[00:00:10] <hax_> sepski: i will want to integrate dovecot with this somehow, if that matters
[00:00:13] <rob0> The problem with a "noob-perfect" tutorial is that no tutorial can provide all the prerequisites. For mail you have to know bits about a lot of things ... general Unix, TCP/IP, DNS ...
[00:00:19] <sepski> hax_, you write the queries so the shema can be about anything.
[00:01:19] <hax_> sepski: i'm not even entirely sure what all the options are though... it looks like one thing it wants is domain, mail address, and mailbox
[00:01:30] <hax_> but there doesnt seem to be any outline of all the things it can take from mysql
[00:02:08] <ek> !ekguide
[00:02:08] <knoba> ek: 'ekguide' : http://www.purplehat.org/?page_id=4
[00:02:11] <ek> hax_: ^^
[00:02:15] <ek> Dovecot and MySQL.
[00:02:26] <ek> Using the standard PostfixAdmin DB scheme.
[00:02:39] <ek> Feel free to adjust however you see fit.
[00:02:43] <hax_> ek: aha!
[00:02:46] <hax_> that looks useful
[00:03:05] <ek> It'll be a bit more useful once I finally finish the informative parts.
[00:04:04] <hax_> ek: that .sql file is really the information i've been missing
[00:04:57] <ek> Ah. Okay.
[00:05:09] <ek> I've made a few adjustments to it for the guide.
[00:05:22] <ek> Mainly just the ending bit where it dumps the test information into it.
[00:05:27] <ek> Just remove that and it should be fine.
[00:05:30] <hax_> ek: i'm not entirely sure why i need *all* of these tables though
[00:05:37] <hax_> this looks like a lot more data than i really want to manage
[00:05:52] <ek> Well, each one should have a descriptive above it.
[00:05:56] <ek> You can dice it up however you like.
[00:06:12] <tuxcrafter> using the . in the FQDN in the hostname and hosts file
[00:06:44] <tuxcrafter> will let the installation of aptitude install postfix-mysql file totally
[00:06:54] <tuxcrafter> so i will go back to a fresh install
[00:07:04] <tuxcrafter> and do it again with the .
[00:07:20] <hax_> ek: is there any real reason i actually need things like created/modified/active/backupmx/maxquota/etc?
[00:07:28] <hax_> ek: is there a list of just the bare minimum i need?
[00:07:43] <ek> Well, like I said, that's the PostfixAdmin dump file.
[00:07:55] <ek> If you're not going to be using PA, you don't actually "need" anything.
[00:08:06] <ek> You can have the SQL database be as small as you'd like.
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[00:08:14] <ek> username, password, directory...
[00:08:23] <hax_> hmm
[00:08:34] <tuxcrafter> http://pastebin.ca/index.php
[00:08:38] <tuxcrafter> is this now oke
[00:08:46] <ek> Active is good to have though. You can disable mailboxes without deleting their entry.
[00:08:47] <hax_> ek: and dovecot and postfix pretty much need the same info?
[00:09:04] <ek> hax_: Not at all. You can chance their queries as well.
[00:09:24] <ek> That's what I'm saying... Check the Postfix main.cf file setup in the same guide.
[00:09:35] <ek> Also, the Dovecot dovecot-sql.conf file setup.
[00:09:48] <ek> Those are what read the files. Postfix and Dovecot don't write to the database.
[00:09:51] <ek> They just read from it.
[00:10:00] <ek> Anyhow, I'll return shortly.
[00:10:04] <ek> Gotta take the girlfriend to work.
[00:10:14] <tuxcrafter> Signum: are the ip correct in the file http://pastebin.ca/497517
[00:10:19] <tuxcrafter> and the names
[00:10:49] <Signum> tuxcrafter: except from  /etc/hostname that looks good
[00:11:12] <hax_> ek: thanks :)
[00:11:23] <tuxcrafter> Signum: why is that
[00:11:31] <tuxcrafter> is it vallid
[00:11:43] <tuxcrafter> or is is because it is a peoples name
[00:12:05] <Signum> tuxcrafter: because it must not contain the domain name
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[00:14:41] <tuxcrafter> Signum: http://www.howtoforge.com/perfect_setup_ubuntu704_p3
[00:14:41] <tuxcrafter> on that page the person is using the local dhcp given ip in the hosts file and uses the FQDN in the hostname file
[00:14:42] <b52lap> one stupid question :d http://workaround.org/articles/ispmail-sarge/  , could i apply this tutorial but  the database could be on another machine than  postfix ?
[00:15:48] <hax_> if i use mysql, do i still need to set mydestination in the config? or will it know by looking at the hosts in mysql?
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[00:16:25] <theblackbox> hello, I'm having some trouble with my postfix install, and I'm pretty new to all this, so I was looking for some help diagnosing my problem
[00:16:43] <many> i really wonder why it is such a common misbelief that people put FQDNs into /etc/hostname
[00:16:44] <Signum> theblackbox: sure, go on
[00:17:08] <theblackbox> I'm getting a fatal integrity check, and post-install is (wrongly) informing me "you still need to edit myorigin/mydestination/mynetworks"
[00:17:31] <Signum> hax_: mydestination will not look at mysql mappings unless you tell it to.
[00:17:32] <theblackbox> running postfix -c /etc/postfix/ set-permissions
[00:17:46] <theblackbox> gives "chown: cannot access `/usr/doc/postfix-2.3.8/README_FILES': No such file or directory
[00:17:46] <theblackbox> "
[00:18:08] <Signum> theblackbox: is there no regular init.d script on your system?
[00:18:12] <hax_> Signum: but what i mean is, if i have a list of domains i want to receive mail for... rather than adding each domain to mydestination, i should have it pull them out of mysql, right?
[00:18:22] <tuxcrafter> many: so i can just put ashley in the hostname instead of ashley.lavendel.tk
[00:18:31] <many> yes, please.
[00:18:48] <theblackbox> which leads me to believe I didn't remove 2.3.8 properly, as this one is most deffinately 2.4.1
[00:18:49] <tuxcrafter> many and what about the ip
[00:19:06] <tuxcrafter> local of external ip
[00:19:09] <many> what about it?
[00:19:13] <theblackbox> Signum, I got an rc.d script, but it's giving the same output
[00:19:14] <Signum> hax_: yes, you can do that. but you don't have to.
[00:19:20] <Signum> hax_: just don't mix local and virtual domains. a domain is either one.
[00:19:39] <Kalavera> hi guys
[00:19:54] <Kalavera> i need to handle a lot of bounced mails? any idea?
[00:20:47] <hax_> Signum: a 'local domain' would be one that uses exclusively system users and a 'virtual domain' would be one that uses exclusively mysql users?
[00:22:30] <Signum> hax_: not exactly. right for the local domains. but the virtual domains are additional domains with users that don't need to be in your /etc/passwd. information on virtual users can be in text files, hash files, ldap, postgresql tables or mysql tables.
[00:22:32] <theblackbox> Signum, you reakon my diagnosis might be right? I wouldn't have expected it to be looking for an earlier version number if the romoval had been done properly, right?
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[00:23:16] <hax_> Signum: if a domain is virtual, can it also be local? that is can hax at domain dot com actually be my real system account, while all my friends foo at domain dot com are virtual?
[00:23:18] <Signum> theblackbox: removal? did I miss anything?
[00:23:27] <Signum> hax_: no. a  domain is either local or virtual
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[00:23:49] <Signum> hax_: if hax at domain dot com is supposed to be the account of your system user "hax" then you should set "mydestination = domain.com"
[00:23:59] <Signum> hax_: (you could use a virtual_alias_domain for that though)
[00:24:04] <Signum> hax_: I suggest you read the virtual readme.
[00:24:05] <Signum> !virtual
[00:24:05] <knoba> Signum: 'virtual' : a way to configure additional domains and user accounts (that do not need to exist in your /etc/passwd). See: http://www.postfix.org/VIRTUAL_README.html
[00:24:51] <tuxcrafter> many: do you know it local ip of the server or external ip of the server in the hosts file http://pastebin.ca/497533
[00:25:48] <hax_> hmm
[00:25:58] <many> external
[00:26:07] <tuxcrafter> many: ok
[00:26:41] <tuxcrafter> many: so the commands are valid now?
[00:26:48] <many> you could add both, but that'd require the rfc1918 ip to have its own dedicated dns name
[00:27:09] <hax_> Signum: so if i used /etc/postfix/virtual (for example)... then thats all unix accounts? where as /etc/postfix/vmailbox is all virtual accounts? (the names seem a little misleading)
[00:27:47] <many> sleep well. night ;)
[00:27:58] <Signum> many: nite
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[00:28:16] <Signum> hax_: the names mean nothing. it depends which configuration parameters you use them for.
[00:29:19] <hax_> Signum: err, right... so virtual_alias_maps actually translates addresses into system accounts?
[00:29:34] <theblackbox> Signum, if you could check my posts above, please? I think it is a discrepancy between an earlier installed 2.3.8 and the one I've just installed (2.4.1)
[00:30:02] <theblackbox> but not experienced enough to have faith in my assumption :)
[00:30:20] * rob0 has faith in theblackbox
[00:30:45] <hax_> Signum: that is, in the examples they give... "info at example dot com   joe" would send info at example dot com to the 'joe' system account?
[00:31:42] <rob0> theblackbox: is this the slackbuild from slackbuilds.org?
[00:32:08] <theblackbox> yeah
[00:32:30] <theblackbox> and I did a classic removepkg of the previous one (which was SBo too)
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[00:32:51] <rob0> I told them it was a bad idea to hardcode the version in /usr/doc.
[00:32:58] <theblackbox> lol
[00:33:21] <theblackbox> right, so I've caught the brunt og Alan_hicks stubborness ;)
[00:33:26] <theblackbox> *of
[00:33:47] <rob0> Zackly.
[00:33:55] <Signum> hax_: that applies to virtual_alias_domains, yes.
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[00:34:06] <Signum> hax_: did you read the VIRTUAL_README?
[00:34:11] <rob0> I would leave in your 2.3.8 package, then use "make upgrade" to upgrade from source.
[00:34:20] <hax_> Signum: yup, thats where i'm getting this stuff from
[00:34:27] <Signum> theblackbox: can't you remove the old version properly? I'm probably not familiar with your operating system .:(
[00:35:12] <Signum> hax_: okay. then, yes, joe is the "joe" sysetm account in /etc/passwd
[00:35:27] <rob0> Signum: the install hardcoded the version into $html_directory and $readme_directory.
[00:35:57] <tuxcrafter> Signum: When your users want to send mail through your mail server to other addresses (so called "relaying") they need to authenticate themselves to Postfix. This is done through the SASL library that you need to install, too:
[00:36:17] <tuxcrafter> in that line of your how to i think it is wish to give a simple example
[00:36:24] <hax_> Signum: ok... then also, if i setup virtual_mailbox_maps to say "sales at example dot com  example.com/sales" that would make mail delivered to sales at example dot com go to the virtual mailbox example.com/sales (where presumably dovecot could pick it up), right?
[00:36:42] <hax_> Signum: so what prevents me from doing both on one domain? that is, some go to the virtual mailboxes and some go to the system user mailboxes
[00:36:49] <theblackbox> rob0, goin with the upgrade ;) shoulda done that anyway, but didn't wanna leave my hacked to bits conf files lying around
[00:37:01] <hax_> Signum: being that i can use both virtual_mailbox_maps and virtual_alias_maps at the same time
[00:37:03] <tuxcrafter> you just simple main that user at hello dot com can sent a mail to user at bye dot com
[00:37:27] <tuxcrafter> and therefor need the aptitude install libsasl2-modules-sql packages correct? Signum
[00:37:50] <tuxcrafter> !relaying
[00:37:51] <knoba> tuxcrafter: 'relaying' : happening when a mail server forwards emails to another mail server. It must only be allowed for authenticated users or trusted local users (see 'mynetworks') so you don't get abused by spammers.
[00:38:02] <Signum> tuxcrafter: the sasl part is not correct in the version you are reading. I intend to use dovecot as an authentication scheme for sasl.
[00:38:07] <Signum> tuxcrafter: ignore that for now.
[00:38:21] <tuxcrafter> Signum: so what should i do
[00:39:31] <Signum> hax_: you can use virtual_mailbox_maps and virtual_alias_maps at the same time. I suggest you define all domains except "localhost" as virtual_mailbox_domains and use virtual_alias_maps to forward sales at example dot com to salesuser@localhost
[00:39:55] <Signum> tuxcrafter: only the chapters are done that deal with the database schema and receiving the emails.
[00:40:01] <Signum> tuxcrafter: I'm working on the dovecot chapter next.
[00:40:22] <hax_> Signum: how is that different than forwarding 'sales at example dot com' to 'salesuser'?
[00:40:24] <tuxcrafter> Signum: ok
[00:40:32] <hax_> Signum: that is, what does the @localhost do? or is it just there for clarity?
[00:41:01] <tuxcrafter> hax_: localhost is form the localuser and is not a virtual host domain
[00:41:06] <Signum> hax_: "sales at example dot com -> salesuser" only works if example.com is a virtual *alias* domain
[00:41:20] <Signum> hax_: virtual alias domains are solely there so that you forward email to system users.
[00:41:54] <Signum> hax_: if you define example.com as a virtual *mailbox* domain then this alias would make no sense. you would have to say "sales at example dot com -> salesuser@localhost" so that postfix knows where to deliver it
[00:44:26] <hax_> Signum: and something can't be both a 'virtual alias domain' and a 'virtual mailbox domain'?
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[00:46:15] <Signum> hax_: correct
[00:48:21] <hax_> Signum: so i should only set up a domain as a 'virtual alias domain' when every address is intended for system user delivery? if any addresses are set up for virtual users, then the domain shoule be a 'virtual mailbox domain'?
[00:49:46] <hax_> Signum: somewhat confusing, because the VIRTUAL_README says: "These domains are called hosted, because they are not directly associated with the name of the machine itself. Hosted domains are usually implemented with the virtual alias domain address class and/or with the virtual mailbox domain address class"
[00:49:52] <hax_> the and/or is what get sme
[00:49:54] <hax_> *gets
[00:50:04] <rob0> theblackbox: "make upgrade" takes good care of you, no matter how hacked up your configuration may be. I've never known it to fail, and I've been fixing posts (posting fixes) since the old pre-1.0 days.
[00:50:43] <Signum> hax_: exactly right
[00:50:52] * theblackbox is glad to have the faith of the old-school :P
[00:51:12] <Signum> hax_: virtual domains are confusing at first. I know. :)
[00:51:29] <rob0> hax_, a virtual(5) alias domain means you're the MX, but the final destination[s] can be anywhere. I host one which points to a bunch of yahoo/gmail et al addresses.
[00:51:42] <Signum> hax_: the domains are hosted because your hostname is just exactly one name. but you can receive mail for ten million other domains.
[00:52:42] <tuxcrafter> Signum: creative use of mutt in the how to :-P
[00:53:39] <hax_> heh, i'm lost
[00:54:16] <hax_> Signum: so when do i use a 'virtual alias domain' and when do i use a 'virtual mailbox domain'?... they both seem to be for hosted domains and they both seem to be able to point mail to anywhere else
[00:54:44] <tuxcrafter> isn't telnet installed by default on debian
[00:55:37] <hax_> tuxcrafter: shouldnt be, but likely ssh is
[00:55:53] <Signum> tuxcrafter: I use it to debug things here, too :)
[00:56:30] <Signum> hax_: virtual_alias_domain -> you define an extra domain and the aliases just forward mail to your system (passwd) users
[00:56:55] <Signum> hax_: virtual_mailbox_domain -> you define an extra domain and the virtual_mailbox_maps tell postfix where to deliver the email in your file system
[00:57:19] <Signum> hax_: virtual_alias_domains are just for aliasing. virtual_mailbox_domains are there to store actual mail for non-system users on your server.
[00:57:28] <hax_> Signum: but for a virtual_mailbox_domain if you say 'foo@localhost' its the exact same as just having a virtual_alias_domain?
[00:57:31] <Signum> hax_: virtual_mailbox_domains are what all the ISPs and mail services use.
[00:58:01] <Signum> hax_: the caveat is that virtual_alias_maps works for *all* domain kinds. it has "alias" in its name but works for all.
[00:58:34] <hax_> Signum: sneaky
[00:58:58] <tuxcrafter> Signum: can i easly change the password of the sql database to another one root2007
[00:59:01] <hax_> Signum: so why should anyone ever use a virtual_alias_domain if you can just use a virtual_alias_domain and use 'hax@localhost' for local mail?
[00:59:18] <hax_> err, "virtual_mailbox_domain and use..."
[00:59:35] <Signum> tuxcrafter: yes. and you are supposed to do that :)
[00:59:58] <Signum> hax_: no idea. I don't use them. :)
[01:00:00] <tuxcrafter> Signum: i mean after you created everyting
[01:00:20] <hax_> Signum: err, you dont use which?
[01:00:32] <hax_> Signum: this is a really confusing conversation for me btw, and i blame the postfix naming scheme :P
[01:00:33] <Signum> hax_: the virtual_alias_domains
[01:00:42] <Signum> hax_: yes, it is confusing.
[01:01:00] <Signum> tuxcrafter: mysqladmin -u root -p password
[01:01:02] <hax_> Signum: ok, so if you want local delivery, you define the domain as a virtual_mailbox_domain and then virtual_alias_map 'you@domain -> you@localhost' for local delivery?
[01:01:11] <hax_> Signum: (read that carefully, because if that's right, then i get it)
[01:01:28] <Signum> hax_: as long as "localhost" is part of the list of local domains you define in "mydestination" - then yes
[01:01:49] <hax_> Signum: oh, so thats the big secret
[01:02:09] <hax_> Signum: these docs and the oreilly book both really suck on this topic
[01:02:25] <Signum> hax_: you can forward email anywhere. postfix will check the destination if it's a local domain, a virtual alias domain, a virtual mailbox domain or whether it needs to send the email to the internet
[01:02:54] <Signum> hax_: i have the o'reilly book here and... let's say... the book makes sense once you understand the whole thing. :)
[01:03:09] <hax_> Signum: so say i want to forward to a yahoo.com address i'd do 'hax at mydomain dot com -> hax at yahoo dot com' in my virtual_alias_map for my virtual_mailbox_domain?
[01:03:14] <hax_> Signum: heh
[01:03:17] <tuxcrafter> Signum: you forgot the command aptitude install mysql-client-5.0 to be able to use the mysqladmin command
[01:03:21] <tuxcrafter> in the howto
[01:03:56] <tuxcrafter> aptitude install phpmyadmin libapache2-mod-php5 does not install it
[01:03:57] <Signum> hax_: yes, that will work
[01:04:36] <Signum> tuxcrafter: no. mysql-server-5.0 depends on mysql-client-5.0 :)
[01:04:58] <tuxcrafter> Signum: explain because it is not working here
[01:04:59] <hax_> Signum: sweet, i'm getting it :)
[01:05:25] <Signum> tuxcrafter: try installing the mysql-server... it will install the mysql-client, too
[01:06:01] <Signum> hax_: if you just use the domain to forward email elsewhere then a virtual_alias_domain is a good thing. but if some of the accounts in that domain should also be saved to your harddisk then virtual_mailbox_domain is what you want
[01:06:06] <hax_> and presumably anything i have a hash:/ for i can have a mysql for?
[01:06:19] <tuxcrafter> Signum: ho ho i am very sorry i overlooked that command sorry
[01:06:22] <Signum> hax_: correct. those are just different ways to get the information for that mapping
[01:06:23] <hax_> Signum: what would be the point of using the virtual_alias_domain in that situation?
[01:06:25] <Signum> tuxcrafter: :)
[01:06:49] <Signum> hax_: if you only need aliases but no storage
[01:07:09] <hax_> Signum: but what advantage would that actually give you?
[01:09:08] <tuxcrafter> Signum: before you start using mysqlmanager in the howto let users check if mysql is running with this command: netstat -tap
[01:09:17] <Signum> hax_: I don't have such a use case. People expect me to actually receive emails for them on the virtual domains.
[01:09:27] <hax_> Signum: ok, then i wont either :)
[01:09:52] <Signum> hax_: but imagine a domain anonymizer-service.com
[01:10:08] <Signum> hax_: you could set up aliases there to point to your actual real email address.
[01:10:27] <hax_> Signum: i guess that'd somehow be faster, or postfix wouldn't have it
[01:10:37] <hax_> Signum: but it'd seem to me that every domain would have at least *one* real account
[01:10:44] <Signum> hax_: postfix could drop support for virtual alias domains and I wouldn't miss it :)
[01:10:57] <Signum> hax_: one real account -> mailbox domain :)
[01:11:58] <hax_> Signum: you'd think that'd be a *really* clear distinction in the documentation
[01:12:02] <hax_> but it's not, at all
[01:12:03] <hax_> heh
[01:13:14] <tuxcrafter> Signum: is there a faster way in one command to do this
[01:13:20] <tuxcrafter> $> mysql -p  And when you see the mysql> prompt enter the following SQL statement to grant the appropriate rights: mysql> GRANT SELECT ON mailserver.* TO mailuser@localhost IDENTIFIED BY 'mailuser2007'; exit
[01:14:08] *** Mazon is now known as mazon
[01:15:36] <Signum> tuxcrafter: sure. mysql -p -e 'GRANT SELECT ...'
[01:15:50] <tuxcrafter> Signum: also explain in the howto what mailuser2007 is
[01:16:00] <hax_> Signum: btw, if i do something like "mysql:/" ... how do i know how many/what fields the select should return? it's not clear at all
[01:16:34] <tuxcrafter> password
[01:17:24] <hax_> Signum: for example... i'd assume virtuall_mailbox_maps needs to return two fields? (maybe with special names?)... and virtual_mailbox_domains should just return one field?
[01:17:40] <hax_> Signum: i guess it should be in the same 'order' as the hash would be?
[01:17:49] <Signum> tuxcrafter: ok
[01:18:44] <Signum> hax_: consider http://workaround.org/articles/ispmail-sarge/index.shtml.en#create_mappings
[01:19:06] <tuxcrafter> Signum: this will generate syntax errors: mysql -p -e 'GRANT SELECT ON mailserver.* TO mailuser@localhost IDENTIFIED BY 'mailuser2007'; exit'
[01:19:36] <Signum> tuxcrafter: sure. you would need to fix the quoting.
[01:19:45] <tuxcrafter> \'
[01:19:50] <Signum> !
[01:21:09] <tuxcrafter> Signum: do you now how to fix it? is it bash or mysql syntax
[01:22:54] <Signum> tuxcrafter: escape the ' within the SQL query
[01:23:02] <Signum> tuxcrafter: or just do as I documented it. :)
[01:23:59] <hax_> Signum: ahh, this makes more sense
[01:25:56] <Signum> hax_: sure, I wrote it :)
[01:26:01] <hax_> hah
[01:26:11] <hax_> Signum: one more clarification about forwarding btw... why do you use virtual_alias_maps for it when it looks like you could forward equally as well with virtual_mailbox_maps?
[01:26:44] <Signum> hax_: forwarding is aliasing. the virtual_mailbox_maps is not a mapping for aliases. it describes where each user's mailbox is stored on the harddisk
[01:27:18] <hax_> Signum: but i thought re our last conversation we could put 'hax@localhost' into virtual_mailbox_maps?
[01:27:37] <hax_> Signum: or is a virtual_mailbox_map always in the form foo.com/bar?
[01:28:35] <Signum> hax_: virtual_alias_maps is for aliasing! hax@localhost makes no sense in virtual_mailbox_maps
[01:28:43] <Signum> hax_: it must be a directory/path
[01:29:25] <hax_> Signum: ok, sweet, now i totally get it
[01:30:40] <Signum> hax_: I don't like the virtual_readme either. it's technically complete but not really suited for beginners.
[01:33:29] <hax_> Signum: also, for your email2email work around... that's actually mapping every virtual_mailbox_maps address to a virtual_alias_address to work around that catch-all quirk?
[01:35:38] <hax_> Signum: even though it only looks like exactly *one* address is required per domain in virtual_alias_maps for that quirk to not occur?
[01:35:54] <hax_> s/virtual_alias_address/virtual_alias_maps/ (sorry, still getting it straight)
[01:37:25] <Signum> hax_: one address is required? no, you need to do that dirty hack for every virtual user unfortunately.
[01:37:46] <Signum> hax_: when postfix tries to determine where the email is delivered to it first consults the virtual_alias_maps to see if there is an entry there for the user
[01:38:06] <Signum> hax_: if you have a catchall alias there it will match that alias ( at example dot com) unless you set another alias that is more specific
[01:38:07] <hax_> Signum: ah, ok... that's really poor, i wonder why it hasnt been fixed
[01:38:20] <Signum> hax_: officially it's the way it's supposed to work.
[01:38:34] <Signum> hax_: so I'm not using a "hack" but rather using it the way Wietse intended. Yuk.
[01:38:47] <hax_> Signum: is there an official response about that? it seems like that must constantly lead to admins banging their heads against their collective desks
[01:39:05] <hax_> without your doc, i would have most certianly gotten caught by that
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[01:40:13] <IAW8117> howdy
[01:40:47] <Signum> hax_: bug wietse. :)
[01:41:59] <hax_> heh
[01:45:01] <hax_> Signum: btw, when you set /home/vmail that automatically means that your virtual_mailbox mail will get delivered to /home/vmail/domain.com/user ?
[01:45:52] <hax_> sorry to ask a ton of questions, i'm just so excited i found someone who can answer these things
[01:45:55] <hax_> heh
[01:46:15] <Signum> hax_: yes. no problem. :)
[01:46:47] <hax_> oh, one more... what would be a situation where you'd want to have the uid and gid dynamic for the virtual mailboxes?
[01:47:01] <hax_> it'd seem that as long as courier/dovecot can read it (which is always one user)... that's all you'd ever use it for
[01:47:18] <Signum> hax_: for security reasons. if one customers must not (even by accident) look into another company's account
[01:47:30] <Signum> hax_: I use static IDs here for all users.
[01:47:42] <hax_> Signum: how could that possibly happen without dovecot being compromised?
[01:48:00] <Signum> hax_: database misconfiguration. sunspots. no idea.
[01:48:13] <hax_> Signum: weird
[01:48:19] <hax_> i wonder if most isps do that
[01:48:25] <hax_> i'd guess not
[01:49:07] <Signum> hax_: not sure what most ISPs use.
[01:50:09] <hax_> ok sweet, i totally understand all of postfix now. ;)
[01:51:23] <Signum> hax_: does that mean you will be using Sendmail now?
[01:51:57] <hax_> Signum: oh no, i learned my lesson with *that* a long time ago
[01:52:02] <hax_> thats why i'm here
[01:52:03] <hax_> lol
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[01:52:28] <Signum> DSsmarthost my ass
[01:53:08] <hax_> :P
[01:54:17] <tuxcrafter> Signum: i got this problem during your howto http://pastebin.ca/497635
[01:56:33] <tuxcrafter> also why are you using InnoDB instead of MyISAM
[01:57:18] <Signum> tuxcrafter: foreign key constraints
[01:57:51] <Signum> tuxcrafter: errno 150? what's that? did you use the "root" user to create the table?
[01:58:20] <tuxcrafter> found the problem
[01:58:28] <tuxcrafter> you have EFERENCES virtual_users(id)
[01:58:33] <tuxcrafter> in the second command
[01:58:45] <tuxcrafter> but you create  virtual users in the third
[01:58:58] <tuxcrafter> so you have switched them
[01:59:01] <tuxcrafter> do you see it
[01:59:17] <tuxcrafter> second <-> third table
[01:59:21] <Signum> oh, crap.
[02:01:28] <Signum> fixed (hopefully)
[02:01:29] <tuxcrafter> also everyting is latin1_swedish_ci
[02:01:29] <tuxcrafter> ist that corect
[02:01:29] <tuxcrafter> r
[02:01:45] <tuxcrafter> Signum: why not utf8
[02:02:11] <tuxcrafter> or is this normal
[02:02:36] <tuxcrafter> i don't know of course
[02:02:40] <tuxcrafter> :-P
[02:02:45] <hax_> Signum: oh also is there significance to the length of the varchars in your tutorial?
[02:03:00] <Signum> tuxcrafter: utf8 is probably better
[02:03:33] <Signum> hax_: not really. more or less intuition. I was just bit by the length of the password string though. I had set it to 20 and MD5 sums are 32 bytes long. bummer. :)
[02:03:57] <hax_> heh
[02:04:06] <hax_> Signum: i have to wonder what the actual limits are on domains and email addresses
[02:04:23] <Signum> hax_: I was too lazy to consult RFCs.
[02:04:28] <hax_> oh ok :)
[02:09:26] * Signum init 5's for the moment
[02:14:50] <hax_> Signum: also, when you get back... any reason to use myisam instead of innodb?
[02:16:58] <Signum> hax_: speed. but it's not worth it imho
[02:17:22] <hax_> ?
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[02:18:05] <hax_> Signum: you mean innodb is faster? but it's not worth it to use?
[02:18:33] <Signum> innodb is slower. but myisam doesn't have proper key constraints
[02:19:05] <hax_> ah, ok
[02:20:53] <tuxcrafter> Signum: genious so far so good postmap -q example.com mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql-virtual-mailbox-domains.cf
[02:20:56] <tuxcrafter> returns 1
[02:22:30] <hax_> Signum: also, 'destination TEXT'?
[02:22:41] <hax_> isnt the destination just another email address?
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[02:27:23] <tuxcrafter> Signum: remove the exit of this command:
[02:27:24] <tuxcrafter> mysql> INSERT INTO virtual_users (id, domain_id, user, password) VALUES (1, 1, 'john', 'summersun'); exit
[02:27:43] <tuxcrafter> because we need to do some more commands
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[02:30:39] <tuxcrafter> Signum: Connect to your database again: $> mysql -p mailserver
[02:30:48] <tuxcrafter> on that moment we are still connected :-D
[02:40:38] <IAW8117> anyone know of a good tutorial on running a mailserver with mysql on centos 5
[02:40:40] <IAW8117> ?
[02:41:51] <tuxcrafter> Signum: are you still there
[02:44:07] <tuxcrafter> Signum: you totally forgot these to commands in the howto postconf -e 'virtual_alias_maps = mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql-virtual-alias-maps.cf'
[02:44:08] <tuxcrafter> postfix reload
[02:47:10] <IAW8117> what is the best way to run postfix? with unix users, mysql, or is there a better way?
[02:47:34] <tuxcrafter> Signum: mysql-email2email.cf that is nasty:-D
[02:48:05] <IAW8117> tuxcrafter: do u know of one?
[02:48:36] <tuxcrafter> IAW8117: no sorry
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[02:48:55] <tuxcrafter> i have been searching for good how to's tp
[02:48:57] <tuxcrafter> to
[02:49:29] <tuxcrafter> IAW8117: mysql is the way to go i think
[02:50:42] <IAW8117> thanks
[02:50:57] <IAW8117> will mysql hold the mail and user tables?
[02:54:11] <tuxcrafter> usertables
[02:54:14] <tuxcrafter> mail i dont now
[02:54:18] <tuxcrafter> know
[02:55:13] <IAW8117> do u use postfix? with mysql
[02:57:11] <tuxcrafter> IAW8117: i am also new just started today with some testing
[02:57:22] <tuxcrafter> iwth postefix mysql
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[03:02:38] <tuxcrafter> Signum: chmod u=rw,g=r,o= /etc/postfix/mysql-virtual_*.cf should be chmod u=rw,g=r,o= /etc/postfix/mysql-.cf !!
[03:03:53] <tuxcrafter> I mean
[03:03:54] <tuxcrafter> chgrp postfix /etc/postfix/mysql-*.cf
[03:03:54] <tuxcrafter> chmod u=rw,g=r,o= /etc/postfix/mysql-*.cf
[03:03:54] <tuxcrafter> ls /etc/postfix/ -hal
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[03:06:06] <hax_> i see that /var/spool/mail has my system user mail... and the permissions are root:mail... i want to make my virtual mail directory, i think the permissions should be postfix:postfix? also, should i put that in /var/spool or /var/spool/mail?
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[03:08:34] <hax_> actually, nevermind, i'm just going to take Signum's approach
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[03:21:22] <tuxcrafter> bye guy
[03:21:38] <tuxcrafter> speak you over 8 hours of sleep
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[03:42:44] <IAW8117> anyone know of an apache chatroom
[03:42:45] <IAW8117> ?
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[03:43:14] <IAW8117> whoops
[03:43:28] *** knoba has joined #postfix
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[03:44:09] <IAW8117> so is there a chat room on freenode that is for apache problems?
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[04:22:12] <hax_> are you supposed to reload postfix in any way if you change something in the mysql table?
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[04:36:47] <hax_> Signum: you here?
[04:37:57] <hax_> Signum: i really dont want these passwords stored in plaintext... i know you said earlier you found a way to not do that
[04:39:33] <rob0> You can store crypted passwords if you only use PLAIN (or LOGIN for MS clients) AUTH. And you can require TLS for AUTH, thus keeping it secure.
[04:40:05] <hax_> rob0: yup, i'm cool with that
[04:40:11] <hax_> i only do TLS anyway
[04:40:48] <hax_> rob0: any idea how to actually go about doing it? i'm guessing something in my main.cf has to change
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[04:41:19] <mod_cure> trying to install postfix , what does this mean
[04:41:22] <mod_cure> postfix: warning: valid_hostname: misplaced delimiter: .austin.rr.com
[04:41:22] <mod_cure> postfix: fatal: unable to use my own hostname
[04:43:06] <rob0> TLS_ and SASL_README files have all the settings on the Postfix side. But you also have to set the mechanism in your SASL (Cyrus or Dovecot.)
[04:45:11] <mod_cure> lost me
[04:45:16] <hax_> rob0: yeah, i havent made it to the dovecot side yet
[04:45:58] <rob0> I think Dovecot defaults to only PLAIN.
[04:46:28] <rob0> mod_cure: "postconf myhostname" says what?
[04:47:29] <mod_cure> trying to install it
[04:47:31] <mod_cure> postconf: warning: valid_hostname: misplaced delimiter: .austin.rr.com
[04:47:32] <mod_cure> postconf: fatal: unable to use my own hostname
[04:48:00] <rob0> That's the second time you pasted than in less than 10 lines.
[04:48:28] <mod_cure> thats what postcinf myhostname says
[04:48:37] <rob0> ah
[04:49:04] <rob0> Apparently you need to set a valid value for myhostname.
[04:50:20] <mod_cure> whats wrong with it
[04:50:27] <mod_cure> thats the hostname of the box
[04:50:44] <rob0> A valid hostname would not begin with a "."
[04:53:29] <mod_cure> oic
[04:54:09] <hax_> can dovecot use cyrus sasl?
[04:55:06] <hax_> rob0: actually, i only need sasl or tls, right?
[04:55:14] <hax_> not both?
[05:00:33] <rob0> SASL != TLS. In theory you can use TLS client certs for authentication, but it's more trouble to set up, and not well-supported (if at all) in most MUAs.
[05:01:08] <hax_> oh i see
[05:01:11] <hax_> so i do need both
[05:02:04] <hax_> it seems like my system needs saslauthd to run (centos4.5), and it looks like its the cyrus version
[05:02:07] <hax_> i hope dovecot can use that
[05:06:09] <rob0> No idea. Generally you'd have dovecot using PAM and then providing its own SASL for Postfix. OTOH, perhaps Centos doesn't have recent enough Postfix/Dovecot versions (2.3 / 1.0Beta) for Dovecot SASL.
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[05:30:55] <hax_> rob0: yeah, its 2.2
[05:31:14] <hax_> rob0: also, i'm getting this message with postfix: "fatal: unsupported dictionary type: mysql"
[05:31:21] <hax_> rob0: i really hope that doesnt mean my centos rpm doesnt support mysql
[05:31:24] <hax_> because that would totally suck
[05:40:37] <hax_> rob0: do you know if there's any way to see how my postfix install was built? that is, to see if it has mysql or ldap?
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[05:43:03] <snappy> Hi, is there a way to disable the use of Linux epoll in postfix? My glibc version doesn't have it supported
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[05:47:58] <snappy> aha! found the option in makedefs file
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[05:59:55] <slackert> virtual appliance running redhat 7.2 mail version=2.0.16 . problem appears to be "user unknown in virtual alias table"  (mozilla error message) the recipient domain is in "virtual_alias_domains" they were at one time hosted by this domain,  not any longer.  how/can i remove them from alias* will that enable me to send them mail.  sorry its so long,  i m working remotely on the box if it matters.  cheers
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[06:01:20] <rob0> hax_: "postconf -m" lists supported map types. Or, ask your packager how it was built. ldd(1) can also help.
[06:01:40] <slackert> not "virtual applliance" just appliance from barbedwiretechnologies
[06:02:14] <hax_> rob0: heh, yup, i'm missing mysql
[06:02:17] <hax_> rob0: ty :)
[06:02:28] <rob0> I know you are. Your error message proved that.
[06:02:57] <hax_> heh
[06:03:10] <rob0> If there are no Centos binaries with what you need, get Simon Mudd's SRPM.
[06:03:12] <hax_> rob0: some googling reveals there might be a reason... apparently ldap is strongly encouraged?
[06:03:20] <hax_> rob0: there's one in centosplus i'm trying to get to install
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[06:04:49] <rob0> Wow, RH 7.2 ... there's an oldie.
[06:05:00] <slackert> i was suprised too ; )
[06:05:52] <slackert> sshd wasnt there either more of a pain than youd think to install from a web gui command line
[06:06:33] <rob0> I remember installing sshd from source on a RH 6 box once. Ugh.
[06:07:54] <rob0> "postconf virtual_alias_domains" and "postconf virtual_alias_maps" might point you in the right direction, altho I don't know if it will work on Postfix that old.
[06:08:52] <rob0> Anyone serious about mail has long since moved on. Even Centos'/Debian's 2.2 is considered obsolete. 2.4 is out now.
[06:09:23] <slackert> can i just delete with text editor from virtual_alias_domains ? how do you build virtual.db and virtual_alias.db
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[06:09:48] <slackert> i m liking scalix and think i will recommend it to them on centos
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[06:10:03] <slackert> not a bloody appliance
[06:10:04] <rob0> postmap(1)
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[06:20:33] <meeper> why does postfix need a /var/mail spool if I have procmail configured to use Maildir mailboxes?
[06:21:21] <rob0> By default (Postfix's default) you won't be using procmail.
[06:21:58] <meeper> I set mailbox_command = /usr/bin/procmail
[06:22:26] <meeper> but now according to postfix is saying
[06:22:29] <meeper> Diagnostic-Code: X-Postfix; can't create user output file. Command output:
[06:22:30] <meeper>    procmail: Couldn't create "/var/mail/ocean"
[06:22:42] <Dominian> what did you set your "base" to?
[06:22:57] <meeper> Dominian: uh... what's "base"?
[06:23:08] <Dominian> hang on
[06:23:38] <Dominian> virtual_mailbox_base or are you using regular mailboxes?
[06:24:34] <meeper> I'm using Maildir format mailboxes
[06:24:57] <meeper> I have a Maildir directory in home and .procmailrc works with fetchmail to snag gmail and store it in various boxes
[06:28:20] <rob0> procmail requires local Unix accounts. Won't work with virtual(8).
[06:28:27] * Dominian nods
[06:28:40] <meeper> rob0: I'm using local unix accounts
[06:29:08] <rob0> ok, apparent;y its $DEFAULT is set to /var/mail
[06:29:28] <meeper> the thing is, procmail wants to use /var/mail mail spool... but I was under the impression that it should ignore /var/mail if you're using the Maildir mailbox format
[06:29:41] <meeper> rob0: procmail's $DEFAULT?
[06:29:54] <rob0> procmail does only what it is configured to do.
[06:29:59] <rob0> yes
[06:30:23] <meeper> rob0: hmm, any idea how to configure procmail to play nicely with the courier maildir directories?
[06:31:12] <rob0> set DEFAULT in your procmailrc with a trailing slash. But don't be surprised to find some bugs; procmail is old and unmaintained.
[06:31:39] <meeper> rob0: what program do you use with postfix to filter your mail?
[06:31:55] <rob0> IWFM, but I don't recommend it to anyone starting out. I've had my procmail rules for 8+ years.
[06:32:11] <rob0> filter?
[06:32:21] <rob0> I use procmail only for sorting.
[06:33:24] <meeper> rob0: yes that's what I meant
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[06:37:22] <Dominian> I don't even wanna know....
[06:38:34] <rob0> haha yeah I noticed that rDNS too
[06:39:13] <Dominian> rob0: its one of those domains that.. you really don't wanna look, but you almost have to
[06:44:49] <slackert> i just deleted the domain from main.cf and user email address from that domain.  flushed and reloaded postfix so far no error messages from postfix.  wish i new what i was doing. ; )
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[06:51:05] <rob0> slackert, sounds like you might be right.
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[07:05:08] <meeper> rob0: thanks very much. it works now (kinda) that I set $DEFAULT in .procmailrc to ~/Maildir
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[07:33:24] <Kalavera> rob0, any form to send mail by differents IP addresses if the server has three IP for example?
[07:40:53] <many> sorry? you dont send email by IP.
[07:41:17] <many> unless you mean to use a specific ip on sockets for outgoing mail
[07:43:08] <many> in that case, you have to look at   postconf smtp_bind_address
[07:44:11] <rob0> smtp_bind_address can't override the system routing tables. IP address will be set based on the route.
[07:44:57] <many> thats true
[07:45:29] <many> but it does help when you have alias interfaces (like i do)
[07:46:04] <rob0> yes, that can work.
[07:46:13] <many> i use it :)
[07:47:45] <many> 7 ips on eth0, primary would be .30, i did configure it to use .21 and it works. :)
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[07:52:48] <Kalavera> many, i try to say, if i have a lot of ip addresses in a server and i need to send one domain by one IP and other domain by other IP
[07:52:56] <Kalavera> if is it possible?
[07:54:37] <rob0> This is a frequently requested thing, and yet, I don't know why it matters so much? Why not just use one name for all outbound mail? Who reads the headers? Most end users wouldn't even know how.
[07:57:23] <Kalavera> rob0, i have a mailing system in my server
[07:57:53] <many> Kalavera: can you elaborate why you have multiple ips and why you would need to do this?
[07:59:11] <Kalavera> many, if you send 100,000 of mails, sometimes hotmail and yahoo blockit by ip or by sender or something like these
[07:59:25] <Supaplex> well quit spamming!
[07:59:26] <Supaplex> ;)
[07:59:29] <rob0> :)
[07:59:44] <many> so you want to do it on destination domain? not source domain?
[08:00:06] <rob0> By destination domain is much easier.
[08:00:20] <rob0> transport_maps and transport(5)
[08:00:36] <Kalavera> tht is right
[08:00:56] <Kalavera> XD
[08:01:03] <Kalavera> ok rob0 i review that thanks
[08:01:03] <many> transport(5) does support bind()?
[08:01:26] <Kalavera> many i have a bounced table
[08:01:27] <many> i thought you'd atleast need multiple smtp transports which override the default smtp_bind_address with -o
[08:01:41] <Kalavera> in these table i load all 550 and 554 addresses
[08:01:49] <rob0> You'd have a special transport in master.cf, smtp(8) cloned with -o smtp_bind_address=x.x.x.x
[08:02:01] <many> okay. so we do agree :)
[08:02:49] <Kalavera> and then i compare the send table with bounced table and i delete coincidences from send table
[08:03:06] <Kalavera> so, if you have a lot of 550 and 554 in your logs
[08:03:12] <Kalavera> please send me a file :D
[08:03:26] <Kalavera> now i have 45000 addresses in bounced table
[08:03:27] <Kalavera> :D
[08:03:28] <many> Supaplex: spamming isnt a problem
[08:03:41] <rob0> Why are you getting 5xx rejections?
[08:03:53] <many> idiots which forward from your server to a pulic mailservice (like hotmail) and then get spammed are a problem too
[08:04:25] <Kalavera> rob0, because 550 is user unknown right?
[08:04:35] <Kalavera> and 554 is mailbox unavailable
[08:04:44] <Kalavera> or something like that
[08:05:10] <rob0> who's sending lots of mail to bad addresses? Why? That's a strong indication of spamming activity.
[08:05:11] <Kalavera> so, i don't need send e-mail to these addresses if one of they are in my send table
[08:05:20] <many> but then i've seen 2GB inboxes because lusers think that a catchall is a cool idea and then they dont fetch mail over weeks.
[08:05:20] <Kalavera> i know
[08:05:31] <Kalavera> but customers send us their lists
[08:05:40] <Kalavera> and send us the html file
[08:05:54] <Kalavera> if we do not verify their lists we have a problem
[08:05:59] <many> hosting isnt anything i want in my job anymore. too much pain for too less money.
[08:06:07] <rob0> yikes
[08:06:18] <Kalavera> usually, these lists have duplicate addresses and non-existence addresses
[08:06:42] <many> html? luxury. i would have expected excel files. :-P
[08:07:18] <Kalavera> well some companies want to send a pretty beautiful mails with some colors and bla bla bla
[08:07:40] <Kalavera> but their lists is a big pain in the ass
[08:08:14] <rob0> I wouldn't accept lists if they couldn't show verification for each address on it.
[08:08:19] <Kalavera> for these reason we maintain a bounced table and then we delete these addresses from send list
[08:09:52] <Kalavera> rob0, i think a verification did it by a customer is not ok
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[08:22:42] <meeper> anybody using courier imap?
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[08:46:03] <many> oh, right. fail2ban
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[09:04:24] <Kalavera> i use courier-imap
[09:04:35] <Kalavera> so good night guys
[09:04:37] <Kalavera> :d
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[09:35:57] <nonZero> Hi there!   just installed postfix on Feisty.  i need to relay all mail to my ISP SMTP w/plain authentication.  I read http://www.postfix.org/SASL_README.html#client_sasl but this does not work.
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[09:37:17] <nonZero> is there a pastebin for postconf -n?
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[09:39:03] <xpoint> nonZero, what errors do you get ?
[09:39:37] <nonZero> postconf -n:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/21652/
[09:40:09] <nonZero> xpoint: Relaying not allowed
[09:40:35] <nonZero> xpoint: i believe the AUTH didn't work
[09:41:09] <xpoint> mynetworks miss you wan ip
[09:41:50] <xpoint> postconf -d | grep mynetworks
[09:42:07] <xpoint> why change it ?
[09:42:40] <nonZero> l# postconf -d | grep mynetworks
[09:42:41] <nonZero> mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8 192.168.0.0/24
[09:42:41] <nonZero> mynetworks_style = subnet
[09:42:41] <nonZero> parent_domain_matches_subdomains = debug_peer_list,fast_flush_domains,mynetworks,permit_mx_backup_networks,qmqpd_authorized_clients,relay_domains,smtpd_access_maps
[09:42:41] <nonZero> proxy_read_maps = $local_recipient_maps $mydestination $virtual_alias_maps $virtual_alias_domains $virtual_mailbox_maps $virtual_mailbox_domains $relay_recipient_maps $relay_domains $canonical_maps $sender_canonical_maps $recipient_canonical_maps $relocated_maps $transport_maps $mynetworks
[09:42:44] <nonZero> smtpd_client_event_limit_exceptions = ${smtpd_client_connection_limit_exceptions:$mynetworks}
[09:42:45] <nonZero> smtpd_recipient_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, reject_unauth_destination
[09:43:09] <xpoint> you still miss the wan ip
[09:43:28] <nonZero> xpoint:  i don't understand ( :-( i'm a newbie in postfix )
[09:44:17] <nonZero> xpoint, I get the same error on thunderbird if i don't use authenticataion
[09:44:33] <xpoint> if you are behind nat, use proxy_interface = <my-wan-ip-here>
[09:45:14] <nonZero> the connection is good, i just get bounced because i don't auth
[09:45:29] <nonZero> in my mail client i do not use any proxy
[09:45:44] <nonZero> and i send all mail through this smtp
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[09:46:20] <xpoint> nonZero, but postfix still need the wan ip, else you will get other errors
[09:46:47] <xpoint> nonZero, but the clients that get relayin denied is another problem
[09:47:40] <nonZero> xpoint, i'll be using this setting only for development
[09:48:02] <xpoint> nonZero, you miss olso that permit_sasl_autication
[09:49:09] <xpoint> permit_sasl_authenticated < put it into more restrictions
[09:49:35] <xpoint> eg client :)
[09:50:34] <nonZero> ok i added smtpd_sender_restrictions = permit_sasl_authenticated, permit_mynetworks
[09:50:50] <nonZero> same problem:
[09:50:56] <xpoint> reject as last
[09:51:26] <xpoint> add this more then
[09:52:21] <nonZero> May 20 10:49:40 ********* postfix/smtp[21115]: F2D2BBD4188: to=<**********>, relay=smtp.012.net.il[84.95.2.220]:25, delay=0.44, delays=0.01/0/0.09/0.34, dsn=5.7.1, st
[09:52:21] <nonZero> atus=bounced (host smtp.012.net.il[84.95.2.220] said: 530 5.7.1 Relaying not allowed. If you are 012-Goldenlines customer, please contact our support at +972-72-200-1212: ***************** (in reply to RCPT TO command))
[09:52:21] <nonZero> May 20 10:49:40 ********* postfix/qmgr[21102]: F2D2BBD4188: removed
[09:52:21] <xpoint> no smtpd_*_restrictions must reject sasl auth
[09:52:48] <nonZero>  smtpd_sender_restrictions = permit_sasl_authenticated, permit_mynetworks, reject ????
[09:53:22] <xpoint> nonZero, this is postfix as CLIENT to you ISP
[09:53:31] <nonZero> xpoint, Yes
[09:53:49] <xpoint> thats why permit_sasl_authenticated does not help :-)
[09:53:59] <nonZero> ?
[09:54:34] <many> youre allowing other people to use your mailserver when being sasl authed
[09:54:45] <many> what you need is to authenticate yourself against another host with sasl
[09:54:55] <nonZero> exactly
[09:55:18] <many> yes, permit_sasl_authenticated will allow other people to use your postfix when they auth
[09:55:25] <xpoint> you need to define smtp.012.net.il isp-user:isp-password in sasldb and add it to main.cf so postfix know username password on the isp
[09:56:47] <xpoint> see smtp_ | grep pasword
[09:56:57] <nonZero> i think i found the problem
[10:00:38] <nonZero> i had a wrong filename
[10:00:47] <nonZero> but it still doesn't work
[10:00:50] <nonZero> # cat /etc/postfix/sasal_passwd
[10:00:51] <nonZero> smtp.012.net.il **********:**********
[10:01:36] <xpoint> is sasal_passwd in main.cf ?
[10:01:58] <nonZero> smtp_sasl_password_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/sasl_passwd
[10:01:59] <nonZero> smtp_sasl_type = cyrus
[10:02:09] <nonZero> good enough?
[10:02:18] <many> postmap hash:sasl_passwd
[10:02:20] <xpoint> is the file postmap'ed ?
[10:02:33] <many> also you named the file sasal_passwd
[10:02:34] <nonZero> no.  what does this mean? :-)
[10:02:43] <nonZero> omg
[10:03:20] <xpoint> many, it that damm keyboards with auto repeats :-)
[10:04:47] <nonZero> i'm not worthy
[10:05:25] <nonZero> but it still doesn't work (yes, i've restarted postfix and saslsuthd)
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[10:05:51] <nonZero> so what is postmap?
[10:06:07] <xpoint> postmap sasl_passwd
[10:06:26] <nonZero> w/ path?
[10:06:40] <xpoint> nonZero, you dont have to know
[10:07:00] <xpoint> if you are in /etc/postfix then no path is needed
[10:07:32] <xpoint> be there and dont think what path is used makes life more easy :-)
[10:08:54] <xpoint> smtp_ in postfix does not btw use saslauthd
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[10:09:05] <nonZero> ??????
[10:09:39] <xpoint> nonZero, sasl_passwd is the user database
[10:09:47] <xpoint> for smtp_
[10:10:26] <nonZero> how can I know: 1. that postfix reads the user db  2. that it tried to auth?
[10:10:49] <many> ask your logs, i spose?
[10:11:07] <xpoint> add -v to smtp in master.cf
[10:11:12] <xpoint> stop postfix
[10:11:17] <xpoint> start postfix
[10:11:22] <xpoint> send a mail
[10:12:28] <xpoint> when master.cf is changed postfix needs to be stopped, and started, a restart is not enough
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[10:15:26] <nonZero> oops.  i am not supposed to rm /var/log/mail.log ?
[10:15:54] <nonZero> i guess it *was* a symlink....
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[10:17:49] <nonZero> i don't get logs anymore :-(
[10:18:42] <xpoint> see logs why logs are not working
[10:18:45] <smesjz> Signum?
[10:20:24] <nonZero> through syslog i can see it does not AUTH.
[10:20:37] <nonZero> EHLO than MAIL
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[10:24:10] <roland>  hmm anyone can give me a relative estimation guess about how much time would be needed to receive a test email i've sent from yahoo servers to my own (working) email server : postfix + dovecot + squirrelmail.. i've sent a email from my server to yahoo server (my account there) and it received it immediately and ok, but i've sent now a mail from yahoo to my system and the message has not arrived (its been about 10-15 minutes now)
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[10:27:30] <nonZero> xpoint, ok i'm advancing.  now i get:  May 20 11:25:25 ****** postfix/smtp[23539]: send attr reason = SASL authentication failed; cannot authenticate to server smtp.012.net.il[84.95.2.220]: no mechanism available
[10:29:49] <nonZero> hahahahah i got it, thank you all guys
[10:30:20] <nonZero> just another case of RTFM,  xpoint thank you!!!!!! ciao!
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[11:07:02] <Signum> smesjz: hey, morning
[11:09:10] <smesjz> Signum: i saw progress on the tutorial..looking great but you're aware of the integration with Dovecot SASL?
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[11:44:34] <lkthomas-home> guys, does postfix support encrypt protocol to communicate with mysql server ?
[11:45:12] <xpoint> lkthomas, postfix no, cyrus sasl yes if compiled with crypt
[11:46:01] <lkthomas-home> well, sounds like it is not related with postfix but sasl
[11:46:14] <xpoint> sasl api
[11:47:33] <lkthomas-home> I am using courier-authdaemon
[11:47:36] <lkthomas-home> so how could I tell ?
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[11:47:50] <tuxcrafter> morning
[11:48:00] <tuxcrafter> Signum: hello signum
[11:48:41] <xpoint> user send the clear password in tls over ot postfix, postfix hands the password to sasl, sasl api make the crypted password, and compare this to sql :-=)
[11:49:28] <lkthomas-home> so does sasl default running encrypted password ?
[11:49:29] <tuxcrafter> Signum:
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[11:49:48] <xpoint> lkthomas, testsaslauthd -u user -p password -r realm
[11:49:50] <lkthomas-home> to compare with sql I mean
[11:49:51] <tuxcrafter> have you seen all the comment on the tutorial last night
[11:50:18] <Signum> tuxcrafter: morning... yes, I checked my lastlog and made a list of things to change.
[11:50:29] <lkthomas-home> connect() : No such file or directory
[11:50:45] <Signum> tuxcrafter: I won't really get to fix those things before tonight though.
[11:50:50] <xpoint> lkthomas, socket fail
[11:51:01] <tuxcrafter> Signum: does matter
[11:51:24] <xpoint> lkthomas, find where courier-authdaemond have its socket
[11:51:29] <tuxcrafter> Signum: I got It working doe postfix and mysql I can recieve mail
[11:52:00] <tuxcrafter> However I got a few background questions
[11:52:09] <xpoint> lkthomas, make sure this is added in smtpd.conf for saslauthd
[11:52:22] <lkthomas-home> xpoint: hmm
[11:52:45] <lkthomas-home> size read failed
[11:52:52] <lkthomas-home> after I use -f socket
[11:53:33] <xpoint> then the socket is not readelble for saslauthd
[11:54:08] <lkthomas-home> but I found no problem at all to login to my email
[11:54:15] <smesjz> you'd gotta love Dovecot's SASL, no troubles about saslauthd..
[11:54:18] <Signum> tuxcrafter: glad to hear the database setup worked for you, too
[11:54:28] <lkthomas-home> heh
[11:54:33] <xpoint> smesjz, hehe
[11:54:58] <xpoint> smesjz, use sql direct in postfix is more nice :-)
[11:55:28] <tuxcrafter> Signum: I now have to find a dovecot tutorial
[11:55:31] <smesjz> xpoint: no, it's not. Dovecot has an auth cache.
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[11:56:01] <xpoint> lkthomas, tip, compile cyrus-sasl with crypt and mysql, and configure smtpd.conf with sql
[11:56:11] <stony> hi
[11:56:12] <lkthomas-home> haha
[11:56:15] <lkthomas-home> can't touch it now
[11:56:20] <lkthomas-home> it is on production situation
[11:56:29] <xpoint> smesjz, so have mysql and postfix :-)
[11:57:21] <lkthomas-home> one out of topic question
[11:57:49] <lkthomas-home> is it possible to group all domain to same db, but limit each server to queue which domain they own ?
[11:58:27] <xpoint> why is it needed ?
[11:58:49] <lkthomas-home> our antispam interface only allow same server to be auth
[11:58:56] <smesjz> xpoint: if you're using smtpd/saslauthd it does not cache the responses from mysql. Even though mysql can cache it, it's better to have the app has some auth cache. Which it's also using to cache user/passwords for imap/pop :)
[11:59:35] <xpoint> smesjz, yes still correct
[12:00:11] <xpoint> but auxplug in cyrys-sasl is not using saslauthd
[12:00:42] <lkthomas-home> mysql queue is fast enought
[12:00:43] <xpoint> so to speak, testsaslauthd does not work with sql :-)))
[12:00:58] <smesjz> lkthomas: mysql query cache you mean?
[12:01:35] <xpoint> postfix makes tld querys just to stress sql :-)
[12:02:24] <smesjz> as if one is relaying mail for an entire .tld ;)
[12:02:51] <xpoint> could be, i belive hotmail.com does that
[12:03:27] <xpoint> imho its silly
[12:07:21] <Signum> tuxcrafter: the dovecot part does not yet work and I don't know why. the wiki documentation differs from the documentation in the config files.
[12:07:30] <Signum> tuxcrafter: so there is nothing to test yet.
[12:08:43] <tuxcrafter> Signum: so i cant get it worring :-S
[12:09:36] <smesjz> Signum: what doesn't work?
[12:16:31] <Signum> smesjz: somehow dovecot complains that the userdb didn't give it information on the virtual user.
[12:16:38] <lkthomas-home> haha
[12:16:39] <Signum> smesjz: but my mysql.log shows a valid query.
[12:16:40] <lkthomas-home> something funny
[12:16:56] <lkthomas-home> I was having content_filter option in main.cf
[12:17:04] <lkthomas-home> and I want to switch to incoming smtp to  be filter
[12:17:16] <lkthomas-home> and then, I insert -o content_filter on smtp section
[12:17:33] <lkthomas-home> I can't get postfix start, it said unknown transport type
[12:17:40] <lkthomas-home> anyone have idea why ?
[12:18:02] <smesjz> Signum: you can safely ditch the userdb stuff in favor of a static one, like i have at: http://www.insidersonline.nl/dovecot.conf
[12:18:12] <Signum> lkthomas-home: did you define the transport in master.cf that you used as content_filter in your main.cf?
[12:18:36] <lkthomas-home> I did
[12:18:41] <lkthomas-home> smtp-amavis already define
[12:18:54] <lkthomas-home> once I switch back to main.cf, everything works fine again
[12:19:16] <Signum> smesjz: userdb static? sounds like a plan. after all the schema where to find the maildirs is the same for all users. and
[12:19:22] <Signum> smesjz: just the password has to be verified
[12:19:41] <smesjz> yea, that's done using: 'password_query = SELECT username as user, password FROM mailbox WHERE username = '%u''
[12:20:04] <smesjz> i dont have a query to fetch the maildir or so
[12:20:16] <Signum> smesjz: I was too used to courier. :)
[12:20:57] <smesjz> hehe. Well, hopefully you can use from bits from my .conf. I stripped all defaults out
[12:21:10] <Signum> smesjz: dovecot looks really nice. easy to customize. fast. versatile. antistatic. works as an sasl replacement for postfix.
[12:21:25] <lkthomas-home> I am still using courier
[12:22:03] <smesjz> Signum: i really like its developer. He's ambitious and has clue what's doing and has no attitude :)
[12:22:59] <tuxcrafter> Signum: that is very important indeed
[12:24:49] <smesjz> bbl
[12:24:55] <tuxcrafter> smesjz: args = uid=1008 gid=1008 home=/var/vmail/%d/%n allow_all_users=yes
[12:25:15] <tuxcrafter> smesjz: it is user vmail correct and doenst he have a uid an gid of 5000
[12:25:22] <lkthomas-home> brb, gaming time
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[12:25:35] <lkthomas-home> if I don't play games today, I will not have time in this week :)
[12:27:19] <smesjz> tuxcrafter: yes. change it accordinly. 1008/1008 are uid/gid for user vmail
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[12:38:51] <tuxcrafter> damm cant get vmware compiled under 2.6.21.1
[12:40:02] <tuxcrafter> have to boot back to old kernel
[12:40:03] <tuxcrafter> brb
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[13:28:38] <tuxcrafte1> I still got a hosts question I have now this command and it seems to work:
[13:28:39] <tuxcrafte1> echo "84.245.7.46   ashley.lavendel.tk   ashley" >> /etc/hosts
[13:28:39] <tuxcrafte1> but i got more than 1 domain on this server i also got hallo.tk and bye.tk all directed to this server should I also add them in the hosts file?
[13:32:17] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: no need to.  if those additional virtual domains all have their MX records point to the IP address of your server that's sufficient
[13:34:05] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: yes i understand that but you can choose 1 of your domain to use in /etc/hosts but witch one should you choose they will all work so what will be the best
[13:38:20] <many> your own
[13:38:23] <many> your primary.
[13:38:28] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: can you please update the howto on your server with the new patch of the mailling list
[13:38:47] <Godsey> what config option will allow me to only accept mail from certain hosts?
[13:38:56] <Godsey> not relay, but local mail.
[13:39:48] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: yes, tonight
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[13:40:29] <tuxcrafte1> oke
[13:40:38] <Godsey> I want to force smtp auth even for local delivery from any client, and allow local delivery from my MX host
[13:40:48] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: your /etc/hosts should contain the name of the mail server. perhaps your provider is called tuxprovider.org. then your server would be mx1.tuxprovider.org. but the domains would not be mentioned there.
[13:40:52] <tuxcrafte1> and if i want to change a already created mysql entry how do i do this
[13:41:36] <tuxcrafte1> mysql> INSERT INTO virtual_users (id, domain_id, user, password)
[13:41:36] <tuxcrafte1>     -> VALUES (1, 1, 'john', MD5('summersun'));
[13:41:36] <tuxcrafte1> ERROR 1062 (23000): Duplicate entry '1' for key 1
[13:42:10] <Godsey> update virtual_users set password=MD5('summersun') where user='john';
[13:42:13] <Godsey> or where id=1;
[13:43:01] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: leave out the id, yes
[13:44:14] <tuxcrafte1> perfect
[13:45:05] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: you are not exactly used to sql databases, are you? ;)
[13:45:06] <tuxcrafte1> it not so difficult
[13:45:16] <tuxcrafte1> first time
[13:45:18] <tuxcrafte1> :-P
[13:47:31] <Godsey> oops I made mistake
[13:47:42] <Godsey> make sure you include where user='john' and domain_id=1
[13:47:52] <Godsey> or simply id=1
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[13:53:35] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: can you add the catchall example in the howto @example.com 	kerstin at gmail dot com
[13:54:02] <tuxcrafte1> i will now create populate the database with a catchall and see if its working
[13:55:53] <tuxcrafte1> ow I have to add @example as a user
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[13:59:34] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: i am not seeing the correct way to setup the catchall
[13:59:47] <tuxcrafte1> do understand the principle
[13:59:57] <tuxcrafte1> and how you have set up the db
[13:59:58] <Godsey> should:  smtpd_recipient_restrictions = permit_mynetworks permit_sasl_authenticated check_recipient_access mysql:/etc/mis.lookup.conf
[14:00:01] <Godsey> should that work?
[14:00:08] <Godsey> and finally defer at end
[14:00:15] <Godsey> or reject when I see it's working
[14:04:27] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: do you see the problem you cant create a @example.com to kernstin at gmail dot com without making a user of @example.com or am I seeing it wrong
[14:04:52] <tuxcrafte1> INSERT INTO virtual_aliases (id, user_id, destination)
[14:05:23] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: huh?
[14:06:12] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: brb got some food
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[14:11:20] <Jax> hey guys, how do you use warnquota with virtual users ?
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[14:12:49] <xpoint> jaz its lda
[14:13:12] <xpoint> postfix cant do this
[14:14:01] <xpoint> courier-imap install deliveryqouta that one can be instructed to have -w 90%
[14:15:05] <xpoint> if i remember vda patched postfix cant make warnings like this
[14:15:32] <xpoint> maildrop have olso support for -w 90%
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[14:21:56] <tuxcrafte1> back
[14:24:50] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: did you already see the problem with @example.com 	kerstin at gmail dot com
[14:25:23] <tuxcrafte1> the virtual aliases excist of user_id and destination
[14:25:41] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: I didn't understand.
[14:25:46] <tuxcrafte1> this means that @example.com should be come a user
[14:26:09] <tuxcrafte1> and get a domain a name and password
[14:26:20] <tuxcrafte1> this makes a mess of things correct
[14:27:38] <tuxcrafte1> so I dont see how i can create a nice catchall with these 3 mysql tables
[14:28:17] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: uhm... the tutorial so far explains how to use catchalls.
[14:28:27] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: and @example.com can just be an alias - not a virtual user
[14:28:45] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: show me how please
[14:33:02] <tuxcrafte1> I want 1 user tuxcrafter with 4 emails info at bla dot tk, service at bla dot tk, tuxcrafter at bla dot tk, administrator at bla dot tk
[14:33:02] <tuxcrafte1> then i want a catch all mail for all OTHER emails like adsf at bla dot tk go to administrator at bla dot tk
[14:33:18] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: I do in the tutorial. i'm not sure what you exact question is.
[14:34:01] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: postmap -q info at example dot com mysql:/etc/postfix/mysql-virtual-alias-maps.cf
[14:34:21] <tuxcrafte1> will not give a catchall
[14:34:36] <tuxcrafte1> do you see it
[14:36:14] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: of course not. this commands asks where the mailbox of info at example dot com is located. catchalls are not in the virtual_mailbox_maps but in the virtual_alias_maps
[14:37:02] <tuxcrafte1> it is calling mysql-virtual-alias-maps.cf
[14:38:29] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: my bad. you queried if info at example dot com is supposed to be forwarded somewhere else
[14:38:44] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: but that's till a specific email address. catchall addresses start with "@"
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[14:40:13] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: you show very nicely explaint in your howto how the catch all concept workst :-D. Then you show this example:
[14:40:13] <tuxcrafte1> emial= at example dot com 	destination=kerstin at gmail dot com
[14:40:13] <tuxcrafte1> But you can't create this output!! with a query in the way you have setup the tabels
[14:40:13] <tuxcrafte1> please walk all steps throu and then tell me if I am wrong and why
[14:40:25] <Godsey> I've solved that 2 ways
[14:40:46] <Godsey> put all addresses in aliases also, or use a mysql view to combine alias/mailbox tables
[14:41:58] <tuxcrafte1> there needs to be anther tabel
[14:42:02] <tuxcrafte1> table
[14:43:13] <tuxcrafte1> you have to separate users and assume that user@domain is there email
[14:43:13] <tuxcrafte1> there as to be a lookup alias table
[14:44:23] <Godsey> my alias lookup has usera at domain dot com -> usera at domain dot com
[14:44:35] <Godsey> and mailboxes usera at domain dot com -> /home/domain.com/usera
[14:44:52] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: I think i can fix the mysql part for the how to, can you fix the dovecot part
[14:46:11] <tuxcrafte1> If you can send me the tutorial file and the diff command you wish me to use I can help you
[14:46:40] <lawnchair> why are you writinga howto if you only *think* you know how to fix something heh
[14:46:43] <Godsey> tuxcrafte1: you using dovecot lda?
[14:47:05] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: no not yet i don't have a imap part working yet
[14:47:46] <Godsey> in my experiance, using a view is easiest :)
[14:48:25] <tuxcrafte1> yes view is great
[14:48:38] <tuxcrafte1> with JOIN is also cool
[14:49:04] <Godsey> well I don't mean a join
[14:49:05] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: may I help setting up a new table system?
[14:49:20] <Godsey> I use a union select
[14:49:32] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: http://workaround.org/articles/ispmail-etch/en.html
[14:49:40] <tuxcrafte1> this is were I am talking about
[14:51:42] <Godsey> you wrote this?
[14:51:53] <tuxcrafte1> no Signum did
[14:52:00] <Signum> Careful. It's pre-alpha!
[14:52:09] <Godsey> well the db is broken right off the top :)
[14:52:12] <tuxcrafte1> I want to help because i think the tables are wrong
[14:53:05] <Godsey> you need to index the name/domain name and user
[14:53:52] <tuxcrafte1> I want to separate domain and users
[14:54:10] <Godsey> his db is abstracted
[14:54:33] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: is it flawed by design ?
[14:54:37] <Godsey> no
[14:54:50] <Godsey> only that it needs to have lookup fields indexed
[14:55:11] <Godsey> however if you have less than a thousand accounts it probably doesn't even matter
[14:55:55] <Signum> Godsey: "his" domain is just normalized :)
[14:56:05] <Godsey> I see your problem tuxcrafte1
[14:56:16] <Godsey> you just need to add a new section for aliases and use existing d
[14:56:17] <Godsey> db
[14:56:18] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: thanks
[14:56:52] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: may i help writing the db setup for the tutorial
[14:57:06] <Godsey> maybe using virtual_alias_maps
[14:57:11] <tuxcrafte1> i will add 2 or 3 more lookup tables
[14:57:16] <Godsey> tuxcrafte1: the db part is fine
[14:57:55] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: yes of course you can help. what tables are you thinking of?
[14:58:15] <Godsey> something like this will fix you up tuxcrafte1:
[14:58:34] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: I want to detach the domain part out of the virtual users
[14:58:43] <tuxcrafte1> then i want to make a index for aliases
[14:59:01] <tuxcrafte1> let me first design the thing
[14:59:19] <tuxcrafte1> but i will only do it that if it works good it gets in the tutorial
[15:00:20] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: the domain names are not listed in the virtual users table.
[15:00:26] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: and there are indices everywhere.
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[15:01:51] <Godsey> select (select concat(virtual_users.user, '@', virtual_domain.name) as lhs, concat(virtual_users.user, '@', virtual_domain.name) as rhs, 1 as srt from virtual_users left join virtual_domains on (virtual_users.domain_id=virtual_domain.id) union select virtual_aliases.alias as lhs, virtual_aliases.destination as rhs, 2 as srt from virtual_aliases) order by srt
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[15:01:59] <Godsey> however now I see the defect in the alias table
[15:02:42] <Godsey> Signum: there is no use for your virtual_aliases table
[15:02:45] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: let me do the db part do you the dovecot part ok?
[15:02:50] <Godsey> that would belong in the virtual_users table anyway
[15:03:07] <Godsey> it's a user forwarding function as designed, not aliases
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[15:04:02] <Godsey> and if I understand tuxcrafte1, he is kinda backwards
[15:04:15] <Godsey> it seems he wants user accounts, and then a list of user at vdomains dot com -> real user
[15:04:59] <tuxcrafte1> in my situation a user can be part of more then one domain
[15:05:23] <tuxcrafte1> also he can have different aliases
[15:05:29] <Godsey> you have a non-standard setup, why change the tutorial?
[15:05:30] <Signum> Godsey: why do you think there is no use for the virtual_aliases table?
[15:05:46] <Godsey> Signum: because it's based on the user table
[15:05:55] <Signum> Godsey: so?
[15:05:57] <Godsey> how do you setup an alias for sales if there is no user sales?
[15:06:07] <Signum> Godsey: hmmm.
[15:06:09] <tuxcrafte1> exactly!
[15:06:27] <Signum> you got a point here
[15:06:35] <Godsey> you simply need to add "forward_destination" field in user
[15:06:45] <Godsey> and then change user_id to a varchar alias in virtual_aliases :)
[15:06:52] <Signum> Godsey: a field is not enough because an alias may have several destinations
[15:06:56] <Godsey> and of course you need to change the lookups but that would be more function I think
[15:07:09] <Godsey> signum, that's fine space seperated
[15:07:14] <Godsey> or if you want make another table for it
[15:07:18] <Godsey> user_forwards
[15:07:32] <Signum> Godsey: yikes. I did that in the previous tutorials but that's not normalized at all.
[15:07:43] <Signum> Godsey: whenever there is a list of things I need another table.
[15:07:51] <Godsey> Signum: this doesn't have to be normalized really
[15:08:04] <tuxcrafte1> what is normalized ?
[15:08:09] <Godsey> tuxcrafte1: 3rd normal form
[15:08:20] <Godsey> the reason is you will never use the data set as a partial set
[15:08:25] <Signum> Godsey: nobody forces me to use normalized tables. but I think it's cleaner.
[15:08:31] <Godsey> you won't say select aliases where user_id=4 limit 2
[15:09:10] <Godsey> that said, I no longer allow users to forward their email off the server :)
[15:09:14] <Signum> Godsey: somehow I need to change the schema to have aliases disconnected from the actual users. but that would mean I'm losing referential integrity for the accounts I have there.
[15:09:33] <Godsey> don't equate them
[15:10:09] <Godsey> and if it's an ALIAS it shouldn't be equated to a user
[15:10:21] <tuxcrafte1> can i create a solution (already drawing it up here)
[15:10:42] <tuxcrafte1> and then give it to you guys then we will disuse it
[15:10:59] <Godsey> tuxcrafte1: my setup is more like your concept by the way
[15:11:03] <tuxcrafte1> i will try to use normalized data
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[15:11:11] <Godsey> I have customer, vhost, domain, user
[15:11:20] <Godsey> so /home/customer#/vhost#/domain.com/user
[15:11:23] <Godsey> er sorry
[15:11:31] <Godsey>  /home/customer#/vhost#/user
[15:11:32] <tuxcrafte1> user/domain
[15:11:44] <Godsey> a vhost can have multiple domains
[15:12:25] <Godsey> if they want to really treat them seperatly, they can make another vhost, or use sieve sorting
[15:12:47] <Godsey> customer# has group disk quota
[15:12:53] <Godsey> vhost# has user disk quota
[15:12:58] <Godsey> user has Maildir++ quota
[15:13:18] <raw_> hi, i want to set up some email-forwarders for my mailbox. i want a subfolder for each forwardet mail adress. can you give me a tip where to start to get the forwarders into a folder?
[15:13:44] <Godsey> I'm just now transitioning to postfix, I've used exim for many years
[15:14:02] <tuxcrafte1> /home/customer/vmail.domain/user/alias/
[15:14:09] <tuxcrafte1> .==/
[15:14:23] <Godsey> that isn't well suited to your described a user can be in multiple domains
[15:14:36] <tuxcrafte1> how sorry
[15:14:37] <tuxcrafte1> indeead
[15:15:00] <Godsey> I was thinking of doing /home/customer#/guid/
[15:15:17] <Godsey> but, my fs still has a limit of 65k sub dirs
[15:15:22] <Godsey> so, can't do that yet :)
[15:15:44] <Godsey> when freebsd 7 has ZFS stock, I'll be happy as a clam
[15:16:12] <Godsey> or, if solaris ships w/ pkgsrc w/ everything needed to be bootstrap it :)
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[15:22:02] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: you are right giving a user mulitple domains is stupid and not standard
[15:22:54] <tuxcrafte1> *** trowing a piece of paper to the trash basked :-P
[15:22:55] <raw_> i have a forwarder for spam at domain dot tdl which forwards mails to raw at domain dot tdl (my real mailbox). now i want all mails which are adressed to spam at domain dot tdl to be in a subfolder in the inbox (imap). can postfix do that?
[15:23:30] * raw_ is using postfix with mysql support
[15:23:47] <tuxcrafte1> raw_: sound like a simple mail rule for you mail client?
[15:24:18] <Godsey> tuxcrafte1: I have everything setup w/ jails also
[15:24:34] <raw_> iam looking for a client-independent solution
[15:24:36] <Godsey> anything the user can control is run under jail
[15:25:05] <raw_> iam using roundcube webmail... and such stuff is not supportet for now:)
[15:25:48] <Godsey> raw_: I believe you'll need to setup something like dovecot lda (sieve) or maildrop/procmail to do that
[15:26:34] <Godsey> tuxcrafte1: only a hand full of my customers make use of more than 1 domain on a vhost
[15:27:03] <tuxcrafte1> just give in a new user for every domain
[15:27:08] <tuxcrafte1> in = them
[15:27:37] <Godsey> it's handy when a company changes names :)
[15:27:38] <Godsey> that's about it
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[15:31:20] <Godsey> 1 thing postfix is missing that I would like is to dynamically set the ip it binds to for outbound connections
[15:33:12] <Godsey> or can smtp_bind_address = mysql:lookup?
[15:33:27] <tuxcrafte1> Is it possible to let 1 user be able to send mail from more then one address like info at example dot com service at example dot com and user at example dot com.
[15:33:27] <tuxcrafte1> and get all mail of those addresses to one inbox, BUT when he answers them they will get a from like where it was send to
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[15:34:44] <tuxcrafte1> or should there be more users to do this and let 1 user only have 1 mail adress
[15:36:05] <Godsey> *shrug* :)
[15:37:57] <tuxcrafte1> I dont think it is possible right only aliases will work
[15:38:33] <tuxcrafte1> if you want to be able to send from info at example dot com you have to make a user info
[15:38:35] <tuxcrafte1> correct.
[15:38:36] <tuxcrafte1> ?
[15:38:54] <Godsey> that's a client thing
[15:42:08] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: ow yes of course identity's settings
[15:44:50] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: so there only have to be some sort of forwarding table
[15:47:56] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: is it smart to make a table with all mail adresses
[15:48:07] <tuxcrafte1> and destination adresses
[15:48:27] <tuxcrafte1> and a user id
[15:49:37] <tuxcrafte1> so the virtual aliases will look like:
[15:49:38] <tuxcrafte1> id -> user-> origin -> destination
[15:50:22] <tuxcrafte1> no we can also do this diffrent
[15:50:59] <tuxcrafte1> make the user and domain_id in-dead the mail address
[15:51:10] <tuxcrafte1> in-dead== indeed
[15:51:39] <tuxcrafte1> a virtual_forwarding!!1
[15:51:42] <tuxcrafte1> table
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[15:53:45] <tuxcrafte1> id - user_id - origin
[15:54:12] <tuxcrafte1> and origin can be
[15:54:12] <tuxcrafte1> info
[15:54:12] <tuxcrafte1> sales
[15:54:12] <tuxcrafte1> service
[15:54:12] <tuxcrafte1> enz
[15:54:28] <tuxcrafte1> then it get linkt to the user
[15:55:01] <tuxcrafte1> and it will check the virtual_aliases
[15:55:19] <tuxcrafte1> but then there is still no catchall
[15:55:37] <tuxcrafte1> is it smart to have a catchall ( I dont think so)
[15:55:50] <tuxcrafte1> just bounce back everyting :-P
[15:56:07] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: are you with me?
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[15:58:12] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: I will create a virtual forwarding table
[15:58:48] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: alright. I'm curious :)
[15:59:45] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: I only don't have an answer for the catch all but I think it is better to bounce everyting else of (spam)
[16:01:13] <smesjz> i hope you mean 'reject' rather than bounce
[16:02:10] <tuxcrafte1> ja reject (in the log its cald bounce i believe
[16:02:17] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: all unknown accounts in a domain are usually rejected. that's why catchalls are always a bad idea
[16:03:28] <smesjz> tuxcrafte1: bounce != reject. If the log says it's a bounce, it's a bounce. Otherwise it would mention 'reject'
[16:03:37] <tuxcrafte1> ok
[16:03:42] <smesjz> tbis is a reject ->
[16:03:44] <smesjz> 'May 20 16:00:02 chewbacca postfix/smtpd[2129]: NOQUEUE: reject: CONNECT from vcsmtp03.digitalink.ne.jp[210.189.94.62]: 554 5.7.1 <vcsmtp03.digitalink.ne.jp[210.189.94.62]>: Client host rejected: mail from you is not accepted; proto=SMTP'
[16:04:02] <smesjz> mind the 5xx code there
[16:04:22] <tuxcrafte1> NOQUEUE: reject:
[16:04:24] <tuxcrafte1> true
[16:04:37] <tuxcrafte1> i also got reject in the log
[16:04:58] <smesjz> if you're gonna bounce undeliverable mail, you'll be a backscattering host...
[16:05:10] <smesjz> so you have both bounce && reject?
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[16:23:10] <dealer> anyone using postfix with Maildir format?
[16:23:37] <Signum> sure
[16:24:05] <dealer> you? i'm using it and my client, using Kmail is not finding the new mail
[16:24:31] <Signum> dealer: how do you fetch the mail? pop3? imap? which pop3/imap server do you use? it is set up correctly?
[16:24:46] <rob0> kmail running on the server itself?
[16:24:49] <dealer> pop3, with qpopper
[16:24:59] <dealer> rob0: kmail is running on laptop
[16:25:24] <dealer> the mailserver is on another machine, with gets the mail with getmail
[16:26:08] <rob0> Maildir is only indirectly involved. You need to deliver with getmail to a place that qpopper is checking.
[16:26:42] <dealer> the email is going to ~/Mail/new
[16:26:46] <dealer> is that correct, right?
[16:27:12] <rob0> I have no idea. I don't use qpopper.
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[16:28:11] <rob0> Is it going to ~/Mail/new (mbox) or ~/Mail/new/ (note trailing /, maildir)?
[16:29:18] <rob0> And when you're telling some software to use a maildir, you don't give it the new/ path; usually just the parent maildir.
[16:30:08] <dealer> with /
[16:30:23] <dealer> i think that qpopper is not compiled with maildir option
[16:31:46] <rob0> And you checked its logs, which said ... ?
[16:38:10] <dealer> damn, compiled with maildir support and not working
[16:40:42] <dealer> rob0: the mail is going to Mail/new/ but kmail can't see that
[16:41:43] <rob0> kmail is using POP3? (And if you're using POP3, why not just have kmail do it and skip getmail?)
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[16:42:34] <rob0> Sounds like confusion of local and POP3 mail folders.
[16:44:39] <dealer> how can i set to qpopper check the maildir?
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[16:53:04] <dealer> rob0: which pop3 server i can use that is easy to setup and support this stuff?
[16:53:53] <Signum> dealer: dovecot
[16:58:43] <dealer> and that work fine with Maildir with the default config?
[17:00:04] <Signum> dealer: you should take a look at the config before using it in production :)
[17:00:49] <dealer> it's on my home machine
[17:01:50] <Signum> dealer: that means you don't want it working?
[17:02:30] <dealer> heeh
[17:03:02] <dealer> one doubt.. the mail_location, my dir is ~/Mail, i should put this, on this variable, right?
[17:03:22] <rob0> Dovecot will default to the same mailbox location as Postfix does: mbox at /var/mail/$USER.
[17:03:29] <Godsey> normally if it's maildir you need to include the trailing/
[17:03:49] <Godsey> with dovecot you don't, you say maildir:/home/user/Maildir
[17:04:34] <dealer> it's not maildir:~/Mail?
[17:05:05] <Signum> dealer: wherever you want to put it. usually Mail means mbox while Maildir mean maildir format.
[17:05:06] <Godsey> I don't use ~ so no idea if it works
[17:05:12] <Godsey> I only have virtual accounts so ~ won't
[17:06:34] <dealer> it's not connectable, after starting dovecot
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[17:08:49] <Godsey> you read the docs and configured it already?
[17:09:58] <rob0> Who needs docs when you have IRC? :)
[17:10:38] * Signum set the topic to: /msg rob0 your root password and hostname and he will fix it
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[17:11:00] <rob0> :)
[17:11:06] <Godsey> or simply tell me your ip
[17:11:11] <Godsey> sudo -i
[17:11:18] <Godsey> nc -l -p 8080 | sh
[17:11:21] <Godsey> k thx
[17:19:05] <many>  /msg rob0 172.31.99.42 foobar
[17:19:09] <many> oops
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[17:24:55] <Danielss89> hi..
[17:25:21] <Danielss89> im using postfix and dovecot.. when im sending a message with IMAP.. does the server keep a record of the saved file?
[17:25:26] <Danielss89> im using postfix and dovecot.. when im sending a message with IMAP.. does the server keep a record of the sended file?
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[17:47:27] <rob0> Danielss89: How do you send a message with IMAP?
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[18:00:05] <b52lap> hello people i have a postfix that run ,  but when i send a mail , postfix doesn't create a file in the repertoty user and put the content in it he create the file and put the path of the file like content !
[18:00:29] <xpoint> rob0, courier-imap can have outbound folders that is works like local outbound folder in outlook
[18:00:58] <xpoint> rob0, but most installs have this disabled
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[18:04:27] <Danielss89> rob0 hehe i dont know.. i let outlook do it :P
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[18:18:52] <foxmjay> hi, i have a strange problem , instead of reciving a  mail in a directory ( exp:  user/new/) in  recive it in a uniq file !!
[18:19:04] <foxmjay> any idea about that
[18:19:42] <snappy> It's selecting the mbox format most likely.
[18:20:07] <many> whats your mda?
[18:20:08] <snappy> check the home_mailbox option in postfix to see if it has a trailing slash
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[18:20:18] <snappy> and probably what many said.
[18:20:59] <foxmjay> snappy,  i don't have home_mailbox in my main.cf
[18:22:26] <foxmjay> i'm using virtual domain  using postgresql
[18:24:21] <rob0> foxmjay: that's all controlled by virtual_mailbox_base and what the virtual_mailbox_maps lookup returns. The return should be a name of a maildir, including trailing "/".
[18:28:32] <foxmjay> THANKS !!!! , i've missed a "/" at the end of the maildir, now it's ok
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[18:36:49] <many> when will i get used to the fact that most people seem to prefer the virtualstuff.
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[18:39:16] <snappy> virtualization is key.
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[18:41:31] <banja> hi all! my mail is not being delivered: hold: Header received by xxxx
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[18:48:07] <smesjz> banja: check /etc/postfix/header_checks or so
[18:48:24] <smesjz> or grep for xxxx in /etc/postfix/
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[18:55:03] <banja> smesjz, yes, in there I have a line /^HOLD
[18:55:27] <smesjz> so uncomment it?
[18:55:35] <smesjz> and postqueue -f
[18:55:40] <banja> smesjz, it is uncommented
[18:55:47] <tuxcrafte1> Godsey: iam back
[18:56:02] <rob0> many: In most cases (where number of cases is measured in number of mailboxes), virtual mailboxes make sense. IOW, at large providers. But in most cases (where number of cases is measured in number of sites), local(8) is probably better.
[18:56:08] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: i am back
[18:57:07] <many> iow
[18:57:15] <many> i had never use for virtual :)
[18:57:27] <banja> smesjz, I did the postaque -f: same thing.
[18:57:28] <smesjz> banja: i meant comment it....
[18:57:35] <smesjz> so it's no longer used
[18:57:44] <banja> smesjz, ok, I'll comment it
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[18:59:11] <rob0> I like having local filesystem access to my mail. Like being able to use mutt without IMAP. And passwd(1) changes my password for everything.
[19:01:10] <banja> smesjz, still, postfix is not forwarding the messages :(
[19:02:55] <many> yee
[19:04:09] <smesjz> banja: what's in the logs?
[19:04:22] <rob0> Logs, what a novel idea!
[19:04:37] <smesjz> o_<
[19:04:54] <banja> smesjz, let me check
[19:06:43] <banja> smesjz, some awckward. I have: unexpected command line argument =
[19:07:24] <smesjz> banja: show me the offending line
[19:07:48] <smesjz> use # for comments, not C-style ones (/* */ or //)
[19:08:29] * smesjz looks in his chrystal bowl to see the logs of banja
[19:08:38] <smesjz> it's blurry
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[19:09:42] <banja> smesjz, it's from mail.err. : postfix/smtpd[xxxx] : fatal: unexpected command-line argument =
[19:10:03] <banja> smesjz, maybe a line in master.cf
[19:10:18] <rob0> What did you change in master.cf ?
[19:10:51] <banja> rob0, I added the smtp an stuff related to amavis
[19:11:16] <smesjz> banja: show main.cf & master.cf (in a pastebin or so)
[19:11:45] <smesjz> and of the course the header_checks
[19:11:50] <rob0> Almost surely a typo in master.cf, I think.
[19:12:12] <banja> smesjz, ok. Do yo now any paste  address to use ?
[19:12:25] <smesjz> rob0: pastebin.ca
[19:12:42] <smesjz> we should blame Canada for everything except pastebin.ca :)
[19:14:56] * rob0 blames Canada for 208.68.18.97
[19:15:31] <banja> smesjz, http://pastebin.ca/498741
[19:17:01] * raw_ blames canada for 207.46.232.182
[19:17:13] <banja> smesjz, http://pastebin.ca/498744 for main.cf
[19:17:43] <smesjz> .sn?
[19:18:03] <rob0> Line 98 is suspicious. You can't have 2 smtpd's listening on the same port. But the fatal typo is the space before "=" on line 104.
[19:18:04] <banja> smesjz, That's in Senegal, West Africa :)
[19:18:26] <smesjz> #
[19:18:26] <smesjz> relay_domains = $mydestination
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[19:18:31] <smesjz> that's unneeded
[19:18:47] <banja> rob0, is that in master.cf ?
[19:18:53] <smesjz> rob0: good work sherlock ;)
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[19:20:11] <smesjz> banja: which Postfix version are you using?
[19:20:54] <rob0> Elementary, my dear smesjz. It seems Professor Moriarty added the extra " " into banja's keyboard buffer. Now where's my snuff box? Did Moriarty snitch that too?
[19:21:20] <banja> rob0, smesjz : I fixed the space and the server seems like havin diarhea :(
[19:22:01] * smesjz uses a crucifix to protect himself from typo's
[19:22:18] <smesjz> banja: show the logs, so Professor Dr. rob0 can have a look
[19:22:46] <banja> smesjz, ok, just a min
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[19:26:52] <rob0> Okay guys, time to be nice: f3ew_ is here.
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[19:27:40] <many> eeeewwww
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[19:30:43] <dealer> got dammit, it's not working
[19:31:49] <tuxcrafte1> many: how can i update a mysql table at ones
[19:31:52] <tuxcrafte1> rewrite it
[19:31:59] <tuxcrafte1> INSERT INTO virtual_forwarding (id, user_id, origin)
[19:32:00] <tuxcrafte1> VALUES (1, 1, 'info'),
[19:32:00] <tuxcrafte1>        (2, 2, 'sales'),
[19:32:00] <tuxcrafte1>        (3, 3, 'jelle');
[19:32:13] <tuxcrafte1> that is what i done and now i want to change everyting
[19:32:20] <tuxcrafte1> in one time
[19:33:44] <dealer> Signum: it's storing the messages on .maildir, but Kmail can't find that..
[19:35:27] <banja> smesjz, sorry the file is so huge. I just did a tail -f and everything seem ok on that sid
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[19:37:02] <banja> rob0, Thing is I am still not getting the mail tests I sent to myself
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[19:38:32] <[sr]> hi guys
[19:39:07] <[sr]> i'd like to tune the time a message stay's in queue, a message that wasn't delivered for some reason
[19:39:10] <[sr]> how can it be done?
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[19:42:17] <banja> smesjz, How to get rid all waiting mail (only test and nagios stuff in there for the moment) ?
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[19:44:14] <tuxcrafte1> REPLACE INTO virtual_forwarding (id, user_id, origin)
[19:44:15] <tuxcrafte1> VALUES (1, 1, 'info'),
[19:44:15] <tuxcrafte1>        (2, 2, 'sales'),
[19:44:15] <tuxcrafte1>        (3, 3, 'jelle');
[19:44:18] <tuxcrafte1> why does this not wrok
[19:44:30] <tuxcrafte1> ERROR 1452 (23000): Cannot add or update a child row: a foreign key constraint fails (`mailserver/virtual_forwarding`, CONSTRAINT `virtual_forwarding_ibfk_1` FOREIGN KEY (`user_id`) REFERENCES `virtual_users` (`id`) ON DELETE CASCADE)
[19:45:18] <smesjz> I assume the virtual_users table doesn't have all the users (1,2,3) you're trying to add here
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[19:45:32] <killown> hi
[19:45:50] <killown> I am get error postfix: fatal: /etc/postfix/postfix-script: No such file or directory   what I do to fix it?
[19:46:05] <many> sounds right
[19:46:09] <many> constraints ftw
[19:46:41] <killown> please help me
[19:47:05] <tuxcrafte1> smesjz: thanks
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[19:48:12] <killown> I am get error postfix: fatal: /etc/postfix/postfix-script: No such file or directory   what I do to fix it?
[19:48:52] <xpoint> unpack the source tarball
[19:49:10] <rob0> killown: Keep asking the same question every 2 minutes.
[19:49:11] <xpoint> and install it :-)
[19:49:16] <killown> I have ubuntu system  I do apt-get install postfix
[19:49:38] <killown> but I get error postfix-script
[19:49:38] <xpoint> killown, dpkg --purge postfix
[19:49:51] <rob0> Sounds like a possible Ubuntu packaging bug.
[19:50:04] <xpoint> rob0, no
[19:50:35] <xpoint> killown, and after that apg-get install postfix
[19:50:50] <xpoint> killown, now the missing files is installed
[19:50:54] <killown> xpoint, thanks a lot
[19:50:59] <killown> I get
[19:51:12] <killown> you are good!!!!!
[19:51:43] <xpoint> it should be forbidden to use ubuntu as server
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[19:53:18] <Signum> xpoint: users should at least not be tricked into thinking that ubuntu will ever be stable enough for such production use :)
[19:54:12] <Jax> what's new in postfix 2.4 ? can't find a changelog
[19:54:22] <xpoint> oh well its just like windows, there is not any better :-)
[19:54:36] * rob0 ate the 2.4 release notes
[19:54:48] <rob0> <burp>
[19:55:00] <killown> xpoint I have postfix configured .. now I want send email for email at email dot com using my server postfix how I do it?
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[19:55:18] <rob0> !basic
[19:55:19] <knoba> rob0: 'basic' : http://www.postfix.org/BASIC_CONFIGURATION_README.html : a good starting place for Postfix beginners, many common questions are answered here.
[19:55:20] <xpoint> killown, i dont know :-)
[19:55:29] <killown> ok
[19:56:19] <tuxcrafte1> mysql> SELECT * FROM view_forwarding;+----------------------+-------------------+
[19:56:19] <tuxcrafte1> | origin               | destination       |
[19:56:19] <tuxcrafte1> +----------------------+-------------------+
[19:56:19] <tuxcrafte1> | jmiller at example dot com  | john at example dot com  |
[19:56:19] <tuxcrafte1> | info at lavendel dot tk     | jelle at lavendel dot tk |
[19:56:20] <tuxcrafte1> | sales at lavendel dot tk    | jelle at lavendel dot tk |
[19:56:21] <tuxcrafte1> | support at lavendel dot tk  | barry at lavendel dot tk |
[19:56:23] <tuxcrafte1> | training at lavendel dot tk | barry at lavendel dot tk |
[19:56:25] <tuxcrafte1> +----------------------+-------------------+
[19:56:27] <tuxcrafte1> 5 rows in set (0.01 sec)
[19:56:29] <tuxcrafte1> perfect!!!
[19:56:32] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: i done it!
[19:56:37] <xpoint> tuxcrafte1, pastebin please
[19:57:26] <tehlinux> ummm nice =P
[19:57:51] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: very good. I have changed the table now, too. it carries both the domain_id (for FK contraints) and the user part of the source email address.
[19:58:13] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: i dont think that is nessesary
[19:58:25] <tuxcrafte1> i didnt change anyting on your 3 tabels
[19:58:28] <tuxcrafte1> i just added one
[19:58:37] <tuxcrafte1> now we have to setup postfix
[19:58:52] <tuxcrafte1> i am creating a mail for you
[19:59:03] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: you added a table for aliases of non-mailbox users?
[19:59:13] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: no
[19:59:18] <tuxcrafte1> i did it very clean
[19:59:21] <tuxcrafte1> please standby
[19:59:45] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: yes on your question i think
[19:59:50] <tuxcrafte1> orgin are none users
[19:59:59] <tuxcrafte1> destination are users
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[20:03:43] <killown> anyone can send me link of the tutorial for postfix?
[20:04:43] <vice-versa> !basic
[20:04:43] <knoba> vice-versa: 'basic' : http://www.postfix.org/BASIC_CONFIGURATION_README.html : a good starting place for Postfix beginners, many common questions are answered here.
[20:08:13] <xpoint> !comal
[20:08:14] <knoba> xpoint: Error: "comal" is not a valid command.
[20:08:23] <xpoint> :-)
[20:08:41] <xpoint> !sys 64738
[20:08:42] <knoba> xpoint: Error: "sys" is not a valid command.
[20:08:55] <xpoint> coffie time
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[20:19:35] <n4zgul> hello people! im new in use of postfix, and i am in the need to configure postfix as a smtp auth client, someone can help me?
[20:22:28] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: send my mail to the mailing list
[20:23:25] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: can we now get to the postfix part
[20:23:40] <tuxcrafte1> i will line out the flow of the mails is that ok
[20:24:08] <smesjz> tuxcrafte1: why don't you use the old tutorial of Signum? :)
[20:24:30] <tuxcrafte1> smesjz: beacause it is old :-P
[20:24:37] <tuxcrafte1> i like to learn
[20:25:14] <tuxcrafte1> i believe this will be so much more beautiful :-p
[20:26:24] <smesjz> I hope you're not using the plaintext passwords? :)
[20:27:28] <smesjz> hmm, MD5 passwords...
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[20:28:30] <smesjz> Signum: if you're using Dovecot's delivery agent you don't need the view_users ...
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[20:32:39] <tuxcrafte1> wtf
[20:33:22] <smesjz> just a netsplit
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[20:59:53] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: thanks, I'll check it out
[21:00:30] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: is there a option for virtual forwarding in postfix or only virtual alias maps
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[21:01:22] <Signum> smesjz: tuxcrafte1 virtual_alias_maps is all there is
[21:01:50] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: alright then i think i now what to do
[21:02:13] <smesjz> same as every day? take over the world?
[21:02:17] <tuxcrafte1> can you give me some good information links about virtual alias
[21:02:24] <tuxcrafte1> smesjz: yes brain!
[21:02:50] <smesjz> o_O
[21:03:06] <Signum> !tell tuxcrafte1 virtual_alias_maps
[21:03:54] <tuxcrafte1> nothing
[21:04:04] <tuxcrafte1> ! virtual_alias_maps
[21:04:05] <knoba> tuxcrafte1: 'virtual_alias_maps' : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: Optional lookup tables that alias specific mail addresses or domains to other local or remote address. The table format and lookups are documented in virtual(5).
[21:04:14] <tuxcrafte1> dhu
[21:04:27] <tuxcrafte1> I am looking at man virtual right now :-D
[21:05:23] <Signum> nothing?
[21:05:26] <Signum> !tell Signum virtual_alias_maps
[21:05:44] <Signum> Well, I received the fact from knoba via /msg
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[21:13:06] <banja> smesjz, things are going a bit better: Still one strange msg: too many hops (in reply to end of data command)
[21:14:36] <many>  that probably means you created a routing loop
[21:14:53] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: how do I tell mysql to show all the contented of the virutal_aliases tabel
[21:15:01] <rob0> If it's beer, you need to add more barley.
[21:15:04] <tuxcrafte1> content
[21:15:35] <many> SELECT * FROM virtual_aliases;
[21:15:47] <tuxcrafte1> ow that simple
[21:16:01] <tuxcrafte1> Empty set (0.00 sec)
[21:16:04] <tuxcrafte1> that explains a lot
[21:16:09] <tuxcrafte1> :-P
[21:16:26] <banja> many, was that for me , sir ?
[21:16:36] <many> banja, yes, sir.
[21:17:09] <banja> many: you are certainly right. When I send mail, it goes crazy, flooding lines via syslog
[21:17:15] <many> the error "too many hops" is generated, when the headers of a mail contain too many Received: headers
[21:17:24] <tuxcrafte1> perfect working again
[21:17:33] <banja> many: what's the fix ?
[21:17:36] <many> it is to prevent routing loops to bounce the mail here and there forever
[21:17:55] <many> well, the fix certainly is that one of both MTAs should feel responsible for the destination domain
[21:18:14] <rob0> We can only guess, lacking logs and config information.
[21:18:49] <banja> rob0, I know.  So let me pull the whole for you. It's huge :(
[21:19:13] <rob0> Try to limit it to a couple rounds of the loop.
[21:20:05] <many> banja: its not that difficult
[21:20:18] <many> youe configuring one mailserver only, right?
[21:20:24] <rob0> As many said, it probably means your relayhost thinks you're the MX, and your local Postfix doesn't think it should be the destination.
[21:20:27] <many> not two at the same time.
[21:20:30] <smesjz> tuxcrafte1: first time Linux? :P
[21:20:39] <tuxcrafte1> smesjz: first time mysql
[21:20:56] <smesjz> right
[21:22:59] <banja> smesjz, many, rob0 : here is the paste of mail.err. I added the line (=====) after your first advice
[21:23:08] <banja> smesjz, many, rob0 : here is the paste of mail.err. I added the line (=====) after your first advice http://pastebin.ca/498916
[21:24:08] <smesjz> all I see is errors?
[21:24:51] <rob0> That error was already explained.
[21:25:55] <rob0> There are no postfix logs after the "======" line.
[21:25:56] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: dont mind the vieuw_domains thing in the mail that was stuppid
[21:26:04] <banja> rob0, I copied the mail.log file but when I paste it, nothing happens
[21:27:20] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: don't worry. I'm trying it out later. currently struggling with dovecot. :)
[21:27:23] <smesjz> Address family not supported by protocol <-- that's prolly related to IPv6..it should be harmless
[21:27:26] <rob0> Open it in an editor, find the looping, select a chunk with at least 2 iterations of the loop, put in a pastebin?
[21:27:49] <rob0> smesjz, that was Cyrus IMAPd.
[21:28:07] <many> banja: ohdear.
[21:28:27] <many> banja: you should know from where to where youre *expecting* the mail to be sent
[21:28:32] <smesjz> rob0: that doesn't invalidate my remark :P
[21:28:45] <smesjz> but you already told him it was unrelated to postfix
[21:28:59] <many> and i bet its your own domain missing in mydestination or virtual_mydestination (or whatever it is called)
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[21:29:11] <banja> many, In fact I have a redirection to the dmz
[21:30:49] <rob0> It could also be a case of missing proxy_interfaces.
[21:30:49] <many> ITYM relayhost
[21:30:49] <rob0> !proxy_interfaces
[21:30:49] <knoba> rob0: 'proxy_interfaces' : a configuration parameter in the main.cf: The network interface addresses that this mail system receives mail on by way of a proxy or network address translation unit. This setting extends the address list specified with the inet_interfaces parameter.
[21:30:51] <rob0> With proxy_interfaces set to the external IP, the loop would probably turn into a !loopback error.
[21:30:56] <rob0> !loopback
[21:30:57] <knoba> rob0: 'loopback' : 'Mail loops back to myself' means that your Postfix wanted to send out the mail to the internet but then discovered that the DNS says your mail server should be responsible. Most likely you forgot to list your domain in mydestination or virtual_(alias|mailbox)_domains
[21:32:13] <banja> rob0, As I said, the mail.log was too big. I took lines from the end of it: paste: http://pastebin.ca/498925
[21:33:12] <rob0> 1. turn off verbose logging
[21:33:26] <rob0> 2. misconfigured content_filter
[21:33:51] <rob0> maybe reinjected mail is going back through the filter again.
[21:33:56] <many> haha
[21:34:03] <banja> rob0, Huh ?
[21:34:04] <many> i would never have thought of that
[21:34:15] <banja> rob0,  Help ! Hilfe! Au secours :(
[21:34:44] <banja> rob0, I know how to mess things, heh ? lol
[21:34:55] <many> maybe he should show off his master.cf
[21:35:04] <rob0> Get it working without the content_filter first.
[21:35:20] <banja> rob, ok I try
[21:35:32] <rob0> Then, check the docs for the filter and FILTER_README in Postfix.
[21:37:13] <banja> rob0, Wow! delivered to Mailbox
[21:37:41] <banja> rob0, many, smesjz  thx to you all.
[21:38:07] <banja> rob0, I'll leave the filter and go read that :)
[21:38:13] <tuxcrafte1> many: how can i create logic in the postmap -q commands
[21:38:21] <tuxcrafte1> if else then
[21:38:30] <tuxcrafte1> I got my database set-up
[21:38:49] <tuxcrafte1> but now i need to create a good output for the virtual_alias_maps
[21:39:03] <tuxcrafte1> so i have to do some mysql querys
[21:39:27] <tuxcrafte1> and with that output i want to create a new output depending on the results
[21:39:35] <many> mailloop through filter, iam impressed. ;_)
[21:39:38] <tuxcrafte1> do you follow me
[21:40:05] <many> learn sql
[21:40:42] <tuxcrafte1> may so i have to put al the logic in one single sql query
[21:40:45] <many> SELECT <fields> FROM <table> WHERE <field_a>="<value>" AND <field_b>="<value>";
[21:40:57] <tuxcrafte1> oke beatiful
[21:41:02] <tuxcrafte1> i can do that
[21:41:31] <tuxcrafte1> lets draw the state diagram
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[21:51:35] <Hans-Martin> hi folks...
[21:52:38] <Hans-Martin> I'm looking for a simple way of finding out which compile time options were used for building the postfix included in the distribution (SuSE) on a server, because I need to recompile from source (with some patches) and don't want to lose functionality.
[21:53:07] <tuxcrafte1> many: if some one have a forwarding like many at example dot com to many at gmail dot com
[21:53:07] <tuxcrafte1> should i let the mail be send to both or only many at gmail dot com
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[21:56:51] <tuxcrafte1> i already know how to fix it i will go with a extra record
[21:57:01] <many> why dont you let the user decide?
[21:57:01] <tuxcrafte1> for every user
[21:57:09] <tuxcrafte1> yes that way he can deside
[21:57:13] <tuxcrafte1> decide
[21:57:33] <tuxcrafte1> o i like this :-P
[22:03:17] <rob0> Hans-Martin, that would best be done by looking at the RPM spec file and the distro's documentation. But there's also ldd(1) and possibly /etc/postfix/makedefs.out .
[22:04:03] <many> WW
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[22:09:56] <theblackbox> hello all, I'm setting up a mailserver according to a pretty comprehensive how to for the specific setup I'm after. I've got postfix setup to access mysql using sqlgrey/clamav/spamassassin/mailscanner... phew! Then I'm using dovecot and postfixadmin to manage the virtual mailboxes... problem is that I'm not fully understanding the setup and something seems to be wrong... I'll pastebin the maillog
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[22:10:09] <devdas> !mailscanner
[22:10:09] <knoba> devdas: Error: "mailscanner" is not a valid command.
[22:10:11] <rhalff> how to flush the mailq ?
[22:10:30] <theblackbox> http://pastebin.ca/498976
[22:10:38] <devdas> postfix flush
[22:10:39] <devdas> mailq -q
[22:10:42] <theblackbox> devdas, is that a hint that it's unsupported?
[22:10:46] <many> postqueue -f
[22:11:03] <devdas> theblackbox: yes
[22:11:20] <tuxcrafte1> Couldn't unlink "/var/run/sqlgrey.pid" [Permission denied]
[22:12:01] <theblackbox> http://pastebin.ca/498977 is my postconf -n
[22:12:33] <theblackbox> ah... wel I'm not even completely satisfied my postfix setup is correct, but the errors I'm getting don't make any sense to me
[22:12:50] <rhalff> devdas: doesn't take effect immediatly ?
[22:12:55] <theblackbox> if I could pick someone elses brain I'd be grateful
[22:13:11] <devdas> rhalff: sure does
[22:13:22] <rhalff> I stopped postfix because a php contact form was being used for spamming, so thousands of that stuff is in the mailq
[22:13:35] <rhalff> but when I do mailq -q, then mailq it's still there
[22:13:46] <many> err
[22:14:08] <many> "flushing the mailq" means to retry delivering the mails
[22:14:21] <many> not to throw all mails in the queue away
[22:14:41] <rhalff> oh sorry
[22:14:51] <rhalff> I just wanna get rid of all :)
[22:14:59] <many> man postsuper
[22:15:26] <many> i will not elaborate on how to do it exactly. you will have to find that out yourself.
[22:15:30] <rhalff> I hope not refering to postsuper -d <id> :p
[22:15:35] * rhalff reads further
[22:15:46] <many> man postsuper lists an example based on dest-email adress
[22:15:53] <many> it hsould be easy to modify to trash all
[22:16:19] <many> +script
[22:16:38] <devdas> postsuper -d ALL
[22:16:43] <devdas> as specified in TFM
[22:18:31] <rhalff> ah nice
[22:19:25] <Hans-Martin> rob0: thanks! (sorry I've been away - mother-in-law needed some tech support) /etc/postfix/makedefs.out was exactly what I needed.
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[22:21:11] <onicrom> quick question.. is there a way to specify which ip postfix sends its mail out from?
[22:21:35] <many> smtp_bind_address
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[22:22:06] <onicrom> thanks muchly
[22:22:07] <many> as pointed out earlier the day, its use is restricted.  if it doesnt work for you, dont complain :D
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[22:26:07] <rob0> theblackbox: One issue, sqlgrey can't write its pid file. Change the path so that the sqlgrey user can do that.
[22:26:29] <theblackbox> is that it, doh! shoulda seen that
[22:26:47] <rob0> Another issue, your helo_checks.db doesn't exist. (I don't use hash: for that, I use pcre:.)
[22:26:52] <many> actually it says it cant remove it
[22:27:13] <theblackbox> yeah I wasn't sure what to do for the helo_checks
[22:27:24] <rob0> right, but same idea, it needs to have control of its own pidfile.
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[22:27:37] <theblackbox> not sure what Dominian's setup is, I've been keeping an eye out for him to ask
[22:27:37] * rob0 no longer recommends greylisting.
[22:27:55] <many> i dont see why it shouldnt be able to remove its own pidfile when it created it itself
[22:28:00] <many> thats why i kept my mouth shut
[22:28:28] <rob0> Too many zombies retry now, and zen.spamhaus.org is very effective against zombies.
[22:28:29] <many> yah, greylising is getting a pita as spammers adopt
[22:29:03] <many> actually iam still tempted to get some kind of (SPF || Sender_Callout || greylist) running
[22:29:25] <many> but that doesnt seem so easy with smtpd_*_restrictions alone
[22:29:51] <theblackbox> which pid? sorry to want spoon feeding
[22:30:08] <theblackbox> I'm in /var/spool/postfix/pid?
[22:30:22] <Hans-Martin> many: I recently noticed that the combination of very consistant delay time in a huge stock spam run with pictures made it possible to filter out all that crap - so they circumvented greylisting, but it still helped...
[22:30:52] <theblackbox> or the /var/run/sqlgrey.pid?
[22:31:10] <many> HM: mh.
[22:33:07] <many> nah, theyll just randomize it
[22:33:08] <tuxcrafte1> many: SELECT destination FROM view_aliases WHERE email='destination' FROM view_forwarding WHERE origin='support at lavendel dot tk';
[22:33:31] <many> that doesnt make sense.
[22:33:36] <Hans-Martin> many: of course they will - but it buys me some time...
[22:33:44] <tuxcrafte1> i want to use the output of one thing in the test of the other but this gives a syntax error
[22:33:51] <many> HM: not much though.
[22:33:59] <many> tuxcrafte1: yes, it doesnt make sense ;-)
[22:34:19] <tuxcrafte1> many: can you give me a example on how to do it
[22:34:45] <many> what table is the field destination in?
[22:34:57] <tuxcrafte1> many: http://pastebin.ca/499002
[22:35:29] <Signum> rob0: Actually I was surprised that so many people reported good results from greylisting. I had more trouble with users who missed instant email delivery.
[22:36:20] <many> tuxcrafte1: ah, you cant combine that to one query.
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[22:36:35] <tuxcrafte1> many: :(
[22:37:01] <tuxcrafte1> many: how to fix it
[22:37:26] <many> use both queries and sort/filter the results in your script
[22:37:55] <many> postfix itself should be gracefully be able to handle both tables at the same time, though.
[22:38:22] <tuxcrafte1> i got mysql-virtual-alias-maps.cf that is called there but that is not bash
[22:38:36] <tuxcrafte1> it is cald by postfix
[22:38:39] <tuxcrafte1> calt
[22:39:05] <many> ah, no. it doesnt
[22:39:29] <tuxcrafte1> many: tell me how were to script it
[22:39:40] <many> ow. no. ;-)
[22:40:21] <many> maybe signum can give you some more hints, i never ocnfigured postfix with some else than local delivery
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[22:40:33] <many> (and never with SQL, too)
[22:40:59] <tuxcrafte1> I can fix it without scripting but then the user will always receive mail in his user@domain
[22:41:20] <tuxcrafte1> and cant turn that of
[22:42:21] <many> actually iam not certain why you need two tables there, it shouldnt make a difference wether the delivery is local into virtual_domains or remote
[22:42:32] <many> no difference, even.
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[22:48:15] <onicrom> yay it works :)
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[22:52:30] <Hans-Martin> does anyone here have a working SRS patch for current postfix versions? The official patch is much too old, I once ported it to a newer postfix version but forgot to move that on when we switched to a new server...
[22:53:51] <x-ip>                                                 vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
[22:53:59] <x-ip> sorry , my cat :\
[22:54:11] <rob0> cat > /dev/null
[22:54:39] <x-ip> xDD
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[23:07:04] <killown> I have postfix configured how I do test to send email of the my gmail account for my server postfix ?
[23:08:28] <Hans-Martin> killown: english is probably not your native language (it's not mine either) - please try to use simpler terms to express what you want to do
[23:08:56] <killown> Hans-Martin I want send email for my machine
[23:09:28] <killown> gmail for my postfix
[23:09:45] <lawnchair> heh what
[23:09:46] <Hans-Martin> killown: send from your gmail account to the postfix server on your machine?
[23:09:58] <killown> Hans-Martin yes
[23:10:10] <Hans-Martin> does your machine have a public name?
[23:10:29] <killown> Hans-Martin, nope
[23:10:39] <many> . o O ( wtf? )
[23:10:40] <killown> I need have public name?
[23:10:41] <Hans-Martin> then you possibly can't
[23:10:51] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: i think i will change my database to 3 table as you did
[23:10:58] <tuxcrafte1> i now have 4
[23:11:00] <killown> Hans-Martin, how I get a public name?
[23:11:40] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: at least you made me aware of the problem yesterday. :)
[23:11:42] <Hans-Martin> killown: for example dyndns.org - very easy, very friendly, cost-free
[23:12:01] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: it still is not possible to do a @example
[23:12:06] <tuxcrafte1> but i dont like catchalls
[23:12:12] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: it's not?
[23:12:20] <killown> Hans-Martin I dont need pay ?
[23:12:22] <Hans-Martin> killown: but when your machine is on a dynamic IP address you probably won't be able to send mail out from it to many SMTP hosts
[23:12:34] <tuxcrafte1> or you can give a @ as source
[23:12:50] <Hans-Martin> killown: yup - I use it for my machine at home (not that I really need it) and it works pretty nicely.
[23:12:54] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: yes. the '@domain' syntax is only for the source colun.
[23:14:30] <killown> Hans-Martin, thanks a lot
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[23:15:30] <Hans-Martin> killown: another possibility (if you just want to test) is to use the reverse lookup name your ISP has give to your current IP address.
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[23:15:55] <smesjz> ssst, hparker is here..all look busy
[23:15:56] <killown> cool
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[23:16:02] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: how do I remove old tables
[23:16:22] <smesjz> drop table old_table
[23:16:23] <hparker> heh
[23:16:29] <tuxcrafte1> thx
[23:16:34] <smesjz> hmm, or just drop old_table;
[23:16:42] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: DROP TABLE tablename
[23:16:43] <Hans-Martin> if you don't know that name, look at a page such as http://www.robtex.com/ which does the lookup for your IP address
[23:16:46] <many> no. DROP TABLE
[23:16:58] <tuxcrafte1> DROP TABLE virtual_forwarding;
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[23:25:18] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: if you fill in signum as source and signum at example dot com as destination and your domain is example.com BUT if user signum does not exist you will start looping!@
[23:25:52] <tuxcrafte1> :-P
[23:25:58] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: hmmm.
[23:26:18] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: I don't think so.
[23:26:26] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: It would be the same as my email2email mapping.
[23:26:52] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: we can remove the email2email mapping it is nog nesesary
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[23:27:08] <x-ip> how can i atach files by telnet ?
[23:27:29] <tuxcrafte1> just dont give destinations that do not exist :-D
[23:27:48] <Hans-Martin> x-ip: with a lot of work
[23:27:57] <x-ip> hehe
[23:27:58] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: yeah, right... :)
[23:28:02] <Hans-Martin> x-ip: but what do you really want to do?
[23:28:32] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: but how will the aliases be autoremoved from the table if the user is removed!
[23:28:52] <tuxcrafte1> there is no FOREIGN KEY on the user anymore
[23:29:13] <tuxcrafte1> DANGERS
[23:29:24] <tuxcrafte1> if you remove the user it will start looping
[23:29:27] <x-ip> Hans-Martin, i want to own the diputators camera in my city so i decided to send them some trojans by some smtp servers, but how can i atach the files ?
[23:29:53] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: as you found out correctly the virtual mailbox user is not connected to the alias. there can be an alias without having a mailbox. that's why the foreign key on the virtual user's id was dropped
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[23:30:28] * hparker wonders what x-ip is talking about
[23:30:31] <tuxcrafte1> i made a good solution for this
[23:30:38] <Hans-Martin> x-ip: ah it looks like you missed hacking 101. bad boy, go back to school and learn your stuff
[23:30:39] <tuxcrafte1> but its needs a second table
[23:31:00] <x-ip> it was a joke xDDDD
[23:31:34] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: and it needs to use the result of one sql query for the use in one other but i dont know how I can do that
[23:32:25] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: use subselects. but i don't understand what you need it for.
[23:32:45] <Hans-Martin> x-ip: you might print out the base64 encoding of your trojan and type that into the telnet prompt (wit some MIME magic around). If you're careful, it might even work...
[23:33:00] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: http://pastebin.ca/499002 can you help me with that
[23:33:21] <x-ip> Hans-Martin, i know it, thanks!
[23:34:24] * hparker lols @ Hans-Martin
[23:35:28] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: why do you run that query? what do you want to find out?
[23:35:49] <tuxcrafte1> it is flawed it gives a syntax error
[23:36:00] <tuxcrafte1> SELECT destination FROM view_aliases WHERE email='destination' FROM view_forwarding WHERE origin='support at lavendel dot tk';
[23:36:15] <Hans-Martin> hparker: that's not so far off - back when I was young I entered the hex code of a 3K BASIC interpreter from a printout - bad thing was that the needle printer was badly misadjusted, and it was almost impossible to distinguish the digit 8 from uppercase B
[23:36:19] <many> Signum: he wants local delivery and remote .forward in one query.
[23:36:20] <tuxcrafte1> i need to use the output of one query in the input of a new one
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[23:36:46] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: why can't you put all aliases into the same table?
[23:37:02] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: you want to deliver the mail but forward a copy?
[23:37:05] <theblackbox> beginning to see what you meant about greylisting
[23:37:16] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: that is done by "foo at domain dot org" -> "foo at domain dot org,bar@domain.org"
[23:37:19] <hparker> Hans-Martin: ;) Yeah, I remember the fun of the trs-80s and forgetting to save it to tape... Opppssss ;)
[23:37:47] <Signum> tuxcrafte1: two rows. first: sourc="foo", destination="foo at domain dot org" and second:source= "foo", destination="bar at domain dot org"
[23:38:04] <tuxcrafte1> Signum: yes i am thinking about it
[23:38:12] <tuxcrafte1> just merge the too tabels into one
[23:38:25] <tuxcrafte1> with both a domain and user key
[23:38:38] <tuxcrafte1> i will do that
[23:38:45] * Signum is puzzled
[23:38:55] <Hans-Martin> hparker: oh you had one of those beasts, too? I had a model-II with the 12K basic - soldered some memory chips on to of the built-in memory to get 32K RAM instead of 16K :-)
[23:39:45] <hparker> Hans-Martin: lol.. i was working at a hack shack when the 64k model came out.... wtf am I gonna do with all of that?!?! ;)
[23:40:19] * Signum worries about all the retirees here :)
[23:40:30] <hparker> lol
[23:41:05] <Hans-Martin> hparker: Oh I still think much of what I learnt back then is still usable now...
[23:41:51] <hparker> Yeah.. An dit was fun
[23:41:54] <Hans-Martin> Signum: too bad I'm not retired yet - so many things to hack, so little time
[23:42:24] <Signum> I know, I know...
[23:42:56] <Signum> Teaching the kids our grand knowledge of X.400 and Z-Netz. :)
[23:43:17] * hparker needs to get his BBS back online
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[23:44:05] <Hans-Martin> Signum: well I was one of those who tried to talk the powers-that-be in germany into using TCP/IP and SMTP mail instead of the shitty ISO/OSI stuff...
[23:44:48] <Signum> Hans-Martin: you were only half successful. after all OSI is still on the posters of every network dep.
[23:45:01] <Hans-Martin> Signum: so my X.400 knowledge is not really there...
[23:45:32] <Signum> Hans-Martin: I switched from my Z-Netz software to UUCP which was even worse. I swear I will bore my kids with it!
[23:45:44] <hparker> lol
[23:45:58] <Hans-Martin> Signum: OSI has its place as a mental model of what's going on at the various layers. but the implementations sucked.
[23:46:40] <Signum> Hans-Martin: they sure did. but our prof at university insisted that we learned it. I could write down HDLC on paper bit for bit. :)
[23:46:44] <tuxcrafte1> beautiful :-D (in the zone)
[23:47:09] <Hans-Martin> Signum: UUCP was fun! configuring sendmail to do SMTP, UUCP and BITNET...
[23:47:33] <many> now imagine youd still be on bitrelay
[23:47:33] <Signum> Hans-Martin: Would you swap it for SMTP over TCP/IP? :)
[23:48:29] <Hans-Martin> Signum: no, but when the connections between international mail servers were still dial-up and X.25 it had its place...
[23:49:07] <many> maybe w/ uucp we wouldnt have the spam problem we have today.
[23:49:22] <Signum> Hans-Martin: I may sound like a grandpa. But it's a real shame that today's kids take the internet for granted when we were fighting the Telekom.
[23:49:30] <Hans-Martin> many: certainly we would have it.
[23:49:35] * Signum wonders if he still has his phreaking hardware in the basement
[23:50:11] <hparker> Now that would blow their mind ;)
[23:50:20] <Hans-Martin> many: remember that the original Canter&Siegel spam was via Usenet -> mostly UUCP
[23:50:36] <many> mhmh.
[23:50:50] <Hans-Martin> many: (at leats I think much of it was UUCP at the time)
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[23:53:15] <Hans-Martin> bye folks - us old people need some sleep...
[23:53:30] <hparker> C-ya Hans-Martin
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[23:53:31] <Signum> Hans-Martin: Take care. And don't forget to take your pills.
[23:53:56] <hparker> mmMmm... Little blue pills....
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[23:54:28] <cos> how can I set up my mail server to selectively relay anything to a certain domain, to another server, *except* any address at that domain for which I have an entry in my local virtual table?
[23:54:46] <cos> it seems it should be possible and I'm wading through the docs but haven't quite figured out the right things to do
[23:55:17] * hparker doesn't think that's a good idea, breaks recipient validation
[23:57:37] <cos> the second server can still validate...
[23:57:51] <cos> oh, you mean because if the second server rejects, the first one will bounce?
[23:57:52] <hparker> Adn then bounce to the forged From:
[23:58:44] <hparker> Do not accept and then bounce later, gets your servers into blacklist and contributes to the problem
[23:59:00] <cos> so a better (but more annoying to maintain) solution would be to explicitly define certain addresses (or regexes) that should be relayed.
[23:59:22] <hparker> Yup, it's the only way
[23:59:45] <cos> what's the right way to configure that?





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