January 9, 2019 
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January 9, 2019 [00:01:56] <myke> lazyness isn't a good attribute for a game developer nor a business owner[00:02:14] <aeth> My main hope is that Sol won't be let go when the inevitable merger happens.[00:02:49] <aeth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andromeda%E2%80%93Milky_Way_collision#Fate_of_the_Solar_System[00:02:58] *** HZun <HZun!~HZun@0x3ec721e2.osd.customer.dk.telia.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[00:03:22] *** rtypo <rtypo!~alex@unaffiliated/rtypo> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[00:04:51] <aeth> myke: depends on what kind of laziness.[00:05:26] <aeth> myke: Laziness as in buy a bunch of Unity assets and expect people to like the game? No. Laziness as in cut the scope down so it's achievable with a lot less work? Could be a good thing.[00:06:06] <solidfox> aeth: no sir. you must build your own engine. dont be lazy![00:06:17] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomTab@modemcable249.134-83-70.mc.videotron.ca> has joined #gamedev[00:06:30] <aeth> solidfox: Well, I happen to agree.[00:07:05] <solidfox> aeth: i get the feeling if i actually get serious about games development im gonna end up trying to make an engine..[00:07:20] <solidfox> but why[00:07:32] <aeth> If you want to make your own engine, though, you have to make a game that's better on its own engine than on some other engine, though. A generic MP FPS or something else that's common enough to be well-supported in major engines is probably a bad game idea for a custom engine project.[00:07:35] *** [Relic] <[Relic]!~Relic]@2602:306:33a3:6d30:482c:9f95:943b:5c9f> has joined #gamedev[00:07:50] <aeth> Something like Factorio definitely makes sense on its own engine.[00:08:10] <solidfox> kojima made his own[00:08:11] <solidfox> TIME[00:08:26] *** Buoy172 <Buoy172!~Buoy172@13.94.248.217> has quit IRC ()[00:08:27] <solidfox> kojima made his own engine just for metal gear solid[00:08:32] <solidfox> its basically a shooter[00:08:45] <solidfox> aeth: unreal finished building when i said time[00:09:08] <aeth> solidfox: (1) that was a long time ago when engines were a lot more expensive and (2) AAA plays by its own rules in terms of what makes sense to do[00:09:22] <solidfox> aeth: ah[00:09:29] <aeth> Also, I thought the engine was called TIME[00:10:28] <solidfox> nah sorry i was being weird about it[00:10:38] <solidfox> anyways, unreal doesnt run[00:11:28] <aeth> lol[00:11:50] <aeth> Welcome to the wonderful world of compiling someone else's gigantic C++ project.[00:11:59] <aeth> See you in a week when you figure out how to get everything working.[00:12:10] *** RoadKillGrill <RoadKillGrill!~RoadKillG@cpe-24-166-114-198.neo.res.rr.com> has joined #gamedev[00:22:54] <myke> aeth: making an achievable design for your team (which may be just you) isn't being "lazy" it's understanding what's feasible[00:23:12] <myke> every game has some sort of "engine"[00:23:19] <myke> it may just be for that game tho[00:23:48] <myke> i prefer somewhat lower level frameworks just for the control[00:33:14] *** HZun <HZun!~HZun@0x3ec721e2.osd.customer.dk.telia.net> has joined #gamedev[00:40:28] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.125.57.214> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[00:42:33] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)[00:47:28] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[00:50:38] <LastTalon> That is being lazy.[00:51:03] <dostoyevsky> myke: what's a lower level framework?[00:52:02] <dostoyevsky> s/ a / an example for a /[00:52:43] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[00:53:07] <dostoyevsky> aeth: I thought one week is just for compiling the whole project once :)[00:53:24] <dostoyevsky> So it may take like 6months to get it working[00:54:07] <LastTalon> I feel like this is being misinterpreted.[00:54:20] <LastTalon> Lazy in this context is not the same as loafing.[00:55:03] <LastTalon> aeth, interpreted it as intended.[00:57:23] <LastTalon> Not doing paperwork to gain a benefit is laziness. You're not doing the work. That doesn't mean you did nothing instead.[01:21:42] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[01:28:51] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[01:30:36] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)[01:30:40] *** mandeep <mandeep!mandeep@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mandeepb> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[01:32:23] *** mandeep <mandeep!mandeep@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mandeepb> has joined #gamedev[01:35:16] *** HZun <HZun!~HZun@0x3ec721e2.osd.customer.dk.telia.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[01:37:44] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[01:42:57] *** freestyledork is now known as freefork_afk[01:47:13] <myke> dostoyevsky: libgdx[01:47:15] <myke> is whag i use[01:48:13] <myke> imagine writing games in java smh :([01:58:18] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has joined #gamedev[01:59:13] *** ZeroSystem <ZeroSystem!45f81b6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.248.27.107> has joined #gamedev[02:00:57] <solidfox> i dont understand what i have to do to run Unreal engine[02:01:49] <solidfox> it says "Cannot find a compatible Vulkan driver (ICD). Please look at the Getting Started guide for more info."[02:02:46] <solidfox> i dont know what Vulkan is[02:04:08] <myke> yikes[02:08:56] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has joined #gamedev[02:09:18] <solidfox> i have a built-in intel gpu[02:09:34] *** Cahaan <Cahaan!~Cahaan@ns326233.ip-37-187-158.eu> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[02:10:06] <solidfox> im gonna try mesa-vulkan-drivers[02:13:45] <solidfox> huh that worked[02:17:20] <solidfox> myke: i tried asking yesterday about a book that would bring me upto date on terminology but i was told reading books is for squares[02:18:52] <solidfox> (guess i would know about vulkan if i actually played games!)[02:27:57] <solidfox> im in[02:36:30] <LastTalon> Reading books is fine.[02:36:39] <LastTalon> There's just no book that's going to teach you want you want.[02:38:28] <solidfox> yeah[02:38:30] <solidfox> you're right[02:38:43] <LastTalon> You might find books on game design, or programming, or on 3D art, or whatever.[02:38:49] <solidfox> if there were a book, everyone would be doing it. and then who would buy the games[02:39:01] <solidfox> they'd be too busy making them[02:40:17] <LastTalon> Turns out that game dev comprehensively is an art form that draws from many diverse disciplines.[02:40:33] <aeth> Strange that it would require Vulkan. Lots of perfectly-capable hardware from idk 2012ish can't run Vulkan.[02:40:49] <aeth> (and I wouldn't be surprised if for Intel it was 2014ish or 2015ish)[02:41:14] <LastTalon> I'd wager it needs the driver whether or not its using vulkan on that particular hardware.[02:41:51] * LastTalon shrug[02:42:02] <chrisf> aeth: the intel 2013 hardware can run vulkan just fine.[02:42:19] <chrisf> aeth: dont fud[02:42:37] <aeth> Not on AMD from 2010, but on AMD from 2012. Same with Nvidia. Intel from 2012-104 can run Vulkan but only on Linux and Android. Windows requires 2015+. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vulkan_(API)#Compatibility[02:42:57] *** notus <notus!uid244649@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qwgpwakmwtsptbjt> has joined #gamedev[02:43:15] <chrisf> more 'driver team doesnt care' than hardware issues[02:43:32] <aeth> Technically hardware you *bought in 2012* (like the GPU I had bought at the time) can't run it, but hardware *released in 2012* can all run it, except Intel on Windows.[02:44:09] <aeth> Thinking in terms of the latter is probably more accurately saying "from 2012"[02:44:16] <chrisf> windows driver team is 'build what we need to sell the silicon'. linux team is 'stick it to the windows team'[02:44:54] <aeth> s/from 2012-104/from 2012-2014/[02:44:58] <aeth> I really did typo that year a lot[02:53:18] *** macza <macza!~macza@d75-157-125-9.bchsia.telus.net> has joined #gamedev[02:57:19] *** macza <macza!~macza@d75-157-125-9.bchsia.telus.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[02:59:26] <solidfox> hmm everytime i try to open an unreal project it crashes :p[02:59:34] <solidfox> ok im sticking with unity for now[03:00:00] <solidfox> maybe someday i'll have a windows 10 PC with 32 GB of memory and 5 graphics cards[03:02:11] <aeth> I'd be surprised if 16 GB isn't enough. What do you have? 8 GB?[03:02:37] <solidfox> yeah[03:02:43] <solidfox> 8gb[03:03:04] <chrisf> download more ram[03:03:17] <aeth> chrisf: cruel not to provide the link[03:03:20] <aeth> solidfox: https://downloadmoreram.com/[03:03:25] <solidfox> ok[03:03:41] <solidfox> woah this is free!?[03:03:45] <solidfox> awesome! thanks guys[03:04:24] <aeth> oooh it's an updated design that even links to an information video at the end[03:04:37] <solidfox> woah i got rick rolled[03:04:53] <solidfox> aeth: my ram is still the same[03:04:59] <solidfox> i chose 32 GB of course[03:05:57] <aeth> solidfox: did you go to the information link?[03:06:41] <solidfox> aeth: yeah[03:06:48] <solidfox> good song[03:07:57] <solidfox> what is RAM anyways?[03:08:01] <solidfox> maybe i need to upgrade it[03:08:07] <solidfox> to the new version[03:08:10] <solidfox> before getting more[03:08:18] <aeth> what's sad is I immediately recognize dQw YouTube links so I don't even need to click it[03:08:37] <solidfox> lol nice[03:09:56] <aeth> A very old version of RAM (thanks, Wikipedia). https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e7/Antikensammlung_Kiel_107.JPG[03:10:50] <solidfox> lol[03:12:01] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[03:19:55] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)[03:22:14] *** NiniGeo2 <NiniGeo2!~NiniGeo2@c-73-178-72-18.hsd1.nj.comcast.net> has joined #gamedev[03:22:22] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has joined #gamedev[03:24:46] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[03:26:37] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[03:29:47] *** unixfreak <unixfreak!~null@unaffiliated/unixfreak> has joined #gamedev[03:31:09] <myke> sorry never used unreal engine[03:31:14] <myke> i really only do 2d games these days[03:31:27] <myke> speaking of containing scope to what one or two developers can handle[03:31:56] <aeth> eh 3D isn't bad you just need to pick an achievable style[03:32:41] <myke> i've done simple 3d games[03:32:47] <myke> everything is more complex with 3d, though[03:33:24] <aeth> Depends. Some of the most complicated games are 2D because they really can't be 3D and offer as much as they do offer.[03:33:30] <aeth> 3D has a higher complexity baseline, though.[03:35:14] <baudejogos> does anyone here use Lua?[03:35:52] <LastTalon> Yes[03:36:22] <baudejogos> embedded?[03:40:04] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has joined #gamedev[03:40:57] <aeth> any other way to use Lua?[03:41:09] <LastTalon> Yeah, what would be the alternative you had in mind?[03:41:27] <LastTalon> Just ask your question.[03:41:29] <aeth> I looked into a few Lua game frameworks and they behave basically the same way, with a C++ core. It's just the way Lua works.[03:42:22] <baudejogos> so I want to know about the mindset used to write the scripts. what steps are taken to make the scripts to happen inside the game[03:42:37] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has joined #gamedev[03:42:53] <LastTalon> Its largely imperative, but not strictly.[03:43:09] <LastTalon> Functions are first class, so you have a lot of flexibility in that regard.[03:43:15] <baudejogos> for example, now I want to add rules to my scenario. how do you usually add rules with lua scripts?[03:43:44] <baudejogos> what do you usually bind and what do you usually leave inside the vm[03:43:46] <LastTalon> I'm not sure about the second part. "make the script to happen"[03:44:06] <baudejogos> ok. let's use two rules as examples:[03:44:17] <baudejogos> 1) I want to tell what and how tiles would be destructed[03:44:31] <baudejogos> 2) I want to trigger new tiles after some time passed or some enemy destroyed[03:44:40] <LastTalon> Okay.[03:45:04] <baudejogos> scenarioRules = { ... }[03:45:43] <LastTalon> So an API usually exposes certain libraries of functions that you can interact with in Lua.[03:45:52] <LastTalon> For instance you might have a tiles library.[03:46:00] <baudejogos> yes. I have this already for levels, players, enemies, weapons[03:46:08] <LastTalon> And I might be able to call a function like tiles.destruct() with some parameters.[03:46:15] <baudejogos> my Scenario class also allows tile manipulation[03:46:44] <LastTalon> You can also get back userdata that can itself have properties and methods to call.[03:47:15] <LastTalon> So you might get an object "tile" from somewhere and use the property tile.type to give it a new type and it would then change in the world.[03:47:33] <baudejogos> yes and yes :) I know how to embed Lua. I am looking for ideas and use cases. I want to know your similar experiences[03:47:41] <LastTalon> As far as when to trigger actions usually there's some sort of event/callback system.[03:48:13] <baudejogos> I am mostly interested on how to define rules/actions in Lua[03:48:23] <LastTalon> Not entirely sure what you're looking for then.[03:48:43] <baudejogos> examples, war stories, etc.[03:49:05] <LastTalon> You're not being clear on what you want people to tell you.[03:49:06] *** cheakoirccloud <cheakoirccloud!uid293319@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vorsgweckskosssd> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[03:49:40] <baudejogos> [21:48] <baudejogos> I am mostly interested on how to define rules/actions in Lua. have you done something similar? if yes can you talk about it?[03:50:00] <LastTalon> I'm not sure what you mean by rules and actions if you don't mean calls to some api.[03:53:44] <LastTalon> Do you mean like an action event system.[03:53:46] <LastTalon> ?[03:53:58] <baudejogos> perhaps[03:54:17] <baudejogos> I am just looking for examples and inspirations[03:54:23] <baudejogos> but I feel I won't get any[03:55:58] <LastTalon> Probably not. Can't really tell you what you want if I'm not sure what it is you're asking for.[03:57:20] <LastTalon> If you want to know the general structure of most scripts, you either define certain callbacks or subscribe to certain events and take actions using some api calls when those events/callbacks trigger.[03:57:28] <LastTalon> Thats the general idea of most scripts in Lua.[03:57:39] <baudejogos> yeah[03:59:07] <LastTalon> There's also #lua[03:59:51] <baudejogos> too much noise there. I already tried[04:00:01] <baudejogos> perhaps I can find a better time and try again[04:00:10] <LastTalon> No one is talking there right now.[04:01:03] <aeth> if you're doing something real time you probably want a tick system[04:01:31] <aeth> So constantly tick forward, maybe 100 times a second or something along those lines (in that case each tick would be 10 ms). Do this independently of the framerate.[04:02:15] <aeth> Then you can work in absolute time (e.g. 1500) or relative time (135 ticks from now) and it's all integers, no floating point and the mess it can cause.[04:02:43] <aeth> Sort of like the advice to work in cents instead of dollars when you're working with currency.[04:03:32] <aeth> This is afaik not built into Lua (not every Lua program will want it!)[04:04:04] <aeth> Even if there's a timer, you don't want that, you want a game timer so it can e.g. be paused.[04:06:12] <aeth> And if you're doing a turn based game, you'd do something similar, but with turns, so the numbers would be smaller, but the concepts for your actions would be similar.[04:07:18] <baudejogos> Lua with turn based games is way easier[04:07:27] <baudejogos> just hand over almost everything to it :D[04:07:36] <aeth> Of course, time isn't the only factor. You also want to do things in location. If you're doing a 2D game, large tiles can be used. If you're doing 3D games you'd have to set spheres or circles some other shape and be careful not to trigger it twice.[04:08:25] <aeth> (unless, of course the 3D is purely graphical and it's just ultimately a 2D board game in its gameplay or something)[04:08:42] <LastTalon> You usually get some sort of access to the core loop. And the callbacks and events usually take place sometime in this loop.[04:09:11] <LastTalon> Even if they don't necessarily specify that.[04:09:40] <LastTalon> But like... input events usually happen during the input step of the loop.[04:10:23] <LastTalon> Of course that's all dependent on what its being used for, so it could be completely wrong and wonky.[04:16:27] *** SaraDT_ <SaraDT_!~SaraDT@unaffiliated/saradt> has joined #gamedev[04:28:59] *** refs <refs!~refs@dslb-178-005-091-189.178.005.pools.vodafone-ip.de> has quit IRC (Quit: refs)[04:34:51] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)[04:37:50] *** krychu <krychu!~krychu@2a02:1205:505c:2ab0:cdf7:6cdb:981f:1305> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[04:41:09] *** pavonia <pavonia!~user@unaffiliated/siracusa> has quit IRC (Quit: Bye!)[04:56:54] <solidfox> i think unity cant do textures[04:59:11] <solidfox> maybe its paid[04:59:15] *** RoadKillGrill <RoadKillGrill!~RoadKillG@cpe-24-166-114-198.neo.res.rr.com> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[05:07:21] <LastTalon> solidfox, it can.[05:09:10] <solidfox> is that what a shader does[05:10:17] <aeth> if unity couldn't do textures every free unity game would look like Mario 64[05:10:23] <aeth> well, maybe with more polygons[05:10:55] <aeth> textures are just about everything[05:11:02] <solidfox> ok so i .. no im gonna read the manual a little more[05:11:54] <LastTalon> solidfox, or do a few tutorials. They should cover it.[05:12:12] <LastTalon> Textures are applied to materials, and materials are applied to game objects.[05:12:47] <LastTalon> Renderers and meshes are also applied to game objects that will use that material in its rendering.[05:14:32] <aeth> Yes, textures aren't literally everything, but they're essentially why games look like they do now as opposed to what they looked like in 1996. And the polygon count isn't as high as you think, most of that is texture trickery.[05:15:08] <LastTalon> Darn shader magic![05:16:15] <aeth> What really (probably) happens in post-2008 games is that artists make really high poly models (what you think the game uses) and then textures/materials/etc. are used to make the in-game asset look roughly like that model even though the actual polygons probably aren't that much more than what 2004 games had.[05:16:25] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has joined #gamedev[05:17:54] <aeth> With solid colors instead of textures, you'd see triangles and rough edges everywhere and nothing would be round.[05:18:54] <aeth> Well, with flat lighting, too.[05:19:52] <dostoyevsky> aeth: could one use high-poly models right out of zbrush or the like these days in games?[05:20:57] <solidfox> LastTalon: before i got a job program i was pretty confident that i could do it, and figure things out in their project[05:21:06] <solidfox> LastTalon: i knew the names of everything[05:21:18] <LastTalon> aeth, you could still do some of the material stuff even with flat colors to make it look nicer.[05:21:23] <solidfox> LastTalon: im not confident about this.. yeah maybe i need to do a tutorials[05:21:34] <LastTalon> Like without a texture, having flat colors still.[05:21:38] <solidfox> but i didnt learn programming doing tutorials.. not at first..[05:21:49] <aeth> dostoyevsky: At some point you draw a line and do the rest of it tricks with lighting + materials + textures. How many triangles probably depends on the importance, e.g. a player character in a 3rd person 3D game.[05:21:53] <aeth> afaik[05:22:03] <aeth> LastTalon: Yes, it's probably best thought of as a combination of lighting + materials + textures.[05:22:31] <LastTalon> Like... tf2's aesthetic can be a good example.[05:22:38] <LastTalon> Lots of flat colors and whatnot.[05:22:52] <aeth> Well, that kind of aesthetic has *tons* of nice lighting in modern games[05:23:02] <aeth> Much better than you'd see in e.g. 2004. The thing that really stands out, really.[05:23:05] <solidfox> my blender project is fucked up beyond repair[05:23:10] <LastTalon> But even so, in tf2 I suppose you could say you notice the comparatively low poly models.[05:23:11] <solidfox> i hit render and its just a white image[05:23:18] <LastTalon> But it definitely does its job.[05:24:13] <LastTalon> solidfox, well how did you learn programming?[05:24:13] <solidfox> oh i was set to alpha[05:24:50] <solidfox> LastTalon: oh yeah i guess i did do some tutorials, but when i went to college the professor taught us ADA and i read excerpts from the book[05:24:54] <LastTalon> I think you're just encountering the daunting amount of material that exists and getting stuck there. You don't have to know it all.[05:25:21] <LastTalon> Game dev is not a small area of knowledge. Much the opposite.[05:25:36] <LastTalon> Lots of different areas culminating into one product.[05:27:03] <LastTalon> Tutorials would probably be good. They can sort of cut to the chase on a lot of this stuff.[05:27:51] <LastTalon> You don't always need to get caught up in how to get the textures and materials and meshes to work, the tutorial will tell you how to get them in and you can start learning how to use them.[05:28:36] <LastTalon> This is something textbooks and classes hide from you. All the extra stuff you would naturally have run into first.[05:29:39] <LastTalon> Maybe keep a notepad where you can write down things you want to learn or don't understand. That way you can move on from them for now and come back to them later.[05:29:56] <dostoyevsky> aeth: it just seems so much wasted energy that one has to retopologize all the models regularly to keep up with the rising performances of gpu cards[05:31:19] <dostoyevsky> aeth: or is one already at a stage these days where you actually won't have to retopologize for some years as with that target resolution it just looks good enough[05:34:22] <solidfox> LastTalon: so like what do you think, blender tutorials and then unity tutorials?[05:34:38] <LastTalon> I mean... both if you're planning on doing both.[05:34:49] <solidfox> i have to do everything myself i think[05:35:11] <LastTalon> The thing to keep in mind is you'll have to work gradually.[05:35:25] <solidfox> my old friends from youth group are artistic but one wont shutup about trump on facebook so i dont wanna talk to him[05:35:31] *** veridiam <veridiam!~alex@S010674d02b5e3c80.vs.shawcable.net> has joined #gamedev[05:35:35] <LastTalon> You'll start by learning the tools, then proceed into very general types of tasks, then into more specific knowledge of how things are done.[05:36:00] <solidfox> ok[05:36:07] <baudejogos> oh boo hoo hoo evil truuump[05:36:10] <solidfox> damn whos gonna make the music[05:36:12] <LastTalon> I mean its hard to elaborate on without an example.[05:36:35] <LastTalon> But like... you aren't obviously going to be making the kind of stuff a professional 3D artist would after your first blender tutorial.[05:37:03] <solidfox> i did learn some good things when i did a blender tutorial ages ago in youth group[05:37:16] <solidfox> like the n key[05:37:27] <LastTalon> solidfox, you can maybe find some hobbyists to team up with.[05:37:48] <LastTalon> Unfortunately here is probably not the best place for it.[05:37:52] <aeth> dostoyevsky: blame consoles, probably[05:38:02] <LastTalon> Doesn't seem to be that much interest in that kind of thing here.[05:38:07] <aeth> dostoyevsky: maybe things will change with the next gen which will take a while, maybe not. The Switch is pretty weak.[05:38:11] <solidfox> LastTalon: in blender?[05:38:22] <solidfox> LastTalon: what do you guys do buy 3d models?[05:38:25] <LastTalon> I meant game dev in general.[05:38:36] <aeth> dostoyevsky: keep in mind though that people do buy remasters when there's a new console gen so maybe it's actually profitable[05:38:37] <solidfox> not much interest in game dev in #gamedev ???[05:38:40] <LastTalon> You can find some people to do hobby projects with and learn from each other.[05:39:02] <LastTalon> Grouping up for hobby projects doesn't appear to be very popular here.[05:39:07] <solidfox> where do i find people[05:39:32] <LastTalon> Around? Idk.[05:39:34] <solidfox> google.com people near me[05:39:38] <solidfox> no results[05:39:52] <LastTalon> Game devs in your area.[05:40:07] <LastTalon> They want to chat with you.[05:40:29] <veridiam> i've been down the join-up-with-hobbyists route before. you won't get anything done unless you're paying people. they don't get their tasks done and they'll disappear suddenly[05:40:34] *** mandeep <mandeep!mandeep@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mandeepb> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[05:40:58] <veridiam> scope something small enough that you can finish it solo or save up some capital to pay people[05:41:04] <LastTalon> I mean if your intent is to make a professional product that's probably correct.[05:41:20] <LastTalon> Otherwise you'd see a lot of well-made games created by hobby groups all over the place.[05:41:39] <solidfox> damn i need capital to acquire capital :< life is so unfair[05:41:50] <LastTalon> But if learning is your goal its probably fine.[05:42:02] <LastTalon> You don't actually have to finish a project to learn, but do try to finish your projects.[05:42:06] <solidfox> my goal is to fund my tea drinking, and maybe build a house in the woods[05:42:16] <LastTalon> To drink tea in?[05:42:19] <solidfox> yes[05:42:22] <solidfox> how did you know!?[05:42:33] <LastTalon> I have a similar goal.[05:42:41] <LastTalon> This reminds me. I need to buy tea tomorrow.[05:42:41] <solidfox> heh[05:42:49] <solidfox> LastTalon: lets team up[05:43:07] <solidfox> LastTalon: also do you drink pu'erh tea[05:43:07] <baudejogos> tea up[05:43:13] <LastTalon> ^[05:43:21] <solidfox> lol[05:43:30] <dostoyevsky> solidfox: I could be your project mismanager[05:43:37] <dostoyevsky> let's do it!!![05:43:38] <solidfox> dostoyevsky: ok[05:43:42] <LastTalon> dostoyevsky, can you be the "idea guy" instead?[05:43:46] <LastTalon> :D[05:43:47] <dostoyevsky> developers, developers, developers[05:43:51] <LastTalon> ^[05:44:11] <LastTalon> Developers, developers, developers, developers, developers[05:44:30] <solidfox> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMU0tzLwhbE[05:44:33] <dostoyevsky> Ok, you have 10mins to launch[05:44:51] <dostoyevsky> You have 5mins to launch[05:44:53] <solidfox> 10 minutes? ok ive got a rolling ball game i copied from a unity tutorial[05:44:56] <LastTalon> solidfox, I've not seen this one before.[05:45:08] <dostoyevsky> 2mins to launch[05:45:09] <solidfox> LastTalon: lol someone made a song out of it[05:45:15] <LastTalon> dostoyevsky, I have a chrome extension that isn't very feature rich, but it works as intended.[05:45:17] <LastTalon> :D[05:45:19] <dostoyevsky> Ok, your game just launched[05:45:21] <LastTalon> Is that good en ough?[05:45:22] <aeth> dostoyevsky: launch? SpaceX or something?[05:45:25] <aeth> oh some game[05:45:49] <dostoyevsky> I didn't know that earning 1mio USD was so easy[05:46:10] <dostoyevsky> solidfox: Where do I need to send my bill?[05:46:32] <solidfox> dostoyevsky: you get paid with stocks not money[05:46:42] <LastTalon> Lol[05:46:57] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[05:47:09] <LastTalon> You get 30% of revenue :D[05:47:22] <dostoyevsky> solidfox: That wasn't what we didn't really agree on.... Luckily I have a good lawyer specializing in IRC[05:47:49] <LastTalon> My lawyer says this constitutes an implicit contract. :D[05:51:28] <solidfox> dostoyevsky: alright you're fired[05:51:48] <LastTalon> You fool, you have to pay severance now![05:52:48] *** grim002 <grim002!~grim001@ip70-173-209-228.lv.lv.cox.net> has joined #gamedev[05:53:35] <aeth> dostoyevsky: the next launch is about Jan 11. Don't get us excited by saying "2mins to launch". https://spaceflightnow.com/launch-schedule/[05:59:13] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@189.78.182.121> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[06:02:09] *** grim001 <grim001!~grim001@ip70-173-209-228.lv.lv.cox.net> has quit IRC (*.net *.split)[06:02:09] *** BlueProtoman <BlueProtoman!~BlueProto@ool-4577fdaf.dyn.optonline.net> has quit IRC (*.net *.split)[06:08:20] *** BlueProtoman <BlueProtoman!~BlueProto@ool-4577fdaf.dyn.optonline.net> has joined #gamedev[06:10:22] *** [Relic] <[Relic]!~Relic]@2602:306:33a3:6d30:482c:9f95:943b:5c9f> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[06:10:38] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[06:14:44] * dostoyevsky launches aeth into space on destination OGLE-2005-BLG-390Lb[06:15:30] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[06:16:22] *** mandeep <mandeep!mandeep@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mandeepb> has joined #gamedev[06:20:36] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has joined #gamedev[06:20:59] *** gristly <gristly!~josh@CPE9050ca1afc63-CM9050ca1afc60.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[06:26:40] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.125.57.214> has joined #gamedev[06:27:23] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.125.57.214> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[06:30:55] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[06:31:22] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.125.57.214> has joined #gamedev[06:36:50] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has joined #gamedev[06:42:38] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[06:43:34] <SaraDT_> I worked for ESA for ~4 years, and NEVER seen or been near a rocket :([06:46:33] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)[06:50:21] <dostoyevsky> SaraDT_: Depending what you'd do with a rocket that might be a good or a bad thing[06:53:26] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[06:56:43] <SaraDT_> dostoyevsky, lol, I never considered that.[07:05:28] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[07:05:53] <baudejogos> level1:addTileHitEvent(function (level,tile,tilePos)[07:05:53] <baudejogos> print ("hit tile " .. tile.id .. " at " .. tilePos)[07:05:53] <baudejogos> return false[07:05:53] <baudejogos> end)[07:06:21] *** unixfreak <unixfreak!~null@unaffiliated/unixfreak> has quit IRC (Quit: This is not the best quit message in the world - this is just a tribute)[07:08:21] <baudejogos> Lua is awesome[07:08:52] <aeth> SaraDT_: space tourism has never been cheaper though[07:10:09] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[07:10:44] <myke> weird syntax[07:11:22] <SaraDT_> Looks pretty obvious.[07:11:42] <SaraDT_> Not sure the same use of annonymous function would look much different in e.g. python or C#.[07:11:52] <SaraDT_> But is LUA still a thing?[07:12:19] <aeth> that's the one thing Lua does right syntactically. .. vs. + instead of overloading +[07:12:45] <SaraDT_> aeth, yeah but I was controlling satelites, not sure how tourism for satelites is doing. Maybe if you put a bed there I could start a Satelite Bed & Breakfeast.[07:13:23] <aeth> SaraDT_: there is a tourism equivalent to satellites, launching your own cheap ones[07:15:17] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.125.57.214> has quit IRC (Quit: http://www.shlomifish.org/ ; Some people grow older and wiser. Not I. I grow older and more foolish.)[07:16:16] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[07:17:06] *** mr_lou <mr_lou!~misthalos@085083077157.dynamic.telenor.dk> has joined #gamedev[07:23:28] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)[07:26:00] *** gristly <gristly!~josh@CPE9050ca1afc63-CM9050ca1afc60.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com> has joined #gamedev[07:28:39] *** macza <macza!~macza@67.231.29.194> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[07:30:16] *** SaraDT_ <SaraDT_!~SaraDT@unaffiliated/saradt> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[07:30:48] *** rindolf <rindolf!~rindolf@77.125.57.214> has joined #gamedev[07:30:53] *** SaraDT <SaraDT!~SaraDT@unaffiliated/saradt> has joined #gamedev[07:31:39] *** RazielXYZ is now known as Raziel[07:34:39] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df000-56.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[07:34:49] *** batman_nair <batman_nair!~batman_na@111.92.77.160> has joined #gamedev[07:36:05] *** Beliar <Beliar!~Beliar@2a02:8108:9640:6c42:9931:bc9d:4cc:1a6c> has joined #gamedev[07:44:36] *** cheakoirccloud <cheakoirccloud!uid293319@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-matjgprvdtkxkmuj> has joined #gamedev[07:46:20] *** terminx <terminx!~terminx@173-16-252-156.client.mchsi.com> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[07:47:24] *** terminx <terminx!~terminx@173-16-252-156.client.mchsi.com> has joined #gamedev[07:50:29] <DnzAtWrk> hey ho[07:52:19] <DnzAtWrk> what is your favorite boss tune?[07:52:41] *** genr8_ <genr8_!~genr8_@unaffiliated/genbtc> has joined #gamedev[07:54:18] <myke> Born in the USA[07:55:55] <rindolf> myke: heh[08:00:49] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has joined #gamedev[08:17:34] *** Tylak <Tylak!~Tylak@074-135-002-092.res.spectrum.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[08:24:32] *** gogoprog <gogoprog!~gogoprog@2a02:a03f:44f0:6600:71a2:8b47:f039:570d> has joined #gamedev[08:27:33] *** bnyio <bnyio!~bnyio@alcatraz.open-xchange.com> has joined #gamedev[08:30:11] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[08:33:01] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@79.184.211.30.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl> has joined #gamedev[08:34:56] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)[08:49:55] *** notus <notus!uid244649@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qwgpwakmwtsptbjt> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[08:54:15] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[08:58:52] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[09:00:56] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[09:09:42] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[09:24:13] *** Cahaan <Cahaan!~Cahaan@ns326233.ip-37-187-158.eu> has joined #gamedev[09:24:48] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has joined #gamedev[09:32:46] *** NiniGeo2 <NiniGeo2!~NiniGeo2@c-73-178-72-18.hsd1.nj.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: G'nini everybody! :D)[09:47:01] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[09:54:14] *** cheakoirccloud <cheakoirccloud!uid293319@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-matjgprvdtkxkmuj> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[10:16:29] *** zeduckmaster <zeduckmaster!~zeduckmas@85.106.1.181> has joined #gamedev[10:20:51] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has joined #gamedev[10:25:28] *** SaraDT <SaraDT!~SaraDT@unaffiliated/saradt> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[10:25:52] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)[10:39:23] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df000-56.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[10:44:58] *** pulse <pulse!~pulse@unaffiliated/pulse> has joined #gamedev[11:05:51] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[11:11:25] *** HZun <HZun!~HZun@0x3ec721e2.osd.customer.dk.telia.net> has joined #gamedev[11:13:37] *** refsw <refsw!~refsw@80.150.130.51> has joined #gamedev[11:15:44] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq8PTCxuzTA[11:15:55] <pulse> klepacki > jesus[11:16:49] <pulse> it shouldn't be physically possible to produce music this good[11:17:11] <R2robot> i'm not familiar with the compositions of jesus[11:17:19] <R2robot> so difficult to make comparisons[11:17:53] <pulse> :D[11:18:06] <pulse> i think he was into black metal[11:18:11] <R2robot> lol[11:18:47] <R2robot> weird, I use alt+click to turn URLs into clickable links in my terminal and for some reason, the word music turns into a clickable link[11:19:01] <pulse> what ... what does it link to :o[11:19:05] <R2robot> well alt+hover over link changes it.[11:19:16] <R2robot> ohhh[11:19:26] <R2robot> it opens my music folder in Finder[11:19:29] <R2robot> PogChamp[11:19:32] <pulse> ah[11:19:49] <pulse> my music folder has been the same since youtube was invented[11:19:52] <pulse> :s[11:19:58] <R2robot> :P[11:20:10] <pulse> i just copy it from an old drive every time i buy a new one[11:20:15] <pulse> so now it's pretty much a museum[11:20:17] <R2robot> haha, same[11:20:34] <R2robot> some of it is unplayable because it is early iTunes stuff with DRM :([11:20:44] <R2robot> well, I can play it in iTunes, but I prefer MPD[11:20:54] <pulse> i have some old electro mixes there[11:22:07] <R2robot> do you dance to them?[11:23:50] <pulse> i don't dance[11:24:11] <pulse> i'm like a wooden plank if i try[11:24:15] <pulse> so i just don't do it[11:24:38] <R2robot> :D[11:24:49] <pulse> i'm trying to figure out which demon klepacki made a deal with[11:24:53] <pulse> so i can try to do the same[11:25:07] <pulse> every damn OST he does[11:25:11] <R2robot> is he still alive?[11:25:12] <pulse> is beyond masterful[11:25:18] <pulse> aye[11:25:29] <pulse> https://twitter.com/FrankKlepacki[11:25:29] <R2robot> shoot him an email[11:25:39] <R2robot> maybe he didn't sign an NDA[11:25:43] <R2robot> with the dmon[11:25:43] <pulse> :D[11:25:52] <pulse> i bet it was one of those old scrolls[11:26:57] <R2robot> hmmm[11:27:11] <R2robot> single use.. they burn up when used[11:27:14] <pulse> frank klepacki and the tiberian sons[11:27:15] <pulse> lol.[11:27:30] <pulse> R2robot, heh, yeah[11:27:58] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[11:28:11] <R2robot> not sure I have a favorite composer any more. At one time it was Bobby Prince, then "the fat man", but now.... *shrugs*[11:28:28] <pulse> hmm[11:28:36] <R2robot> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Sanger_(musician)[11:28:57] <pulse> yeah they're good[11:29:06] <R2robot> i was super into the 7th Guest sound track at one time :D[11:29:09] <pulse> my 2 top ones are glenn stafford and frank klepacki[11:29:16] <pulse> ah, 7th gues[11:29:18] <pulse> guest*[11:29:21] <R2robot> glenn from blizzard?[11:29:31] <pulse> that game used to terrify me as a kid[11:29:36] <pulse> i didn't want to play it, lol[11:29:37] <pulse> R2robot, yeah[11:29:38] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df000-56.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[11:29:42] <R2robot> cool[11:29:50] <pulse> he did the warcraft 2 ost[11:29:52] <pulse> nuff said[11:29:56] <R2robot> yeah[11:37:44] <R2robot> speaking of music, I opened LMMS to tinker with making something, but got distracted and didn't touch it.. a while later, it crashed. Not a good sign.[11:43:06] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[11:47:38] <Cahaan> ah shit the fat man[11:47:50] <Cahaan> the guy who made the music in Ultima Underworld[11:48:03] <Cahaan> I love the OST of that game[11:49:29] * jprajzne listens[11:50:43] <pulse> LMMS is meh[11:51:22] <pulse> very awkward to work with and almost impossible to produce something that sounds good[11:51:34] <pulse> imo buy any real DAW if you're going to do music[11:51:37] <R2robot> well it's on my shitlist now[11:51:48] <jprajzne> i have troubles making music with mouse and keyboard[11:51:51] <R2robot> can't afford one, need a free option for now[11:52:08] <pulse> jprajzne, it's just like paint but for music :s[11:52:20] <jprajzne> pulse: i know lmms[11:52:22] <pulse> R2robot, try sunvox if you dare[11:52:24] <Cahaan> FL Studio is awesome[11:52:29] <pulse> Cahaan, agreed[11:52:42] <pulse> i spent like $500 on Fl + some plugins, don't regret a dime[11:52:43] <jprajzne> but in general, it's just not tactile enough for me[11:52:43] <R2robot> pulse: I have it downloaded already.. haven't tried it[11:53:07] <jprajzne> i liked when we worked with hw synths[11:53:21] <pulse> plus lifetime free updates with FL[11:53:45] <R2robot> i don't even have 50 bucks :P[11:53:55] <pulse> i have like $100 left for this month xD[11:53:58] <R2robot> times are hard at the moment :D[11:54:04] <jprajzne> R2robot: write your own :))[11:54:07] <R2robot> noo[11:54:10] <pulse> jprajzne, yeah, right[11:54:10] <pulse> lol[11:54:13] <jprajzne> yes :D[11:54:29] <pulse> can't imagine a more complex task off the top of my head[11:54:30] <jprajzne> come on, webaudio uses oscillator[11:54:31] <R2robot> i want to write games, not game tools :P[11:54:54] <jprajzne> R2robot: games and game tools go together really well? :)[11:55:12] <pulse> R2robot, i used sunvox for a long time, it's pretty sweet actually[11:55:19] <pulse> just gotta figure out a few things[11:55:20] <R2robot> sure, but not the time it takes to do both[11:55:40] <R2robot> pulse: good to know[11:55:51] <pulse> it's nice how you can make sounds on the fly in sunvox just by daisy chaining generators and effects[11:55:52] <jprajzne> it's iterative process, just write it modular :)[11:56:07] <pulse> but tbh it's hard to actually produce with it[11:56:17] <pulse> i use it for making sound effects sometimes[11:56:30] <pulse> it's like a tracker but with a few modern touches[11:56:37] <jprajzne> there're proglangs for making music, too[11:56:49] <pulse> classical trackers are too clunky for me[11:56:51] <jprajzne> you can live code the music :)[11:57:05] <pulse> jprajzne, examples?[11:57:06] <R2robot> pulse: just started it up.. already don't like it. lol[11:57:15] <pulse> R2robot, yeah the learning curve is a bit weird[11:57:16] <jprajzne> pulse: octave, i think[11:57:19] <pulse> it grows on you though[11:57:25] <pulse> jprajzne, hmm[11:57:29] <pulse> so many things named octave[11:57:29] <pulse> :S[11:58:12] <Cahaan> last track I made with FL Studio, if anyone is interested: https://www.dropbox.com/s/9zrz9v23lsw55xa/darkhaventales.mp3?dl=0[11:58:21] <Cahaan> for my new game[11:58:58] <R2robot> O_o[11:59:09] <pulse> Cahaan, first thought: hans zimmer[11:59:10] <pulse> lol[11:59:22] <pulse> Cahaan, very nice[11:59:28] <R2robot> pretty good. that intro..[12:00:55] <jprajzne> there was a yt video explaining how to achieve certain atmosphere with intervals :)[12:01:09] <jprajzne> that's my first impression[12:01:30] <pulse> Cahaan, just listened through it. awesome music[12:02:47] <jprajzne> Cahaan: what was your goal with this track?[12:03:38] <jprajzne> pulse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_audio_programming_languages[12:03:55] <pulse> jprajzne, ill check them out[12:17:08] *** grouse <grouse!~grouse@83-233-9-2.cust.bredband2.com> has joined #gamedev[12:17:49] <pulse> oh what i just discovered[12:17:51] <pulse> http://www.frankklepacki.com/listen.html[12:17:57] <pulse> all high quality[12:18:17] <pulse> sounds so much crisper than the YT versions[12:18:30] <pulse> gonna listen through it all now i guess, lol[12:20:19] <pulse> storm coming on the tibsun soundtrack is just eargasmic[12:21:21] <pulse> this guy's like a demigod or something[12:21:53] <Cahaan> thanks a lot guys ![12:21:59] <Cahaan> glad you like it[12:22:03] <pulse> :][12:22:44] <Cahaan> it's supposed to convey some epicness with some emotional sadness at the same time (well sadness prolly not the right word)[12:22:49] <Cahaan> but something emotively charged[12:23:28] <pulse> my only feedback would be that the drums maybe sound a little flat[12:23:37] <pulse> the composition is top notch though[12:23:45] <Cahaan> yeah I'm not terribly good with drums atm[12:23:48] <Cahaan> still trying things[12:23:57] <pulse> yeah same here[12:24:03] <pulse> i tend to just compose drumless[12:25:06] <pulse> i'd give you a suggestion about drums but i really don't know how to fix drums even in my own music[12:25:08] * pulse shrugs[12:25:17] <pulse> sometimes a little bit of reverb helps[12:25:28] <Cahaan> yeah I was just thinking about more reverb[12:25:39] <Cahaan> and maybe add more variations to the rythm[12:25:44] <pulse> yeah[12:25:56] <pulse> it's super hard to emulate a person actually playing the drums[12:26:04] <pulse> i haven't found a good way[12:27:10] <Cahaan> maybe with a drum dedicated VST and playing the drums manually on the keyboard to have a more natural feel to it[12:27:14] <jprajzne> reverb and compression[12:27:44] <Cahaan> yes I still need to add compression too, in fact the track is not mastered at all yet[12:27:46] <jprajzne> i like it as well, but the melody is probably happier than intended? :)[12:27:47] <Cahaan> just quickly mixed[12:30:10] <jprajzne> i'd go with dorian, phrygian, aeolian or locrian for something sad/dark[12:51:51] <pulse> the vim substitution i just wrote: :%s/\/\/\\\/\\\//g[12:51:53] <pulse> lol[12:51:59] <pulse> well escaped[12:52:35] <pulse> turns out i don't need it, eh[12:52:45] <pulse> i was so excited that it worked at all[12:53:20] <R2robot> i heard you like escapes so i've escaped your escapes so you can escape escapes[12:54:12] <pulse> \:\S[12:57:55] <pulse> i just automated a process that wastes like 20 minutes of my life every day[12:57:56] <pulse> noice[12:58:07] <pulse> take that, gravity[12:59:39] <R2robot> ＼(^o^)／[12:59:50] <R2robot> you built an anti-gravity device?[13:00:45] <pulse> in a manner of speaking[13:00:56] <pulse> just some templating stuff for work :D[13:01:46] <pulse> instead of me doing edits manually i now press a button and call it a day[13:04:23] <R2robot> nice[13:07:02] <DnzAtWrk> oh my god[13:07:17] <DnzAtWrk> you big bastard, you're taking away jobs[13:07:59] <R2robot> Some people need to be replaced with small shell scripts.[13:08:15] *** ZeroSystem <ZeroSystem!45f81b6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.248.27.107> has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed)[13:09:21] *** batman_nair <batman_nair!~batman_na@111.92.77.160> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[13:09:41] <pulse> :D[13:14:03] *** snakegums_ <snakegums_!~snakegums@216.80.123.244> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[13:15:07] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qV7AOAjp0oo[13:18:52] <jprajzne> do you get rewards for automating yourself away, pulse? :)[13:19:13] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[13:22:25] *** xen74 <xen74!~xen74@2001:44b8:2e3:9b00:34b0:b5a:16a:6b0a> has joined #gamedev[13:23:41] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[13:25:48] <jprajzne> reminds me how shitty are social networks for discussion https://www.instagram.com/p/BsYou4cgpbO/ that should be threaded[13:26:10] <pulse> jprajzne, yeah, the reward is i get paid for doing nothing[13:26:15] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[13:26:27] <pulse> not too shabby[13:26:35] <jprajzne> pulse: that's just first level :))[13:26:43] <pulse> good enough for me, lol[13:32:13] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@cpe-172-192-134-25.qld.foxtel.net.au> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[13:33:09] <jprajzne> pulse: am literally paid for automation and get bonuses if i do more of it :))[13:36:22] <pulse> jprajzne, hehe nice[13:38:51] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[13:40:49] <pulse> i could probably automate more of my job but i'm always reminded of https://xkcd.com/1319/[13:41:10] <pulse> plus there's always a chance something may change down the line and i'd have to reconfigure the automation or throw it away altogether[13:42:41] <jprajzne> pulse: that xkcd suffers from megalomania and prefectionism :))[13:42:59] <pulse> :p[13:43:12] <jprajzne> if you automate small portions at reasonable level, it's ok :)[13:43:25] <pulse> lol @ tooltip though[13:44:32] <jprajzne> :)) yeah[13:45:18] <jprajzne> it's a good reminder that people often forget to watch how the processes/environment change and how their automation becomes obsolete, leading to disaster sometimes :)[13:55:48] *** DnzAtWrk <DnzAtWrk!~DnzAtWrk@mobile-access-6df000-56.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[14:11:49] *** DaScoot <DaScoot!~Scooter@static-24-153-33-9.cpe.metrocast.net> has joined #gamedev[14:12:43] *** pulse <pulse!~pulse@unaffiliated/pulse> has quit IRC (Quit: pulse)[14:18:36] <jprajzne> anyone has tried coding a game with bdd methodology?[14:20:31] *** troido <troido!~troido@tilde.town> has joined #gamedev[14:27:39] *** pulse <pulse!~pulse@unaffiliated/pulse> has joined #gamedev[14:41:59] *** pavonia <pavonia!~user@unaffiliated/siracusa> has joined #gamedev[14:47:19] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@152.250.155.220> has joined #gamedev[15:02:22] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[15:16:18] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[15:20:56] *** zeduckmaster <zeduckmaster!~zeduckmas@85.106.1.181> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[15:37:08] *** HZun <HZun!~HZun@0x3ec721e2.osd.customer.dk.telia.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[15:45:20] *** HolodocPrime <HolodocPrime!~holodoc@unaffiliated/holodoc> has joined #gamedev[15:46:22] *** fidasx <fidasx!~fidasx@ppp-94-66-221-138.home.otenet.gr> has joined #gamedev[15:48:24] *** holodoc <holodoc!~holodoc@unaffiliated/holodoc> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)[16:11:45] *** bnyio <bnyio!~bnyio@alcatraz.open-xchange.com> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)[16:25:02] *** batman_nair <batman_nair!~batman_na@111.92.77.160> has joined #gamedev[16:25:39] *** solidfox <solidfox!~solidfox@unaffiliated/snake/x-2550465> has joined #gamedev[16:27:22] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@152.250.155.220> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[16:28:37] <baudejogos> guys, don't you sleep or are you in weird timezones?[16:30:57] *** batman_nair <batman_nair!~batman_na@111.92.77.160> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[16:31:18] <jprajzne> Wed 9 Jan 16:31:08 CET 2019[16:31:43] <solidfox> i slept for probably like 7 or 8 hours then laid in bed for a bit questioning my life decisions[16:32:04] <solidfox> then i made breakfast and now im here[16:32:09] <solidfox> just 1 hour after i got up[16:33:01] <solidfox> baudejogos: my bed time must be right in the middle of your day[16:33:14] <solidfox> well i say mine assuming you were talking about me[16:36:44] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@177.138.111.125> has joined #gamedev[16:38:21] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Quit: My tummy says it's time to sleep Mr. Bubbles.)[16:42:07] *** powerbit <powerbit!~powerbit@5-15-177-185.residential.rdsnet.ro> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[16:42:07] *** gogoprog <gogoprog!~gogoprog@2a02:a03f:44f0:6600:71a2:8b47:f039:570d> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[16:43:06] *** gogoprog <gogoprog!~gogoprog@2a02:a03f:44f0:6600:71a2:8b47:f039:570d> has joined #gamedev[16:46:40] <pulse> from my perspective, the jedi have weird timezones![16:50:22] *** [Relic] <[Relic]!~Relic]@2602:306:33a3:6d30:a513:b17b:a9d3:5145> has joined #gamedev[17:00:53] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@79.184.211.30.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl> has quit IRC (Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com))[17:02:33] *** fidasx <fidasx!~fidasx@ppp-94-66-221-138.home.otenet.gr> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[17:08:21] *** Tylak <Tylak!~Tylak@074-135-002-092.res.spectrum.com> has joined #gamedev[17:09:52] *** Tylak <Tylak!~Tylak@074-135-002-092.res.spectrum.com> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[17:12:23] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[17:25:40] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomTab@modemcable249.134-83-70.mc.videotron.ca> has quit IRC (Disconnected by services)[17:25:59] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomTab@modemcable249.134-83-70.mc.videotron.ca> has joined #gamedev[17:26:26] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomTab@modemcable249.134-83-70.mc.videotron.ca> has quit IRC (Disconnected by services)[17:27:11] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomSof@207.219.200.115> has joined #gamedev[17:31:29] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[17:34:42] *** Tylak <Tylak!~Tylak@074-135-002-092.res.spectrum.com> has joined #gamedev[17:36:56] *** Iolo <Iolo!~iolo@dsl-tkubng22-58c023-38.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC 1.6.6+deb1ubuntu0.1 - http://znc.in)[17:38:26] *** macza <macza!~macza@162.221.202.202> has joined #gamedev[17:42:39] *** Iolo <Iolo!~iolo@dsl-tkubng22-58c023-38.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[17:45:40] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)[17:47:42] *** cheakoirccloud <cheakoirccloud!uid293319@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wixmllrwjjgvlllm> has joined #gamedev[18:09:22] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@79.184.211.30.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl> has joined #gamedev[18:10:58] *** BlueProtoman <BlueProtoman!~BlueProto@ool-4577fdaf.dyn.optonline.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[18:14:20] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/c/AMD/live[18:14:30] <pulse> go amd![18:19:45] <Atari2600> Lua levals[18:19:51] <pulse> 7nm levels[18:20:16] <Atari2600> sol2 automatically binds Lua functions into std::functions :)[18:20:21] <Atari2600> my code does not depend on Lua at all[18:20:24] *** grouse <grouse!~grouse@83-233-9-2.cust.bredband2.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[18:20:27] <Atari2600> and still I can embed any shit I want :)[18:20:32] <brainzap> who needs new graphics cards in 2019[18:20:36] <brainzap> the old ones are so strong[18:20:56] <Atari2600> if my game works as I expect, I will be compelled to donate some money to the phd guy[18:21:40] <pulse> brainzap, i need a new card so i can play my DOS games even more effectively[18:23:22] <solidfox> thinking of buying kerbal space program?[18:23:29] <solidfox> is it fun :o[18:25:52] *** Iolo <Iolo!~iolo@dsl-tkubng22-58c023-38.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC 1.6.6+deb1ubuntu0.1 - http://znc.in)[18:26:58] *** Iolo <Iolo!~iolo@dsl-tkubng22-58c023-38.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[18:34:02] <solidfox> fuck it[18:38:12] *** Serpent7776 <Serpent7776!~Serpent77@90-156-31-193.internetia.net.pl> has joined #gamedev[18:38:35] <Atari2600> Big Mouth cartoon![18:38:40] <Atari2600> if you can't deal with it! fuck it![18:40:33] <pulse> i want to buy a big rock so i can live under it[18:42:06] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[18:47:21] <mischief> solidfox: its a bit old at this point but i like to play now and again[18:50:48] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[19:08:18] *** freestyledork <freestyledork!~freestyle@unaffiliated/freestyledork> has joined #gamedev[19:15:53] <dostoyevsky> pulse: A small rock might be free though[19:16:08] *** gaffa <gaffa!~gaffa@unaffiliated/gaffa> has joined #gamedev[19:16:26] <dostoyevsky> and you could wear it on your hat[19:19:24] <pulse> simple solutions, eh[19:19:42] <dostoyevsky> think big but start small[19:20:42] *** red-001 <red-001!red@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-qqhjtsguajskhfqy> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[19:26:40] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Quit: My tummy says it's time to sleep Mr. Bubbles.)[19:37:01] *** xen74 <xen74!~xen74@2001:44b8:2e3:9b00:34b0:b5a:16a:6b0a> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[19:39:44] *** swebb <swebb!~swebb@161.97.245.62> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[19:42:03] *** krychu <krychu!~krychu@2a02:1205:505c:2ab0:a010:831d:b77c:ad4a> has joined #gamedev[19:44:35] *** macza <macza!~macza@162.221.202.202> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[19:45:02] *** macza <macza!~macza@162.221.202.202> has joined #gamedev[19:55:42] <solidfox> im playing mgs3 european extreme[19:56:44] <Atari2600> I'm sorry for you[19:56:58] <solidfox> :/[19:56:59] * Atari2600 eats "edible cookie dough"[19:57:27] <solidfox> Atari2600: i wanna play new games but idk which to choose theres so many and im worried ill buy one i dont like[19:57:43] <solidfox> theres no political fictions like MGS[19:57:44] <Atari2600> yup! that happens to me all the time[19:57:49] <Atari2600> I try a new game, I get bored[19:57:50] *** red-001 <red-001!red@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-skroqjybcabgxhge> has joined #gamedev[19:57:58] <solidfox> games suck[19:58:19] <Atari2600> most games suck balls, indeed[19:58:25] * Atari2600 is lost in the past[19:58:32] <solidfox> same[19:59:46] <Atari2600> I want to play again fun platformers, like King's Valley[20:00:03] <Atari2600> or really good challenging, but not impossible, puzzles like Castle Excellent[20:01:22] <Atari2600> aeth, regarding lua and print statement not requiring (). it only works with a single argument and no expressions at all[20:01:30] <Atari2600> print a + b does not work[20:01:43] <solidfox> thats hardcore strange[20:01:48] <Atari2600> print (a+b) works[20:02:09] <solidfox> thats almost as bad as whitespace in python.. sometimes it means block, sometimes it just means arbitrary space[20:02:13] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has joined #gamedev[20:02:26] <Atari2600> print "aa"[20:02:27] <Atari2600> aa[20:02:27] <Atari2600> print 1+2[20:02:27] <Atari2600> [string "print 1+2"]:1: '=' expected near '1'[20:02:33] <Atari2600> https://repl.it/repls/NaiveMildQueryplan[20:03:09] <Atari2600> the error message is even worse[20:03:24] <Atari2600> it took me a little while yesterday to figure it out while I was writing my debugging rules[20:07:30] *** jlebrech <jlebrech!~jlebrech@89.165.136.2> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[20:22:53] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has joined #gamedev[20:25:56] <solidfox> lol mgs3 is so worn out, not even european extreme makes it fun[20:26:37] *** iLoVue <iLoVue!~DinoJS@41.107.14.180> has joined #gamedev[20:30:28] *** Iolo <Iolo!~iolo@dsl-tkubng22-58c023-38.dhcp.inet.fi> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[20:33:38] *** Iolo <Iolo!~iolo@dsl-tkubng22-58c023-38.dhcp.inet.fi> has joined #gamedev[20:34:10] <aeth> Atari2600, solidfox: Well, you mostly see it with foo{} with tables as the sole argument[20:34:20] <aeth> solidfox: stranger than you think[20:35:09] <aeth> Why have keyword arguments when you can have foobar{foo = "hello", bar = 42} ?[20:35:30] <aeth> But of course what you're really doing is the same thing as print "hello"[20:35:42] <aeth> (I mean, syntactically, obviously not in outcome)[20:39:13] *** swebb <swebb!~swebb@161.97.245.62> has joined #gamedev[20:40:08] <aeth> Lua's full of clever hacks like that, but if you're used to more structure it feels wrong. It's basically the same sort of thinking as the thinking behind Perl programming, except in a much smaller language.[20:43:28] <cantelope> https://codepen.io/cantelope/full/OpNOpx[20:46:52] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[20:55:36] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[20:57:24] *** brainzap <brainzap!~brainzap@217.22.129.78> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)[21:01:36] *** gogoprog <gogoprog!~gogoprog@2a02:a03f:44f0:6600:71a2:8b47:f039:570d> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)[21:07:06] *** cheakoirccloud <cheakoirccloud!uid293319@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wixmllrwjjgvlllm> has quit IRC (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)[21:11:09] *** mandeep <mandeep!mandeep@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mandeepb> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:12:23] *** mr_lou <mr_lou!~misthalos@085083077157.dynamic.telenor.dk> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[21:13:30] <Atari2600> aeth, heh, I buy your hacks argument, but comparing Lua with Perl is really mean[21:13:44] <Atari2600> Perl stack is a bag of cats[21:14:01] *** noglin <noglin!~julien@241.red-88-7-89.staticip.rima-tde.net> has joined #gamedev[21:14:54] <aeth> Atari2600: I mean, they do it in different ways. Perl's about expressing yourself linguistically, and iirc one of its idioms is "foo() or die" or something like that[21:15:05] <aeth> Lua's all about abusing what little it gives you into doing everything[21:15:39] <solidfox> foo() or die is annoying lol[21:15:49] <Atari2600> perl and php ftw \m/[21:16:11] <Atari2600> aeth, Lua is still the best of the awful script languages[21:16:23] <aeth> But the common point about this approach, in either Perl or Lua, is that you kind of have to turn off the "this is how computers work" model that you need to have to e.g. write C[21:16:43] <aeth> Because, as I said, a lot of it feels wrong.[21:16:55] <Atari2600> Lua has the least wrong things compared to the others[21:16:58] <Atari2600> and it is good to embed[21:17:06] <Atari2600> embeds nicely and swiftly[21:17:08] <Atari2600> so I am not mad[21:17:21] <Atari2600> who cares if the print statement is crazy? all the rest is working well :)[21:17:45] <Atari2600> I just wanted you to know that I also observed the craziness of print[21:18:08] <Atari2600> and I will keep watching the other crazy stuff that happens, but so far so good I am pretty satisfied :)[21:18:23] *** noglin <noglin!~julien@241.red-88-7-89.staticip.rima-tde.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[21:19:38] <pulse> time spent arguing about programming: |----------------------|[21:19:43] <pulse> time spent actually programming: |-|[21:20:01] <pulse> put this on and make games! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBOD8qeCBuc[21:20:19] <Atari2600> time spent on IRC |------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|[21:20:23] <pulse> :S[21:20:27] <Atari2600> time spent on Facebook |----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------[21:20:38] <pulse> time spent on facebook: n/a[21:20:43] <Atari2600> you're lucky[21:20:54] <Atari2600> I managed to detach myself from WhatsApp[21:20:59] <Atari2600> but Facebook is still sticking[21:22:28] <aeth> what's facebook?[21:22:43] <Atari2600> lucky[21:23:09] <Atari2600> being living abroad, I don't have the option of abandoning Facebook :-/[21:26:43] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnMR6SOBa9k[21:27:10] * pulse buys a rejuvenation a potion[21:29:18] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has joined #gamedev[21:35:36] <Atari2600> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yt4KG9ib8S4 :)[21:35:49] *** mandeep <mandeep!mandeep@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mandeepb> has joined #gamedev[21:35:49] <Atari2600> diablo I was amazing, btw[21:35:52] <Atari2600> better than II[21:36:25] <pulse> agreed[21:36:34] <pulse> 2 is a great game[21:36:45] <pulse> but 1 had the better atmosphere[21:37:40] <Atari2600> yeah! I played diablo II in my home forever (I had four computers in my bed room)[21:37:46] <Atari2600> but diablo I was beaufitul[21:38:28] <Atari2600> Diablo II, AoE 2 and HoMM III. we've played them forever in my little private lan party <3[21:39:48] <LastTalon> Eww. Facebook[21:40:14] <pulse> ^ this[21:40:27] <pulse> i'd rather use homing pigeons[21:41:02] <LastTalon> Twitter is better even.[21:43:58] *** swebb <swebb!~swebb@161.97.245.62> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)[21:45:08] <pulse> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7wJ8pE2qKU[21:45:46] <pulse> Xbox! Jim Carrey![21:45:46] <pulse> Steal a bear! Run and pee! Xbox! Jim Carrey! Steal a bear! Run and pee![21:45:51] <pulse> xD[21:46:45] <pulse> i never could get into FF[21:46:49] <pulse> but damn if the music isn't top notch[21:47:43] <LastTalon> Lol[21:47:44] <LastTalon> This song[21:48:54] *** immibis <immibis!~immibis@125-238-72-168-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[21:48:56] <LastTalon> Sephiroth![21:50:14] *** refs <refs!~refs@dslb-178-005-091-189.178.005.pools.vodafone-ip.de> has joined #gamedev[21:50:45] *** LunarJetman <LunarJetman!LunarJetma@94.196.247.102.threembb.co.uk> has joined #gamedev[22:05:43] <Atari2600> I was never able to catch up Twitter too. it seems I could avoid the most dumb places in the Internet[22:05:55] <Atari2600> but Facebook is still sticking on me like a tumor :([22:06:07] <Atari2600> also it helps me to poop[22:06:37] <pulse> :S[22:06:49] <pulse> you'll get even more poop bacteria all over your phone[22:06:53] <pulse> this is why i don't touch other people's phones[22:07:00] <pulse> and why i wash mine[22:07:06] <Atari2600> I wash mine too[22:07:07] <Atari2600> ofc[22:07:14] <pulse> at least you're doing something right[22:07:25] <Atari2600> eww. poop in my hands and mouth? no thanks[22:07:55] *** mobile_c <mobile_c!~mobile_c@cpe-172-192-88-169.qld.foxtel.net.au> has joined #gamedev[22:07:57] <solidfox> LastTalon: you're on facebook right[22:09:28] *** panda81 <panda81!~panda81@162.246.216.28> has quit IRC (Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com))[22:09:54] <LastTalon> Why is your phone in your mouth? D:<[22:10:01] <LastTalon> I am technically on facebook.[22:10:35] <LastTalon> So that my extended family can apparently feel good about being able to talk to "me" or about "me".[22:10:45] <LastTalon> Even though... its not me[22:10:50] <LastTalon> I don't use that account.[22:11:12] <LastTalon> But I also don't delete it cuz that would apparently make people upset.[22:11:40] <LastTalon> But I don't go on facebook.[22:12:08] <LastTalon> The only reason I usually go on there is to accept friend requests occasionally to, again... make people happy.[22:12:21] <LastTalon> These are the symptoms of social networks, btw.[22:12:49] <LastTalon> This idea that these actions on a website matter and are important the way real interactions are.[22:13:50] <LastTalon> I suspect I'll end up using facebook if I ever end up doing marketing.[22:17:02] <LastTalon> solidfox, so no, not really.[22:19:06] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has joined #gamedev[22:19:56] *** mandeep <mandeep!mandeep@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mandeepb> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[22:21:10] <aeth> I haven't gone on Facebook in years. I did temporarily deactivate it for a while, maybe a few months or a few years a really long time ago. Decided it was just better to literally never use it, though.[22:21:22] <aeth> Maybe logged on about once every 2-3 years, probably last time 2 years ago or so. Every time it's even more useless.[22:21:30] <LastTalon> Basically the same.[22:21:37] <aeth> Since I never use it, it's just a bunch of family members and people I now have nothing in common with.[22:21:42] <LastTalon> If I deleted the account it would cause more problems than if I just leave it dormant.[22:22:12] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has joined #gamedev[22:24:46] <aeth> What ruined Facebook was all of the Facebook games. "This baby cow is lost and homeless. Will you join Farmville and give it a nice home?"[22:25:11] *** DaScoot <DaScoot!~Scooter@static-24-153-33-9.cpe.metrocast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Bye)[22:25:18] <aeth> I mean, they eventually fixed that but made the site even more useless by not showing you everything and just showing you what it thinks you want to see.[22:26:43] *** david2_ <david2_!~davidbach@212-186-25-215.cable.dynamic.surfer.at> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)[22:27:01] <pulse> i hate when someone gives me a facebook link[22:27:09] <pulse> and i click it, and this HUGE popup comes up basically saying[22:27:17] <pulse> join us, or you don't get to see content[22:27:36] <pulse> i remove it manually with F12 but it's still annoying as hell[22:27:47] <pulse> facebook is the worst thing ever[22:27:50] <aeth> well, yes, I do that manual removal too[22:27:52] <aeth> Oh, also, growing older also made Facebook less interesting. A lot of Facebook is people having kids, etc., and posting politics, etc.[22:28:14] <aeth> I'm not interested in seeing pictures of your baby, or in seeing why you think taxes are evil.[22:28:18] <Atari2600> lol, the reason I joined Facebook was the games :)[22:28:24] <Atari2600> it was a gaming social platform[22:28:34] <aeth> Atari2600: except the browser games pre-facebook were much better.[22:28:38] *** powerbit <powerbit!~powerbit@5-15-177-185.residential.rdsnet.ro> has joined #gamedev[22:28:39] <Atari2600> more or les[22:28:45] <Atari2600> they weren't social[22:28:50] <Atari2600> it was fun playing with friends[22:29:16] <aeth> The browser games pre-facebook were basically like Eve Online with just the politics and no graphics and very little gameplay. $0 with maybe like a $20 a month premium or some very light monetization like that, not "pay whatever you want for gems up to tens of thousands"[22:29:30] <Atari2600> facebook became bad when the games got rotten and people started to think their opinions mattered :-/[22:30:17] <Atari2600> after they got their 10B from venture capital, they decided to 'revolutionize the world'[22:30:20] <Atari2600> hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr[22:32:41] <aeth> To be fair, Facebook did wind up 'revolutionizing' the world.[22:33:36] <aeth> There's celebrity, then there's reality TV star, and now there's You™ thanks to social media! Take videos and pictures of every little part of your life and pretend people care![22:33:57] *** Tobbi <Tobbi!~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi> has joined #gamedev[22:34:10] <pulse> i get why people like facebook[22:34:14] <pulse> but i'm way too asocial for that[22:34:19] <pulse> i didn't like it when it came out[22:34:21] <pulse> i don't like it now[22:34:22] <pulse> :D[22:35:03] <aeth> I'm very social, I'm just social under pseudonyms like "aeth" not under my full name and picture to people I know in RL.[22:35:23] <aeth> I mean, I don't try too hard to hide my identity and you can find it if you want and when I do link to my gitlab it does use my real name (which isn't unique but is fairly rare)[22:35:49] <aeth> But I don't make things too easy, either, by doing everything with my full real name and picture to people I know in RL.[22:35:53] *** SigSegOwl <SigSegOwl!~SigSegOwl@static.85.124.99.88.clients.your-server.de> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[22:36:03] <aeth> s/to people/and saying it to people/[22:36:36] <aeth> A bit more freedom to speak freely, although, really, people used to think Internet trolling was because people didn't use their real names and social media definitely disproved that. Plenty of trolls are willing to tell you exactly who they are.[22:37:09] <aeth> And my favorite part about "aeth" is that it's short and not unique, so not every "aeth" you'll see online is me.[22:38:16] *** troido <troido!~troido@tilde.town> has left #gamedev ("WeeChat 2.3")[22:48:15] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomSof@207.219.200.115> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[22:49:23] *** krychu <krychu!~krychu@2a02:1205:505c:2ab0:a010:831d:b77c:ad4a> has quit IRC (Quit: krychu)[22:50:38] *** Donitzo <Donitzo!~Donitzo@85-156-203-108.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[22:51:44] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has joined #gamedev[22:55:52] *** Serpent7776 <Serpent7776!~Serpent77@90-156-31-193.internetia.net.pl> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[23:00:24] *** alystar <alystar!~alystar@2601:148:4200:36c7:d412:5414:67f3:2594> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[23:04:37] *** hahuang6- is now known as hahuang65[23:06:27] <Atari2600> I think the best part of Bandersnatch is that my upcoming ZX Spectrum Next is increasing value A LOT :)[23:06:43] <solidfox> woah i built a tesseract irl[23:06:52] <solidfox> hid all my hentai underneath it[23:07:17] <Atari2600> hentai is an interesting genre[23:07:19] <Atari2600> it is 99% crap[23:07:26] <Atari2600> but sometimes we can find a golden 1%[23:07:35] <Atari2600> which is amazingly good[23:10:23] <solidfox> heh[23:10:32] <solidfox> i dont have a tesseract :<[23:10:52] <solidfox> but there may be a 4th spatial dimension that is just shorter than x y and z[23:12:45] <LastTalon> solidfox, you should have hid your hentai behind it. Then it would be hidden in the 4th dimension and we can't see it. :P[23:13:14] <Atari2600> 4th dimension is a myth[23:13:15] <Atari2600> give up[23:13:19] <solidfox> no u[23:13:23] <Atari2600> stop trying :D[23:13:32] <solidfox> its reel i no it[23:13:45] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[23:13:55] <solidfox> capsule corp will become a thing and you can package a house up and take it with you[23:14:02] <solidfox> into a little capsule[23:14:37] <solidfox> then again we will probably never encounter it if its small, since we're expanding away from it xyz[23:15:00] <solidfox> (the faster you go in one direction the slower you go in the others)[23:15:16] <Atari2600> seems like a good idea for a game[23:15:18] <Atari2600> EXECUTE IT[23:15:28] <Atari2600> IS IT GAMEDEV OR WHAT???[23:15:31] *** Donitzo <Donitzo!~Donitzo@85-156-203-108.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has joined #gamedev[23:15:35] <solidfox> yes. let me just press the gamedev button[23:15:37] <Atari2600> enslave Donitzo[23:15:43] <Atari2600> then you can have your game[23:15:45] <solidfox> BOOM tripple-A game[23:15:59] <solidfox> man meigakure is gonna be so fucking cool[23:16:15] <solidfox> too bad it will take ages[23:16:25] <Atari2600> :([23:16:26] <solidfox> guy probably isnt even gonna finish it[23:16:38] <Atari2600> now I feel powerful that std::function understands lua functions out of the box[23:16:44] <solidfox> like heaven forbid.. if he died in a plane accident[23:16:46] <Atari2600> which means I gonna write a shit ton of rules scripts[23:17:15] <Atari2600> while keeping my C++ code tiny and very testable and reusable[23:17:37] <Atari2600> pulse, and I gonna have to switch to delta times sooner or later :-/[23:17:43] <Atari2600> it was fun while it lasted[23:18:20] <Atari2600> 1) whack the shit out of Lua scripts[23:18:29] <Atari2600> 2) switch to delta times to have proper collision detection and movements[23:18:39] <Atari2600> 3) switch to OpenGL to have decent animation speed[23:18:52] <Atari2600> 4) put the game on Steam and fail[23:21:17] <aeth> Atari2600: well, yes, #4 ends in "and fail" because it's #4 and not #987[23:21:52] <Atari2600> low budget + single developer does not allow to add more items[23:22:09] * Atari2600 needs artists, writers, level designers and testers[23:22:13] <Atari2600> I have only the latter[23:22:20] <Atari2600> (my friends)[23:22:37] <aeth> writers?[23:22:43] <aeth> don't make content that requires writing![23:22:52] <aeth> Successful solo projects rarely have that.[23:23:06] <Atari2600> but... proper writing enriches everything[23:23:09] <aeth> If you do you'll wind up with about 5 hours of content and people hate short games.[23:23:27] <solidfox> wonder if hes gonna rake in the dough with his 4d game engine[23:23:35] <solidfox> or give it away for free[23:23:41] <Atari2600> I even hate 3D[23:24:07] <Atari2600> if I switch to OpenGL, then I gonna use 3D ONLY FOR TROLLING[23:24:21] <Atari2600> like rendering a foggy 3D model on top of the 2D game screen[23:24:49] *** knops <knops!~yannick@ip-62-143-84-11.hsi01.unitymediagroup.de> has joined #gamedev[23:24:52] <Atari2600> and sudden scary faces[23:28:20] <solidfox> whats the difference between color tinting and changing the value of a color[23:28:30] <solidfox> i feel like they're the same, but maybe not[23:29:01] <solidfox> i also feel like making color tones are the same as reducing the saturation maybe?[23:29:29] <solidfox> but are shades of a color low value or high value[23:30:32] <LastTalon> 4th dimension is a myth?[23:30:39] <LastTalon> Really confused by what you mean there.[23:30:49] <LastTalon> You guys, multiplication is a myth.[23:31:16] <aeth> Atari2600: 3D isn't much harder than 2D if you do "proper" 2D. Possibly a bit easier. The bar has been raised in 2D and a lot of 3D effects in things like lighting have been ported over to 2D. And a lot of sprites are made from 3D models![23:32:04] <Atari2600> 3D sucks[23:32:10] <Atari2600> all 3D games are lousy[23:32:13] <Atari2600> and dumb[23:32:31] <aeth> take that back right now, Euro Truck Simulator 2 isn't bad.[23:32:36] <Atari2600> 3D is easier because they just put retarded models to animate and they call it a game[23:32:38] <LastTalon> Atari2600, that's sort of the point of Lua. Most of the game should be written in Lua modularly.[23:32:59] <Atari2600> LastTalon, yeah! I am finally seeing it[23:33:02] <aeth> Atari2600: Whether or not you can even do 2D depends on your genre.[23:33:21] <LastTalon> It also means your game will have great mod support.[23:33:28] <Atari2600> ^ :)[23:33:35] <LastTalon> Cuz mods can be written basically the same as the entire game was written.[23:33:42] <Atari2600> I still don't understand why Tomb Raider was a success hit. I always hated that shit[23:34:21] <aeth> Atari2600: If you want to see early 3D games that show the potential of 3D without having bad (by today's standards) controls, you basically have to look exclusively at PC FPSes[23:34:37] <aeth> Many of them hold up today.[23:34:39] <Atari2600> or alone in the dark :)[23:34:44] <Atari2600> fom fem fom fem fom[23:34:55] <solidfox> LastTalon: i think he meant the idea i was saying that there may be a physicial direction in our material universe other than upwards forwards and sideways[23:35:07] <solidfox> LastTalon: not just on paper, not just as a concept that is valid, but in the real world[23:35:24] <LastTalon> There's no way to prove it in the real world.[23:35:37] <solidfox> but whats really gonna bake your noodle is this: how can space exist if it is not made of matter or energy, all that exists are matter and energy[23:35:39] <LastTalon> However the world appears to be 3D so we should treat it that way in most approximations.[23:35:52] <aeth> Atari2600: original PlayStation or N64 games are to 3D like what Atari 2600 games was to 2D. I mean, there are like 4 games that kind of sort of hold up and are fun, but it was more about potential and imagining things.[23:36:03] <aeth> 2D didn't really mature until the SNES era imo[23:36:06] <LastTalon> But like I've been into in-depth before you can't really prove the world isn't 2D or 1D or 4D or any amount of dimensions wrapped up the right way to look 3D.[23:36:24] <Atari2600> aeth, seriously? PS1 and N64 only had garbage[23:36:41] <solidfox> Atari2600: metal gear solid[23:36:43] <Atari2600> I can only fathom ten games I would like to play in PS1[23:36:46] <Atari2600> solidfox, garbage[23:36:48] <solidfox> crash bandicoot[23:36:52] <LastTalon> Crash bandicoot was great[23:36:59] <solidfox> gran turismo[23:37:02] <Atari2600> N64... I don't know. only mario kart[23:37:04] *** stefkos <stefkos!~Pawel@79.184.211.30.ipv4.supernova.orange.pl> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[23:37:08] <solidfox> lozoot[23:37:09] <LastTalon> Mario kart, super mario 64[23:37:14] *** Tobbi <Tobbi!~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[23:37:20] <solidfox> majoras mask[23:37:22] <aeth> Atari2600: Super Smash Brothers, Mario Party, Mario 64, etc., started franchies, although the GameCube versions are better with the possible exception of mario 64.[23:37:24] <LastTalon> Banjo kazooie[23:37:33] <solidfox> bible games 64[23:37:35] <aeth> Atari2600: Mario Kart started with SNES and the SNES version is probably better than the N64 version.[23:37:39] <LastTalon> solidfox, LOL[23:37:44] <solidfox> :p[23:37:57] <LastTalon> aeth, debatable.[23:38:03] <Atari2600> nah[23:38:05] <Atari2600> N64 is better[23:38:08] <Atari2600> wat better[23:38:12] <Atari2600> *way[23:38:20] <aeth> I mean, you're free to be objectively incorrect...[23:38:21] <Atari2600> smooth 4P mode[23:38:37] <aeth> What was fun in the N64 version was the battle mode 4 player, at least at the time[23:38:41] <aeth> Not sure if it would hold up today[23:38:48] <Atari2600> yup! mario kart is the only N64 game I would still want to play[23:38:59] <LastTalon> I regularly played both as a kid. They're both very good in their own ways.[23:39:05] <Atari2600> PS1 I can say castlevania, silent hill, parasite eve...[23:39:19] <Atari2600> and a couple more I can't remember[23:39:33] <aeth> Resident Evil? The GameCube remake is much better, though.[23:39:36] <LastTalon> Conker's bad fur day[23:39:41] <Atari2600> PC version was better too[23:39:42] <LastTalon> Goldeneye[23:39:47] <Atari2600> goldeneye perhaps[23:39:54] <aeth> goldeneye has not aged well[23:40:01] <LastTalon> Nope[23:40:02] <aeth> compare it to e.g. Quake which you can still play today[23:40:09] <Atari2600> yeah! quake is amazing[23:40:10] <LastTalon> Paper Mario[23:40:20] <Atari2600> paper mario is good. nice one[23:40:23] <LastTalon> Pokemon snap[23:40:30] <aeth> Pretty much everything by Id has aged amazingly well in the FPS realm, at least with the PC originals.[23:40:45] <aeth> And Valve's games from back then are still being updated[23:40:46] <Atari2600> rocket jumps and scripts[23:41:01] <Atari2600> Id, Valve and Blizzard... <3[23:41:13] <aeth> We're talking about 90s 3D though[23:41:26] <Atari2600> come get some[23:41:29] <aeth> Although "90s 3D" probably goes to about 2002 or so :-p[23:41:35] <LastTalon> I love me some halflife[23:41:39] <Atari2600> blah[23:41:41] <aeth> Then you have the awkward middle years until photorealism around 2008 or so[23:41:54] <Atari2600> the interactive CDs were the worst[23:41:56] <Atari2600> Ripper[23:41:58] <Atari2600> Urban Runner[23:42:08] <Atari2600> Man Enough[23:43:47] <solidfox> man i need some PAINT[23:43:54] <solidfox> and canvases[23:43:56] <LastTalon> Mario paint[23:44:02] <aeth> LastTalon: beat me to it, damn[23:44:02] <solidfox> my wacom is GAY[23:44:15] <LastTalon> solidfox, does it draw a lot of penises?[23:44:47] <solidfox> LastTalon: lol no, its just uh kinda difficult to use. like i cant even draw a straight line with it[23:44:50] <solidfox> get it[23:45:07] <LastTalon> I thought my joke was better.[23:45:11] <solidfox> cant draw a straight line :p[23:45:13] <solidfox> ok[23:45:30] <solidfox> well anyways, nothing wrong with being gay, but i would need to be able to draw straight[23:45:38] <solidfox> i think maybe a wacom is too advanced for me[23:45:42] <solidfox> i need to start at the basics[23:45:50] <solidfox> red green and yellow is all i need.[23:46:15] <LastTalon> I have a wacom tablet.[23:46:19] <LastTalon> They're useful.[23:46:20] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@177.138.111.125> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[23:46:46] <solidfox> i hope i can get money while being an artist/gamedev[23:47:05] <solidfox> /farmer[23:47:22] <LastTalon> Alizarin Crimson, Cadmium Yellow, and Phthalo Green[23:47:34] <LastTalon> Get to work with your 2 inch brush.[23:47:42] <LastTalon> Don't forget your odorless paint thinner[23:50:13] <solidfox> huh[23:50:18] <solidfox> why would i need them colors[23:50:32] <solidfox> i can make every color i need with just red yellow and blue..[23:51:06] *** xrash <xrash!~xrash@177.138.111.125> has joined #gamedev[23:53:11] <solidfox> wait what kind of paint tho[23:53:32] <solidfox> i dont even know the different kinds! lets see, theres water colors, are pastels a type of paint? acrylic?[23:54:17] *** RandomCouch <RandomCouch!~RandomTab@modemcable249.134-83-70.mc.videotron.ca> has joined #gamedev[23:54:57] <solidfox> watercolors r c00l[23:57:36] <solidfox> LastTalon: can you also make any color with those three[23:58:01] <LastTalon> You get other colors to make colors more consistently.[23:58:44] <LastTalon> Sure you can technically make any color of any shade with true magenta, cyan, yellow, white, and black.[23:58:49] <LastTalon> But you aren't a printer.[23:59:01] *** macza <macza!~macza@162.221.202.202> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[23:59:22] *** macza <macza!~macza@162.221.202.202> has joined #gamedev[23:59:44] <LastTalon> Opacity also matters.[23:59:54] <solidfox> Low toner