[00:00:15] <e^ipi> serrs: if you're trying to make a raidz bigger, you can just replace the disks one by one with bigger disks
[00:00:23] <e^ipi> it'll automatically pick up the extra space
[00:00:41] <serrs> jamesd: hum, that seems strait forward, thx
[00:00:47] <serrs> e^ipi: ok
[00:01:00] <sstallion> e^ipi: thanks
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[00:08:27] <ZOP> i got it.  ugh some weird interaciton must be going on
[00:08:38] <ZOP> have to make sure svm/store gets UP before you even try to enable anything else
[00:08:55] <ZOP> which is just weird because in my mind the dependencies shoudl start store, then once it clears start the other stuff waiting heh
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[00:10:28] <PaulR_> can you do xen guest installs over the network?
[00:10:52] <e^ipi> like jumpstart?
[00:11:05] <PaulR_> yea...
[00:11:18] <PaulR_> does xen having something built in to boot off net?
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[00:12:15] <e^ipi> virt-install has a '--pxe' option
[00:12:19] <e^ipi> so seems probable
[00:13:05] <TomJ> So I'm just trying SMB/CIFS on b99.  I can now mount a given ZFS dataset from Windows.  But, with that dataset mounted, I can't browse in Windows to any of the child datasets - it would appear I would have to individual mount every single dataset from Windows in order to be able to browse them. Is this fixable?
[00:15:12] <PaulR_> xen HVM - hardware assisted virtual machine...does that just mean it has the extensions in the CPU natively?
[00:15:50] <ZOP> PaulR_: HVM means the env is fully virtualized, so you can run OSes that don't support paravirtualization (like Windows)
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[00:16:53] <PaulR_> what do you mean "fully virtualized" ?
[00:17:05] <ZOP> Exactly that.
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[00:17:14] <ZOP> All of the hardware is fully virtualized.
[00:17:14] <PaulR_> I understand the concept of having a "control domain" and then having guess domains/VMs running
[00:17:26] <ZOP> so to the gues it looks like they're running on bare metal.
[00:17:29] <PaulR_> what would you have other then HVM?
[00:17:30] <ZOP> *guest
[00:17:35] <ZOP> PAravirtualization
[00:17:57] <ZOP> where the guest is aware of the virtualization and cooperates with the host to use more efficient ways of accessing the hardware/block devices.
[00:18:22] <ZOP> VMWare is HVM, traditionally Xen has been paravirtualization, but it's gotten HVM recently.
[00:18:38] <e^ipi> PaulR_: in other words, a paravirtualized guest is a port to xen, an HVM is a port to x86
[00:19:17] <PaulR_> I've never used paravirtualized anything
[00:19:23] <PaulR_> I've only used VMWare
[00:19:25] <e^ipi> it's a bunch faster
[00:19:28] <seanmcg> though one can have a HVM guest with only some PV in the guest - like having PV network drivers
[00:19:28] <PaulR_> so I guess that's why I'm so dense
[00:19:53] <Plazma> how is opensolaris laptop support coming along these days.. sleep mode and wireless are seeming to mature fairly well
[00:19:53] <nachox> e^ipi, indiana can run SSGD?
[00:20:01] <_mary_kate_> TomJ: i never found a way around that.  many filesystems + nfs|smb is a little annoying
[00:20:02] <e^ipi> probably
[00:20:11] <e^ipi> you might need a couple packages from SXCE though
[00:20:30] <seanmcg> Plazma, b100 will have much improved support for suspend to ram on laptops, i.e. more laptops supported
[00:20:38] <nachox> then it needs it's documentation updated
[00:20:49] <Plazma> right.. wasn't there a dedicated HCL for laptops.. or is it pretty dated by now
[00:21:00] <e^ipi> the HCL kinna sucks :-/
[00:21:09] <TomJ> _mary_kate_: yeah, seems to defeat the whole object of zfs filesystems.  i've not found it an issue yet in NFS cos I general automount, but it's a vast disadvatage for CIFS
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[00:21:15] <kebomix> Free Programming ebooks With Direct Links Here http://request-ebooks.blogspot.com/
[00:21:25] <Plazma> heh there it is again
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[00:21:49] <noyb> what is that?  irc spam?
[00:21:53] <Plazma> ys
[00:21:58] <Plazma> its been in 3 other rooms botting/spamming
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[00:22:11] <_mary_kate_> TomJ: i'm not sure automounting solves the problem entirely for nfs either.. it won't mount subdirectories, will it?  (unless you configure them in the map)
[00:22:22] <noyb> just as bad as smtp spam...   kill it before it gains a foothold!    :-)
[00:22:29] <ZOP> _mary_kate_: i think with v4 it can.
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[00:22:41] <noyb> yay!
[00:22:53] <TomJ> _mary_kate_: yeah that's what I do, maps with * and & and stuff
[00:22:54] <ZOP> and it's getting a global kline too.
[00:23:37] <Plazma> is it?
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[00:23:56] <PaulR_> so why is it good if the OS is aware that its being virtualized?
[00:24:18] <ZOP> PaulR_: performance.
[00:24:18] <Plazma> so it can take advantage of the vritualization technology if your CPU supports it
[00:24:25] <TomJ> presumably optimisations can be made for that case
[00:24:40] <Plazma> i forgot the name intel calls it.. but if your chip supports it, it really enhances performance... as stated :D
[00:24:45] <ZOP> PaulR_: if you know you're being virtualized you can do things in certain ways that means there's less work to be done when say moving packets in and out and working with disk I/O
[00:25:02] <PaulR_> hmm I'll have to read more about that
[00:25:08] <PaulR_> I didn't know there was a difference
[00:25:20] <_mary_kate_> there's another type of guest now, hvm with PV drivers
[00:25:36] <serrs> xen "clients" have very thin/simple driver layers
[00:25:36] <_mary_kate_> the kernel itself doesn't undersatnd xen for memory management, but it has drivers for the virtualised network devices
[00:25:38] <PaulR_> so thats the OS doesn't know its virtualized but certain devices do?
[00:26:07] <_mary_kate_> it's much easier to implement than a full PV kernel, it's useful for windows (and i think some pv drivers are being worked on for s10)
[00:26:22] <PaulR_> is the performance (paravirtualization) that dramatic over plain HVM?
[00:26:34] <phrost> _mary_kate_: so using pv drivers in the place of qemu device emulation? interesting
[00:26:47] <seanmcg> this blog maybe useful for PV vs HVM and installing on both: http://blogs.sun.com/shalon/entry/virt_install_demo
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[00:27:56] <ZOP> yeah emulation is way slower than pv
[00:28:33] <ZOP> because in pv basically the 'guest' puts the packet in a zero copy area (generally) that the dom0 then picks the packet up from, maybe copies it (hopefully not) and hands it off to the device drivers.
[00:28:52] <ZOP> whereas with emulation we have to trap all that, and copy data through bounce buffers, at the very least.
[00:28:54] <_mary_kate_> i thought they decided zero-copy network backend was actually slower, because of all the page ownership changes
[00:29:04] <_mary_kate_> turns out it's faster to copy it into a new page
[00:29:29] <seanmcg> 'they' being xen ?
[00:29:38] <_mary_kate_> either xen or the linux xen people, not sure
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[00:30:29] <Plazma> i need to invest in a btter laptop, or well A laptop.. but im cheap
[00:30:39] <Plazma> i should get an old sager 166
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[00:34:41] <PaulR_> so this is interesting
[00:34:48] <h3sp4wn> Can anyone help me locate xview packaged in a sane way for SXCE (trying to build the sun media libs examples and they need xview and as far as I can see it was depreciated with Solaris 9)
[00:34:58] <PaulR_> basically with Xen you can install Solaris via Jumpstart off the DVD ISO..."Jumpstart Install" from the install menu
[00:35:15] <PaulR_> so what I'm thinking is then you could build that xen guest domain from a flar you have created...
[00:35:32] <PaulR_> then use zfs to clone your guest domain
[00:35:44] <TomJ> for insalling Solaris as a guest of another host OS?
[00:36:21] <TomJ> cos surely not for installing Solaris as a guest of Solaris?  that's what zones are for.
[00:36:24] <PaulR_> well I'm saying using OpenSolaris as the host OS and then install additional Solaris installs through XEN
[00:36:24] <seanmcg> the guest OS has its image file on zfs, then clone away...
[00:36:25] <PaulR_> xen
[00:36:39] <PaulR_> right...so once you get one image made you can clone like crazy
[00:36:49] <TomJ> PaulR_: that's horribly inefficient.  what purpose do you have for them that zones can't meet?
[00:37:01] <PaulR_> well we do it today with Zones
[00:37:12] <PaulR_> but I'd like to build out different guest domains for different OS's
[00:37:15] <e^ipi> TomJ: there are domains in which it makes sense to have a solaris guest on a solaris host via xvm rather than zones
[00:37:31] <PaulR_> and then when someone needs a new "box" we just give them a new xen guest domain
[00:37:40] <PaulR_> of whatever OS they want from our zfs clones
[00:37:43] <TomJ> I'm sure there are some, but it must be fairly rare to justify the huge overheads
[00:37:44] <e^ipi> f.ex when you have an application that requires something like a loopback file
[00:37:45] <Plazma> so xen is kinda like VMware ESX in the sense its a hypervisor correct
[00:38:48] <PaulR_> being able to provision new VMs for people quickly with Solaris is very exciting to me
[00:39:29] <e^ipi> PaulR_: well, i'd probably still use zones for that
[00:39:37] <seanmcg> how do you configure those new cloned VMs afterwards ?  With zones, I'd have a new sysidcfg in /etc/, but with VMs its a little different..
[00:39:39] <PaulR_> what if someone needs a Windows box
[00:39:39] <e^ipi> zones can be cloned as well
[00:39:44] <Plazma> do branded zones still exist.. i wondw how popular they are..
[00:39:58] <PaulR_> or someone needs an Ubuntu install
[00:40:05] <PaulR_> you can't do that with Branded zones today
[00:40:20] <e^ipi> yeah, fair enough
[00:40:35] <PaulR_> seanmcg:  correct...so you'd have to reconfigure the network
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[00:40:41] <PaulR_> or so I'm thinking
[00:40:45] <Plazma> if they really want an ubuntu install.. i know exactly what you should tell them.. but you may want to cover your ears :P
[00:40:47] <PaulR_> I'm going to experiment this week
[00:41:05] <PaulR_> Plama:  or whatever OS that Brandz doesn't support :)
[00:42:09] <Plazma> though nothing makes me stare blissfully into space more tahn drawing flames on my compiz WM while running a production oracle database on it
[00:42:13] <Plazma> and then X takes 80% CPu..
[00:43:57] <phrost> anyone know if you can forcibly disable hardware offloading on xvm guest interfaces? due to the solaris bug in rge0 all of my xvm PV guests can't do network based installs due to hardware tcp/udp offloading on the xvm nic not functioning due to it not functioning on the host nic (rge0)
[00:44:24] <PaulR_> what I want to try to do is automate provisioning with xen
[00:45:41] <seanmcg> PaulR_, off hand; change the mac addy of each cloned VM before booting it,  have the VM mount say an ISO on boot, which would have a sysidcfg file per mac addy.. ?
[00:46:05] <seanmcg> or just a dhcp server with those mac addy's added.
[00:46:09] <PaulR_> yes for Solaris that would work
[00:46:14] <PaulR_> but I'm not sure how for other OS's
[00:46:28] <seanmcg> dhcp server :)
[00:47:19] <PaulR_> yea I'm going to look into it
[00:47:39] <PaulR_> I'd like to be able to have a script that will build me a new guest domain of whatever OS I want
[00:47:51] <e^ipi> like virt-install?
[00:48:05] <PaulR_> well total hands off install
[00:48:14] <PaulR_> no configuration
[00:48:20] <e^ipi> the guest would have to support that
[00:48:38] <PaulR_> right...I'm assuming certain Linux distributions do
[00:48:54] <PaulR_> not sure about Windows
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[00:52:32] <e^ipi> they must have some sort of automated install
[00:53:49] <ZOP> oh bugger *headdesk* i have to build my xen domU linux kernels.
[00:54:18] <ZOP> yeah apparently CentOS has some support either in CentOS or virt-install or a combination of hte two.
[00:54:24] <evocallaghan> why does grep -q not exist on opensolaris ?
[00:54:55] <evocallaghan> Its on OpenGroup http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908799/xcu/grep.html
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[00:57:35] <ZOP> evocallaghan: hmm not sure but you can use /usr/gnu/bin/grep
[00:57:45] <ZOP> which will have that (since it's GNU Grep)
[00:58:05] <seanmcg> evocallaghan, /usr/xpg4/bin/grep has it
[00:59:08] <serrs> and then /usr/vms/bin/ ... all the switches are constant...  ;)
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[01:00:09] <CIA-25> Sowmini Varadhan <Sowmini.Varadhan at Sun dot COM>: 6753521 show-linkprop should not return ENOTSUP for DEFAULT value of props like speed., 6748230 gldv3_warning should initialize cnt when calling dladm_get_linkprop
[01:00:09] <CIA-25> Chin-Long Shu <Chin-Long.Shu at Sun dot COM>: 6605670 Missing "else" in ldaplist.c:main(), Contributed by Vinay Simha B.N. and Beeresh G.
[01:00:10] <CIA-25> John Sonnenschein <John.Sonnenschein at Sun dot COM>: 6756000 hg rtichk output missing
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[01:00:22] <evocallaghan> Thanks lads
[01:00:33] <Plazma> the hell is CIA-25 ?
[01:00:37] <Plazma> a pastebot?
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[01:00:55] <seanmcg> aye, for the hg pushes into on
[01:01:00] <Plazma> ahh
[01:01:08] <Plazma> all these trolls these days and their spam.. makes me all nervous
[01:01:09] <evocallaghan> then what is this ? which grep
[01:01:09] <evocallaghan> /usr/bin/grep
[01:02:03] <jamesd> CIA-25, it shows commits to opensolaris source
[01:02:34] <Plazma> oh cool
[01:03:26] <seanmcg> evocallaghan, /usr/bin/grep is the age-old bsd/srv4 derived one, then the one in /usr/xpg4 is POSIX grep (me thinks)
[01:03:39] <evocallaghan> what the hell
[01:04:14] <seanmcg> theres a bunch of POSIX compliant bits in /usr/xpg[4|6]
[01:04:47] <evocallaghan> pfexec rm /usr/bin/grep ; pfexec ln -s /usr/xpg4/bin/grep /usr/bin/grep
[01:04:53] <evocallaghan> That should do the trcik
[01:04:56] <evocallaghan> s/trick
[01:05:01] <evocallaghan> What a load of crud
[01:05:02] <seanmcg> man standards
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[01:05:14] <_mary_kate_> evocallaghan: or you could just set your $PATH properly
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[01:05:26] <seanmcg> evocallaghan, wouldn't do that, can break things
[01:05:32] <tsoome> not all links are good links:)
[01:05:44] <_mary_kate_> the reason /usr/bin and /usr/xpg?/bin are separate is they're not always compatible
[01:05:44] <evocallaghan> To late
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[01:05:56] <_mary_kate_> (although it is lame that the /usr/bin versions miss some non-conflicting functionality)
[01:06:06] <evocallaghan> I am going to clean off this opensolaris distro soon anyway
[01:06:11] <evocallaghan> Its a load of crap !
[01:06:29] <evocallaghan> No matter how many bug/rfe reports I have done
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[01:06:40] <_mary_kate_> does that mean you'll go away?  ;)
[01:06:52] <evocallaghan> lol
[01:07:12] <e^ipi> evocallaghan: right, bugs without patches; there are a finite amount of developers working on opensolaris
[01:07:13] <evocallaghan> _mary_kate_:I am going to spend my life hunting you down
[01:07:30] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:I know, but to what end
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[01:07:40] <e^ipi> and they have other priorities than bug fixes
[01:07:50] <evocallaghan> O_o
[01:08:11] <evocallaghan> OK, well that's not the topic so I'll stop at that last point
[01:08:40] <kito> I'm sure ubuntu will serve you well
[01:08:41] <e^ipi> with respect to xpg* vs /usr/bin
[01:08:45] <evocallaghan> After 5months I am moving back to sxce for my workstation
[01:09:09] <e^ipi> /usr/bin are the SVID compliant utils, xpg are the SUS compliant utils, when SUS and SVID are incompatible
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[01:09:33] <_mary_kate_> evocallaghan: this is no different in sxce
[01:09:37] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:Why keep SVID around ?
[01:09:56] <_mary_kate_> evocallaghan: because it's required for backward compatibility
[01:10:00] <evocallaghan> _mary_kate_:Ah, but the PATH is not so messed up
[01:10:04] <e^ipi> because solaris is a SystemV unix?
[01:10:04] <sponix> anyone know, did they make any X changes between SXCE 98 and 99 ? 98 loads fine in VirtualBox, and 99 never loads X, just spits out some semi-random characters and hangs
[01:10:13] <_mary_kate_> that's not the issue; the issue is why those tools don't have the additional POSIX functionality
[01:10:19] <h3sp4wn> sponix: Look at the install.log
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[01:10:38] <evocallaghan> sponix:Yes, there was some. What version of vbox are you using ?
[01:10:39] <h3sp4wn> There is a bunch of fonts stuff that has to be reinstalled
[01:11:06] <evocallaghan> oh, yea. I seen that on the forum
[01:11:41] <sponix> evocallaghan:  2.0.2 on Ubuntu i386 8.0.4.1
[01:12:08] <_mary_kate_> 8.0.4.1?  since when did they get such long version numbers
[01:12:30] <sponix> the .1 is a revision to 8.04 ... Sorry, it should be 8.04.1
[01:12:45] <sponix> Anyway, I have to get out the door, I'll come complain more some other time ;)
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[01:14:24] <evocallaghan> lol
[01:19:04] <ZOP> ok so xm is deprecated but virsh doesn't work heh
[01:19:06] <ZOP> awesomeness.
[01:19:21] <ZOP> # virsh list
[01:19:21] <ZOP> libvir: Remote error : No such file or directory
[01:19:21] <ZOP> error: failed to connect to the hypervisor
[01:19:32] <Plazma> get that old stuff outta here !
[01:19:33] <ZOP> (where xm list works)
[01:20:23] <nachox> virsh?
[01:23:02] <ZOP> yeah its supposedly the new style interface (virt-install and related too)
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[01:23:46] <nachox> ohh, xen stuff
[01:24:05] <ZOP> ok i really need to scoot i'm gonna be late
[01:25:28] <ZOP> probably have to dtrace it later to see what it's doing and where it's gettign it's obviously incorrect setup from or something.
[01:25:33] <ZOP> xend is running so.  *shrugs*
[01:25:56] <ZOP> oh crap
[01:25:59] <ZOP> different daemon
[01:26:02] * ZOP headdesk
[01:27:39] <nachox> hahaha
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[02:15:21] <scott> can anyone help with a newbie to open solaris?
[02:16:04] <scott> I have been playing with Open Solaris along with many other Linux distros
[02:16:10] <jamesd> yes, but we are limiting newbies to one question a day and that was yours... come back again tomorow.  thankyou for using opensolaris
[02:16:26] <nachox> hehe
[02:16:29] <scott> haha
[02:16:55] <nachox> ask away
[02:17:17] <scott> I have found OpenSolaris to be pretty polished....the question is why would we use it vs. Linux or better yet RedHat?
[02:17:33] <scott> what are the main advantages?
[02:17:50] <jamesd> zfs, dtrace, smf, zones, etc..
[02:18:15] <nachox> scott, it depends on what you actually do with your computer, but in general, what jamesd said
[02:18:17] <jamesd> solaris is cheaper vs red hat.. and has better support.
[02:18:24] <scott> k
[02:19:04] <nachox> scott, what would you use rh for?
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[02:19:23] <scott> Here is what I am attempting to do....I truely want to find a desktop replacement....I am writing a whitepaper on the cost and benefits of open source
[02:19:53] <jamesd> solaris as a desktop is not a perfect match...
[02:19:53] <scott> what I am looking to produce is something that is simple for the non techie
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[02:20:05] <scott> ok
[02:20:06] <nachox> if you want desktop, you dont want rh or solaris, you want osx
[02:20:08] <jamesd> perhaps windows or ubuntu is better.
[02:20:32] <scott> Windows is what I am attempting to move from...
[02:21:02] <scott> my other dilemma is that I am tring to create something for the non geek
[02:21:21] <scott> to be honest...my experiment has been hell...
[02:21:31] <scott> especially video drivers
[02:21:39] <scott> of very beefy systems
[02:21:44] <e^ipi> scott: buy a mac. *shrug*
[02:21:48] <scott> lol
[02:21:53] <scott> I have 4:)
[02:21:57] * nachox agrees
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[02:22:28] <delewis> can't beat OS X on a workstation.
[02:22:37] <jamesd> some users just aren't happy unless they can click on every link people send them, even if it includes viruses.
[02:23:07] <nachox> seriously linux is no better than indiana on the desktop, but neither can compete with osx
[02:23:11] <scott> lo
[02:23:25] <scott> right
[02:23:35] <houst0n-_> Slightly odd place to ask this - but I've just obtained an eeePC (yay...) and I need to pick a linux distro to put on it (There's no way I'm going to even bother with solaris on a 600mhz 512mb .. thingy..) so - what's a good linux these days?
[02:23:50] <houst0n-_> I've not used linux in... well an age
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[02:23:58] <scott> you know what is funny
[02:24:06] <nachox> houst0n-_, you realize youre in #opensolaris, right?
[02:24:16] <houst0n-_> nachox: Of course, I'm not blind =)
[02:24:19] <e^ipi> houst0n-_: timsf has opensolaris on his eeepc
[02:24:21] <scott> You guys are not "big headed" and rude like many in the linux community
[02:24:40] <houst0n-_> e^ipi: Yeah I bet it's slow as hell
[02:24:45] <nachox> scott, some are
[02:24:47] <e^ipi> nah, he seems to have a good time of it
[02:24:48] <houst0n-_> ;)
[02:24:49] <scott> From my experience of opensolaris...
[02:24:56] <e^ipi> solaris runs plenty fine on 300mhz cpu's
[02:25:06] <scott> it has been quite better than any linux distro
[02:25:13] <houst0n-_> I'm more concerned about the mem useage
[02:25:22] <scott> I think that is the problem...too many choices
[02:25:40] <houst0n-_> Linux with kde4 is only using.... 160mb (not that you can ever get a very accurate measure)
[02:25:45] <e^ipi> my suggestion if you're not going to go with solaris is FreeBSD
[02:25:55] <houst0n-_> And kiss wpa support goodbye? No thanks
[02:26:08] <houst0n-_> I was a freebsd fanboy for many years - it's great and everything
[02:26:10] <houst0n-_> but naaah
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[02:26:45] <houst0n-_> Oh well  - to google ( and sleep )
[02:26:46] <nachox> just use opensd :)
[02:26:47] <houst0n-_> laters =)
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[02:29:06] <jamesd> why do they charge so much more to make it smaller. and its not like its that much more smaller.. give me a decent 15", dual core, 2GB ram laptop for $500 and i'm happy
[02:29:44] <nachox> i'd love a 13'' with that
[02:31:43] <e^ipi> I want one of those MIPS based subnotebooks
[02:31:44] <Dominic> I got my 12" Dell about 18 months ago before this latest craze of cheap, tiny laptops.  I'd probably feel more sick if the insurance company hadn't paid for most of it...
[02:32:02] <Dominic> cost a tidy sum :(
[02:32:13] <jbk> evening
[02:33:13] <nachox> e^ipi, to run what there?
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[02:33:56] <e^ipi> to run awesome there.
[02:34:03] <e^ipi> i dunno, tiny laptop, cool architecture
[02:34:06] <e^ipi> i can find a use for it
[02:35:23] <jamesd> a tiny latop running something like solaris 8  would rock because it could use almost no power and run at 250mhz and 1GB of ram...
[02:35:45] <TomJ> hmm
[02:35:46] <TomJ> data/export/porn                                                      75.0G  3.27T  75.0G  /data/export/porn
[02:35:49] <TomJ> maybe I need to cut down
[02:36:17] <jbk> haha
[02:36:21] <nachox> ...
[02:38:18] * nachox is waiting for a newer indiana post nv_100 to see if he can get suspend to ram working here
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[02:41:07] <TomJ> I can't believe my rpool went from single to mirror in 6 minutes.  7GB used out of 370GB total capacity.  back on SVM that'd have taken hours.
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[03:01:43] <sponix> NOTICE: MPO disabled because memory is interleaved. WARNING: BIOS microcode patch for AMD Athlon(tm) 64/Opteron(tm) processor erratum 131 was not detected; updating your system's BIOS to a version containing this microcode patch is HIGHLY recommended or erroneous system operation may occur.
[03:01:52] <sponix> anyone seen these two messages ?
[03:02:23] <evocallaghan> No, but I got a idea what it means
[03:02:28] <evocallaghan> Update your BIOS
[03:03:27] <sponix> yeah, BIOS one does seem to point to that, what is this MPO one ?
[03:03:42] <sponix> ... Let me guess, update my BIOS, then see if it still appears? :)
[03:03:59] <sponix> evocallaghan:  that is inside VirtualBox that I see these messages, if that matters
[03:04:29] <sponix> Booting off a FreeDOS CD still the way to go about updating BIOS ?
[03:05:05] <nachox> memory placement optimization probably
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[03:22:23] <sbahra> http://dlc.sun.com/osol/opensolaris/2008/05/os200805.iso = supports UltraSparc III?
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[03:23:32] <e^ipi> no
[03:23:45] <e^ipi> 2008.xx doesn't support sparc, you'll be using SXCE
[03:24:05] <e^ipi> january, i'm told
[03:24:28] <sbahra> owell
[03:24:43] <Plazma> that sucks sun cut their workstation market off.. but i guess it makes sense form a marketing aspect
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[03:26:42] <jbk> yeah
[03:26:48] <jbk> really annoying for where i work
[03:27:06] <jbk> certain workstation software is only available for solaris on sparc
[03:27:11] <jbk> thus
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[03:27:22] <jbk> the users now use linux workstations
[03:27:24] <Plazma> my one lab down south in the bigger plant jus bought 2 new sun ultra 45's or so for their vibration testing
[03:27:49] <jbk> since now, the major players are pretty much resting on their laurels
[03:28:00] <jbk> (major software players in the industry)
[03:28:08] <_Auralis> sparc desktop is dead
[03:28:12] <jbk> and from what i've been told, have mostly layed off most of the developers
[03:28:39] <jbk> thus, it's very possible for one major app at least, that there may be no one left that even knows how to build it
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[03:31:37] <mike-11101> Is anyone using munin on opensolaris 2008.xx or (recommends) alternative?
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[04:05:13] <nachox> night guys
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[04:07:10] <servnhim> Greetings
[04:07:37] <servnhim> I am looking to move away from windows and was wondering if OpenSolaris would be better than Linux?
[04:08:28] <servnhim> I am a business user, not a system admin, but heard a lot of good things about open solaris.
[04:08:55] <servnhim> would open solaris be a good choice?
[04:09:06] <_mary_kate_> what do you want to use it for?
[04:09:07] <e^ipi> you're asking an opensolaris channel
[04:09:12] <e^ipi> what do you think we're going to reply?
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[04:09:24] <e^ipi> just try them both and use which you like better
[04:09:52] <servnhim> Is there any reason to choose opensolaris?
[04:10:11] <Auralis_> it depends on what you want to do with the system in question
[04:10:26] <servnhim> Desktop solution....to replace windows
[04:10:37] <e^ipi> once again
[04:10:41] <servnhim> Office, photoshop, etc
[04:10:46] <e^ipi> you are asking solaris people if solaris is better than the alternatives
[04:10:51] <_mary_kate_> use Windows if you want office and photoshop
[04:10:51] <e^ipi> what do you think the answer will be?
[04:10:51] <servnhim> I am looking to save $$$
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[04:11:20] <servnhim> That is why I am asking...why is opensolaris better?
[04:11:29] <_mary_kate_> on Unix you'll get openoffice and gimp, which are like office and photoshop, except they suck
[04:11:34] <servnhim> the only negatives I have read is that their is a lacking of drivers
[04:11:36] <Auralis_> honestly, it doesn't matters, both solaris and linux pretty much use the exact same applications, so try them both, and use the one you like best
[04:12:21] <servnhim> so really, moving away from windows is not all that?
[04:12:36] <_mary_kate_> if your goal is to run Windows applications, the right choice is Windows
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[04:12:41] <TomJ> it is until you need an application that is better on Windows
[04:12:44] <_mary_kate_> solaris could be 300 times better, but it still wouldn't do what you want
[04:12:44] <servnhim> thanks for the time
[04:12:45] <TomJ> real men use both.
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[04:13:32] <mike-11101> virtualbox? :P
[04:13:49] <TomJ> yeah
[04:15:56] <Auralis_> now if virtual box has 3d accel and sound in support on solaris ....
[04:16:35] <TomJ> it doesn't have sound?
[04:16:42] <TomJ> 3d accel i can live without, but USB needs to come
[04:16:57] <Auralis_> it has, but sound input is not worky, mics for example
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[04:19:20] <mike-11101> I though USB worked?
[04:19:37] <mike-11101> as of 2.0
[04:19:57] <TomJ> not in Solaris still
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[04:27:29] <evocallaghan> Where does one find the core dump file of Xorg ?
[04:27:47] <Plazma> current working directory
[04:27:51] <Plazma> i think
[04:27:56] <evocallaghan> Nope
[04:28:03] <jamesd> find / -name 'core*'
[04:28:05] <Plazma> what does coreadm say? (or maybe its dumpadm
[04:28:06] <_mary_kate_> i guess his question is which directory would be X's cwd
[04:28:10] <Plazma> ahh
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[04:28:20] <Plazma> possibly wher edtlogin ands tuff reside?
[04:28:21] <Plazma> dtlogin*
[04:28:23] <Plazma> i can't type
[04:28:56] * dclarke falls in
[04:29:12] <evocallaghan> dclarke:Hi
[04:29:34] <evocallaghan> dclarke:Do you know where you find Xorg core files ?
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[04:30:07] <dclarke> look at the results from coreadm first
[04:30:38] <dclarke> if there is no global device or directory set ( I generally set coreadm up ) then go looking in /usr/X11 area
[04:31:00] <evocallaghan> jamesd:You got to be joking ! That would take years with the amount of data I got :p
[04:31:26] <dclarke> for example .. I have global core file pattern: /var/core/core.zone=%z.fid=%f.uid=%u.grp=%g.pid=%p
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[04:32:14] <jamesd> evocallaghan, you should probably develop/test on boxes with smaller directory structure, of course it may end up in the same place everytime...
[04:32:18] <evocallaghan> dclarke:Its set to ''
[04:32:21] <dclarke> if anyone has been waiting for a decent bittorrect client .. Transmission 1.34 is coming along nicely : http://www.blastwave.org/dclarke/stuff/Transmission_1.34_SunOS5.8_Sparc_000.png
[04:32:46] <evocallaghan> james:I am not dev. It bloody crashed on me ;[
[04:32:57] <dclarke> evocallaghan: ick
[04:33:17] <dclarke> evocallaghan: time to run find I think
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[04:33:35] <evocallaghan> I am getting *so* pi** off at this opensolaris distro. ;(
[04:33:58] <evocallaghan> Fedora was more stable *scream* !
[04:34:14] <dclarke> let's not go there
[04:34:25] * evocallaghan ducks
[04:34:41] <dclarke> can I ask a really lame stupid question ?  Where is the firefox3 binary on OpenSolaris ?
[04:35:10] <dclarke>  /bin/firefox ?
[04:35:12] <evocallaghan> in /usr/bin
[04:35:18] <Auralis_>  /bin/sh /usr/lib/firefox/run-mozilla.sh /usr/lib/firefox/firefox-bin
[04:35:26] <cchapman> other than nexenta, is there anything similar to the way nexenta does stuff but using the Sun C compiler?
[04:36:00] <_mary_kate_> cchapman: which part exactly of nexenta do you want?
[04:36:02] <dclarke> Auralis_: thanks .. I have been trying to get that running from the command line with a remote xauth setup display
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[04:36:35] <evocallaghan> FF3 sucks on solaris/intel gpu for some reason
[04:36:44] <_mary_kate_> cchapman: please don't /msg me.  and you probably want indiana (aka opensolaris 2008.05)
[04:36:56] <e^ipi> FF3 sucks on everything everywhere
[04:37:04] <e^ipi> it's not a solaris localized problem
[04:37:25] <evocallaghan> Works fine on Linux, FreeBSD and Windows?
[04:37:35] <cchapman> _mary_kate_: opensolaris 2008.05 has apt-get?
[04:37:36] <e^ipi> "fine"
[04:37:45] <_mary_kate_> it has IPS, which provides equivalent functionality
[04:37:50] <mike-11101> are they ever going to make a x64 version of FF?
[04:38:07] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:I can browser the web and it does not crash after 6months of not being closed
[04:38:09] <_mary_kate_> mike-11101: while FF uses a lot of memory, i've not seen it approach the 32-bit limit yet..
[04:38:37] <evocallaghan> lol !
[04:38:49] <mike-11101> heh
[04:38:55] <evocallaghan> Why do people think 64bit == faster ?
[04:38:55] <cchapman> _mary_kate_: IPS?
[04:39:01] <_mary_kate_> yes
[04:39:03] <mike-11101> though you'd be surprised
[04:39:11] <evocallaghan> Intel marketing
[04:39:49] <mike-11101> ips -> http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/pkg/add_package/
[04:39:52] <evocallaghan> 64bit can make apps slower
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[04:40:13] <dclarke_> oops
[04:40:14] <_mary_kate_> evocallaghan: but it can also make them faster, depending on the application
[04:40:31] <evocallaghan> correct
[04:40:37] <_mary_kate_> yes.  that's why i said it
[04:40:38] <mike-11101> yeah extra registers  ;)
[04:40:40] <cchapman> is ips as functional as apt?
[04:40:42] <dclarke_> very bad things just happened when I ran that /bin/sh /usr/lib foo firefiox
[04:41:05] <evocallaghan> 64bit  FF is not going to be any faster as far as I can tell
[04:41:18] <dclarke_> I am on a DEC VT220 terminal now .. I think X11 just locked up
[04:41:25] <mike-11101> ips repos are not as filled as ubuntu's apt repos no.
[04:41:40] <e^ipi> evocallaghan: no, but it'll be able to eat through >4GB of address space without coring
[04:41:43] <dclarke_> mike-11101 : so what ?
[04:41:43] <evocallaghan> dclarke_:haha ! I was just warning about FF and X
[04:41:52] <evocallaghan> dclarke_:Is that a Intel chipset ?
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[04:42:25] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:If FF is eating 4gb of mem then something is wrong
[04:42:29] <mike-11101> lacks stable - experimental - etc seperation but in general yes functional its the same.
[04:42:39] <dclarke_> I have an VIA CoolStream based low power C7 motherboard running os200811_snv98 and remote display on a CDE based Solaris 8 box
[04:43:01] <mike-11101> dclarke: means I still have to manually install certain apps.
[04:43:07] <dclarke_> and .. a DEC VT220
[04:43:13] <evocallaghan> dclarke_;I mean the chipset that was running X that locked up ?
[04:43:21] <dclarke_> mike-11101 : its a work in porogress
[04:43:33] <dclarke_> yes .. intel based
[04:43:39] <dclarke_> ummm ...
[04:43:46] <dclarke_> okay .. actaully
[04:43:49] <dclarke_> it is very complex
[04:43:54] <dclarke_> a gfew layers
[04:44:25] <dclarke_> the desktop that I am logged into is Sparc Solaris 8 CDE
[04:44:45] <dclarke_> however .. I am using remote dtlogin to do it from a Solarsi x86 box
[04:45:00] <dclarke_> the os200811_snv98 box is just a running motherboard
[04:45:07] <evocallaghan> dclarke_:Intel GPU's suck ! I am never ever going to buy there hardware again !
[04:45:09] <dclarke_> I exported the xauth MIT keys
[04:45:24] <dclarke_> I do not think there is a GPU here .. anywhere
[04:45:42] <mike-11101> dclarke: oh I'm sure it will work out. but I while I hope to live tomorrow I am doing my work today.
[04:45:46] <cchapman> why reinvent the wheel with ips?
[04:45:58] <dclarke_> cchapman : fun?
[04:46:11] <dclarke_> cchapman : it was needed in the Solaris world
[04:46:23] <dclarke_> cchapman : SVR4 pkg was like pkg tools ver 1
[04:46:29] <dclarke_> rpm is like ver 2
[04:46:33] <mike-11101> cchapman: it's rounder.
[04:46:34] <evocallaghan> Had *big* problems with intel chipsets on both the sata and gpu side of things. As you well know dclarke_ .. I had kernel panics, Xorg core dumps, FF core dumps and slow as hell everything
[04:46:34] <dclarke_> ips is ver 4
[04:46:54] <cchapman> whats apt?
[04:46:57] <evocallaghan> All the hardware is ment to be well supported by Intel themselfs
[04:47:00] <dclarke_> geez .. that sounds like the fifht level of hell
[04:47:12] <dclarke_> cchapman : apt does not count
[04:47:26] <cchapman> dclarke_: why is that?
[04:47:26] <dclarke_> cchapman : the debian thing ?
[04:47:36] <cchapman> dclarke_: ya
[04:47:49] <dclarke_> cchapman : it is just a package tracker and delivery tool .. not a management interface
[04:47:52] <dclarke_> \
[04:48:29] <cchapman> dclarke_: so like apt on steroids?
[04:48:37] <dclarke_> cchapman : but it has been a while .. can I use apt-get or aptitude to fetch a whole update to my machine and then switch over to the new running image ? and switch ba2ck on the fly ?
[04:49:09] <dclarke_> cchapman : like apt on drugs .. yes
[04:49:23] <dclarke_> performance enhancing drugs .. not LSD
[04:49:47] <dclarke_> cchapman : have you installed the OpenSolaris release ?
[04:49:56] <cchapman> dclarke_: lol....  2008.11 going to use that as its default?
[04:49:56] <dclarke_> give it a whirl
[04:50:05] <dclarke_> see my blog for stupuid long details on how to do live updates
[04:50:21] <cchapman> dclarke_:  I run our SAN/NAS at work off opensolaris
[04:50:26] <dclarke_> cchapman : default .. yes
[04:50:39] <cchapman> dclarke_: very cool
[04:51:04] <dclarke_> see http://www.blastwave.org/dclarke/blog and scroll down to the thing that offers you $100
[04:51:17] <dclarke_> of course no one has picked up the $100
[04:51:24] <dclarke_> I should raise that to $250
[04:51:51] <dclarke_> okay .. I have to drive away
[04:52:01] <dclarke_> got to get gas and coffee .. same thing I guess
[04:52:13] <dclarke_> my X11 is totally locked .. themouse is gone
[04:52:19] <dclarke_> creap
[04:52:21] <dclarke_> crap
[04:52:29] <dclarke_> I have soooo much stuff runnign too
[04:52:44] <dclarke_> maybe I can ssh into the OpenSolaris box and nuke the FF process
[04:53:13] <dclarke_> damn .. no response to numlock
[04:53:17] <dclarke_> that can't be good
[04:53:50] <evocallaghan> dclarke_:I just had the same thing only min ago
[04:53:51] <dclarke_> pardon me .. must try to save my desktop
[04:53:57] <dclarke_> dammit ~
[04:54:02] <dclarke_> I caught it from you
[04:54:06] <dclarke_> dammit
[04:54:11] <evocallaghan> and I was trasfer a very large file to someone with scp !
[04:54:11] <dclarke_> yer cursed !
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[04:54:23] <dclarke_> I have transmission running here also
[04:54:41] <dclarke_> and a big pile of new SeaMonkey sessions
[04:54:44] <dclarke_> crap
[04:54:52] <evocallaghan> X has become broken in regards to Intel drivers as well
[04:54:52] <dclarke_> be back in ten minutes .. or not
[04:55:10] <evocallaghan> As the new drivers are ment to be for Xorg 7.4
[04:55:19] <dclarke_> check with Alan coopersmith on such thigns
[04:55:26] <dclarke_> brb
[04:55:27] <evocallaghan> He knows
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[04:57:13] <sponix> dclarke:  you have vlc 8.6f in the blastwave repos now ?
[04:57:56] <evocallaghan> OK that's it, going to get sxce 99 and install that today
[04:58:15] <sponix> http://www.blastwave.org/dclarke/blog/images/VLC_Player.jpeg       This picture isn't just posted to tease me is it ?
[04:58:49] <evocallaghan> sponix:He will be back in 10min
[04:59:06] <sponix> evocallaghan:  I just installed 98, 99 didn't want to fire over X inside VirtualBox, until I get my data backed up (could be months), I can't try it natively
[04:59:07] <mike-11101> oi bleach.
[05:00:01] <evocallaghan> sponix:That has got to do with a simple font package problem
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[05:00:05] <evocallaghan> Its on the forums
[05:00:24] <evocallaghan> No big deal compared with kernel panics, xorg dumping etc..
[05:00:33] <sponix> evocallaghan:  so, you are saying if I wasn't a lazy bastard, it could easily be fixed ? ;)
[05:01:37] <evocallaghan> yes lol ;)
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[05:02:20] <evocallaghan> sponix:1sec, i'll see if I can find the post for you
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[05:03:19] <sponix> hmm, chances of me running 99 are slim then. I operate like this: I try every build I can, and bitch about what effects me directly. That is unfortunately the level of bug reporting I have time for :(
[05:03:59] <sponix> never have got a second to see if they fixed my MCP61 nvidia NIC yet... with any luck I'll eventually get around to that
[05:04:29] <sponix> evocallaghan:  you sticking with SXCE on most boxen ?
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[05:05:25] * lloy0076 hmmm
[05:05:54] <evocallaghan> sponix:Man, I been using osol distro since before .05 came out from testing it to my workstation. Nothing but problems one after the other
[05:05:57] <lloy0076> I'm currently running b74 (because it hasn't broken) and am thinking about switching to b99 on ZFS boot...
[05:06:08] <lloy0076> That's not that amazing, I suppose.
[05:06:26] <evocallaghan> the amount of bugs I reported and got fixed. If only I spend that time more worth while on sxce instead
[05:06:29] <lloy0076> However, I have a zfs pool on export (/export) with about 40ish file systems on it...
[05:07:00] <evocallaghan> lloy0076: Hold off until 100 I would say
[05:07:05] <lloy0076> And I assume that if I don't wipe that pool out physically...that the data on those pools won't magically disappear.
[05:07:08] <lloy0076> evocallaghan: Oh
[05:07:17] <lloy0076> evocallaghan: Well, I'd be happy running UFS as well
[05:07:39] <lloy0076> evocallaghan: But I'm really asking whether b99 will see my zfs pool still and be able to use it.
[05:07:52] * lloy0076 ponders
[05:07:57] <lloy0076> I guess there's one way to find out.
[05:07:57] <sponix> evocallaghan:  stability is my main issue(s) with os200805/11 as well, my 2.25TB NAS box is running SXDE b75 (or something) because the os200805 dumps core every time I try to cp or mv a file ;)
[05:08:15] <evocallaghan> lloy0076:There has been known panics and funny things in 99 due to the no. of changes gone in. 100 would be a better target in regards to the next 'stable' build on the street
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[05:08:40] * lloy0076 sigh
[05:08:47] <e^ipi> 101 is the target actually IIRC
[05:08:48] <sponix> evocallaghan:  I've had good luck with 98 so far, but have only been running it for a few days
[05:08:59] <lloy0076> Just when I decide to do an upgrade, I choose a time where the release is wonky.
[05:09:08] <evocallaghan> sponix:I know, its junk ! Sun marketing it pushing it down everythings trought..
[05:09:34] <mike-11101> should I stick to b98 for my server then?
[05:09:36] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:True, but 100 should be fairly stable
[05:09:38] <lloy0076> I really don't think making another Sunbuntu is the most sensible thing.
[05:09:42] * lloy0076 eep
[05:09:43] <sponix> evocallaghan:  hosing their rep imho, to push a product that well, should be a product at all
[05:09:44] <lloy0076> Did I say that?
[05:09:59] <e^ipi> evocallaghan: could be
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[05:10:26] <e^ipi> or it could be that everyone dumps crap in to 100 because 101 is restricted
[05:10:30] <e^ipi> only time will tell
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[05:10:54] <e^ipi> (not saying that that's the case, only that you can't really make statements like that )
[05:11:26] <evocallaghan> lol, well from what I been following from flag days and what I been watching change in the gate
[05:11:57] * lloy0076 damnations
[05:11:57] <evocallaghan> He wanted to upgrade to 99. I was just recomending 100 instead as its a short wait
[05:12:13] <lloy0076> I can't get b98 because b74 kind of lost my DVD drive
[05:12:13] <sponix> I'm all for making things easier to admin, graphic tools, easier commands, but not at the sacrifice of stability, compatibility, and so on
[05:12:15] <lloy0076> lol
[05:12:40] <e^ipi> sponix: stability of course, but what's the value of compatibility?
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[05:12:55] <e^ipi> just playing devils advocate here, i think it's a valuable thing to have
[05:12:56] <evocallaghan> sponix:http://www.opensolaris.org/jive/thread.jspa?threadID=77077&tstart=45
[05:13:26] <e^ipi> more to the point, what /level/ of compatibility is required?
[05:13:29] <sponix> e^ipi:  backward compat, and playing well with others are nice ;)
[05:14:02] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:If I buy Mathematica, I expect it to work
[05:14:09] <evocallaghan> That is what compat means to me
[05:14:22] <e^ipi> but what version?
[05:14:27] <evocallaghan> If something changes and I need to dig at it, then I may as well use windows or whatever
[05:14:38] <e^ipi> if you buy a copy of mathematica for SunOS 4.1.1... should you expect it to work on 5.11?
[05:14:49] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:Whatever version I bought at the time and works for me/us
[05:15:04] <e^ipi> so backwards compatibility /isn't/ important to you
[05:15:04] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:Yes I should !
[05:15:22] <evocallaghan> s/isn't/is/
[05:15:29] <evocallaghan> g
[05:15:37] <sponix> evocallaghan:  that says after install, my interactive installer (the default one) doesn't even come up to X for the first time install to begin ;)
[05:15:46] <e^ipi> you expect 20 year old software to run on a modern machine?
[05:16:21] <evocallaghan> 8years is fine
[05:16:26] <evocallaghan> maybe 10
[05:16:57] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:I expect it to *work*.. No excuse ..
[05:17:15] <e^ipi> you expect 20 year old software to work?
[05:17:24] <e^ipi> or just a couple versions back?
[05:17:42] <evocallaghan> Just becuase I upgrade my OS or Hardware does not mean I 'am _expected_' to upgrade my apps
[05:17:57] <e^ipi> no, but how many upgrade cycles does that remain true?
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[05:18:07] <e^ipi> when is the answer just 'virtualize the old apps' ?
[05:18:23] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:I already stated, about 8years is fine, so maybe 3-4versions depending on the app, some move quickly
[05:19:12] <e^ipi> okay, so somewhere between linux ( incompatible changes every fortnight ) and solaris ( incompatible changes every decade and a half )
[05:19:29] <evocallaghan> correct
[05:19:31] <sponix> I like FreeBSD's approach, they just have a 4x compat, 5x compat, 6x compat set and so on, so 7x can run 4x-6x if you install the compat set
[05:19:37] <mike-11101> I expect my software to work as long as it's supported ^^
[05:20:14] <e^ipi> mike-11101: that's reasonable
[05:20:33] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:btw, Mathematica does not run properly on your Intel workstations under solaris.. only AMD ones. It seems to be linked to the amd libs
[05:20:59] <e^ipi> i didn't even know they had a solaris/x86 port
[05:21:01] <mike-11101> With off-course the demand for a timely heads up when support is going to be ended.
[05:21:17] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:I tried contacting both Sun and Wolfram about this but they don't lissen to a single person.
[05:21:32] <e^ipi> well, sun has nothing to do with it
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[05:21:53] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:Know anyone internal that could contact Wolfram on my behalf to get that fixed ?
[05:22:03] <e^ipi> contact whom, the ISV's?
[05:22:12] <e^ipi> no, i don't...
[05:22:16] <evocallaghan> I am sure Sun must be interested in there ISV's ?
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[05:22:54] <evocallaghan> I think that is a *big* mistake if not. No software then it does not matter how good your OS is ..
[05:24:18] * evocallaghan looks forward to a nice fresh install of SXCE snv_99
[05:25:05] <h3sp4wn> evocallaghan: You can fix it by just using the ones from sunstudio 12
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[05:26:36] <h3sp4wn> MathKernel tells you which ones then you can just find them in /opt/SUNWspro - then run Mathematica -cleanstart
[05:29:27] <e^ipi> evocallaghan: also, think about what ISV's want... they /want/ OS's to be incompatible
[05:29:31] <e^ipi> then they get to sell the new version
[05:38:38] <sponix> e^ipi:  oh, is that the MS angle ?
[05:39:08] <mike-11101> office for mac anyone?  :p
[05:39:45] <sponix> With that Approach, it is time to dump Solaris 8/9, that will force almost all applications to buy a new version ;)
[05:40:06] <sponix> mike-11101:  you offering, seeking, or looking for opinions ?
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[05:40:30] <e^ipi> not saying that that's a correct approach
[05:40:53] <e^ipi> but if i were an ISV, i wouldn't mind my OS vendor making incompatible releases
[05:41:02] <mike-11101> sponix: Example of the 'MS angle'
[05:41:16] <sponix> e^ipi:  yeah, I would much rather purchase a new version because they actually made it better, not just because some OS compat issues ;)
[05:41:41] <e^ipi> but that's hard
[05:42:00] <e^ipi> much easier to just release a couple bug fixes and only certify it for $new_os_version
[05:42:38] <sponix> True, look at K3b and k9copy though, they keep adding more encoding features, an so forth, but how long will they be able to keep this up before its so bloated something else overcomes them ?
[05:43:46] <sponix> Funny example, Mozilla released firefox, to a slim version, that wiped out its own Mozilla builds ... They went back to the drawing board a bit, to move forward ;)
[05:43:56] <e^ipi> heh
[05:44:01] <e^ipi> "firefox" and "slim"
[05:45:42] <evocallaghan> This freaking windows admin n00b keeps leaving top running 24/7 on the production server ! Seems like its the only command he knows, and prob does not even know what it means
[05:45:55] <e^ipi> solaris or linux?
[05:46:39] <evocallaghan> linux
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[05:47:00] <e^ipi> top is still expensive, you just don't have a cheaper alternative
[05:47:13] <evocallaghan> h3sp4wn:I know I can fix it, but its a product I paid for, I want to work work out the box. No treaking anything..
[05:47:37] <evocallaghan> e^ipi:It seems to have killed off the mail server, me thinks
[05:47:58] <evocallaghan> Any way, the box needed a reboot. Its running on a P3
[05:48:06] <evocallaghan> This guy is clueless anyway
[05:48:25] <e^ipi> evocallaghan: no, linux killed the mail server
[05:48:33] <e^ipi> google://OOM+killer
[05:48:47] <mike-11101> perhaps he's just really concerned about the cpu load ;)
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[05:55:54] <evocallaghan> Oh this is a joke
[05:55:59] <evocallaghan> Does not work now
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[05:56:28] <evocallaghan> Typical RHEL install, just dies on its own after a random amount of time
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[05:57:48] <e^ipi> linux is clearly the future.
[06:00:26] <jbk> god help us all
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[06:11:36] <Plazma> heh
[06:11:40] <Plazma> i have to take a huge ubuntu..
[06:11:41] <Plazma> :P
[06:11:45] <Plazma> sorry i couldn't resist
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[06:22:43] <evocallaghan> ROFL !
[06:22:54] <evocallaghan> gezz qmail is crap
[06:23:27] <evocallaghan> Some blackhole whoever spam list died and it stopped incoming mail with a 550 ?
[06:23:34] <evocallaghan> Anyone else suffer this ?
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[06:40:28] <mattfury> im having troubles with xorg
[06:45:25] <mattfury> I'm not sure what happened, what moment it was working and the next moment after i installed a few services it crashed, and now the gnome-session wont run because of the services that arent running (ipsec etc.,)
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[06:51:33] * evocallaghan sees the light after a short google :p
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[06:56:09] <mattfury> i might just wipe that last partition and start again, but it took 4 hrs last time ...
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[06:59:44] <mattfury> i saw something about how i have to open the xorg config in a "lower level" user
[07:00:12] <mattfury> but the entire partition is read-only
[07:00:33] <mattfury> how could i set certain parts to be writable?
[07:02:41] <Okona> you have to remount the whole partition to read write
[07:03:03] <mattfury> umount remount?
[07:03:22] <mattfury> i wouldnt be here, but i lost all my *nix books a while ago
[07:03:41] <Okona> hmm, I think google found them for you (-:
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[07:04:00] <Okona> i'd say mount -o remount,rw
[07:05:18] <mattfury> mount -o && remount,rw =)
[07:06:22] <Okona> ?
[07:06:32] <_mary_kate_> remount,rw isn't a command, it's an option to -o
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[07:09:13] <mattfury> so it'd be more like; umount /dev/hdX && /mount -o remount,rw ?
[07:09:25] <_mary_kate_> mp. ot
[07:09:33] <_mary_kate_> mount -oremount,rw /
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[07:11:08] <Okona> mattfury: /dev/hdX... are you on Linux?
[07:11:23] <mattfury> i have a knowledge of linux
[07:11:26] <mattfury> not solaris
[07:11:41] <mattfury> where would i find the normal hdd place?
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[07:12:48] <Okona> look in /dev/dsk
[07:13:09] <mattfury> oh ty :)
[07:14:06] <mattfury> o_0
[07:14:49] <mattfury> lots c0t0d0p0, what would translate into hda?
[07:15:14] <Okona> that (could) translate to hda1
[07:15:24] <_mary_kate_> if you're just trying to mount root rw, do mount -oremount,rw /
[07:17:40] <coffman_> morning
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[07:19:18] <Okona> mattfury: http://initialprogramload.blogspot.com/2008/07/how-solaris-disk-device-names-work.html but for remount, heed _mary_kate_'s advice
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[08:08:10] <trochej> Elo
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[08:25:58] <trochej> Coffee?
[08:26:24] <CosmicDJ> tea...
[08:26:58] <trochej> Hmm
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[08:40:17] <lkthomas> hey guys
[08:40:27] <lkthomas> does sun offer any solution to deal with mysql clustering ?
[08:40:53] <_mary_kate_> mysql cluster
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[08:41:50] <rustyT> hi
[08:41:53] <rustyT> http://loljesus.com/wp-content/uploads/lion.JPG
[08:43:39] <ZOP> OK i'm confused, anyone know the 'correct' incantation of virt-install for debian Etch?
[08:46:24] <lkthomas> do I have to use NDB ?
[08:46:32] <_mary_kate_> yes, ndb is part of mysql cluster
[08:47:10] <lkthomas> :S
[08:47:18] <lkthomas> I was asking for alternative ,  haha
[08:48:04] <_mary_kate_> well, that's not what you said..
[08:48:19] <_mary_kate_> Sun Cluster also supports mysql, if you have shared storage
[08:49:26] <lkthomas> how do you define "shared storage" ?
[08:49:51] <_mary_kate_> a storage device that is connected to both systems
[08:50:11] <_mary_kate_> usually fibre channel, but DAS SCSI or SAS works, and some iSCSI targets are also supported
[08:50:27] <lkthomas> Lustre + SAN ?
[08:50:40] <_mary_kate_> i think lustre is a filesystem, so it's not relevant/required
[08:50:47] <_mary_kate_> an FC SAN with a LUN exported to both hosts will work
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[08:51:04] <lkthomas> but you know the file system need to be able to handle lock
[08:51:10] <_mary_kate_> no
[08:51:18] <CosmicDJ> shared qfs does that
[08:51:21] <_mary_kate_> the SCSI target needs to support the scsi-3 'reserve' command
[08:51:33] <_mary_kate_> but there are no special requirements on the filesystem itself
[08:51:36] <lkthomas> sorry, I don't get it
[08:51:45] <_mary_kate_> the storage is only mounted on one system at a time
[08:51:45] <lkthomas> normally, file system will crash if you do that
[08:51:51] <_mary_kate_> when that system fails, it's remounted on the failover
[08:51:57] <lkthomas> I see
[08:52:00] <lkthomas> active/passive
[08:52:04] <_mary_kate_> yes
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[08:52:12] <lkthomas> right, now you are talking :P
[08:52:29] <lkthomas> CosmicDJ, does qfs being dominate or lustre ?
[08:53:03] <_mary_kate_> on Solaris, QFS is much more mature
[08:53:37] <lkthomas> I assume qfs is free to use ?
[08:53:49] <_mary_kate_> yes.  but support is very expensive
[08:54:00] <lkthomas> hmm
[08:54:09] <_mary_kate_> (i think it starts at about $8,000 per system)
[08:54:09] <CosmicDJ> IIRC lustre is linux only
[08:54:15] <lkthomas> CosmicDJ, no
[08:54:24] <lkthomas> _mary_kate_, hmm
[08:54:26] <CosmicDJ> http://www.sun.com/software/products/lustre/specs.xml yes
[08:54:43] <lkthomas> _mary_kate_, better test it in lab before production to eliminate all problems
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[08:55:25] * _mary_kate_ wishes sun would adopt veritas' support model - you can get support for small vx installations for $120/year now
[08:55:50] <lkthomas> _mary_kate_, SAM is a management tool to manage QFS, right ?
[08:55:52] <CosmicDJ> sam-qfs installations aren't small :)
[08:56:08] <_mary_kate_> CosmicDJ: SAM - no.  but QFS as a shared filesystem can be used in small environments
[08:56:12] <trochej> CosmicDJ: Now there will be. :)
[08:56:18] <_mary_kate_> lkthomas: no, SAM is the HFS part.  it uses QFS as a disk cache to access tape-backed files
[08:56:38] <lkthomas> hmm
[08:56:53] <lkthomas> once I use QFS, I can't go back to linux :)
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[08:56:59] <_mary_kate_> QFS runs on Linux
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[08:57:03] <_mary_kate_> (RHEL and SUSE)
[08:57:07] <lkthomas> really ? hmm
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[08:57:24] <_mary_kate_> why do you need a shared filesystem though?
[08:57:31] <_mary_kate_> UFS and ZFS are much cheaper ;)
[08:57:45] <lkthomas> ZFS + NFS of course solve most of the problem
[08:58:00] <_mary_kate_> .. that doesn't seem to solve any of the problem
[08:58:07] <lkthomas> huh
[08:58:24] <lkthomas> what are you talking about ?
[08:58:33] <_mary_kate_> your active/failover mysql cluster
[08:58:37] <_mary_kate_> what are you talking about?
[08:58:48] <lkthomas> well
[08:58:57] <lkthomas> we don't plan to implement shared file system
[08:59:05] <lkthomas> most because of poor performance
[08:59:08] <lkthomas> better use NFS
[08:59:27] <_mary_kate_> MySQL strongly recommends against running the database over NFS, it hurts both reliability and performance
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[08:59:36] <_mary_kate_> and why would you expect shared QFS to be slower than NFS?
[08:59:54] <lkthomas> according to the theory
[09:00:01] <lkthomas> all shared fs is slower
[09:00:11] <lkthomas> because they need to make sure all nodes in sync
[09:00:15] <lkthomas> and that takes time
[09:00:24] <_mary_kate_> and NFS doesn't?  why do you think all NFS writes are synchronous?
[09:00:32] <lkthomas> nope
[09:00:38] <_mary_kate_> also, NFS 4.1 implements pNFS, which is a system very similar to QFS that improves performance
[09:00:46] <_mary_kate_> (only metadata goes to the server, data goes directly to storage - like QFS)
[09:00:49] <lkthomas> I heard pNFS is not ready yet
[09:00:54] <_mary_kate_> it's not, but QFS is
[09:01:08] <_mary_kate_> my point is, NFS is implementing the QFS model to improve performance
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[09:01:32] <lkthomas> hmm
[09:02:00] <lkthomas> _mary_kate_, ever try to setup qfs before ?
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[09:03:18] <_mary_kate_> i use QFS regularly, but not shared
[09:03:31] <lkthomas> huh?! why not use ZFS instead ?!
[09:05:18] <_mary_kate_> because QFS is faster for innodb
[09:05:33] <lkthomas> you are not serious, are you ?!
[09:05:39] <lkthomas> any benchmark ?
[09:06:35] <_mary_kate_> why are you surprised? it's well known that ZFS performs poorly at OLTP workloads
[09:06:50] <_mary_kate_> i didn't publish any benchmarks because they're specific to this environment
[09:07:08] <lkthomas> OLTP ?
[09:07:18] <e^ipi> online transaction processing
[09:07:24] <lkthomas> I see, hmm
[09:08:28] <lkthomas> LOL
[09:08:36] <lkthomas> finally I found a quick start manual from sun, haha
[09:08:36] <trochej> Coffee
[09:11:43] <lkthomas> _mary_kate_, I assume QFS isn't for country to country setup, right ?
[09:11:48] <lkthomas> I mean, shared QFS
[09:12:44] <_mary_kate_> i can't imagine a useful way to use a shared filesystem for that
[09:12:48] <_mary_kate_> there's only one storage
[09:12:58] <lkthomas> hmm
[09:13:06] * Tempt scratches his head
[09:13:08] <lkthomas> I really kind of wondering how does youtube did that
[09:13:21] * Tempt scratches his head a little more
[09:13:23] <_mary_kate_> caching
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[09:13:31] <lkthomas> hmm
[09:13:57] <lkthomas> Tempt, don't rubber it :)
[09:15:03] <lkthomas> out of topic question, did you guys ever heard someone using myisam as production db structure ? LOL
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[09:15:47] <_mary_kate_> ISAM-type databases are good for lots of things
[09:15:56] <_mary_kate_> we use it for bulk key/value storage
[09:16:17] <lkthomas> HAHA, you guys split into detail, I see
[09:16:29] <_mary_kate_> i don't know what that means
[09:16:55] <lkthomas> nevermind, ever got myisam db corrupt ?
[09:17:07] <_mary_kate_> no
[09:17:15] <_mary_kate_> and even if we did, there are three replicas of each database
[09:17:20] <lkthomas> I have seen million times
[09:17:24] <lkthomas> I see
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[09:55:13] <DTEIT> morning
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[10:00:01] <lkthomas> guys
[10:00:08] <lkthomas> opensolaris did not ask to config ip address
[10:00:16] <lkthomas> does it means it can't identify the NIC card ?
[10:00:23] <e^ipi> man nwam
[10:01:10] <lkthomas> ok
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[10:01:18] <lkthomas> I mean
[10:01:21] <lkthomas> during installation
[10:01:24] <lkthomas> isn't that strange ?
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[10:01:31] <e^ipi> no
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[10:02:46] <lkthomas> e^ipi, how could I tell if opensolaris could identify my NIC card or not ?
[10:03:07] <e^ipi> the device detection tool
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[10:04:24] <lkthomas> prtconf -pv ?
[10:04:47] <e^ipi> no... the device detection tool
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[10:12:13] <CosmicDJ> or ifconfig...
[10:12:56] <lkthomas> CosmicDJ, do you mean ifconfig -a ?
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[10:13:15] <lkthomas> ifconfig -a only shows lo0
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[10:15:47] <lkthomas> LOL
[10:16:40] <lkthomas> found the problem
[10:16:44] <lkthomas> because we are using Marvell 8056
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[10:43:01] <dsop> hmm my opensolaris gives me error 19 when trying to mount the root filesystem
[10:43:14] <dsop> but the rpool is not damaged. I only imported it once from another system
[10:44:05] <dsop> any suggestions how to debug or fix such an issue that the system cannot find the root filesystem anymore?
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[10:55:56] <Tempt> chris_unix_dude: Haha.
[10:57:11] <PerterB> The unix dude abends^H^H^H^Hides
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[11:14:05] <jaym> hi all
[11:14:31] <jaym> i am trying to use ndis wrapper
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[11:15:24] <jaym> while issuing ./ndiscvt i am getting error that "bash ./ndiscvt cannot execute binary file
[11:15:42] <jaym> i am new to solaris world and any help will be appreciated
[11:18:25] <ballChalk> type file ndiscvt and paste it in here
[11:22:02] <dsop> does someone has an idea how to fix the rootfs issue?
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[11:22:35] <ballChalk> what is error 19?
[11:23:10] <dsop> ballChalk: i don't know
[11:23:40] <ballChalk> perror 19 will explain if mysql's installed
[11:23:56] <ballChalk> #define ENODEV  19      /* No such device                       */
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[11:25:25] <ballChalk> try removing /etc/zfs/zpool.cache and trying again
[11:25:34] <dsop> okay
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[11:32:00] <jaym> sorry ballChalk
[11:32:11] <jaym> the key board got struck
[11:32:34] <jaym> i installed opensolaris on XVM...guest os is XP SP3
[11:32:51] <jaym> soryy host OS is XP sp3
[11:33:46] <jaym> while working on OpenSolaris, the keyboard is not responding. This happens frequently. Some times if you wait for a while, it keyboard works
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[11:34:07] <jaym> some times i need to restart the Guest OS
[11:34:24] <jaym> i am using Dell Inspiron 1525
[11:34:27] <jaym> any idea??
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[12:04:33] <jaym> hi all
[12:05:00] <jaym> i am getting error "bash: ./ndiscvt cannot execute binary file"
[12:05:10] <jaym> any help will be appreciated
[12:05:55] <asyd> how you try to call it?
[12:05:58] <Berny> jaym, type file ndiscvt
[12:06:00] <ballChalk> what does file ndiscvt say?
[12:06:14] <timsf> type "file ndiscvt"
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[12:06:24] <jaym> ok
[12:06:27] <timsf>  (anyone else care to chime in?)
[12:06:35] <asyd> you can't do bash ./ndiscvt ..
[12:06:48] <Berny> isn't that a kernel module?
[12:07:26] <jaym> i am trying to build a driver using ndis wrapper
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[12:07:37] <jaym> http://opensolaris.org/os/community/laptop/wireless/ndis/
[12:08:03] <jaym> i am trying To build a 64-bit version of the driver
[12:08:49] <Berny> yeah read the docs... or try a modload ndiscvt
[12:08:52] <jaym> as per doc i am trying # ./ndiscvt -i ndis.inf -s ndis.sys -o ndis.h
[12:11:32] <jaym> berny...i dont understand your suggestion
[12:11:56] <PerterB> and the "make ndiscvt" step succeeded? it would really help if you answered the question that 3 people asked, and also the output of "isainfo"
[12:12:02] <PerterB> Berny: it isn't a kernel module
[12:12:15] <TomJ> jaym: and the 'make ndiscvt' before that worked without errors?
[12:13:04] <jaym> instead of "make ndiscvt", i used "/usr/ccs/bin/make ndiscvt"
[12:13:11] <jaym> and it worked
[12:13:15] <Berny> PerterB, oh well it's been a while since i last touched ndis... then it's the thing that converts the inf file to usefull stuff?
[12:13:31] <PerterB> Berny: yeah
[12:14:03] <PerterB> FSVO "useful"
[12:16:18] <Berny> good point. you're right, it's spelled useful
[12:16:33] <Berny> .oO(a decent wlan card is even more useful though :>)
[12:16:50] <PerterB> I wasn't correcting your spelling, I was implying converted ndis drivers may not be all that useful...
[12:17:10] <jaym> how i can solve the issue??
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[12:17:48] <PerterB> you could start by answering the questions people keep asking you.
[12:17:51] <CosmicDJ> jaym: provide the info 3+ ppl requested from you
[12:18:34] <jaym> CosmicDJ... i already provided answer for that
[12:19:17] <jaym> instead of 'make ndiscvt', i used '/usr/ccs/bin/make ndiscvt' and its worked
[12:19:24] <Berny> jaym, type file ndiscvt
[12:19:29] <PerterB> No you didn't... "file ndiscvt" and "isainfo" output is what we're after
[12:19:30] <Berny> what das THAT say?
[12:20:23] <jaym> type ./ndiscvt gave me './ndiscvt is ./ndiscvt'
[12:20:37] * PerterB sighs
[12:20:43] <PerterB> *file*
[12:20:44] <asyd> :)
[12:21:05] <hohum> anyone have some words of advice for an aspiring war monger and a total Eve noob?
[12:21:18] <TomJ> hohum: ask in a channel related to that?
[12:21:35] <hohum> oops
[12:21:38] <hohum> wrogn window
[12:21:39] <hohum> sorry
[12:21:46] <Berny> PerterB, relax... have a coffee :-)
[12:22:00] <jaym> PeterB : ELF 64-bit LSB executable AMD 64 Version 1
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[12:22:37] <jaym> PeterB : dynamicaly linked, not stripped, no debugging information available
[12:22:55] <Berny> jaym, and isainfo?
[12:23:01] <PerterB> oh, I'm relaxed :) more coffee seems like a good idea though ... maybe by the time I get back he'll have figured out he's trying to run a 64 bit executable with a 32 bit kernel ;)
[12:23:50] <sickness> I can't understand why the 32bit perl that's in solaris is limited to 255 file descriptors :/
[12:23:55] <jaym> ok..
[12:24:03] <sickness> does every other 32bit program have the same limit?
[12:24:16] <TomJ> sickness: every program does by default
[12:24:22] <_mary_kate_> sickness: it's probably not 256 FDs, but 256 stdio handles
[12:24:24] <TomJ> well, certainly every 32bit yes, not tried 64bit
[12:24:29] <_mary_kate_> sickness: you can increase that using extended_FILE
[12:24:29] <TomJ> it can be trivially increasedd
[12:24:37] <jaym> Berny: isainfo i will give you now
[12:24:38] <_mary_kate_> extendedFILE(5)
[12:25:01] <sickness> modifying a perl program, or modifying the perl binary itself? =)
[12:25:16] <TomJ> doesn't he just want ulimit -n 64000 or something?
[12:25:40] <sickness> TomJ: already done the ulimit thing and even the plimit one ;)
[12:26:37] <_mary_kate_> TomJ: well, he said '32-bit' in a way that suggests he tried a 64-bit program and didn't encounter the limit
[12:26:45] <_mary_kate_> (and the stdio limit doesn't apply to 64-bit programs)
[12:26:58] <TomJ> ok
[12:27:10] <jaym> Berny: isainfo -v gave me '32 Bit i386 applications'
[12:27:21] <sickness> well I just tried in 32bit mode for now, but I've read on the forums that the 64bit perl included in solaris doesn't have this limit...
[12:27:55] <Berny> jaym, well you are trying to run a 64bit binary on a 32bit kernel (and/or cpu)
[12:28:25] <jaym> actually i installed OpenSolaris as a guest OS on SunXVM
[12:29:09] <jaym> Is there any way to change from 32 bit to 64bit
[12:29:25] <Berny> jaym, inside a virtual machine what do you need the ndiswrapper for?
[12:29:37] <ballChalk> new virtualbox supports 64 in 64...if thats what you mean
[12:30:14] <Berny> jaym, now i got what you meant by running winxp
[12:30:33] <jaym> actually i want to use OpenSolaris as stand alone OS
[12:30:56] <TomJ> can you use arbitrary device drivers in XVM guests?  You certainly can't in any other virtualisation method I know of
[12:30:58] <Berny> i guess your xp is only 32bit
[12:31:00] <jaym> and my laptop is Dell Inspiron 1525 which is having a Marvel Yukon NIC
[12:31:14] <jaym> yes.berny u r correct
[12:32:15] <Berny> aehm there are native driver for the marvel yukon nics
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[12:32:39] <Berny> google for marvel yukon solars and follow the first link (to the bigadmin hcl)
[12:32:58] <sickness> masayuki murayama++
[12:33:00] <sickness> ;)
[12:33:25] <jaym> but not for my one Marvel yukon 88E8040
[12:33:28] <Berny> yeah
[12:33:45] <jaym> myk driver doesnt support 88E8040
[12:34:00] <sickness> :/
[12:34:01] <sickness> gh
[12:35:45] <jaym> i also purchased one Intellinet 10/100 USB Ethernet adapter
[12:35:54] <jaym> it also not working
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[12:37:08] <jaym> so i thought i will use NDIS wrapper and move the driver files
[12:37:15] <jaym> again bad luck
[12:37:20] <Berny> the myk driver (#21) works for the 88e8040 yukons
[12:37:50] <Berny> it's reported to work on a dell inspiron 1525
[12:37:57] <Berny> searchthe opensolaris forums
[12:38:38] <jaym> it will identify the driver
[12:38:42] <jaym> but will not work
[12:38:55] <jaym> i discussed the same issue here before
[12:39:20] <jaym> (#21) also says Myk doesn't work for 88E8040 (FE+)
[12:39:56] <jaym> I saw that forum...
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[12:44:46] <jaym> thanks guys
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[12:51:47] <evocallaghan> Hi
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[12:51:59] <evocallaghan> Great to finally be back on SXCE !
[12:52:26] <evocallaghan> How does one choicse to use ZFS root in the SXCE installer ?
[12:52:38] <CosmicDJ> install in textmode
[12:54:49] <evocallaghan> oh
[12:55:25] <evocallaghan> CosmicDJ:What am I looking for, or does it just say "ZFS root, turn this corner.." ?
[12:55:36] <TomJ> it will come up with an obvious option UFS/ZFS
[12:55:47] <codestr0m> What's the best way to handle this when I need to include from both dir? ld: fatal: recording name conflict: file `/usr/lib/amd64/libpng12.so' and file `/opt/foo/usr/lib/libpng.so' provide identical dependency names: libpng12.so.0
[12:55:50] <evocallaghan> ok thanks
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[12:59:38] <Enter> i'm trying to install the ruby gem for mysql (native driver) but the makefile says it can't find /usr/ucb/install
[13:00:12] <hile_> Did you install it?
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[13:27:06] <corpxicle> anyone know how to match a iscsi target to a devicename ?
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[13:39:42] <sartek> wtf to do with a 2G dbx core file?
[13:39:56] <CosmicDJ> rm? :)
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[13:40:38] <sartek> i'm serious
[13:40:39] <codestr0m> sartek: don't have enough ram?
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[13:40:59] <sartek> codestr0m: ?
[13:41:00] <Berny> sartek, mail it to someone you love ;-)
[13:41:20] <codestr0m> sartek: if you can reproduce on one of ruse39 boxes maybe debug it there
[13:42:09] <sartek> codestr0m: dont think that it reproduceable there, but here always crashes ('ve enabled thingies with coreadm that's why i have it)
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[13:42:46] <codestr0m> basically. don't do what you were doing or find a machine with more ram you can debug with
[13:43:41] <sartek> http://rafb.net/p/jJdYmU58.html
[13:43:47] <codestr0m> http://rafb.net/p/cQqd5e99.html
[13:43:50] <codestr0m> trade ya :P
[13:44:27] <codestr0m> you can't use dbx?
[13:44:33] <sartek> kinda
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[13:45:27] <sartek> so it's quite annoying
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[13:48:01] <codestr0m> which version of dbx?
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[13:49:58] <sartek> codestr0m: all
[13:50:24] <sartek> ss12, ssx (which comes with osol), ssx latest
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[13:57:15] <CosmicDJ> sartek: dbx crashing is indeed strange
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[14:02:37] <CosmicDJ> sartek: any other cmds producing cores? or just dbx?
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[14:03:15] <sartek> only dbx "without" reason
[14:03:56] <CosmicDJ> too bad dbx isnt elfsigned :(
[14:05:31] <CosmicDJ> sartek: IIRC you can use pkgchk to check file content/permission
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[15:14:08] <phips> win 1
[15:14:11] <phips> oops
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[15:30:12] <codestr0m> does cc -l/opt/foo/usr/lib/libdca.so.0.0.0 test.c work the same way? cause I get ld: fatal: library -l/opt/foo/usr/lib/libdca.so.0.0.0: not found, but I can clearly nm and get the symbol that's not resolving to link
[15:31:11] <Belgar> normally you add /opt/foo/usr/lib to $LD_LIBRARY_PATH and then use -ldca
[15:31:35] <oxygene> erm.. /opt/foo/usr/lib? what kind of a mess is that?
[15:31:38] <codestr0m> Belgar: isn't $LD_LIBRARY_PATH evil?
[15:31:41] <Belgar> i think what cc will do in your case is look through the $LD_LIBRARY_PATH for a library with the name you gave
[15:31:47] <oxygene> codestr0m: -L/opt/foo/usr/lib -R/opt/foo/usr/lib
[15:31:54] <oxygene> codestr0m: -ldca
[15:31:59] <Belgar> that would be even better
[15:32:03] <Belgar> what would be evil with LD_LIBRARY_PATH?
[15:32:05] <oxygene> codestr0m: but still: what kind of a mess is /opt/foo/usr/lib?
[15:32:23] <oxygene> Belgar: maintenance
[15:32:53] <Belgar> perhaps
[15:32:53] <codestr0m> oxygene: not much different than /opt/csw or something.. I don't want to put in /usr/lib as it's not going to be managed under IPS
[15:33:29] <oxygene> codestr0m: so /opt/foo/lib
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[15:37:50] <Belgar> rmesta
[15:38:06] <rmesta> Belgar: Mr. Magnus, long time no chat ;)
[15:38:32] <Belgar> Mr Rick, indeed. How are you? :-) Still destroying NFS?
[15:38:40] <rmesta> but of course ;)
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[15:39:13] <Belgar> rmesta: i suspected that :)
[15:39:24] <Belgar> Loke, good evening :)
[15:39:25] <rmesta> yup; lots-o-work to do
[15:39:50] <Belgar> rmesta; i think of you everytime i have a customer who tries to use NFSv4 ;)
[15:39:55] <rmesta> NFSv4.1 barely cooked; whackin on code like monkeys :)
[15:40:07] <rmesta> ah, just tell them "nobody" did it ;)
[15:40:15] <Belgar> hehehehe
[15:40:20] * Stric needs to use nfsv4 soon due to zfs+nfs
[15:40:28] <Belgar> that would explain a lot of things, wouldn't uit?
[15:40:33] <rmesta> 0:)
[15:40:39] * rmesta disavows all knowledge
[15:41:34] <rmesta> Belgar: how are things on your end of the world ?
[15:41:59] <Belgar> great thanks, i shifted to work more with storage, which is fun since it gave me a lot new things to learn
[15:42:37] <rmesta> ahhhhh... so, _that's_ why my ears have been ringing ;) ?
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[15:43:15] <Belgar> could be ;)
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[15:49:56] * maxote Stric, try with zfs+iscsi
[15:50:24] <Stric> Yeah, that'll work well with 100+ client machines..
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[15:50:33] <Stric> Solaris, Linux, MacOSX..
[15:51:35] <loke> hello belgar
[15:57:13] <codestr0m> Am I mistaken or does the CDDL http://www.sun.com/cddl/cddl.html section 3.1 require source to be distributed if you modify the original code?
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[16:00:00] <Belgar> hey Loke, how's things?
[16:00:43] <aruiz> codestr0m, nope, if you deliver binary code whose source is under CDDL, you have to provide the source code if requested to those that have acquired the binaries
[16:01:11] <codestr0m> aruiz: ok. so in general it doesn't have to be provided publicly
[16:01:31] <aruiz> codestr0m, let's say in general, it does, but it's not mandatory
[16:02:00] <codestr0m> aruiz: thanks. I mostly wanted a 2nd opinion on it
[16:02:21] <codestr0m> green-bytes isn't providing the source and has modified the opensolaris code
[16:02:32] <codestr0m> we're not a customer, but wanted to ask first before buying
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[16:36:03] <jay> hi all
[16:36:38] <jay> is ndis wrapper will work with any NIC driver?
[16:37:33] <oxygene> jay: if the driver only uses the windows functions that are reimplemented in the wrapper (and stays within some more limits), yes. if it requires more, no.
[16:37:50] <Stric> I'm 60% sure that only wifi drivers use the NDIS spec
[16:38:30] <jay> ok
[16:38:44] <oxygene> no, NDIS is a generic network driver interface
[16:39:32] <oxygene> though it's possible that ndiswrapper is quite specialized on wifi
[16:39:43] <oxygene> jay: what card do you have where there's no native driver?
[16:40:22] <jay> basically i want to connect my laptop to network using Marvel Yukon 88E8040 Ethernet Controller
[16:40:36] <jay> myk driver doesnt support this card
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[16:42:45] <oxygene> jay: attaching the pci id to myk didn't help, either? maybe it's somewhat compatible (if *bsd and linux handle them all with a single driver, that would be quite likely)
[16:43:06] <TrogL> zfs help:  did a "umount -f /zfs_filesystem", now I can't "df -kl", "ls -l" the filesystem, nor can I "kill -9" the umount process.  Now what?
[16:43:13] <jay> oxygene: i purchased ASIX AX88772 USB2.0 Fast Ethernet Network Adapter
[16:43:48] <oxygene> uh, usb NICs quite likely require more than the NDIS subset of the windows API (just in case you try to ndiswrap that one)
[16:43:53] <oxygene> anyway, I'm off
[16:44:33] <jay> i want to use native driver for this ASIX
[16:46:36] <jay> i have got the driver source files for Linux
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[16:46:49] <TrogL> forgot to log.  brb
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[16:47:27] <jay> any idea that how I can use these files
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[16:49:46] <TrogL> zfs help:  did a "umount -f /zfs_filesystem", now I can't "df -kl", "ls -l" the filesystem, nor can I "kill -9" the umount process.  Now what?
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[16:50:26] <evocallaghan> I find out something extreamly interesting today :p
[16:50:42] <evocallaghan> \t != ascii 0x09
[16:50:50] <evocallaghan> Amazing how stupid I am
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[17:32:47] <evocallaghan> How does one geratate a tab key press using echo ?
[17:33:11] <evocallaghan> I tried echo '\09' as per the man page and it does not work :/
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[17:37:48] <evocallaghan> As echo '\t' is not the same thing ..
[17:37:52] <Berny> hmm /usr/bin/echo "\tB" does work
[17:38:38] <evocallaghan> Berney:\t != ascii 0x09
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[17:39:51] <evocallaghan> Erwann:Hi
[17:40:19] <Erwann> Hi evocallaghan
[17:41:08] <Berny> evocallaghan, if you want 0x09 use \011
[17:41:21] <Berny> mind you echo wants octal numbers
[17:41:33] <Berny> so \09 isn't valid
[17:42:25] <Berny> \016 borks the term :-)
[17:42:27] <evocallaghan> Berney:Ha! Thanks, I been stearing at this for hours
[17:42:36] <evocallaghan> 016 ?
[17:43:05] <Berny> 0c0e
[17:43:12] <Berny> 0x0e even
[17:44:55] <evocallaghan> ^N ?
[17:45:12] <Berny> hmm supposed to be "shift out" whatever that is
[17:45:25] <evocallaghan> What does that mean ?
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[17:45:50] <Berny> ctrl-n :-)
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[17:46:49] <evocallaghan> Anyway
[17:46:59] <evocallaghan> Berny:Check this out
[17:47:36] <Berny> anyway according to diff \011 and \t there is no diff :-)
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[17:47:42] <evocallaghan> http://rafb.net/p/kNc9mJ99.html
[17:48:54] <evocallaghan> Erwann:Feel like doing some active debuging with me on that Intel GPU problem ?
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[17:50:54] <Erwann> evocallaghan, I'm travelling atm, so I don't have access to an intel machine :/
[17:51:18] <evocallaghan> Erwann:OK, ok. I just saw you and and though I would hit you up
[17:51:46] <evocallaghan> Erwann:I updated that bug report. I really can't think what more I can add. There is heaps of detail there
[17:52:02] <kohju> i'm home...
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[17:52:53] <Erwann> evocallaghan, yes, cool, at least when the driver team will look into it they'll have a lot of information, thanks
[17:54:04] <evocallaghan> Erwann:Well they said they have looked into it but can't reproduce it
[17:54:42] <evocallaghan> I just did a fresh install of sxce 99 today and still can't get past 1024x768 :[
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[17:55:36] <Berny> evocallaghan, in your nopaste the first exapmple works nicley on my sol 10 box (sparc) but fails on the x86 boxes
[17:55:39] <Erwann> evocallaghan, :/
[17:56:08] <Berny> you sure there is a tab in front of that line?
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[17:57:27] <Berny> ok there is a tab
[17:57:47] <evocallaghan> Berny:Interesting ay!?
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[17:58:42] <Berny> ok the echo generates the correct ascii
[17:58:54] <Berny> seems like sed doesn't like that
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[18:02:14] <Berny> go for sed 's/^[^t]//'
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[18:04:02] <ballChalk> start/working_directory            astring  :default
[18:04:16] <ballChalk> What does this mean, from listprop dns/server?  where can I find this :default value?
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[18:06:22] <balzac> hello
[18:06:48] <balzac> I
[18:07:07] <balzac> I'm trying to use the pkgadm tool but having no success so far
[18:07:11] <Berny> evocallaghan, or depending on your shell press ctrl-v before typing the tab
[18:07:17] <Berny> works fine too
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[18:14:28] <evocallaghan> Berny:/usr/sbin/psrinfo -vp | sed 's/^[^t]//' | tail -1 works thanks.
[18:14:38] <evocallaghan> very odd
[18:14:51] <evocallaghan> bug in sed maybe ?
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[18:19:47] <rajeshsr> hi all
[18:20:24] <rajeshsr> am planning to install open solaris in my system. I ran live CD and found that my "usb is misconfigured" in the Device Driver Utility.
[18:20:30] <rajeshsr> I use USB mouse!
[18:20:45] <rajeshsr> It is quite hard to work with open solaris without a mouse..
[18:21:00] <rajeshsr> I want to install solaris and wanna work with mouse.
[18:21:11] <rajeshsr> What am I to do?
[18:21:18] <rajeshsr> Can anyone help me with this?
[18:21:36] <h3sp4wn> This is on real hardware right ?
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[18:22:47] <rajeshsr> h3sp4wn, U mean am not using virtual box and tried with direct PC, right?
[18:23:15] <evocallaghan> yes
[18:23:31] <rajeshsr> evocallaghan, I use PC, directly
[18:23:32] <evocallaghan> also turn on usb mouse/kb support in your bios
[18:23:51] <evocallaghan> also make sure your bios is up to date
[18:24:08] <ballChalk> try unplugging and plugging it in
[18:24:19] <rajeshsr> evocallaghan, It is always on. I face that usb error, when I run open solaris live cd and my usb ports doesn't function.
[18:24:32] <ballChalk> ive have problems with usb mouse on one pc...  it just stops responding...  i think maybe its some power management thing gone funky
[18:24:58] <rajeshsr> That "ehci host-controller" error is what I face when I boot up!
[18:25:19] <ballChalk> ah interesting.  is there anything in the bios relating to ehci?
[18:25:19] <oxygene> rajeshsr: then disable "usb legacy keyboard" (or something like that) in BIOS
[18:25:31] <oxygene> rajeshsr: if there's an option "auto", use that
[18:25:40] <rajeshsr> oxygene, I don't think I have such option..
[18:25:49] * evocallaghan hates BIOS
[18:25:59] <rajeshsr> I mean regarding that legacy thing..
[18:26:06] <oxygene> rajeshsr: look for something with "usb" and "keyboard" or "legacy" - usually it's there. disable it
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[18:26:18] <evocallaghan> Right, bed time
[18:26:21] <evocallaghan> Nigth lads
[18:26:23] <rajeshsr> oxygene, My problem is with usb mouse..
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[18:26:42] <oxygene> rajeshsr: it's the same protocol
[18:26:48] <oxygene> so it might be the same hook
[18:26:59] <rajeshsr> oxygene, u want me to disable usb completely or onely the legacy support..
[18:27:37] <ballChalk> dont disable usb if you want to use it
[18:27:57] <rajeshsr> ballChalk, ok
[18:28:01] <rajeshsr> Any other fix.
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[18:28:11] <rajeshsr> loosk like I have to get the device driver.
[18:28:17] <oxygene> rajeshsr: only legacy - that will disable keyboard and mouse once bios passes control to the boot loader, but that way, BIOS doesn't interfere with the operating system
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[18:29:04] <rajeshsr> I have tweaked with bios lots of time, I think I need to get the device driver itself!
[18:29:16] <rajeshsr> Of corz, I am yet to check the legacy setting
[18:29:20] <rajeshsr> lemme check that
[18:29:54] <rajeshsr> if any other fix with respect to bios, lemme know
[18:30:03] <rajeshsr> so that I could try them all at a time..
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[18:31:27] <evocallaghan> rajeshsr:Flash your BIOS to the latest version, _then_ check the above setting. If all else fails there should be a setting to put the BIOS into "OS PnP=No" and turn the above option on
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[18:37:23] <PaulR_> how do I exit from a virt-install "shell" ?
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[18:38:37] <PaulR_> got it
[18:38:56] <PaulR_> ctrl+alt+]
[18:40:13] <evocallaghan> Anyone know if lzma ships with sxce ?
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[18:41:34] <ZOP> the excape char is same as telnet
[18:41:39] <ZOP> just ctrl+]
[18:42:00] <rajeshsr> evocallaghan, Well "Falshing the bios" is a new thing for me! I never heard anything like that! Only now, I google about it!
[18:42:04] <rajeshsr> Thanks!
[18:42:08] <jamesd> evocallaghan, doesn't look like it..
[18:42:14] <rajeshsr> lemme check that also.
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[18:43:31] <rajeshsr> One silly question. when I booted open solaris via live cd "alt+f2" as in normal gnome doens't work!
[18:43:38] <evocallaghan> jamesd:I always though 7zip e foo.lzma would do the trick ?
[18:43:40] <rajeshsr> is the key binding different?
[18:43:41] <jamesd> evocallaghan, nope not there on b94
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[18:44:20] <jamesd> evocallaghan, good news is that 7zip is there, which is surprising...
[18:45:28] <evocallaghan> Error: Can not open file as archive
[18:45:28] <seanmcg> not really since all new packages are not 7zip'd..
[18:45:44] <evocallaghan> $ file dwhelper.tar.lzma
[18:45:45] <evocallaghan> dwhelper.tar.lzma:	data
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[18:50:19] <ZOP> rajeshsr: i don't think solaris has multiple VCs like Linux does.  atleast not by default.
[18:50:41] <rajeshsr> ZOP, VCs means?
[18:50:41] <e^ipi> it does now
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[18:50:50] <e^ipi> but screen is far superior anyways
[18:51:38] <ZOP> rajeshsr: virtual consoles
[18:51:58] <ZOP> rajeshsr: thats what you're doing when you're pressing alt+f2, switching virtual consoles.
[18:52:22] <ZOP> e^ipi: wow really?  different hotkey or just disabled by default?
[18:52:29] <evocallaghan> ZOP:NO, that's ^C+^A+F2
[18:52:43] <rajeshsr> ZOP, Nope, am just instatiating a Run application! I am not talking about "ctrl+alt+f2"
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[18:52:49] <evocallaghan> ZOP:See flag days
[18:53:01] <e^ipi> ZOP: build 100
[18:53:08] <ZOP> e^ipi: i see.
[18:53:14] * evocallaghan falls over
[18:53:17] <evocallaghan> Night people
[18:53:20] <e^ipi> screen integrates in 100 as well
[18:53:37] <e^ipi> <3 screen
[18:53:38] <trochej> Anyone here knows how to use ip.tun properly (ie. not hanging up the system)?
[18:53:45] <ZOP> rajeshsr: oh hah, i don't use X ever, i missed teh bit about gnome.
[18:53:46] <ballChalk> under svccfg, how do I figure out what a property value of :default means?
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[18:54:02] <e^ipi> ballChalk: it's the default
[18:54:09] <e^ipi> *nod*
[18:54:15] <e^ipi> check the docs
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[19:03:20] <ZOP> oh and i figured out my Debian install problem...since there's no domU support in the installer it won't even try for debian unless you tell it to --hvm instead of --paravirt (for virt-install)
[19:03:49] <ballChalk> im looking at the /network/dns/server:default/start/working_directory property.  but i dont find any reference to it within Solaris 10 System Administrator Collection
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[19:05:00] <mui> hi
[19:07:05] <mui> any clue where I could start finding the problem with lsi megaraid 84016?, disks are in jbod mode and solaris sees them fine but zpool create, format and mkfs etc just hangs (although its possible to ctrl+c them still)
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[19:07:29] <mui> i can dd in and out disk devices under rdsk fine
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[19:14:51] <ZOP> where does libvirtd/virtd store it's config
[19:15:03] <ZOP> destroy doesn't work so i'm going ot need to manually fix some crud.
[19:15:31] <e^ipi> i'd assume in SMF but i could be dead wrong
[19:18:58] <hudnix> question: If I wanted to deploy a production opensolaris server, employing Xen and Samba, should I use Solaris Express or one of the recent Opensolaris builds?
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[19:19:39] <e^ipi> why use samba? solaris has an in-kernel CIFS server
[19:20:36] <hudnix> Yeah, I wanto to make it a Domain controller, I hacven't been able to figure that out with the built-in one.
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[19:22:24] <hudnix> but I'm having trouble figuring out which solaris* version is closest to production-ready, and will be the simplest to keep up-to-date...
[19:22:50] <hudnix> I'm running Solaris Express right now, but it's missing that nifty 'pkg' command.
[19:23:01] <ballChalk> i'd use the latest scxe.  i guess reading the release notes would be a good thing to do
[19:23:19] <SunTzuTech> SXCE with zfs root is still pretty good
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[19:24:40] <hudnix> How then to get sxce to get all the nifty add-on software you get with the 'pkg' command on Opensolaris?
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[19:25:08] <hudnix> or am I missing something?
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[19:27:21] <aoglobalent> does any one in the room work with Solaris or Windows on Virtual box at all? I have done some installs of my V-box, but am having some problems.
[19:28:40] <hudnix> I've done some solaris installs in windows and linux vbox hosts...
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[19:37:56] <ZOP> e^ipi: yeah looked there the start/exec script resolves to /usr/lib/libvirtd -d
[19:38:24] <ZOP> e^ipi: trying strings on the libvirt lib now - can't get lsof to build (missing headers and i am sketchy on how to track those down at the moment)
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[19:54:05] <phrost> anyone know if you can do sxce global with indiana type zones?
[19:56:55] <PaulR_> anyone jumpstarted a guest domain?
[19:57:29] <Berny> ZOP, did you check /var/lib/xend ?
[19:59:30] <CIA-25> Peter Dennis - Sustaining Engineer <Peter.Dennis at Sun dot COM>: 6713198 metaset dumps core if -l 56 is specified, 6735303 meta_*_check_component frees random memory
[20:01:10] <CosmicDJ> cia is back...
[20:01:39] <CosmicDJ> phrost: I don't think that's possible
[20:01:40] <jbk> destabilizing 3rd world countries?
[20:01:57] <CosmicDJ> jbk: no spamming #opensolaris again ;)
[20:03:36] <e^ipi> before i got it in my email, i actually found it relatively useful to have it here
[20:03:39] <e^ipi> *shrug*
[20:03:46] <e^ipi> RSS feed is still probably better though
[20:08:07] <ZOP> Berny: yeah i didn't realize they "shared" like that.  figured it out though
[20:13:16] <hudnix> hmm, is there a trick to running the smb service in a zone? : svcadm: svc:/milestone/network depends on svc:/network/physical, which has multiple instances.
[20:13:40] <hudnix> also will not let me run smbsat in the zone.
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[20:15:02] <Berny> hu? i'm running samba in two zones (but not via smf though)
[20:16:26] <hudnix> nevermind, should have googled first.
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[20:22:04] <ZOP> hudnix: i don't think you can run the kernel services inside a zone.
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[20:26:42] <hudnix> ZOP: thanks. Does this mean I can't have multiple zones each set up with a custom cifs configuration, using the in-kernel cifs server? :(
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[20:30:34] <ZOP> hudnix: i believe not, you'll have to google to be sure but ISTR something like that for both the NFS and CIFS services.
[20:30:54] <ZOP> hudnix: Samba's your alternative.
[20:31:50] <hudnix> heh, I started out with samba, and everyone here was like"why not use the in-kernel cifs?" :)
[20:32:14] <ZOP> well it's a lot faster
[20:32:28] <e^ipi> and it understands ACL's
[20:32:34] <ZOP> and it's more integrated....but if you didn't mention the fact you wanted to use zones heh.
[20:32:39] <ZOP> yeah and it actually understands ACLs
[20:32:45] <ZOP> something Samba has never quite managed.
[20:32:47] <jbk> it would be nice if it was zone aware
[20:32:51] <e^ipi> and zfs can sharesmb directly
[20:34:29] <hudnix> yeah, reading up on the zfs and ACL support is starting to win me over...
[20:35:12] <ZOP> what you lose versus what you gain.
[20:35:35] <ZOP> the question becomes do you really *NEED* to serve from inside a Zone?
[20:35:40] <ZOP> the answer in many cases is probably not.
[20:35:51] <e^ipi> indeed
[20:36:08] <e^ipi> set up your ACL's correctly and it's already walled off enough
[20:36:23] <ZOP> since the SMB stuff hides the pathing ANYWAY.  and with correct ACLs....
[20:36:28] <ZOP> yeahp
[20:36:56] <ZOP> ok time for me to run to the office
[20:37:09] <hudnix> My primary reason was for disaster recovery. My plan was to have no services offered by the default installation, and have a zone backed up so all I have to do is a default install then restore the zone.
[20:37:10] <e^ipi> if you just set sharesmb to on you get fun share names like export_home_myuser
[20:37:50] <e^ipi> hudnix: flar ( flash archive ) the thing?
[20:38:10] <e^ipi> like, create a flar, keep it backed up somewhere... if the worst happens, install from flar and you're already rolling
[20:38:23] <ZOP> yeah flar, with zfs, i think is better
[20:38:40] <ZOP> zfs contains *most* of the samba stuff, the flar contains the rest.
[20:38:45] <ZOP> if it goes south
[20:38:51] <TrogL> brb
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[20:38:58] <hudnix> man, I grew up on solaris, but have been away since Sol 8. Guess I have a lot of catching up to do...
[20:39:01] <ZOP> you just have to tell the installer to install from a flar
[20:39:23] <Atomdrache> Quick login shell question.
[20:39:31] <e^ipi> Atomdrache: use ksh93
[20:39:31] <e^ipi> .
[20:39:37] <ZOP> lol
[20:39:39] <ZOP> or bash
[20:39:40] <Atomdrache> Can a user in Solaris change their default login shell without having access to /etc/passwd?
[20:39:44] <e^ipi> to hell with bash.
[20:39:46] <ZOP> the default for root is crack.
[20:39:53] <ZOP> Atomdrache: chsh
[20:39:58] <ZOP> Atomdrache: and /etc/shells
[20:40:02] <e^ipi> ZOP: ENOEXIST
[20:40:03] <Atomdrache> Where's chsh?
[20:40:05] <Atomdrache> Can't find it.
[20:40:07] <Atomdrache> No man page, even.
[20:40:10] <ZOP> e^ipi: oh crap seriously?
[20:40:14] <e^ipi> yeah man
[20:40:17] <Atomdrache> Ain't there.
[20:40:18] <ZOP> chfn?
[20:40:25] <e^ipi> http://cr.opensolaris.org/~error404/chsh/
[20:40:42] <Atomdrache> So, using commands that actually exist, how would this be done?
[20:40:46] <e^ipi> i wrote that a while back.. it's suboptimal so when i have a couple hours i plan on retooling it
[20:40:53] <Atomdrache> Hmm.
[20:40:55] <Atomdrache> Neat.
[20:40:57] <ZOP> see it's been a while for me, i bet on my old machines i was importing some chsh replacement lol
[20:40:58] <e^ipi> Atomdrache: i just posted the source of chsh
[20:41:17] <Atomdrache> Is a non-privileged user going to be able to use it?
[20:41:27] <e^ipi> Atomdrache: if root installs it, yes
[20:41:32] <e^ipi> it's suid
[20:41:46] <Atomdrache> I am trying to help out a guy who neither has root nor knows the administrator.
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[20:42:11] <e^ipi> the security guys had some concerns about it with respect to NIS+/LDAP ( namely, it doesn't use them )
[20:42:26] <e^ipi> so i'm gonna fix it and try to get it integrated
[20:42:34] <Berny> Atomdrache, run an interactive shell from .login *duck*
[20:42:49] <e^ipi> not real helpful in this situation right now, but *shrug*
[20:42:54] <Atomdrache> Berny: I may suggest that, though I think that's gross.
[20:43:15] <ZOP> passwd -e mebbe
[20:43:15] <ZOP> ?
[20:43:22] <Atomdrache> Insufficient privileges.
[20:43:31] <ZOP> ah hell yeah perm denied when i'm regular user heh
[20:43:37] <e^ipi> Atomdrache: yeah, it's stupid
[20:43:40] <e^ipi> it's a bug
[20:43:51] <e^ipi> ( it is now actually, i filed it a week ago )
[20:43:52] <Atomdrache> e^ipi: What's a bug?
[20:44:05] <e^ipi> Atomdrache: that a user can't change his or her own shell
[20:44:07] <Atomdrache> Oh.
[20:44:30] <hudnix> some admins might not like that.
[20:44:41] <e^ipi> hudnix: they can just not install it
[20:44:46] <ZOP> well Solaris is the only one you can't
[20:45:00] <e^ipi> hudnix: there's also the idea to give it an RBAC priviledge
[20:45:11] <ZOP> anyway bbiab
[20:47:20] <Berny> Atomdrache, of course it is gross :-) but may be the only easy way
[20:48:47] <Atomdrache> ZOP: Perhaps, but I still hear plenty of whining from the Linux evangelists.
[20:49:58] <Atomdrache> (and, really, it is kind of annoying to hear arguments like "that is an inferior OS because {ps has sysV syntax | I don't like the default shell | etc.}" so often.)
[20:50:10] <ZOP> heh eyah
[20:50:16] <e^ipi> Atomdrache: they will whine forever, and we'll keep removing reasons for them to whine ( exempli gratia virtual consoles ) until we get down to the real reason ( id est, "i hate sun because i can't afford a SPARC machine" )
[20:50:21] <Atomdrache> Always complaints about very superficial things.
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[20:50:53] <ZOP> yeah they shoudls top and ask why their NFS server doesn't work in 2.6
[20:51:03] <ZOP> or that kernel locking has been completely fubar off and on pretty regularly.
[20:51:06] <Atomdrache> e^ipi: except that there isn't much of an excuse for that anymore, seeing as an Ultra 24--or, for that matter, a common PC that can run Solaris--is cheaper than the plexiglass-clad neon signs these guys drag to LAN parties.
[20:51:25] <e^ipi> because no UNIX company has gone tits-up and donated them a working NFS server with their death-rattle
[20:51:32] <e^ipi> which is how Linux seems to get most of it's features
[20:52:38] <e^ipi> Atomdrache: if they were rational they wouldn't be whining about stupid crap in the first place
[20:52:48] <e^ipi> they'd install screen and marvel at how inferior virtual consoles are
[20:53:16] <Atomdrache> I actually rather like screen, with the sole exception that its handling of scrollback is annoying as all fuck.
[20:53:30] <Atomdrache> It is nice to be able to run a few terminal apps, log out, walk away, log in a mile away, and resume.
[20:54:37] <e^ipi> or not have downloads/compiles/what have you interrupted when you're sshed in to a stable machine from one with a shitty wifi connection
[20:55:01] <Atomdrache> Hence, I prefer to put applications and such in screen.  They handle it all right.
[20:55:04] <e^ipi> my laptop drops off wifi fairly regularly, it's nice that my (wired) machine at home can continue doing what it's doing
[20:55:14] <Atomdrache> (I usually keep this irssi session in screen, for example.)
[20:55:35] <jbk> as do i
[20:56:20] <sstallion_work> jbk: afternoon
[20:56:35] <jbk> hi
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[20:56:54] <Atomdrache> Honestly, if I were going to hate on Sun stuff, I'd probably do it from the perspective of, say, a mainframe snob.
[20:56:58] <Atomdrache> (but I don't have that much money)
[20:57:01] <sstallion_work> jbk: have some Brussels questions for you ;)
[20:57:35] <Atomdrache> but I could totally respect a mainframe snob, mostly becauze z/VM on System z10 is awesome.
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[20:57:43] <jbk> ok, i'll try to answer
[20:57:52] <sstallion_work> messing with the adv_ and en_ mii props
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[20:58:13] <sstallion_work> my view on adv_ is this: adv_ props are driver capabiliites and should never change
[20:58:23] <sstallion_work> en_* simply filters what is negotiated with a link partner
[20:58:31] <sstallion_work> (just looking for validation)
[20:58:31] <jbk> that is my recollection as well
[20:58:38] <sstallion_work> interesting
[20:58:50] <sstallion_work> If I'm reading afe right, when an en_ prop is set, it also sets the adv_ bits
[20:59:00] <sstallion_work> I think bge does something else similar
[20:59:13] <sstallion_work> also, how do those relate to the ether kstats ?
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[20:59:33] <sstallion_work> I assume ETHER_STAT_ADV_CAP => adv, and ETHER_STAT_CAP => en_ ?
[20:59:44] <jbk> probably
[20:59:47] <oxygene> is there any documentation/example for a serial port driver? I'm working my way through information about ftdi's chip (which is my target, I have two of their usb-serial adapters here and need them) I can find, and the writing device driver book from docs.sun.com.
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[21:00:51] <jbk> oxygene: i think that's done via streams (*shudder*)
[21:01:22] <oxygene> jbk: looks like it - why "shudder"?
[21:01:46] <jbk> streams seems to be one of those 'looks nice in theory, horrid in practice' things
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[21:02:56] <oxygene> okay, so I'll fetch the streams handbook, too
[21:02:57] <oxygene> thanks!
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[21:03:48] <oxygene> that chipset makes the difference for me between being able to develop for coreboot, or not (connection to the target system) - and dual boot sucks :)
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[21:21:33] <sstallion_work> look at the streams programming guide
[21:21:37] <sstallion_work> oxygene: ^
[21:22:07] <sstallion_work> look into the chip specs, the usb interfaces, and at what other OS's have done
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[21:26:40] <oxygene> sstallion_work: no specs - only openbsd source
[21:26:59] <sstallion_work> oxygene: have you asked the manufacturer? that tends to make things more bearable.
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[21:27:13] <sstallion_work> (unless its based on an existing standard)
[21:27:53] <hudnix> ok, so if I want to set up home directories such that each user has his own cifs-exported zfs filesystem, is there support for that, or do I need to make a custom adduser script?
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[21:28:44] <sstallion_work> hudnix: set the sharesmb property on the enclosing filesystem
[21:28:52] <sstallion_work> (i.e. rpool/export/home)
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[21:29:38] <hudnix> yes, but having adduser create a export/home/$user zfs FS?
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[21:31:16] <sstallion_work> hudnix: you'll need to look into whether sharesmb is inherited or not and adjust accordingly
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[21:33:22] <hudnix> It does, thanks
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[22:09:38] <PaulR_> anyone jumpstart xen with opensolaris?
[22:11:04] <seanmcg> yup, just like normal jumpstart..
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[22:12:08] <PaulR_> sean...ok check this out...
[22:12:53] <PaulR_> http://pastebin.com/mc0817ae
[22:14:07] <PaulR_> according to the documentation I'm doing it right
[22:14:08] <seanmcg> your dhcp server is setup right ?
[22:15:11] <PaulR_> yeayes
[22:15:24] <PaulR_> I shouldn't get the "source media" issue
[22:16:12] <seanmcg> aye, you have a shell though now ?
[22:16:15] <seanmcg> ifconfig -a
[22:16:28] <seanmcg> ifconfig xnf0 dhcp  ?
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[22:18:37] <PaulR_> I get an IP
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[22:19:10] <seanmcg> Okona, try suninstall again
[22:19:16] <seanmcg> ok even
[22:19:19] <PaulR_> http://pastebin.com/m700d3299
[22:20:36] <seanmcg> and the nfs share is ok too ?
[22:21:11] <PaulR_> couldn't find matching rules file
[22:21:21] <PaulR_> my rules are in my /export/config shared via nfs
[22:21:28] <PaulR_> and yes...I can mount all the shares manually
[22:22:04] <PaulR_> how can I see where jumpstart i slooking for the rules?
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[22:26:43] <seanmcg> your nfs shares are read-only right ?
[22:26:47] <PaulR_> yes
[22:27:25] <seanmcg> do a df -h, you should see a /tmp/[_]install..  dir, two of them I think, one of them should have the rules file etc
[22:28:27] <PaulR_> right
[22:28:58] <PaulR_> but if I am doing...--autocf nfs:10.12.83.98:/export/config - that means my rules.ok file should be on that nfs share right?
[22:29:01] <PaulR_> or in
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[22:37:21] <seanmcg> PaulR_, I don't see whats wrong with your config..
[22:37:42] <PaulR_> me neither
[22:37:46] <PaulR_> unless its some sort of bug
[22:37:56] <seanmcg> what I've done is based stuff off this blog, I used it as a reference:  http://blogs.sun.com/shalon/entry/virt_install_demo
[22:38:12] <PaulR_> that's what I'm using
[22:38:17] <PaulR_> its driving me crazy
[22:38:29] <PaulR_> I can do a normal install
[22:38:33] <PaulR_> but I dont care about that
[22:38:50] <seanmcg> ya, you want an automatic install..
[22:38:54] <PaulR_> its just not reading my nfs shares in the miniroot or something
[22:39:01] <PaulR_> although I can mount them
[22:39:15] <PaulR_> or maybe virt-install isn't getting the nfs shares passed to it correctly
[22:39:51] <seanmcg> running the 'check' script created the rules.ok ?
[22:40:28] <seanmcg> btw, is the netmask on the nfs server 255.255.255.0 ?  same as client ?
[22:41:37] <PaulR_> yes it did
[22:41:41] <PaulR_> yes
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[22:42:28] <PaulR_> the jumpserver works because that's what I built the OpenSolaris box with
[22:44:03] <seanmcg> ya, just chasing the usual little things that catch me..
[22:44:39] <seanmcg> and that mac address isn't known to be a bradcast one in disguise or the like ?-)
[22:45:40] <PaulR_> nope :)
[22:46:01] <PaulR_> I'm checking all my configs again too
[22:46:05] <PaulR_> it all looks right
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[22:54:35] <blahee> (let's see if this D945GCLF2 integrated RTL6168C does work with snv_99 too. Now the board is dual-core Atom and Gbit NIC)
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[22:56:07] <seanmcg> sorry PaulR_ I can't see from here anything wrong..
[22:56:40] <PaulR_> its not passing the right parameters from what I can see
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[23:01:51] <PaulR_> I got a little further
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[23:01:55] <PaulR_> may have gotten it this time...
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[23:02:11] <PaulR_> I'm about to go nuts if it doesn't work :/
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[23:14:54] <PaulR_> ok figured it out
[23:15:01] <PaulR_> needed to add a line to dom0's /etc/hosts
[23:15:10] <PaulR_> freaking 4 hours of that
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[23:16:14] <Phoul> Hello everyone, i was curious about something, i was told open solaris was a project // kernel, not a installable system itself, im lookiong on teh website for opensolaris and it has a "opensolaris" download. I was just curious what 'version' that would be
[23:16:23] <seanmcg> PaulR_, eh ?  for the nfs server ?
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[23:16:31] <PaulR_> no for the guest domain
[23:16:46] <PaulR_> so I needed to add the hostname/ip to domU's /etc/hosts
[23:17:37] <seanmcg> the dom0 has to know the domU's hostname/ip ?  odd
[23:18:01] <PaulR_> yea...once I added it jumpstart was all good
[23:18:10] <PaulR_> I imagine that's because it can't mount nfs without knowing its own IP
[23:18:26] <PaulR_> it doesn't get its own IP until it starts the arp
[23:18:39] <Phoul> anyone at all
[23:18:39] <PaulR_> or when dhcp gives it an IP
[23:19:14] <seanmcg> SXCE's install is still odd to me at times like that.
[23:20:05] <Phoul> No one knows?
[23:20:08] <seanmcg> Phoul, opensolaris is the name given to both the code base (which is the kernel and a lot of the userspace bits aroung the kernel).  As well as the name given to Sun sponsored new distribution.
[23:20:33] <Phoul> Ok
[23:20:38] <seanmcg> the current versions of both are in the topic of this channel
[23:20:39] <Phoul> So would that be the reccomended one?
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[23:21:12] <Phoul> Im not asking about the versioning... im asking which version it is thats lsited as 'opensolaris' on the website
[23:21:36] <e^ipi> that'd be indiana
[23:21:40] <e^ipi> aka 2008.05
[23:21:46] <PaulR_> Phoul, if you download opensolaris from opensolaris.org it takes you to Sun.com to download it...think of it as a prerelease Solaris 11
[23:21:54] <e^ipi> it's a bit of a confusing mess
[23:22:06] <Phoul> Im trying to figure out what i should dl if i want to test opensolaris
[23:22:23] <PaulR_> opensolaris is the latest and supposedly "greatest" :)
[23:22:37] <Phoul> However... it seems like its a bit of a cluster#*$% to find the right one... no offence
[23:22:52] <PaulR_> Indiana - 2008.05 is a release of OpenSolaris that was stable enough for Sun to officiall support
[23:22:54] <e^ipi> Phoul: 2008.05 is the brand-new untested one... SXCE is the more stable, more solaris10 like one
[23:23:12] <PaulR_> Sun supports 2008.05
[23:23:20] <PaulR_> they don't support OpenSolaris
[23:23:25] <Phoul> Im just looking because personally i just bought a laptop not too long ago, Im running ubuntu on it but i hate ubuntu, so im looking into solaris just to poke around
[23:23:26] <PaulR_> and yes...it is confusing as hell
[23:23:34] <e^ipi> blame marketing...
[23:23:39] <Phoul> I blame the media
[23:23:42] <Phoul> :P
[23:23:43] <PaulR_> Phoul, I wouldn't wrong it primarily on a laptop
[23:23:53] <Phoul> wrong what
[23:23:55] <PaulR_> throw VirtualBox on your laptop and then play with Solaris
[23:23:57] <Phoul> run you mean?
[23:24:01] <PaulR_> run
[23:24:02] <PaulR_> yea
[23:24:05] <Phoul> Ahh kk, Why not?
[23:24:05] <PaulR_> sorry my brain is fried
[23:24:05] <e^ipi> Sun ONE Java System iPlanet N1 xVM OpenSolaris Enterprise Edition 2008.05
[23:24:11] <PaulR_> I've been fighting with Xen all day
[23:24:37] <Phoul> is opensolaris not friendly to laptops?
[23:24:50] <PaulR_> Solaris in general is not friendly to laptops
[23:24:52] <e^ipi> it's fine
[23:24:58] <seanmcg> either is fine.
[23:25:02] <e^ipi> it'll be more friendly in a couple weeks when a build100 distro comes out
[23:25:11] <Phoul> whats build100
[23:25:11] <Phoul> lol
[23:25:17] <e^ipi> it is build number 100
[23:25:20] <PaulR_> its going to be the latest "stable" release
[23:25:33] <PaulR_> like 2008.05 is Indiana, Build 100 will be 2008.11
[23:25:33] <e^ipi> b100 integrated a bunch more power management stuff
[23:25:39] <e^ipi> PaulR_: no.
[23:25:40] <PaulR_> or 101
[23:25:41] <seanmcg> b99 is out now, b100 is out later (SXCE wise).  IPS (aka indiana) is a little behind.
[23:25:44] <e^ipi> PaulR_: 101 will be indiana
[23:25:57] * Phoul runs headlong into a wall
[23:26:03] <Phoul> Ok, So dont run it on a laptop is what im getting
[23:26:15] <PaulR_> run it virtualized
[23:26:23] <seanmcg> norman, I'm typing this on a toshiba laptop, running sxce99 just fine
[23:26:27] <PaulR_> VMWare/Parallels/VirtualBox
[23:26:27] <seanmcg> no even.
[23:26:47] <PaulR_> seanmcg:  does your power management work?
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[23:27:34] <seanmcg> nope.  not till b100
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[23:28:09] <balzac> hello again
[23:28:55] <balzac> I'm trying to use pkg-add to add pkg-get from blastwave but I get Error: unable to establish connection to blastwave.network.comm
[23:29:28] <balzac> how do I configure the package manager to have network access?
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[23:31:34] <e^ipi> hey Gman_
[23:31:43] <Gman_> g'day e^ipi
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[23:44:46] <balzac> is there a text based browser available in solaris by default?
[23:45:14] <e^ipi> you can set up firefox to block images
[23:45:15] <e^ipi> ;)
[23:45:28] <balzac> I'm logged in via ssh
[23:45:46] <e^ipi> wget ?
[23:45:55] <PaulR_> lynx? :)
[23:46:10] <e^ipi> PaulR_: he's asking about the default install
[23:46:20] <balzac> I did sudo -u root pkginfo | grep lynx
[23:46:23] <balzac> nothing
[23:46:25] <e^ipi> you can add lynx or links2 or what have you afterwards
[23:46:29] <e^ipi> balzac: s/sudo/pfexec
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[23:46:36] <balzac> I'd love to be able to add anything
[23:46:43] <e^ipi> don't use sudo, it's old and busted
[23:46:43] <PaulR_> you can't add anything?
[23:46:48] <e^ipi> new hotness: pfexec
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[23:47:28] <balzac> PaulR_: not yet
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[23:47:49] <balzac> well, I tried pgkadd to add pkg-get from blastwave
[23:47:53] <balzac> it wouldn't connect
[23:48:42] <balzac> so I'm wondering if it's locked inside a firewall, and if so, how am I supposed to install anything?
[23:48:54] <balzac> I'm suspicous I've been sent on a fools errand
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[23:50:59] <bda> telnet www.google.com 80 ? :)
[23:51:18] <e^ipi> does blastwave use http for packages?
[23:52:19] <e^ipi> i guess it does
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