September 27, 2010 
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September 27, 2010 [00:06:43] *** nokia3510 has joined #postfix[00:10:57] <ToxicFrog> will_: because not all MTAs insist that IP addresses be enclosed in [].[00:11:31] <ToxicFrog> The whole "be strict in what you output but lenient in what you accept" philosophy.[00:12:04] *** TomHome has joined #postfix[00:15:21] <ToxicFrog> The addresses it's rejecting are all of the form user at 1 dot 2.3.4[00:20:53] *** koltroll has joined #postfix[00:21:24] *** cafuego has joined #postfix[00:21:26] *** cafuego has joined #postfix[00:23:44] <will_> Hmm... yeah very true[00:26:17] <koltroll> Good evening. I have installed a lamp-server and most things are working really good (considering I'm behind the wheels). However, some mail I send using php get's right to my inbox, some ends up in my junk and some just get rejected by the host I'm sending to. I have not done any configuration of postfix besides the most simple one where I choose that it was an Internet Site and so on.[00:26:27] <koltroll> My postconf -n output: http://pastebin.com/qxk0U26u[00:26:45] <thumbs> oh, you're read the /topic already[00:27:33] <koltroll> thumbs, I did read it. I'll re-read it then :) (postfixwiki.org didn't work for me, which I tried to visit first!)[00:27:41] <thumbs> koltroll: no, you're fine.[00:27:57] <thumbs> koltroll: however, log entries would help.[00:28:20] <koltroll> coming up.[00:31:10] <koltroll> Here is the latest I got from the log: http://pastebin.com/tAYuWWRJ[00:33:46] <roe> !rdns[00:33:47] <knoba> roe: "rdns" : A reverse lookup is often referred to as reverse resolving, or more specifically reverse DNS lookup, and is accomplished using the in-addr.arpa domain in the form of a PTR record. See the !ptr factoid as well as http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RDNS[00:34:20] *** uqlev has quit IRC[00:34:22] <koltroll> Here's it the whole mail.log for today: http://pastebin.com/D4WDsD89[00:36:26] <koltroll> yea right knoba! That's about the only thing I have understood about this I think. And all domains we have used should point to the correct ip. But now I'm thinking that since we did the dns change quite recent it might not be active everywhere yet.[00:36:43] <koltroll> When I ping foretagsbladet.se from my computer it resolvs correctly, but when I do it from the server it's the old ip.[00:36:57] <koltroll> Wow. that's really good news if that's the only problem we've got.[00:40:15] *** TomHome has quit IRC[00:40:24] <koltroll> Is that the only thing you think should be causing this problem knoba ?[00:40:51] <koltroll> Or are there other options? So I could read up on these as well and be abit more prepared tomorrow if we still encounter these problems.[00:44:48] <koltroll> oh. I've been highlighting the bot. awesome. It was meant for you roe =)[00:45:40] <roe> your server announces itself as ny.perfica.se but your rdns doesn't match that[00:48:11] <koltroll> hm. my server should announce itself as 109-74-1-173-static.serverhotell.net shouldn't it.[00:48:48] <koltroll> since that is the name I'm getting when I ping any of the domains I've pointed to the ip 109.74.1.173.[00:49:35] *** friskd has joined #postfix[00:50:56] <roe> you can have your ISP change your rdns too[00:51:15] <koltroll> are there any downsides to just use the one that I got right now?[00:51:22] <koltroll> could that become a problem?[00:53:15] <roe> I guess not, but it seems a bit lazy[00:55:00] <koltroll> would you rather tell the ISP to change the rdns to ny.perfica.se ?[00:57:01] <roe> that is what I would do[00:57:14] <Trengo> the rdns doesnt matter, as long as it matches forward[00:57:42] <Trengo> not the helo[00:57:51] <Trengo> although some servers also check helo...[01:01:53] <roe> all three should match for completeness[01:02:04] <roe> especially when you start having trouble with hotmail/yahoo/gmail[01:04:41] *** zamba has quit IRC[01:08:09] <koltroll> Alright. Thanks alot for the help and input guys![01:09:19] *** koltroll has quit IRC[01:13:48] *** smtpnewbie has joined #postfix[01:14:46] <smtpnewbie> !welcome[01:14:46] <knoba> smtpnewbie: "welcome" : welcome to #postfix! if you're joining for the first time, or are new to irc, the first thing you'll want to do is read the channel topic (/topic). it includes crucial instructions on how to effectively ask for help here, and what data you should include with your questions. the degree of success you'll have is directly related to how effectively you're able to follow those guidelines.[01:20:48] *** brancaleone has quit IRC[01:20:51] *** forsberg is now known as fOrsberg[01:21:21] *** brahama__ has joined #postfix[01:22:46] <smtpnewbie> hi[01:23:18] *** smtpnewbie is now known as halfsack[01:23:33] *** cilly has joined #postfix[01:24:01] *** halfsack has quit IRC[01:24:51] *** JonnyV_ has quit IRC[01:29:05] *** brahama__ has quit IRC[01:37:08] *** Mario__ has joined #postfix[01:37:24] *** sebbow has joined #postfix[01:38:33] <Mario__> Hi, I think there is a setting to reject all mail with a 450 error, is there a config option?[01:38:46] <Dominian> !soft_bounce[01:38:46] <knoba> Dominian: "soft_bounce" : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: Safety net to keep mail queued that would otherwise be returned to the sender. This parameter disables locally-generated bounces, and prevents the Postfix SMTP server from rejecting mail permanently, by changing 5xx reply codes into 4xx. However, soft_bounce is no cure for address rewriting mistakes or mail routing mistakes.[01:40:17] <Mario__> ok thank you.[01:40:26] <Dominian> no problem[01:46:37] <Mario__> I followed workaround's tutorial for my mail server. I installed when in sarge now I want to upgrade to lenny. I asked in the workaround forum and the author told me to do etch and then lenny.[01:46:58] <Mario__> any of you has changed from sarge to lenny?[01:47:11] <roe> not without first upgrading to etch[01:48:01] <Dominian> I don't use the distros packages for postfix anyway[01:48:05] <Dominian> I always build from source[01:48:58] <Mario__> ok then I'll do what he says. I thought to change all the config files and the DB queries, put postfix on hold, move the maildirs and then comment and uncomment as needed. Sounded easy but who knows.[01:49:59] <Mario__> I updated debian to etch and then lenny but not the mail server setup.[01:50:43] <Mario__> It's the only mail server so tuesday I'll be very careful when doing it.[01:51:01] <Mario__> as the germans say, measure three times, cut only one.[01:51:25] <will_> hehe[01:55:08] *** sebuba has joined #postfix[01:55:24] <Mario__> another question: can I make postfix faster when receiving mails locally? mine receives at 180Kbps in a 100mbit network.[01:56:04] <will_> Mario__: Check your IO for a bottleneck. Usually the first place[01:56:30] <thumbs> will is downloading pr0n on your server. Kick him out.[01:56:49] <Mario__> I'll kick him out for not sharing (:[01:57:38] <Mario__> the server is a humble webserver, load is 0.2 but I'll check top.[01:57:52] <thumbs> Mario__: the load average is not relevant[01:58:46] <Mario__> I can download from the server at 9Mb so it must be postfix.[01:59:03] <Mario__> 9MB[02:02:54] <thumbs> Mario__: prove it.[02:05:02] <Mario__> I put a 2GB file inside the apache www dir and downloaded it from the server to my dektop.[02:31:07] *** sebuba has quit IRC[02:51:31] *** ib-mobile_ has quit IRC[02:54:32] *** Mario__ has quit IRC[02:58:26] *** psilo2 has quit IRC[03:03:31] <jeev> porn has a higher QoS priority.[03:03:35] <jeev> 2gb porn, share link[03:34:49] *** wdp_aao_ has joined #postfix[03:38:31] *** wdp_aao has quit IRC[03:43:11] <will_> Linode's reputation is pretty good. Transactional emails flow through w/o delay[03:48:38] <thumbs> unless will_ is the administrator[03:49:32] <will_> yeah :/[03:49:53] <will_> I'll push more too much spam[03:50:12] *** Zeit|awy has quit IRC[03:51:22] *** Zeit|awy has joined #postfix[04:06:32] *** sysmonk has quit IRC[04:16:04] *** sysmonk has joined #postfix[04:19:17] *** xpoint has joined #postfix[04:19:48] <xpoint> anyone know what happend with mailzu ?, is it gone /dev/null ?, the former homepage is just something that is not mailzu anymore :([04:20:43] <roe> I think it died[04:20:55] <roe> a fork may or may not have happend 'mailz-ng'[04:21:07] <roe> er, mailzu-ng[04:24:31] *** nokia3510 has quit IRC[04:25:45] *** friskd has quit IRC[04:27:13] <xpoint> http://trac.husku.net/mailzu-ng/browser/CHANGELOG sad not much happend since 2007 :([04:27:21] <thumbs> so it's dead.[04:28:12] <jeremymcs> xpoint, quit cross posting[04:28:14] <xpoint> i will try to make it develop again[04:28:27] <roe> xpoint, work on a roundcube plugin instead[04:28:55] <xpoint> roe: i will[04:29:34] <xpoint> my users hate me if i remove roundcube, have horde here as my own prefered[04:31:44] <roe> I think there will be much more traction and a larger user base for a roundcube plugin[04:39:04] *** nokia3510 has joined #postfix[04:40:16] *** igie has joined #postfix[04:41:15] <igie> Anyone have the time to help me fully install postfix on jaunty?? I've been following this (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PostfixBasicSetupHowto) guide, but i'm stuck on the second setup test.[04:41:53] <thumbs> !tutorial[04:41:53] <knoba> thumbs: "tutorial" : A very common problem is that some people prefer to follow a step-by-step tutorial that shows them how to setup their server w/out reading the documentation or understanding what they are doing. If something goes wrong, they have no clue whatsoever about where to find hints, and they sometimes decide to start from scratch using a different tutorial. This is not The Proper Way.[04:41:56] <thumbs> !basic[04:41:56] <knoba> thumbs: "basic" : http://www.postfix.org/BASIC_CONFIGURATION_README.html : a good starting place for Postfix beginners, many common questions are answered here.[04:43:52] <thumbs> igie: see those two[04:45:07] <igie> thumbs: i've been to that site before, so far all seems well except for when I try "netcat mail.yourdomain.com 25" terminal/telnet just sits there...[04:45:29] <lunaphyte> don't tell us, show us.[04:46:11] *** john--__ has joined #postfix[04:47:15] <john--__> anyone aware of a way I can use includes or something of the like to manage lists of email addresses in /etc/aliases? an alias might have say 50 or 100 recipients[04:47:21] <igie> lunaphyte: how can I show you? screenshots?? is there a pastebin for screenshots? sorry i'm a beginner.[04:47:21] <john--__> we dont want to use mailman[04:47:34] <john--__> since it adds a bunch of overhead and people shouldnt be able to unsubscribe or anything[04:47:38] <john--__> its purely one way communication[04:47:45] <lunaphyte> igie: screen shots of what?[04:47:51] <lunaphyte> your terminal full of text?[04:47:59] <lunaphyte> that would be absurd.[04:48:52] <thumbs> igie: text is easy to select, copy, and paste into a pastebin[04:49:26] <lunaphyte> you aren't one of those people that email a screen shot by pasting the image into a word document, are you?[04:51:07] *** lunaphyte has quit IRC[04:52:02] <igie> lunaphyte: thumbs: that the thing, there is no text... I type "netcat mail.getupandget.com 25" in terminal, and nothing happens... the guide at (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PostfixBasicSetupHowto) says it should look like this : (http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/501254/) and I did it once before and was getting OKs from telnet, but now... i'm not getting anything... so nothing to show really.[04:52:03] <john--__> or any alternate suggestions? im trying to get our mail lists of a vax application (pmdf), and looking at what to do with about 2000 lists created by an external application[04:52:09] <john--__> igie, he's gone[04:53:02] <igie> john--__: cool.[04:55:58] <thumbs> igie: we don't care or support your third-party guide[04:56:48] <igie> thumbs: thank you, have a good night. bye.[04:58:33] *** tharkun has joined #postfix[05:01:49] <john--__> anyone in a good mood?[05:02:12] <tharkun> for chatting ?[05:03:16] *** Vivek has joined #postfix[05:03:16] *** Vivek has joined #postfix[05:03:23] *** lunaphyte has joined #postfix[05:03:24] *** lunaphyte has joined #postfix[05:03:30] <john--__> just in general[05:03:47] <tharkun> Shoot[05:04:45] <xpoint> roe: i have now updated my mailzu to have a link to mailzu-ng trac and i created a ticket, hope some dime in and get it awake, http://trac.husku.net/mailzu-ng/[05:05:19] <john--__> is my question completely insane? its weird how the mailing list world is so limited. exchange distribution groups seems easier[05:06:26] <lunaphyte> !tell igie welcome[05:06:26] <knoba> igie: "welcome" : welcome to #postfix! if you're joining for the first time, or are new to irc, the first thing you'll want to do is read the channel topic (/topic). it includes crucial instructions on how to effectively ask for help here, and what data you should include with your questions. the degree of success you'll have is directly related to how effectively you're able to follow those guidelines.[05:08:21] *** rajijoom has joined #postfix[05:08:22] <will_> Spoke too soon. Yahoo transfailed me on the bogus "deferred because you have complaints"[05:08:26] <tharkun> lunaphyte: persoanal question, what irc client are you using ?[05:08:43] <will_> Didn't set up all the good stuff yet, so probably why it's not going 100%[05:08:50] <lunaphyte> colloquy[05:09:56] <igie> knoba: lunaphyte: thank you, I will check it out.[05:11:09] <john--__> do any of you run a large number of mailing lists? mailman has issues with authentication, sympa is too complicated and has poor docs, and listserv costs more than my car[05:11:13] <john--__> what other choices exist?[05:11:44] <will_> What issues does mailman have with authentication?[05:12:06] <john--__> there's not a native way to use a database as the backend[05:12:31] <john--__> with 2000 lists it seems like mailman gets messy[05:12:45] <will_> Ok, but what does that have to do with authentication?[05:12:50] <john--__> oh, i misread[05:12:59] <john--__> having a list password associated with an email address sucks[05:13:10] <john--__> we need LDAP auth[05:13:20] <tharkun> #colloquy-mobile[05:13:58] <john--__> see, our purpose of those 2000 lists isnt really for people to subscribe[05:14:03] <john--__> they're all pre-populated[05:14:08] <will_> Spam![05:14:14] <john--__> not spam[05:14:18] <john--__> internal use at a university[05:14:26] <john--__> lists like all-voting-faculty[05:14:31] <john--__> all-sophomores[05:14:35] <john--__> crap like that[05:14:55] <john--__> but 2000 freakin combinations[05:15:07] <john--__> so secretaries can targett who they need to email about scholorship crap[05:15:11] <john--__> or new HR policies[05:15:33] <will_> It would be trivial to make something for internal use[05:15:56] <john--__> what would you suggest?[05:16:06] <will_> Does your university have a comp sci department? :)[05:16:16] <john--__> we dont even need mailman if we can just create lists somehow.[05:16:29] <john--__> ha, believe it or not, our CS dept just uses exchange distribution lists[05:16:49] <will_> So why can't you use that?[05:16:49] <john--__> we're a huge, huge huge school, and my college has more complex needs than CS[05:17:09] <john--__> partially for compatibility with legacy stuff we have[05:17:18] <john--__> and partially because we have a lot of non-campus users[05:17:27] <john--__> so we cant put them in the distribution groups[05:17:33] <john--__> bobfarmer at aol dot com[05:17:44] <will_> How are they going to subscribe/unsubscribe?[05:17:47] <john--__> (yes, we have a lot of farmers, we're the Ag college, we do outreach)[05:18:01] <john--__> they're already in a database[05:18:09] <john--__> subscribing/unsubscribing isnt a choice they have[05:18:16] <will_> So it is spam?[05:18:17] <john--__> so the current lists are handled by dumps of the database[05:18:37] <john--__> no, it goes along with the program they're in. they register for a program, and as part of it they get put in lists for the semester[05:18:37] <tharkun> lunaphyte: Thx for the info it does not run on ipod touch firmware version 2 :([05:18:56] <will_> Why can't you just import that info into mailman then?[05:19:09] <john--__> can a mailman system support 2000 lists?[05:19:21] <will_> I don't know. Ask them? I don't see why not[05:19:24] <john--__> each list makes like 5 entries in /etc/aliases[05:19:50] <will_> And?[05:20:29] <tharkun> john--__: i have a strong feeling that you should contact directly the project mailing list or their irc channel. I don't think you will find your solution here[05:21:09] <will_> I think you can make aliases a db lookup, if that's any help[05:21:17] <john--__> will_ really? how?[05:21:26] <tharkun> as for my choice, a script using mutt, mysql and a few other stuff would suffice, but then again i am no expert on mailing lists.[05:21:27] <will_> I think most maps can[05:21:30] <john--__> tharkun: yeah ill followup with mailman[05:25:35] *** shasta has quit IRC[05:25:45] *** shasta has joined #postfix[05:29:17] *** nokia3510 has quit IRC[05:29:51] *** john--__ has left #postfix[05:34:41] *** Vivek has quit IRC[05:34:51] *** MAAAAAD has joined #postfix[05:37:01] *** tharkun has quit IRC[05:38:54] *** MAAAAD has quit IRC[05:40:01] *** igie has left #postfix[05:49:26] *** Vivek has joined #postfix[05:50:52] *** friskd has joined #postfix[06:00:48] *** cilly has quit IRC[06:00:52] *** cillybabe has joined #postfix[06:01:08] *** will_ has quit IRC[06:03:17] *** Vivek has quit IRC[06:03:17] *** Vivek has joined #postfix[06:03:50] *** saurabhb has joined #postfix[06:05:17] *** saurabhb has quit IRC[06:06:48] *** will_ has joined #postfix[06:20:32] *** will_ has quit IRC[06:36:07] *** Vivek has quit IRC[06:44:26] *** ib-mobile has joined #postfix[07:07:40] *** dragonheart has joined #postfix[07:08:08] *** Motoko-chan has joined #postfix[07:15:18] *** knoba has quit IRC[07:15:19] *** Signum has quit IRC[07:24:12] *** halfsack has joined #postfix[07:29:26] *** halfsack has quit IRC[07:29:46] *** uqlev has joined #postfix[07:45:11] *** uqlev has quit IRC[07:54:44] *** knoba has joined #postfix[08:09:55] *** will_ has joined #postfix[08:12:35] *** jeev_ has joined #postfix[08:12:45] *** jeev has quit IRC[08:13:46] *** jeev_ is now known as jeev[08:23:31] *** e-jones has joined #postfix[08:29:40] *** halfsack has joined #postfix[08:34:16] *** fOrsberg is now known as forsberg[08:38:21] <halfsack> Hi[08:41:09] *** EagleWatch has joined #postfix[08:45:03] *** W_SHaRK has joined #postfix[08:45:41] *** brancaleone has joined #postfix[08:46:23] <halfsack> Do you have access to configuration variables, such as $myhostname etc, in header_checks? (So that you can insert their values in reject text, prepend text etc)[08:56:19] *** W_SHaRK has quit IRC[08:57:49] <sysmonk> afair no[09:01:47] *** Motoko-chan has quit IRC[09:05:49] <halfsack> sysmonk: too bad, it could be useful[09:19:10] <sysmonk> !tias[09:19:10] <knoba> sysmonk: "tias" : Try It And See[09:19:13] <sysmonk> halfsack: ^^[09:19:17] <sysmonk> as i might be wrong[09:19:29] <will_> sysmonk is never wrong[09:19:37] <sysmonk> i am, i am[09:19:53] <sysmonk> i was wrong on friday when i bought a new beer and thought it would taste nice[09:19:55] <sysmonk> it didn't :([09:20:36] <will_> haha[09:20:38] <will_> What kind?[09:20:58] <sysmonk> will_: well, you won't know, it's our local beer in lithuania[09:21:08] <will_> You never know, maybe I would![09:21:10] <will_> Do they have a website?[09:21:54] <sysmonk> i don't think so, and i really think that you won't know that beer[09:22:13] <will_> oh[09:22:38] <will_> http://www.fremontbrewing.com/ When you come see me, I buy[09:23:02] <sysmonk> i think this is the one http://mgkolekcija.wordpress.com/2010/07/01/ponoro-nefiltruotas-kaimiskas-alus/[09:23:21] <will_> Oh yeah, I've had that. Yeah, didn't like it[09:23:29] <sysmonk> yeah, right :)[09:23:58] <sysmonk> and when i will come to see you, that brewery won't exist anymore![09:24:06] <will_> awww :([09:24:41] <halfsack> sysmonk: i tried it allready and couldn't get it to work! I was hoping it was just my incompetence though...[09:24:48] <sysmonk> unless you want to invite me and offer me a quick job that would let me pay for the flight :)[09:25:28] <will_> Hmm...[09:25:37] <will_> It's a pita to get a US visa :([09:25:44] <sysmonk> yup[09:26:11] <sysmonk> and the flightitself would cost me half or whole of my salary[09:26:18] <will_> wow[09:26:29] <sysmonk> and that's too much for me just to drink a few beers with you :)[09:26:33] <will_> I guess not a lot of flights[09:26:40] <will_> :)[09:26:58] <sysmonk> will_: where do you live exactly?[09:27:09] <will_> Seattle[09:27:09] <sysmonk> i'm curious how much would the flight cost[09:27:15] <sysmonk> k, lemme see[09:27:20] <will_> SEA is the airport code[09:29:37] <sysmonk> two way flight to washington would cost me about half of my sallary[09:30:18] <sysmonk> and it's abuot 11 hours of flying[09:32:14] <sysmonk> well, not that it's a lot in money, as my sallary isn't big :)[09:32:23] <sysmonk> but it's about 1200USD[09:33:34] <will_> wow[09:33:44] <will_> Still pretty expensive[09:34:01] <will_> 11 hours is nothing :)[09:34:18] <sysmonk> well, there's another 6 hours of waiting for the transfer flight[09:34:22] <sysmonk> but that's in amsterdam :P[09:34:26] <sysmonk> so not a big problem :P[09:34:28] <will_> haha[09:34:48] <_ruben> 6hrs at amsterdam airport, do a stroll along all gates, and your 6hrs are over[09:35:04] <_ruben> unless they dont have any contruction shit going on atm[09:35:27] <sysmonk> or do a stroll to the nearest coffee shop[09:35:48] <will_> I don't drink coffee![09:35:56] <sysmonk> nobody does in amsterdam[09:36:01] <sysmonk> there's no actual coffee there[09:36:05] <will_> heh[09:40:41] <_ruben> most coffeeshops do offer coffee, it's just not their "hottest" product ;)[09:41:23] <_ruben> and that'd mean leaving the airport, not sure if that's allowed during a transfer[09:44:26] *** aptituz_ has joined #postfix[09:45:22] *** aptituz has quit IRC[09:45:28] <sysmonk> _ruben: it is, but you'll have to pass the security again[09:45:50] <sysmonk> i've did that in copenhagen when i had about 8 hours of free time between transfers[09:46:14] <CaBa> hi[09:46:28] <_ruben> ah ok[09:46:36] <CaBa> what is the smtp restriction that disallows sender addresses like foobar at 12 dot 23.34.1[09:46:55] <sysmonk> CaBa: which part? @12.23.34.1 ?[09:47:10] <CaBa> sysmonk: yes[09:47:13] <sysmonk> none, that's a valid address and postfix has to accept it[09:47:22] <CaBa> well it doesnt[09:47:25] <CaBa> it says[09:47:25] <CaBa> 501 5.1.7 Bad sender address syntax[09:47:34] <CaBa> In: MAIL FROM:<Minerva at 77 dot 66.155.136> BODY=7BIT SIZE=1365[09:47:34] <sysmonk> well, make the syntax correct[09:47:35] <CaBa> Out: 501 5.1.7 Bad sender address syntax[09:47:39] <sysmonk> foobar at [12 dot 23.34.1][09:48:03] <CaBa> sysmonk: you just said that would be a valid address[09:48:38] <CaBa> sysmonk: however, i want postfix to accept that mails... our upstream MTA from our internet provider accepts those, so its ugly if they get stuck when fetchmail passes them to our mta[09:48:47] <CaBa> sysmonk: how can i disable that syntax check?[09:49:11] *** UQlev has joined #postfix[09:49:28] <sysmonk> CaBa: well, i thought you wanted to block that kind of addresses, not sure if it's MUA's job to convert them to a correct address or not, but i'd bet it should be[09:49:53] <CaBa> strict_rfc821_envelopes does the trick i guess[09:49:54] <sysmonk> not sure if it's possible as it's not a standard way[09:50:07] <sysmonk> CaBa: it's disabled by default[09:50:26] <CaBa> sysmonk: its the envelope *sender* address that does the problem... i simply want postfix not to care whats in the sender address[09:51:22] <CaBa> hm indeed, thats disabled..[09:51:25] <sysmonk> !tias but i don't think it will help[09:51:26] <knoba> sysmonk: Error: "tias" is not a valid command.[09:51:39] <sysmonk> it's just against the standards[09:56:37] <CaBa> sysmonk: tias?[09:56:53] <sysmonk> !tias[09:56:53] <knoba> sysmonk: "tias" : Try It And See[09:57:19] <Aprogas> !tias foo[09:57:19] <knoba> Aprogas: Error: "tias" is not a valid command.[09:57:28] <Aprogas> Silly bot.[09:57:45] <Aprogas> !tell CaBa notify_classes[09:57:46] <knoba> CaBa: "notify_classes" : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: The list of error classes that are reported to the postmaster. The default is to report only the most serious problems. The paranoid may wish to turn on the policy (UCE and mail relaying) and protocol error (broken mail software) reports.[09:58:03] <Aprogas> Stop looking at spambots causing protocol errors on your server. :)[09:58:10] <Aprogas> What are you trying to fix here?[09:58:40] <CaBa> Aprogas: well the upstream provider MTA accepts mail from sender addresses such as blalbla at 123 dot 234.123.234[09:58:53] <CaBa> Aprogas: our fetchmail picks them up and passes them to our internal MTA that rejects them[09:59:16] <CaBa> Aprogas: but i want our MTA to accept everything the upstream MTA accepts. thats the policy that has to be implemented[09:59:33] <CaBa> Aprogas: so i wonder how to make postfix accept that mail.[10:00:23] <Aprogas> Do you have any _restrictions ?[10:00:54] <CaBa> smtpd_recipient_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, reject_unauth_destination[10:01:05] <CaBa> thats the only restriction set[10:02:30] <Aprogas> I think address literals have to be [bracket] enclosed also in the address, but you might instruct cleanup or trivial-rewrite to fix that out for you.[10:02:49] *** skymeyer has joined #postfix[10:03:26] <sysmonk> Aprogas: but isn't that done after smtp session ?[10:03:30] *** skymeyer has quit IRC[10:03:55] *** skymeyer has joined #postfix[10:04:17] <CaBa> i think so. and the invalid sender address is already rejected before DATA[10:04:34] <CaBa> mail from: <foobar at 10 dot 123.23.12>[10:04:34] <CaBa> 501 5.1.7 Bad sender address syntax[10:04:34] <CaBa> mail from: <foobar at [10 dot 123.234.1]>[10:04:34] <CaBa> 250 2.1.0 Ok[10:04:35] <Aprogas> I think smtpd talks with cleanup before-DATA to expanded aliases and such.[10:04:38] <CaBa> so brackets it should be[10:04:38] <sysmonk> as far as i understand he fetches his mail with fetchmail and fetchmail sends it through postfix[10:04:52] <sysmonk> so your best guess would tell fetchmail to fix that[10:05:02] <Aprogas> CaBa: I vaguely remember there is a setting that would convert non-bracketed literals to bracketed.[10:05:12] <CaBa> fetchmail is a bitch. i dont think it'll be able to do that[10:05:56] <Aprogas> !tell CaBa resolve_numeric_domain[10:05:56] <knoba> CaBa: "resolve_numeric_domain" : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: Resolve 'user@ipaddress' as 'user@[ipaddress]', instead of rejecting the address as invalid.[10:06:23] <CaBa> knoba: thank you!![10:06:23] <Aprogas> Also, introducing fetchmail into an SMTP-delivery chain isn't very robust.[10:06:26] <CaBa> very nice :)[10:06:44] <Aprogas> Using fetchmail to write directly to a mailbox is acceptable, but reinserting into SMTP just feels wrong.[10:06:44] <CaBa> Aprogas: i'm aware of that. unfortunately i am not authorized to restructure that mail setup[10:07:06] <Aprogas> Your boss is not authorized to manage a technical workforce.[10:07:47] <sysmonk> Aprogas: doh, didn't know that setting existed[10:08:17] <Aprogas> Postfix will let you break some standards on the receiving end.[10:13:59] *** Dovid[Laptop] has joined #postfix[10:14:25] *** Dovid has quit IRC[10:18:38] <sysmonk> act_like_qmail and act_like_lotus_notes settings?[10:18:39] <sysmonk> ;)[10:19:54] <Aprogas> rewrite_valid_mail_as_if_submitted_by_outlook_express[10:43:01] *** Dovid[Laptop] is now known as Dovid[10:58:18] *** Ill has joined #postfix[10:58:20] <Ill> hi people[10:58:29] <Ill> does anyone uses maia+postfix[10:59:18] *** pinoyskull has quit IRC[10:59:43] <Aprogas> !tell Ill poll[10:59:43] <knoba> Ill: "poll" : please do not ask if anyone uses some program or postfix feature. Instead ask your real question.[11:00:09] *** bricid has joined #postfix[11:01:26] <Trengo> i didnt know maia was still being developed[11:01:45] <Ill> Trengo: don't you like it ?[11:02:18] <Aprogas> Ill: For which organisation are you conducting this poll? Where will we find the published results after it is complete?[11:02:54] <Trengo> Ill oh yeah[11:03:34] <Ill> ups sorry ok I'm doing some test with maia+postfix+clamav sending mail via telent. the thing is that maia doesn't label well the mail[11:04:57] <Ill> I mean the spam. I have "consider mail spam when score is 5" but when I get messages with a score of 5 or more it doesn't consider it as a spam[11:05:08] <Ill> I don't know where the problem is[11:05:16] <Ill> Aprogas: sorry I didn't understand well that question :p[11:05:19] <Ill> any ideas ?[11:06:20] *** Dovid[Laptop] has joined #postfix[11:07:08] <Aprogas> If Maia correctly receives the mail from Postfix, this sounds more like a Maia problem than a Postfix problem.[11:07:42] <Trengo> ask the maia guys[11:07:58] <Trengo> they're very helpful IIRC[11:08:17] *** TomHome has joined #postfix[11:08:42] <Ill> I'm on maia channel[11:08:46] <Ill> there are 2 guys[11:08:51] <Ill> sleeping xD[11:08:58] *** Twinkletoes has joined #postfix[11:09:17] <Aprogas> We get SA and Amavis people in here all the time too.[11:09:18] *** Dovid has quit IRC[11:11:10] *** Dovid[Laptop] has quit IRC[11:12:52] *** possi has joined #postfix[11:12:53] *** possi has quit IRC[11:13:12] *** pinoyskull has joined #postfix[11:16:06] *** Dovid has joined #postfix[11:17:04] <Trengo> americans *should* be sleeping now[11:17:40] <Aprogas> Even Alaskans and Hawaiians?[11:17:56] <Trengo> no idea[11:19:57] <Ill> spanish are up now :p[11:20:34] <Ill> Maia marks all mails as a "Suspected spam" instead of "confirmed spam", that's my problem[11:20:52] *** hever has joined #postfix[11:21:19] <Aprogas> I guess Maia has multiple tag levels: not spam, suspected spam, confirmed spam, silent-drop spam, etc.[11:22:45] <Ill> yes[11:25:42] *** JoKoT3 has joined #postfix[11:27:02] *** hever has quit IRC[11:27:58] *** hever has joined #postfix[11:30:11] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[11:36:25] *** bricid has quit IRC[11:43:10] *** henriknj_ has joined #postfix[11:43:35] *** henriknj has quit IRC[11:47:17] *** wdp has joined #postfix[11:47:18] *** wdp has quit IRC[11:47:18] *** wdp has joined #postfix[11:51:45] *** cpm has joined #postfix[11:51:51] *** henriknj_ has quit IRC[11:53:28] *** wdp has quit IRC[11:53:54] *** wdp has joined #postfix[11:53:55] *** wdp has joined #postfix[11:57:43] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[12:00:07] *** henriknj has quit IRC[12:00:51] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[12:01:34] *** jamesmacleod has joined #postfix[12:03:01] *** hever has quit IRC[12:03:52] *** hever has joined #postfix[12:28:03] *** rajijoom has quit IRC[12:29:11] *** henriknj has quit IRC[12:38:14] *** _bt has left #postfix[12:50:20] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[12:53:42] *** UQlev_ has joined #postfix[12:53:47] *** EdwardIII has joined #postfix[12:54:22] <EdwardIII> hey - can someone point me to a doc that shows how to log postfix messages elsewhere than /var/log/maillog? not sure if there's some channel i can just capture in /etc/syslog.conf and redirect or whether i need to modify postfix config?[12:56:48] <sysmonk> !log[12:56:48] <knoba> sysmonk: Error: You don't have the owner capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.[12:56:51] <sysmonk> !syslog[12:56:51] <knoba> sysmonk: Error: "syslog" is not a valid command.[12:56:55] <sysmonk> damn[12:56:57] <sysmonk> !log_facility[12:56:57] <knoba> sysmonk: Error: "log_facility" is not a valid command.[12:56:59] <sysmonk> ;/[12:57:12] <sysmonk> !syslog_facility[12:57:12] <knoba> sysmonk: "syslog_facility" : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: The syslog facility of Postfix logging. Specify a facility as defined in syslog.conf(5). The default facility is "mail".[12:57:15] <sysmonk> hooray![12:57:23] *** UQlev has quit IRC[12:57:55] *** UQlev_ has quit IRC[13:00:03] *** makomi has joined #postfix[13:11:37] *** cillybabe is now known as cilly[13:15:15] *** EagleWatch has quit IRC[13:15:31] *** EagleWatch has joined #postfix[13:17:10] *** swombat has joined #postfix[13:20:15] <swombat> My mail server is suddenly getting a whole bunch of "User unknown", "Address rejected" and "Invalid recipient" or even "Host not found" responses from SMTP servers, for emails that are, I'm pretty sure, known (they've registered and confirmed their emails on our service). This started just now about 10 minutes ago and is ongoing. We are not on any blacklists according to mxtoolbox and other tools. Any thoughts what could b[13:20:15] <swombat> e going wrong?[13:20:40] <sysmonk> !pastebin[13:20:40] <knoba> sysmonk: "pastebin" : see !paste[13:20:42] <sysmonk> !paste[13:20:43] <knoba> sysmonk: "paste" : do not paste more than 3-4 lines in the channel. a pastebin is a way to share larger amounts of data with others, without flooding the channel with garbage. try http://pastebin.com or http://paste.debian.net (or use google and find your own). don't forget to tell us the url where you pasted the text[13:20:44] <sysmonk> !logs[13:20:44] <knoba> sysmonk: "logs" : postfix logs to the mail facility of syslog. Something like grep -i `postconf -h syslog_facility` /etc/syslog.conf should tell you where logs are going. also see !no_logs and !have2mung[13:20:56] <sysmonk> might be DNS issues, we can't see anything if you don't provide logs[13:21:03] <swombat> ok, one sec[13:21:05] *** Vivek has joined #postfix[13:25:36] *** TomHome has quit IRC[13:33:48] <swombat> ok, here you go[13:33:49] <swombat> http://pastie.org/private/ity8k3pxnsrjgt24qy8buq[13:34:27] <EdwardIII> sysmonk, that's excellent. thanks![13:34:31] <swombat> worth noting that only some emails are failing... and others are delivering fine, even to the same domains that bounced... and also, the spurt of failed emails seems to have stopped, so this seems like it was a transient email[13:34:37] <swombat> er, a transient problem[13:35:08] <roe> what type of table are these users in?[13:35:25] <swombat> these are not our users, we're delivering mail to them[13:35:34] <swombat> i.e. from our smtp to theirs[13:35:36] <sysmonk> EdwardIII: ? :)[13:35:43] <Aprogas> Looks like DNS problems.[13:35:43] <EdwardIII> sysmonk, syslog_facility[13:35:47] <sysmonk> oh :)[13:36:12] <Aprogas> Actually looks like all sorts of different problems.[13:36:39] <roe> postconf -n?[13:36:47] <swombat> roe: that to me?[13:36:51] <roe> yes[13:37:01] <sysmonk> swombat: actually, everything is fine[13:37:13] <sysmonk> atleast i see the same ip's and NXDOMAIN's[13:37:21] <sysmonk> wtpartnerships.com doesn't exist[13:37:21] *** Vivek has quit IRC[13:37:34] <Aprogas> sysmonk: Then it's not a DNS problem. :)[13:37:47] <Aprogas> swombat: How high is your mail traffic?[13:37:53] <sysmonk> other HOsts's resolve to the same ip's[13:37:58] <swombat> not very high, though seems to have been quite high those few minutes[13:38:00] <sysmonk> so you're talking to the correct ip's[13:38:12] <swombat> for those minutes i think it was up to a hundred mails a minute[13:38:16] <Aprogas> If someone is sending a mass mailing through your server, it makes sense to get mass bouncing back.[13:38:23] <sysmonk> swombat: maybe some marketing jerk sent a mailing list to some old email addrss base ?[13:38:24] <Aprogas> These all seem like errors thrown by remote servers.[13:38:36] <sysmonk> yup[13:38:38] <swombat> sysmonk: nah, only our webapp has access to this mail server[13:38:53] <Aprogas> Are any of these addresses your clients?[13:38:54] <swombat> mind you, users can send mail through the webapp to other registered users[13:38:59] <swombat> they're all our clients[13:39:02] <Aprogas> PHP-scripts have a tendence to be leaky and allow mail() exploits.[13:39:09] <swombat> this is a rails app[13:39:11] <sysmonk> swombat: then maybe the marketing jerk hacked your webapp (like, emailed your boss and asked for access) and used some webapp to send the mailing list ? :)[13:39:21] <swombat> I'm the boss :-)[13:39:27] <sysmonk> oh noes, that's a bigger problem[13:39:37] <swombat> hehe[13:39:48] <Aprogas> Scroll up in your logs, check what started it all.[13:39:55] <swombat> good idea[13:41:29] <swombat> first bounce is at 11:16 to a registered, confirmed user... but got a "550 5.1.1 User Unknown" from the mail server[13:41:38] <swombat> just before that there are successful mails to wtpartnership.com..[13:41:51] *** sysop has joined #postfix[13:41:54] *** sysop has quit IRC[13:42:19] <Aprogas> postfix/smtp is the client, there is likely a postfix/pickup postfix/smtpd or similar above the first postfix/smtp log entry that reveals what started it[13:43:26] <Aprogas> Postfix doesn't generate mails (some exceptions like bounces and notify_classes), it passes along mails generated by something else. Find out how the mail-generator fed into Postfix, then find out who the mail-generator is, and ask it/them what it/they is/are doing.[13:43:36] <swombat> oh, facepalm. I know what's sending a lot of emails at this time - our weekly activity email[13:43:45] <swombat> this is not spam, though, it's something that people opt in into[13:43:57] <Aprogas> You should make a bounce handler.[13:44:09] <swombat> goes to all users, summarises the last week's activity on their projects... so these could be just normal real bounces i guess![13:44:30] <Aprogas> Repeatedly sending to nonexistent addresses is treated my some mailservers (yahoo, gmail) as spammy behaviour, which can give your mailserver a few spammy-points.[13:45:05] <swombat> sorry for bothering you guys, I wasn't sure what was going on and I thought maybe something was deeply broken, but you're right, we need to implement a bounce handler. I only just implemented delivery failure notifications, which meant this week for the first time I got about 25 emails telling me about email delivery failures all at once...[13:45:11] <Aprogas> Repeated bounces should be fed back to your administration department, who then contacts the client for updated contact information.[13:46:06] <swombat> i panicked :o( Sorry for taking up your time, and thanks a lot for the help![13:47:13] *** pinoyskull has quit IRC[13:47:40] *** filiusdeus has joined #postfix[13:48:17] <EdwardIII> hrm ok now postconf shows syslog_facility = smtp and syslog_name = postfix, i've added smtp.* -/var/log/smtp into /etc/syslog.conf, restarted postfix & syslog, but no /var/log/smtp has appeared?[13:48:26] <Aprogas> I've had these panics. I had turned on all notify_classes for the testing phase. Then the 5000-recipient mass-mailing went out.[13:48:39] <EdwardIII> can't see any complaints in /var/log/messages[13:48:44] <Aprogas> EdwardIII: smtp is not a facility[13:48:51] <Aprogas> syslog is ancient[13:48:53] <swombat> Aprogas: that's exactly what happened. about 7000 odd emails there[13:49:15] <EdwardIII> Aprogas, hrm, should i use local[some high number] /var/log/smtp then?[13:49:25] <Aprogas> What's wrong with the mail facility?[13:49:25] <EdwardIII> Aprogas, how can i choose what number to use?[13:49:40] <EdwardIII> Aprogas, i want to seperate out postfix and cyrus logging[13:49:52] *** BigWookie has joined #postfix[13:50:11] <BigWookie> hi, i've got a problem, my postfix ignores my /etc/aliases as it seems[13:50:12] <Aprogas> You could use any localN that isn't used by something else; you could even annex something ancient like LOG_UUCP.[13:50:19] <Aprogas> !tell BigWookie welcome[13:50:19] <knoba> BigWookie: "welcome" : welcome to #postfix! if you're joining for the first time, or are new to irc, the first thing you'll want to do is read the channel topic (/topic). it includes crucial instructions on how to effectively ask for help here, and what data you should include with your questions. the degree of success you'll have is directly related to how effectively you're able to follow those guidelines.[13:50:34] <EdwardIII> Aprogas, how can i check which localN are in use and which aren't?[13:51:22] <Aprogas> EdwardIII: Easy way, pick one at random, if another daemon also ends up in /var/log/smtp that was also using that same localN[13:51:38] <Aprogas> EdwardIII: Hard way, check all configurations of all daemons that run for which syslog facility they log to[13:51:55] <EdwardIII> heh Aprogas thanks[13:52:19] *** uqlev has joined #postfix[13:53:27] <BigWookie> okay sorry, Postfix is working properly, but the local mail delivery to another adress won't work because it seems /etc/aliases ( .db) is ignored, i ran newaliases and reload of postfix , in my config i got ( alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases[13:53:32] <BigWookie> alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases[13:54:20] <Aprogas> Did you run the right newaliases? How about that postconf -n and logs the welcome factoid and topic requested of you?[13:54:24] <roe> BigWookie, pastebin[13:55:18] <BigWookie> thought it wouldn't be neccesary , but i'll paste them[13:55:55] <Aprogas> If something "doesn't work", logs are always necessary.[13:56:04] <Aprogas> As is the configuration that is being used.[13:57:07] <EdwardIII> hrm Aprogas i'm seeing: /etc/postfix/main.cf: parameter syslog_facility: unrecognized value: local10[13:57:52] <Aprogas> As I said, syslog is ancient. You could consult syslog documentation.[13:58:09] <EdwardIII> ok, thanks![13:58:21] <EdwardIII> only goes up to local7[13:58:25] <EdwardIII> what the hell[13:58:36] *** saurabhb has joined #postfix[13:59:06] <Aprogas> 24 facilities should be enough for everyone![13:59:27] <EdwardIII> hah along with 512k of ram?[14:00:48] *** cpm has quit IRC[14:02:39] *** uqlev has quit IRC[14:03:27] *** zuran_ has joined #postfix[14:04:24] *** Mugen has joined #postfix[14:05:46] <BigWookie> http://pastebin.com/cBzDMAiX[14:06:16] *** cpm has joined #postfix[14:06:24] *** cpm has joined #postfix[14:07:26] <roe> BigWookie, is xxxx.com or whatever a local domain or virtual one?[14:08:05] <BigWookie> its a real domain( and the hostname of the server )[14:08:15] <Aprogas> Yes, but what address class is it in?[14:08:15] <roe> BigWookie, is xxxx.com or whatever a local domain or virtual one?[14:08:30] <Aprogas> Also what is the address class of the domain in /etc/mailname ?[14:09:03] <BigWookie> /etc/mailname is xxxx.com[14:09:10] <roe> fix line 52[14:09:26] <BigWookie> had it fixed, can refix it[14:09:51] <BigWookie> thought that could help :S but i reverse it[14:10:15] <EdwardIII> hrm postfix doesn't seem to put it's startup logging into the custom log, or anywhere for that matter[14:10:18] <zuran_> Is it possible to automatically hold all incoming emails, and release them after a by me specified time? I'm setting up postfix relays at work which should deliver all emails marked as suspected spam, and would like the emails to be delayed for a couple of days so we get the time to clean upp spam from the queue. I work at an ISP and our customers are spamming like hell :)[14:10:19] <Aprogas> /etc/aliases only applies to mail delivered by local(8)[14:10:30] <Aprogas> Use virtual aliases to rewrite other mail.[14:10:33] <EdwardIII> Aprogas, syslog or postfix' doing you think?[14:11:26] <Aprogas> Also I'm not sure how the sendmail-pickup-chain handles the recipient "root" but I think $myorigin will get added, even if it is a recipient.[14:11:29] <BigWookie> oO[14:12:07] <EdwardIII> ah wait, now it is, all good. thanks![14:12:08] *** sebuba has joined #postfix[14:12:38] <Aprogas> zuran_: Several spamfilters offer quarantine features, but Postfix doesn't quarantine by itself.[14:13:11] <BigWookie> roe: fixed it the mail is delivered now, but it still ignores /etc/aliases.db, if i change the adress to a invalid it still works[14:13:15] <Aprogas> zuran_: It is probably possible to freeze all mail delivery, but playing with Postfix queues is messy.[14:13:17] <roe> zuran_, sure[14:13:33] <Aprogas> !tell BigWookie postmapq[14:13:33] <knoba> BigWookie: "postmapq" : You can check your lookups with the postmap command. Example: if you defined transport_maps = mysql:/etc/postfix/transport.cf you may check this mapping by running postmap -q example.com mysql:/etc/postfix/transport.cf and see if it works.[14:13:44] <roe> you can put all incoming mail in the hold queue[14:14:04] <zuran_> roe, yeah, I know how to do it with postsuper -H / -h ALL[14:14:27] <zuran_> roe, but in this case I'd like all emails to be delayed for a day or two before attempting to deliver[14:15:08] <roe> you will have to release them manually or schedule a script to run to release them[14:18:39] *** uqlev has joined #postfix[14:24:02] *** feisar has joined #postfix[14:24:36] <zuran_> roe, good idea... I'll just place them all on hold automatically, and run a script that releases the emails based on their time stamp[14:26:49] *** BigWookie has quit IRC[14:27:32] *** Section1 has joined #postfix[14:35:33] *** suchu has joined #postfix[14:36:44] *** suchu has quit IRC[14:42:55] *** koollman has joined #postfix[14:44:50] *** nokia3510 has joined #postfix[14:49:31] *** uqlev has quit IRC[14:51:07] *** famicom has quit IRC[14:51:08] *** henriknj has quit IRC[14:54:29] *** Dovid has quit IRC[14:57:17] *** misterJack has joined #postfix[15:05:57] <Mugen> Can someone send me either an unscrewed up default main.cf or one configured for simple deb lenny domain setup? I've toasted mine..[15:06:43] *** famicom has joined #postfix[15:08:31] <sysmonk> unscrew it[15:08:39] <sysmonk> i have a screw driver somewhere[15:09:19] <Mugen> its screwed pretty badly.. its infact become a ssl key file..[15:09:39] <aptituz_> Mugen: dpkg-reconfigure -plow postfix does not work for you?[15:09:48] *** aptituz_ is now known as aptituz[15:10:07] <Mugen> plow! .. did it without that bounches of times[15:10:36] <Mugen> thanks[15:10:42] <aptituz> well, depending on your dpkg configuration that is not needed[15:11:14] *** technoid_ has joined #postfix[15:11:25] *** technoid_ has left #postfix[15:13:25] *** Toerkeium has quit IRC[15:13:49] <Mugen> it doesnt reask those questions with out it for me on deb lenny... of coarse now it still isnt working heh[15:14:41] <aptituz> in the end there is still purge and reinstall.[15:14:48] <Mugen> 205.185.120.135 does not like recipient. Remote host said: 554 5.7.1 <doug at wargo dot biz>: Relay access denied Giving up on 205.185.120.135.[15:15:54] <Mugen> so your a relay if your a standard pop3 mail server? thought relay was something else?[15:18:55] <Mugen> Oh well, almost time to go to work guess I'll fix it tomorrow (or try dovecot heh)[15:19:20] *** Mugen has quit IRC[15:20:54] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[15:26:11] *** brancal has joined #postfix[15:27:37] *** henriknj has quit IRC[15:27:52] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[15:29:13] *** brancaleone has quit IRC[15:29:57] *** Ill has left #postfix[15:29:59] *** Ill has joined #postfix[15:33:52] *** brancal is now known as brancaleone[15:38:36] *** UQlev has joined #postfix[15:41:56] *** wdp has quit IRC[15:42:12] *** wdp has joined #postfix[15:42:12] *** wdp has joined #postfix[15:46:26] *** JonnyV has joined #postfix[15:46:54] *** bluethundr has joined #postfix[15:51:37] *** hever has quit IRC[16:05:20] *** JonnyV has quit IRC[16:13:11] *** henriknj has quit IRC[16:16:08] *** ssureshot has joined #postfix[16:16:45] *** hever has joined #postfix[16:19:43] *** higuita has quit IRC[16:21:21] *** zooz has left #postfix[16:26:53] *** dwarder has joined #postfix[16:28:14] <dwarder> semicolon for address separation is valid?[16:28:37] <dwarder> to: email at example dot com; email2 at example dot com[16:28:41] <dwarder> ?[16:29:46] <lunaphyte_> what does this have to do with postfix?[16:29:59] <Dominian> no kidding[16:30:25] <lunaphyte_> go ask whoever wrote the program you're using.[16:32:55] <dwarder> i see, they don't know[16:33:03] <dwarder> it is php mail function[16:33:09] <dwarder> they == #php[16:33:23] <lunaphyte_> bummer.[16:33:39] <dwarder> they thinks this is somehow related to arguments passed to sendmail in php.ini[16:33:56] <lunaphyte_> that sure would be pretty easy to determine, i would think.[16:33:56] <dwarder> think*[16:34:55] <dwarder> lunaphyte_: my shared hosting provider just switched off possibility to separate emails with ; , and i want to know where you set it[16:35:10] <dwarder> with semicolon[16:35:23] <dwarder> now i can separate mails with comma only[16:36:58] <lunaphyte_> tell them to turn it back on.[16:40:37] <Dominian> Or if you can... write code using pear's mail() factory and be done with it[16:41:04] <dwarder> lunaphyte_: their support sux, they say that they didn't change anything and problem is your scripts(not true) and if you want aswers write email to us, i did already they just don't answer them, anyway i changed to ,(comma) and it works now, but what is left is curiosity, how they did this[16:41:27] <thumbs> as usual, the ##php folks are morons.[16:41:28] <dwarder> aswers==answers[16:41:33] <lunaphyte_> what does this have to do with postfix?[16:41:47] <thumbs> dwarder: take it to the appropriate channel.[16:41:55] *** dragonheart has quit IRC[16:41:57] *** halfsack has quit IRC[16:41:58] <Zerberus> lunaphyte: as much as it has with Sendmail, where he asks the same[16:42:10] <dwarder> Zerberus: hi :)[16:42:17] *** e-jones has quit IRC[16:43:14] <dwarder> thumbs: 14:49 as usual, the ##php folks are morons[16:43:21] <dwarder> thumbs: go back there? l)[16:43:23] <dwarder> ;)[16:43:30] <thumbs> dwarder: I never entered.[16:43:43] <thumbs> dwarder: all I hear is report of them sending out users to the wrong channels.[16:44:07] <dwarder> anyway there should be at least one php coder[16:44:17] <thumbs> dwarder: pardon me?[16:44:47] <Zerberus> dwarder: frankly, when it comes to PHP it seems everyone thinks to be a coder[16:45:22] <sysmonk> ofcourse, my grandma knows php![16:45:42] <dwarder> i believe you[16:46:10] <sysmonk> hm, it seems both my grandmas know php![16:46:21] <sysmonk> they're both php-fu's[16:53:28] *** tharkun has joined #postfix[16:53:35] <lunaphyte_> hm, so your logic is that since there is probably someone in a channel who might know the answer to your question, it's appropriate to ask?[16:53:54] <lunaphyte_> i also know about carpentry. shall i answer questions about that here as well?[16:55:40] <sysmonk> lunaphyte_: um, yes?[16:56:10] <thumbs> lunaphyte_: that's a major pet peeve of mine too. I can't stand it.[16:56:56] <sysmonk> well, actually, i think that IT related questions (not related to postfix) should go to a specific channel. But carpentry related questions can go to #postfix / lunaphyte_ directly[16:58:32] <dwarder> \[17:02:12] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[17:04:25] *** f3ew has quit IRC[17:04:49] <tharkun> Gentlemen good morning. on postscreen_whitelist_networks i need to add a single ip, can i do postscreen_whitelist_networks = $mynetworks, xx.xx.xx.xx ?[17:05:21] *** f3ew has joined #postfix[17:08:38] *** dwarder has left #postfix[17:08:59] <tharkun> Second question. Is it more expensive to look for an ip on postscreen_blacklist_networks or keep on doing test up to the dns blocklist test ?[17:10:59] <tharkun> If anyone has at least an idea on what the answer is or where it may be located it would be apreciated. Also a way to meassure or test either would also be apreciated. ;P[17:15:48] *** JonnyV has joined #postfix[17:17:58] *** astinus_ has quit IRC[17:18:31] *** astinus has joined #postfix[17:35:34] *** gencha has quit IRC[17:35:52] *** intelinsider has quit IRC[17:36:38] *** intelinsider has joined #postfix[17:37:46] *** gencha has joined #postfix[17:44:59] *** tPl0ch has joined #postfix[17:50:24] *** filiusdeus has quit IRC[17:51:09] *** Zearth has joined #postfix[17:54:09] *** friskd has quit IRC[17:54:13] *** Blue-E2 has joined #postfix[17:55:30] <Blue-E2> What causes this: status=deferred (delivery temporarily suspended:[17:56:01] <Aprogas> Truncating the useful part of the error causes that.[17:56:05] <UQlev> Blue-E2, wrong moon-phase[17:56:36] <Blue-E2> nice, but really what defers delivery?[17:56:51] <Blue-E2> or rather, why is delivery being suspended?[17:56:59] <UQlev> paste full log[17:57:14] <tharkun> Blue-E2: rephrasing what you were told, unless you paste the full log it will not be usefull at all[17:57:41] <Blue-E2> ok, it looks like my machine is being used to send junk.. how much of the log do you want? a few lines?[17:58:06] <UQlev> Blue-E2, all lines relevant to defferred message[17:58:57] <Blue-E2> post here or a pastebin?[17:59:07] <tharkun> pastebin[17:59:12] <UQlev> of course pastebin or dpaste[18:00:45] <Blue-E2> Here is a grab of the last page or so of the log file: http://pastebin.com/nHHFrR1r[18:00:57] <Blue-E2> so my machine is being used to spam?[18:01:51] <Blue-E2> what caused me to start checking, is that I am not receiving any mail to my info@ box.[18:04:16] <rob0> The last "page" is least likely to have relevant information. You need to search and find when/how the deferred messages arrived.[18:04:19] <UQlev> Blue-E2, http://www.mxtoolbox.com/SuperTool.aspx?action=mx%3a71.95.205.162 this might help[18:05:13] <UQlev> Blue-E2, your server is blacklisted and not only 1 server refuse to receive mails from you[18:06:09] <Blue-E2> my server is BL because it is not using the FQDN?[18:06:30] <Blue-E2> or because it was relaying too much junk?[18:07:47] <tharkun> Blue-E2: One step at a time. Fix your FQDN then look for the relaying of junk[18:08:08] <UQlev> Blue-E2, http://postmaster.yahoo.com/421-ts01.html e.g. yahoo.com may just delay delivery sorta greylisting[18:08:11] <adaptr> unrelated. he should find one message and grep the log for the queue-id[18:08:24] <adaptr> UQlev: they don't. they throttle[18:08:58] <Blue-E2> ok, ok. so the problem now is in my mx record pointing to an IP and not my fqdn right?[18:09:26] <tharkun> The first problem you have to solve. Yes[18:09:36] <rob0> ivmSIP and Barracuda are significant lists. Wouldn't hurt to RIGHT NOW stop Postfix.[18:10:10] <rob0> (before you send out more spam and get on more lists)[18:10:48] <tharkun> Blue-E2: also do a postconf -n before stoping postfix so you know where to start looking for trouble[18:11:05] <adaptr> I'm still waiting for actual logs from actual messages with actual problems that are actually going wrong. actually[18:11:24] * tharkun actually tazes adaptr[18:11:32] <UQlev> adaptr, there are a bunch of those[18:11:39] <adaptr> no, actually, you didn't. actually[18:11:40] <seekwill> Boeing rejected a message from my Yahoo account, because of spam.[18:11:41] <seekwill> heh[18:11:45] <rob0> postconf(1) still works on a stopped Postfix.[18:11:52] <adaptr> UQlev: a temp deferral is NOT a problem. not without corroboration[18:12:03] <rob0> seekwill![18:12:09] <seekwill> rob0![18:12:10] <adaptr> kill will![18:12:12] <adaptr> Pt 3[18:12:13] <Blue-E2> my postconf -n: http://pastebin.com/CyLTvvdY[18:13:12] <Blue-E2> ive stopped postfix[18:13:57] <UQlev> adaptr, look at his timestaps, 3 a sec, his queue might be flooded[18:14:10] <adaptr> UQlev: I haven't looked at anything :)[18:14:20] *** tPl0ch has quit IRC[18:14:38] <adaptr> I'm so glad I'm not eating yet[18:15:17] <Blue-E2> right, so much in the log, and so rapidly[18:15:21] <UQlev> Blue-E2, stop your postfix immediately[18:15:26] <Blue-E2> I have[18:15:41] <UQlev> Blue-E2, and all services like httpd[18:15:47] <Blue-E2> ok[18:16:00] <rob0> trace back ONE of the spams by queue ID to where it originated. Yes, stopping httpd is a good idea too.[18:16:26] <Blue-E2> ok I have this log open[18:17:15] *** robotarmy has quit IRC[18:17:57] *** robotarmy has joined #postfix[18:18:02] *** robotarmy has joined #postfix[18:20:46] *** Toerkeium has joined #postfix[18:21:18] <UQlev> Blue-E2, doubtfully that your postfix relaying that spam itself. Seems like your server has a backdoor for local submission via httpd/php[18:21:24] <Toerkeium> guys, when the queue grows up constantly, it's because I'm in need of processes of smtpd and virtual?[18:22:22] <UQlev> Toerkeium, need of read logs[18:23:17] <Blue-E2> ok, we do use squirrelmail on our local intranet, but how would anything be getting in if it is just local?[18:23:19] <UQlev> Toerkeium, if you need to discuss them, dpaste or pastebin it and give a link[18:24:15] <Toerkeium> UQlev: any special "sign" to pay atttention? regarding this bottleneck queue issue?[18:24:52] <UQlev> Toerkeium, status=deferred is your key[18:24:53] <adaptr> Toerkeium: read the logs, sum up the queue sizes, AND look at running processes[18:26:09] <UQlev> Blue-E2, postqueue -p[18:26:36] <Blue-E2> wow[18:26:43] <Toerkeium> adaptr: I woke up today with 5000+ messages in queue, running 100 smtpd processes, and logs we not of much help, as I tried to find some 'error|fatal' but nothing came up, at least in maillog[18:27:25] <UQlev> Blue-E2, impressing?[18:27:33] <Blue-E2> still loading![18:27:43] <Toerkeium> UQlev: oh, checking[18:28:34] <UQlev> Toerkeium, http://www.mxtoolbox.com/ go and check your IP for blacklisting as well[18:29:36] <Aprogas> multirbl.valli.org is better in my opinion[18:32:04] <Blue-E2> still going...[18:32:05] <adaptr> Toerkeium: grep "defer" /your/mail/log | less[18:32:12] *** ib-mobile has quit IRC[18:32:40] <tharkun> adaptr: adding -S to less renders a clearer and more easy to read output[18:33:01] *** ib-mobile has joined #postfix[18:33:12] <adaptr> tharkun: good to know, thanks - testing that out[18:33:20] <adaptr> long lines not wrapping ?[18:33:36] <adaptr> (I use most(1), the power of the beast)[18:33:57] *** Zeit|awy has quit IRC[18:34:21] <Aprogas> I think I used most for a while, not sure why I dropped it.[18:35:06] <Aprogas> I also like -F which basically causes less to not be a pager if output isn't multiple pages.[18:35:16] <Toerkeium> adaptr: there are lot of deferred messages, mostly rejections from a server which blacklist this (mine) machine[18:35:35] <adaptr> Toerkeium: rejections are only deferredwhen they're 4xx[18:36:19] <Aprogas> I think with soft_bounce = yes, Postfix not only turns its own 5xx errors into 4xx, but also interprets the 5xx errors of remote MTAs as 4xx errors.[18:36:39] <Aprogas> But that's not really related to the matter at hand.[18:37:02] <adaptr> let's hope not[18:37:17] <rob0> Toerkeium: soft_bounce was supposed to be temporary.[18:37:25] <Toerkeium> adaptr: there are some deferred with 5xx responses[18:37:38] <Toerkeium> rob0: yes I disabled it[18:37:39] <tharkun> adaptr: i used to use most also, i dropped it along the way. I don't remember why[18:37:56] <adaptr> Toerkeium: shouldn't be[18:38:31] <Toerkeium> hmm.. going to recheck[18:38:53] *** suchu has joined #postfix[18:38:58] * cpm bounces rob0 softly[18:39:08] <adaptr> TMI[18:39:10] <adaptr> really[18:40:03] <Toerkeium> rob0: I disabled it later, the queue was "generated" with softbounce=yes, so I may check it now[18:40:29] <Toerkeium> that's why I had deferred messages with 5xx responses?[18:40:34] <rob0> yes[18:40:39] <adaptr> Toerkeium: check if a requeue instantly drops thos, and tell us what happens :)[18:40:40] <Toerkeium> great[18:40:44] *** suchu has quit IRC[18:41:00] <rob0> No requeue, just "postfix flush"[18:41:14] <adaptr> ah, lucky him[18:41:23] <Blue-E2> postqueue still loading...[18:41:45] <Toerkeium> too late, customer called me this morning histerical and told me to delete all queue[18:42:00] <Toerkeium> I'll try next time if this guy don't call me that early[18:42:20] <Toerkeium> what a bad way to wake up, btw[18:42:25] <adaptr> a customer told you to ...delete... the queue...[18:42:30] <Aprogas> Another "I messed with a bogged queue and made it worse"-issue?[18:42:33] <adaptr> I'd have told him to go shove it[18:43:05] <Toerkeium> heh[18:44:11] <Toerkeium> there were some mail intended for local delivery, which I tried to make it delivered flushing postfix[18:44:28] <Toerkeium> so I presume most of the emails messages were those 5xx deferred messages[18:44:40] <rob0> well yikes, you don't want to throw away real mail, just the spam![18:46:30] <Toerkeium> lets see now then[18:47:21] *** freaky[t] has quit IRC[18:48:30] *** tjikkun has joined #postfix[18:48:31] *** tjikkun has joined #postfix[18:51:53] <Toerkeium> and when you telnet host 25 and the banner has some delay to show, it could be caused by lack of smtpd process? if yes, if the banner shows up, delayed, but shows up, there won't be any error at all right?[18:51:58] <Toerkeium> I mean, in logs[18:52:59] *** hever has quit IRC[18:53:06] <adaptr> !smtpd_connection_timeout[18:53:06] <knoba> adaptr: Error: "smtpd_connection_timeout" is not a valid command.[18:53:26] <adaptr> of course it is, silly[18:53:30] <Toerkeium> heh[18:53:31] <adaptr> ah well, something like that[18:53:38] <adaptr> out of the 600-odd settings[18:54:03] <adaptr> *default* settings, that is. I am often tempted to add a few 100 transports to lift the number of settings to 100000+[18:54:36] *** smica has joined #postfix[18:55:30] *** freaky[t] has joined #postfix[18:57:17] *** mroe has joined #postfix[18:57:23] <mroe> why won't POP die already!?[18:57:38] <Aprogas> !tell mroe pop-before-smtp[18:57:38] <knoba> Aprogas: Error: No factoid matches that key.[18:57:44] <Aprogas> !tell mroe popbefore_smtp[18:57:44] <knoba> Aprogas: Error: No factoid matches that key.[18:57:47] <Aprogas> meh[18:57:48] <Aprogas> nvm[18:58:07] <mroe> trying to list for me other things that should die as well?[18:58:20] <Aprogas> !popbeforesmtp[18:58:20] <knoba> Aprogas: "popbeforesmtp" : SMTP-after-POP (or POP-before-SMTP) is a way to allow road-warriors to relay mail through your mail server. Look at: http://www.stahl.bau.tu-bs.de/~hildeb/postfix/postfix_pop-before-smtp_en.shtml[18:58:39] <mroe> yea, what of it. That is miserable[18:58:46] <Aprogas> My ISP doesn't even run an IMAP server, only POP.[18:59:13] <mroe> that is another thing I have never understood. Why is there a relationship between ISPs and Email providers?[18:59:40] <rob0> heh, I learned over a decade ago not to trust email to my ISP[18:59:57] <rob0> served me well, hopping ISPs[19:00:14] <Aprogas> I configured them as my domain-contact in case of problems with my own domain and people unable to contact me.[19:00:29] <Aprogas> Apparently they silent-drop spammy mail.[19:00:42] <mroe> most ISPs silently drop non-spammy mail[19:01:57] <thumbs> mroe: because John Doe, on cable, has no idea what an email server is, and can barely configure his wintendo machine to begin with.[19:02:14] <thumbs> mroe: hence the need for ISP's to provide email services to those poor users.[19:03:23] <seekwill> yeah[19:03:25] <rob0> John should sign up for a freemail account.[19:03:31] <seekwill> yeah[19:03:43] <mroe> not that I am condoning them, but I think gmail/yahoo/hotmail/etc do a better job providing email to the illiterate[19:03:58] <seekwill> Wasn't that SBC who contracted out their mail to Yahoo?[19:04:16] <seekwill> I condone thumbs[19:04:55] <Toerkeium> is there any way to tell postfix log some warning when there is some delay in the greeting smtp banner?[19:05:21] <Aprogas> "some delay" ?[19:05:34] <rob0> sbc is yahoo yes[19:05:34] <adaptr> Toerkeium: what banner[19:05:35] <seekwill> Toerkeium: Why is "some delay" a big issue?[19:05:45] <tharkun> !postscreen[19:05:45] <knoba> tharkun: "postscreen" : Server that performs triage on multiple inbound SMTP connections in parallel. More information can be found at: http://www.postfix.org/postscreen.8.html[19:05:46] <adaptr> you're a big issue, seekwill[19:05:47] <seekwill> adaptr: The greeting banner![19:05:52] <seekwill> adaptr: Only for thumbs[19:06:07] <adaptr> tharkun: he means delayed connects from clients because postfix is busy[19:06:13] <adaptr> nothing to do with pregreet[19:06:25] *** cinch has quit IRC[19:06:31] <tharkun> adaptr: ohh got the wrong idea then :o[19:06:33] <adaptr> although postscreen can cut down on he number of stupid spam connections holding smtpd slots[19:06:42] <adaptr> but that presupposes he HAS those.[19:06:47] <Toerkeium> well.. if the greeting banner is starting to have some delays, is not a sign that possible trouble if connections keep comming with more concurrency?[19:07:12] <adaptr> Toerkeium: no. that's the reason the SMTP timeouts are not 0.001 ms[19:07:50] <adaptr> a good indication is A. the number of smtpd processes working, and B. if that is maxed out, WHAT the system is spending its time on. use dstat to find out[19:08:10] <Toerkeium> great, thanks[19:08:14] <adaptr> none of those facts in isolation mean anything[19:08:34] <Toerkeium> understand[19:08:57] <mroe> I've just wasted the last 2 hours of my life because some user insisted on using pop with 5 email accounts and uses outlook as their MUA. I am ready to pummel someone[19:09:36] <adaptr> the (usually) correct sequence is: 1. detect problem with growing queue. 2. ascertain what queue and what kind of messages. 3. check process limits. 4. check system load[19:10:07] <adaptr> if the processes are maxing out, but there's no load, increase the limits[19:10:29] <adaptr> if there is I/O load, you're bottlenecking on disk. nothing you can do about that except get more and better disks[19:11:00] <adaptr> if none of the above is the problem, you're probably not delivering messages[19:12:19] <seekwill> mroe: Exchange![19:12:46] <mroe> seekwill, over my dead body[19:12:58] <adaptr> seekwill: your chance! grab it![19:13:14] <mroe> any server I have control over is imaps and submission *only* for users[19:13:16] * seekwill install Exchange over mroe[19:13:42] * rob0 starts digging a grave[19:13:45] * mroe freezes randomly[19:15:44] <mroe> anyone know if mozilla has finally abandoned their mork db format?[19:16:49] <tharkun> Does postscreen log in the same facility as postfix ?[19:17:09] <f3ew> tharkun yes[19:17:18] *** EagleWatch has quit IRC[19:19:43] <tharkun> f3ew: thx, i Whitelisted the mailrelay so everything gets passed automagically, i see on the logs that some mail coming from the relayhost has passed through but the WHITELISTED stanza is not on the log entries. For the matter there is no WHITELISTED matches on the mail log at all[19:20:05] <rob0> postscreen *is* postfix[19:20:29] <tharkun> rob0: Hi[19:20:51] *** Blue-E2 has quit IRC[19:21:11] <mroe> there is no postfix[19:21:20] <tharkun> rob0: Great, for a moment i thought it was a separate daemon. So it is part of master[19:23:46] <adaptr> mroe: yes there is, look, I'm bending it with my mind[19:24:05] <adaptr> tharkun: yes, it is a separate daemon.[19:24:20] <adaptr> master doesn't do anything. it loads the config and fires off daemons.[19:24:31] <adaptr> it doesn't handle any mail, ever[19:24:48] <tharkun> ok[19:25:11] <adaptr> the closest master(8) comes to handling mail is passing an ACCEPT() socket to an smtpd process[19:25:22] <tharkun> adaptr: then how do i know that postscreen is running fine ?[19:25:59] <adaptr> if you run it, it precedes every message. look at your logs.[19:26:27] <adaptr> and I highly recommend you only run it in warning mode until you are confident it is doing what you want[19:26:54] <adaptr> keep your RBL checks in your restrictions until you are, they have to be applied somewhere[19:27:35] <tharkun> adaptr: For the moment i am running the whitelist test. I will be going through the order the manpage has[19:27:39] <mroe> has postscreen always been part of postfix?[19:27:50] <tharkun> mroe: Since version 2.8[19:27:52] <adaptr> mroe: no. 2.8[19:27:57] <adaptr> so, it isn't, yet[19:28:10] <adaptr> but you can run it on 2.7, and the snapshot of 2.8 also runs well[19:28:37] <mroe> I was going to say, postscreen seems to make greylisting obsolete[19:28:48] <standon> mroe: how so?[19:28:50] <seekwill> Greylisting has always been :)[19:29:19] <adaptr> +1[19:30:16] *** MAAAAAD has quit IRC[19:30:32] <Toerkeium> benefits of new postfix installs.. I was proud of greylisting[19:30:36] *** MAAAAAD has joined #postfix[19:30:57] <mroe> while the man page doesn't go into details, I am interpreting " postscreen(8) maintains a temporary whitelist for clients that have passed a number of tests." to mean that it performs some tests similar to what gray listing does[19:31:36] <lunaphyte_> eh?[19:31:46] <lunaphyte_> greylisting does not "test" anything.[19:32:10] <mroe> sure it does, it tests to see if the sending server will try again[19:32:21] <seekwill> heh[19:32:30] <mroe> ah, but I see the things postscreen tests at the bottom of the page.[19:32:48] <lunaphyte_> that is twisting words around.[19:33:13] <mroe> it is *technically* correct... The best kind of correct[19:33:18] <lunaphyte_> nonsense.[19:33:28] <lunaphyte_> technically speaking, that is not a "test".[19:33:45] <mroe> ooo, right back at me, eh?[19:34:05] <lunaphyte_> the point is that postscreen does nothing at all like greylisting, and does nothing at all similar to what greylisting does.[19:34:21] *** UQlev has quit IRC[19:34:33] <standon> eh, mroe needs to do a bit of reading and, ahem, learning. :)[19:34:35] <mroe> yes, I see that now, after reading the TRIAGE PARAMETERS section of the man page[19:35:34] <Toerkeium> why seekwill says greylisting has been always obsolete?[19:35:52] <seekwill> Because it doesn't work[19:35:58] <mroe> because it is a hackish and largely ineffective way to limit spam[19:36:06] <seekwill> Causes more headaches[19:36:08] <Toerkeium> seekwill: what's the replacement? it's working for years to me[19:36:22] <tharkun> Because any persisten program that sends mail will timeout the greylist and deliver its spam[19:37:19] <tharkun> does ps -AF|grep postscreen should give any output ?[19:37:28] <seekwill> Toerkeium: Exactly what mroe said. It's a hack. More people complain about "where is my email?" than "why do I have spam". I don't have too much of an opinion about greylisting messages with an already high spam score[19:38:11] <lunaphyte_> err - *is nothing at all like greylisting.[19:38:18] <Toerkeium> understand your point[19:42:09] *** jamesmacleod has quit IRC[19:47:35] <lunaphyte_> claiming that greylisting has been empirically defined as "ineffective" is silly.[19:47:54] *** mroe has quit IRC[19:49:56] <Toerkeium> well.. it's been working for some years for me, and I could say that if I just remove greylisting now, a lot of customers will complaint. But I get the point of not using it also[19:51:00] <seekwill> :)[19:51:03] <adaptr> I hereby define gheylisting empirically as INEFFECTIVE[19:51:19] <adaptr> I tested it 0 times, and it failed to work for me 100% of those times[19:51:26] <adaptr> that's empirical for you[19:51:46] <seekwill> lunaphyte_: Yes to a point. But the cost of greylisting outweighs the benefits[19:51:52] *** friskd has joined #postfix[19:51:59] <lunaphyte_> for you perhaps.[19:52:09] <seekwill> For my clients as well[19:52:26] <lunaphyte_> please don't state your experiences as global equivocations.[19:52:33] <Toerkeium> seekwill: I have explained customers how it works, and told them to explain their customers... and it bringed some benefits to our lifes[19:52:38] <seekwill> ok[19:52:57] <lunaphyte_> (that's what i'm getting at. a pet peeve, i suppose)[19:53:21] <Dominian> against greylisting?[19:53:57] *** Twinkletoes has quit IRC[19:54:36] *** Dovid has joined #postfix[19:56:58] <rob0> adaptr has been empirically defined as "silly".[19:57:15] <adaptr> rob0: took you long enough[19:57:34] <rob0> but yeah, I agree, greylisting is no longer a good tool[19:58:07] <lunaphyte_> bah. et tu, rob0?[19:58:11] <rob0> still (and probably will always) can help some.[19:58:50] <rob0> probably reject_non_fqdn_helo_hostname will do as much, and Zen will do more.[19:58:51] * tharkun is unsure if postscreen is working on a low level production server[19:59:06] <seekwill> Toerkeium: lunaphyte_ hits an excellent point, and one of my pet peeves as well. Everyone has different ideas about how to implement email systems. And because of that, email is so "messed" up, that causes people to move towards other technologies[20:00:48] <seekwill> Toerkeium: A documentary sounds really convincing, until you realize you didn't hear the full story[20:00:51] <tharkun> !trivial-rewrite[20:00:51] <knoba> tharkun: Error: "trivial-rewrite" is not a valid command.[20:05:25] <Toerkeium> yes of course, I get your point. It happened to me, but at the time I implemented it, it was easy, fast, non resource consuming and easy to get ride too if any trouble, and at that times there was spamassassin which was a lot heavy, not that easy to setup and hardware consuming[20:05:52] <Toerkeium> so I picked up greylisting and til today, working. Now, it would be a good time to evaluate a improve[20:06:00] <seekwill> And that's my flaw, and where lunaphyte_ makes an excellent point. I have different requirements and resources to implement things differently :)[20:06:37] <adaptr> you're a flaw[20:06:43] <Toerkeium> heh[20:06:46] <seekwill> Only to the eyes of thumbs :([20:06:56] <Toerkeium> you guys are fun :P)[20:07:09] * tharkun is puzzled as why on a production server there is no Log entries associated with postscreen. And there are on his testing laptop[20:08:04] <tharkun> adaptr: You once said that postscreen could be disabled, How do you do that. I see no reference in either man 5 postcreen or man 5 postconf[20:08:33] <rob0> postscreen is section 8 FWIW[20:08:52] <tharkun> ?tell rob0 about debian[20:09:19] <tharkun> rob0: yea i know but what can i do besides ranting about it[20:09:31] <adaptr> tharkun: if you don't define any parameters for it, it will obviously not do anything[20:09:45] <adaptr> tharkun: and all actions can be set to reject nothing[20:09:46] <tharkun> adaptr: i have the full set of parameters enabled[20:10:04] <adaptr> tharkun: why did you do that, then, if you wan to disable it ?[20:10:41] *** jamesmacleod has joined #postfix[20:11:23] <seekwill> Toerkeium: Despite everything I previously said, greylisting still blows![20:11:54] <rob0> Toerkeium probably would require a subscription for Spamhaus, but it would help a lot. They do offer a free trial, and you might even fly under their radar without paying. (But it's worth paying for, cheaper than a lot of less effective and less safe things you might try.)[20:12:03] <rob0> !tell Toerkeium zen[20:12:04] <knoba> Toerkeium: "zen" : http://www.spamhaus.org/zen/ : A composite of all Spamhaus DNSBLs: SBL, XBL and PBL. Testing your DNSBL lookup can be done here: http://www.crynwr.com/spam/[20:12:05] <tharkun> adaptr: i want to enable it :D and see that it is alive and kicking. I suppose at this momment that it is running, but i see no proof of that[20:12:28] <adaptr> tharkun: as I said previously, if it is running, it will preced EVERY single incoming message. read your logs.[20:15:19] *** GoGi has quit IRC[20:17:13] <Toerkeium> seekwill: every opinion is valid to me[20:18:45] <Toerkeium> rob0: I-ll check them but.. never liked too much RBLs but I'll have to, at some point[20:19:25] <adaptr> Toerkeium: RBLs stop 95% of all spam, even without HELO restrictions[20:19:33] <adaptr> with HELO, it's about 50/50[20:19:34] <seekwill> 95% is a bit high...[20:19:47] <adaptr> seekwill: I don't have a very large sample space :)[20:19:50] <adaptr> it's >90 for me[20:19:54] <seekwill> hehe[20:20:12] <seekwill> adaptr: Be careful about making those statements. lunaphyte_ will get on your case.[20:20:30] <seekwill> <adaptr> Toerkeium: RBLs stop 95% of my spam, even without HELO restrictions[20:20:30] <adaptr> he can take my case and... well, fantasize amongst yourselves[20:20:31] <seekwill> hehe[20:27:15] *** henriknj has quit IRC[20:37:32] *** uqlev has joined #postfix[20:42:18] *** uqlev has quit IRC[20:44:25] <Dominian> There are some people in this world that should never be allowed to troubleshoot email...[20:45:54] <wdp> some?[20:50:42] <Dominian> wdp: in this context, yes.[20:50:59] <Dominian> send me headers... and bitch that our system is 'forwarding' emails on its own to a user...[20:51:16] <Dominian> then when I see the headers.. shows clearly that the forwardin gis being done.. from a laptop.. on a user's home connection, via outlook...[20:51:29] <Dominian> and then tell me its a problem with our system cause 'we've already checked his laptop; its not his laptop'[20:51:35] <Dominian> the headers tell a different story chief[20:57:05] <adaptr> users don't believe headers, they think you're inventing something to blame them "what are these headers, I've never heard of them, and neither has my nerdy tech boyfriend!"[20:57:16] <adaptr> they think mail routing "just works"[20:57:31] <adaptr> or, in the extreme case, they think their outlook talks to your thunderbird[20:57:45] <adaptr> as if my thunderbird would listen to such a steaming pile[20:58:55] <jeev> grep -c blocked maillog[20:58:56] <jeev> 6139[20:59:03] <jeev> sexy[20:59:17] <Dominian> adaptr: this isn't a 'user' per se but a self-proclaimed IT administrator[20:59:24] <jeev> delivered = 163[20:59:28] <jeev> Dominian, you fix your shit?[20:59:31] <Dominian> jeev: yep[20:59:40] <jeev> cool, what was it[20:59:40] <Dominian> jeev: looks like some code changes withint mailzu-ng[20:59:52] <Dominian> the default table schema that they provide in the instalsl notes..[20:59:58] <Dominian> has two tables: msgs and msgrcpt[21:00:07] <Dominian> both contained a 'content' column[21:00:21] <Dominian> I had to make some additions to part of mailzu-ng to use msgs.content[21:00:29] <jeev> oh heh[21:00:30] <jeev> so much work[21:00:37] <Dominian> and..[21:00:40] <Dominian> I got releases working[21:00:44] <Dominian> although I don't remember how[21:01:16] <Dominian> and got "release" to remove the email from the qurantine view on release.[21:02:15] <Dominian> jeev: Now, I'm going to have to write code to add a user account administrative interface.[21:02:20] <Dominian> should be fun[21:02:59] <jeev> sounds sexy[21:03:36] <Dominian> they assume you're going to use ldap or imap to do the user lookups[21:03:56] <Dominian> No real easy way to do it via mysql.. since this won't have real accounts at all and doing only relay_domains and transport_maps[21:04:07] <jeev> i dunno but it worked perfectly for me[21:04:16] <Dominian> jeev: You use imap for authentication though[21:04:19] <Dominian> big difference[21:05:39] <Dominian> I had to create a default 'login' table just to do authentication into mailzu[21:06:12] <jeev> yea, imap is fine enough[21:06:17] <jeev> for me[21:06:24] <Dominian> aye[21:06:32] <Dominian> but, like I said.. no virtual mailboxes with this setup[21:06:40] <jeev> sUCKS FOR YOU![21:06:48] <Dominian> this is just a 'receive email for relay_domains scan it and then pass it off to transport_maps for delivery to $client"[21:07:01] <Dominian> works well so far[21:07:11] <Dominian> I have one of my domains configured as such right now[21:09:39] <Dominian> and recipient verification is working too[21:10:22] <Dominian> jeev: I may move the relay_domains and possibly transport_maps to sql and wirte code to allow 'full site admins' access to update it dynamically[21:11:21] <Dominian> will make it so I don't have to touch the main.cf ever again[21:11:58] <jeev> lol i was looking at a pdf that was crooked[21:12:05] <jeev> so i moved to securecrt to see something on a server and it was crooked[21:12:09] <jeev> damn mental things[21:12:15] <Dominian> lol[21:12:23] <jeev> i got a bad drive here[21:12:33] <jeev> i need to RMA it but now it wont even show up so i can zero it a thousand times[21:13:37] <jeev> what should i do? hmm[21:13:42] <thumbs> jeev: it's fine. No one will steal your data.[21:13:44] <jeev> it spins ;/[21:14:00] <jeev> thumbs, it's not mine.. it's a customers, hence the data is more important than mine. always put the privacy of others in front of mine.[21:14:07] <jeev> i have nothing to hide but porn.[21:14:09] <adaptr> who'd want it[21:15:12] <lennard> jeev: its simple, either you or your customer makes the choice: be 100% sure where the data goes (and pay the cost of a new disk/spare) or simply RMA it with all the (tiny, imho) risk involved[21:15:45] <jeev> lennard, he already has a new disk.[21:15:58] <jeev> but i told him i'd get this replaced[21:16:57] <jeev> it's a powerful disk but i think that i'm going to have to be cautious and destroy it[21:17:23] <jeev> if it was my drive, i'd do it. even though he doesn't have anything *illegal*, he does have private emails that should never be seen by others.[21:21:22] <Toerkeium> jeev: how is it possible that a process of configuration can be sexy?[21:21:50] *** cpm has quit IRC[21:21:50] *** e-jones has joined #postfix[21:22:12] <jeev> who knows[21:24:07] *** jfried has joined #postfix[21:24:17] *** LinuxCode has joined #postfix[21:31:38] *** ssureshot has quit IRC[21:32:27] *** Jippi_mac has joined #postfix[21:34:45] *** wdp has quit IRC[21:38:59] *** halfsack has joined #postfix[21:39:22] *** mroe has joined #postfix[21:39:26] *** mroe has joined #postfix[21:45:40] *** sebuba has quit IRC[21:49:55] *** lunaphyte_ has quit IRC[21:50:34] *** MAAAAAD has quit IRC[21:51:17] *** MAAAAAD has joined #postfix[22:02:14] *** lunaphyte_ has joined #postfix[22:07:38] *** ib-mobile has quit IRC[22:07:45] *** ib-mobile has joined #postfix[22:08:48] *** saurabhb has quit IRC[22:12:43] *** szonek has joined #postfix[22:12:47] *** szonek has joined #postfix[22:12:58] <szonek> hi[22:14:13] <szonek> how can i send all mail from test at something dot com directly and all other mail via external relay host? (spam and virus firewall)[22:14:57] <szonek> now i've set relay host to spam and virus firewall but i want to make exception for one sender[22:15:16] <szonek> and just for him send mail directly from postfix[22:15:23] <KB1JWQ> relayhost and transport maps.[22:15:54] <szonek> KB1JWQ: how can i do that?[22:16:03] <KB1JWQ> !relayhost[22:16:04] <knoba> KB1JWQ: "relayhost" : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: The default host to send non-local mail to when no entry is matched in the optional transport(5) table. When no relayhost is given, mail is routed directly to the destination. If your relay host requires authentication see the !saslclient channel factoid.[22:16:06] <KB1JWQ> !transport_maps[22:16:06] <knoba> KB1JWQ: "transport_maps" : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: Optional lookup tables with mappings from recipient address to (message delivery transport, next-hop destination). See transport(5) for details.[22:16:36] <szonek> what should i put as next-hop destination if i want to send mail directly?[22:16:57] *** Toerkeium has quit IRC[22:17:02] <KB1JWQ> If you want me to do this for you I'll require green pieces of paper with pictures of dead presidents on them.[22:17:41] <seekwill> KB1JWQ: How many pieces of paper do you want?[22:17:52] <KB1JWQ> seekwill: All of them. I'll settle for "what I can get."[22:18:06] <seekwill> KB1JWQ: btw, "cash" is sooooo yesterday. We do paypal now[22:18:08] <szonek> i have none, so that's done[22:18:53] <szonek> i tried transport maps with: test at something dot com :[22:19:07] <szonek> and: * smtp:my_relay_host[22:19:11] <mroe> KB1JWQ, I require green pieces of paper with dead inventors on them[22:19:12] <szonek> but it didn't work[22:19:21] <seekwill> mroe: lol[22:19:22] *** cilly has quit IRC[22:19:29] * mroe hands KB1JWQ a stack of George Washingtons[22:21:14] *** f3ew has quit IRC[22:21:30] <tharkun> Does Abraham Lincon be ok ?[22:22:05] * mroe wonders if he missed the pastebin with szonek's log and config[22:22:29] <adaptr> who was on that 500-dollar bill now ?[22:22:32] <adaptr> Franklin ?[22:22:40] <mroe> he was on the $100[22:22:40] <tharkun> Grant[22:22:43] <adaptr> no, that's 100[22:22:45] <adaptr> yeah, him[22:22:48] <adaptr> gimme![22:22:52] <tharkun> nop[22:23:01] <mroe> nice, 'dead alcoholic generals'[22:23:03] <tharkun> There is even a 1,000 usd bill[22:23:27] <mroe> Grover Cleveland baby[22:23:28] *** Toerkeium has joined #postfix[22:25:20] <kyle> MUTT[22:25:21] *** f3ew has joined #postfix[22:25:26] <kyle> argh :)[22:25:30] <mroe> password:[22:25:38] <kyle> noes! :P[22:25:39] <seekwill> thumbs4life[22:25:46] *** Matic`Makovec has joined #postfix[22:28:14] *** Motoko-chan has joined #postfix[22:28:45] *** henriknj has joined #postfix[22:29:02] *** Jippi_mac has quit IRC[22:32:50] <thumbs> what?[22:33:21] <seekwill> That's my root password[22:35:11] *** f3ew has quit IRC[22:35:54] <tharkun> adaptr: can you take a look at this log fragment and tell me if postscreen is working. According to me it is not. http://paste.debian.net/92078/[22:36:16] <thumbs> seekwill: neat.[22:36:33] * tharkun uses his tazer on seekwill[22:36:47] <seekwill> Kinky[22:36:56] <tharkun> ohh dear[22:37:08] <adaptr> tharkun: is it logging ? no, it's not logging.[22:37:09] * seekwill uses his "Tazer" on thumbs[22:37:20] * adaptr uses his thumbs on seekwill[22:37:42] *** f3ew has joined #postfix[22:37:57] * GNU\colossus seeks his thumb uses at will[22:38:04] *** e-jones has quit IRC[22:38:36] * tharkun thinks that whoever thinks his party is inmoral, should pick up his clothes and leave[22:42:26] <seekwill> Oh, this is _your_ party[22:43:05] <tharkun> seekwill: you are allways wellcome to the party[22:43:25] <seekwill> Thanks[22:43:29] <seekwill> Can thumbs come too?[22:43:40] <seekwill> He gets cranky if he doesn't get invited to parties[22:44:00] <tharkun> Well let's make an exception and grant him a permanent invitation[22:44:12] <seekwill> Sweet. I'll let him know[22:44:42] <tharkun> But unless rob0 stops serving drinks to the bees, he will not be invited[22:47:39] *** mroe has quit IRC[22:49:24] *** mroe has joined #postfix[22:49:51] *** mroe is now known as Guest49153[22:54:23] * tharkun edited the wrong server /etc/postfix/master.cf file[22:57:56] *** JonnyV has quit IRC[23:02:53] *** korozion has joined #postfix[23:04:40] *** EdwardIII has left #postfix[23:08:10] *** Guest49153 has quit IRC[23:14:43] <tharkun> IT IS ALIVE !!!![23:14:59] <adaptr> good[23:17:18] <seekwill> What's the IP?[23:17:46] <Aprogas> 4 and 6, it's dual-stack[23:18:38] <adaptr> so...10, then[23:18:44] * adaptr unfurrows[23:19:03] *** Matic`Makovec has quit IRC[23:22:52] *** feisar has quit IRC[23:26:22] <tharkun> i have on man 5 postconf the following choices for postscreen_dnsbl_action continue and drop on http://www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#postscreen_dnsbl_action i have ignore enforce and drop which one should i follow ?[23:29:08] *** Toerkeium has quit IRC[23:29:36] <tharkun> It does not matter what i put into it, there is no rejection by either value from postfix[23:33:50] <tharkun> postconf -d postscreen_dnsbl_action = continue on my particular version. If this is going to change to ignore as the web page states, where can i get the information ?[23:38:40] <seekwill> Dang, I want the domain "dontspam.me"[23:45:54] *** smica has quit IRC[23:51:47] *** Motoko-chan has quit IRC[23:52:11] *** wdp has joined #postfix[23:53:47] *** wdp_aao_ has quit IRC[23:57:44] *** Signum has joined #postfix[23:57:59] * tharkun uses his Tazer on Signum[23:58:13] <Signum> Yeah, right. :)[23:59:15] *** jfried has quit IRC