku> okay, I got Vision working[03:45:42] <Tsyesika> :P[03:45:47] <Tsyesika> jessicah patch made[03:45:51] <Skipp_Haiku> I had to fill in ident[03:46:10] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku it's a requirement in USER[03:46:15] <jessicah> i thought it's normally filled in by default[03:46:15] <Tsyesika> USER x x ident :realname[03:46:21] <Tsyesika> all are required[03:46:28] <Tsyesika> xx wil be done by the client tho[03:46:50] <Skipp_Haiku> right, well, that was the secret[03:47:37] <Tsyesika> :P[03:47:49] <Tsyesika> there is actually a bug in vision tho which will cause a similar experance as you described[03:49:02] <Tsyesika> brb while i switch to the latest version of Vision[03:49:08] *** Tsyesika has quit IRC[03:49:41] *** Tsyesika has joined #haiku[03:49:56] <Tsyesika> http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_(operating_system)[03:49:58] <Tsyesika> hazar![03:49:59] <Tsyesika> it works[03:50:05] <Skipp_Haiku> not for me :)[03:50:26] <Tsyesika> :P[03:50:35] <Tsyesika> http://tsyesika.co.uk/u/Haiku/ <-- if anyone wants it[03:51:33] <Skipp_Haiku> brb[03:51:35] *** Skipp_Haiku has quit IRC[03:53:05] *** Skipp_Haiku has joined #haiku[03:53:12] <Skipp_Haiku> works for me here on r1a4[03:53:33] <Tsyesika> what does?[03:53:46] <Skipp_Haiku> Your version of vision[03:53:54] <Tsyesika> ohh cool! :) thanks for testing[03:54:00] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku you'll notice it has notifications too[03:54:11] <Skipp_Haiku> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_OS[03:54:31] <Skipp_Haiku> hmmm that's a different URL[03:54:43] <Tsyesika> http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_(operating_system) if you wanna test it[03:54:44] <Tsyesika> hehe[03:54:48] <Skipp_Haiku> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_(operating_system)[03:54:54] <Skipp_Haiku> yes that works[03:55:11] <Tsyesika> ^_^[03:55:25] <Skipp_Haiku> fun stuff[03:55:36] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[03:58:03] <Tsyesika> ugh sourceforge won't let me open the bug[04:00:00] <jessicah> i'm kind of surprised people still use sourceforge[04:00:01] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[04:00:29] <Tsyesika> :P[04:00:53] <Tsyesika> jessicah most activity on it was done like 2002/2003[04:01:01] <Skipp_Haiku> yeah sf.net sucks[04:01:05] <Tsyesika> mmm[04:01:07] <Tsyesika> agreed[04:01:08] *** LeandroLuiz has quit IRC[04:01:35] *** Xeon3D|Zzz is now known as Xeon3D[04:02:04] *** duvjones has joined #haiku[04:05:36] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[04:06:14] *** nsuperbus has joined #haiku[04:07:25] *** backb0ne_ has joined #haiku[04:09:49] *** backb0ne__ has joined #haiku[04:09:51] *** backb0ne_ has quit IRC[04:10:14] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[04:13:15] <Tsyesika> i'm not sure what to do regarding vision :P i can't seem to make this bug it just 417's on me[04:14:19] *** backb0ne__ has quit IRC[04:14:27] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[04:14:49] <Skipp_Haiku> w00t, got BeScreenCapture compiled![04:15:54] <Tsyesika> ooo does it work? i've been wanting a screen capture for a while[04:16:06] <Tsyesika> i tried some on haikuware but they don't work[04:16:11] <Skipp_Haiku> There is a small amount of crashing[04:16:45] <Tsyesika> hmm[04:16:55] <Skipp_Haiku> could ffmpeg not be compiled?[04:17:33] <Skipp_Haiku> Cause that's what is crashing...[04:18:02] *** bjz has quit IRC[04:18:13] <Tsyesika> who's noticed osdrawer interface not being right[04:19:12] <Skipp_Haiku> what about it?[04:20:26] <Tsyesika> it doesn't seem right... it's css or something[04:22:20] <Skipp_Haiku> osdrawer is f-ed up[04:22:25] <jstressman> Tsyesika: it's been like that for awhile.[04:22:28] <Skipp_Haiku> the CSS doesn't load, you can't sign up[04:22:46] <jstressman> I wish they'd just hand it over to someone capable of maintaining it.[04:23:01] <Tsyesika> jstressman o :([04:24:01] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku how did you compile this i see a jam file but it doesn't seem to... compile it[04:25:54] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: the Jamfile does not work[04:26:03] <Tsyesika> seems like it[04:26:07] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: I used Paladin, but the fun doesn't stop there[04:26:11] <Tsyesika> xD[04:26:14] <Tsyesika> i got paladin on here[04:26:35] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: hold a bit[04:27:24] <Tsyesika> it's alright ControllerObserver.cpp fails[04:27:36] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: yeah, I've fixed that, hold on[04:27:42] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku no worries[04:28:26] <Tsyesika> it's a shame so much of this software seems to have been just abandoned[04:28:33] <Xeon3D> to be honest[04:28:43] <Xeon3D> what's the advantage of osdrawer versus github et al ?[04:29:07] <Tsyesika> well i prefer git but... github restricts you to it :P when some like to use svn[04:29:17] <jessicah> i like github[04:29:21] <Xeon3D> surely there's a svn equivalent of github[04:29:28] * Tsyesika shrugs[04:29:30] <Tsyesika> i like github :P[04:29:32] <jessicah> google code[04:29:42] <jessicah> i dun really like git, but i'm getting used to it[04:29:43] <Xeon3D> https://github.com/blog/626-announcing-svn-support[04:29:48] <Tsyesika> yeh google code is pretty cool[04:30:10] <Tsyesika> one of my friends wrote an awesome piece of software that's on github[04:30:13] <Xeon3D> LOL[04:30:16] <Tsyesika> not github[04:30:18] <Tsyesika> google code[04:30:18] <Xeon3D> github even supports SVN[04:30:22] <Xeon3D> so...[04:30:26] <Xeon3D> osdrawer could just die[04:30:27] <Xeon3D> :P[04:30:32] <Tsyesika> Xeon3D i have no idea :P i'm using github :P[04:30:41] <Tsyesika> http://github.com/xray7224[04:31:43] <Xeon3D> ?[04:32:05] <Tsyesika> Xeon3D my github[04:32:34] *** Xeon3D is now known as Xeon3D|Zzz[04:32:46] <Skipp_Haiku> my github is better[04:32:56] <Tsyesika> :P[04:33:13] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku most likely tbh[04:33:30] <Tsyesika> megbot is pretty good but besides that[04:33:42] <Skipp_Haiku> Here's why: https://github.com/jscipione/BeScreenCapture[04:33:46] <Tsyesika> :D[04:33:51] <Tsyesika> that's amazing[04:33:54] * Tsyesika is getting it[04:34:06] <Skipp_Haiku> so, download it to /home/projects[04:34:15] <Skipp_Haiku> /boot/home/projects I mean[04:34:19] <Tsyesika> i'd put vision on my github but... i'm not so sure they'd be cool with that[04:34:45] <Skipp_Haiku> Not sure what the JBQ license allows[04:35:00] <Tsyesika> is that what Vision is under?[04:35:08] <Skipp_Haiku> yes[04:35:19] <Skipp_Haiku> at least that's what it said in one of the files[04:35:34] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku i noticed some files the licence changes[04:35:45] <Skipp_Haiku> idk[04:36:04] <Tsyesika> tons of linking errors[04:36:09] <Skipp_Haiku> actually it looks lke it is MPL[04:36:16] <Skipp_Haiku> so go ahead and put it on github if you want[04:36:31] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku doesn't compile :P[04:36:34] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: hmmm[04:37:36] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: under Project > Change System Libraries... are libgame.so, libmedia.so, and libtranslation.so checked?[04:37:44] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: also, gcc2 or gcc4?[04:38:00] <Tsyesika> gcc4[04:38:08] <Tsyesika> oh yes i forgot to do that[04:38:47] <jessicah> oh you're jscipione[04:39:09] <Skipp_Haiku> for gcc4 check libstdc++.so and libsupc++.so[04:39:09] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku selected those and it still fails[04:39:12] <Tsyesika> o okay[04:39:13] <Tsyesika> cool[04:39:46] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku yep runs now[04:40:24] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: try capture, does it crash?[04:40:30] <Tsyesika> nope but it does give me an error[04:40:40] <Tsyesika> initialization failed[04:40:53] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: what build are you on?[04:41:16] <Tsyesika> hrev44584[04:41:32] <Skipp_Haiku> I get the same init fail on r1alpha4rc[04:41:50] <Skipp_Haiku> on gcc4, gcc2 crashes instead[04:42:47] <Tsyesika> i don't mind shoving it with my vision binary if you would want it hosting (unless you got somewhere)[04:43:42] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: well, I'd like to get it working for r1a4[04:43:48] <Tsyesika> :)[04:43:52] <Tsyesika> that'd be nice[04:44:17] <Tsyesika> it'd be nice if someone could do like haiku tutorials and stuff maybe :) how to's or something[04:44:21] <Skipp_Haiku> I was hoping it would just work with a recompile...[04:44:52] <Skipp_Haiku> I guess I'm not that lucky[04:45:01] *** alexandros_c has quit IRC[04:45:06] <Tsyesika> :P[04:45:15] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku you should develop it :) get more codecs and really make it amazing[04:45:37] <jessicah> the mediakit should take care of encoding[04:46:13] <Tsyesika> cool :)[04:46:21] <Tsyesika> i'm still getting use to the API's[04:46:39] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: what do you want me to develop?[04:47:11] <Tsyesika> i'm not sure i'll have to look at the other OS stuff :P[04:47:18] <Skipp_Haiku> jessicah: I think it is using the Media Kit...[04:48:23] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku i just noticed it allowed 3 codecs[04:48:25] <jessicah> yeah looks like it does[04:49:30] <Tsyesika> i'm tempted to add my name to the vision about bit :P[04:49:35] <Tsyesika> :3[04:49:52] <jessicah> =/ i forgot i installed windows over my haiku install...[04:50:02] <Tsyesika> awhh :([04:50:10] <jessicah> munchausen: you have haiku working on a macbook?!?![04:50:31] <jessicah> munchausen: was me complaining about usb mouse (i hadn't opened a ticket)[04:52:11] *** ity has joined #haiku[04:53:10] <Tsyesika> blah doesn't paladin listen to make files if they are there?[04:55:01] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: I don't think so...[04:55:58] <Tsyesika> hmm[04:59:32] <Tsyesika> I'm trying to think what next to add to Vision[04:59:46] <Tsyesika> there seems to be quite a lot of ask for ssl which would be nice[05:00:01] <Tsyesika> I don't know how haiku's net kit or whatever it's call handles that[05:00:03] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[05:04:16] *** luroh has quit IRC[05:05:44] <jessicah> blah. today is one of those days i really wish i had a new battery for my phone[05:05:53] <jessicah> lacking a camera sux[05:08:28] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku https://github.com/xray7224/Vision :D[05:09:55] <Skipp_Haiku> nice[05:12:13] <Tsyesika> :)[05:12:25] <Tsyesika> i guess i'm going to be the one developing on this xD[05:15:20] <Skipp_Haiku> Congratulations, you're the Vision maintainer[05:15:34] *** nighty has joined #haiku[05:15:52] <Tsyesika> haha :P[05:15:53] <Tsyesika> thanks[05:16:43] *** nighty has quit IRC[05:17:13] *** hamishm has quit IRC[05:21:08] <Skipp_Haiku> ffmpeg comes with Haiku right?[05:21:18] <Skipp_Haiku> I don't have to download it[05:21:38] <OmniMancer> not sure[05:21:46] <OmniMancer> the libs that back it are definitely there[05:21:56] <Skipp_Haiku> okay[05:21:57] <OmniMancer> not sure if the ffmpeg executable is shipped though[05:22:07] <Skipp_Haiku> I just need the libs[05:22:33] <OmniMancer> most of the media server codecs are from ffmpeg's libavcodec I think[05:27:45] *** ismd has joined #haiku[05:28:17] *** bjz has joined #haiku[05:28:46] <ismd> haiku site doesn't work[05:31:04] <Tsyesika> ismd what about it doesn't work?[05:32:50] <Skipp_Haiku> works for m[05:32:50] <ismd> for example http://www.haiku-os.org/development is it shown for you correctly?[05:32:52] <Skipp_Haiku> me[05:32:59] <ismd> hm...[05:33:03] <Skipp_Haiku> yes[05:33:12] <Tsyesika> yeh it's fine[05:36:07] <ismd> oh, seems it's my problem with chromium[05:41:37] *** alexandros_c has joined #haiku[05:41:45] <Tsyesika> I wonder how hard it would be to add SSL to Vision[05:52:31] <jessicah> ffmpeg is a media add-on[05:52:53] <jessicah> the .so for it should prolly exist as well, i'd guess[05:52:55] <Skipp_Haiku> jessicah: right, I added libmedia.so, so I guess that should include ffmpeg[05:53:32] <jessicah> uh, i'd hazard a guess and say it probably doesn't[05:53:45] <jessicah> addons are separate dynamically loaded components[05:55:02] <Tsyesika> does network kit do SSL easily?[05:55:35] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[05:58:25] <Skipp_Haiku> jessicah: well, my real question is do I have to do anything special to get BeScreenCapture to use ffmpeg?[05:58:39] <Skipp_Haiku> It compiles and links so I assume that I do not[06:00:12] <jessicah> Skipp_Haiku: if it's using the mediakit (which it looks like it does), then no[06:00:44] <jessicah> whether the add-on has encoding stuff actually enabled is another matter... :p[06:06:28] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[06:09:29] <Skipp_Haiku> mpeg4?[06:09:46] <Skipp_Haiku> I mean, mpeg4 is the encoder it is using (by default)[06:11:24] <Tsyesika> Is there any good video editing software for haiku?[06:12:07] <Skipp_Haiku> ummm, no[06:12:10] <Skipp_Haiku> I don't think so[06:12:37] *** hiryu has joined #haiku[06:13:44] <Tsyesika> awhh[06:17:42] <jessicah> there you go! an opportunity for a killer app ;)[06:18:40] <Tsyesika> haha :P[06:19:18] <Tsyesika> I'm not really a video editor the most i might do is crop a bit of a video and shove a title on it :P best someone who knows quite a bit about video write it :P[06:19:37] <jessicah> :)[06:21:22] *** ismd has quit IRC[06:21:49] *** ismd has joined #haiku[06:24:30] <Tsyesika> Does anyone know about network kit and SSL?[06:27:35] <CIA-58> haiku.r1alpha4: nielx * hrevr1alpha4-44578 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=b6fa397 : Update translations from Pootle[06:27:51] <jessicah> looks like it exists[06:28:03] <jessicah> there's a BSecureSocket class[06:28:14] <Tsyesika> ohh![06:28:24] <Tsyesika> http://api.haiku-os.org/index.html <-- am i missing something... i can't see the network stuff[06:28:27] <jessicah> headers/os/net/SecureSocket.h[06:28:34] *** ity has quit IRC[06:28:35] <jessicah> it's not there[06:28:43] <jessicah> when in doubt, i go to the source :)[06:28:49] <Tsyesika> :P[06:29:12] <Tsyesika> there is no docks for this?[06:29:26] <jessicah> apparently not[06:29:39] <Tsyesika> haha why did i spell it docks[06:29:42] <Tsyesika> *docs[06:29:47] <Tsyesika> next i'll be talking about ships[06:29:53] <jessicah> probably all you need to do is detect if SSL is desired, and use the BSecureSocket constructor instead of BSocket[06:30:00] <Tsyesika> ugh i'm just babbling... this is what happens at 5:30am[06:30:09] <jessicah> BSecureSocket extends BSocket, so that should basically be the only change[06:30:25] <jessicah> but that's my naive thinking; it *may* be more complicated than that[06:30:48] *** ianj has quit IRC[06:37:58] <Tsyesika> i just grepped the entire Vision source and BSocket isn't in it[06:38:56] <Tsyesika> i can't tell if i'm being stupid here and missing something...[06:39:02] <Disreali> Tsyesika: iirc, Clockwerk is a video editor. use iop to install[06:41:41] * Tsyesika hits her head against a wall[06:41:59] <Disreali> Tsyesika: as for Bsocket use in Vision, I wuld recommend asking on the haiku-3rdparty-dev list. http://www.freelists.org/list/haiku-3rdparty-dev[06:42:14] <Disreali> s/wuld/would[06:42:19] <Tsyesika> why...[06:42:25] <Tsyesika> i have the source here[06:42:33] <Tsyesika> ugh i need sleep i think[06:43:35] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[06:44:40] <Disreali> Tsyesika: not everything in the source is really straightforward and there are very knowledgeable devs on the list[06:44:55] *** ksx4system has joined #haiku[06:45:32] <Disreali> specifically, AnEvilYak/DeadYak, how is one of Visions original devs[06:45:42] <Disreali> s/how/who[06:46:04] <Tsyesika> from what i'm seeing this looks like traditional BSD sockets[06:46:36] <Disreali> well, you would know better than me. I hope to learn soon[06:49:41] <Tsyesika> Disreali was it you whow as interested in coloured nicks for like ~/&/+/@/% users?[06:50:38] <Disreali> Tsyesika: you asked if it was a good idea, and I said it sounded cool. I also recommended to check out how mIRC handled them[06:51:09] <Tsyesika> Disreali http://tsyesika.co.uk/u/Vision-colours.png <-- how's that :D[06:51:24] <Disreali> iirc, vision uses mIRC colours[06:51:31] <Tsyesika> it does :)[06:52:17] <Tsyesika> but yeh i've implemented that[06:52:22] <Disreali> very cool! I like it[06:52:26] <Tsyesika> Disreali i fixed the url bug with breakets[06:52:34] <Disreali> I read that[06:52:42] <Tsyesika> yep :)[06:52:45] <Disreali> very nice[06:52:48] <Tsyesika> now i'm looking at adding SSL[06:52:55] <Tsyesika> tho i feel like i'm a bit sleep deprived[06:53:30] <Disreali> well it is 0530 there? I'm not suprised[06:53:59] <Disreali> actually, it is almost 0600[06:54:57] <Disreali> wait... it is Daylight Saveings my calculations may be off[06:56:16] <Tsyesika> yeh lik 6am[06:56:17] <Tsyesika> :P[07:00:23] *** qptain_Nemo has quit IRC[07:09:13] *** ismd has quit IRC[07:11:06] <Tsyesika> looks like i'm going to have to make the decision to switch this to network kit or just hack sockets in using the openssl library[07:13:08] <jessicah> i can make a fork on github, have a look see[07:13:37] <Tsyesika> i think maybe in the long run it might be better to switch it to network kit[07:13:38] *** ianj has joined #haiku[07:14:31] <jessicah> forked & cloned[07:14:59] <Tsyesika> :P[07:19:32] <jessicah> yeah... a lot of work to change[07:20:08] <jessicah> a lot of the code is designed around the fact that a unix socket is an integer[07:21:36] <jessicah> well, now i know why my phone's battery was dying so chronically[07:21:50] <jessicah> the battery is a lil bit swollen...[07:21:56] <jessicah> i guess water damage =/[07:22:14] <Tsyesika> :([07:23:13] *** ianj has quit IRC[07:23:27] <Tsyesika> it's getting light I can't decide if i should sleep or cycle[07:23:28] <jessicah> here's to a longer lasting battery, i hope :p[07:23:39] <jessicah> cycle, then sleep[07:25:50] <jessicah> whenever i'm like "hmm, i'll just have a nap first...", i never get the thing i was supposed to do afterwards done[07:26:34] <Tsyesika> mm[07:26:36] *** ismd has joined #haiku[07:30:05] *** ianj has joined #haiku[07:41:23] *** letharion_ has quit IRC[07:46:54] *** letharion has joined #haiku[07:47:37] <Skipp_Haiku> http://imagebin.org/226540 <-- updated BeScreenCapture look[07:48:19] <Tsyesika> ooo[07:49:36] *** ismd has quit IRC[07:50:42] <jessicah> does it work though?[07:51:00] <Skipp_Haiku> no, no work... looks good while crashing[07:51:03] <jessicah> what's the white box bottom left?[07:51:35] <Skipp_Haiku> that is a stop light indicator that is white when not lit for whatever reason[07:52:23] <Tsyesika> i'm starting to think making Vision use network kit isn't going to happen...[07:52:35] <Skipp_Haiku> haha, what is SSL for?[07:52:42] <Tsyesika> huh?[07:52:57] <Skipp_Haiku> Tsyesika: you want to add SSL to Vision, what does that get you?[07:53:13] <Tsyesika> oh, encrypted traffic between you and the ircd[07:53:51] <Skipp_Haiku> for things like passwords?[07:54:11] <Tsyesika> not all networks are public or log publically... people do say sensative stuff on IRC and would rather it wasn't given to everyone wirelessly sniffing at the coffee shop or the ISP[07:55:21] <Tsyesika> I guess if i was sat in a coffee shop and happened to see another user on IRC and they sent their OPER or nickserv pass over i'd see it, grab it and could then use it?[07:55:50] <Skipp_Haiku> I see, right, I wasn't thinking of packet sniffing[07:56:17] <Tsyesika> routers which spy, not trusting ISPs or government which may issue warrents[07:57:12] <Tsyesika> maybe you don't trust your work? who knows[07:58:33] <Tsyesika> Skipp_Haiku i was at a technology conference recently, i would have said most people who attended knew how to packet sniff, i bet some did :P ... most of us used IRC if they had sniffed when i connected they'd have got my oper and nickserv pass and could literally take over my network i run/founded[07:58:55] <Tsyesika> so yeh... in short... SSL for IRC is nice[08:00:34] <Tsyesika> humph I don't know how far i'll get with this...[08:00:36] <jessicah> i'm feeling so lazy right now[08:00:40] <jessicah> want pizza[08:00:55] <Tsyesika> jessicah I really don't wanna go cycling at the moment i'm trying to psych myself up[08:01:22] *** pseudomind has quit IRC[08:01:26] <jessicah> jog around the house[08:07:54] *** Mazon has quit IRC[08:09:03] *** Mazon has joined #haiku[08:09:33] <Skipp_Haiku> well, I am out of space both on disk and in brain, so goodnight[08:10:16] *** Skipp_Haiku has quit IRC[08:10:55] <Disreali> Tsyesika: would it be possible to use openssl directly instead of Haiku's network kit? that is what Web+ does[08:11:04] <Tsyesika> it would be[08:11:06] <Tsyesika> i'd rather not[08:11:17] <Disreali> yeah[08:12:01] <Disreali> the network kit should have openssl as a dependency and the all apps would just use the kit[08:12:28] <Disreali> but that sounds more complicated atm[08:12:56] <Disreali> 0220 here. tire for sleep[08:13:09] <Disreali> s/tire/time[08:13:37] *** Disreali has quit IRC[08:28:13] *** ksx4system has quit IRC[08:31:17] *** MatthewH12 has quit IRC[08:44:17] *** _marc` has quit IRC[09:03:53] *** Sikosis has quit IRC[09:05:51] <arfonzo> morning all[09:06:42] <arfonzo> I'm using quassel IRC client and core, which connects encrypted between client and core, for the "coffee shop" or working on client site scenario.[09:07:07] <Tsyesika> morning[09:07:31] <arfonzo> hey Tsyesika[09:09:03] *** happy4cr_ has joined #haiku[09:12:06] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[09:13:13] *** ismd has joined #haiku[09:14:37] *** Negr0_VoP2P_LMin has joined #haiku[09:16:03] <jessicah> hey arfonzo[09:16:44] <Tsyesika> arfonzo it would be nice if vision has ssl[09:16:54] <Tsyesika> if vision was the best IRC client there was[09:18:50] <arfonzo> hi jessicah[09:19:57] <arfonzo> Tsyesika: sure, if you prefer Vision, that's a good feature to have. I prefer quassel as I never need to login and join channels, like screen/tmux for irc. Plus having a client on my android which also doesn't need to rejoin servers & channels, is a real time saver for me.[09:20:42] <Tsyesika> yeh i've used quassel before[09:21:17] <rootbaron> If it helps, I think Vision is the best client there was on BeOS at least![09:21:20] <rootbaron> >_>[09:21:24] <CIA-58> haiku.master: scottmc * hrev44593 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=61306f1 : Rebuilt many OptionalPackages for R1A4[09:21:28] <Tsyesika> :P[09:22:12] <arfonzo> rootbaron: I think I'd agree with that, too. It's the best native IRC client that I know of.[09:23:17] <Tsyesika> hopefully i can get it even better :D[09:26:22] <arfonzo> Tsyesika: have you coded other things using the Haiku API before?[09:26:37] <Tsyesika> erm no not really i've played with it a bit[09:27:39] <jessicah> jstressman: whoa, i see what you meant by vlc 2 and the distorting the track when it above 100%[09:28:04] <arfonzo> Tsyesika: cool[09:28:09] <jessicah> i always inadvertently modifying volume level with scrollwheel =/[09:28:22] <jessicah> 109% and i thought my speakers were damaged or smth[09:29:16] <rootbaron> I hate when media players interpret my scroll wheel as being something other than an accident...[09:31:20] *** TimKack has joined #haiku[09:32:36] *** letharion has quit IRC[09:32:38] <jessicah> personally, i hate apps having their own volume controls[09:32:55] <Tsyesika> mm it doesn't make much sense does it? :S[09:33:06] <Tsyesika> i've never actually realised how stupid it seems[09:33:07] <jessicah> unless your volume control is actually controlling the mixer level in the system mixer, just don't[09:33:14] *** J-Ho has joined #haiku[09:33:42] <Tsyesika> it'd be nice if the haiku mixer would split into apps[09:33:50] <Tsyesika> like windows 7's[09:34:04] <jessicah> i'm fairly certain beos' did. maybe i'm wrong[09:34:16] <Tsyesika> i've never used BeOS :P[09:34:31] <jessicah> i could be wrong though[09:34:34] <Tsyesika> :P[09:34:41] <jessicah> it's been a long time[09:34:56] <Tsyesika> i used linux most my life[09:34:57] <jessicah> i remember seeing mixer in win7, and being like "about time it finally caught up"[09:35:15] *** XenoDuck has quit IRC[09:35:28] <jessicah> but i can't remember what it caught up to, lol[09:35:55] <Tsyesika> afaik mac doesn't, it's fairely recent on linux too :P[09:36:01] <Tsyesika> so we narrowed it down[09:38:55] *** letharion has joined #haiku[09:51:23] <HAIKU-Buildbot_> build #683 of x86-Linux64-host is complete: Failure [failed [x86gcc2]] Build details are at http://mmadia.dyndns.org:8010/builders/x86-Linux64-host/builds/683 blamelist: Scott McCreary <scottmc2 at gmail dot com>[09:53:41] <HeTo> per-app volume mixing was one of those points on BeOS where you could point at to show it was ahead of its time, so I'm pretty sure it had it[09:54:34] <jessicah> oh, so i not losing my mind then :)[09:54:45] <rootbaron> No, you arw, but for other reasons.[09:54:52] <jessicah> aww[10:00:23] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[10:02:04] <rootbaron> Well, it's 4:01. Time to repartition my drives and experiment. With disasterous results, I hope.[10:02:27] <geist> yay[10:06:21] *** Jessica_mob has joined #haiku[10:06:42] *** happy4cr_ has quit IRC[10:08:01] *** bjz has quit IRC[10:13:25] *** Jessica_mob has quit IRC[10:16:31] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[10:17:53] *** rootbaron has quit IRC[10:22:44] *** dcase has joined #haiku[10:33:10] *** Beretta021 has quit IRC[10:34:21] *** TimKack has quit IRC[10:34:55] *** Beretta021 has joined #haiku[10:45:02] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.[10:45:30] <jstressman> good morning brobostigon :)[10:45:42] <brobostigon> morning jstressman :)[10:46:26] <jstressman> jessicah: supposedly in the latest release (2.0.3 or something?) they fixed that. (the vlc volume)[10:47:53] <Tsyesika> jstressman the scrolling?[10:48:41] <jstressman> Tsyesika: in 2.0.0 through 2.0.2 the volume algorithm was changed.[10:48:57] <jstressman> I kept trying to complain on the forum and they'd just keep basically us to shut up etc...[10:48:58] <jessicah> no, the distortion[10:49:01] <Tsyesika> ohhh[10:49:02] <jessicah> yeah. i haven't upgraded[10:49:06] <jessicah> upgrades are so annoying[10:49:11] <jstressman> they finally fixed it in 2.0.3 :P[10:49:31] <Tsyesika> sort ish on/off topic... I really wish mediaplayer had network streaming[10:49:49] <Tsyesika> until it does it struggles to compete with vlc[10:49:58] <jstressman> yeah. :/[10:50:06] <jstressman> there are a few features I'm waiting on...[10:50:17] <jstressman> ability to read subtitles from within an mkv file is another one.[10:50:25] <Tsyesika> it can't do that?[10:50:26] <jstressman> it can do subtitles, and it can read mkv...[10:50:32] <Tsyesika> oh[10:50:35] <jstressman> but it can't read a subtitle from an mkv yet. ;)[10:50:40] <Tsyesika> sounds trivial to tie the two together?[10:50:47] <jstressman> just needs to be done basically.[10:50:53] <Tsyesika> yeh[10:51:04] <Tsyesika> i say that it is probably more complicated than i made that out to be[10:51:10] <jstressman> of course. ^_^[10:51:48] <jstressman> a little bit of expanded subtitle format support as well...[10:51:57] <jstressman> I might have filed tickets on these issues already.[10:52:18] <jstressman> I watch a LOT of Japanese stuff with subtitles... and this makes me unable to do it in Haiku. :([10:52:36] <Tsyesika> :([10:53:30] <jstressman> MediaPlayer supports the most basic form of .srt files etc... but almost none of the expanded features (text formatting and so on) from what I can tell.[10:53:45] <Tsyesika> that sucks[10:53:53] <Tsyesika> one day :)[10:54:08] <jstressman> http://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/8496[10:54:14] <jstressman> http://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/6826?cversion=1&cnum_hist=2[10:54:17] <jstressman> hrm[10:54:29] <jstressman> https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/6826[10:54:30] <jstressman> :)[10:54:37] <jstressman> looks like I did make a pretty detailed ticket.[10:55:03] <jstressman> oh... just added to it. :P[10:55:18] <jstressman> https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/8694[10:55:31] <jstressman> those are all things I'd love to see... and wish I could add in myself. :/[10:56:00] <munchausen> jessicah - yes haiku works (sort of) on my macbook. It wont always boot, and when it does wired network doesnt work, no sound and no power management.[10:56:37] <munchausen> But I use my thinkpad now anyway![10:57:03] <munchausen> I still havent searched for a ticket for mouse stuff but when I find/raise one I'll let you know on here[10:58:58] <jessicah> i can't get it to boot on my macs[10:59:18] <jessicah> fixes to hda might fix sounds[10:59:39] <Tsyesika> I wish i still had my mac to try[11:00:01] <Tsyesika> well i own the machine but nothing happens when i press the power button :P[11:00:41] <jessicah> got one of those faulty imacs? :p[11:00:47] <Tsyesika> it's a mb[11:01:02] <Tsyesika> it has had 2 coffees and a cider spilt on it[11:01:08] <Tsyesika> the last coffee killed it[11:01:10] <munchausen> One thing that is strange is that it gets to the grey boot icons, but they wont begin to light up until you press a key[11:01:15] <jessicah> it's actually a real problem they had with their latest imacs a couple months ago[11:01:23] <jessicah> we had to get a bunch fixed[11:01:40] <jessicah> because power button wouldn't work properly[11:01:46] <Tsyesika> weird[11:02:06] <jessicah> shittiest engineering i ever come across on an apple product[11:02:07] <munchausen> Then more often than not the desktop wont come up. But after a few attempts it works and then is stable[11:02:15] <Tsyesika> I want haiku to get bluetooth support so i can buy an apple bluetooth keyboard[11:02:24] <jessicah> munchausen: with the white stripe thing?[11:02:49] <HAIKU-Buildbot_> build #736 of x86-FreeBSD-host is complete: Failure [failed [x86gcc2] @alpha-anyboot [x86gcc2] @alpha-vmware [x86gcc2] @alpha-raw [x86gcc2] @alpha-cd [x86gcc2] @nightly-anyboot [x86gcc2] @nightly-vmware [x86gcc2] @nightly-raw [x86gcc2] @nightly-cd [x86gcc2hybrid] @alpha-anyboot [x86gcc2hybrid] @alpha-vmware [x86gcc2hybrid] @alpha-raw [x86gcc2hybrid] @alpha-cd[11:02:49] <HAIKU-Buildbot_> [x86gcc2hybrid] @nightly-anyboot [x86gcc2hybrid] @nightly-vmware [x86gcc2hybrid] @nightly-raw [x86gcc2hybrid] @nightly-cd] Build details are at http://mmadia.dyndns.org:8010/builders/x86-FreeBSD-host/builds/736 blamelist: Scott McCreary <scottmc2 at gmail dot com>[11:02:55] <Tsyesika> woah[11:02:57] <Tsyesika> wtf[11:02:59] <jessicah> munchausen: what model mac do you have?[11:03:17] <jessicah> server couldn't fetch some packages or smth[11:03:24] <jessicah> it happens sporadically[11:03:43] <jessicah> is usually the culprit[11:04:01] <Tsyesika> they really shouldn't have a blame list :P it seems to be more often than not the person's fault who's in the blamelist[11:04:18] <munchausen> jessicah - I had a lot of problems with my macbook when I first got it. camera didnt work, power supply broke, battery died after a couple of months, hard disc died twice while in warranty, mouse button stopped working and optical drive slot gap was warped so it scratched cds on the way in and wouldnt always eject them[11:04:27] <munchausen> that's a macbook (1,1)[11:04:40] <munchausen> Fortunately everything was fixed under warranty[11:04:51] <Tsyesika> i always have needed power supply replacements, mac, toshiba, thinkpad, etc...[11:04:54] <Tsyesika> crazy[11:05:01] <munchausen> I have a macbook 6,2 as well for work, but I havent tried haiku on it[11:05:08] <Tsyesika> ohh![11:05:14] <Tsyesika> is that the white polycarbonate one?[11:05:18] <munchausen> black one[11:05:21] <Tsyesika> 2.24Ghz or somethin[11:05:27] <jessicah> macbook1,1?[11:05:31] <munchausen> yeah[11:05:34] <jessicah> that sounds incredibly old[11:05:39] <munchausen> yeah, 2006[11:05:43] <munchausen> core duo[11:05:59] <Tsyesika> i had the macbook 6,2 2.24Ghz[11:06:02] <munchausen> in fact my new one is a macbook pro 6,2[11:06:03] <Tsyesika> it was awesome[11:06:05] <Tsyesika> and my baby[11:06:08] <Tsyesika> <3[11:06:12] <Tsyesika> i miss it :([11:06:20] <Tsyesika> stupid liquids[11:06:24] <munchausen> lol[11:06:43] <munchausen> liquid spills go sraight through thinkpads :)[11:06:53] <Tsyesika> munchausen it's why i now own a thinkpad T61[11:06:56] <munchausen> I dont use my macbook pro any more :)[11:07:07] <jessicah> i have macbook air 4,2[11:07:13] <munchausen> thinkpad x61[11:07:37] <Tsyesika> my thinkpad T61 is nearly dead[11:07:57] <Tsyesika> fan is a bit dodgy on it, screen is broke, power supply is crap[11:08:02] <munchausen> oh dear[11:08:15] <munchausen> you can pick them up for 100lbs though[11:08:23] <munchausen> (GBP)[11:08:39] <jessicah> i would've been nice if the trackpad on my mba was as customisable as the eeepc's trackpad under windows[11:08:40] <Tsyesika> my t61 was 130[11:08:43] <jessicah> it*[11:08:45] <munchausen> (irssi seems to not like the pound sign)[11:09:05] <Tsyesika> i don't have the UK keyboard turned on[11:09:08] <jessicah> my eeepc had the best trackpad i've ever used in terms of functionality[11:09:12] <Tsyesika> i prefer the US international one :P[11:09:25] <Tsyesika> i require too many utf-8 symbols[11:09:33] <Tsyesika> like ä and ì ;)[11:09:53] <Tsyesika> having micro and stuff is useful too[11:10:19] <munchausen> Urr. Some of the things I'm happy about now that I dont use a mac any more - 2 mouse buttons, more than 2 usb ports, a keyboard layout that actually works and has all the things you need on it[11:10:33] <jessicah> :)[11:10:38] <Tsyesika> i didn't care about 2 mouse buttons[11:10:44] <Tsyesika> you get so use to the 2 finger tab[11:10:46] <Tsyesika> and stuff like that[11:10:59] <munchausen> I found it doesnt work very well in linux[11:11:09] <munchausen> Or at all in haiku![11:11:14] <jessicah> my smaller eeepc has a more complete keyboard than my macbook air :p[11:11:15] <Tsyesika> oh yeh god yeh the macbook gestures under linux were awful[11:11:23] <Tsyesika> linux actually sucked on my linux machine[11:11:32] <Tsyesika> gah[11:11:36] <Tsyesika> i mean linux sucked on my mb[11:12:02] <Tsyesika> also if you select mac as the keyboard layout it... didn't give you the mac keyboard layout[11:12:03] <munchausen> yeah... the mouse is a pain. But I do most of my work in linux and got tired of using a virtual macine all the time[11:12:08] <Tsyesika> it just gave you this really awkward one[11:12:12] <munchausen> yeah[11:12:16] <jessicah> i'm sure my eeepc had three finger swipe before os x did[11:12:21] <munchausen> But even in mac os its a pain to get a #[11:12:23] <Tsyesika> and i was like "Wtf you doing linux"[11:12:29] <Tsyesika> munchausen nah i'ts not[11:12:29] <munchausen> or a pound sign[11:12:32] <Tsyesika> *it's[11:12:42] <munchausen> ok, but its a not normal key combo[11:12:45] <Tsyesika> but i got it into muscle memory like i know qwerty[11:12:46] <munchausen> alt-3 or something[11:13:07] <munchausen> and the pound sign just isnt there[11:13:44] <Tsyesika> ermm i don't remember now how to get it but you can[11:13:52] <Tsyesika> i use to know them all just without thinking[11:14:03] <Tsyesika> probs give me a mac and i could get them :P[11:17:27] *** HAIKU-Buildbot_ has quit IRC[11:17:49] *** HAIKU-Buildbot has joined #haiku[11:19:21] *** ianj has quit IRC[11:20:01] *** ianj has joined #haiku[11:24:37] <jessicah> jstressman: ugh, #8694 is better off as a preference[11:25:03] <jessicah> i had mkvs of life on mars with embedded english subtitles[11:25:24] <jessicah> had to get up off the coach for every episode to go turn off subtitles =/[11:25:54] *** lollo64it has quit IRC[11:26:43] <jessicah> couch[11:26:44] <jessicah> buh[11:26:48] <jessicah> sleepy[11:32:14] *** Luko has joined #haiku[11:33:02] *** TimKack has joined #haiku[11:40:36] <jstressman> jessicah: that's perfectly fine. :) that was kind of my intention.[11:40:56] <jstressman> (a preference as to whether or not to play a subtitle by default)[11:41:53] <jstressman> I'd leave it on all the time, as I'm guessing most people would. but your example was exactly the type of thing that came to mind as to why it would be better as an optional preference than something that just happened all the time.[11:43:51] <jessicah> err, should be like a dvd player. subtitles off by default[11:45:19] <jessicah> sleep now[11:45:23] <jessicah> night night =^.^=[11:50:30] <arfonzo> hm, has anyone installed hrev 44588? It seems to be missing libjpeg and libpng required by Web+ and a lot of apps I had installed are now broken... anyone experienced the same?[11:50:45] <jstressman> most people that get dvd's with subtitles don't actually want them. (most regional dvds around here have languages like french, spanish, italian, english.. whether you want them or not)[11:51:07] <jstressman> but I'm guessing most people don't download subtitled video files or videos with external subtitles unless they intentionally want to see those subtitles.[11:51:12] <jstressman> apples to oranges comparison.[11:51:30] <jstressman> arfonzo: I haven't yet.[11:52:15] <jstressman> jessicah: sweet dreams. :)[11:52:21] <jstressman> (going on 6am here)[11:57:09] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[12:01:29] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[12:01:47] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[12:03:23] *** Blub\w has joined #haiku[12:08:12] *** johnny_b has joined #haiku[12:08:27] <munchausen> arfonzo - wasn't there a bunch of commits that happened to do with libjpeg and libpng[12:08:32] <munchausen> maybe something to do with that[12:08:55] <munchausen> maybe they didnt get included or are now different enough to require re-linking?[12:08:59] <arfonzo> I have not reviewed the latest commit logs munchausen, that sounds like the culprit. Just wondering if anyone else experienced the same.[12:09:06] <munchausen> I think they were also changed in haiku-ports[12:09:33] <arfonzo> I tried re-linking but I got a few broken symbols, I'm trying to re build jpeg and libpng from haikuporter now. The download links were broken a few days ago last I tried.[12:09:36] <munchausen> I haven't tried that recent a build though so can't be sure, but I'd check that out[12:11:17] <munchausen> http://cia.vc/stats/project/Haiku/.message/80545[12:11:43] <munchausen> ^^ looks as though someone has fixed it and committed, but you might have to wait until tomorrow to get a pre-built nightly[12:11:58] <arfonzo> there is also a problem with libjpeg.so.8.0 being expected, for example, from Web+.[12:12:17] <arfonzo> munchausen, nah, I don't use the pre builts. I'll grab it from the repo later and try, thanks. I didn't update my local code since 2/3 days ago.[12:12:31] <munchausen> Ah wait, that was a few days ago[12:12:46] <munchausen> aha - thats probably your problem then[12:13:11] <munchausen> theres also another commit about re-linking all the optional packages[12:13:13] <arfonzo> yeah, that was a simple fix, however still leaves Web+ broken. Good thing I don't use it.[12:13:21] <arfonzo> I'll have to try that later.[12:13:26] <munchausen> what do you use instead?[12:13:38] *** Smartnow has joined #haiku[12:13:55] <jstressman> Qupzilla most likely.[12:13:58] <arfonzo> qupzilla. Which was also broke, but nothing a few symbolic links after re-installing the latest from haikuporter didn't fix.[12:19:21] <munchausen> yeah I use qupzilla a bit, but it's a bit crashy[12:19:27] *** TimKack has quit IRC[12:19:38] <munchausen> it's definitely faster than web+ though[12:20:19] *** diver has joined #haiku[12:20:52] <arfonzo> Yeah. It recovers fairly well, the crashiness is part of a bugged qtwebkit. Affects all browsers using that, not just Qupzilla.[12:21:05] *** diver has left #haiku[12:23:06] *** TimKack has joined #haiku[12:25:08] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[12:25:27] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[12:27:40] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[12:30:04] *** Smartnow has quit IRC[12:51:30] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[12:51:49] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[12:54:10] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[12:54:29] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[13:00:48] *** johnny_b has quit IRC[13:04:15] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[13:04:17] *** JsobCloud_ has joined #haiku[13:07:45] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[13:07:45] *** JsobCloud_ is now known as JsobCloud[13:10:25] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[13:10:44] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[13:11:24] *** XenoDuck has joined #haiku[13:12:23] *** swarfega has quit IRC[13:12:44] *** J-Ho has quit IRC[13:18:00] *** swarfega has joined #haiku[13:18:04] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[13:18:11] *** HaikuUser is now known as xxhell[13:23:59] <jstressman> http://r-wos.org/hacks/gti[13:24:03] <jstressman> *chuckle*[13:24:14] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[13:24:54] *** xxhell has quit IRC[13:36:52] <Anarchos> jstressman i always type lep instead of lpe to open Pe :)[13:51:02] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[13:51:21] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[13:54:00] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[13:54:01] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[13:54:46] <munchausen> I wondered why there was no way to launch Pe from the command line. I made a link[13:55:03] <munchausen> Since vim doesnt seem to work quite right and I havent looked into that too much yet[13:57:32] <Anarchos> munchausen now you get the solution :)[13:57:36] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[13:58:57] *** Luko has quit IRC[14:10:25] *** daedaluz has joined #haiku[14:17:30] *** letharion has quit IRC[14:18:11] *** CIA-58 has quit IRC[14:18:53] *** lollo64it has joined #haiku[14:20:20] *** ity has joined #haiku[14:22:41] *** ity has quit IRC[14:25:10] *** ity has joined #haiku[14:25:26] *** letharion has joined #haiku[14:26:44] *** JsobCloud_ has joined #haiku[14:29:27] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[14:29:27] *** JsobCloud_ is now known as JsobCloud[14:31:53] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[14:32:11] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[14:34:47] *** CIA-72 has joined #haiku[14:35:39] *** brianb_ has joined #haiku[14:36:42] *** brianb has quit IRC[15:01:16] *** oco2 has joined #haiku[15:05:29] *** CIA-72 has quit IRC[15:09:36] *** ity has quit IRC[15:11:33] *** dak has joined #haiku[15:11:34] *** CIA-69 has joined #haiku[15:12:42] *** ity has joined #haiku[15:14:00] *** CIA-69 has quit IRC[15:14:15] *** kcj has quit IRC[15:25:05] *** bjz has joined #haiku[15:29:45] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[15:30:30] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[15:31:16] *** ity has quit IRC[15:31:59] *** CIA-80 has joined #haiku[15:43:04] *** Luko has joined #haiku[15:44:11] *** adev_ has joined #haiku[15:44:28] *** duvjones has quit IRC[15:46:08] *** oco2 has quit IRC[15:53:59] *** JsobCloud_ has joined #haiku[15:57:29] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[15:57:29] *** JsobCloud_ is now known as JsobCloud[16:02:18] *** ity has joined #haiku[16:02:20] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[16:02:39] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[16:06:23] *** dylaneddies has joined #haiku[16:06:34] <dylaneddies> Hello all.[16:07:11] <dylaneddies> Does Haiku support EFI booting?[16:08:51] *** letharion has quit IRC[16:10:12] *** Negr0_VoP2P_LMin has quit IRC[16:10:42] * jstressman has no idea. :/[16:11:10] <dylaneddies> ah.. I use a mac and basically macs don't use BIOS.[16:11:41] <dylaneddies> and I've been having problems getting any kind of other opperating system working. :S[16:12:04] *** alexandros_c has quit IRC[16:12:55] *** letharion has joined #haiku[16:13:37] *** paul0 has joined #haiku[16:13:51] <dylaneddies> And also, is Haiku a UNIX based OS?[16:14:12] *** hamishm has joined #haiku[16:15:32] <OmniMancer> depends what do you mean by UNIX based[16:15:35] <OmniMancer> ?[16:19:14] <dylaneddies> Sorry, I got confused with something for a second, disregard my question regarding UNIX :-).[16:20:11] <OmniMancer> Haiku is in some ways posix compatible but I don't think it would be classed as unix based[16:23:14] *** ity has quit IRC[16:23:42] <dylaneddies> Ah, I see. Sorry if this is a stupid question, Does the kernel implement the UNIX api into the kernel?[16:26:15] <dylaneddies> Oops, grammar error. I'll be right back.[16:33:36] <dylaneddies> I'm back. :-).[16:33:49] *** paul0_ has joined #haiku[16:34:17] <OmniMancer> I'm not entirely sure what you are asking[16:34:18] *** paul0 has quit IRC[16:34:18] *** paul0_ is now known as paul0[16:42:20] *** negusnyul has joined #haiku[16:42:51] *** XenoDuck has quit IRC[16:43:22] *** ity has joined #haiku[16:44:48] *** ity has left #haiku[16:45:01] *** ity has joined #haiku[16:46:49] <dylaneddies> It doesn't matter, OmniMancer. But, do you know if Haiku supports EFI booting?[16:47:17] <OmniMancer> I don't know, though I don't think it does at this time[16:49:07] <dylaneddies> Okay, thank you :).[16:53:19] *** Spacewalker has quit IRC[16:54:01] *** TimKack has quit IRC[16:57:47] <dylaneddies> Goodbye. :-)[16:58:52] <OmniMancer> bye[16:59:12] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[16:59:13] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[16:59:21] *** johnny_b has joined #haiku[16:59:47] *** ity has quit IRC[17:01:08] *** dylaneddies has quit IRC[17:01:13] *** rootbaron has joined #haiku[17:02:51] *** JsobCloud has quit IRC[17:03:09] *** JsobCloud has joined #haiku[17:08:33] *** tqh has joined #haiku[17:09:28] *** rjg has quit IRC[17:13:20] *** rjg has joined #haiku[17:14:30] *** cherrypie has quit IRC[17:17:37] *** cherrypie has joined #haiku[17:29:35] *** 45PAAYUWC has joined #haiku[17:31:18] *** rimio has quit IRC[17:37:57] *** 45PAAYUWC is now known as karvjorm[17:40:20] *** rootbaron has left #haiku[17:48:44] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[17:50:59] *** rootbaron has joined #haiku[17:51:30] *** rootbaron has left #haiku[18:02:01] *** paul0 has quit IRC[18:12:05] *** ziomatto has joined #haiku[18:12:58] *** ziomatto has quit IRC[18:15:42] *** adev_ has quit IRC[18:20:45] *** _marc` has quit IRC[18:25:04] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[18:27:03] *** robert_negro has joined #haiku[18:27:47] *** jmelesky has joined #haiku[18:28:42] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[18:29:00] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[18:32:15] *** luroh has joined #haiku[18:37:32] *** leszek has joined #haiku[18:38:19] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[18:38:39] <leszek> hi[18:41:55] *** bjz has quit IRC[18:42:18] *** robert_negro has quit IRC[18:46:03] *** paul0 has joined #haiku[18:52:15] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[18:52:15] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[18:56:27] *** RaptorFX has joined #haiku[18:56:50] *** RaptorFX has quit IRC[18:58:47] *** robert_negro has joined #haiku[19:00:11] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[19:00:46] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[19:03:13] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[19:05:06] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[19:07:32] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[19:08:31] *** leszek has quit IRC[19:09:03] *** Soft has quit IRC[19:09:12] *** Soft has joined #haiku[19:09:12] *** leszek has joined #haiku[19:09:32] <leszek> re[19:20:45] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[19:20:47] *** robert_negro has left #haiku[19:24:51] *** idefix_gromit has joined #haiku[19:25:46] *** tqh has quit IRC[19:28:01] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[19:29:59] *** dak has quit IRC[19:31:50] *** tqh has joined #haiku[19:37:38] *** alexandros_c has joined #haiku[19:39:15] *** CIA-80 has quit IRC[19:40:39] *** pitelpan has joined #haiku[19:40:40] *** pitelpan has joined #haiku[19:43:31] *** qptain_Nemo has joined #haiku[19:51:03] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[20:02:46] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[20:08:06] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[20:14:01] *** oco2 has joined #haiku[20:26:04] *** pitelpan has quit IRC[20:28:29] *** pitelpan has joined #haiku[20:29:43] *** CIA-82 has joined #haiku[20:30:37] *** Negr0_VoP2P has joined #haiku[20:31:12] *** DimitrisGR has joined #haiku[20:32:00] *** araxeus has joined #haiku[20:32:29] *** Luko has quit IRC[20:38:35] *** Blub\w has quit IRC[20:40:30] *** CIA-82 has quit IRC[20:41:39] *** tracius has joined #haiku[20:42:22] *** tracius has quit IRC[20:44:52] *** PasNox has quit IRC[20:44:59] *** PasNox_ has joined #haiku[20:47:41] *** Spacewalker has quit IRC[20:49:43] *** robert_negro has joined #haiku[20:50:36] *** AlienSoldier has joined #haiku[20:57:06] *** vezhlys has joined #haiku[20:58:53] *** nsuperbus has quit IRC[20:59:51] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[20:59:52] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[21:00:18] *** pitelpan has quit IRC[21:01:41] *** karvjorm has left #haiku[21:06:42] *** _marc` has quit IRC[21:06:50] *** paul0 has quit IRC[21:07:17] *** Spacewalker has quit IRC[21:07:43] *** PasNox_ is now known as PasNox[21:08:40] *** johnny_b has quit IRC[21:09:05] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[21:17:25] *** araxeus has quit IRC[21:24:41] *** yosafbridge has quit IRC[21:25:46] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[21:26:54] *** elliottc1ble has quit IRC[21:39:49] *** MatthewH12 has joined #haiku[21:44:01] *** rdmr has joined #haiku[21:44:20] *** pvalue has joined #haiku[21:45:02] *** rdmr has quit IRC[21:46:01] *** idefix_gromit has left #haiku[21:47:33] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[21:47:33] *** Spacewalker has joined #haiku[21:52:48] *** CIA-80 has joined #haiku[21:57:49] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[22:00:34] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[22:01:22] *** groia9 has joined #haiku[22:01:33] <groia9> Hi everyone[22:02:10] <Tsyesika> hey[22:02:17] *** araxeus has joined #haiku[22:02:49] *** DimitrisGR has left #haiku[22:02:54] <groia9> so I installed Haiku on a real machine, on a separate partition. It worked well for a while, but now Haiku has OVERWRITTEN the adjacent partition (where my linux lives)[22:03:24] <groia9> that's a pretty horrible bug - any tickets on it i can comment on?[22:03:40] <PulkoMandy> never heard of such a thing[22:03:49] <tqh> groia9 report a new one. This sounds serious.[22:03:52] <groia9> also, PCnet32 doesn't work on my smp unless i disable smp[22:03:53] <PulkoMandy> is your hard disk very big ?[22:04:06] <groia9> i guess, it's 1 tb[22:04:10] <groia9> pretty normal these days[22:04:20] <groia9> WD[22:04:22] <tqh> is it a gpt disk?[22:04:26] <groia9> yup[22:05:16] <tqh> ah, probably a mbr hybrid[22:05:37] <groia9> it's pretty bad for me since it borked the main machine... fucking complete reinstall[22:05:45] <groia9> fortunately i had backup of most stuff[22:05:54] <PulkoMandy> if mbr and gpt are out of sync you will likely get in trouble yes[22:05:55] <groia9> guess that's the punishment for running alpha on production machines[22:05:55] <groia9> haha[22:06:03] *** yosafbridge has joined #haiku[22:06:16] <PulkoMandy> (likely to happen if you created a partition using our tools)[22:06:25] <PulkoMandy> (since we don't handle the gpt part and only change the mbr)[22:06:36] *** Colin_Finck has joined #haiku[22:06:45] <groia9> indeed[22:07:00] *** Dane_ has joined #haiku[22:07:22] *** Colin_Finck has quit IRC[22:07:22] *** Colin_Finck has joined #haiku[22:07:32] <groia9> i come back to haiku once a year in hopes it's getting close to ready, but noooo[22:07:46] <groia9> guess i have to leave my BeOS dreams behind for another year[22:07:55] <tqh> I'm really sorry about that. We are a bit lacking in gpt, and if you have both mbr and gpt there are problems.[22:08:01] <groia9> where's the ticket system again?[22:08:05] <Tsyesika> dev.haiku-os.org[22:08:09] <groia9> k[22:08:11] <groia9> FUCK[22:08:18] <PulkoMandy> we are making progress toward getting ready[22:08:38] <Dane_> uh oh...[22:08:39] <Dane_> The 870-a G46 motherboard... looks like maybe it's been discontinued??[22:08:51] <Dane_> anybody know if the 970-A series would work?[22:08:52] *** diver has joined #haiku[22:08:54] <groia9> the PCnet32 driver has been borked for at least two years[22:08:54] <PulkoMandy> but it's not an easy task, particularly with the changes happenning to pc compatible standard like GPT...[22:09:09] <groia9> osdev is hard. period.[22:09:16] <groia9> don't let dumbasses do it[22:09:24] <Dane_> that rules me out :-)[22:09:25] <groia9> the net driver code is insane[22:10:13] * Dane_ will check back later in case anyone has any insights on the mobo question above[22:10:25] <groia9> hopefully someone will get their act together an put on a haiku api and gui on top of linux, only way to get all the needed drivers in practical terms[22:10:48] <groia9> just too much hardware out there for such a small project, alas[22:10:58] *** volci has quit IRC[22:11:00] <PulkoMandy> Dane_: still using it for BeOS ? or is it for Haiku ?[22:11:20] <PulkoMandy> groia9: there are technical problems in doingthat[22:11:27] <groia9> of course[22:11:30] <PulkoMandy> our kernel is tied to the way the api works and tuned for it[22:11:39] <groia9> i know, i've hacked on it[22:11:44] <groia9> in the NewOS days too[22:11:48] <groia9> it's a silly approach[22:11:51] <PulkoMandy> so you would lose most of the interest of haiku, lightweitness, response times, all that[22:12:02] <PulkoMandy> idon't think it's worth it[22:12:04] <groia9> bleah, the linux kernel would provide all that[22:12:09] <groia9> AND all the drivers[22:12:12] <groia9> totally worth it[22:12:15] <PulkoMandy> also, we are able to use FreeBSD drivers for network cards[22:12:21] <PulkoMandy> while keeping our kernel[22:12:31] <groia9> FreeBSD drivers are fewer and shittier, tho[22:12:45] <groia9> and then there's all the other non-nic drivers[22:13:25] <groia9> I absolutely love BeOS and crave for a modernized version, but haiku is just never finishing. 10 years and partitions are still overwritten? for fucks sake...[22:13:42] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[22:13:52] <groia9> yes, the partition kill got me into a bad mood, sry[22:14:03] <PulkoMandy> well, the blueEyedOs project tried the API-over-linux way, and didn't succeed[22:14:19] <groia9> that's not proof of anything[22:14:24] <PulkoMandy> sure[22:14:25] <groia9> other than them being morons[22:14:34] <groia9> of course it would work[22:14:45] <PulkoMandy> well, and it was linux from 10 years ago, which didn't help I guess[22:14:50] <groia9> the SkyOS dude did it in a couple of weekends[22:15:04] <groia9> alas, the project is dead (and not beos-ish)[22:15:22] <PulkoMandy> mh... I see a pattern about dying projects there[22:15:32] <groia9> not unlike haiku[22:15:43] <groia9> despite not being based on linux[22:15:48] <groia9> lesson: don't generalize[22:16:30] <jayrulez> There is no need to run linux kernel in order to use linux drivers.[22:16:49] <groia9> no, but there are other reasons[22:17:09] <groia9> like... a war-tested kernel that actually works on smp[22:17:09] <jayrulez> like?[22:17:17] <groia9> and optimized like crazy[22:17:19] <groia9> portability[22:17:25] <groia9> etc, etc[22:17:48] <jessicah> groia9: take some time out to chill, then come back :)[22:17:53] <groia9> the manpower needed for a decent kernel these days is just too much[22:17:59] <PulkoMandy> well, the Haiku project went with their own kernel and I don't think that's going to change[22:18:08] <PulkoMandy> but we would be happy to see others embrassing the Be API[22:18:10] <jayrulez> linux kernel would not fit well with Haiku[22:18:13] <groia9> jessicah: my partition died cuz of haiku. I let the steam out here, k?[22:18:39] <jessicah> groia9: the web pages clearly say it's alpha, and do not use on production machines[22:18:50] <groia9> yes?[22:19:00] <jayrulez> That was careless.[22:19:15] <PulkoMandy> well[22:19:20] <PulkoMandy> the bug should be fixed anyway[22:19:24] <jayrulez> For driver reuse, there is DDEKit http://wiki.tudos.org/DDE/DDEKit[22:19:24] <jessicah> so don't get all hot headed for your carelessness[22:19:28] <groia9> whatever[22:19:33] <PulkoMandy> to quote axel, "obviously, this shouldn't happen"[22:19:47] <groia9> axel is a dumbfuck[22:20:06] <groia9> every other line he commits has a bug in it[22:20:06] <jayrulez> Genode is using it http://genode.org/documentation/api/dde_kit_index It uses a relatively small amount of code in order to reuse unmodified linux drivers[22:20:07] <groia9> really[22:20:15] <jessicah> groia9: seriously, report the bug, then go chill[22:20:21] <groia9> nah[22:20:43] <groia9> fucking amateurs[22:20:48] *** groia9 has quit IRC[22:22:05] <vezhlys> che che, ruined partitions usually are problem of over-confident or newbie users. not OS or installer.[22:22:42] <PulkoMandy> we should still investigate the problem anyway[22:23:03] <PulkoMandy> if we release alpha4 with an actual bug like this and get dozen of angry users, it's not a nice thing[22:23:38] <tqh> known troll, he read my bug report on the issue. It only happens if you have hybrig gpt partitioning, which means you arn't following any spec. But yes we should fix it.[22:23:58] *** leszek has quit IRC[22:24:19] <PulkoMandy> tqh: how comes it's not an alpha 4 blocker ?[22:24:33] <PulkoMandy> (or did I miss it ?)[22:24:52] <jessicah> it should detect if the protective MBR doesn't cover whole drive, and simply abort partitioning[22:25:01] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[22:25:14] <jessicah> (and that it's a gpt disk to begin with)[22:25:35] <tqh> PulkoMandy, it's a problem if you build under linux, not in the OS itself afaik. https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/8434[22:26:03] <pvalue> /n[22:27:49] <jayrulez> For wider range of drivers, I suggest you look into DDE. The maintennance overhead is small and you can get a lot of drivers for that small maintennance overhead. http://wiki.tudos.org/DDE/DDEKit[22:27:50] <jayrulez> http://genode.org/documentation/release-notes/12.05#Re-approaching_the_Linux_device-driver_environment[22:31:28] <PulkoMandy> we had a project about running the linux kernel in a sandbox to use their drivers in last year gsoc[22:31:45] <PulkoMandy> unfortunately the student vanished after some time and we got nothing useable out of it[22:32:01] <PulkoMandy> and since it was based on his own previous works, no dev able to continue the project[22:32:25] <tqh> it needs a lot of legwork, and without extra hands it's hard to pursue.[22:35:48] <jayrulez> Even using the DDEkit approach?[22:37:32] <tqh> Can't say as I don't know, but someone needs to read up on it, adapt to Haiku OS and do a proof of concept. Hard to estimate.[22:37:37] <PulkoMandy> they don't seem to plan porting it to other hos OSes ?[22:38:06] <PulkoMandy> so it could turn out the same as Gallium 3D - in theory all nice and portable, and actually tied to the driver architecture of linux kernel[22:38:44] <PulkoMandy> it doesn't look much further than our freeBSD compatibility layer either[22:42:46] <PulkoMandy> yes, seems quite similar to our freebsd network layer[22:43:20] <PulkoMandy> seeing that our USB support is quite good already, and drivers not too hard to port[22:43:35] <PulkoMandy> and the video card part is usually too complex to take such an approach[22:43:47] <PulkoMandy> (not to mention the way app_server works is quite different from X11 stack)[22:43:56] <PulkoMandy> I think we can't improve much on that area[22:44:04] *** vooshy has joined #haiku[22:47:33] <jayrulez> You can read the second link. A maintennance overhead of about 1000 lines of code enables the use of more than 100000 lines of code in network drivers.[22:47:47] <PulkoMandy> yes, it goes towards what we're already doing[22:48:00] <PulkoMandy> our freebsd compatibility layer is just that[22:48:19] <PulkoMandy> and I don't think we need to do it for other kind of devices[22:48:36] <PulkoMandy> or do we ? any example ?[22:50:13] <tqh> This our glue code for a wifi driver from FreeBSD, I think we can reduce this more btw: http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/tree/src/add-ons/kernel/drivers/network/wlan/iprowifi4965/glue.c[22:50:27] <jayrulez> None off the top of my head. The only motivation would be that linux has quite a lot more network card drivers.[22:50:46] <PulkoMandy> there are problems with using the linux drivers[22:50:58] <PulkoMandy> the first one is licencing (we try to go BSD style licences whenever possible)[22:51:09] <PulkoMandy> and the second one is the internals of linux have no stable API[22:51:21] <PulkoMandy> and they tend to change a lot over releases[22:51:37] <PulkoMandy> while FreeBSD seems to not need as much work to keep up to date[22:51:47] <PulkoMandy> moreover, their driver code is cleaner and easier to read[22:52:01] <PulkoMandy> so we have at least some idea on what's going on inside[22:52:39] <tqh> I always have issues with linux drivers.[22:53:24] <PulkoMandy> yes, they get more drivers only because they accept whatever patches comes in without time to carefully test it or whatever[22:53:56] <PulkoMandy> and with the huge ecosystem of distros, software stacks and whatnot, it's hard for an end-user to make a bug report that successfully foes up to the kernel team[22:54:22] <PulkoMandy> while FreeBSD is, like Haiku, straight from kernel devs to end user :)[22:57:30] <tqh> but it might be a good approach, just that those already working are tied up with other things.[22:58:09] *** Colin_Finck has quit IRC[22:59:08] <PulkoMandy> well, it would likely work, but is it worth the effort ?[22:59:24] *** DocPheniX has joined #haiku[22:59:34] <PulkoMandy> even if in the end it's only ~1000 lines of code to write, you still need to get deep knowledge of the targetted OS internals[22:59:38] <tqh> they wouldn't call it research if we knew what we are doing :)[23:00:35] <PulkoMandy> and, these years of research that end up in few lines of code written usually aren't the most motivating stuff[23:00:46] <PulkoMandy> unless they really make a huge breakthrough in usability[23:00:55] <PulkoMandy> and I think Haiku is past that point for now[23:01:01] <PulkoMandy> (may change with future hardware)[23:01:09] <Tsyesika> Does haiku have dvorak?[23:02:08] * tqh don't know[23:02:40] <Tsyesika> i'm looking in keymap and can't see it in the list or menus[23:03:10] <PulkoMandy> it's in there[23:03:17] <Tsyesika> hmm[23:03:18] <PulkoMandy> Dvorak and Dvorak (programmer's)[23:03:32] <PulkoMandy> between Dutch and Esperanto[23:03:33] <Tsyesika> AH![23:03:36] <Tsyesika> thanks![23:03:39] * Tsyesika is blind[23:04:52] <PulkoMandy> te list is too long, as well :)[23:04:58] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[23:05:21] <Tsyesika> I see the windows/super key isn't mapped to any keys... how come? that's tons of combos which could be used to get utf-8 chars[23:05:28] *** AlienSoldier has joined #haiku[23:05:39] <tqh> btw, if you have suggestions adding it as an enhancement ticket as dev.haiku-os.org is a good way to make a official request: https://dev.haiku-os.org/[23:05:48] <Tsyesika> tqh I know :)[23:06:05] <PulkoMandy> it's mapped on the one I use (French)[23:06:15] <Tsyesika> dvorak french?[23:06:25] <Tsyesika> it's mapped on international US[23:06:28] <tqh> Tsyesika, ah good, it was a comment to another discussion though.[23:06:32] <PulkoMandy> no, plain french here (not that's a good choice...)[23:06:38] <Tsyesika> tqh ooh sorry[23:06:47] <PulkoMandy> but some keymaps have strange mappings yes[23:07:00] <Tsyesika> i'm using US international because the UK one doesn't map any utf-8 chars[23:07:06] <Tsyesika> so i can't use it[23:07:10] <PulkoMandy> for example the french one would need an extra modifier since we have ctrl, alt, windows, altgr on the keyboard[23:07:17] <PulkoMandy> same for german and some others[23:07:35] <PulkoMandy> haiku just doesn't have enough modifiers in the API for that, which leads to some confusion[23:07:46] <Tsyesika> like I use ì and ä far too much to use UK keyboard[23:07:55] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[23:08:21] <PulkoMandy> if you edit the keymap, please submit a patch[23:08:48] <PulkoMandy> that being said, time to sleep here :)[23:08:52] <Tsyesika> and it's nice to be able to type stuff like umlaut u and ezsett[23:09:00] <Tsyesika> PulkoMandy okay :P[23:09:00] <PulkoMandy> 'night (or whatever time of day it is for you)[23:09:01] <Tsyesika> i might[23:09:06] *** Barrett has quit IRC[23:09:09] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[23:10:25] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[23:11:00] *** robert_negro has left #haiku[23:19:58] *** Spacewalker has quit IRC[23:21:23] *** dcase has quit IRC[23:22:21] *** jmelesky_ has joined #haiku[23:23:25] *** jmelesky has quit IRC[23:23:31] *** tqh has quit IRC[23:32:14] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[23:34:15] *** kcj has joined #haiku[23:35:28] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[23:40:12] *** araxeus has quit IRC[23:51:02] *** Ingenu has quit IRC