August 11, 2012 
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August 11, 2012 [00:00:47] <jessicah`> some really weird audio issues on this box[00:01:48] *** jjido has quit IRC[00:02:37] *** Megaf has quit IRC[00:03:17] *** BitPuffin has quit IRC[00:03:25] <jessicah`> sooo glitchy[00:07:37] *** jessicah` has quit IRC[00:07:38] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[00:08:18] *** negusnyul has quit IRC[00:12:02] *** AlienSoldier has joined #haiku[00:13:39] *** Luko has quit IRC[00:14:59] <jessicah> and KDL :)[00:15:21] <jessicah> oh yay, bumblebee gone. zomg, talk about kitten magnet...[00:15:41] <dreamed> heh. cicadas too.[00:16:06] *** Blub\w has quit IRC[00:19:04] *** freakazoid0223 has quit IRC[00:21:15] *** BitPuffin has joined #haiku[00:26:10] *** Postumus has quit IRC[00:34:09] *** vezhlys has quit IRC[00:40:35] *** vezhlys has joined #haiku[00:52:12] *** adb has quit IRC[00:53:36] *** dcase has quit IRC[00:53:51] *** ianj has joined #haiku[00:58:04] *** BitPuffin_ has joined #haiku[00:58:30] *** BitPuffin has quit IRC[00:59:58] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:00:28] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:02:05] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[01:05:54] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[01:06:20] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[01:07:49] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has joined #haiku[01:09:25] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:10:49] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:11:28] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[01:12:56] *** adb has joined #haiku[01:13:47] *** stargater has joined #haiku[01:13:50] <stargater> hi[01:15:43] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:18:34] <jstressman> stargater: :)[01:19:20] <stargater> hi jstressman[01:20:45] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:21:37] <stargater> kallisti5: hi[01:22:11] <jstressman> doing a fresh clean install of Haiku in my virtualbox[01:22:25] <jstressman> it was getting a bit out of date...[01:22:29] <jstressman> ~200 revs behind.[01:23:48] <jstressman> stargater: http://haikudou.blogspot.com/2012/08/new-redgreen-color-blind-friendly-pe.html[01:23:53] <jstressman> I updated the blog. :)[01:24:20] <jstressman> leavengood says he'll probably add the source code icons this weekend, as they're part of the native Haiku MIME types, and separate from Pe.[01:25:20] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:26:35] *** adb has quit IRC[01:26:37] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:30:40] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:32:16] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:35:31] <CIA-63> HaikuPorts: scottmc * r2015 /haikuports/trunk/dev-lang/python/ (patches/python-2.6.8.patch python-2.6.8.bep) http://ports.haiku-files.org/changeset/2015 : Updated python to 2.6.8[01:38:53] *** kcj has quit IRC[01:39:16] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:40:07] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:41:15] <stargater> jstressman: nice blog news, perfect[01:41:20] <stargater> good job.[01:41:28] <stargater> i like the new icons[01:45:02] <jstressman> thank you :)[01:48:37] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:50:56] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[01:51:18] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has quit IRC[01:52:41] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:53:36] <stargater> but the code icon i see -----$ its nicer when its eg: http://www.hypercosm.com/google_code/images/source_code_icon.jpg , http://prometheus-digi.sourceforge.net/images/icon_bin.png , http://clam-project.org/images/sourcecode_icon.png[01:54:37] <stargater> i like { -----}[01:55:43] <stargater> jstressman: see you my links?[01:55:51] *** stargater has quit IRC[01:56:09] *** stargater has joined #haiku[01:56:18] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has joined #haiku[01:56:27] <stargater> jstressman: see you my links?[01:57:48] *** slubman has quit IRC[01:58:45] *** slubman has joined #haiku[01:58:53] <stargater> jstressman: i like this in the source code icon:[01:58:56] <stargater> { ----- ---- ---- ---- ----- ---- ---- ---- ----- ---- ---- ---- ----- ---- ---- --- }[01:59:20] <stargater> or // source code[01:59:24] <stargater> { ----- ---- ---- ---- ----- ---- ---- ---- ----- ---- ---- ---- ----- ---- ---- --- }[02:02:00] <jstressman> I see your links...[02:02:28] <jstressman> it's harder to fit stuff like that in at the small size and angle.[02:02:41] *** slubman_ has joined #haiku[02:02:49] <jstressman> I was just emulating the look/feel of the existing text file icons[02:02:58] *** slubman has quit IRC[02:03:11] *** swarfega has joined #haiku[02:06:05] *** Cenbe has quit IRC[02:07:38] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has quit IRC[02:08:49] *** Cenbe has joined #haiku[02:10:19] *** slubman_ has quit IRC[02:10:20] *** slubman has joined #haiku[02:10:47] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has joined #haiku[02:12:22] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has quit IRC[02:13:01] *** swarfega has quit IRC[02:13:09] *** swarfega has joined #haiku[02:20:35] <stargater> jstressman: and when you used { } in a center of icon paper and big[02:22:00] *** slubman has quit IRC[02:24:10] *** slubman has joined #haiku[02:24:25] *** swarfega has quit IRC[02:24:35] *** swarfega has joined #haiku[02:26:20] *** jmelesky has quit IRC[02:30:13] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[02:30:36] <HaikuUser> hello[02:30:58] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[02:31:20] *** slubman has quit IRC[02:32:41] *** NewtonNerd has joined #haiku[02:32:56] <NewtonNerd> Hello haiku peeps[02:33:25] <NewtonNerd> have a question, you guy's seem to be in the "OS Salvage" "buisness"[02:33:56] <NewtonNerd> and while salvaging a great desktop OS is a wonderful idea, I was curious if any of you knew of anyone interested in saving whats left of Newton OS[02:34:19] <NewtonNerd> iOS, and Android are arguably less user friendly and generally great.[02:34:54] <NewtonNerd> and I'm getting tired of using a Messagepad 2100 in black and white, and tired of the defeatist attitudes of the newton community as a whole[02:36:37] <stargater> hi NewtonNerd[02:36:43] <NewtonNerd> Hello[02:37:20] *** slubman has joined #haiku[02:37:29] <stargater> i understand your question[02:37:40] <NewtonNerd> I'm fully aware of the major differences between this project and the proposed, I just figured, there must be at least one BEOS user that liked Newton OS as well[02:39:16] <NewtonNerd> I'm also aware of the legal and logistical complications involved in salvaging, rewriting, porting, or making a work alike clone of NOS[02:39:43] <NewtonNerd> but come on… am I the only one who thinks modern "tablets" and "smart" devices are a joke?[02:40:06] *** BitPuffin_ has quit IRC[02:42:10] *** slubman has quit IRC[02:42:36] <NewtonNerd> the newton community, they want to keep the OS alive, but they are god awful lazy[02:43:19] <NewtonNerd> someone was talking on their mailing list of adding ssl to the networking stack, and most of the replies to such talk were[02:43:47] *** mmadia has quit IRC[02:43:56] <NewtonNerd> it could take a whole "GASP" year of weekend coding to do something like that, given that little to no documentation on the networking stack exists…[02:44:43] <NewtonNerd> and it was like… ARE YOU KIDDING… linux nerds do this kinda crap all the time without getting paid… and they are just UPDATING things… and your complaining about something essential to salvaging the OS you want to keep using...[02:44:59] <NewtonNerd> so I came here… I figured there must be at least one person here, who could understand[02:46:09] *** swarfega has quit IRC[02:46:35] *** swarfega has joined #haiku[02:47:33] *** slubman has joined #haiku[02:48:29] <stargater> NewtonNerd: haiku is a complitly os , he have all moder task for a os.[02:48:52] <NewtonNerd> what?[02:48:56] <stargater> fast, protectet of memory, multithreading, multitasking ...[02:49:11] <NewtonNerd> no I understand what haiku is[02:49:19] <stargater> ok[02:49:35] <stargater> do you code for haiku os ?[02:49:44] <NewtonNerd> I'm trying to find out if any of you haiku geeks would like to be part of another project to save another OS as well[02:50:21] *** netstar has joined #haiku[02:50:30] <stargater> hi netstar[02:50:39] <netstar> Hi :)[02:51:31] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[02:51:33] *** jimage has quit IRC[02:51:33] *** Negr0_VoP2P has quit IRC[02:51:33] *** AmineKhaldi has quit IRC[02:51:34] *** jstressman has quit IRC[02:51:35] *** diver has quit IRC[02:51:36] <netstar> ouch[02:52:01] <NewtonNerd> I don't, I'm currently trying to patch NOS NIE 2.0 for SSL so I don't have to forward my gmail through gmx… its not going very well[02:52:16] *** Negr0_VoP2P has joined #haiku[02:55:07] <NewtonNerd> I came here, because I maintain an interest in Haiku, and I though it might be possible that someone here, may have an interest in "salvaging" more than just BEOS, and may have an interest in salvaging NOS as well, because the actual newton community sure as hell wants to, but they definitely don't have the drive to actually do so.[02:55:07] *** slubman has quit IRC[02:57:59] *** jstressman has joined #haiku[02:57:59] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[02:57:59] *** jimage has joined #haiku[02:58:00] *** AmineKhaldi has joined #haiku[02:58:00] *** diver has joined #haiku[02:59:30] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[02:59:49] *** slubman has joined #haiku[02:59:56] <jstressman> ugh...[03:00:05] <jstressman> Haiku keeps crashing to KDL when I exit the game. :([03:00:16] <stargater> :_)[03:00:36] <ddavid123> What game?[03:00:41] <jstressman> Quake3.[03:01:33] <stargater> jstressman: nice on the new rev on haiku[03:01:39] <ddavid123> app server can't handle the different screen resolutions?[03:02:01] <stargater> i think the app server can it do[03:03:03] <ddavid123> may be interesting to change the in-game resolution up and down a few times to see if that has any effect.[03:03:18] <stargater> ok[03:03:31] <ddavid123> have to go. later.[03:03:34] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[03:04:09] *** rennj has joined #haiku[03:04:18] <jstressman> http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d12/phreadom/q3exitkdl2.png[03:09:40] *** slubman has quit IRC[03:10:43] *** slubman has joined #haiku[03:13:19] *** jstressman has quit IRC[03:13:27] *** jstressman has joined #haiku[03:14:25] *** adin has joined #haiku[03:17:39] <adin> hi folks, i just got to know that you exist, and im glad that somenone continues to build on the idea of Be OS[03:18:13] *** slubman has quit IRC[03:18:29] <NewtonNerd> It's pretty awesome isn't it Adin… I've been trying to get some people on here interested in continuing whats left of Newton OS as well… but they seem uninterested[03:18:51] <stargater> adin: hi , nice to see you here[03:18:56] <adin> Newton OS! ouu thats been pretty far now[03:19:21] <adin> well i guess all the touchy things swallowed the market where newton was[03:19:25] <stargater> NewtonNerd: sorry i cant understand what you mean[03:19:58] <stargater> Haiku os is in development, some stuffe are not final and need some works[03:20:15] <stargater> haiku need at time user, geeks and coder[03:20:38] <adin> stargater: i understand that, its in alpha version... as far as i remember be os wasnt much further[03:21:17] <NewtonNerd> lol…[03:21:23] <stargater> adin: haiku is alpha but in other world have os final but its alpha too ;-)[03:21:29] *** slubman has joined #haiku[03:21:39] <NewtonNerd> I'm trying to get the people here interested in salvaging Newton as well, because, Haiku on the desktop[03:21:59] <adin> stargater:nowadays, i think, you could get some attention from all the retro geeks who seek some sort of esthetic-intellectual haven[03:22:29] *** stef_ has joined #haiku[03:22:41] <NewtonNerd> and newton on the handheld would be a good combo[03:22:45] <adin> NewtonNerd: but newton was interconnected with special hardware...[03:23:18] <NewtonNerd> It was, sorta[03:23:32] <NewtonNerd> however, it had a special rom extension called REX[03:23:41] <NewtonNerd> that allowed drivers for any hardware to be written[03:23:58] <jstressman> https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/8870[03:24:18] <NewtonNerd> sharp and several other companies took advantage of this to run it on their hardware, and really, the only "special" hardware it needed at the time[03:24:33] <NewtonNerd> was a device with a ARM CPU and a touch screen, which were rare then…[03:24:37] *** stef has quit IRC[03:24:38] <NewtonNerd> now they are all over the place[03:25:18] <adin> NewtonNerd:oh i didnt know that... i only remember the big and heavy thingy able to recognize hanwriting, kinda)[03:25:35] <NewtonNerd> In fact the Newton Emulator, doesn't even emulate Newton hardware.. it just emulates an arm CPU, and then has a bunch of Rex rom extension drivers so that it can output sound and use input natively[03:26:09] <NewtonNerd> yeah, 2 pounds, about the size of a kindle, and they still make the iphone and android devices look like polished turds[03:27:05] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[03:27:11] <stargater> hi OmniMancer[03:27:15] <NewtonNerd> but if you want to look at it like that and say "oh well it required special hardware" so did BEOS originally[03:27:19] <NewtonNerd> it ran on the BEbox[03:27:21] <adin> NewtonNerd:well i think nowadays you can ppl get interested into sth so 80s like, like Be OS was. Because its stylish again (still)[03:27:22] <NewtonNerd> and that was it[03:27:38] <NewtonNerd> ....[03:27:44] <NewtonNerd> that wasn't the 80s[03:27:47] <NewtonNerd> it was the mid ninties[03:27:53] <NewtonNerd> if you want to get people interested in 80s[03:27:55] <NewtonNerd> you would be talking[03:28:03] <NewtonNerd> Mac OS 1 through like 4[03:28:03] <adin> NewtonNerd:i know but the visual style was kinda isotropic[03:28:08] <adin> nn[03:28:14] <NewtonNerd> and Dos[03:28:17] <NewtonNerd> IDK[03:28:35] <NewtonNerd> they UI design was very modern then and until the early 2000's even[03:28:40] <NewtonNerd> its still not very retro[03:28:45] <NewtonNerd> if your looking for retro asthetic[03:28:50] <adin> i mean those custom icons and widgets, they were in a way modern, but still isotropic[03:29:00] <NewtonNerd> you'd need to go back to like visi OS or[03:29:01] <NewtonNerd> like[03:29:04] <NewtonNerd> windows 2[03:29:10] <NewtonNerd> or some of those dos shells[03:29:21] <adin> noo:)[03:29:25] *** slubman has quit IRC[03:29:27] *** stargater has quit IRC[03:29:44] <NewtonNerd> here, hold up[03:29:46] <jstressman> http://ports.haiku-files.org/ticket/378[03:29:53] <adin> i think we miss our points a bit. anyway im glad someone revived it in a way[03:29:57] <jstressman> if anyone else wants to try it (and see if they get the KDL too) :P[03:30:24] *** slubman has joined #haiku[03:32:45] *** stargater has joined #haiku[03:32:46] <adin> good luck guys, im eager to try your haiku soon[03:32:53] <stargater> re[03:32:54] <NewtonNerd> lol[03:33:03] <NewtonNerd> Adin:[03:33:09] <NewtonNerd> its not about the retro look or feel[03:33:15] <NewtonNerd> its about the function[03:33:18] <adin> yes?[03:33:18] <NewtonNerd> BEOS[03:33:26] <NewtonNerd> had lots of things that modern OS's never adopted[03:33:29] <NewtonNerd> same with Newton OS[03:33:32] <stargater> adin: you are a developer?[03:33:43] <NewtonNerd> thats why I'm trying to find people, like the people who are working on BEOS[03:33:47] <NewtonNerd> to help save Newton OS[03:34:04] <adin> ah ok ok, but u were talking abt ppl getting interested, and mostly ppl get interested because of how things look like (users)[03:34:16] <adin> without users theres no need to do anything[03:34:20] <NewtonNerd> I'm a user[03:34:23] <NewtonNerd> and I don[03:34:23] <NewtonNerd> t[03:34:23] <NewtonNerd> don't[03:34:28] <NewtonNerd> I get interested in features[03:34:30] <adin> stargater:no, im out of it for now[03:34:37] <NewtonNerd> getting interested in looks, is a more recent thing[03:34:47] <NewtonNerd> OS's used to be advertised by their capabilities[03:34:55] <NewtonNerd> these day's its all about how shiny they are[03:35:00] <NewtonNerd> they are useless but they are shiny[03:35:24] <netstar> my haiku desktop is shiny shiny shiny boots of leather[03:35:32] <adin> NewtonNerd: that was before current era of new age of icons[03:35:49] <NewtonNerd> if you want to get people interested in an older OS thats more functional you have to do it based on ability, and you want to do it based on ability, because the people you want to get interested are the ones that are dejected and disenchanted by modern OS's inability to do anything particularly useful[03:36:33] <NewtonNerd> Theres no point in trying to gear an OS designed for usability and function and speed and, gear towards power users, at people who would be happy with a polished turd[03:36:49] <adin> NewtonNerd:what do you miss in nowadays OSs?[03:36:59] <NewtonNerd> Well…[03:37:00] <NewtonNerd> OK[03:37:02] <NewtonNerd> Mac OS[03:37:04] <NewtonNerd> is ok still[03:37:10] *** MDLeBlanc has joined #haiku[03:37:12] <NewtonNerd> but its getting worse[03:37:27] <NewtonNerd> its loosing features with every version and getting more like eye candy[03:37:34] <NewtonNerd> and windows is going to windows 8[03:37:42] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[03:37:43] <NewtonNerd> which is all about the chrome and not at all about function[03:37:50] <NewtonNerd> and as for Android and iOS[03:37:50] <adin> how abt linux[03:37:54] <NewtonNerd> they are simply jokes[03:38:02] <NewtonNerd> linux follows the others, at least the main stream distros[03:38:03] <NewtonNerd> also[03:38:14] <NewtonNerd> linux is just a mess of dependancy hell and inconsistancies[03:38:25] <NewtonNerd> if they ever work it out and standardize things[03:38:31] <NewtonNerd> maybe it will stop being a hobby OS[03:38:42] <NewtonNerd> but like I was saying[03:38:50] <stargater> sleep time[03:38:50] <adin> dependency hell is gone... you talk abt ages before propper package management like in ubuntu etc[03:38:54] <NewtonNerd> modern "smart" device and "tablet" OS's are jokes[03:38:59] <NewtonNerd> iOS has no file system[03:39:07] <ddavid123> What Linux needs is a standardized based from which distros spin their release.[03:39:13] <NewtonNerd> your forced to install only approved software unless you jailbreak[03:39:16] <ddavid123> *base[03:39:16] <adin> iOS is horror i agree[03:39:29] <NewtonNerd> android is as much of a mess underneath as any other linux distro[03:39:34] *** slubman has quit IRC[03:39:37] <NewtonNerd> and it's sorta "tracky"[03:39:45] <adin> linux is standardised[03:40:00] <NewtonNerd> not to mention its got awful security[03:40:05] *** netstar has quit IRC[03:40:08] <NewtonNerd> and no standard file browser[03:40:08] *** mattlacey has joined #haiku[03:40:19] <NewtonNerd> and you can install applications from outside the "Play" store[03:40:35] <NewtonNerd> but you still have to root it to use it decently[03:40:35] *** slubman has joined #haiku[03:40:35] <NewtonNerd> now[03:40:37] <adin> NewtonNerd: i have i know it, i told u its a horror :)[03:40:47] <NewtonNerd> lets take a trip down memory line[03:41:42] <ddavid123> What I mean is someone like the Linux Foundation could make their own Distro that is released once a year for the sole purpose of being a base for all the other distros.[03:42:22] <NewtonNerd> Newton OS, you can install what you want where you want, it has preemptive multitasking, you can expand it with tons of PCMCIA cards that do all sorts of things, you can expand the memory easily, its got wonderful handwriting recognition, and it has something no other handheld OS has, honest to god, free floating windows, windowed applications and the ability to run apps side by side.[03:42:30] <ddavid123> Every distro would have the exact same version of every package as any other distro[03:42:57] <adin> PCMCIA is history[03:43:07] <NewtonNerd> there are tons of other features that are missing from modern handhelds… and some that were missing from the newton, but hell its 15 years old, and if it can still keep up with them its no joke...[03:43:11] <NewtonNerd> Adin[03:43:11] <augiedoggie> that has basically been tried, it's the LSB (Linux Standard Base)[03:43:12] <ddavid123> I love PCMCIA[03:43:21] <NewtonNerd> you need to look at the bigger picture[03:43:25] <NewtonNerd> so what PCMCIA is history[03:43:28] <NewtonNerd> it was expandable[03:43:32] <NewtonNerd> it can still be expandable[03:43:36] <NewtonNerd> on a modern system[03:43:40] <NewtonNerd> it would use SD cards[03:43:41] <adin> i know but its BIG[03:43:45] <NewtonNerd> and other expansion cads[03:43:50] <NewtonNerd> cards[03:43:52] <adin> just look at nowadays devices[03:43:53] <NewtonNerd> It was yes[03:43:57] <NewtonNerd> but modernize[03:44:02] <NewtonNerd> modernize the OS[03:44:07] <NewtonNerd> put it on modern hardware[03:44:09] <adin> and the bus is slow[03:44:11] <NewtonNerd> and you don't have to worry about that do you[03:44:16] <NewtonNerd> BEOS[03:44:24] <NewtonNerd> was on a dual core PPC machine[03:44:38] <NewtonNerd> PPC is as you'd put it generally "history"[03:44:46] <ddavid123> Linux needs to either rewrite much of the X server or replace it completely[03:44:49] <NewtonNerd> but you think saving BEOS is a good idea[03:45:14] <NewtonNerd> They are working on a replacement for the x server[03:45:15] <NewtonNerd> but[03:45:15] <adin> yea cause it was the first system that worke with my DV cam back in 1999[03:45:20] <NewtonNerd> who knows if it will ever come out[03:45:27] <ddavid123> Wayland[03:45:34] <adin> and i liked it cause it wasnt complicated and virus free[03:45:50] <NewtonNerd> thats why I'm hoping haiku will be at least marginally successful eventually[03:46:00] <NewtonNerd> and newton OS[03:46:02] <ddavid123> If any OS deserved to be saved it was BeOS[03:46:02] <NewtonNerd> is the same way[03:46:04] <NewtonNerd> virus free[03:46:08] <NewtonNerd> and uncomplicated[03:46:11] <NewtonNerd> and user friendly[03:46:14] <adin> good :)[03:46:44] <NewtonNerd> with a better filesystem than android or iOS… which is funny, because it doesn't actually HAVE a file system… it stores things in soups[03:47:07] <NewtonNerd> Adin[03:47:09] <adin> alright ill try it in the next days[03:47:12] <NewtonNerd> I get the impression your rather young[03:47:33] <adin> humm?[03:47:46] <ddavid123> How difficult would it be to port ZFS to Haiku? How much is kernel land and how much is user space?[03:48:12] <NewtonNerd> because you don't seem to think of things in terms of usability, or how the fact that something old and expandable regardless of the dated technology might be better over all than something new and shinny and unexpandable[03:48:23] <augiedoggie> ddavid123: that was already a gsoc project 2 years ago[03:48:41] <ddavid123> Did anything come out of it?[03:48:42] <NewtonNerd> Dave, theres a team working on it on OS X, 2 actually, and they did it rather quickly[03:48:58] <augiedoggie> ddavid123: not really, I think we failed most of the students that year[03:49:06] <NewtonNerd> and given that OS X, Haiku, and Solaris are Unix like[03:49:37] <ddavid123> Haiku would just rock with ZFS[03:49:44] <NewtonNerd> it probably wouldn't be nearly as hard as say, porting something from windows[03:49:57] <NewtonNerd> I think what they need to do, is take all the ideas from ZFS[03:50:01] <NewtonNerd> and from BFS[03:50:04] <NewtonNerd> and combine them[03:50:06] *** Megaf has joined #haiku[03:50:08] <ddavid123> Another good one would be btrfs[03:50:10] <NewtonNerd> in all together new OS[03:50:24] <NewtonNerd> Adin[03:50:48] <NewtonNerd> if you want to try newton OS just google Einstein Emulator, and Newton OS Roms[03:50:55] *** slubman has quit IRC[03:51:17] <NewtonNerd> all the software availible is spread around the net, much of it at unna.org and many links at Newton Poetry and My apple Newton[03:51:40] <adin> NewtonNerd: i studied computer science at the uni and have worked more than 20 yrs with OSs :) So we cld start talking abt timing of busses and microcontrollers of PCMCIA etc, but im out of it...[03:52:07] <adin> i do sth else[03:52:16] <NewtonNerd> I think if you could take all the good bits from ZFS, XFS, HFS+, NTFS, and BFS, along with some completely new ideas, you could perhaps make a file system that was adequately modern[03:52:20] <adin> so good luck, and good night[03:52:27] <adin> or morning :)[03:53:04] <NewtonNerd> lol, thanks, and adin, I get that the bus is slow.. .but it was still expandable in 1997, and today the iphone is not[03:53:08] <NewtonNerd> thats the point I was making[03:53:21] <NewtonNerd> a point you missed because you were concerned about bus speed[03:53:32] *** slubman has joined #haiku[03:53:38] <adin> yea but u see the whole world went in a frenzy way just haywire[03:53:55] <NewtonNerd> right[03:53:57] <adin> so thats why its possible ppl buing these new shits[03:54:00] <NewtonNerd> but if you rereleased newton OS[03:54:03] <NewtonNerd> with all its abilities[03:54:06] <NewtonNerd> in color[03:54:08] <NewtonNerd> and shiny[03:54:09] <adin> cause theyre just brainwashed[03:54:12] <NewtonNerd> but still usable[03:54:20] <NewtonNerd> and set up to be expandable with modern hardware[03:54:27] <NewtonNerd> THAT would make them actually take a look[03:54:52] <NewtonNerd> hell you could even release it as a desktop OS[03:54:58] <NewtonNerd> for touch screen desktops and things[03:55:06] <NewtonNerd> it has the ability to run windowed apps[03:55:50] <adin> but it wld have to cooperate with all sommon devices like navigations, HD video, etc[03:56:01] <NewtonNerd> no shit sherlock[03:56:08] <NewtonNerd> thats what the whole point of MODERNIZING it is[03:56:09] <NewtonNerd> lol[03:56:13] <adin> not talking abt wireless networking[03:56:25] <NewtonNerd> you modernize the OS[03:56:30] <NewtonNerd> os that it supports these things[03:56:42] <NewtonNerd> , I don't understand how you can't understand what I'm saying[03:57:02] <NewtonNerd> its not that hard of a concept, and shouldn't be for someone with "20 years of experience" under their belt[03:57:31] <adin> hey, i dont want to go down to offensive talk[03:57:41] <adin> we have different oppinions[03:57:49] <adin> if you dont like mine, ok[03:57:50] <NewtonNerd> I'm not trying to be offensve[03:57:52] <NewtonNerd> ofensive[03:57:55] <NewtonNerd> but jesus[03:58:03] <NewtonNerd> its like it doesn't sink in[03:58:34] <NewtonNerd> Newton OS… does almost all the things you could want of a modern device… so if you modernize it more, update it, speed it up, put it on modern hardware, it would be pretty hard to compete with[03:58:56] <adin> do it :)[03:59:04] <NewtonNerd> I can't do it alone![03:59:13] <NewtonNerd> thats why I'm trying to find programmers to help me[03:59:19] <adin> and i dont write stuff anymore... sorry[03:59:21] <NewtonNerd> and its got to be done relatively sneaky[03:59:41] <NewtonNerd> because, while many of the old apple patents are expired… a lot aren't[04:00:06] <adin> oh i thougth its been released as gpl or sth[04:00:33] <adin> i mean newtons source under gpl[04:00:36] <NewtonNerd> its one of those things where you just do it, and see what happens, if apple sends cease and desist letters… then you worry, otherwise who cares, they abandoned it[04:00:59] <NewtonNerd> And do you know why it was abandoned?[04:01:13] <NewtonNerd> because steve jobs was a petulant child[04:01:15] <adin> lack of interestconsumer ?[04:01:24] <NewtonNerd> John Scully[04:01:25] <adin> interest of cosnumers[04:01:28] <NewtonNerd> former CEO of apple[04:01:29] <adin> whos that[04:01:31] <adin> ah[04:01:36] <NewtonNerd> was the one who started the project[04:01:44] <NewtonNerd> he also was the guy who fired steve jobs in the 80s[04:01:48] <NewtonNerd> so when steve came back[04:01:50] <adin> :))[04:01:58] <jayrulez> What makes Newton OS superior to contemporary OS?[04:02:00] <NewtonNerd> he ended the newton project out of spite[04:02:11] <NewtonNerd> ....[04:02:16] <adin> simple vendetta?[04:02:17] <NewtonNerd> didn't I just go over that?[04:02:19] *** slubman has quit IRC[04:02:21] <NewtonNerd> pretty much[04:02:23] <NewtonNerd> also[04:02:32] <adin> typical[04:02:38] *** stpere has left #haiku[04:02:40] <NewtonNerd> they had to develop a new type of microprocessor[04:02:40] *** qptain_Nemo has quit IRC[04:02:42] <NewtonNerd> for the newton[04:02:56] <NewtonNerd> and thats where the ARM architecture came from sorta, its what popularized it at least[04:03:34] <NewtonNerd> and what makes it better than its contemporary equivalents?[04:03:38] <NewtonNerd> better input[04:03:40] <NewtonNerd> better speed[04:03:45] <NewtonNerd> smaller file sizes[04:03:53] <NewtonNerd> better expandability[04:04:03] <NewtonNerd> open for all, not restricted by an app store[04:04:06] *** qptain_Nemo has joined #haiku[04:04:09] <NewtonNerd> able to be heavily modified[04:04:36] <NewtonNerd> allows for writing of new drivers for new hardware expansions relatively easily by comparison to something like iOS[04:04:44] <NewtonNerd> really user friendly[04:04:55] <NewtonNerd> and mostly modeless[04:05:12] <NewtonNerd> when you use a newton, its like using a pen and paper...[04:05:16] <NewtonNerd> only it does all sorts of things[04:05:22] <NewtonNerd> when you use an ipad...[04:05:27] <adin> the transparency of technology you work with, the fact that you really can do anything with it and no one can sue you for using your freedom, could become a value again[04:05:39] <NewtonNerd> its like using a PC… only its been watered down and ruined and been stripped of features[04:05:55] <NewtonNerd> srsly[04:06:01] <NewtonNerd> I want to start a kickstarter page[04:06:08] <NewtonNerd> and get a bunch of people together[04:06:15] <NewtonNerd> to buy the remaining patent rights[04:06:20] <NewtonNerd> and start redevelopment[04:06:27] <adin> then u need to get hw partner[04:06:44] <NewtonNerd> I don't know enough about the coding or the hardware, but I'm enthusiastic, and I can get people interested[04:06:46] <adin> and that means to be present in china[04:06:53] <NewtonNerd> ehh[04:07:12] <NewtonNerd> I figure you release it first as an alternative OS for android devices and other arm handhelds[04:07:26] <NewtonNerd> then work on getting specific high end very nice hardware out[04:07:29] *** slubman has joined #haiku[04:07:46] <NewtonNerd> it already runs on android through an emulator…[04:07:52] <NewtonNerd> but thats not quite the same is it[04:08:25] <NewtonNerd> also, some things could be greatly improved thats for sure… but the foundation is there[04:08:31] <adin> forget emu, it has to play HD, navigate and tell u where u left ur wife:)[04:08:42] <adin> or kids[04:08:43] <NewtonNerd> ...[04:08:52] <NewtonNerd> it has GPS...[04:08:57] <NewtonNerd> it doesn't play HD[04:09:07] <NewtonNerd> it does play video[04:09:16] <NewtonNerd> and it can tell you many things[04:09:22] <NewtonNerd> its got built in text to speech[04:09:43] <NewtonNerd> I imagine[04:09:46] <NewtonNerd> but[04:09:58] <NewtonNerd> these things would all be obvious parts of modernizing[04:09:59] <NewtonNerd> it[04:10:14] <NewtonNerd> you improve and expand upon functions it already has[04:10:19] <NewtonNerd> you add new ones[04:10:24] <NewtonNerd> you don't dumb it down[04:10:27] <NewtonNerd> and it would be fine[04:11:29] <adin> NewtonNerd: modernizing software technology fr 1990s means to rewrite it completely[04:11:43] <NewtonNerd> not necessarily[04:11:48] <NewtonNerd> like I said[04:11:50] <NewtonNerd> its expandable[04:11:52] <NewtonNerd> also[04:12:00] <NewtonNerd> much of it would need a rewrite yes[04:12:02] <NewtonNerd> but not everything[04:12:07] *** slubman has quit IRC[04:12:10] <NewtonNerd> many things would just need reverse engineering[04:12:19] <adin> just :)[04:12:20] <NewtonNerd> I don't think you realize how ahead of its time it was[04:12:21] <NewtonNerd> also[04:12:26] <NewtonNerd> Mac OS X is modern[04:12:32] <NewtonNerd> and its NextStep[04:12:42] *** slubman has joined #haiku[04:12:44] <NewtonNerd> and next step is from the early 1990's[04:12:49] <adin> yea it was ahead, but the time is gone[04:12:51] <NewtonNerd> Unix is "modern"[04:12:54] <NewtonNerd> thats from the 80's[04:13:01] <adin> unix is fr 60s[04:13:16] <NewtonNerd> if you want to get into semantics and consider minix[04:13:21] <NewtonNerd> and other predicessors to unix unix[04:13:25] <NewtonNerd> than sure[04:13:29] <NewtonNerd> but the point is[04:13:37] <NewtonNerd> just because its from a decade ago[04:13:43] <adin> 2 decades[04:13:47] <NewtonNerd> doesn't mean it needs to be entirely rewritten[04:13:49] <NewtonNerd> newton OS?[04:13:53] <NewtonNerd> not the newest one[04:13:57] <NewtonNerd> 1.5 decades[04:13:58] <NewtonNerd> anyways[04:14:00] <NewtonNerd> semantics[04:14:02] <NewtonNerd> just because its older[04:14:15] <NewtonNerd> doesn't mean it needs to be entirely rewritten[04:14:26] <NewtonNerd> OS X and some Unixes[04:14:32] <NewtonNerd> are the most modern OS's out there[04:14:46] <NewtonNerd> and they are built upon code MUCH much OLDER than the newton OS[04:14:55] <NewtonNerd> you seem to think[04:15:08] <NewtonNerd> OLD = Crap/Out dated[04:15:20] <NewtonNerd> and New necessarily = Good/and modern[04:15:24] <NewtonNerd> but thats not actually trew[04:15:25] <NewtonNerd> true[04:15:34] <NewtonNerd> new things can be "out dated" crap[04:15:55] <NewtonNerd> and old things can be way better "futuristic, and "technically advanced"[04:16:07] <NewtonNerd> the hardware has greatly improved[04:16:08] <NewtonNerd> however[04:16:19] <NewtonNerd> programming doesn't necessarily always follow that[04:16:23] <NewtonNerd> neither does UI[04:16:24] <adin> NewtonNerd: it was an interesting chat, youre couragious and i wish success in your revival projects. for now im sorry for my local time is 4:16 :)[04:16:38] <NewtonNerd> ha ha[04:16:41] <NewtonNerd> well sleep then[04:17:00] <adin> thank u[04:17:12] <adin> to u good day?[04:17:18] <NewtonNerd> yes![04:17:19] <NewtonNerd> well[04:17:20] <NewtonNerd> night[04:17:27] <adin> bye![04:17:28] <NewtonNerd> but yes, thanks[04:17:31] <NewtonNerd> bye![04:17:38] *** adin has left #haiku[04:17:38] <NewtonNerd> Ok… anyone else in here interested?[04:17:41] <NewtonNerd> srsly?[04:17:46] *** slubman has quit IRC[04:17:59] *** NewtonNerd has left #haiku[04:18:02] *** slubman has joined #haiku[04:21:37] *** slubman has quit IRC[04:25:41] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[04:26:14] *** slubman has joined #haiku[04:28:00] *** Negr0_VoP2P has quit IRC[04:31:53] *** AmineKhaldi__ has joined #haiku[04:31:54] *** diver has quit IRC[04:31:55] *** AmineKhaldi has quit IRC[04:32:13] *** slubman_ has joined #haiku[04:32:25] *** slubman has quit IRC[04:32:31] <ddavid123> He was right, new isn't always better![04:33:22] *** Postumus has joined #haiku[04:33:24] <ddavid123> Take Windows 8 for instance. It is new and is a piece of garbage! lol[04:34:54] <ddavid123> On the other hand, there are many areas of Haiku that been unmodified for years and it is still good[04:39:25] *** slubman_ has quit IRC[04:40:08] *** slubman has joined #haiku[04:41:42] *** qptain_Nemo has quit IRC[04:41:50] <jayrulez> Not all of windows 8 is garbage.[04:47:13] *** slubman has quit IRC[04:55:15] *** slubman has joined #haiku[04:58:48] *** slubman has quit IRC[04:59:31] *** slubman has joined #haiku[05:03:09] *** Hiryu has quit IRC[05:04:58] *** slubman has quit IRC[05:05:10] <jstressman> http://haikudou.blogspot.com/2012/08/ioquake3-update-for-haiku.html[05:05:15] <jstressman> 2 blog updates in 1 day! :o[05:05:54] *** slubman has joined #haiku[05:12:27] *** Spelln has joined #haiku[05:14:04] *** jimage has quit IRC[05:16:06] *** Hiryu has joined #haiku[05:18:44] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[05:20:12] *** OmniMancer1 has joined #haiku[05:22:02] <ddavid123> jstressman: Did changing the resolutions in game have any affect?[05:23:26] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[05:25:40] *** stargater has quit IRC[05:27:00] *** GuestOne has quit IRC[05:29:58] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[05:31:19] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[05:38:00] *** stargater has joined #haiku[05:41:34] <bigbluehat> there seems to be a small typo on the USB install page: http://www.haiku-os.org/guides/installing/making_haiku_usb_stick[05:41:58] <bigbluehat> in the Mac section it says "/dev/rdisk[x]" when it should say "/dev/disk[x]"[05:42:04] <bigbluehat> might confuse somebody[05:42:15] *** stargater has quit IRC[05:42:29] <augiedoggie> did they do away with rdisk?[05:42:41] <MDLeBlanc> Has the install process been updated in the last 3 months?[05:42:53] <MDLeBlanc> I kept getting a kernel panic after install the last time I tried it.[05:48:46] <Hiryu> wifi doesn't work for me... I'm trying to connect to WPA2 and it just won't happen. Oh well.[05:49:06] <Hiryu> at least it detects, sees, and attmpts to use the card :)[05:50:59] *** Postumus has quit IRC[05:54:59] <bigbluehat> augiedoggie: heh...nope...looks like I assumed it was a typo[05:55:05] <bigbluehat> sorry >_<[05:55:08] <bigbluehat> what's the difference?[05:55:22] <bigbluehat> I just used /dev/disk2 and it "seems" to have worked...[05:56:03] <bigbluehat> 727711744 bytes transferred in 1006.322213 secs (723140 bytes/sec)[05:56:44] <augiedoggie> rdisk is unbuffered[05:57:03] <jessicah> so basically no difference :)[05:58:08] *** Postumus has joined #haiku[05:58:22] <bigbluehat> ah, any speed difference in writing?[05:58:35] <bigbluehat> might be worth adding a note about the difference...though thankfully it's minor :)[05:59:01] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[05:59:16] <augiedoggie> with a buffered device you have to 'sync' the write afterwards[05:59:35] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[05:59:36] <augiedoggie> either directly via the 'sync' command or the 'eject' command will do it[06:00:47] <bigbluehat> gotcha[06:01:16] <bigbluehat> well, I'm not getting drive initialization errors....[06:01:23] <bigbluehat> guessing something broke?[06:03:40] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[06:06:15] <jstressman> Hiryu: did you do: installoptionalpackage wpa_supplicant[06:06:16] <jstressman> ?[06:08:15] *** Postumus has quit IRC[06:25:36] <CIA-63> haiku.master: nielx * hrev44511 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=6c6f5ec : Update translations from Pootle[06:28:10] <CIA-63> haiku.master: leavengood * hrev44512 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=b0841df :[06:28:10] <CIA-63> Ignore hidden or minimized windows in workspaces mouse down.[06:28:10] <CIA-63> This avoids selecting those windows for moving and more importantly bringing to[06:28:10] <CIA-63> front a minimized window with Ctrl-click, which causes the minimized state to[06:28:11] <CIA-63> be out of sync between the app_server and BWindow, causing #8860.[06:28:20] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[06:29:01] <Disreali> well, my day was not fun[06:30:15] <Disreali> an auto update to my ubuntu 10.04LTS broke the install so it was un-recoverable[06:34:18] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[06:36:21] *** MatthewH12 has quit IRC[06:36:42] *** OmniMancer1 has quit IRC[06:42:42] *** Disreali has quit IRC[06:52:51] *** ismd has quit IRC[06:53:17] *** ismd has joined #haiku[07:12:28] <Hiryu> jstressman: no! I didn't know that existed...[07:12:32] <Hiryu> I'll try it now[07:13:11] *** martinhpedersen has quit IRC[07:16:43] *** JonathanThompson has joined #haiku[07:28:47] *** Postumus has joined #haiku[07:29:31] <Hiryu> wait, installoptionalpackage works kinda like apt? I need an internet connection, right?[07:29:33] <Hiryu> LOL[07:30:26] <augiedoggie> if it's a recent nightly then it's already included[07:30:44] <Hiryu> it's a recent alpha anyimage[07:30:50] <Hiryu> will that still work?[07:31:10] <Hiryu> maybe I should just do a search for wpa_supplicant and see what turns up[07:31:13] <Hiryu> :)[07:31:30] <augiedoggie> should be /boot/common/bin/wpa_supplicant[07:35:38] <Hiryu> yes, I found that[07:35:39] <Hiryu> uhm[07:35:51] <Hiryu> now when I try to connect to my network, it asks for the password, etc, as before[07:35:58] <Hiryu> but I end up in kdl[07:36:43] <Hiryu> it's not a big deal, I just wantd to play with it.[07:37:37] <Hiryu> this is on the family computer... on my desktop is a wired connection but haiku gives me a blurry vesa mode on my 1080p monitor here as I have a GTX580. The family comp has a radeon 6870 which has a little bit of support in haiku[07:48:34] *** ismd has quit IRC[08:10:36] *** fhein has joined #haiku[08:24:17] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[08:28:39] *** kcj has joined #haiku[08:39:57] *** Postumus has quit IRC[08:47:17] *** martinhpedersen has joined #haiku[08:52:51] *** stef_ is now known as stef[08:54:14] *** diver has joined #haiku[09:16:36] *** JonathanThompson has quit IRC[09:19:34] *** Luko has joined #haiku[09:20:14] *** stargater has joined #haiku[09:20:17] <stargater> moin[09:30:37] *** [r4] has joined #haiku[09:30:48] *** jjido has joined #haiku[09:32:54] *** bob_ok has joined #haiku[09:42:19] *** pseudomind has joined #haiku[09:50:25] *** pseudomind has quit IRC[09:51:48] *** dcase has joined #haiku[09:53:04] *** Blub\w has joined #haiku[09:55:49] *** Luko has quit IRC[10:10:25] *** bob_ok has quit IRC[10:22:04] *** mattlacey has left #haiku[10:23:33] <jstressman> Hiryu: is there some reason you're not running a nightly? the alpha builds are very out of date.[10:23:44] <jstressman> you should really get the latest nightly from http://haiku-files.org/[10:25:21] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[10:26:59] *** [r4] has quit IRC[10:30:58] *** jjido has quit IRC[10:49:19] <CIA-63> xyzzy-github.x86_64: xyzzy-github * d384cac4439511a49ec1b0b0c673bbcb324e6fdb : Support ELF64 in set_haiku_revision.[10:59:13] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[11:04:24] *** stargater has quit IRC[11:08:55] *** stargater has joined #haiku[11:11:49] *** JonathanThompson has joined #haiku[11:12:29] <arfonzo> ahoy, mateys[11:15:29] <jstressman> morning arfonzo :)[11:18:40] *** negusnyul has joined #haiku[11:20:07] *** stargater has quit IRC[11:20:51] *** kcj has quit IRC[11:25:37] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.[11:36:38] <arfonzo> hey all, how goes it?[11:37:57] <PulkoMandy> :)[11:38:07] <PulkoMandy> messing with GLUT a bit today[11:38:13] <jstressman> just waking up from a nap :)[11:38:26] <PulkoMandy> I think the API is even worse than SDL...[11:38:28] <jstressman> played a little Doom 3 on windows as consolation for failing to compile it on Haiku. ;) haha[11:38:50] <jstressman> PulkoMandy: saw your email about it.[11:40:10] <PulkoMandy> well, there's also this licence problem[11:40:27] <PulkoMandy> but for now I'll have to find some other lib for software I'm writing...[11:40:50] <jstressman> :([11:42:17] <PulkoMandy> I just want to blit some 2d framebuffer to the screen[11:42:22] <PulkoMandy> I don't need anything else[11:42:32] <PulkoMandy> and I can't find a suitable lib[11:42:37] <OmniMancer> SDL?[11:43:27] <PulkoMandy> that's what I used before, but it is too slow, and it wants to replace the main function in my program when building for some OS[11:43:58] <PulkoMandy> when I needed to add some windows in another project, I wanted to use wxWidgets which also replaces the main function[11:44:03] <PulkoMandy> and never got it to work[11:44:04] <OmniMancer> in which OSes is this a problem?[11:44:12] <PulkoMandy> this was for Windows[11:44:26] <PulkoMandy> but I guess for osX you'd get the same kind of result[11:44:51] <OmniMancer> I know OSX is rather evil so they have to do some trickery to get SDL to work at all[11:44:58] *** PasNox has quit IRC[11:45:11] <PulkoMandy> well, on osX you get an SDLMain.m file you need to include in your program[11:45:11] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[11:45:29] <PulkoMandy> that replaces the main() function somehow and injects some init code[11:45:35] <OmniMancer> yes[11:45:53] <OmniMancer> you can probably get around this by calling the init code yourself[11:46:00] <PulkoMandy> on windows it's done in the lib, and some hearder does something like #define main SDL_Main or so[11:46:05] <OmniMancer> but then the SDL use is not transparent to you[11:46:13] <PulkoMandy> which can have all kind of weird effects[11:46:20] <OmniMancer> yea[11:46:26] <PulkoMandy> and also, don't work if your main() function doesn't uses SDL[11:47:04] <PulkoMandy> there's tinyPTC that looks better, just a window, a framebuffer, and nothing else[11:47:17] <PulkoMandy> but the BeOS port comes as source files and not a proper lib[11:47:27] <PulkoMandy> so another project I have to take over and finish development...[11:47:53] <PulkoMandy> and I'm not even sure I can find a working version for other OSes either[11:50:22] <arfonzo> hey PulkoMandy[11:50:40] <arfonzo> could you point me towards info/shed some light on the state of the window decorator code? What's broken?[11:54:16] *** negusnyul has quit IRC[11:56:31] <PulkoMandy> the core code is ok[11:56:42] <PulkoMandy> the decorators add-ons need some updates[11:57:16] <PulkoMandy> Stack and Tile support was changed a bit and decorators now handle multiple windows in collaboration with stack and tile code in app server[11:57:31] <PulkoMandy> even the main decorator has some drawing glitches :)[11:57:41] <PulkoMandy> the Mac and Window decorators won't even build[11:58:20] <PulkoMandy> or maybe I fixed the mac one but it only draws the tab of the first window[11:59:23] <arfonzo> cool, thanks for that.... i will try to take a look...[12:02:07] *** _scanty has joined #haiku[12:02:19] *** nyl has joined #haiku[12:04:25] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[12:04:44] *** kcj has joined #haiku[12:04:52] <HaikuUser> hello all[12:05:06] *** HaikuUser2 has joined #haiku[12:05:30] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[12:05:30] *** HaikuUser2 has quit IRC[12:09:09] *** scanty has quit IRC[12:09:09] *** trn has quit IRC[12:14:52] *** trn has joined #haiku[12:23:16] *** jjido has joined #haiku[12:27:38] *** jjido has quit IRC[12:36:42] <arfonzo> PulkoMandy: do these glitches include when tab 1 changes name/length, and tab 2 is not redrawn correctly/resized, for example?[12:40:38] <PulkoMandy> yes, I was thinking of that one[12:41:07] <PulkoMandy> if you're getting into decorators, having a look at looncraz ones would be nice[12:43:02] <PulkoMandy> mh[12:43:07] <PulkoMandy> looks offline :([12:43:42] *** Negr0_VoP2P has joined #haiku[12:44:41] *** stargater has joined #haiku[12:51:02] *** swarfega is now known as swarfeg[a][12:52:12] *** swarfeg[a] is now known as swarfega[12:54:37] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[13:03:24] <stargater> rw[13:03:25] <stargater> re[13:10:19] <jstressman> :)[13:11:28] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[13:11:36] <mmu_man> plop[13:11:42] *** JonathanThompson has quit IRC[13:12:06] <mmu_man> https://zareason.com/shop/UltraLap-430.html could be interesting to have this one officially supported[13:15:31] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[13:15:59] *** luroh has quit IRC[13:25:20] <jstressman> anyone have one? I seem to recall hearing someone else mentioning one recently...[13:26:36] *** Luko has joined #haiku[13:31:28] <dreamed> one what?[13:34:14] <mmu_man> nothing in http://www.freelists.org/archive/haiku-development or haiku[13:34:59] <mmu_man> nor in echelog[13:35:11] <mmu_man> dreamed: 13:12 < mmu_man> https://zareason.com/shop/UltraLap-430.html could be interesting to have this one officially supported[13:36:55] <dreamed> oh I see[13:37:15] <dreamed> why are they calling that an ultra slim?[13:37:24] <dreamed> I guess the screen is thin[13:43:11] <dreamed> so you're just wanting more stuff able to run haiku, I guess?[13:43:18] <dreamed> sorry, I'm a bit not with it tonight - asthma/tired[13:46:55] <jstressman> mmu_man: yeah, your comment was already on google within minutes of you saying it. :o[13:47:07] <jstressman> that was the first place I checked "echelog haiku zareason" :P[13:57:11] <PulkoMandy> there were several mails from Pete Goodeve I tink (?)[13:57:24] <PulkoMandy> he bought one ZaReason machine, but I don't know if it's the same[13:58:51] <jstressman> ah, that was it... the partitioning troubles.[13:59:02] <jstressman> http://www.freelists.org/post/haiku-development/Unable-to-create-partition[14:05:22] <mmu_man> well it seems to be one of the few machines with a choice of preinstalled OS[14:06:13] <mmu_man> oh I searched for "ultralap" only[14:06:34] <mmu_man> maybe he'd want to contact them[14:07:00] <dreamed> ah okay[14:07:53] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[14:08:25] *** swarfega is now known as swarfeg[a][14:08:36] *** swarfeg[a] is now known as swarfega[14:09:18] *** Postumus has joined #haiku[14:10:24] <PulkoMandy> mmu_man: IIRC he went to their real-life shop to try Haiku on the computer before buying it[14:10:35] <PulkoMandy> everything besides network seems to be working now[14:10:43] <PulkoMandy> (see topic about rtl8111 or so)[14:27:19] *** stargater has quit IRC[14:49:15] <CIA-63> xyzzy-github.x86_64: xyzzy-github * efffcb292feee3c2db4814d7e414910fe91876d9 :[14:49:15] <CIA-63> Better fix for picture data type mismatch. [2 commits][14:49:15] <CIA-63> Should use a fixed-size type (int32) rather than a platform-dependent[14:49:15] <CIA-63> one.[14:50:17] <arfonzo> PulkoMandy: cool, this redrawing issue on tabs is what I'm looking at currently... then perhaps looncraz, whatever that might be.[14:52:34] <PulkoMandy> arfonzo: looncraz made some replacement decorator with a different look and S&T support[14:53:05] <diver> arfonzo: looncraz has created this (unfinished) decor https://dl.dropbox.com/u/15787359/PHOS_decorator.png[14:53:05] <PulkoMandy> I think it would be the easiest one to update to the new API if you feel like messing with that[14:53:24] <PulkoMandy> and the most interesting one as well, as not much people care about a Windows 95 or Mac OS 8 look :)[14:53:55] <arfonzo> ah, ok.[14:54:13] <arfonzo> I was under the impression that the tab re-drawing fix wasn't depending on each decorator[14:56:06] <PulkoMandy> well, the decorator does all the drawing[14:56:23] <PulkoMandy> but there may be a problem in the logic and event order when changing tab size[14:56:35] <PulkoMandy> if you fix it for everyone, then good ! :)[15:03:49] <arfonzo> PulkoMandy: did looncraz make the decorator code available somewhere?[15:04:01] <arfonzo> or is that what's down[15:05:02] <PulkoMandy> his website is down[15:05:11] <PulkoMandy> I dont remember if the source was included anyway[15:15:48] <jstressman> I'd like to try my hand at decorators... but I have a feeling they're a lot more complex than I could easily dive into. :/[15:17:37] *** PasNox has quit IRC[15:17:52] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[15:23:30] <PulkoMandy> they're just drawing[15:23:40] <PulkoMandy> and we're here to help :)[15:36:14] *** kcj has quit IRC[15:59:40] *** qptain_Nemo has joined #haiku[16:00:12] <CIA-63> haiku.master: anevilyak * hrev44513 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=3943305 :[16:00:12] <CIA-63> Fix ticket #8858.[16:00:12] <CIA-63> is a link, resolve it to its destination first. Fixes #8858.[16:03:47] *** nyl has quit IRC[16:05:37] *** AmineKhaldi__ is now known as AmineKhaldi[16:05:43] *** AmineKhaldi has quit IRC[16:05:43] *** AmineKhaldi has joined #haiku[16:06:21] *** PasNox has quit IRC[16:09:19] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[16:09:20] <CIA-63> haiku.master: anevilyak * hrev44514 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=e68cc8b : Fix typo.[16:29:45] *** tqh has joined #haiku[16:30:43] *** XenoDuck has joined #haiku[16:35:03] *** idefix_gromit has joined #haiku[16:47:21] *** PasNox has quit IRC[16:47:31] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[17:01:48] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[17:02:01] *** PasNox has quit IRC[17:02:13] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[17:02:16] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[17:02:39] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[17:02:57] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[17:03:15] *** Beretta021 has joined #haiku[17:03:17] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[17:05:21] *** tqh has quit IRC[17:05:30] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[17:12:29] *** stpere has joined #haiku[17:18:49] *** _scanty is now known as scanty[17:22:08] *** Postumus has quit IRC[17:22:43] *** letharion has quit IRC[17:25:16] *** PasNox has quit IRC[17:25:28] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[17:25:39] *** letharion has joined #haiku[17:30:42] *** Beretta021 has quit IRC[17:32:30] *** Beretta021 has joined #haiku[17:39:10] *** rdmr has joined #haiku[17:43:47] *** Luko has quit IRC[17:57:53] *** XenoDuck has quit IRC[17:58:19] *** bbjimmy has quit IRC[18:03:38] *** idefix_gromit has left #haiku[18:04:12] *** idefix_gromit has joined #haiku[18:05:59] *** luko has joined #haiku[18:06:04] *** jayrulez has quit IRC[18:07:46] *** tn_ has joined #haiku[18:11:36] *** tqh has joined #haiku[18:13:19] *** pseudomind has joined #haiku[18:17:49] *** rdmr has quit IRC[18:26:02] *** idefix_gromit has left #haiku[18:28:09] *** jjido has joined #haiku[18:29:25] *** idefix_gromit has joined #haiku[18:31:17] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[18:32:38] *** jjido has quit IRC[18:35:51] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[18:39:21] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[18:39:27] *** orealis has quit IRC[18:41:24] *** paval has joined #haiku[18:42:56] *** paval is now known as vegeek-ng[18:48:09] *** letharion has quit IRC[18:53:16] *** letharion has joined #haiku[18:59:27] *** rennj has quit IRC[19:21:27] *** rennj has joined #haiku[19:24:19] <CIA-63> buildtools.master: xyzzy * btrev43033 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/buildtools/commit/?id=abe2582 : Corrected x86_64 target in build-gcc4-optional-package-Haiku.sh.[19:24:28] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[19:26:03] *** Sintendo has joined #haiku[19:33:10] *** Sintendo has quit IRC[19:35:14] *** pseudomind has quit IRC[19:35:55] *** stargater has joined #haiku[19:39:57] *** idefix_gromit has left #haiku[19:55:49] *** qptain_Nemo has quit IRC[19:55:57] *** qptain_Nemo has joined #haiku[19:57:19] *** vegeek-ng has quit IRC[19:58:15] *** vegeek-ng has joined #haiku[19:59:09] *** bob_ok has joined #haiku[20:02:54] *** jayrulez has joined #haiku[20:09:24] *** vegeek-ng has quit IRC[20:13:04] *** jjido has joined #haiku[20:17:18] *** volci has quit IRC[20:18:20] *** bob_ok has quit IRC[20:19:51] *** jjido has quit IRC[20:20:03] *** jjido has joined #haiku[20:24:17] *** paul0 has joined #haiku[20:26:00] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[20:27:01] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[20:28:24] *** jjido_ has joined #haiku[20:29:14] *** jjido has quit IRC[20:42:16] <jstressman> think I need to reboot to Haiku on bare metal and test out this Quake3 build again.[20:42:23] <jstressman> to match the setup in my vbox.[20:48:28] *** jjido_ has quit IRC[20:50:19] *** jjido has joined #haiku[20:56:08] *** negusnyul has joined #haiku[20:58:25] *** jjido has quit IRC[21:01:35] <Hiryu> jstressman: there's GPU acceleration?[21:04:24] <jstressman> jstressman: no.[21:04:41] <augiedoggie> heh[21:05:08] <jstressman> Hiryu: http://haikudou.blogspot.com/2012/08/ioquake3-update-for-haiku.html[21:05:11] <jstressman> I explain it more there.[21:05:31] <jstressman> first I'm going to update my vbox install, redo the quake install... and see if it still crashes.[21:05:40] <jstressman> then I'll do the exact same setup on bare metal to see what happens.[21:08:40] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[21:10:20] *** MatthewH12 has joined #haiku[21:12:49] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[21:13:22] <Hiryu> alright[21:13:35] <Hiryu> from what you're saying maybe there's 3d accel under vbox? I'll find out when I read tho[21:15:18] <jstressman> no :)[21:15:32] <jstressman> no matter where you play it right now you're going to get like 10 fps tops. :P[21:16:16] <Hiryu> yah[21:16:20] <Hiryu> I see that from what I'm reading[21:16:30] <Hiryu> but uh[21:16:52] <Hiryu> I know Alexander Von Gluck (or something like that) is working on bringing some mesa goodness to haiku[21:17:00] <Hiryu> is LLVM pipe evetually going to come?[21:17:43] <Hiryu> does quake 2 work? especially since you can set it to run without opengl[21:18:35] <jstressman> I think it did in the past.[21:18:45] <Hiryu> there was quake2 for beos I think[21:18:46] <jstressman> I know it did on BeOS.[21:18:47] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[21:18:48] <jstressman> yeah.[21:18:49] <Hiryu> haha[21:19:05] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[21:19:28] <Hiryu> on an unrelatd note... the haiku email program seems pretty broken[21:19:41] <Hiryu> I trid using it and it seems my mail server doesn't even see an imap connection[21:19:42] <jstressman> http://haikuware.com/directory/view-details/games/3d/quakeii[21:20:10] <Hiryu> I'm using imaps and set it to use SSL in the email client... maybe the email client is still trying to use port 143? (or whatever the default imap port is) rather than 003[21:20:12] <Hiryu> er[21:20:13] <Hiryu> 993[21:20:23] <Hiryu> and there's no way to specify the port to use[21:20:35] <augiedoggie> that's probably for the best that it didn't see the connection, it's been known to destroy emails on imap connections[21:20:51] <Hiryu> augiedoggie: LOL![21:21:03] <Hiryu> that's good to know[21:21:18] <augiedoggie> it's one of the sticking points for the next alpha release[21:21:34] <Hiryu> yah I bet[21:22:30] <Hiryu> who's working o that client? If anyone's interested, I'd be willing to do regular tests[21:22:40] <Hiryu> I can just setup an account on my mail server strictly for this purpose[21:22:46] <augiedoggie> axel is doing a rewrite in his github branch[21:22:56] <Hiryu> ah[21:23:00] <augiedoggie> clemens is trying to fix the current one in the tree[21:23:21] *** PasNox has quit IRC[21:23:57] <Hiryu> ah[21:25:02] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[21:25:27] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[21:26:06] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[21:26:27] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[21:26:43] *** ksx4system has quit IRC[21:30:19] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[21:30:20] *** jjido has joined #haiku[21:30:41] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[21:34:07] *** rdmr has joined #haiku[21:34:08] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[21:34:57] *** ksx4system has joined #haiku[21:36:27] <ddavid123> Assuming that Alpha 4 is released after GSOC concludes, could we have a 64 bit version of Alpha 4?[21:40:10] <Disreali> ddavid123: not in the alpha. there would most likely be unsupported 64bit builds however[21:41:29] <ddavid123> Ok, that is good[21:41:42] <Hiryu> hmm... could a 64 bit version support more than 8 cpu's?[21:42:03] <Hiryu> I know why more than 8 aren't supported currently[21:42:13] <Hiryu> there's some array or something rather defined with a length of 8[21:42:17] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[21:42:35] <Hiryu> but maybe the 64-bit port wouldn't have to be confined to that bit of backwards compatibility[21:42:46] <Hiryu> just a thought anyway[21:42:55] <ddavid123> So if I have a sixteen core processor, Haiku would only be able to use half of them?[21:43:14] <ddavid123> So limiting[21:43:18] <ddavid123> lol[21:43:49] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[21:44:24] <Hiryu> pretty much[21:44:28] <Hiryu> I have a 6 core i7[21:44:32] <Hiryu> so that's 12 threads[21:44:44] <Hiryu> and haiku can only work with 8 /12[21:45:15] <ddavid123> How many threads can a core have, 2?[21:45:35] <Hiryu> it was explained to me there's some internal data structure where the cpu's are stored in an array defined to be an array of 8 long inside the struct... instead of just defining a pointer and dynamically allocated the memory[21:45:35] <Hiryu> yes[21:45:46] <Hiryu> hyper threading is currently 2 threads per core[21:46:04] <Hiryu> so in theory if you had my chip, you'd probably want to disable hyper threading[21:46:45] <Hiryu> but since I have windows and linux, I don't want to go in and out of the bios all the time and it's not like there's anything for me to do in haiku as of yet that would tax 8 threads anyway :)[21:46:54] *** MDLeBlanc has quit IRC[21:47:10] <Hiryu> I have a core i7 980x[21:48:22] <ddavid123> I would like a new computer with two eight core Core i7 processors, 32 gigs of ram, three five terabytes hard drives with Haiku running on it![21:48:36] <Hiryu> you can get mobo's that do dual i7's[21:48:42] <Hiryu> the problem is that you can only run xeon's that way[21:48:57] <Hiryu> even the extreme editions don't support SMP with other physical CPU's[21:49:02] <Hiryu> yes, I've looked into it[21:49:03] <Hiryu> hahahaha[21:49:27] <Hiryu> and the xeons tend to be more lowly clocked then their desktop counterparts... there's higher clocked ones but those start makign the extreme editiosn look cheap[21:49:44] *** jjido has quit IRC[21:49:56] <Hiryu> it takes me somewhere around 17 or so minutes to compile haiku and gcc for haiku from scratch[21:49:56] *** jua_ has joined #haiku[21:50:01] *** BitPuffin has joined #haiku[21:50:12] *** juaa_ has quit IRC[21:50:24] <ddavid123> Does the Xeon processors support turbo boost and hyperthreading?[21:50:38] <Anarchos> Hiryu 17 min ?? It takes me two a=hours...[21:50:57] <Hiryu> I'm compiling under linux so that might be part of it[21:51:15] <Anarchos> ddavid123 i prefer to have a sparc running haiku... Could be pretty cool ![21:51:16] <Hiryu> Anarchos: there's a way to pass an option to haiku such that make will use how many threads you specify[21:51:23] <Hiryu> you pass it to configure[21:51:28] <Hiryu> and then it runs make and jam with -j#[21:51:31] <Anarchos> Hiryu jam -j2 ?[21:51:47] <Hiryu> yah that too, just a moment, I have a simplstic script for this[21:52:08] <Hiryu> jam -qj$THREADS[21:52:09] <Anarchos> Hiryu i did "-j 3"[21:52:23] <Hiryu> cd generated.x86gcc4[21:52:23] <Hiryu> ../configure --alternative-gcc-output-dir ../generated.x86gcc2 -j$THREADS --build-cross-tools-gcc4 x86 ../../buildtools/[21:52:45] <Hiryu> that's how you do it when building gcc[21:52:51] <Hiryu> because otherwise building gcc is very slow[21:53:01] <Hiryu> and I build hybrid so I build 2 versions of gcc[21:53:07] <ddavid123> What would it take to sell Haiku boxes? i used to build small form factor pc's back in the day and I think Haiku needs a good OEM[21:53:24] <Hiryu> sadly and pathetically it needs flash :)[21:53:39] <Hiryu> flash is still used a lot for cheesy games and by most people on youtube[21:53:42] <ddavid123> Forget flash, flash is terrible[21:53:46] <Hiryu> oh I hate flash[21:53:50] <Hiryu> but for most people it's necessary[21:54:17] <Hiryu> I can nearly run my system without installing flash anymore (the html5 youtube beta works most of the time for me, but there's still other sites that require flash)[21:54:23] <ddavid123> A good port of Gnash would be nice[21:54:32] <Hiryu> and while we're dreaming, I'd like a pony[21:54:34] <Hiryu> :D[21:54:53] <ddavid123> Trt Minitube[21:54:58] <ddavid123> try[21:55:12] <Hiryu> youtube isn't really the issue anymore, it's the other sites I need to deal with[21:55:27] <Hiryu> for example my arcade has regular tournaments and those get streamed[21:55:31] <Hiryu> and that all uses flash sadly[21:56:12] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[21:56:23] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[21:56:25] <PulkoMandy> ddavid123: therewere some talks about OEM PCs with Haiku, but well, it is still in alpha stage[21:56:45] <PulkoMandy> I guess no one is ready to do the support hotline for an alpha quality OS ? :)[21:56:51] <Hiryu> the stupid security camera system at my arcade also requires IE... and It seems not to work with the latest IE... but I don't know for sure as I'm a linux guy so I've never used the system myself :)[21:57:05] <Hiryu> PulkoMandy: who'd have thought?[21:57:16] <Hiryu> how's the port of haiku to raspberry pi going?[21:57:46] <PulkoMandy> not moving a lot right now, kallisti5 is busy finishing the radeon hd driver for the alpha4[21:58:11] <Hiryu> PulkoMandy: finishing what exactly? actual 3d accel?[21:58:23] <ddavid123> God bless him[21:58:39] <Hiryu> or is it mode basic mode setting and 2d support for radeon gpu's?[21:58:48] <Hiryu> more basic mode setting, even[21:58:59] <Hiryu> now that that is bad[21:59:34] <ddavid123> How different is the Raspberry Pi to the PandaBoard?[22:00:14] <Hiryu> i don't know, but the one I want to see supported is the odroid-x[22:00:23] <Hiryu> $129 for quad core 1.4 ghz and a gig of memory[22:00:47] <ddavid123> quad core ARM?[22:00:51] <Hiryu> yes[22:00:54] <ddavid123> Wow[22:00:56] <Hiryu> that's old news[22:01:02] <Hiryu> A9 does quad core up to 2.0 ghz[22:01:17] <ddavid123> I am waiting for A-15[22:01:24] <Hiryu> the PS vita has one but apparently they don't run it at 2.0 ghz because in sony's own words it would melt the device and the battery would run out in less than a minute[22:01:43] <Hiryu> in fact, I think they might only allow devs to only use 3 cores[22:01:45] <Hiryu> go figure[22:01:55] <augiedoggie> my pandaboard will crush a pi :P[22:02:02] <Hiryu> of course, and the odroid-x will crash the panda[22:02:07] <Hiryu> panda is dualcore, right?[22:02:10] <augiedoggie> yes[22:02:23] <Hiryu> isn't the panda also more than $129?[22:02:35] <augiedoggie> yes[22:03:04] <Hiryu> the panda comes with a built more built in than the odroid... such as wireless. But you can buy wifi for the odroid for very cheap from the odroid vendor[22:03:21] <ddavid123> I have thought for a long time that an ARM dual core processor and a Intel dual core processor at the same frequency; the ARM is faster and more energy effecient.[22:03:33] <Hiryu> it's more energy efficient[22:03:46] <Hiryu> but I don't know if it's faster... I think the atom still edges it out in performance[22:03:49] <Hiryu> but it's getting close[22:03:54] <ddavid123> Reduces instruction set is superior[22:04:01] <ddavid123> reduced[22:04:02] <Hiryu> a 2 ghz i7 will absolutely run many circules around a 2 ghz arm[22:04:13] <Hiryu> sure, but tchnically intel chips have been risc for a while[22:04:21] <Hiryu> internally intel chips are risc[22:04:28] <ddavid123> really?[22:04:32] <Hiryu> they take the cisc instructions and convert them internally[22:04:40] <ddavid123> oh[22:04:43] <Hiryu> and this begins to explain why intel chips are so inefficient and power hungry[22:04:59] <ddavid123> the conversion latency must be murder[22:05:04] <Hiryu> must be[22:05:13] <Hiryu> but I think it's why intel chips need such ridiculous numbers of transistors[22:05:24] *** luko has quit IRC[22:05:29] <Hiryu> I'm not expert on the matter, so maybe someone else can elaborate, but that's my basic understanding[22:05:47] <ddavid123> AMD I believe is completely risc[22:05:55] <Hiryu> I've done asm for motorola 68k, x86, and sparc[22:06:06] <Hiryu> well, no it would have to be like intel[22:06:22] <Hiryu> do you know the difference between risc and cisc when it comes to instructions?[22:06:38] <Hiryu> amd couldn't be externally risc too if it has to handle old cisc instructions[22:06:54] <Hiryu> maybe the better way to phrase that is "entirely risc externally"[22:07:00] <ddavid123> Sort of like ARM's thumb and Thumb2 instruction set. Converts 32 bit instructions into 16 bit for better code density.[22:07:36] <Hiryu> ddavid123: all instructions in risc have the exact same size (often 32 bits even on 64 bit risc cpu's. The SH4 in the dreamcast had 16 bit sized instructions)[22:07:48] <Hiryu> in cisc the instruction length varies[22:08:01] <Hiryu> and many cisc instructions can reference memory directly[22:08:14] *** dimonov has quit IRC[22:09:21] <Hiryu> in risc most instructions can't, you just have instructions for loading from memory and storing to memory. the idea with risc is to do as much in the cpu as possible. This is why risc cpu's tend to have more registers. amd64 has 16 general purpose registers (x86 has 8), but sparc *basically* has 32 registers at any given time. I think mips and ppc are the same or close (both are more than 16)[22:09:47] <Hiryu> ddavid123: or did you mean amd64 is completely risc? MAYBE, I have no idea. I haven't done amd64 asm.[22:10:36] *** dimonov has joined #haiku[22:11:28] <jessicah> hmm, that zareason 'ultralap' looks kinda nice[22:11:54] <jessicah> the keyboard is an exact match of my existing eeebox kb i use here at home all the time[22:13:52] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[22:17:13] *** fhein has quit IRC[22:21:11] <jessicah> :o zareason to open a retail shop here in nz?[22:22:26] <jessicah> good morning dreamed :)[22:24:36] <dreamed> /wave[22:30:02] *** luroh has joined #haiku[22:34:06] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[22:36:20] *** idefix_gromit has joined #haiku[22:43:43] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[22:51:00] *** jayrulez has quit IRC[22:59:34] *** Megaf has quit IRC[23:12:16] *** BitPuffin_ has joined #haiku[23:12:51] *** BitPuffin has quit IRC[23:16:21] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[23:17:47] *** Megaf has joined #haiku[23:26:40] <Hiryu> there's no KVM drivers for haiku?[23:28:27] *** idefix_gromit has left #haiku[23:28:39] <jstressman> hrm.... no <sys/shm.h> on Haiku. :/ that throws a wrench in the gears.[23:29:56] <Hiryu> was that a general statement or a reponse to what I just said?[23:31:29] <jstressman> general statement. sorry.[23:31:44] <Hiryu> no problem... I was just confused why that would be an issue[23:31:45] <Hiryu> hahahaha[23:32:12] <PulkoMandy> jstressman: we have areas in the BeAPI[23:32:21] <PulkoMandy> similar functionality, but different API[23:38:14] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[23:40:06] *** johnny_b has quit IRC[23:44:16] *** kcj has joined #haiku[23:48:49] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[23:49:17] *** happy4crazy has joined #haiku[23:50:50] *** tqh has quit IRC[23:53:27] *** happy4crazy has quit IRC[23:55:55] *** vezhlys has quit IRC