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[00:11:37] <bleathem_> 4th of June? That's one month short of being the "all-american" birthday!
[00:11:45] <lightguard_jp> haha
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[00:47:16] <lightguard_jp> bleathem_: Have you been able to speak to Jay yet about the datatable export?
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[00:59:10] <bleathem_> lightguard_jp: will do so tomorrow (before, during, or after the Richfaces meeting)
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[01:08:55] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master 3239433.. John Ament Removed descriptor and forge plugin, now in the forge repo.
[01:08:55] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master ab6b3c0.. John Ament Added a QueueBuilder, similar to TopicBuilder.
[01:08:55] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/jms/compare/1970fff...ab6b3c0
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[02:47:40] <gastaldi> yo !
[02:49:22] <gastaldi> hey lightguard_jp !
[02:50:15] <gastaldi> lincolnthree1: You there ?
[02:51:27] <gastaldi> What did I do wrong? http://pastie.org/2001178
[02:54:05] <johnament> is that a forge release or snapshot?
[02:54:18] <gastaldi> Snapshot
[02:54:22] <gastaldi> I figured out the problem
[02:54:27] <johnament> angry kittens?
[02:54:37] <gastaldi> I am running on forge on D:\Forge
[02:54:44] <gastaldi> It downloaded on C:\
[02:54:52] <johnament> hahaha
[02:54:55] <gastaldi> But is trying to run mvn on D:\Users
[02:54:56] <johnament> sounds like a bug
[02:54:58] <gastaldi> yeah
[02:55:06] <johnament> drive letter problem.
[02:55:10] <johnament> solution: switch to linux
[02:55:17] <gastaldi> hahaha better
[02:55:20] <johnament> list that as the work around - run it in linux.
[02:55:29] <gastaldi> hahaha will do it
[02:55:44] <gastaldi> At least it warns you: "  Windows? Really? Okay..."
[03:00:33] <gastaldi> There you go: SEAMFORGE-197
[03:00:35] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMFORGE-197] Running git-plugin on Windows executes Maven on a different drive letter [Open (Unresolved) Bug, Major, Unassigned] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMFORGE-197
[03:01:29] <gastaldi> See the Workaround description :)
[03:08:40] <gastaldi> it seems Seam Forge is not very "Drive letter friendly"
[03:09:47] <gastaldi> I need to stop using this Windows crap
[03:09:48] <gastaldi> :P
[03:15:43] <gastaldi> it seems that running "forge git-plugin" also ignores my settings.xml
[03:20:06] <gastaldi> sh*t, Now I am getting http://pastie.org/2001255
[03:20:15] 
[03:21:21] <gastaldi> It happened when I moved Forge to my C:\ :(
[03:23:03] <gastaldi> Ok.  Deleted Arquillian-plugin and it started again
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[03:27:20] <lightguard_jp> gastaldi: yes?
[03:27:34] 
[03:27:36] <gastaldi> :)
[03:27:53] <lightguard_jp> been better
[03:28:08] <gastaldi> Why is that ?
[03:28:44] <lightguard_jp> lots of stuff going on, kids are sick
[03:29:00] <gastaldi> too bad. Hope they get well soon
[03:30:00] <lightguard_jp> Seems like a four day thing
[03:30:40] <gastaldi> We are near Winter here in Brazil
[03:30:52] 
[03:30:59] <gastaldi> hell * -1
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[03:39:11] <gastaldi> lightguard_jp: So, how is the doodle poll going ?
[03:39:19] <gastaldi> everybody voted ?
[03:39:37] <lightguard_jp> No, not yet
[03:39:47] <lightguard_jp> Had six or so
[03:40:54] <gastaldi> hum, what is the total number of voters ?
[03:41:30] <lightguard_jp> I would have hoped we'd at least get all the module leads
[03:41:51] <gastaldi> nice
[03:42:44] 
[03:43:00] <gastaldi> What are the full topics for tomorrow ?
[03:44:33] <gastaldi> Max has replied my tweet about Seam Reports asking if it should contain the hibernate Birt integration present in JBoss tools
[03:44:47] <gastaldi> That should be something to discuss, I guess
[03:54:11] <gastaldi> Can anyone tell me why Forge always says that any new plugin is not a valid plugin when installing on Forge itself ?
[03:55:08] <lightguard_jp> I have three thus far: AI from last week, poll results and compat module.
[03:55:20] <lightguard_jp> Does anyone here have anything they'd like to add to that?
[03:55:22] <gastaldi> Great
[03:55:42] <gastaldi> Do you think my previous statement is valid ?
[03:56:06] <gastaldi> would be valid, I mean
[03:57:07] <lightguard_jp> I don't see why it couldn't.
[03:57:12] 
[03:59:47] <gastaldi> Oh my... Forge shows ***ERROR*** Exception encountered: null (type "set VERBOSE true" to enable stack traces) When I do Ctrl + Left arrow :)
[04:00:17] 
[04:01:16] <gastaldi> better file an issue for that :)
[04:01:37] 
[04:01:43] <gastaldi> I am using Alpha 3
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[04:39:16] <lincolnthree1> gastaldi:
[04:39:20] <lincolnthree1> if you are using Alpha3
[04:39:28] <lincolnthree1> and installing a plugin that was built against a -SNAPSHOT
[04:39:31] <lincolnthree1> it will give you that message
[04:39:35] <lincolnthree1> because the APIs are not compatible
[04:41:41] <gastaldi> oh
[04:41:48] 
[04:43:28] <gastaldi> I managed to create unit tests for seamreports Forge plugin
[04:43:32] <gastaldi> They are running OK now
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[04:44:31] <gastaldi> Check it out: https://github.com/forge/plugin-seam-reports/blob/master/src/test/java/org/jboss/forge/seam/reports/SeamReportsPluginTest.java
[04:45:14] <gastaldi> Is there a way to test auto completion ?
[04:45:18] <gastaldi> unit test
[04:48:50] <gastaldi> lincolnthree1: Is there an easy way to i18n forge ?
[04:49:25] <gastaldi> I filed an issue some time ago. I was wondering how hard would that be to implement ?
[04:50:12] <gastaldi> I mean, when searching for a command, you should rely on a comparator or something
[04:50:36] <gastaldi> a ResourceBundle object might help
[04:50:44] <gastaldi> Will help, of course
[04:56:59] <gastaldi> lincolnthree1: When is alpha4 scheduled ?
[04:58:59] <gastaldi> I thought of using curly braces like "{xx}"
[04:59:11] <gastaldi> For i18n commands
[04:59:39] <gastaldi> And having a ForgeBundle.properties on the plugin package as well
[04:59:42] <gastaldi> That would be cool
[05:02:16] 
[05:02:23] <Diablo-D3> I see a gastaldi
[05:04:35] <gastaldi> maybe we could place the supported locales on forge.xml
[05:12:00] <lincolnthree1> gastaldi: it's definitely planned, just not enough people to work on it right now :) if you wanted to prototype that, it would actually be really welcomed
[05:12:03] <lincolnthree1> i gotta run though
[05:12:20] <lincolnthree1> bbl
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[05:12:25] <gastaldi> Bye
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[05:22:45] <gastaldi> ok, gotta go now
[05:22:48] <gastaldi> Bye all !
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[05:23:02] <gastaldi> hey shane !
[05:23:23] <lightguard_jp> sbryzak: Still playing catchup?
[05:23:32] <gastaldi> Do we have a "go, go !" or a "no, no!" ?
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[05:46:58] <sbryzak> lightguard_jp: i think i've caught up now ;)
[05:47:04] <sbryzak> still trying to learn F15
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[05:49:38] <lightguard_jp> F15?
[05:50:32] <sbryzak> fedora 15
[05:50:47] <lightguard_jp> Ah
[05:51:01] <lightguard_jp> You probably saw my tweets about my day's experience with it.
[05:51:27] <sbryzak> yeah ;)
[05:51:44] <sbryzak> so.. you don't use qwerty?
[05:51:52] <lightguard_jp> No, using dvorak
[05:51:59] <sbryzak> geez
[05:52:01] <lightguard_jp> I switched about seven years ago
[05:52:08] <sbryzak> i know you're supposed to be able to type faster with it
[05:52:19] <lightguard_jp> Been a long time since I've taken a test
[05:52:33] <lightguard_jp> I don't type as much as I did when I took them with qwerty
[05:52:46] <lightguard_jp> I was around 80 wpm with about 96% accuracy.
[05:52:56] <lightguard_jp> Not stellar, but not bad
[05:52:58] <sbryzak> i couldn't deal with having to switch between keyboard layouts
[05:53:04] <lightguard_jp> Hehe
[05:53:18] <lightguard_jp> Dan at one point wanted to learn single handed dvorak
[05:53:22] <lightguard_jp> I think he's given that up
[05:54:27] <sbryzak> it would be like converting the US to metric
[05:54:52] <lightguard_jp> Ugh, be so much better if we (the US) would convert
[05:55:00] <lightguard_jp> Won't ever happen, but it would be nice
[05:55:32] <sbryzak> there's way too much infrastructure to be updated
[05:55:39] <sbryzak> it would be extremely expensive
[05:55:46] <sbryzak> plus you have to retrain an entire culture ;)
[05:57:38] <lightguard_jp> Yeah
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[06:06:04] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: do you know what a "Cost Centre" is in a Red Hat HR sense?
[06:06:29] <lightguard_jp> I haven't come across it.
[06:06:52] <bleathem> ok, I'll check with Rodney tomorrow
[06:07:19] <sbryzak> bleathem: it's the "department" that gets charged for expenses
[06:07:34] <sbryzak> department is probably a bad word for it
[06:07:39] <bleathem> thanks sbryzak
[06:07:52] <bleathem> how can I find out what mine is?
[06:07:59] <bleathem> Are we all in the same cost centre?
[06:08:00] <sbryzak> you need to ask rodney
[06:08:10] <sbryzak> should be
[06:08:18] <lightguard_jp> Oh goodie, listening to Tomoe die again.
[06:08:32] <bleathem> while I have your attentions sbryzak & lightguard_jp
[06:08:36] <lightguard_jp> Bonus points for those that know what show I'm referring to.
[06:08:36] <bleathem> ...
[06:08:52] <bleathem> I have a question about whether to include a feature in Seam Faces
[06:09:10] <bleathem> I posted to the seam-dev mail list (jose did too) but we've not yet had any response
[06:09:21] <sbryzak> bleathem: what's the feature?
[06:09:31] <bleathem> 1 sec.. I'll c&p
[06:09:52] <lightguard_jp> Let me find the post
[06:10:04] <bleathem> sbryzak: sc:inputContainer
[06:10:13] <bleathem> there is a JSF bug that stops it from working:
[06:10:18] <bleathem> http://java.net/jira/browse/JAVASERVERFACES-1991
[06:10:19] <lightguard_jp> Ah
[06:10:20] <jbossbot> jira [JAVASERVERFACES-1991] Submitted value of UIInput gets lost inside composite components [Open (Unresolved) Bug, Blocker, Ed Burns] http://java.net/jira/browse/JAVASERVERFACES-1991
[06:10:20] <lightguard_jp> Yes
[06:10:33] <lightguard_jp> Wasn't there a pull request to fix it on our side?
[06:10:36] <bleathem> we can work around it, but having the input wrapped in f:facets
[06:10:41] <bleathem> jose did this already
[06:11:01] <bleathem> I'm not sure if we should include a temporary workaround feature like this
[06:11:11] <bleathem> given that it will likely be fixed upstream
[06:11:27] <bleathem> we either include then later deprecate the workaround feature
[06:11:39] <bleathem> or we just say it's broken for now, wait till it's fixed upstream
[06:11:50] <bleathem> what would be the better approach?
[06:12:02] <lightguard_jp> Will the workaround work once it's fixed in a newer version of mojarra?
[06:12:08] <lightguard_jp> Does the issue exist in myfaces?
[06:12:22] <bleathem> yes, but it's ugly, adding a nested facet in the ui:inputcontainer
[06:12:28] <bleathem> that becomes unnecessary
[06:12:42] <bleathem> it'll still work, but would be "deadwood"
[06:13:16] <lightguard_jp> What about myfaces (I've seen posts with people asking about which version of mojarra Faces works because apparently it's broken in 2.1
[06:13:17] <lightguard_jp> )
[06:13:33] <bleathem> I'm torn between providing the best capabilities for the users, but not cluttering the API
[06:13:39] <bleathem> yeah, I saw that post too
[06:13:45] <bleathem> I need to check into it.
[06:14:19] <bleathem> should we discuss this at the meeting tomorrow? or is it too specific?
[06:14:28] <lightguard_jp> If it works in MyFaces as is currently I'd just tell people how to fix it themselves until a version of Mojarra fixes it.
[06:14:53] <bleathem> good call - but there is other stuff that is broken in MyFaces...
[06:14:54] <lightguard_jp> Not really sure if the whole community needs to weigh in on it.
[06:15:00] <bleathem> sorry state of affairs right now...
[06:15:02] <lightguard_jp> Nice
[06:15:09] <lightguard_jp> It's always been that way with JSF :(
[06:15:26] <bleathem> doesn't have to be.
[06:15:46] <bleathem> We need OpenTCK style tests for JSF features that Faces depends on
[06:15:56] <bleathem> something we can point the Mojarra/MyFaces devs to
[06:15:58] * lightguard_jp sighs
[06:15:59] <bleathem> ^too
[06:16:10] <bleathem> to say "hey your sh*t doesn't work!!"
[06:16:17] <lightguard_jp> Yeah, good luck getting O to okay anything like that
[06:16:46] <lightguard_jp> I'm very torn on this whole (OpenTCK / portability) issue.
[06:16:49] <bleathem> not necessarily spec things.  Just "doesn't work as advertised" things
[06:17:02] <bleathem> it's such a good idea
[06:17:10] <lightguard_jp> The good guy and the dev in me wants to do it and show them their stuff is busted
[06:17:20] <lightguard_jp> But of course my hands are tied in this matter
[06:17:23] <lightguard_jp> Very frustrating
[06:17:31] <bleathem> it would only help make the ecosystem a better place
[06:17:38] <bleathem> it would do no harm
[06:17:50] <lightguard_jp> Yeah, tell that to O
[06:17:53] * bleathem sharing lightguard_jp's frustration
[06:18:16] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: I don't think you should capitalize that "o" - not deserved atm
[06:18:22] <lightguard_jp> haha
[06:18:37] <lightguard_jp> I had such high hopes they'd do something good with Java too
[06:18:41] <lightguard_jp> Those were quickly dashed
[06:18:53] * lightguard_jp wishes Google had bought Sun
[06:19:27] <bleathem> I still think java will do well overall, same trend as up until now, but better executed. It's not all bad
[06:19:33] <bleathem> it just could be better
[06:20:09] <bleathem> and I thing Google would have stripped out the parts of java that aren't necessary to them.  a la app engine
[06:20:16] <lightguard_jp> The parts I'm interested in are suffering
[06:20:21] <lightguard_jp> Maybe that's a better way of saying it
[06:20:31] <bleathem> in many ways, they are thriving
[06:20:36] <bleathem> compared to 5 years ago
[06:21:04] <bleathem> it just would be better if they werre more open
[06:21:09] <lightguard_jp> Yeah
[06:21:12] <bleathem> better in all senses of the word
[06:21:28] <bleathem> but it's not bad. at least it's better than .Net
[06:21:33] <bleathem> srsly
[06:21:54] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: would you mind weighing in with your opinion to the JSF issue on the seam-dev mail list?
[06:22:07] <bleathem> might spark some other opinions
[06:22:34] <bleathem> jose_freitas: you there?
[06:22:55] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: sure
[06:24:14] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: What was the subject of that email?
[06:24:40] <bleathem> UIInputContainer problems
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[06:28:42] <lightguard_jp> PeteRoyle: ping
[06:35:56] <PeteRoyle> lightguard_jp: pong
[06:36:30] <lightguard_jp> PeteRoyle: Responded to the email about wanting a review, maybe someone else will pick it up as well.
[06:38:31] <PeteRoyle> OK cool thanks.
[06:38:38] <PeteRoyle> Sending commit through now
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[08:36:05] <jbossbot> git [cron] push master d8f25ab.. Pete Royle Updated readme to reflect Alpha1 release, better exception name, throw InternalException if bug is found, fixed spelling mistake
[08:36:05] <jbossbot> git [cron] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/cron/compare/3b6f5e4...d8f25ab
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[11:21:18] <johnament> sbryzak: you still up?
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[11:36:41] <sbryzak> johnament: yep i'm here
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[11:51:38] <johnament> sbryzak: i'm ready now if you are.
[11:51:47] <johnament> for the release
[11:51:58] <sbryzak> johnament: cool
[11:52:01] <sbryzak> give me a minute
[11:52:04] <johnament> i was going to ping you last night but i fell asleep
[11:52:35] <johnament> BTW, I'm still fighting with Oracle/JCP on membership, but thanks for the vote in to Oracle.
[11:53:59] <Diablo-D3> heh
[11:54:16] <Diablo-D3> why doesnt redhat/apache/eclipse just form their own standards organization and block oracle out?
[11:54:28] <sbryzak> so.. we're releasing 3.0.0.Beta2, right?
[11:57:33] <johnament> yep
[12:00:50] <sbryzak> johnament: np, release is underway
[12:01:40] <johnament> sbryzak:  cool, you still have the security setting, right?
[12:01:58] <sbryzak> johnament: security setting?
[12:02:08] <sbryzak> johnament: you don't seem to be using seam-bom
[12:02:36] <johnament> ?
[12:02:42] <sbryzak> also you have jboss-logging in your dependencies
[12:03:26] <johnament> you are correct on bom. hmm.
[12:04:13] <sbryzak> i'll add it
[12:04:18] <johnament> oh ok.
[12:04:21] <johnament> i just opened it all up.
[12:05:18] <johnament> you sure? it's got a few places to be fixed..
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[12:06:35] <sbryzak> yeah i'm on it ;)
[12:06:42] <johnament> alright thanks.
[12:10:11] <sbryzak> johnament: are you using embedded for tests?
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[12:11:05] <johnament> sbryzak: jbossas-managed-6
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[12:15:12] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master 78191a0.. Shane Bryzak fix dependencies
[12:15:12] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/jms/compare/ab6b3c0...78191a0
[12:15:24] <sbryzak> johnament: i've just commented out the unnecessary dependencies, you can clean it up later if you like
[12:16:13] <johnament> sbryzak: where did you define seam.version ?
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[12:16:41] <sbryzak> it's already in your pom
[12:17:08] <johnament> its still valid?
[12:17:24] <johnament> its too early to be messing with maven for me.. :-)
[12:18:37] <sbryzak> it's set to 3.0.0.Final, so it's valid ;)
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[12:19:15] <johnament> just not the latest?
[12:20:37] <sbryzak> pretty sure that's the latest bom?
[12:21:39] <johnament> ok
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[12:26:54] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master 1c908e1.. Shane Bryzak [maven-release-plugin] prepare release 3.0.0.Beta2
[12:26:55] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/jms/compare/78191a0...1c908e1
[12:27:01] <jbossbot> git [jms] push 3.0.0.Beta2 URL: http://github.com/seam/jms/compare/0000000...5a52fb3
[12:27:07] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master a40e6ba.. Shane Bryzak [maven-release-plugin] prepare for next development iteration
[12:27:07] <jbossbot> git [jms] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/jms/compare/1c908e1...a40e6ba
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[12:27:41] <johnament> yay
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[12:36:49] <sbryzak> johnament: artifacts have now been released to maven, congrats :)
[12:37:02] <sbryzak> i'll build the docs and dist and upload them
[12:37:30] <johnament> sbryzak: this is more of pmuir's release than mine :-)
[12:37:47] <pmuir> johnament: ?
[12:38:01] <sbryzak> oh cool, i didn't know ;)
[12:38:16] <johnament> though some of the rubyists will be happy that i emulated some of the features in ironjacamar (sp?)
[12:38:25] <johnament> pmuir: your renamed annotations from judcon
[13:02:19] <pmuir> aha excellent work johnament
[13:02:27] <nickarls> pmuir: mornings. do you have any insights on where to best do seam2-style conversationPropagation="none" for e.g. commandLinks in Seam3? navigation handler? custom component? servlet response wrapper? what would be the best way to strip off the "cid" parameter propagated?
[13:02:53] <pmuir> nickarls: hm
[13:03:10] <nickarls> f:param noCid?
[13:03:47] <nickarls> it's a sticky bugger once it gets appended
[13:04:12] <nickarls> one way would perhaps to place a navigationhandler before the weld one, calling super and stripping off the cid if needed(?)
[13:04:39] <nickarls> I don't recall how it was done for h:link (there was a bug at one point where it got appended there, too)
[13:05:35] <sbryzak> johnament: distribution is now uploaded to sourceforge, and docs uploaded to docs.jboss.org
[13:05:45] <sbryzak> johnament: can you update the seam-jms page on sfwk.org ?
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[13:06:07] <pmuir> weld doesn't have a nav hander
[13:06:12] <pmuir> do you mean view handler?
[13:06:33] <nickarls> ah, yes. Weld has a ConversationAwareVH...
[13:07:56] <nickarls> johnament: session scoped CDI beans can be used for durable reception in Seam JMS already?
[13:08:07] <pmuir> so yes, thats tricky
[13:09:13] <johnament> nickarls: not yet, needs a tiny proxy
[13:09:55] <johnament> sbryzak: yeah, i'll do that and blog it sometime today, hopefully before the meeting.
[13:10:04] <nickarls> pmuir: of course one could override the renderer of the commandlink to make sure the cid is never there if it has a f:param but its an ugly hack
[13:10:09] <sbryzak> johnament: great :)
[13:10:35] <pmuir> nickarls: I think you need to do a viewhandler that removes it if needed
[13:11:34] <nickarls> isn't the "if needed" a bit tricky? I can't read which component is calling so I can't see if it has a f:param or not(?)
[13:13:10] <johnament> nickarls: personally, i don't get why people feel they need durable.  how long are you really going to keep messages on the topic for a subscriber to pick up? are you really expecting a timed out client to want to read JMS based messages or should they be loaded from the database?
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[13:31:27] <pmuir> nickarls: ah yes, that is tricky
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[14:17:10] <jharting> PeteRoyle: ping
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[15:16:44] <oranheim> I'm having a difficult time with JBoss 6, using Weld 1.1.0 and ConcurrentModificationException when conversation ends. Is there a way to use/patch JBoss 6 with Weld 1.1.1 in conjunction with Seam Solder 3.0.0? It's killing me.
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[15:20:53] <maschmid> oranheim: from weld core sources, go to "jboss-as" directory, set JBOSS_HOME environment variable and use mvn -Pupdate-jboss-as
[15:21:09] <Diablo-D3> man
[15:21:11] <Diablo-D3> cant wait
[15:21:12] <Diablo-D3> for
[15:21:13] <Diablo-D3> as7
[15:21:29] <Diablo-D3> I heard its so fast that its already been running for several minutes by the time you tell it to start
[15:21:30] <oranheim> i sooo much miss as7, hope to switch when rc1 is out
[15:21:37] <oranheim> :-)
[15:22:11] <oranheim> maschmid: can you elaborate a little bit?
[15:29:20] <oranheim> maschmid: is this the right co point: git clone git://github.com/weld/core.git
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[15:31:06] <maschmid> oranheim: git clone git://github.com/weld/core.git; cd core/jboss-as;  edit the pom.xml, replace all 1.1.0-SNAPSHOT with 1.1.1.Final; export JBOSS_HOME=...   ; mvn -Pupdate-jboss-as
[15:31:19] <Diablo-D3> erm
[15:31:27] <Diablo-D3> he doesnt have to edit the pom
[15:31:37] <Diablo-D3> he can checkout the tag for 1.1.1.Final
[15:31:57] <maschmid> Diablo-D3: but the core/jboss-as/pom.xml in 1.1.1.Final still points to 1.1.0-SNAPSHOT
[15:34:31] <Diablo-D3> ...
[15:34:32] <Diablo-D3> fail
[15:35:40] <oranheim> maschmid: thx
[15:36:40] <maschmid> oranheim: yw
[15:36:56] <Diablo-D3> I need a jira for myself
[15:37:09] * Diablo-D3 adds issue DIABLO-1: remember to yell at weld devs
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[15:40:20] <gastaldi> hey !!
[15:40:26] <gastaldi> hey pmuir !
[15:40:32] <gastaldi> morning all
[15:41:25] <maschmid> Morning gastaldi!
[15:43:58] <Diablo-D3> hey gastaldi
[15:44:23] <gastaldi> hey Diablo-D3 ! Still awake ?
[15:44:54] <Diablo-D3> yes
[15:49:00] <oranheim> maschmid: [WARNING] The requested profile "update-jboss-as" could not be activated because it does not exist.
[15:50:24] <maschmid> oranheim: Ah... probably outdated docs... just run it without any profile...
[15:50:37] <oranheim> maschmid: ok
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[15:56:46] <gastaldi> sbryzak: You there ?
[15:58:49] <pmuir> hi gastaldi
[15:59:23] <Diablo-D3> SEAM TEAM, ASSEMBLE
[15:59:26] * Diablo-D3 gets the glue
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[16:03:51] <gastaldi> pmuir: I created a pull request for CDI-110
[16:03:52] <jbossbot> jira [CDI-110] Provide support for binding an invocation handler to an interface or abstract class [Pull Request Sent (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, George Gastaldi] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/CDI-110
[16:04:22] <pmuir> gastaldi: I saw, thanks, I will *try* to review today (I was away for a long weekend) but definitely this week
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[16:04:25] <gastaldi> Diablo-D3: lol
[16:04:28] <gastaldi> Ok
[16:04:50] <Diablo-D3> all we need is Pete to show up
[16:04:55] <Diablo-D3> so I can harass him over seam cron =P
[16:05:25] 
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[16:05:26] <gastaldi> :)
[16:07:17] <Diablo-D3> its the only thing I use that needs to be coded faster =P
[16:09:46] <Diablo-D3> also
[16:09:59] <Diablo-D3> how the fuck are people deploying databases on install?
[16:10:11] <Diablo-D3> like, hibernate has hbm2ddl.auto=create
[16:10:17] <Diablo-D3> but theres no way to do that once
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[16:16:21] * Diablo-D3 gets all stabby
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[16:24:32] <Diablo-D3> no one has a comment on that?
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[18:06:18] <jose_freitas> g'afternoon
[18:10:15] <gastaldi> good afternoon jose_freitas !
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[18:13:58] <gastaldi> Do we have JRebel Licenses ?
[18:14:51] <jose_freitas> no, but we can ask for an open source license
[18:15:06] <jose_freitas> I have a personal one
[18:15:09] 
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[18:15:27] <gastaldi> I have too, but I would like to know if someone already asked
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[18:16:36] <jose_freitas> nope
[18:16:47] <jose_freitas> I guess that no one asked yet.
[18:17:14] <gastaldi> hum, ok
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[18:42:05] <bleathem> ping jose_freitas
[18:42:37] <bleathem> I got some great feedback from mojavelinux on the UIInputContainer problem
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[18:44:33] <bleathem> The idea is to use the same component for both the facet and the non-facet version
[18:44:58] <bleathem> conditionally rendering the facet if it's present, otherwise rendering the children directly
[18:45:19] <bleathem> logging warning messages as appropriate
[18:46:00] <bleathem> then when the problem is fixed upstream, we can disregard the facet, and consume the contents directly
[18:46:07] <bleathem> jose_freitas: WDYT?
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[18:47:44] <jose_freitas> hm
[18:48:00] <jose_freitas> it seems a nice solution
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[18:51:22] <jose_freitas> I'll make some prototypes for it
[18:51:41] <jose_freitas> I don't think it'd have technical problems implementing it
[18:51:55] <bleathem> sweet, that's great news!
[18:52:01] <bleathem> thanks jose_freitas!
[18:52:04] <jose_freitas> NP
[18:52:23] <bleathem> I think I'll feel much more comfortable with this solution in the long term
[18:52:44] <jose_freitas> but it'd be the same backing class
[18:52:52] <jose_freitas> but would be the same compcomp as well?
[18:53:09] <jose_freitas> bleathem: me too
[18:53:24] <jose_freitas> I guess that might be a problem if we use the same .xhtml for both of them
[18:53:45] <gastaldi> hey mojavelinux !
[18:53:47] <bleathem> yes.  I'll update the jira with some concrete details/examples of what it would look like from the user's perspective
[18:54:56] <mojavelinux> hey all.
[18:54:59] <jose_freitas> hey dan
[18:55:00] <mojavelinux> thanks for staying on this issue jose. this is exactly the type of broken window issue that haunts us if we don't chase it down.
[18:55:03] <bleathem> hey mojavelinux
[18:55:21] <mojavelinux> so fixing it is more than just fixing it ;)
[18:55:51] <jose_freitas> I was not comfortable with the earlier solution eitgher
[18:55:55] <jose_freitas> either*
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[18:56:56] <mojavelinux> yeah, i like hiding these bugs from the user and trying to fix them on our end, if possible. in a sense, it can be a value that we add, even though it sucks to have to mask it
[18:57:27] <mojavelinux> it sucks the problem exists in the first place, that is, but c'est la vie
[18:58:11] <jose_freitas> c'est la vie
[18:58:13] <jose_freitas> :)
[18:58:44] <jose_freitas> especially with the composite components implementation there seems to be a lot of jsf bugs
[18:59:16] <mojavelinux> it doesn't surprise me, because it's been the source of a lot of confusion just within the impl teams
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[19:03:28] <jose_freitas> mojavelinux, sbryzak, bleathem: don't you want to come to jboss in bossa ? september 2011
[19:03:38] <jose_freitas> in brasilia
[19:03:47] <bleathem> I love Brasil
[19:03:53] <mojavelinux> definitely a possibility...i've been thinking about making a trip to Brazil
[19:04:00] <bleathem> I spent a few weeks in Brazil a couple of years ago
[19:04:09] <jose_freitas> where bleathem?
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[19:04:34] <bleathem> My wife and I traveled across S.A. from Lima to Rio over 8 weeks
[19:04:41] <jose_freitas> nice!
[19:04:41] <bleathem> had a great time
[19:04:45] <gastaldi> cool
[19:04:53] <jose_freitas> you should contact @jedgarsilva
[19:04:58] <jose_freitas> from redhat brazil
[19:04:59] <bleathem> I like the meat buffets a lot!
[19:05:03] <gastaldi> bleathem: Did you find the blue parrots ?
[19:05:05] <jose_freitas> he can "beg" for some budget
[19:05:05] <gastaldi> :)
[19:05:17] <jose_freitas> meat buffets rlz!
[19:05:28] <gastaldi> jose_freitas: Agreed
[19:05:48] <bleathem> din't remember blue parrots, but saw lots of parrots and macaw's at the various clay licks
[19:06:02] <mojavelinux> yeah, i'm going to touch base with edgar soon, and I'll keep you in the loop jose
[19:06:05] <gastaldi> yeah
[19:06:14] <bleathem> Rodizio's were they called?
[19:06:18] <mojavelinux> sept seems a bit quiter...though it can't conflict w/ javaone, which I think is oct 2 - 6
[19:06:18] <gastaldi> Yup !!
[19:06:20] <jose_freitas> yeap
[19:06:36] <jose_freitas> its september 3
[19:06:39] <jose_freitas> I believe
[19:06:50] 
[19:07:14] <gastaldi> anyway, you have an excuse to come here :)
[19:07:51] <bleathem> mojavelinux: go, and eat some meat at the Rodizio's for me!
[19:08:03] <gastaldi> haha
[19:08:08] 
[19:08:22] <jose_freitas> bleathem: come too and will have a seam table
[19:08:26] <jose_freitas> we'll
[19:08:28] <gastaldi> cool !
[19:08:29] <gastaldi> Yeah !
[19:09:59] <pmuir> anyone here on windows who can help me?
[19:10:04] <bleathem> Now that would be an awesome trip! but sadly, I think the travel is in my cards - not this year at least...!
[19:10:11] <bleathem> oops
[19:10:11] <gastaldi> pmuir: Me
[19:10:18] <bleathem> I don't think the travel is in my cards
[19:10:27] <bleathem> *significant omission*
[19:10:35] <bleathem> lol
[19:10:37] <pmuir> gastaldi: could you take three screenshots for me, one for each of these steps:
[19:10:39] <pmuir> Right click on My Computer and select Properties.
[19:10:39] <pmuir> Click to the Advanced tab and click on the button at the bottom that says Environment Variables (pictured below)
[19:10:39] <pmuir> Create a System property (meaning available to all users) named JBOSS_HOME and point it to the directory in which you unzipped JBoss AS.
[19:11:04] <pmuir> and make sure the directory you point to in step 3 is called jboss-as-7
[19:11:10] <pmuir> and mail them to me
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[19:11:16] <gastaldi> ok, let me change to English
[19:11:24] <pmuir> gastaldi: rotfl
[19:13:54] <pmuir> mojavelinux: go to brazil, it's awesome ;-)
[19:14:01] <gastaldi> pmuir: Can you mail me these steps ?
[19:14:08] <pmuir> gastaldi: sure
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[19:25:02] <jose_freitas> bleathem: do we have jrebel licenses?
[19:25:21] <bleathem> yep, (well my current employer does)
[19:25:32] <jose_freitas> hm
[19:25:40] <bleathem> my current employer for the next two days
[19:25:46] <jose_freitas> hehehe
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[19:25:57] <bleathem> you can get a jrebel licence for OSS use for free
[19:26:09] <gastaldi> pmuir: I am installing the english language pack here.
[19:26:16] <gastaldi> Will send it to you asap
[19:26:39] <jose_freitas> bleathem: yes but the project lead should ask for it (I guess)
[19:27:13] <bleathem> yeah, I think this has already been worked out for the Seam project
[19:27:23] <bleathem> ask lightguard_jp about it
[19:27:27] <gastaldi> Are Seam Module leaders allowed to apply for a free JRebel license ?
[19:27:33] <gastaldi> ok
[19:28:07] <bleathem> or was it antoine who did it at one point
[19:28:15] <bleathem> let me check the mail list
[19:28:26] <gastaldi> antoine asked the mailling list
[19:28:35] <gastaldi> But mojavelinux recommemded using fakereplace
[19:28:52] <bleathem> right, reading that  (again) now
[19:28:56] <jose_freitas> it'd be nice if fakereplace was ready
[19:29:02] <jose_freitas> but I don't think it is
[19:29:27] <gastaldi> I think that jRebel is enough :)
[19:29:33] <bleathem> we should maybe ask lightguard_jp to arrange some jRebel licences for Seam devs
[19:29:52] 
[19:29:55] <bleathem> do it once for the project, rather than one module at a time
[19:30:00] <gastaldi> yes
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[19:35:11] <mojavelinux> we can open the dialog about fakereplace once as 7 is out
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[19:43:40] <bleathem> fakerplace will be JBoss AS specific right?
[19:44:46] <bleathem> I had a good conversation with Toomas from ZeroTurnaround at JUDCon
[19:44:59] <bleathem> they are not opposed to the idea of opensourcing JRebel
[19:45:09] <gastaldi> wow, that would be awesome
[19:45:18] <bleathem> as they see the class reloading problem as one that is not too hard to solve
[19:45:32] <bleathem> but rather it's in the framework integration where all the complexity lies
[19:45:35] <gastaldi> I wish they take the Red Hat way
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[19:45:48] <bleathem> that would be nice
[19:45:51] <gastaldi> I mean, they could offer a subscription
[19:46:01] <gastaldi> and have a community version
[19:46:05] <bleathem> but I think they are considering the IDEA route
[19:46:14] <bleathem> of an open source core, with for pay extensions
[19:46:23] <bleathem> the more enterprisey extensions being more expensive
[19:46:31] <gastaldi> hum
[19:46:46] <bleathem> the community should petition them in this direction
[19:46:54] <bleathem> more OSS = better for everyone
[19:47:01] <gastaldi> right, this way one could buy only the necessary plugins
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[19:47:28] <bleathem> and if you don't need any plugins, your set
[19:47:32] <gastaldi> Yeah
[19:47:33] <bleathem> ^you're set
[19:47:36] <gastaldi> Cool
[19:47:49] <gastaldi> Hope they go this direction
[19:50:57] <gastaldi> Red Hat could buy ZeroTurnaround :)
[19:53:53] <jose_freitas> bleathem: ping
[19:54:17] <bleathem> jose_freitas: pong
[19:54:53] <jose_freitas> I was making some tests
[19:54:59] <jose_freitas> and I discovered something really cool
[19:55:36] <jose_freitas> if the children are wrapped in a h:panelgroup
[19:55:40] <jose_freitas> they recover the value
[19:55:49] <jose_freitas> it seems that we dont need the facet at all
[19:55:51] <bleathem> lovely
[19:56:03] <bleathem> even better!
[19:56:13] <bleathem> nice find jose_freitas!
[19:56:53] <jose_freitas> <o> all that work
[19:57:09] <bleathem> ugh, indeed!
[19:57:27] <bleathem> hopefully we all learned something in the process though...
[19:57:57] <jose_freitas> yeap
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[20:03:54] <jose_freitas> I want to make some automate tests for this component
[20:04:11] <gastaldi> JSFUnit ?
[20:04:22] <jose_freitas> yeap
[20:04:29] <gastaldi> JSFUnit + Arquillian
[20:04:32] <jose_freitas> probably arquillian too don't know
[20:04:48] <gastaldi> There is a subject on this in Java Magazine
[20:05:01] <jose_freitas> bleathem, do you mind showing me the wires you developed?
[20:05:08] <jose_freitas> gastaldi, really?
[20:05:16] <gastaldi> jose_freitas: Yup, very cool
[20:05:26] <jose_freitas> let me see if we have it here
[20:05:53] <gastaldi> the one with Glassfish 3.1 on the cover
[20:06:25] <gastaldi> Page 54 :)
[20:06:34] <jose_freitas> do you know the edition?
[20:06:37] <bleathem> jose_freitas: I based it off of what stuartdouglas did with arquillian in seam persistance
[20:06:44] <gastaldi> 91
[20:06:57] <bleathem> in terms of being set up with single tests that can be run in multiple containers
[20:07:16] <bleathem> let me see if I still have that branch lying around somewhere
[20:08:03] <gastaldi> Is should be possible to import a BOM and have these profiles available
[20:08:08] <gastaldi> on any project
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[20:09:02] <bleathem> jose_freitas: I have a branch on my faces clone called "tests"
[20:09:21] <bleathem> where I was trying to get something going with Jetty, JSFUnit, and Arquillian
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[20:09:33] <bleathem> it's really old though...
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[20:09:55] <jose_freitas> gastaldi: found it here
[20:10:15] <gastaldi> jose_freitas: great
[20:10:16] <jose_freitas> but it seems to be about jfsunit only
[20:10:22] <jose_freitas> but it'll help for sure
[20:10:23] <jose_freitas> thanks
[20:10:49] <gastaldi> page 56 says something about Arquillian
[20:11:31] 
[20:11:34] <jose_freitas> bleathem: thanks, I'll look at your branch
[20:11:49] <jose_freitas> gastaldi: anyway it seems a really good article
[20:11:54] <jose_freitas> I normally don't like this magazines
[20:12:10] <gastaldi> neither do I
[20:12:19] <gastaldi> I hate this magazine specifically
[20:12:26] <gastaldi> I prefer MundoJ
[20:12:38] <gastaldi> but still it is not THAT good :)
[20:14:39] <jose_freitas> hehehe
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[20:22:44] <jose_freitas> bleathem: should I put the use of panelGroup as a best practice?
[20:22:49] <jose_freitas> on the documentation?
[20:23:12] <jose_freitas> for those that won't use our component.xhtml
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[20:27:22] <bleathem> maybe as a tip, referencing the JSF bug
[20:27:37] <bleathem> because it won't be necessary once the JSF bug has been resolved
[20:28:18] <jose_freitas> yes, I'm writing within a tip
[20:28:27] <jose_freitas> it's a best practice to use a jsf panelGroup to wrapp the insertChildren tag. see  http://java.net/jira/browse/JAVASERVERFACES-1991 for more details
[20:28:28] <jbossbot> jira [JAVASERVERFACES-1991] Submitted value of UIInput gets lost inside composite components [Open (Unresolved) Bug, Blocker, Ed Burns] http://java.net/jira/browse/JAVASERVERFACES-1991
[20:28:28] <bleathem> so I guess I should disregard the currently open opull request jose_freitas?
[20:28:44] <jose_freitas> yes
[20:28:56] <bleathem> jose_freitas: maybe "It is currently required to wrap..."
[20:29:50] <jose_freitas> perfect
[20:30:04] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master 7e14b27.. Christian Kaltepoth SEAMFACES-166: Set rendererType for UIValidateForm correctly
[20:30:06] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMFACES-166] UIValidateForm doesn't set the rendererType property correctly [Open (Unresolved) Bug, Minor, Unassigned] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMFACES-166
[20:30:06] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master ab9db41.. Brian Leathem Merge pull request #36 from chkal/seamfaces-166...
[20:30:06] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/faces/compare/9a6964e...ab9db41
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[20:35:08] <daniel_hinojosa> hey folks EL2 is standard now?
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[20:51:17] <jose_freitas> bleathem: how could I ignore the other commits?
[20:51:44] <jose_freitas> my fork it's perfect, I deleted for example the facetInput files, but the commit is still there
[20:51:54] <jose_freitas> it'll like create the file and then delete
[20:51:55] <jose_freitas> it
[20:52:09] <bleathem> don't worry about it
[20:52:17] <jose_freitas> ok
[20:52:19] <bleathem> it may be useful to have in the history
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[20:55:38] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master cbebfe1.. joserodolfofreitas UIInputContainer refactoring.
[20:55:39] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master bd4ab55.. joserodolfofreitas UIInputContainer refactoring
[20:55:39] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master 9386206.. joserodolfofreitas corrected a possible NPE when the valueExpressionAnalyzer return null.
[20:55:39] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master 505f08c.. joserodolfofreitas SEAMFACES-93 - Reverted the old solution to a simplest one. there's...
[20:55:39] 
[20:55:39] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master 4d9a6ae.. joserodolfofreitas valueExpressionAnalyzer can return a null value. The condition...
[20:55:39] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master 88b776a.. Brian Leathem Merge pull request #37 from joserodolfofreitas/master...
[20:55:40] <jbossbot> git [faces] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/faces/compare/ab9db41...88b776a
[20:55:48] <bleathem> thanks jose_freitas, well done!
[20:56:08] <jose_freitas> np :)
[20:56:36] <jose_freitas> a really simple solution for all the time that has passed
[20:58:43] <jose_freitas> I'd  like to build some automate tests though
[21:01:38] <bleathem> yes, automated tests are increasingly becoming a requirement
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[21:02:14] <bleathem> every bug reported in the forums right now comes from some different combination of bits that gives all sort of different behaviour
[21:03:06] <jose_freitas> I'll focus on that
[21:03:19] <jose_freitas> and try to build a test to UIInputContainer
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[21:10:35] <bleathem> jose_freitas: maybe, to keep things simple, don't worry about targeting multiple containers
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[21:10:55] <jose_freitas> yeah, it can be an incremental process
[21:11:04] <bleathem> if you can get SeamFaces / JSFUnit and Arquillina working together (using JBoss) that would be an excellent start point
[21:11:27] <jose_freitas> ok
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[21:13:40] <gastaldi> hey
[21:13:50] <gastaldi> How do I place a Birt Runtime available to my test ?
[21:15:45] <lightguard_jp> gastaldi: Can you get it from Maven?
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[21:17:54] <gastaldi> It seems not
[21:18:11] 
[21:18:22] <lightguard_jp> Hm
[21:18:29] <lightguard_jp> Ask ALR in #jbosstesting
[21:18:47] <lightguard_jp> You'll probably need it in a directory somewhere your tests can access it
[21:18:58] <gastaldi> ok
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[21:19:54] <gastaldi> Maybe I could distribute it and unpack before testing
[21:20:05] <gastaldi> but that would make the JAR huge
[21:20:56] <gastaldi> or download it
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[21:30:27] <jose_freitas> bleathem: were you using 2.0 beta1?
[21:30:32] <jose_freitas> or jsf 1.3?
[21:30:36] <jose_freitas> jfsunit
[21:30:54] <bleathem> jsfunit 2 is required
[21:31:02] <bleathem> (it's what I was using)
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[21:31:11] <bleathem> required for Arquillina integration
[21:31:34] <jose_freitas> hm, I saw that 1.3 has arquillian integration too
[21:31:56] <bleathem> I though it used cactus... (orsomething like that)
[21:32:43] <jose_freitas> it uses
[21:32:45] <jose_freitas> too
[21:33:22] <jose_freitas> but I'll use beta1
[21:33:59] <jose_freitas> I'm a little bit worried that there's no update since march 2010
[21:35:21] <lightguard_jp> Beta1 was released Feb 7, 2011
[21:35:59] <jose_freitas> hmm
[21:36:13] <jose_freitas> ok then
[21:36:15] <bleathem> hey lightguard_jp!
[21:36:22] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: Yes?
[21:36:40] <jose_freitas> on the site appears 2010-02-03 as release date
[21:36:41] <bleathem> we were talking about OSS licences to JRebel earlier
[21:37:21] <bleathem> we werer wondring if it would be worth setting this up for the Seam Project in one shot, rather then each module lead doing it independently
[21:37:52] <lightguard_jp> This was brought up before, if you want one, go ask zeroturnaround for one. I think Antoine (maybe it was someone else) did that.
[21:38:07] <lightguard_jp> It's not really needed for each module
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[21:44:13] <gastaldi> Eclipse has an ugly way to use dependencies with Maven
[21:44:22] <gastaldi> They always put ranges on it :(
[21:44:46] <gastaldi> See what I mean: http://maven.eclipse.org/nexus/content/repositories/testing/org/eclipse/birt/org.eclipse.birt.core/2.6.2/org.eclipse.birt.core-2.6.2.pom
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[22:07:57] <jbossbot> git [core] push master c31f2ae.. George Gastaldi Changed signature of getCompletionTokens() to Iterable<?> for...
[22:07:57] <jbossbot> git [core] push master c887f0d.. Sten Aksel Heien Fixed SEAMFORGE-10
[22:07:59] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMFORGE-10] windows xp mvn install error [Closed (Done) Bug, Major, Lincoln Baxter III] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMFORGE-10
[22:07:59] <jbossbot> git [core] push master 555f3b4.. Sten Aksel Heien Fixed SEAMFORGE-163
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[22:08:00] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMFORGE-163] AbstractResource.getFullyQualifiedName() returns wrong file path on Windows [Closed (Done) Bug, Minor, Lincoln Baxter III] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMFORGE-163
[22:08:00] <jbossbot> git [core] push master URL: http://github.com/forge/core/compare/5d86c72...555f3b4
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[22:19:55] <gastaldi> Meeting is about to start in 37 min, is that right ?
[22:20:23] <lightguard_jp> Yes
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[22:21:16] <gastaldi_> cool
[22:21:28] <lightguard_jp> Lincoln's evil twin wasn't enough huh?
[22:22:11] <gastaldi_> hehe
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[22:40:05] <mojavelinux> the seam project has a jrebel license
[22:40:13] <bleathem> sweet!
[22:40:17] <mojavelinux> let me find the details
[22:42:33] <lightguard_jp> We need to put that somewhere we can all get to (or at least you, Shane and myself)
[22:42:37] <lightguard_jp> mojavelinux: ^^
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[22:44:11] <mojavelinux> hmm, seems I confused myself
[22:44:19] <mojavelinux> we have IDEA and jprofile licenses
[22:44:33] <mojavelinux> so yes, we should approach jrebel for a license for Seam
[22:44:37] <mojavelinux> is there a signup page for OSS?
[22:45:10] <gastaldi> mojavelinux: An email should be sent
[22:45:24] <gastaldi> to sales at zeroturnaround dot com I guess
[22:45:30] <jose_freitas> http://sales.zeroturnaround.com/
[22:45:51] <gastaldi> ah, they changed that
[22:45:53] <jose_freitas> on the left it has an apply form
[22:45:57] <gastaldi> Thanks jose_freitas
[22:45:57] <jose_freitas> ops
[22:46:00] <jose_freitas> right
[22:46:10] <bleathem> http://sales.zeroturnaround.com/
[22:46:13] <bleathem> oops
[22:46:19] <bleathem> beat me to it!
[22:47:08] <bleathem> I was on the site buying licenses this morning, and saw the link
[22:47:16] <mojavelinux> looks like we can have 5 licenses
[22:47:19] <gastaldi> cool
[22:47:23] <gastaldi> Or more
[22:47:53] <jose_freitas> I believe you can have more. but up to five licenses you have to provide email adresses
[22:47:56] <gastaldi> "If you require up to 5 licenses please provide the names and emails of all team members in the textarea. "
[22:48:10] <gastaldi> yup
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[22:49:48] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o lightguard_jp
[22:49:55] *** lightguard_jp sets mode: +o jbott
[22:49:56] <mojavelinux> hmm, that's a confusing statement
[22:50:03] <mojavelinux> who should I put down...i've added jason
[22:50:05] <mojavelinux> so far
[22:50:21] <mojavelinux> I want to put down names of people likely to use it straight away
[22:50:26] <mojavelinux> george and jose?
[22:50:35] <gastaldi> mojavelinux:Maybe each module team leader ?
[22:50:46] <gastaldi> You may put mine
[22:50:51] <lightguard_jp> Brian wants one
[22:50:55] <mojavelinux> yep, got that
[22:51:01] <jose_freitas> I'd like to have one as well
[22:51:04] <mojavelinux> brian, george, jose, jason and lincoln (for forge?)
[22:51:11] <gastaldi> do it
[22:51:32] <mojavelinux> k, I'm sure we can ask for additional ones...I just want to get the initial request in, get it started
[22:52:23] <gastaldi> cool
[22:52:41] <bleathem> I'll probably get one through the richfaces project (since it's also OSS), at which point I can throw my Seam one back in the pool
[22:52:45] <jose_freitas> cool[2]
[22:53:05] <bleathem> I <3 JRebel
[22:53:11] <bleathem> if only it was OSS
[22:53:17] * lightguard_jp wants fakereplace
[22:53:44] <mojavelinux> applied
[22:54:19] <bleathem> If I understand correctly, fakerplace == JRebel "core/kernel"
[22:54:40] <lightguard_jp> Yeah, but it's OSS :)
[22:54:44] <bleathem> the real work in JRebel is appreantly in all the library/framework integrations
[22:54:49] <lightguard_jp> Would be very deeply integrated with AS
[22:54:57] <bleathem> yes, good for us
[22:54:59] <gastaldi> hum... I am getting an error when running all the tests on forge/core
[22:55:01] <lightguard_jp> Yep
[22:55:16] <lightguard_jp> gastaldi: Yeah, it's been going around on the list for a while.
[22:55:21] <gastaldi> java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: org.apache.maven.surefire.util.NestedCheckedException ?
[22:55:58] <jose_freitas> brb
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[22:56:06] <mojavelinux> i only have a minute to explain before meeting, but the background on jrebel vs fakereplace is this
[22:56:20] <mojavelinux> fakereplace supports some features that are not in jrebel and vice versa
[22:56:31] <mojavelinux> but as you pointed out, the real work is in the framework integrations, where is where things can go south
[22:56:38] <mojavelinux> it's a classic case of an open vs a closed system
[22:56:43] <mojavelinux> fakereplace would be an open system for plugins
[22:56:50] <mojavelinux> jrebel makes it's money on the framework integration (plugins)
[22:57:15] <mojavelinux> thus, it's in our best interest to create and support fakereplace as the foundation of an ecosystem of hot deployment functionality
[22:57:22] <mojavelinux> perhaps even so far as we make it a standard, but that is thinking way ahead
[22:57:23] <gastaldi> well, meeting time ! :D
[22:57:58] <mojavelinux> because right now, every framework does reloading on it's own, and it's wild west
[22:58:01] <mojavelinux> meeting time
[22:58:19] <bleathem> agreed, fakerplace +1, OSS FTW !
[22:58:23] <gastaldi> mojavelinux: Yeah, that would be cool also
[22:58:27] <bleathem> but for now, jRebel gets work done
[22:58:44] <gastaldi> BTW, jRebel could be OSS in the future, as bleathem pointed out
[22:59:05] <sbryzak> morning all
[22:59:11] <gastaldi> morning sbryzak
[22:59:32] <bleathem> morning sbryzak!
[22:59:48] <gastaldi> we are here gathered for another Seam meeting
[23:00:02] <gastaldi> Let the host begin
[23:00:04] <gastaldi> :_
[23:00:06] <gastaldi> :)
[23:01:08] <bleathem> gastaldi: you sound like a priest
[23:01:12] <gastaldi> haha
[23:01:16] <gastaldi> I knew that was coming
[23:01:31] <mojavelinux> gotta make myself an op
[23:01:31] <kenfinnigan> are you passing the collection plate?
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[23:01:39] <gastaldi> lol, I wish
[23:01:40] <bleathem> lol
[23:01:59] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mojavelinux
[23:02:07] <mojavelinux> I have on my robe now :)
[23:02:12] <gastaldi> yay !
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[23:02:16] <mojavelinux> #startmeeting
[23:02:16] <jbott> Meeting started Wed Jun  1 21:04:49 2011 UTC.  The chair is mojavelinux. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
[23:02:16] <jbott> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
[23:02:19] <kenfinnigan> and the pointy hat?
[23:02:34] *** jharting1 has quit IRC
[23:02:34] <lightguard_jp> Add me as a chair please
[23:02:34] <bleathem> the pointy "red" hat!
[23:02:39] <kenfinnigan> lol
[23:02:39] <gastaldi> we hail you
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[23:02:46] <mojavelinux> #chair lightguard_jp
[23:02:46] <jbott> Current chairs: lightguard_jp mojavelinux
[23:02:46] <kenfinnigan> isn't that a cardinal?
[23:02:56] <mojavelinux> no underwear on underneath :)
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[23:03:01] <gastaldi> haha
[23:03:03] <bleathem> yikes!
[23:03:08] <lightguard_jp> You've been hanging around Pete too much
[23:03:14] <gastaldi> lol
[23:03:16] <mojavelinux> hehehe
[23:03:21] <lightguard_jp> Okay, let's get started
[23:03:26] <lightguard_jp> First item up
[23:03:33] <lightguard_jp> #topic Action Items from last week
[23:03:33] *** jbott changes topic to "Action Items from last week"
[23:03:46] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: Your report
[23:04:19] <mojavelinux> get on the pulpit man
[23:04:32] <gastaldi> He must be praying now
[23:04:34] <mojavelinux> brother leathem
[23:04:39] <gastaldi> ARISE
[23:04:53] <kenfinnigan> is that what bleatham is short for? brother leathem
[23:05:00] <kenfinnigan> never knew you were a monk brian!
[23:05:03] <gastaldi> haha
[23:05:10] <bleathem> sorry
[23:05:14] <bleathem> afk for a minute
[23:05:17] <lightguard_jp> There he is
[23:05:40] <bleathem> #info I spoke with Jay re: the dataexport from jsf data tables
[23:06:09] <gastaldi> cool
[23:06:23] <bleathem> #info short answer is RichFaces 4 planned to add support for this, but not shceduled for a release version yet
[23:06:36] <lightguard_jp> Good enough for me
[23:06:45] <bleathem> #info follow-up for further discussion on the RichFaces forums, to discuss any Seam tie-in
[23:06:50] <lightguard_jp> I know primefaces already has it, pretty sure icefaces does as well.
[23:06:58] <lightguard_jp> not sure about openfaces
[23:07:10] <bleathem> right, so JBoss needs a solution to
[23:07:13] <bleathem> too
[23:07:15] <mojavelinux> funny that was one of the first jsp tags I used
[23:07:16] <mojavelinux> displaytag
[23:07:19] <mojavelinux> for that very reason
[23:07:27] <mojavelinux> that was like 8 years ago
[23:07:32] <bleathem> time flies eh mojavelinux?
[23:07:43] <kenfinnigan> reminiscing?
[23:07:49] <clerum> primefaces lets apache poi do the excel formatting. very simple but effective
[23:07:55] <mojavelinux> just saying, nice to see that we are getting around to it :)
[23:08:10] 
[23:08:12] <lightguard_jp> Okay, we'll leave that up to the RichFaces team to work out, and people that ask can pester them :)
[23:08:21] <clerum> yeah definitly a RF thing
[23:08:22] <bleathem> it may be cool if RF provides basic functionality, but Seam integration could provide some added "sauce"
[23:08:25] <mojavelinux> okay, but that would be a great feature for an example app
[23:08:27] <gastaldi> Okey
[23:08:31] <mojavelinux> so let's make sure we use it as soon as it's ready
[23:08:34] <bleathem> via Seam Reports or something
[23:08:39] <mojavelinux> oh, yeah!
[23:08:40] <mojavelinux> plugin
[23:08:42] <gastaldi> Yeah !
[23:08:46] <gastaldi> Forge !
[23:08:56] <mojavelinux> well, I meant plugin like extension
[23:08:56] <mojavelinux> spi
[23:08:58] <mojavelinux> or something
[23:09:00] <gastaldi> ah ok
[23:09:07] <bleathem>  /done
[23:09:08] <gastaldi> That would do as well :)
[23:09:12] <mojavelinux> as in, you get the data dump and you can feed it into your report mechanism
[23:09:22] <lightguard_jp> Next two official items from last week went to mojavelinux.
[23:09:46] <mojavelinux> oh yes, cool
[23:09:50] <lightguard_jp> About the definitions and arquillian embedded jboss modules
[23:09:53] <mojavelinux> okay, so notice on the home page we now have the defintiions
[23:09:59] <mojavelinux> I updated the community integrator definition
[23:10:11] <mojavelinux> http://seamframework.org/Community/CommunityRoles
[23:10:42] <gastaldi> nice
[23:11:06] <lightguard_jp> #link http://seamframework.org/Community/CommunityRoles
[23:11:13] <mojavelinux> I checked on the embedded AS 7 and it sounds like that is already working (or close to it); basically, AS 7 can be embedded cleanly
[23:11:20] <lightguard_jp> That may show up twice, oh well :)
[23:11:36] <lightguard_jp> #info AS7 can be embedded cleanly for arquillian tests
[23:11:46] <kenfinnigan> is there somewhere we can get it yet?
[23:12:24] <mojavelinux> I'm a bit behind on following the arquillian dev, but as far as I know, the container should be available
[23:12:30] <mojavelinux> check the github repo for Beta1
[23:12:31] <gastaldi> I wish configuring arquillian be a little easier.
[23:12:33] <kenfinnigan> cool
[23:12:55] *** mbg has quit IRC
[23:13:15] <mojavelinux> not up to date with Beta1 yet
[23:13:25] <mojavelinux> it will be simpler, that's what is currently being worked on
[23:13:30] <gastaldi> Ok
[23:13:34] <lightguard_jp> We have a couple of followup items that weren't official as well.
[23:13:44] <mojavelinux> we are in a bit of a between period right now, because the docs aren't yet put together with the latest of how arquillian in configured
[23:13:47] <mojavelinux> but it gets a lot simpler
[23:13:53] <bleathem> ALR is the king of developer simplicity, so if he's on it, there is nothing to worry about
[23:13:54] <lightguard_jp> One is removing "Committer" from the module pages
[23:13:58] <bleathem> :D
[23:13:58] <mojavelinux> and I've proposed moving to a yaml baesd format for configuration to make it even simpler
[23:14:04] <lightguard_jp> This has been done and now says "Contributor" :)
[23:14:11] <gastaldi> Oh my, looks like I won something ! :D
[23:14:31] <bleathem> yaml +1 !
[23:14:53] <mojavelinux> I'm going to suggest that we have arquillian.yaml if arquillian.xml is absent
[23:14:58] <mojavelinux> gotta file a jira for that
[23:14:59] <lightguard_jp> We're also in the process of removing the GWT module from the site and replacing it with Errai info
[23:15:06] <gastaldi> cool
[23:15:26] <mojavelinux> yes, that's for driving that jason
[23:15:32] <mojavelinux> so just to be clear,
[23:15:37] <mojavelinux> #info there is no GWT Module
[23:15:48] <mojavelinux> #info rather, we have Errai CDI
[23:16:04] <mojavelinux> #info Errai CDI brings the CDI programming model to GWT, both on the client and server side
[23:16:23] <mojavelinux> #info Errai is the bus that handles the event roundtripping
[23:16:33] <mojavelinux> it's fast a hell
[23:16:40] <lightguard_jp> Look for that change to be finalized in the next day or two
[23:16:53] * rruss knew it was good to send Dan to IO with Mike ...
[23:16:57] <lightguard_jp> #action lightguard_jp finish the GWT module -> Errai CDI
[23:17:06] <mojavelinux> it's like Ajax Push on steroids
[23:17:14] <gastaldi> haha cool
[23:17:26] <gastaldi> Even better if GWT was not used
[23:17:53] <mojavelinux> it's interesting that  you say that george
[23:18:34] <gastaldi> Maybe Seam Remote could have something like that ?
[23:18:36] <mojavelinux> because it wouldn't be too far out of the realm of possibility to reuse the infrastructure to adapt it to other frameworks
[23:18:40] <mojavelinux> right, exactly
[23:18:46] <rruss> cbrock: will you be able to use Errai outside of GWT?
[23:18:47] <mojavelinux> perhaps Seam remoting could be changed to use Errai
[23:19:02] <gastaldi> yeah, that would be awesome
[23:19:04] <lightguard_jp> Seam remoting currently is a little messy
[23:19:15] <mojavelinux> because a lot of the logic inside of Errai is about the mechanism of handling a streaming json respose
[23:19:16] <mojavelinux> and about
[23:19:31] <mojavelinux> task scheduling, work pools
[23:19:31] <mojavelinux> etc
[23:19:35] <lightguard_jp> Reusing Errai would be a good move, if it can be done
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[23:19:45] <mojavelinux> you could think of it as Node.js written in Java
[23:19:50] <kenfinnigan> that would be cool
[23:19:51] <gastaldi> yeah
[23:19:55] <gastaldi> with CDI
[23:20:36] <mojavelinux> #idea use Errai to power Seam Remoting (or other Ajax/push technology stacks)
[23:20:45] 
[23:20:48] <mojavelinux> if you want to know why Errai and Node.js matter
[23:20:52] <gastaldi> Shane ?
[23:21:00] <kenfinnigan> think so yes
[23:21:01] <mojavelinux> I strongly urge you to spend a few minutes and read the Node.js refcard
[23:21:03] <mojavelinux> you will totally get it
[23:21:06] *** jharting1 has quit IRC
[23:21:15] <mojavelinux> serial request-response is dead
[23:21:21] <mojavelinux> long live async requests
[23:21:37] <mojavelinux> the refcard is more about the paradigm than the impl
[23:21:41] <gastaldi> Richfaces could benefit from that too !
[23:21:58] <sbryzak> i'd have to take a look
[23:22:03] <mojavelinux> http://refcardz.dzone.com/refcardz/nodejs-building-scalability
[23:22:12] <mojavelinux> shane, this idea fits well with Seam Remoting
[23:22:13] <PeteRoyle> (morning!)
[23:22:18] <sbryzak> there is no push in remoting currently
[23:22:32] <sbryzak> it was in seam 2, but i took it out for seam 3 because i wanted to rewrite it
[23:22:34] <mojavelinux> how much you can use from Errai is something I can't tell you, but certainly the technique can be used
[23:22:54] <mojavelinux> but I trust Mike with this feature if we do put it back
[23:23:03] <mojavelinux> because he has spent a lot of time unwrapping it
[23:23:09] <sbryzak> it has a few requirements, including 1) being able to subscribe to a jms topic/queue
[23:23:13] <jbossbot> git [core] push master e31ac24.. Lincoln Baxter, III SEAMFORGE-200
[23:23:14] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMFORGE-200] Forge should default to built-in 'mvn' command line if Maven is not detected in the underlying system [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Lincoln Baxter III] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMFORGE-200
[23:23:14] <jbossbot> git [core] push master URL: http://github.com/forge/core/compare/555f3b4...e31ac24
[23:23:16] <sbryzak> 2) receive CDI event notifications
[23:23:17] <gastaldi> There is SEAMREMOTING-6 and SEAMREMOTING-7
[23:23:19] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMREMOTING-6] Comet requests for Seam Remoting [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Shane Bryzak] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMREMOTING-6
[23:23:19] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMREMOTING-7] Seam event bus integration for remoting [Open (Unresolved) Feature Request, Major, Shane Bryzak] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMREMOTING-7
[23:23:32] *** johnament has joined #seam-dev
[23:23:41] <mojavelinux> both of those are being worked on in Errai
[23:23:53] <jbossbot> git [core] push master abcc0f2.. Lincoln Baxter, III SEAMFORGE-200, typo
[23:23:54] <jbossbot> jira [SEAMFORGE-200] Forge should default to built-in 'mvn' command line if Maven is not detected in the underlying system [Closed (Done) Feature Request, Major, Lincoln Baxter III] https://issues.jboss.org/browse/SEAMFORGE-200
[23:23:54] <jbossbot> git [core] push master URL: http://github.com/forge/core/compare/e31ac24...abcc0f2
[23:23:57] <mojavelinux> so it will be interesting to see if we can reuse the bus w/o gwt...I'm guessing we can, but don't want to jump to conclusions
[23:24:06] <sbryzak> does it only use json though?
[23:24:23] <mojavelinux> XML should not be used, not even in Seam remoting (IMO)
[23:24:31] *** lightguard_jp sets mode: -v jbossbot
[23:24:31] <gastaldi> agreed
[23:24:33] <sbryzak> what's the alternative?
[23:24:36] <mojavelinux> json or yaml
[23:24:40] <mojavelinux> yaml being the best choice
[23:24:43] <mojavelinux> yaml is the choice
[23:24:49] <sbryzak> json doesn't support recursive object graphs
[23:24:53] <mojavelinux> though I think currently Errai uses JSON, but it's totally custom inside of Errai
[23:24:59] <mojavelinux> so it could use anything
[23:25:01] <sbryzak> i don't know about yaml
[23:25:05] <johnament> no reusing buses
[23:25:32] <mojavelinux> yaml does from what I understand
[23:25:43] <sbryzak> i'm looking now
[23:25:44] <mojavelinux> but again, i'm a bit on the fringe of my understanding here, still have stuff to read
[23:25:53] <mojavelinux> john?
[23:25:59] <mojavelinux> no reusing buses?
[23:26:14] <gastaldi> sbryzak: That could be an action for next meeting, what do you think ?
[23:26:26] <johnament> i don't think it will work. i was looking at it for JMS & Errai, won't work.
[23:26:50] <gastaldi> Maybe Errai should be refactored then
[23:26:56] <mojavelinux> ah, we'll, I was thinking along the lines of the fact that we could make changes to the project, if there were motivation to do so
[23:27:05] <mojavelinux> geoge beat me to it
[23:27:18] <johnament> even factoring in a refactor.
[23:27:20] <sbryzak> yaml doesn't look like it supports it either
[23:27:22] <johnament> conceptually it won't work.
[23:27:48] <bleathem> johnament: you mean specifically the JMS tie-in?
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[23:27:52] <mojavelinux> oh, wait, we are talking about jms and errai, I mean whether errai can be used for other push technologies like seam remoting
[23:28:00] <johnament> oh
[23:28:04] <mojavelinux> right, that's seperate and likely I agree with you there that's not going to work w/o a bridge
[23:28:13] * johnament shouldn't jump into the middle of an on going conversation
[23:28:17] <gastaldi> :)
[23:28:23] <mojavelinux> it's okay, got us thinking :)
[23:28:31] <johnament> why not use the richfaces features?
[23:28:44] <johnament> Seam JMS Beta2 just added specific support to support RichFaces push
[23:28:44] <mojavelinux> basically, we need an alignment
[23:28:46] <johnament> :-)
[23:29:05] <mojavelinux> because the actually mechanism of push in errai is highly optimized
[23:29:05] <lightguard_jp> mojavelinux: Do you want the action item, or should we give it to someone else?
[23:29:43] <bleathem> Richfaces push is going to add support for CDI
[23:29:58] <johnament> bleathem: event model?
[23:30:00] <mojavelinux> I think the action item is that we need a plan for the seam remoting story with respect to errai...are we moving forward with seam remoting, trying to join them or just pushing forward w/ errai
[23:30:06] <bleathem> looks like there is a lot of duplication of effort going on
[23:30:11] <mojavelinux> so for shane
[23:30:18] <gastaldi> yes
[23:30:36] <mojavelinux> and I guess richfaces has a part of that story too
[23:30:39] <bleathem> johnament: I don't know the details (yet)
[23:30:40] <kenfinnigan> consolidation certainly required
[23:30:45] <lightguard_jp> #action sbryzak will talk with cbrock about errai and flesh out the seam remoting / errai idea
[23:31:03] <sbryzak> remoting would only use errai for push functionality
[23:31:07] <lightguard_jp> #info also need to get Jay involved in this for RichFaces push
[23:31:17] <sbryzak> errai is no replacement for the other features
[23:31:23] <gastaldi> #agreed
[23:31:24] <mojavelinux> yeah, I know
[23:31:35] <johnament> sounds like we need a separate "push" feature that is view independent.
[23:31:51] <mojavelinux> my hope is that's errai...because it's not just about push
[23:31:59] <gastaldi> I bet Seam Remoting is the place for that
[23:32:01] <mojavelinux> it's also about async requests and task pooling
[23:32:12] <mojavelinux> because the requests will build up otherwise
[23:32:21] <kenfinnigan> sounds like errai needs to separate GWT bits so it can be re-used elsewhere
[23:32:27] <mojavelinux> errai is very optimized to handle massive # of incoming requests and not getting backlogged
[23:32:31] <gastaldi> kenfinnigan: agreed
[23:32:40] <mojavelinux> once you start to queue
[23:32:41] <bleathem> +1 kenfinnigan, summed it up well
[23:32:43] <mojavelinux> your async goes to shit
[23:33:20] <mojavelinux> it's all fun and games until the pipe clogs
[23:33:26] <kenfinnigan> very true
[23:33:34] <lightguard_jp> Any other action items from last week we need to discuss?
[23:33:40] <gastaldi> Code Review ?
[23:33:46] <kenfinnigan> not that i recall
[23:33:46] <lightguard_jp> gastaldi: It's coming
[23:33:51] <gastaldi> ok
[23:34:03] <mojavelinux> ticket bastard
[23:34:05] <gastaldi> What about Forge + Seam modules ?
[23:34:23] <lightguard_jp> If we have time.
[23:34:31] 
[23:34:37] <mojavelinux> jason and I are getting organized to revive ticket bastard, we will be making an announcement when we get it sorted
[23:34:47] <gastaldi> cool
[23:34:50] <johnament> ticket bastard?
[23:34:52] <johnament> que es?
[23:34:58] <mojavelinux> ticket monster -> ticket bastard
[23:35:02] <lightguard_jp> Ticket Monster
[23:35:06] <gastaldi> lol
[23:35:14] <johnament> still don't get it.
[23:35:17] <johnament> is that a demo app?
[23:35:22] <kenfinnigan> mojavelinux: read thru the design doc, looks like some good thinking has already been done
[23:35:28] <mojavelinux> yes, this is the seam booking predecessor
[23:35:32] <sbryzak> ticket monster is on hold for a while
[23:35:33] <johnament> ah
[23:35:34] <gastaldi> https://github.com/seam/ticket-monster
[23:35:47] <sbryzak> pete needs to get the infinispan/cdi integration into an infinispan release
[23:35:54] <sbryzak> he said that it would happen in early july
[23:36:02] <mojavelinux> can we take out infinispan for now?
[23:36:05] <mojavelinux> just do JPA?
[23:36:17] <johnament> what is it using in infinispan?
[23:36:21] <sbryzak> i guess so.. but that was one of the big features for the demo
[23:36:26] <kenfinnigan> +1 to that, could then introduce infinispan and hibernate ogm together
[23:36:37] <mojavelinux> that's fine, our concern isn't for a demo at this point, it's having a new example to work on
[23:37:02] <sbryzak> i fixed most of the build the other night
[23:37:07] <mojavelinux> and we actually have design documents for this thing, so it makes it reasonable to keep it going
[23:37:16] <mojavelinux> fantastic
[23:37:27] <sbryzak> just have to pull out the seam-clouds stuff
[23:37:30] <mojavelinux> can we make those design documents public?
[23:37:36] <mojavelinux> cause they are useful
[23:37:43] <sbryzak> i don't see why not
[23:37:51] <rruss> me either
[23:37:56] <mojavelinux> okay, we need an action item then
[23:38:03] <jose_freitas> agreed
[23:38:06] <mojavelinux> just copy paste it to the wiki, clean up some formatting
[23:38:30] <mojavelinux> #action Shane will copy paste the ticket monster (bastard) design documents to the Seam wiki so more people can play
[23:38:41] <mojavelinux> #action or, put them in a design.md file in the source tree
[23:38:54] <mojavelinux> either way
[23:39:08] <mojavelinux> feel free to reassign
[23:39:44] <lightguard_jp> Okay, moving on to the next item :)
[23:39:50] <lightguard_jp> I think you're all interested in this one.
[23:39:59] <jose_freitas> as I understood this app is for module leads playing with other modules right?
[23:40:25] <lightguard_jp> jose_freitas: Not necessarily.
[23:40:42] <lightguard_jp> #topic Results of the Polls
[23:40:42] *** jbott changes topic to "Results of the Polls"
[23:41:16] <lightguard_jp> #info Community integrator was a pretty tight race
[23:41:29] <lightguard_jp> #info George Gastaldi will be our next Community Integrator
[23:41:40] <kenfinnigan> congrats gastaldi!
[23:41:45] <gastaldi> Yay !! Finally I won an election ! :D
[23:41:47] <jose_freitas> congratulations george
[23:41:51] <gastaldi> Thanks !
[23:42:04] <jose_freitas> to the next you can try for senator
[23:42:06] <sbryzak> ticket monster doc is shared: https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1JIVsO90PsLIYI66mEwOWC5qZ2GxHBRWXT3oYnjBTOyQ
[23:42:06] <bleathem> congrats gastaldi !
[23:42:15] <sbryzak> it won't be easy to move it to seam wiki
[23:42:22] <sbryzak> we'd lose all the comments, which i think are important
[23:42:26] <sbryzak> plus it's full of tables/images
[23:42:57] <mojavelinux> oh, okay, didn't think of making it public in google docs
[23:43:01] <johnament> congrats george
[23:43:06] <mojavelinux> let's just add a link to it, perhaps from the Examples Ideas page
[23:43:26] <gastaldi> Thanks everyone
[23:43:30] <jose_freitas> wow, it has a lot of structure already
[23:43:37] <mojavelinux> congrats george!
[23:43:49] <lightguard_jp> #info Forum Jedi support overwhelmingly went in favor of Jason Porter
[23:43:55] <mojavelinux> and also, congrats to george and antoine for becoming officially listed on CDI 1.1, and for their participation
[23:44:10] <sbryzak> bah, the published doc lost the comments anyway
[23:44:14] <gastaldi> Congratulations Jason !
[23:44:22] <mojavelinux> yeah, the forums finally have someone at the wheel again :)
[23:44:25] <kenfinnigan> congrats jason, best man got the job
[23:44:40] <gastaldi> yeah
[23:44:48] <jose_freitas> now the lightguard has another reason to be a guardian
[23:44:50] <jose_freitas> :=
[23:44:51] <mojavelinux> I realized that I didn't set terms on them, for revote...how about we say 6 months?
[23:44:55] <jose_freitas> congrats
[23:44:57] <gastaldi> haha nice one jose_freitas
[23:45:06] <bleathem> 6 month term sounds good
[23:45:12] <lightguard_jp> 6 months sounds like a good term
[23:45:12] <gastaldi> yeah
[23:45:25] 
[23:45:28] <jose_freitas> agreed
[23:45:34] <lightguard_jp> #agreed revote for these positions again in 6 months
[23:45:34] <mojavelinux> #action set event in calendar for next vote on community roles
[23:45:44] <mojavelinux> barring a special election :)
[23:45:47] <bleathem> gastaldi: now you jinxed it! watch out next time you cross the street!
[23:45:49] <johnament> that also means that bleathem and lightguard_jp owe time
[23:46:54] <gastaldi> :)
[23:47:12] <lightguard_jp> Next item, unless others have questions
[23:47:37] <mojavelinux> jason, you can add that to your sig on the forums
[23:47:48] <lightguard_jp> mojavelinux: Good point
[23:48:00] <lightguard_jp> #topic Code Reviews
[23:48:00] *** jbott changes topic to "Code Reviews"
[23:48:13] <lightguard_jp> I'll let gastaldi talk about this, he brought it up
[23:48:54] <gastaldi> Ok, it all happened when Antoine joined the room and wanting a code review for Seam Social
[23:49:14] 
[23:49:31] <gastaldi> It happens that we found better design ideas
[23:50:01] <gastaldi> So, I thought that this practice would apply to other modules as well
[23:50:37] <mojavelinux> and in fact it has, but perhaps accidental progress, or by chance
[23:50:47] <gastaldi> yeah
[23:51:01] <mojavelinux> and I know that cody has piped up at a number of meetings asking for a code review, so I think in the interest of seeing seam be successful and consistent
[23:51:25] <mojavelinux> we can have sort of a call for review and if you have some cycles, try to pitch in on reviewing those apis
[23:51:30] <gastaldi> We could have Crucible running for code reviews
[23:51:42] <mojavelinux> jboss is looking at getting that setup
[23:51:42] <bleathem> that might be overkill
[23:51:50] <gastaldi> bleathem: how so ?
[23:51:53] <lightguard_jp> For now, GitHub works just as well
[23:51:57] <kenfinnigan> crucible is cool, but wouldn't that add a lot of admin overhead?
[23:52:07] <lightguard_jp> You just have to be looking at a commit to make comments
[23:52:17] <mojavelinux> the only shortcoming of github is that you can only comment on commits, not just on a file in a branch
[23:52:17] <bleathem> I don't think we need code review integrated into our work flow
[23:52:24] <gastaldi> ah, ok. Github may do the job as well
[23:52:25] <lightguard_jp> You can do line by line commenting as well in GitHub
[23:52:30] <mojavelinux> right, I think if we use the develop -> master flow
[23:52:31] <bleathem> doing it as "one offs" is better suited
[23:52:40] <mojavelinux> then we can comment on the proposed merge
[23:52:50] <mojavelinux> that also helps people know what to comment on
[23:53:02] <mojavelinux> lightguard_jp this comes back to the git workflow
[23:53:15] <mojavelinux> so perhaps, we need to doc how the review process fits in there
[23:53:16] <mojavelinux> then this will work
[23:53:21] <bleathem> I've been looking more closely at the git workflow - I like what I see
[23:53:21] <kenfinnigan> do we need an action item to move all modules to git flow?
[23:53:34] <mojavelinux> yes, I think we just need to do it at this point
[23:53:38] <jose_freitas> what means to move them to git flow?
[23:53:48] <bleathem> Seam Faces will adopt it (as soon as I find the time)
[23:53:50] <jose_freitas> does it mean*
[23:54:10] <mojavelinux> #action take steps to shift modules to using git flow; first step is to clarify what it is on the mailinglist
[23:54:23] <bleathem> jose_freitas: see http://nvie.com/posts/a-successful-git-branching-model/
[23:54:31] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: Install git flow, run git flow init you're done :)
[23:54:33] <mojavelinux> there have been some follow-up posts as well
[23:54:39] <kenfinnigan> was looking for that, it's got great explanation on the process
[23:55:00] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: is it transaparent for other committers?
[23:55:15] <lightguard_jp> It's essentially a wrapper around branching
[23:55:18] 
[23:55:21] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: in that they just fork patch and pull request?
[23:55:21] <lightguard_jp> It's completely transparent
[23:55:29] <mojavelinux> yep
[23:55:31] <lightguard_jp> some extra data in .git/config
[23:55:37] <bleathem> but they have to fork develop, not master right?
[23:55:37] <mojavelinux> i think it actually solves some confusion with git
[23:55:41] <mojavelinux> yes
[23:55:57] <kenfinnigan> I agree, makes it easier to manage in my view
[23:56:02] <mojavelinux> this is where I wish github would fix their forking
[23:56:06] <mojavelinux> so that you can redirect your fork
[23:56:15] <lightguard_jp> Set up develop as the main branch in GitHub admin for your module and it'll work just fine.
[23:56:16] <kenfinnigan> follows a more natural dev process
[23:56:19] <mojavelinux> it's just a matter of changing the remotees on their end
[23:56:23] <bleathem> so I was wondering if master should be develop
[23:56:29] <lightguard_jp> Might want to make mention of your using the workflow in the readme or description though
[23:56:30] <bleathem> rather than release
[23:56:45] <kenfinnigan> lightguard_jp: good call
[23:56:47] <mojavelinux> ahhhh
[23:56:53] <lightguard_jp> You could do that too
[23:56:53] <mojavelinux> yeah
[23:56:58] <mojavelinux> master release instead of develop master
[23:57:13] <lightguard_jp> master is just a name
[23:57:13] <bleathem> this conversation is too multi-threaded, I'm losing track of who is responding to who :P
[23:57:34] <gastaldi> me too
[23:57:37] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: We can talk more later about it if you have questions
[23:57:37] <bleathem> lightguard_jp: but master is what contributors fork by default right?
[23:57:41] <bleathem> ok
[23:57:48] * bleathem shelved
[23:57:55] <mojavelinux> k, we can get that started on the list
[23:57:58] <jose_freitas> agree with bleathem
[23:57:58] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: Just because that's the default branch GitHub gives to them, it's configurable.
[23:58:06] <mojavelinux> yep, its' configurable
[23:58:10] <bleathem> oh, didn't know that
[23:58:11] <mojavelinux> that's how you can make develop the main branch
[23:58:14] <mojavelinux> it's in the admin page
[23:58:16] <kenfinnigan> bleathem: with git flow it becomes develop, which as lightguard_jp mentioned you can change in the admin of github
[23:58:23] <bleathem> in other words, RTFM !!
[23:58:26] <mojavelinux> hahaha
[23:58:34] <bleathem> lol
[23:59:13] <lightguard_jp> #action lightguard_jp will field questions about git flow after the meeting or at some other time
[23:59:21] <lightguard_jp> Shall we move on?
[23:59:28] <mojavelinux> yes
[23:59:33] <lightguard_jp> #topic Meet bi-weekly instead of each week
[23:59:33] *** jbott changes topic to "Meet bi-weekly instead of each week"
[23:59:44] <lightguard_jp> I've been thinking about this the last couple of meetings
[23:59:44] <kenfinnigan> +1 to that idea
[23:59:55] <lightguard_jp> Do we have enough stuff currently to hold a meeting each week?





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