July 27, 2010 
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July 27, 2010 [00:01:35] <bmp> dru345: Thank you for the link; I don't know why I didn't find that page the first time. I do notice that it fails because it wants GCC 2.95.3-haiku-100712, whereas I have -1004something. Does this mean I should just build the support tools, even though the docs say I needn't bother?[00:02:05] <CIA-54> zooey * r37763 /haiku/trunk/ (10 files in 6 dirs):[00:02:05] <CIA-54> * updated ICU build packages with newer builds that try a bit harder to avoid[00:02:05] <CIA-54> warnings and incorporate some of the ICU-patches we had in our repo before[00:02:05] <CIA-54> we upgraded to 4.4.1[00:02:05] <CIA-54> * fixed remaining warnings when building locale kit[00:02:05] <CIA-54> * activated EnableWerror for locale kit[00:02:05] <CIA-54> * added 'Unicode' license, which is the second license in use by ICU[00:03:03] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[00:03:25] <dru345> bmp - it's difficult to find some pages[00:05:16] <mmadia> there's been some changes in public headers since r1a2.[00:05:37] <mmadia> it's easiet to simply upgrade to a nightly and build from there.[00:06:16] <bmp> All right, I'll do that. Thanks.[00:07:37] *** bmp has quit IRC[00:08:56] *** oxoocoffee has quit IRC[00:17:12] *** Hubert_ has joined #haiku[00:30:47] *** ker has left #haiku[00:30:59] *** Ola__ has quit IRC[00:35:11] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[00:35:20] *** _arjen_ has quit IRC[00:43:47] <CIA-54> zooey * r925 /haikuports/trunk/dev-libs/icu/ (icu-4.4.1.bep patches/icu-4.4.1.patch): * updated ICU bep and patch to match ICU packages dated 2010-07-26[00:43:55] *** dru345 has quit IRC[00:48:28] *** dru345 has joined #haiku[00:50:31] *** dflemstr has quit IRC[00:50:53] *** yourpalal_ has quit IRC[00:51:09] *** veve-mao has quit IRC[00:53:46] *** Hubert_ has quit IRC[00:55:11] *** sprma has quit IRC[00:55:41] *** dflemstr has joined #haiku[00:57:54] *** oco2 has quit IRC[01:05:37] <Duggan> wb dru345[01:06:00] <dru345> ty[01:06:02] <Duggan> np[01:11:16] <Duggan> dru345 the rate I've been going, I should have a mostly-finished product by the end of the night[01:13:32] <Duggan> hmm[01:17:50] <dru345> i'll find you some bugs ;)[01:17:56] <Duggan> hope so :)[01:18:00] <Duggan> I'm sure there will be plenty[01:18:06] <Duggan> though I've fixed a few since the last one[01:18:24] <dru345> things don't disappear? :)[01:22:15] <Duggan> lol that depends[01:22:33] <Duggan> if they disappear then its because you set their parameters outside of the filter[01:22:41] <Duggan> which is to be expected :P[01:23:45] <Duggan> I think there are still some problems with the controls in the ticket view (and there are about to be alot more when i finish what I'm working on now)[01:29:23] *** saivert has quit IRC[01:29:24] *** tmpsaivert has joined #haiku[01:29:25] *** tmpsaivert is now known as saivert[01:29:26] *** saivert is now known as tmpsaivert[01:29:27] *** tmpsaivert is now known as saivert[01:34:33] *** michaelvo has joined #haiku[01:34:56] <michaelvo> haiku doesn't have a rename command?[01:35:02] *** dru345-haiku has joined #haiku[01:35:20] <dru345> rename?[01:35:37] <michaelvo> yes.. to rename multiple files to uppercase at terminal[01:35:38] <Anarchos> michaelvo just use mv a b[01:35:41] <Anarchos> in the same dir[01:35:51] <Anarchos> oh multi files ? dunno[01:35:55] <michaelvo> I have 50 files in a folder[01:36:02] <michaelvo> all lowercase[01:36:18] <michaelvo> I want to switch to uppercase[01:36:35] <michaelvo> In linux the command is rename 'y/a-z/A-Z/' *[01:36:39] *** impy has quit IRC[01:38:06] <dru345> rename on linux is actually a perl script[01:38:26] <mmadia> for file in * ; do echo "mv $file `echo $file | tr '[a-z]' '[A-Z]'`" ; done[01:38:46] <michaelvo> huuum.. tr is what I'm looking for[01:38:54] <mmadia> that will only echo the command.[01:38:55] <dru345> the code is here - http://tips.webdesign10.com/files/rename.pl.txt[01:41:46] <Duggan> whats the best way to check if a BString is empty?[01:44:34] <michaelvo> thanks[01:44:39] <michaelvo> all works here[01:45:04] *** michaelvo has quit IRC[01:45:56] <Duggan> ok dumb question but something still isn't working :/[01:59:33] *** l_n has joined #haiku[01:59:33] *** l_n has joined #haiku[02:00:07] <l_n> rawr! :)[02:00:47] <dru345> hello l_n[02:01:52] * l_n still hasn't found his misplaced mind..[02:02:12] <dru345> use Tracker to do a query for it? :p[02:07:06] <Duggan> hey l_n[02:17:02] *** warpdesign has quit IRC[02:28:09] *** tmpsaivert has joined #haiku[02:28:10] *** saivert has quit IRC[02:28:14] *** tmpsaivert is now known as saivert[02:30:04] *** cpr420 has joined #haiku[02:30:16] <dru345> hello cpr420[02:32:13] <cpr420> hello[02:33:06] <l_n> Duggan && cpr420: hello[02:36:07] <l_n> did i miss any more 'gpl is bad' discussion after i timed out earlier?[02:36:29] <dru345> oh i missed out :/[02:37:25] <l_n> i think the person that was defending it may have been fresh from the GNU/Lunix world... :P[02:39:35] <Anarchos> there is no <stack.h> for gcc4 ??[02:40:11] * l_n runs a quick query[02:40:55] <l_n> openssl/stack.h exists[02:42:30] <Anarchos> l_n yes but i am pretty sure it is not the same as in gcc2[02:43:45] <Duggan> hey cpr420[02:43:59] <Duggan> l_n not that I recall.... but yes, GPL is BAD[02:44:23] <Duggan> l_n you should've been here for a debate me and HeTo had a couple years ago :P[02:46:11] <l_n> Duggan: did you convince him that gpl is bad for the OSS community/world at large?[02:47:31] <Duggan> no[02:47:44] <Duggan> but he did call me a filthy capitalist[02:48:24] <Duggan> to each their own I suppose :)[02:50:06] <dru345> how much capital has been spent improving or open sourcing projects (webm, OOo, gecko...) gpl people feed upon?[02:50:50] <Duggan> dru345 the question is, how much more capital has been invested in liberally licensed projects vs copyleft licenses :)[02:50:55] <l_n> haiku, inc. paid stippi to work on webkit... :)[02:51:08] <dru345> :)[02:51:17] <mmadia> hooray for Haiku, Inc. ![02:51:29] <Xeon3D> yo o/[02:51:55] <dru345> hi Xeon3D[02:52:38] <Duggan> hey Xeon3D[02:52:46] <Duggan> l_n what license is webkit under?[02:54:23] <Duggan> another thing, yes I've heard of people making money off of GPLed software, one was where they were contracted to write something, it didn't matter what license it was under as long as the contractee got to use it, and it ended up as GPL[02:54:38] <Duggan> however...[02:54:48] <Duggan> lets take... apache for instance[02:55:09] <Duggan> its a liberally licensed project and thus commercial companies can use its source in their commercial products[02:55:16] <l_n> Duggan: i don't remember..[02:55:48] <Duggan> so if the open source version makes progress, the commercial version makes progress, the company is more likely to spend more money on the open source version in this case[02:56:04] <Duggan> less money for more benefit, its good business[02:56:51] <Duggan> thats not possible with GPLed software[02:56:59] <Xeon3D> Duggan, where do I remember the HeTo nickname from? :X[02:57:08] <Duggan> its over to the right :P[02:57:13] <Xeon3D> right.[02:57:13] <Xeon3D> :)[02:57:18] <Duggan> lol[02:57:47] <Xeon3D> hmmm can someone recommend me a good mp3 player for linux (preferably non-qt/kde)[02:57:50] <DraX> Duggan: soulless capitalist :)[02:58:00] <Duggan> you betcha :)[02:58:08] <luroh> Duggan: sure it's possible, you just have to provide source code for the gpl'd components[02:58:20] <luroh> countless companies do this[02:58:32] <Duggan> luroh if your product is based on the GPLed product, then that means you have to release your source code[02:58:44] <Duggan> its called a "derivative work" and must be GPLed according to the GPL[02:59:06] <luroh> right, but that's not the whole truth[02:59:26] <Duggan> if that company owns the rights to the GPLed product then they can hope to do that, otherwise, no[03:00:13] <Duggan> for instance: Ogre3D moved their project from the lGPL to the MIT license... they owned the rights, they can do that (and I'm glad they did)[03:00:59] <luroh> a good chunk of the whole embedded space use gpl'd stuff[03:01:02] <l_n> Duggan: LGPL and BSD (webkit licensing)[03:01:48] <l_n> Xeon3D: reboot. pick haiku. start mediaplayer. :)[03:01:50] <Duggan> l_n I don't understand dual licensing :/ you get all the trouble from the lgpl and none of the benefit of the BSD[03:02:02] <l_n> Duggan: parts of it are under lgpl and parts are bsd.[03:02:14] <l_n> the probably recycled some other code that was already LGPL.[03:02:37] <Duggan> there are some projects that are dual licensed with the gpl.... I really don't understand that one :/[03:02:39] <l_n> apple has shown a preference for BSD with the core of Darwin already.. so i'd say apple code is mostly bsd[03:02:39] <cpr420> Xeon3D: if you can get songbird to actually run it's nice[03:02:56] <Xeon3D> oh, no. not songbird.[03:03:02] * Xeon3D hates itunes-like things[03:03:03] <Duggan> l_n OSX is based on freebsd isn't it?[03:03:10] <l_n> Duggan: bsd/os[03:03:12] <Xeon3D> l_n, no haiku to pick :D[03:03:23] <l_n> the predecessor to the current *bsd's[03:03:49] <l_n> os x is based on NeXTStep/OpenStep which had a bsd/os core, IIRC[03:03:51] <Duggan> gotcha[03:04:01] <Duggan> brb[03:04:05] <l_n> Xeon3D: you should fix that problem.[03:04:28] <Xeon3D> it's not a problem :)[03:04:43] <l_n> if i ever go back to an unix-like os again, it'll be freebsd.[03:05:03] *** intranut has joined #haiku[03:05:41] <intranut> hi all[03:06:22] <Xeon3D> hi intranut[03:07:36] <intranut> hi[03:08:27] <Xeon3D> l_n, haiku at the moment doesn't offer me any more "excitement".[03:09:46] <Xeon3D> and as far as I know, the last revs have been a bit flaky?[03:09:50] <intranut> i have recently downloaded alpha2 and i would like to install in my test system, i have a linux system , with one partition is it required to partition prior to installation?[03:10:32] <Xeon3D> intranut, yes, you should have a partition prepared for haiku, but also, I'd recommend you to try one of the nightlies instead of the alpha2 as many things have changed since then.[03:11:15] <Xeon3D> just resize and create a partition in linux. The haiku DriveSetup app can format it to the required FS (BeFS).[03:11:35] <intranut> is it better to test in qemu first[03:11:36] <intranut> ok[03:12:12] <intranut> great[03:13:34] <intranut> i was following since 2years but did not dare to install on my only system because i donot know whether i will get dual boot or not[03:14:13] <Xeon3D> you will, you have to add it to grub or whatever you use as a bootloader.[03:14:40] <intranut> ok thats great[03:17:34] <Duggan> back[03:17:50] <l_n> front[03:18:01] <Duggan> l_n I tried freebsd quite recently (last week?)[03:18:11] <Duggan> I couldn't do crap with it :/[03:19:02] <Duggan> some people suggested PC-BSD which I may do... or I may just make it another haiku partition...[03:19:09] <Duggan> ... or maybe put Plan 9 on it ;)[03:19:16] <l_n> plan9 confused me.[03:19:27] <l_n> couldn't ever do anything useful with it[03:19:27] <Duggan> me too, but it looks cool[03:19:38] <l_n> it's pastel...[03:19:43] <l_n> very intentionally.[03:19:51] <Duggan> and how many people can say they've got a plan 9 install running native? :P[03:19:54] <l_n> i once read *why*, but i've forgotten.[03:19:57] <intranut> i am just an average user with a little knowledge ;) and i tried to boot from my usb the dd dumped the files but the usb did not become bootable. i took anyboot[03:20:01] <l_n> i had one running native once.[03:20:17] <Duggan> I ran it off a live cd, never installed it to the hard drive[03:20:20] <l_n> intranut: use raw for usb sticks.. it seems to work a little better.[03:20:29] <l_n> http://www.haiku-files.org/raw/[03:20:33] <intranut> oki[03:20:46] <l_n> anyboot is still considered 'experimental'[03:20:51] <Duggan> inferno might be cool but I'm not sure if you even CAN run it native[03:21:58] <Duggan> other than that I'm just about of neato OSes[03:22:04] <Duggan> just about out of^[03:25:34] <l_n> Duggan: uuu was interesting before the lead person decided to switch from x86 asm to stackless python.[03:25:41] <l_n> it died shortly after that.[03:25:56] <l_n> it had no kernel and was all hand-coded x86 asm[03:26:02] <jmayfield> stackless is super cool[03:26:25] <jmayfield> and what made uuu interesting[03:26:28] <jmayfield> imo.. hehe[03:26:32] <Duggan> hmm[03:27:14] <l_n> here's a *great* oss license http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WTFPL[03:28:11] <Duggan> http://unununium.org/ ?[03:30:45] <Duggan> actually (as a hobby of course) for a long time I've wanted to write my own compiler in assembly until it was self-hosting, then use that language to not only write and expand itself, but also to write an OS with it[03:31:08] <Duggan> cut out as much of "what everybody else has done" out of it[03:33:12] <intranut> Duggan: hope you have checked Kolibrios[03:33:19] <Duggan> never heard of it[03:33:40] <intranut> its fork of Minuetos[03:33:46] *** jmelesky has quit IRC[03:34:11] <intranut> i checked in qemu it works[03:35:02] <Duggan> hmm[03:36:29] <Duggan> looks nice[03:36:45] <intranut> you can develop it further i think[03:36:53] <Duggan> I won't :)[03:37:23] <Duggan> biggest reason is that it's GPLed[03:37:41] <intranut> oh i c[03:37:46] *** l_n has quit IRC[03:38:00] <Duggan> I may use it at some point, but I won't assist with development[03:38:39] *** surrounder has quit IRC[03:41:00] <Duggan> it does look pretty good though[03:41:17] *** l_n has joined #haiku[03:43:06] <Duggan> wb l_n[03:43:24] *** surrounder has joined #haiku[03:43:50] *** Sir_Konrad has quit IRC[03:44:55] <intranut> Duggan: will kolibri damage hardware if things go wrong[03:45:45] <l_n> wtf?[03:46:23] <l_n> yes, unununium[03:49:34] *** acous has quit IRC[03:50:11] *** Disreali has quit IRC[03:50:14] *** acoos has joined #haiku[03:51:28] *** dru345-haiku has quit IRC[03:54:36] <Duggan> intranut what do you mean?[03:54:54] <Duggan> l_n wtf?[03:55:00] <Duggan> l_n surprised its still alive?[03:57:23] <l_n> Duggan: no. i got disconnected.[03:57:49] <l_n> #uuu is completely vacant[03:58:28] <Duggan> oh lol[03:58:53] <Duggan> well there was a post on the website on June 1st of this year[03:59:49] <Duggan> actually June 12th[04:00:21] <l_n> yeah.. i saw that.[04:01:44] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[04:03:15] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[04:08:01] * l_n is putting off reading more of darkwyrm's lessons by searching for ultimately meaningless articles on the interwebs thingy.[04:08:40] *** twock has joined #haiku[04:08:43] *** JoeyA has joined #haiku[04:11:09] <Duggan> I requested a connection on haikuware if you want to bother with that :P[04:11:17] <Duggan> I don't really know what they're good for, but I figure why not :P[04:12:12] *** augiedoggie has joined #haiku[04:12:41] <Duggan> hey[04:12:43] *** cpr420 has quit IRC[04:12:45] <l_n> haikuware is eventually supposed to be a 'social-networking' site for haiku/beos related people.[04:12:59] <Duggan> who runs it? I've been trying to figure that out :/[04:13:04] *** augiedoggie is now known as cpr420[04:13:12] <Duggan> wb cpr420[04:14:56] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[04:15:08] <l_n> Duggan: karl[04:15:50] <Duggan> hey Disreali[04:17:16] <Duggan> I don't hear of him much outside haikuware...[04:30:39] *** mmadia has quit IRC[04:38:02] *** redblue has quit IRC[04:42:08] <Disreali> hey Duggan, sorry I was afk[04:42:17] <dru345> hi Disreali[04:43:56] <Disreali> o/[04:50:43] *** Leon9 has joined #haiku[04:52:44] *** Barrett has quit IRC[04:53:29] <l_n> hrm.. i've been thinking a lot lately about a couple of heathen ideas.. "You are your deeds." and "Heathenry is just what we do - die Sitte." any thoughts?[04:57:19] <Duggan> nope[04:57:34] <Duggan> not a heathen so I can't help you much there :P[04:58:03] <intranut> do i need any command to make the usb bootable after dd?[04:59:46] <Duggan> after dd? no[04:59:58] <intranut> Duggan: thanks[05:00:05] *** jmayfield has quit IRC[05:00:11] <Duggan> quite welcome[05:00:38] <intranut> lemme reboot quickly and relogin, wish be goodluck[05:00:45] <Duggan> good luck :)[05:01:12] <intranut> ;][05:03:15] <l_n> is BWindow::ScreenChanged() for resolution changes?[05:04:43] *** ambroff has quit IRC[05:05:07] *** ambroff has joined #haiku[05:13:19] <l_n> so BWindow is everything inside the border + titlebar. BView is a subset/frame within the BWindow ?[05:13:45] * l_n isn't reading ahead, just semi-deducing from reading the bebook definitions of BWindow methods[05:14:10] <Duggan> BWindow is the frame, BView is the area inside the frame[05:16:22] *** intranut has quit IRC[05:16:50] <l_n> ok. gn8. it's 23:19[05:20:55] *** Leon9 has quit IRC[05:20:57] <dru345> goodnight l_n[05:21:20] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[05:28:19] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[05:28:26] *** jmayfield has joined #haiku[05:28:26] <dru345> hi OmniMancer[05:28:33] <dru345> hello jmayfield[05:28:38] <jmayfield> hi[05:28:47] <OmniMancer> hi dru345[05:32:05] <OmniMancer> I'm bored :([05:32:12] <dru345> nooooo[05:32:15] *** havokmalo has joined #haiku[05:38:43] *** cpr420 has quit IRC[05:47:11] <havokmalo> Hello my Haiku brothers and sisters.[05:48:25] <Xeon3D> o/[05:48:59] *** Leon9 has joined #haiku[05:49:51] * Xeon3D got some rad new reggae songs ^_^[05:53:09] <OmniMancer> boooooooorrrreeeeeedddddd[05:56:44] *** aphedox_ has quit IRC[05:56:45] *** Trezker has quit IRC[05:56:45] *** ragcsi has quit IRC[05:56:45] *** LoganA has quit IRC[05:56:45] *** kallisti5 has quit IRC[05:56:45] *** hexamon has quit IRC[05:56:45] *** miffe has quit IRC[05:56:45] *** TrN has quit IRC[05:57:02] *** markos_ has quit IRC[05:58:44] *** helf has quit IRC[05:58:45] * dru345 points OmniMancer at trac ... that'll keep ya busy :P[05:58:45] *** Qeos has quit IRC[05:58:45] *** Auronandace has quit IRC[05:58:51] *** matthia10 has joined #haiku[05:58:52] *** aphedox_ has joined #haiku[05:58:53] *** Trezker has joined #haiku[05:58:53] *** ragcsi has joined #haiku[05:58:53] *** LoganA has joined #haiku[05:58:53] *** kallisti5 has joined #haiku[05:58:53] *** hexamon has joined #haiku[05:58:53] *** miffe has joined #haiku[05:58:53] *** TrN has joined #haiku[05:58:54] *** rkbm has quit IRC[05:58:54] *** gluon has quit IRC[05:59:08] *** gluon_ has joined #haiku[05:59:08] *** Qeos|2 has joined #haiku[05:59:08] * OmniMancer contemplates attempting to port skia to haiku[05:59:09] *** matthias9 has quit IRC[05:59:09] <OmniMancer> yay netsplit[05:59:09] <dru345> that might be cool[05:59:09] *** kjalarr has quit IRC[05:59:09] <dru345> yay[05:59:09] *** kjalarr has joined #haiku[05:59:09] *** helf has joined #haiku[05:59:10] * OmniMancer sighs at 157[05:59:10] <OmniMancer> MB for git on windows[05:59:10] * OmniMancer also destroys enter key[05:59:21] *** rennj has quit IRC[05:59:29] *** joeblob has quit IRC[05:59:31] *** joeblob has joined #haiku[05:59:52] *** rennj has joined #haiku[06:00:07] *** Moiman has quit IRC[06:00:07] *** Jondice has quit IRC[06:00:07] *** Qeos|2 has quit IRC[06:00:07] *** ambroff has quit IRC[06:00:07] *** waveshaper has quit IRC[06:00:07] *** MrSunshine__ has quit IRC[06:00:08] *** knut_ has quit IRC[06:00:08] *** maniac|aw has quit IRC[06:00:08] *** CIA-54 has quit IRC[06:00:08] *** gordonjcp has quit IRC[06:00:08] *** luroh has quit IRC[06:00:09] *** saivert has quit IRC[06:00:09] *** Vampyre 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joined #haiku[06:15:28] <Xeon3D> eh... no services?[06:15:50] *** lorenzo has quit IRC[06:16:08] <Xeon3D> oh :)[06:16:11] <Xeon3D> going for sandwiches... (fed up a bit on pizza) brb.[06:16:18] *** lorenzo has joined #haiku[06:16:35] <dru345> fed up with pizza? :P[06:16:56] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[06:17:13] *** HaikuUser2 has joined #haiku[06:17:18] <HaikuUser> hello[06:19:05] <dru345> hi[06:19:18] <HaikuUser2> just got started with hiaku[06:19:27] <dru345> welcome :)[06:19:32] <HaikuUser2> I am impressed with the speed running in VM. Its faster then windows Native[06:19:33] *** AlonzoTG has quit IRC[06:20:28] <dru345> just curious - which VM app?[06:20:40] <HaikuUser> both VMware and Virtualbox.[06:20:43] <HaikuUser> tried both[06:20:47] <dru345> cool[06:20:54] <dru345> i normally use haiku on vmware[06:20:57] <HaikuUser> shame I can't run it native[06:21:06] <HaikuUser> got a pretty sweet quad core[06:21:21] <dru345> does the CD not boot?[06:21:28] <HaikuUser> nothing works[06:21:30] <dru345> or just can't repartition and all that fuss?[06:21:31] <dru345> oh[06:21:32] <HaikuUser> it boots[06:21:36] <HaikuUser> no network etc[06:21:40] <HaikuUser> no chipset support[06:21:55] <HaikuUser> nvidia 8300[06:21:57] <dru345> did you file a ticket so it can be fixed?[06:22:09] <HaikuUser> not yet.[06:22:11] <dru345> ok[06:22:14] <dru345> please do :)[06:22:20] <HaikuUser> its a asus m4n78 pro motherboard[06:22:42] <HaikuUser> I have no idea how to file a ticket[06:22:46] <HaikuUser> total newb[06:22:58] <dru345> go to http://dev.haiku-os.org[06:23:05] <HaikuUser> if you want me to hack your cars ecm. I am your guy. everything above machine code makes no sense to me[06:23:08] <HaikuUser> LOL[06:23:47] *** lorenzo has quit IRC[06:24:30] <HaikuUser> anyway you can file the ticket ?[06:24:34] <HaikuUser> I don't have a account[06:24:45] <dru345> you can create one[06:24:49] <dru345> there's no restriction[06:24:57] <HaikuUser> ok will do[06:24:59] <HaikuUser> brb[06:24:59] <dru345> :)[06:25:17] <Duggan> HaikuUser what kinds of problems are you having running native?[06:25:56] <Duggan> there are alot of known issues to which there are workarounds[06:26:04] <HaikuUser> no chipset support for the asus m4n78 pro MB. Uses a VIa audio chip and Nvidia chipset with integrated lan[06:26:47] <Duggan> hmm what chipset is the lan?[06:27:05] <Xeon3D> nvidia me thinks[06:27:21] <Duggan> I didn't know nvidia did nics :/[06:27:27] <Xeon3D> they did[06:27:34] <Xeon3D> at least on nforce 2 and 3 times they did[06:27:58] *** jmayfield has quit IRC[06:29:37] <HaikuUser> finding docs right now to post links in the ticket[06:30:40] <HaikuUser> also have radeon hd5770 video card. I knew you weren't supporting those either. But would be nice.[06:31:18] <Xeon3D> haikuUser: support for newer ati cards will come in time since there are docs for it, i think.[06:31:26] <Xeon3D> now nvidia is a whole different issue.[06:32:22] <Xeon3D> which is basically why I don' buy nvidia stuff (apart from high-end vga's)[06:32:23] <HaikuUser> nvidia is a bunch of tards but I can find those docs for the chipset if you want them. Should work for all 8xxx series board[06:32:35] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[06:32:41] <HaikuUser> Geforce 8xxx series stuff. they use the same driver for all the 8xxxx family chipset[06:32:55] <Xeon3D> yeah, but there aren't any open hardware specs for it afaik[06:33:05] <Xeon3D> unlike ATI / Intel.[06:33:21] <OmniMancer> yay for ATI[06:33:22] <HaikuUser> for nvidia 8xxx series chipsets ?[06:33:25] <dru345> wb OmniMancer[06:33:40] <Xeon3D> HaikuUser for anything nvidia-related.[06:34:23] <HaikuUser> What exactly do you need to support my chipset ?[06:34:23] <Xeon3D> meh, my LCD has 3 black pixels :([06:34:31] <Xeon3D> hardware docs...[06:34:51] <HaikuUser> Eyefinity rocks. I got porn in one windows, windows desktop in one windows and hiaku in another window.[06:34:55] <HaikuUser> Life is good.[06:35:09] <HaikuUser> exactly what docs do you want ? Hardware map IO structure ?[06:35:13] <HaikuUser> I can ask around[06:35:37] <HaikuUser> instruction set ?[06:35:49] <HaikuUser> what exactly do you need. I am good at finding these things[06:35:57] <HaikuUser> I know people who work in embeded.[06:35:58] <Duggan> the more the better[06:36:21] <Xeon3D> HaikuUser idk, to be honest... but not so sure if the devs are willing to work with documentation obtained ilegally...[06:36:38] <Xeon3D> and since nvidia doesn't publically give that same documentation.[06:36:42] <HaikuUser> who siad anything about ilegally ?[06:36:46] * Xeon3D is not a dev.[06:36:52] <HaikuUser> ya they won;t give it to you.[06:37:12] <HaikuUser> but there are people who con obtain it for a myriad of legal reasons.[06:37:15] <Xeon3D> if they give it to embedded people or any other person, they must be under a NDA[06:37:18] <OmniMancer> shun the nvidia, ATI forever![06:37:22] <HaikuUser> na no NDA's[06:37:28] <HaikuUser> I do prefer ATI[06:37:33] <HaikuUser> eyefinity is sweet[06:37:47] <Xeon3D> oh well, then idk.[06:37:55] <HaikuUser> I will ask around[06:38:23] <HaikuUser> basically you need the core map, a compiler and instruction set if you want to do it firmware style. Or you just need a high level assembler[06:38:39] <HaikuUser> shame you guys can't make use of the linux or windows driver model[06:38:47] <HaikuUser> those are fiarly well doc'd[06:38:47] <Xeon3D> ewwww[06:39:07] * OmniMancer shuns HaikuUser[06:39:10] <HaikuUser> the issue is the haikucentric compiler as I understand it.[06:39:17] <HaikuUser> why the shunning ?[06:39:20] *** [r4] has joined #haiku[06:40:00] <Xeon3D> wrappers are never a good thing.[06:40:03] <HaikuUser> i'll ask around and see what happen to fall into my lap.[06:40:19] <HaikuUser> I don't disagree but what is so different about the drive rmodel to begin with ?[06:40:34] <HaikuUser> I am not a high level languag guy. I prefer to live in assembler where shit makes sense.[06:43:38] <OmniMancer> perhaps we should have drivers written in scheme :P[06:44:25] <HaikuUser> Has anybody considered that all the card BIOS have to be somewhat generic for VGA modes to work ? Maybe dissassembling the bios might shed some light since we have a good idea of memory mapping from the input side ?[06:44:50] <HaikuUser> for the machine to post the bios on the machine has to talk to the video card for the display to run at all[06:44:59] <HaikuUser> does invidia have a documented instruction set ?[06:47:19] <OmniMancer> I think they very likely use different ones for different cards[06:47:39] <HaikuUser> nah that wouldn;t make any sense[06:47:43] <HaikuUser> to much $$$ in that[06:47:52] <HaikuUser> I did find the shader library pretty easily[06:48:06] <HaikuUser> looks like it is for native windows apps[06:48:13] <HaikuUser> aarrggh and it works with their drivers[06:48:23] <HaikuUser> hmmm time to get some nvidia bios and set what they are doing[06:48:38] <HaikuUser> these things are really just fancys MCU's at the core[06:48:45] <HaikuUser> MCU's I understand[06:48:53] <HaikuUser> windows and drivers. Not so much[06:49:49] <OmniMancer> I don't mean different for every card[06:49:57] <OmniMancer> I mean not necessarily the same for all[06:50:15] <OmniMancer> also the dirvers are what do the shader assembly and compilation[06:50:39] <HaikuUser> at a glance. generic windows drivers run on nivida cards with 3d acceleration. to some degree that suggest they are adding but not removing instructions. which makes sense[06:50:56] <HaikuUser> Yeah I figured that out reading through the shader programming guide[06:51:13] <HaikuUser> shaders get fed to the driver for application compression compiling for translation to the card.[06:51:23] <HaikuUser> the translation compression compiling for the card it the problem[06:51:26] <HaikuUser> now I see[06:51:29] <HaikuUser> hmmmm[06:51:42] <HaikuUser> seems like documenting the hardware is the only course of action[06:53:58] <OmniMancer> pretty much unless nvidia helps it won't happen soon[06:54:58] *** bbjimmy has joined #haiku[06:56:52] <HaikuUser> mind you of my ignorance but this appears to beceveloper tools for linux. if I am reading this correctly.[06:57:20] <OmniMancer> huh?[06:57:23] <HaikuUser> http://developer.nvidia.com/object/cuda_3_1_downloads.html#linux[06:57:40] <OmniMancer> ah that is probably CUDSA runtimes for linux[06:57:44] <OmniMancer> CUDA[06:57:52] <HaikuUser> for using cuda which is a part of the micro architecture. Doing alot of reading[06:58:18] <HaikuUser> actually if I read it right it is a driver developer application. You could also register to be a developer for nvidia[06:58:20] <HaikuUser> here[06:58:56] <dru345> gpl fanatics use binary blobs on linux for video drivers? scandalous![06:59:07] *** veve-mao has joined #haiku[06:59:33] <HaikuUser> http://developer.nvidia.com/page/registered_developer_program.html[06:59:35] <OmniMancer> CUDA is a framework like OpenCL but only for nvidia cards for running programs on the GPU with massive SIMD parralellism[06:59:44] <HaikuUser> I hope I spelled that right I am retyping from windows[07:00:05] <HaikuUser> someone could register from the haiku teams and see if thye let you in[07:00:22] <HaikuUser> actually haiku could send the email[07:00:33] <HaikuUser> from the haiku-os.org website[07:00:44] <HaikuUser> see if they will let you in[07:00:51] <HaikuUser> the answer is NO until you ask[07:01:00] <HaikuUser> anyways I gotta get to bed[07:01:15] <HaikuUser> I will ask around for nvidia and ATI info. anything else you might find useful ?[07:02:14] <Duggan> dru345 you ready for another version?[07:02:20] *** HaikuUser2 has quit IRC[07:02:20] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[07:02:41] <dru345> let me start haiku[07:03:13] <Duggan> alright[07:05:16] *** dru345-haiku has joined #haiku[07:05:57] *** marowit has quit IRC[07:07:39] *** marowit has joined #haiku[07:10:09] *** havokmalo has quit IRC[07:13:41] *** JonathanThompson has joined #haiku[07:15:30] <dru345> hi JonathanThompson[07:15:39] <JonathanThompson> Hi dru345.[07:19:46] <dru345> OmniMancer could you port Modula-2 to Haiku? :)[07:20:34] <OmniMancer> dunni[07:20:37] <OmniMancer> don't know[07:20:42] <OmniMancer> probably wouldn't want to :P[07:20:56] <dru345> i'd welcome it :)[07:33:14] <dru345> the OpenGL 4.1 spec is released.[07:34:35] <MrSunshine__> anyone heard anything from aljen in a while ?[07:34:49] <Duggan> so theres a thingy in jam to use private headers.... is there any similar thing for make?[07:36:03] <Duggan> UsePrivateHeaders <directory list>;[07:38:14] *** surround1r has joined #haiku[07:40:40] *** bbjimmy has quit IRC[07:41:52] *** surrounder has quit IRC[07:44:04] <Duggan> dru345 go to haiku for a sec[07:45:11] *** acoos has quit IRC[07:49:30] *** jamy has joined #haiku[07:58:25] *** Auronandace has joined #haiku[08:12:29] *** JoeyA has quit IRC[08:14:58] *** [r4] has quit IRC[08:29:08] *** redblue has joined #haiku[08:32:06] *** ivoire has quit IRC[08:32:06] *** ivoire has joined #haiku[08:32:36] *** markos_ has quit IRC[08:41:19] *** jamy has quit IRC[08:43:17] *** jamy has joined #haiku[08:58:03] *** brobostigon has joined #haiku[08:58:37] <brobostigon> morning all.[08:59:20] <OmniMancer> hi[09:00:25] <brobostigon> hi OmniMancer[09:06:11] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[09:08:49] *** dru345-haiku has quit IRC[09:09:48] *** dru345-haiku has joined #haiku[09:13:40] *** impy has joined #haiku[09:15:22] *** CyberKitsuneAndr has joined #haiku[09:16:47] *** CyberKitsuneAndr has quit IRC[09:20:42] *** sprma has joined #haiku[09:24:11] *** CyberKitsuneAndr has joined #haiku[09:32:56] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[09:44:12] *** dflemstr has quit IRC[09:49:59] *** dflemstr has joined #haiku[09:53:08] *** CyberKitsuneAndr has quit IRC[09:55:40] *** dru345-haiku has quit IRC[09:56:57] *** CK|iPod has joined #haiku[09:57:01] *** dru345-haiku has joined #haiku[10:04:01] *** lorglas has joined #haiku[10:08:43] *** dru345-haiku has quit IRC[10:12:31] *** The123king has joined #haiku[10:14:28] *** markos_ has joined #haiku[10:16:57] *** Nozy has quit IRC[10:29:26] * dru345 peeks over Duggan's shoulder to look at his project[10:32:00] <Duggan> bah... trying something incredibly iffy[10:32:48] <Duggan> oh damn....[10:33:00] <dru345> good ?[10:33:43] *** xray7224 has quit IRC[10:36:41] <CIA-54> phoudoin * r37764 /haiku/trunk/src/kits/tracker/InfoWindow.cpp:[10:36:41] <CIA-54> Fixed Volume sizes unit in info window, using string_for_size().[10:36:41] <CIA-54> This fix #6395.[10:37:28] *** phoudoin has joined #haiku[10:37:28] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o phoudoin[10:38:06] *** marc_smith has joined #haiku[10:39:04] <CIA-54> phoudoin * r37765 /haiku/trunk/data/catalogs/kits/tracker/ru.catkeys: Fix Tracker russian catalog, broken by previous commit.[10:42:54] *** marshan has joined #haiku[10:44:47] *** tqh has joined #haiku[10:45:56] <marshan> morgen[10:45:57] *** tqh has joined #haiku[10:46:17] *** tqh has quit IRC[10:46:49] *** tqh has joined #haiku[10:49:16] <phoudoin> marshan: morgen[10:49:26] <marshan> :)[10:49:51] <phoudoin> And hi to all our non-german speaking (including me)[10:50:10] <marshan> I'm still only learning german :P[10:51:28] <dru345> hi[10:52:58] <Xeon3D> olá, bom dia! (and for everyone else, hi and good morning)[10:57:30] <phoudoin> So, what's up?[10:58:24] *** maniac|aw is now known as _maniac_[11:01:29] *** CK|iPod has quit IRC[11:02:23] *** CK|iPod has joined #haiku[11:02:32] <Xeon3D> trying to triage a intel bug on the linux kernel[11:03:03] <CK|iPod> Im still waiting for WPA(2) to hit haiku[11:03:15] <CK|iPod> I check the svn logs every day[11:03:33] <CK|iPod> I may even code a bot to do it for me[11:04:03] <PulkoMandy> wget haiku.rss|grep -i wpa[11:04:05] <PulkoMandy> bot done :)[11:04:23] <CK|iPod> XD[11:04:24] *** geist_ is now known as geist[11:06:18] <Duggan> guten morgen, god morgon, ohayou gozaimasu, howdy folks[11:07:14] *** brobostigon has quit IRC[11:07:54] <Xeon3D> Ohayou duggan-san, dou shiteru?[11:11:12] * Xeon3D knows very basic japanese.[11:12:25] <Duggan> Xeon3D good question.... I'vebeen wanting to learn for a long time[11:12:48] <Xeon3D> heh.[11:12:54] <Xeon3D> I don't know that much tho.[11:13:01] <Duggan> if you or anyone you know would be interested in assisting me, let me know ;)[11:13:01] <CIA-54> pulkomandy * r37766 /haiku/trunk/src/ (2 files in 2 dirs):[11:13:01] <CIA-54> * Make linkcatkeys output the fingerprint in decimal in case of error. This makes it easier to match with the one in the[11:13:01] <CIA-54> catkey file.[11:13:04] <Duggan> you now more than me :P[11:13:11] <Xeon3D> just the hi, bye, how are you, numbers and a few more common phrases[11:13:50] <Xeon3D> Duggan, you would say "Genki desu." (I am fine)[11:14:05] <PulkoMandy> preferences > locale > set japanese as preferred language > learn it the hard way[11:14:17] <Xeon3D> I would say Tsukareta[11:14:25] <Xeon3D> which translates roughly to I'm tired.[11:14:44] <Xeon3D> or Tsukareta desu (for completeness)[11:15:31] <Xeon3D> PulkoMandy, that, or watch a log of anime :P[11:15:33] <Xeon3D> *lot[11:15:46] <CIA-54> phoudoin * r37767 /haiku/trunk/data/catalogs/kits/tracker/ru.catkeys: Fixed wrong checksum, whick break the build. Sorry.[11:16:33] <Duggan> Xeon3D I do that too but unfortunately I tend to listen to the poor english voice acting over reading subtitles which really doesn't help anyway[11:16:59] <Xeon3D> I hate dubbed anime. :)[11:17:12] <Xeon3D> go for subtitles.[11:18:44] *** PathagenX has joined #haiku[11:19:11] *** Ola__ has joined #haiku[11:19:29] <Xeon3D> Ganbatte kudasai! <- Do your best! (which normally means good luck)[11:21:17] <marshan> Speed Racer :P[11:21:51] <Duggan> lol[11:22:35] *** dflemstr has quit IRC[11:24:03] <phoudoin> And I was worry when I changed blindly this russian translation ten minutes ago!...[11:24:11] <phoudoin> worried, even[11:25:33] <Xeon3D> =D[11:25:56] *** brobostigon has joined #haiku[11:26:00] <Xeon3D> damn iphone dev team... got a 3GS here waiting for them :P[11:27:33] <dru345> waiting for?[11:28:07] <phoudoin> them. :p[11:28:52] <dru345> oh Portugal didn't get iPhone 4 yet. :/[11:29:12] <dru345> Xeon3D - move to Spain ;)[11:29:35] <Xeon3D> dru345, the new unlock/jailbreak[11:29:38] <phoudoin> Or buy from Spain.[11:29:43] <Xeon3D> dru345, kinda dislike the i4...[11:29:47] <dru345> oh.[11:29:56] <Xeon3D> and i'm feckin poor.[11:30:02] *** Leon9 has quit IRC[11:30:09] <Xeon3D> this iphone I have here isn't mine...[11:30:09] <phoudoin> Or move away from Apple but stay in Portugal. :-)[11:30:11] <dru345> thought i saw iOS 4 was jailbroken.[11:30:22] <Xeon3D> it is... but it's not out yet[11:30:22] <surround1r> phoudoin++[11:30:28] <dru345> oh[11:30:41] <Xeon3D> phoudoin, I don't own anything apple-branded...[11:30:45] <dru345> then claims it has been are vaporware :D[11:30:51] <Xeon3D> dru345,[11:30:57] <Xeon3D> there's proof by the devs.[11:31:08] <Xeon3D> but they're still refining the process...[11:31:34] <Xeon3D> should be out this week tho.[11:31:48] <Xeon3D> specially now that it's legal to Jailbreak and Unlock phones. :)[11:32:03] <Xeon3D> kudos to the EFF. :)[11:32:24] <phoudoin> Xeon3D: then why jailbreak/unlock apple-branded device could be an issue?![11:32:26] <OmniMancer> freeing us from the tyranny that is apple[11:32:35] <Xeon3D> and google :)[11:32:42] <Xeon3D> (yes, rooting is also legal now :P)[11:32:46] <dru345> lol OmniMancer[11:33:15] <phoudoin> Freeing us from the tyranny that is hype, you mean?[11:33:18] <Xeon3D> funnily, the Portuguese law is grey on that subject (unlocking :P)[11:33:42] <Xeon3D> so we have a lot of indian shops who "fix" phones (similarly to what happens in the UK, I reckon)[11:35:18] <PulkoMandy> hey, it's your phone, you do whatever you want with it[11:35:37] <PulkoMandy> if they don't want people to use them the best solution is not to sell them[11:35:49] <PulkoMandy> (they could still build a rental system)[11:36:32] <Xeon3D> thing is, they are selling them preety low (as they're subsidized) and people are taking advantage of it.[11:37:23] <Xeon3D> and since factory-unlocked phones are premium priced... there is a lot of people buying them locked and unlocking them for extra profit.[11:37:23] <phoudoin> They = Apple!? That would be the first time I hear someone saying Apple price are "low" ![11:37:32] <Xeon3D> nah[11:37:38] <phoudoin> India shops.[11:37:39] <Xeon3D> I meant the mobile operators here in Portugal[11:38:17] <phoudoin> Low but with 1 or 2 years mobile contract locked.[11:38:17] *** surround1r has quit IRC[11:38:49] <Xeon3D> On the Nokia 33x0 times (3310, 3330), even I used to walk with a 3310 with a DCT-Calculator as the rom.[11:39:05] <Xeon3D> for unlocking anywhere...[11:39:27] <Xeon3D> Made some nice cash that way[11:42:14] <CIA-54> pulkomandy * r37768 /haiku/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs):[11:42:14] <CIA-54> * Set the ICU default time zone from the locale preflet. Unfortunately it looks like this doesn't solve all the problems[11:42:14] <CIA-54> yet.[11:43:11] *** surrounder has joined #haiku[11:44:58] <CIA-54> pulkomandy * r37769 /haiku/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): * Remove now unneeded (hopefully) timezone data[12:04:18] *** Teknomancer has joined #haiku[12:04:42] *** dru345-haiku has joined #haiku[12:11:03] <Teknomancer> trying out irssi for the firstime, lol getting a simple nicklist involves 2 windows and cat'ing on pipes. sweet![12:11:23] <surrounder> yay for irssi[12:11:24] <dru345> sounds geeky :P[12:11:42] <Teknomancer> i'm going to try get used to it :P it's what all the shell providers provide[12:11:50] <Teknomancer> dru345: it's text based[12:12:01] <Teknomancer> but Terminator+screen+irssi = sweetness[12:12:28] <Teknomancer> lunch[12:12:29] <Teknomancer> bbl[12:16:02] *** leszek has joined #haiku[12:16:14] <leszek> hi[12:16:26] *** Qeos has joined #haiku[12:17:09] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[12:17:58] *** Qeos|2 has quit IRC[12:25:36] <gluon_> Anyone using HTA right now?[12:25:42] <gluon_> it seems terribly broken this time[12:26:06] * dru345 <-- not using[12:29:17] *** Colin_Finck|lap has joined #haiku[12:30:07] *** Colin_Finck|lap has quit IRC[12:30:07] *** Colin_Finck|lap has joined #haiku[12:36:04] *** PathagenX has quit IRC[12:36:12] *** OmniMancer|Haiku has joined #haiku[12:37:21] <phoudoin> gluon_: me niether, but to my defence I tried to break Tracker russian translation, so I'm not totally indifferent to HTA users :-)[12:37:50] <phoudoin> neither[12:42:26] <CIA-54> pulkomandy * r37770 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/ (UserBuildConfig.ReadMe UserBuildConfig.sample):[12:42:26] <CIA-54> * Remove references to the timezone files in userbuildconfig jamfiles. We would need another AddSymlinkToHaikuImage[12:42:26] <CIA-54> example...[12:42:43] *** warpdesign has joined #haiku[12:45:52] <gluon_> phoudoin: ah that's why I saw ru.catkeys updated when svn updating ;)[12:45:58] *** jamy has quit IRC[12:55:23] <phoudoin> gluon_: yep, I'm the gulty for that.[12:56:43] <phoudoin> But that was for a just cause: fixing #6395[12:57:05] <phoudoin> Aka volume sizes displayed in G*i*B instead of GB.[12:57:18] <CIA-54> darkwyrm * r37771 /haiku/trunk/src/apps/resedit/ (ResListView.cpp ResListView.h): I managed to miss these two files the last time I worked on resedit. How it took this long for me to notice, I'll never know. :/[12:57:24] <OmniMancer|Haiku> what are the *s for? :P[12:58:07] <phoudoin> OmniMancer|Haiku: volume size*s*?[12:58:16] <phoudoin> capacity, used, free.[12:59:08] <phoudoin> lunch, BBL.[13:00:11] *** LinuxKeitaro has quit IRC[13:03:37] *** kurain has joined #haiku[13:03:52] <kurain> hello all[13:10:24] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[13:10:27] <OmniMancer|Haiku> you said G*i*B why not just GiB?[13:13:08] <PulkoMandy> to stress the I so no one misses it[13:13:25] <mmu_screen> no way[13:13:39] <mmu_screen> GB = 1024*1024*1024B[13:13:49] <mmu_screen> at least until the US switches to the metric system :P[13:16:07] *** GedMurphy has joined #haiku[13:16:34] <Teknomancer> re[13:17:25] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[13:18:01] *** michaelvo has joined #haiku[13:19:06] *** Trezker has quit IRC[13:20:48] <OmniMancer> mmu_screen: but then GiB is also 1024x1024x124B[13:20:51] <OmniMancer> 1024*[13:21:54] *** l_n has quit IRC[13:21:56] <mmu_screen> I don't know this unit :p[13:22:20] <mmu_screen> let's use the GaB (Gaga Byte) = 1000*1000*1000 :p[13:23:07] *** l_n has joined #haiku[13:23:13] <mmu_screen> cause all those using 1000 are gaga[13:23:49] *** aubrey has joined #haiku[13:23:51] <OmniMancer> Gibbi byte :D[13:26:23] *** lorglas has quit IRC[13:26:26] <dru345> still sounds like pet food to me[13:26:51] <Teknomancer> it should've always been 1024[13:26:59] <Teknomancer> silly HDD manufacturers :P[13:27:06] <Teknomancer> screwed it all up[13:28:08] <OmniMancer> it should always have been 1024[13:28:12] <OmniMancer> but never used giga[13:29:19] <dru345> yes it should've been 1024[13:29:19] *** saivert has quit IRC[13:29:33] <kurain> hello dru345[13:30:01] <dru345> speaking of 1024, why does About Haiku now tell me RAM size and then tell me 1MB is unavailable? why is that unavailable and what use it is to the general user to know that? :P[13:30:03] <dru345> hi kurain[13:30:42] <dru345> err not "unavailable" it says "inacessible (spelling wrong btw)[13:31:29] <kurain> well, some errors like that appear in the user guide[13:32:00] <kurain> but I don't know if it is necessary to point out in the mailing list[13:32:17] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[13:32:58] <gluon_> phoudoin: by the way, what was the problem with 6395?[13:32:59] <kurain> just like " let's you....."[13:33:08] <gluon_> cant find the ticket (probably closed)[13:33:45] <kurain> this is the syntax error[13:36:30] *** veve-mao has quit IRC[13:36:46] *** saivert has joined #haiku[13:39:06] *** saivert has quit IRC[13:43:22] <tqh> dru345, haiku don't use memory that it can't access or that may be 'reserved'. I think 1 MB is reserved to be able to use real mode bios calls (vesa). Haiku now shows this so it doesn't look like the OS is using a lot of mem it is not.[13:44:01] <dru345> ah. ok. that 1 MB is going to vesa in my case.[13:44:45] *** Teknomancer has quit IRC[13:44:55] <dru345> i really think that info could be off in a 'detail' revealing preflet not really needed in that dialog since that provides no explanation for inaccessibility but that's me.[13:44:58] *** saivert has joined #haiku[13:46:09] <tqh> in some cases you have much more mem unavailable. Then it would look like Haiku was using gigs of mem it is not.[13:46:41] <tqh> it might need an explenation popup though.[13:46:51] <OmniMancer> if you had 4GB of ram some would be unusable[13:47:29] *** velcroshooz has joined #haiku[13:48:33] <tqh> that is not entirely true now either, since I think Ingo enabled the extention for addressing more than 32 bit.[13:49:18] <OmniMancer> then if you have 8+GB of ram some will be unusable :P[13:49:28] <dru345> if you need a popup to explain it, it belongs in a preflet :P[13:49:35] <dru345> lol OmniMancer|Haiku[13:49:37] <saivert> so how much ram does the Haiku kernel reserve?[13:49:53] <saivert> isn't that what you are talking about now?[13:50:02] <dru345> apparently not[13:51:47] *** sprma has quit IRC[13:52:49] <tqh> not to much :)[13:54:30] <OmniMancer> saivert: no haiku is not 64 bit yet so cannot use more than howevermany gigs PAE lets it use :P[13:54:39] *** adriano-src has joined #haiku[13:54:52] *** jamy has joined #haiku[13:54:57] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[13:57:26] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[13:58:16] <gluon_> hey kurain[13:58:23] <gluon_> can you login to HTA please?[13:58:30] <gluon_> is it working or completely broken?[13:58:49] <gluon_> try editing some catalog[13:59:20] <dru345> hi kurain, sorry i didn't answer before[13:59:34] <dru345> haiku needs one of these articles and graphics - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Architecture_of_Windows_NT[13:59:44] <kurain> well, I haven't tried that[14:00:04] <kurain> now I will try[14:00:04] *** velcroshooz has quit IRC[14:00:26] *** velcroshooz has joined #haiku[14:00:53] *** _maniac_ is now known as maniac|aw[14:01:40] *** tqh has quit IRC[14:02:14] *** Teknomancer has joined #haiku[14:02:39] <kurain> gluon_, it seems broken[14:02:42] <gluon_> thanks[14:02:53] <kurain> I can't edit any of these catatlogs[14:02:56] <gluon_> maybe travis was trying something[14:03:04] <kurain> maybe[14:03:07] <gluon_> it's broken since yesterday[14:03:08] <waveshaper> god damn... my apartment only got 10amp fuses for normal outlets. and now with my new powersupply on 1000w I keep blowing them if I dont step by step power up the machine[14:03:12] <waveshaper> bah. I gotta move[14:03:24] <kurain> and now I am trying to translate the user guide[14:09:50] *** jamy has quit IRC[14:09:50] *** saivert has quit IRC[14:09:51] *** tqh has joined #haiku[14:10:35] *** Teknomancer has quit IRC[14:10:35] *** Teknomancer has joined #haiku[14:10:39] <HeTo> Duggan: you’re mistaking me for someone else, I don’t think I’ve ever called anyone filthy capitalist[14:10:43] *** jamy has joined #haiku[14:11:19] <Duggan> you were pretty irate[14:12:04] *** Teknomancer has quit IRC[14:12:17] <HeTo> I try not to take sides on the GPL/BSD debate heavily, either[14:13:03] <Duggan> then if it wasn't you with whom I've had the debate, it was someone with a name similar to yours and I appologize[14:13:09] *** viller has joined #haiku[14:13:30] *** sprma has joined #haiku[14:13:38] <Duggan> or is it apologize... bah who's counting[14:13:55] <Duggan> had it right the first time[14:14:28] <Duggan> and by similar I mean very similar[14:14:38] <dru345> I understand the desire by GPL users not to have their code monetized without return of modifications but I don't like the viral nature that almost necessarily brings with it.[14:15:38] <Duggan> dru345 I agree, but as a professional courtesy should I either choose not to make a profit or believe that I cannot make a profit off of a project, I cannot in my good conscience prevent anyone else from attempting to do so[14:15:56] <Duggan> considering that I release that project as open source[14:16:26] <dru345> you can profit from gpl code :P[14:16:37] <dru345> so i'm told ;)[14:16:54] <dru345> i wouldn't try it myself.[14:16:59] <Duggan> by me :P but that is a very special case that I can only assume only very rarely presents itself[14:17:02] *** saivert has joined #haiku[14:17:02] <dru345> i'd likely make a mistake[14:17:30] <Duggan> and certainly not to the degree of profit to be had over the lifetime of the product if it were licensed more liberally[14:17:31] <dru345> then i'd have /. calling for my head and EFF ready to sue :P[14:18:01] <Duggan> EFF?[14:18:10] <Duggan> FSF?[14:18:30] <dru345> all of those FFs :P[14:18:34] <Duggan> lol[14:18:42] <viller> is it possible to connect to the haiku servers directly (not through the API)?[14:18:44] <dru345> EFF is the Electronic Frontier Foundation[14:19:37] <dru345> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Frontier_Foundation[14:20:08] *** brobostigon has quit IRC[14:20:27] *** saivert has quit IRC[14:21:09] <dru345> I guess I was thinking of FSF, not EFF.[14:21:30] <dru345> like i said 5:30am. haven't eaten in 12 hrs. tired.[14:21:42] <Duggan> you've eaten since I have[14:21:55] <Duggan> I think you were up before me though, I got up around 4pm[14:22:02] <gordonjcp> afternoon[14:22:07] <Duggan> hey gordonjcp[14:22:08] * gordonjcp has just finished lunch ;-)[14:22:10] <dru345> heh yes i was up much earlier[14:22:19] <dru345> hi gordonjcp[14:22:32] <Duggan> oh and thats 2pm your time :P[14:22:34] * gordonjcp profits off GPLed code[14:22:39] <dru345> yes Duggan :P[14:22:52] <dru345> although I thought you were on EDT[14:22:57] <gordonjcp> some of which I wrote, some of which I didn't, and some of which I didn't write but did contribute patches back to[14:23:08] <dru345> cool gordonjcp[14:23:16] <dru345> you're living proof :)[14:23:32] <gordonjcp> well[14:23:38] <gordonjcp> for suitably small values of profit[14:23:40] *** tqh has quit IRC[14:23:50] <dru345> any profit is good :P[14:23:56] <Duggan> told you it wasn't much :P[14:24:15] <gordonjcp> so far this year I've got six litres of hydraulic fluid and some brake pipes, and a 12-pack of Old Speckled Hen out of my open-source commercial dealings[14:24:28] <Duggan> lol[14:24:46] <gordonjcp> I'm right into the barter system[14:25:08] <gordonjcp> cashless, merit-based society, it's the way of the future[14:25:40] <Duggan> whether we want it or not[14:28:20] *** saivert has joined #haiku[14:29:08] *** saivert has quit IRC[14:30:42] <viller> will C++ be the assumed application development language for Haiku or will there be Python support again?[14:31:01] <dru345> again? isn't there already Python support?[14:32:00] *** marshan has left #haiku[14:32:09] <michaelvo> Haiku have python for ages[14:32:25] <viller> well sorry, I don't use Haiku so I didn't know :P[14:32:41] <dru345> now you know :)[14:32:54] <dru345> but C++ is assumed for most app development[14:33:39] <viller> but if someone made a python app it wouldn't make it into the standard distribution?[14:34:04] <Xeon3D> viller, very few 3rd party apps do make it into the standard distribution today.[14:34:15] <Xeon3D> even if they're coded in supa-fast assembly or c++...[14:34:29] <Xeon3D> viller, R1 is supposed to be an R5 "clone"[14:34:31] <jamy> even haskel[14:34:42] <viller> what about haskell?[14:34:50] <Xeon3D> whatever wasn't on default R5 won't be on R1 (minus some exceptions me thinks)[14:34:58] <viller> ok[14:35:05] <jamy> hi is very power language[14:35:53] <Duggan> I have yet to figure out what the big deal about haskell is all of a sudden.... sounds like another fad like java and ruby :/[14:36:25] <Xeon3D> Duggan, indeed my good sir.[14:36:35] *** saivert has joined #haiku[14:36:36] <viller> would haiku people prefer all apps to be in C++ then?[14:36:52] <Duggan> viller alot of people use Yab[14:37:05] <OmniMancer> C++ is what the API is in so it is easiest to use[14:37:10] <dru345> hello Xeon3D[14:37:50] <dru345> did you port Falcon yet OmniMancer?[14:37:52] <Xeon3D> yo dru :)[14:38:08] <jamy> its a compiller language like C/C++[14:38:16] *** Colin_Finck|lap has quit IRC[14:38:22] <viller> but can anyone answer my earlier question: is it possible to connect directly to the servers instead of using the API? I'm just interested, no particular motive for asking :P[14:38:56] <dru345> I don't understand your question[14:38:58] <jamy> if developer make it possible[14:39:44] <viller> app server, media server and so on[14:39:55] <jamy> no matter[14:39:59] <Duggan> viller the source is available, you can do anything you want if you want to put forth the effort[14:40:22] <jamy> forth?[14:41:03] <Duggan> viller the whole point of the api is to act as the interface with those kits[14:41:03] *** saivert has quit IRC[14:41:20] <viller> I understand that[14:41:28] <Duggan> if you don't go through the api then you're only doing it the hard way for the sake of doing it the hard way[14:41:59] *** andreas_dr has joined #haiku[14:42:10] <Duggan> the source is available, you can access whatever code you want in any way you want[14:42:23] <OmniMancer> well depending it may be easier to do it the hard way :P[14:42:41] <Duggan> OmniMancer like hardware accelerated graphics? :P[14:43:01] <OmniMancer> :P[14:43:18] <OmniMancer> I mean C++ is evil when it comes to interoperability[14:43:46] <Duggan> I just added a ColumnListView to a project of mine[14:43:57] <Duggan> I kind of bypassed the api lol...[14:44:16] <Duggan> I couldn't do it right so I did it best... statically linked it[14:45:34] <mmu_screen> C++ is used by terrorists :D[14:45:55] <mmu_screen> http://www.numerama.com/magazine/16319-pour-arreter-le-terrorisme-interdisons-la-programmation-c.html[14:46:24] <mmu_screen> (stupid french TV doesn't make the diff between a C++ manual and a terrorist hiding guide)[14:46:50] <Duggan> is there an english version?[14:48:02] * Duggan doesn't feel like screwing with google right now[14:48:34] *** saivert has joined #haiku[14:49:15] <viller> is it true that there are very few kernel developers involved with haiku at the moment?[14:50:53] <waveshaper> mmu_screen: it is both funny and scary at the same time[14:52:50] <mmu_screen> yep[14:55:05] <jamy> i am working on transfer haiku on new kernel[14:56:40] *** leszek has quit IRC[14:56:41] *** saivert has quit IRC[14:56:59] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[14:57:21] *** Disreali has quit IRC[14:57:26] <Xeon3D> suddenly there seems to be a lot of people interested in using another kernel with haiku :/[14:57:50] <OmniMancer> I think they should not be interested in that[14:58:09] <Xeon3D> true.[14:58:16] <Xeon3D> I think it's a complete waste of time.[14:58:26] <dru345> why?[14:58:41] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[14:59:02] <dru345> butter that they use haiku's userland than bring the gnu stack to yet another kernel :P[14:59:07] <OmniMancer> dru345 the current kernel was written for haiku and works fine[14:59:25] <dru345> there's no harm in other projects though :)[14:59:33] <dru345> MIT license and all that :P[14:59:34] <OmniMancer> no harm[14:59:41] <OmniMancer> but not necessarily any gain[14:59:44] <OmniMancer> which is the problem[14:59:52] <dru345> well it's gain for them[15:00:06] *** Brennanos has joined #haiku[15:00:26] <dru345> self satisfaction, curiosity, w/e[15:00:26] <jamy> kernel of haiku made for newos!!![15:00:26] <Brennanos> Hello all[15:00:27] <dru345> hi Brennanos[15:00:47] <dru345> i would try out the other kernel based haikus for comparison :P[15:01:13] <Brennanos> I'm sick of iOS programming, and I think it's time to do some beos programming again[15:01:22] <dru345> cool[15:01:26] <dru345> jump in :)[15:01:57] <Brennanos> I think I will make a guy for bsflite[15:02:00] <Brennanos> GUI[15:02:51] *** acoos has joined #haiku[15:03:34] <viller> wait what kernel are they thinking of moving haiku to?[15:03:54] *** saivert has joined #haiku[15:04:07] <dru345> at least one is moving it to L4[15:04:09] *** adriano-src has quit IRC[15:04:31] <dru345> i hadn't heard of others[15:07:00] <viller> people still believe there's a future in microkernels :P?[15:07:00] *** saivert has quit IRC[15:07:34] <OmniMancer> there is a future in themn[15:07:41] <OmniMancer> once hardware is designed for them[15:07:57] *** iIngenu has joined #haiku[15:08:23] <Disreali> morning[15:08:50] <viller> do you think there will be hardware designed for them?[15:10:08] <jamy> viller: you nothing know about microkernel[15:13:02] <Duggan> I guess its bed time... l8r all[15:13:08] <dru345> goodnight Duggan[15:13:23] <Duggan> dru345 expect to see it on haikuware tomorrow (or later today or whatever) :P[15:13:26] *** andreas_dr has quit IRC[15:13:30] <dru345> ok cool[15:13:39] <OmniMancer> eventually they will make hardware that is more microkernel friendly[15:14:26] <dru345> what would that require OmniMancer ?[15:14:48] *** saivert has joined #haiku[15:14:56] <OmniMancer> im not an expert[15:15:14] <OmniMancer> but the current hardware makes it rather expensive to switch into kernel mode[15:15:33] <dru345> ah. yeah :/[15:15:39] *** aubrey has quit IRC[15:15:53] <OmniMancer> due to microkernels having as little as possible 3rd party code in kernel mode you need this to be fast as all hardware access is now done with syscalls[15:17:30] *** saivert has quit IRC[15:18:02] <viller> I like the approach of DragonFlyBSD developers. Instead of starting over with the kernel they started modifying the old one slowly. They have managed to turn BSD into a hybrid kernel with the OS being usable all the time[15:18:49] *** dru345-haiku has quit IRC[15:22:21] *** AlonzoTG has joined #haiku[15:23:39] *** aubrey has joined #haiku[15:24:05] *** saivert has joined #haiku[15:26:20] *** xray7224 has joined #haiku[15:28:51] *** marc_smith has quit IRC[15:33:44] *** jamy has quit IRC[15:38:00] *** surround1r has joined #haiku[15:40:56] *** surrounder has quit IRC[15:41:54] *** lorenzo has joined #haiku[15:43:43] *** jamy has joined #haiku[15:43:56] *** pythium has joined #haiku[15:43:58] *** marshan has joined #haiku[15:44:03] <marshan> narf![15:44:05] <pythium> troz![15:44:34] *** surrounder has joined #haiku[15:44:50] *** surround1r has quit IRC[15:47:32] *** oZ] has joined #haiku[15:54:16] <OmniMancer> viller: changing an existing kernel is probably better, it may not get you there as fast but it ensures you have something that works the whole way[15:54:27] <OmniMancer> night[15:54:35] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[15:54:38] <dru345> goodnight OmniMancer[15:55:47] *** Brennanos has quit IRC[15:59:51] *** viller has quit IRC[16:08:21] *** jamy has quit IRC[16:09:16] *** lorglas has joined #haiku[16:14:40] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[16:14:54] <dru345> good morning mmadia[16:15:21] * mmadia nods while sipping on coffee[16:19:25] <stpere> hah! they took my blood pressure this morning :P[16:19:38] <stpere> apparently it's too low o-O[16:19:58] <dru345> are you a zombie?[16:20:02] <stpere> dunno[16:20:13] <stpere> my pulse is weak, that's for sure[16:20:30] <DraX> stpere: time to get on the high salt, high fat diet! :D[16:20:37] <stpere> haha[16:20:53] <stpere> well, it's not dangerously low[16:20:58] <stpere> 102/71[16:21:03] <marshan> hi mmadia[16:21:12] <DraX> don't take any chances, go eat bacon![16:21:26] <dru345> that's low enough. you a health nut stpere?[16:21:30] <stpere> I had a tendency to lose balance last weekend tho[16:21:53] <stpere> dru345: a health nut?? :)[16:22:01] <stpere> like diet stuff?[16:22:17] <dru345> athletic, eat right, etc?[16:22:31] <stpere> I drink coffee a lot, I walk a lot, I eat to restaurant a lot[16:22:52] <dru345> switch to decaf :D[16:22:58] <stpere> yeah, I should :)[16:23:25] <stpere> I feel weak[16:23:31] <stpere> not really tired, weak[16:24:35] <dru345> are you young?[16:25:29] <stpere> 28[16:25:39] <dru345> yeah that's young. :/[16:25:52] <dru345> i'm over 35 :([16:26:01] <stpere> my sympathies[16:26:02] <stpere> :P[16:26:05] <dru345> ty :P[16:26:23] <dru345> i'd still switch to decaf :)[16:27:23] <kurain> dru345, you are over 35?[16:27:33] <dru345> yes[16:27:54] <dru345> but less than 40 :)[16:27:57] <kurain> wow, beyond my expection[16:28:28] <kurain> you are in you golden time at career[16:28:51] <dru345> I hope not :)[16:29:38] <stpere> hahaha[16:29:53] <kurain> why? you hope this last long>[16:30:22] <stpere> well, maybe he meant if /this/ is golden time, what will it be when it will be worse[16:30:35] <kurain> haha, maybe[16:34:45] <marshan> i'm < 28 :P and i think -that's- still too old[16:36:02] <dru345> it is :)[16:36:52] * helf is 22[16:36:54] <helf> :D[16:37:01] <marshan> i'm 26, but i thought when i got here[16:37:06] <marshan> i'd know a lot more stuff[16:37:19] <marshan> hey helf[16:37:19] <helf> i turn 23 in two days.[16:37:22] <helf> gettin' old[16:37:24] <marshan> <-- Teknomancer[16:37:27] <helf> oh, hey :p[16:37:36] <helf> changing your nickname?[16:37:38] <dru345> hi Tek[16:37:38] <marshan> i'll still be 26 after 2 days :P[16:37:42] <marshan> hi dru[16:37:45] <marshan> pythium is also me[16:37:51] <pythium> yes hi[16:37:52] <pythium> :P[16:38:00] <The123king> i'm 18 :D[16:38:33] <helf> the past couple of years have felt like they have blown by... but im still just 22 :p[16:38:36] * helf feels older[16:38:44] <The123king> the shoddy nick came from an MMORPG i registered at when i was 13 :s[16:38:45] * helf thinks it might be the sprained back[16:38:59] * marshan attributes it to his glasses[16:39:09] * helf has spectacles[16:39:17] <marshan> me too, but i got it last year[16:39:28] <The123king> helf: don't worry, my knee's knackered, my eyes are buggered, my arms are weak and my back twitches[16:39:32] <marshan> i'm going to try contacts, to see if it's any better[16:39:36] <marshan> i heard mixed stuff about it[16:39:40] <The123king> i feel 80, not 18[16:40:11] <helf> lol[16:40:19] <helf> well, i sprained my back playing with my nephew[16:40:24] <helf> but otherwise i think im in OK shape :p[16:40:54] <helf> I need new glasses soon, tho[16:40:57] <helf> http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs234.snc4/39058_417091164854_621049854_4428177_5385011_n.jpg[16:41:27] <michaelvo> haha! nice baby[16:41:47] <CIA-54> laplace * r37772 /haiku/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs):[16:41:47] <CIA-54> * Moved enconding files into system/data/PDF Writer directory,[16:41:47] <CIA-54> as correctly pointed out by Ingo these are no setting files.[16:41:47] <CIA-54> * Use find_directory() here and in places marked with TODOs.[16:41:48] <michaelvo> I'm in the middle of 25 years old[16:42:36] <helf> my neice :p[16:44:37] *** waveshaper has quit IRC[16:45:19] *** [r4] has joined #haiku[16:46:51] *** lorglas has quit IRC[16:49:14] *** Sir_Konrad has joined #haiku[16:51:13] *** toni_ has quit IRC[16:53:44] <michaelvo> mmadia: can you assign ticket#3561 to korli? http://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/3561[16:53:55] *** The123king has left #haiku[16:55:02] *** CK|iPod has quit IRC[16:55:14] *** CK|iPod_ has joined #haiku[16:59:41] <mmadia> i'll nudge him when he gets back from vacation.[17:01:42] <Xeon3D> meh... I'm 27 :P[17:04:18] <michaelvo> thanks![17:04:35] *** tqh has joined #haiku[17:05:32] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[17:06:44] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[17:10:12] <gluon_> anyone using the latest revision?[17:10:23] <gluon_> do experience this: http://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/6396[17:12:27] *** humdinger has joined #haiku[17:13:25] *** raichoo has joined #haiku[17:19:09] <kallisti5> gluon_: it's on my laptop[17:19:15] <kallisti5> gluon_: checking that bug now[17:20:27] <mmadia> r37768 might be the changeset.[17:20:55] *** lorglas has joined #haiku[17:21:01] <kallisti5> gluon_: verified[17:22:00] <kallisti5> mmadia: nope. i am running 37762 and see it[17:23:13] *** TMM has quit IRC[17:23:29] *** TMM has joined #haiku[17:24:30] *** acoos_ has joined #haiku[17:24:43] *** lorglas has quit IRC[17:25:09] <kallisti5> ~r37719?[17:25:19] *** acoos has quit IRC[17:25:33] <kallisti5> whatever the rev.. it seems like it's actively being worked on[17:25:55] <kallisti5> as eyes are on it I am guessing it's only a matter of time until it's fixed[17:26:32] <kallisti5> gluon_: could you check the devices application?[17:26:35] <humdinger> what's getting fixed?[17:26:47] <kallisti5> humdinger: timezone applet[17:26:55] <humdinger> oh. good.[17:27:08] <kallisti5> :)[17:27:26] <kallisti5> gluon_: devices should now parse ACPI nodes properly[17:27:39] <kallisti5> gluon_: I only have one machine i've tested in on though[17:29:07] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[17:29:15] *** tqh has quit IRC[17:31:37] *** PasNox has quit IRC[17:32:30] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[17:33:20] *** raichoo has quit IRC[17:36:09] <CIA-54> axeld * r37773 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/lib/kernel_vsprintf.cpp: * Implemented support for the 'z' qualifier prefix for [s]size_t.[17:41:30] *** The123king has joined #haiku[17:41:30] *** The123king has joined #haiku[17:44:52] *** jmelesky has joined #haiku[17:44:58] *** CK|iPod_ has quit IRC[17:45:11] *** Kernel86|Laptop has quit IRC[17:45:47] *** tqh has joined #haiku[17:48:51] <gluon_> kallisti5: sorry was way[17:48:54] <gluon_> thanks[17:49:25] <gluon_> kallisti5: I should boot the latest revision soon and report here[17:55:35] *** cebulon has joined #haiku[17:56:07] *** GedMurphy has quit IRC[17:56:49] *** dru345 has quit IRC[18:01:37] *** cebulon has quit IRC[18:02:55] *** cebulon has joined #haiku[18:04:40] <kurain> gluon: what about the HTA>[18:04:55] *** cebulon has quit IRC[18:05:05] *** Barrett has quit IRC[18:05:20] <gluon_> kurain: still broken[18:05:32] <gluon_> didn't get a reply from travis yet[18:08:52] <kurain> well[18:09:17] <kurain> you can change to the user guide[18:11:38] <gluon_> yeah I've been busy with the user guide too :)[18:11:59] *** Kernel86|Laptop has joined #haiku[18:12:38] <gluon_> kurain: ACPI nodes seem properly parsed here[18:13:49] <Anarchos> how to debug a program : i got a segfault at same place everytime i run my app, but i don't know how to debug it ![18:14:04] <Anarchos> Debugger says 'no source file' and just print assembly[18:14:11] <Anarchos> gdb is too much difficult to use[18:14:16] *** raichoo has joined #haiku[18:15:08] <marshan> Anarchos: since you're debugging userland, use a debug build[18:15:13] <marshan> of the app you want to debug[18:15:37] <marshan> amd64 assembly debugging is complicated because of the way the argument passing via registers[18:15:45] *** [r4] has quit IRC[18:15:51] <marshan> for userland stuff, there is usually no need to debug in assembly[18:16:12] <Anarchos> marshan it i586 not x64[18:16:48] <marshan> ah okay, that's a tad easier, but still unless you know a certain level of assembly, stack layout and register usage[18:16:56] <marshan> debugging in assembly would be difficult[18:17:08] <marshan> i suggest compiling a debug version of your program[18:17:20] <marshan> then gdb will get symbols + debugging info[18:17:58] <Anarchos> marshan yes but i cannot use watchpoints in gdb on haiku ![18:18:42] *** paul0 has joined #haiku[18:20:26] *** _arjen_ has joined #haiku[18:20:51] <Anarchos> marshan do you ?[18:22:37] <marshan> you mean breakpoints?[18:22:43] <marshan> i'm sure they work[18:22:49] <marshan> it's only because gdb couldn't find the symbol[18:22:53] <marshan> use a debug build[18:23:53] *** pythium is now known as Teknomancer[18:24:01] <Anarchos> marshan gdb can show me source code so it is a well built debug build[18:24:18] <Teknomancer> then it should be able to find the location to set the breakpoint[18:24:28] <Teknomancer> unless there is some haiku-specific bug in gdb[18:24:33] *** tqh has quit IRC[18:24:33] <Teknomancer> which I kinda doubt at this point[18:25:30] *** yourpalal has joined #haiku[18:28:29] <CIA-54> phoudoin * r37774 /haiku/trunk/src/apps/aboutsystem/AboutSystem.cpp: Fixed a typo spotted by dru345 on #haiku[18:28:45] <Anarchos> Teknomancer do you use gdb often ?[18:29:07] <Teknomancer> not in haiku[18:29:27] <Teknomancer> but mostly I used mdb/dbx (solaris)[18:29:39] <Teknomancer> the principles are the same, only syntax differs[18:30:15] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[18:31:16] <Teknomancer> hi PulkoMandy[18:32:22] *** aubrey has quit IRC[18:32:37] *** aubrey has joined #haiku[18:37:09] *** Sir_Konrad has quit IRC[18:37:54] <gluon_> kallisti5: ACPI nodes seem properly parsed here[18:38:52] *** michaelvo has quit IRC[18:41:57] <phoudoin> Hi Anarchos.[18:42:31] <phoudoin> Regarding Debugger no source file error, do you build in debug mode (-g) ?[18:42:53] <Anarchos> phoudoin yes i did !![18:43:16] <phoudoin> which gcc?[18:43:27] <marshan> Anarchos: is this your own app?[18:43:45] <Anarchos> both[18:44:32] <Anarchos> marsshan i have source code[18:44:43] * Anarchos is idle: feeding kids[18:45:31] <marshan> okay[18:45:37] <phoudoin> kallisti5: hope you don't mind for the small changes I made on your Devices patch before apply it...[18:45:55] * marshan wants to fix Beezer for Haiku :([18:45:57] <marshan> no time[18:46:12] <marshan> actually, I want to rewrite it, I can make it much better[18:46:23] <marshan> than what I wrote 5 years back :P[18:46:25] <phoudoin> Anarchos: nobody is *idle* near his/her own kids.[18:46:52] <marshan> I wonder how fast the new ColumnListView on haiku is[18:47:04] <marshan> I remember doing nasty optimizations to CLV back in Beezer[18:47:25] <marshan> and some non-nasty ones, like using qsort instead of bubble sort :P[18:47:58] * marshan wishes to get back to the beautiful userland apps some day[18:50:25] <gluon_> has pootle already 'officially' replaced Travi's HTA?[18:54:35] <PulkoMandy> not that I know[18:54:48] <PulkoMandy> with no export to svn... I'd say use at your own risk[18:55:23] *** procton has joined #haiku[18:57:40] <kurain> bye all[18:57:46] <kurain> time to sleep[18:58:02] <mmadia> PulkoMandy : what's the stance on translating the names of applications?[18:58:22] <mmadia> like Tracker, Deskbar, AboutSystem, Magnify, ....[19:01:07] *** neonsonicboy has joined #haiku[19:01:11] *** kurain has left #haiku[19:01:13] *** iIngenu has quit IRC[19:02:20] *** neonsonicboy has left #haiku[19:03:44] *** Ola__ has quit IRC[19:04:13] *** procton has quit IRC[19:04:13] *** Ola__ has joined #haiku[19:05:57] <Xeon3D> I hope you don't have to.[19:06:09] <Xeon3D> Tracker would be soooo funny in portuguese.[19:06:31] <Xeon3D> Deskbar too...[19:07:35] <Ola__> hmm[19:07:38] <Ola__> tracker...[19:07:50][19:08:17] <Ola__> [You are searching for translators?:D][19:15:31] *** The123king has quit IRC[19:17:20] *** humdinger has quit IRC[19:22:19] <Anarchos> back :)[19:24:00] <yourpalal> Anarchos: if your source files are in some place other than the path encoded into the debugging info, you can show them to gdb with the directory command[19:24:57] <Anarchos> yourpalal how to see the path encoded in debugging info ?[19:25:19] <yourpalal> I think 'info files' will show that[19:26:40] <PulkoMandy> mmadia: the stance is 'let the language team decide case-by-case'[19:27:06] <PulkoMandy> in french we translated preflet names but not the others[19:27:34] <Anarchos> yourpalal i just see 'local exec file' not the others[19:27:55] <yourpalal> hmm... let me just play around in gdb for a second[19:28:16] *** StreaK|ON has joined #haiku[19:28:34] <mmadia> aahh, i was wrong indeed.[19:28:46] *** StreaK|ON has quit IRC[19:34:14] <Xeon3D> nice. :)[19:34:24] <Xeon3D> hope Gluon doesn't want to translate them then.[19:35:49] <yourpalal> ah, Anarchos try 'info soure'[19:36:09] <Anarchos> yourpalal i find 'info sourceS'[19:37:08] <yourpalal> okay, info sources will tell you if you've got the symbols[19:37:46] <yourpalal> info source tells you a bit about your source file(s)[19:38:43] *** mmadia42 has joined #haiku[19:43:46] <Anarchos> yourpalal info source --> "no current source file" :/[19:45:07] <yourpalal> you need to run the program, and break somewhere first, you can just 'b main' and 'r'[19:45:07] <Anarchos> yourpalal ok i need to run start before[19:45:25] <Anarchos> so why can't i see those files in Debugger whereas i see them in gdb ???[19:46:14] <yourpalal> I'm not sure, Debugger isn't finished yet, so maybe this is an unfinished part[19:47:34] <Anarchos> gdb too : i can't watch easily a memory address[19:47:59] <yourpalal> haha, yeah I personally try to avoid all debugging :P[19:49:05] <Anarchos> yourpalal i have no formal prover yet :)[19:49:13] *** tqh has joined #haiku[19:52:14] <yourpalal> prover == test suite?[19:52:39] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[19:53:03] *** humdinger has joined #haiku[19:53:31] <humdinger> hello.[19:53:39] <Anarchos> yourpalal no prover means you give a formal description of your code and it gives you source formally proven correct versus semantics[19:53:54] <humdinger> Any idea where I can get a web+ version that runs on my Haiku revision?[19:54:33] <Anarchos> humdinger alpha2 runs pretty fine here[19:54:38] <humdinger> installoptionalpackage dosn't install a working version.[19:54:51] <humdinger> Anarchos: it's a bit newer revision.[19:54:59] <humdinger> http://mmlr.dyndns.org/chrome/site/nightlies/index.html stops at r526[19:55:06] <Anarchos> humdinger i know[19:55:07] <yourpalal> ah, I see, empirical/mathematical proof[19:55:55] <Anarchos> yourpalal yes, like coq does (http://coq.inria.fr[19:57:12] <yourpalal> cool![19:59:48] *** ali3n0 has joined #haiku[19:59:52] <ali3n0> hi folks[20:00:18] <humdinger> hullo[20:00:35] <gluon_> Xeon3D: translate what again?[20:00:36] <gluon_> :)[20:00:45] <gluon_> HTA is so broken right now :)[20:00:54] <gluon_> that I'm afraid :P[20:01:19] <gluon_> in fact I think it lost my latest changes to the Deskbar catalog[20:01:29] <ali3n0> Xeon3D, do you remember your suggestions about reviewing my... thinkpad sl300 review?[20:01:41] <gluon_> Xeon3D: Deskbar is already localized[20:05:50] *** mmadia42 has quit IRC[20:11:47] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[20:13:57] *** ali3n0 has quit IRC[20:14:15] *** JoeyA has joined #haiku[20:15:54] <gluon_> I think this is the changeset causing the bug I reported about timezone preferences:[20:15:57] <gluon_> http://dev.haiku-os.org/changeset/37758[20:16:14] <gluon_> PulkoMandy ^^[20:16:51] *** Xbertl has joined #haiku[20:17:39] <gluon_> by the way, is there a way to ser the timezone on the command line without using the time preflet?[20:18:01] <gluon_> maybe it's just a symbolic link[20:19:39] <humdinger> it is , gluon_[20:19:47] *** ali3n0 has joined #haiku[20:24:47] <PulkoMandy> yes it's broken[20:25:03] <PulkoMandy> it is but I also removed the data files[20:25:10] <PulkoMandy> so you'll have trouble linking it to anything[20:25:31] <PulkoMandy> please live in GMT now :)[20:27:49] <gluon_> I actually liv3 in GMT for real :)[20:27:53] <mmu_screen> hmm does that mean each time they will change daylight saving we'll have to update the ICU binaries ?[20:28:19] <mmu_screen> I live in PMT, scr3w y0u :p[20:28:20] <gluon_> I was just curious[20:28:23] <mmu_screen> Paris Meridian Time :p[20:28:31] <gluon_> hehe[20:28:40] <gluon_> pretend it's an hour later then :p[20:29:00] * gordonjcp is in Highland Standard Time[20:29:27] <PulkoMandy> mmu_screen: it's possible to have data external to the lib too[20:29:27] <mmu_screen> hmm seems PMT actually seems to be Pierre and Miquelon Standard Time[20:29:37] <mmu_screen> anyway[20:30:16] <PulkoMandy> we use GMT+1 (and +2 in DST)... but I actually live about GMT-0:30 if we look at sun time[20:30:53] <PulkoMandy> so : the timezone handling is now done with icu... but strftime and friends aren't using it yet[20:30:56] <PulkoMandy> ask olta about that[20:31:21] *** plfiorini has joined #haiku[20:31:33] <gordonjcp> there is no word that means "mañana" in Scots Gaelic[20:31:51] *** ziomatto has joined #haiku[20:31:54] <gordonjcp> there is "màrach", which literally translates as "tomorrow", but it hasn't the same sense of urgency[20:35:04] <Anarchos> a static variable is duplicated in each thread ?[20:35:38] * ali3n0 updated his review: http://haikuware.com/details/thinkpad-sl300[20:38:15] <Skipp_OSX> PulkoMandy: So basically there is no way to get a localized time string right now out of the Localization kit?[20:38:39] *** stef has quit IRC[20:39:02] <yourpalal> Anarchos: I don't think so.. otherwise there would be no need for TLS[20:39:31] <Anarchos> yourpalal i know but i noticed that the variable has two addresses different in two threads[20:39:43] <yourpalal> weird![20:40:41] <Anarchos> yourpalal with nm i got "00000008 b caml_async_signal_mode"[20:41:08] <luroh> humdinger: web+ -> http://haiku-files.org/files/optional-packages/[20:42:26] *** Malmis has quit IRC[20:42:31] *** Malmis has joined #haiku[20:42:59] *** lorenzo has quit IRC[20:43:00] <Anarchos> yourpalal the b means local bss symbol[20:43:15] <yourpalal> yeah, that is what man nm is saying[20:43:45] <Anarchos> but i don't know what is local bss symbol :)[20:44:23] *** ali3n0 has quit IRC[20:45:20] <yourpalal> ah, bss is a part of your object file for holding data that gets initialized at runtime[20:45:54] <humdinger> luroh: Thanks I found that. :) Now I'm back to web+ r529[20:46:17] <Anarchos> yourpalal source code : "static intnat volatile caml_async_signal_mode = 0;"[20:46:28] <Anarchos> so i wonder why it has 2 addresses in two threads :/[20:46:59] <yourpalal> I can't fathom why[20:52:08] <Duggan> hi guys[20:53:29] *** JoeyA has quit IRC[20:55:37] <humdinger> hey Duggan[20:57:31] *** lorenzo has joined #haiku[20:57:45] <Duggan> well, I'd be ready to distribute my first product if I could just figure the mimetypes stuff out[20:59:48] <PulkoMandy> Skipp_OSX: it's not localization, only timezones[21:00:18] <PulkoMandy> so it's the rigt format (hh:mm:ss for france) but there are some problems with changing the timezones[21:00:25] <humdinger> Duggan: what seems to be the problem?[21:01:24] <PulkoMandy> Anarchos: if oyu have different addresses, likely it's not threads, but something else[21:01:34] <PulkoMandy> is this declaration compiled twice ?[21:01:43] <Anarchos> PulkoMandy i think not[21:01:48] <PulkoMandy> (like the same .c file used in different places, or the declaration being in a .h ?)[21:02:19] *** Sir_Konrad has joined #haiku[21:03:20] <Anarchos> PulkoMandy in fact all seems ok, no 2 addresses but just one[21:03:30] <PulkoMandy> :)[21:04:23] <Duggan> humdinger looking at BMimeType it seems easy enough to create the mimetype, check if it exists, set the appropriate program, icons, etc....[21:04:46] <Duggan> but I've been looking around (not just in BMimeType) and I can't seem to find how to set the mimetype for a specific file[21:04:56] <PulkoMandy> BNodeInfo ?[21:06:27] <Duggan> thanks PulkoMandy[21:07:51] *** marc_smith has joined #haiku[21:08:02] <Duggan> I'm pretty excited about this...[21:09:15] *** oco2 has joined #haiku[21:09:19] <yourpalal> Duggan: are you submitting it to Haikuware?[21:10:16] <Duggan> yep[21:10:25] <humdinger> Duggan: what's your project?[21:10:34] <Duggan> erm well....[21:10:53] <Duggan> I was looking at one of darkwyrm's blog entries the other day and he linked to some list of stuff good teams do[21:10:57] <Duggan> good article[21:11:23] <Duggan> one thing he mentioned was tracking tickets as something even a single programmer should do[21:11:45] <Duggan> after I finished /facepalming, I decided to write a standalone ticket tracker for individual use[21:12:00] <PulkoMandy> trac works well enough :)[21:12:12] <Duggan> have you ever tried installing trac on your personal computer? :/[21:12:26] <Duggan> ok well if it won't be useful, I might as well not submit it[21:13:12] <Duggan> I've ran a trac server before, its no fun and takes up too much damn time just to configure properly... wasted time that would be better spent coding[21:14:08] *** humdinger has quit IRC[21:14:21] <marc_smith> hello Duggan ! :)[21:14:29] <Duggan> I thought I'd help just by writing one little utility to help peoples productivity as best as I could[21:14:36] <Duggan> but since its useless, no sense in distributing it[21:14:37] <Duggan> hi marc_smith[21:14:57] <yourpalal> I thinkthat makes sense, often when you are just starting a project, you don't want to do all that big stuff[21:15:07] <marc_smith> pleas help if you can. No work is unneeded. :)[21:15:13] <PulkoMandy> well my trac server works quite well... but not everyone is me :)[21:15:26] <yourpalal> A cool feature would be a migration utility to upload the tickets to a trac server when the time comes[21:15:31] <Duggan> frankly trac is overkill for small one person projects[21:15:37] <Duggan> yourpalal I've considered that[21:15:46] <Duggan> also importing from trac[21:15:51] *** Sir_Konrad has quit IRC[21:15:52] <PulkoMandy> Duggan: anyway, a rule I have is "always do what you need, and share what you do"[21:15:59] <marc_smith> there are times you are stuggling with something really unfrendly and then you find this wonderful, little tool to help you with start[21:15:59] <Duggan> theres alot of things I'd like to add to it over time, but first I just need to get something out there for people to use[21:16:29] <PulkoMandy> either no one uses it but it fits your needs, or someone finds it interesting and you get patches for cool things you didn't think of[21:16:47] <CIA-54> zooey * r37775 /buildtools/trunk/ (6 files in 5 dirs):[21:16:47] <CIA-54> * added standard define __STDC_ISO_10646__ to all compiler configurations,[21:16:47] <CIA-54> indicating that haiku uses ISO_10646 in wchar_t (in our case: UTF-32)[21:16:51] <Duggan> in c# this project would've taken me a couple hours, instead it took me a week considering I was learning the Haiku API and sqlite both at the same time[21:17:10] <Duggan> oh and I statically linked a BColumnListView into it LIKE IT OR NOT! :P[21:17:12] <marc_smith> I think everything is needed. Show me the app that did not gathered at least couple of devs :P[21:17:29] <Duggan> and it works fine[21:17:39] <kallisti5> Duggan: Haiku is statically linked[21:17:43] <kallisti5> Duggan: all of it[21:17:54] <Duggan> kallisti5 but the apps are not[21:18:00] <kallisti5> Duggan: yeah they are[21:18:08] <kallisti5> Duggan: The img was too small[21:18:19] <kallisti5> Duggan: so it was decided to static link everything[21:19:01] <mmu_screen> plop[21:19:01] <Duggan> so once I got this project to where it would halfway work, I started using it with respect to its own development[21:19:05] <Duggan> hey mmu_screen[21:19:07] <PulkoMandy> marc_smith: my personal cms attracted no one for the moment[21:19:23] <Duggan> as a result I was able to fix bugs and add features even faster than I would have otherwise[21:19:45] <Duggan> which is sad because it took me so long :/[21:19:56] <mmu_screen> I just rebuilt the cross tools for ppc, arm and m68k here[21:20:18] <mmadia> ppc won't build due to ICU.[21:20:22] <PulkoMandy> Duggan: so it works[21:20:24] <PulkoMandy> release now ![21:20:25] <mmu_screen> m68k still needs fixing in vm[21:20:41] <Skipp_OSX> mmu_screen, haha[21:20:42] <mmu_screen> mmadia: the boot cd builds, but yeah this sux[21:20:56] <Duggan> PulkoMandy no, not without polish :P[21:21:05] *** JoeyA has joined #haiku[21:21:16] <mmu_screen> arf, I just rebuilt the crosstools today to just have to rebuild them again, thx zooey[21:21:29] <yourpalal> Duggan: that's what betas & final releases are for! release an alpha now[21:21:47] <Duggan> would you people actually use it? :P[21:22:07] <Duggan> hehe[21:22:58] <PulkoMandy> ifyou release it, there is some chance of someone using it[21:23:04] <yourpalal> I'll play with it, but I'm not doing any personal projects right now[21:23:07] <PulkoMandy> if you don't... :)[21:23:35] <Duggan> hmm, whats the best way to package it, just zip it?[21:23:41] <PulkoMandy> yes[21:24:00] <PulkoMandy> write a readme, pick licence, zip everything, upload to haikuware[21:24:17] *** mrsun has joined #haiku[21:24:48] <mmu_screen> mmadia: hmm can't we just skip the icu locale backend addon when it's not in ?[21:25:44] <PulkoMandy> you'd lack about half of the posix stuff now[21:26:22] <CIA-54> zooey * r37776 /haiku/trunk/configure: * remove references to timezone files, as those no longer exist[21:26:32] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[21:26:57] <mmu_screen> well, outsourcing stuff that is required to build is really bad[21:27:16] <mmadia> and i don't have short-term plans to try doing the cross-compiling script idea thing.[21:28:27] <PulkoMandy> mmu_screen: talk to olta about it, it was his idea[21:28:43] <kallisti5> lol.. i was making an off comment joke and got dragged away from my computer. just a heads up the static link thing was a poor joke :)[21:28:44] <PulkoMandy> but it shouldn't be too hard to build icu with the 68k compiler ?[21:28:46] <mmu_screen> well the correct way is to integrate them with svn external in 3rdparty and build them along with[21:29:53] <mmu_screen> PulkoMandy: yeah but it should be done by the build system[21:30:15] <mmadia> weeell... i was wondering if the configure script could trigger downloading them, much like --build-cross-tools.[21:30:39] <mmu_screen> still, needs Jamfile & stuff[21:30:42] <PulkoMandy> mh[21:30:56] <PulkoMandy> well the jamfile could just launch make or whatever[21:31:08] <PulkoMandy> you could 'jam icu' and get an optional package[21:31:27] <PulkoMandy> and then upload it to haikuports and forget about it until icu 4.6[21:31:30] * mmu_screen pets distro stuff[21:40:27] *** raichoo has quit IRC[21:41:32] *** xray7224 has quit IRC[21:45:05] *** oZ] has quit IRC[21:47:33] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[21:48:19] <Duggan> so when I upload a program, I'm going to be able to modify it / delete it later and all that, right?[21:50:39] <PulkoMandy> modify yes[21:50:45] <PulkoMandy> delete I didn't try[21:50:50] <PulkoMandy> but why would you want to do that ?[21:51:59] <Duggan> if it gets a million zero stars ratings, why keep embarrasing myself? :P[21:53:44] <yourpalal> if it gets bad ratings, improve it![21:54:23] <PulkoMandy> bad ratings are meaningless... but criticism is often good to take[21:54:52] <PulkoMandy> if 100 people find it useless, they lost maybe a day testing it[21:55:11] <PulkoMandy> if a single guy finds it useful and use it for one year, the ratio is 3:1 already[21:55:16] *** kmargar has joined #haiku[21:55:23] <Duggan> true that[21:56:04] *** markos_ is now known as Guest17373[21:56:09] *** kmargar is now known as markos_[21:57:05] *** Guest17373 has quit IRC[21:57:28] *** Trezker has joined #haiku[21:58:53] <Duggan> cheers http://haikuware.com/directory/view-details/development/miscellaneous/personal-issue-tracker[22:00:19] *** Moiman has quit IRC[22:00:26] *** Moiman has joined #haiku[22:00:41] <Skipp_OSX> I am trying to come up with some better error messages for Deskcalc for certain functions[22:01:13] <Skipp_OSX> for log() and ln() if you enter a negative number I write 'negative expression' as the error message[22:01:37] <Skipp_OSX> so log(-2) would return an error of 'negative expression'[22:02:05] <Skipp_OSX> can you think of a better way of putting that?[22:02:40] <stpere> out of domain[22:02:49] *** The123king has joined #haiku[22:02:52] <Skipp_OSX> stpere: okay...[22:03:04] <yourpalal> or 'out of domain error'[22:03:37] <stpere> that's pretty technical tho[22:03:42] <stpere> not exactly user friendlyt[22:03:50] <stpere> but I suppose if you know what log is..[22:04:08] <Skipp_OSX> stpere: I like that because I used that for asin() acos() and atan()[22:04:56] <Skipp_OSX> stpere: which is better, 'out of domain' or printing 0?[22:05:10] <Skipp_OSX> stpere: I say out of domain is infinitely better[22:07:32] <stpere> hmm 0 would be incorrect actually[22:07:32] <stpere> because 0 is defined[22:07:33] <stpere> you could think it actually is worth "0"[22:07:33] <stpere> which is a number[22:07:33] <stpere> see? :)[22:07:33] <Skipp_OSX> stpere: exactly, that is what it does now[22:07:33] <stpere> oh[22:07:33] <stpere> hehehe[22:07:33] *** lorenzo has quit IRC[22:07:33] <Duggan> id10-T error[22:07:33] <Skipp_OSX> stpere: like log(1) = 0 that is fine but log(-1) also returns 0 which is bad...[22:07:34] <stpere> yes, very :)[22:07:56] <Duggan> so, any comments?[22:08:12] *** Xbertl has quit IRC[22:08:21] <stpere> Duggan: yes, I'm hungry[22:08:32] <Duggan> on my program :P[22:08:52] *** PasNox_ has joined #haiku[22:08:53] <stpere> sigh, precisions, always precisions :P[22:09:06] <Duggan> hehe[22:09:49] *** PasNox has quit IRC[22:09:55] <yourpalal> Duggan: the screenshots look nice[22:10:00] *** PasNox_ has quit IRC[22:10:12] <Skipp_OSX> I wish the MAPM library supported infinity...[22:10:40] <Duggan> yourpalal lol thanks[22:10:44] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[22:10:45] <Duggan> try it, it works too :P[22:10:51] <stpere> Skipp_OSX: they tried to make it fit in 64bits.. and failed[22:11:15] *** Sir_Konrad has joined #haiku[22:13:39] <CIA-54> yourpalal * r37777 /haiku/trunk/src/kits/interface/ (9 files): (log message trimmed)[22:13:40] <CIA-54> Generally, clean up new archiving constant names & strings to be consistent in[22:13:40] <CIA-54> all classes. Modify archiving constants to be const char* const (thanks Ingo).[22:13:40] <CIA-54> Also modify archiving in many classes to use less fields by storing more data in[22:13:40] <CIA-54> arrays and structs. The common min, max, and preferred sizes, for example are[22:13:40] <CIA-54> always stored in an array now. In BTwoDimensionalLayout and BSplitLayout, the[22:13:41] <CIA-54> insets are archived in a BRect. Also fixed a typo in BGridLayout which caused[22:13:45] <PulkoMandy> Skipp_OSX: just use the infinity char as an error then ?[22:13:46] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[22:13:46] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[22:13:46] <Skipp_OSX> PulkoMandy, how do I get a float/double equal to infinity?[22:13:46] <PulkoMandy> inf in C++ I think[22:13:47] <PulkoMandy> or something similar[22:14:34] <Skipp_OSX> PulkoMandy, it is INFINITY in math.h I got it[22:20:02] *** Jondice has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** ambroff has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** MrSunshine__ has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** phoudoin has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** plfiorini has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** Ola__ has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** paul0 has quit IRC[22:20:03] *** acoos_ has quit IRC[22:20:04] *** AlonzoTG has quit IRC[22:20:04] *** marshan has quit IRC[22:20:04] *** sprma has quit IRC[22:20:04] *** velcroshooz has quit IRC[22:20:04] *** l_n has quit IRC[22:20:04] *** helf has quit IRC[22:20:04] *** kjalarr has 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Teknomancer has joined #haiku[22:27:33] *** aubrey_ has joined #haiku[22:28:29] <Skipp_OSX> netsplit!!![22:28:46] <Duggan> w00t[22:28:59] *** aubrey_ has quit IRC[22:29:10] <mmu_screen> aw, 12 cores... seems the ultimate upgrade to the Mac is Haiku :P http://www.apple.com/macpro/[22:29:15] *** aubrey_ has joined #haiku[22:29:15] *** aphedox has quit IRC[22:29:38] *** aubrey_ has left #haiku[22:29:44] *** aubrey has quit IRC[22:29:56] *** nopper has quit IRC[22:29:57] *** aphedox has joined #haiku[22:30:10] *** nopper has joined #haiku[22:30:21] *** Malmis has joined #haiku[22:30:37] *** aubrey has joined #haiku[22:30:41] <Duggan> "as you are no doubt aware..." geniuses.... absolute geniuses[22:31:16] <mmadia> mmu_screen : i thought we're artificially limited to 8 for now?[22:31:23] *** aphedox_ has joined #haiku[22:33:02] <mmu_screen> for x86 yes but well[22:33:34] <mmu_screen> actually I think the only ABI issue is with system_info but it can be worked around like with other things[22:34:46] <mmu_screen> _get_system_info() already gets a size arg btw[22:34:56] *** aphedox has quit IRC[22:35:29] *** phoudoin_home has joined #haiku[22:36:14] *** phoudoin has quit IRC[22:36:14] *** phoudoin_home is now known as phoudoin[22:36:23] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o phoudoin[22:36:53] *** kirilla has quit IRC[22:41:32] *** The123king has quit IRC[22:51:45] *** paul0 has quit IRC[22:52:46] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[22:53:54] *** yourpalal_ has joined #haiku[22:54:01] <Skipp_OSX> Is it okay to use Unicode characters in the source?[22:54:09] *** yourpalal has quit IRC[22:54:32] <Skipp_OSX> I know that recently there has been a few added due to localization stuff...[22:55:45] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[22:56:07] <CIA-54> yourpalal * r37778 /haiku/trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Updated BMenuField and its custom BLayoutItems for layout-safe archiving. Added an _InitMenu(const BMessage*) method that inits the menu during unarchival.[22:57:47] *** kirilla has joined #haiku[23:02:37] <phoudoin> in source, yes, Skipp_OSX. In source file name... yes.[23:02:40] <phoudoin> :-)[23:03:05] <phoudoin> Issue is with svn look command used by our Trac commit hook, but that's all AFAICT.[23:04:08] <phoudoin> Not a reason to use localized file name for source files, though. It make sense only for file that end user will see, proposed to choose in some way (popup menu, list, whatever).[23:05:01] <phoudoin> If it's only for the sake of having SourceEnFrançais.cpp, then no, it's not welcome in Haiku source tree.[23:05:19] *** idefix_xifedi has quit IRC[23:06:02] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[23:08:28] *** xray7224 has joined #haiku[23:08:56] *** JoeyA has quit IRC[23:10:55] <PulkoMandy> phoudoin: no, the bug is not in trac[23:11:02] <PulkoMandy> it's in our port of svn[23:11:29] <PulkoMandy> it thinks the files are encoded in iso-8859-15 instead of utf8 and mangles them[23:14:24] <phoudoin> PulkoMandy: oh. So do we have possible issue to check in and/out svn item with UNICODE names?[23:15:07] <Duggan> why am I still listed as a user on haikuware? :/[23:15:30] <phoudoin> why don't you want to be anymore?[23:15:44] <Duggan> because I submitted a program?[23:17:03] <phoudoin> Looking for a developer promotion?[23:17:21] <PulkoMandy> phoudoin : yes[23:17:36] <PulkoMandy> basically if you commit in haiku and checkout in haiku the mangling will be reversed[23:17:38] *** tqh has quit IRC[23:17:53] <PulkoMandy> but using any other platform on one side will mixup things[23:18:04] <phoudoin> okay, I see.[23:18:24] <Duggan> found it[23:18:24] *** _arjen_ has quit IRC[23:18:26] <phoudoin> Does Linux svn support UTF8 already?[23:18:30] <PulkoMandy> ifyou look at the current Bépo keymap file, it's utf8 on the server (checked in on mac os X by françois I guess) but checked out in haiku it ends up iso-8859-15[23:18:31] <Duggan> phoudoin yes I was and I found it[23:18:33] <phoudoin> I guess yes[23:18:49] <PulkoMandy> yes, it's just that our svn is badly compiled[23:19:06] <PulkoMandy> (for lack of locale support when it was done, or maybe they just assume the C locale can't be utf8)[23:19:13] <phoudoin> haiku-ports guys are informed?[23:20:16] <PulkoMandy> I talked about it on the haiku-dev ml[23:20:25] <PulkoMandy> maybe we should file a bug for them[23:20:42] <phoudoin> maybe scott has filed one already.[23:20:57] <Duggan> well I changed it to developer but I'm still listed under users :/[23:22:16] <phoudoin> well, a good developer should also be a user...[23:22:18] *** andreas_dr has joined #haiku[23:25:21] *** marc_smith has quit IRC[23:28:43] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[23:34:45] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[23:34:47] <CIA-54> zooey * r37779 /buildtools/trunk/ (6 files in 5 dirs):[23:34:47] <CIA-54> * revert 37775, as the define has a wrong value and it's probably better to do[23:34:47] <CIA-54> stuff like this somewhere in our libc headers.[23:35:51] <Skipp_OSX> I am trying to gracefully handle infinity now but how do you tell the difference between INFINITY and -INFINITY for floating point numbers?[23:36:12] *** dru345 has joined #haiku[23:36:36] <Skipp_OSX> they both seem to evaluate to positive infinity on my system[23:36:39] <dru345> hi 'ku o/[23:37:02] *** vooshy has joined #haiku[23:37:10] <dru345> hi vooshy[23:37:17] <vooshy> dru345: hi[23:37:32] <vooshy> is mmadia about?[23:37:55] <mmadia> somewhat.[23:38:25] <vooshy> mmadia: i have some money to donate, do you need dollars or euros more?[23:38:49] <mmadia> is euros your native currency?[23:39:08] <mmadia> if not, usd is fine.[23:39:31] <vooshy> well im english so GBP, so it will need converting either way.[23:39:33] <mmadia> ... speaking of which, mmu_screen : submit your RMLL costs :P[23:40:25] <mmadia> then USD, as we tend to wire the contractors the money from the bank as it's slightly cheaper than paypal.[23:41:08] <vooshy> mmadia: thanks, sorry bit of a dull conversation.[23:41:30] <mmadia> money is never dull :D[23:44:59] <phoudoin> :)[23:45:48] <vooshy> how's GSOC going at the moment? PulkoMandy seems very busy with HCD, but not many blogs from students[23:46:05] <dru345> GSoC needs more updates[23:46:21] <mmadia> ... yeah, i've been putting off the midterm summary article.[23:46:30] <PulkoMandy> they're working harder than me[23:46:35] <dru345> heh[23:46:35] <PulkoMandy> so no time for blogging[23:46:56] <mmadia> one of the students, Alex Wilson ( yourpalal_) has been granted commit access, while working on the layout api[23:47:01] <dru345> don't they have to submit regular reports or something?[23:47:09] <phoudoin> Atis have made great progress regarding IPv6[23:47:36] <phoudoin> Alex had even been granted commit access for his layout api work, which is very good[23:47:38] <PulkoMandy> dru345: yes, but that lands on the haiku-gsoc list[23:47:41] *** oco2 has quit IRC[23:47:41] <mmadia> this and past years, the students were only 'strongly encouraged' to keep public updates.[23:47:50] *** yourpalal has joined #haiku[23:47:56] <dru345> oh. maybe i should read that list too.[23:48:00] <dru345> hi yourpalal[23:48:13] <yourpalal> hi dru345[23:48:19] <PulkoMandy> dru345: the rule would be something like 'weekly ping: be it a patch, a message to haiku-gsoc, or blog update'[23:48:29] <mmadia> if we get to participate next year, we'll be introducing 1/4 term and 3/4term milestones and a stricter policy on public updates.[23:48:45] <phoudoin> The student working on the service kit seems to have enough stuff done to try using it to replace curl backend in our WebKit port[23:49:30] <PulkoMandy> yes, that work is going a bit out of main haiku tree[23:49:50] <PulkoMandy> there are signs of life from jvff (ext3)[23:50:00] <PulkoMandy> not sure we'll get something working out of it[23:50:08] <PulkoMandy> and ipv6 seems to work well too[23:50:08] <vooshy> we do like signs of life :)[23:50:13] <phoudoin> Christopher has encounted several issues regarding Media Kit actual state regarding demuxplexing and non-file input reader, but seems to be in a better shape now.[23:50:15] *** yourpalal_ has quit IRC[23:51:05] *** PasNox has quit IRC[23:54:41] *** andreas_dr has quit IRC