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[01:55:21] <johnament> grrrrr weld
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[14:47:58] <jbossbot> git [university] push master 007af14.. Shane Bryzak implemented most of the server-side support for file uploads
[14:47:59] <jbossbot> git [university] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/university/compare/5a0c024...007af14
[14:48:56] <jbossbot> git [social] push develop 74429a1.. Antoine Sabot-Durand Comment & formatting
[14:48:56] <jbossbot> git [social] push develop 8579a96.. Antoine Sabot-Durand Refactoring to prepare the addition of models object in social services
[14:48:56] <jbossbot> git [social] push develop 6aaac39.. Antoine Sabot-Durand Added support of JAXB implementation for JBoss AS7
[14:48:56] <jbossbot> git [social] push develop URL: http://github.com/seam/social/compare/91db580...6aaac39
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[15:09:53] <gastaldi> morning all !
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[15:10:18] <Guest99857> shit...
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[15:12:43] <gegastaldi> IRC Question: How do I reclaim my nick if I failed to authenticate the first time ? :P
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[15:35:32] <emmanuel> gegastaldi: slash nickserv ghost username then slash nick username
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[15:43:29] <gegastaldi> emmanuel: Thanks, already tried that but no luck :(
[15:43:49] 
[15:44:04] <emmanuel> define no luck?
[15:44:10] <gegastaldi> The damn NickServ says: gastaldi Nick/channel is temporarily unavailable
[15:44:20] <emmanuel> ah
[15:44:26] <emmanuel> I don't know about that error
[15:44:38] <gegastaldi> yeah me too :P
[15:44:55] <emmanuel> you can ask the freenode gods
[15:45:01] <emmanuel> they hang out somwhere
[15:45:06] <emmanuel> and are usually helpful
[15:45:14] <emmanuel> gods=admin or moderator
[15:45:14] <gegastaldi> good idea
[15:45:26] 
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[15:47:23] <gastaldi> yaay ! :)
[15:47:28] <gastaldi> Thanks emmanuel
[15:47:42] <gastaldi> I had to /msg NickServ release
[15:48:41] <gastaldi> hey lincolnthree !
[16:02:26] <lincolnthree> hey gastaldi
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[16:03:14] 
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[16:06:15] <gastaldi> is there any JIRA admin in here ?
[16:06:35] <gastaldi> It would be nice to have this plugin installed/enabled: https://studio.plugins.atlassian.com/wiki/display/JGIT/JIRA+Git+Plugin
[16:06:48] <lincolnthree> I'm not
[16:06:49] <lincolnthree> Wish I were
[16:06:51] <lincolnthree> I need one myself
[16:07:19] <gastaldi> yeah, we are mere mortals
[16:08:24] <gastaldi> Ha ! Now I figured it out the true meaning of "Arquillian" name to the framework
[16:08:29] <lincolnthree> :-p
[16:08:32] <lincolnthree> squash the bugs!
[16:08:40] <gastaldi> Yeah !!!
[16:08:41] <gastaldi> hahaha
[16:09:22] 
[16:09:26] <jbossbot> git [social] push develop 5e69dda.. Antoine Sabot-Durand Change import section to correct compilation error
[16:09:26] <jbossbot> git [social] push develop URL: http://github.com/seam/social/compare/6aaac39...5e69dda
[16:09:40] <gastaldi> Excellent name
[16:09:51] <lincolnthree> Ps. For those who haven't seen it: http://vimeo.com/26128736
[16:09:59] <lincolnthree> Turn up the bass.
[16:10:28] <gastaldi> ah ! Cool !
[16:10:35] <gastaldi> Finally :)
[16:11:48] <lincolnthree> :)
[16:11:50] <lincolnthree> Zap
[16:11:54] <lincolnthree> zap zap zapzapzap
[16:14:24] <gastaldi> It would be nice to add some glassfishes being zapped
[16:14:36] <lincolnthree> that would just be mean
[16:14:40] <gastaldi> :)
[16:15:59] <gastaldi> There is a new era: B.J (Before JBoss AS7) and A.J (After JBoss AS7)
[16:16:17] <gastaldi> I saw that in a tweet and found it awesome :)
[16:17:26] <gastaldi> lincolnthree: I want Forge final to be released ASAP, what should be worked to make that happen ?
[16:17:35] <lincolnthree> gastaldi: :)
[16:17:35] <lincolnthree> well
[16:17:45] <lincolnthree> let me see
[16:17:56] <gastaldi> I mean, which blocker issues are holding it
[16:18:05] <gastaldi> We must squash them
[16:18:14] <gastaldi> With Arquillian weaponry
[16:18:24] <lincolnthree> we need jboss modules integration
[16:18:32] <lincolnthree> gotta be able to do modular classloading of plugins and plugin dependencies
[16:18:41] 
[16:18:58] <lincolnthree> I really haven't started yet, but it's basically the only big thing left between now and final
[16:19:05] <gastaldi> We could have a Forge Hack night to make that happen
[16:19:10] <lincolnthree> the rest is dialogue
[16:19:10] <gastaldi> WDYT ?
[16:19:19] <lincolnthree> well... it's really a complicated issue
[16:19:34] <lincolnthree> we could have a forge hack night to work on smaller issues
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[16:19:44] <lincolnthree> im thinking modules will take 1 person about a week or 2 to get working
[16:19:51] <lincolnthree> I was planning on starting today
[16:19:57] <gastaldi> wow
[16:20:08] 
[16:20:30] <lincolnthree> basically, except JBM doesn't work unless you boot the entire application with JBM from the start
[16:20:36] <gastaldi> oh
[16:20:40] <lincolnthree> the plugin repo needs work too
[16:20:49] <lincolnthree> and the scaffolding
[16:20:56] <gastaldi> So, we need to make Weld a module too
[16:21:18] <gastaldi> What about embedding Forge on AS7 ?
[16:21:34] <gastaldi> AS7 as the runtime for Forge
[16:21:37] <lincolnthree> gastaldi: thought about that actually
[16:21:40] <lincolnthree> it's a possibility
[16:21:51] <gastaldi> Imagine how cool would that be
[16:22:01] <lincolnthree> you wanna give that a shot? :)
[16:22:09] <gastaldi> If I had time, I would :)
[16:22:38] <gastaldi> Unfortunately I can only see that after-hours :P
[16:23:16] <lincolnthree> yeah
[16:24:16] <lincolnthree> actually embedding forge in AS7 also opens up the ability to deploy instantly ;)
[16:24:16] <gastaldi> If AS7 were the default runtime for Forge, you could run an app without even leaving the console app ! :)
[16:24:20] <gastaldi> Yeah !
[16:24:23] <lincolnthree> but AS7 is big
[16:24:31] <lincolnthree> it would increase the DL size by 300%
[16:24:36] <gastaldi> hum
[16:25:08] <gastaldi> Forge could come bundled with AS7
[16:25:21] <lincolnthree> that would increase AS7 dl size by 33% ;)
[16:25:22] <lincolnthree> hehe
[16:25:25] <gastaldi> hehe
[16:25:55] <gastaldi> We need to think a little bit more about it
[16:25:59] <lincolnthree> God, I can't keep up with Google+
[16:26:04] <lincolnthree> It's too much
[16:26:14] <gastaldi> Yeah, I ignored that crap for now :)
[16:26:18] <lincolnthree> Yeah...
[16:26:34] 
[16:26:43] <gastaldi> We could discuss that
[16:27:03] <lincolnthree> I will be there
[16:27:14] <lincolnthree> But the right solution is to use JBM in forge
[16:27:23] <lincolnthree> :)
[16:27:25] <gastaldi> yeah
[16:28:17] <gastaldi> There is also an issue when tabbing sub folders in Forge
[16:28:50] <lincolnthree> on windows?
[16:28:58] <gastaldi> I tested only on windows
[16:29:00] <lincolnthree> yeah
[16:29:12] <lincolnthree> the path completion on windows is screwy for some reason
[16:29:24] <lincolnthree> that would be nice to fix before final :)
[16:29:27] <gastaldi> crappy OS
[16:29:40] <gastaldi> for sure
[16:30:18] 
[16:31:00] <gastaldi> gotta work now ! see ya ! :)
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[16:39:33] <jose_freitas> stuartdouglas: ping
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[18:50:10] <johnament> bleathem: ping
[18:52:57] <bleathem> johnament: pong
[18:54:01] <bleathem> johnament: pong
[18:54:04] <bleathem> oops
[18:56:56] <johnament> bleathem: as7 is missing jms :/
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[19:03:10] <jose_freitas> missing jms?
[19:03:16] <jose_freitas> =o
[19:05:09] <bleathem> who uses JMS anyway :P
[19:05:44] <jose_freitas> lol
[19:06:45] <gastaldi> haha
[19:07:26] 
[19:08:15] <jose_freitas> I thought it was
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[19:08:29] <bleathem> I wonder if John was looking at the web profile
[19:09:40] 
[19:09:48] <gastaldi> http://www.jboss.org/jbossas/downloads
[19:15:14] <gastaldi> hum
[19:15:28] <gastaldi> I wonder if the modules from AS7 can be gathered from a Maven repository
[19:15:59] <gastaldi> Like, using Maven to fetch the necessary modules instead of needing to package them in the modules dir
[19:17:14] <gastaldi> hum, it just uses JBoss Modules to startup
[19:17:34] <gastaldi> Using maven would f*** the performance
[19:19:41] <jamezp> gastaldi: We also can't assume all AS7 installs are running a server that has a connection to the internet.
[19:19:53] <jamezp> gastaldi: Plus yes, that would kill our performance :-)
[19:20:06] <cbrock> whoo... Errai now has first-class support for qualifiers and producers -- in the browser!
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[19:20:22] <gastaldi> jamezp: My concern is the need to install modules
[19:20:35] <gastaldi> jamezp: The embedded Maven could run in offline mode
[19:20:48] <gastaldi> by default
[19:22:22] <jamezp> gastaldi: Have you read this https://docs.jboss.org/author/display/AS7/Class+Loading+in+AS7?
[19:23:00] <jamezp> It's a good look on how the class loading works.
[19:24:06] 
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[19:24:27] <gastaldi> mbg: You there ?
[19:24:54] <bleathem> cbrock: Nice! - Errai is sounding really compelling these days!
[19:25:17] <mbg> gastaldi: me here
[19:25:39] <cbrock> bleathem: really thinking that Errai's code-generation based container could have an application with regular CDI, potentially
[19:25:48] <gastaldi> I was checking out http://community.jboss.org/blogs/mariusb/2011/07/13/spring-and-jboss-as7-part-1-getting-started
[19:25:49] <bleathem> who's mbg? that's not very many letters to identify you by...
[19:25:55] 
[19:26:00] <gastaldi> marius ?
[19:26:15] <bleathem> ah, that makes sense
[19:26:18] <mbg> gastaldi: yes.
[19:26:40] <gastaldi> The article mentions a file named "jboss-dependency-structure.xml"
[19:26:43] <mbg> bleathem: unfortunately, if pidgin had more sense, it could display my real name
[19:26:55] 
[19:26:55] <bleathem> cbrock: how so? what benefit does it provide?
[19:27:06] <mbg> gastaldi: crap.
[19:27:08] <gastaldi> Check the link jamezp provided
[19:27:08] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: /who mbg or /msg NickServ info mbg
[19:27:20] <bleathem> mbg: no worries, now I know (and knowing is half the battle!)
[19:27:33] <cbrock> bleathem: well, Errai's CDI container basically works by sucking in the CDI metadata, and then emitting a bootstrap class to wire the application. So there's no runtime component to the container: https://raw.github.com/gist/1080810/82bd2314837637db6edc9ab6d8d74bd587ab452c/gistfile1.java
[19:27:39] <mbg> yeah if pidgin had some sense, it would list my real name
[19:27:45] <cbrock> bleathem: it's CDI as a precompiler, rather than a runtime container.
[19:27:54] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: thanks
[19:27:54] <mbg> but for some reason Real Name is 'purple'
[19:28:23] <mbg> gastaldi: the github link shows the correct file.
[19:28:49] <bleathem> cbrock: would certainly improve deploy time performance, and probably the memory footprint
[19:28:58] <mbg> gastaldi: thanks for reading it, btw!
[19:29:02] <bleathem> cbrock: but then all your CDI jars would have to be present at compile time
[19:29:18] 
[19:29:37] <gastaldi> not on the file
[19:29:39] <bleathem> cbrock: not a bad thing if it would give a significant performance boost
[19:29:40] <gastaldi> The name of the file
[19:29:54] <mbg> gastaldi: what typo? check again in 5 minutes. I'll add a correction and an errata.
[19:30:08] <gastaldi> mbg: The article mentions "jboss-dependency-structure.xml" and should be "jboss-deployment-structure.xml"
[19:30:14] <mbg> gastaldi: the question was in jest :)
[19:30:31] <mbg> thanks for letting me know, I just meant that I am fixing it ASAP
[19:30:35] <gastaldi> Cool
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[19:32:23] <gastaldi> mbg: You should use one of the sarcasm emoticons as lincolnthree does when in jest :D
[19:32:53] <mbg> gastaldi: I am specializing in deadpan humour
[19:32:57] <gastaldi> hehe
[19:33:39] <mbg> or, like Sheldon Cooper of The Big Bang Theory fame, "I am getting better at sarcasm" ;)
[19:33:46] <gastaldi> haha
[19:36:18] 
[19:36:33] <gastaldi> :)
[19:36:52] <gastaldi> Congrats on that article again btw
[19:37:21] <mbg> gastadi: oh thanks :)
[19:37:40] <gastaldi> I wonder if we should have a Seam Spring module :)
[19:38:07] <mbg> gastaldi: I'll start on that one in the next days ...
[19:38:20] <gastaldi> cool
[19:38:58] <gastaldi> You can count on me to that also
[19:39:14] <mbg> gastaldi: excellent!
[19:40:01] <gastaldi> I am starting to think that I should get a medal on "Top modules envolvment" :D
[19:40:25] 
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[19:41:05] <gastaldi> involvement
[19:41:13] <mbg> gastaldi: we should use a sash. much classier.
[19:41:29] <gastaldi> haha like scouts do
[19:42:10] <gastaldi> jose_freitas: Btw, congratulations on your slides
[19:42:44] <gastaldi> Only after reading it I realized that Arquillian meant to "squash the bugs" like in MiB
[19:42:52] <jose_freitas> hehehe
[19:42:55] <jose_freitas> cool huh?
[19:43:00] <jose_freitas> I made as simple as possible
[19:43:26] <jose_freitas> people absorbs only 20% of what you present on a slide
[19:43:40] <jose_freitas> slide presentation I mean
[19:45:07] <gastaldi> very cool
[19:45:23] <gastaldi> The demo picture was a blast ! :)
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[19:46:52] <jose_freitas> funnier in portuguese I guess
[19:47:02] <gastaldi> Of course
[19:47:27] <gastaldi> ou you could append an "N" to the end
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[19:54:14] <bleathem1> Tried switching from Empathy IRC client to Pidgin
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[19:54:55] <jose_freitas> gastaldi: true :)
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[20:06:19] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: You should be able to edit now.
[20:09:42] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: thanks
[20:10:04] <bleathem> wow, pidgin is a way better IRC client than Empathy. Thanks for the unintended recommendation mbg!
[20:10:27] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: so am I like a super-admin now?
[20:11:02] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: guest / member / admin is all that's there in sfwk
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[20:47:08] <antoine_sd> hi gastaldi
[20:48:26] <gastaldi> hey antoine_sd
[20:50:35] <antoine_sd> I vote +1 for Seam Spring module
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[21:11:04] <mbg> antoine_sd: thx ;)
[21:12:27] <antoine_sd> I think it's a good choice to have it as a module and not only in Snowdrop
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[21:13:51] <antoine_sd> mbg : I made a few tests with Rick Hightower cdi-spring bridge. It could be a good example or start point...
[21:16:44] <mbg> antoine_sd: for sure. I also want to bring in an older prototype that I've been working on the side
[21:17:15] <mbg> unfortunately, more pressing matters always took precedence
[21:20:06] <jose_freitas> hey gastaldi, are you coming tomorrow/
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[22:06:02] 
[22:06:35] <gastaldi> Got extremely busy lately
[22:06:38] <gastaldi> :P
[22:06:44] <jose_freitas> heheh
[22:06:46] <jose_freitas> ok
[22:06:55] <gastaldi> Working 11 hours /day
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[22:17:59] <antoine_sd> gastaldi : too much Seam modules to deal with
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[22:19:17] <gastaldi> :)
[22:21:05] <gastaldi> I wish I could work all day long with Seam Modules
[22:21:11] 
[22:23:25] <gastaldi> antoine_sd: What a non-french speaker must know to avoid any issues in Paris ?
[22:24:45] <antoine_sd> stay away from french people ?
[22:25:00] <antoine_sd> seriously, you're coming to Paris ?
[22:25:02] <gastaldi> haha
[22:25:03] <gastaldi> Yes
[22:25:06] <gastaldi> In September
[22:25:21] <gastaldi> Honeymoon time
[22:25:41] <antoine_sd> Congrats
[22:25:46] <gastaldi> Thanks !
[22:26:43] <antoine_sd> I guess it could be hard to put in your schedule but I'd love to meet you at the occasion
[22:27:10] <gastaldi> That would be cool
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[22:29:39] <antoine_sd> ok, you'll tell me when you come exactly and I can invite you and your wife for a dinner or something like that.
[22:32:45] *** jamezp_afk is now known as jamezp
[22:32:55] 
[22:34:13] <antoine_sd> gastaldi: I didn't find you on Google+ you're in a "resistance" organization or something like that ?
[22:34:25] <gastaldi> haha wait
[22:35:37] <jose_freitas> antoine_sd: are you from paris?
[22:36:30] <antoine_sd> yes. I was born in Paris and I live in the suburbs approx 1 miles from Paris now.
[22:37:35] <jose_freitas> nice :)
[22:37:44] <jose_freitas> I had some friends from french
[22:37:49] <gastaldi> nice
[22:37:54] <antoine_sd> you're also looking for a trip jose_freitas ?
[22:37:59] <gastaldi> I have one that lives in Paris also
[22:38:02] <jose_freitas> they used to say that people from paris are not really nice
[22:38:13] <jose_freitas> I guess that they might be wrong
[22:38:16] <jose_freitas> :)
[22:38:28] <jose_freitas> no, not for now antoine_sd
[22:38:30] <jose_freitas> :)
[22:38:39] <gastaldi> Wonder what would happen if I speak in english in there :)
[22:38:44] <gastaldi> Or Portuguese :)
[22:38:58] <antoine_sd> Yeah, it's true but there are also nice people
[22:39:10] <gastaldi> I was told French people hate English
[22:39:17] <gastaldi> is that true ?
[22:39:21] <antoine_sd> Speak english and you'll be charged twice
[22:39:26] <gastaldi> hahaha
[22:39:30] <gastaldi> Thanks for the tip
[22:39:56] <antoine_sd> by english you mean the language ?
[22:40:05] <gastaldi> Yes
[22:40:07] <gastaldi> Merci pour le tuyau
[22:40:12] <antoine_sd> de rien
[22:40:37] <gastaldi> God bless Google Translate !
[22:41:02] <antoine_sd> French don't hate english, they don't know how to be its friend.
[22:41:22] <antoine_sd> English teaching is very bad in France
[22:41:53] <antoine_sd> I learned it with Role Playing games and Text adventure video games
[22:41:58] <antoine_sd> but not at school
[22:42:03] <gastaldi> wow
[22:42:18] <gastaldi> I need some french classes
[22:42:42] <antoine_sd> French is a very difficult language
[22:42:48] <gastaldi> I think that paying twice will be unavoidable :)
[22:42:53] <antoine_sd> with a lot of strange things
[22:43:21] <antoine_sd> no if you speak it would be better
[22:43:40] <antoine_sd> There are a lot of potugueese in Paris
[22:43:47] <gastaldi> ah really ?
[22:43:49] 
[22:43:56] 
[22:44:16] <gastaldi> Here in Brazil we love to create jokes about them
[22:44:37] <antoine_sd> One of my best friend is portuguese
[22:45:31] <antoine_sd> that's not very nice : you stole their language and now you make fun of them. Naughty !
[22:45:48] <gastaldi> Ha ! They stole our gold and our resources :)
[22:46:07] <gastaldi> :)
[22:46:53] <antoine_sd> yeah but that didn't prevent hem from bankruptcy...
[22:47:07] <gastaldi> hehe
[22:47:53] <antoine_sd> Anyway, it would be nice to meet in september
[22:48:30] 
[22:49:05] <antoine_sd> it's Bastille day tomorrow
[22:49:25] <antoine_sd> There are a lot of fireworks in Paris sky tonight
[22:49:45] 
[22:50:49] 
[22:51:21] <gastaldi> antoine_sd: Have you met emmanuel in there ?
[22:51:29] <gastaldi> I think he is French also
[22:52:29] <antoine_sd> yes I meet emmanuel from time to time in ParisJug
[22:53:02] <antoine_sd> and Antonio Goncalves also : Java Champion and Java EE 6 warrior ;-)
[22:53:14] 
[22:53:46] <gastaldi> haha Obrigado
[22:54:27] 
[22:54:47] <lightguard_jp> Going to wait for Ken to get here
[22:54:53] <lightguard_jp> He said he'll be a little late
[22:54:58] <lightguard_jp> If that's okay with people
[22:55:02] <gastaldi> Ah ok
[22:55:02] <gastaldi> mojavelinux is missing also
[22:55:49] <lightguard_jp> He's at a conference
[22:55:58] <gastaldi> ah yeah, uber something
[22:56:10] <gastaldi> I saw his tweets
[22:56:22] <lightguard_jp> Yep
[22:56:37] <gastaldi> lightguard_jp: My Google Calendar shows that the Seam Hack is scheduled for today also
[22:56:41] 
[22:56:52] <sbryzak> my fingers are freezing off...
[22:57:02] <gastaldi> haha welcome sbryzak !
[22:57:18] <gastaldi> sbryzak: Try building an igloo
[22:57:39] <gastaldi> That is supposed to keep warm in these temperatures
[22:57:55] <sbryzak> i'll look into it
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[22:58:03] <gastaldi> :) And you got no roof to care about
[22:58:12] <kenfinnigan> hey all
[22:58:17] <lincolnthree1> hey kenfinnigan
[22:58:20] <lightguard_jp> Hey ken
[22:58:23] <gastaldi> hey kenfinnigan !
[22:58:37] <antoine_sd> hi all
[22:59:06] <antoine_sd> In Paris we're celebrating JBoss AS7 release tonight
[23:00:06] <antoine_sd> Fireworks and music everywhere
[23:00:16] <sbryzak> i wonder how many people have downloaded it so far
[23:00:19] <sbryzak> i should check
[23:00:44] <sbryzak> ah, we're not hosting it on sourceforge
[23:00:52] 
[23:01:01] <gastaldi> :)
[23:01:36] <gastaldi> cool, so are we all set ?
[23:01:38] <sbryzak> not really.. download speed is 30kb/s
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[23:01:56] <sbryzak> i think we need some bigger pipes
[23:02:01] <gastaldi> agreed
[23:02:08] <gastaldi> #agreed
[23:02:14] <lightguard_jp> Hang on, can't type well with a 3 month old on my lap
[23:02:18] <sbryzak> lightguard_jp: let's get this party started
[23:02:20] <gastaldi> hehehe
[23:02:29] <kenfinnigan> lightguard_jp: lol
[23:04:10] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: what's this video all about? The thread you refer to was before my time I think...
[23:04:15] <sbryzak> i'm wearing my headphones just to keep my ears warm
[23:06:45] <gastaldi> lightguard_jp: Anyone missing ?
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[23:09:06] <kenfinnigan> we getting this show on the road?
[23:09:45] <gastaldi> hope so
[23:09:51] * gastaldi pokes lightguard_jp
[23:10:12] <lightguard_jp> Okay, let me pull up the agenda
[23:10:15] <lightguard_jp> Sorry everyone
[23:10:50] <lightguard_jp> #startmeeting
[23:10:50] <jbott> Meeting started Wed Jul 13 21:14:55 2011 UTC.  The chair is lightguard_jp. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
[23:10:50] <jbott> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
[23:10:59] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o lightguard_jp
[23:11:03] *** lightguard_jp sets mode: +o jbott
[23:11:09] <lightguard_jp> #chair sbryzak
[23:11:09] <jbott> Current chairs: lightguard_jp sbryzak
[23:11:23] <lightguard_jp> #topic Action Item Follow-up
[23:11:23] *** jbott changes topic to "Action Item Follow-up"
[23:11:45] <lightguard_jp> Welcome everyone!
[23:12:04] <lightguard_jp> The only action item from last week was the calendar update, which has been done.
[23:12:24] <lightguard_jp> Other updates and general news include getting all modules setup on Git Flow, which was done on Monday
[23:12:34] <lightguard_jp> #info Other updates and general news include getting all modules setup on Git Flow, which was done on Monday
[23:12:36] <lightguard_jp> Thanks gastaldi
[23:12:42] <gastaldi> Nop
[23:12:55] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: Were you able to update the pages on sfwk?
[23:14:04] <gastaldi> hum, I think he is away
[23:14:20] <bleathem> oh
[23:14:21] <bleathem> meeting
[23:14:23] <bleathem> forgot :P
[23:14:35] <gastaldi> :)
[23:14:41] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: not yet
[23:14:49] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: I've reviewed the git-flow stuff
[23:14:58] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: and I don't think it will be a big deal to add it
[23:15:26] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: Okay, cool. Shall we keep that with you for the next week?
[23:15:26] <bleathem> unless anyone else feels like doing it ??
[23:15:55] <bleathem> sure, but if someone else wants to volunteer for it, they are by no means stepping on toes
[23:16:03] <bleathem> ;)
[23:16:17] <lightguard_jp> #info We'll leave the contribution updates with bleathem unless someone feels ambitious and gets to it first
[23:16:33] <lightguard_jp> aslak: Are you here?
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[23:17:37] <aslak> lightguard_jp, yes
[23:17:49] <lightguard_jp> Okay, let's talk about testing then :)
[23:18:00] <lightguard_jp> #topic Testing discussions
[23:18:00] *** jbott changes topic to "Testing discussions"
[23:18:25] <lightguard_jp> I think I'll let kenfinnigan and aslak talk about this one
[23:18:33] <lightguard_jp> Too bad John isn't here.
[23:18:53] <kenfinnigan> for those that have been keeping up with the mail thread on testing
[23:19:09] <kenfinnigan> we're looking at changing the structure of the modules for container testing
[23:19:12] <lightguard_jp> We're looking at ideas for targeting containers and possibly different types of testing (smoke, integration, unit, etc) for module testing
[23:19:23] <lightguard_jp> what kenfinnigan said :)
[23:19:27] <gastaldi> hum, right
[23:19:53] <lightguard_jp> kenfinnigan: Just going to copy your statement with #info so it's in the minutes
[23:19:54] <kenfinnigan> with a view to having a separate module for each container for each type of testing (ie. smoke, integration)
[23:19:55] <lightguard_jp> #info we're looking at changing the structure of the modules for container testing
[23:20:02] <kenfinnigan> np
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[23:20:47] <gastaldi> hummm cool
[23:21:15] 
[23:21:39] <lightguard_jp> Part of this is because there may be changes needed based on the container
[23:21:40] <kenfinnigan> aslak: can you run a test with different types of containers and using the @TargetContainer to differentiate which tests run in which container?
[23:21:44] <lightguard_jp> e.g. weld vs owb
[23:21:50] <kenfinnigan> or is it only multiple containers of the same type?
[23:22:05] <lightguard_jp> So there could be a base, then container specific tests that are only for a particular container
[23:22:26] <kenfinnigan> or if there is no container specificity required then the version in the base would be run
[23:22:30] <jose_freitas> which tests would be container specific?
[23:22:40] <lightguard_jp> jose_freitas: That all depends on the module.
[23:22:47] <gastaldi> humm
[23:23:00] <aslak> kenfinnigan, that was a possible usecase in the original design, but the support for a dependencies section has been removed from configuration impl for now, due to classloading issues.
[23:23:09] <lightguard_jp> jose_freitas: In catch I'm testing for a deployment exception, but those aren't specified by the CDI spec, so I have to change it based on the container I'm running in.
[23:23:21] <kenfinnigan> aslak: ok
[23:23:33] <lightguard_jp> aslak: So currently, we can't do this with arquillian.xml?
[23:23:54] <aslak> kenfinnigan, currently only managed and remote containers are supported, embedded got to messy
[23:24:14] <kenfinnigan> does that include weld embedded?
[23:24:24] <aslak> kenfinnigan, in theory you can configure different managed/remote container types in the same config as long as their API / impl requirements clash
[23:24:57] <aslak> as long as they don't clash that is
[23:25:03] <lightguard_jp> aslak: So can we deploy to a remote AS7 and a remote AS6 by defining them in the arquillian.xml or would that also require a maven profile / dep section?
[23:25:23] <aslak> e.g. GlassFish Remote and JBoss AS 7 remote 'should' work, since they are both Rest based and have a minimal client lib
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[23:26:21] <aslak> lightguard_jp, not sure about as6 and 7, you might run into JBoss Remote version issues
[23:26:49] <aslak> lightguard_jp, but yea, they still need a Maven Profile to split the deps out from the rest, but you would have as6 and 7 in the same profile
[23:26:54] <kenfinnigan> aslak: so at the moment it's recommended to keep arquillian containers separate, either through profiles or separate modules?
[23:26:57] <lightguard_jp> aslak: The answer then is "maybe, but using maven profiles / modules is probably safer"?
[23:27:14] <kenfinnigan> lightguard_jp: jinx
[23:27:24] * lightguard_jp muffles something
[23:28:05] <aslak> lightguard_jp, correct
[23:28:21] <aslak> kenfinnigan, correct
[23:28:29] <kenfinnigan> ok, so the question is whether we think profiles or modules are a better way to separate the test containers
[23:28:46] <aslak> we're revisiting this for next version, possible using JBoss Modules on client side
[23:28:52] <lightguard_jp> Okay. I'd like to put forward the idea of using modules instead of strictly profiles to ease the jenkins matrix for testing.
[23:28:52] <kenfinnigan> I lean towards modules, after lightguard_jp provided some good reasons
[23:29:13] <aslak> kenfinnigan, then issue with profiles is that you can't get maven to run all profiles
[23:29:28] <aslak> (or atleast not a way i've found)
[23:29:31] <lightguard_jp> We can run the whole suite with one job instead of one per container.
[23:29:35] <kenfinnigan> aslak: exactly, which was one of lightguard_jp reasons, that I now agree with
[23:29:44] <lightguard_jp> Yeah, this one is mostly a work around for maven's profiles.
[23:30:21] <aslak> lightguard_jp, i was findling with multiple surefire configuration etc today, but the whole thing is a bit odd, or i'm missing something
[23:30:29] <kenfinnigan> lightguard_jp and I have been doing a lot of talking, what are everyone else's opinions of profile vs module?
[23:30:43] <kenfinnigan> I know Jozef was against modules and preferred profiles
[23:30:44] <lightguard_jp> Persistence is setup similarly as well.
[23:30:48] 
[23:31:05] <lightguard_jp> aslak: No, surefire configuration is odd, and I've found buggy at best
[23:31:09] <bleathem> +1 for modules
[23:31:12] <aslak> you can bind surefire to a alternative phase/goal, so you can have 2 surefire runs.. but only 2 it seems, one being default and one being the one you have defined, else it will complain about the same plugin configured multiple times
[23:31:32] <gastaldi> aslak: What about creating a jboss-surefire plugin ?
[23:31:43] <gastaldi> And use JBoss Modules underneath ?
[23:31:50] <aslak> gastaldi, it exists.. :)
[23:31:53] <gastaldi> ah
[23:32:02] <aslak> as a Kabir fork atleast..
[23:32:09] <PeteRoyle> So would modules be used to run the same set of tests against multiple containers?
[23:32:16] <aslak> that's how we had as7 embedded running to begin with
[23:32:18] <kenfinnigan> PeteRoyle: correct
[23:32:35] <PeteRoyle> ie: one module containing the common tests, and other modules containing container-specific test setup?
[23:32:41] <lightguard_jp> Yep
[23:32:43] <kenfinnigan> with whatever tweaking was required for some tests on a container by container basis
[23:32:47] <PeteRoyle> is that possible?
[23:32:54] <lightguard_jp> The the container would also run the common tests for that container
[23:33:04] <kenfinnigan> seam persistence has a similar setup now
[23:33:11] <aslak> PeteRoyle, well, modules would allow for a clean seperation between the containers classpath, so in the end allowing for multiple different containers to run in the same vm but used differently
[23:33:28] <PeteRoyle> OK I need to check that out cos I was trying to do that witch Cron as one stage an couldn't
[23:33:44] <lightguard_jp> PeteRoyle: Using the test jar idea?
[23:34:01] <aslak> of course we will probably run into 100 other issues then just pure ClassLoading but, that's atleast the first hinder
[23:34:15] <PeteRoyle> I couldn't get Mavem to run tests that were specified in a nother module without subclassing each test in the container-specific-module
[23:34:22] <PeteRoyle> liyeah
[23:34:26] <kenfinnigan> PeteRoyle: I believe the trick is that the tests in the common module are actually in the src/main area of the module
[23:34:26] <PeteRoyle> lightguard_jp: yep
[23:34:47] <PeteRoyle> kenfinnigan: ah ok.
[23:34:50] <lightguard_jp> PeteRoyle: Hrm, we may need some further research into that one then. Subclassing each test would be a PITA
[23:34:59] <aslak> PeteRoyle, you'll need to copy-dependency the test jar end extract it to some folder, then setup a surefire config to use that output as it's testClassOutputFolder
[23:35:35] <PeteRoyle> ok so looks like there are others who've got the solution all sussed out :)
[23:35:38] <PeteRoyle> that's cool
[23:35:41] <kenfinnigan> I should be finding out whether the subclassing approach will work tonight when I continue on making the testsuite changes to i18n
[23:35:51] <kenfinnigan> but shouldn't be an issue
[23:36:05] <lightguard_jp> I'd prefer not to have to subclass if we can help it.
[23:36:10] <kenfinnigan> me too
[23:36:14] <PeteRoyle> lightguard_jp: +1
[23:36:16] <lightguard_jp> Using the test jar would be a much better approach
[23:36:36] <aslak> PeteRoyle, https://gist.github.com/1081397
[23:36:42] <kenfinnigan> not sure I've heard of the test jar approach.  what is it?
[23:37:14] <lightguard_jp> kenfinnigan: Aslak mentioned it a few lines up
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[23:37:28] <lightguard_jp> Yep, that gist
[23:37:38] <kenfinnigan> ok, will check that out
[23:37:53] <aslak> lightguard_jp, that only apply if you can run the exact same test against different containers
[23:38:05] <bleathem> stuartdouglas: did you ahve to dubclass the tests for what you did with testing in Seam Persistence?
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[23:38:11] <bleathem> ^subclass
[23:38:17] <lightguard_jp> aslak: You can use that and other tests too though, can't you?
[23:38:17] <aslak> or possible you can split them out into folders that are container specific and use include exclude filters
[23:38:49] <aslak> lightguard_jp, yes, the module can have it's own tests, and include the other modules
[23:38:59] <aslak> the other module's test jar
[23:39:00] <lightguard_jp> I think that's what we want to do
[23:39:15] <aslak> it will be 2 separate surefire runs
[23:39:22] <lightguard_jp> Ugh
[23:39:29] <lightguard_jp> Can't run it as just one?
[23:39:49] <aslak> lightguard_jp, you can run both in smae Maven run, but it wil be two surefire runs
[23:39:52] <lightguard_jp> What if you exploded it into the standard target/testClasses location?
[23:40:17] <aslak> as in, two surefire configs that are executed in two separate surefire 'processes' within the same maven instnace
[23:40:41] <lightguard_jp> Well, that wouldn't be the end of the world, not idea, but it would work
[23:40:48] <aslak> lightguard_jp, aa, you could possible extract it to the standard out. havn't tested that
[23:40:48] <lightguard_jp> ideal*
[23:41:03] <lightguard_jp> kenfinnigan: Would you mind trying that idea out?
[23:41:31] <lightguard_jp> Extract the jar containing the tests into the standard location and see if it works (picks up all the tests, common and container specific)?
[23:41:31] <kenfinnigan> exploding common tests into target/testClasses?
[23:41:36] <lightguard_jp> Yep
[23:41:38] <kenfinnigan> sure
[23:42:03] <lightguard_jp> Sounds like people generally like the idea of using one module per container, that sound right?
[23:42:08] <aslak> dan has been fidling with some Grouping / Filtering ideas as well.. but not done yet: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/ARQ-287
[23:42:09] <jbossbot> jira [ARQ-287] Add support for filtering tests based on required execution environment [Coding In Progress (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Dan Allen] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/ARQ-287
[23:42:42] <aslak> you would still need one module pr 'arq setup', they could all reuse the same test suite and test classes
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[23:42:55] <kenfinnigan> lightguard_jp: sounds like it
[23:43:01] <aslak> different containers activate different deployments in the test class for instance
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[23:43:38] <lightguard_jp> #agreed the new testing approach will use a module per arq setup idea
[23:44:13] <lightguard_jp> Yes, that would work
[23:44:43] <lightguard_jp> Oh, had a question aslak. Can Arquillian do parameter injection into the static methods needed for sw deployment creation?
[23:45:22] <lightguard_jp> So I could do something like public static Archive<?> createArchive(@ArquillianResource TargetContainer)
[23:45:29] <lightguard_jp> That's probably not right, but you get the idea
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[23:47:37] <aslak> lightguard_jp, not yet, i thought i had a issue on it, but can't find it atm
[23:47:49] <kenfinnigan> lightguard_jp: whats the next topic?
[23:48:03] <lightguard_jp> Okay, that would allow you to modify the archive based on the container, but not a big deal.
[23:48:13] <lightguard_jp> target container
[23:48:34] 
[23:48:41] <lightguard_jp> #info we'll continue this discussion via the mailing list with more feedback from Ken as he continues his research.
[23:48:49] <lightguard_jp> Let's move on.
[23:48:57] <lightguard_jp> sbryzak: You still here, and thawed out?
[23:49:05] <sbryzak> i'm awake!
[23:49:06] <lightguard_jp> #topic default target container
[23:49:06] *** jbott changes topic to "default target container"
[23:49:13] <lightguard_jp> sbryzak: All yours then
[23:49:15] <sbryzak> still not fully defrosted then
[23:49:23] <sbryzak> *though
[23:49:27] <sbryzak> ok, the container
[23:49:33] <aslak> lightguard_jp, was thinking of being allowed to Target a Deployment within the SCope of another, so @Deployment create(@OperatesOnDeployment("some_other") @ArquillianResource URL url) {}
[23:49:35] <sbryzak> for seam 3.1 our default will be AS7
[23:49:48] <sbryzak> i've been discussing with pete how we should support other containers
[23:49:55] <sbryzak> because there are library differences etc
[23:50:09] <sbryzak> he suggested that we use separate pom files
[23:50:24] <lightguard_jp> aslak: That would be cool.
[23:50:32] <sbryzak> and then you just use mvn -f to pick which pom you want to use
[23:50:54] <kenfinnigan> so a different build for each target container?
[23:50:55] <sbryzak> that will keep the examples simple to understand
[23:51:02] <sbryzak> kenfinnigan: yes
[23:51:03] <lightguard_jp> Do we need to go that route? What's an example of needing to change the pom?
[23:51:15] <lightguard_jp> Just for examples or for the artifact?
[23:51:16] <sbryzak> well, we need to comply with TAG-16
[23:51:17] <jbossbot> jira [TAG-16] Redirected to: https://issues.jboss.org/login.jsp?permissionViolation=true&os_destination=%2Fsi%2Fjira.issueviews%3Aissue-xml%2FTAG-16%2FTAG-16.xml
[23:51:18] <aslak> lightguard_jp, i think filters/groups are more what your trying to solve at this point, my thought on it was to e.g. to add initial-parmts in web.xml based on some other deployments location..
[23:51:20] <kenfinnigan> just for the example apps or for the module code as well?
[23:51:32] <sbryzak> this is for example apps
[23:51:39] <sbryzak> sorry i should have clarified
[23:51:48] <sbryzak> module poms should just target AS7
[23:52:20] <sbryzak> and we can use documentation to address using the module in different containers
[23:52:25] <lightguard_jp> Are there things that people can think of that would change to a module to support another container?
[23:52:42] <sbryzak> yes, dependencies
[23:52:48] <sbryzak> remoting is one example
[23:52:54] <sbryzak> in AS6, dom4j is provided
[23:52:58] <sbryzak> in AS7 it's not
[23:53:22] <sbryzak> it's needed by remoting though, so currently in AS7 you need to explicitly add the dependency
[23:53:43] <sbryzak> so in the documentation for remoting, we need to describe that it has a dependency on dom4j
[23:54:00] <sbryzak> and that if the container already provides it, it needs to be excluded from the project pom
[23:54:16] <lightguard_jp> Would you put dom4j as a compile time, runtime or provided scope then?
[23:54:27] <sbryzak> compile
[23:54:36] <lightguard_jp> You have to have it compile?
[23:54:36] <sbryzak> because our default target now is AS7
[23:54:47] *** jose_freitas has quit IRC
[23:54:52] <sbryzak> yes, it's used to process the XML requests
[23:55:03] <lightguard_jp> That sounds more like runtime
[23:55:08] <gastaldi> agreed
[23:55:13] <lightguard_jp> unless it's actually using the dom4j classes
[23:55:14] <kenfinnigan> would we do that through separate poms or simply profiles for a container?
[23:55:19] <sbryzak> it is using the dom4j classes
[23:55:22] <gastaldi> yeah, I was going to say that :)
[23:55:23] <lightguard_jp> okay
[23:55:46] <sbryzak> https://github.com/seam/remoting/blob/master/impl/src/main/java/org/jboss/seam/remoting/ExecutionHandler.java
[23:55:51] <sbryzak> you can see an example there
[23:56:15] <sbryzak> for the examples, we'll use different poms
[23:56:22] <gastaldi> sbryzak: What about using standard XML APIs ?
[23:56:50] <sbryzak> gastaldi: that's an option i guess, but dom4j makes it much easier
[23:56:54] <lightguard_jp> This doesn't sound like it really affects things until the runtime scope.
[23:57:01] <sbryzak> that's besides the point though
[23:57:30] <gastaldi> yeah
[23:57:38] <sbryzak> lightguard_jp: it's required for compilation
[23:57:38] <kenfinnigan> sbryzak: is there a particular reason to prefer separate poms over profiles?
[23:57:47] <lightguard_jp> sbryzak: I'm talking in general.
[23:57:57] <lightguard_jp> What's in the container doesn't affect what's required at compile time.
[23:58:13] <sbryzak> we need to comply with the JBoss TAG guidelines for examples
[23:58:42] <kenfinnigan> oh, couldn't see the jira as my id doesn't have permissions to view it
[23:58:56] <sbryzak> pete's still working on the details for it, but his suggestion for now is to use separate poms for simplicity
[23:59:04] <sbryzak> it's so that people can easily get up and running with the examples
[23:59:12] <sbryzak> and they have to be easy to import into JBDS
[23:59:47] <sbryzak> kenfinnigan: the TAG group's content is restricted unfortunately
[23:59:56] <sbryzak> the guidelines are on the intranet also





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