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[00:31:12] <plufz> how long does it take to be working at a reasonable speed in blender? hard question to answer of course, but I’m close to giving up after using it for a couple months. every little thing seems to take hours for me to do.
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[00:40:59] <CoJaBo> I've been using it infrequently for 2 decades, and I still suck at everything =D
[00:41:40] <plufz> hehe :)
[00:42:49] <plufz> I cant even combine two cubes with boolean union without creating internal geometry. It feels like a joke…
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[00:45:33] <CoJaBo> plufz: Yeh, booleans are deep magic to get work
[00:46:21] <CoJaBo> plufz: The trick is, you basically can't have 2 coincident edges, or it will implode most, but not all, of the time.
[00:47:39] <CoJaBo> plufz: So, e.g., for 2 cubes the easiest way I've found is to just scale one by a minute fraction, and move them a minute amount closer, then it magically all works. I hope someday, someone will find a better way lol
[00:49:14] <plufz> CoJaBo: Thanks for th tips! If you where to create this shape: https://www.dropbox.com/s/c0b8zs83g5mc5c0/Screenshot%202020-02-13%2000.46.49.png?dl=0 would you use boolean union or something else?
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[00:50:05] <CoJaBo> plufz: I'd probably extrude a cube
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[00:50:24] <plufz> ah right of course.
[00:51:35] <plufz> thanks for the help and feedback. I was about to go mental. :P
[00:56:01] <ze> tbh boolean operations have generally been more suited to mathematical primitives than meshes, i think the fact it's available for meshes at all is kindof a finicky bonus way of approaching things than the first thing one should go for
[00:57:07] <CoJaBo> Yeh, I usually only use the diff or sometimes intersect operator for cutting out bits
[00:57:38] <CoJaBo> I haven't seen really much use for union; if anything I just join the meshes and leave them like that. Works good enough for 3D printing
[00:57:43] <ze> though it also still sounds like it might have room for improvement on meshes and will probably get better i should think
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[01:03:32] <ze> it's kinda funny to hit F12 and have 4 renders happen for it
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[01:04:10] <plufz> I really want to use blender. The community seems really nice and fun with such an advanced piece of creative software that is open source.
[01:04:33] <ze> well if you're using meshes, use mesh-oriented ways of modelling :)
[01:05:18] <ze> booleans can still be useful in some cases like CoJaBo said, but mostly you'll want to use things like extrusion
[01:05:45] <ze> or procedural modelling with modifiers and such ;)
[01:08:09] <plufz> ze: right. I’m trying to learn. it just feels so backwards for me to like make hard changes to a mesh instead of using arrays, bools, etc. But I’m more from the c4d and adobe world and I’m trying to be unbiased about this, but it is a little hard. :P
[01:09:16] <ze> are mesh booleans even nondestructive in blender?
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[01:09:24] <ze> i thought they still altered it
[01:09:30] <ze> but i haven't messed with them tbh
[01:09:45] <ze> last time i used 3d CSG was in povray :)
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[01:10:13] <plufz> like say I make a house with a lot of holes for windows. I dont want to make each window an individual hole, I want to have one original hole that I can resize and have all holes update, right…?
[01:10:34] <ze> hmm!
[01:11:42] <ze> sounds reasonable, i dunno how else you might go about it, but i don't know much so maybe there's another approach
[01:12:25] <ze> or maybe you can get it tamed as you learn the quirks
[01:12:27] <ze> hehe
[01:12:53] <CoJaBo> plufz: That's basically how I do screw holes, yeh. One mesh for the size of the hole, and used as a boolean diff wherever I need one.
[01:13:20] <ze> oh booleans are a modifier, i see
[01:13:24] <CoJaBo> OpenSCAD is much more refined for stuff like that, but has the downside of having to learn OpenSCAD
[01:13:53] <plufz> ah right.
[01:14:19] <plufz> a totally different thing. most shortcuts seems to tied to where the mouse is. like say I select an object in the outliner, I cant press “x” to delete it. I have to move the mouse to the viewport and then press x. can I do something about that?
[01:14:41] <plufz> having to move the mouse takes a bit of the short of the shortcut away :P
[01:15:24] <ze> i swear you could delete stuff from the outliner that way in 2.80, i'm not sure why it went away or what that situation is
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[01:15:55] <ze> they've been fixing up some weirdness with discrepencies in the outline selection vs viewport selection, kinda stuff, so maybe it relates to that development
[01:16:47] <plufz> from what I’ve seen they seem to do a great job in improving blender though. 2.8 seems to have been a huge step.
[01:16:56] <ze> yeah
[01:17:00] <plufz> 2.80
[01:17:13] <ze> i'm a fan of 2.8x
[01:17:53] <ze> i dabbled in blender here and there for years before, but really managed to get into it a lot more and work on real projects since 2.80
[01:17:58] <CoJaBo> Yeh, I've been using the 2.8x since it was still in nightlies. It was such a huge change, I figured I'd rather learn it sooner rather than later
[01:18:51] <ze> my todo list used to have an old entry to work on learning blender with explicit training to master the workflow
[01:19:27] <ze> but then 2.80 doesn't ask me to train in its unusual style and i can just pick it up and go and figure out details as i go along
[01:19:29] <ze> :P
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[01:20:34] <plufz> for a new person like me selecting with LMB seems reasonable ;)
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[01:21:09] <CoJaBo> I pretty much don't use the 3d cursor since I set it so often by accident lol
[01:21:42] <ze> i can kinda understand the rationale of like, you're clicking with the left button everywhere all the time, and it balances the repetitive load to put a different frequently-used thing on the right click, but ehhh.. nothing else worries about that and only the people used to it seem to care
[01:21:45] <ze> heh
[01:21:59] <CoJaBo> *creates new object* “⸘⸘⸘TF did it go‽‽‽”
[01:22:06] <ze> and they can still set it that way
[01:22:23] <ze> CoJaBo: hah yeah, i almost never do anything with the cursor but leave it where it is
[01:22:31] <ze> though i'm picking up some of its uses
[01:22:47] <CoJaBo> I almost never do anything with it except reset it to origin 500 times a session
[01:22:56] <ze> in previous versions i just kept moving it by accident and then having to search around for how to undo it
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[01:23:54] <CoJaBo> I had that problem in UT2K4 level editor way back. I accidentally added like 600 nukes just out of bounds
[01:24:15] <ze> i don't even feel like clicking in 3D space is a way i'd ever want to position it, since the perspective can throw that off and it just seems imprecise in general
[01:24:29] <ze> heh
[01:25:02] <CoJaBo> Can confirm, that seems insane to even allow that in the first place lol
[01:25:04] <ze> most of how i do find it useful for so far involves snapping it to things and then snapping other things to it
[01:25:29] <plufz> need to go now. thanks a lot for the help and moral support! I’ll be back! :)
[01:25:33] <ze> s/for//
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[01:25:38] <ze> hehe
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[01:26:48] <CoJaBo> Apparently, even the pros do this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DaHk5gNNxI
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[01:28:27] <ze> i just learned to use the array modifier with a rotational offset using an object offset and rotating the offset object
[01:28:55] <ze> seems weird it only has positional offset parameters and not rotational ones if it'll do rotational offsets with an object like that... why should i need to use an object just to access rotational offsets?
[01:29:52] <ze> CoJaBo: hehe
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[01:30:35] <CoJaBo> I could swear there's a rotational option too..
[01:31:21] <ze> i'm not seeing it in mine
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[01:34:58] <ze> usually "professional" just means either that you're good at meeting a required standard as quickly and cheaply as possible, or you got roped into trying to and constantly stress over the shortcuts and compromises you're forced to take at every turn
[01:35:01] <ze> ;p
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[01:38:43] <ze> fun offscreen graphics
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[01:43:47] <AurorAWOL> Has anyone tried the crowdrender add on? It cut my renders down by over 2/3 :)
[01:46:21] <ze> nope... what is it, distributed processing? does it cost money, or do you contribute cpu time for credits, or what?
[01:47:20] <AurorAWOL> No it's local and free. Kinda like network render just a lot better.
[01:47:49] <ze> oh just for local clustering?
[01:48:29] <AurorAWOL> Yes. They also have a paid cloud option too for remote access.
[01:48:43] <ze> could be cool but i don't really have other machines to help hehe
[01:49:49] <AurorAWOL> Though some big renders I had would take like 30 minutes I had 4 other machines with generic GPU's but awesome processors. With all 5 of them connected I'm getting those same renders in about 4 -5 min
[01:50:02] <ze> sweet
[01:50:32] <ze> does it work cross-platform? i might be able to borrow a windows machine or 2 if they can help my linux one
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[01:50:52] <AurorAWOL> Yes
[01:50:55] <ze> nice
[01:51:06] <ze> be a pain to setup, but could really be worth it for animations
[01:51:08] <ze> hehe
[01:51:11] <AurorAWOL> Setup is super simple.
[01:51:31] <ze> well i just mean even getting on and installing blender on those machines to start with
[01:51:33] <ze> hehe
[01:51:48] <ze> doing anything on windows is painful for me ;p
[01:52:27] <AurorAWOL> That's why I like dividing my attention to multiple os's.
[01:52:38] <AurorAWOL> I mainly use Kali and Arch though
[01:53:31] <ze> i've stuck with gentoo for a long time, after my linux-from-scratch build got stale and tedious :P
[01:54:39] <AurorAWOL> Which is funny cause I have one with Windows 10. 1 with Ubuntu server 1 with Arch and Kali. And one with OSX lol
[01:55:29] <ze> i was stuck with nothing but an old netbook for a while... i put gentoo on it ;P
[01:55:55] <AurorAWOL> Gentoo is decent imo. I recently installed Arch on a laptop and forgot how much of a pain in the butt it was to setup.
[01:56:18] <ze> every distro i've played with or looked at seems awful by default to me :(
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[01:56:49] <ze> it's always the first chore to go through and set up what i like and how i like it
[01:56:51] <ze> heh
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[01:56:54] <AurorAWOL> I agree. Except Kali honestly. Cause its geared solely as a tool
[01:58:34] <ze> haven't used it
[01:59:10] <ze> that one of those self-contained secure crypto distros or something?
[02:00:52] <AurorAWOL> In a way I suppose. It's used for penetration and security
[02:01:17] <ze> ah right
[02:03:09] <AurorAWOL> Well back to making my book lol
[02:04:02] <ze> hehe, well good fortune on that
[02:04:23] <AurorAWOL> http://pasteall.org/pic/c62dddb94fc8df904bd7630b4fdb59d9 it's functional too.
[02:05:21] <ze> cool
[02:06:00] <AurorAWOL> Spine and environment still need work but considering I took a 4 year break from everything I'm surprised how much I retained. Even though everything changed in 2.8
[02:06:16] <ze> hehe
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[02:08:24] <AurorAWOL> Honestly I just now noticed in cycles theres no resoultion option anymore?
[02:08:55] <ze> part of the output properties tab instead of the render settings
[02:09:21] <AurorAWOL> ah lol
[02:10:03] <ze> i think it makes more sense there
[02:10:05] <ze> hehe
[02:10:43] <AurorAWOL> I had seen that and changed it but forgot to put the % up and was scratching my head when they werent coming out as dictated lol
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[02:11:01] <ze> ah hehe
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[02:12:53] <AurorAWOL> Well thanks for the chat. Hope you have a good rest of your day/night
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[02:13:17] <ze> thanks, you too
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[03:34:03] <ze> whoever decided that urls are allowed to be touched by sentence punctuation is wrong
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[03:48:54] <iceburgh>
[03:49:09] <redlizard> Quite right.
[03:49:23] <redlizard> There must be a space between a URL and punctuation.
[03:49:46] * ze nods
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[03:55:59] <ze> so hmm... you could probably put a bunch of cameras each in their own collection, then create as many view layers, and then enable only of those collections for each layer, then creater a render layers node in the compositor for each one, and plug those to file output nodes, and then when you hit f12 all your cameras render their frame, and when you hit ctrl-f12 it'll render out each camera on every frame...
[03:56:01] <ze> i think?
[03:57:50] <ze> this current thing i'm rendering is actually giving me 4 render passes and 2 output files per frame with 1 camera viewing 2 different scenes
[03:57:52] <ze> :P
[03:59:30] <ze> wait hmm maybe that setup wouldn't work, enable/disabling different cameras per view layer via collections doesn't set any of them to be the active camera :(
[04:00:06] <ze> does it?
[04:00:08] <ze> heh
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[04:04:29] <ze> http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=13f5b2b961a772d134f5039ce866c13f
[04:04:52] <ze> the 2 composite nodes don't seem to do any good, only one is active at a time, but i guess they're easy to switch between by clicking if you wanted to do that for some reason
[04:04:54] <ze> :p
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[04:05:16] <ze> and really they're not even seeming to be necessary to actually composite the image and save its output so i'm not sure why i even need them?
[04:05:39] <ze> or one
[04:05:41] <ze> :p
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[06:32:18] <ze> https://i.imgur.com/gvS8e3e.gifv obnoxious demo of my spherical portal from both directions
[06:32:21] <ze> :P
[06:38:44] <ze> which was all rendered in one ctrl+F12
[06:38:48] <ze> hehe
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[06:39:17] <ze> to 2 series of frames, which i concatenated and encoded externally
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[07:03:12] <ze> https://i.imgur.com/ZtcM80q.jpg
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[10:41:38] <blenderguest> Hey. Is there a way to prevent brush radius circle hide while sculpting in blender 2.81, just like it was in blender 2.7x? It's very confusing for me, I feel like I have better control on sculpting in old blender because the radius circle appers and changes depending on pen tablet pressure. Can I make it work the same in new blender?
[10:47:57] <swordsmanz> are any other tutorial producers about ?
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[13:39:47] <MissDjax> hi guys
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[13:41:54] <MissDjax> haven't used Blender in a long while this is why I am a bit confused with the new 2.8* interface. I have issues to display my model with a texture on it like it was in 2.7*. No matter if I am in solid, edit, I can't see my texture on my model. Not sure what I am doing wrong. Any help would be greatly appreciated
[13:48:08] <seseri> upper right in the 3d view, hit the down arrow beside the 4 shading modes, there you can enable texture/material view
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[13:53:01] <day> isn't the button right between "solid view" and "render view"?
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[14:02:45] <MissDjax> it doesn't help unfortunately and I checked there already hmm. https://dl.dropbox.com/s/9opc3c6qtw8sfno/blender_issue.JPG?dl=0
[14:05:50] <seseri> works for me, are you sure the object has a material and a texture?
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[14:09:31] <Sushi> I don't think it's possible unless selecting the material view
[14:11:43] <seseri> MissDjax, http://pasteall.org/pic/show.php?id=bafda40015d94e27e873e37467d7da75
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[14:16:46] <MissDjax> https://dl.dropbox.com/s/btbdobcb0sri8k7/blender_issue2.JPG?dl=0
[14:17:23] <MissDjax> in edit view the UVs are alright, just in case you doubt :)
[14:17:41] <seseri> that does not show any material on the object
[14:18:59] <seseri> or in better words, that texture is probably not assigned to the material, it is just loaded in the texture menu and does nothing
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[14:27:27] <MissDjax> I don't get it, I didn't do anything different than what I did in the past
[14:28:04] <MissDjax> I tried from scratch now with a cube and applying a texture to a created material, still nothing
[14:31:33] <day> o0
[14:31:36] <MissDjax> seseri: this is the simple cube file which should show the texture on the model if you could have a look. Maybe you can tell me what I am exactly missing, in case I do, that would be nice: http://pasteall.org/blend/index.php?id=52897
[14:32:25] <day> MissDjax: it's called "view port shading"
[14:32:31] <day> works flawless for me on linux and windows
[14:34:13] <day> viewport shading -> material preview to be precise
[14:34:26] <seseri> MissDjax, there is no texture attached to the material, the texture menu you are using there is pretty much "useless"
[14:34:53] <seseri> I bet you used blender back when blender internal was the default, that is not how it works anymore
[14:35:41] <day> seseri: the menu should be sufficient to see the effect
[14:36:06] <day> all i did was open a new project, click the cube, texture menu, change base color to something redish
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[14:38:54] <seseri> the material is just plain white, no texture attached, and that is what is displayed there
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[14:41:58] <seseri> MissDjax, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XI-pZshRp8g
[14:42:13] <seseri> a simple tutorial on how to add textures to a material
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[14:47:35] <MissDjax> seseri: hmm ok I seem to understand. In the past you didn't have the shader editor (or at least I never used it). Seems like I need it now to link the texture to the object? If so, too bad it's not done automatically like it was in the past as I basically don't need any special shader, I just need to apply UVs properly with a preview before exporti
[14:47:35] <MissDjax> ng
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[14:54:51] <MissDjax> But good to know that it works like that nowadays, damn this was making me go crazy :D
[14:55:20] <MissDjax> Thanks for the help seseri and day
[14:55:28] <jaggz> in case anyone wants to see some rough animation frames done by a studio to get some insight -- it's not an in-depth lesson but it's neat to see
[14:55:29] <jaggz> https://youtu.be/BlU49dJhfcw?t=122
[14:55:58] <jaggz> (in youtube if you pause you can use , and . to go frame forward/bw)
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[15:08:33] <swordsmanz> any other tutorial producers around yet ?
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[15:13:37] <th160> Is there supposed to be a 2.82 release today?
[15:17:10] <pedja> hopefully, yes :)
[15:17:17] <th160> Excellent
[15:19:13] <pedja> lots of goodies in it. lots of goodies in queue for 2.83, too :)
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[15:21:32] <pedja> Greace Pencil refactor, iirc, is one of the most interesting ones.
[15:26:49] <blenderguest> hopefully they'll fix brush radius circle that disappears while sculpting the mesh
[15:27:15] <blenderguest> I really hope that they didn't make it a 'feature', because it's really bad
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[16:03:10] <pedja> couldn't find that particular bug report.
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[19:20:30] <hmw[at]> Ze I can blender again!
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[19:20:59] <hmw[at]> (actually for the 1st time)
[19:21:07] <hmw[at]> never blendered anything before
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[19:21:24] <hmw[at]> did 3DS4 under DOS rofl
[19:21:25] <ze> grats?
[19:21:27] <ze> hehe
[19:21:29] <ze> hehe
[19:22:14] <hmw[at]> Got the same model notebook in good condition with all kinds of stuff and a fun WinXP carrying thing for 180€
[19:24:09] <ze> cool
[19:25:21] <ze> hmw[at]: in case you want the blend file to go with that car render http://pasteall.org/blend/index.php?id=52900
[19:25:23] <ze> hehe
[19:25:41] <hmw[at]> ah that comes in handy
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[20:48:49] <pclover> so a strange issue with blender.. If i move a armature if object mode and then go to edit mode it resets itself UNLESS i apply it's scale location and rotation
[20:48:57] <pclover> any idea what's going on
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[20:54:47] <vrav> My only thought is if you moved it in pose mode
[20:55:02] <vrav> Oh nvm they left immediately
[20:55:27] <ze> no they didn't ;p
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[20:56:16] <pclover> going to poke around some more and see if i can figure it out
[20:56:24] <pclover> it's just strange
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[21:08:09] <blendster> Hey, I want to ask a question. Is disappearing brush size circle while sculpting a bug or a change in blender?
[21:08:42] <blendster> It seems that it disappears only when using certain brushes or not all the time, but I'm not sure.
[21:10:24] <blendster> I hope it will be fixed, because it's so much harder to figure out whenever I smooth the right area in selective way and I often have to press ctrl+z and then ctrl+y to see the changes.
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[21:27:26] <ze> sometimes when i click on the physics tab for something, it just looks blank, but then if i move the scroll wheel up the options will suddenly show up or scroll out or whatever
[21:27:28] <ze> heh
[21:27:39] <blendster> ehh
[21:28:26] <blendster> the circle radius is showing when sculpting with clay strips and crease brush, but it disappears with the others : (
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[21:40:22] <ze> blendster: look around in the various options and settings in and next to the mode's menu bar, seems like there's something that shows/hides that that might be set differently by default in different contexts/brushes
[21:40:37] <ze> not sure though, i haven't used any of that much
[21:40:52] <ze> but seems like maybe i did bump into something there once :P
[21:40:57] <blendster> I've already checked all the options, there's no such options or it's broken for most od the brushes
[21:41:13] <blendster> of*
[21:44:14] <pedja> with factory reset on 2.82?
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[21:44:38] <blendster> I didn't change any options
[21:44:56] <blendster> It's like that whenever I open new file
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[22:06:29] <ze> after watching a tut, i feel a bit confused by "liquid" particles and mesh in mantaflow... i get the sense the particles (the liquid ones, not the extra spray/foam/bubble ones) are generated as part of how the fluid sim works, and then the mesh gets optionally generated from that
[22:06:47] <ze> but this tutorial basically set them both up to render and it seemed weird
[22:07:30] <ze> i suspect it's the sorta thing, if you want to render it like a granular fluid like sand, maybe you'd do that by just rendering it as particles and not necessarily bothering to enable the mesh?
[22:08:11] <ze> but then if you want it to be a liquid you can make the mesh and not necessarily have to render the particles?
[22:08:45] <ze> like being able to set them both up like that affords some artistic freedom but probably isn't what you'd be looking for by default
[22:09:45] <ze> i think? :p
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[23:13:17] <ze> hmm i can't seem to get a volume shader to work on a fluid... i'm applying the material to the domain, since that seems to be what renders the mesh, and a surface shader works fine, but as soon as i plug a volume shader in it just disappears completely (surface too!), unless i set the density to 0 and then the surface'll show back up
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[23:43:10] <gripner> hummm, how can you see what images blever is trying to load as textures for example for shaders
[23:50:54] <ze> look at the path in the image node being used to feed the texture to it?
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[23:54:47] <gripner> my entire scene with 20+ objects, all with textures/shaders are all pink
[23:54:58] <gripner> but out of 20+ png files only 2 is missing................
[23:55:30] <ze> try the 'find missing files' thing in the file menu?
[23:55:54] <gripner> thats what i did
[23:55:58] <ze> ah
[23:56:09] <gripner> and the 24ish objects who each have one of the 24ish textures ONLY 2 is missing
[23:56:18] <gripner> so dont see why ALL objects are pink
[23:56:35] <ze> hmm
[23:56:51] <ze> sounds weird unless they're some kinda base that the rest use somehow :p
[23:58:14] <gripner> actualy whole render viewport gets pink...............
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   February 13, 2020  
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