January 28, 2019 
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January 28, 2019 [00:07:06] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[00:10:03] *** Beliar <Beliar!~Beliar@2a02:8108:9640:6c42:3496:3d6d:2f62:e49f> has quit IRC (Quit: The only real mistake is the one from which we learn nothing)[00:18:34] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[00:23:26] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[00:24:52] *** refs <refs!~refs@dslb-178-005-230-000.178.005.pools.vodafone-ip.de> has quit IRC (Quit: refs)[00:46:38] *** Buoy172 <Buoy172!~Buoy172@95.86.6.187> has quit IRC ()[00:52:35] * o][o splurts[01:06:58] *** atomekk <atomekk!~atomekk@unaffiliated/atomekk> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[01:15:46] *** genr8_ <genr8_!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[01:26:12] *** ra4king <ra4king!~ra4king@unaffiliated/ra4king> has quit IRC (Quit: Take a byte out of this!)[01:26:45] *** ra4king <ra4king!~ra4king@unaffiliated/ra4king> has joined #gamedev[01:39:14] *** Twipply <Twipply!~Twipply@unaffiliated/twipply> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[01:46:11] *** [Relic] <[Relic]!~Relic]@2602:306:33a3:6d30:70c0:af9e:8143:6247> has joined #gamedev[01:56:14] *** fidasx <fidasx!~fidasx@ppp-94-66-221-145.home.otenet.gr> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[01:56:28] *** infinee_ <infinee_!~infinee@061093245022.static.ctinets.com> has joined #gamedev[01:58:10] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JZnj4eNHXE[01:58:25] <pulse> i wanna program like they do at oracle[02:01:17] * solidfox gets cancer[02:01:22] <solidfox> thanks pulse[02:01:48] <solidfox> that song gave me cancer[02:02:35] <solidfox> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tas0O586t80[02:02:36] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[02:02:48] <solidfox> program in C low-budget parody[02:04:26] *** LunarJetman2 <LunarJetman2!LunarJetma@188.30.99.249.threembb.co.uk> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[02:04:28] *** infinee_ <infinee_!~infinee@061093245022.static.ctinets.com> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)[02:04:44] <solidfox> oh this ones good too https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYRlTISvjww[02:04:51] <solidfox> let me know if you survive that one[02:06:37] <pulse> i got the best one[02:06:38] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq3CuMDXaPs[02:10:50] <solidfox> oof[02:12:03] <solidfox> you win[02:12:18] <solidfox> just gonna go bury myself[02:15:58] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nN4cIWFF6_8[02:16:03] <pulse> cam[02:16:06] <pulse> can't top this one*[02:16:08] <pulse> guaranteed[02:16:20] <pulse> this is peak performance[02:19:05] <solidfox> woa[02:20:00] <solidfox> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJ8LHd01CyM[02:20:13] <pulse> lolwut[02:20:14] <pulse> that intro[02:20:35] <solidfox> its the opening to that song i think[02:20:50] <solidfox> its at least in the song, not sure[02:20:56] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFSwIw-_-as[02:21:02] <pulse> amazing[02:21:04] <solidfox> pulse: what a time to be alive[02:21:08] <pulse> true dat[02:23:41] *** lurchman <lurchman!~lurchman@74.70.68.50> has quit IRC (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)[02:45:00] *** pulse <pulse!~pulse@unaffiliated/pulse> has quit IRC (Quit: pulse)[03:03:22] *** kraybit <kraybit!~kraybit@46.230.220.238> has joined #gamedev[03:05:06] *** Tylak <Tylak!~Tylak@074-135-002-092.res.spectrum.com> has joined #gamedev[03:06:59] *** R2robot <R2robot!~R2robot@unaffiliated/r2ro> has joined #gamedev[03:07:07] *** R2robot <R2robot!~R2robot@unaffiliated/r2ro> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[03:07:27] *** R2robot <R2robot!~R2robot@unaffiliated/r2ro> has joined #gamedev[03:13:30] * o][o is hearing Type O Negative \o\[03:22:53] <R2robot> it's the 'on hold' music while the channel is closed[03:23:45] <solidfox> im listening to SOAD[03:24:15] <solidfox> R2robot: will the channel be opened 2morrow[03:25:04] <R2robot> yes, the government shutdown has ended (for now) so the channel will reopen tomorrow[03:25:34] <solidfox> r u trying 2 suggest.. nvm im taking this too seriously[03:26:24] <o][o> what was this shutdown about? I live here in NYC and I have no fucking idea about wtf is going on :D[03:29:40] <R2robot> :P[03:32:04] <solidfox> o][o: trump couldnt get congress to vote on wall funding, so he told the head of the senate to not give him any bills to sign until they give into his demands[03:33:38] <o][o> wtf[03:33:58] <o][o> super troll master :D[03:34:07] <solidfox> more like super dictator[03:34:17] <o][o> nah! he can't hold the congress forever[03:34:22] <solidfox> with a shill at the head of senate he can do whatever he wants.[03:34:38] <solidfox> make it illegal to vote democrat, whatever.[03:34:42] <o][o> he is just a fat bully who is pissed off when it is bullied[03:35:37] <o][o> also he is asking for an impeachment :D[03:36:18] <solidfox> well i think you need a large majority of congress to vote on impeachment[03:37:35] <solidfox> but yeah maybe it could happen[03:37:45] <solidfox> like heres how i'd imagine it[03:37:53] <solidfox> wait should we move to ##politics ?[03:37:56] *** batman_nair <batman_nair!~batman_na@111.92.74.136> has joined #gamedev[03:38:07] <R2robot> idiot said mexico would pay for it, now he's holding US hostage until we pay for it.[03:38:09] <solidfox> i think politics should be off topic in every channel besides a politics channel[03:38:24] <solidfox> well anyways[03:38:33] <R2robot> #boring[03:38:36] <solidfox> if those federal workers called their republican senators[03:38:54] <R2robot> pretty sure they did.. and that's why they're reopening for now[03:39:12] <solidfox> they could tell them if they dont vote to impeach trump, they wont vote for them. but republicans care more about their money donors than the public's opinion of them[03:39:13] <R2robot> approval rating took another hit[03:39:25] <solidfox> R2robot: ah i see[03:44:01] *** flerfb0rt <flerfb0rt!~misterflu@c-73-60-160-159.hsd1.ma.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[03:49:42] <o][o> thanks for the clarification :) let's get back to games \o/[03:49:52] * o][o needs to make time to play Rage of Mages again[03:51:41] <R2robot> vidya gaems[04:01:13] *** genr8_ <genr8_!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has joined #gamedev[04:03:46] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[04:04:30] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[04:13:00] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[04:18:46] *** batman_nair <batman_nair!~batman_na@111.92.74.136> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[04:19:29] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[04:24:22] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[04:24:33] *** code_zombie <code_zombie!~code_zomb@2605:a601:aa1:da00:e101:8946:da94:ceb6> has joined #gamedev[04:34:16] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8a03:a100:773d:27e9:f519:dd31> has joined #gamedev[04:37:50] <LastTalon> And make the government employees pay for it![04:38:33] <LastTalon> :P[04:38:53] <o][o> let's play Hidden Agenda \o/[04:38:54] * LastTalon goes back to rimworld[04:39:14] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8a03:a100:773d:27e9:f519:dd31> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[04:41:38] <solidfox> o][o: never heard of it[04:41:49] <solidfox> o][o: is it a detective mystery drama game[04:41:52] <solidfox> like a visual novel?[04:41:59] <o][o> I wish it were[04:42:29] <o][o> it is an old MS-DOS game where you are the new president of a small country that just got its independence[04:42:40] <o][o> then you have to make tough political choices[04:43:06] <LastTalon> Sounds like Tropico[04:43:12] <o][o> it has a very strong political/historical content, although everything there happens in hypothetical places[04:43:19] <o][o> it is better than Tropico[04:43:28] <o][o> but clumsier too[04:43:34] <LastTalon> Lots of games are better than tropico. :P[04:43:58] <o][o> some shmucks tried to pastiche this game, but they all failed[04:44:03] <LastTalon> I like my city/colony builders[04:44:40] <LastTalon> Eventually I might tackle making one, but the details can be so intricate.[04:44:55] <o][o> the engine is simple, but the design is hardcore[04:45:06] <o][o> how to balance things, how to create interesting challenges, etc.[04:45:09] <LastTalon> Yeah.[04:45:25] <LastTalon> Kings of emergent gameplay.[04:46:38] <o][o> gamedev is a terrible unfair field. lotsa work and super underpaid[04:53:17] *** babuloseo <babuloseo!~babuloseo@unaffiliated/babuloseo> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[04:54:08] <LastTalon> Sort of seems like a problem with a lot of the software field in general.[04:54:13] <LastTalon> But yeah, for sure.[04:54:50] *** lordkryss <lordkryss!uid25759@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-betxrstgfpoikbsv> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[04:55:55] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[04:59:08] <_DB> any unity guys here?[04:59:20] <_DB> wondering if unet is getting deprecated what are we supposed to use?[05:11:40] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8814:4f00:37d5:5816:a9da:204> has joined #gamedev[05:13:32] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has joined #gamedev[05:16:03] <LastTalon> _DB, yes, it is.[05:16:13] <LastTalon> _DB, this thread will probably help. https://forum.unity.com/threads/unet-deprecation-thread.543501/[05:16:14] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8814:4f00:37d5:5816:a9da:204> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[05:18:02] <LastTalon> Unity is sort of bad at being clear on what exactly is going on unfortunately.[05:18:12] <LastTalon> I find these forum threads are the most useful in keeping track.[05:19:16] *** sebbu <sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[05:19:39] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)[05:26:18] *** sebbu <sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu> has joined #gamedev[05:27:35] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@187.56.135.98> has joined #gamedev[05:28:21] <_DB> hmm interesting[05:29:07] *** sebbu <sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[05:29:32] *** sebbu <sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu> has joined #gamedev[05:32:39] *** pavonia <pavonia!~user@unaffiliated/siracusa> has joined #gamedev[05:34:16] <_DB> after readin that post unity has no idea what to do[05:34:17] <_DB> XD[05:34:25] <o][o> :D[05:35:10] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[05:35:18] <_DB> https://forum.unity.com/threads/mirror-networking-for-unity-unet-replacement.425437/[05:35:24] <_DB> however someone made this so thats cool i guess[05:42:16] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[06:04:58] *** Beliar <Beliar!~Beliar@2a02:8108:9640:6c42:403d:97f8:56e5:9430> has joined #gamedev[06:05:16] *** Tylak <Tylak!~Tylak@074-135-002-092.res.spectrum.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)[06:05:29] <LastTalon> Yeah.[06:05:41] <LastTalon> Prepare for the transition... by doing what... exactly?[06:05:45] <LastTalon> :P[06:20:31] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has joined #gamedev[06:44:48] <aeth> LastTalon: no the differnce between gamedev and software dev is the pay... probably 1/3 to 1/2 of what you could expect (although, to be fair, the "1/3" is because tech is very bubbly right now)[06:44:59] <aeth> obviously both are full of companies that expect you to work 80-90 hours[07:22:20] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[07:30:44] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Quit: My tummy says it's time to sleep Mr. Bubbles.)[07:38:14] *** [Relic] <[Relic]!~Relic]@2602:306:33a3:6d30:70c0:af9e:8143:6247> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[07:45:09] *** Beliar <Beliar!~Beliar@2a02:8108:9640:6c42:403d:97f8:56e5:9430> has quit IRC (Quit: The only real mistake is the one from which we learn nothing)[07:46:26] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[07:53:29] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8a03:a100:773d:27e9:f519:dd31> has joined #gamedev[07:54:58] *** jprajzne <jprajzne!jprajzne@nat/redhat/x-jlhuszrvbslcinve> has joined #gamedev[08:12:05] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[08:16:43] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[08:30:56] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@79.184.45.219.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl> has joined #gamedev[08:31:42] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@77.208.14.46.static.wline.lns.sme.cust.swisscom.ch> has joined #gamedev[08:38:37] *** code_zombie <code_zombie!~code_zomb@2605:a601:aa1:da00:e101:8946:da94:ceb6> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[08:46:37] *** rts-sander <rts-sander!~rts-sande@185.60.252.150> has joined #gamedev[09:10:08] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.124.99.198> has joined #gamedev[09:26:44] *** pulse <pulse!~pulse@unaffiliated/pulse> has joined #gamedev[09:42:23] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[09:46:52] <brainzap> good morning pulse[09:51:46] <pulse> top of the morning to you brainzap[10:08:21] *** pulse is now known as unpulsed[10:15:53] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[10:31:04] <_DB> pfft game devs are paid crap[10:31:13] <_DB> freelance gamedevs get lucky here and there[10:32:49] <R2robot> If I owned a game dev studio, I'd be reluctant to pay high wages as well. There is no guarantee of success, or even that you will finish the project.[10:32:59] <R2robot> that money has to come from somewhere[10:33:50] <rts-sander> but the gaming industry is bigger than film + music, you'd think gamedevs would be very well compensated[10:34:15] <R2robot> what's the average these days?[10:34:19] <rts-sander> especially since the programming aspects has unique performance constraints / deadlines[10:34:34] <unpulsed> lies, i just bought a new ferrari[10:34:35] *** shlomif <shlomif!~rindolf@77.127.7.201> has joined #gamedev[10:34:40] <unpulsed> i'm joking, i bought a bag of oranges :([10:34:42] <jprajzne> publishers/distributors grab most of the money?[10:34:49] <R2robot> film industry is unionized[10:34:52] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@187.56.135.98> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[10:35:10] <jprajzne> i think the main problem is who keeps the rights?[10:35:10] <R2robot> actors have a minimum pay and it's not a lot[10:35:41] <rts-sander> yeah the fact that a lot of gamedevs are passionate about it gets exploited resulting in lower wages[10:35:45] <R2robot> jprajzne: yeah, publishers own the rights in most cases[10:35:56] <R2robot> nobody gets exploited more than artists though[10:36:05] <R2robot> 'do it for the exposure'[10:36:30] <jprajzne> well, artists don't have to suffer[10:36:33] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.124.99.198> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)[10:37:00] <R2robot> ?[10:37:19] <jprajzne> there's been a trend - artists founding their own publishing labels[10:37:37] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@187.56.135.98> has joined #gamedev[10:37:44] <jprajzne> or even their own instruments and devices[10:38:02] <R2robot> sure, but the problem is then getting enough jobs..[10:38:14] <jprajzne> you hire people for that[10:38:20] <R2robot> there are still plenty of starving artists out there willing to naively do work for 'exposure'[10:38:31] <R2robot> jprajzne: hire them with what money? :D[10:38:45] <R2robot> it's a chicken/egg kinda deal[10:38:47] *** shlomif is now known as rindolf[10:38:55] <jprajzne> R2robot: ofc you have to earn enough, and you surely do by keeping the rights to your product[10:39:43] <jprajzne> steve vai kept all the rights by founding his own publishing company, small one - just him and the lawyer :))[10:40:04] <R2robot> that was after he became famous though, right?[10:40:25] <jprajzne> guys from Periphery didn't quite do that, but they make their own tools and pedals that they sell[10:40:51] <jprajzne> R2robot: after first album, but anyone can do an album with the tech today[10:41:25] <jprajzne> tosin abasi makes his own guitars and pedals, same as ola englund (youtouber actually)[10:41:33] <R2robot> right, but that doesn't automatically make you a success[10:41:39] <jprajzne> os it's just a matter of figuring it out for yourself[10:41:46] <R2robot> owning the rights with no sales still makes you poor :D[10:41:56] <_DB> I dont work for exposure ever and no project that ever asked me to work for exposure took off[10:41:59] <_DB> XD[10:42:17] <R2robot> haha[10:42:25] <jprajzne> R2robot: obviously. but also why would you do all that if you can't do a shit? :))[10:43:07] <R2robot> why is this channel filled with gamedevs, but no games ? :P[10:43:37] <jprajzne> because 96% of people fail in whatever category you pick? :))[10:44:00] <R2robot> because you have to at least try :)[10:44:05] <R2robot> failing is ok as long as you try[10:44:07] <jprajzne> if we talk about owning a business :)[10:44:09] <R2robot> better than not trying :D[10:44:36] <R2robot> being a musician and owning your own rights, etc = being a business on top of being an artist[10:44:42] <jprajzne> not saying it's not ok to fail, it's just that even if you try, the success rate is low[10:44:55] <R2robot> yeah[10:45:25] <jprajzne> R2robot: no, not really. actually you deal with less people and not some big corp. trying to make you their bitch :)[10:46:08] <R2robot> doesn't matter though. a business is a business no matter the size of the entities you deal with[10:47:07] <R2robot> my idiot cousin started a business and would turn down 'small' projects in order to work on projects for HUGE corporations.. for the 'exposure' lol[10:47:32] <R2robot> he liked to brag about the names.. 'coca cola, houston astros, etc'[10:47:42] <R2robot> as he went out of business. lol[10:48:15] <jprajzne> well, reminds me of my last band i was in[10:48:48] <jprajzne> guys wanted to do only perfect music, so they picked only the juiciest riffs and licks etc.[10:49:02] <jprajzne> ended up with isolated pieces[10:49:39] <jprajzne> simply not enough experience in making shitty music[10:49:53] <jprajzne> as dave grohl said, go to the garage and suck[10:49:53] <R2robot> ;)[10:49:56] <jprajzne> then suck some more[10:50:13] <jprajzne> and then, if you persist and have some smarts, maybe then you succeed[10:50:25] <R2robot> :D[10:50:34] <jprajzne> reality check 101 :))[10:51:10] <jprajzne> my last guitar lesson, the new student realized he sucked. best thing ever, for him :)[10:51:13] <R2robot> same thing we say in here for all the first-time game devs wanting to do an 3d open world MMORPG having barely made their first hello world compile. :)[10:51:31] <jprajzne> yes, that's classic :))[10:51:56] <_DB> meh ive been out of the last 2 yeras[10:52:01] <_DB> working on a clients website full time[10:52:15] <_DB> now im unemployed finding clients for games, apps, websites etc[10:52:31] <R2robot> hows it going?[10:52:36] <_DB> luckily my resume is a bit better and ive got the experience of my first big gig[10:52:44] <_DB> not to shabby 3 weeks in and ive got 2 clients[10:52:47] <_DB> and 3 leads[10:52:48] <R2robot> nice![10:53:14] <jprajzne> that sounds great :)[10:53:21] <_DB> yeah but its hasnt been a picnic I just recently learned to make apps so ive been coding my butt off in visual studi and Xamarin forms[10:53:56] <R2robot> my sympathies[10:54:01] <_DB> I also had to reorganize all my old demos because unity updated and most of them broke[10:54:12] <R2robot> whoops[10:54:27] <_DB> meh I should have realized it would happen I spent my free time going out enjoying my position[10:54:36] <_DB> remote work + decent pay[11:07:43] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df042-11.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[11:07:57] <DnzAtWrk> yodeleioh[11:11:15] <_DB> sodemyeioh XD[11:13:02] <R2robot> yodelyodelyodel[11:13:51] <_DB> any of you guys on the website toptal?[11:13:54] <_DB> its pretty neat[11:14:15] <_DB> freelancing site with an extensive application process they test you 3 times[11:14:30] <_DB> and you webcam/screenshare to be accepted then they find you clients[11:15:56] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[11:17:37] *** Cahaan <Cahaan!~Cahaan@ns326233.ip-37-187-158.eu> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[11:18:28] <rts-sander> are you a top 3% developer _DB ?[11:19:02] <_DB> not yet[11:19:09] <_DB> hoping I qualify XD[11:19:27] <_DB> a friend of mine got in i mentioned it to him and hes like oh yeah dide i get work from there all the time XD[11:19:51] <rts-sander> probably a bullshit statistic[11:19:51] <_DB> his examine was building a simple chess based AI from a bunch of stuff they gave him[11:19:54] <rindolf> rts-sander: hi[11:20:04] <rts-sander> rindolf, hi what's up[11:20:05] <_DB> exam**[11:20:19] <_DB> sorry its 5:20 am im about to go to bed[11:20:22] <rindolf> rts-sander: updated awesome wm in mageia[11:21:08] <rts-sander> rindolf, a windows manager for a linux distro? cool[11:22:45] <rindolf> rts-sander: and also see https://phabricator.kde.org/D18566[11:23:17] <rindolf> rts-sander: i had a heisenbug[11:23:55] <rindolf> rts-sander: the field was auto-initted to 0 in the debug build[11:25:45] <rindolf> rts-sander: regarding top 3% - see https://www.shlomifish.org/humour/fortunes/show.cgi?id=linus-95-percent-of-programmers[11:26:28] <rts-sander> rindolf, another reason why debugging with print statements is better than a debugger :P[11:26:55] <rts-sander> rindolf, but at least you solved it, that's good for sanity[11:27:35] <rts-sander> rindolf, yes people overestimate their own abilities[11:29:00] *** zhalla <zhalla!~zhalla@unaffiliated/zhalla> has joined #gamedev[11:29:37] *** Cahaan <Cahaan!~Cahaan@ns326233.ip-37-187-158.eu> has joined #gamedev[11:30:58] <R2robot> lol[11:31:07] <R2robot> perfect :D[11:41:40] *** macza <macza!~macza@d75-157-125-9.bchsia.telus.net> has joined #gamedev[11:43:19] *** zhalla <zhalla!~zhalla@unaffiliated/zhalla> has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC 1.6.5+deb1+deb9u1 - http://znc.in)[11:46:22] *** macza <macza!~macza@d75-157-125-9.bchsia.telus.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[11:46:24] *** unpulsed <unpulsed!~pulse@unaffiliated/pulse> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[11:50:53] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df042-11.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[11:51:08] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df042-11.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[11:52:00] *** zhalla <zhalla!~zhalla@unaffiliated/zhalla> has joined #gamedev[12:09:30] *** zhalla <zhalla!~zhalla@unaffiliated/zhalla> has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC 1.6.5+deb1+deb9u1 - http://znc.in)[12:10:47] *** zhalla <zhalla!~zhalla@unaffiliated/zhalla> has joined #gamedev[12:12:10] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[12:29:27] *** zhalla <zhalla!~zhalla@unaffiliated/zhalla> has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC 1.6.5+deb1+deb9u1 - http://znc.in)[12:30:59] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8a03:a100:773d:27e9:f519:dd31> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[12:35:09] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8a03:a100:773d:27e9:f519:dd31> has joined #gamedev[12:45:45] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[12:50:55] *** Kingsqueee <Kingsqueee!~kingsquee@S01069050ca3c92d3.va.shawcable.net> has quit IRC (Quit: しょうがない)[12:59:04] *** ZeroSystem <ZeroSystem!45f81b6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.248.27.107> has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed)[13:00:48] *** nunatak <nunatak!~nunatak@unaffiliated/nunatak> has joined #gamedev[13:14:13] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df042-11.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[13:15:06] *** wPSvils <wPSvils!~PDevelope@83.243.92.42> has joined #gamedev[13:15:56] <wPSvils> Hey peeps.[13:16:14] <R2robot> o/[13:16:54] <wPSvils> Almost started a new engine from scratch.[13:17:10] <wPSvils> Forced myself to open up existing one, and see that there's no point, I might as well implement new ideas in the existing one... Close call.[13:17:19] <wPSvils> Phew ...[13:17:40] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df042-11.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[13:20:24] <R2robot> #SAVED[13:20:49] <R2robot> #MakeGamesNotEngines[13:25:16] <DnzAtWrk> #UseAPrefab[13:26:09] <R2robot> #ReCycle #FreeCycle[13:32:18] *** Twipply <Twipply!~Twipply@unaffiliated/twipply> has joined #gamedev[13:35:42] <DnzAtWrk> every youtuber is conspiring to spoil RE2 for me[13:36:15] <brainzap> what is there to spoil, big monster, shoot it, go home[13:36:16] <wPSvils> R2robot: I make engines :([13:36:17] <DnzAtWrk> Haven't gotten too far, but I can already tell I love the game[13:36:22] <wPSvils> That isn't my goal - it's a realization.[13:37:13] <R2robot> Well now you know[13:37:18] <R2robot> #TurnYourLifeAround[13:37:22] <R2robot> :P[13:38:00] <DnzAtWrk> there is a balance[13:38:17] <DnzAtWrk> a good proper game isn't just a hopscotch of code that does just one thing[13:38:24] <DnzAtWrk> at one point in the game[13:38:29] <DnzAtWrk> there needs to be some overall structure[13:38:43] <wPSvils> Fo sho.[13:38:58] <DnzAtWrk> then again, do you REALLY need that scripting language?[13:39:03] <DnzAtWrk> You are just moving code from one place to another[13:39:06] <DnzAtWrk> with a bunch of overhead[13:39:09] <wPSvils> With this iteration, I purposefully made basic subsystems enough for prototyping.[13:39:27] <wPSvils> For room to iterate each subsystem to be better and faster and more flexible, but currently working with colored squares.[13:40:10] <wPSvils> But then I started making the inventory system which needs a GUI and got pinned down in that rabbithole.[13:40:42] <DnzAtWrk> Entity, EntityManager : Entity, EntityManager.UpdateEntities, Camera : Entity, GameScene : Entity, Player : Entity[13:40:47] <DnzAtWrk> Button : Entity[13:40:54] <DnzAtWrk> this is one of my favored systems[13:40:55] <wPSvils> Gross.[13:40:57] <wPSvils> :D[13:41:01] <DnzAtWrk> naw[13:41:04] <DnzAtWrk> it's logical[13:41:12] <rts-sander> ah crap, better start writing a rendering pipeline to implement my inventory system with[13:41:45] <wPSvils> rts-sander: I have my rendering pipeline, started making an anchor-based layout system with nodes and anchors ...[13:41:47] <wPSvils> :D[13:42:02] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: My engine is more like `entity.set<Transform>(0.0f, 0.0f, 0.0f);`[13:42:25] <DnzAtWrk> at that point it's already at a higher level of abstraction than I care for[13:42:29] <DnzAtWrk> in my own engine[13:42:48] <wPSvils> well, it's just not inheritance based as yours.[13:43:00] <wPSvils> most of my subsystems don't know what an entity is.[13:43:22] <wPSvils> so yes, the ECS is a layer above the lowest layer ... most systems are translation systems from ECS to subsystems.[13:43:41] <DnzAtWrk> I can show you an example entity class I have[13:44:28] <DnzAtWrk> https://www.dropbox.com/s/u2flj0wfwik1e3d/entity.class.js?raw=1[13:44:48] <DnzAtWrk> oh yeah, in this game every entity HAD to belong to an entity manager[13:44:59] <DnzAtWrk> but entity managers are also entities so they can be nested[13:45:08] <wPSvils> ah gotcha. yeah, my entities aren't classes per se.[13:45:12] <DnzAtWrk> makes for a kind of tree like structure for the entire game from the very menu[13:45:16] <rts-sander> javascript? D:[13:45:19] <DnzAtWrk> yes[13:45:33] <wPSvils> functionality is added as new classes instead of extending an entity class.[13:45:42] <rts-sander> shouldn't the only the entity manager have references to the entity?[13:46:04] <DnzAtWrk> it's useful for an entity to be able to refer to its only entity manager[13:46:09] <DnzAtWrk> so you can say entity.Destroy[13:46:11] <DnzAtWrk> and it destroys itself[13:47:04] <DnzAtWrk> also extremely useful is draw priority[13:47:09] <DnzAtWrk> I don't think I've ever not needed it[13:47:20] <wPSvils> aha. I have an Entity class that wraps an EntityId, but the Entity class should only be used in tight scopes, where it does now the source of the entity.[13:47:22] <DnzAtWrk> I guess if you're working in 3d it isn't an issue[13:47:39] <wPSvils> For wider scope persistence only EntityIds should be saved.[13:47:48] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: what is priority?[13:48:09] <DnzAtWrk> in this case it's the update priority[13:48:15] <DnzAtWrk> higher number, entity updates earlier in game loop[13:48:42] <DnzAtWrk> entity + entity manager works in a team like that[13:48:47] <DnzAtWrk> makes up the foundation for the game[13:49:36] <DnzAtWrk> Eh, It's just one of those solutions which in hindsight I found very practical[13:49:40] <brainzap> Entity-isNaked = true[13:50:16] <DnzAtWrk> Entity-IsDirty = true[13:50:34] <DnzAtWrk> eh, I think it's dirty[13:50:38] <rts-sander> dirty, naked, and ready to be destroyed[13:50:51] <DnzAtWrk> I think you're not supposed to say isBlah for fields[13:51:07] <brainzap> you can be whatever you want[13:51:35] <rts-sander> why not isBlah?[13:51:46] *** nunatak <nunatak!~nunatak@unaffiliated/nunatak> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[13:51:57] <DnzAtWrk> for some reason I think isBlah is for functions[13:52:00] *** nunatak <nunatak!~nunatak@unaffiliated/nunatak> has joined #gamedev[13:52:02] <DnzAtWrk> like blah, isBlah()[13:52:10] <DnzAtWrk> but maybe I'm wrong[13:52:18] <R2robot> Most definitely wrong[13:52:20] <R2robot> "wrong"[13:52:22] <R2robot> :P[13:52:45] <brainzap> bring it to the Council to make a isWrong[13:53:16] <R2robot> Coucil of GameDev Elders?[13:53:40] <rts-sander> DnzAtWrk, oh yeah I assumed that was a function name[13:54:02] <DnzAtWrk> I don't remember the justification anymore[13:55:05] <jprajzne> i hope isWhatever retruns bool, that's my only complaint besides being descriptive :)[13:55:25] <rts-sander> yeah I'm sure we can all agree on that[13:55:37] <brainzap> null can also be false[13:55:38] *** luin_n <luin_n!~luin_n@81-67-166-23.rev.numericable.fr> has joined #gamedev[13:55:40] <DnzAtWrk> whatIsLove[13:55:55] *** luin_n <luin_n!~luin_n@81-67-166-23.rev.numericable.fr> has left #gamedev[13:57:54] <R2robot> dontHurtMe()[13:58:19] <DnzAtWrk> technically a verb[14:00:03] <R2robot> along the line of do()[14:00:09] <R2robot> which I hate[14:00:19] <DnzAtWrk> get/calculate[14:00:23] <DnzAtWrk> estimate[14:00:25] <DnzAtWrk> approximate[14:00:26] <DnzAtWrk> fornicate[14:02:19] <jprajzne> i think it's well worth it to grep a similar code base and see what naming it uses[14:02:45] <jprajzne> usually better than inventing your own 'cool' names :)[14:03:04] <brainzap> I don't invent names, I use existing ones from Harry Potter[14:03:12] <DnzAtWrk> There are some things I do which tend to aggregate the people on #javascript[14:03:31] <DnzAtWrk> like using a naming scheme like this._privateVariable, this.p_protectedVariable, this.publicVariable[14:03:45] <DnzAtWrk> I think it helps immensily in keeping some kind of virtual "encapsulation" in my code[14:03:45] <brainzap> this.immutableString = 3[14:03:57] <DnzAtWrk> but they argue that "IT'S FAKE ENCAPSULATION. IT'S NOT REAL"[14:04:01] <DnzAtWrk> doesn't mean it's not useful :P[14:04:16] <R2robot> leviosa()[14:04:30] <jprajzne> DnzAtWrk: agreed, you can see the scope without going to the declaration[14:04:50] <jprajzne> fokHarryPow3()[14:05:00] <DnzAtWrk> isWizard[14:05:12] <jprajzne> isLizard()[14:06:51] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: But how do you decide priority?[14:06:51] <brainzap> you are an entity Harry[14:07:04] <wPSvils> I process my entities when it makes sense, priority seems confusing to me.[14:07:19] <jprajzne> fifo[14:07:21] <wPSvils> Usually everything should have an explicit priority - atleast conceptually, you should know the order in which you want things to happen.[14:07:41] <DnzAtWrk> wPSvils, priority is manually assigned in the constructor or subclassed entities[14:07:43] <DnzAtWrk> based on need[14:07:48] <DnzAtWrk> of*[14:08:14] <jprajzne> wait/async[14:08:14] <DnzAtWrk> for example, something like camera tracking player should update after player, so the camera should have a lower priority[14:08:43] <wPSvils> for me personally it's confusing abstracting the processing order into a unified float value of some sort.[14:08:58] <wPSvils> instead of updating my input and controller systems, then updating camera and rendering systems etc.[14:09:17] <DnzAtWrk> it's only the priority in the parent entity manager[14:09:20] <wPSvils> but I guess your architecture is based around `entity.update(delta);` ?[14:09:33] <DnzAtWrk> you can imagine if you nest multiple entity managers that the priority gets much more granular[14:10:07] <jprajzne> granular as a dog food or mice poop?[14:10:09] <wPSvils> from an API perspective, my entities are component storage maps.[14:10:27] <DnzAtWrk> I'm a fan of keeping entities self contained[14:10:32] <DnzAtWrk> so everything related to player is inside player[14:10:45] <DnzAtWrk> except in the case of inheritance[14:10:48] <wPSvils> yes, this was my first approach.[14:10:54] <brainzap> but then where do you store the relationship between two players?[14:11:05] <DnzAtWrk> in this.love[14:11:36] <brainzap> but when this dies, the other player loves null?[14:11:53] <brainzap> just like real life[14:12:19] <DnzAtWrk> just check player.otherPlayer.isDestroyed()[14:12:32] <DnzAtWrk> which you should be doing anyway[14:13:21] *** DaScoot <DaScoot!~Scooter@static-24-153-33-9.cpe.metrocast.net> has joined #gamedev[14:14:47] <brainzap> good morning DaScoot[14:17:11] <DaScoot> lo[14:18:10] <DaScoot> I think my least favorite thing about this gig is when I make a status update and people immediately unsubscribe[14:18:23] <DaScoot> like it was a mistake to remind them that the project exists >_>[14:20:32] *** nunatak <nunatak!~nunatak@unaffiliated/nunatak> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[14:20:35] <brainzap> dont worry they are just bots[14:20:54] <DnzAtWrk> hmm, my github repo has 20 stars[14:20:59] <DnzAtWrk> odd[14:21:40] <DaScoot> nah, talking patreon subscribers[14:21:46] <brainzap> link?[14:22:04] * o][o avoids inheritance like hell[14:22:15] <o][o> my Player class only delegates[14:22:28] <brainzap> oh a former apple developer?[14:22:39] <o][o> :D[14:22:43] <jprajzne> brainzap: :))[14:22:51] <DnzAtWrk> I have yet to really make something proper with ECS[14:22:52] <o][o> I did ObjC only once[14:22:56] <DnzAtWrk> it always ends up a mess[14:22:56] <o][o> not getting back[14:23:00] <DnzAtWrk> not something I'm proud of[14:23:18] <brainzap> There is beauty in a uniform coding style, where a single pattern is used during the whole code base[14:23:27] <o][o> after I realized that inheritance was the root of all evil, my dev life became better[14:24:16] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: where does it end up like a mess?[14:24:37] <DnzAtWrk> at the point where I actually what to do things[14:24:39] <brainzap> when he ends up with a circualr reference[14:24:40] <wPSvils> ECS can be verbose, which is why I make my ECS' api to do lots of work internally for me.[14:24:45] <DnzAtWrk> let's make a cool animation for the player[14:24:49] <DnzAtWrk> and add this and that effect[14:24:56] <DnzAtWrk> and this other custom code[14:25:13] <DnzAtWrk> want*[14:25:14] <o][o> DnzAtWrk: this is solved by a decent animation class and a properly designed FSM :)[14:25:24] <wPSvils> it took me a brain warp in such a way that I don't understand and can't create inheritance based systems anymore.[14:25:30] <DnzAtWrk> try making an animation class with enough features to cover every unique scenario you have[14:25:50] <o][o> wPSvils: I only inherit to implement behavior and State Pattern[14:25:55] <wPSvils> my animation system animates entities. afterwards I can add whatever components I want to the entities.[14:26:02] <o][o> DnzAtWrk: animations are always the same[14:26:39] <wPSvils> an AnimationComponent most likely contains the animation data, and EntityIds to which entities should be attached to which bones.[14:26:55] <wPSvils> unless you're doing spritesheet animations, but similar concepts apply.[14:27:34] <o][o> animations are simpler than that[14:27:53] <o][o> you are adding extra layers already :D[14:28:11] <DnzAtWrk> and animations is the most simple example[14:28:16] <DnzAtWrk> let's take something better[14:28:19] <DnzAtWrk> a SHMUP enemy[14:28:26] <o][o> sure[14:28:28] <o][o> easy too[14:28:33] <DnzAtWrk> and let's make it 40 different enemies[14:28:48] <DnzAtWrk> are you going to keep reusing some base component for all of them?[14:29:03] <DnzAtWrk> maybe have a sineWave movement class[14:29:10] <o][o> yeah! movement and behavior[14:29:12] <o][o> simple[14:29:25] <DnzAtWrk> now you want a shmup enemy made from multiple blocks which moves like a snake[14:29:31] <DnzAtWrk> going to add the movement component to each part?[14:29:48] <o][o> wut[14:29:48] <DnzAtWrk> what about an enemy that can teleport[14:30:06] <DnzAtWrk> or an enemy that can move in the depth axis[14:30:18] <DnzAtWrk> or the other 500 things you can unique make an enemy do[14:30:22] <DnzAtWrk> uniquely*[14:30:23] <o][o> easy[14:31:10] <DnzAtWrk> you'll just spend half the gamedev time naming each component :P[14:31:43] <DnzAtWrk> for something used on a single type of entity[14:32:12] <DnzAtWrk> plus it's not just enough to have one unique component per entity. No it has to be split up based on what type of component it is[14:32:19] <DnzAtWrk> to make it proper ECS[14:33:00] <DnzAtWrk> Point is, ECS kills diversity[14:33:07] <DnzAtWrk> </rantily rant>[14:41:58] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[14:52:10] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: you have an incorrect perception of ECS imo :)[14:52:36] <wPSvils> with the 500 unique things - how does your way solve that? you need to create 500 different behaviour classes in that case.[14:52:37] <DnzAtWrk> it's just based on my time with unity[14:52:42] <wPSvils> emmm[14:52:46] <wPSvils> how long ago?[14:52:51] <wPSvils> Unity only recently added an ECS[14:53:08] <DnzAtWrk> I mean, the entire point here is that you need one component per behaviour[14:53:09] <wPSvils> I think they added it fall 2018[14:53:20] <DnzAtWrk> or you can put in 30 unique features in a single Enemy class[14:53:31] *** grouse <grouse!~grouse@83-233-9-2.cust.bredband2.com> has joined #gamedev[14:53:34] <DnzAtWrk> without all the overhead code[14:53:44] <wPSvils> but how do you use that Enemy class if you want to differentiate enemies?[14:53:55] <wPSvils> you still have a single enemy class with all of that stuff there ...[14:54:08] <DnzAtWrk> related to a single unique enemy yes[14:54:17] <DnzAtWrk> the vast majority which won't be reused[14:54:39] <wPSvils> MyUniqueEnemyComponent ?[14:54:53] <wPSvils> using an ECS, you don't NEED to break the behaviours down to a granular level, until you do need to.[14:54:57] <DnzAtWrk> which goes against the principle of ECS[14:55:14] <wPSvils> not necessarily[14:55:26] <wPSvils> it's by necessity you should break the behaviours down.[14:55:44] <wPSvils> so at some point you might want to reuse some specific parts, at which you can extract that behaviour and add a component to control it.[14:55:56] <wPSvils> step by step y'all[14:56:27] <DnzAtWrk> if you used this method in pure ECS you'd end up with EnemyType1System EnemyType2System EnemyType3System[14:56:31] <DnzAtWrk> it's an ugly hack[14:56:50] <rts-sander> does your engine use hyperthreading?[14:57:04] <DnzAtWrk> whose?[14:57:25] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: you seemed to have a problem with the super granular approach, and now you have a problem with having higher level systems, and call it an ugly hack?[14:57:42] <rts-sander> general question[14:57:45] <wPSvils> EnemyType3System is the exact same as your EnemyType3 class with 30 behaviours inside.[14:57:48] <DnzAtWrk> it's an ugly hack in ECS[14:57:59] <wPSvils> it's not a hack at all :D[14:58:11] <wPSvils> I wouldn't have to do anything special with how my ECS works to implement this.[14:58:52] <wPSvils> and for some special cases, I would even consider creating a BehaviourComponent which takes a pointer to a IBehaviour interface object to apply VERY unique behaviours to certain entities.[14:59:46] <wPSvils> now that I could consider a hack, but I mean - if you really want to argue about how ECS is difficult, as well as enforcing very strict ECS purist rules on yourself, then there are more productive things to be done :)[15:00:15] <wPSvils> I generally start at a higher level, and decompose features and components as it becomes necessary.[15:00:39] <wPSvils> instead of trying to parse out and separate everything right from the start - since we all know how well planning out everything at the start of a project goes :D[15:01:21] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has joined #gamedev[15:02:15] <rts-sander> yes first you try to do it by the book, and then you start introducing workarounds and despoil the integrity of the code[15:02:21] <DnzAtWrk> https://www.gamedev.net/articles/programming/general-and-gameplay-programming/a-critique-of-the-entity-component-model-r3621/[15:02:24] <DnzAtWrk> this article seems good[15:03:29] <DnzAtWrk> I'm fairly sure the double-inheritance scenario is a fallacy at this point[15:03:41] <DnzAtWrk> I have yet to see it in practice[15:03:50] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[15:05:12] <rts-sander> DnzAtWrk, did you click the first hit when googling "entity component sucks" :P[15:05:33] <DnzAtWrk> oh I'm not that shallow maybe[15:06:51] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: are you advocating the last part where it talks about systems and a database?[15:07:55] <DnzAtWrk> not really, I just wanted to bring up the issue of wide inheritance[15:07:56] <wPSvils> by the end of the article I'm not sure what it's critiquing ...[15:07:58] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[15:08:13] <wPSvils> I didn't understand the wide inheritance point.[15:08:18] <wPSvils> you mean inheritance in components?[15:10:15] <DnzAtWrk> not really[15:10:22] <wPSvils> ELI5 :([15:11:09] <DnzAtWrk> you need all of these features, and you have moved from a deep inheritance based hierarchy into a wide hierarchy[15:11:15] <DnzAtWrk> number of features is still the same[15:11:30] <wPSvils> yes, it is flatter, and you can now compose entities during runtime.[15:11:58] <DnzAtWrk> but now you have much looser couplings[15:12:29] <rts-sander> yes only one level[15:12:45] <rts-sander> but that's not bad because the goal was flexibility[15:13:56] <wPSvils> Yes, the whole point IS the looser coupling. I'm not a complete ECS purist, so you can as needed "glue" together things with a IBehaviour object as needed, though these parts would be fragile without some safety checks and what not.[15:14:01] <DnzAtWrk> so the question is when does it become more effort than it's worth[15:14:07] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[15:14:14] <DnzAtWrk> if you have a lot of entities which are similiar, ECS is great sure[15:14:26] <DnzAtWrk> if you have a lot of unique entities, ECS adds a lot of overhead and planning[15:14:42] <wPSvils> DnzAtWrk: Where you create a new class, I create a new system. The added complexity is usually imagined.[15:14:58] <wPSvils> Though imagined complexity is still real - hence I make my APIs cleaner with every iteration.[15:16:18] <wPSvils> it's something you either get used to, or have an abstraction layer to help and reduce boiler plate.[15:16:33] <wPSvils> using my ECS, I don't need to remember to add every entity to every relevant manager.[15:16:42] <wPSvils> the systems automatically pick up entities it needs to process.[15:16:54] <wPSvils> which helps with managing lifecycles etc.[15:18:39] <DnzAtWrk> You mean, every relevant system[15:20:54] <wPSvils> mm?[15:21:57] <DnzAtWrk> the systems deal with the components[15:22:00] <DnzAtWrk> not managers[15:22:20] <DnzAtWrk> unless you call a system a manager[15:22:34] <rts-sander> LifeCycleSystemManager[15:24:06] <wPSvils> When I did inheritance-based game stuff, I called them managers, but sure, you can call them systems, ye[15:24:15] <wPSvils> useless difference stuck in my head.[15:24:54] <DnzAtWrk> well it is in the name after all[15:25:16] <rts-sander> good old BulletManager[15:25:30] <DnzAtWrk> I still use ParticleManager now and then[15:25:40] <DnzAtWrk> And EntityManager and MapManager[15:25:51] <DnzAtWrk> SpriteManager[15:26:04] <rts-sander> ManagerManager[15:26:16] <DnzAtWrk> It wouldn't make sense to call it a MapFactory since it keeps a list of maps as well[15:27:54] <wPSvils> Uhf, BulletManager brings back the mems.[15:28:11] <wPSvils> a classic class[15:28:11] <DnzAtWrk> still makes sense if you're making a bullet hell game[15:28:14] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@2405:7f00:8a03:a100:773d:27e9:f519:dd31> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[15:28:51] <rts-sander> right? most game devs have written a BulletManager at some point[15:33:24] <brainzap> I wonder if I can learn pixel art[15:35:19] <DnzAtWrk> create 16x16 image -> scribble something -> does it look good? - yes -> keep, - no -> try again[15:36:29] <DnzAtWrk> or just draw whatever and be happy you had the patience to do it at all[15:37:25] <rts-sander> I saw a tool once that converted normal pictures into pixel art intelligently[15:38:15] <rts-sander> ah this: http://pixelatorapp.com/[15:38:44] * DnzAtWrk scratches chin[15:38:46] <DnzAtWrk> hold my beer[15:39:39] <rts-sander> that way you can doodle something crappy, then use the tool to make it look half decent[15:39:43] <DnzAtWrk> what, no online version?[15:39:57] <DnzAtWrk> I'll have to install it at home[15:40:32] <rts-sander> oooh and also "However, if you want to use it for commercial projects you need to Purchase a license"[15:40:45] <rts-sander> how is he going to know though that you used the tool[15:40:45] <DnzAtWrk> yeah yeah no biggie[15:40:50] <DnzAtWrk> I paid for texturepacker already[15:41:47] <DnzAtWrk> is there like a recommended black line width or what?[15:42:05] <rts-sander> idk never used it[15:44:22] <DnzAtWrk> god I'm too bored to even draw non-pixelated art[15:45:15] *** pulse <pulse!~pulse@unaffiliated/pulse> has joined #gamedev[15:45:42] *** cantel0pe is now known as cantelope[15:49:09] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has joined #gamedev[15:51:07] <brainzap> oh dont be like that DnzAtWrk, we all know you can do it if you put your mind to it[15:51:33] <solidfox> you can do it![15:54:01] <DnzAtWrk> would be easier without the expectation of failure or "not good enough"[15:54:10] <DnzAtWrk> when it all comes together it tends to be "good enough"[15:55:44] *** [Relic] <[Relic]!~Relic]@2602:306:33a3:6d30:3e:7bd4:ebd5:4815> has joined #gamedev[15:56:16] *** freefork_afk is now known as freestyledork[15:58:18] <DnzAtWrk> tell me if you have seen a game like this[15:59:35] *** rottz <rottz!~rottz@189.54.147.21> has joined #gamedev[16:00:57] <DnzAtWrk> it's a 2d game seen from the side. The world of the game is a downhill slope with hazards and bumps. Your goal is to pick random 2d shapes, planks, wheels, other things. Your goal is to connect random parts as you move down the hill and connect them to your own junk vehicle. The pieces of your vehicle are loosely connected and break off easily. You have a little pilot in the center of the vehicle. If the pilot touches the ground[16:00:57] <DnzAtWrk> its game over.[16:01:14] <DnzAtWrk> I'm sure several games like that must exist[16:02:05] <wPSvils> sounds like it could be fun[16:02:06] <DnzAtWrk> I need to see it exists so I don't need to make it[16:06:58] <WarauSalesman> :D[16:07:36] <WarauSalesman> it was so easy to implement arbitrary enemy behavior in my engine..[16:07:46] <jprajzne> so it's a macgyver game, DnzAtWrk? :))[16:08:49] <brainzap> does not sound fun[16:09:34] *** grouse <grouse!~grouse@83-233-9-2.cust.bredband2.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[16:13:39] <rts-sander> doesn't sound fun, don't do it, I'll do it[16:14:57] <rts-sander> but how do you collect the materials? are you constantly on the move?[16:15:24] <DnzAtWrk> yes, and when you break/move past pieces you can connect the game slows down[16:15:27] <DnzAtWrk> into slow motion[16:15:49] *** knops <knops!~yannick@ip-62-143-84-11.hsi01.unitymediagroup.de> has joined #gamedev[16:15:57] <DnzAtWrk> you click/touch and drag the piece onto your vehicle, and it automatically welds to the centers of all the other parts it touches[16:16:38] <DnzAtWrk> the part is rotated based upon its center of mass as you drag it, so if you drag a long rectangle at its edge it will line up in the direction you drag it[16:18:38] <brainzap> so you just have two wheels and a bar between, and thats it[16:18:50] <DnzAtWrk> to begin with yes[16:18:56] <DnzAtWrk> and the slope isn't too steep[16:19:09] <DnzAtWrk> two wheels, a bar and a guy made from a triangle and a sphere[16:19:24] <DnzAtWrk> you get more wheels later to pick up[16:20:14] <WarauSalesman> a very nice hint for gamedevs who struggle with OOP shenanigans:[16:20:23] <WarauSalesman> READ GoF Design Patterns book!!!!!![16:25:26] <rts-sander> that old crap? :P[16:25:49] <rts-sander> I wonder why functional programming never took off for gamedev[16:28:49] <jprajzne> it sort of did, if you use anonymous classes :))[16:28:55] <WarauSalesman> lol[16:29:04] <WarauSalesman> functional programming only works in certain contexts[16:29:11] <jprajzne> same for oop[16:29:14] <WarauSalesman> gamedev is too general purpose to be suitable for functional programming[16:29:29] <WarauSalesman> jprajzne, that is why C++ is the best for gamedev :)[16:29:34] <jprajzne> fucntional programming is as good as oop[16:29:51] <jprajzne> no, it's good because of performance and multiparadigm[16:29:59] <WarauSalesman> ofc[16:30:03] <WarauSalesman> my point exactly[16:30:09] <rts-sander> DnzAtWrk, and then at the end of the slope the player goes into a river and needs to cross it[16:30:10] <jprajzne> the latter is often scoped down, because we're messy kind :)[16:30:12] <WarauSalesman> multiparadigm = not limited to oop/fp crap[16:30:24] <jprajzne> sorry, gotta go[16:30:28] <rts-sander> DnzAtWrk, otherwise what's stopping you from building a massive machine, tacking everything on in your path?[16:30:28] <WarauSalesman> performance = what we actually want for games[16:30:34] <jprajzne> tomorrow if you want "_[16:30:36] <jprajzne> :)[16:30:48] <WarauSalesman> :)[16:30:53] *** jprajzne <jprajzne!jprajzne@nat/redhat/x-jlhuszrvbslcinve> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.)[16:43:49] *** Tylak <Tylak!~Tylak@074-135-002-092.res.spectrum.com> has joined #gamedev[16:46:35] *** zhalla <zhalla!~zhalla@unaffiliated/zhalla> has joined #gamedev[16:50:42] <brainzap> do you guys not have phones???[16:51:16] *** Twipply <Twipply!~Twipply@unaffiliated/twipply> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[16:52:25] <brainzap> it would be easier to learn Rust than to catch up to current C++[16:55:45] <pulse> you only need 0.03% of it to make a full game[16:56:17] <brainzap> if, for, functions and goto[16:56:45] <rts-sander> MOV[16:56:54] <pulse> std::vector helps[16:58:09] <solidfox> brainzap: i switched from rust to cpp for my tetris clone[16:58:20] <solidfox> brainzap: totally rewrote it.[16:58:26] <solidfox> brainzap: but i knew C to begin with.[16:59:00] <_DB> back[16:59:41] <pulse> C++ is like C on cocaine[16:59:46] <pulse> or meth[17:05:50] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[17:06:48] <solidfox> yes not sure why but i don't understand rusts module system[17:06:59] <solidfox> its not simple like java or csharp[17:07:07] <solidfox> its sorta convoluted[17:09:41] <brainzap> it was designed so that only smart people can use it[17:09:57] <solidfox> its also harder than c/c++ header files[17:10:07] <solidfox> brainzap: is that so? :P[17:10:50] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@77.208.14.46.static.wline.lns.sme.cust.swisscom.ch> has quit IRC (Quit: My tummy says it's time to sleep Mr. Bubbles.)[17:11:58] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[17:12:20] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has joined #gamedev[17:20:28] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[17:32:55] *** firippu <firippu!~philip@unaffiliated/firippu> has joined #gamedev[17:33:11] <cantelope> https://lookie.ml/v-IOF9i[17:34:03] <_DB> lolol[17:40:54] <solidfox> haha[17:47:20] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[17:52:33] <LastTalon> aeth, sorry for the late response. Depends on where you are. Around here in wisconsin a lot of places expect software devs to work for the wages of cashiers.[17:54:54] <LastTalon> Not all, but quite a few. Its just a sign of how little software dev (including game dev) is valued.[17:56:38] <LastTalon> In places that are known for software dev obviously the pay is better.[17:57:16] <LastTalon> But there are still systemic problems with how the industry treats its developers.[17:58:35] <LastTalon> As you said, 80+ hour workweeks, expecting employees to do extra work because someone else promised an untenable schedule, next to no bargaining power.[17:59:54] <brainzap> https://shiro.ch/MFbuqDw.jpg[18:02:24] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[18:09:32] <pulse> holy fucking unfuckable fuck https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU5Dn-WaElI[18:10:03] <pulse> gg[18:10:06] <pulse> no re[18:11:10] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[18:18:05] <pulse> this is the craziest shit i've ever seen[18:25:47] <Prestige> lol cantelope[18:32:18] *** Serpent7776 <Serpent7776!~Serpent77@90-156-31-193.internetia.net.pl> has joined #gamedev[18:32:30] <solidfox> i sometimes wonder how people around me earn money[18:33:01] <solidfox> lots of cars on the road and people at the store. i wonder are they all nurses?[18:33:14] <solidfox> (medical industry is big around here due to lots of elderly)[18:35:03] <DaScoot> judging wealth by spending habits can be misleading[18:35:24] <DaScoot> lots of people living on credit cards, the average american has like a couple hundred bucks in savings[18:38:03] <solidfox> my dad is 100k in debt[18:40:47] *** warweasle <warweasle!user@2600:3c03::f03c:91ff:fe26:d1db> has joined #gamedev[18:41:01] <brainzap> NA?[18:41:15] <solidfox> brainzap: what?[18:42:26] <solidfox> DaScoot: im judging based on their continued survival, but i suppose you're right, they could just be buying the means of survival on credit.[18:45:24] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has joined #gamedev[19:10:01] *** LunarJetman2 <LunarJetman2!LunarJetma@188.30.99.249.threembb.co.uk> has joined #gamedev[19:11:25] <brainzap> oh my god is apple swift garbage[19:11:54] *** ZeroSystem <ZeroSystem!2f1775d2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.47.23.117.210> has joined #gamedev[19:14:26] <solidfox> yes swift uses a reference counter for garbage collection[19:15:22] <brainzap> thats not what garbage collection means[19:17:02] <solidfox> what do you mean[19:17:09] <solidfox> i didnt define the term garbage collection[19:17:30] <solidfox> i merely stated a component of swift's gc[19:18:21] <brainzap> swift does not use garbage collection[19:18:41] <brainzap> there is no background process which watches the memory[19:18:41] <aeth> Reference counting was garbage collection until GC became uncool. Then it became a way to not have GC.[19:19:07] <DnzAtWrk> GC was never cool[19:19:09] <aeth> I guess definitions change, though.[19:19:23] <brainzap> well now we have sub 1ms GC so GC is back[19:19:27] <aeth> DnzAtWrk: Everything is cool then uncool. Java was cool at one point.[19:19:50] <DnzAtWrk> I bet silverlight was never cool[19:21:13] <aeth> Yeah but Silverlight isn't a subset of everything because it's dead.[19:21:33] <aeth> And good riddance.[19:21:36] <DnzAtWrk> pretty necrophobic[19:22:13] <DnzAtWrk> work is over, time to go home and drink and play re2[19:22:23] <aeth> The only thing Silverlight was used for ime was somehow DRMing videos that seemed to otherwise use Flash (!) so I couldn't watch it in Linux.[19:22:29] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df042-11.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[19:37:08] *** Sadale <Sadale!~Sadale@unaffiliated/sadale> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[19:51:31] *** Beliar <Beliar!~Beliar@2a02:8108:9640:6c42:44d7:f1ea:f05f:8787> has joined #gamedev[19:53:19] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomSof@207.219.200.115> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[19:59:30] *** rottz <rottz!~rottz@189.54.147.21> has quit IRC (Quit: rottz)[20:03:50] *** knops <knops!~yannick@ip-62-143-84-11.hsi01.unitymediagroup.de> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[20:04:29] *** knops <knops!~yannick@ip-62-143-84-11.hsi01.unitymediagroup.de> has joined #gamedev[20:07:15] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[20:07:18] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[20:10:04] * WarauSalesman hates Rust[20:10:06] *** rottz <rottz!~rottz@177.181.18.204> has joined #gamedev[20:12:41] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[20:15:53] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[20:18:37] *** kraybit <kraybit!~kraybit@46.230.220.238> has quit IRC (Quit: ZZZzzz…)[20:27:20] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[20:32:49] <aeth> WarauSalesman: This is #gamedev so I have to ask: Which Rust?[20:34:05] *** Twipply <Twipply!~Twipply@unaffiliated/twipply> has joined #gamedev[20:37:06] * mr_lou has no idea what Rust is.[20:38:38] <aeth> mr_lou: Rust is an online, multiplayer survival game where being a jerk is the point of the game. Rust is a low-level (relative to most non-asm languages) C++-competitor programming language that focuses on safety (like Ada) and performance.[20:39:20] <aeth> Since it's both a game and a language that can be used to write games, "Rust" is ambiguous in a gamedev context. Do you think the game's awful and shouldn't be copied or that the language is awful and shouldn't be used?[20:39:58] <WarauSalesman> fuuuuck! I have to develop in Python today :((((((((([20:40:15] <WarauSalesman> aeth, now please make a similar review of Python[20:45:13] <aeth> WarauSalesman: I can't because I haven't played the game Python[20:45:24] <WarauSalesman> just don't[20:45:26] <WarauSalesman> it is miserable[20:45:35] <WarauSalesman> almost bad as Candy Crush[20:56:05] *** genr8__ <genr8__!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has joined #gamedev[20:59:13] *** genr8_ <genr8_!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[20:59:44] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[21:06:24] *** PSvils <PSvils!~PDevelope@88.135.146.138> has joined #gamedev[21:11:03] *** genr8_ <genr8_!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has joined #gamedev[21:14:28] *** genr8__ <genr8__!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[21:22:24] *** freestyledork is now known as freefork_afk[21:23:12] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[21:27:31] *** refs <refs!~refs@dslb-178-005-230-000.178.005.pools.vodafone-ip.de> has joined #gamedev[21:28:52] *** Sadale <Sadale!~Sadale@unaffiliated/sadale> has joined #gamedev[21:29:26] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has joined #gamedev[21:31:55] *** warweasle <warweasle!user@2600:3c03::f03c:91ff:fe26:d1db> has quit IRC (Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.4.1)[21:35:59] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Quit: My tummy says it's time to sleep Mr. Bubbles.)[21:45:48] *** code_zombie <code_zombie!~code_zomb@2605:a601:aa1:da00:a9d7:d2b9:3b8b:824> has joined #gamedev[21:51:40] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)[21:53:07] *** freefork_afk is now known as freestyledork[22:06:02] *** Serpent7776 <Serpent7776!~Serpent77@90-156-31-193.internetia.net.pl> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[22:06:42] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[22:11:53] *** atomekk <atomekk!~atomekk@unaffiliated/atomekk> has joined #gamedev[22:13:47] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[22:15:39] *** Beliar <Beliar!~Beliar@2a02:8108:9640:6c42:44d7:f1ea:f05f:8787> has quit IRC (Quit: The only real mistake is the one from which we learn nothing)[22:19:06] *** firippu <firippu!~philip@unaffiliated/firippu> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[22:24:28] *** DaScoot <DaScoot!~Scooter@static-24-153-33-9.cpe.metrocast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Bye)[22:24:48] *** [Relic] <[Relic]!~Relic]@2602:306:33a3:6d30:3e:7bd4:ebd5:4815> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[22:50:05] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c786OGJ1VU[22:50:12] <pulse> me trying to sell a game in an oversaturated market[22:50:40] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@79.184.45.219.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[22:56:30] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[23:00:02] * WarauSalesman does not like Seinfeld and Friends.[23:00:03] *** atom32k <atom32k!~atomekk@unaffiliated/atomekk> has joined #gamedev[23:00:26] * WarauSalesman liked a little bit of How I Met Your Mother[23:00:27] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[23:01:28] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has joined #gamedev[23:02:48] *** atomekk <atomekk!~atomekk@unaffiliated/atomekk> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[23:03:14] <solidfox> pulse: lol[23:03:26] <solidfox> step 1. make a game[23:04:29] <solidfox> step 2. create a patch that installs a piece of ransomware, and only apply the patch to certain users downloading from strange sites (that you secretly run)[23:04:41] <solidfox> step 3. go directly to prison.[23:04:50] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@c-98-252-1-155.hsd1.de.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[23:04:53] <solidfox> nevermind, thats a bad idea[23:06:04] *** atom32k__ <atom32k__!~atomekk@unaffiliated/atomekk> has joined #gamedev[23:09:03] *** atom32k <atom32k!~atomekk@unaffiliated/atomekk> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[23:10:20] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[23:13:34] *** Prestige <Prestige!~Prestige@2607:5300:60:549::1> has quit IRC (Quit: Prestige)[23:14:26] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[23:21:53] *** Prestige <Prestige!~Prestige@2607:5300:60:549::1> has joined #gamedev[23:26:41] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[23:27:09] <WarauSalesman> :D[23:28:50] <pulse> seinfeld is way better than friends[23:29:21] <pulse> friends is too typical and social[23:29:43] <pulse> seinfeld is completely antisocial and full of psychotic people[23:29:49] <pulse> seinfeld is 10/10[23:29:50] <pulse> :p[23:30:16] <WarauSalesman> heh[23:30:57] <PSvils> I thought I didn't like Seinfeld, then I started watching from ep.1, and I really dig that show.[23:30:58] <R2robot> seinfeld was the best![23:31:15] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[23:31:21] <PSvils> I made myself start watching because over and over all kinds of comedians were saying how Seinfeld changed comedy.[23:31:30] <WarauSalesman> +__+[23:31:34] <PSvils> so if comedians I really like say that, must be true![23:31:39] <PSvils> Friends is shit, I hate that shit.[23:31:47] <WarauSalesman> well, at least seinfeld does not have that damned background laughing[23:32:05] <WarauSalesman> or does it have? I don't remember anymore[23:32:48] <pulse> it does[23:33:11] <pulse> but it's actual live audience[23:33:57] <PSvils> you can see the actors break once in a while[23:34:07] <PSvils> it's a nice watching experience.[23:34:56] <WarauSalesman> ewww[23:35:07] <WarauSalesman> what is the cheapest registrar for transferring .net domains? :D[23:35:17] <WarauSalesman> domains.google is charging me 12 bucks[23:35:21] <WarauSalesman> it seems the cheapest[23:36:32] <PSvils> you're a salesman, you figure it out[23:37:15] *** knops <knops!~yannick@ip-62-143-84-11.hsi01.unitymediagroup.de> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[23:37:28] <R2robot> I liked friends too...[23:37:34] <R2robot> ALso, Everybody Loves Raymond :D[23:37:47] <pulse> i watched many many sitcoms[23:37:56] <pulse> and just two are on the top end[23:38:05] <pulse> allo allo and seinfeld[23:38:06] <pulse> :p[23:38:10] <R2robot> lol wut[23:38:18] <pulse> slightly lower is it crowd[23:38:24] <pulse> then nothing for a long while[23:38:32] <R2robot> way lower, but kinda funny[23:38:40] <R2robot> went off track with that weird dark guy[23:38:42] <pulse> 3rd rock from the sun is somewhat up there too[23:38:44] <R2robot> emo* guy[23:39:12] <pulse> richmond?[23:39:15] <pulse> lol, he's the funniest[23:39:17] <R2robot> All in the Family was god tier[23:39:32] <pulse> hmm, never watched it[23:39:42] <R2robot> it's from the 70s :D[23:39:49] <pulse> it's probably good then[23:39:53] <R2robot> Also Benny Hill[23:43:31] *** code_zombie <code_zombie!~code_zomb@2605:a601:aa1:da00:a9d7:d2b9:3b8b:824> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[23:44:38] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZYu7DnsCF0[23:45:02] *** atom32k__ <atom32k__!~atomekk@unaffiliated/atomekk> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[23:45:14] *** code_zombie <code_zombie!~code_zomb@136.63.230.43> has joined #gamedev[23:47:08] <R2robot> lol loved 3rd rock[23:47:28] <R2robot> Frasier is really good as well[23:49:02] *** ZeroSystem <ZeroSystem!2f1775d2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.47.23.117.210> has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed)[23:56:25] *** Glasstree <Glasstree!~Glasstree@2a01:4c8:101c:6499:f1bc:7d8:18d5:1e61> has joined #gamedev