August 16, 2011 
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August 16, 2011 [00:00:05] *** hoelzro has quit IRC[00:01:05] *** zgaga has quit IRC[00:01:18] *** Colin_Finck|lap has quit IRC[00:06:54] *** brrant has quit IRC[00:13:19] *** Ziusudra has joined #haiku[00:13:31] *** jjido has quit IRC[00:13:36] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[00:14:17] *** lukove has quit IRC[00:17:57] *** OmniMancer1 has joined #haiku[00:19:23] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[00:21:25] *** redblue has joined #haiku[00:41:23] *** elliottcable is now known as egirljr[00:43:02] *** egirljr is now known as elliottcable[00:43:54] *** elliottcable is now known as Vorian[00:48:19] *** negusnyul has quit IRC[00:51:57] *** Vorian is now known as elliottcable[00:52:02] *** lukove has joined #haiku[00:59:27] *** amidrew_ has joined #haiku[01:00:48] *** amidrew has quit IRC[01:01:50] *** vezhlys has quit IRC[01:03:14] *** _arjen_ has quit IRC[01:04:38] *** jsj has quit IRC[01:06:56] <judgen> Hey, bk =D[01:10:07] *** GeekShadow has quit IRC[01:10:26] *** Sikosis has joined #haiku[01:10:26] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Sikosis[01:11:58] *** GeekShadow has joined #haiku[01:12:21] *** Sikosis has quit IRC[01:13:04] *** Sikosis has joined #haiku[01:13:04] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Sikosis[01:22:53] *** scgtrp has joined #haiku[01:28:51] *** AlienSoldier has joined #haiku[01:35:36] <CIA-73> Haiku: czeidler * r42636 /haiku/trunk/src/servers/app/decorator/DefaultDecorator.cpp http://dev.haiku-os.org/changeset/42636 : Reset the tab region when switching to a tab less look. At least partially fixes #7919.[02:04:40] *** Suner has joined #haiku[02:10:22] *** jmelesky has quit IRC[02:13:47] *** Suner has quit IRC[02:17:44] *** mmadia has quit IRC[02:20:04] *** Suner has joined #haiku[02:28:32] *** lukove has quit IRC[02:29:18] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[02:42:07] *** MatthewH12 has quit IRC[02:42:41] *** MatthewH12 has joined #haiku[02:48:33] *** Ziusudra has quit IRC[02:59:19] *** P4R4N01D has quit IRC[02:59:19] *** DraX has quit IRC[02:59:19] *** NeonLicht has quit IRC[02:59:19] *** eml has quit IRC[02:59:29] *** eml has joined #haiku[02:59:36] *** DraX has joined #haiku[02:59:37] *** DraX has quit IRC[02:59:37] *** DraX has joined #haiku[02:59:38] *** NeonLicht has joined #haiku[03:03:27] *** P4R4N01D has joined #haiku[03:11:17] *** Scollins2 has quit IRC[03:18:17] *** judgen has quit IRC[03:21:16] *** jstressman has quit IRC[03:22:03] *** jstressman has joined #haiku[03:25:26] *** dak has quit IRC[03:40:58] *** Nozy has quit IRC[04:13:28] *** Ziusudra has joined #haiku[04:15:16] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[04:19:47] *** Nozy has quit IRC[04:30:08] *** Suner has quit IRC[04:31:20] *** f1assistance has joined #haiku[04:39:49] *** f1assistance has left #haiku[05:02:58] *** Androo has joined #haiku[05:04:30] <Androo> I have a system that will boot the LiveCD, and completes an install, but no matter what I do the Haiku bootloader does not recognize the new install. Happens with alpha 3 and the most recent nightly build. Any ideas?[05:05:51] *** duvjones has joined #haiku[05:06:15] *** duvjones has quit IRC[05:06:47] <Duggan> I haven't heard of that problem myself, if i come across anything though I'll let you know[05:07:09] <augiedoggie> several people have mentioned that problem[05:10:00] <Androo> I have an unfounded belief that it's a bug in DriveSetup (I partition the drive as a single Haiku partition, but when I reboot after the install ... it's not ... remenants of the old Windows partition layout remain).[05:10:30] <Androo> Very odd.[05:10:40] <augiedoggie> is the drive mounted when you're making changes?[05:11:32] <Androo> Not by me if it is. I go straight to the Installer on the LiveCD.[05:12:39] <augiedoggie> you could delegate the partitioning to fdisk from linux or something[05:13:11] <augiedoggie> just create a partition with fdisk and set the type to eb[05:14:05] <Androo> I'd like to gather enough info to write a good bug report, or at least know enough to find an existing bug. Contribute a bug report then dd the MBR.[05:17:19] <augiedoggie> is Haiku the only OS on the machine?[05:17:33] <Androo> Besides the one I'm trying to overwrite? Yes.[05:17:46] <augiedoggie> did you install a bootmanager?[05:17:57] <Androo> Just Haiku's.[05:18:15] <augiedoggie> well, there is the mbr and then there is a bootmanager[05:18:39] <augiedoggie> I would boot the cd and hold shift before Haiku starts[05:18:46] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[05:18:49] <augiedoggie> it will allow you to select a different boot volume[05:18:54] *** HaikuUser is now known as SCollins2[05:18:57] <Androo> It had a standard Windows 7 install on it prior to this.[05:18:59] <augiedoggie> one will be the cd and one will be the hard drive[05:19:25] <Androo> augiedoggie, Haiku bootloader shows no volumes ... even with the CD in the drive.[05:20:27] <SCollins2> Androo, what type of hardware are you attempting to boot Haiku on ?[05:21:05] <Androo> It's a Dell Inspiron 531 desktop, stock.[05:21:47] *** freakazoid0223 has quit IRC[05:21:59] <SCollins2> looking up the hardware, see if I can help ya[05:22:20] <SCollins2> ahh nvidia chipset[05:22:32] <SCollins2> have you tried to usb boot ?[05:22:47] <Androo> No. It boots fine from the LiveCD, just not after an install.[05:23:13] <SCollins2> what types of HDD do you have ?[05:23:34] <SCollins2> or does it just boot straight to windows ?[05:24:33] <Androo> It's a system I inherited from a friend that I'm intending to be a full-time Haiku box. I'm intending Haiku to be the only OS on the SATA drive.[05:25:50] <SCollins2> ok, does your Bios support setting the HDD to legacy IDE mode ?[05:26:05] <SCollins2> or for that matter setting the sata controller to IDE mode ?[05:26:09] <SCollins2> if so, try that[05:26:20] <Androo> Windows 7 was installed on the drive previously. What's strange is that I partition the drive as a single Haiku volume, but after the install I reboot and go back to DriveSetup on the LiveCD and it's no longer partitioned that way ...[05:27:16] <SCollins2> ok, then you need to delete all existing partitions and reformat the disc, sounds like win7 put in that gawdaweful 100mb boot sector[05:27:42] <Androo> I did delete the partitions via DriveSetup.[05:27:49] <Androo> Didn't appear to take.[05:28:01] <SCollins2> yeah, sounds like something has write protected part of the drive.[05:28:29] <Androo> Forgive my lack of knowledge here, but how would something do that?[05:28:30] <SCollins2> So you might need to go into the bios and check if there is a write protected boot loader area on the HDD and if so disable that feature[05:28:36] *** amidrew_ has quit IRC[05:28:52] <SCollins2> the OEM's are notorious for this[05:28:59] <Androo> ah, BIOS restrictions?[05:29:13] <SCollins2> very possiable they secured the boot loader code from modification[05:29:20] <Androo> interesting ...[05:29:25] <SCollins2> you can do that with many BIOS's[05:29:41] <SCollins2> if thats the case, just disabling that feature should get the disk to format correctly[05:30:01] <Androo> so I would also have trouble installing Linux on this box, if this is the problem?[05:30:14] <SCollins2> maybe[05:30:36] <Androo> gonna try[05:33:09] *** amidrew has joined #haiku[05:35:47] <Androo> don't see any related BIOS settings :([05:35:59] <Androo> and no option to switch SATA to legacy[05:36:27] <SCollins2> ok, try this, boot up a hirens boot CD or similar and see if they have a drive utility for completely wiping a drive, IIRC they do[05:36:53] <SCollins2> just frmat the drive to fat32 or something to clean it[05:39:44] <Androo> For my education: Why would DriveSetup fail here but another LiveCD be successful?[05:40:17] <SCollins2> did you delete all the existing partitions ?[05:40:31] <Androo> Through DriveSetup, yes.[05:41:08] <SCollins2> so does it just show a single empty disk ?[05:42:33] <Androo> It does. I then install Haiku onto that volume and reboot ... nothing ... just get the Haiku bootloader menu with no volumes detected. I reboot to the LiveCD again, enter DriveSetup, and the drive no longer is shown as being a single Haiku volume.[05:42:56] <SCollins2> Ok, lets try this instead[05:43:06] <SCollins2> boot up, delete the partitions[05:43:16] <SCollins2> reboot and see what shows up[05:43:45] <Androo> I did this with the same results, but I'll do it once more to be sure.[05:47:30] *** jstressman has quit IRC[05:49:32] <SCollins2> Might be time to try a different hardrive, that on could have something on it[05:51:50] <Androo> SCollins2: ok. First boot: DriveSetup shows five entries on the drive, two with device nodes (/dev/disk) and three without (showing as "-"). No partition types listed, though they were there the first time I did this.[05:52:12] <Androo> Screenshot utility does not work on LiveCD :([05:52:17] <SCollins2> Ok, so the disk is getting some type of write protection[05:52:54] <Androo> shucks[05:53:15] <SCollins2> well, it could also be a host of other things, but write protected sounds like whats going on here,[05:53:30] <SCollins2> sort of strange there nothing in the bios about it though.[05:53:36] <Androo> BIOS seemed very limited.[05:53:40] *** jstressman has joined #haiku[05:53:42] <Androo> It's Dell :/[05:53:49] <SCollins2> very true.[05:54:07] <SCollins2> is there a functional bios you could flash in from the openbios proect?[05:54:34] <Androo> I'll hvae to investigate.[05:55:11] <SCollins2> could be dell might be , locking out other vendors, seen this on laptops[05:55:53] <Androo> is there something I could try, say ... writing to an area of the hard drive with dd ... that would confirm the BIOS restriction?[05:56:51] <SCollins2> the installer and delete partition function pretty much proed out, there is some form of write protection on the disk, The only thing you could try right now, is to remove the bios battery and hope somehow its just some nasty microcode bug or similar[05:57:25] <SCollins2> you could alsm try moving the disk to another machine and doing a reformat ![05:57:38] <Androo> why does DriveSetup think the repartitioning was succesful?[05:58:08] <SCollins2> it could be the bios has write protection that protects it, but the bios is preventing "malacious software" from changing the mbr etc[05:58:17] <SCollins2> its just reporting sucess[05:59:21] <Androo> shouldn't DriveSetup verify that the write to the MBR was successful?[05:59:58] <SCollins2> the bios might be confirming this to, but in reality it never gets completed.[06:00:09] <SCollins2> do you have another computer you can put the disk in and do a reformat ?[06:01:41] <Androo> sure sure. Just trying to figure out if Haiku is in any way at fault here. If I can install Linux without issue, for instance, I'm going to be questioning what Haiku is lacking or if this is indeed the problem.[06:01:56] <SCollins2> well, you can try it.[06:02:24] <SCollins2> it could be a short comming in the installer, but considering I have done hundred of formats and installs with haiku, I doubt it. Never say never though ![06:02:39] <Androo> I have too :) This is honestly the first time I've ever had issues.[06:03:02] <SCollins2> well, I know the nvidia chipsets can be a bit buggy, but usually the damned thing just won't boot[06:08:14] *** jstressman has quit IRC[06:18:08] *** nsuperbus has joined #haiku[06:23:26] <Androo> yeah, there must be something BIOS-level going on ... Arch Linux install failed[06:24:22] <Androo> gonna wipe the drive and try again. Thanks for the help SCollins.[06:24:23] <SCollins2> yep, and I have seen it on numerous computers as of late, its almost like a vendor lock, but taking out the disk and formating it in another machine may cure the problem ![06:25:37] *** augiedoggie has left #haiku[06:31:26] <Androo> k, did a CLEAN command on the drive in Windows' diskpart utility.[06:31:59] <SCollins2> that should kill it[06:38:05] <SCollins2> there is something wrong with the pthread layer in the kernel[06:38:38] <SCollins2> Transmission which used to be a really stable functional application, keeps dying and hanging generating a huge amount of cpu load on one of the pthreads[06:39:23] *** helf has quit IRC[06:40:11] *** helf has joined #haiku[06:43:29] <SCollins2> http://pastebin.com/5fCrguJE[06:43:45] <SCollins2> 42064 might be the culprit, though QT could need a rebuild?[06:45:21] *** duvjones has joined #haiku[06:47:39] *** [Katisu] has quit IRC[06:48:26] *** [Katisu] has joined #haiku[06:51:11] *** witukind_ has quit IRC[06:56:46] *** Disreali has quit IRC[07:11:07] *** SCollins2 has quit IRC[07:29:52] *** fhein has joined #haiku[07:33:32] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[07:55:40] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[08:00:34] *** rotundNut has joined #haiku[08:04:04] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[08:10:13] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[08:10:16] *** Androo has quit IRC[08:11:40] *** [Katisu] has quit IRC[08:17:21] *** [Katisu] has joined #haiku[08:31:39] *** [Katisu] has quit IRC[08:33:51] *** [Katisu] has joined #haiku[08:34:32] *** hey68you has joined #haiku[08:35:09] *** [Katisu] has quit IRC[08:35:56] *** [Katisu] has joined #haiku[08:37:08] *** _marc` has quit IRC[08:37:09] *** Nozy has left #haiku[08:45:13] *** zgaga has joined #haiku[08:51:28] *** adominguez has joined #haiku[08:56:46] *** phalax has joined #haiku[09:04:03] *** DDevine has joined #haiku[09:08:05] *** J-Ho has joined #haiku[09:12:16] *** phalax has quit IRC[09:22:17] *** phalax has joined #haiku[09:22:30] <DDevine> Greetings.[09:23:10] <DDevine> I'm trying to create a file in /usr/local/lib and it just gives me No file or Directory[09:23:33] <DDevine> /usr/local/lib exists but I cannot create a file inside it.[09:25:39] <DDevine> Actually, I cannot create a file anywhere under /usr[09:25:40] <hey68you> @DDeive: do you have write permission in the folder?[09:25:53] <DDevine> That shouldn't be an issue in Haiku right?[09:26:01] *** Sikosis has quit IRC[09:26:33] *** Sikosis has joined #haiku[09:26:33] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Sikosis[09:26:38] <DDevine> Though I just checked and I do have permissions.[09:27:54] <Duggan> DDevine I think I know why...[09:29:13] <Duggan> / doesn't actually exist, it's a logical directory[09:29:19] <Duggan> that's why everything is under /boot[09:29:35] *** phalax has quit IRC[09:29:41] <DDevine> Mmm... But why can I list the directory if it doesn't exist?[09:29:47] *** Sikosis has quit IRC[09:30:05] <Duggan> if you go into tracker and enter "/" into the nav bar, it just lists the mounted volumes[09:30:17] *** Sikosis has joined #haiku[09:30:18] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Sikosis[09:30:27] <Duggan> it's a logical directory.... ramdisk type stuff... not sure exactly what the proper term is[09:30:48] <Duggan> but nothing there actually "exists"... not as it's displayed to exist anyway[09:31:57] <Duggan> if you actually were able to write anything to it it would cease to exist when you rebooted anyway[09:31:57] <DDevine> Maybe...[09:32:36] <Duggan> this volume I'm using is named Haiku, which (if I'm correct) is a symlink in / to /boot[09:33:00] <Duggan> /bin /etc /system /tmp and /var are symlinks as well (if I'm right)[09:33:04] <DDevine> What about /var /etc and /bin?[09:33:08] <Duggan> to other directories inside /boot[09:33:10] <DDevine> Ah ok[09:33:14] <DDevine> That makes sense.[09:33:22] <Duggan> but / doesn't actually exist[09:33:42] <Duggan> maybe try /boot/usr/local/lib ?[09:35:39] <DDevine> There is no /boot/usr[09:36:09] <Duggan> there is no /usr either? :)[09:36:23] <Duggan> but at least you can create /boot/usr[09:36:39] <Duggan> if you need to store something in the user directory, try /boot/home[09:38:25] <Duggan> but if you're trying to store a lib someplace, try one of the other lib directories that already exist?[09:39:18] <DDevine> Yeah, it's not that important I was just playing with something[09:39:40] <Duggan> understand why you can't now?[09:39:47] <Duggan> I want to say that once upon a time you actually could write to /[09:40:13] <Duggan> if you could, they obviously disabled it as it was pointless since you lost everything there if you rebooted[09:56:42] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[10:01:14] *** [Katisu] has quit IRC[10:03:35] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[10:13:50] *** [Katisu] has joined #haiku[10:14:47] <DDevine> Hmmm... I wonder if I should submit a patch to PIL so that it checks the appropriate library/include directories for Haiku.[10:15:12] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[10:15:25] <DDevine> It'd be nice ot be able to just run pip install PIL and have it build properly. Currently you have to download and modify in setup.py.[10:15:45] <DDevine> It does give you an error telling you what to do but it would be easy to just get fixed upstream...[10:15:57] <DDevine> I'll add it to my list of things to do.[10:27:54] <DDevine> I wonder if LibreCAD could build under Haiku (with Qt)[10:29:50] <DDevine> Ah already has![10:29:52] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[10:30:04] <DDevine> "Caduntu" == LibreCAD[10:31:37] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[10:31:59] *** jalopeura has joined #haiku[10:33:39] *** yuri_ has joined #haiku[10:33:47] *** yuri_ has left #haiku[10:48:39] *** judgen has joined #haiku[11:10:21] *** lukove has joined #haiku[11:14:29] *** rotundNut_ has joined #haiku[11:16:59] *** rotundNut has quit IRC[11:17:58] <Teknomancer> Morning all[11:18:48] *** The123king has joined #haiku[11:23:32] *** rotundNut_ has quit IRC[11:23:35] *** lukove has quit IRC[11:23:49] *** lukove has joined #haiku[11:23:59] *** rotundNut_ has joined #haiku[11:25:01] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[11:25:43] <Duggan> hey Teknomancer[11:25:48] <Teknomancer> hi Duggan[11:31:51] *** MatthewH12 has quit IRC[11:34:49] *** kieselsteini has joined #haiku[11:40:05] *** Kernel86 has quit IRC[11:40:22] *** Kernel86 has joined #haiku[11:43:13] *** negusnyul has joined #haiku[11:45:42] <judgen> g'day mates =D[11:46:24] <surrounder> yo judgen[11:46:29] <judgen> Do we have some auto update nowdays for Haiku?[11:46:48] <judgen> I lost much of my stuff last time i tried to just copy the new files over.[11:47:29] <judgen> also is there a way to disable the studid new way of copying files... the folders merge like in windows instead of replace the folder.[11:47:35] <judgen> highly annoying[11:48:43] <Duggan> no the package management system (which I believe is also supposed to handle updates) isn't finished yet and as far as I know, no there's no way to change how directory copies are handled[11:49:48] <judgen> Duggan: I liked the BeOS way better.[11:50:16] <judgen> Not the os but the way it handled the folder-copy.[11:50:31] <Duggan> lol I sure liked the OS :)[11:51:56] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has quit IRC[11:52:17] <Teknomancer> hi judgen[11:52:22] <Teknomancer> autoupdates?[11:52:23] <judgen> hi Teknomancer[11:52:32] <Teknomancer> ah those[11:52:36] <Teknomancer> yes that'd be awesome[11:53:04] <Teknomancer> Duggan but i heard the package management is designed such that everything including system files/libs etc. are part of a package[11:53:12] <Teknomancer> and thus can be upgraded[11:53:17] <judgen> Teknomancer: sweet[11:53:17] <Teknomancer> probably WIP[11:53:29] <Teknomancer> but i heard this is the aim[11:53:42] <Teknomancer> nowadays it doesn't make sense otherwise[11:53:51] <Teknomancer> i'd be a real pain to reinstall everything all the time though[11:55:43] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[11:55:48] <Duggan> Teknomancer yeah that's why I was mentioning the package manager wasn't finished yet so there's no "autoupdating" feature currently[11:55:51] *** jstressman has joined #haiku[11:55:59] <Teknomancer> ah iokay[11:56:00] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[11:56:40] * Teknomancer wonders if anyone porter Terminator to Haiku[11:56:47] <Teknomancer> s/porter/ported[11:57:26] <Duggan> what is it?[11:58:23] <Teknomancer> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminator_(terminal_emulator)[11:58:29] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[11:58:45] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[11:59:21] <Teknomancer> that might be the wrong link[11:59:22] <Teknomancer> hmm[11:59:40] <Duggan> ..... "runs on any POSIX system with Java 5 or later".... wtf?[11:59:51] <Teknomancer> http://s6.tinypic.com/2z3z9d1.jpg[11:59:57] <Duggan> why would it matter if it's a POSIX system or not if it's running in java?...[11:59:58] <Teknomancer> yeah Duggan , i just noticed that[12:00:01] <Teknomancer> seems it's the wrong link[12:00:09] <Teknomancer> or the article is bloody wrong[12:00:36] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[12:00:42] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[12:01:50] <judgen> Do anyone haev a guess about the 2012 election?[12:02:08] <Duggan> who we think will win?[12:02:30] <judgen> I think it will be Perry VS Obama, and they are both the same so it wont matter who wins...[12:03:20] <Duggan> I don't agree that Perry will make it that far and I don't agree they're the same...[12:03:51] <judgen> One is a religios nutbag and the other is just a nutbag =D[12:03:57] <Duggan> (personally, I'd like to see Bachman with Palin as a running mate)[12:04:16] <judgen> Palin?'[12:04:26] <Duggan> yep[12:04:29] <judgen> So they would lose against Obama?[12:04:35] <Duggan> I don't think they would lol[12:05:19] <judgen> Hope Palin gets an mandatory class in US history as well as basic geography of the world before running.[12:05:38] <Duggan> the media hates Palin, that's a good mark on her in my book....[12:06:05] <judgen> Should you not like Dr. Paul more then?[12:06:30] <judgen> Palin is in the news and has been since 2008 and is not even oficcially running[12:07:08] <Duggan> they're still trying to crucify her.... it just hasn't worked yet :)[12:07:35] <surrounder> as someone from outside the US ron paul always seem the most same to me[12:07:59] <judgen> surrounder: same?[12:08:13] <surrounder> *sane, sorry[12:08:25] <surrounder> moar coffee[12:08:43] <judgen> Duggan: Crucify? seriously? She got her own show on fox, she is followed on her vacation everywhere.[12:09:26] <judgen> I think the huckster had the best chance to beat obama[12:09:40] <Duggan> I don't think he could ever get elected as president[12:10:16] <judgen> surrounder: you are not suppoesed to be sane in the Republikan primararies.. it is alot about getting the evangelical's to vote for you.[12:10:26] <surrounder> ouch[12:10:29] <judgen> Duggan: Why could Huckabee not be president?[12:10:52] <Duggan> didn't say he couldn't be, just said I don't think he would be elected[12:11:30] <surrounder> always seems strange to me they're only 2 big parties in the US, we have 12 to choose from[12:11:54] <Duggan> I think his extreme focus on religion will alienate alot of people[12:12:19] <Duggan> surrounder there are many parties in the US, but yes only 2 big ones[12:12:23] <judgen> I think the drawback of going for the evangelical vote in the primaries is that you are considered a crazy hat in most secular states of the union.[12:12:48] <surrounder> Duggan: seems like there only 2 that actually count[12:13:00] <judgen> surrounder: the green's had a fairly good vote count one election. and also Ross Perot did not do badly in his campaign.[12:13:33] <judgen> I say bring back the Wig party =D[12:13:44] <Duggan> hehe[12:13:49] <judgen> They had a lot of US president.[12:14:28] *** bknoedel has joined #haiku[12:15:27] <judgen> My least favourite president in US history would probably be the democrats "saint" FDR[12:16:05] <judgen> Maybe LBJ as a closed second[12:16:08] <judgen> close*[12:18:27] <judgen> but ia just oppinion[12:19:24] <judgen> Duggan: What do you think about former chair of the federal reserve Herman Cain as a president?[12:19:39] *** lukove has quit IRC[12:19:50] *** bknoedel has quit IRC[12:20:02] <judgen> brb going to install Haiku again..[12:20:05] *** judgen has quit IRC[12:27:44] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[12:27:51] *** HaikuUser is now known as judgen[12:28:15] <judgen> installing A3 as we sepak )D[12:28:31] <judgen> speak*[12:29:03] <judgen> too bad i have to install a noisy gfx card to get decent resolutions.[12:29:13] <judgen> or atleast i think so.[12:29:29] <judgen> havent tried this newer version of haiku.[12:29:38] <OmniMancer1> you could alter your views on decent resoltions and solve the problem without the noisy card :P[12:30:23] <judgen> OmniMancer1 CRT screen... 60 hz on 22inch display just hurts my eyes.[12:30:41] <surrounder> ow indeed[12:30:46] <surrounder> 60 hz is always horrible[12:30:46] <OmniMancer1> then you have another alternative[12:30:55] <OmniMancer1> don't use a CRT[12:31:05] <judgen> Not as get headaches from all LCD\s i own[12:31:18] <judgen> i have a very odd problem with my eyes[12:31:30] <judgen> install done.[12:32:05] *** judgen has quit IRC[12:35:09] *** Ziusudra has quit IRC[12:35:44] *** judgen has joined #haiku[12:35:58] <judgen> Is the bootloader not called bootman anymore_[12:36:26] <OmniMancer1> BootManager I think[12:36:35] <zgaga> bootloader can be installed from menu of installer program[12:36:38] <OmniMancer1> there should be a leaf menu option[12:36:49] <OmniMancer1> also it is now in the installer[12:37:16] <judgen> BootManager worked.[12:37:28] <judgen> one more reboot..[12:37:33] *** judgen has quit IRC[12:38:56] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[12:39:02] *** judgen has joined #haiku[12:39:34] <judgen> how do i figure out what gfx card driver that is beeing used?[12:39:46] *** Nozy has quit IRC[12:39:59] *** JonathanThompson has quit IRC[12:40:37] <judgen> Driver used: Not Implemented.[12:40:49] <judgen> ill just get my card then.[12:40:53] <OmniMancer1> open screen[12:40:56] <OmniMancer1> prefs[12:41:15] <OmniMancer1> and hover over the monitor[12:41:21] *** makopo has joined #haiku[12:41:24] <judgen> aaah VESA[12:41:44] <judgen> guessing that getting more hz out of the VESA driver is out of the question?[12:42:23] <OmniMancer1> unless the VESA version it uses has some way to do that probably is out of the question yea[12:42:59] <judgen> ok swapping cards then.[12:43:04] *** judgen has quit IRC[12:47:46] *** hey68you has quit IRC[12:50:29] *** DrHouse|TARDIS has joined #haiku[12:53:05] *** judgen has joined #haiku[12:53:41] <judgen> wyw it works like a charm[12:53:44] <judgen> yay[12:54:49] <judgen> the anyboot images is GCC2 hybrid? correct?[12:57:12] <judgen> wow webpositive is blazingly fast[13:00:49] <OmniMancer1> all of the official releases are GCC2 hybrid[13:15:06] *** Suner has joined #haiku[13:16:29] <judgen> nice[13:16:57] <judgen> Hmm media services crashed and if i try to restart them i get a loud beeing sound instead of sound.[13:18:48] <judgen> it worked for a while though[13:21:45] *** makopo has left #haiku[13:22:44] *** Suner has quit IRC[13:23:56] <zgaga> Would it be anything wrong if I use BStreamingGameSound[13:23:57] <zgaga> ?[13:25:16] <OmniMancer1> hmm>[13:25:18] <OmniMancer1> ?[13:26:03] <zgaga> in be book it is not recommended to use it[13:26:27] *** fhein has quit IRC[13:33:43] *** voodoo123 has joined #haiku[13:36:04] <judgen> Got an idea why the sound crashes after a while of listening?[13:43:40] <judgen> ill try rebooting again[13:43:42] *** judgen has quit IRC[13:50:25] *** judgen has joined #haiku[13:51:10] <judgen> is opensound installed by default onthe A3 image?[13:51:28] <OmniMancer1> doubt it[13:51:33] <OmniMancer1> that would be bad[13:51:54] <judgen> i installed it, might it be the problem i am having. As it worked before.[13:52:09] <judgen> but i can not find a list of installed files so i can remove it.[13:52:14] <OmniMancer1> I don't know maybe[13:52:28] <OmniMancer1> that is a reason not to install OSS[13:54:53] <judgen> i removed all files named OSS and the opensound addon to media[13:55:01] <judgen> but i guess i am missing something[13:55:36] <OmniMancer1> try reinstalling haiku[13:55:44] <judgen> OmniMancer1 Aw MAAAN[13:55:48] <judgen> i just did[13:59:20] *** judgen has quit IRC[13:59:48] *** lukove has joined #haiku[14:00:45] *** judgen has joined #haiku[14:01:27] <judgen> yay that worked![14:01:53] <Teknomancer> judgen what worked?[14:01:56] <judgen> after removing the files, i deleted all preferences too and rebooted.[14:01:58] <Teknomancer> removing all "*oss*" files in haiku?[14:02:11] <judgen> also the opensound_media_addon[14:02:20] <Teknomancer> hmm[14:03:39] <judgen> even the front jack works now[14:04:53] * judgen is listening to Cuberok - Lilly Allen whilst using webpositive to find a nifty wallpaper.[14:15:43] <judgen> is there any way to watch youtube anymore? or is all the sollutions broken now?[14:16:47] <OmniMancer1> don't know[14:21:50] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[14:25:11] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[14:26:53] *** dru_ has joined #haiku[14:31:00] *** Kernel86 has quit IRC[14:33:03] *** judgen has quit IRC[14:33:36] *** phalax has joined #haiku[14:35:35] *** Kernel86 has joined #haiku[14:59:46] *** phalax has quit IRC[15:02:52] *** brrant has joined #haiku[15:09:50] *** adominguez has quit IRC[15:13:25] *** lukove has quit IRC[15:18:38] *** Colin_Finck|lap has joined #haiku[15:19:03] *** lukove has joined #haiku[15:19:38] <zgaga> It would be nice to have ability to change default yellow color of window titlebar to custom one[15:20:59] <OmniMancer1> you can[15:21:13] <zgaga> how?[15:21:14] <OmniMancer1> I like making them a nice deep shade of green[15:21:20] <OmniMancer1> appearance preflet?[15:21:34] <OmniMancer1> you used to be able to at any rate[15:24:10] <Teknomancer> scgtrp ; do you know if I could give the haiku vbox additions a try at the present stage? where would i get them from?[15:27:01] *** Colin_Finck|lap has quit IRC[15:27:02] *** Colin_Finck|lap has joined #haiku[15:30:09] *** phalax has joined #haiku[15:30:32] *** OmniMancer1 has quit IRC[15:35:25] <Teknomancer> anyone running Haiku in VBox at the moment?[15:37:22] <Teknomancer> typing ~ (tilde) in terminal/Pe needs to be done 2 times[15:37:31] <Teknomancer> but it apparently works fine in Keymap preferences[15:37:31] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[15:37:35] <Teknomancer> which leads me to think it's not a VBox bug[15:37:38] <Teknomancer> with keyboard emulation[15:37:53] <Teknomancer> but rather a Haiku/app-specific issue[15:41:01] *** LordLobo has joined #haiku[15:49:17] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[15:49:49] *** bknoedel has joined #haiku[15:50:31] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[15:54:44] *** bknoedel has quit IRC[16:23:31] *** oxoocoffee has joined #haiku[16:26:08] *** phalax has quit IRC[16:27:41] *** Kernel86 has quit IRC[16:31:53] *** Kernel86 has joined #haiku[16:36:49] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[16:37:04] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[16:38:53] *** fhein has joined #haiku[16:41:51] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[16:42:43] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[16:52:28] *** kieselsteini has quit IRC[16:54:37] *** rotundNut_ has left #haiku[16:55:23] *** rotundNut has joined #haiku[16:56:37] <scgtrp> Teknomancer: github.org/scgtrp/vbox-haiku, i've built some binaries but they're out of date now[16:56:56] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[16:56:59] <scgtrp> i'd build you a more current package but my working copy is only semi-working atm due to playing with video stuff[16:57:08] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[16:59:31] <Teknomancer> scgtrp: i see, no problem, i can use the older ones till then[17:00:31] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[17:00:52] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[17:04:09] *** kPb_in_ has joined #haiku[17:04:09] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[17:04:10] *** kPb_in_ is now known as kPb_in[17:04:36] *** J-Ho has left #haiku[17:09:12] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[17:09:13] <Teknomancer> scgtrp: I'd rather not compile the entire vbox tree in my haiku VM for the additions if i can avoid it :)[17:09:34] <scgtrp> you don't have to, kmk VBOX_ONLY_ADDITIONS=1[17:09:42] <Teknomancer> yes I know[17:09:51] <scgtrp> or whatever it is, it's actually like 4 times longer than that[17:10:19] <Teknomancer> do I need to do anything extra for kBuild?[17:10:32] <Teknomancer> do you use ./configure or the tools/env.sh approach?[17:10:51] <scgtrp> yes, try it once, wait for it to fail, update revision.kmk, resume build[17:11:02] <Teknomancer> i see, will give it a go when i get some time then,[17:11:05] <scgtrp> there are build instructions in there[17:11:08] <scgtrp> README.haiku[17:11:15] <Teknomancer> ah thanks[17:11:28] <scgtrp> it'll get a lot less insane soon though, that's one of my major cleanup tasks[17:11:28] <Teknomancer> internally we don't use configure anymore, i was wondering if it was busted in general[17:11:31] <Teknomancer> good to know[17:13:02] <Teknomancer> kmk love[17:13:58] <Teknomancer> ^ works as expected :)[17:14:22] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[17:14:40] <zgaga> I figured out that using simply BStreamingGameSound is not good idea because of threading issues[17:14:55] <zgaga> I'll go for BPushGameSound[17:18:16] *** hoelzro has joined #haiku[17:20:43] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[17:21:52] *** DDevine has quit IRC[17:23:45] *** _marc` has quit IRC[17:23:52] *** kieselsteini has joined #haiku[17:26:19] *** Stellar|2 has joined #haiku[17:28:36] *** tqh has joined #haiku[17:28:49] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[17:33:17] *** humdinger has joined #haiku[17:35:42] *** Colin_Finck|lap has quit IRC[17:38:23] *** Tanami has left #haiku[17:42:37] *** _arjen_ has joined #haiku[17:53:05] *** tqh has quit IRC[17:56:09] *** humdinger has quit IRC[18:01:26] *** jmelesky has joined #haiku[18:04:33] *** rotundNut has quit IRC[18:04:48] *** freakazoid0223 has joined #haiku[18:12:40] *** JonathanThompson has joined #haiku[18:21:28] * Teknomancer poits JonathanThompson[18:22:04] * JonathanThompson poits Teknomancer in greetings[18:22:26] <Teknomancer> :)[18:24:36] <JonathanThompson> Want to make a recruiter a sad panda, Teknomancer?[18:24:59] <Teknomancer> lol[18:25:05] <JonathanThompson> Explain to them that while you're available, due to some silly rule about 100 day breaks, you're not eligible to work a particular type of contract.[18:25:08] <Teknomancer> what's up?[18:25:18] <Teknomancer> hmm[18:25:36] <Teknomancer> wow.. 100 day breaks[18:26:32] <JonathanThompson> Because I finished up a very short-term contract that's A-, I can't take on a long-term V- contract until I've had that break, but I'd be able to take on an A- contract that used up up to the rest of the 1 year-100 day (or whatever) limit.[18:26:46] <Teknomancer> JonathanThompson is the hiring scene still only offering contracts and not employee positions?[18:26:59] <JonathanThompson> No, full-time positions are available.[18:27:51] <JonathanThompson> Here's the funny thing about that short-term contract I had, Teknomancer: I was automating OSX/iOS builds by re-creating C#/ANTLR-based tools in a combination of Java, Perl and AWK and ANTLR, at Microsoft.[18:27:56] <Teknomancer> I somehow feel contracts are always heavily slated towards the company's favour[18:28:35] <Teknomancer> Ahh :)[18:28:36] <JonathanThompson> I was working in everything-but-Microsoft's-technology at Microsoft at their request.[18:28:48] <Teknomancer> that actually doesn't sound too bad[18:29:02] * Teknomancer is allergic to Microsoft technologies[18:29:14] <JonathanThompson> And it was a 1 month contract, because it was the end of the budget year, and they ran out of budget to keep me longer :p[18:29:37] <Teknomancer> esp. after seeing some of the windows file system and video drivers :/[18:29:47] <Teknomancer> ah that sucks[18:29:47] <JonathanThompson> So, yes: it's got to be the strangest thing in my field on my resume at this time.[18:30:27] <JonathanThompson> I was working on the Lync team.[18:30:28] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[18:30:49] <Teknomancer> i'd still think just the words working for Microsoft boosts your resume's value[18:30:57] <JonathanThompson> Perhaps :)[18:31:11] <JonathanThompson> Now I've got, in order, experience at Yahoo!, Amazon.com and Microsoft.[18:31:21] <JonathanThompson> (Besides other curious ones)[18:31:46] <Teknomancer> I still don't know how Yahoo are still in business :)[18:31:47] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[18:31:48] <JonathanThompson> Now I need to add Google and Apple, right? :D[18:31:57] <Teknomancer> yeah :)[18:33:31] <JonathanThompson> I'm not entirely certain how Google is, but I know when you work at Microsoft and Apple, they greatly desire that you not do something outside of work that is development: IIRC, what's theirs is theirs, and what's yours is theirs when you create apps, etc.[18:33:54] <JonathanThompson> So there can be advantages in terms of freedom of what you do outside of work hours if you're on a contract.[18:33:54] <Teknomancer> hmm[18:34:02] <Teknomancer> yeah that makes sense[18:34:03] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[18:36:57] *** kieselsteini has quit IRC[18:37:27] <JonathanThompson> I'm curious as to what will become of the mobile OS/device sector after yesterday's announcement, Teknomancer.[18:37:40] <Teknomancer> google+motorola?[18:37:54] <JonathanThompson> Because I'm old enough and cynical, I don't believe for a minute that Moogle won't have an advantage over all the other Android licensees.[18:38:06] <JonathanThompson> And I don't believe the other licensees will believe that, either.[18:38:29] <Teknomancer> Hmm, i don't know too much about the licensing/licensees behind them. i'm yet to get my first droid phone :)[18:38:33] <Teknomancer> which will be soon enough, probably next month[18:38:37] <Teknomancer> as my iPhone contract finally runs out[18:38:50] <Teknomancer> all i know is, many people run Android x86 on VirtualBox :P[18:39:01] <JonathanThompson> Well, there's a bunch of Android licensees, which, up to this point, have all been equally treated for software updates, etc. from Google.[18:39:47] <JonathanThompson> However, Motorola Mobility being bought by Google, there's going to be a bit of natural distrust, despite claims that they'll be treated just like all the others.[18:40:02] <Teknomancer> I hear Samsung is not too pleased :)[18:40:28] <JonathanThompson> I've thus far only seen the copy/pasted "Yes we're glad!" statements Google put out from all of them :p[18:41:03] <JonathanThompson> It's curious how they all say almost exactly the same thing: makes you wonder if they had Google's hand up their back, moving their mouths to say it :D[18:41:51] <Teknomancer> haha[18:43:01] <JonathanThompson> Part of me sees the whole development much like the Microsoft/Borland thing: in theory, Borland should have gotten necessary access to the OS APIs and what was coming down the pike to make their developer tools...[18:43:07] <Teknomancer> It's pseudo-random autogenerated using copy pasta spaghetti code[18:43:19] <JonathanThompson> In reality, Microsoft's internal team always got the advantage, so Borland was always going to be late.[18:43:51] <JonathanThompson> I still maintain that Borland's tools and their libraries were better (OWL) than Microsoft's (MFC).[18:44:00] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[18:44:08] <Teknomancer> i've only used MFC for a short period of time[18:44:15] <Teknomancer> don't remember using OWL[18:44:18] <JonathanThompson> But, Microsoft had that lead time for supporting the latest Windows APIs, and Borland could never keep up.[18:44:28] <Teknomancer> ahh[18:44:32] <The123king> !@£$%^&*()_}{POIUYTREWQ|":LKL:"|[18:44:42] <The123king> whoops[18:44:48] <Teknomancer> passwd[18:44:52] <Teknomancer> change required[18:44:53] <JonathanThompson> The123king: doing regex in the channel? :D[18:44:54] <Teknomancer> The123king :)[18:45:33] * JonathanThompson copies down text :p[18:46:20] <The123king> dodgy copy-pasting :s[18:46:45] <JonathanThompson> You zigged when you should have zagged :p[18:47:26] <The123king> :P[18:47:58] <Teknomancer> JonathanThompson still have any ideas/hopes for Project X on Haiku someday? :)[18:48:27] <JonathanThompson> Memories are long :D[18:48:31] <Teknomancer> hehe[18:48:39] <JonathanThompson> Then again, with the OS taking as long as it is, well... they need to be :P[18:49:07] <zgaga> Where can I find zipped/PDF be book on internet?[18:49:33] <Teknomancer> yes, it's still in Alpha :) but that happens with such massive projects[18:49:33] <JonathanThompson> I would love to know how many Haiku users there are, Teknomancer.[18:49:51] <JonathanThompson> And then I'd love to know how many are developers... and then how many of them would pay for great tools :p[18:49:56] <Teknomancer> Perhaps, you'd know all of them by their first name[18:50:01] * Teknomancer hides[18:50:24] <Teknomancer> but hey[18:50:30] <Teknomancer> they are still doing Java and OS/2 development[18:51:05] <JonathanThompson> Related to this somehow, Teknomancer, I had an interesting discussion with a recruiter Friday: he was evaluating me for submission to a V- contract at Microsoft working on porting their C++ compiler to a different, unspecified platform :p[18:51:17] <Teknomancer> oh my...[18:51:45] <JonathanThompson> Yes, why think small? :)[18:52:05] <Teknomancer> that'd be some effort :)[18:52:28] *** Advant- has quit IRC[18:52:41] <JonathanThompson> Take perhaps the hairiest commonly used programming language and port it to a different processor architecture and optimize it for performance: shouldn't be too hard, right? :p[18:53:02] <Teknomancer> :)[18:53:09] <JonathanThompson> There's a reason that's a V- contract, as they can go over a year :p[18:53:19] <Teknomancer> we have a bot in our work IRC channel[18:53:25] <Teknomancer> that whenever it hears templates/C++[18:53:33] <Teknomancer> it replies "C++ is evil" or "Templates are evil"[18:53:35] <Teknomancer> lol[18:53:37] <zgaga> oh I found it. it's great it has over 700 pages[18:53:50] <Teknomancer> zgaga: I'd be interested[18:53:53] <Teknomancer> in the link if you don't mind[18:54:05] <JonathanThompson> Teknomancer: in the iphonedev channel, we have lots of non-bots that make comparable statements :D[18:54:12] <Teknomancer> :)[18:54:14] <JonathanThompson> (And they don't stop with a single sentence)[18:54:16] <zgaga> www.typewritten.org/Articles/Be/bebook-1.1d6.pdf[18:54:17] <Teknomancer> about Objectivec C? :P[18:54:23] <Teknomancer> zgaga thanks[18:54:29] <JonathanThompson> They think C++ is evil :D[18:54:48] <Teknomancer> :)[18:57:54] *** scgtrp has quit IRC[18:57:58] *** phalax has joined #haiku[18:58:00] <JonathanThompson> Of course, I'm working on my first iPhone game, which has the game logic itself in C++, but the GUI and such in Objective-C.[18:58:02] <jrabbit> if you don't like C++ I don't possibly see how ObjC is better[18:58:15] <smop> need some haskell[18:58:19] <JonathanThompson> jrabbit: it's simpler, seems to be their main argument.[18:58:55] <jrabbit> smop: atleast you get somethign for haskell's weirdness :)[18:59:09] <JonathanThompson> I wish the Obj-C libraries for ADTs were as complete/powerful as STL.[18:59:34] <smop> yep[18:59:38] <Teknomancer> I wish debugging heavily optimized template code was easier[19:00:17] *** luroh has joined #haiku[19:00:27] <negusnyul> what is the current status of WPA on Haiku?[19:00:47] <JonathanThompson> Teknomancer: one thing of Objective-C that takes getting used to is it being valid to send messages to nil objects :p[19:01:06] <Teknomancer> lol[19:01:31] <jrabbit> negusnyul: works if you grab the magic wpa_supplicant.[19:02:04] <negusnyul> jrabbit: cool, can you give me a dl link? or I need to compile from source[19:02:08] <negusnyul> ?[19:02:27] <jrabbit> someone else has it I'm sure[19:02:30] <jrabbit> the link[19:02:31] <luroh> negusnyul: requires alpha 3 and there's no support for key storage though[19:03:16] <luroh> the source is not in the project's repo, afaik[19:07:08] <luroh> negusnyul: http://haiku.mlotz.ch/wpa_supplicant_r1alpha3.zip[19:08:24] <negusnyul> luroh: thanks![19:10:05] *** brrant has quit IRC[19:12:22] *** tqh has joined #haiku[19:27:26] *** genkie has joined #haiku[19:31:58] *** lukove has quit IRC[19:33:18] *** Teknomancer has quit IRC[19:33:32] *** Teknomancer has joined #haiku[19:33:37] *** jalopeura has quit IRC[19:34:36] *** dobroerlanger has quit IRC[19:35:10] <Teknomancer> #$$(*&#$*( close client by mistake[19:43:16] *** user___ has joined #haiku[19:48:24] *** dobroerlanger has joined #haiku[19:48:28] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[19:51:24] *** brechtm has joined #haiku[20:04:03] *** The123king has quit IRC[20:08:22] <Teknomancer> Roster.cpp why is there a "printf("_SendToRunning : B_REFS_RECEIVED\n");" in there? missed removing debug line during commit it seems like[20:08:27] <Teknomancer> probably should be removed[20:08:42] <Teknomancer> trunk/src/kits/app/Roster.cpp[20:09:09] *** user___ has quit IRC[20:17:17] <Teknomancer> anyway heading home now, l8rz[20:21:02] *** lukove has joined #haiku[20:35:12] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[20:35:39] *** phalax has quit IRC[20:38:16] *** duvjones has quit IRC[20:39:19] *** duvjones has joined #haiku[20:40:34] *** zgaga has quit IRC[20:45:27] *** lukove has quit IRC[20:47:42] *** brechtm has left #haiku[20:50:31] *** lukove has joined #haiku[20:56:42] *** oxoocoffee has quit IRC[21:09:02] *** voodoo123 has left #haiku[21:23:27] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[21:30:11] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[21:32:22] *** Cr0wb4r has joined #haiku[21:33:15] *** Advant has joined #haiku[21:33:42] *** vooshy has joined #haiku[21:37:25] *** tqh2 has joined #haiku[21:38:25] *** tqh has quit IRC[21:58:48] <Cr0wb4r> If I remember correctly BeOS had the ability to run some windows programs using some librarys that translated system calls and programs instructions so that the BeOS could understand them. Will the haiku OS ever aim for this? Or is it in the todo list?[22:03:55] *** fhein has quit IRC[22:05:32] <tqh2> it's probably a 3rd party oppertunity. To much work to do already.[22:05:57] <tqh2> winbe was the name btw.[22:07:11] *** tqh2 has quit IRC[22:08:03] <HeTo> the winbe on BeBits seems to be for the opposite purpose: to compile and run BeOS apps on Windows[22:09:14] <vooshy> there was work on wine for beos back in the day, but it struggled to get off the ground really[22:09:31] *** tqh has joined #haiku[22:10:58] *** pgr has joined #haiku[22:16:07] <Cr0wb4r> Hmm perhaps that is something I will look into. Though I would prefer something that was a bit more efficient than wine. Though reverse engineering MS libs does not sound fun.[22:18:56] *** tqh has quit IRC[22:19:22] <HeTo> a bit more efficient than wine? in what way?[22:19:59] *** adamk has joined #haiku[22:20:00] *** adamk has joined #haiku[22:20:39] *** adamk has quit IRC[22:23:04] <Cr0wb4r> Heto as in being able to use drivers written for MS. I have yet to find a way to use graphics drivers in wine so that I can really use it for anything like photoshop. Don't get me wrong, I love wine use it and am grateful for it but it has some problems that force me to use windows.[22:23:48] <Cr0wb4r> Though most of the problems I have had have been with special software like Rosetta stone that runs a server and a client at the same time.[22:24:03] <PulkoMandy> well, if you want windows... use windows ?[22:24:16] <PulkoMandy> or there is ReactOS which plans for supporting MS drivers[22:24:22] *** LordLobo has quit IRC[22:24:58] <Cr0wb4r> I Hate windows, I just am forced to use it because of some programs that I use. And I looked at ReactOS which looks promising.[22:26:59] <HeTo> being able to run Windows drivers is not directly connected to efficiency[22:27:15] <HeTo> how do you need Windows graphics drivers for Photoshop anyway?[22:27:42] <Cr0wb4r> Also I like the speed of Haiku OS and have yet to see any other OS that comes close to it (with a very few exceptions like MinuetOS).[22:28:09] <Cr0wb4r> HeTo perhaps I should have said versatility.[22:28:57] <Cr0wb4r> CS5 requires a 512mb graphics card. And needs to be able to use it.[22:29:04] *** MatthewH12 has joined #haiku[22:29:08] *** LordLobo has joined #haiku[22:29:23] *** MatthewH12 has quit IRC[22:29:47] <HeTo> use it for what? you can use OpenGL on Wine, and Wine even implements DirectX using OpenGL[22:29:52] *** MatthewH12 has joined #haiku[22:31:50] <Cr0wb4r> Right it is the driver that I have run into the most problems with. Driver support on linux is pretty good but there is always that one card that no one likes.[22:32:34] <HeTo> well if you are serious just buy NVIDIA[22:33:02] <HeTo> and no, Linux supports drivers very badly[22:33:10] *** dru_ has quit IRC[22:33:36] <HeTo> Linux just bundles a lot of drivers with the kernel, and a few external drivers just cope with it[22:35:53] <Cr0wb4r> I guess I should say that I have been able to find drivers for most of my hardware.[22:38:31] <Cr0wb4r> HeTo is there a OS that you prefer to Linux that supports drivers better?[22:39:12] <HeTo> note that Linux does support hardware very well[22:39:19] <HeTo> because of what I said[22:39:47] <HeTo> in practice I mostly use Linux[22:39:57] <HeTo> except on my server where I run FreeBSD[22:40:25] <HeTo> in theory I prefer Haiku to Linux but it's not there yet (Haiku also supports drivers a lot better than Linux)[22:40:58] <Cr0wb4r> I have been thinking about messing with FreeBSD. I too mostly use Linux but hope to use Haiku.[22:44:28] *** Ziusudra has joined #haiku[22:48:25] <NeonLicht> 222515 HeTo:and no, Linux supports drivers very badly[22:48:26] <NeonLicht> 223124 HeTo:note that Linux does support hardware very well[22:48:49] <NeonLicht> How did you change your opinion so drastically in less than 7 minutes?[22:49:01] <HeTo> drivers != hardware[22:49:19] <HeTo> Linux doesn't support drivers very well but it includes a lot of drivers which support a lot of hardware[22:49:33] *** Cr0wb4r has quit IRC[22:49:38] <NeonLicht> Uh, OK :)[22:49:52] <vooshy> i was thinking more mood swings :)[22:50:10] <HeTo> and as I said, due to its popularity some out-of-tree drivers just cope with the poor support for drivers[22:50:50] <vooshy> i wouldnt worry the Cr0wb4r left[22:52:10] *** Cr0wb4r has joined #haiku[22:53:30] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[22:58:12] *** _marc` has quit IRC[23:07:21] *** f1assistance has joined #haiku[23:11:27] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[23:13:07] *** Colin_Finck|lap has joined #haiku[23:13:35] *** Colin_Finck|lap has quit IRC[23:13:35] *** Colin_Finck|lap has joined #haiku[23:16:09] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[23:19:11] *** zgaga has joined #haiku[23:19:31] <zgaga> can linux static library (.a) be used under haiku?[23:21:12] <mrsunshine> static libraries yes, but not libraries compiled for linux :P[23:21:27] <zgaga> i don't understand[23:21:46] <mrsunshine> static libraries can be used under haiku, but not if its a library that is compiles for linux[23:21:51] <mrsunshine> it has to be compiled for haiku =)[23:22:03] <hoelzro> :w[23:22:07] <hoelzro> oops[23:22:13] <hoelzro> this isn't Vim![23:22:29] <zgaga> ok[23:23:18] <Cr0wb4r> hoelzro: I do the same thing XD[23:31:06] *** zgaga has quit IRC[23:33:43] *** pgr has quit IRC[23:42:53] *** zgaga has joined #haiku[23:52:09] *** lukove has quit IRC[23:54:17] *** Ziusudra has quit IRC[23:55:29] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[23:55:45] *** zgaga has quit IRC[23:58:07] *** negusnyul has quit IRC[23:59:57] *** Qeos has quit IRC