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   January 10, 2019
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[00:24:51] <LunarJetman> I will destroy Qt.
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[00:41:18] <AmR|EiSa> LunarJetman: :O ?
[00:41:43] <LunarJetman> AmR|EiSa: what?
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[00:43:52] <kalven> just ignore him
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[00:50:40] <cbreak> I will rebuild Qt
[00:51:00] <cbreak> only takes half an hour or so :)
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[01:02:57] <AmR|EiSa> Can I make class that mast inherited in C++ ?
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[01:04:03] <AmR|EiSa> cbreak: Did you try build webkit as static or for android ?
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[01:29:37] <ap4lmtree-> hi
[01:29:39] <ap4lmtree-> any of you take free online classes, such as through coursera ?
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[03:00:11] <amosbird> what's the new way of saying this : class lexicographic : public std::binary_function<std::pair<T1, T2>, std::pair<T1, T2>, bool> {...
[03:00:19] <amosbird> std::binary_function is removed in 17
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[03:01:54] <AmR|EiSa> Can I make class that must inherited in C++ ?
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[03:10:35] <manuelschneid3r> google pure virtual class
[03:11:04] <manuelschneid3r> no abstract class and pure virtual functions
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[03:14:45] <AmR|EiSa> manuelschneid3r: Thanks :-)
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[05:01:35] <Wetmelon> Why would adding "static" to a function, or putting it in an anonymous namespace, allow the compiler to inline that function?
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[05:09:20] <Stanley00> Wetmelon: to make a function has internal linkage, https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/namespace#Unnamed_namespaces
[05:10:22] <Wetmelon> I assume external linkage makes it difficult to inline a function?
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[05:11:47] <Stanley00> Wetmelon: it has nothing to do with inline, you can check linkage here https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/storage_duration#Linkage
[05:13:46] <Wetmelon> not inline, the keyword. I'm talking about compiler optimization step of inlining. And as it turns out, my compiler is just generating a function definition but then optimizing it away anyway. When it has internal linkage, the compiler doesn't opitmize away the function definition. I guess that's because the compiler knows all references to the function occur within the translation unit?
[05:14:22] <Wetmelon> err, other way around. With internal linkage it DOES optimize away the definition
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[05:30:13] <kalven> lto is a thing too these days..
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[09:48:06] <markand> a colleague is complaining that C++ enums (even class) are not enough strongly typed as you can assign a value to an enum that is *not* in that enum
[09:48:19] <markand> I already tested better-enum in the past but didn't like it that much
[09:48:32] <markand> so I was thinking of a very small wrapper that does some checks around the value: https://ideone.com/F9Y1Rh
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[09:49:09] <markand> the downside is the mix of color and ColorEnum
[09:50:18] <quarterback> There are better ways to represent data than enum. Speaking of enums, enum class is better than plain enums which store data as int.
[09:50:43] <quarterback> Using a enum is really old style programming.
[09:50:56] <markand> yes, but what he's really complaining is that you can do : enum class foo { a, b, }; foo f = static_cast<foo>(5555);
[09:51:01] <markand> yeah it depends
[09:51:09] <markand> there are still good use case of enums
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[09:51:58] <Stanley00> markand: why would you ever need "static_cast<foo>(5555)"?
[09:52:19] <Stanley00> enum is to avoid "magic number", casting a magic number to enum is just so wrong...
[09:52:21] <markand> you can't assign a int to a "strong" enum directly
[09:52:37] <markand> but using a cast is still possible (unfortunately)
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[09:52:56] <markand> so this means each time you receive a enum as argument, you must check if its value is correct
[09:53:06] <mitch0> markand: unfortunately? how would you do any kind of serialization otherwise?
[09:53:20] <markand> memcpy
[09:53:23] <markand> just kidding
[09:53:47] <TheSchaf> people fall back to ints when there is versioning isssues for example
[09:53:56] <TheSchaf> like servers sending new enum values to old versioned clients
[09:54:20] <markand> I like to use enum as flags instead of having individual boolean options
[09:54:59] <markand> like window w(window::resizable | window::borderless); or something like that
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[09:58:30] <Stanley00> I would use bitset + enum class for that
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[09:59:16] <markand> do you have an example of code where you used that? I've tried bitset several years ago, I was not fan of the syntax
[09:59:35] <markand> if you take a std::bitset as argument, can you do w(window::foo | window::bar) ?
[10:01:17] <markand> oh bitset returns itself in set()
[10:01:30] <markand> so at least you can do bs.set(a).set(b).set(c);
[10:02:50] <Stanley00> I didn't actually use bitset, it's just in my thought
[10:04:55] <markand> https://ideone.com/9AZkCb
[10:05:17] <markand> that won't work with enum class as all functions takes std::size_t
[10:06:10] <Stanley00> markand: this one come up after a quick search, https://stackoverflow.com/a/17351268
[10:06:39] <markand> I've was exactly reading it :P
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[10:06:48] <markand> Qt does something similar
[10:07:09] <markand> they create a enum like Flag and then wrap it in a class as plural form Flags
[10:08:34] <Stanley00> so, did you see the way it uses bitset as underlying type and enum class as flags index/offset?
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[10:13:53] <Stanley00> markand: back to your orignal question, check this out http://aantron.github.io/better-enums/
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[10:19:31] <markand> 09:48 < markand> I already tested better-enum in the past but didn't like it that much
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[10:28:32] <Stanley00> ah, I missed that message back there
[10:28:37] <markand> =(^.^)=
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[10:50:37] <AlexCD> Hi, I'm trying to get up and running with glfw in Ubuntu - I've installed (lib)glfw3-dev and used find_package in my cmakelists (which works), but when i add the -lglfw3 flag I get 'cannot find -lglfw3'
[10:53:24] <urdh> don't add linker flags manually, use target_add_dependencies and pass target names
[10:54:33] <urdh> hopefully the glfw3 cmake package exports one, so you can do e.g. target_add_dependencies(your_app glfw)
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[10:59:56] <Stanley00> AlexCD: pkg-config --libs glfw3 tells me it should be "-lglfw" only
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[11:21:34] <AlexCD> Stanley00: it appears you're correct. A lot of the guides seem to say -lglfw3, which confuses me.
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[11:22:34] <AlexCD> urdh, do you mean just 'add_dependencies'? target_add.. is unknown to cmake
[11:26:34] <urdh> what kind of ancient CMake are you using?
[11:27:56] <TinoDidriksen> target_add_dependencies() doesn't exist. add_dependencies() does.
[11:28:03] <urdh> nevermind, I'm just being confused today
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[11:28:11] <urdh> I meant target_link_libraries
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[11:30:15] <AlexCD_> urdh: 3.10.2?
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[11:33:24] <AlexCD> no wait, 3.13
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[11:35:52] <AlexCD> Lots of undefined references to glfw functions in my source code coming from the linker now D:
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[11:40:33] <TinoDidriksen> After you did target_link_libraries() ?
[11:41:09] <AlexCD> TinoDidriksen: Happens if I set flags, or use target_link_libraries
[11:42:11] <AlexCD> I'm importing glad, then glfw
[11:42:20] <AlexCD> *including
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[13:42:15] <Sepultura> will this work anyway? I know class Example should inherit from IFace but would it work? https://nopaste.xyz/?41361668e8aff503#MLTTVO9nNVls4DDoF4GJHSdoycIEoEM9uflFekdjEL8=
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[13:50:10] <urdh> !tias
[13:50:12] <nolyc> tias is Try it and see yourself. 1) Stops wasting our time and 2) You learn the answer. If you have a specific compiler error prepare a test case at https://wandbox.org/
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[14:11:42] <markand> isn't * executed before ++ in expression *it++ ?
[14:11:51] <markand> in debugger I enter operator++ before operator* on my own iterator
[14:15:21] <markand> ah no they are 3 both
[14:15:26] <markand> according to https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/operator_precedence
[14:18:19] <urdh> geordi: --precedence *it++
[14:18:19] <geordi> *(it++)
[14:18:33] <quarterback> * has highest precedence I think
[14:18:46] <urdh> not that it matters since post-increment returns a copy of the iterator before incrementing, anyway
[14:19:04] <quarterback> markand, It could be (*it)++
[14:19:26] <urdh> scratch that
[14:19:49] <quarterback> markand, Use ( ) always where you are iterating. Its best to use ( ).
[14:21:16] <urdh> completely redundant for the *it++ case, the precedence is clear and the expression is idiomatic
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[14:23:31] <quarterback> markand, Its good practice to use ( ). Its almost impossible for somebody to judge the precedence correctly when they are going through that line in a large source file.
[14:24:25] <symm-> a minefield of trivia :(
[14:24:42] <urdh> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
[14:24:47] <symm-> sometimes I think it would be better to have a language where everything has to be explicit
[14:25:08] <quarterback> symm-, Writing explicit code always results in cleaner code.
[14:25:12] <urdh> there are situations where making the precedence explicit helps readability, but *it++ is not really one of them
[14:25:15] <symm-> no default constructors/assignment operators, no implicit conversions, no operator precedence
[14:25:45] <markand> yes
[14:26:32] <markand> there are still places where you're happy to have implicit conversions
[14:26:49] <markand> e.g. a function taking a Color that accept strings: you can do set_color("black")
[14:27:01] <markand> if not, you will need to write set_color(color("black"s))
[14:27:08] <velco> that's a bad design to begin with
[14:27:09] <quarterback> in some industries, conversions are forbidden. It seems like you haven't worked there.
[14:27:27] <markand> velco, whyy?
[14:27:27] <symm-> much easier to have an additional set_color(char*)
[14:28:23] <velco> text processing is stupid anywhere except in the direct interaction with a user
[14:28:28] <markand> since you already have a color object I don't think it's the responsability of set_color to have multiple overloads
[14:28:48] <velco> (well, obvoisusly not when the input data is text)
[14:28:55] <markand> set_color does not need to know how the color was parsed (e.g. a name, a hex string, a rgb tuple)
[14:29:06] <symm-> markand: because it introduces a tiny extra bit of "stuff to remember". it feels neat when you've just written it, but a year from now you and others will have to constantly pay the price of (re)discovering this tiny fact - that, "oh! Color has a string constructor, too! I see."
[14:29:14] <velco> setColor(Color::BLACK); // is nicer
[14:30:05] <quarterback> markand, Even if you are trying to be clever, others have to spend time to figure out what you did..it will be extra $$ or Pounds spend for them to waste that extra time.
[14:30:05] <markand> this is okay if Color has a constructor that accept Color::BLACK
[14:30:07] <velco> if there's a general fucntion, thart parses textual representatin of colors, it surely should accommodate for syntactically incorrect descriptions, have the appriopriate error returns that need to be checked and acted upon
[14:30:57] <symm-> these bits of cleverness all over a MLOC+ codebase add up like cancer and make progress grind to a halt
[14:31:20] <markand> other than that I hate implicit conversions
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[14:31:42] <markand> e.g. char to int etc
[14:31:58] <velco> you mean promotions ?
[14:31:58] <markand> or int to bool in boolean context
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[14:32:18] <symm-> you get a warning for int to bool
[14:32:29] <velco> int to bool is fine ;)
[14:32:39] <markand> it's even worse in some scripting language, e.g. in JS if (foo) will evaluate to false if foo is a number set to 0
[14:32:58] <velco> the "usual arithmetic conversions" are the big PITA
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[15:10:35] <markand> funny, the functional cast is prior the C-style cast
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[16:04:14] <markand> I'm playing with structured bindings to be added in your own class
[16:05:00] <markand> is template <> get() = delete a way to delete the generic function *except* the specializations?
[16:05:29] <markand> example: https://wandbox.org/permlink/4MioOgu9tm5Uu8XP
[16:05:47] <markand> so I can use c.get<0 or 1 or 2>() but not c.get<3>() (as desired)
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[17:01:03] <amosbird> Hi, anyone has experience of providing definitions to weak symbols at runtime using dlopen?
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[17:01:47] <amosbird> it crashes when I tried invoking a virtual function that is defined in the loaded DSO
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[17:08:36] <quarterback> What would be a good way to generate keys consisting of characters a-z and A-Z, characters !!@#$%^&*()_+={};":"`~|\ and 0123456789. If there were a 64 byte key made up of such characters. How easy is it to break the key?
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[17:09:50] <quarterback> It took about 4 seconds to generate 52*52*52*52 combinations. I am assuming that it will take much longer to break a key with some of above characters.
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[17:12:13] <amosbird> the assembly looks like this https://la.wentropy.com/JbxR . it crashes when jumping to the symbol definition
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[17:14:28] <symm-> quarterback: generating is easy, hashing is slower
[17:14:42] <quarterback> symm-, What do you mean by hashing?
[17:15:02] <symm-> a password is usually hashed into a numerical value
[17:15:18] <symm-> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptographic_hash_function
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[17:15:42] <quarterback> symm-, Ah ok, I also did it the same way, generate a key for numbers from 0 to some number as 7788888888
[17:16:06] <symm-> yes but keys are 128 bits long (or even bigger)
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[17:16:22] <symm-> you cannot iterate from 0 to 2^128, there is not enough time in the universe
[17:16:48] <quarterback> symm-, How does anybody break such keys? Somebody in this channel showed me that they broke XOR encryption with such keys.
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[17:17:04] <symm-> lol, XOR encryption is child's play
[17:17:29] <symm-> serious encryption uses 128+ bit keys and computationally intensive hash functions
[17:17:51] <quarterback> symm-, So even with a complex 128 bit key, you can break XOR encryption?
[17:17:52] <symm-> (the hash function produces the key)
[17:18:09] <symm-> quarterback: depends on the XOR algorithm
[17:18:46] <quarterback> symm-, There are no additions or shifting, just one xor op ^.
[17:19:11] <symm-> if it's literally the simplest imaginable - "XOR the key to the data" - it's easily crackable because the patterns will still be visible in the encrypted text - for example, you can always look for CR+LF sequences, even if they are encrypted
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[17:19:40] <symm-> Alan Turing cracked enigma by correctly presuming that all messages ended with Heil Hitler
[17:19:52] <symm-> and also using the knowledge that a letter never mapped to itself
[17:19:59] <quarterback> symm-, Ah so CR and LF are xor'ed the same way...but they may change places.
[17:20:15] <symm-> not a serious obstacle
[17:20:23] <urdh> symm-: that sounds apocryphal
[17:20:39] <symm-> urdh: hmm, fair enough, just stuff I read
[17:20:48] <quarterback> symm-, I did a xor decryption with simple alpabetical keys, it took under 40 seconds for a 700 word text.
[17:21:17] <quarterback> symm-, You pointed out one thing which is noticeable.The CR and LF bytes.
[17:21:50] <symm-> amosbird: what is a "weak symbol"? also, my first thought would be, you're mixing up calling conventions (cdecl/stdcall/thiscall)
[17:22:18] <symm-> quarterback: yeah. you can look for such clues if you have an idea what the original file is supposed to be
[17:22:29] <amosbird> symm-: I haven't done anything related to calling convetions
[17:22:31] <symm-> all known formats have a predictable structure
[17:22:53] <quarterback> symm-, How do you generate complex keys with strange symbols like ^ ( or ~ or ; and still look for clues?
[17:23:10] <symm-> amosbird: is the .so created by you?
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[17:23:14] <amosbird> yes
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[17:23:43] <quarterback> symm-, The key generation would take lot of time, probably days or weeks if all combinations of ascii characters are to be generated.
[17:23:44] <symm-> amosbird: C or C++ external symbols? in other words, is there C++ name mangling?
[17:23:49] <amosbird> yes
[17:23:51] <amosbird> c++
[17:24:00] <amosbird> virtual member functions
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[17:24:27] <symm-> amosbird: try adding a dummy function marked "extern C" (the simplest case) and see if this can be called without problems
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[17:24:42] <symm-> a global function (not class member)
[17:24:56] <amosbird> hmm, that even not needs to be weak...
[17:25:02] <symm-> quarterback: doesn't matter what symbols you use, ^ is not any more "strange" than A :P
[17:25:05] <amosbird> global symbols are allow to be undefined
[17:25:45] <symm-> amosbird: sorry, what do you mean?
[17:26:28] <amosbird> i mean ""extern C" (the simplest case) " works won't be related to this crash
[17:26:46] <symm-> quarterback: it is simply a question of how many symbols you have in total, say, 26 lowercase letters, 26 uppercase, and 20 symbols, that's 62 symbosl in all
[17:26:59] <symm-> amosbird: yes, but what if it doesn't work
[17:27:04] <symm-> amosbird: that will tell you something
[17:27:21] <symm-> amosbird: the key to debugging a problem is removing the unknowns one at a time :)
[17:27:44] <amosbird> well, I'm only half agree with you
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[17:31:50] <quarterback> symm-, So you are saying a char such as 01100001 may have common bits with this 01101011 and may produce similar encrypted text.
[17:32:14] <symm-> hmm no, why would I say that?
[17:33:06] <quarterback> symm-, You said its easy to break simple xor encryption done with ^ operator and complex keys as IO&89@`;0988123FEGE
[17:34:46] <InPhase> quarterback: If you repeat the key usage, it is known to be fairly trivial to break.
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[17:35:18] <quarterback> InPhase, Repeat key usage? Can you elaborate more please?
[17:35:19] <InPhase> quarterback: xor encryption is roughly equivalently strong to the cryptographic strength of the key schedule.
[17:35:59] <symm-> quarterback: I trust you have a clear understanding of how XOR encryption works?
[17:36:14] <quarterback> symm-, Yes I do to some extent.
[17:36:46] <symm-> quarterback: for example, you have the cleartext message 00 23 FF 13 AB, and the encryption key 12 5E, what would the encrypted text be?
[17:36:48] <InPhase> quarterback: If you have a random key of 1024 bytes, but encrypt 1 megabyte by reusing that same key for every 1024 bytes, then an adversary can trivially remove your encryption and look for patterns in your data.
[17:37:11] <quarterback> symm-, I know that xor encryption is nearly the same with keys which are near to each other..you may have a decrypted word like haste and hASte with keys which are near to each other like abba and abbb
[17:38:10] <InPhase> quarterback: Mathematically, for key K, if you transmite X = x ^ K, then Y = y ^ K, your adversary can do X ^ Y, which is x ^ y ^ K ^ K, which is just x ^ y. Your key is not in there, and only the plain text is.
[17:38:11] <symm-> yes and no. if you XOR 'a' and 'A' with the ***same*** byte, the results will differ by only 1 bit
[17:38:16] <symm-> but generally, no.
[17:40:01] <symm-> quarterback: let me give it another go, suppose you have the message "helloworld" and the key is one byte, for example 0x23
[17:40:09] <symm-> how would XOR encryption work?
[17:40:13] <quarterback> symm-, One thing about xor is that there is not enough standard deviation with each key.
[17:40:55] <symm-> a XOR operation takes two operands, what are the two operands here?
[17:40:59] <quarterback> symm-, You would xor each char of "helloworld" with 0x23 and get the encrypted string.
[17:41:05] <symm-> quarterback: ok
[17:41:15] <InPhase> quarterback: If K1 and K2 have no relationship that the adversary can exploit, then xor encryption is strong. For example if both K1 and K2 are true random numbers known to both parties, then you have a one-time pad scenario which is provably uncrackable. But if they are the same number, it is trivial.
[17:41:21] <symm-> quarterback: now, what about if the key is 0x23 0x45 (two bytes long)?
[17:42:01] <InPhase> known ONLY to both parties, that is
[17:42:13] <symm-> InPhase: what are K1 and K2?
[17:42:35] <quarterback> symm-, You Xor first byte with 0x023, second byte with 0x45, third with 0x23, fourth with 0x45 and so on until the key is all used up.
[17:42:50] <InPhase> symm-: Keys used for xor'ing with two blocks.
[17:43:01] <symm-> quarterback: exactly; that's what InPhase meant by "repeat key usage"
[17:43:27] <symm-> InPhase: ok, and what are blocks? :)
[17:43:58] <InPhase> symm-: Chunks of data of a fixed size which does not affect what I was saying.
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[17:45:16] <symm-> InPhase: ok, fair enough, was just trying to get a handle on the terminology as I only have a layman's understanding of the process
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[17:46:27] <InPhase> symm-: If it helps you to reason it out, you can consider them bytes or words. The same principle scales up.
[17:46:39] <quarterback> InPhase, Still, a complex key is computationally hard to crack.
[17:46:57] <InPhase> quarterback: Not if you repeat it.
[17:47:18] <quarterback> InPhase, There are clues though like CR and LF bytes as symm said. Obviously I would be repeating it.
[17:47:42] <kalven> don't roll your own crypto
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[17:48:28] <InPhase> Imagine it as a one-byte key for example. If you use it on helloworld, the two l's will yield the same output. If you xor the results for encrypting 'l' together, you know the password. Instant full compromise.
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[17:49:41] <InPhase> If you had a very large set of data, and you ended up encrypting a large file with many zeroes, the same problem arises. You just transmitted your encryption key to the adversary.
[17:49:47] <quarterback> InPhase, So you mean guessing each char of the key this way by xor'ing with all chars of encrypted text?
[17:50:15] <symm-> xoring with one byte is pretty hilarious encryption :)
[17:50:42] <symm-> I used to have it for a thing I did in high school
[17:51:08] <symm-> then someone clued me in to mixing in the value of the previous byte into the current xor result (or something like that)
[17:51:14] <InPhase> Imagine you have a file that's only HALF zeroes. A smart adversary can still extract the key by just observing the patterns. If you do English text, even if there are no zeroes, an adversary can extract your repeated key by studying the known patterns in English text. This last one is a little harder to see how, but it's still quite doable.
[17:51:47] <quarterback> InPhase, How would you really decode a text of 1000 words and a key as ABXE#@#@()*#):_9283423
[17:51:59] <symm-> quarterback: the key is ONE BYTE
[17:52:10] <symm-> (in this example)
[17:52:21] <quarterback> symm-, I'm referring to a 64 byte key in the above example.
[17:52:33] <quarterback> symm-, One byte is too easy, so forget about it.
[17:52:43] <symm-> 64 bytes? that's huge
[17:52:50] <symm-> maybe you mean 64 bits?
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[17:53:32] <quarterback> symm-, I mean 128 bit which is 16 bytes.
[17:53:50] <symm-> quarterback: ok, and it's just a simple XOR scheme, like you explained earlier?
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[17:54:05] <symm-> it's simple: is the original text in standard english?
[17:54:08] <InPhase> quarterback: I'm not an expert on the most efficient methods of doing that, but consider you can start with a dictionary of English words, slide them along, and look for repeated key values. Or you can assume every character is a space character, and look for which value repeats (this is probably sufficient, since you repeated your key 45 times, and spaces make up about 1 in 5 characters of
[17:54:14] <InPhase> English).
[17:54:17] <symm-> then it will contain enough common words like "the" and "and"
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[17:54:23] <quarterback> symm-, The original text would have english words from a dictionary.
[17:54:40] <symm-> there will be a standard frequency of letters, e.g. 'e' will be the most frequently used letter
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[17:55:59] <InPhase> Oh, 45 WORDS, means you repeated your key 225 times. Space character analysis is definitely sufficient.
[17:56:09] <symm-> 'e' may xor to different values, but if the attacker knows the length of the key, then they can reason that two different xor'ed values that were both originally 'e' are part of the key, and thus slowly build the key by trial and error
[17:56:10] <InPhase> 1000 words
[17:56:10] <quarterback> symm-, There are about 300 words which I will store in a list.
[17:56:38] <symm-> quarterback: any separator between the words? like CRLF or space? :)
[17:57:14] <quarterback> symm-, Each line would have CR and LF assuming its ascii text. I think unicode may have CR only.
[17:57:21] <symm-> any such clues only help speed up the process
[17:57:35] <InPhase> quarterback: A good rule of thumb from analyses of English text is that it only has about 1-2 bits of entropy per letter.
[17:57:35] <symm-> quarterback: then it's a walk in the park
[17:58:00] <quarterback> InPhase, What is entropy per letter?
[17:58:17] <InPhase> quarterback: It describes the complexity, or inversely, the predictability.
[17:59:05] <InPhase> quarterback: Something that is predictable and patterned means it is easy for cryptographers to exploit a wide variety of relationships about the content.
[17:59:48] <quarterback> InPhase, I have to think about patterns between two or more decrypted text with some keys. if there is such way.
[18:01:42] <symm-> noticing patterns is good, and has often led to discoveries; but what's most important is a clear picture of what is happening
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[18:02:55] <quarterback> symm-, One thing which I saw is xor is not very strong if done with a single ^ operator. There are a few encrypted messages which seemed similar. But with complex keys, it cane be hard to see any pattern like this.
[18:03:21] <kalven> yikes
[18:04:10] <quarterback> symm-, Decryption generated almost identical text with case of alphabets changed like in text like This is a text and THis Is A tEXT
[18:04:49] <symm-> sure, because lowercase and uppercase ASCII differ by only one bit
[18:04:49] <quarterback> symm-, That is with decryption using different keys.
[18:05:04] <symm-> with different keys??
[18:05:16] <quarterback> symm-, keys like abba and abbb
[18:05:34] <symm-> they don't look very different :)
[18:05:35] <InPhase> Best keys ever.
[18:05:48] <symm-> also, when you say 'abba', is that a 32-bit (4-byte) key?
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[18:06:07] <symm-> InPhase: that's the combination I have on my luggage :D
[18:09:23] <quarterback> symm-, If the key size is increased to 8 or 16 bytes, decryption becomes harder
[18:09:47] <quarterback> symm-, This is if characters other than alphabets and numbers are used.
[18:10:23] <InPhase> quarterback: I have a programming assignment for you, to help you understand that. Take a key of "secret", and repeat it as needed to xor. Then try to encrypt the following text: "foo bar". Look at the encryption output, and tell me if you can deduce the key just from inspection.
[18:11:00] <quarterback> InPhase, I will check it, thanks.
[18:11:01] <InPhase> quarterback: There were 16 spaces (please include them) between "foo" and "bar" in my input, if that didn't show up properly due to wrapping.
[18:11:12] <quarterback> InPhase, I think you are talking about whitespace which is a common occurence.
[18:11:24] <InPhase> quarterback: You might be shocked by the output.
[18:12:17] <symm-> quarterback: I also have an assignment :) if there are two people who are encrypting stuff, one of them can create keys using just five letters: ABCDE, and another can create keys using five symbols: $%^&*, then whose encryption will be harder to decrypt??
[18:12:18] <velco> one just has to choose a key, longer than the combined sum of all messages that would be ever encrypted with the xor, isn't it ?
[18:13:04] <quarterback> symm-, Both might be similar.
[18:13:17] <symm-> might? or will surely be identical?
[18:13:36] <InPhase> symm-: Technically it depends on whether the restriction is known.
[18:13:43] <InPhase> symm-: I think you want to declare it known.
[18:13:50] <symm-> fair enough
[18:14:18] <quarterback> symm-, Identical perhaps, but its hard to know whether they are identical. If you guessed the characters in the key are consequetive then they may be identical.
[18:14:29] <symm-> but suppose it is known: either keys are built ouf of ABCDE, or out of $%^&*
[18:15:00] <symm-> quarterback: I just don't understand why you seem to believe that '%' is more "complex" than 'A'
[18:15:20] <quarterback> symm-, If you state a precondition that chars in the key are consecutive then they both may be identical.
[18:15:39] <symm-> "chars in the key"?
[18:15:46] <symm-> the key is a *number*
[18:15:46] <quarterback> symm-, letters in the key
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[18:18:23] <quarterback> symm-, Character is a key means a is a char in key abba1234
[18:18:32] <quarterback> symm-, Character in a key means a is a char in key abba1234 *
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[18:21:23] <symm-> ok:)
[18:23:45] <quarterback> symm-, What do you think? Would you crack a 1000 word english text with every word in a dictionary and key such as abba(%@^ with a xor encryption using single ^?
[18:24:23] <symm-> I think it would be relatively easy
[18:24:38] <quarterback> symm-, How would you start?
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[18:25:00] <symm-> CR LF and letter frequency in the english language
[18:25:44] <symm-> in fact, if I knew for a fact that it was a list of vocabulary words, I would just brute force it against a 50,000 word wordlist
[18:26:34] <symm-> especially if I know up front what the key length is
[18:26:55] <quarterback> What if you dont know the length of the key?
[18:27:18] <symm-> I can still assume it lies within reasonable limits, say 5 to 50 characters long
[18:27:54] <symm-> just apply all words in the 50,000 word list against the beginning of the file
[18:27:56] <TinoDidriksen> How many times do you have to be told it's trivial?
[18:28:11] <kalven> 5 to 50 times more
[18:28:21] <symm-> and try each xor key I get against the rest of the file, 5 to 50 times
[18:28:46] <symm-> just create a giant text dump and look through it by hand until I see what looks like english then bingo
[18:29:17] <velco> I think this discussion about the xor encryption has been going for 4-5 years now
[18:29:41] <TinoDidriksen> Yeah. It has been going on for years.
[18:29:51] <quarterback> symm-, I see, it could work. I have to try it sometime.
[18:29:58] <velco> (and I have the strange feeling that I've made that comment 2-3 years ago :)
[18:30:59] <quarterback> symm-, I have a 100k wordlist which I used for lookups for dictionary words. You are Xoring the words in wordlist with encrypted message.
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[18:44:25] <amosbird> hmmmm, it's indeed symbol lookup failure
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[18:49:49] <amosbird> why do I get this warning: ‘visibility’ attribute ignored on non-class types when doing this https://la.wentropy.com/-a4m
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[18:55:15] <m5w> afaik, when you declare a function in C with no parameters, you're supposed to say e.g. void foo(void). When I declare an extern "C" function in C++ with no parameters, should I do the same, or can I just say e.g. extern "C" void foo()?
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[18:56:00] <symm-> you're not really supposed to say (void) in any situation
[18:56:23] <urdh> amosbird: attributes go on the declaration, not the definition (IIRC)
[18:56:29] <m5w> huh, I thought that if you didn't say (void) the function could technically accept an undefined number and type of arguments
[18:57:08] <m5w> https://stackoverflow.com/a/51080/3020256
[18:57:58] <symm-> in C maybe
[18:58:09] <symm-> but in C++ it means 0 arguments
[18:58:24] <symm-> (even when marked with "extern C", it's still C++ if compiled as C++)
[18:59:05] <m5w> ok, that makes sense
[19:00:22] <vdamewood> m5w: Yeah, in C++ just go with empty parens.
[19:02:01] <vdamewood> Though, using (void) shouldn't hurt, it's just not idiomatic. It's common-ish to see in polyglot header files that use #if defined __cplusplus \n extern "C" { ... and so on, though.
[19:03:01] <m5w> yeah, this is just for main and interrupt handlers
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[19:03:52] <m5w> thanks!
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[19:09:00] <symm-> amosbird: a shot in the dark but maybe try the fix from here: https://gcc.gnu.org/ml/gcc-help/2014-06/msg00040.html (or more likely, it's what urdh said)
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[19:18:44] <Hathadar> What kind of overload do I need for my Foo class to allow assignment myInt = myFoo ?
[19:20:39] <m0shbear> Hathadar: `operator int () const`, as a member function
[19:23:32] <Hathadar> thx
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[19:43:42] <iCherry> anyone know if Beej's network guide is still up to date? it says last updated june 2016. any important networking advancements since then?
[19:47:25] <LunarJetman> iCherry: just use boost.asio
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[19:53:32] <iCherry> LunarJetman, im doing it primarily to learn about networking, and beej's guide is heavily recommended, it seems
[19:57:26] *** nanthil <nanthil!8e883eca@gateway/web/freenode/ip.142.136.62.202> has joined ##C++-general
[19:57:29] <nanthil> I hav\e a library which includes "#define this that", but I need to compile a dll which exports "this". clearly "#define __declspec(dllexport) this that" won't work. how can I acheive this since the #define is the only place where that is defined?
[19:58:13] <nanthil> I also tried "#define this that <newline> __declspec(dllexport) this"
[20:00:25] <urdh> if `this` really is a preprocessor macro, it won't be in the dll at all
[20:00:58] <nanthil> that's my problem
[20:01:06] <urdh> well, it's never going to be in the dll
[20:01:14] <urdh> are you familiar with how the preprocessor works?
[20:01:17] <nanthil> there's no way to export the name?
[20:01:28] <nanthil> basically copy pasta en masse
[20:02:03] <urdh> yes, and after the preprocessor step there won't be a `this` in your code
[20:02:12] <urdh> so how would it ever end up in the dll?
[20:02:26] <urdh> now, you might need to export `that`, but that's a different matter
[20:02:47] <nanthil> well the intent, I'm sure, is to #include the .h file that contains my #define, but I'm using an FFI, and I need the symbols from the header file but I can't #include them because it's a different language
[20:03:00] <nanthil> so I NEED those symbols, how would you suggest i go about that?
[20:03:04] <urdh> your macro is not a symbol
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[20:03:52] <symm-> so, you want the string "this" to be an exported symbol from your dll?
[20:04:04] <symm-> what would it point to? a variable? a function?
[20:04:09] <nanthil> I want a symbol "this" that refers to "that"
[20:04:18] <nanthil> because that's how it's used in thel ibrary
[20:04:18] <symm-> and what is "that"?
[20:04:33] <nanthil> a function
[20:04:40] <urdh> then make the macro an actual function
[20:05:09] <symm-> any chance of just renaming "that" to "this"?
[20:05:19] <symm-> (I'm assuming this is all C btw?)
[20:05:28] <nanthil> not and maintaining any sort of compatibility
[20:06:01] <symm-> wait, do you use "this" and "that" as example names, or do your strings actually say "this" and "that"?
[20:06:04] <nanthil> so I could do something like int this = that;
[20:06:28] <nanthil> no I'm trying to make an example. I'm using GLEW and I need the definitions, over an FFI
[20:06:49] <nanthil> but the visible members from the .dll don't have the GLEW #defined names
[20:06:49] <symm-> can you write simple wrappers?
[20:07:06] <nanthil> example?
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[20:07:39] <symm-> int clean_name(char* arg1, float arg2) { return actual_ugly_function_name(arg1, arg2); }
[20:07:51] <symm-> int __declspec(dllexport) clean_name(char* arg1, float arg2) { return actual_ugly_function_name(arg1, arg2); }
[20:08:02] <symm-> (forgot the dllexport)
[20:08:07] <nanthil> I could, but holy shit we're tlaking about 2000 #defines
[20:08:12] <nanthil> sorry, 20000
[20:08:46] <urdh> tough luck
[20:08:48] <nanthil> and it's doing a function lookup, so I would have to script to find the function declaration
[20:08:58] <symm-> hmm, sorry say, the only way for your .dll to have an exported symbol named "blah" is for it to contain a function named "blah"
[20:09:12] <symm-> unless you want to doctor PE's by hand yourself (not a good idea)
[20:09:16] <urdh> I think usually you'd do the same aliasing on the FFI side as the defines do on the C++ side
[20:09:18] <nanthil> if that isn't a glaring oversight
[20:09:35] <urdh> which is usually possible to automate
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[20:09:43] <nanthil> it is possible
[20:09:53] <nanthil> but horribly inconvenient
[20:10:26] <symm-> is it not possible to write a script that generates the 20,000 wrapper functions from the 20,000 #defines?
[20:10:33] <nanthil> it is
[20:10:39] <nanthil> but I would have to do that at startup
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[20:10:45] <symm-> assuming the defines are only as simple as #define SYMBOL1 SYMBOL2
[20:10:48] <nanthil> which is overhead that I don't want, but I gues I have to do
[20:10:54] <urdh> "at startup"?
[20:11:00] <nanthil> when I run my application
[20:11:10] <urdh> that doesn't make much sense
[20:11:11] <symm-> what startup? no, I mean write a script that generates a cpp for you, once
[20:11:16] <urdh> ^
[20:11:23] <nanthil> oh, derp
[20:11:30] <symm-> and that cpp then becomes a permanent part of your project
[20:11:34] <nanthil> sorry, my head is somewhere dark and smelly
[20:11:45] <symm-> (it could be run at every build if you want to be fancy)
[20:11:57] <nanthil> I could just dump it to a text file and it would be native code at that point
[20:12:34] <nanthil> aight thanks all
[20:12:36] <symm-> yes, .cpp is a text file :)
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[20:12:55] <nanthil> no, not .cpp, this is another language altogether
[20:13:00] <nanthil> tyring to import glew into julia
[20:13:06] <symm-> I see
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[22:43:03] <That_Guy_Anon> is there a good resource on all the good coding practices for c++? I just found out about [[nodiscard]] and trailing return and I feel like there are so many things i could incorporate into my coding-standard in order to make it more readable.
[22:43:40] <That_Guy_Anon> and reliable
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[22:53:44] <Ameisen> perhaps I'm insane, but how do you cache cmake configure results so it doesn't have to reconfigure every time (given that it's reconfiguration is somehow _slower_ than autoconf)
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[23:27:12] <rpav> reconfigure every time?
[23:27:33] <rpav> don't delete the cache or force things to be uncached?
[23:28:23] <rpav> for me it regenerates in a second or so with cache still around
[23:28:43] <rpav> 0.84s total
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[23:47:01] <Ameisen> So, I have a partial implementation of one of my extensions for C++ in Clang. Not quite sure what to call them, and the syntax is in flux.
[23:47:23] <Ameisen> It lets you define constructors/destructors, right now at least, as $construct/$destruct instead of class_name/~class_name
[23:47:33] <Ameisen> which also technically lets you define them for anonymous classes
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[23:49:44] <cbreak> geordi: { X x; x.$X(); } struct X { $X() { BARK; } };
[23:49:45] <geordi> error: ISO C++ forbids declaration of '$X' with no type
[23:49:57] <cbreak> geordi: { X x; x.$X(); } struct X { void $X() { BARK; } };
[23:49:57] <geordi> X::$X()
[23:50:05] <cbreak> Ameisen: you sure?
[23:50:08] <DarkShin> Hey guys, how can I measure the time taken to access a bool variable versus a std::vector<bool> entry? Im looking in this old code that uses lots of bool vars instead of a vector. I am wandering that if they did that for performance
[23:51:00] <urdh> Ameisen: doesn't seem terribly useful
[23:52:03] <cbreak> DarkShin: you can benchmark it
[23:52:09] <cbreak> by running the code in a profiler for example
[23:52:31] <cbreak> if the variables have good names, then it's better though.
[23:52:44] <cbreak> if they have no meaning other than by index, then a std::vector<bool> would be fine
[23:52:48] <cbreak> but I'd use a bitset in that case
[23:56:26] <DarkShin> Well the problem is that I can just use an enum and populate the vector with a loop
[23:56:50] <DarkShin> but this way, with alot of variables, the code must be written assign values to each one.. pain in the ass
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[23:57:23] <DarkShin> cbreak: u think that writing a simple benchmark could measure it ? It should be in nano seconds right?
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   January 10, 2019
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