April 23, 2008 
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April 23, 2008 [00:00:47] *** {V} is now known as {V}zzz[00:01:48] *** HeTo has quit IRC[00:02:45] *** SiCuTDeUx has quit IRC[00:05:28] *** wildur has quit IRC[00:07:31] *** AnEvilYak has quit IRC[00:08:22] *** AnEvilYak has joined #haiku[00:11:55] *** DHowett has joined #haiku[00:13:02] *** AnEvilYak has quit IRC[00:14:34] *** urnenfeld has left #haiku[00:15:08] <duaneb> woot, threading works[00:15:44] <DeadYak> in Python?[00:16:16] <duaneb> yea[00:16:39] <duaneb> I mean, most of this is just wrangling defines[00:26:55] <DeadYak> just curiosity, are you using bethon as a basis or are you doing this "from scratch"?[00:27:07] <DeadYak> I'd assume the latter since enough is different POSIX-wise..[00:31:55] <geist> thought ingo and grew were doing real pthreads[00:31:55] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[00:31:56] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[00:32:01] <geist> crew even[00:33:24] <DeadYak> they are[00:33:30] <DeadYak> geist: btw, did you see Ingo's sem rewrite?[00:36:32] <geist> yep[00:36:41] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[00:36:44] <DeadYak> what do you think?[00:36:55] <geist> a little piece of me died inside[00:36:58] <DeadYak> ah[00:37:07] <geist> nah, anyway, sounds good[00:37:19] <geist> he's rewriting it for Great Justice[00:37:21] <DeadYak> is that what you meant by a generic wait queue or did you have something different in mind by that?[00:37:24] <geist> which is important[00:37:27] <geist> yeah[00:37:31] <geist> that's good stuff[00:37:33] <DeadYak> gotcha[00:37:44] <DeadYak> I definitely like how all these things don't need sems/condvars to block any more[00:38:10] *** TheNerd_ is now known as TheNerd[00:38:20] <geist> yep[00:38:25] <geist> the beos strategy is pretty lame[00:38:29] <geist> so any improvement is good[00:41:59] <DeadYak> aye[00:42:03] <DeadYak> I do like his approach in any case[00:42:08] <DeadYak> just wondered what your opinion of it was :)[00:44:27] <geist> i always intended to rewrite newos around that stuff[00:44:38] <geist> but i found it easier to just do it that way in the next kernel I wrote[00:44:43] <CIA-52> anevilyak * r25113 /haiku/trunk/src/kits/interface/Shelf.cpp:[00:44:43] <CIA-52> When saving its state, BShelf was erroneously saving the BMessage[00:44:43] <CIA-52> given to it when the replicant was first added. This had the net[00:44:43] <CIA-52> effect that any on the fly changes such as the color drops allowed[00:44:43] <CIA-52> by the Activity Monitor replicant were discarded. Fixed.[00:44:51] <DeadYak> geist: ah[00:45:04] <geist> so i did it that way in the little embedded thing I use all the time[00:48:02] *** duaneb has quit IRC[00:51:11] *** mmadia has quit IRC[00:51:55] *** tradewind has quit IRC[00:56:21] *** luroh has left #haiku[01:02:02] *** jiuda_D`arkness has joined #haiku[01:05:22] * mmu_man pets DeadYak[01:05:56] *** WindowsUninstall has quit IRC[01:06:26] * DeadYak pets mmu_man[01:06:28] <DeadYak> sorry about that :)[01:06:37] <DeadYak> don't know how long you spent trying to track it down[01:06:47] *** oco has quit IRC[01:06:57] *** Wiss has left #haiku[01:10:40] <mmu_man> DeadYak oh, 0s, I didn't try it in Haiku yet[01:10:57] <mmu_man> need to make room first on my partition first[01:11:05] <mmu_man> temporary divx dump :)[01:11:19] <mmu_man> btw, checked the new Pe extensions ? :)[01:11:38] <mmu_man> I added a HeaderHeader one, using funny hacks[01:11:50] <mmu_man> just find a way to use BFilePanel synchronously[01:12:21] <mmu_man> I should probably add a BMimeRefFilter class in svn, could be handy[01:12:22] *** MichaelHenry has joined #haiku[01:12:58] <DeadYak> mmu_man: I actually don't really wind up using Pe much :)[01:13:41] <mmu_man> well I was using BeIDE (and I still use vim) till last month or so[01:14:01] <mmu_man> but after getting sane keybindings Pe replaces it quite well[01:14:03] <mmu_man> http://rafb.net/p/6uVArv69.html[01:14:16] * mmu_man pets Pe's WebPaste extension too :)[01:14:25] <DeadYak> well, it's just I do almost all my Haiku coding from Linux at the moment :)[01:14:55] <mmu_man> eh[01:15:07] <mmu_man> even XEmacs in recent linux feels weird...[01:15:15] <mmu_man> that's why I keep zeta around mostly[01:15:26] <DeadYak> too unstable on my box[01:15:37] <DeadYak> the version I have locks up in various ways within 5 minutes at most[01:15:45] <mmu_man> 1.5 ?[01:15:48] <DeadYak> yes[01:15:56] <mmu_man> I still use a mixed up 1.2[01:16:07] <DeadYak> yeah, that's what I used to use before yT imploded[01:16:08] <mmu_man> I didn't like the large toolbars everywhere in 1.5[01:16:13] <DeadYak> I don't have any way of replicating that build though[01:16:15] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC[01:16:16] *** jiuda_D`arkness is now known as Barrett666[01:16:26] <DeadYak> and yeah, I hated the toolbars :)[01:17:18] <DeadYak> either way though, Linux builds a lot faster[01:17:28] <DeadYak> so until I can do all this stuff from Haiku day to day...[01:17:48] <mmu_man> righto[01:17:56] <MichaelHenry> Any way to create a symlink from the home directory to another drive...[01:17:57] <mmu_man> that's why I also use linux[01:18:01] <mmu_man> for m68k, ...[01:18:26] <DeadYak> MichaelHenry: meaning, /boot/home/linktosomeotherdrive?[01:18:29] <mmu_man> MichaelHenry ln -s /TheDriveName/somewhere ~/alink[01:18:30] <mmu_man> ?[01:18:33] <DeadYak> or putting /boot/home on a different drive?[01:18:51] <MichaelHenry> nah, /boot/symlink to /anotherdrive[01:19:08] <MichaelHenry> yeah deadyak[01:19:25] <mmu_man> ah, if you want to have home/ on another drive you must make sure it is mounted before Tracker is launched[01:19:26] <DeadYak> mm...[01:19:41] <DeadYak> mmu_man: before Tracker? what about everything else that looks in ~/config/settings?[01:19:41] <mmu_man> else it will screw up your link and recreate the folder[01:19:48] <mmu_man> DeadYak right[01:19:51] <MichaelHenry> tried the symlink and it worked but when I deleted the older home my system crashed[01:20:01] <mmu_man> except mountvolume requires app_server :)[01:21:03] <MichaelHenry> renamed home to home.bak[01:21:21] <MichaelHenry> and deleted home.bak[01:21:26] <MichaelHenry> and crash[01:21:44] <MichaelHenry> failure to find boot device[01:22:44] <DeadYak> you mean after rebooting?[01:22:51] <MichaelHenry> yep[01:22:53] <mmu_man> it probably contained drivers needed for boot :D[01:22:54] <MichaelHenry> so no go[01:23:25] <DeadYak> that's because it'd need to be able to be mounted early enough... by default only /boot is mounted during startup, and Tracker takes care of mounting the rest[01:23:40] <MichaelHenry> ah ok[01:23:45] <DeadYak> which isn't good enough here since home also contains all the settings needed to start the sys[01:23:48] <DeadYak> + any extra drivers you have[01:25:25] <MichaelHenry> well, I reinstalled Zeta 1.21 this morning, now, I gonna upgrade to 1.51 and replug in my hard drives.... Talk about a mess I did last night :)[01:25:55] <MichaelHenry> I needed to reinstall anyway sooooo[01:33:00] <MichaelHenry> mmu_man: How do I get a build enviroment set up to build the tools I was talking about for Zeta?[01:33:34] <mmu_man> what tools ?[01:33:52] *** thorn_ has quit IRC[01:34:13] <MichaelHenry> bash, coreutils, updates to other files, etc.[01:34:29] <MichaelHenry> The stuff Begasus told me to ask you about[01:36:39] <mmu_man> you mean the opensource stuff published on yellowtab.com ?[01:36:52] <MichaelHenry> yeah[01:37:11] *** thorn has joined #haiku[01:37:24] <MichaelHenry> standard enviroment in Zeta will work?[01:37:50] <mmu_man> well there should be a ZetaOSS zip or something with files that mimics the yT build environment to build all at once[01:38:10] <MichaelHenry> ahhh[01:38:21] <MichaelHenry> so no tracking down the individual packages[01:38:23] <mmu_man> but you can also just rename the GNUmakefile to something else and use the infos in it to find what configure options to use[01:39:08] <MichaelHenry> btw, do you have a copy of ZBackup that was available on yt's site before it went down?[01:39:10] <mmu_man> each zip contained the sources we used plus a GNUmakefile that was used by our build system to run configure && make && make isntall with correct values[01:39:34] <MichaelHenry> we?[01:39:37] <mmu_man> I can probably dig the sources and build it[01:39:39] <MichaelHenry> you worked there?[01:39:51] <mmu_man> "we" ? yes I worked there for 1.5 y[01:39:58] <MichaelHenry> sweet[01:39:59] <DeadYak> a few of us did, back in the day[01:40:07] <MichaelHenry> you too?[01:40:13] <DeadYak> not for 1.5, but before that yes[01:40:19] <MichaelHenry> cool[01:40:22] <MichaelHenry> Thanks[01:41:11] <MichaelHenry> the build system is in the ZETAOSS?[01:42:18] <MichaelHenry> got everything you have mentioned...[01:42:27] <MichaelHenry> so I will give it a try tonite[01:43:05] <mmu_man> yes that one[01:43:17] <mmu_man> unzip all to a folder and run make[01:43:40] <mmu_man> make zetainstall should give you zips of bins[01:46:03] <MichaelHenry> "MAKE ZETAINSTALL"[01:46:11] <MichaelHenry> by itself[01:46:27] <MichaelHenry> gotcha[01:47:05] <MichaelHenry> i am gonna have fun[01:49:45] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[01:49:52] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[01:49:52] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[01:53:02] <DeadYak> wb[01:53:25] <mmu_man> disco...[01:54:04] <pyCube> hm.. all this time i assumed the channel was dead, but it was me being all scrolled up.. heh[01:54:57] *** MichaelHenry has quit IRC[02:05:09] <Kokito> mmu_man, you went disco dancing? :P[02:05:19] <mmu_man> I went disco-nected :)[02:06:05] <Kokito> LOL[02:06:53] <pyCube> verydisco[02:11:45] <Kokito> or disco-very?[02:12:37] <pyCube> there's a difference?[02:13:27] <DeadYak> if you like puns :P[02:38:12] *** tombhadAC has quit IRC[02:39:09] *** tombhadAC has joined #haiku[02:39:29] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC[02:42:05] *** Advant has joined #haiku[02:42:32] *** duaneb has joined #haiku[02:50:36] *** rdmr has quit IRC[02:53:24] *** petterhj has quit IRC[02:53:29] *** umccullough_w has joined #haiku[02:53:52] <umccullough_w> Kokito, the end of the topic is chopped off on my side[02:53:57] <umccullough_w> maybe my IRC client[02:54:25] <umccullough_w> looks like it truncates for me at 450 characters[02:55:48] <umccullough_w> perhaps some tinyurl's to replace some of the bigger ones ;)[02:57:04] <DeadYak> umccullough_w: not your client, freenode's limit is 450[02:57:08] <umccullough_w> like replace the GSOC link with http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2130[02:57:13] <umccullough_w> DeadYak, thanks, i wasn't sure[02:57:18] <DeadYak> [15:46] SAFELIST CASEMAPPING=ascii CHANNELLEN=30 TOPICLEN=450 KICKLEN=450 KEYLEN=23 USERLEN=10 HOSTLEN=63 SILENCE=50 :are supported by this server[02:57:57] <umccullough_w> scale link can be changed to: http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2028[02:58:24] <umccullough_w> fosdem link can be changed to http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2050[02:58:31] <umccullough_w> that should help :)[03:00:06] <umccullough_w> oh, mindfuck potential...[03:00:26] <umccullough_w> mmu_man, you around?[03:00:29] <mmu_man> ..[03:00:37] <mmu_man> yes it's truncated[03:00:50] <umccullough_w> can you op me so i can fix the topic? but wait a sec ;)[03:00:55] *** mmu_man sets mode: +o umccullough_w[03:00:55] *** umccullough_w is now known as Luposian[03:01:05] <DeadYak> hhaha[03:01:06] <Luposian> ;)[03:01:06] *** mmu_man sets mode: -o Luposian[03:01:11] <mmu_man> tsss[03:01:43] *** Luposian was kicked by mmu_man (impersonation is baaad)[03:01:50] <mmu_man> even at 3 am[03:01:52] *** Luposian has joined #haiku[03:01:57] <Luposian> bah, i own this nick[03:02:00] <DeadYak> lol[03:02:30] <mmu_man> still, it's bad :P[03:02:56] <Luposian> you didn't even give me a chance to change the topic ;)[03:03:08] *** mmu_man sets mode: +o Luposian[03:03:17] <Luposian> actually, what came after "Commits:"?[03:03:24] <mmu_man> don't give me a chance to ban you :p[03:03:25] <Luposian> cia?[03:03:32] <DeadYak> cia.navi.cx I think[03:03:33] <DeadYak> lemme check[03:03:40] *** Luposian is now known as umccullough_w[03:03:58] <DeadYak> http://cia.vc/stats/project/OpenBeOS[03:04:22] <umccullough_w> thx[03:04:22] <mmu_man> Commits: http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/OpenBeOS[03:04:26] <umccullough_w> anything else missing?[03:04:44] *** umccullough_w changes topic to "Haiku: http://haiku-os.org | 5 projects on GSoC: http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2130 | Haiku@SCaLE 6x: http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2028 | Haiku@FOSDEM: http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2050 | Haiku Tech Talk: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=236331448076587879 | IRC logs: http://echelog.matzon.dk/?haiku | Commits: http://cia.vc/stats/project/OpenBeOS"[03:04:45] *** ChanServ changes topic to "Haiku: http://haiku-os.org | 5 projects on GSoC: http://www.haiku-os.org/news/2008-04-21/haiku_gets_five_students_spots_for_gsoc_2008 | Haiku@SCaLE 6x: http://www.haiku-os.org/blog/koki/2008-02-11/haiku_at_scale_6x_overall_impressions | Haiku@FOSDEM: http://www.haiku-os.org/blog/mmu_man/2008-02-25/hello_from_fosdem | Haiku Tech Talk: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=236331448076587879 | IRC logs: http://echelog.matzon.dk/?haiku | Commits:"[03:04:53] <umccullough_w> oh, chanserv[03:04:58] <mmu_man> eh :)[03:05:03] <umccullough_w> stupid topiclock ;)[03:05:08] <DeadYak> probably won't allow someone to change it unless they're an actual op in its list[03:05:22] <umccullough_w> well, this nick isn't reg'd[03:05:29] <umccullough_w> which was why i changed to the other one ;)[03:05:44] <umccullough_w> but i dare not...can't afford to have it banned[03:05:48] *** mmu_man changes topic to "Haiku: http://haiku-os.org | 5 projects on GSoC: http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2130 | Haiku@SCaLE 6x: http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2028 | Haiku@FOSDEM: http://www.haiku-os.org/node/2050 | Haiku Tech Talk: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=236331448076587879 | IRC logs: http://echelog.matzon.dk/?haiku | Commits: http://cia.vc/stats/project/OpenBeOS"[03:05:55] <umccullough_w> cool[03:05:55] <DeadYak> thought so[03:05:56] *** mmu_man sets mode: -o umccullough_w[03:05:59] <mmu_man> thx for trying[03:06:07] <duaneb> heh[03:06:16] <umccullough_w> thx for giving me the (almost) opportunity for a funny[03:06:47] <umccullough_w> [18:00] *** set by Luposian on Mon Apr 22[03:06:51] <umccullough_w> would have bene awesome[03:10:05] *** mmu_man is now known as Luposian[03:10:13] *** Luposian is now known as mmu_man[03:10:34] <umccullough_w> you like that nick? i'll sell it to ya cheap ;)[03:10:35] <mmu_man> this way ?[03:10:42] <mmu_man> lol[03:10:51] <mmu_man> nyway, I should sleep[03:10:55] <umccullough_w> 'night[03:11:02] <DeadYak> night mmu_man[03:11:33] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[03:12:15] <umccullough_w> i thought it would have been funny anyway :P[03:13:14] <umccullough_w> hmm...[03:15:14] *** the_webers_inc has joined #haiku[03:15:39] *** absabs has joined #haiku[03:15:39] *** the_webers_inc has quit IRC[03:16:22] *** the_webers_inc has joined #haiku[03:19:17] *** tangel has joined #haiku[03:21:40] *** the_webers_inc has quit IRC[03:21:53] *** the_webers_inc has joined #haiku[03:22:49] *** tangel has left #haiku[03:24:05] <umccullough_w> tonight I need to submit a bug on teh i865 crash in app_server that I'm experiencing :([03:24:16] <umccullough_w> hope i don't forget[03:25:02] <umccullough_w> unfortunately it happens in gdb, but leaves the system in a state that I can't copy/paste the backtrace - so I'll have to take a pic with the camera i guess[03:26:14] *** the_webers_inc has quit IRC[03:26:41] <umccullough_w> ah, and of course - Microsoft proves that DRM is everything it promised: http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080422-drm-sucks-redux-microsoft-to-nuke-msn-music-drm-keys.html[03:29:38] *** Kokito has quit IRC[03:32:14] <duaneb> I love arstchnica[03:32:27] <duaneb> arstechnica*[03:32:40] <duaneb> the perfect balance of reporting and geekiness[03:34:32] <umccullough_w> of course, /. picked it up too :P[03:50:31] *** helf has joined #haiku[03:50:45] <helf> good lord[03:50:56] * helf has been reading cleanmpg.com forum entries[03:51:28] *** moparx has quit IRC[03:51:35] <helf> these people get incredible MPG from their cars but at what cost? constantly start/stopping the engine, shitting to neutral and back a lot, engaging the clutch for long stretches... :|[03:51:44] <helf> i guess they buy a new car every 2 years[03:56:36] *** tombhadAC has quit IRC[03:59:03] <helf> wow, all these people are the ones I hate getting behind :P[03:59:14] <helf> "pulse and glide with a 10mph delta" .. uh.. nooo.. :)[04:00:44] <geist> ttp://marriedtothesea.com/042208/oops-thats-not-funny.gif[04:01:32] <DeadYak> toilet transfer protocol? :)[04:02:07] <helf> ew[04:02:08] <helf> :P[04:02:28] <geist> http://marriedtothesea.com/042208/oops-thats-not-funny.gif[04:02:39] <absabs> joke?[04:02:40] <DeadYak> just giving you a hard time :)[04:02:45] <absabs> :P[04:02:53] <duaneb> Du hast!![04:02:54] <absabs> hi DeadYak[04:02:56] <geist> that's not funny[04:03:00] <duaneb> my two german words I know :P[04:03:01] <DeadYak> absabs: hiya[04:03:08] <duaneb> and rosenrot[04:03:11] <helf> wtf[04:03:14] <helf> why draw a cartoon like that?[04:03:16] <helf> it has no point[04:03:17] <DeadYak> someone listens to rammstein[04:03:25] <DeadYak> helf: apart from irony?[04:03:34] <geist> marriedtothesea is the shit[04:03:40] <helf> :P[04:04:14] <umccullough_w> da shiznit?[04:06:01] * duaneb is moving back to amiga os[04:06:16] <helf> OS4? :)[04:06:44] <umccullough_w> leaving a dead OS for an even deader one?[04:07:04] *** the_webers_inc has joined #haiku[04:07:08] <duaneb> that was really the pinnacle of computing[04:07:43] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[04:08:27] <helf> what version are you going to use? :)[04:08:42] <mmadia> fleh![04:08:54] <helf> hey[04:08:57] * DeadYak pets mmadia[04:09:51] * mmadia orders DeadYak a newspaper subscription. ; )[04:11:13] <DeadYak> why newspaper?[04:11:35] *** pyCube has quit IRC[04:11:49] <mmadia> didnt think of ordering a pair of slippers.[04:12:22] *** ozy` has quit IRC[04:12:34] *** ozy` has joined #haiku[04:12:40] <duaneb> I actually don't know[04:12:56] <duaneb> I haven't booted the sucker up since I was seven, way back in '98[04:13:29] <helf> what model do you have?[04:13:40] <helf> I want to get an A1200 or a 4000T eventually[04:15:07] <duaneb> the 4000[04:15:19] <duaneb> I think my dad has a 4000T somewhere...[04:15:20] <helf> Wanna sell it? :)[04:15:26] <duaneb> I also have an amiga one[04:15:27] *** rcjsuen has quit IRC[04:15:27] <helf> or his? :)[04:15:38] <helf> ooo.. I'll take one of htose too ;)[04:15:55] *** ozy` has quit IRC[04:16:37] *** ozy` has joined #haiku[04:17:58] <duaneb> over my dead body![04:18:02] *** cherrypie has joined #haiku[04:18:06] <helf> heh[04:18:08] <helf> hey cherrypie[04:18:20] * duaneb peruses ebay[04:18:31] <helf> I hate ebay[04:18:35] <helf> I spend too much money there :][04:18:50] <mmadia> weren't you just selling stuff helf? : )[04:18:50] *** rcjsuen has joined #haiku[04:19:37] <duaneb> though I really want this: http://cgi.ebay.com/Apple-Powerbook-G4-12-inch-FACTORY-SEALED_W0QQitemZ230245546930QQihZ013QQcategoryZ111422QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem[04:19:40] * duaneb drools[04:20:31] <duaneb> and if anyone wants a server, grab this: http://cgi.ebay.com/Apple-G4-Cube-1GB-450MHZ-Power-Mac_W0QQitemZ360043711671QQihZ023QQcategoryZ111418QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem[04:21:01] <helf> only up side to that is its a cube :P[04:21:08] <helf> mmadia: most of it ;)[04:21:13] <helf> just told my trash 80 m100[04:21:19] <helf> selling my sharp oz-9500 now[04:21:32] <helf> i have a ss20 to sell too, and possible a Mac SE if I can find it :P[04:21:40] <helf> its in a closet somewhere[04:21:42] <ozy`> duaneb: I'm sure there are cheaper servers[04:22:02] <ozy`> hell, my roommate has a fairly hefty gaming machine he got used for $25[04:22:03] * helf has a 933 PowerMac G4[04:22:05] <helf> its... ok.[04:22:18] <duaneb> but the G4 cube is DEAD silent[04:22:24] <helf> ozy`: you can get 3ghz machines used for like 100 bucks or less sometimes :)[04:22:33] <helf> duaneb: and slow[04:22:33] <ozy`> helf: hot[04:22:40] <helf> and has heat issues if you arent careful :P[04:22:56] <helf> why did I even mention slow?[04:22:59] <helf> I use a 33mhz machine..[04:23:11] <ozy`> helf: O_o[04:23:17] <ozy`> what box would that be?[04:23:20] <helf> duaneb: I want to get a SSD for my NeXT and my PC.. im sick of the hdd whine[04:23:29] <helf> ozy`: NeXTStation Turbo Color[04:23:35] <ozy`> o rly[04:24:00] *** daste has joined #haiku[04:24:22] <helf> ya rly[04:24:44] <helf> 128mb ram, 33mhz 040, 2gb internal hdd.. etc etc :)[04:24:45] <helf> i wuv it[04:25:20] <ozy`> I still have a machine somewhere that runs at about that speed[04:25:24] <ozy`> it's horrendous[04:25:28] <umccullough_w> heh[04:25:44] <ozy`> I remember it being actually usable when I was 10 or so[04:25:46] <umccullough_w> you can get a lot done with a shitty slow-ass machine if you aren't doing much to begin with ;)[04:26:04] <umccullough_w> like say... chatting on IRC[04:26:25] <helf> :([04:26:28] <umccullough_w> lol[04:26:29] <helf> it's not shitty :([04:26:37] <umccullough_w> ok, it's nifty[04:26:41] <ozy`> that reminds me[04:26:42] <helf> you haven't used a NeXT.. I'll show you! ;P[04:26:47] <helf> I'll video take it running later :P[04:27:09] <umccullough_w> i've never even seen a NeXT up close[04:27:15] * mmadia wonders if the video camera has a faster processor : D[04:27:18] <ozy`> someday I would like to get a lightweight machine that's built like a brick[04:27:36] <helf> mmadia: its ARM based, so I'm sure :P[04:27:37] <umccullough_w> lightweight and brick[04:27:44] <helf> contradiction in terms...[04:27:46] <ozy`> by which I mean, it should be incredibly durable[04:27:49] <ozy`> not heavy :p[04:28:04] <umccullough_w> built like a rock?[04:28:22] <ozy`> that works[04:28:25] <ozy`> I guess[04:28:34] <ozy`> ˜\O_o/˜[04:28:35] <helf> http://deskshots.noccy.com/view/full/?46[04:28:35] <umccullough_w> bob seger came to mind[04:28:40] <helf> my NeXT desktop right now[04:28:49] <helf> my site is down for some reason... only reason im linking there[04:29:12] <duaneb> helf, trade you an amiga for your next[04:29:25] <helf> ha[04:29:30] <ozy`> helf: that actually looks much nicer than the few NeXT screenshots I've seen[04:29:44] <helf> ozy`: ive worked on it. i have some more stuff to do to it later on.[04:30:02] <helf> im in hte process of finishing setting up a drive with nextstep 3.3 for deadyak at the moment. supposed to have had htat done ages ago[04:30:06] <helf> ran into problems. heh[04:30:12] <umccullough_w> helf, party like it's 1999 dude[04:30:19] <helf> you mean 1992?[04:30:26] <helf> says 1999 because of the y2k patch ;)[04:30:30] <umccullough_w> :)[04:30:50] <helf> i have tons of up-to-date CLI apps and such.[04:30:56] <helf> so it's not that out of date, really[04:31:07] <helf> latest openssl and the like. can even use the mail.app with gmail ;)[04:31:07] <umccullough_w> what compiler does that use?[04:31:12] <umccullough_w> metrowerks?[04:31:19] <helf> i have the same version beos r5 has of gcc[04:31:27] <helf> i use gcc[04:31:32] <helf> it came with cc and several others[04:31:39] <helf> plus the objC compiler[04:31:43] <umccullough_w> ah, gcc supported 68k then... i was thinking ppc i guess[04:32:11] <helf> yeah, its 68k[04:32:36] <umccullough_w> was objC basically designed for NeXT?[04:32:44] <helf> i dunno[04:32:51] <helf> i think so[04:33:21] <helf> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j02b8Fuz73A <-- steve jobs in his typical annoying self demoing nextstep 3[04:33:26] <helf> its pretty cool, really.[04:33:32] <helf> specially given the hardwares age[04:33:35] <umccullough_w> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objc[04:34:11] <cherrypie> seems everyone is on a retro next kick atm[04:34:22] <helf> no, i just cause it :)[04:34:31] <helf> I hijack conversations[04:34:42] <umccullough_w> damn, he's young in that video :)[04:34:43] <cherrypie> need some ppl to dig out some old dec machines for variety[04:35:55] <helf> cherrypie: give me time... ;)[04:36:06] <cherrypie> kk[04:36:11] <cherrypie> you have a mission now[04:36:20] <helf> eventually, I'll finally get my hands on a symbolics 36xx and I'll go on and on about it[04:36:37] <cherrypie> I ex[ect to see an alphastation in here by 2009 ;)[04:36:50] <helf> not like those are hard to get ;)[04:36:58] <cherrypie> :)[04:37:05] <duaneb> I have access to a pdp-11 :D[04:37:20] <cherrypie> oooer[04:37:23] <cherrypie> retro[04:37:24] *** stargater has quit IRC[04:37:33] <helf> hehy[04:37:35] <helf> *heh[04:37:40] <helf> I almost bought one a few years ago off ebay[04:37:52] <duaneb> the pdp had the best architecture of all time[04:37:57] *** mmadia has quit IRC[04:38:06] <helf> it was decent ;)[04:38:15] <duaneb> ahh....[04:38:28] <duaneb> heck, I'm only sixteen[04:38:38] <duaneb> imagine when I'm sixty and I'm reminiscing O.O[04:38:47] <helf> heh[04:38:48] <cherrypie> I remember how drool worthy the old alpha ev6's were in the day[04:38:51] <helf> I'm only 20..[04:39:05] <umccullough_w> i'm an old fart[04:39:10] <helf> I wish Dec hadn't been assimilated[04:39:14] <helf> DEC[04:39:18] <cherrypie> don't we all[04:39:27] <cherrypie> one of the last companies with self respect[04:39:29] <helf> The roadmap for the alpha CPUs was insane :)[04:39:30] <DHowett> I always wanted a DEC Terminal for my desktop... :P[04:39:53] <cherrypie> probably would've gone like Sun though[04:40:06] <cherrypie> lost their edge, lost direction[04:40:16] <helf> probably :/[04:41:34] <helf> DHowett: best 'terminal' I've ever owned is a Toshiba T3100 laptop :)[04:41:48] <helf> runs freedos off a floppy with kermit[04:42:18] <DHowett> ... I've got a T3200 under my desk! Sweet.[04:42:40] <helf> gas plasma FTW![04:42:42] <helf> :D[04:43:17] <DHowett> No operating system though.. no disks that work in it, and the screen has a bunch of random lines in it.. they get worse as it stays on.[04:43:49] <helf> no disks that work in it?[04:43:51] <helf> same issue I had[04:43:56] <helf> i can dupe mine if you want :)[04:44:09] <helf> i went through god knows how many boot floppies before i found the ONE that would work[04:44:15] <helf> FreeDOS v0.4b[04:44:27] <helf> no other dos would work.. older and newer freedos versions wouldnt even boot..[04:44:42] <helf> oh, the drive will only read 720kb floppies, too[04:44:46] <DHowett> yep[04:45:30] <DHowett> Tried physically hacking a HD floppy into a lower density ("Hey let's cover the hole that means HD") and copying a 720kb image on it with various linux tools.[04:45:56] <helf> i can make a dupe of mine and make sure it boots and mail it to you :P[04:46:27] <DHowett> Nah, but thanks :)[04:46:42] <umccullough_w> what was it designed to run with originally?[04:47:12] <helf> No idea[04:47:30] <DHowett> DOS 3 or something, I imagine[04:48:16] <helf> ms dos 3.3[04:48:25] <helf> i tried that and couldn't get it to boot[04:48:40] <helf> http://www.old-computers.com/museum/doc.asp?c=917[04:49:43] <umccullough_w> shipped with 3.2?[04:50:28] <helf> i meant 3.2 heh[04:56:57] <umccullough_w> "one $500 fax modem" -- nice[04:57:05] <umccullough_w> watching that video helf :)[04:57:20] <helf> hehe[04:57:28] <helf> i have high quality vhs rips on a dvd if you want :P[04:57:32] <helf> its 4 different videos[04:57:33] <umccullough_w> nah[04:57:43] <umccullough_w> maybe if I actually owned one :P[04:57:48] <helf> :P[04:58:01] <helf> its fun to watch all the way through :)[05:11:48] <umccullough_w> bah, time to go home :P[05:11:50] <umccullough_w> later[05:12:01] *** umccullough_w has quit IRC[05:14:10] *** cps1966 has joined #haiku[05:17:41] *** duaneb has quit IRC[05:18:15] <helf> hey cps[05:18:16] *** aljen has quit IRC[05:20:03] *** mib_xrexen6f has joined #haiku[05:20:26] *** AlexForster has quit IRC[05:28:06] <ozy`> hmm, the creators of Obj-C were named Love and Cox[05:28:34] <helf> heh[05:28:42] <cps1966> what??[05:28:45] <DHowett> *snickers*[05:29:02] <ozy`> "Objective-C was created primarily by Brad Cox and Tom Love in the early 1980s at their company Stepstone." <== from Wikipedia[05:30:19] <helf> through a few Ss in there...[05:30:24] <helf> Tom loves brads cox[05:30:27] <helf> :([05:30:29] <helf> im sorry[05:31:25] <DHowett> You're a horrible person and should feel horrible[05:31:31] <ozy`> it's okay... the computer industry is an eternal fountain of lulz... there's nothing anyone can do about it :p[05:31:31] <DHowett> No, that was pretty awesome actually[05:31:32] <DHowett> :P[05:31:40] <helf> :P[05:32:26] * DeadYak pets DHowett[05:32:44] <DHowett> Ow. Apparently the air coming out of my laptop is 194 degrees Fahrenheit.[05:32:59] <cps1966> gee i had to pick myself off the floor after that your nasty young man helf[05:33:32] *** daste has quit IRC[05:33:41] <cps1966> j/k[05:34:01] *** the_webers_inc has quit IRC[05:34:37] <helf> :P[05:34:42] <helf> you're welcome[05:34:54] <cps1966> :-D[05:35:48] *** _Megaf is now known as Megaf_[05:45:32] <helf> heh[05:45:36] <helf> the people on this forum are insane[05:45:49] <helf> this one guy has an insight that he is "streamlining" :P as if its not enough already..[05:45:50] <Technix> the people in this IRC are insane :P[05:46:00] <helf> That just goes without saying[05:46:01] <helf> this is IRC[05:46:02] <helf> :)[05:46:25] <helf> Technix: have any scsi accessories or ADB stuff? I might as well ask everyone :P[05:46:39] <Technix> um, no, and no[05:46:49] <helf> k[05:50:03] *** rcjsuen has quit IRC[05:53:12] *** DHowett is now known as Away[DHowett][05:56:25] *** absabs has quit IRC[05:59:02] <umccullough> ho hum...[05:59:19] <helf> bored?[05:59:20] <umccullough> helf, what kinds of scsi and adb stuff?[05:59:24] <umccullough> :)[05:59:45] <umccullough> i think I have an ADB trackpad somewhere[06:00:14] <helf> anything you got :P[06:00:22] <umccullough> yep, found it - an ALPS Glidepoint[06:00:27] <helf> id have to see what it is and check my NeXT out and see if it'd work[06:00:35] <helf> touchpad?[06:00:39] <helf> like on a laptop?[06:00:46] <umccullough> yeah, but it's standalone[06:00:49] <umccullough> let me find a pic[06:00:52] <helf> neat[06:00:57] <umccullough> "ADB Version"[06:01:07] <helf> I think i used to have a ps/2 version of one of those[06:01:20] <helf> what color is it?[06:01:25] <umccullough> http://search.ebay.com/alps-glidepoint[06:01:28] <umccullough> gray[06:01:34] <umccullough> light gray[06:02:11] <umccullough> basically it's one of these: http://cgi.ebay.com/ALPS-Desktop-Glidepoint-Apple-Mac-Touchpad-Mouse_W0QQitemZ230244054987QQihZ013QQcategoryZ25445QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem[06:02:17] <umccullough> shit, what a crappy URL[06:02:57] <helf> nifty[06:02:58] <umccullough> has more use though - buttons are "shiny" from use, and a slightly worn spot ont he pad itself[06:03:09] <helf> want to get rid of it?[06:03:19] <umccullough> sure, i don't really want it[06:03:36] <umccullough> what kind of scsi stuff you looking for?[06:03:39] <helf> im messing with ADB items with my NeXT.. seeing what works, what doesnt.. ;)[06:03:43] <helf> drives, readers[06:03:55] <umccullough> i've got a few things...[06:04:00] <helf> i'd love a good tape drive. like a DDS3 or something[06:04:07] <umccullough> mmm... :)[06:04:13] <umccullough> maybe i'd be willing to part with mine :D[06:04:20] <helf> :P[06:04:23] <umccullough> actually, i think it's older than DDS3[06:04:24] <helf> have some tapes too? :)[06:04:26] <umccullough> yeah[06:04:29] <umccullough> and a cleaning tape even[06:04:34] <helf> kewl[06:04:43] <helf> ive been wanting one for a decent backup[06:04:49] <umccullough> i'll take a look - my wife would love if I ditched some shit[06:04:56] <umccullough> i think the tapes are 2-4gb[06:05:09] <umccullough> i tried to use it once and had problems - so I can't guarantee it works[06:05:23] <umccullough> it's a 3.5" full-height internal drive, btw[06:05:33] <umccullough> can be put in an external enclosure of course[06:05:49] <umccullough> and it has factory 5.25" brackets on it[06:05:57] <umccullough> with a 5.25" front bezel i think[06:06:14] <umccullough> yeah... in fact i dont' think I have the 3.5" bezel :([06:06:25] <helf> i dont care :)[06:06:39] <umccullough> i also have a syquest drive[06:06:42] <umccullough> 88mb i think[06:06:47] <umccullough> and a few scsi CDROM drives[06:07:02] <helf> external cd drives?[06:07:03] <umccullough> also have an external 6x SCSI CD burner - smart-n-friendly[06:07:12] <umccullough> dood, i've got all kinds of shit ;)[06:07:26] <helf> heck, ill take whatever you want to mail :P[06:07:27] <umccullough> the external CD burner is in tip-top shape i believe[06:07:35] <helf> sweet[06:07:37] <umccullough> worked when i used it last - just not very useful to me :P[06:07:50] <helf> have the maker/model?[06:08:05] <umccullough> it's a smart-n-friendly turbowriter 6x ...i'll go look[06:08:10] <umccullough> my wife wanted me to dump it anyway[06:08:15] <umccullough> have the original box and everything[06:08:28] <helf> i may work with the cd burning GUI app for nextstep[06:08:31] <helf> *it[06:08:36] <helf> which would rock :)[06:09:38] <umccullough> damn, can't find it atm[06:09:43] <umccullough> probably under a pile of junk[06:10:02] <umccullough> i seriously gotta think about that one though - i was keeping it in case I got my LCIII working again - as it actually worked with that machine[06:10:05] <DeadYak> umccullough: no work tonight?[06:10:10] <umccullough> DeadYak, just got home[06:10:14] <DeadYak> gotcha[06:10:16] <umccullough> so, not working so late :)[06:10:23] <DeadYak> yay[06:10:33] <umccullough> actually, i gotta look into this coverity stuff tonight[06:10:52] <umccullough> helf, catch me this weekend[06:10:55] <helf> umccullough: psh, you dont need it ;)[06:10:56] <helf> ok[06:10:57] <helf> cya man[06:11:20] <umccullough> not leaving yet, but if you remind me on the weekend, i'll dig some stuff up and get you pics :)[06:11:31] <umccullough> as for shipping to you...we'll have to talk about that ;)[06:13:06] <helf> ok :)[06:13:09] <helf> where are you located?[06:13:57] <umccullough> california[06:14:02] <umccullough> I think this is the model I have: http://www3.shopping.com/xPR-Smart-and-Friendly-TurboWriter-SAF795[06:14:16] <helf> ah, good. i can pay shipping or whatever. thats no problem :P[06:14:21] <umccullough> k[06:14:27] <umccullough> anyhow, bbiab[06:14:36] <helf> cya[06:20:11] <Technix> blarg[06:26:49] <helf> lol[06:27:23] <helf> watching cops.. apparently on this one, a home owner came home and some guy walked in while he was in another room and started taking a shower..[06:28:33] <cherrypie> lol[06:29:05] <helf> the caught him right in the middle of a shave :P[06:29:12] <helf> he was taking a bubble bath in the girls bathtub[06:29:16] <helf> this is hilarious[06:41:07] *** mib_xrexen6f has quit IRC[06:44:00] *** DeadYak has quit IRC[06:46:24] *** umccullough_x has joined #haiku[06:55:40] *** MauriceK has quit IRC[06:56:53] *** Away[DHowett] has left #haiku[07:05:45] *** Begasus has joined #haiku[07:08:15] <Begasus> morning[07:13:13] <geist> splat[07:22:24] <Technix> yo[07:36:29] *** TuneTracker has quit IRC[07:51:17] *** Teknomancer has joined #haiku[07:52:07] *** umccullough_x has quit IRC[08:33:34] *** pmr has quit IRC[08:38:32] *** waveshaper has joined #haiku[08:45:09] *** Teknomancer has quit IRC[08:46:47] *** emitrax has joined #haiku[08:50:28] *** Roderic has joined #Haiku[08:50:29] *** Roderic is now known as Ingenu[09:06:05] *** SprMa has joined #haiku[09:34:52] *** _Lucretia_ has quit IRC[09:35:33] *** _Lucretia_ has joined #haiku[09:48:27] *** slaad has joined #haiku[09:59:31] *** emitrax has quit IRC[09:59:56] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[10:06:20] *** Odium has quit IRC[10:14:25] *** helf has quit IRC[10:14:26] *** helf|away has quit IRC[10:15:57] *** tradewind has joined #haiku[10:18:40] *** absabs has joined #haiku[10:24:38] *** SprMa has quit IRC[10:32:52] *** HohenheimElric has joined #haiku[10:33:25] *** Begasus is now known as Begasus_bbl[10:44:42] *** absabs has quit IRC[10:47:35] *** dan_ has joined #haiku[11:06:09] <CIA-52> stippi * r25114 /haiku/trunk/src/apps/ (24 files in 4 dirs):[11:06:09] <CIA-52> Added Pairs game contributed by Ralf Schuelke to the image! (Demo folder)[11:06:09] <CIA-52> Thanks a lot, Ralf![11:10:00] *** hakimrie has joined #haiku[11:13:37] *** mats has joined #haiku[11:19:45] *** vbmithr has joined #haiku[11:22:48] *** Barrett666 has joined #haiku[11:27:08] *** TheNerd has quit IRC[11:33:38] *** SprMa has joined #haiku[11:42:10] *** absabs has joined #haiku[11:51:26] <CIA-52> stippi * r25115 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/HaikuImage: Forgot to commit this, added Pairs to the image in the Demos folder. Sorry![11:56:04] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[11:56:04] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[11:56:36] *** hakimrie has quit IRC[11:58:20] *** mats has quit IRC[12:06:08] *** vbmithr has quit IRC[12:06:25] *** vbmithr has joined #haiku[12:07:40] *** hakimrie has joined #haiku[12:12:27] *** slaad has quit IRC[12:13:25] *** slaad has joined #haiku[12:26:36] *** jiuda_D`arkness has joined #haiku[12:35:29] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[12:35:47] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[12:38:12] *** Euver has joined #haiku[12:39:47] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[12:42:14] *** SprMa_ has joined #haiku[12:42:47] *** Begasus_bbl has quit IRC[12:47:16] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[12:50:25] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC[12:53:55] *** SprMa has quit IRC[12:55:18] *** SprMa_ has quit IRC[12:55:28] *** jiuda_D`arkness has quit IRC[12:55:55] *** hakimrie has quit IRC[12:59:45] *** Barrett has quit IRC[13:01:39] *** pfoetchen has joined #haiku[13:01:52] *** Barrett666 has joined #haiku[13:02:37] *** HohenheimElric has quit IRC[13:17:06] <Thom_Holwerda> wow[13:17:11] <Thom_Holwerda> apple buys pa semi[13:22:29] *** slaad has quit IRC[13:23:15] *** wildur has joined #Haiku[13:23:42] *** slaad has joined #haiku[13:31:35] *** DaaT has joined #haiku[13:33:56] <DaaT> howdy[13:34:34] *** daste has joined #haiku[13:36:21] *** DeadYak has joined #haiku[13:38:26] *** absabs has quit IRC[13:40:06] <Barrett666> burp[13:41:20] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC[13:42:47] <Thom_Holwerda> really interesting this[13:42:54] <Thom_Holwerda> http://www.osnews.com/story/19672/Apple_Buys_Chip_Designer[13:43:02] <Thom_Holwerda> gtg to work[13:43:47] *** nibble has joined #haiku[13:44:11] *** MichaelHenry has joined #haiku[13:44:16] <DeadYak> that'd be an interesting move, I thought the current iPod/iPhone is ARM-based[13:44:29] <Thom_Holwerda> they are[13:44:48] <DeadYak> right...which makes switching to a PPC derivative decidedly non-trivial...at least in the iPhone's case[13:44:58] <DeadYak> iPod < Touch you could get away with it though[13:45:37] * slaad converts DeadYak to PPC.[13:45:54] * DaaT rips off DeadYak's ARM[13:46:40] * DeadYak slaps DaaT[13:46:57] <MichaelHenry> Can't have no ARM[13:47:07] <MichaelHenry> Can't slap that is[13:47:10] * DaaT rips off DeadYak's other ARM so he doesn't slap anyone anymore[13:47:33] <MichaelHenry> Headbutt maybe[13:47:35] <slaad> But how will you slap... without any ARMs?[13:47:46] <MichaelHenry> kick possible[13:48:10] * DaaT has flashbacks to Monty Python's Quest for the Holy Grail's Black Knight[13:48:28] <DaaT> DeadYak the Black Knight :P[13:50:13] <surrounder> "it's just a fleshwound!"[13:50:49] <DaaT> :D[13:51:20] <MichaelHenry> yeah, it rips the flesh off[13:53:30] *** pfoetchen has quit IRC[13:53:33] *** johannes_ has joined #haiku[14:03:26] *** daste has quit IRC[14:05:13] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[14:05:14] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[14:09:38] *** DeadYak has quit IRC[14:09:47] *** HeTo has joined #haiku[14:13:50] *** rcjsuen has joined #haiku[14:24:53] *** tombhadAC has joined #haiku[14:34:00] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[14:36:47] *** tombhadAC is now known as tombhadZ[14:39:38] *** HohenheimElric has joined #haiku[14:44:10] <CIA-52> axeld * r25116 /haiku/trunk/src/tests/add-ons/kernel/file_systems/ (4 files in 2 dirs):[14:44:10] <CIA-52> * Wrote a test application that tries to fragment your disk by creating many[14:44:10] <CIA-52> small files, and then deleting every other.[14:48:57] *** Euver has quit IRC[14:50:38] *** stargater has joined #haiku[14:50:46] <stargater> hi :-)[14:58:00] *** waveshaper has quit IRC[14:59:45] *** stargate1 has joined #haiku[15:03:24] *** DeadYak has joined #haiku[15:07:25] *** _Lucretia__ has joined #haiku[15:12:28] *** Megaf_ has quit IRC[15:15:56] *** stargater has quit IRC[15:16:29] *** emitrax has joined #haiku[15:16:59] *** _Megaf has joined #Haiku[15:16:59] *** Hummin has joined #haiku[15:17:04] <Hummin> hi there[15:17:33] <Hummin> I was thinking about something[15:17:49] <Hummin> 1. how I never contribute to this project, even though I'm a programmer[15:18:37] <Hummin> 2. that I'm actually creating a OpenVG-like api based on opengl for triangulating polygons that is bezier based and whatnot[15:18:51] <Hummin> I'm using it to create a 2d game engine for iphone/psp[15:18:56] <Hummin> but then I started thinking[15:19:19] <Hummin> eventually haiku's gonna wan't a hardware accelleratodet vector-graphics-rendering-subsystem, right?[15:19:39] <Hummin> agg is all fine and dandy, but still[15:19:52] <Hummin> it's all software[15:20:45] *** WindowsUninstall has joined #haiku[15:20:48] <Hummin> am I talking to myself ?[15:20:58] <DaaT> no, we're reading[15:20:59] <DaaT> :)[15:21:18] <Hummin> anyways.. then I saw the GoC position to create sub-pixel rendering and such[15:21:25] <Hummin> and I just felt like that's the wrong direction to go[15:21:56] <Hummin> don't you/we want the graphics rendering to be done by hardware?[15:22:05] <Hummin> doesn't haiku have a mature mesa port?[15:22:16] <Hummin> won't it eventually get hardware drivers?[15:22:17] <DaaT> but for R1, it's the only option[15:22:21] *** stargate1 is now known as stargater[15:22:25] <DaaT> dunno how mature it is/is not[15:22:53] <Hummin> well.. implementing a new api and then trying to get it hw accellerated[15:23:04] *** _Lucretia_ has quit IRC[15:23:07] <Hummin> yeah.. R1 will prolly do without this[15:23:34] *** rcjsuen has quit IRC[15:23:35] <DaaT> getting hw accelerated will take a looong time[15:24:04] *** nibble is now known as nibble\work[15:24:12] <stargater> hi DaaT[15:24:29] <DaaT> hey stargater :)[15:25:01] <stargater> DaaT: have you haiku installet ore emulatet?[15:26:01] <Hummin> daat: well, getting a opengl-based renderer isn't AS big of a task[15:26:15] <DaaT> stargater, not here at home, only at work[15:26:17] *** _Megaf has quit IRC[15:26:26] <Hummin> and opengl already has hw support..[15:26:27] <DaaT> Hummin, that I don't know. Not a coder :)[15:26:38] <Hummin> maybe I should talk to robert (skyos)[15:27:24] <Hummin> DaaT: well, I got polygon-triangulation and beziers with simple shaders and whatnot setup in a week[15:27:40] <DaaT> nice[15:27:41] *** cherrypie has quit IRC[15:27:43] <Hummin> but there's plenty more to it[15:27:49] <DaaT> *nod*[15:28:14] <Hummin> but it could be a way for me to contribute and work on my private projects at the same time[15:28:21] <stargater> DaaT: ok[15:28:36] <DaaT> true. Why don't you e-mail the ml about it?[15:28:49] <stargater> DaaT: notif you this = http://cia.vc/stats/project/OpenBeOS/.message/7c5d3d[15:29:03] <Hummin> yeah.. maybe i should mail the glass elevator list[15:29:34] *** hbhth has joined #haiku[15:29:36] <DaaT> stargater: ahhhhhhhhhhhh!! I saw the commit on my rss feed, but the text wasn't long enough to say the name of the coder. Congrats :)[15:29:51] <DaaT> Hummin, or that, yes[15:29:57] <stargater> :-)[15:30:16] <Hummin> anyways.. the rendering/agg backend.. anyone know who's done that part of the code?[15:30:25] <Hummin> I'll check the web-page[15:31:04] *** SiCuTDeUx has joined #haiku[15:33:04] *** SiCuTDeUx has quit IRC[15:33:15] <DeadYak> Hummin: stippi[15:33:33] <DeadYak> Hummin: as for subpixel, it's not so much a matter of writing it as it is enabling it in the backend and making adjustments related to that[15:33:40] <DeadYak> AGG can already do it, it's just not currently used in the rendering path[15:33:49] <DeadYak> and with or without hw accel, the subpixel's still needed for things like fonts.[15:34:00] <DeadYak> which was the main idea behind enabling it in the first place[15:34:16] *** _Megaf has joined #Haiku[15:34:45] <DeadYak> currently it's not really feasible to be reliant on hardware accel anyhow, seeing as it's quite difficult to get fully accelerated drivers for all chipsets atm[15:40:01] *** _Megaf has quit IRC[15:48:28] <stargater> cu later[15:48:35] *** stargater has quit IRC[15:49:59] *** slaad has quit IRC[15:50:51] <Hummin> hi DeadYak![15:50:55] <Hummin> yeahI know agg can[15:50:58] <Hummin> I've used agg[15:51:14] <Hummin> if ever you see any dvdXrpess dvd-vending machines around[15:51:24] <Hummin> chanses are that the UI is rendered with AGG[15:51:37] <Hummin> although the newer versions replaced the code with .net code[15:51:42] <Hummin> and changed the ui[15:52:22] <Hummin> DeadYak: yeah.. subpixels are required[15:52:28] <Hummin> I agree on that[15:52:34] <Hummin> but extending the use of AGG[15:52:57] <Hummin> when a hardware accellerated (or future hw acc) api should be used[15:53:19] <Hummin> that's why I thought the sub-pixel effort would be wrong[15:54:33] <Hummin> I need to look into font-rendering further.. maybe have a look at agg:s freetype 2 implementation[15:55:02] <Hummin> but still.. a opengl-based rendering subsystem feels like the way to go[15:55:05] <Hummin> (ask apple?)[15:56:25] <DeadYak> except we have no way of getting 3d drivers for nvidia chipsets[15:56:31] <DeadYak> or older radeon chipsets[15:56:43] <DeadYak> that's definitely r2 material there.[15:58:04] <HeTo> older radeon chipsets? those at least have a working open-source 3D accelerated X driver[15:58:48] <HeTo> although I've no idea how well or clearly that has been written[15:59:20] <Hummin> DeadYak: well, the code will be the same, hardware or not[15:59:23] *** pmr_ has joined #haiku[15:59:24] *** pmr_ is now known as pmr[15:59:33] <Hummin> DeadYak: it'll use software until there's hw support[15:59:37] <DeadYak> Hummin: but it's pointless if less than half your userbase can use it[15:59:44] <DeadYak> and that would be slow as all hell[15:59:48] <Hummin> DeadYak: what are you talking of ?[15:59:52] <Hummin> anyone get's software gl ?[15:59:59] <DeadYak> software GL is slow[16:00:06] <Hummin> well.. mesa is SLOW[16:00:10] <DeadYak> ever tried OSX on hardware that can't hardware accelerate it?[16:00:14] <Hummin> I mean VESA[16:00:20] <Hummin> but it works[16:00:58] <Hummin> well. ever tried a media-centric os:s that don't aim for hardware accelleration?[16:00:58] <DeadYak> I don't think moving the entire display renderer to OGL unless you can guarantee acceleration for the majority of chipsets out there is a good idea.[16:01:12] <Hummin> ok.. how about multiple subsystems?[16:01:32] <Hummin> got hw opengl.. k.. use opengl subystem[16:01:37] <DeadYak> maybe down the road, at the moment it's imo wasted effort[16:01:41] <DeadYak> it's not like we're swimming in devs[16:01:42] *** helf has joined #haiku[16:01:49] <Hummin> if not.. k.. use template-fettish-agg subsystem[16:02:11] <helf> hi[16:02:14] <Hummin> DeadYak: I'm saying that I would do it[16:02:20] <helf> hk[16:02:24] <helf> *hm[16:02:25] <helf> crap. brb[16:02:28] *** helf has left #haiku[16:02:52] <DeadYak> well, talk to stippi then I guess,[16:03:11] <Hummin> yeah.. I will[16:04:01] *** _Lucretia__ has quit IRC[16:04:10] <stpere> hi![16:04:23] <Hummin> the thing is.. I'm already doing alot of opengl based rendering.. I though it would be interresting to atleast compare results from a AGG/OpenGL based subsystem[16:04:45] <Hummin> with ogl based having the benefit of future hardware support where I'm pretty sure agg won't[16:05:07] *** SiCuTDeUx has joined #haiku[16:05:15] <Hummin> anyways.. I'm thinking further down the road[16:06:03] <Hummin> getting hw 3d is a must-have if I'm ever to switch os[16:06:36] <Hummin> althought rendering subsystem in ogl isnt'a must-have[16:09:58] *** tombhadZ has quit IRC[16:10:07] *** procton has quit IRC[16:10:12] *** procton has joined #haiku[16:10:25] *** tombhadAC has joined #haiku[16:10:31] * DeadYak steals procton's coffee[16:11:39] <stpere> pfff[16:11:44] <stpere> that's a capital crime here[16:11:46] <stpere> :)[16:11:55] <DeadYak> stpere: it's an old tradition between me and him :P[16:12:02] <stpere> haha ok[16:12:47] <stpere> I'm a bit ashamed about my behaviour of the other day with BenoitRen :-\[16:13:04] <Advant> is there haiku image packed with gcc and sdk yet?[16:13:51] <DeadYak> Advant: only if you build it yourself[16:14:17] <Advant> Why don't they release that? So no need to cross compile building apps?[16:14:22] *** _Lucretia_ has joined #haiku[16:14:36] <DeadYak> Advant: because the assumption is that if you're a dev, you onow enough to do that[16:14:45] <DeadYak> no need to balloon the download with something most people won't use[16:14:47] <DeadYak> know*[16:16:46] <Hummin> deadyak: just wanted to add on the opengl subystem-discussion that the whole thing came up when talking some people about a an apple-ish approach to building a custom-computer with *sortof* a custom os[16:17:14] <Hummin> with focus on one subset of hardware[16:17:38] <Hummin> like bebox 2010-ish[16:18:10] <Hummin> although with more branding/consistent design[16:19:57] *** johannes_ has quit IRC[16:22:39] <Advant> DeadYak: i suppose, just never felt like downloading gcc and compiling ;)[16:29:10] *** fed1 has joined #haiku[16:29:39] *** pfoetchen has joined #haiku[16:35:14] *** Barrett666 has joined #haiku[16:35:41] <fed1> good evening, may i ask sum help with beos max v4b1? i'm trying to burn it from linux with the command "cdrecord dev=1,0,0 speed=4 -eject -v -data intel_r5.0.3_boot_cd.img BeOS5PEMaxEditionV4b1.iso" or similar, but when rebooting it always gives me kernel panic or simply restarts. What should I do? burn just the iso image or try burning it from senryu on vmware?[16:36:22] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC[16:36:32] <stpere> hi fed1[16:36:47] <stpere> can you verify the md5 sum of your image?[16:37:14] <stpere> I've been burned quite a few times with a corrupted image :)[16:37:25] *** absabs has joined #haiku[16:38:01] <HeTo> fed1: Do you have an Intel processor (and not AMD)?[16:38:09] *** hbhth has quit IRC[16:38:13] <stpere> oh[16:38:26] <HeTo> also if you have more RAM than 512MB, I'm not sure if Max has a RAM limiter patch for that[16:38:32] <fed1> lol just a sec stpere[16:39:24] <HeTo> and thirdly, does cdrecord fixate the disc with that command?[16:40:43] *** Barrett666 has joined #haiku[16:40:45] <fed1> just tried to look at the checksum with k3b, but ti doesnt read it :(.. no, the pc has just 512[16:41:09] <fed1> what do you mean for fixating? i'm kinda n00b u see![16:41:57] <HeTo> write a TOC on the cd[16:42:15] <stpere> fed1: usually, you would find the checksum on the website.. but I don't see it :([16:42:31] <stpere> so, my idea is void :)[16:43:03] <HeTo> I'm not sure if BeOS requires that, though, but I'd make sure you have multisession setting set as no multisession and that any fixate checkbox is on, if you're using a GUI[16:43:43] <fed1> no HeTo, i'm just using the textline one ;S[16:43:53] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[16:43:53] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[16:44:11] <HeTo> as for cdrecord command line, I think the command to fixate the disc is fix or -fix or -fixate or something like that, and you put that after the iso file name on the command line[16:44:36] <mmu_man> it should fix CDs by default if you use -dao[16:46:19] <fed1> so i should use cdrecord, floppy image name, cd image name, and -dao right?[16:48:04] *** pfoetchen has quit IRC[16:48:53] <mmu_man> cdrecord dev=/dev/... -dao -data generated/haiku-boot-floppy.image generated/haiku.image[16:48:56] <mmu_man> soething like that[16:49:06] <mmu_man> usually works for me[16:49:26] *** _Megaf has joined #Haiku[16:50:12] <absabs> does haiku can use serial com as a terminal like *nix does[16:50:40] <absabs> I have only LCD now?[16:50:46] *** _Megaf is now known as Megaf_[16:50:59] <absabs> and two pc[16:51:02] <DeadYak> I don't remember if you can use the kernel debugger across serial or not[16:52:38] <absabs> I mean I want to use some cli command[16:52:46] <absabs> If I have two monitor, that's ok[16:52:56] <absabs> but Now I have only 1 monitor[16:53:22] <absabs> one pc and one monitor for development[16:53:31] *** pfoetchen has joined #haiku[16:53:40] <absabs> and another pc for test haiku[16:53:45] *** Hummin has quit IRC[16:53:52] <absabs> without a monitor[16:54:23] <absabs> so can I log in haiku through serial com1?[16:55:36] <absabs> does your guies all using two monitor for development?[16:55:52] <Advant> ?[16:56:06] <Advant> you talking about logging debugging through serial?[16:56:22] <absabs> yep[16:56:26] <DeadYak> absabs: I don't generally do any kern-level development so I don't usually need two PCs :)[16:56:41] <Advant> absabs: you can use VMware to do it[16:56:49] <Advant> you can set serial to point to a file[16:57:00] <absabs> I want to use the serial as terminal as linux does[16:57:02] *** fed1 has quit IRC[16:57:09] <absabs> not for debuging infomation[16:57:18] <stpere> Advant: I think vmware thing is readonly[16:57:19] <Advant> for what pipurpose then?[16:57:34] <stpere> absabs: you mean, like you log in a cisco router?[16:57:41] <stpere> kindof?[16:57:42] <absabs> yes[16:58:00] <absabs> I mean I have two pc[16:58:01] <stpere> I don't know.. but I know what you mean :)[16:58:04] <Advant> why do you want to do that in haiku though?[16:58:10] <absabs> but only one has a monitor[16:58:21] <DeadYak> absabs: Ingo should have sshd done soon[16:58:27] <absabs> aha[16:58:30] <absabs> cool[16:58:35] <DeadYak> absabs: no need for serial then[16:58:42] <DeadYak> absabs: though afaik Haiku does currently have a telnetd[17:00:01] <absabs> telnetd will give me a bash shell?[17:00:25] <absabs> Last year I have two monitor, so there is no problem[17:04:58] *** cherrypie has joined #haiku[17:05:01] <mmu_man> and likely won't ever[17:05:14] <mmu_man> er, it shouldn't anymore when sshd works[17:05:17] <mmu_man> telnet is insecure[17:05:58] <stpere> hmm[17:06:00] <absabs> mmu_man, does haiku's sshd can give me a bash shell like linux does?[17:06:11] <stpere> haiku takes forever to boot in vmware :([17:06:22] <mmu_man> there is no sshd installed yet though[17:06:29] <mmu_man> but either will give you bash yes[17:06:40] <absabs> that's ok[17:07:06] <absabs> If serial can be used as a terminal[17:07:23] <absabs> it will be cool[17:08:20] <stpere> oh sorry, it's my firefox that went rogue on my host :D[17:08:36] <Advant> :)[17:10:35] *** thorn has quit IRC[17:10:44] *** thorn has joined #haiku[17:19:48] *** tqh has joined #haiku[17:25:22] <stpere> I wonder how can the be_roster know my apps signature before I launch it at least once :)[17:25:33] <stpere> magic :)[17:26:22] <Advant> maybe index's all executables in background[17:27:24] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[17:27:38] *** HohenheimElric has quit IRC[17:28:06] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[17:28:06] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[17:28:55] <HeTo> I just wonder why anyone would like to use Haiku only through CLI[17:29:35] <HeTo> I mean, if it's only CLI you want, Linux or some of the BSDs is a lot better option than Haiku, which is a graphical desktop OS[17:30:14] <tqh> c64 is also a good choice :P[17:30:41] <absabs> HeTo, if I need to do kernel or driver development[17:30:50] <absabs> cli will be better[17:31:03] <Advant> eh[17:31:08] <absabs> otherwise I need two monitors[17:31:33] <absabs> If I can login into haiku through a terminal get a bash[17:31:43] <absabs> I need only one monitor[17:32:24] <mmu_man> yeah C64... Lunix NG \o/[17:32:40] <absabs> then use minicom or ssh to test a simple cli exe which using the developing driver[17:33:07] *** pfoetchen has quit IRC[17:34:29] <absabs> so it's just for part of haiku's development[17:35:50] <DeadYak> absabs: you might be able to use minicom for the kernel debugger, but not for a regular bash term for sure[17:36:03] <absabs> not only kernel but some application server or app add-ons such as media kit will benifit[17:36:14] <absabs> DeadYak, yep[17:36:49] <absabs> I have been using it[17:37:07] <absabs> but I want to run some cli test app[17:37:17] <absabs> to test the driver[17:37:25] <absabs> so a shell is needed[17:37:58] <absabs> if I have only one monitor, ssh or serial terminal is a better choice[17:39:16] <DeadYak> well, like I said, Ingo should hopefully be done with sshd soon :)[17:39:40] <absabs> I'm looking forward to it[17:39:44] <absabs> :)[17:42:09] <HeTo> and for now, there seems to be at least telnetd in beos/bin of my Haiku partition[17:43:41] <HeTo> BTW, I think Haiku needs a text editor that works in safe mode[17:44:23] *** Yaroze has quit IRC[17:44:40] <HeTo> vim doesn't work since it complains that it couldn't initialize global fonts even if called as vi without a -g option[17:44:41] <absabs> vim?[17:44:58] <absabs> :)[17:45:59] <HeTo> so you need to either make it initialize its graphical subsystem only if you call it so that the GUI is used, or make two binaries of vim, one of which is built completely without GUI support[17:49:35] <DeadYak> I don't think it's gui support, it probably has to do with Terminal and the fake_app_server[17:49:40] <DeadYak> not sure though[17:51:06] <HeTo> but since ls et al. work, I suppose that all purely command-line programs work in safe mode[17:52:13] <HeTo> but when vim is built with BeOS GUI support, I suppose it tries to init global fonts and do other GUI init stuff that might fail, before it gets to checking command line arguments to decide whether it should start in GUI or terminal mode[17:53:26] *** SprMa has joined #haiku[17:53:27] <DeadYak> that's probably because it links to libbe[17:53:32] <DeadYak> which then tries to init the fonts on load[17:53:47] <HeTo> of course, I suppose you could also fix the problem by making fake_app_server return B_OK from init_global_fonts() or whatever the function is called always, even if fake_app_server has no font support[17:54:31] <HeTo> I don't know too much about Haiku internals, though, but I suppose that's what's going on there[17:54:45] <DeadYak> you you might want to file a bug on that though[17:54:49] <DeadYak> assuming there isn't one already :)[18:01:52] *** MauriceK has joined #haiku[18:02:06] *** MauriceK has left #haiku[18:02:11] *** MauriceK has joined #haiku[18:02:14] <DeadYak> wb[18:02:25] <stpere> anyone noticed how resizing the terminal window when vim is open doesn't resize vim?[18:02:38] <MauriceK> sounds like Windows :P[18:09:41] *** tombhadAC has quit IRC[18:09:57] *** rdmr has joined #haiku[18:14:05] *** jiuda_D`arkness has joined #haiku[18:16:01] *** jiuda_D`arkness has quit IRC[18:16:59] *** daste has joined #haiku[18:19:09] *** jiuda_D`arkness has joined #haiku[18:21:46] *** katisu has joined #haiku[18:22:27] *** [Katisu] has quit IRC[18:22:27] *** Kernel86_ has joined #Haiku[18:22:28] *** Kernel86 has quit IRC[18:22:29] *** katisu is now known as [Katisu][18:25:15] *** rdmr has quit IRC[18:28:03] *** luroh has joined #haiku[18:28:24] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC[18:31:08] *** Teknomancer has joined #haiku[18:31:31] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[18:32:47] *** zlominus has quit IRC[18:35:06] *** dr_Evil has joined #haiku[18:35:19] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o dr_Evil[18:36:11] *** jiuda_D`arkness is now known as Barrett666[18:39:03] *** Teknomancer has left #haiku[18:41:42] <{V}zzz> [16:58] <DeadYak> absabs: Ingo should have sshd done soon[18:41:42] <{V}zzz> COOL![18:41:47] *** {V}zzz is now known as {V}[18:42:14] <Monni> weird time to wake up ;)[18:43:20] <{V}> yeah :)[18:43:20] <{V}> Good thing I just forgot to change my nick when I woke up this morning :)[18:44:42] <Monni> that's why I don't append my status in my nickname ;)[18:45:14] *** ibanez has joined #haiku[18:46:33] *** ibanez has quit IRC[18:47:55] <{V}> I always wondered why you didn't do that :p Aren't you a smart cat.[18:48:49] <Monni> it's redundant ;)[18:49:46] <{V}> :)[18:51:08] *** urnenfeld has joined #haiku[18:53:00] *** tqh has quit IRC[18:53:01] *** pyCube has joined #haiku[18:53:39] <cps1966> Monni: redundant[18:57:40] <Monni> eh...[18:57:48] *** bogomipz has joined #haiku[18:59:24] *** tqh has joined #haiku[19:03:01] * HeTo made a bug report of vim not working in safe mode, then: http://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/2146[19:03:13] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[19:07:32] *** ddew|bofh has joined #haiku[19:07:39] <ddew|bofh> g'day[19:08:49] <Monni> *burp*[19:09:01] <dr_Evil> behave[19:09:39] <Monni> lol[19:10:33] <CIA-52> bonefish * r25117 /haiku/trunk/src/add-ons/kernel/network/protocols/unix/ (UnixFifo.cpp UnixFifo.h):[19:10:33] <CIA-52> Replaced the reader/writer blocking semaphores by condition variables.[19:10:33] <CIA-52> This fixes race conditions. The OpenSSH tests don't hang anymore --[19:10:33] <CIA-52> instead they run the system out of memory, apparently due to a net[19:10:33] <CIA-52> buffer/data node leak.[19:11:09] <urnenfeld> network/protocols/unix/..... mmu_man is that what i think it is ?[19:11:42] <mmu_man> yes, Ingo wrote that[19:12:37] *** jiuda_D`arkness has joined #haiku[19:12:40] <urnenfeld> good.. something i can count on[19:13:54] *** helf has joined #haiku[19:13:58] <helf> omg[19:14:03] * helf clutches chest[19:14:14] <helf> i was in the mibbit default channel by accident[19:14:21] <helf> i wondered why the darn IQ levle had dropped so much[19:15:42] <DeadYak> the difference in users in the channel wasn't your first hint? :P[19:16:00] <helf> i didn't pay any attention to the user list. heh[19:16:08] <helf> wow, ive sat in there for like 2 hours[19:16:23] <pyCube> whats mibbit?[19:16:32] <helf> mibbit.com[19:16:36] <helf> online irc client[19:16:38] <helf> works pretty well[19:16:41] <pyCube> ah[19:16:44] <helf> er[19:16:45] <helf> web based[19:18:46] <stpere> should the time setting preflet ask you to apply changes rather than applying it automatically at window closure?[19:18:53] <stpere> not using a popup mind you[19:19:20] <stpere> but requiring you to press apply before closing the window[19:19:44] <stpere> what do you'all think?[19:19:49] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC[19:20:06] <tqh> shouldn't it be set instantly?[19:20:08] <cps1966> press apply[19:20:24] <helf> bbl[19:20:29] *** helf is now known as helf|away[19:20:37] <stpere> tqh: oh you're right[19:20:40] <stpere> it's set instantly[19:20:41] *** Zaranthos_1 has quit IRC[19:20:46] *** Zaranthos has quit IRC[19:21:12] <stpere> I ask because it's quite possible it's the intended way for haiku to do it[19:21:31] <stpere> but I find it a bit tricky[19:22:11] <stpere> let say you want to change from may to july, you will change the system date twice[19:22:18] <stpere> one for june in between[19:22:26] <stpere> that's seems unnecessary[19:22:39] <stpere> and counter intuitive :) (at least to me)[19:22:52] <stpere> but it's also logicial in some way[19:23:07] <stpere> logical*[19:23:07] <tqh> I don't think you need to optimize for that :) Although keeping the settings from launch to be able to revert is nice.[19:23:25] *** nibble has joined #haiku[19:23:28] <stpere> yes, that's one thing[19:23:48] <dr_Evil> the only panel that should need an apply is the screen preferences (because constant changing will black the monitor), all others should have a revert button[19:23:51] <stpere> at least for date, not sure I would want to revert time :)[19:24:05] * ddew|bofh hates block_writer[19:24:09] *** hUMUNGUz has quit IRC[19:24:18] <stpere> ok, I will add the revert button in that preflet![19:24:20] <tqh> you could keep a delta change of time though.[19:24:26] <ddew|bofh> i'm sure he's convinced that his sole purpose of existence is to piss me off[19:24:44] <stpere> tqh: ah yes, good suggestion[19:27:17] *** dan_ has quit IRC[19:28:48] *** absabs has quit IRC[19:29:02] *** korli has joined #haiku[19:29:02] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o korli[19:32:01] <korli> evening[19:32:56] <DaaT> hi[19:39:52] *** nibble\work has quit IRC[19:42:09] *** oco has joined #haiku[19:42:20] * DaaT pokes cherrypie[19:46:08] <luroh> hmm[19:46:15] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[19:46:19] <luroh> anyone else noticed that vmware image boot time has increased the last couple of days?[19:46:20] <helf|away> listen.grooveshark.com[19:46:29] <pyCube> no[19:46:33] <luroh> maybe 20-30% or so[19:48:13] <luroh> guess i should try to svn revert to find the regression[19:49:04] *** Wiss has joined #haiku[19:49:55] *** AlexForster has joined #haiku[19:54:35] *** rdmr has joined #haiku[19:55:00] <{V}> I thought someone had mentioned the vmware boot time had _decreased_[19:56:45] *** kr1stof has joined #haiku[19:57:26] *** stargater has joined #haiku[19:57:30] <stargater> re[19:59:55] <{V}> wb stargater[20:01:03] *** DHowett has joined #haiku[20:02:06] <DHowett> That was bizarre. I was just having a dream about Haiku.. well, more of a nightmare. It came with a wizard on first boot and a HORRID set of default prefs.. Like, to the point where it wasn';t even very Be ish anymore. But the upside was that it actually worked on my computer. :P[20:02:18] <DeadYak> .....[20:02:22] <DeadYak> I'm scared[20:02:49] <DHowett> Probably for the best[20:04:55] *** korli has quit IRC[20:11:48] *** SprMa has quit IRC[20:15:00] <Thom_Holwerda> right-o[20:15:09] <Thom_Holwerda> so im not earning a dime more than 12 months ago, right[20:15:10] <Thom_Holwerda> but yet[20:15:25] <Thom_Holwerda> while last year i did not have to pay a certain tax due to being, well, too poor[20:15:27] <Thom_Holwerda> this year[20:15:30] <Thom_Holwerda> with the exact same income[20:15:35] <Thom_Holwerda> i have to pay[20:15:42] <Thom_Holwerda> and the rules didnt change.[20:16:14] <Thom_Holwerda> they dont even TRY to get me to like them.[20:16:19] <Thom_Holwerda> (government people)[20:17:27] *** siarzhuk has joined #haiku[20:21:36] *** nibble has quit IRC[20:22:09] <HeTo> rant channel continues: OS2008 battery life on N800 sucks[20:22:57] <HeTo> I took my N800 off the charger yesterday evening, browsed for probably less than an hour[20:23:06] *** mindchld2 has joined #haiku[20:23:09] <HeTo> and now it says it's going to run out of battery soon[20:23:18] *** mindchld2 has quit IRC[20:23:36] *** dr_Evil has quit IRC[20:23:40] *** dr_Evil has joined #haiku[20:23:46] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o dr_Evil[20:24:39] <HeTo> although I admit I've mistakenly let it run out of battery a couple of times because the battery life is poorer in OS2008 than it was in OS2007[20:31:52] <DaaT> Thom_Holwerda, bummer[20:31:53] <DaaT> that sucks[20:33:26] *** AndrevS has joined #haiku[20:34:34] *** petterhj has joined #haiku[20:37:23][20:37:44] *** nibble has joined #haiku[20:38:20] *** MichaelHenry has quit IRC[20:40:11] *** Yaroze has joined #haiku[20:41:51] <CIA-52> bonefish * r25118 /haiku/trunk/src/add-ons/kernel/network/stack/net_buffer.cpp:[20:41:51] <CIA-52> * When appending/prepending data to a buffer we kept the initial[20:41:51] <CIA-52> reference to a newly created header. It would thus not be deleted when[20:41:51] <CIA-52> the new node (which also has a reference) was removed again.[20:41:51] <CIA-52> * Added debugger command "net_buffer_stats" which prints the allocation[20:41:52] <CIA-52> counts of net buffers and data headers.[20:43:19] <Advant> looks like leack is plugged[20:43:28] <DeadYak> one of them anyways[20:43:38] *** dr_Evil has quit IRC[20:44:53] *** dr_Evil has joined #haiku[20:55:38] *** EuanK has joined #haiku[20:57:39] *** tqh has quit IRC[21:01:35] *** TheNerd has joined #haiku[21:01:47] <pyCube> hehe.. boy, i sure do love shell arguments..[21:03:08] <DaaT> are they being loud and bothering you[21:03:11] <DaaT> ?[21:03:12] <Technix> That's not a command! Yes it is![21:03:12] <DaaT> :P[21:03:25] <Technix> gmta daat[21:04:01] * Technix slaps DaaT around a little[21:04:11] <DaaT> :)[21:04:19] <Technix> ah, old times... good stuff[21:04:29] <Technix> *smack* .. you like that, you lil bitch... :P[21:04:31] <stargater> Technix: i think haikunews need a news design[21:05:07] <stargater> and a animal, DaaT have sheep[21:08:08] <Technix> a new design, overall?[21:09:19] *** tarandus has joined #haiku[21:11:19] <stargater> yes[21:12:49] *** tqh has joined #haiku[21:14:41] *** dan_ has joined #haiku[21:15:10] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[21:15:15] *** Barrett is now known as Barrett666[21:20:22] * JonathanThompson notes any system configuration/build setup that can't be done by a literate monkey is a complete failure[21:21:09] *** jiuda_D`arkness has quit IRC[21:21:09] *** Barrett666 is now known as jiuda_D`arkness[21:22:34] *** tqh has quit IRC[21:27:34] *** _Lucretia_ has quit IRC[21:28:31] *** _Lucretia_ has joined #haiku[21:35:18] <Technix> stargater: if you have any suggestions, I'm all ear[21:35:20] <Technix> ears[21:35:36] *** DHowett has left #haiku[21:35:44] *** tarma has joined #haiku[21:36:48] <Technix> Back when it was beosjournal.org, that site did change a number of times, from basic grey/yellow, to green, to a blue scheme, and then blue/grey, and then when we jumped to HaikuNews.org I came up with the scheme you see now, although the design itself has changed a little over time[21:36:49] <stargater> thats simpel = haikunews = haiku style (colors and icons) , drupal cms, a nice logo "Haikunews" etc..[21:37:01] <Technix> ah.. see, I abhor Drupal. :P[21:37:10] <Technix> and, it doesn't do what I want to do, either[21:37:31] * JonathanThompson rips out all the tassles from Technix[21:37:40] <stargater> :-)[21:38:09] <Technix> Define "Haiku Style" though, this seems an interesting comment. I'm keen to know what you mean[21:38:14] <stargater> beosjournal.org grey and logo whas nice[21:38:25] <stargater> :-)[21:38:33] <Technix> It was a bit "cutting edge" at the time, yes[21:38:52] *** dr_Evil has quit IRC[21:38:57] * JonathanThompson is scarred for life because of Technix ;)[21:39:00] *** dr_Evil has joined #haiku[21:39:07] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o dr_Evil[21:39:17] <stargater> Technix: but i think , a cooperation to haikuware whas better[21:39:41] <Technix> I am entirely open to cooperating with any site[21:39:56] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[21:39:57] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[21:40:08] * JonathanThompson hooks Technix up with an extreme body mod site where he'll now fit right in[21:40:13] <Technix> SWEET[21:40:26] <Technix> make sure is uses Drupal so the experience can be painful at least[21:40:31] <Technix> s/is/it[21:40:39] <stargater> i mean you and karl make one site and osdrawer too[21:40:51] <Technix> stargater: ah, no no... That will never happen.[21:40:54] <Technix> period. :)[21:41:21] <stargater> :-) do you not like teamwork?[21:41:35] <Technix> I do.[21:41:59] <Technix> but I have several years left for HaikuNews to do. Why would I split my focus on more sites?[21:43:34] *** MrSunshine has joined #haiku[21:44:34] <ddew|bofh> any thoughts on original content as opposed to news aggregation?[21:45:06] <Technix> I was thinking of putting a wiki on the site, calling it Haikupedia[21:45:12] <JonathanThompson> Are you asking merely for thoughts, or actual original content? :D[21:45:25] <stargater> not split, focu of one site[21:45:34] <ddew|bofh> i liked the interview with Roman, more stuff like that would be cool[21:46:02] <Technix> ddew|bofh: absolutely. We have more interviews coming (2 within the next week in fact)[21:46:10] <ddew|bofh> nice :)[21:46:22] <stargater> Technix: ore, close haiku news, and bring pdf magazine out[21:46:33] <ddew|bofh> brainpickage ftw[21:46:34] <Technix> I'm also thinkining of starting a new editorial campaign[21:46:55] * JonathanThompson wonders where MYOB is hiding these days[21:47:04] *** duaneb has joined #haiku[21:47:05] <Technix> stargate : no, that will never happen like that. If anything, we'd simply incorporate a PDF magazine as part of the site[21:47:12] <Technix> he's busy working[21:47:17] <Technix> I just talked with him recently[21:47:24] <JonathanThompson> I think if Technix did that, stargater, nothing good would come of it.[21:47:25] <Technix> he's not ready yet to come back to Haiku[21:47:39] <ddew|bofh> moving to a pdf format would be a step back as far as i'm concerned :)[21:48:02] <Technix> indeed. But offering PDF format for selected articles, and offering a PDF consolidate time view, would be not hard to do[21:48:15] <ddew|bofh> like a weekly thing perhaps?[21:48:22] <Technix> I actualy have some PDF backend work done already from years ago[21:48:30] <Technix> its just a matter of tying it together in to a magazine format[21:48:35] <ddew|bofh> another thing i'd like to see would be commenting enabled for the stories[21:48:37] <Technix> yeah, a weekly roundup[21:48:43] <Technix> Haiku News Roundup[21:48:48] <JonathanThompson> That used to exist (IIRC).[21:48:58] <Technix> ddew|bofh: you can see that here: http://haikunews.org/c[21:49:03] <Technix> that's our beta test page[21:49:04] <stargater> Technix: you can c++ ?[21:49:10] <Technix> stargater: yes[21:49:20] <JonathanThompson> Any good at it?[21:49:26] <Technix> I'm ok[21:49:27] * JonathanThompson asks the more important question[21:49:33] <ddew|bofh> Technix: looks good :)[21:49:46] <stargater> then fergot writing new, then coding for haiku :-)[21:50:04] <Technix> stargater: I contribute in my own way(s)[21:50:11] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[21:50:28] <JonathanThompson> After all, there was a woman that was interviewed where I'm working for a position in the team, and she didn't appear to even know about the usage of regular expressions when asked a question that'd be a natural for it.[21:50:50] <Technix> sad[21:51:04] *** TheNerd_ has joined #haiku[21:51:09] <Technix> see, there are different roles in any community[21:51:24] <JonathanThompson> I guess she knew C++, but when asked "How would you go through 50 thousand static webpages and replace all phone numbers with just one?" she didn't even mention it.[21:51:31] <Technix> I have chosen to fill a news role, a sort of eye on the community, for the community[21:51:32] <ddew|bofh> there's a huge difference between knowing something and knowing it well. i know c++ but there's no way in hell i'd be able to do heavy lifting work on haiku[21:51:43] <Technix> ddew|bofh: agreed[21:52:03] <Technix> stargater: Besides the fact that I'm pretty good at it, I LOVE it.[21:52:04] <JonathanThompson> Well, in this woman's case, she didn't even know of what was out there, which is a bad thing when you consider it's one of the common things that's been around for decades now.[21:52:05] *** TheNerd has quit IRC[21:52:26] <ddew|bofh> i prefer to say that i'm good at hacking together stuff :)[21:52:27] *** dr_Evil has quit IRC[21:52:29] *** dr_Evil has joined #haiku[21:52:36] <stargater> :-)[21:53:42] <stargater> Technix: ok, also make a new layout and new colors[21:53:53] <stargater> at first.[21:54:55] <Technix> What's wrong with the current layout and colors?[21:55:06] <stargater> its orange[21:55:41] <EuanK> and a forum I miss teh old beos communities[21:55:42] <Technix> Tell you what. After I finish up with user logins, prefs, and such, I'll start on theming[21:55:43] <stargater> and the font are small , and its look and feel bloatet[21:56:08] <Technix> Haiku News, bloated?[21:56:16] * Technix takes the crack pipe away from stargater[21:56:36] <ddew|bofh> i have to agree with him on the orange bit.[21:56:44] <ddew|bofh> it's a little loud[21:56:58] <Technix> I understand that. Hence color theming[21:57:01] <JonathanThompson> Just a LSB loud, ddew|bofh :D[21:57:03] <Technix> eventually.[21:57:08] <ddew|bofh> hehe[21:57:12] <JonathanThompson> Of course, that's Technix ;)[21:57:29] * JonathanThompson notes nobody has a plainer site than he does[21:57:39] *** m0ns00n has joined #haiku[21:57:43] <JonathanThompson> Mine could called downright stark :)[21:58:15] <stargater> thats look good and clear = http://www.haiku-os.org/[21:58:16] <duaneb> JonathanThompson, I do.[21:58:20] <duaneb> this is my webpage:[21:58:48] <duaneb> <html><head><title></title></head><body>bailey.d.r at gmail dot com</body></html>[21:58:49] * JonathanThompson awaits duaneb's webpage[21:58:57] <stargater> Technix: i dont like drugs[21:58:58] <JonathanThompson> That did NOT work as planned ;)[21:59:03] <duaneb> hehe[21:59:21] <duaneb> ah, I love today's xkcd[21:59:22] <stargater> duaneb: thats good , i like your site, its verry clear[21:59:30] * JonathanThompson suspects duaneb forgot a key when doing copy[21:59:40] * JonathanThompson detects stargater being sarcastic[22:00:01] <stargater> hehe[22:00:03] * JonathanThompson dials 1 million chevrons for stargater for his sarcasm[22:00:04] *** SiCuTDeUx has quit IRC[22:00:18] * JonathanThompson still awaits comparison with duaneb's webpage/site.[22:00:27] *** emitrax_ has joined #haiku[22:00:37] <stargater> hi emitrax_[22:00:50] <JonathanThompson> emitrax: that's all, nothing else![22:01:04] * JonathanThompson has too many junk bits of commercials stuck in his head wasting space[22:01:08] *** emitrax_ has quit IRC[22:01:17] <JonathanThompson> duaneb, what's your website URL ? :)[22:01:17] <duaneb> JonathanThompson, no, seriously, I already gave it to you[22:01:19] *** dr_Evil has quit IRC[22:01:28] <duaneb> JonathanThompson, atm, 127.0.0.1:8000[22:01:31] <JonathanThompson> That's not a website![22:01:33] <JonathanThompson> Oh....[22:01:40] * JonathanThompson shoots duaneb[22:01:48] * stargater wish a better terminal and vim with syntax hig.[22:01:54] <JonathanThompson> I'm glad I parsed that address before putting it in my browser ;)[22:02:05] *** aljen has joined #haiku[22:02:08] <aljen> hey =)[22:02:12] <stargater> hi aljen[22:02:25] <JonathanThompson> I can't look at your website if that's it, duaneb: that's a loopback address, and I don't have anything there atm :)[22:02:42] <duaneb> JonathanThompson, copy and paste :)[22:02:49] <HeTo> stargater: doesn't :sy enable work in Haiku's vim?[22:02:51] <JonathanThompson> Copy and paste what? :)[22:03:10] <JonathanThompson> I don't have a webserver or page available currently setup on my local machine :)[22:03:54] <stargater> HeTo: no vim make a error ( cant found /etc/vim/... )[22:04:26] <stargater> :syntax on[22:05:53] * stargater make KAKAU for all[22:05:54] <HeTo> stargater: at least that sounds like it could be fixed if you got the syntax files from a vim distribution package[22:06:45] <stargater> HeTo: i think it to , but the path is the same?[22:07:09] <stargater> adn vim in haiku is 6.3 , better is 7.1 without gui[22:07:52] <stargater> and haiku as supportet os on the vim page[22:08:01] <HeTo> stargater: I think /etc is a symlink to somewhere (/boot/beos/etc?) in Haiku[22:08:11] <HeTo> or you could change $VIMRUNTIME[22:08:18] <stargater> is the qnx, amiga, etc, no beos ore haiku[22:08:33] <HeTo> or instead of :sy enable, you could :source /path/to/syntax.vim[22:08:47] *** TheNerd_ has quit IRC[22:09:10] <stargater> HeTo: ah ok, but in time haiku vim cant do syntax out of the box[22:10:10] *** jiuda_D`arkness has quit IRC[22:11:13] <aljen> hey stargater :)[22:12:44] <stargater> :-)[22:13:24] *** Barrett666 has joined #haiku[22:15:39] <duaneb> the haiku vim is strange >.<[22:15:46] *** tqh has joined #haiku[22:15:57] <{V}> duaneb, you should run http://validator.w3.org/#validate_by_input over your website some time ;)[22:16:42] *** crash_ has joined #haiku[22:17:05] *** rdmr has quit IRC[22:17:39] <duaneb> damn doctype[22:17:57] <duaneb> it says '<html>'[22:18:33] <{V}> yes, but which dialect? :p[22:18:47] <HeTo> that's not doctype, that's just the main element of html[22:23:24] <ddew|bofh> heh, for some reason i've suddenly become interested in converting my porsche into an electric car[22:23:57] <ddew|bofh> if i'd lived in a house as opposed to an apartment i'd do it in a heartbeat[22:24:02] <stpere> ddew|bofh: that's a sin! :)[22:24:26] <ddew|bofh> i dunno, i kinda like the idea of getting twice the power for half the cost[22:24:31] <ddew|bofh> :)[22:24:41] <stpere> hehe, yes, sounds good[22:25:24] <ddew|bofh> well in reality it's cheaper but i'm factoring in the cost of batteries and maintenance as well[22:29:28] *** MichaelHenry has joined #haiku[22:30:13] *** tarandus has quit IRC[22:31:08] *** ozy` has quit IRC[22:34:24] *** Sememmon has joined #haiku[22:34:33] *** MichaelHenry has quit IRC[22:35:54] *** HeTo has quit IRC[22:40:10] *** Euver has joined #haiku[22:40:26] <CIA-52> stippi * r25119 /haiku/trunk/src/preferences/fonts/MainWindow.cpp:[22:40:26] <CIA-52> Applied patch by Philippe Saint-Pierre:[22:40:26] <CIA-52> * Add spacing around the tab view.[22:40:26] <CIA-52> Thanks, Philippe! BTW, the tab view will come in handy again, now with the[22:40:26] <CIA-52> additional options that sub-pixel rendering is going to offer... :-)[22:41:02] *** kr1stof has left #haiku[22:41:46] <luroh> looks like i wasn't just imagining things, r25098 boots in 13.0 seconds, r25099 boots in 23.3 seconds[22:42:17] <DeadYak> what change was 25099?[22:42:28] <luroh> a nasty looking one https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/haiku-commits/2008-April/013216.html[22:42:29] <stpere> luroh: yes, I think I've experience the same here[22:42:38] <luroh> threads, semaphores and stuff[22:42:49] <luroh> ah ok, thanks for confirming[22:43:28] <DeadYak> only on VMWare or on real hw also?[22:43:39] <luroh> only vmware[22:43:57] <stpere> yes, other report vast improvement on real hw I think[22:44:02] <stpere> others* reports*[22:44:16] <DeadYak> I was going to say on my a64 I'd noticed quite the opposite[22:44:32] <DeadYak> stpere: in all fairness though, what BGA was reporting was compile speed, not boot speed[22:44:37] <stpere> ah yes[22:44:45] <stpere> totally true :)[22:45:23] *** MichaelHenry has joined #haiku[22:45:40] <{V}> perhaps luroh should do some compile speed tests as well ;p[22:46:45] <{V}> (or whoever else noticed a rise in boot time)[22:47:47] <stpere> *cough*[22:48:13] <luroh> nah, had enough compiling for today, thanks ;)[22:49:11] <luroh> i do have a nice boot graph though[22:49:31] <luroh> now if only google docs would let me save it :>[22:50:36] *** m0ns00n has quit IRC[22:51:30] <stpere> luroh: maybe you can add to trac? what do others think?[22:51:34] <stpere> in a ticket[22:51:52] <stpere> so that maybe someone who have a clue why vmware reacts like that can do some tests[22:52:50] <luroh> right, i could do that[22:55:09] *** DeadYak has quit IRC[22:56:41] *** inseculous has joined #haiku[22:57:45] *** Euver has quit IRC[23:01:18] <stpere> oops, I did a n00b mistake in my last patch :) stippi got it right tho[23:01:42] *** bogomipz has quit IRC[23:01:43] <stpere> made my diff from the subdir rather the haiku parent dir[23:02:41] <Advant> ;)[23:04:38] *** siarzhuk has quit IRC[23:04:41] *** duaneb has quit IRC[23:05:37] *** duaneb has joined #haiku[23:05:44] *** SiCuTDeUx has joined #haiku[23:09:21] *** tqh has quit IRC[23:10:22] *** tradewind has quit IRC[23:18:29] *** MichaelHenry has quit IRC[23:20:40] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[23:20:40] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[23:21:02] *** tarma has quit IRC[23:26:29] *** daste has quit IRC[23:27:04] *** stippi has joined #haiku[23:27:04] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[23:27:51] *** emitrax has quit IRC[23:32:23] *** dan_ has quit IRC[23:32:43] *** stippi has quit IRC[23:35:06] *** Advant has quit IRC[23:37:24] *** EuanK has left #haiku[23:38:41] *** Odium has joined #haiku[23:40:49] *** BenoitRen has joined #haiku[23:41:27] <BenoitRen> I'm on Haiku right now. SoundBlaster 16 PCI not detected. Neither are my FAT32 volumes. :([23:41:37] *** MauriceK has quit IRC[23:41:47] <mmu_man> tried with opensound ?[23:41:53] <BenoitRen> I remember my SoundBlaster being detected on BeOS.[23:41:58] <BenoitRen> mmu_man: OpenSound?[23:42:18] <mmu_man> the VFS had a recent API change which broke other filesystems, so it might not be usable in your image[23:42:19] <MindChild> Is your machine detecting it? As in, are resources being set aside for it?[23:42:39] <MindChild> the Soundblaster that is[23:43:16] <BenoitRen> I looked at the Media panel. Is there somewhere else I should look?[23:43:40] <BenoitRen> mmu_man: Isn't OpenSound for UNIX/Linux?[23:44:41] <mmu_man> I made a port to BeOS usable from the Media Kit[23:44:50] <mmu_man> if you have optional packages it shoudl be installed[23:45:43] <BenoitRen> mmu_man: I have just the image.[23:46:08] <[Katisu]> mmu_man, did you ever look into changing the license?[23:46:18] <[Katisu]> http://www.opensound.com/press/2008/oss-bsd.txt[23:46:46] <{V}> wasn't FAT adapted to the new VFS already?[23:46:50] <ddew|bofh> to mit?[23:47:36] <mmu_man> [Katisu]I didn't update teh port yet[23:47:50] <mmu_man> {V} maybe after the version his image was built from[23:48:11] <BenoitRen> My image is from 18 April.[23:48:12] <mmu_man> and I'm not sure there is a partitionning addon that can show the volumes in Tracker yet anyway[23:48:27] <mmu_man> you can probably mount it from Terminal then[23:48:42] <{V}> BenoitRen, should be included then. FAT was updated in r24987 on april 16th[23:49:06] <BenoitRen> I use DiskSetup.[23:49:33] <BenoitRen> So, command line...[23:49:34] <Technix> Check the Devices pref panel, BenoitRen ?[23:49:39] <oco> isn't it a hard coded limitation of the type of partitions the tracker could mount under Haiku to avoid dammage foreign ones ?[23:50:01] <BenoitRen> Technix: Devices doesn't exist in Haiku. Seems to be a BeOS thing.[23:50:08] <Technix> ah.. shame. :([23:50:14] <Technix> didn't know it wasn't coded yet[23:50:47] <oco> i think this feature was removed to avoid mistakes in case of bugs[23:51:20] <Technix> ttyl all[23:51:27] <oco> in haiku's file system (file cache...)[23:51:29] <{V}> bye Technix[23:53:33] <BenoitRen> So how can I check if resources have been reserved for the SoundBlaster?[23:54:32] <BenoitRen> All I can say is that Real-Time Audio is enabled.[23:57:32] *** BenoitRen has quit IRC[23:58:39] *** cps1966 has quit IRC[23:59:23] *** {V} has quit IRC[23:59:25] *** Megaf_ is now known as _Megaf[23:59:32] *** {V} has joined #haiku[23:59:59] *** {V} is now known as {V}afk