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[05:14:59] <bleathem_> g'evenin' folks
[05:24:38] <lightguard_jp> bleathem_: Evening
[05:38:42] <bleathem_> Does Seam 3 use slf4j, or jboss logging?
[05:38:50] <lightguard_jp> jboss logging
[05:39:00] <bleathem_> exclusively?
[05:40:35] <lightguard_jp> It should be
[05:40:50] <lightguard_jp> jboss logging is still black magick to me though
[05:40:59] <lightguard_jp> I've read the code and I still don't fully understand it.
[05:41:07] <lightguard_jp> There's no docs
[05:41:13] <lightguard_jp> almost no examples
[05:41:14] <lightguard_jp> No tests
[05:44:21] <bleathem_> Yeah, I'm pulling the jboss logging code from elsewhere in faces
[05:46:01] <bleathem_> Dan made his logger "private transient", rather than "private static final" like I've normally done it.
[05:46:04] <bleathem_> Is this preferred.
[05:46:16] <bleathem_> ?
[05:46:35] <lightguard_jp> No point in making it static
[05:46:57] <lightguard_jp> Statics are typically not good, unless you really understand how they work and how to GC them.
[05:47:33] <bleathem_> huh.  it's funny the things you do because you've always done them that way, and never question.
[05:47:48] <bleathem_> I wonder how much of the boiler-plate part of my code falls in that category.
[05:48:33] <bleathem_> "question everything" used to be my motto.
[05:48:47] <bleathem_>  could probably do with more of that these days.
[05:48:48] <lightguard_jp> :)
[05:54:53] <bleathem_> Wow, this is a great read on the topic: http://wiki.apache.org/jakarta-commons/Logging/StaticLog
[05:54:58] <bleathem_> worth a tweet...
[05:55:53] <bleathem_> Great article on when *not* to make your java loggers static: http://goo.gl/Zeiev
[05:56:01] <bleathem_> oops, this isn't twitter !!
[06:10:40] <bleathem_> drives me nuts the way braces { } are lines up in Seam code.
[06:10:47] <bleathem_> ^lined up
[06:15:09] <lightguard_jp> lol
[06:17:18] <lightguard_jp> Setup your formaters correctly and then have it format when you checkin
[06:23:34] <bleathem_> are these git formaters?
[06:23:49] <bleathem_> or some eclipse thing maybe?
[06:24:36] <lightguard_jp> Eclipse formatters
[06:24:47] <lightguard_jp> Don't ask me where they're at, I don't remember :)
[06:25:08] <bleathem_> Where are th^H^H^H^H
[06:25:54] <bleathem_> might be useful info to add to the "contibuting to seam" page.  If it's not already there.
[06:29:33] <lightguard_jp> I think those of us *not* using eclipse are the minority
[06:33:26] <bleathem_> let me guess, your an idea guy
[06:34:04] <bleathem_> Do you know why Dan would not want to pass AbortProcessingExceptions to seam catch?
[06:34:35] <bleathem_> I can think of use cases where I would want it passed to seam catch.
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[06:41:58] <bleathem_> hey lincoln
[06:42:42] <bleathem_> lincolnthree1: Do you know why Dan would not want to pass AbortProcessingExceptions to seam catch?
[06:42:44] <bleathem_> I can think of use cases where I would want it passed to seam catch.
[06:43:14] <bleathem_> I imagine it's because we want to be sure the action processing stops.
[06:44:09] <lincolnthree1> sleeping now, sorry bleathem - will be back tomorrow am
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[06:47:52] <bleathem_> ok
[06:48:39] <lightguard_jp> bleathem_: idk
[06:48:53] <lightguard_jp> Yep, I'm using idea, though I've used eclipse and netbeans in the past
[06:49:07] <lightguard_jp> If I didn't have a license for IntelliJ it would be netbeans
[06:49:17] <lightguard_jp> I'm not overly happy with eclipse
[06:49:33] <bleathem_> eclipse suffers from a lack of overall design
[06:50:03] <bleathem_> leaving everything to plugins means too many styles/layouts/workflows creep in.
[06:54:31] <lightguard_jp> eclipse suffers from a lot of things
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[06:57:03] <bleathem_> indeed.
[06:57:20] <bleathem_> well I'm done integrating Dan's proposal with my implementation,
[06:57:31] <bleathem_> 'cept for the one outstanding question, all seems good.
[06:58:00] <bleathem_> Tommorrow a test app.
[06:58:03] <bleathem_> Can't wait to use this for real!
[06:58:21] <lightguard_jp> How are you liking catch?
[06:58:28] <lightguard_jp> Any problems, things you would change, etc?
[07:04:50] <bleathem_> Haven't really tried it yet, aside from this faces integration.  Will do so tomorrow when I right a test app.
[07:05:09] <bleathem_> I'll see how many ways I can through an exception, and observe how they are caught
[07:05:29] <bleathem_> I'm curious to see how well I can deal with unwrapping of exceptions.
[07:05:37] <bleathem_> EJBExceptions for instance
[07:06:26] <lightguard_jp> Catch handles all the unwrapping for you
[07:06:33] <bleathem_> oh nice
[07:07:09] <bleathem_> does it take care of how the different app servers wrap them differently?
[07:07:54] <bleathem_> anyways, I'm out for tonight.
[07:08:02] <bleathem_> tks for the tips.
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[07:33:44] <jbossbot> git [parent] push master 067dc2e.. Dan Allen use artifact version as manifest spec/impl version...
[07:33:44] <jbossbot> git [parent] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/parent/compare/3dd48fa...067dc2e
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[15:43:35] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 4e797fb.. Jozef Hartinger minor
[15:43:35] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 08ef647.. Jozef Hartinger minor
[15:43:36] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master ec98fa1.. Jozef Hartinger removed unused import and outdated comments
[15:43:36] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 1f52182.. Jozef Hartinger Initial freemarker support.
[15:43:36] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 47c8508.. Jozef Hartinger minor
[15:43:36] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 52aaa3d.. Jozef Hartinger minor
[15:43:36] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master d28898c.. Jozef Hartinger Templating support improved...
[15:43:37] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master c3da326.. Jozef Hartinger Enhanced seam-tasks sample application with templating support (freemarker)
[15:43:37] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 08b904c.. Jozef Hartinger minor
[15:43:38] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 5f13bd6.. Jozef Hartinger Added seam-servlet dependency...
[15:43:38] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master dc1c800.. Jozef Hartinger rewritten templating initialization logic
[15:43:39] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 3390604.. Jozef Hartinger added templating configuration to seam-tasks
[15:43:39] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 360bf74.. Jozef Hartinger Improved logging
[15:43:40] <jbossbot> git [rest] push master 937a47d.. Jozef Hartinger Documentation for templating
[15:44:06] <lincolnthree1> jharting: is that the resteasy stuff?
[15:44:09] <lincolnthree1> seam rest?
[15:44:40] <jharting> lincolnthree1: yes, I merged the templating branch
[15:44:48] <lincolnthree1> might i ask what you use the templating for?
[15:45:45] <jharting> lincolnthree1: for creating HTTP responses, instead of using JAXB for example, you might choose to write the xml in a template
[15:45:56] <lincolnthree1> interesting
[15:46:11] <lincolnthree1> Also could be used for an MVC
[15:46:14] <lincolnthree1> Rendering pages
[15:46:45] <jharting> lincolnthree1: yes, JAX-RS 2.0 is heading the MVC way so at some point I will align I think
[15:47:00] <lincolnthree1> yeah, i was looking in to that but couldn't find much information
[15:47:03] <lincolnthree1> do you have any?
[15:47:12] <lincolnthree1> i only found the spec proposal
[15:48:07] <jharting> lincolnthree1: yes, I also read the announcement earlier today but did not get to any details
[15:48:21] <lincolnthree1> ok then we're about even :) thanks!
[15:49:27] <jharting> lincolnthree1: but probably it will be something similar to what is in jersey http://blogs.sun.com/sandoz/entry/mvcj
[15:49:39] <lincolnthree1> Yeah I was looking at that too
[15:49:46] <lincolnthree1> That's how Jersey does it
[15:49:55] <lincolnthree1> Which is actually interesting
[15:50:03] <lincolnthree1> but there are some issues that need to be addressed
[15:50:08] <lincolnthree1> like addressing common resources
[15:50:29] <lincolnthree1> handling interactions from forms to model data
[15:50:34] <lincolnthree1> row clicks etc
[15:50:42] <lincolnthree1> otherwise we're back in the world of JSP
[15:50:51] <lincolnthree1> and request/session objects
[15:51:08] <lincolnthree1> while powerul, yes, I'd argue that it's too low-level for today's expectations
[15:54:00] <jharting> lincolnthree1: I see your point, for Seam REST the primary reason to have templating support ATM is to be able to provide nice (XML) representations including links, etc (which is not always easy with JAXB) while JAXB is OK for the consuming part where all you need is data
[15:54:41] <lincolnthree1> which makes a lot of sense
[15:55:07] <lincolnthree1> I just hope they take what they are doing in the right direction.
[15:55:12] <lincolnthree1> MVC should probably be a separate JSR
[15:55:21] <lincolnthree1> There may still be time to influence their decision.
[15:55:40] <lincolnthree1> JAX-RS should be about REST IMO, not about Web
[15:55:45] <lincolnthree1> Html
[15:55:45] <lincolnthree1> Etc
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[15:59:19] <jharting> lincolnthree1: right, let's see what they come up with. do you know if there's anyone from RH in the EG for 2.0? Bill or anyone?
[15:59:40] <lincolnthree1> Bill is not on there, I checked the list and I didn't see any RHers
[15:59:46] <lincolnthree1> I think there should be.
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[17:39:50] <lightguard_jp> Hi all
[17:40:44] <pmuir> hi jason
[17:40:57] <bleathem> hey
[17:41:19] <lightguard_jp> bleathem: How's testing coming?
[17:41:58] <bleathem> tonight hopefully - I don't get the privilige of working on open source for my day job :(
[17:42:15] <lincolnthree1> hey brian, sorry i had to run last night
[17:42:21] <lincolnthree1> i needed to be up early for a meeting
[17:42:26] <bleathem> you were running in your sleep?
[17:42:45] <bleathem> no big deal, I kind of ambushed you when I saw you sign in to IRC
[17:43:04] <lincolnthree1> I was actually just giving my computer a courtesy reboot
[17:43:08] <bleathem> damn east coasters going to bed so early :P
[17:43:12] <lincolnthree1> yeah, 1am
[17:43:13] <lincolnthree1> so early
[17:43:14] <lincolnthree1> ;)
[17:43:23] <lincolnthree1> I was up at 4:30am
[17:43:28] <bleathem> ouch
[17:43:30] <lincolnthree1> your time ;)
[17:43:54] <lincolnthree1> you had a question about an exception? i didn't quite follow what you were talking about
[17:43:55] <bleathem> Gotta love the PST!
[17:44:20] <bleathem> let me get the link
[17:45:00] <bleathem> I was studying Dan's proposal, incoporating it into what I'd done so far: https://gist.github.com/734963
[17:45:19] <bleathem> When he loops through the JSF exception list
[17:45:33] <bleathem> to pass the to catch
[17:45:37] <bleathem> he skips AbortProcessingExceptions
[17:46:01] <bleathem> I figure it's because we want JSF to see the exception, and abort the action
[17:46:20] <bleathem> but I can think of a use case where I would want Catch to handle the action
[17:46:34] <bleathem> ^sorry, handle the exception
[17:46:48] <lincolnthree1> oh
[17:47:00] <lincolnthree1> well you throw AbortProcessingException when you want JSF to halt immediately IIRC
[17:47:20] <bleathem> They also get thrown when a business exception is thrown in an actionlistener
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[17:47:35] <lincolnthree1> Hmmm... that's a good question to ask. I've never experienced that
[17:47:42] <bleathem> and I would w3ant catch handling business exceptions
[17:48:14] <bleathem> I once tried having all my actions be strings, and having all side effects occur in actionlisteners
[17:48:36] <bleathem> worked kind of nice, except for the AbortProcessingException wrapping
[17:48:54] <lincolnthree1> If that's the case, then I don't think they should be skipped.
[17:49:01] <lincolnthree1> We'll need to get his thoughts
[17:49:02] <bleathem> maybe it's enough of a corner case to skip
[17:49:24] <lincolnthree1> It might have to do with the s:viewAction tag
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[18:00:08] <lightguard_jp> If they're not handled (assuming nothing handles them) they should be rethrown
[18:01:03] <lincolnthree1> right, there's got to be a reason he intentioanlly avoids them, , though
[18:07:23] <lightguard_jp> I've got to leave, bbl.
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[19:52:29] <clerum> lincolnthree1:
[19:52:47] <clerum> do you know if it is possible to add an attribute to an h:inputText component
[19:52:57] <clerum> so that it renders a placeholder=""
[19:53:28] <clerum> <input type="text" name="j_id76:j_id79:j_id87" tabindex="10" placeholder="First Name...">
[19:56:45] <clerum> trying to do this http://davidwalsh.name/dw-content/html5-placeholder.php
[19:56:46] <lincolnthree1> ahh
[19:57:08] <lincolnthree1> mayyyybe
[19:57:08] <lincolnthree1> maybe
[19:57:12] <lincolnthree1> 1 sec
[19:57:12] <clerum> or is that writing a new renderer
[19:57:15] <clerum> k
[19:58:33] <lincolnthree1> no i dont think it works:
[19:58:34] <lincolnthree1> <f:attribute name="value" value="Click Me"></f:attribute>
[19:58:43] <lincolnthree1> only lets you set attributes on the component itself
[19:58:53] <lincolnthree1> you'll have to create a new composite component or a new renderer
[19:59:05] <clerum> yeah I tried the f:attribute
[19:59:07] <clerum> boo
[19:59:13] <lincolnthree1> sorry, jsf strikes again
[19:59:26] <clerum> that would be a nice way to futureproof a bit
[19:59:36] <lincolnthree1> they are talking about something like that i think
[20:00:00] <clerum> <s:inputText placeholder="woo!"
[20:00:20] <lincolnthree1> that exists?
[20:00:36] <clerum> :-) thought that was your job to add it :-_
[20:00:38] <clerum> :-)
[20:01:10] <clerum> would it be possible in seam faces to add an attribute like that?
[20:01:25] <clerum> or have an <s:inputText> that allows you to do that?
[20:01:40] <clerum> would help as these html5 features trickle into the browsers
[20:01:41] <lincolnthree1> seam really doesn't want to be in the business of maintaining components
[20:01:52] <lincolnthree1> richfaces might
[20:04:56] <clerum> hmm lemmie check over there
[20:05:09] <lincolnthree1> that being said... you can't be the first person to have this issue
[20:05:22] <lincolnthree1> there's got to be a component out there already
[20:05:25] <clerum> seems like a handy thing to have
[20:05:55] <lincolnthree1> I shouldn't be telling you this
[20:05:58] <lincolnthree1> but....
[20:06:28] <lincolnthree1> do this:
[20:06:35] <clerum> k
[20:06:54] <lincolnthree1> <input type="text" jsfc="h:inputText" placeholder="woo!" value="#{bean.value}" />
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[20:07:43] <lincolnthree1> that may or may not work
[20:07:45] <lincolnthree1> but it's worth a shot
[20:07:56] <lincolnthree1> it's specified behavior that nobody talks about because it's scary as hell under the covers
[20:09:09] <clerum> hmm
[20:09:12] <clerum> it skips it
[20:09:16] <lincolnthree1> darn
[20:09:16] <lincolnthree1> sorry
[20:09:25] <lincolnthree1> wait, skips what?
[20:09:34] <lincolnthree1> try adding an id="foo"
[20:10:15] <clerum> skipps the placeholder
[20:10:15] <clerum> <input id="j_id76:j_id79:foo" type="text" name="j_id76:j_id79:foo">
[20:10:21] <lincolnthree1> crap
[20:10:23] <lincolnthree1> that's what i was afraid of
[20:10:24] <lincolnthree1> ok
[20:10:25] <lincolnthree1> sorry
[20:10:26] <clerum> oh well
[20:10:36] <clerum> time to learn how write my own inputText component :-)
[20:10:48] <clerum> been looking for an excuse to dive in
[20:11:47] <clerum> seems like something that would be nice to be ablet o add with something like an <f:attribute>
[20:11:58] <clerum> something for the eg I guess
[20:12:11] <lincolnthree1> if you think about it, it technically makes sense that it isn't supported
[20:12:20] <lincolnthree1> the component would have to know how to interpret that information
[20:12:24] <lincolnthree1> im not saying it shouldn't be
[20:12:30] <lincolnthree1> but once you see how components work you'll understand
[20:13:29] <clerum> right..more passing somthing through for the html renderer
[20:13:36] <clerum> component shouldn't really care about it
[20:13:55] <clerum> doesn't need to act on it or anything...just write it with the html
[20:15:41] <clerum> but I could just query to snag the value from the title
[20:15:50] <clerum> just use jquery
[20:16:04] <lincolnthree1> jquery is probably a much simpler approach
[20:18:10] <bleathem> typical server side guys think of jQuery last! (myself included, I didn't think of it reading along either!)
[20:18:29] <lincolnthree1> i thought of javascript right away :-p
[20:18:55] <clerum> I just try and be lazy and have the server code accomplish want I want
[20:19:05] <lincolnthree1> just didn't mention it because i forget to take a step back sometimes
[20:19:13] <lincolnthree1> and figured there was some reason he wanted to do it on the server
[20:19:24] <clerum> I'll do 10 hours of work to save ten minutes
[20:19:32] <lincolnthree1> oh wait, that's the same thing brian just said
[20:19:34] <lincolnthree1> n
[20:19:35] <lincolnthree1> m
[20:20:18] <bleathem> <grinning, but nothing to add>
[20:28:16] <clerum> well that works well
[20:28:18] <clerum> :-)
[20:43:30] <lincolnthree1> back in a few
[20:43:32] <lincolnthree1> moving to starbucks
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[23:26:26] <nickarls> anyone happen to know if extended persistence contexts are supposed to be available in session ejb @postconstruct methods?
[23:26:46] <lincolnthree> It would only make sense
[23:26:54] <lincolnthree> @PostConstruct is supposed to be called after the bean is complete
[23:27:02] <lincolnthree> If that's not working I'd say it's a bug
[23:27:06] <lincolnthree> PS. Hey Nik
[23:28:00] <nickarls> hi there. ok, I'll file a jira, I'm sure I saw a null one today on as 6
[23:28:11] <nickarls> (saving my caps)
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[23:50:53] <jbossbot> git [forge] push master 45fbdd4.. Lincoln Baxter, III comment fix
[23:50:53] <jbossbot> git [forge] push master 4a9bab7.. Lincoln Baxter, III repackaged
[23:50:54] <jbossbot> git [forge] push master c836442.. Lincoln Baxter, III JavaParser now understands Enums and Annotation declarations
[23:50:54] <jbossbot> git [forge] push master URL: http://github.com/seam/forge/compare/e2ac9ec...c836442
[23:51:34] *** lincolnthree has quit IRC
[23:58:23] *** lightguard_jp has quit IRC





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