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[00:34:11] <mmu_man> hmm BQuery::GetNextEntry() doesn't clear the entry... leaves loads of fds to folders :-(
[00:34:20] <mmu_man> at least on beos, didn't check Haiku :)
[00:35:25] <DeadYak> oops.
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[00:37:10] <mmu_man> was wondering why I got NULL from BPath at some point :)
[00:37:29] <DeadYak> max fds exceeded?
[00:37:34] <mmu_man> yeah
[00:37:41] * mmu_man pets lsof
[00:37:42] <DeadYak> that seems like a major bug :)
[00:39:10] <mmu_man> calling Unset() works around it
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[00:39:27] <erika14213> hi all
[00:39:40] <stpere> hi!
[00:40:09] <erika14213> i was reading about morphos today on osnews as well as haiku
[00:41:08] <erika14213> in my mind if morphos will ever take over they should release it for powermac
[00:41:46] <erika14213> thats always been amiga vrowd downfall no realiable hard ware provider
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[00:42:59] <mmu_man> hmm
[00:43:21] <mmu_man> actually I will have to switch from a BEntry BList to an entry_ref BList
[00:43:37] <erika14213> look at apple they went x96 cpu
[00:43:40] <erika14213> intel
[00:43:49] <mmu_man> ahh it's not BQuery, that's just because I clone the BEntry to put in the list :^)
[00:43:58] <DeadYak> mmu_man: oops :)
[00:44:08] <mmu_man> bad design :)
[00:44:11] <erika14213> no one one is gonna go buy a motherboard just to run that os
[00:44:31] <DeadYak> dunno, I don't really follow Amigaland these days...too much politics and infighting
[00:44:46] <erika14213> its basically dead
[00:45:02] <DeadYak> that and Amiga was honestly more interesting to me for the hardware, without it the OS really isn't anything special imo
[00:45:04] * mmu_man pets Opt-Alt-H (BeHappy Pe Extension)
[00:45:27] <erika14213> i had amaiga 2000
[00:45:31] <erika14213> at one time
[00:45:38] <stpere> where in the build process generate_boot_splash is called?
[00:45:47] <stpere> someone know from top of his head?
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[00:48:10] <DeadYak> not me
[00:48:35] <stpere> I will dig :)
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[00:55:44] <mmu_man> ugh, BeOS BFS is really screwed up with queries...
[00:56:04] <mmu_man> if you use multiple criteria you get same file several times :^)
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[00:57:45] <DeadYak> what, like name=a && date=b returns the same file twice if it matches both?
[00:58:59] <mmu_man> like
[00:59:00] <mmu_man> query "(Audio:Track>-1)||(Audio:Year>-1)||(Audio:Album==\"**\")||(Audio:Artist==\"**\")||(Audio:Comment==\"**\")||(Audio:Genre==\"**\")||(Audio:Title==\"**\")"
[00:59:08] <mmu_man> but yeah
[00:59:17] <mmadia> about the BFS and write back problems,  can't a crontab be made to run `sync` every so often ?
[00:59:34] <mmu_man> mmadia yeah but that's lame
[01:00:24] <mmadia> point well taken : )
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[01:07:26] <CIA-47> mmlr * r24759 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/fs/devfs.cpp: (log message trimmed)
[01:07:26] <CIA-47> Change publish_node() of the devfs to not insert the node into the directory.
[01:07:26] <CIA-47> Instead return the directory vnode, so the calling function can insert it after
[01:07:26] <CIA-47> all vnode initialization is done. Otherwise entry created notifications are
[01:07:26] <CIA-47> sent upon inserting the node into the directory for vnodes that are not yet
[01:07:29] <CIA-47> fully initialized (i.e. they have no type or the device hooks are not yet set).
[01:07:31] <CIA-47> That would cause for example ioctls to fail when someone would react to a
[01:10:38] <aljen> yeah, anon svn is up ;P
[01:17:53] <burfi> the bear is awake
[01:22:18] <CIA-47> mmlr * r24760 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/fs/node_monitor.cpp:
[01:22:18] <CIA-47> Change the NodeMonitorService lock from a mutex to a recursive_lock. This
[01:22:18] <CIA-47> allows event listeners to add new listeners inside a node monitoring event
[01:22:19] <CIA-47> (i.e. if one wants to add a listener for the entry that has just been created
[01:22:22] <CIA-47> and triggered the current notification).
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[01:39:49] <shackster> Thom_Holwerda: proofread :P 'looting' is way different from 'looking'
[01:40:26] <geist> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KANI2dpXLw
[01:42:30] * mmu_man pings TuneTracker
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[01:46:11] <pyCube_> hehe
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[01:47:25] <pyCube_> i dont understand the whole rick-roll thing.. but it makes me laugh
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[02:09:34] <mmadia> hi mmadia_  ; )
[02:09:57] <stpere> hehe
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[02:10:43] <umccullough_work> eh?
[02:11:12] <stpere> tee mmadia
[02:11:35] <mmadia> umccullough_work  re: bezilla blog,  i know tqh definitely wants haiku to be it's own target.   i'm just not sure what and how.
[02:11:54] <mmadia> but i did reply a half-baked plan
[02:13:51] <umccullough_work> mmadia, yeah - the problem with the half baked plan is that it assumes by default that Haiku starts off like BeOS ;)
[02:14:01] <umccullough_work> not saying that's bad...
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[02:14:43] <mmadia> well, the r5bone binaries run on Haiku  : )
[02:14:50] <umccullough_work> yeah, but that's binary compatibility
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[02:15:03] <umccullough_work> i.e. it starts with the assumption that Haiku has all the same limitations as BeOS
[02:15:50] <mmadia> disabling the workaround for BeOS's 32md add-on limit is trivial.
[02:15:59] <umccullough_work> ...
[02:16:15] <umccullough_work> i'm talking about essentially every line of code written for BeOS Firefox
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[02:16:19] <mmadia> ...not saying that's the only one
[02:16:30] <umccullough_work> it's just a different way to go about porting
[02:16:58] <umccullough_work> for example, Ingo added many missing features to Haiku whenever porting stuff recently - even though he could ahve probably just used the beos patches instead
[02:17:15] <umccullough_work> which assumed no missing functionality could be added
[02:17:29] <umccullough_work> Haiku has the pleasure to improve upon BeOS :)
[02:17:42] <mmadia> right, but you have to consider the red tape involved with checking in code to mozilla.
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[02:17:48] <umccullough_work> well, there's that :/
[02:17:58] <mmadia> which is why i saw it as stages.
[02:18:00] <umccullough_work> and honestly, that's where I'm an outsider
[02:18:19] <mmadia> i've only started submitting patches this past month : |
[02:18:19] <umccullough_work> I think Mozilla is fucking retarded though if they are not willing to embrace new ports
[02:18:27] <umccullough_work> and Haiku's firefox is a new port either way
[02:18:44] <mmadia> definitely --- re: new port
[02:18:45] <umccullough_work> so they're going to be anal either way I suspect - unless they're willing to bend rules a bit
[02:19:21] <mmadia> also i think it's imperative to get Mozilla building on haiku ... even if it's simply re-using the current BeOS code.
[02:19:45] <mmadia> simply because at least tqh can't run r5 these days.
[02:19:56] <umccullough_work> whatever works :)
[02:20:16] <umccullough_work> for FF3 and above though - I'd just "throw away" the beos port and start fresh
[02:20:28] <umccullough_work> do a clean port of all dependencies
[02:20:31] <mmadia> there won't be beos port for FF3  ; )
[02:20:44] <umccullough_work> well, there is already - it just doesn't build ;)
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[02:21:23] <umccullough_work> I guess ultimately porting is a "nasty business" - so it's up to the porter how they wish to do things
[02:21:26] <mmadia> gcc is being killed, the current graphics model has a death sentence,  a few other odds and ends
[02:21:35] <umccullough_work> oh, i know the status
[02:21:40] <umccullough_work> i've read all the blogs ;)
[02:22:03] <mmadia> : )
[02:22:23] <umccullough_work> basically what i'm saying is - don't try to build on existing 'cruft' code that happens to work - but write an improved Haiku port using the beos code as reference
[02:22:40] <umccullough_work> and improve Haiku whenever possible
[02:22:48] <umccullough_work> like missing posix support, etc.
[02:23:02] <umccullough_work> take SkyOS for example
[02:23:12] <mmadia> right,  we're definitely on the same page for the end goal : )
[02:23:21] <umccullough_work> RobertSz ported Firefox to SkyOS and I'm certain he simply added whatever was missing to SkyOS to help him
[02:23:38] <umccullough_work> that way he didn't have to wrangle with massive patches to firefox
[02:23:51] <umccullough_work> and less potential for bustage
[02:24:25] <umccullough_work> the question is - what do you start with? the linux port?
[02:24:40] <umccullough_work> ...so ultimately, maybe starting with the beos port is best - it just seems "dirty"
[02:24:46] <mmadia> me?  the build system cause i don't know C/C++ : P
[02:25:20] <stpere> mmadia: question about the build system :)
[02:25:44] <stpere> do you know where/when does generate_boot_splash is called?
[02:26:05] <umccullough_work> isn't generate_boot_splash a tool that is used manually?
[02:26:06] <stpere> I can't find it and begin to think it's called manually
[02:26:21] <stpere> ah yes, so, I got the conclusion on the late :)
[02:26:28] <mmadia> stpere right now i'm only familiar with mozilla's build system
[02:26:31] <umccullough_work> i thought that just took an image and made a resource out of it that you copied into somewhere manually
[02:26:52] <umccullough_work> stpere, i think stippi hasn't integrated it into the build system yet, only made a comment that he might someday
[02:26:53] <stpere> umccullough_work: you're right I think
[02:33:42] <umccullough_work> stpere, http://svn.berlios.de/viewcvs/haiku?rev=24446&view=rev
[02:33:51] <umccullough_work> "NOTE: The header which is now generated is not usable by the rest of the
[02:33:51] <umccullough_work> source code yet, but that will come later. generate_boot_screen is not
[02:33:51] <umccullough_work> integrated yet anyways.
[02:33:53] <umccullough_work> "
[02:34:19] <umccullough_work> so, he probably just used it once ,and checked in the output manually
[02:37:33] <stpere>  ah ok
[02:41:52] <stpere> thx
[02:42:03] <stpere> you'all are very supportive :)
[02:46:03] <umccullough_work> i have my bad days ;)
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[02:47:08] <pyCube_> shut up
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[02:49:36] <pyCube_> is there such a thing as a place to work where the IT dept makes things easier rather that more difficult?
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[02:50:08] <stpere> eh?
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[03:03:49] <umccullough_work> pyCube_, i have worked in such a place
[03:04:13] <umccullough_work> of course, in my case they made it easier on me because I had been the IT dept of the company that merged with them in the first place :P
[03:04:54] <ozy`> umccullough_work: the entire department?
[03:05:28] <umccullough_work> ozy`, basically, yes - a small startup company consisting of ~15 employees ;)
[03:06:07] <ozy`> hot
[03:06:49] <umccullough_work> the company we merged with had an IT dept of 2.5 people... and a total of ~60 employees, so it wasn't a huge deal
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[03:12:30] <The_Ringmaster> hi
[03:12:42] <The_Ringmaster> the latest superpack is amazing
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[03:14:00] <umccullough_work> because it's... better?
[03:14:46] <The_Ringmaster> well because it includes that new usb mass storage driver
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[03:15:04] <The_Ringmaster> that's not totally finished though right?
[03:16:33] <umccullough_work> it's sort of a temporary thing
[03:16:43] <umccullough_work> it's not a true mass storage driver like what it should be :P
[03:17:47] <The_Ringmaster> does haiku use any anti-aliasing for fonts?
[03:18:35] <umccullough_work> of course :) FreeType2
[03:18:41] <umccullough_work> you couldn't tell?
[03:18:45] <uranium> i see on src there's freetype, does haiku use it for font rendering?
[03:18:52] <umccullough_work> of course! :)
[03:19:21] <ozy`> The_Ringmaster: what platform are you coming from? you should be able to tell when a system uses no anti-aliasing whatsoever...
[03:19:25] <umccullough_work> The_Ringmaster, i mean you couldn't tell it was AA?
[03:19:42] <umccullough_work> i think he uses OS X...
[03:19:53] <ozy`> oh, heh
[03:19:55] <The_Ringmaster> i'm running haiku in vmware player on my VISTA laptop
[03:20:02] <umccullough_work> ah
[03:20:11] <umccullough_work> still, you should be able to tell it's AA
[03:20:18] <umccullough_work> i mean, non-AA fonts look exceptionally bad
[03:20:22] <umccullough_work> by comparison
[03:20:30] <The_Ringmaster> yes it looks like it, but i was really asking if there was a freetype2-cleartype availbe
[03:20:32] <umccullough_work> (says the guy who turns off ClearType in windows XP)
[03:21:01] <The_Ringmaster> available*
[03:21:04] <ozy`> cleartype is 100% patented, down to the style of comments they use in the source code
[03:21:35] <umccullough_work> there's a header option to enable that feature - not sure if the haiku devs turned it on or not
[03:21:46] <The_Ringmaster> cleartype packages (as least on arch linux) are used for lcd screens
[03:22:09] <umccullough_work> hmm.. no subpixel rendering yet if that's what you're looking for
[03:22:18] <umccullough_work> that's a GSoC idea in fact
[03:22:19] <The_Ringmaster> that must be why
[03:23:48] <umccullough_work> interesting, looks like FreeType is used, but AGG does the rendering currently
[03:24:14] <umccullough_work> http://www.haiku-os.org/community/gsoc2008/ideas
[03:24:15] <uranium> does Haiku already support openAL and openGL API ?
[03:24:23] <umccullough_work> OpenGL, yes
[03:24:29] <umccullough_work> it uses Mesa 7.x
[03:24:36] <umccullough_work> no hardware accel yet
[03:24:40] <uranium> so no openAL ?
[03:24:47] <umccullough_work> i don't even know what that is
[03:24:50] <umccullough_work> audio stuff?
[03:24:56] <stpere> yes
[03:25:00] <pyCube_> like closedAL, but more open
[03:25:03] <uranium> yea like openGL but its Audio
[03:25:42] <The_Ringmaster> eh, learned something today
[03:26:13] <umccullough_work> uranium, i guess there's nothing currently in the repo
[03:26:22] <uranium> ic
[03:26:58] <uranium> so how haiku speak? i mean making sound?
[03:26:59] <The_Ringmaster> how come every time I open up that old opera, another day is taken off my evaluation?
[03:27:13] <umccullough_work> uranium, it has its own media kit
[03:27:19] <uranium> ooo ic ic
[03:27:26] <umccullough_work> similar to what BeOS had
[03:27:45] <umccullough_work> The_Ringmaster, dunno - that thing is ancient :)
[03:27:53] <umccullough_work> The_Ringmaster, there's a free reg code for that
[03:27:54] <uranium> it would be better to include it on gameKit since it easier for game developer to port their codes
[03:28:11] <The_Ringmaster> i know but it's fun to play with
[03:28:21] <umccullough_work> uranium, game kit is for directwindow and joystick support
[03:28:30] <The_Ringmaster> you know where I could get a reg code for this?
[03:28:35] <umccullough_work> media kit is for all audio/video management
[03:28:41] <uranium> well game is not only graphic and input though...
[03:28:53] <uranium> unless there is another definition of game
[03:28:57] <umccullough_work> uranium, it's not windows, there won't be directx
[03:29:22] <umccullough_work> if someone wants to port OpenAL to Haiku and have it direct output through the haiku media kit...that's great
[03:29:32] <umccullough_work> like how SDL works
[03:29:42] <uranium> i think openAl is direct to hardware not through mediakit
[03:29:47] <umccullough_work> doesn't matter
[03:29:52] <umccullough_work> doesn't have to be
[03:29:55] <uranium> ic
[03:30:10] <umccullough_work> just write a generic backend driver for it and it won't know the difference
[03:30:10] <uranium> there so much to be done heh...
[03:30:28] <umccullough_work> well, those are 3rd party opportunities - i doubt the OS devs will bother with that
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[03:30:35] <uranium> ic
[03:30:47] <umccullough_work> maybe in R2
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[03:31:09] <uranium> so when is R1 actually will be released? or is it already released?
[03:31:39] <stpere> an alpha is coming along
[03:31:50] <uranium> this month?
[03:32:00] <The_Ringmaster> would be nice
[03:32:08] <umccullough_work> doubtful
[03:32:13] <uranium> wew
[03:32:18] <umccullough_work> still a lot of loose ends in the kernel to clean up
[03:32:27] <uranium> like what?
[03:32:37] <uranium> i ran it on vmware all work smoothly
[03:32:50] <umccullough_work> it appears to run, that's the hard part ;)
[03:32:57] <umccullough_work> there's a lot of missing backend support - such as lack of pagefile support
[03:33:03] <uranium> ic
[03:33:06] <umccullough_work> no virtual memory :P
[03:33:10] <uranium> what?
[03:33:13] <umccullough_work> a crappy scheduler
[03:33:14] <uranium> ahhahahah
[03:33:35] <uranium> Haiku have its own scheduler?
[03:33:43] <uranium> i mean not port of another project?
[03:33:43] <umccullough_work> well, yeah - every OS does
[03:33:54] <umccullough_work> we're talking about a task scheduler in the kernel
[03:34:01] <uranium> i mean there a lot of scheduler developed
[03:34:01] <umccullough_work> the thing that decides which thread runs when
[03:34:05] <uranium> why dont just pick one?
[03:34:14] <umccullough_work> haiku currently just uses a rudimentary one
[03:34:22] <umccullough_work> like what?
[03:34:23] <uranium> yeah i know what scheduler is...
[03:34:28] <umccullough_work> a linux scheduler wouldn't be suitable
[03:34:40] <uranium> recently i work on realtime OS
[03:34:47] <uranium> is it not sufficient?
[03:34:50] <umccullough_work> there was a custom O(1) scheduler written last year by a GSoC student but it's not integrated into the kernel
[03:34:57] <uranium> ic
[03:35:02] <umccullough_work> i know little about that stuff
[03:35:08] <uranium> so how about allocator?
[03:35:11] <uranium> its good?
[03:35:18] <umccullough_work> the allocator also needs work AFAIK
[03:35:30] <The_Ringmaster> block allocator?
[03:35:42] <umccullough_work> there's both a block and slab alloc IIRC
[03:35:43] <uranium> ive seen open source allocator that worked better than 2.6.24
[03:35:51] <umccullough_work> but the slab allocator is buggy as hell
[03:35:58] <umccullough_work> i think right now it uses HOARD
[03:36:05] <uranium> that is!
[03:36:07] <uranium> :))
[03:36:09] <umccullough_work> but that might be the usermode one
[03:36:14] <uranium> its good
[03:36:23] <uranium> so Haiku uses HOARD?
[03:36:27] <umccullough_work> uranium, if you're into osdev - i'm probably a bad person to talk to :)
[03:36:30] <umccullough_work> geist would know a lot more
[03:36:37] <umccullough_work> i don't dev haiku
[03:36:41] <The_Ringmaster> gnu/hurd and haiku possible?
[03:36:48] <uranium> nah... just having chats...
[03:36:48] <umccullough_work> ick
[03:37:09] <uranium> so what are you into if not osdev?
[03:37:17] <pyCube_> cheese
[03:37:28] <umccullough_work> i am mostly just a haiku evangelist :)
[03:37:33] <uranium> ic
[03:37:38] <umccullough_work> enthusiast perhaps
[03:37:42] <geist> love to chat but i'm just about to head out
[03:37:47] <umccullough_work> i write C# software for a libing
[03:37:48] <umccullough_work> living
[03:37:55] <umccullough_work> later geist
[03:38:02] <uranium> i write on C++ for simulator
[03:38:22] <uranium> i love OS quirks... :D
[03:38:22] <The_Ringmaster> ever use mono?
[03:38:25] <pyCube_> c#eese
[03:38:35] <uranium> nope i hate JIT
[03:38:50] <umccullough_work> The_Ringmaster, yeah, i've messed with it some
[03:39:04] <The_Ringmaster> c# for linux
[03:39:10] <pyCube_> i've written a couple gtk# apps
[03:39:36] <umccullough_work> mono is really more than "C# for linux"
[03:40:02] <The_Ringmaster> well that's the idea
[03:40:04] <umccullough_work> mono is a complete CLR, CIL compiler, .Net class library, etc.
[03:40:30] <umccullough_work> i mean, C# is just a language - you can compile that with GCC if you wanted to
[03:40:37] <umccullough_work> but it wouldn't be .net
[03:41:00] <The_Ringmaster> righgt
[03:41:03] <The_Ringmaster> right*
[03:41:17] <pyCube_> .HET  <-- cyrillic
[03:41:58] <uranium> btw who is the maintainer of Haiku Kernel?
[03:42:15] <uranium> i mean the lead programmer?
[03:42:44] <The_Ringmaster> axeld?
[03:43:22] <uranium> what he does for living?
[03:43:31] <umccullough_work> several kernel devs actually
[03:43:42] <umccullough_work> axeld has touched a lot of it though ;)
[03:43:47] <umccullough_work> same with ingo (bonefish)
[03:44:01] <umccullough_work> geist wrote the original newos kernel that it was forked from
[03:44:07] <The_Ringmaster> yeah bonefish is a bug squasher
[03:44:10] <uranium> ic
[03:44:17] <uranium> so they do it full time?
[03:44:23] <The_Ringmaster> I always see his name on commits and stuff
[03:44:24] <pyCube_> hehe
[03:44:35] <umccullough_work> wel, from what i gathered, ingo and axel both work for a company that pays them to hack on Haiku
[03:44:42] <umccullough_work> but i'm not sure what the situation is really
[03:44:54] <uranium> Haiku Inc. ?
[03:44:56] <umccullough_work> no
[03:45:01] <The_Ringmaster> getting paid to work on free software, nice
[03:45:04] <umccullough_work> Haiku Inc has no paid employees
[03:45:24] <umccullough_work> The_Ringmaster, well, the company makes an embedded device which I think uses Haiku as the os
[03:45:36] <umccullough_work> but seriously, i'm just regurgitating what I think i've heard
[03:45:39] <uranium> ic
[03:45:43] <The_Ringmaster> hey use pre alpha software??
[03:45:48] <The_Ringmaster> they*
[03:45:53] <umccullough_work> dunno if it's in production use ;)
[03:46:01] <pyCube_> all the cool kids use pre-alpha software
[03:46:13] <The_Ringmaster> bleeding edge!!
[03:46:20] <uranium> curious why use Haiku, why not linux...
[03:46:26] <umccullough_work> no clue
[03:46:31] <The_Ringmaster> choice
[03:46:38] <uranium> nice
[03:46:38] <umccullough_work> maybe to avoid the GPL problems
[03:46:39] <pyCube_> extra rad-ness
[03:46:47] <uranium> actually i got tired with linux
[03:46:57] <The_Ringmaster> l33tness maybe?
[03:47:04] <uranium> yeah
[03:47:08] <pyCube_> gpl is only a problem is you dont wanna follow the rules
[03:47:09] <pyCube_> :-p
[03:47:10] <uranium> some kind of that
[03:47:27] <The_Ringmaster> anyone read gpl v3?
[03:47:36] <uranium> nope
[03:47:42] <The_Ringmaster> i've read v2
[03:47:42] <stpere> who reads licences..
[03:47:46] <stpere> :P
[03:47:49] <uranium> hehe
[03:48:02] <The_Ringmaster> i have a printed copy actually
[03:48:09] <uranium> i've WTFPL License... its good
[03:48:12] * pyCube_ points at the dork
[03:48:18] <uranium> *i've read
[03:48:31] <The_Ringmaster> wow
[03:48:43] <umccullough_work> uranium, that's one of my favs :)
[03:48:54] <The_Ringmaster> wtf public license
[03:48:57] <umccullough_work> more free than free :D
[03:49:02] <uranium> yeah
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[03:49:14] <uranium> i want to make good software using that license
[03:49:16] <uranium> hehe
[03:49:28] <umccullough_work> i think there is some out there actually
[03:49:33] <uranium> really?
[03:49:34] <umccullough_work> i've stumbled across it
[03:49:43] <The_Ringmaster> is this a violation?? Nah you use the wtf public license
[03:49:46] <umccullough_work> hang on, let me check
[03:51:04] <uranium> http://freshmeat.net/browse/1008/
[03:51:26] <The_Ringmaster> wow that's a real license???
[03:51:35] <uranium> yeah why not..
[03:51:40] <The_Ringmaster> lmao
[03:51:46] <umccullough_work> it's recognized by OSI IIRC
[03:51:54] <umccullough_work> i mean, it meets the requirements
[03:52:09] <The_Ringmaster> man if only i thought of it first
[03:52:33] <The_Ringmaster> what does it stand for?
[03:52:48] <uranium> what?
[03:52:53] <uranium> WTFPL ?
[03:52:56] <The_Ringmaster> yeah
[03:52:56] <umccullough_work> actually, i think libcaca *was* where i saw it first :)
[03:53:11] <umccullough_work> i think someone had suggested adding libcaca image translator support to Haiku at one point
[03:53:18] <umccullough_work> as an output option
[03:53:18] <uranium> do What The Fuck you want Public License
[03:53:55] <The_Ringmaster> that wouldn't be the actual name of this license though
[03:54:10] <uranium> actual name like what?
[03:54:15] <uranium> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WTFPL
[03:54:31] <umccullough_work> http://www.haiku-os.org/community/forum/aalib_translator
[03:54:41] <The_Ringmaster> hehe ok
[03:55:38] <The_Ringmaster> but how is it different than bsd license?
[03:56:19] <umccullough_work> you have fewer limitations?
[03:56:45] <The_Ringmaster> bsd doesn't have any though
[03:57:02] <umccullough_work> really? can you remove the copyright on a bsd licensed fiel?
[03:57:04] <umccullough_work> file?
[03:57:09] <uranium> i think WTFPL doesnt retain the copyright
[03:57:27] <umccullough_work> basically, you can remove WTFPL from any file it's in
[03:57:31] <uranium> you can change the copyright name...
[03:57:33] <umccullough_work> *that* is freedom :)
[03:57:35] <uranium> or remove it
[03:57:38] <uranium> yeah
[03:57:39] <umccullough_work> yeah, you can alter the license if you change the name
[03:57:44] <umccullough_work> that's pretty damn flexible
[03:57:52] <The_Ringmaster> so it's not really a license
[03:57:55] <uranium> you can sell it as closed source...
[03:57:56] <uranium> :P
[03:57:59] <umccullough_work> it's really no different than public domain
[03:58:17] <umccullough_work> except that it has a name, and the license belongs to someone ;)
[03:58:32] <umccullough_work> you change the license, you have to change the name of the license
[04:00:49] <uranium> does GCC 4.x.x support to compile to haiku executable?
[04:01:09] <uranium> last time i heard its only 2.95
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[04:01:36] <umccullough_work> uranium, you can compile the entire OS in gcc4 - but it won't be binary compatible with BeOS R5
[04:02:01] <umccullough_work> and there's currently no native gcc4 toolchain for haiku - so you'll have to cross-compile everything from linux
[04:02:04] <umccullough_work> or whatever
[04:02:27] <uranium> so if i develop and compile using GCC 4 it couldn't run on Haiku?
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[04:02:46] <umccullough_work> it *could* run if you were using a gcc4-compiled version of Haiku
[04:03:04] <umccullough_work> but you'd have to cross-compile your app also
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[04:03:27] <umccullough_work> uranium, assuming you're talking about C++, not C
[04:03:37] <uranium> yeah
[04:04:05] <uranium> does Haiku executable format compatible with *nix or its just compatible with BeOS?
[04:04:10] <umccullough_work> elf
[04:04:27] <umccullough_work> but i think it's a custom runtime_loader...
[04:05:07] * umccullough_work notes he's starting to talk about stuff slightly over his head :)
[04:05:08] <uranium> ic
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[04:05:35] <uranium> so its use ELF but using Custom Extension of Haiku own format
[04:05:44] <umccullough_work> mmu_man and DeadYak are useful for that type of knowledge ;)
[04:06:32] <mmu_man> uranium we use ELF with the SysV ABI
[04:06:55] <uranium> so it could run unix executable right?
[04:07:21] <mmu_man> (we ought to register a custom ABI but I suppose SCO has other stuff to do)
[04:07:27] <mmu_man> no
[04:07:34] <mmu_man> ABI != API
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[04:08:03] <mmu_man> we don't have the same syscalls or signals...
[04:08:19] <uranium> hoooo ic ic
[04:08:20] <mmu_man> just like linux bins are different than sco ones despite using ELF
[04:08:40] <mmu_man> (but SCO has a linux personality to emulate that)
[04:08:51] <mmu_man> but most can be recompiled
[04:08:56] <mmu_man> anyway
[04:08:57] <mmu_man> zzz
[04:09:02] <umccullough_work> 'night
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[04:09:06] <uranium> ok
[04:09:26] <umccullough_work> .t gmt
[04:09:29] <BuildFactory> Thu, 03 Apr 2008 02:09:06 GMT
[04:09:34] <umccullough_work> damn
[04:10:06] <umccullough_work> is france +1?
[04:10:07] <uranium> watsap?
[04:10:15] <umccullough_work> mmu_man is in france :)
[04:10:22] <uranium> ic
[04:10:46] <uranium> so where are u?
[04:10:57] <umccullough_work> I'm in california
[04:11:02] <uranium> ic
[04:11:05] <uranium> im +7
[04:11:10] <uranium> need to sleep
[04:11:10] <umccullough_work> wow :)
[04:11:17] <DeadYak> france I believe is GMT or
[04:11:20] <uranium> but waiting for download...
[04:11:22] <DeadYak> GMT+1 depending on what part of it you're in
[04:11:34] <umccullough_work> DeadYak, yeah, looking at a map that seems logical
[04:12:54] <umccullough_work> yeah, -7 now with DST
[04:12:57] <umccullough_work> here
[04:12:58] <DeadYak> GMT-6 here
[04:13:14] <The_Ringmaster> deakyak, where you at/
[04:13:20] <DeadYak> The_Ringmaster: Huntsville, AL
[04:13:27] <The_Ringmaster>  cool
[04:13:31] <DeadYak> Chicago I see?
[04:13:36] <The_Ringmaster> freeport, il here
[04:13:39] <DeadYak> ah
[04:13:41] <DeadYak> close :)
[04:13:43] <umccullough_work> heh
[04:13:52] <umccullough_work> my PoP is in SF
[04:18:48] <The_Ringmaster> gonna go play savage
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[04:20:19] <umccullough_work> too bad he didn't show up yesterday when I had his nick :)
[04:21:05] <[Katisu]> screaming banshee?
[04:21:35] <umccullough_work> no, The_Ringmaster
[04:21:46] <umccullough_work> although, screaming banshee would have been even more amusing
[04:21:54] <umccullough_work> since he didn't register his nick and *I* did :D
[04:24:53] <CIA-47> bonefish * r24761 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/cache/block_cache.cpp:
[04:24:53] <CIA-47> cache_end_transaction() doesn't remove the transaction, so that the
[04:24:53] <CIA-47> check in notify_transaction_listeners() didn't hold, although the
[04:24:53] <CIA-47> cache_hooks were deleted anyway. I've introduced a listener_change
[04:24:53] <CIA-47> counter to detect changes to the listener list while iterating, since
[04:24:56] <CIA-47> any change makes the iteration unsafe. Should fix bug #2008 for real.
[04:24:57] <CIA-47> Nevertheless I thing the transaction listener concept needs revision.
[04:26:08] <umccullough_work> ingo up late again...
[04:27:01] <umccullough_work> DeadYak, guess that means the svn up issue is fixed :)
[04:27:31] <umccullough_work> and hopefully your boot problem
[04:28:44] * umccullough_work is trying to remember where his 80gb SATA disk ended up
[04:28:56] <stpere> I've enhanced the bootsplash once again
[04:29:04] <stpere> now, it takes positionning from images.h
[04:29:16] <stpere> so, it's customizable at compile time
[04:30:13] <DeadYak> yay
[04:30:14] <DeadYak> here's hoping...
[04:31:00] <stpere> is there a reason why every first boot on my vmware ends with a page fault?
[04:31:07] <stpere> 0xdeadbeef..
[04:31:09] <DeadYak> probably that bug
[04:31:10] <DeadYak> yeah that bug
[04:31:22] <DeadYak> stpere: that svn change just now should fix that
[04:31:35] <stpere> ah great
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[04:45:40] <umccullough_work> damn, some people on osnews are absolute morons :)
[04:46:17] <umccullough_work> i mention that a certain piece of math related software runs 3x faster when compiled for x64 rather than x86 and some guy calls that an outrageous claim
[04:46:29] <umccullough_work> you'd have to be a fucking moron...
[04:46:40] <DeadYak> math software's exactly the kind of place you'd see that
[04:46:44] <DeadYak> what with the exra registers and stuff
[04:46:49] <umccullough_work> especially when it's integer math
[04:46:50] <DeadYak> extra*
[04:47:30] <umccullough_work> http://osnews.com/thread?307836
[04:47:45] <umccullough_work> he clearly misinterpreted what i said
[04:49:08] * umccullough_work adds him to the list of people he wants to hit with a bag of doorknobs
[04:49:30] <umccullough_work> damn, i need a USB mosue
[04:49:31] <umccullough_work> mosue
[04:49:32] <umccullough_work> mouse
[04:50:59] <Anxiety|Home> lol, what a dork
[04:54:20] <umccullough_work> it takes all kinds :)
[04:56:39] <[Katisu]> I can sort of see how he could get confused except for the part where he mentions "vista ultimate"
[04:56:58] <umccullough_work> lol
[04:57:17] <umccullough_work> he was just clueless to start, and then he ran into me
[04:57:35] <umccullough_work> and i was posting something barely related to the article - so i was not doing him any favors :)
[04:58:10] <umccullough_work> I *cannot* believe that machines sold in the last 2 years still have 10/100 nics only
[04:58:21] <umccullough_work> and worse - I can't believe that my company bought several of them
[04:58:27] <[Katisu]> I can :P
[04:58:28] <skoe> lol
[04:59:02] <umccullough_work> Dells...
[04:59:12] <[Katisu]> doesn't gigabit need new cabling?
[04:59:16] <umccullough_work> no
[04:59:21] <umccullough_work> can run it over cat5e
[05:00:12] <[Katisu]> yeah, assuming you have cat 5e :P
[05:00:37] <umccullough_work> they've been selling that for like the last 10 years I think
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[05:01:47] <ari-free> yay
[05:02:32] <umccullough_work> [Katisu], in any case, the building we were in when the machines were purchased was wired for gigabit copper - not much excuse to buy a 10/100 nic
[05:02:55] <ari-free> hi
[05:03:43] <umccullough_work> hi ari-free
[05:03:46] <umccullough_work> long time no see :)
[05:03:55] <ari-free> oh good someone remembers hehe
[05:04:10] <ari-free> yeah i remember you
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[05:04:27] <umccullough_work> :)
[05:04:41] <ari-free> how are those distributed projects going?
[05:04:52] <umccullough_work> not too bad - but i've got a few of my machines offline ATM
[05:05:00] <[Katisu]> I need new hardware :P
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[05:05:22] <ari-free> so do I. there's a nice box upstairs but there's vista on it
[05:05:33] <umccullough_work> D:
[05:08:37] <umccullough_work> I should throw SkyOS on my haiku test machine
[05:08:52] <ari-free> how is that os doing these days
[05:08:55] <umccullough_work> just to see how it compares on like hardware
[05:09:15] <umccullough_work> dunno, i haven't used it in well over a year
[05:10:04] <ari-free> I just heard he's planning a kernel rewrite
[05:11:14] <stpere> patch submitted :)
[05:11:18] <stpere> night!
[05:12:42] <umccullough_work> wtf: "Scheduling is many orders of magnitude faster now that it's being done in software."
[05:13:07] <umccullough_work> i guess that's something I just don't understand - is there some sort of BIOS-mode fallback hardware-scheduler?
[05:14:43] <umccullough_work> something about an upcoming "scalable driver api" that will allow many new drivers to appear for SkyOS
[05:15:00] <umccullough_work> i wonder if they'll pull a page out of the Haiku book and write a fbsd compat layer
[05:16:10] <ari-free> haiku got a new scheduler right?
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[05:16:19] <umccullough_work> not exactly
[05:16:53] <tux|ive> there is a wiki to install haiku to real partition
[05:16:54] <umccullough_work> code for a new scheduler was written.... but not integrated into the kernel
[05:17:09] <tux|ive> i have beos max installed in one
[05:17:12] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, there are two howto articles that can help
[05:17:20] <umccullough_work> but they are from linux
[05:17:26] <tux|ive> yes
[05:17:31] <tux|ive> im in archlinux
[05:17:44] <tux|ive> and slackware
[05:17:51] <tux|ive> how ican do it
[05:18:08] <ari-free> well in a way we're doing the same rewrite but we don't call ourselves "beta" in the middle of this
[05:18:37] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, first this: http://www.haiku-os.org/documents/dev/building_haiku_on_ubuntu_linux_step_by_step
[05:18:42] <umccullough_work> but it's for *buntu
[05:18:43] <tux|ive> ty
[05:18:49] <tux|ive> ok
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[05:18:59] <umccullough_work> then once you can successfully compile a raw image...the next doc is:
[05:19:00] <tux|ive> i try linux is the same
[05:19:29] * umccullough_work is looking for the link
[05:19:32] <umccullough_work> http://www.haiku-os.org/documents/dev/installing_haiku_to_a_partition_from_linux
[05:19:41] <tux|ive> well
[05:20:06] <tux|ive> i have my beos max installed
[05:20:18] <tux|ive> in one partition mounted in linux
[05:20:23] <tux|ive> but i cant write
[05:20:26] <umccullough_work> can you build haiku in beos max currently?
[05:20:27] <tux|ive> on it
[05:20:36] <tux|ive> no
[05:20:41] <umccullough_work> what's your goal?
[05:20:46] <umccullough_work> to replace the beos max with haiku?
[05:20:53] <tux|ive> yes
[05:21:02] <umccullough_work> as in, wiping that partition clean?
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[05:21:23] <tux|ive> fresh max install
[05:21:40] <umccullough_work> installing haiku to the partition will completely replace it
[05:21:59] <umccullough_work> in other words, the act of following those two guides will esseentially reformat the partition and install haiku
[05:22:12] <umccullough_work> it doesn't matter what OS is already on there
[05:22:59] <tux|ive> and i can use the raw image
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[05:23:08] <tux|ive> mount  on beos max
[05:23:09] <treohelf> hi
[05:23:19] <tux|ive> and replace the kernel only
[05:23:26] <treohelf> I actually have a beos question :P
[05:23:27] <umccullough_work> you can't replace the kernel only
[05:23:55] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, if you had another partition free, you could use beos max to install haiku to it isntead
[05:24:05] <umccullough_work> but then you'd have to run makebootable on it afterward
[05:24:13] <treohelf> I forget what it means when you try to boot an install cd and it KDLs with...
[05:24:14] <treohelf> "cant find shell"
[05:24:25] <umccullough_work> treohelf, dunno :P
[05:24:36] <treohelf> useless! :P
[05:25:28] <umccullough_work> yeah
[05:25:59] <tux|ive> and i can do dd haikuraw to /dev/beosmasparttition
[05:26:04] <treohelf> well, now its just freezing on the last circle...
[05:26:33] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, it likely won't boot if you only dd it
[05:26:42] <umccullough_work> you'll have to also run makebootable on it
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[05:27:38] <tux|ive> with cfdisk
[05:27:45] <umccullough_work> not exactly
[05:27:54] <tux|ive> or parted
[05:28:02] <umccullough_work> makebootable is a program designed for BFS to write some information to the boot block of a BFS partition
[05:28:07] <treohelf> PANIC: no shell!
[05:28:10] <treohelf> :(
[05:28:13] <tux|ive> ok
[05:28:32] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, it also has to write the partition offset into the BFS boot block - so it's custom
[05:28:46] <treohelf> hm
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[05:29:15] <treohelf> mmadia!
[05:29:26] <mmadia> treohelf !
[05:29:40] <mmadia> the goods have been delivered.
[05:29:45] <treohelf> didn't you try to get me a few days ago?
[05:29:46] <tux|ive> where i can get makebootable for bfs
[05:29:59] <mmadia> yeap.
[05:30:07] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, it's in the haiku repository - you have to build it from source
[05:30:12] <treohelf> your machine is up?
[05:30:30] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, you can maybe use beos max to do it
[05:30:37] <mmadia> sorta... i'm waiting on some hard drives to be replaced
[05:30:46] <treohelf> oh yeah
[05:31:04] <treohelf> mmadia, maybe you will remember what this means
[05:31:33] <mmadia> ... ?
[05:31:37] <treohelf> trying to boot beos max and I get "PANIC: no shell!" then kdl
[05:32:18] <mmadia> sounds like the bootscript is having trouble finding Tracker and Terimnal.
[05:32:40] <treohelf> bad cd?
[05:33:10] <tux|ive> but now the beos max its bootable
[05:33:17] <tux|ive> sorry
[05:33:22] * JonathanThompson meows once again like a burmese pythob
[05:33:23] <tux|ive> the partition
[05:33:26] <JonathanThompson> Er, python
[05:33:29] <mmadia> treohelf what's the hardware you're using?
[05:33:38] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, bootable partition isn't the same as bootable BFS
[05:33:46] <treohelf> a dell something or other
[05:33:49] <umccullough_work> tux|ive, it's very hard to explain because most OSes don't have this problem
[05:34:09] <treohelf> optiplex gx110
[05:34:22] <umccullough_work> anyhow, i'm gonna take off
[05:34:23] <umccullough_work> ttyl
[05:34:24] <tux|ive> i think its not bootale at all im using a floppy image to boot to it
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[05:34:31] <treohelf> upgraded to a 1.4 tualatin and 512mb ram
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[05:36:06] <mmadia> treohelf i  remember having trouble getting R5 on a gx1xx
[05:36:20] <mmadia> i810 or i815?
[05:36:27] <treohelf> ...
[05:36:37] <treohelf> i810
[05:36:50] <mmadia> got any pci video cards?  : P
[05:37:05] <treohelf> maybe the ide controller?
[05:37:29] <treohelf> using an nvidia fx5500 :P
[05:38:03] <mmadia> you could try using the ide repl drivers to boot.
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[05:38:27] <treohelf> ona boot floppy?
[05:38:52] <mmadia> yeah, it could boot the cd.
[05:39:20] <mmadia> did you try any safemode options?
[05:39:42] <treohelf> all,  arious combinations.. same error
[05:39:43] <treohelf> various
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[06:10:01] <aroman> hi
[06:10:36] <aroman> is there much interest in OHCI usb support for Summer of Code? I'm thinking of applying for that project...
[06:10:56] <aroman> it seems it has already been started, and some development was done last year for Summer of Code...
[06:11:27] <aroman> anyone know what is the status of the driver?
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[06:18:36] <DeadYak> aroman: the guy who started on it applied to finish it, yes
[06:18:49] <aroman> DeadYak: ok, then...
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[06:19:57] <aroman> the other thing that I found interesting from the proposed ideas was porting a zeroconf solution, mDNSResponder for instance...
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[06:21:34] <DeadYak> aroman: go ahead and write up a proposal :)
[06:22:56] <aroman> DeadYak: I will, but first I wanted to get an idea of what is required from a feature perspective
[06:23:33] <Al2O3_> Q: just started the setp 6 of the build in linux for Haiku.  I'm doing the image instead of vmware.  I will likely do both.  Does the image that results for the hardware hosting (non vmware) need to be then burned to CD and installed from that to the hardware for boot?
[06:24:03] *** Al2O3 has quit IRC
[06:24:52] <aroman> I was reading the ticket #1042 about zeroconf, and I am unclear about the second "we need" point: "the possibility to extend the known hosts and services list via an instant messenger, for example". What is meant by "instant messenger"?
[06:25:22] <aroman> I'm not sure I understand what the required functionality be for this particular point...
[06:25:31] <DeadYak> I would assume a chat client like AIM or whatnot, I'm honestly not sure on that one though
[06:26:57] <aroman> not sure how an instant messenger applies to zeroconf...
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[06:30:52] <DeadYak> who posted that ticket?
[06:31:09] <aroman> wkornewald
[06:31:16] <DeadYak> ah
[06:31:27] <DeadYak> he's not around any more I don't think...might be best off asking the dev list about that one
[06:31:34] <aroman> hmm
[06:31:35] <aroman> k
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[06:32:07] <DeadYak> especially given all the different time zones people're in
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[06:55:29] <umccullough> DeadYak, still no haiku hosting?
[06:56:27] <Thom_Holwerda> grumble
[06:56:54] <Thom_Holwerda> exam at 8:45, meaning i need to get up at 6:30 and leave at 7:00
[06:56:59] <umccullough> yay
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[06:58:01] <Thom_Holwerda> and already three traffic jams on my route!
[06:58:05] <Thom_Holwerda> yay
[06:58:47] <umccullough> i just got home a little bit ago :)
[06:58:57] * JonathanThompson laughs at Thom_Holwerda
[06:59:02] <JonathanThompson> Only 3?
[06:59:08] <JonathanThompson> Fast day ;)
[06:59:11] <Thom_Holwerda> ttyl guys
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[07:13:53] * umccullough found his 80gb SATA disk :)
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[07:16:07] <aroman> What do most people use for Haiku development? BeOS, or Linux?
[07:16:48] <umccullough> linux at this point i think
[07:17:03] <umccullough> i assume you mean for building haiku
[07:18:28] <geist> umccullough: i'm standing next to a mountain
[07:18:33] <geist> chop it down with the edge of my hand
[07:18:54] <umccullough> :/
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[07:20:59] <aroman> umccullough: yeah, building/developing :)
[07:21:27] <aroman> anyone ever built haiku on Mac OS X?
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[07:25:06] <aljen> aroman: yeah
[07:25:26] <aljen> developing/building
[07:25:35] <geist> yep, can be done
[07:25:38] <geist> provided it's an intel mac
[07:25:50] <aroman> aljen: any special steps, or just the steps on the haiku site?
[07:25:59] <geist> probably
[07:26:11] <geist> it's not well tested, so i wouldn't be surprised if it breaks from time to time
[07:26:20] <aljen> checkout & build (tested only gcc4)
[07:26:35] <geist> yeah., can only build gcc4
[07:27:16] <aroman> k
[07:27:26] <aroman> i'll give it a shot...
[07:29:09] <aljen> aroman: ahh and you need case-sensitive hfs
[07:29:40] <aroman> hmm... lemme check :P
[07:29:53] <aroman> shoot... don't have that :(
[07:30:36] <geist> easy to do, create a disk image and run inside it
[07:30:42] <aljen> aroman: disk utility create image ;P
[07:30:43] <geist> disk utility will let you do that easily
[07:30:48] <geist> that's what I did
[07:31:05] <aroman> hmmm good point :)
[07:32:14] <aroman> how big should I make it?
[07:32:53] <aljen> mine is 8gb but 3.98 is free
[07:32:58] <geist> yeah
[07:33:05] <geist> the checkout of all the source is a GB or so
[07:33:09] <geist> so plan accordingly
[07:33:14] <geist> 8GB sparse disk image will do ya
[07:33:17] <aljen> mine/my sorry for my english ;P
[07:33:26] <aroman> k.. shold I enable journaling? is there any point? :s
[07:33:36] <geist> yeah, no reason not do
[07:33:42] <geist> but make sur eyou select case sensitive
[07:33:43] <aroman> sparse doesn't allocate it at the beginning, right?
[07:33:45] <aroman> yeah
[07:35:20] <aroman> so, I'll try to follow the linux instructions, then
[07:35:38] <geist> shoul.d be alright
[07:35:42] <aroman> k
[07:35:44] <geist> i'll give it a whirl here again too. haven't in a while
[07:35:56] <aroman> cool
[07:35:57] <aroman>  :)
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[07:37:18] <aroman> checking out the build tools...
[07:47:53] <umccullough> why do people make salads with raisins and onions together
[07:48:43] <ari-free> craisins are good
[07:48:57] <umccullough> yeah
[07:49:06] <umccullough> but again - would not work well with onions :(
[07:49:12] <ari-free> never heard of raisins in a salad
[07:49:21] <umccullough> it's common here
[07:49:25] <umccullough> i'm not fond of it
[07:49:47] <umccullough> i like my salads drenched in bleu cheese dressing - so anything sweet generally ruins it
[07:49:59] <ari-free> whew!
[07:50:17] <ari-free> that is strong stuff
[07:50:45] <ari-free> i like salads with fruit in them. strawberries, mandarin oranges, etc
[07:51:01] <umccullough> apples and raisins apparently go together in salads
[07:51:13] <ari-free> well thats a waldorf
[07:51:17] <umccullough> oh
[07:51:33] <umccullough> yuck :)
[07:51:56] <ari-free> with mayo...very yuck
[07:52:16] <umccullough> oh boy: http://osnews.com/thread?307855
[07:52:39] <ari-free> you didnt know?
[07:53:05] <umccullough> didn't know what?
[07:53:15] <ari-free> self hosting
[07:54:37] <umccullough> i was linking to luposians comment specifically
[07:55:20] <ari-free> well what he quoted was more interesting: My network card "just works" without configuration (not only do I have to configure it in BeOS, but network connectivity is so flaky as to be unusable). In Haiku, the native resolution on my monitor is supported, whereas in BeOS I have to endure stretch mode.
[07:55:44] <umccullough> yeah, that was jfreeman he quoted IIRC
[07:56:03] <umccullough> and on my Dell GX270 - Haiku supports pretty much all the hardware out of the box
[07:56:26] <aroman> wait... so the self hosting is NOT a joke, right? I hope....
[07:56:55] <umccullough> heh
[07:57:00] * umccullough shrugs
[07:57:26] <umccullough> I haven't seen it with my own eyes yet - but pretty much the same day it was announced, a bunch of tweaks were made to the kernel that apparently busted stuff again
[07:57:44] <ari-free> it is remarkable the haiku project lasted this long to get up to this point
[07:57:45] <umccullough> the VFS was messed with, and then the cache
[07:58:03] <aroman> how can I install jam in a different location?
[07:58:11] <umccullough> just copy it wherever you want it
[07:58:16] <aroman> jam0?
[07:58:19] <umccullough> yeah
[07:58:22] <aroman> ok
[07:58:28] <umccullough> sudo mv jam0 /usr/bin/hjam
[07:58:31] <umccullough> or whatever you want
[07:58:45] <aroman> no --prefix=? :P
[07:58:52] <umccullough> just run make
[07:58:57] <aroman> I did
[07:59:00] <aroman> built fine
[07:59:01] <umccullough> then copy it - just a single binary
[07:59:09] <aroman> k
[07:59:19] <umccullough> you can install it with ./jam0 install
[07:59:26] <umccullough> i don't think there's an install rule in the makefile
[07:59:33] <umccullough> only in the jamfile
[07:59:43] <umccullough> but just copying it works fine
[08:00:35] * umccullough is reinstalling his dell gx270 with an 80gb sata disk
[08:00:56] <umccullough> should be an improvement over the crappy 40gb UDMA disk i had :/
[08:01:09] <umccullough> damn thing booted slower than my laptop
[08:02:05] * umccullough hesitates for a minute realizing there was some stuff on that 40gb disk he needed
[08:02:13] <umccullough> shit.
[08:02:34] <aroman> did you format it?
[08:02:42] <umccullough> no
[08:02:46] <umccullough> but...
[08:02:57] <umccullough> the problem is - it took me 20 goddamn minutes to get the other disk into this machine
[08:03:02] <aroman> :(
[08:03:09] <umccullough> because it's a slim case that's all tight and nasty inside
[08:03:18] <ddew|bofh> (away
[08:03:29] <ddew|bofh> good morning
[08:03:29] <umccullough> )away!
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[08:07:57] <umccullough> this isn't gonna be pretty... the files I need are on a BFS partition
[08:08:10] <umccullough> guess i'll have to swap the disk back in :(
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[08:17:50] <ddew|bofh> aw man, ingo's work seriously impresses me.
[08:18:45] <ddew|bofh> porting even seemingly easy apps is a dependency spiral
[08:19:11] <umccullough> yeah, he just goes and adds whatever is needed to Haiku :)
[08:19:34] <umccullough> must be nice to have that sort of confidence
[08:19:39] <ddew|bofh> indeed
[08:20:02] <ddew|bofh> i'm thinking of prodding him so he gets openssh running again
[08:21:14] <ddew|bofh> i gave building it a few shots, replacing bits of their autoconf setup but to no avail
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[08:49:37] <Kokito> hello folks
[08:49:46] <ddew|bofh> good morning
[08:49:47] <ari-free> hi
[08:50:07] <Kokito> good evening ddew|bofh & ari-free
[08:50:40] <ddew|bofh> ok, this might sound silly. but doesn't "using namespace std;" work on gcc4 or what?
[08:52:34] <ddew|bofh> r24756 is a gcc4 build-fix and it changes nothrow to std::nothrow, am i missing some obvious thing here?
[08:52:56] * ddew|bofh hasn't memorized all the standard c++ libraries...yet
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[08:53:56] <Kokito> hey slaad
[08:54:05] <Kokito> how is it going?
[08:54:28] <slaad> Beep.
[08:54:31] <slaad> Not too bad.
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[09:00:32] <cshaiku> slaaaaaaaaaaaaaad
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[09:06:10] <Kokito> cshaiku = chris simon by any chance?
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[09:08:00] * umccullough is falling asleep in the chair so it's time for bed
[09:08:14] <ddew|bofh> heh, nighty night
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[09:13:35] <cshaiku> that's me, Kokito
[09:13:46] <cshaiku> Chris Simmons (two m's! :)
[09:13:56] <Kokito> hello stranger :) this is Koki
[09:14:00] <cshaiku> heyas
[09:14:01] <cshaiku> ltns
[09:14:08] <Kokito> indeed
[09:14:13] <cshaiku> I read your article over on osnews, nice stuff
[09:14:18] <Kokito> good to see you are alive
[09:14:29] <Kokito> cshaiku: which one?
[09:14:30] <cshaiku> yeah, I'm better, back in Canada, and starting to get that itch
[09:14:47] <cshaiku> the Haiku one. :P
[09:14:48] <Kokito> where in Canada?
[09:14:53] <cshaiku> Edmonton, Alberta
[09:15:02] <Kokito> is that home for you?
[09:15:05] <cshaiku> yup
[09:15:07] <Kokito> cool
[09:15:08] <cshaiku> born and raised
[09:15:23] <cshaiku> then moved to PEI for four years, that's where I first discovered BeOS one day in 1998
[09:15:32] <Kokito> nice. so I guess that's a good thing :)
[09:15:34] <cshaiku> omg, 10 years ago this coming June!?!? wtf
[09:15:41] <cshaiku> ok, that's my return article on hnn
[09:15:51] <Kokito> yeah, we are all getting old :P
[09:15:54] <cshaiku> frack me
[09:16:01] <cshaiku> 10 years ago, I discovered BeOS
[09:16:23] <Kokito> is hnn making a come back?
[09:16:31] <cshaiku> you bet
[09:16:42] <Kokito> couldn't be a better time
[09:16:51] <cshaiku> http://osnews.com/story/19537/Haiku_Article_in_Software_Design_Magazine
[09:16:54] <cshaiku> that article
[09:17:10] <Kokito> yes, I figured :)
[09:17:11] <cshaiku> I had to take a serious break from it all, you understand
[09:17:33] <Kokito> yes, of course
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[09:22:58] <Stargater> moin
[09:23:04] <cshaiku> moin moin
[09:23:05] <Kokito> morgen Stargater
[09:23:14] <cshaiku> hoe gaat het?
[09:23:19] <Stargater> hey Kokito :-)
[09:24:21] <Kokito> Stargater, before you ask: the bebook and be newsletters will become available for download when Simon Kennedy is done with doing some little tweaking.
[09:24:32] <Kokito> :)
[09:24:52] <Stargater> oh nice :-)
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[09:26:50] <Kokito> hello Al2O3
[09:26:59] <Al2O3> hello
[09:27:11] <Al2O3> chris, what up
[09:27:20] <Al2O3> long time dude.
[09:28:55] <Al2O3> just for fun here, while looking for some laundry on Bush, found this site rather funny and twisted.  Particularly the 'excited' photo of our VP.
[09:28:56] <Al2O3> http://mindprod.com/politics/bushismsgay.html#GAY
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[09:30:58] <cshaiku> how goes?
[09:31:05] <cshaiku> Al2O3: what nick do I know you by from BeShare?
[09:31:35] <cshaiku> dang it.. he left?
[09:32:19] <Al2O3> nah I"m here
[09:32:19] <Kokito> Al2O3 is still here cshaiku
[09:32:20] <Al2O3> what up dog
[09:32:24] <Al2O3> moof
[09:32:27] <cshaiku> heh
[09:32:30] <Al2O3> lets see, hmmmmmmmm.
[09:32:52] <Al2O3> how can I say with without being like Albert Einstein's brother...?
[09:32:57] <Al2O3> (the clue is in the clue)
[09:33:06] <Al2O3> 3 riddles removed.
[09:33:08] <Al2O3> ;0
[09:33:13] <cshaiku> no idea
[09:33:18] <Al2O3> lol
[09:33:19] <cshaiku> sorry, its been years?
[09:33:26] <Al2O3> yes, a few
[09:33:58] <slaad> cshaiku ?
[09:34:08] <cshaiku> <-- Technix in a former life
[09:34:11] <Kokito> TN
[09:34:15] <Al2O3> ok, did albert einstein have a brother, no.  So that would leave maybe some other albert einstein...  maybe albert brooks.
[09:34:17] <slaad> Ahar. That rings a bell.
[09:34:28] <cshaiku> hehe
[09:34:51] <Al2O3> ok, so albert brooks has a brother, by the name of Bob Einstein.
[09:35:00] <Al2O3> and he played a character on Bizarre.
[09:35:08] <Al2O3> that should give you the clue you need ;)
[09:35:24] <cshaiku> What does the color purple smell like in your world?
[09:35:28] <Al2O3> lol
[09:35:37] <Al2O3> just wanted to see if you'd figure it out.
[09:35:50] <Al2O3> SJB, SDO, BBT maybe...  anyway, how you doing?
[09:35:53] <cshaiku> nope... I'm so weary from fighting a flu recently, I don't know.
[09:36:02] <cshaiku> SJB sounds familiar
[09:36:03] <Al2O3> sorry to hear you are not doing well.
[09:36:12] <Al2O3> super dave osbourne :)
[09:36:21] <Al2O3> sdo.dyndns.org  :)  quad dell 6100
[09:36:33] <Al2O3> pretty funny to find you loafin around here, you still using Haiku?
[09:36:56] <cshaiku> I'm not using it, but I'm keeping an eye on things
[09:36:58] <Al2O3> aren't you up in the Nederlands or something?  Moved from the US to there?  Thought that was you.
[09:37:08] <Al2O3> Iceland, Finland, Holland?
[09:37:13] <Al2O3> some X-land?
[09:37:16] <cshaiku> I moved from PEI to The Netherlands from 2002 - 2006
[09:37:25] <cshaiku> and move from NL to Edmonton, Alberta, in 2006
[09:37:26] <Al2O3> you are back then.
[09:37:30] <Al2O3> ah...
[09:37:31] <cshaiku> I'm back in CA, yeah
[09:37:45] <cshaiku> I work here now: http://www.tera-byte.com
[09:37:46] <Al2O3> how was it there?
[09:37:50] <cshaiku> in NL? awesome
[09:38:06] <cshaiku> overall, awesome. I struggled on 50 euros a month, at times, but it was awesome
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[09:38:23] <cshaiku> made some really good friends, whom I still keep in contact with weekly, etc.
[09:38:59] <cshaiku> I miss Zathros, at the end of my time there, he was very ill
[09:42:06] <surrounder> lawl
[09:42:11] <surrounder> cshaiku: where did you live in nl ?
[09:43:33] <Kokito> Zathros? that rings a bell... from beshare perhaps?
[09:43:34] <cshaiku> Rotterdam
[09:43:47] <cshaiku> Kokito: yeah, that was Ted Leuwenstein (spelling)
[09:43:47] <surrounder> eek :P
[09:44:03] <cshaiku> if you'll remember, he was diagnosed with a life threatening disease
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[09:44:21] <andybe> Morning every body
[09:44:22] <Kokito> poor soul. I did not know that...
[09:44:23] <cshaiku> a couple of years ago, I wrote about it for our community to know, maybe send him some email, money, etc.
[09:44:23] <surrounder> :<
[09:45:03] <Kokito> ah, now that you mention it, I may have read about it cshaiku
[09:45:15] <MichaelHenry> Is Zathros still sick?
[09:46:18] <cshaiku> http://haikunews.org/index.php?id=259
[09:46:40] <cshaiku> that was back in 2003, but when I left NL in 2006, he wasn't doing so well, iirc
[09:47:22] <cshaiku> see http://haikunews.org/index.php?id=352 also
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[09:58:36] <Kokito> ok folks, time for the old man to get some sleep
[09:58:39] <Kokito> good night all
[09:58:52] <cshaiku> laters
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[10:10:52] <Al2O3> cs, you doing windows now?
[10:13:22] <cshaiku> been doing windows for years, unfortunately.
[10:13:33] <cshaiku> but, I do CentOS a lot these days from work, my colo runs it, etc.
[10:14:00] <ari-free> CentOS the Freshmaker. hmmm so what is centOS
[10:14:08] <cshaiku> a good distro
[10:14:17] <cshaiku> its forked from rhel
[10:14:51] <ari-free> how is it different
[10:15:06] <cshaiku> hrm... its more server centric than usual redhat flair
[10:15:20] <cshaiku> has yum, which rocks
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[10:18:46] <cshaiku> ok, the latest csi ny is retarded, technologically speaking
[10:18:53] <cshaiku> recursive spider??!!?? wtf
[10:19:22] <ari-free> wow even our bugs are high tech
[10:19:53] <ari-free> that explains the other day when I saw a pigeon with an iphone
[10:20:50] <ddew|bofh> well if csi:ny was more "techy" a majority of the viewers would feel like they're left out
[10:22:47] <ari-free> reminds me of 24. oh I just pressed alt control F12 and that fixed the kerberos problem
[10:24:03] <ddew|bofh> heh, it's entertainment. if you worry about technical accuracy you have way too much time on your hands :)
[10:24:54] <CIA-47> axeld * r24762 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/fs/devfs.cpp:
[10:24:54] <CIA-47> * Renamed publish_node() to new_node().
[10:24:54] <CIA-47> * Introduced a new publish_node() which then actually publishs the node,
[10:24:54] <CIA-47>  similar to the VFS's new_vnode(), and publish_vnode() semantics.
[10:24:57] <cshaiku> geez, nice advertising for Cisco
[10:25:26] <ddew|bofh> product placement ftw :)
[10:25:29] <ddew|bofh> dell and cisco
[10:25:35] <cshaiku> yeah
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[10:30:48] <ddew|bofh> ls
[10:30:50] <ddew|bofh> oops
[10:34:03] <cshaiku> heh.. wrong window?
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[10:35:41] <ddew|bofh> actually the wrong computer :)
[10:36:23] <cshaiku> nice.. lol
[10:37:02] <ddew|bofh> i'm starting to suspect that haiku's bugged out on me. i've been stuck doing an rm -rf for quite a while now
[10:37:22] <ddew|bofh> either that or it just is way slow on when deleting many files
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[10:50:59] <CIA-47> stippi * r24763 /haiku/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs):
[10:50:59] <CIA-47> Applied patch by James Woodcock:
[10:50:59] <CIA-47> * Implemented POSIX getpagesize() function in libroot.
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[11:04:14] <CIA-47> stippi * r24764 /haiku/trunk/src/kits/tracker/ (CountView.cpp CountView.h):
[11:04:14] <CIA-47> Applied patch by Christof Lutteroth:
[11:04:14] <CIA-47> * The count/info view in Tracker truncates the text in a better way when
[11:04:14] <CIA-47>  it does not fit, and also used the space of the barber pool when it isn't
[11:04:14] <CIA-47>  displayed.
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[11:17:33] <Stargater> re
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[12:19:08] <CIA-47> stippi * r24766 /haiku/trunk/src/tools/generate_boot_screen.cpp:
[12:19:08] <CIA-47> * Changed the generate_boot_screen build tool to take placement parameters
[12:19:08] <CIA-47>  for the logo and the icons separately.
[12:19:08] <CIA-47> * Image data output uses full line width.
[12:23:05] <CIA-47> stippi * r24767 /haiku/trunk/src/tools/generate_boot_screen.cpp: * Renamed placement constants to fit into the existing scheme.
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[12:52:57] <ddew|bofh> anyone here having problems with dev.haiku-os.org?
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[13:21:03] <CIA-47> axeld * r24768 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/cache/block_cache.cpp: (log message trimmed)
[13:21:03] <CIA-47> * Decoupled notifications from the block cache functions; they are now
[13:21:03] <CIA-47>  called without having the cache's lock held.
[13:21:03] <CIA-47> * The only downside to this approach is that ending a transaction now needs
[13:21:03] <CIA-47>  additional memory, and might therefore fail - that could be fixed by
[13:21:04] <CIA-47>  allocating that memory upfront with the start of the new transaction,
[13:21:08] <CIA-47>  though.
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[13:22:16] <CIA-47> axeld * r24769 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/cache/block_cache.cpp: * Removed the "transaction_changed" leftover member.
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[13:36:10] <ddew|bofh> lo dead
[13:36:57] <DeadYak> hiya
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[14:03:17] <andybe> hello mmu_man
[14:04:14] <mmu_man> plop
[14:04:44] <andybe> plup makes the fish.
[14:05:03] <andybe> mmu_man: big steps as i can see. wonderfull.
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[14:19:57] <ddew|bofh> gah, a kingdom for a working ahci driver
[14:20:05] <CIA-47> axeld * r24770 /haiku/trunk/src/kits/tracker/CountView.cpp: Cleanup.
[14:24:57] <andybe> ddew|bofh: huhu
[14:25:21] <andybe> ddew|bofh: wich board you are using?
[14:26:05] <ddew|bofh> gigabyte p35-ds3r
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[14:31:23] <stpere> morning
[14:31:40] <Ingenu> any card that need a heatpipe is a proof of lame design
[14:31:45] <Ingenu> (motherboard)
[14:32:11] <Ingenu> well same is true for any other hardware IMO, I'm pretty much sick of turning my money into hot air ;p
[14:32:30] <Ingenu> not like I don't appreciate hot air during a cold winter ;)
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[14:34:42] <ddew|bofh> Ingenu: your point being? the only heatsink on this mobo is a normal aluminium heatsink without a fan
[14:34:51] <Begasus> afternoon peeps
[14:35:11] <Ingenu> wait, I have to make a point ? ^^
[14:35:18] <Ingenu> just random thoughts that's all
[14:35:36] <Ingenu> expressing my displeasure of the current hardware industry trend
[14:35:58] <ddew|bofh> ah, my bad. i interpreted it as a jab at my mobo :)
[14:37:23] <Ingenu> ah no the P35 chipset is one of the last not to require heat pipes and all
[14:38:20] <andybe> aha
[14:38:24] <ddew|bofh> doesn't surprise me the slightest, they're putting more and more into the chips
[14:38:56] <ddew|bofh> reduce the chipcount at the expense of heat
[14:39:09] <CIA-47> axeld * r24771 /haiku/trunk/src/ (2 files in 2 dirs):
[14:39:09] <CIA-47> * I'm not sure if that puts more or less pressure on stippi, but the
[14:39:09] <CIA-47>  PackageInstaller, ZipOMatic, and the Expander now all have the same
[14:39:09] <CIA-47>  icon (instead of none, resp. a BeOS bitmap icon).
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[14:41:21] <stpere> hi bga, mmu_man
[14:41:50] <mmu_man> re
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[14:49:57] <MindChild> Thom_Holwerda: That "slothness" that SkyOS has is because it is built with debug info. The same reason most MS beta OS's feel slow
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[15:03:22] <Thom_Holwerda> MindChild: im not speaking of that slowness.
[15:14:04] <MindChild> o
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[15:37:17] <cshaiku> blarg
[15:39:26] <helf> HI
[15:39:38] <cshaiku> hey helf
[15:39:40] <cshaiku> how goes?
[15:39:52] <helf> tired, just got to work
[15:39:54] <cshaiku> I remember you from BeShare... :)
[15:39:58] <helf> :)
[15:39:59] <cshaiku> <-- Technix
[15:40:03] <helf> oh! hi :P
[15:40:13] <helf> honestly, I seriously miss beshare.
[15:40:17] <cshaiku> yeah, it was awesome
[15:40:27] <cshaiku> you know what.... I just had a thought. :P
[15:40:29] <helf> when haiku gets released, lets all move back to it :P
[15:41:28] <plfiorini> yay tomorrow the shop will deliver me a new hdd
[15:41:38] <plfiorini> hope i will be able to install haiku!
[15:44:15] *** jiuda_D`arkness is now known as Barrett666
[15:44:21] * stpere is preparing to move out :)
[15:44:35] <stpere> aahh.. broadband.. :)
[15:45:16] <helf> cshaiku, what was your thought ? :)
[15:45:33] <cshaiku> I don't have a copy handy of anything that can connect to a muscle server... but, who wants to try connecting to the muscle server I just setup?
[15:46:28] <helf> i can
[15:46:32] <cshaiku> hit cshaiku.com
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[15:48:06] <helf> connected
[15:48:17] <cshaiku> cool, so you should be the only one there
[15:48:23] <helf> yep
[15:48:28] <cshaiku> well, glad to know that it just worked like so.
[15:48:34] <cshaiku> its' been a while since I touched muscle
[15:48:41] <cshaiku> that sounded bad. :P
[15:48:47] <helf> :P
[15:48:50] <helf> go to the gym
[15:48:53] <cshaiku> indeed.
[15:49:05] <helf> I havent used beshare in ages
[15:49:21] <cshaiku> same
[15:49:35] <cshaiku> I hope BeShare works on Haiku like it did on BeOS.
[15:49:45] <cshaiku> we need a new name though, maybe?
[15:49:48] <cshaiku> HaShare?
[15:49:51] <cshaiku> HaSH?
[15:49:54] <cshaiku> heh
[15:50:48] <DeadYak> I never really got the appeal of beshare myself
[15:50:59] <stpere> Harakira would be a good name for kill!
[15:51:12] <helf> silence, infidel!
[15:51:15] <cshaiku> guess it was before your time, DeadYak ?
[15:51:18] * helf mutes deadyak
[15:51:27] <cshaiku> we used it to talk with Be Inc. devs all the time
[15:51:49] * cshaiku used it to spread beos secrets. :P
[15:51:52] <helf> beshare really wasn't too different from IRC.. but i like it more :P
[15:52:04] * helf has fond memories
[15:52:10] <cshaiku> yeah, good times
[15:52:15] <helf> like the secret trade of beos warez ;)
[15:52:16] <DeadYak> cshaiku: before my time?
[15:52:22] <cshaiku> indeed
[15:52:23] <helf> i met deadyak in beshare
[15:52:32] <helf> he was there long before me :p
[15:52:33] <DeadYak> cshaiku: I'm hazarding a guess you don't realize who I am...
[15:52:47] <cshaiku> the name doesn't ring too many bells
[15:52:59] <DeadYak> Rene...you rode to BG with me and Frans once
[15:53:09] <cshaiku> oh! :)
[15:53:14] <cshaiku> salut!
[15:53:18] <DeadYak> so yeah, hardly before my time :P
[15:53:28] <DeadYak> I just didn't need it much for file sharing and thought it sucked as a chat interface :)
[15:53:28] <stpere> cshaiku: allo :)
[15:53:31] <cshaiku> well, pff... you didn't hang out there as much as we did! :)
[15:53:50] <cshaiku> well, you frenchies were always too picky anyhow.
[15:53:51] <cshaiku> :)
[15:53:55] <DeadYak> I'm...not french :P
[15:54:06] <DeadYak> despite my first name
[15:55:59] <cshaiku> are you not same Rene as beosfrance?
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[15:56:45] <helf> deadyak is austrian, right?
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[15:56:53] <cshaiku> I have no idea now
[15:56:56] <helf> austrian without the cool accent
[15:57:12] <cshaiku> what was your old BeShare nick then, DeadYak ?
[15:57:22] <helf> deadyak
[15:57:23] * cshaiku hates his memory
[15:57:24] <helf> :P
[15:57:27] <cshaiku> blarg
[15:57:29] <helf> iirc
[15:57:42] <cshaiku> really? wow, I really don't remember that
[15:57:52] <DeadYak> cshaiku: AnEvilYak
[15:57:58] <helf> oooh
[15:58:01] <cshaiku> AH.. hehe, THAT I remember
[15:58:06] <cshaiku> see.. I knew it was different
[15:58:08] <helf> i was sitting here trying to remember if it actually was deadyak
[15:58:11] <helf> heh
[15:58:32] <cshaiku> you were the one living in Austria that offered to put me up for a few days when I went backpacking, right?
[15:58:42] <DeadYak> mm..no
[15:58:45] <helf> how was that backpacking trip?
[15:58:47] <DeadYak> haven't lived in Austria since 1985 :P
[15:58:57] <helf> two years before i was born
[15:58:58] <helf> ^_^
[15:59:32] <DeadYak> at the time of that car ride to BG I was living in Belgium though
[15:59:41] <helf> i think this is about the only handle I have ever used online
[16:00:45] <cshaiku> so, what is your last name, Rene?
[16:01:07] <andybe> bga: question....is there a way to use the gcc 4 direcly in haiku, normal only 2.95 works as i know....
[16:01:10] <cshaiku> helf, it was awesome... I have all the pics on facebook
[16:01:23] <helf> i want to do that sooo badly
[16:01:30] <helf> what countries did you go through?
[16:01:32] <cshaiku> andybe: from the sounds of it, that'll be a possibility eventually, but you might want to ask on one of the dev mailing lists
[16:01:38] <helf> did you go to vandersex?
[16:01:39] <helf> ;)
[16:02:16] <cshaiku> helf: started from NL, then Germany, Switzerland, Italy, France, Belgium, Luxemburg, and back to Rotterdam
[16:02:23] <cshaiku> no, didn't go there. :)
[16:02:29] <helf> how long did it take?
[16:02:39] <cshaiku> holy freck.. got lots of incoming tickets to take care of, gotta jet
[16:02:42] <cshaiku> 17 days
[16:02:45] <helf> fun
[16:02:46] <helf> cya
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[16:02:55] <cshaiku> yeh, I'll be around
[16:03:08] <cshaiku> working at an ISP has its ups and downs
[16:03:16] <DeadYak> andybe: gcc4 hasn't been ported to Haiku yet
[16:03:35] <andybe> DeadYak: but it works allready in cross mode!
[16:03:43] <andybe> its not far from that
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[16:03:47] <DeadYak> andybe: that's not the same as porting it to Haiku
[16:03:48] <uranium> gcc4 is very important to haiku dev... they should ported as soon as possible... but there are too many linux developer...
[16:03:49] <Hugen_> hi all
[16:03:52] <Hugen_> hi aljen
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[16:08:51] <mmu_man>  [16:04] <mmu_man> you didn't copy the whole UserBuildConfig.ReadMe did you ?
[16:08:52] <mmu_man>  [16:05] <(anonymized)> i did
[16:08:53] <mmu_man>  [16:05] <(anonymized)> just renamed it
[16:08:53] <mmu_man>  [16:05] <(anonymized)> and removed the ReadMe
[16:09:59] <DeadYak> whoops
[16:10:25] <PulkoMandy> aren't readme files meant to be read ?
[16:10:50] <DeadYak> .Readme contains every possible option you can put in that file iirc :)
[16:10:57] <DeadYak> not necessarily with useful values when used together
[16:11:21] * DeadYak is scared to ask what would result if he did MV LINT GENERIC on FreeBSD and tried to build a kernel off that
[16:11:45] <DeadYak> s/LINT/whatever that file's called nowadays/
[16:11:54] <DeadYak> iirc the name changed in more recent revs but I don't remember
[16:14:31] <CIA-47> axeld * r24772 /haiku/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs):
[16:14:31] <CIA-47> Looks like some bloke forgot to commit *some* files that should have been part
[16:14:31] <CIA-47> of r24768 (block cache notification mechanism rewrite).
[16:14:31] <CIA-47> Thanks for the note, Vasilis!
[16:14:41] <helf> LOL
[16:14:42] <helf> thats awesome
[16:15:37] <DeadYak> "some bloke" named Axel? :)
[16:15:45] <stpere> ;-)
[16:17:32] * DeadYak wonders if Axel intentionally quoted the name of a Britney Spears song in his reply on the commit list just now
[16:19:24] <helf> what song title?
[16:19:51] <DeadYak> "Oops, I did it again"
[16:20:27] <helf> oh, right
[16:20:37] <helf> my stations phone is jacked up
[16:20:52] <helf> its a completely digital system and im just getting garbled static
[16:21:28] <helf> they are redoing some phone lines aparently...
[16:21:39] <helf> mines the only one jacked up. hope they didnt screw something up again
[16:23:00] <helf> hm, most of its functions still work.. you just cant hear anything over the BRAAAA A A A A ZZZZZ noise
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[16:24:15] <matthewpoer> users
[16:24:29] <stpere> hi matthew
[16:24:41] <stpere> developpers, developpers, developpers..
[16:24:41] <helf> huh, unplugged it and replugged it in and now its working..
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[16:24:44] <matthewpoer> hello. sorry, I meant the irc command users
[16:24:50] <stpere> :)
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[16:25:42] <CIA-47> stippi * r24773 /haiku/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed)
[16:25:42] <CIA-47> * Revised boot splash artwork, the logo is back in the lower right corner,
[16:25:42] <CIA-47>  the icons are centered.
[16:25:42] <CIA-47> * The boot loader and kernel now use the placement info that
[16:25:42] <CIA-47>  generate_boot_screen now generates.
[16:25:43] <CIA-47> * Made the code that draws the images handle the case where any of the images
[16:25:47] <CIA-47>  is larger than the frame buffer.
[16:27:09] <matthewpoer> OkAY so i've heard of this BeOS stuff and I've got haiku running in qemu. Is there a web browser?
[16:27:28] <stpere> firefox runs on it, but isn't included
[16:27:33] <stpere> you need the port tho
[16:27:45] <emitrax> matthewpoer: firefox shuold work
[16:28:05] <matthewpoer> Can i wget it from somewhere or what?
[16:28:39] <ddew|bofh> o/
[16:29:06] <ddew|bofh> wish Haiku was as stable on my workstation as it is on my experimental box :)
[16:29:15] <mmu_man> matthewpoer meanwhile wget http://revolf.free.fr/beos/links-beos-bin.zip
[16:29:24] <matthewpoer> links runs :D
[16:29:41] <ddew|bofh> i've been using it heavily the whole day, web-browsing, email and multimedia :)
[16:31:25] <matthewpoer> what about an irc client?
[16:31:57] <helf> ddew|bofh, and its running fine?
[16:32:10] <ddew|bofh> it's running perfectly
[16:32:16] <helf> wow.. hm
[16:32:20] <helf> how much ram is it usuing?
[16:32:22] <helf> using
[16:32:49] <ddew|bofh> roughly 150 megs
[16:32:53] <helf> hm
[16:33:24] <ddew|bofh> it's hard to give an exact figure, with the cache and so on
[16:33:27] <helf> i should install it on something :P
[16:33:36] <helf> think it
[16:33:51] <helf> *it'll run on a 250mhz pentium 1 mmx with 512mb of ram?
[16:34:02] <helf> 250mhz/100mhz fsb
[16:34:13] <ddew|bofh> can't imagine it wouldn't work
[16:34:20] <helf> hmmm
[16:34:25] <ddew|bofh> i've used it with 256mb ram
[16:34:36] <helf> maybe ill give it a shot later
[16:34:37] <ddew|bofh> but i really want it on my workstation
[16:34:37] <stpere> our shop will sell air guitars o_O
[16:34:41] <helf> does haiku support usb mice?
[16:35:10] <ddew|bofh> i think it does, but i use a ps2 converter for my kbd and mouse
[16:35:16] <DeadYak> helf: depends on if your USB controller's supported
[16:35:21] <DeadYak> my OHCI one isn't, so no mice for me
[16:35:21] <helf> hm
[16:35:36] <helf> my p-mmx machine only has usb and an AT port.. no ps/2
[16:35:37] <matthewpoer> In most linux distros, there is an application repository where there is a ton of software pre-configured and compiled for that environment. is there something similar for haiku, or do i just download things randomly like windows?
[16:35:57] <ddew|bofh> sounds like you have an older controller then
[16:36:08] <helf> the usb is a pci card
[16:36:15] <helf> ill have to check it later
[16:36:18] <ddew|bofh> usb2?
[16:36:24] <helf> i thikn its 1.1
[16:36:27] <DeadYak> matthewpoer: most BeOS-related software can be found at www.bebits.com
[16:36:38] <DeadYak> matthewpoer: to answer your question though, no, Haiku doesn't use a package manager
[16:36:41] <CIA-47> axeld * r24774 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/HaikuImage:
[16:36:41] <CIA-47> Added syskonnect driver to the build to close ticket #1945 again that
[16:36:41] <CIA-47> diver reopened so fast.
[16:36:44] <helf> anyone tested bebattle in haiku, yet? :P
[16:37:22] <ddew|bofh> give me a few minutes and i'll give it a go :)
[16:38:33] <ddew|bofh> minor rendering glitches in the UI but it runs just fine
[16:39:03] <helf> sweet
[16:39:03] <helf> :D
[16:39:06] <helf> i LOVE that game
[16:39:20] <ddew|bofh> hehe
[16:40:41] <helf> I might have to learn to code just to update it
[16:40:58] <mmu_man> http://www.nasa.gov/55644main_NASATV_Windows.asx ATV docking to ISS
[16:41:00] <helf> it needs network play for multiple players, more pieces, different pieces... :P
[16:41:07] <mmu_man> (vlc plays that in beos)
[16:41:12] * JonathanThompson meows violently at helf
[16:41:19] <matthewpoer> what is the default text editor command?
[16:41:29] <helf> hey JonathanThompson
[16:41:54] <helf> textedit ?
[16:42:11] * JonathanThompson laughs at some Ars poster thinking that when Intel sold XScale off, they got out of embedded processors...
[16:42:22] <DeadYak> matthewpoer: CLI or GUI?
[16:42:29] <matthewpoer> oh,i guess its the styled edit..
[16:42:35] <matthewpoer> either one would work for me
[16:42:41] <mmu_man> JonathanThompson wrong
[16:42:42] <DeadYak> there's vi in there as well I believe
[16:42:49] <mmu_man> they still have 80286
[16:42:56] <mmu_man> it's used in mars robots
[16:43:00] <mmu_man> very embedded :)
[16:43:07] <DeadYak> matthewpoer: as for IRC clients, wget http://vision.sf.net/Vision-0.9.7-H-30032008.zip
[16:43:08] <JonathanThompson> They also (last I knew) had 8 bit processors/controllers.
[16:43:29] <JonathanThompson> Why put a 286 in a microwave, when a 4004 is more than required?
[16:45:10] <matthewpoer> thanks, DeadYak
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[16:45:36] <JonathanThompson> I'd bet there's far more Intel 8 bit processors in embedded applications than any other # of bits.
[16:45:54] *** matthewpoer has quit IRC
[16:47:40] <zlominus> JonathanThompson: 8051 is preaty popular amoung MCUs too
[16:47:47] <zlominus> *pretty
[16:48:00] <helf> 8051?
[16:48:05] <JonathanThompson> Yes, I remember writing or assisting in writing code for one in 95-96: my point exactly.
[16:48:22] <JonathanThompson> I think perhaps it was an 8751 part number because it had embedded eeprom...
[16:49:02] <JonathanThompson> It was just powerful enough as it was, with a little care, to analyze ECC/EDC for a 2X CD-ROM drive.
[16:49:20] <JonathanThompson> Well, actually, read that stuff off...
[16:50:04] <JonathanThompson> And I bet there's still far more microwaves, washers and dryers and other small appliances with CPUs in them than there are media devices :)
[16:50:49] *** matthewpoer has joined #haiku
[16:50:59] <matthewpoer> I made it :)
[16:51:40] <helf> my friends toaster has a processor
[16:52:04] <DeadYak> cool
[16:52:38] <helf> kinda sad
[16:52:38] <helf> :P
[16:52:45] * matthewpoer is idle: BRB
[16:54:12] <zlominus> At uni they are teaching us x86 asm and 8051 MCUs ... x86 is ancient, but lots of asm is the same for modern CPUs
[16:54:13] <helf> theres this guy that comes in all the time and he wears those SUPER dark, bono sunglasses
[16:54:24] <helf> what is an 8051?
[16:54:41] <DeadYak> helf: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8051
[16:54:42] <mmu_man> "smooth docking of the ATV" :)
[16:55:01] <ddew|bofh> excellent :)
[16:56:23] <helf> man
[16:56:26] <helf> i cant listen to it :(
[16:56:30] <helf> i HATE working the helldesk
[16:56:47] <DeadYak> listen to what?
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[16:58:24] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o JBurton
[16:58:33] <helf> heh, 128bytes of ram on that chip
[16:58:40] <cshaiku> hey Jack
[16:58:41] <helf> deadyak, the nasa feed
[16:58:48] <JBurton> cshaiku yo
[16:58:52] <cshaiku> whats goin on
[16:58:58] <DeadYak> helf: oh
[16:59:04] <DeadYak> JBurton: long time :)
[16:59:07] <CIA-47> mmu_man * r24775 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/UserBuildConfig.ReadMe: Just make sure someone copying it as UserBuildConfig will understand what is wrong and where instead of reporting build breakage induced by their misbehaviour.
[16:59:16] <mmu_man> hopefully that'd do it
[16:59:21] <helf> I want to get to stand in the control room observe :P
[16:59:24] <JBurton> DeadYak yeah :=)
[16:59:56] <helf> heh.. "i renamed it and removed the readme"
[17:00:19] <cshaiku> maybe make a .sample instead of .readme
[17:00:25] <mmu_man> there is a .sample
[17:00:30] <mmu_man> much smaller
[17:00:40] <cshaiku> then remove the .
[17:01:16] <mmu_man> it only has a subset of the possible things fromthe readme
[17:01:17] <helf> you know, i dont understand why people seem to think thin clients will take off
[17:01:20] <mmu_man> but commented out
[17:01:23] *** jiuda_D`arkness has joined #haiku
[17:01:32] <cshaiku> or move that documentation to a folder and in that folder, have proper documentation
[17:01:33] <mmu_man> helf they do
[17:02:06] <mmu_man> I showed VNC years ago at school... they found it so nice they bought expensive Citrix clients with a dual NT server instead :F
[17:02:07] <mmu_man> :D
[17:02:14] <cshaiku> lol
[17:02:22] <mmu_man> plain bs
[17:02:42] <cshaiku> you ever have to work with Citrix?
[17:02:45] <cshaiku> it sucks balls
[17:03:21] <JBurton> cshaiku really ? my boss always talks well about it
[17:03:31] <MindChild> Citrix kicks ass
[17:03:34] <DeadYak> I know lots of people that are absolutely in love with Citrix
[17:03:42] <cshaiku> no, it SUCKS horribly
[17:03:55] <MindChild> Yeah, if you don't love Citrix, you don't know how to use it
[17:03:56] <cshaiku> those people need to be shot
[17:03:58] <DeadYak> first time I've heard that :)
[17:04:14] <cshaiku> I'm telling you, from first hand experience at IBM, Citrix is fucking retarded
[17:04:16] <helf> i hate thinclients
[17:04:23] <cshaiku> pardon my french, :)
[17:04:27] <helf> heh
[17:04:36] <mmu_man> overpriced alienated RDP, that's it
[17:04:38] <MindChild> cshaiku: Don't hate us because you are incompotent
[17:04:49] <helf> mindchild is always to brash
[17:04:50] <cshaiku> I was not in charge of its deployment
[17:05:00] <cshaiku> I merely was forced to use it daily
[17:05:37] <DeadYak> mmu_man: I was under the impression RDP was based on Citrix, not the other way around
[17:05:54] <helf> rdp sucks :) im using it now
[17:05:55] <MindChild> cshaiku: So you were a user of a badly setup situation
[17:05:58] <cshaiku> their citrix server (one of the clients I worked for at the account), was also quite poorly secured. One could access all kinds of documents on the C: drive
[17:05:58] <helf> the laag.. the laaaag...
[17:06:01] <MindChild> that doesn't mean the product suck
[17:06:02] <MindChild> s
[17:06:08] *** Barrett666 has quit IRC
[17:06:08] *** jiuda_D`arkness is now known as Barrett666
[17:06:14] <cshaiku> MindChild: well, it definitely gave it a bad impression.
[17:06:21] <helf> network gets under a lot of load and it gets soo bad..
[17:06:24] <cshaiku> and citrix is based on rdp
[17:06:36] <MindChild> citrix is so much more than RDP
[17:06:39] <DeadYak> Citrix Winframe was around long before RDP was though
[17:06:57] <DeadYak> from what I recall MS licensed the proto from Citrix to create RDP
[17:07:09] <MindChild> you can even display windows apps on a webpage... like the windows app is on the server, but anyone with a decent browser can use it on a webpage
[17:07:14] <MindChild> I hope I explained that correctly
[17:07:17] <cshaiku> its an insidious relationship, to be sure, MS/Citrix
[17:07:24] <MindChild> there is also the SMB<->NFS
[17:07:32] <MindChild> man, I could go on all day
[17:07:33] <cshaiku> MindChild: lol... no, you mean MetaFrame, the launcher
[17:07:41] <helf> I guess if you have a good server(s), good thinclients nad a FAST network, it'd be OK.. for some things..
[17:07:41] <MindChild> cshaiku: no, I don't
[17:07:43] <cshaiku> you cannot display the app on a website, you can launch the app from the website.
[17:07:50] <MindChild> cshaiku: WRONG
[17:08:07] <cshaiku> it invokes a citrix window/session using metaframe protocal
[17:08:14] <MindChild> it CAN
[17:08:22] <cshaiku> so, I'm not wrong then
[17:08:24] <MindChild> it can also do apparently so much more than you are aware of
[17:08:31] <MindChild> not to mention what a developer can extend
[17:08:43] <cshaiku> guess I never got to see it in its glory then.
[17:08:54] <MindChild> that really is a shame
[17:08:58] * JonathanThompson lobs a Tandy M-100 at helf
[17:08:59] <cshaiku> it left a horrible taste in my mouth, really ran to VNC
[17:09:02] <helf> http://articles.techrepublic.com.com/5100-1035-1034859.html
[17:09:14] <helf> NFuse is what its called
[17:09:19] <helf> apparently
[17:09:26] <DeadYak> my experience with VNC is it uses WAY more bandwidth than RDP to do the same thing
[17:09:38] <helf> JonathanThompson, I own one that works perfectly still in an original carrying case with original manual ;)
[17:09:49] <helf> DeadYak, yeah, vnc is a lot worse than rpd
[17:09:50] <JonathanThompson> I was betting DeadYak you had one :D
[17:09:51] <helf> rdp
[17:09:58] <helf> heh
[17:10:12] <helf> ive used it for a console for my ss20 :)
[17:10:22] *** rcjsuen has quit IRC
[17:11:11] <helf> 40x8 kinda sucks for ssh though
[17:11:12] <helf> :P
[17:11:22] <helf> it was great for IRC
[17:11:29] <helf> the thing runs FOREVER on 4 AAs
[17:11:48] <JonathanThompson> I was just telling DeadYak that :)
[17:11:49] <helf> The same batteries have been in mine since i bought it, about 2-3 years ago..
[17:12:00] * helf hugs his trs-80 m100
[17:12:14] <helf> I want to get the enhanced ROMs for it and get the RAM upgraded
[17:12:48] <JonathanThompson> I remember a friend from church had one when they were new, who loved it.  He wasn't even good at tech stuff, but he loved the tech stuff :)
[17:13:04] <helf> heh
[17:13:07] * JonathanThompson notes the wikipedia entry doesn't even make a peep about them
[17:13:11] <helf> trs-80s are still in use
[17:13:20] <helf> the m100s and 102s, that is
[17:13:24] <JonathanThompson> What an amazing thing, that Wikipedia doesn't have them.
[17:13:26] <helf> the m100s are built better than the 102s
[17:13:31] <helf> they dont?
[17:13:35] <JonathanThompson> Nope.
[17:13:53] <JonathanThompson> I think the people editing that page are too young and not old-tech enough to have a clue :)
[17:13:53] <helf> http://articles.techrepublic.com.com/5100-1035-1034859.html
[17:13:54] <helf> er
[17:14:17] <JonathanThompson> Ok, not the m100 page :D
[17:14:19] <helf> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TRS-80_Model_100_line
[17:14:35] <DeadYak> helf: the Tandy page doesn't mention it though :)
[17:14:36] <helf> doesnt have a peep about what? the uopgrades?
[17:14:44] <JonathanThompson> I guess I didn't put in the right text search stuff :)
[17:14:55] <DeadYak> helf: the wikipedia page about Tandy doesn't mention it at all, just the TRS-80 and 1000/2000
[17:14:57] <helf> oh, the main tandy page doesnt mention them?
[17:14:59] <helf> wtf
[17:15:08] <JonathanThompson> Would have helped if I'd remembered the entire model number correctly :D
[17:15:08] <helf> this is why i dont trust the wikipedia :P
[17:15:30] <JonathanThompson> Yeah: all done by a bunch of amateurs and rated by jokers, you can't be too sure :)
[17:15:36] <stpere> someone saw stippi around lately? (I don't remember what is the IRC command to get the last see ..)
[17:15:50] <DeadYak> stpere: /ns info stippi
[17:16:07] <DeadYak> [10:15:56] -NickServ-           Last Seen: 2 days (1h 7m 10s) ago
[17:16:37] * JonathanThompson laughs at the price of the model 100
[17:16:54] <JonathanThompson> Remember: $1099 in 1983 dollars!
[17:17:46] <JonathanThompson> Wow, and the Tandy company home page doesn't mention it prominently, and neither does the Tandy wikipedia page, despite selling over 6 million???
[17:18:08] <zlominus> is there a jam build target that just update the raw image without building the whole stuff again ?
[17:18:25] <DeadYak> zlominus: jam update-image targetname
[17:18:32] <DeadYak> zlominus: i.e. jam update-image kernel
[17:18:42] <zlominus> DeadYak: thanks
[17:18:59] <stpere> DeadYak: thanks
[17:20:29] <DeadYak> np
[17:20:30] <DeadYak> brb work stuff
[17:20:43] <helf> http://helf.freeshell.org/trs100/
[17:20:45] <helf> there ya go
[17:20:51] <helf> i forgot i had those pics on my phone :)
[17:20:59] <helf> JonathanThompson, i thought you knew i had one.. :P
[17:21:11] <JonathanThompson> I thought I remembered that :)
[17:21:21] <JonathanThompson> (Couldn't be sure if my memory was missing parity, though)
[17:22:20] <helf> reload the page if you are on it
[17:22:22] <helf> i changed it
[17:22:36] <ddew|bofh> hmm, is the emuxki stuff handled only by OSS now?
[17:23:08] <zlominus> when we are talking about interesting old hardware i had NeXT :)
[17:23:13] <JonathanThompson> helf, now you need email and a web browser running on it ;)
[17:23:20] <helf> yep ;)
[17:23:22] <JonathanThompson> He has that too, zlominus :P
[17:23:23] <helf> ill get that
[17:23:28] <helf> zlominus, I have two, actually :P
[17:23:35] <zlominus> cube ?
[17:23:42] <JonathanThompson> He has that two, too! :D
[17:23:44] *** dchis has joined #haiku
[17:23:46] <helf> A Turbo Mono and a Turbo Color.. i had a customized cube with quad motherboards, but I sold it
[17:24:08] <zlominus> I had Turbi color and cube :)
[17:24:12] <zlominus> *turbo
[17:24:19] *** JBurton has quit IRC
[17:24:24] <helf> my mono turbo just recently crapped out :( I gave most of my peripherals to deadyak and I sold a few other things off from it. I love my turbo color. I'm going to get an LCD for it eventually
[17:24:39] <helf> I need to get a bigger hdd for it and load openstep 4.2, right now I just have NS3.3 on it
[17:24:40] <helf> maxed ram though
[17:25:10] <andybe> ddew|bofh: ok firefox works on real hardware 24774, not a bad version...
[17:25:51] <zlominus> I gave away most of the old hardware I had ... but still keep my C64
[17:26:10] <andybe> oh c64 nice.
[17:26:16] <ddew|bofh> andybe: yeah?
[17:26:33] <JonathanThompson> I'd contend that due to portability, the Tandy m-100 is more valuable than a C64 ;)
[17:26:40] <helf> heh
[17:26:41] <andybe> i laptop curo duo 1.60
[17:26:48] <helf> i had a c64.. sold it off too
[17:27:02] <helf> zlominus, I still use my turbo color NeXT a LOT :P
[17:27:07] <helf> its basically my main computer at home
[17:27:25] * JonathanThompson suspects helf will still wear 1980's clothing 50 years from now
[17:27:40] <andybe> ddew|bofh: yeah, but the broarcom driver bcm440 doen't work like the old BeOS/Zeta times...
[17:27:41] * helf wears jeans, t-shirts, tennis shoes/flipflops
[17:27:44] <zlominus> helf: I gave mine away to friend ... My girlfriend won't let my keep it :(
[17:27:52] <helf> dude
[17:27:57] <JonathanThompson> You'd fit right in at where I work, helf ;)
[17:28:11] <JonathanThompson> Time to get an upgraded model ;)
[17:28:12] <helf> if i chick told me my NeXT or her.. she'd be picking her butt off my lawn after being tossed out the door :P
[17:28:21] <helf> s/i/a/
[17:28:34] <zlominus> helf: hehehe :)
[17:28:54] <zlominus> any way 1040STFM is still here .. with its mono monitor
[17:29:03] * cshaiku knows what kind of model JonathanThompson means too. :P
[17:29:04] <helf> oh nice
[17:29:12] <helf> I've wanted a falcon for ages. want to get a CT63 for one :)
[17:29:33] * helf realizes he knows way too much about computers made before he was even out of diapers
[17:29:49] <PulkoMandy> :)
[17:29:50] <cshaiku> you can make good money with that knowledge.
[17:29:53] <zlominus> helf: I have the same problem :)
[17:29:55] *** Begasus_bbl is now known as Begasus
[17:30:01] * cshaiku pokes Begasus
[17:30:06] <helf> someday I'll get a symbolics XL1200...
[17:30:07] * helf drools
[17:30:12] <helf> hey Begasus ! :)
[17:30:13] * cshaiku hands helf a tissue
[17:30:17] * JonathanThompson notes Washington state adding HOT lanes nearby
[17:30:25] <helf> HOT lanes?
[17:30:28] <helf> hybrid?
[17:30:29] <Begasus> sup cshaiku ?
[17:30:32] <Begasus> hi helf  ;)
[17:30:35] <JonathanThompson> High Occupancy Toll lanes.
[17:30:38] <helf> oh
[17:30:41] <cshaiku> http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/Projects/SR167/HOTLanes/
[17:30:50] <helf> poor clowns are gonna have to pay up finally
[17:30:55] <JonathanThompson> As if the carpool lanes didn't already discriminate against those that don't have others to go with them...
[17:31:05] <helf> i hate these extra lanes
[17:31:08] <helf> its retarded
[17:31:09] <cshaiku> Begasus, remember me?
[17:31:10] <helf> just drive the same damn road
[17:31:25] <Begasus> doesn't ring a bell atm cshaiku
[17:31:30] <Begasus> atleast not the nick ;)
[17:31:31] <cshaiku> <-- Technix
[17:31:38] <Begasus> ah !
[17:31:41] <JonathanThompson> You beat me to it, cshaiku.
[17:31:44] <Begasus> hya Chris! ;)
[17:31:47] <cshaiku> hehe.. hi buddy
[17:31:48] <cshaiku> ltns
[17:32:01] <Begasus> long time no see .. how's things back in the US?
[17:32:09] <cshaiku> back in Canada, actually.. good good
[17:32:15] <Begasus> don't miss the Netherlands? ;)
[17:32:18] <cshaiku> I miss eu though
[17:32:22] <Begasus> ;)
[17:32:23] <JonathanThompson> Canada: the 51st US state ;)
[17:32:28] <cshaiku> yeah, I really do miss it
[17:32:34] <cshaiku> JonathanThompson: don't laugh, its true. :P
[17:32:41] <helf> JonathanThompson, we've been through this
[17:32:42] <cshaiku> I have a tatto which symbolizes this very concept
[17:32:45] <JonathanThompson> Who said I wasn't laughing? :)
[17:32:46] <helf> it's our largest natinal park
[17:32:50] <cshaiku> lolol
[17:32:54] <helf> national
[17:33:04] * cshaiku throws a national tree helf's way
[17:33:22] <cshaiku> so Begasus, when you coming to Canada?
[17:33:27] * JonathanThompson thinks helf should study to become a message therapist
[17:33:37] <Begasus> when retirement hits me ;)
[17:33:45] *** bSO1 has joined #haiku
[17:33:47] * JonathanThompson retires Begasus
[17:33:48] <cshaiku> oh, next year already!?
[17:33:53] <Begasus> well ... it's one of the plans ;)
[17:33:56] <andybe> so guys ... going home see you...
[17:33:57] <Begasus> not quite :P
[17:34:00] <cshaiku> hehe
[17:34:01] <Begasus> cu andybe
[17:34:04] <cshaiku> how's your son?
[17:34:11] *** andybe has quit IRC
[17:34:13] * JonathanThompson coughs up snakeballs
[17:34:16] <Begasus> son is ok ... as are the 3 daughters ;)
[17:34:29] <cshaiku> well, I never got to meet them
[17:34:32] <JonathanThompson> The grandkids, though, they need some work ;)
[17:34:33] <cshaiku> just you and your son at BG
[17:34:59] <Begasus> my son?
[17:35:08] <Begasus> think you are confused with Jixt :P
[17:35:09] <Begasus> hehe
[17:35:21] <Begasus> I'm not that old!! ^^
[17:35:24] * JonathanThompson sings, "Here comes the son!" and does the "do do do do!" part
[17:35:55] <Begasus> me and Jixt came together a few times to BG
[17:36:03] <cshaiku> AH.. I thought he was your son!
[17:36:05] <cshaiku> heh
[17:36:12] <Begasus> rofl
[17:36:17] <JonathanThompson> Adopt him, and surprise the crap out of him ;)
[17:36:28] <Begasus> I think he'd be falling off his chair also if he heared it ;)
[17:36:35] <JonathanThompson> (Make sure you feed him lots of pizza)
[17:37:23] <Begasus> Jixt also turned to the 'dark' side ... (he's using OSX also now) :P
[17:37:30] <JonathanThompson> Or, depending on the pizza, feed him TO the pizza :)
[17:37:51] <Begasus> cshaiku, you didn't see our newest family addition I presume .. ;)
[17:37:52] <cshaiku> anyone on facebook that wants to add me, search for cs.haiku at gmail dot com
[17:37:57] <cshaiku> Begasus: no, what?
[17:38:16] * JonathanThompson is decidedly anti-social site-wise
[17:38:24] * cshaiku ignores the hermit
[17:38:25] <cshaiku> :)
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[17:38:30] <Begasus> http://www.flickr.com/photos/begasustro/2262810937/sizes/l/
[17:38:39] * JonathanThompson intones, "Hello, I'm Hermit the Frog!"
[17:38:51] <cshaiku> wow.. those are REALLY NICE dogs!
[17:38:51] <Begasus> cshaiku, don't use your old gmail account anymore?
[17:38:54] <Begasus> ;)
[17:38:56] <Begasus> thnx
[17:38:58] <cshaiku> that is my old/same gmail
[17:39:05] <Begasus> ow
[17:39:10] <Begasus> ;)
[17:39:38] * JonathanThompson remembers next time to not try to go back to a previous page in the browser while having the IRC client in focus
[17:39:42] <helf> im soo hungry..
[17:39:46] <helf> soo.. hungry...
[17:40:03] * JonathanThompson feeds helf some more nybbles and bits
[17:40:19] <cshaiku> easy, he can only take helf at a time.
[17:40:20] <cshaiku> :)
[17:40:22] <JonathanThompson> Good helf!  Roll over!  Scroll out!
[17:40:42] <JonathanThompson> Well, he's not he
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[17:40:53] <JonathanThompson> Well, he's not helf bad at wolfing down food :)
[17:40:59] <cshaiku> hehehe
[17:41:01] <helf> ...
[17:41:09] <cshaiku> we should go on the road, JonathanThompson
[17:41:15] <JonathanThompson> (But at least he isn't a helfer :)
[17:41:19] <cshaiku> you take that helf, I'll take the other helf.
[17:41:30] <JonathanThompson> Won't that get us arrested for indecent exposure, cshaiku?
[17:41:41] <cshaiku> hrm...
[17:41:51] <Begasus> deppends on what helf you're taken in what place ...
[17:41:54] <Begasus> ^^
[17:41:54] <cshaiku> corruption of minors?
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[17:42:37] <helf> hehe.. corruption of minors..
[17:42:37] <cshaiku> ok, Begasus, the pic in your flickr of the dogs on the beach, rocks!
[17:42:40] <helf> thats fun
[17:42:45] <Begasus> rofl
[17:42:52] <JonathanThompson> Major corruption of minors results in a general problem that requires corporal punishment to show them the captain of their soles have the eyes as the Windows to them, as long as the tongue isn't sticking out in the way :)
[17:42:55] <Begasus> that's one from the movie 'snow dogs'
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[17:43:43] * JonathanThompson imagines a shoe salesman singing, "I'm a Sole man!"
[17:44:00] *** _Lucretia_ has joined #haiku
[17:44:30] <Begasus> ps .. more (earlier) images here cshaiku http://www.flickr.com/photos/begasus ;)
[17:44:44] <JonathanThompson> It'd also be appropriate to hear that come from a hermit that sings ;)
[17:44:52] <Begasus> free service only goes up to 200 pics ... so needed to create a new one :D
[17:44:58] <JonathanThompson> But then, who hears hermits sing?
[17:45:06] <Begasus> kermits?
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[17:45:21] <JonathanThompson> Hermits, not kermits: kermits may croak, however ;)
[17:45:28] <JonathanThompson> Remember: it's not easy being green!
[17:45:54] * JonathanThompson Joshes helf about his nickname
[17:46:01] <cshaiku> Begasus: I have 35 photo albums on FB
[17:46:08] <cshaiku> which is why I enjoy using it so
[17:46:28] * JonathanThompson sings, "helf, the man, I used to be!  helf, the man I used to be...."
[17:46:53] <Begasus> never used FB here cshaiku ... maybe I should have a look at it ..
[17:47:09] <Begasus> ps ... what are you doing these days on the net?
[17:47:20] <Begasus> managing some websites or so?
[17:47:21] <cshaiku> I work at http://www.tera-byte.com as a NOC tech
[17:47:35] <cshaiku> I am getting back into the swing of things, slowly
[17:47:41] <cshaiku> in regards to Haiku
[17:48:21] <Begasus> got a build system set up already?  ;)
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[17:53:02] <helf> ugh
[17:53:12] <helf> my shell has gotten unbelievably DUMB.
[17:53:55] * cshaiku tries to come up with a witty reply, but... not necessary? :)
[17:54:10] <Begasus> hehe
[17:54:46] <Begasus> cshaiku, been busy myself with porting games the last year ;)
[17:54:51] <cshaiku> nice
[17:54:58] <cshaiku> SDL games?
[17:55:04] <helf> heh
[17:55:11] <Begasus> yep ;)
[17:55:28] <Begasus> brought some games back on par with compiling in BeOS ;)
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[17:56:53] <Begasus> http://www.bebits.com/devprofile/5956
[17:57:05] <Begasus> some of the games on BeBits ;)
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[18:01:02] *** bhy_ is now known as bhy
[18:01:04] <Begasus> hi mats
[18:01:11] <mats> hi Begasus
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[18:12:31] <Begasus> so .. heading out if a bit here ...
[18:12:40] <Begasus> dog practice ;)
[18:12:44] <Begasus> cya peeps!
[18:12:51] *** Begasus is now known as Begasus_bbl
[18:14:44] <helf> another hour before i can take lunch
[18:14:45] <helf> :(
[18:15:18] <stpere> helf: my subway sandwich was so good :)
[18:15:25] <stpere> j/k, I won't torture you ;-)
[18:15:49] <helf> D:
[18:15:55] <helf> i have like 5 bucks to eat on
[18:16:05] <helf> being poor sucks. i gotta get a better job :P
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[18:16:47] <helf> trying to decide what i can get for 5 bucks...
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[18:17:05] <helf> taco bell, mc donalds, POSSIBLY jacks or Chic-fil-a ..
[18:17:10] <helf> hmm
[18:17:23] <helf> i can eat lunch at taco bell for less than 4 bucks..
[18:17:29] <helf> even if it IS dog food
[18:17:30] <helf> :P
[18:17:44] * helf needs t ostart buying real food and taking his lunches
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[18:20:42] <leszek> hi
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[18:27:56] <cshaiku> spend that $5 on some kraft dinner, and something to go with it
[18:28:14] <helf> or a double decker
[18:28:16] <helf> :]
[18:28:19] <cshaiku> at least it'll be more nutritious than fast food
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[18:28:55] <helf> i eat nutritiously for dinner, usually. heh.  I've been cutting back on my fast food, and soda/sodium meals
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[18:29:57] <helf> I drink WAY too much soda
[18:30:15] <helf> ive started getting to the point where I no longer like the taste. heh
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[18:33:16] <stpere> the only fast food I eat is subway
[18:33:27] * stpere isn't paid by subway :P
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[18:34:25] <helf> heh
[18:34:34] <helf> maybe i should go there :P
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[18:34:57] <helf> I have $10.49 in checking..
[18:35:02] <helf> man, i just cant seem t oget caught up again
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[18:44:19] <helf> oh my god
[18:44:27] <helf> this lady was complaining about her email not sending
[18:44:41] <helf> she was trying to attach an 88mb word file to a nemail
[18:44:46] <stpere> ouch
[18:45:05] <stpere> with one photo resized in word itself
[18:45:06] <stpere> :)
[18:45:09] <helf> its only 3 pages with some iamges.. but saved as RTF..
[18:45:12] <helf> yeah :p
[18:45:22] <helf> i saved it as a 2007 docx and its 127kb...
[18:45:36] <helf> 88mb -> 127kb.. wtf
[18:45:37] <helf> :P
[18:46:00] <stpere> there is room for some optimization in the former format :)
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[18:46:45] <helf> just a tad
[18:47:06] <helf> yahoo was like "hells no!"
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[18:50:19] <helf> heya cube
[18:50:22] <pyCube> hi
[18:52:16] <helf> driving your 914?
[18:53:28] <pyCube> ugh.. no, I keep putting off taking it in to get the brakes fixed
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[18:57:53] <stpere> brakes.. who needs breaks anyway ;-)
[18:58:08] <helf> why? :P
[18:59:03] <stpere> oh, I was thinking of my father that once have bet with his brother that he could to Rimouski - Murdochville without touching the brakes with his truck
[18:59:07] <stpere> he did it
[18:59:26] <stpere> that's about hmm 400 kilometers
[18:59:27] <helf> ha
[18:59:41] <helf> i could do that i nmy VW Rabbit, i can take it to a stop with just the shifter :)
[18:59:42] <stpere> nothing that hard, we live in the middle of nowhere
[19:00:18] <stpere> not sure what my last line implies..
[19:00:27] <stpere> like, you don't have to break for ppl in your way!
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[19:04:26] <daste> hello
[19:04:35] <stpere> hi daste
[19:04:44] <daste> ;-)
[19:08:13] <pyCube> helf: brake fix gets put off because I keep doing other thigns with my money
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[19:08:25] <helf> heh
[19:08:26] <helf> bbl
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[19:21:37] <CIA-47> stippi * r24776 /haiku/trunk/src/apps/launchbox/MainWindow.cpp: Don't display error when BRoster::Launch() returns B_ALREADY_RUNNING...
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[19:35:40] <tqh> hi
[19:37:19] <stpere> hi
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[19:37:32] <Hugen> hi all
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[19:45:27] <DeadYak> evening Euan :)
[19:45:30] <EuanK> evening
[19:45:34] <DeadYak> any luck with figuring out your AHCI issue?
[19:45:56] <EuanK> nah.  I was gonna look at tonight but decided to look at radeon instead
[19:46:17] <DeadYak> ah
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[19:50:54] * tqh curses whatever proxy is fronting haiku-os.org
[19:52:04] <DeadYak> tqh: you mean dev. ?
[19:52:37] <tqh> yeah if that is different.
[19:52:45] <DeadYak> it is
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[19:57:13] <helf> my sister just texted me and asked if I wanted to go to a poetry reading tonight
[19:57:21] <helf> I need a polite way to say "fuck no"
[19:57:38] <EuanK> sore ears from a hard days work
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[19:58:46] <helf> i could probably pick up chicks though...
[19:58:51] <helf> shallow ones
[19:58:56] <helf> who think they are smart and sophisticated
[19:59:03] <pyCube> helf: "how can I say 'fuck no" in a nice way.. let me count the ways...."
[19:59:12] <helf> heh
[19:59:57] <pyCube> only thing worse than poetry readings are goddamn 'hip
[20:00:02] <pyCube> ' indy films
[20:00:39] <helf> and big sunglasses
[20:00:45] <pyCube> ya know.. films that are dumb, but black and white so feel compelled to assume they dont get it, but are ashamed to admit it
[20:00:56] <helf> my sister is a college english teacher. (not quite a processor yet)
[20:00:58] <helf> er
[20:00:59] <helf> professor
[20:01:00] <helf> heh
[20:01:09] <tqh> helf: 'Sure I'll go' is the answer you are looking for :)
[20:01:30] <pyCube> i am gonna punch the next person that tries to tell me that Pi is a great piece of film art
[20:01:47] <DeadYak> Pi was...interesting
[20:01:57] <pyCube> ..or Clerks
[20:01:58] <DeadYak> not sure about 'great' though
[20:02:00] <helf> an hour drive to a big ass college, a poetry reading from some dead poet im supposed to admire and then mingling with intellektuduls and then another hour drive back
[20:02:02] <helf> ummm. no
[20:02:08] <tqh> Is that American Pi or just Pi :P
[20:02:10] <helf> Pi was OK.. i own it..
[20:02:13] <helf> I liked primer
[20:02:28] <DeadYak> tqh: American Pie != Pi :P
[20:03:10] * tqh slaps DeadYak: I know
[20:03:17] <DeadYak> :P
[20:03:31] <MindChild> Our contry reeks of trees
[20:03:39] <MindChild> our yaks are really large
[20:03:46] <MindChild> and they smell like rotten beef carcasses
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[20:06:43] <helf> wtf
[20:07:04] <EuanK> was that fun?
[20:07:17] <EuanK> wall to floor?
[20:07:31] <helf> floor to the door
[20:07:33] <stpere> beware of cat!
[20:07:35] <helf> run bitches run!
[20:07:41] <helf> its the haiku rap!
[20:08:01] <stpere> haik-ee-doo
[20:08:23] <stpere> HaikEDo, nice product name ... hmm :)
[20:08:43] <tqh> haikarate?
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[20:08:58] <tqh> haikung fu
[20:09:04] <TheNerd> MindChild, The Royal Canadian Kilted Yaksmen are pretty cool ;)
[20:09:30] <Hugen_> HaikuBox
[20:09:30] <MindChild> More than cool. They are the way
[20:09:40] <Hugen_> HaiBox
[20:09:47] <TheNerd> MindChild, are you Canadian?
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[20:10:17] <stpere> I am NOT canadian.. pfft.. Quebec rules ;-)
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[20:10:51] <helf> lol
[20:10:53] <TheNerd> stpere, you can take your alcool are seperate!
[20:10:54] <TheNerd> lol
[20:10:58] <TheNerd> are=and
[20:11:03] <pyCube> quebe.. quois?
[20:11:10] <stpere> quebecois
[20:11:20] <stpere> hard C
[20:11:21] <pyCube> quoi?
[20:11:28] <stpere> yes, sounds like quoi
[20:11:32] <pyCube> heh
[20:11:37] <pyCube> fetchez la vache!
[20:11:45] <stpere> hehe
[20:11:49] <TheNerd> go Lucien Bouchard!
[20:12:12] <stpere> Jean Bouchard and Lucien Charest ;-)
[20:12:18] <TheNerd> LOL
[20:12:50] <TheNerd> and can't forget Jean Harper
[20:12:56] <TheNerd> and Stephen Cretien
[20:13:00] <stpere> :)
[20:13:12] <pyCube> and celine dion
[20:13:17] <TheNerd> pyCube, ewww
[20:13:29] <TheNerd> Roche Voisine
[20:13:46] <stpere> Brian Adams ;-)
[20:13:55] <TheNerd> Alexander Keiths
[20:13:56] <TheNerd> :D
[20:14:13] <CIA-47> mmlr * r24777 /haiku/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed)
[20:14:13] <CIA-47> Implement node monitoring in the kernel disk device manager.
[20:14:13] <CIA-47> * Added {Create|Delete}Device() analogous to {Create|Delete}FileDevice
[20:14:13] <CIA-47> * Added a small DeviceWatcher class that reacts to entry creation/removal
[20:14:15] <stpere> The Canadian government apologized several times regarding Brian Adams!
[20:14:15] <CIA-47> * Implemented a way to start/stop node monitoring
[20:14:16] <CIA-47> * Start watching for devices after the boot volume has been mounted and the
[20:14:20] <CIA-47>  the second initial scan was run
[20:14:27] <TheNerd> haha
[20:14:40] <TheNerd> the Canadian gov needs to apologize for more than Bryan Adams
[20:14:41] <TheNerd> lol
[20:14:54] <CIA-47> korli * r24778 /haiku/trunk/src/kits/media/Controllable.cpp: fix typo
[20:14:55] <pyCube> and Snow
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[20:15:10] <TheNerd> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acO5l3avz9g
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[20:15:48] <TheNerd> snow isn't that bad
[20:15:55] <pyCube> uhh..
[20:16:09] * TheNerd likes snow
[20:17:04] <pyCube> w3rd to canadian whiteguy rappers
[20:17:18] <TheNerd> haha
[20:17:40] <TheNerd> like Buck 65
[20:19:43] <ddew|bofh> hmm, this is really starting to bug me. i'm having problems getting a partition booting
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[20:20:05] <pyCube> Buck Satan and the 666 Shooters
[20:21:18] <ddew|bofh> my "test" machine is haiku only and i'm trying out new builds by mounting the image and copying it to a partition i've just run mkbfs on. for some reason it stops booting at a blue screen with a mouse pointer
[20:21:59] <ddew|bofh> when i check the running threads in kdl it's just the idle processes running
[20:22:09] <stpere> hmm
[20:22:36] <DeadYak> is input_server running?
[20:22:51] <DeadYak> sounds like it's waiting for some team to start that never finishes starting
[20:23:15] <DeadYak> actually is Bootscript still running?
[20:23:39] <ddew|bofh> indeed, the odd thing is that the kdl command "running" shows just two idle threads
[20:24:59] <ddew|bofh> heh, posting is really slow on that box
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[20:25:31] <CIA-47> korli * r24779 /haiku/trunk/src/apps/cortex/addons/common/RawBuffer.cpp: fix warning
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[20:27:28] <ddew|bofh> ok, i'm in kdl now. there's a waitfor team that seems stuck
[20:27:44] <ddew|bofh> _input_server_event_loop_
[20:28:03] <DeadYak> that implies input_server died while starting
[20:28:11] <DeadYak> or never started at all
[20:28:19] <DeadYak> is the input_server team there at all?
[20:28:38] <ddew|bofh> nope
[20:29:00] <DeadYak> that'd explain that...wonder why it's not starting
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[20:43:29] <Thom_Holwerda> ok, this is starting to worry me
[20:43:41] <Thom_Holwerda> my cat has been out for like 4-5hrs now, and its getting dark
[20:43:43] <Thom_Holwerda> nothing special
[20:43:50] <Thom_Holwerda> except for a few things
[20:44:21] <Thom_Holwerda> my cat has never been outside for longer than 10 minutes, because usually he comes running back into the house because he's scared shitless because of, i dont know, a falling leaf or something
[20:44:42] <Thom_Holwerda> when i last saw him outside, he went mentally scared because a horse came walking through the street :s
[20:45:07] <Thom_Holwerda> he tried to frantically climb the brick wall of my house :/
[20:45:31] <DeadYak> brick:1, claws:0 ?
[20:45:51] <EuanK> he'll be hiding under a car somewhere
[20:46:13] <EuanK> or cart if that's what you have there :)
[20:46:40] <Thom_Holwerda> checked all cars in the neighbourhood
[20:46:47] <Thom_Holwerda> logical place, yes.
[20:47:04] <Thom_Holwerda> god im SO not ready for children.
[20:47:14] <Thom_Holwerda> even this gets me worried
[20:47:16] <Thom_Holwerda> ;)
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[20:52:40] <m0ns0on> ^^
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[20:53:24] <EuanK> I removed radeon from haikuimage, and the graphics folder.  Can I still run the JamFile manually???
[20:53:37] <DeadYak> yes.
[20:53:52] <EuanK> how?
[20:54:02] <DeadYak> jam -q radeon
[20:54:05] <DeadYak> or whatever the target name is :)
[20:54:38] <EuanK> ...found 1 targets
[20:54:48] <EuanK> ...can't find 1 targets
[20:54:52] <DeadYak> hmm
[20:54:52] <EuanK> nothing else
[20:54:56] <DeadYak> might have some grist on it...
[20:55:01] <EuanK> grist?
[20:55:01] <stpere> that's mean it's not the target name I guess
[20:55:11] <DeadYak> as in something like <driver>radeon or something along those lines
[20:55:19] <DeadYak> I can't access my box right now though so I can't check
[20:55:20] <EuanK> ah...
[20:55:47] <EuanK> nah it's KernelAddon radeon
[20:55:55] <DeadYak> ah.
[20:56:11] <EuanK> meh I'll just add it back in
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[20:59:26] <m0ns0on> Heh, finally installed BeOS Max4 on a dedicated PC here
[20:59:27] <m0ns0on> Man
[20:59:34] <m0ns0on> Things haven't changed much in the OS world in the last 8 years
[20:59:35] <m0ns0on> hehe
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[20:59:48] <m0ns0on> Well, except perhaps on the antialiasing front of fonts
[21:00:12] * helf hates AA
[21:00:15] <helf> EVIL
[21:00:17] <m0ns0on> Hehe
[21:00:18] <helf> EEEVIL
[21:00:18] <m0ns0on> :-)
[21:00:19] <EuanK> only another 17 years for that ms patent to expire
[21:00:37] <helf> I've YET to see a computer with AA enable on fonts that looked good. it was always a horrible blurred mess
[21:00:40] <m0ns0on> Where's the best BeOS software depo nowdays? Except BeBits?
[21:00:58] <m0ns0on> helf: That's because most screens are under 100dpi
[21:01:06] <m0ns0on> helf: Looks good if you have 200dpi =)
[21:01:11] <pyCube> i like aa fonts
[21:01:16] <helf> go to hell
[21:01:17] <helf> ;)
[21:01:23] <helf> m0ns0on, maybe
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[21:01:31] <helf> I've still yet to see a machine that looked good :P
[21:01:39] <m0ns0on> Anyway
[21:01:45] <helf> </rant>
[21:01:46] <m0ns0on> I'm using Baxter for IRC
[21:01:49] <m0ns0on> Is there something better?
[21:01:56] <m0ns0on> It's fine, just wondering
[21:01:56] <m0ns0on> =)
[21:02:13] <pyCube> fonts look great on this giant 30inch monitor
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[21:02:36] <helf> whats the resolution, though?
[21:02:44] <pyCube> 2560x1600
[21:03:06] <m0ns0on> But MAN :-) This is a 600mhz computer with 256 mb ram, and it FLIES
[21:03:11] <m0ns0on> BeOS is soo fast!!
[21:03:14] <helf> heh
[21:03:18] <m0ns0on> I've almost forgot how it is to use such a fast computer!
[21:03:18] <m0ns0on> :-)
[21:03:25] <m0ns0on> I can't believe I was used to this in 2001
[21:03:26] <m0ns0on> =)
[21:03:29] <helf> I used to run beos on a 233mmx with 192mb of ram.
[21:03:34] <helf> i always thought it was badass :P
[21:03:38] <helf> with a radeon 7k
[21:03:40] <m0ns0on> It's crazy
[21:03:49] <m0ns0on> Linux is so slow with the current popular DEs
[21:03:57] <m0ns0on> XFCE lightweight? that's a lol if I saw one
[21:03:58] <m0ns0on> =)
[21:04:02] <pyCube> completely lame comparison though
[21:04:10] <m0ns0on> Not really
[21:04:14] <pyCube> yes really
[21:04:19] <m0ns0on> Explain =)
[21:05:23] <procton> m0ns0on: Vision rocks... My favourite IRC client (I wish I would be able to use it in other platforms aswell)
[21:05:32] <m0ns0on> ok
[21:05:34] <m0ns0on> Gonna look it up
[21:05:43] <m0ns0on> pyCube: I don't think you can explain if you don't agree with that =)
[21:06:03] * DeadYak steals procton's primary and backup coffee
[21:06:15] <EuanK> cd ..
[21:06:19] <EuanK> oops hehe
[21:06:52] <DeadYak> ~$
[21:07:06] <EuanK> ah if I run jam -q radeon from down 1 level all is fine...
[21:07:51] <pyCube> m0ns0on: i just mean that while beos might have some fancy design that makes it 'faster' in certain ways.. i'd argue that much of the snappiness people feel in beos is more about how little beos is doing/can do in its current state
[21:08:18] <pyCube> current  (8 years old) state
[21:08:22] <DeadYak> pyCube: a lot of it has to do more with how asynchronously it does a lot of ops actually
[21:08:25] <m0ns0on> pyCube: AROS is also very snappy, I think it basicly comes down to a different philosophy with the developers
[21:08:43] <DeadYak> if you look at the way GTK and a lot of other toolkits do things, there's a lot of blocking in there
[21:08:46] <DeadYak> which makes things feel slow
[21:08:50] <m0ns0on> pyCube: Also design, but basicly, oldschool developers liked to optimize for speed. People today say: "Ram is cheap" etc
[21:09:00] <pyCube> DeadYak: like i said, i know there are design reasons contributing..
[21:09:11] <DeadYak> pyCube: and that's a perfectly valid comparison imo
[21:09:51] <m0ns0on> Example - when opening a file window in modern DEs it can take a second before it displays, 5-6 icons
[21:10:10] <m0ns0on> It has to load huge libraries and frameworks for simple things
[21:10:36] <m0ns0on> Modern code often is taken hostage to the effects of automagic functionality in modern libs
[21:10:59] <m0ns0on> the KISS philosophy is ignored =)
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[21:11:28] <m0ns0on> Look at Amarok. It's huge. And it is supposed to play mp3s, radio and keep a collection.
[21:11:35] <m0ns0on> But it slows my computer to a crawl sometimes
[21:11:55] <m0ns0on> If they'd spent more time on optimizing and fixing bugs, rather than trying to implement all kinds of features... :-)
[21:11:56] <pyCube> m0ns0on: but people want that
[21:12:01] <emitrax> please let's not talk about players
[21:12:02] <pyCube> not the slow.. but the funcitnoality
[21:12:11] <m0ns0on> I know
[21:12:16] <emitrax> I still haven't found a nice player for linux!
[21:12:22] <DeadYak> pyCube: you missed his point, what he was saying is that for the functionality it has, it's way slower than it should be
[21:12:23] <emitrax> that's why I'm moving to Haiku :D
[21:12:42] <m0ns0on> pyCube: We ended up with extremely bad operating experiences because of it
[21:13:05] <m0ns0on> pyCube: The OS'es have been compromized =)
[21:13:12] <pyCube> m0ns0on: or, the trade-offs havent been properly balanced yet
[21:13:27] <m0ns0on> pyCube: Do you think they will be?
[21:13:36] <m0ns0on> pyCube: First they need to change their philosophy
[21:13:44] <m0ns0on> pyCube: But as I'm seeing from KDE4, forget it =)
[21:13:48] <pyCube> hehe
[21:14:12] <m0ns0on> pyCube: In the end, software will be coded like AMOS Basic, or Visual Basic. Highly abstracted APIs which basically transforms c code into meta code
[21:14:25] <m0ns0on> pyCube: And everyone pulls up 100s of libs by compiling their hello worlds
[21:14:55] <pyCube> all not inherently bad tradeoffs
[21:14:57] <m0ns0on> No
[21:15:03] <pyCube> ..can be implemented poorly..
[21:15:05] <m0ns0on> But by experience, it ends like that
[21:15:12] <m0ns0on> If something can be implemented poorly, it usually is =)
[21:15:29] <m0ns0on> It doesn't have to be :-)
[21:15:50] <m0ns0on> Haiku looks impressive so far for example
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[21:15:58] <pyCube> my attitude towards it is very similar to my attitude towards python
[21:16:17] <m0ns0on> I can appreciate that
[21:16:59] <m0ns0on> I guess my point is, when people start making a habit of abstracting functionality in ever growing classes, they loose sight of what kind of resources they are pulling on for simple things
[21:17:14] <pyCube> sure
[21:17:17] <m0ns0on> People are starting to fly way up in the sky over the clouds, not seeing whats on ground level
[21:17:21] <pyCube> and sometimes thats exactly what you want
[21:17:24] <m0ns0on> Yeah
[21:17:26] <m0ns0on> Absolutely
[21:17:34] <EuanK> is "pointer" a new official type???
[21:17:38] <m0ns0on> But "with power comes responsability"
[21:17:39] <m0ns0on> :-)
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[21:18:09] <m0ns0on> Besides, making efficient code is fun =)
[21:18:32] <pyCube> m0ns0on: i guess what i meant about the beos - linux comparison being not quite right is that beos has never had to / been able to deal with the range of uses that linux does
[21:19:08] <burfi> abstraction is no the problem - bad abstraction is. good abstraction is HARD.
[21:19:09] <DeadYak> EuanK: pardon?
[21:19:12] <m0ns0on> pyCube: Well, but I am approaching it from a different angle
[21:19:31] <EuanK> there was some variables defined as type "pointer"
[21:19:36] <m0ns0on> pyCube: Linux is a wildcard system, but the kernel is fast enough, the drivers are good enough, to be able to give you a fast interface
[21:19:40] <EuanK> couldn't find a typedef or define for it
[21:19:44] <helf> NeXTs are better than all your computers!
[21:19:46] <m0ns0on> pyCube: Basically, nobody made a good desktop for twm yet ;)
[21:19:47] * helf runs off
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[21:20:01] <EuanK> I just #defined it for now
[21:20:28] <m0ns0on> pyCube: AmigaOS, GEM etc ran a full desktop under 10mhz
[21:20:45] <pyCube> my hunch is that if beos was expected to run on a ridiculous range of platforms, be a server, be a desktop, be embedded, etc etc.. its 'suffer' form lack of super awesome nimbleness that we experience in beos
[21:20:55] <pyCube> m0ns0on: yeah.. i know
[21:20:59] <m0ns0on> pyCube: With lots of features. Nowdays, people are calling desktops that definately aren't lightweight, "lightweight for old computers"
[21:21:00] <m0ns0on> :-)
[21:21:03] <m0ns0on> So that's my whole point
[21:21:16] <pyCube> right
[21:21:53] <DeadYak> pyCube: that's imo part of the problem, systems that really aren't designed to do something well are being paraded as jack-of-all-trades that do it great
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[21:23:28] <pyCube> right.. and sometimes you dont want a sports car, but you wanna have fun driving.. and you dont want an SUV but you need to carry shit around.. so you end up with something like a subaru station wagon that is a lot of fun to drive
[21:23:31] <pyCube> hehe
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[21:23:48] <DeadYak> something like that :)
[21:24:04] <Schmedly3D> WRX Sti !!
[21:24:30] <m0ns0on> pyCube: Point is, running a desktop system shouldn't be using 20% CPU, it isn't that dam* huge job =)
[21:24:31] <pyCube> subaru, admittedly, got the implementation down pretty well
[21:24:40] <pyCube> m0ns0on: i agree
[21:24:56] <m0ns0on> brb
[21:25:01] <m0ns0on> gonna try vision
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[21:25:27] <cyrus82> Hello!
[21:25:37] <stpere> hi cyrus82 !
[21:25:42] <cyrus82> I'm running haiku native on my notebook right now!
[21:25:44] <helf> 20% of the cpu? wha?
[21:25:45] <cyrus82> it rocks!
[21:25:49] <helf> nice :D
[21:26:12] <cyrus82> sorry, I just had to say that :)
[21:26:23] <stpere> don't be sorry for that :)
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[21:26:42] <cyrus82> it seems to be quite stable
[21:27:08] <helf> will haiku run on a pentium75 with 24mb of ram? ;P
[21:27:18] <DeadYak> helf: dunno about with that little RAM
[21:27:25] <m0ns0on> :-)
[21:27:37] <DeadYak> helf: you could just barely run R5 on that iirc
[21:27:39] <cyrus82> is there a possibility to make screenshot under haiku?
[21:27:42] <helf> heh
[21:27:43] <DeadYak> cyrus82: hit printscreen
[21:27:50] <helf> only OS I can run on my poor laptop is windows 95
[21:27:51] <DeadYak> cyrus82: it will drop a .png in the home dir
[21:27:52] <helf> everything else cralws
[21:28:16] <cyrus82> i can't believe it! :)
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[21:39:48] <andybe> mmu_man: you are mmrl or?
[21:40:01] <mmu_man> not at all
[21:40:30] <andybe> hm thought so, why i think all the time a are the one? - funny
[21:40:42] <andybe> you are
[21:40:42] <mmu_man> mmixed up :)
[21:40:54] <andybe> ok shake it baby...lol....
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[21:41:38] <andybe> hm do you think it is hard to adapt the freebsd bcm440 driver (broadcom 440), because the give never works at all.
[21:41:49] <andybe> or in most situation?
[21:42:02] <mmu_man> I have that card here, works fine
[21:42:05] <mmu_man> mostly
[21:42:37] <andybe> no here, i can not assign a irq and so, long time i talk to bernd about that problem here....
[21:42:40] * JonathanThompson meows like a giraffe into the channel
[21:43:41] <andybe> do you think to port that driver from freebsd works....or ist the code to equal?
[21:43:50] <Schmedly3D> JonathanThompson are you speaking from the Island of Dr. Moreau?
[21:43:55] <helf> methinks jt is going insane
[21:44:00] <JonathanThompson> Going?
[21:44:06] <helf> i was being polite
[21:44:11] <JonathanThompson> Dr. Mercer Island, Schmedly3D :P
[21:44:20] <Schmedly3D> ooooh
[21:44:21] * JonathanThompson is "The Mercer Island Mountain Man"
[21:44:26] <helf> the crazy brits are going to bring on a real Dr. Moreau with their hybrid stuff :P
[21:44:32] <JonathanThompson> Ok, so they're good-sized hills :D
[21:44:47] <JonathanThompson> (Mountains require a bit more of a hike/run to get to)
[21:45:00] <Schmedly3D> Are the hills adjacent to the huge tracts of land?
[21:45:05] <JonathanThompson> But it's fully within my capacity to run to something called a mountain within a short time.
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[21:45:19] <JonathanThompson> Mercer Island has almost *nothing* that's flat and level, Schmedly3D.
[21:45:28] <JonathanThompson> There's flat areas, but almost all of them are hills ;)
[21:45:30] <mmu_man> andybe dunno, didn't read it
[21:45:55] <JonathanThompson> There's a very small portion of streets downtown Mercer Island that are what you might consider "level"
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[21:46:13] <Schmedly3D> JonathanThompson, are you in the Pacific Northwest?
[21:46:23] <JonathanThompson> And then there are streets that are steep enough nearby that would give Lombard St. a run for its money for hilliness.
[21:46:29] <JonathanThompson> Yes, between Bellevue and Seattle.
[21:46:37] <JonathanThompson> In the middle of Lake Washington.
[21:46:42] <andybe> ok mmu_man, I look at it.....thanks at all...
[21:46:49] <andybe> thanks for listening.
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[21:50:31] <Schmedly3D> JonathanThompson, trying to check out your locale on google maps but it's terribly slow for me today
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[21:51:28] <JonathanThompson> Well, it's about the same distance for me to run to the southwest edge of Bellevue as it is to run to the east edge of Seattle from where I'm at, via I-90.
[21:51:42] <JonathanThompson> I'm living downtown Mercer Island, slightly south of I-90.
[21:51:47] <Schmedly3D> I'd like to visit that area someday, but Astoria, OR would have to be my first place on the list due to the incredibly high treasure factor
[21:52:21] <Schmedly3D> I guess that's a few hours from you though
[21:52:49] <CIA-47> bonefish * r24781 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/ImageRules: Replaced "echo -n >" by "touch" as it's more portable.
[21:54:31] <JonathanThompson> A few ;)
[21:55:50] <stpere> what is the best place to host my project?
[21:56:01] <stpere> (the calendar app)
[21:56:11] <stpere> free and relatively reliable
[21:56:30] <Schmedly3D> you might try Assembla
[21:57:26] <stpere> looks good
[21:57:27] <stpere> will try it
[21:58:28] <ddew|bofh> how about osdrawer?
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[21:59:44] <stpere> hmm, yay, it's more haiku specific, which is good for my project
[21:59:48] <stpere> yeah*
[22:00:23] <ddew|bofh> that's what i was thinking, osdrawer seems like a great "replacement" for bebits
[22:01:32] <zlominus> Anyone know if there is an online version (pdf, chm, etc) of "Beos porting unix applications"
[22:01:42] <stpere> but the 3 "AND WE ARE BACK!" message in the News isn't looking that good :)
[22:02:13] <ddew|bofh> heh, true.
[22:02:59] <stpere> I will try OsDrawer.net anyway, it will help build the community I hope (with any arrogance..
[22:03:06] <stpere> without*
[22:03:08] <stpere> grr, typos
[22:03:14] <ddew|bofh> heh
[22:03:17] <stpere> not arrongance, but..
[22:03:29] <stpere> hmm, anyway :)
[22:03:33] <ddew|bofh> if you need a hand feel free to give me a shout
[22:03:48] <stpere> I need a name!
[22:03:52] <stpere> for my project, not me
[22:03:54] <stpere> :)
[22:04:07] <ddew|bofh> heh
[22:05:19] <JonathanThompson> SoDated, stpere ;)
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[22:06:26] <JonathanThompson> Or "Mr. Gregorian's Calendar Emporium" :)
[22:07:38] <stpere> JonathanThompson: hehe, nice :)
[22:07:41] <stpere> Clippy
[22:07:48] <stpere> and I implement Clippy to tell you:
[22:07:53] <JonathanThompson> Which one, stpere? :)
[22:07:56] <stpere> I think you are forgetting your appointment
[22:08:05] <stpere> JonathanThompson: SoDated ;-)
[22:08:14] <JonathanThompson> Clippy From Hell :)
[22:08:14] <stpere> but it might sounds like "Sedated"
[22:08:24] <JonathanThompson> The laid-back calendar app :)
[22:08:37] <stpere> SpaceTime
[22:08:38] <JonathanThompson> "Hey, you might be missing an appointment, thought I'd let you know, that ok?:
[22:08:47] <JonathanThompson> Only has Time covered :)
[22:08:54] <stpere> ah yes :)
[22:08:59] <stpere> YearLight
[22:09:10] <JonathanThompson> YearLightBuzz :D
[22:09:10] <stpere> hmm, have no actual link
[22:09:15] <stpere> lol
[22:09:27] * JonathanThompson is full of fun names
[22:09:39] <stpere> ContinUM
[22:09:40] <CIA-47> bga * r24782 /haiku/trunk/src/build/libbe/storage/ (3 files in 2 dirs):
[22:09:40] <CIA-47> While tracking a mimeset bug when building under Haiku, I found these. Not sure
[22:09:40] <CIA-47> if these changes are correct byt they seem to make sense. Ingo?
[22:09:40] <CIA-47>  during the build process. Added checking for HAIKU_HOST_PLATFORM_HAIKU where
[22:09:41] <CIA-47>  relevant.
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[22:10:38] <stpere> Hagenda?
[22:10:58] <stpere> simple, includes reference to Haiku
[22:10:59] <JonathanThompson> For Haiku Agenda?
[22:11:02] <stpere> yes
[22:11:04] <m0ns0on> 
[22:11:14] <JonathanThompson> Please don't get into using the name too much in titles ;)
[22:11:24] <stpere> :)
[22:11:50] <stpere> or something really generic
[22:11:54] <JonathanThompson> Then we end up with stuff like "KEdit"  "Konqueror" "KWrite" and such where trying to search for things requires always typing out the same dumb thing that everything starts out with :)
[22:12:01] <mmu_man> <SGA><Shep>You're never gonna name anything ever again!</Shep></SGA>
[22:12:10] <Schmedly3D> Agenda is a pretty succinct and functional name
[22:12:16] <stpere> yes
[22:12:19] * JonathanThompson slaps mmu_man sillier than normal
[22:12:23] <stpere> and it tells you what it does
[22:12:27] <stpere> not like Excel
[22:12:28] <Schmedly3D> yep
[22:12:47] <stpere> agenda, so be it :)
[22:12:50] * JonathanThompson still can't figure out what Outlook was supposed to be referring to
[22:13:03] <JonathanThompson> At least Word made perfect sense.
[22:13:06] <JonathanThompson> Outlook, though?
[22:13:15] <JonathanThompson> Perhaps they should have named it In/Outbox ;)
[22:13:23] <JonathanThompson> Or shortened to IOBox.
[22:14:16] <stpere> a quick search on bebits seems to tell me that name is unused
[22:14:29] <stpere> (it returns Konqueror!)
[22:14:45] * JonathanThompson waits to see how long it takes stpere to verify Agenda isn't being used for email elsewhere
[22:16:14] <stpere> google uses that name
[22:16:24] <stpere> in french
[22:16:28] <stpere> rather than Google Calendar
[22:16:46] <EuanK> call it laundry list then
[22:16:51] <stpere> :)
[22:17:03] <EuanK> or "daily chores"
[22:17:04] <JonathanThompson> "Missed Appointment Minder"
[22:17:33] <mmu_man> HeyYouJustMissedYourTrain
[22:18:02] <EuanK> "stuff i'd rather not ever again" "Sirnea"
[22:18:19] <EuanK> or just Sirn
[22:18:40] <EuanK> hehe missed the word "do" as that spoilt it
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[22:22:39] <stpere> :)
[22:22:54] <DHowett> hey :P
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[22:24:16] <Enauv> yay
[22:24:19] <Enauv> svn is up
[22:24:36] <tqh> Annoyor is my suggestion
[22:24:58] <EuanK> how about "pro nag"
[22:25:01] <tqh> Prepare to be annoyed
[22:25:08] <tqh> Nag is excellent idea.
[22:25:30] <Enauv> prepare to be LOVED!
[22:25:41] * tqh runs like the wind.
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[22:27:25] * tqh likes that haikunews is back
[22:27:26] <stpere> Nag is cool
[22:28:09] <EuanK> instead of "Ok" for applying a new appointment, it will need to be "nag me"
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[22:28:26] <Stargater> hi
[22:28:34] <EuanK> hi there
[22:28:45] <Stargater> jo
[22:28:58] <Enauv> anyone here do reddit?
[22:29:14] <tqh> Boo would be nice name as well.
[22:29:23] * Enauv ♥s proggit
[22:29:26] <tqh> Boo. You got an appointment!
[22:31:33] <stpere> I will try to make the attr specs easy and good enough so that IDE can you it for your TODO list
[22:31:41] <stpere> ahh!
[22:31:46] <stpere> can use it*
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[22:32:41] <tqh> Don't forget that even if you start your computer after an appointment is meant to be it should still remind you that you are running late.
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[22:32:58] <stpere> yes
[22:34:56] <tqh> anyone tested booting from external disk yet?
[22:35:07] <EuanK> what USB?
[22:35:14] <tqh> yes
[22:35:18] <Thom_Holwerda> goddamnit i hate it when i cant translate a dutch word into english
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[22:35:51] <Schmedly3D> Thom_Holwerda, what word?
[22:36:02] <Thom_Holwerda> portiek.
[22:36:08] <Schmedly3D> and vague meaning of course
[22:36:30] <Thom_Holwerda> hard to describe but ill try
[22:36:38] <Thom_Holwerda> my front door is "indented" into the building
[22:36:46] <Schmedly3D> recessed?
[22:36:47] <EuanK> would an sd card work?
[22:36:47] <Thom_Holwerda> creating a little "alcove" of some sort
[22:37:04] <Thom_Holwerda> like, 1 square metre
[22:37:11] <ddew|bofh> doorway?
[22:37:13] <EuanK> my laptop's SATA doesn't boot, would be good if I can get that to work instead...
[22:37:41] <tqh> EuanK: I don't know if it even supports booting, but mmlr added some disk driver in a recent revision. See http://www.haikuware.com for instance.
[22:37:41] <Thom_Holwerda> ddew|bofh: a doorway can be anything, the word "portiek" specifically describes the recessed area in front of it
[22:37:53] <Thom_Holwerda> not all doors have it
[22:38:05] <Schmedly3D> recessed entry?
[22:38:11] <ddew|bofh> Thom_Holwerda: i know, we have a similar word for it in Swedish. don't know an exact translation of it :)
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[22:38:15] <pyCube> Thom_Holwerda: um.. porch?
[22:38:28] <Thom_Holwerda> some are just aligned with the wall they are part of, mine is "recessed" by a metre into my own house
[22:38:31] <Schmedly3D> porch usually dictates extending outwards
[22:38:38] <Thom_Holwerda> pyCube: porch generally extends outwards
[22:38:39] <Enauv> Schmedly3D, not necessarily
[22:38:40] <Thom_Holwerda> exactly
[22:38:50] <pyCube> not really
[22:38:56] <pyCube> i have a recessed porch
[22:39:06] <EuanK> \tqh yeah I saw that commit
[22:39:14] <Thom_Holwerda> pyCube: yes, but when you say porch, people will think of the outward one
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[22:39:22] <pyCube> Thom_Holwerda:  i dont
[22:39:30] <pyCube> i think of a porch.. inward or outward
[22:39:39] <Thom_Holwerda> enter "porch" in google images
[22:39:44] <Thom_Holwerda> you'll catch my drift
[22:39:44] <Schmedly3D> *usually* and you are the minority in that respect
[22:40:08] <burfi> portico - haha
[22:40:21] <Thom_Holwerda> tadaaa
[22:40:23] <Thom_Holwerda> http://www.vintageseattle.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/queens_court_02.jpg
[22:40:29] <Thom_Holwerda> that's what i have
[22:40:33] <Thom_Holwerda> a lot less fancy of course
[22:40:40] <Thom_Holwerda> found it using recessed entry
[22:40:42] <pyCube> thats a porch
[22:40:46] <Thom_Holwerda> oh and i dont have a stairs
[22:40:49] <Thom_Holwerda> in front of it
[22:40:52] <pyCube> a smallish one. ./but still
[22:40:54] <Thom_Holwerda> mine's at street level
[22:40:55] <Enauv>  gold should work on haiku, right?
[22:41:01] <Schmedly3D> it could also be called a stoop
[22:41:02] <Enauv> pyCube, got python compiled on haiku
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[22:41:14] <Enauv> though dynamic loading does not work for now
[22:42:05] <pyCube> Enauv: nice
[22:42:12] <pyCube> dynamic loading?
[22:42:37] <stpere> Thom_Holwerda: in french it's portique :)
[22:42:42] <stpere> I think
[22:42:50] <Enauv> pyCube, as in compiled modules
[22:42:52] <stpere> kindof
[22:42:53] <Thom_Holwerda> stpere: i actually knew that :)
[22:42:59] <Enauv> so python isn't very useful for now :P
[22:43:13] <ddew|bofh> it's a start :)
[22:44:09] <Enauv> yea
[22:44:20] <Enauv> I need to figure out haiku's dynamic loading now... :/
[22:45:52] <DHowett> There was Mailing List talk about a GSoC related to fixing some "TODO:"s in the code... did that idea ever get considered more thoroughly? I think it'd be neat ... ;)
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[22:46:58] <Enauv> anyone know how to boot a vmdk file in qemu/kvm?
[22:47:07] <Enauv> I am *sick* of vmware
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[22:48:06] <mmu_man> Enauv just use libdl
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[22:48:10] <mmu_man> python used that in zeta
[22:48:12] <mmu_man> http://revolf.free.fr/beos/patches/python-2.3.4-zeta.patch.011.txt
[22:48:18] <mmu_man> maybe we miss it
[22:49:43] <CIA-47> korli * r24783 /haiku/trunk/src/add-ons/kernel/bus_managers/acpi/ (209 files in 15 dirs): merging acpica-20080321 in trunk
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[22:51:03] <MindChild> Would you think there would be a speed hit for simply having a SCSI 80pin->68pin adapter? I can get an 80pin Ultra3, 15000rpm drive for $22, but the same drive/specs, with a 68pin interface is $80
[22:51:07] <rennj> qemu-img convert -f vmdk <thefile>.vmdk -O raw raw.img
[22:51:35] <rennj> convert your vmware disks to raw or cow or somethign
[22:51:44] <mmu_man> Enauv actually libroot has a dlopen
[22:51:57] <mmu_man> cf /work/haiku/trunk/headers/posix/dlfcn.h
[22:52:00] <Enauv> rennj, no native?
[22:52:08] <Enauv> I have to convert every time? >.<
[22:52:21] <Enauv> ahh, never mind
[22:52:26] <rennj> qemu can convert i think between raw,cow,vpc,vmware or something
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[22:52:42] <rennj> i use qemu-img
[22:52:50] <rennj> got to convert
[22:53:01] <rennj> vpc to vmware lets say
[22:53:15] <rennj> qemu-img convert <thefile>.img -O vmdk <thefile>.vmdk
[22:53:23] <rennj> i usally conver to vmware
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[22:54:43] <stpere> adnega
[22:54:51] <stpere> that might be the name of my app
[22:55:38] <Enauv> rennj, but no way to get qemu itself to recognize a .vmdk file?
[22:55:41] <Enauv> I have to convert it?
[22:55:51] <rennj> yeah
[22:55:55] <rennj> convert
[22:56:01] <rennj> oh your knees befor zod
[22:58:22] <Enauv> damnit
[22:58:29] <Enauv> why can't people write software?
[22:58:54] <stpere> eh?
[22:58:57] <Enauv> if something was undefined, the c preprocessor came out with if(somefunc() || )
[22:59:13] <EuanK> nice!
[23:00:39] <mmu_man> it's probably not supposed to not be defined :p
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[23:01:04] <mmu_man> sometimes you do want that to happen
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[23:01:17] <mmu_man> when prefixing symbols or strings
[23:01:54] <Enauv> mmu_man, that won't compile
[23:02:06] <Enauv> anyway you look at it
[23:02:20] <mmu_man> that's your fault, not that of gcc
[23:03:05] <Enauv> mmu_man, not my fault
[23:03:09] <Enauv> I never wrote the code :P
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[23:09:26] <Enauv> crap, how do I link to socket?
[23:10:17] <Enauv> in the jam fashion
[23:10:22] <DeadYak> oh
[23:11:11] <DeadYak> $(TARGET_NETAPI_LIB) if you're doing it out of Haiku's build sys
[23:11:28] <Enauv> thanks
[23:13:15] <Enauv> nope, still doesn't work
[23:13:28] <DeadYak> umm, how're you doing it?
[23:14:06] <Enauv> never mind, I was being stupid
[23:14:08] <DeadYak> I've got Application appname : listofsources : listoflibs : rsrc ;
[23:14:15] <Enauv> I only applied it to one of the targets
[23:14:18] <DeadYak> ah
[23:14:20] <Enauv> yea, linked find
[23:14:21] <Enauv> fine*
[23:14:54] <tqh> if it's for Haiku I guess linking with network would be prefered.
[23:15:53] <Enauv> kvm is *fast*
[23:16:24] <Enauv> fare well
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[23:18:21] <CIA-47> bonefish * r24784 /haiku/trunk/ (8 files in 5 dirs):
[23:18:21] <CIA-47> * Renamed vmdkheader to vmdkimage and changed it to create a full image
[23:18:21] <CIA-47>  by default (new option "-H" will create the header only). Option "-c"
[23:18:21] <CIA-47>  will clear the image.
[23:18:21] <CIA-47> * Adjusted build_haiku_image accordingly. vmdkimage is way faster and
[23:18:22] <CIA-47>  more portable than the former vmdkheader+dd combo.
[23:19:26] <DHowett> kvm is pretty nice...
[23:19:35] <DHowett> it hangs 1/3 of the time for me though.. whole system ><
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[23:28:11] <andybe> mmu_man: seams to be that beos / Zeta doesn't share irq....
[23:28:22] <mmu_man> it does
[23:28:33] <mmu_man> but some drivers are just to selfish to respect that
[23:29:12] <andybe> oh oh take the bfe into the source compiled ...and then i see irq 15 by booting
[23:31:14] <andybe> the shame is on me ....because i filled it up only, with cable insert i don't get ing a screen.
[23:31:33] <andybe> with not pluged in i get PANIC: should never be called
[23:31:55] <andybe> mmu_man: look like a funny thing..yes stuped me.
[23:32:56] <EuanK> freebsd if driver?
[23:33:08] <andybe> yes freebsd
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[23:33:27] <andybe> the other driver also look up the machine...
[23:33:28] <EuanK> need to write a glue.c that works.  as per the syskonnect i did this week
[23:33:51] <andybe> hm you did.
[23:33:52] <EuanK> that message was because the interrupt enable / disable isn't implemented
[23:33:59] <EuanK> ported that is
[23:34:57] <andybe> aha, I'm not firm with that realy...
[23:35:04] <EuanK> neither was i
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[23:35:54] <andybe> which drive EuanK ?
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[23:36:17] <AnEvilYak> syskonnect
[23:36:28] <EuanK> in freebsd it's sk
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[23:38:04] <andybe> aha, I'm allready in you glue.c
[23:39:52] <andybe> I only was copy over that glue.c from axel EuanK
[23:40:07] <EuanK> ?
[23:40:21] <EuanK> ah no they are all unique
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[23:41:11] <andybe> EuanK: but it was nice to see the card is regonized by the driver
[23:41:32] <EuanK> you need to identify if the driver uses queues, task queues, and / or software interrupts (a kernel thread that polls)
[23:42:22] <andybe> EuanK: that stuff I was read long time ago....I never like drivers, but a computer without network isn't a relay one today
[23:42:31] <EuanK> indeed
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[23:43:06] <andybe> you did 2 stuff
[23:43:13] <andybe> reenable
[23:43:22] <andybe> and disable
[23:44:39] <EuanK> yeah
[23:45:00] <EuanK> also note the define that indicates if queues or swi are used
[23:45:45] * andybe crawl..
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[23:46:59] <EuanK> compare that with other glue.c's
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[23:47:45] <mmu_man> hmm Cosmos 1999 :)
[23:48:06] <andybe> I will do....
[23:48:17] <andybe> time to go to bed...
[23:48:45] <EuanK> nah
[23:48:49] <EuanK> on;y 11
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[23:50:28] <andybe> see you EuanK ,mmu_man a and all the others....
[23:50:48] <EuanK> nite
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   April 3, 2008  
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