[00:00:07] <Red_Cloud> Bartman007 I would really like to fully configure all of the shells on my 'puter so that I might use them all to become familiar with their different configurations.
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[00:03:06] <nachox> hi :)
[00:05:03] <Bartman007> Red_Cloud: personally I think trying to learn several different shells simultaniously if you aren't familiar with a unix environment is a rather abmitious task, I would pick one, get fairly comfortable with it and solaris in general, then look at trying out others.
[00:05:32] <Red_Cloud> Bartman007 then I will start with bash.  Thanks.
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[00:06:22] <nachox> Red_Cloud, i'd start with ksh, specially since bash lacks both a profile and a restricted shell in solaris
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[00:07:01] <Red_Cloud> nachox let me look and see what I have and must create.  Am googling as we speak.
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[00:27:45] * boyd would congratulate nrubsig, but he must be off partying
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[00:32:00] <nachox> yeah, he earnt it
[00:35:24] <alanc> it's after midnight in Germany - this is about when he normally shows up here
[00:36:34] <nachox> i seriously think he does not sleep
[00:36:55] <agliodbs> hey, alanc
[00:37:09] <alanc> hi
[00:37:49] <jbk> boyd: why, was ksh93 putback?
[00:38:37] <alanc> yes, about 4 hours ago
[00:38:42] <jbk> ahh cool
[00:39:08] <alanc> see opensolaris-announce or the on flag days
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[00:41:38] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stevel
[00:42:12] <Tpenta> hey stevel
[00:42:28] <Tpenta> not seen any cia messages for a while, is everything still working?
[00:42:29] <stevel> 'afternoon alan
[00:43:27] <stevel> not sure
[00:43:39] <stevel> trying to submit an RTI right now before kupfer leaves - will check in a bit
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[00:43:53] <Tpenta> :)
[00:45:49] <tsp> where would be the best place to put a command that will run every time the box boots?
[00:45:59] <wesolows> autoexec.bat!
[00:46:02] <nachox> ...
[00:46:11] <tsp> I tried creating a file called /etc/rc3.d/S99local, but it sometimes didn't run
[00:46:12] <nachox> tsp, a service?
[00:46:20] <wesolows> see smf(5)
[00:46:30] <tsp> nachox: I just want it to speak some text after everything loads
[00:46:47] <wesolows> SMF supports both persistent (daemon) services and one-shot execution
[00:46:51] <wesolows> smf(5)
[00:46:54] <tsp> the service would probably run before everything else
[00:47:03] <wesolows> it supports dependencies too
[00:47:04] <wesolows> smf(5)
[00:47:08] <nachox> you have dependencies
[00:47:08] * tsp rtfm's
[00:47:37] <wesolows> See also http://www.sun.com/bigadmin/content/selfheal/sdev_intro.html
[00:47:39] * nachox wonders if wesolows has a shortcut to write smf(5)
[00:47:50] <wesolows> and smf(5)
[00:48:07] <wesolows> that's what this chan really needs, a man page bot
[00:48:59] <jbk> i've sometimes been accused of being that :)
[00:49:00] <nachox> the only bot that is really needed is chanserv and it doesnt seem to be here
[00:49:56] <stevel> tpenta: looks like the bridge borked on ksh93
[00:50:02] * stevel disables the bridge for now
[00:50:05] <stevel> i'll investigate in a bit
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[00:50:25] <g4lt-mordant> wesolows, if you make one, could we borrow it in #solaris as well? XD
[00:50:40] <Tpenta> ROFL
[00:50:50] <Tpenta> roland broke the bridge
[00:50:58] <nachox> hehe
[00:51:12] <nachox> dont tell richlowe he will blame gman
[00:51:16] <g4lt-mordant> who gets to tell him? ;P
[00:51:35] <stevel> roland broke nothing.  the bridge is not structurally sound
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[00:54:40] <alanc> I'm sure Roland will be happy to rebuild the bridge as a ksh93 script for you
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[00:55:40] <FrostCS> Captain, we have problems on the bridge...
[00:56:13] <alanc> the bridge as a ksh93 script might actually need the 64-bit ksh93 to run...
[00:56:42] <boyd> Surely they tested against the bridge?
[00:57:07] <alanc> is there anyway to test the bridge other than driving your putback across it?
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[00:57:20] <g4lt-mordant> alanc, given what I've heard about the bridge, at least if it's remade as a ksh93 script, it will be more  reliable ;P
[00:57:35] <boyd> alanc: I'm not sure, but I'd have expected at least that.
[00:57:58] <alanc> yeah, but is it worth the effort given stevel is counting the days until he can burn the bridge?
[00:58:50] <boyd> Really?
[00:59:02] <g4lt-mordant> well, that depdns on how good stevel is with burning a ksh93 script instead of what's there now XD
[00:59:10] <boyd> Oh, wait... I'm thinking of a different bridge I think
[00:59:18] <nachox> burn it now! ksh was already integrated, it's job is over, so many messages and he failed when it was important
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[01:00:57] <richlowe> g4lt-mordant: no, it wouldn't be.
[01:01:17] <richlowe> g4lt-mordant: the problem with the bridge is that TeamWare does nearly nothing to prevent people commiting the most despicable of evils.
[01:01:42] <stevel> alanc is right... driving across the bridge is the only way to test it
[01:01:44] <boyd> Well, the boot archive is in there, so that's proof <cymbal crash>
[01:01:47] <wesolows> put another way, teamware is very powerful and flexible
[01:02:04] <richlowe> wesolows: in the right hands.
[01:02:11] <nachox> hehe, have to love marketing
[01:02:18] * wesolows laughs evilly
[01:02:18] <ket> wesolows: so is peoplesoft.
[01:02:25] * ket coughs
[01:02:29] <alanc> wonder what ksh93 upstream uses for code management - it's already going svn -> teamware -> hg for the opensolaris integration alone
[01:02:31] <g4lt-mordant> so's spring steel, does that mean you're going to balance a truck on one nd and yourself on the other?
[01:02:48] <wesolows> ket: Really?  It always seemed like a giant bloated incomprehensible database schema that you were supposed to hire 200 pakistani programmers to "extend" via java
[01:02:57] <boyd> nachox: At least the embarrasing one has moved off the home page
[01:03:00] <ket> wesolows: no, via SQR
[01:03:15] <ket> wesolows: and that, is 'flexible.'
[01:03:45] <boyd> What's wrong with the "Triple your Capacity" promo here: http://www.sun.com/promotions/
[01:03:55] <wesolows> ket: I see.  So it's "flexible" in the same way that vi is flexible; you can implement a complete business process solution using either, and with approximately equal effort.
[01:04:02] <richlowe> boyd: we complained about this already, didn't we?
[01:04:15] <boyd> Yes, you and I did.. Someone asked...
[01:04:18] <ket> boyd: the fact that i see absolutely no promotions whatsoever?
[01:04:23] <Tempt> Haha
[01:04:29] <Tempt> IBM, huh? Oh dears.
[01:04:55] <ket> wesolows: .. i'm gonna guess you've never really used peoplesoft. ;P
[01:04:56] <richlowe> nachox: also, why would I blame Glynn?
[01:05:02] <boyd> Tempt: Cut that out
[01:05:03] <richlowe> nachox: everything of that nature is stevel's fault, duh.
[01:05:10] <ket> Tempt: only on the x86 blades, thankfully.
[01:05:15] <nachox> hehe
[01:05:34] <Tempt> I'm sure Sun will get lots of support contracts out of this. Ha. Ha. Ha.
[01:05:39] <wesolows> ket: I have but mostly my job consisted of rebooting the 212 peoplesoft servers when one of the 200 pakistani java programmers said it was broken.  This occurred approximately 54323 times a day.
[01:05:48] <tsp> is there some way I don't know about to turn off the damned interpret-backspace-literally-after-\ syndrom?
[01:05:49] <alanc> boyd: don't you know "Triple" is marketing speak for "Increase by 50%" ?
[01:05:52] <agliodbs> hey, richlowe
[01:06:10] <boyd> alanc: Apparently.
[01:06:13] <ket> wesolows: well there's your problem. rampant incompetence.
[01:06:14] * tsp would subscribe and post to the lists, but decided to ask here first
[01:06:27] <agliodbs> tsp: don't ask on -discuss
[01:06:29] <nachox> wesolows, that has to be a boring job
[01:06:30] <wesolows> ket: Yes.  I was not responsible for actually making it work.
[01:06:30] <ket> wesolows: unless you're talking strictly about the nt process schedulers.
[01:06:31] <agliodbs> you'll get an earful
[01:06:32] <Tempt> Okay, so Java is already shipping with Google malware, and now they're building it into StarOffice?
[01:06:43] <wesolows> nachox: Now you can see why I decided I'd rather be an engineer for Sun. :-)
[01:06:47] <tsp> if I'm in ed, and hit \ by accident and want to get rid of it, I have to hit backsapce twice
[01:06:51] <ket> Tempt: ... that's another few lines in my jumpstarts. thanks for the warning.
[01:07:06] <tsp> agliodbs: why not -discuss? that sounds like the perfect place to ask
[01:07:07] <nachox> wesolows, i can also see why you hate everyone and everything :P
[01:07:14] <boyd> tsp: That's not ed, that's the unix terminal driver. You shoudl introduce yourself to it sometime.
[01:07:30] <Tempt> ket: It looks like they're only targetting the Windows versions.
[01:07:34] <tsp> boyd: solaris is the only unix I've used that does that, though.
[01:07:36] <nachox> well, not hate but... well...
[01:07:38] <Tempt> ket: Which figures, because Windows users are used to Malware.
[01:07:58] <wesolows> Isn't the purpose of Windows to serve as a malware platform?
[01:08:03] <ket> Tempt: yeah, but have you ever actually seen or used solaris update? it'll be in solaris soon enough.
[01:08:13] <wesolows> That's what Stevie meant when he said Developers, Developers, Developers!
[01:08:52] <ket> dear sun; if you want to promote crap, maybe your promotions page should have current promotions on it. love, me.
[01:08:53] <Tempt> ket: I don't think there *is* a Google Adbar for anything except Windows, right?
[01:09:03] <agliodbs> tsp: because they've just chewed out a bunch of newbies who were asking technical questions
[01:09:17] <ket> Tempt: i'm sure there's one for linux, since they refuse to use anything that works there.
[01:09:46] <Tempt> ket: Good point. Reason to avoid Linux number 5932141: It may be full of Google adware.
[01:10:10] <wesolows> That seems a bit unfair
[01:10:47] <ket> wesolows: you want the other 5932140 reasons?
[01:10:59] <ket> ... sun's trade-in calc is still broken, too, i see.
[01:11:15] <ket> (nevermind that it lumps the e2900 with the v890 when it should be v490, v890, e1280..)
[01:11:24] <wesolows> I don't know; I only need one reason not to use GNU/Linux, and that's that Solaris is great and does everything I want and more.
[01:11:38] <g4lt-mordant> ket wll, if it gives me a 1:1 swap, my U60  -> a U45, I'm cool with its brokenness ;P
[01:11:53] <agliodbs> ket: but all that runs on Oracle Applications!  It should be perfect!
[01:11:57] <Tempt> Sadly, no. Sun's online trade-in calculator is a bit of a joke.
[01:12:07] <Tempt> If you trade in your E25K you can get 20% off an Ultra-20.
[01:12:08] <wesolows> s/trade-in calculator/presence/
[01:12:10] <ket> agliodbs: yes, that's why the e2900 can only be equipped with 8 cpus there!
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[01:12:24] * ket must be hallucinating about those third boards in his
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[01:12:40] <solaris_q> hello
[01:12:41] * Tempt removes those imaginary third boards to make everything better.
[01:13:07] <ket> Tempt: put them back or i neuter you with a rusty spoon. the things crawl as is. :P
[01:13:29] <Tempt> Aaah, c'mon, the 2900 is a nice little machine.
[01:13:38] <solaris_q> I did a mkisofs and burned it to cd doing the following: mkisofs -O -i myfile.iso myfile
[01:13:43] <Tempt> Performance is fine for such a little box.
[01:14:18] <solaris_q> and when i did a cdrw -M it's telling me I don't have a cd in the drive
[01:14:29] <solaris_q> what did i do wrong?
[01:14:39] <Tempt> Is there a CD in the drive?
[01:14:40] <delewis> trading in a Blade 1000 for an Ultra 20, saves me %5 -- certainly a Blade 1000 is worth more than that?
[01:14:45] <solaris_q> yes
[01:14:50] <ket> little. heh.
[01:14:51] <Tempt> Aah well, you're boned then.
[01:14:53] <solaris_q> it burned the disk just fine
[01:15:07] <Tempt> delewis: Try trading in a V890.
[01:15:10] <boyd> solaris_q: mkisofs doesn't burn, it makes the .iso file
[01:15:17] <wesolows> well, the B1000 is worth maybe $100, but since it would cost $80 to ship you'd probably get $20 for it.
[01:15:27] <solaris_q> boyd: i burned it with cdrw
[01:15:28] <wesolows> Which is actually < 5% of the price of a new U20.
[01:15:44] <solaris_q> cdrw -O -i ./myfile.iso
[01:15:54] <g4lt-mordant> delewis, it's just that anyone that trades a sparc for a U20 has to pay a 500% stupidity tax
[01:16:00] <Tempt> Do they actually pick up the equipment for trade-ins?
[01:16:03] <boyd> solaris_q: Ok, that's not what you typed above.
[01:16:06] <nachox> sun actually throws that old hardware away right?
[01:16:17] <ket> Tempt: hell no.
[01:16:22] <Tempt> That's what I thought.
[01:16:23] <delewis> nachox: they used to refurb it.
[01:16:24] <ket> nachox: nope. refurb and sell or loaner.
[01:16:31] <wesolows> g4lt-mordant: I assume you mean the other way around, right?  The U20, while not a great machine, is about 5x faster than any SPARC machine with a price tag within an order of magnitude.
[01:16:35] <delewis> and mark it back up %200.
[01:16:38] <solaris_q> boyd: sorry.  Before I did the burn I did a cdrw -M and it told me I had a blank CD in.
[01:16:46] <Tempt> I've never done machine trade-ins, but I've done CPU upgrades and shit and the net result is a shelf full of spare parts.
[01:16:52] * delewis remember seeing refurb'd Ultra 5s going for $3000 up until 2 or 3 years ago
[01:16:56] <boyd> I don't use cdrw, maybe it only reports blank cds
[01:17:02] <ket> delewis: ahahhaha original run u5's?
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[01:17:06] * ket used to have one.
[01:17:08] <Tempt> And Sun don't do much refurb really.
[01:17:16] <boyd> solaris_q: cdrecord -atip   ?
[01:17:17] * ket was only upset he did not get to set that steaming pile of shit on fire. twice. minimum.
[01:17:28] <Tempt> I know in Australia they were actually collecting trade-ins and destroying them to try to keep the ebay market down.
[01:17:30] <delewis> ket: that bad?
[01:17:53] <ket> delewis: i had the hot-to-trot at the time 333mhz i think it was, and 2 *gigs* in it. this was pre-2K
[01:17:54] <Tempt> There were 4500s going through the grinders day and night.
[01:18:02] <wesolows> delewis: Yeah, universities and such end up with outrageously expensive scientific gear that happens to attach to some custom I/O card that's supported only in one particular SPARC box.  So they're kind of over a barrel and $3k for the worst machine Sun ever made seems like a bargain compared with replacing their cyclotron.
[01:18:05] <nachox> ebay offers really cheap sunrays
[01:18:06] <delewis> ket: big money.
[01:18:14] <ket> delewis: my 486dx4/100 at home with only 256mb was running circles around it
[01:18:30] <solaris_q> I'll have to go home and see if maybe my solaris box hadn't opened my drive
[01:18:35] <solaris_q> \quit
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[01:18:39] <Tempt> They didn't bother writing IDE drivers that worked until Sol9.
[01:18:39] <ket> delewis: and the 486dx4 was even capable of booting without a keyboard, unlike the u5.
[01:18:40] <delewis> wesolows: good point.
[01:18:49] <ket> Tempt: oxymoron warning.
[01:18:58] <ket> Tempt: 'ide drivers' and 'work'
[01:19:07] <Tempt> Under Sol10 the only problem with I/O on the Ultra5 is the hardware itself.
[01:19:16] <g4lt-mordant> Tempt, rather interesting, since the U5/10 shipped with 8 on them
[01:19:25] <Tempt> Oh, the drivers were there.
[01:19:29] <Tempt> They were just crapulent.
[01:19:30] <ket> g4lt-mordant: in what world do YOU live?
[01:19:38] <ket> g4lt-mordant: 8 wasn't even OUT when the u5 went GA
[01:19:48] <Tempt> 2.6
[01:19:59] <Tempt> or was it OH NOES .. 7?
[01:20:00] <ket> Tempt: hell ours shipped 2.5.1
[01:20:06] <Tempt> Ouch.
[01:20:14] <Tempt> 2.5.1 had ide drivers?
[01:20:20] <ket> ... sort of.
[01:20:20] <Tempt> Or was there a magical install CD?>
[01:20:39] <ket> i refused to do any maintenance on them.
[01:20:40] <g4lt-mordant> tempt yes.  ask a tadpol old hand.  the sparcbook 1 and 2 both had IDE drives
[01:21:07] <Tempt> Was the performance as shocking as the Ultra-5?
[01:21:10] <ket> i had enough hell managing 250+ machines and a metric assload of mission critical apps strictly through JAVASCRIPT.
[01:21:11] <delewis> g4lt-mordant: I'm pretty sure the SPARCbooks were still SCSI at that point.
[01:21:13] <ket> not java. javaSCRIPT
[01:21:21] <delewis> the 3gx was definitely SCSI.
[01:21:35] <delewis> Tadpole didn't start shipping IDE systems until much, much later.
[01:21:50] <delewis> SPARCLE, Viper, and SPARCbook 5000 were the firsts, I think.
[01:22:03] <Tempt> Finding 2.5" SCSI disks for them is .... fun.
[01:22:29] <mritun_> 2.5" SCSI disks !!
[01:22:42] * mritun_ always thought they had 3.5"
[01:22:42] <ket> mritun_: .. uhm, yeah.
[01:22:45] <Tempt> Apple used to use them as well.
[01:22:47] <ket> nope.
[01:22:52] <mritun_> their weight gave such impression :-/
[01:22:59] <ket> hell, ibm made most of them, i think.
[01:23:05] <Tempt> Quantum
[01:23:10] <mritun_> more like luggables, imho
[01:23:14] <delewis> the IDE disks in my Tadpole aren't exactly something you want to do a whole lot of IO on, but as long as you're not doing IO, its a fine system.
[01:23:23] <ket> ... ouch. thank you for killing any desire to ever TOUCH a 3gx.
[01:23:39] <ket> quantum drives are coated in infectious failure disease. they fail, then all the drives around them fail...
[01:23:42] <delewis> 3gx is a SPARCstation 5.
[01:23:43] <Tempt> delewis: You've got a recent tadpole though.
[01:23:44] <delewis> and when I say 'is'
[01:23:47] <delewis> I mean 'is'
[01:23:56] <dos000> anyone ever tried to install sol3 on ibm xseries ? this is complete hell .. so far !
[01:24:07] <Tempt> I had a good quantum drive once.
[01:24:08] <Tempt> 50Mb.
[01:24:09] <ket> dos000: which model xseries?
[01:24:13] <Tempt> 52Mb, actually.
[01:24:14] <ket> Tempt: heh.
[01:24:21] <Tempt> It was the only Quantum product that ever worked well for me.
[01:24:28] <Tempt> Aug 17 06:04:33 taco scsi: [ID 107833 kern.notice]      Vendor: QUANTUM                            Serial Number:  ;      Q Q
[01:24:30] <dos000> ket, x336 2 with dual cpu and 2 with one cpu
[01:24:32] <Tempt> surprise!
[01:24:42] <g4lt-mordant> ket, the RDI powerbooks -- which I am more familiar with -- had IBM or quantum, depnding on size and availability
[01:24:53] <ket> dos000: .. racking brain...
[01:24:54] <bda> QQ
[01:24:55] <Tempt> I've got one of those RDI powerbooks
[01:25:05] <g4lt-mordant> wups, they also used toshibas
[01:25:11] <Tempt> Weighs a metric fuckton and crawls like a three legged dog
[01:25:14] <Tempt> on valium.
[01:25:15] * delewis recalls a certain Quantum IDE disk named 'Bigfoot'
[01:25:27] <delewis> worst. disks. *ever*.
[01:25:35] <ket> delewis: nope. not even close.
[01:25:38] <MooingLemur> I know some good three-legged dogs
[01:25:40] <g4lt-mordant> Tempt, what did you expect, they're microsparc 2s
[01:25:41] <Tempt> Nah. The IBM Deskstar won that prize.
[01:25:41] <ket> delewis: that title belongs to the wdac2500. period.
[01:25:49] <delewis> http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/8436/bigfoot15rk.jpg
[01:25:51] <ket> Tempt: nope. not even close either.
[01:26:05] <boyd> Ah, yes.. the bigfoot
[01:26:07] <delewis> ket: nope. I've had Bigfoots die consistently of head crashes in 15 minutes of operation.
[01:26:10] <ket> delewis: yours is an early one.
[01:26:11] <dos000> ket, i keep getting this  error "pcplusmp: nmi received" blogged at http://milek.blogspot.com/2007/01/solaris-10-on-ibm-ls21.html
[01:26:14] <Tempt> I never understood why vendors haven't done 5.25" or full height 3.5" disks again.
[01:26:16] <ket> delewis: it's missing the window.
[01:26:23] <delewis> ket: I had some of those, too.
[01:26:24] <Tempt> A lot easier to cram more platters in than to increase density.
[01:26:34] <g4lt-mordant> deather, the bigfoots rocked, they took hella cpace and died heat death quick, but if they were well-vntilated they were practically bulletproof
[01:26:38] <ket> dos000: i know. one sec. i gotta remember how to get around it.
[01:26:40] <Tempt> I'd swear the desktop market is ready for an 8Tb 5.25" fullheight.
[01:27:05] <boyd> Tempt: I'd buy one (<$100)
[01:27:14] <ket> dos000: set MP to 1.1 not 1.4
[01:27:15] * dos000 prays ket remembers it
[01:27:21] <g4lt-mordant> Tempt, what, MFM? ;P
[01:27:22] <Tempt> At that price bracket I'd buy 10.
[01:27:32] <dos000> ket, whats MP ?
[01:27:43] <delewis> 'PM' backwards.
[01:27:44] <ket> dos000: MP version in BIOS. also, set reboot on NMI to disable.
[01:27:51] <Tempt> With 10 you might not suffer too much from the 3600RPM
[01:28:07] <delewis> power would be an issue then, though.
[01:28:10] <ket> Tempt: ... i can do that at 7200rpm, but it's double-height.
[01:28:20] <ket> Tempt: as in double-full.
[01:28:24] <delewis> you've 'gotta get those platters spining somehow.
[01:28:25] <Tempt> Double-full?
[01:28:29] <ket> Tempt: yup
[01:28:30] <dos000> ket, there is an option to set MP in the bios ? i saw NMI .. and disabled it. I also have the latest bios 1.14
[01:28:33] <Tempt> That'd be the size of 4 CD-ROM drives.
[01:28:38] <ket> Tempt: yup
[01:28:42] <Tempt> That's huge.
[01:28:48] <ket> Tempt: it's 8 drives.
[01:29:00] <Tempt> Aah.
[01:29:01] <Tempt> Yes, well.
[01:29:04] <delewis> the old Winchester drives were about that large.
[01:29:04] <g4lt-mordant> that would like fill the drive bay of a 5150
[01:29:05] <dos000> ket, lemme go see if there is an option in the  bios called MP. what is it under ?
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[01:29:19] <Tempt> If you can supply that 8Tb of storage for under $100, I'll have 10, thankyou.
[01:29:40] <ket> dos000: that, i don't recall. :/
[01:30:01] <ket> x336 might also not do 1.1. i'm going off memory on a similar box.
[01:30:26] <g4lt-mordant> hell, even 4
[01:30:51] * g4lt-mordant can zpool
[01:31:25] <Tempt> boyd: Should have come out for a drink last night ... We stayed 'til close.
[01:32:01] <Tempt> And the fucking council is re-fucking-building some fucking drain and there is fucking heavy fucking machinery outside my fucking bedroom fucking window
[01:32:16] <wesolows> Tempt: Yellow bulldozers by any chance?
[01:32:23] <wesolows> Building a bypass?
[01:32:29] <Tempt> Aaah.
[01:32:34] <Tempt> I better go lie down in front of it.
[01:32:43] <wesolows> I'm off to the pub.
[01:32:49] <Tempt> Bastard.
[01:33:00] <wesolows> In case I have to hitch a ride on a flying saucer
[01:33:15] <ket> Tempt: you wanna borrow my keys?
[01:33:16] <dos000> ket, anything else ?
[01:33:24] <ket> dos000: should be it i think.
[01:33:31] <ket> Tempt: nothing like a huge fiber cut to stop all construction you know.
[01:33:36] * g4lt-mordant swaps wesolows's HHGTG for a book of vogon poetry, let's see if he notices
[01:33:42] <dos000> ket, what this MP 1.1 thingy ?
[01:33:43] <Tempt> Oh, this is all too much.
[01:33:46] <wesolows> arrrrrggggggghhhhh
[01:33:56] <Tempt> I'm going to stick my in-ear headphones in and drown this out.
[01:34:01] <ket> dos000: multi processor reporting setting.
[01:34:02] <Tempt> Anyone got any Xanax?
[01:34:10] <ket> dos000: makes it report the cpus in a different way, outside of acpi
[01:34:33] * Tempt tries to go back to sleep.
[01:38:09] <dos000> ket, i cant see that MP thingy
[01:39:11] <ket> dos000: okay, i'm probably remembering another x-series. :/  any acpi settings available?
[01:39:32] <dos000> ket, there is no acpi stuff in there i can see
[01:40:01] <dos000> ket, lemme go back there and see
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[01:45:25] <ket> i cannot for the life of me remember exactly what i had to do to the damned x336's to get them to not be stupid. :/
[01:45:52] <g4lt-mordant> ket: sledgehammer?
[01:46:05] <ket> g4lt-mordant: i said 'not be stupid' not 'stop pissing me the hell off.'
[01:47:25] <ket> now, the ibm blade that had it's acpi screwed up enough to take down a whole bladecenter.. that would have reached orbit if someone else hadn't beaten me there. :P
[01:48:24] <dos000> ket, there is something about hyper threading no acpi options tho
[01:48:47] <ket> dos000: turn hypethreading off.
[01:48:50] <dos000> ket, are they at least stable after that ? i see mention of people having constant reboots ?
[01:49:03] <ket> ... sort of.
[01:49:14] <ket> i am not currently being paid enough to fix it(TM)
[01:49:18] <dos000> ket, funny thing is .. the same hw works perfectly fine in debian
[01:50:02] <ket> dos000: see prior comment.. though that has more to do with linux's idea of drivers being more akin to what happens after 20 years of huffing lead-based paint.
[01:50:25] <dos000> key,heh !
[01:50:39] <dos000> key, there is also prefecth queu ?
[01:50:50] <ket> no touchy that.
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[02:04:26] <dos000> ket, looks like its a solaris bug http://bugs.opensolaris.org/view_bug.do?bug_id=6425736
[02:05:06] <dos000> ket, how can i set the /etc/system file beofre installation ?
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[02:07:05] <stevel> please tell me i didn't just paste 1915 lines into #opensolaris
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[02:09:37] <alanc> stevel: didn't see any lines from you other than stevel has quit (Remote closed the connection)
[02:09:42] <stevel> phew
[02:10:00] <stevel> i accidentally pasted the putback output (i.e. all 1915 files the ksh93 putback touched) into gaim
[02:10:03] <stevel> so i quickly pkill'd gaim
[02:10:09] <stevel> :-P
[02:10:28] <alanc> the irc server should have dumped you for flooding after the first 20 or so
[02:10:38] <stevel> 'k. i wasn't sure. that's good to know
[02:10:43] <stevel> anyway. the bridge should be back up now
[02:10:44] <dos000> anyone can explain if there is a workaround (this bug happens at install) in sol-u3  http://bugs.opensolaris.org/view_bug.do?bug_id=6425736
[02:10:55] <dos000> like i dont get it !
[02:11:53] <ket> dos000: gotta make a custom build. :/
[02:11:58] <alanc> WickedWicky was waiting for the ksh93 putback to hit mercurial earlier, I'm sure he'll appreciate that
[02:12:21] <dos000> ay !
[02:12:25] * stevel goes for coffee
[02:12:51] <dos000> ket, can you explain ? i have the us iso. i can open them and make the changes in /etc/system ?
[02:13:28] <FrostCS> though it's just as easy to toss SX on the box..  either that or wait 3 months for 07/07 to finally pop up
[02:14:49] <ket> dos000: sure. just make sure to get the boot section of the cd copied.
[02:14:49] <dos000> ket, where is the /etc/system in the installer ?
[02:15:24] <ket> dos000: that, i can't tell you, 'cause i have no idea. :/
[02:15:47] <duri> on a X4100 M2 with solaris 10 u3 and ipmitool is it possible to configure the ILOM through the in-band connection provided by ipmitool (much like scadm in the older ALOM) ?
[02:16:17] <duri> i have a shell in the box but I need to console to reinstall it
[02:16:35] <dos000> ket, do you know if i need to recompile ? i have the sol-us build. I cant tell  from the bug if snv_40 is after or before sol-u3
[02:16:47] <dos000> ket, sol-u3
[02:18:20] <dos000> acttually it says its fixed in snv_44 .. but the fix does not say if it involves code changes or just /etc/system file changes
[02:18:35] <jbk> how far back does the mercurial history go for ON?
[02:18:40] <richlowe> back to launch.
[02:19:04] <jbk> ok, so is there an easy way to relate changesets to copies used for SXCE builds?
[02:19:20] <jbk> for example, to see 'foo.c' as it was when b64 was built
[02:19:37] <richlowe> the way the snapshots are exposed to us is kinda sucky, but yeah, in theory.
[02:19:40] <FrostCS> dos000, that's easy to figure out, if you look at the date on the Solaris 10 U3 release, and the date on the fix, you can easily figure it out.
[02:20:03] <richlowe> jbk: and, beyond that, onnv_64a is one I don't think you can get.
[02:20:09] <richlowe> though I think it could be done *now*, if someone were to do it.
[02:20:18] * richlowe spits bile at the people responsible for SX:DE
[02:20:19] <jbk> i'm just curious, cause i'm on b62, want to dink with some driver stuff
[02:20:22] <richlowe> and dmarker, in specific. ;)
[02:20:30] <ket> dos000: i really have no idea there. :/
[02:20:39] <jbk> but want to know if anything relevant's changed
[02:21:07] <jbk> my dvd drive is busted, and i'm waiting until some bills are paid off to worry about fixing it (it's on my laptop, and I have no monitor for my desktop atm)
[02:21:18] <FrostCS> dos000, this for work? or personal use?
[02:21:29] <dos000> FrostCS, work
[02:21:56] <FrostCS> dos000, ring up support and bitch at them
[02:21:57] <dos000> FrostCS, isnt there a build page that has links to releases and builds correlations ?
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[02:22:05] <ket> FrostCS: opensolaris == unsupported(TM)
[02:22:08] <dos000> FrostCS, support from ibm suck
[02:22:18] <FrostCS> dos000, Solaris 10u3 is old
[02:22:21] <ket> FrostCS: which also increasingly applies to solaris...
[02:22:29] <FrostCS> oh, you don't have a Sun Support contract?
[02:22:38] <dos000> FrostCS, thats what is available from the solaris download site
[02:22:44] <FrostCS> just install SXCE on the box then
[02:23:03] <dos000> so sxce has snv_44 in it ?
[02:23:37] <FrostCS> sxce is at 69 currently
[02:23:53] <FrostCS> months months newer then snv_44
[02:23:58] <FrostCS> of course it would be included
[02:24:35] <FrostCS> if you aren't going to deal with support, you might as well grab SXCE which will include all bug fixes up until 3 weeks ago
[02:26:12] <dos000> very nice ...
[02:26:37] <FrostCS> only community support, though, so if you have a problem, you come in here, or you use the mailing list
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[02:26:55] <FrostCS> which is leagues better then any support you'd get from IBM on solaris..
[02:27:07] <dos000> FrostCS, can you pray tell where is the correlation between sxce and snv_* pages ?
[02:27:29] <dos000> FrostCS, like a build page or something
[02:27:57] <FrostCS> snv_* is the build number for SXCE editions
[02:28:06] <FrostCS> so SXCE 44 would have been snv_44
[02:28:25] <FrostCS> let me grab you a link..
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[02:29:43] <palowoda> A build schedule if your interested: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/on/onnv_schedule.txt
[02:30:04] <FrostCS> thanks palowoda, hehe
[02:30:23] <FrostCS> and you can see the flag days and integration history on these pages.. http://opensolaris.org/os/community/on/flag-days/66-70/
[02:30:44] <FrostCS> you can also get SXCE from http://opensolaris.org/sxce_dvd
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[02:32:17] <palowoda> And if you use the bug database and search on the term "snv_69" in the Text Search field you will get all the bugs for that build.
[02:33:07] <ket> okay, can someone PLEASE look at why the hell zones apparently have to be under project for non-root users to have an FD limit >1024? >:(
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[02:47:41] <dos000_> i just lost the converstaion !
[02:48:23] <dos000_> i am now downloading sxe64a
[02:50:12] * dos000_ just got disconnected at the worng moment .. anyone has a link to the logs on this channel ?
[02:50:24] <alanc> http://www.uwyn.com/drone/log/bevinbot/opensolaris
[02:50:38] <alanc> should be in the auto-sent welcome message when you join the channel
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[03:00:53] <CIA-21> chin: 6437624 RFE: Add ksh93 (as /usr/bin/ksh93) and libshell.so to OS/Net, 6505835 AST tools and library (libpp) required for creating l10n messages for ksh93, PSARC/2006/550 Korn Shell 93 Integration, PSARC/2006/587 /etc/ksh.kshrc for ksh93, PSARC/2007/035 ksh93 Amendments, Contributed by Roland Mainz <roland.mainz at nrubsig dot org>
[03:01:06] <wesolows> took long enough
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[03:02:34] <gisburn> CIA-21: you're slow as molasses. As usual...
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[03:08:06] <FrostCS> shh, he's on his weekend already
[03:11:33] <stevel> wesolows: it took a while because the bridge was down
[03:11:39] <stevel> (i mean beyond its usual delay)
[03:12:02] <stevel> i only just pushed it an hour ago - and i think CIA batches things up before posting
[03:12:13] <jbk> hmm this is a strange one: ld [0xffffff98], %i2, i'm guessing ld [-0x68], %i2 might be confusing..
[03:12:18] <stevel> (causing posting real-time to IRC is hugely bandwidth consuming you know... :-P)
[03:12:22] <gisburn> stevel: why did the bridge went down ? putback too large ?
[03:12:45] <richlowe> gisburn: Nah, size doesn't matter.
[03:12:46] <gisburn> stevel: (AFAIK >=12MB patch)
[03:12:50] <stevel> the resurrection of a file from deleted_files caused the old filename path to appear in the commit line so 'hg commit' barfed
[03:12:57] <jbk> of course i think that might be constant data, not instructions
[03:13:10] <stevel> richlowe: is that what she's been telling you? ;)
[03:13:11] <wesolows> very likely
[03:13:16] <gisburn> stevel: sum.c ?
[03:13:20] <stevel> gisburn: yeah
[03:13:23] <richlowe> stevel: too obvious, man.
[03:13:24] <gisburn> groan
[03:13:30] <stevel> richlowe: you walked into it. come on..
[03:13:37] <gisburn> stevel: I feared that this thing may bite back somehow...
[03:13:54] <wesolows> gisburn: for once something is not your fault
[03:14:07] <gisburn> stevel: ... the problem is always to anticipate the "how" ... ;-/
[03:16:55] <gisburn> stevel: BTW: does the bridge support unicode filenames ?
[03:17:00] <richlowe> don't even try.
[03:17:11] <gisburn> why ?
[03:17:31] <wesolows> I'm sure it breaks teamware anyway
[03:18:54] <gisburn> wesolows: does teamware look into scripts somehow ?
[03:19:27] <richlowe> no, think of it as sccs+s-file merge+cp
[03:19:29] <wesolows> into them?  I doubt it
[03:19:33] <gisburn> wesolows: ok
[03:19:36] <richlowe> (there's more, but it's a convenient way to view it)
[03:19:47] <wesolows> except that SCCS does, for keyword expansion
[03:20:04] <wesolows> I don't know how the nametable hashing thing works
[03:20:15] <gisburn> wesolows: since ksh93 now supports non-ASCII function and variable names I was thinking about asking the japanese community to translate one of the scripts, inclduing function/variable names.
[03:20:36] <wesolows> Why?  No one should actually write code that way.
[03:20:39] <stevel> just cause you can do something, doesn't mean you should
[03:21:02] <gisburn> wesolows: erm
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[03:21:43] <gisburn> wesolows: my point is more we shouldn't have such restrictions. take a look at the comiler folks and why they added certain options to allow C code to include japanese charatcers
[03:22:20] <wesolows> Should the ATCS also allow speaking arbitrary languages?
[03:22:29] <gisburn> ATCS ?
[03:22:30] <stevel> ugh. it's too late in the week for this argument for me
[03:22:33] <stevel> g'night folks
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[03:22:51] <wesolows> I guess I can sort of see the desire to put things in comments, as examples of some text that's to be processed, etc.
[03:22:54] <sommerfeld> air traffic control system
[03:22:58] <wesolows> But variable and function names?  Madness.
[03:23:05] <gisburn> wesolows: for example during my training as "ITA" our teacher insisted to write pascal with german function names.
[03:23:36] <richlowe> spell the umlauts out as dipthongs.
[03:23:48] <gisburn> wesolows: just see it that way: The japanese/chinese people are VERY picky about their languages. Maybe we can make them a bit more happy.
[03:23:57] <wesolows> There's a reason the C locale is called C.
[03:24:05] <gisburn> wesolows: it doesn't mean to swamp OS/Net with that.
[03:24:10] <wesolows> Yes, I understand their attachment to their languages.
[03:24:22] <gisburn> wesolows: I only want one _demo_ written that way.
[03:24:57] <richlowe> I tried it once with ruby
[03:24:58] <wesolows> Frankly, while I respect their desire to retain tradition and the beauty of those languages, I don't believe they're well suited to communication in an electronic age.  They'd probably be better off without them.
[03:25:03] <richlowe> it didn't quite work, becuase of its demands on case
[03:25:12] <FrostCS> I think I chop japanese, chinese, and korean up enough as it is.. I'd hate for them to have to see my bad grammar all the time in their own language.. let alone english :-P
[03:25:15] <richlowe> and it doesn't view, whatever charset I chose as having 'uppercase' and 'lowercase'
[03:25:24] <richlowe> but it looked a whole lot like gibberish.
[03:25:31] <richlowe> (though mainly because I just picked random characters, I guess...)
[03:25:44] <gisburn> wesolows: erm
[03:26:04] <wesolows> I suppose I should clarify - the language is not so important as the character set.
[03:26:07] <gisburn> wesolows: I only want to do one demo that way. I didn't say I want to translate OS/Net into japanese... ;-/
[03:26:08] <FrostCS> well, I do disagree with some facts.. not everyone has a chance, or the ability to learn english.
[03:26:35] <wesolows> FrostCS: Yes, hence my clarification.
[03:26:42] <gisburn> wesolows: as a side-note: It is now possibe to write one-liners on the shell prompt using japanese chars, too.
[03:26:58] <richlowe> and I doubt it's much more helpful, as code.
[03:27:09] <wesolows> But the point stands - by continuing to use a language with an extremely large, rich character set, they're doing themselves an economic disservice.
[03:27:34] <wesolows> If you want proof, consider the amount of time Japanese children spend learning Kanji.
[03:27:43] <gisburn> wesolows: I am not sure. And I don't even think about to judge about this.
[03:27:50] <Tempt> 7 bits should be enough for anyone ;)
[03:27:51] <wesolows> That time could be better spent learning skills that more directly translate to the ability to add value to products and services.
[03:28:10] <wesolows> Anyway, I guess it's reasonable to demo this, and having multibyte characters in files shouldn't harm teamware.
[03:28:38] <FrostCS> actually most children today don't spend enough time learning kanji..
[03:28:52] <FrostCS> the majority of students can't even read a newspaper...
[03:29:06] <wesolows> It seems that economics is winning, then.
[03:29:19] <FrostCS> or western influences are setting in..
[03:29:32] <FrostCS> in other words laziness. heh
[03:30:00] <wesolows> Perhaps it would be helpful to find a way to express Japanese in latin-1
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[03:31:04] <sommerfeld> wesolows: the commuter train system around tokyo/yokohama displays each stop name three different ways.  kanji for adults.  hiragana for kids and people learning japanese.  and the roman alphabet, for ignorant furriners like me.
[03:31:08] <tsp> Tempt: 7 bits? try standard 6 dot (6 bit) braille
[03:31:11] <tsp> lol
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[03:31:45] <wesolows> sommerfeld: I noticed that, but I also noticed that the maps on the walls did not contain any roman characters.
[03:31:57] <sommerfeld> augh.  fat fingers
[03:32:00] <sommerfeld> that's variable.
[03:32:59] <FrostCS> in the cities there is much romaji .. once you leave them it's less likely to see them..
[03:33:02] <sommerfeld> they apparently put a lot into improving signage around the time of the world cup
[03:33:19] <sommerfeld> so proximity to a stadium probably has something to do with it as well.
[03:34:22] <sommerfeld> when I got back to boston, i realized that the public address announcements in the japanese subways were far more useful to me as a rider than the equivalent announcements in the boston system.
[03:36:12] <FrostCS> Japanese announcements is still leagues above Korea's.. where you have to keep your eyes out the window to see the station signs to know where you are..
[03:36:16] <wesolows> Then there are the subway announcements in the SF system..."2-car L .. K in .. 6 minutes"
[03:36:55] <wesolows> when the train arrives, it's actually an N and the only thing you hear is "N N outbound"
[03:36:58] <FrostCS> in how many languages?
[03:37:04] <FrostCS> or just English and Spanish?
[03:37:05] <wesolows> English, if you're lucky.
[03:37:11] <Tempt> http://mexico.purplecow.org/tmp/CityRail
[03:37:21] <wesolows> No Spanish, no Vietnamese, no Mandarin.
[03:37:38] <wesolows> But it's ok, because even for English speakers the announcements are useless and/or wrong.
[03:37:43] <FrostCS> no spanish? but isn't the US a bilingual country?
[03:37:52] <wesolows> San Francisco certainly is a multilingual place.
[03:38:29] <hile_> FrostCS, not anywhere that has sense, it's not.
[03:38:31] <wesolows> I don't know about the US.  It's filled with barbarians and I'm afraid to leave my City.
[03:39:01] <FrostCS> If spanish had a unicode written language I wouldn't be able to buy anything at the hardware stores..
[03:39:55] <sommerfeld> FrostCS: no, that's canada.
[03:41:16] <sommerfeld> was amused to see that the vancouver airport was bilingual english/french, while the neighborhoods between the airport and downtown were bilingual english/chinese with no sign of any french.
[03:41:18] <FrostCS> I could have sworn you needed to know Spanish to get your lawn mowed...
[03:42:05] <FrostCS> Vancouver and Toronto are famous for authentic Chinese..
[03:43:20] <FrostCS> Might even say more so then Hong Kong..
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[04:00:23] <gisburn> GmanAFK: ping!
[04:06:57] <brendang> ksh93 - cool. so... has hell frozen over enough to get dtksh fixed as well? ;)
[04:09:14] <gisburn> brendang: honestly... I don't know. And right now we first need to cleanup after this putback (Apri&&gk are on it) and them do the next two updates before I start thinking about dtksh
[04:09:24] <richlowe> brendang: it's part of CDE, find someone who can change CDE and has a masochistic streak.
[04:09:28] <gisburn> s/them/then/
[04:09:57] <gisburn> richlowe: updating the ksh93 parts of dtksh can't be hard, AFAIK both HP and IBM did it long ago.
[04:10:33] <richlowe> gisburn: alanc is full of horror stories about the dtksh build.
[04:10:57] <delewis> gisburn: IBM.. nope
[04:11:03] <delewis> $ echo ${.sh.version}
[04:11:03] <delewis> Version M-12/28/93
[04:11:08] <delewis> that's dtksh on AIX 5.3
[04:11:23] <gisburn> delewis: erm, carefully.
[04:11:36] <gisburn> delewis: the version number may be the same.
[04:12:22] <gisburn> delewis: long ago it came from the build system, e.g. if someone only updates the sources and not the #define for the version it will stay the same.
[04:12:29] <delewis> /usr/bin/ksh93 on AIX is still 93e
[04:12:35] <gisburn> groan
[04:12:38] <delewis> (I doubt dtksh is any newer)
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[04:12:48] <richlowe> gisburn: time for you to go yell at IBM! :)
[04:12:58] <delewis> they're still shipping ksh88 as /usr/bin/ksh
[04:13:02] <gisburn> delewis: do you have any idea how this would be changed.
[04:13:07] <gisburn> er
[04:13:13] <gisburn> updating AIX's ksh93 ?
[04:13:16] <delewis> whine to your IBM sales rep. :-)
[04:13:25] <delewis> (if you don't have a sales rep, tough)
[04:13:36] <delewis> welcome to the world of IBM!
[04:13:43] <jbk> good luck :)
[04:15:21] <delewis> least they're shipping ksh88 as /bin/sh
[04:15:26] <delewis> $ /bin/sh
[04:15:27] <delewis> $ set -o gmacs
[04:15:27] <delewis> $ Version M-11/16/88f
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[04:17:16] * gisburn rescues it
[04:23:19] <phus> bash4life
[04:25:23] <gisburn> phus: ?!
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[04:37:30] <brendang> man bash
[04:37:31] <brendang> [...]
[04:37:34] <brendang> BUGS
[04:37:35] <brendang>      It's too big and too slow.
[04:38:11] <brendang> ksh93 might be slow too - need to do some benchmarking
[04:38:38] <richlowe> brendang: it's the 4th down that's more annoying
[04:38:48] <richlowe> 5th, rather.
[04:39:10] <brendang> richlowe: ahh, yes
[04:40:48] <delewis> brendang: not from my experience.
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[04:41:27] <brendang> delewis: I think it has been improved in recent years - that man page comment was probably written about 10 years ago
[04:41:48] <brendang> delewis: need to test and see....
[04:41:51] <delewis> I was telling roland earlier that I recently converted a colleague's cgi-scripts (which were using /usr/bin/bash -- something quick and dirty) to ksh93, and just by changing #!/usr/bin/bash to #!/usr/bin/ksh93, I saw a 20%-30% performance improvement. This was without eliminating his nasty habit of not using builtins, even.
[04:42:04] <delewis> this was bash-3.2 vs. ksh93s
[04:42:36] <brendang> delewis: cool. I can't wait to have DTrace probes in these shells to see why
[04:42:54] <delewis> my guess would be bash forks() even on builtins
[04:44:20] <brendang> delewis: on builtins? that would be crazy
[04:45:04] <gisburn> a bigger problem is |fork()| for subshells
[04:45:24] <richlowe> brendang: with ustack helpers!
[04:46:44] <brendang> bash doesn't seem to fork on builtins I've tried so far... dtrace -n 'syscall::fork*:entry /pid == $target/ {;}' -c bash
[04:48:54] <sommerfeld> forking for builtins would make implementing "cd" very interesting.
[04:50:08] <Tempt> Aah, man, what is this? The anti-bash society?
[04:51:12] <brendang> alias bash='bash -c "kill $$"'
[04:51:26] <Tempt> bash bashing.
[04:51:48] <brendang> alias ksh=/usr/bin/ksh93
[04:52:11] <brendang> echo "bash is bad" >> /etc/motd
[04:52:20] <brendang> chmod 444 /usr/bin/bash
[04:52:36] <brendang> mv /usr/bin/bash /usr/bin/bash_is_bad_dont_use_it
[04:52:45] <Tempt> I bet you're on of those people who "set -o vi"
[04:52:47] <brendang> :) ok, I'll stop now
[04:53:04] <brendang> no, I leave emacs mode on
[04:53:20] <Tempt> I really don't like vi-style editing for a shell.
[04:53:33] <brendang> echo "you are allowed to login if you don't use bash" >> /etc/issue
[04:53:40] <brendang> ok, now I've stopped! :)
[04:53:49] <richlowe> brendang: needs a pam module to go with it...
[04:54:08] <brendang> richlowe: exactly!
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[04:55:07] <brendang> other auth required pam_allow_shell.so.1 ksh ksh93
[04:55:27] <brendang> (a pam module which takes args)
[04:56:49] <Tempt> lolpam
[04:56:52] <gisburn> erm
[04:56:58] <Tempt> Prompts with CAN HAS PASSWORD?
[04:57:03] <gisburn> pam bindings for ksh93 would be nice... :-)
[04:57:04] <Tempt> logins fail with OH NOES
[04:57:22] <brendang> Tempt: LOL
[04:57:41] <brendang> Tempt: I sense a localisation opportunity for Solaris
[04:58:19] <Tempt> Indeed.
[04:58:30] <Tempt> And I know exactly who needs it deployed on their machines.
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[05:01:36] <dos000_> is there a way one could download solaris sxce via wget ? i keep getting this accept licence page .
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[05:03:43] <gisburn> where should a pam_shell proposal go to ? networking-discuss@ ?
[05:04:42] <brendang> gisburn: what would a pam_shell do?
[05:05:34] <sommerfeld> dynamically select a shell based on intersecting user preferences with what's available?
[05:05:51] <gisburn> brendang: it would provide shell bindings for PAM, e.g. PAM shell would invoke a defined shell script with all PAM parameters and the script could then set/get PAM attrobutes etc. ... like a normal PAM module written in native code
[05:06:16] <gisburn> sommerfeld: some kind of PAM bindings for the shell, e.g. you wouldn't have to write the PAM stuff in native code anymore
[05:07:05] <sommerfeld> i think i'd rather write that sort of thing in python or perl
[05:07:13] <gisburn> sommerfeld: why ?
[05:07:46] <sommerfeld> well, for one, python is a better language than ksh
[05:08:01] <richlowe> them's fightin' words.
[05:08:28] <richlowe> (I'm never certain if "them's" would take an apostrophe, in that appalachian kinda phrasing)
[05:08:35] <richlowe> I assume it's "Them is"... but then my mind rebels.
[05:08:48] <gisburn> sommerfeld: agreed. but the shell is what glues Unix together.
[05:08:49] <Red_Cloud> I am customizing my /etc/profile and would like all of you gurus advice to tweak the syntax.  I am not much of a geek and need your help.
[05:08:53] <gisburn> and it#s easier.
[05:09:08] <Red_Cloud> here is the pastbin: http://pastebin.com/d53519f05
[05:11:06] <FrostCS> dos000_ you have to accept license first, accept it as mickey mouse if you need.
[05:12:16] <dos000_> FrostCS, so no cmd line way of getting then ?
[05:12:19] <richlowe> anyone who says "The shell is what glues unix together" needs to read the haters handbook again. :)
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[05:15:59] <Red_Cloud> richlowe I had my user account disables just a while ago because of the syntax within the /etc/profile.  Moved some things around a bit and could again log into the user account.  So I KNOW that what I have conjured is very most probably not correct.  Would appreciate advice. and suggestions.
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[05:24:24] <FrostCS> dos000_, sxce is a free product from sun, which contains some proprietary code, so.. I don't think there is a cmd line way of getting it.
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[05:33:27] <gisburn> richlowe: just curious: where there any commits this year larger than 12MB ?
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[06:04:33] <jbk> hmm.. i think i'm getting really close... i just need to make a few more improvements on my compare script...
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[06:22:59] <jbk> hmm.. i'm wondering about putting together a presentation -- more or less about 'quick & cheap test farm' demonstrating using zfs + xen and a few other projects that haven't integrated yet (the idea being to demonstrate some of stuff 'coming soon' and how it could practically be used to do things better than today)
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[06:26:16] <jbk> hello
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[06:27:58] <richlowe> jbk: at this rate, you may even beat the real test farm :)
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[06:30:44] <jbk> i was just thinking w/ a cpu w/ hw virt. support + xen, you can do solaris for dom0, solaris,linux,freebsd, windows for domU, all sitting on zvols (so can do things like golden image + clone to quickly create another instance), then use the virtual network stuff to connect them together in whatever topology makes sense, and can also use iscsi (on zfs) to add storage (or to simulate remote storage for active/passive clusters), as well as share out zf
[06:30:51] <jbk> all from the same box :)
[06:31:38] <jbk> and all fairly simple to setup (ignoring OS-specific installation bits; not much solaris can do about that)
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[06:35:35] <sommerfeld> now we just need the xen folks to do what nrubsig did today
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[06:41:02] * tsp feels like he's on his old 486 again with this performance :)
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[06:41:50] <jbk> well as i said, it's more to preview upcoming bits at this point
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[06:46:37] <jbk> as it'd also need the zfs + cifs server integration and the virtual switch(?) project (to do fancy connectivity between the domains)
[06:48:47] <palowoda> Hell, zfs boot would be about the next biggest thing in opensolaris.
[06:49:15] <jbk> the idea being that with zfs + some of the network virtualization, managing domains is very quick, simple, and easy
[06:49:28] <richlowe> palowoda: zfsboot is there, just not any kind of easy method to set it up...
[06:49:33] <richlowe> (and not on sparc)
[06:49:49] <jbk> if you have a patched cd/dvd, it's not bad as long as you're not scared of a small text file
[06:50:00] <palowoda> I'm talking about zfs boot in scxe as a standard on both platforms.
[06:50:32] <jbk> i'm using it right now, it rules :)
[06:50:43] <palowoda> It's much more important than xen.
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[06:51:14] <jbk> well
[06:51:23] <palowoda> Sun doesn't even know how to support xen.
[06:51:24] <jbk> i suspect there's not much (if any) overlap between the two teams
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[06:53:39] <sponix> jamesd : good news, eventually I might have a Net service without DL MB Limitations *Grin*
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[06:57:16] <GmanAFK> gisburn, pong
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[06:57:32] <richlowe> Hey Gman.
[06:57:45] * gisburn wakes up
[06:58:34] <sponix> Anyone good with Basic Networking issues ?
[06:58:57] <Gman> hey richlowe
[07:00:19] <CIA-21> sjelinek: 6589797 Unable to install a x86 machine with 256/384/512 MB memory using the Console Session, 6590352 x86.miniroot size is too large for PXE tftp transfers. Causing intermittent boot failures.
[07:00:45] <palowoda> heh that one is funny.
[07:02:08] <jbk> though i know for a few builds there were issues w/ zfs root
[07:02:12] <jbk> did those ever get fixed?
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[07:03:29] <palowoda> jbk: zfsboot is not going anywhere until the sparc PSARC cases get for zfs get integrated.  It's just not important until than.
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[07:06:14] <palowoda> jbk: You have to have both platforms on parity you know.
[07:06:36] <palowoda> Err well excluding Xorg thingy.
[07:08:07] <sponix> OK, I am using a dd-wrt flashed router as a _client_ to a wireless AP (Net Service). So, its is functioning as a router to me on bfe0. If I can: ping my router, ISP's router, ISP's DNS server, and resolve DNS through my router or the ISP's dns server... Does that mean my issue is probably still my routing table? Since I can do all this, but still not _surf_ (cannot ping outside IP's that I can resolve through DNS)
[07:09:58] <jbk> netstat -rn should show one entry 'default' with a gateway that's the same ip as your router
[07:10:11] <sommerfeld> pinging ISP's DNS server but not random other hosts seems .. odd
[07:10:34] <sommerfeld> does the dd-wrt router know it's hooked up backwards?
[07:10:35] <sponix> jbk: it _did_ have exactly that
[07:10:36] <jbk> try pinging well known website
[07:10:39] <jbk> like www.yahoo.com
[07:10:54] <jbk> if that works, it's probably something dropping the packets for other stuff
[07:11:33] <palowoda> and /etc/nsswitch.conf (configured for dns) and /etc/resolv.conf are setup proper too.
[07:11:38] <sommerfeld> (or, knows that it's hooked up as a wired->wireless bridge rather than as a router)
[07:11:42] <sponix> jbk: it wouldn't (yahoo.com google.com freebsd.org netbsd.org) would resolve all through dns, from my router, or the ISP's dns, but no other traffic
[07:11:58] <jbk> but from your box
[07:12:05] <jbk> can you ping them from your solaris system?
[07:12:20] <sponix> palowoda: resolv.conf had search server.net and then 192.168.1.10 (my router)
[07:12:37] <sommerfeld> is it possible that the dd-wrt router has some sort of firewall/packet filtering intended to protect the "inside" from your host?
[07:12:57] <jbk> that's what i'm thinking
[07:13:18] <sponix> palowoda: whats the proper nsswitch.conf entery hosts = files,dns ?
[07:13:26] <palowoda> yep.
[07:13:33] <sponix> yeah, tried that
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[07:13:50] <palowoda> back to what sommerfeld suggested.
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[07:14:20] <sponix> I got frustrated, and blew away my install atm.. and my account is under 1.5Meg before it gets cut off anyway
[07:14:37] <sponix> I plan to reinstall tomorrow though, and dual boot, so I can trouble shoot more
[07:15:56] <sponix> jbk: see, here is the issue with ping... ISP blocks traffic until you login to its hotspot webpage
[07:15:56] <palowoda> Shesh you get cutoff premature before you can do anything with your system.  Sounds a little lame.
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[07:16:32] <sponix> so, since it resolves the page, but then doesn't receive the traffic, I can't even test the router to ping an outside source
[07:17:01] <palowoda> Sounds like you need some real network access.
[07:17:08] <richlowe> sommerfeld: are you still working on the nightly changes you showed me, I guess maybe 3 weeks ago?
[07:17:09] <sponix> odd part, I can't even load the login page of the ISP by IP, it attempts to resolve, and load by URL name, and then fails to load as well
[07:17:48] <sponix> palowoda: no doubts there... In Iraq, as a Soldier I am limited to working with garbage
[07:18:04] <sponix> palowoda: just feel lucky to have Net at all, even if its half-assed
[07:18:05] <palowoda> Now that explains some things.
[07:18:15] <sommerfeld> richlowe: was backburnered when I discovered an alternate path to the solution that didn't involve hacking nightly
[07:18:58] <richlowe> foo
[07:19:13] <richlowe> I was hoping to use the extra bits to pull down closed-bins. :)
[07:19:16] <sommerfeld> heh
[07:19:34] <palowoda> sponix: I'm guessing at this but it sounds like it's at the ISP end and what sommerfeld suggested holds true.
[07:20:24] <sponix> palowoda: Just seems odd, I am using the same settings afaik on this Linux install right now to chat with you
[07:20:49] <sponix> palowoda: nsswitch.conf resolv.conf netstat -rn ... (netstat is a bit diff looking) all the same
[07:21:10] <sommerfeld> richlowe: as far as I could tell I had it working; just needed to do a hair more testing and get it code-reviewed.
[07:21:53] <sponix> palowoda: and I know its possible, and feel like its a routing issue on my part... I _had_ it surfing for at least a few minutes when I did dhcp to my router (pulled IP lease from it instead of static)
[07:22:34] <sponix> palowoda: but recently when I try dhcp it seems to hose up my /etc/hosts entries with garbage, heck cde doesn't even want to login it corrupts the hosts file so bad (have to revert from a backup)
[07:23:32] <sponix> _soon_ I'll get SXDE n55 put back on and I'll get a copy off all my config files so I can put them on pastebin for everyone to poke fun at ;)
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[07:23:48] <sponix> it has to be something simple I've either overlooked or hosed up
[07:24:19] <palowoda> sponix: Is it difficult to get scxe build 69 where your at?
[07:24:48] <sponix> palowoda sommerfeld: Thanks for discussing the matter though, I hope to bring more information next round
[07:25:05] <sponix> palowoda: Yeah, mail travel is 3weeks to a month, and my wife is slow to ship DVD's
[07:25:20] <palowoda> That's what I wanted to know.
[07:25:23] <sponix> From what I can tell, Sun doesn't want to ship their Free DVD's to me here
[07:25:54] <palowoda> Oh it's the location that is probably causing the problem.
[07:26:04] <sommerfeld> sponix: using an APO address, or what?
[07:26:05] <sponix> I enjoy staying current, but my BW Limit is 1G down per _week_ here ATM
[07:26:18] <sponix> sommerfeld: yes, will they ship APO ?
[07:26:22] <sponix> to Iraq ?
[07:26:52] <sponix> right now, I wait on them to ship home (2-3weeks), then another Month for the wife to get it here
[07:27:29] <palowoda> sponix: Most likely the only route you can take.
[07:27:34] <sponix> Oh... n55 didn't want to create a zone for me btw, straight from a example PDF, it errored out
[07:27:49] <sommerfeld> probably not the "official" route but there are always unofficial ones.
[07:28:03] <palowoda> sponix: You have to get your wife to download the latest scxe, burn it and ship it.
[07:28:14] <sponix> palowoda: I enjoy learning Solaris either way
[07:28:24] <sponix> palowoda: true, if she wasn't retarded, I would
[07:30:34] <palowoda> sponix: Well as it turns out Solaris isn't the greatest problem for most.  :)
[07:31:41] <sponix> palowoda: she has managed to hose 3 Linux boxen (ubuntu) since I left. Knocked them all off the net, and some don't even boot
[07:32:09] <jbk> heh
[07:32:19] <palowoda> sponix: I know you can't wait back to fix everything.
[07:32:25] <jbk> zfs root + limited admin privs (if at all) :)
[07:34:14] <jbk> sommerfeld: i don't suppose you know off the top of your head any libs or binaries that use any VIS instructions?
[07:34:51] <sponix> palowoda: She has destroyed my Finances (wiped both bank accounts), and my Computers ... She is in the doghouse, to say the least
[07:35:04] <sommerfeld> I have this vague recollection that the optimised sun4u SHA1 code uses VIS
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[07:36:03] <jbk> ok.. just want to be sure i've run the disassembler against some of that stuff..
[07:36:09] <sommerfeld> try /platform/sun4u/kernel/crypto/sparcv9/sha1
[07:36:22] <jbk> it's getting really close
[07:36:37] <richlowe> the various lib*_psr stuff maybe useful to you, too
[07:36:57] <sponix> Thanks for everything guys. I had better get logged off for now. Don't want to wait that last 2K of DL I have *Grin*
[07:37:14] <palowoda> sponix: ltr.
[07:37:35] <richlowe> sommerfeld: doesn't Olypmus-C have some extra magic that would need to be handled? (going from putback logs...)
[07:37:44] <richlowe> though no doubt the log for the sparc libdisasm would be more informative.
[07:37:54] <sommerfeld> you mean new instructions?  maybe.
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[07:38:17] <sommerfeld> i think there was some weird Fuji-specific multiply-add instructions
[07:38:30] <jbk> sommerfeld: so it does..
[07:38:38] <jbk> (sha1)
[07:38:49] <jbk> now to see if my code or the existing dis is wrong :)
[07:39:08] <richlowe> sommerfeld: I'm looking at a log message that added hwcap flags related to that proc.
[07:39:26] <gisburn> sommerfeld: unfused multiply add
[07:39:55] <richlowe> 6471600 fmaf and popc hwcap flags for OPL Olympus-C
[07:42:25] <sommerfeld> i see no evidence the closed-source disassembler supports the new OPL instructions
[07:43:37] <jbk> if someone can point me to the info on them, it should be trivial to add support
[07:43:44] <richlowe> jbk: looking for it now.
[07:43:56] <richlowe> jbk: www.fujitsu.com/downloads/SPARCE/sparc64vi-extensions.pdf, probably
[07:44:08] <jbk> it'd be really nice if the closed source actually dealt with the floating point registers correctly
[07:44:50] <richlowe> assuming I'm not entirely wrong in thinking there are extra bits.
[07:46:07] <palowoda> Is Fujitusu into OpenSolaris?
[07:46:44] <palowoda> Fujitsu
[07:47:17] * Gman would imagine so
[07:47:20] <Gman> at least on the fringes
[07:47:52] <palowoda> I just thought Fujitsu was more like a proprietary company.
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[07:48:23] <jbk> yeah, wouldn't take too long to add support for all of those
[07:48:42] <jbk> though i guess the question is, is there demand for it?
[07:48:53] <jbk> as I wonder if that might require a new instruction set flag
[07:51:03] <richlowe> jbk: I'm not sure, on either count.
[07:51:36] <richlowe> you'd think if there was much demand, there'd have been a related change to the existing dis.
[07:51:45] <richlowe> but I'm not sure I'm *that* confident in that
[07:51:52] <jbk> true
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[07:52:32] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stevel
[07:52:33] <Shiv__> fujitsu-siemens (http://www.fujitsu.com/global/services/computing/server) is into server grade solutions
[07:52:38] *** stevel changes topic to "Latest SXCE 70 | Latest ON 71 | Starter kits: http://get.opensolaris.org"
[07:52:43] <stevel> SXCE 70 is out
[07:52:57] <Shiv__> May not be specifically into OpenSolaris
[07:52:58] <jbk> cool..
[07:53:08] <Gman> hey stevel
[07:53:18] <stevel> 'evening glynn
[07:53:30] <jbk> i don't suppose i can just pkgadd -R the pacakges (in order) into an empty filesystem + setup boot block and have it work? :)
[07:53:32] <Gman> stevel, bought a flow board and bindings today :)
[07:53:41] <jbk> since i have a non-functional dvd drive at the moment
[07:53:42] <Shiv__> B70 is expected to have a SXDE also. Right ?
[07:53:43] <palowoda> Ok so who from Fujitsu or Siemens has been interested in Opensolaris?
[07:53:50] <richlowe> jbk: yes.
[07:54:04] <richlowe> jbk: 6193412 Support for new Olympus B/C instructions needed in dissassemblers
[07:54:12] <jbk> ahh
[07:54:17] <Gman> palowoda, i could have been making shit up
[07:54:18] <stevel> gman: nice :) i'm so jealous you have winter
[07:54:43] <stevel> shiv__: SXDE is expected to be based off of a snv_70 build if that's what you're asking
[07:54:56] <Gman> stevel, http://au.flow.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=11&node=0&Itemid=331
[07:55:07] <Shiv__> palowoda: I am not sure if they ever had an interest in OpenSolaris. They have good share of product line with SPARC/Solaris, this much I know.
[07:55:07] <palowoda> Gman: No serious who from Fujitsu or Siemens cares about Opensolaris?
[07:55:27] <stevel> gman: what size?
[07:55:35] <Gman> stevel, 156
[07:55:47] <Shiv__> palowoda: May I ask why the question?
[07:55:54] <Gman> palowoda, i've definitely seen some addresses on the mailman list
[07:56:00] <Gman> palowoda, active involvement, probably nothing
[07:56:15] <stevel> wicked. when're you gonna try it out?
[07:56:42] <palowoda> Alright where talking about a rock here. Forget the train of thought.
[07:56:45] <richlowe> Gman: they're almost certainly working on the code.
[07:57:02] <Gman> stevel, hopefully 2 weeks from now, we're heading down south for a 4 or 5 days to wanaka
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[07:59:23] <stevel> sigh. i can't wait for winter
[07:59:51] <palowoda> Yeah, mushroom season.
[08:00:36] <richlowe> stevel: follow Glynn's lead, and get Sun to let you travel the world.
[08:00:55] <Gman> i'm totally hitting sara up for a couple of trips to SF during their winter
[08:01:00] * Gman wants a tahoe trip :)
[08:01:07] <Gman> and i bought a bag too to make that possible
[08:01:10] <stevel> gman: wicked - count me in for a tahoe trip
[08:01:15] <Gman> sweet :)
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[08:01:45] <stevel> richlowe: i travel a fair bit - not to the degree that glynn does though :)
[08:02:16] <palowoda> You guys trying to sell Sun stock?
[08:02:19] <richlowe> stevel: and only where there's football.
[08:02:23] <Gman> heh
[08:02:24] <richlowe> stevel: (or, apparently, snow)
[08:03:48] <stevel> both of which are good conditions
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[08:09:24] <richlowe> whoo, qlc source.
[08:12:06] <stevel> is it cddl'd?
[08:12:17] * stevel too lazy to check
[08:12:27] * stevel too lazy to type 'is'
[08:13:56] <richlowe> if you won't look over NFS, what make's you think I'd pull down the tarball, extract it, then look?
[08:14:16] <stevel> blind baseless hope?
[08:15:26] <jbk> ?wc -l files.txt
[08:15:26] <jbk>     6987 files.txt
[08:15:33] <richlowe> stevel: kinda
[08:15:34] <jbk> i think that's enough files for testing :)
[08:16:09] <richlowe> stevel: cddl 1.0-only + a binary license on the firmware
[08:16:19] <stevel> huh cool.
[08:17:30] <Gman> jbk, go go go! :)
[08:19:26] <palowoda> CDDL is at version 1.1.
[08:19:39] <jbk> i still gotta write up logic go it can correctly compare c++ symbols, but that's a very small minority of the files
[08:19:48] <stevel> okay i'm off to drink
[08:19:49] <stevel> 'night folks!
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[08:20:16] <gisburn> night
[08:20:19] <jbk> it's easily passing 90-95% of that stuff (/usr/bin, /bin, /usr/lib, /kernel/sun4u/drv/sparcv9, etc. -- basically anything that's an ELF object)
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[09:20:01] <BatonT> can SXCE be setup to use zfs boot from the installer?
[09:20:08] <BatonT> eer SXCE 70
[09:22:00] <flyingparchment> no
[09:22:39] <BatonT> i take it is still painfull to setup?
[09:24:57] <palowoda> zfsboot is slated for build 115.
[09:25:06] <LeftWing> heh
[09:25:23] <e^ipi> zfsboot works now
[09:25:30] <BatonT> perhaps i was thinking of zfs root not boot
[09:25:34] <e^ipi> as for the installer, who knows
[09:25:43] <e^ipi> BatonT: root and boot were integrated a few builds ago
[09:25:45] <flyingparchment> it's worked for a while, but the installer doesn't support it
[09:25:48] <palowoda> not that it's confusing.
[09:25:54] <flyingparchment> you can do a jumpstart install iirc
[09:25:57] <BatonT> i just found sdm a pain to try and get root mirroring
[09:26:00] <theRealBallchalk> BatonT: hey i'm on nexenta it's coool
[09:26:02] <e^ipi> you need to go through some magic to work it because the installer doesn't grok it, but you can do it
[09:26:09] <theRealBallchalk> zfs boot
[09:26:10] <flyingparchment> a pain how?  you just run a couple of commands, reboot, and it's done
[09:26:31] <e^ipi> I would use nexenta, except for the gross painful GNUserspace
[09:26:32] <palowoda> that is why it's not in sxce.
[09:27:51] <theRealBallchalk> e^ipi: can one install nexenta and cp all the SXDE userspace over ?
[09:27:54] <theRealBallchalk> hehe
[09:28:09] <e^ipi> I can continue to use SXCE and have that be the end of it
[09:28:19] <e^ipi> which is the option I think I'll go with
[09:28:22] <BatonT> its just i have snv_57 installed atm  and i was going to reinstall my server on 2 new disks (as the current ufs parition on the drive is too small (2nd part of drives is dedicated to zfs))
[09:28:23] <palowoda> nextenta only works with gpl
[09:28:47] <e^ipi> GPL is a license
[09:28:55] <palowoda> does it work?
[09:28:55] <theRealBallchalk> yea i've been using SXDE build 55 forever and i promise i will go back, but i'm just having fun with nexentaOS for tonight that's all
[09:29:06] <e^ipi> and you never really work /with/ the GPL, you just submit to it's will
[09:29:27] <palowoda> I submit I guess it works. :)
[09:29:38] <theRealBallchalk> i even went out and spent $150 for a 160GB for the zfs experience
[09:29:47] <e^ipi> you got ripped off
[09:29:56] <e^ipi> i spent $40 on the same size drive
[09:30:01] <jamesd> i paid $133 for 500GB last week.
[09:30:04] <palowoda> you spent 150 for a 160G drive boy did you get ripped.
[09:30:20] <palowoda> I'm paying 99.00 for 500G.
[09:30:39] <theRealBallchalk> e^ipi: whoa! which brand you got?
[09:30:52] <jamesd> i paid $33 extra to get a full 5 year warranty on a new drive...(seagate) not a rebuilt one.
[09:30:53] <theRealBallchalk> no no but this is a laptop hdd
[09:30:58] <palowoda> Segate and Maxtor's  at Fry's Electronics.
[09:31:08] <theRealBallchalk> ya we got Fry's here
[09:31:12] <e^ipi> theRealBallchalk: maxtor IIRC
[09:31:13] <theRealBallchalk> that's where i went
[09:31:21] <BatonT> the 4 500s i have are WD RE2's
[09:31:31] <palowoda> laptop drives are always more expensive.
[09:31:32] <theRealBallchalk> Best Buy slimmed their selections
[09:32:14] <theRealBallchalk> yea i use laptops
[09:32:19] <palowoda> Hey 750G drives where 170.00 today.
[09:32:33] <theRealBallchalk> where? internal or external?
[09:32:37] <palowoda> Still a ripeoff.
[09:32:42] <palowoda> Internal
[09:32:43] <theRealBallchalk> i'm looking for an external drive also
[09:32:59] <palowoda> Buy an externa sata case.
[09:33:04] <palowoda> external
[09:33:13] <palowoda> what 40.00
[09:33:40] <theRealBallchalk> i was looking at a WD MyBook 500GB w/o firewire for $120 with discount and passed it
[09:33:49] <palowoda> Have a couple of them not impressed with performance.
[09:33:56] <flyingparchment> without firewire?  is that a feature now? :)
[09:33:59] <theRealBallchalk> yea not without firewire
[09:34:14] <theRealBallchalk> naw no sata for me
[09:34:15] <palowoda> firewire still sucks too.
[09:34:16] <theRealBallchalk> can't use'em
[09:34:23] <theRealBallchalk> heck no
[09:34:33] <palowoda> what firewire 800
[09:34:59] <theRealBallchalk> i used to boot my macbook from an external firewire 400 and it felt faster than my internal drive
[09:35:16] <palowoda> what kind of performance?
[09:35:24] <palowoda> numbers please.
[09:35:28] <theRealBallchalk> i think data throughput
[09:35:32] <Shiv__> Anyone knows what -mt option to g++ means?
[09:35:35] <theRealBallchalk> the bandwidth
[09:35:42] <palowoda> wow that is fast
[09:35:44] <theRealBallchalk> you know....the feelings lol
[09:35:58] <palowoda> I'm hooked on a feeling.
[09:36:28] <theRealBallchalk> yea it's fast believe me
[09:37:10] <theRealBallchalk> i used to carry a laptop at the same time lugging around an external drive which looked rediculous
[09:37:25] <palowoda> I use them on my Ipone.
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[09:37:55] <Tempt> haha
[09:37:58] <Tempt> iPwn
[09:37:59] <theRealBallchalk> iphone huh hahah
[09:38:50] <palowoda> It was a typo.  I really use 500G firewire drives on my Iphone.
[09:39:13] <moazamraja> hmmm
[09:39:23] <moazamraja> can i do a pkgadd and have it ignore my zones?
[09:39:31] <theRealBallchalk> i want an iphone
[09:39:41] <moazamraja> <-- has iphone (yes, it kicks ass)
[09:40:13] <theRealBallchalk> ima hit bed and dream of iphones
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[09:40:15] <theRealBallchalk> g'nite all
[09:40:16] <palowoda> I have zfs running on the Iphone too.
[09:40:29] <moazamraja> pkgadd....ignore zone?
[09:40:45] <palowoda> why would you want pkgadd to ignore a zone?
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[09:41:22] <moazamraja> palowoda: cuz I already added those packages in the zone
[09:41:29] <moazamraja> and *now* i'm adding them to the global zone
[09:41:41] <moazamraja> so i don't want it to putz with whatever is already installed in the zone
[09:42:31] <palowoda> Got it.
[09:42:38] <Tempt> man pkgadd
[09:42:41] <Tempt> ffs
[09:42:45] <Tempt> that's lazy
[09:42:55] <palowoda> ffs?
[09:43:42] <moazamraja> found it
[09:45:05] <WickedWicky> Good morning all
[09:45:09] <palowoda> Hmm does live upgrade work with all the individual packages in different zones?
[09:49:20] <palowoda> Ah found it project zulu.
[09:49:48] <Shiv__> Does anyone here have tried building a wxWidgets app?
[09:53:21] <e^ipi> iphone looks just like a huge waste of money and time to me
[09:53:31] <palowoda> Shesh the graphics on wxWidgets is impressive.
[09:54:15] <palowoda> e^ipi: I really use my cell phone to call people.
[09:55:25] <e^ipi> so why clutter that up with a web browser and mp3 player and a bunch of other worthless nonsense ?
[09:56:03] <palowoda> Because I bought Apple stock. :)
[09:56:36] <moazamraja> e^ipi: i dunno, i end up using a lot of its features
[09:56:40] <moazamraja> including the browser, the maps functoin
[09:56:45] <moazamraja> and the weather/stock widgets
[09:57:04] <moazamraja> also great for when you're waiting in line at the docs office or whatever
[09:57:07] <palowoda> It doesn't even have gps for the maps and yet everybody buys them.
[09:57:07] <moazamraja> i'm quite happy with it
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[09:57:25] <e^ipi> *shrug*
[09:57:41] <moazamraja> granted, it's $$. but I didn't pay for mine.
[09:57:47] <moazamraja> so i'm tickled pink with it :)
[09:58:08] <palowoda> Steve Jobs gives them away free at the conferences.
[09:59:37] <e^ipi> whatever works for you then I guess
[10:00:04] <moazamraja> not quite.
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[10:00:27] <palowoda> moazamraja: It's not working?
[10:00:34] <moazamraja> wha?
[10:00:37] <moazamraja> what's not working
[10:00:39] <e^ipi> personally i'd rather spend $50 on a phone and the other $500 on something better
[10:00:42] <palowoda> Your Iphone.
[10:00:45] <moazamraja> works great
[10:00:47] <moazamraja> :/
[10:01:03] <moazamraja> some ppl buy Toyota, some Lexus
[10:01:24] <palowoda> Yeah and you got your Lexus free too.
[10:01:33] <moazamraja> i know :)
[10:01:36] <moazamraja> kicks ass, doesn't it :)
[10:01:47] <moazamraja> now if only someone had given me my real car for free... :/
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[10:03:40] <palowoda> Hmm you may have run out of mojo.
[10:03:50] <e^ipi> sell your iphone, you can get a car for $650
[10:03:58] <e^ipi> not a great car, given
[10:04:03] <e^ipi> but a car nonetheless
[10:04:16] <moazamraja> $650?
[10:04:19] <nightswim> and people wont laugh at you
[10:04:21] <moazamraja> the phone is $599
[10:04:24] <palowoda> Steve Jobs gives away a free car with every Iphone.
[10:04:48] <moazamraja> nightswim: ppl will laugh and cry based on their own b.s. feelings and shortcomings, i'm not going to worry about "people"
[10:04:51] <moazamraja> life is too short
[10:05:28] <palowoda> So is an Iphone battery if it goes dead. :)
[10:05:36] <moazamraja> oh lord :/
[10:05:47] <e^ipi> heh
[10:05:50] <moazamraja> this is like the folks who kept bitching about the original ipod battery
[10:05:54] <moazamraja> which is like $15 anyways
[10:05:59] <moazamraja> but, whatever
[10:06:10] <palowoda> 1000.00 replacement fee.
[10:06:13] * bda bitches about the people bitching about the people bitching.
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[10:06:48] <palowoda> hey how did we get on the Iphone?
[10:07:04] <palowoda> Oh wait I brought it up.
[10:07:05] <moazamraja> damnit, rrdtool won't compile
[10:07:24] <palowoda> moazamraja: use blastwave than compile.
[10:07:53] <moazamraja> wha?
[10:08:01] <moazamraja> i can get the srcpkg from blastwave?
[10:08:18] <palowoda> Ok make your own distribution than try blastwave.
[10:08:30] <bda> Or pkgsrc.
[10:08:37] <palowoda> pkgsrc is dead
[10:08:46] <bda> Oh?
[10:09:00] <palowoda> It's really famous on Solaris.
[10:09:00] <moazamraja> palowoda: that made no sense...
[10:09:20] <moazamraja> if i can't compile it...how am i gonna make my own distro and compile it?
[10:09:21] <palowoda> It's friggen going nowhere.
[10:09:41] <e^ipi> moazamraja: magic
[10:09:50] <moazamraja> yall are drunk.
[10:09:57] <palowoda> It friday
[10:09:58] <moazamraja> i've just figured it out.
[10:10:10] <palowoda> And your compiling rdd
[10:10:19] <e^ipi> i'm not drunk yet, I just got off work
[10:10:28] <e^ipi> ask me again in 20 mins
[10:10:44] <palowoda> wait I thought you where in canada?
[10:11:02] <e^ipi> yeah, western .ca
[10:11:09] <palowoda> your off to work now?
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[10:11:19] <e^ipi> I closed the store today, i just got off
[10:11:34] <palowoda> Damn you work late.
[10:11:43] <e^ipi> you forget, I'm a student, therefore i work student jobs
[10:11:59] <palowoda> Ah, been there. Done that.
[10:12:00] <e^ipi> like slinging coffee for $1 over min. wage
[10:13:43] <palowoda> e^ipi: It keeps your blood flowing.
[10:14:41] <moazamraja> damn, now i want chai/milk tea
[10:14:53] <e^ipi> I don't actually mind my job
[10:15:14] <WickedWicky> jobs make you capable of buying coffee at Timmies eh!
[10:15:20] <e^ipi> for what it is, it pays well & the hours are flexible enough to allow me to stay @ school
[10:15:27] <e^ipi> WickedWicky: erm... no
[10:15:32] <WickedWicky> whichi s about the only decent coffee I found in the entire Ontario
[10:15:37] <e^ipi> their coffee is quite revolting
[10:16:05] <WickedWicky> any suggestions for when I go back to Canada?
[10:16:25] <e^ipi> I don't know anyone that drinks it except when it's swimming in so much cream and sugar that you can't taste it anyways
[10:16:41] <WickedWicky> well yes, I always took the medium double cream
[10:16:48] <e^ipi> WickedWicky: national chains? dunno...
[10:17:22] * WickedWicky rather spent money on Harveys
[10:17:53] <e^ipi> get your coffee at mcdonalds or starbucks... at least they won't serve you last-auction robusta
[10:18:03] <WickedWicky> haha
[10:18:23] <e^ipi> tim hortons' is about the worst coffee i've ever drank outside a gas station
[10:18:42] <WickedWicky> try the coffee they serve in hotels for breakfast
[10:18:52] <e^ipi> horrible, vile substance it is
[10:20:00] <WickedWicky> I went to Toronto three times last year, came back with the first season of Corner Gas and a pile of those prepacked filter coffees
[10:20:41] <palowoda> Ah Jamacian Blue Moutain coffee is the only thing to drink.
[10:20:54] <e^ipi> meh
[10:21:13] <palowoda> It really is smooth.
[10:21:14] <e^ipi> i've had blue mountain... it's not to my liking
[10:21:42] * WickedWicky prefers guarana anyway..
[10:22:16] <e^ipi> i'll take an ethopia harar or indonesian over blue mountain any day
[10:22:53] <palowoda> too strong.
[10:23:20] <e^ipi> erm... so... don't brew it as strongly...
[10:23:41] <e^ipi> the origin country has nothing to do with how you brew it
[10:24:38] <palowoda> Most of the time I dring coffee I'm out in the wilderness so there is not too many options.
[10:24:45] <moazamraja> went downstairs, ended up with lemonade instead of chai
[10:24:50] <e^ipi> use a french press
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[10:25:06] <e^ipi> you can even get travel mugs with french presses already in 'em
[10:25:09] <palowoda> I was thinking of using a french press.
[10:25:15] <e^ipi> i've got a couple of those
[10:25:36] <moazamraja> i tried cappucino today, damn near made my head spin
[10:25:48] <moazamraja> love the smell of coffee, just can't seem to handle drinking it
[10:25:48] <e^ipi> moazamraja: ?
[10:26:04] <moazamraja> <--- tea/cha/chai person
[10:26:07] <Tempt> Hmm
[10:26:08] <e^ipi> fair enough
[10:26:09] <Tempt> Gimmeh espresso
[10:26:26] <moazamraja> altho i had a capucinno in germany (airport) which was excellent
[10:26:34] <moazamraja> i came back to USA and tried to have the same thing, it sucked ass
[10:26:40] <palowoda> moazamraja: if you like chai you should like Blue Moutain.  Go up to Fremont Coffee and get some.
[10:27:01] <e^ipi> yeah, I usually drink press, sometimes straight-shot espresso or a macciatto
[10:27:12] <e^ipi> a cappuccino if I want something milky
[10:27:38] <moazamraja> Fremont Coffee? on Thornton?
[10:27:38] <palowoda> cappuccino has too much milk.
[10:27:45] <moazamraja> i looove me some milk
[10:27:50] <Tempt> moojuice
[10:28:06] <palowoda> moazamraja: It's up on Washington Blvd near the corner of Mission blvd.
[10:28:21] <e^ipi> at the moment I'm in a tea mood, so I'm drinking Yerba Mate
[10:28:35] <moazamraja> oh
[10:28:40] <moazamraja> thats near my old place
[10:28:45] <palowoda> They have every coffee I know about.
[10:28:46] <moazamraja> i'll have to try it this weekend
[10:28:56] <moazamraja> yerba mate is some strrrrong shit
[10:29:03] <palowoda> I use to live up at the Mission area too.
[10:29:10] <e^ipi> depends how you make it
[10:29:14] <Tempt> Isn't it meant to be possible to get high on Yerba or something?
[10:29:15] <moazamraja> one of my office mates drinks hardcore yerba
[10:29:19] <e^ipi> I grew up with the stuff
[10:29:33] <Tempt> What the hell is it, anyway?
[10:29:33] <moazamraja> he fills his cup up to about 70-80% with yerba mate
[10:29:48] <moazamraja> and then puts water in it, and drinks it thru some odd straw contraption
[10:29:56] <e^ipi> moazamraja: yeah, that's how I drink it some times
[10:29:57] <moazamraja> some argentine/south american thing
[10:30:15] <e^ipi> that's how my grandfather drank it
[10:30:16] <Tempt> Tasty?
[10:30:21] <e^ipi> Tempt: I like it
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[10:30:30] <moazamraja> e^ipi: i assume you're argentine? or chilean?
[10:30:33] <Chipdancer> is anybody here using opensolaris' sfw samba server with a mac client?
[10:30:38] <e^ipi> moazamraja: no, german...
[10:30:46] <moazamraja> palowoda: i used to live right on fremont/stevenson
[10:30:46] <Tempt> Chipdancer: You are honestly so much better using NFS to your Mac
[10:30:47] <e^ipi> my family is south american mennonites
[10:30:49] <moazamraja> e^ipi: close enough
[10:30:50] <moazamraja> :/
[10:30:51] <moazamraja> hehe
[10:30:52] <moazamraja> oh
[10:30:55] <Tempt> Chipdancer: Seriously, it's much faster
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[10:31:08] <moazamraja> Chipdancer: he's right, use NFS
[10:31:24] <Chipdancer> Tempt: is there a sensible way to manage it from the mac perspective instead of having to tell other users to use the command line and sudo for mounts/umounts?
[10:31:25] <moazamraja> even apple uses NFS for real transfers of data, internally
[10:31:34] <palowoda> moazamraja: I'm at Washington and Fremont area now.  Restoring an old 1874 house.
[10:31:50] <e^ipi> my mom was born in paraguay, but she was in canada by the time she started school
[10:31:55] <moazamraja> Chipdancer: http://www.bresink.com/osx/143439/screenshots.html
[10:32:15] <e^ipi> Chipdancer: click the desktop
[10:32:15] <palowoda> The guy the built the house is buried under the Mission.
[10:32:20] <e^ipi> command-K
[10:32:21] <Chipdancer> the next kick I'm on is trying to get zero conf networking working nicely on my home network
[10:32:21] <moazamraja> palowoda: oh, so right across from the coffee place.
[10:32:33] <Chipdancer> e^ipi: cmd-k + nfs://?
[10:32:38] <moazamraja> Chipdancer: yeah, what eipi said
[10:32:39] <e^ipi> Chipdancer: yad
[10:32:40] <Chipdancer> figured as much
[10:32:42] <moazamraja> even better
[10:32:43] <Tempt> Chipdancer: Don't know. I don't think there is anything sensible on MacOS
[10:32:48] <e^ipi> yeah, i should say
[10:32:48] <Tempt> I just mount it from the commandline
[10:33:15] <moazamraja> palowoda: this is your personal residence or a 'project' ?
[10:33:45] <Chipdancer> so my next query then is, what's the correct way to manage nfs under opensol these days?  (I'm used to the classic /etc/exports ...)
[10:34:06] <flyingparchment> shareadm
[10:34:16] <e^ipi> or use nfs
[10:34:17] <palowoda> mozazamraja: No down at the 5 corners Washington and Fremont blvd.  But the owner of the coffee shop just catored my daughers wedding.  And yes it's my personal home/project.  Only one room leaft to go.
[10:34:22] <flyingparchment> there was never a /etc/exports in solaris - unless you go back to sunos4
[10:34:29] <e^ipi> erm... zfs
[10:34:45] <Chipdancer> e^ipi: all of my fs' apart from root are zfs on this host
[10:34:53] <flyingparchment> then use zfs set share=...
[10:34:58] <e^ipi> zfs set sharenfs=on pool/fs
[10:35:07] <flyingparchment> don't use 'on' unless you want to share it r/w to the entire world
[10:35:22] <richlowe> there's always sharemgr, if you haven't eaten recently.
[10:35:26] <moazamraja> palowoda: yer a Sun employee, i take it ?
[10:35:44] <palowoda> Was, served 10 years.
[10:35:49] <moazamraja> "served" hehehe
[10:35:56] <Tempt> out for good behaviour
[10:35:57] <palowoda> MDE
[10:36:14] <moazamraja> <-- ex-DevTools, ex-JDK
[10:36:35] <moazamraja> and..uhh, now ex-iPhone, ex-iTunes, back to DevTools
[10:36:48] <Chipdancer> so sharemgr is not the preferred method for management?
[10:36:59] <e^ipi> moazamraja: you work for apple?
[10:37:33] <flyingparchment> Chipdancer: sharemgr is "preferred" (please notice my use of quotes) for UFS
[10:37:39] <flyingparchment> Chipdancer: for ZFS, use zfs set sharenfs
[10:38:02] <Chipdancer> flyingparchment: pointers to good doco on it?
[10:38:03] <moazamraja> yah
[10:38:08] <flyingparchment> Chipdancer: man zfs
[10:38:12] <Chipdancer> :)
[10:38:15] <Tempt> Was there actually an advantage to changing from dfstab to sharemgr?
[10:38:24] <Tempt> Or is it just part of the idiot-proofing process?
[10:38:29] <flyingparchment> basically, zfs set sharenfs=rw=myhost.com:myotherhost.com pool/some/fs
[10:38:41] <Chipdancer> thanks
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[10:39:16] <flyingparchment> Tempt: in theory i like the idea.  but not enough to replace a nice, simple and functional interface that was already there.
[10:39:17] <palowoda> flyingparchment: You have to use FQD?
[10:39:18] <moazamraja> i'll try to get some of this Jamaica Blue Mountain coffee from Barefoot Coffee Roasters in the morning
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[10:39:36] <Chipdancer> moazamraja: *jealous* :)
[10:39:40] <flyingparchment> palowoda: no.  but i usually do
[10:39:57] <moazamraja> Chipdancer: of Barefoot?
[10:40:07] <palowoda> flyingparchment: Just wondering if it affects performance thats all.
[10:40:10] <Chipdancer> moazamraja: yeah :).. that you've got easy access to that
[10:40:14] <moazamraja> hehe
[10:40:19] <Chipdancer> moazamraja: I got some kona a couple of months ago, and that was stunning
[10:40:29] <flyingparchment> i remember some strange issue i had not using fqdn, but i don't remember the details - i just use it because i know it'll work
[10:40:31] <Chipdancer> the nicest espresso I've had
[10:40:43] <flyingparchment> + we only use dns anyway so there's no lookup penalty
[10:41:02] <Chipdancer> moazamraja: does osx have sensible handling of dead mounts, sleep and switching networks?
[10:41:32] <moazamraja> dead mounts...it'll bitch and whine
[10:41:37] <moazamraja> sleep? not sure what you mean
[10:42:01] <Fish-> hello
[10:42:07] <moazamraja> hi fish
[10:42:24] <Chipdancer> same thing really, putting a laptop to sleep without first unmounting the volume, being in a different location upon wake - will the finder or system hang for an unspecified period while it works out what's going on, or just tell you that it's no longer available and fix it
[10:42:25] <e^ipi> no... no it does not
[10:42:34] <Tempt> MacOS handles NFS problems by hanging
[10:42:44] <e^ipi> dead mounts will lock up finder for a long time, rendering the system nigh-useless
[10:42:47] <Chipdancer> Tempt: that's one reason I was going down the samba/cifs path
[10:43:02] <flyingparchment> macosx still does that with nfs?  strange behaviour for a desktop OS...
[10:43:19] <moazamraja> i dont 'sleep' my NFS mounted OS X boxes, so I can't say for sure
[10:43:29] <Tempt> It's craptastic
[10:43:44] <Chipdancer> moazamraja: yeah, I usually reserve nfs for static systems, not desktops or guest systems
[10:43:56] <Tempt> For some reason MacOS is really, really fussy about NFS mounts
[10:44:09] <Tempt> it won't even connect to an IP that doesn't match the hostname
[10:44:17] <palowoda> Still a desktop should hang on nfs mounts.
[10:44:20] <moazamraja> the NFS implementation over on OS X aint the best
[10:44:35] <moazamraja> but i dont know about it hanging on wakeup
[10:44:37] <moazamraja> i'll have to try that
[10:44:42] <flyingparchment> yes, because as a desktop user, i want my desktop to hang when an nfs server is unreachable
[10:44:54] <Chipdancer> what does apple use between clients and servers these days?
[10:44:57] <moazamraja> flyingparchment: i think he meant should not
[10:45:02] <moazamraja> Chipdancer: afp
[10:45:15] <Chipdancer> moazamraja: still?
[10:45:24] <Chipdancer> moazamraja: wow, I'm surprised that still exists
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[10:48:19] <Chipdancer> which services are required for nfs server on opensol?  nfs/server and nfs/status?  others?
[10:48:54] <flyingparchment> rpc/bind
[10:48:57] <palowoda> I think if you man svcs or svcadm you can get a list of dependencies.
[10:48:58] <richlowe> So, now they made /etc/release say Community Edition, etc etc, does that really imply they're spinning separate (yet identical, quite probably) media for DE?
[10:49:04] <richlowe> and, beyond that, that someone thinks this is actually a good idea?
[10:49:10] <Chipdancer> yeah, just hunted svcs for a dependancy tol
[10:49:19] <flyingparchment> iirc it'll start most things the server needs anyway
[10:49:25] <flyingparchment> when you start nfs/server
[10:49:30] <moazamraja> richlowe: it's prolly mainly for support reasons
[10:49:32] <Chipdancer> interestingly, I've just done a zfs share -a and see that network/shares/group:default and zfs are on.. b ut none of the nfs ones are on
[10:49:48] <Chipdancer> just wondering what the shares does without nfs
[10:50:08] <flyingparchment> Chipdancer: if you did reduced services installation, be warned that rpc/bind is configured to only allow local requests
[10:50:16] <flyingparchment> Chipdancer: set the config/local_only property to false to change that
[10:50:31] <Chipdancer> flyingparchment: where is config/local_only found?
[10:50:47] <flyingparchment> svccfg -s rpc/bind; setprop config/local_only=false
[10:51:05] <Chipdancer> thanks
[10:51:16] <palowoda> rechlowe: I don't think DE was a good idea.  Well maybe important to who is working on DE.
[10:51:32] <Chipdancer> still learning about these new service management tools in sol..
[10:52:38] <palowoda> Sorry didn't mean to scew up the nick.  But SCXE has to advertise more the versions of Studio and Netbeans with every release.
[10:52:52] <palowoda> Thus no need for DE.
[10:53:07] <moazamraja> i had assumed the DE was compilers+tools+OS
[10:53:13] <moazamraja> and that CE doesnt have that
[10:53:20] <palowoda> It does.
[10:53:23] <moazamraja> but...folks here are saying differently :/
[10:53:32] <moazamraja> in which case, i'm confused
[10:53:45] <palowoda> So is Sun marketing.
[10:54:06] <palowoda> Are you saying this is new?
[10:54:57] <palowoda> Confusing causes discussion.  Thus marketing spends less dollars.
[10:55:11] <palowoda> Confusion.
[10:56:06] <trs81> richlowe: DE often gets a kernel respin from CE
[10:56:29] <richlowe> trs81: DE often delays CE to allow that respin to happen.
[10:56:55] * trs81 shrugs
[10:57:15] <trs81> anyway, what I actually want to know is will the si3124 driver work on sparc?
[10:57:50] <palowoda> stay away from si3124 untill the driver timeout bug is fixed.
[10:58:34] <palowoda> build 71 last I heard.
[10:58:41] <Chipdancer> ok, so I used zfs share -a, but I guess that only starts sharing for filesystems with the sharenfs property set to tru?
[10:59:55] <moazamraja> wait...is there is a list of what is included in SXCE?
[11:00:16] <moazamraja> cuz...why would they create a whole new binary for DE if CE already has the compilers
[11:00:31] <moazamraja> there has to be a reason
[11:00:34] <richlowe> moazamraja: that's exactly what I was asking.
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[11:00:47] <palowoda> Everybody is asking.
[11:00:50] <moazamraja> i can see that SXCE does *not* come with support
[11:00:53] <moazamraja> while SXDE does
[11:01:02] <moazamraja> but...there should be more to it than that
[11:01:03] <palowoda> what support?
[11:01:04] <flyingparchment> i don't think it's exactly support
[11:01:07] <richlowe> moazamraja: to a certain degree, sure.
[11:01:16] <richlowe> and it really depends on your definition of "support"
[11:01:26] <palowoda> A phone call.
[11:01:31] <moazamraja> Sun Developer Expert Assistance
[11:01:33] <moazamraja> (DEA)
[11:01:46] <palowoda> What whould they say if you called them up?
[11:01:55] <moazamraja> i haven't called them, have you?
[11:01:59] <Tempt> ook! ook! ook!
[11:02:17] <palowoda> Buy a support contract for Studio?
[11:03:59] <moazamraja> ?
[11:04:04] <moazamraja> S DEA is incident based
[11:04:10] <moazamraja> like $49/incident or something
[11:04:35] <flyingparchment> i ordered solaris support the week before last, and i didn't get a quote yet
[11:04:51] <flyingparchment> they really don't want people buying support
[11:05:49] <e^ipi> how is it that the sun sales team still all have jobs?
[11:06:05] <palowoda> Nothing better to do I guess.
[11:06:10] <e^ipi> also, how do you get a job on that team, because I want one
[11:06:17] <e^ipi> it seems you don't have to actually do anything
[11:06:31] <flyingparchment> this is an Irish reseller, i guess they prefer drinking to selling.  ;-)
[11:06:48] <palowoda> They still have to sell the hardware.
[11:07:22] <e^ipi> palowoda: from what I hear they do a pretty piss-poor job of that too
[11:08:12] <palowoda> Well you can talk to a Sun sales rep or website order.  Your choice.  Or some third party vendor.
[11:09:54] <palowoda> I didn't make up the rules.
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[11:40:03] <BatonT> is it just me, or is the dhcp server than comes with solaris a bit ordinary..
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[11:41:39] <hagge_> I'm trying to mount what I belive is solaris ufs (I don't think it should be zfs) in linux, this is my dmesg output:
[11:41:52] <hagge_>  hda: hda1
[11:41:53] <hagge_>  hda1: <solaris: [s0] hda5 [s1] hda6 [s2] hda7 [s7] hda8 >
[11:41:59] <hagge_> c-1dc670d5:/mnt# mount -t ufs -oufstype=sunx86 /dev/hda5 /mnt/solaris
[11:41:59] <hagge_> mount: fel filsystemstyp, felaktig flagga, felaktigt superblock
[11:42:10] <hagge_> shouldn't they be hda5-8?
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[11:46:07] <hagge_> c-1dc670d5:/mnt# cat /proc/filesystems |grep -i ufs
[11:46:08] <hagge_>         ufs
[11:46:10] <hagge_> :(
[11:47:49] <hagge_> oh, stupid me:
[11:47:50] <hagge_> ufs was compiled with read-only support, can't be mounted as read-write
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[12:19:33] <BatonT> when partitioning a boot disk for sdm, i need a small slice for the sdm right?
[12:19:41] <flyingparchment> BatonT: yes
[12:19:53] <flyingparchment> <10MB unless you have a really big number of metadevices
[12:20:52] <BatonT> how does this sound...   0: 12401mb  1: swap 3977mb 3: 12401mb   4: 50mb    7: 352669mb (for zfs)    ?
[12:21:00] <BatonT> want it to be posible to live upgrade
[12:21:24] <flyingparchment> except on an important production server, i would usually just detach the mirror to live upgrade
[12:21:52] <BatonT> ahh!
[12:22:00] <BatonT> yes that makes more sense
[12:22:10] <BatonT> id rather make use of that space
[12:23:36] <BatonT> hmm getting error about root fs not being within the first 1023 cylinders
[12:23:45] <flyingparchment> i think that's just a warning
[12:23:50] <flyingparchment> you can ignore it unless your bios is really really old
[12:24:01] <flyingparchment> (can't address beyond 8GB of disk)
[12:24:06] <BatonT> hmm installer wont let me past it..
[12:24:22] <WickedWicky> are you gonna mirror over the same disk? why?
[12:24:32] <flyingparchment> WickedWicky: i think he was going to have two mirrored slices
[12:24:36] <flyingparchment> one root, one for lu
[12:24:37] <BatonT> yes..
[12:24:46] <BatonT> that is correct
[12:24:57] <flyingparchment> BatonT: i've never seen that problem before
[12:24:59] <BatonT> grr i wanted to have a larder tan 8gb root
[12:25:08] <BatonT> as thats what i had before and it was too small
[12:25:09] <flyingparchment> Filesystem             size   used  avail capacity  Mounted on
[12:25:11] <flyingparchment> /dev/md/dsk/d10         63G   6.0G    56G    10%    /
[12:25:16] <flyingparchment> it can definitely be more than 8GB :)
[12:25:22] <BatonT> yeah bizare
[12:25:27] <WickedWicky> it can, my root partion is 12GB
[12:25:42] <WickedWicky> I had it 15 before
[12:25:45] <flyingparchment> maybe it doesn't start at the beginning of the disk?
[12:25:53] <flyingparchment> i can't imagine why it would complain about that, though..
[12:27:12] <WickedWicky> just for my understanding... how did you want this to work? You break the mirror for LU, then resync the submirrors...
[12:27:28] <flyingparchment> yes
[12:27:31] <WickedWicky> what happens to the data written to the not LU-ed sub mirror during the LU?
[12:27:34] <WickedWicky> you'll lose it
[12:27:34] <BatonT> firstly.. i want the installer to accept larder than 8Gb
[12:27:40] <flyingparchment> you won't
[12:27:54] <flyingparchment> you detach the right side, LU onto it, reboot, and the left side is now your old BE
[12:27:58] <flyingparchment> (right side is the new root)
[12:28:09] <flyingparchment> when you don't need the left side anymore, trash it and make it a mirror of the new root
[12:28:26] <BatonT> grr stupid installer...
[12:28:36] <flyingparchment> BatonT: are you sure it's not warning about that and erroring about something else?
[12:28:41] <BatonT> nah
[12:29:00] <BatonT> it tells me the root slice must lie entirley within the first 1023 cylinders
[12:29:18] <flyingparchment> well that's bs
[12:29:23] <flyingparchment> i have no idea why it would say that :(
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[12:29:51] <BatonT> i think ive had the issue in the past
[12:30:09] <BatonT> it wouldnt be due to sata being in legacy emulation (nvidia chipset) ?
[12:30:54] <flyingparchment> i don't think so - i installed snv_27 on a IDE disk with a larger root than that (i think)
[12:31:04] <WickedWicky> I had no problems using legacy IDE emulation
[12:32:24] <flyingparchment> install on one disk, slice the other with a proper size and LU ;-)
[12:33:06] <mbalmer> I am new here, so I probably just say Hi first ;)
[12:33:17] * flyingparchment remembers installing on an old Pentium that wouldn't boot from disk at all - had to have the DCA floppy in the drive permanently to reboot it
[12:35:36] <WickedWicky> BatonT: the sata is onboard?
[12:35:56] <BatonT> WickedWicky: yes
[12:35:57] <WickedWicky> then I presume the BIOS is new enough to do more than 8GB root disk
[12:36:10] <BatonT> its a recent mobo with dual core amd chip
[12:36:28] <flyingparchment> the 8GB limit is really old - probably anything that old can't even run S10+
[12:37:23] <WickedWicky> Part      Tag    Flag     Cylinders         Size            Blocks 0       root    wm   21768 - 24317       19.53GB    (2550/0/0)   40965750
[12:37:30] <WickedWicky> and my root partition doesnt start on 0 either
[12:37:35] <WickedWicky> rather in the middle
[12:37:58] <BatonT> my root partition is trying to start on cylinder3
[12:38:01] <WickedWicky> or at the end of the disk even, looking at the end cylinder
[12:38:12] <WickedWicky> this is native ATA mind you
[12:38:13] <BatonT> mm perhaps i should try making it start after cylinder 1023
[12:38:45] <WickedWicky> or something fizzy is going on with LBA translation
[12:39:09] <BatonT> nah it dosnt like that either
[12:39:22] <flyingparchment> BatonT: can you paste the error?
[12:39:44] <BatonT> no not really id have to type it out
[12:39:45] <WickedWicky> I'm out for lunch, be back later
[12:40:27] <BatonT> "The root (/) file system must lie entirley within the first 1023 cylinders of the disk drive which contains it."
[12:40:48] <BatonT> the rest of the error just is posible solutions  all which rely on reducing it to  7993mb or less
[12:41:29] <BatonT> if it makes any diference... this disk USED to be part of a zfs pool
[12:41:37] <flyingparchment> i can't believe this shell server with 8GB RAM is running out of memory
[12:41:46] <flyingparchment> people seriously need to fix their software
[12:42:37] <WickedWicky> BatonT: you created a Solaris 2 partition on the disk, didnt you?
[12:42:48] <BatonT> it did i think
[12:42:51] <BatonT> hmm
[12:42:56] <BatonT> perhaps i'll del the partition and readd
[12:43:48] * WickedWicky goes for steak
[12:43:49] <WickedWicky> bbl
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[12:58:13] <BatonT> WickedWicky:  ok works now.. it was due to me not creating a solaris partition, the silly installer let me apply slices to a 'other' type partition which was on the zfs disk
[13:01:39] <BatonT> where would i go to report this bug with the installer?
[13:03:39] <Pietro_S> SFEctags can't be used with OpenGrok?
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[13:07:41] <richlowe> I'd assume it was ectags, but maybe not.
[13:07:52] <richlowe> I'm fairly sure the ctags in SUNWspro is, but I have no idea of what vintage
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[13:10:35] <Pietro_S> I don't have ectags, but etags, but not enough for openGrok :-(
[13:11:28] <richlowe> Pietro_S: if ctags --version starts "Exuberant Ctags", that'd be ectags.
[13:12:44] <Pietro_S> richlowe: it looks like doesn't react on --version option
[13:13:11] <Pietro_S> do I guess I have to look what files were installed by SFEctags, but now lunch
[13:13:33] <richlowe> it won't have installed to /usr/bin, that's for sure.
[13:13:36] <richlowe> well, should be for sure.
[13:18:16] <FireflyST> mornin evrybuddy
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[13:46:41] <Doc> hmm.. it's good to see sunsolve still works as well as ever
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[13:54:01] <FireflyST> so what do you guys think of the IBM/Sun thing?
[13:54:50] <BatonT> it can only be a good thing shurley
[13:54:58] <mbalmer> a bit strange, imo.
[13:55:30] <Pietro_S> how can I list files installed by some package?
[13:55:37] <mbalmer> since ibm bayooed a lot about linux.  and then there is aix.  I wonder why they add solaris to their portfolio, but it's surely nice news
[13:56:44] <LeftWing> mbalmer: One would imagine some IBM customers asked for it, or IBM thinks it can take blade system sales away from Sun, etc.
[13:58:34] <Pietro_S> got it - ctags were in /usr/gnu/bin ...
[13:58:45] <FrostCS> yes, it was on customer request.
[13:58:48] <mbalmer> but that's only on i386, not ppc, right?
[13:59:04] <FrostCS> baby steps.. baby steps
[13:59:05] <Pietro_S> Solaris is capable to run on ppc?
[13:59:17] <FireflyST> sparc is largely dead
[13:59:24] <FireflyST> I love sparc, but it's the truth
[13:59:30] <mbalmer> most operating systems can be ported to ppc...
[13:59:31] <FrostCS> oh yes, of course, sparc is ancient technology..
[13:59:47] <FireflyST> IBM is still actively developing PPC
[13:59:50] <FrostCS> I am glad I didn't just drop that 60k missing from my checking account on sparc gear..
[13:59:51] <FireflyST> well
[13:59:54] <FireflyST> it's not PPC
[13:59:58] <FireflyST> PPC is dead
[14:00:02] <FireflyST> very very dead
[14:00:07] <FrostCS> no, wrong again, ppc is still alive.
[14:00:10] <LeftWing> Sun aren't actively developing SPARC or anything.
[14:00:16] <FireflyST> POWER6 is what you guys mean
[14:00:25] <FireflyST> uhh, no, PPC died with Apple
[14:00:31] <FrostCS> uhh no
[14:00:47] <WickedWicky> Motorola is still developing PPC, no?
[14:00:47] <mbalmer> so ibm will distribute i386 solaris or are the taking efforts to poirt over to ppc?
[14:01:05] <LeftWing> x64, I should think.
[14:01:25] <BatonT> from the announcement didt it just mention their x86 server range?
[14:01:45] <FrostCS> mbalmer, yes, x64.. though the cell devision still wants to work on the ppc support.
[14:02:09] <mbalmer> solaris on pcc, that would be freaky...
[14:02:12] <FrostCS> BatonT, yes, IBM x86 blades, and select servers.
[14:02:31] <FrostCS> mbalmer, people have been wanting Solaris on ppc for a while now.
[14:03:08] <FrostCS> that's what the large war in powerpc discuss was all about..
[14:05:51] <Pietro_S> it would be funny to run Solaris on playstation3 or 4;-)
[14:06:23] <FrostCS> it boots
[14:06:29] <FireflyST> I can find nothing anywhere saying POWER6 will have a PPC equivalent
[14:06:35] <FrostCS> but more work needs to be done on it
[14:06:42] <FireflyST> AFAICT PPC is dead
[14:06:57] <FrostCS> Cell's core is PPC
[14:07:26] <mbalmer> FireflyST, looks like not much is still alive for you ;)
[14:07:49] <mbalmer> I come from group that still supports the Vax .... ;)
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[14:09:39] <FireflyST> and I own 2 PDP11s, but that doesn't mean anything
[14:10:22] <mbalmer> heh, a cluster.  well, generally you are right, sadly.
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[14:11:46] <FireflyST> in fact
[14:12:14] <FireflyST> like, 2 hours ago I was banging my head against the wall trying to get a pertec controller to talk to the 9 track on my PDP11
[14:12:48] <FireflyST> I finally just decided to buy a different one from a manufacturer I have better experiences with (Emulex)
[14:13:15] <FireflyST> OK, anything I find on PowerPC and Cell is old
[14:13:55] <FireflyST> it's all G5/970 based
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[14:16:42] <FireflyST> Cell is not Power6
[14:17:19] <FrostCS> The sky isn't brown today either.
[14:17:22] <FrostCS> How about that...
[14:18:29] <FireflyST> prove me wrong then
[14:18:36] <FireflyST> point me to something that spells this out
[14:18:58] <FireflyST> neither IBM's site nor google come up with this info
[14:19:29] <FireflyST> well, except for people who are using POWER6 and PowerPC interchangably
[14:19:29] <FrostCS> it's $1000 an hour for anything I you want me to teach you.
[14:19:43] <FrostCS> this information is available all over the intarweb.
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[14:19:52] <FireflyST> fine, link please
[14:20:24] <FrostCS> google for cell architecture  or similar
[14:20:29] <FireflyST> I did
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[14:20:38] <FireflyST> it's 970 series based
[14:20:39] <FrostCS> now, read all results.
[14:20:41] <FrostCS> and?
[14:20:53] <FireflyST> and 970 is not POwer6
[14:21:03] <FrostCS> it's powerpc
[14:21:24] <FrostCS> are you reading anything I type?
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[14:21:34] <FireflyST> yes I am
[14:21:54] <FireflyST> I'm saying, current gen Cell is PowerPC 970 yes
[14:22:12] <FrostCS> is derived from PowerPC 970...
[14:22:20] <FireflyST> next gen cell is planned but there's nothing saying IT will be PowerPC, it may be different'
[14:22:56] <kjetilho> is anything other than the PS3 actually using the Cell?
[14:23:22] <FrostCS> read through ibm's developer and press releases FireflyST
[14:23:38] <FireflyST> I have
[14:23:41] <FrostCS> kjetilho, ibm blades, toshiba lcd's, so far..
[14:23:57] <FireflyST> I've laso found articles that make it sound more like PPC will be dropped in favor of a more flexible Power6
[14:24:23] <FireflyST> *also
[14:24:28] <kjetilho> how different is PPC from POWER?
[14:25:15] <FireflyST> Considerably from an implementation standpoint
[14:25:25] <FireflyST> There's no AltiVec in POWER
[14:25:34] <kjetilho> but the Cell is pretty different from either anyway
[14:25:52] <FireflyST> exactly
[14:25:53] <FrostCS> well until they decide to stop working with powerpc, and improving on it.. then it's not dead.
[14:26:16] <FireflyST> why would they care? there's no longer any market for a separate chip
[14:26:25] <FireflyST> The Power and PowerPC lines will grow one step closer together with Power6, which incorporates the AltiVec instruction set that speeds up many multimedia tasks. AltiVec, also known as VMX, increases efficiency by letting a single processing instruction be applied to multiple data elements. That's helpful for video and audio tasks on desktop machines, but servers will benefit as well in, for example, high-performance computing tas
[14:26:25] <kjetilho> IBM adding Cell to z-servers for online 3d-banking -- I had to check the date for this article: http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,2122352,00.asp?kc=EWEWKEMLP042807BOE1
[14:26:31] <FireflyST> Adding AltiVec was a tradeoff, he said. It's a valuable feature, but electrical current "leakage" problems in today's chipmaking technology mean that even idle parts of a chip consume power and produce waste heat.
[14:27:20] <WickedWicky> for those interested in ksh93 , it's in the mercurial repository, tag branch
[14:27:27] <WickedWicky> err, tip branch
[14:27:47] <FireflyST> All of this smells like PowerPC will die in favor of a straight Power6 spinoff of Cell
[14:28:31] <FrostCS> It also smells to some people that Sun is leaving the Server business...
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[14:29:05] <edwardocallagha> hey lads
[14:29:13] <edwardocallagha> quick question
[14:29:14] <FrostCS> You can't go by anything until it happens, I learned that a long time ago..
[14:29:23] <edwardocallagha> boyd:You around?
[14:29:39] <FireflyST> That I'll agree with
[14:29:45] <FrostCS> but today, the products you say are dead, happen to sell very well.
[14:29:50] <edwardocallagha> Anyone had issues with USB framework and hanging a bootup of Solaris?
[14:30:05] <FireflyST> FrostCS: sparc isn't selling new installations
[14:30:14] <FrostCS> huh?
[14:30:25] <WickedWicky> edwardocallagha: No, I use a USB mouse and keyboard plus USB CD-ROM driver, no probs
[14:30:30] <FrostCS> How are you identifying "sparc" ?
[14:30:33] <WickedWicky> I'm using ON71 though
[14:30:40] <edwardocallagha> Ah
[14:30:51] <FireflyST> There aren't companies switching to sparc from anything else
[14:30:55] <edwardocallagha> Well I did a BFU yesterday that worked very nice
[14:31:08] <kjetilho> FireflyST: I don't think that's correct, the Niagara has been a success
[14:31:09] <FrostCS> edwardocallagh, solaris had a various array of usb issues, which haven't been dragged back from sxce yet..
[14:31:12] <edwardocallagha> I see ZFS has been improved and some better SATA support
[14:31:26] <edwardocallagha> But the USB seems doggy on this Asus MB ?
[14:31:52] <edwardocallagha> Well I better get going as i'm with a mate
[14:32:00] <FrostCS> fireflyst, I believe your wrong, the line of Niagara servers sold very very well for sun this past year.
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[14:32:05] <kjetilho> the beauty of Solaris combined with other Open Source solutions is that the CPU architecture doesn't matter
[14:32:29] <edwardocallagha> if dclarke is around later let him know we need to talk about Joomla/CoolStack more..
[14:32:36] <edwardocallagha> ok see yea laters
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[14:32:46] <FrostCS> there were numbers on the niagara line recently too.. somewhere on sun blogs, accounting for the % of marketshare it had..
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[14:33:43] <FireflyST> I don't know why Sun isn't more aggressive in the telco market
[14:34:00] <FrostCS> Just because you're local general store doesn't have sparc boxes lining the shelves, means very little.
[14:34:20] <FireflyST> FrostCS: What the hell is that supposed to mean.
[14:35:27] <FrostCS> it means exactly what it says. Just because *you* can't see sparc, doesn't mean it's dead.
[14:35:42] <FireflyST> dude, I don't judge anything by what I can see
[14:35:53] <FrostCS> There is many people who swear by sparc, and who wouldn't have it any other way.
[14:36:06] <FireflyST> yep, I know
[14:36:13] <FireflyST> like I said
[14:36:22] <FrostCS> Because of those people, Sparc won't die.
[14:36:37] <FireflyST> there aren't any new customers buying sparc
[14:36:44] <flyingparchment> until Sun works out they need to build sparc-quality x86 servers
[14:37:03] <flyingparchment> i guess, most people use sparc because the hardware is good quality + has nice features, not because of the arch itself
[14:37:15] <FrostCS> To support your last statements, you would need to have Sun's new account records in your hands.
[14:38:02] <FireflyST> Whatever dude.  Name one new installation.
[14:39:33] <FrostCS> technically I would be a new account @ sun.
[14:39:37] <FireflyST> Solaris/SPARC is slowly being bought out by Linux/x86, as much as I really hate the latter and especially its community of groupies
[14:39:37] <kjetilho> SPARC quality x86 servers simply means get rid of PC BIOS IMHO
[14:39:51] <FrostCS> since last month was the first TWO orders I made, under my name.
[14:40:04] <FireflyST> and, they were sparcs?
[14:40:05] <FrostCS> in which, yes.. I purchased sparc gear.
[14:40:06] <kjetilho> oh how I hate to see my serial console flickering with "redraws" since the BIOS outputs text in such a stupid manner
[14:40:08] <FrostCS> yes.
[14:40:22] <flyingparchment> kjetilho: not at all.  hot-swap IO boards, more scalable systems...
[14:41:00] <FireflyST> okay.  But then my question is, how many are there of you, for every manager that has a sun contract and goes "Can we switch to Sun's x86 gear for cheaper?"
[14:41:10] <FireflyST> on the next upgrade cycle
[14:41:56] <FrostCS> Well if the organization is dumb enough to not weight in all the factors, they deserve what they get.
[14:42:16] <FrostCS> In many cases, it's cheaper to buy Sparc over x86.
[14:42:22] <FireflyST> no, IT budgets are dropping
[14:42:43] <FireflyST> all you need is one short sighted manager
[14:42:47] <FrostCS> Smaller IT organizations may have budgets being reduced.
[14:42:58] <oxygene> kjetilho: there's more to it - a sparc architecture with the variability in bus chipsets etc would fail just as often as a pc system
[14:43:26] <FrostCS> Military, and Financial establishments are still the major spenders..
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[14:43:51] <perlmonk> FireflyST, Instead of Linux/x86 you still can make the proposition for a switch to some BSD system... if your company doesn't insist on having support and stuff...
[14:44:00] <FrostCS> Perhaps one day people will learn to stop paying taxes, and putting money in banks, and using credit cards.. and then those budgets will fall as well.
[14:45:17] <FireflyST> Sun needs new markets for sparc hardware to succeed
[14:45:28] <kjetilho> oxygene: when the PC hardware is made by Sun, hopefully the variability of bus chipsets is avoided
[14:45:41] <FrostCS> Actually, Sun just needs to keep a hold on some old markets.
[14:45:59] <FrostCS> as long as money is coming in, what is stopping success?
[14:46:10] <FireflyST> it's narrow minded
[14:46:36] <oxygene> kjetilho: sure, if you restrict yourself to a (good!) single vendor, issues like that can be avoided - but that is true no matter which architecture
[14:46:47] <FrostCS> Sun's management problems, should not be an excuse to abuse what is good quality hardware..
[14:47:28] <kjetilho> oxygene: "<flyingparchment> until Sun works out they need to build sparc-quality x86 servers"
[14:47:58] <FireflyST> FrostCS: who were you just talking to in your last sentence?
[14:48:11] <kjetilho> perhaps I'm myopic, but I prefer to use redundant boxes rather than supporting hot-swap this and that.
[14:48:23] <kjetilho> Keep It Simple, Stupid
[14:48:41] <FrostCS> FireflyST, you... you mentioned narrow minded.
[14:48:48] <FireflyST> right
[14:49:06] <Stric> kjetilho: depends if the services allow that or not
[14:49:11] <FireflyST> I'm not understanding what you meant by that then
[14:49:18] <kjetilho> and stuff like the plethora of ALOM, ILOM, ELOM is a much bigger issue for me when considering server quality
[14:49:40] <FrostCS> FireflyST, who decides what markets Sun will approach?
[14:49:43] <kjetilho> Stric: all services can do it, but some are harder than others ...
[14:49:59] <FireflyST> FrostCS: Yes, ok.
[14:50:10] <FireflyST> Then your last statement I agree with
[14:51:01] <FrostCS> I am not a Sun fan-boy, nor IBM or any other company.. I will support any company who does something well, for what they do well, and acknowledge failure in other areas..
[14:51:40] <FireflyST> Sun fails almost as hard at marketing Sparc as IBM does at iSeries
[14:51:48] <FrostCS> That is why I recommend what I do, and do things that I see work.. if they break something.. I am sure someone else might do better in that area further along..
[14:52:06] <FrostCS> Sun has always failed at marketing, what else is new?
[14:52:27] <FrostCS> Atleast IBM has good ($$) sales staff, which overcomes some of that.
[14:52:46] <FireflyST> I will give Sun that their company is much better organized than IBM
[14:52:55] <FireflyST> especially in customer relations
[14:53:27] <FrostCS> From a historical point of view, IBM could sell a lump of dung to a University. Yet Sun couldn't get a peasant to take gold off it's hands.
[14:53:44] <FireflyST> you never, ever want to deal with AS/400 and iSeries customer realtions
[14:54:03] <FrostCS> IBM never was in it for the support.
[14:54:10] <FrostCS> They made the sale, that's good enough for them.
[14:54:41] <FrostCS> If something breaks, have customer support forward the customer to sales to buy a new box.
[14:54:51] <FrostCS> It's upgrade time anyway.
[14:55:16] <FireflyST> That's not generally my experience but OK
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[14:56:31] <FrostCS> Well, a bit of sarcasm was added for good measure, but that's the general concept.
[14:56:44] <FireflyST> you exaggerate a bit
[14:56:52] <FireflyST> they generally just want you off their telephone
[14:57:12] <FireflyST> i.e. you give them much more credit than they deserve
[14:57:35] <FrostCS> hrm, I thought that was HP who randomly disconnected callers..
[14:58:33] <FrostCS> FireflyST, it's been a while since I've even bothered to dial up any of IBM's support services, I am just recalling the past (10-15 years ago)
[14:58:52] <FireflyST> well it's worse now then
[14:59:01] <FrostCS> Though, it still seems to be that IBM can sell lumps of dung..
[14:59:11] <FrostCS> judging by IBM installations..
[14:59:34] <FireflyST> IBM could live off its bank account for 100+ more years
[14:59:57] <kjetilho> I think the performance of all these companies varies with where you're at
[15:00:17] <FireflyST> bllgh
[15:00:20] <FrostCS> IBM's big savings is not having to pay property tax.
[15:00:21] <FireflyST> I need a new AS/400
[15:00:24] <kjetilho> we're very happy with HP and Sun here in Norway, less so with IBM and Dell
[15:00:42] <FireflyST> or at least something that runs V5R4
[15:01:28] <FrostCS> Dell is another company good at dung sales.
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[15:14:34] <Berny> Frosty become a farmer and sell your dung to them :>
[15:16:55] <FrostCS> Don't need to be a farmer to sell dung. Just need to become a bigger eater.
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[15:28:28] <BatonT> hmm reinstalled sxce and now my samba wont let users authenticate to access files
[15:28:29] <BatonT>  (coppied my smb.conf from old install and run smbpasswd -a to add users)     any ideas?
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[15:34:09] <ries> BatonT: do the users also exists in the OS?
[15:34:49] <BatonT> yeah
[15:35:15] <BatonT> thing is i cant find anywhere under solaris to give me errors on why it isnt working
[15:35:38] <BatonT> ive set this up many times before...  just dont know why its not working
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[15:36:52] <Shinden> http://www.noooxml.org/petition
[15:36:55] <Shinden> sign in :]
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[15:42:43] <WickedWicky> heya Laca
[15:43:11] <laca> hey WickedWicky
[15:43:19] <WickedWicky> At work?
[15:43:47] <laca> well, at work == at home, so yes and no (;
[15:43:55] <WickedWicky> hehe
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[15:49:36] <ries> BatonT: I only know on samba you can setup extensive debugging
[15:49:41] <ries> turn it on and check the logfiles
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[15:58:57] <BatonT> ries: it kept telling me password missmatch  even though it was added va smbpasswd..  ended up coppying the smbpasswd and secrets file from old install and it fixed it
[15:59:14] <ries> that's odd....
[15:59:19] <ries> but glad you fixed it
[15:59:21] <BatonT> yeah very..
[16:00:21] <CIA-21> narayan: 6591825 ldc_read does not set qhead after processing control pkts
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[16:15:06] <holcomb> whoa
[16:15:10] <holcomb> qlc opened.  neat
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[16:18:56] <delewis> lpfc would be nice now
[16:19:10] <delewis> emlxs, I mean.
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[16:43:29] <brandini> Yay!
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[17:45:46] <trygvis> in general, is sun cc more strict on the syntax than gcc?
[17:47:31] <kjetilho> depends
[17:48:02] <kjetilho> Sun cc doesn't complain "Suggest putting parenthesis around assignment used as truth value" and other such nonsense
[17:48:06] <g4lt-mordant> in general, are bananas more yellow than ppperes?
[17:48:13] <g4lt-mordant> peppers even
[17:48:40] <bengtf> in general when dealing with templates it fails more often than other compilers
[17:51:32] <Pietro_S> also sunCC (C++) compiler has little problem using latest C standard features ...
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[18:02:42] <Pietro_S> should have PF_UNIX on Solaris same meaning as PF_LOCAL ?
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[18:17:02] <idnar> is it possible to have my root filesystem in a ZFS RAID-Z pool?
[18:17:55] <Stric> currently no
[18:17:56] <g4lt-mordant> you'd have to do a double-shuffle.  boot support for zfs is not perfected
[18:18:02] <Stric> mirrored, yes.. raidz, no
[18:18:48] <idnar> mmm. I guess I could add another drive, or something
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[18:24:16] <Shiv__> Has anyone over here built wxWidgets based apps?
[18:25:13] <Shiv__> I get linker errors when I try building them.
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[18:25:47] <Shiv__> The correct libs are being passed to the linker
[18:26:23] <Shiv__> nm output shows the symbols linker complains about and the library that exports the symbol match.
[18:27:20] <Shiv__> Strangely, the linker error has *unmangled* symbols.
[18:29:06] <Shiv__> Am trying to port a couple of apps to SXDE. gcc is the compiler used.
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[18:39:22] <Pietro_S> Shiv__: and do you have wxwidgets compiled by gcc?
[18:40:34] <Pietro_S> Shiv__: you probably need to link with SFEwxwidgets-gnu.spec package
[18:42:28] <Triskelios> Pietro_S: yes, PF_UNIX == PF_LOCAL
[18:44:04] <Shiv__> Pietro_S: Groan....how could I !  I think this is the reason. Will check the spec.
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[18:47:28] <Pietro_S> fiileservers which has sxce should be much faster ... I want it now! TM ;-)
[18:51:19] <Triskelios> yeah... the mirror that our university uses actually makes the downloads slower ><
[18:52:03] <Pietro_S> Triskelios: thanks, I looked that it's already registered bug in ON so hopefully the synonim will be done soon
[18:52:58] <Triskelios> I'm generally okay with submitting patches to software that use PF_LOCAL since PF_UNIX is more portable anyway
[18:53:29] <Pietro_S> I guess that next Friday, you can download sxce with 4 MB/s, but now too much dudes want to have it :-(
[18:55:13] <Pietro_S> no matter at least I try how SDM is good in resuming downloads
[18:56:41] <BatonT> what speed are you getting?
[18:57:49] <Pietro_S> 0 KB/s
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[18:59:44] <nachox> hey people
[19:02:07] <bobbyz> Quick question, the zfs docs say it's best to use a full disk rather than a slice for zfs.  I've done so for 5 of my hds, 3 in a raidz and 2 in a mirror.  However, I have another hd that I'm using to mirror my / and /export/home slices, which are ufs.  The rest of the space on the hd is unclaimed, and I was thinking of using it with zfs as simply scratch space for data that doesn't need redundancy.  Is it okay to use zfs on a single
[19:02:07] <bobbyz> slice in a scenario like this, or should using it on a slice still be avoided
[19:03:13] <BatonT> bobbyz: not sure but i use slice7 on my mirrored ufs root/boot drives  for zfs
[19:03:29] <BatonT> seems to work fine
[19:03:38] <Stric> bobbyz: the reason is just for a bit of additional performance
[19:03:49] <nachox> the docs say it is best to use the whole disk for zfs because if you use slices, zfs turns of the cache of the disk thats all
[19:03:54] <Stric> bobbyz: if zfs owns the whole disk, it will play with the hd write cache for performance
[19:04:13] <BatonT> hmm
[19:04:24] <bobbyz> Stric, BatonT, nachox:  Thanks.  I just wanted to make sure nothing would go 'boom' if I did it  :)
[19:04:29] <Stric> no boom
[19:04:41] <bobbyz> excellent
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[19:05:40] <BatonT> mm my zpool rebuild perfomance seems a bit crap...   28.6mb/sec
[19:06:08] <nachox> how many disks?
[19:06:13] <BatonT> 2
[19:06:21] <jbk> you said it's on a slice?
[19:06:24] <BatonT> 7200rpm sata
[19:06:39] <nachox> hmm, that doesnt sound too bad actually
[19:06:59] <BatonT> i am doing a zone install at the same time  and that is going terribly slow
[19:07:01] <Stric> BatonT: it doesn't do "raw disk reads", but only rebuilds the parts where there are files..
[19:07:28] <BatonT> yeah
[19:07:33] <BatonT> still it seems slow
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[19:07:42] <BatonT> looking at zpool iostat -v
[19:07:43] <WickedWicky> BatonT: didnt you say you were using legacy ATA mode?
[19:07:50] <BatonT> WickedWicky: yes :(
[19:07:57] <BatonT> crappy nvidia
[19:08:00] <AbsTradELic> X:::
[19:08:01] <WickedWicky> so that wont give you full SATA speed already
[19:08:15] <jbk> also, if it's just a slice and not the whole disk, you probably have write caching turned off
[19:08:16] <Stric> zfs rebuild is slower than "traditional" rebuilds, but that will be regained if your disk isn't full
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[19:08:44] <BatonT> well the disks are like ~90% full
[19:08:45] * WickedWicky just installed Rockbox on his ipod \o/
[19:09:10] <Stric> then zfs rebuilds will be slower than "traditional" rebuilds
[19:09:44] <WickedWicky> and he's using slices, not the entire disk, if he's doing it on the machine he installed this morning
[19:09:59] <BatonT> WickedWicky: yes correct
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[19:10:27] <BatonT> i've just been trying to get the mirrored pool off the old disks onto the 'new' ones
[19:11:07] <BatonT> course zfs has already reslivered the disks at least twice
[19:11:46] <BatonT> i attatched a new disk to current mirrored pool that i imported..  and after attatching it decided it needed to resliver the entire pool again
[19:12:03] <BatonT> quite annoying as it takes ~ 3h
[19:12:22] <nachox> how big are those disks?
[19:12:35] <WickedWicky> you're having a three way mirror?
[19:12:43] <BatonT> WickedWicky: i did for a bit
[19:13:17] <BatonT> then it decided it needed to resilver one of the old disks  so i detached it...  but then it decided it needed to resliver the new one that i though was already fine
[19:13:33] <WickedWicky> it will always resilver
[19:13:42] <WickedWicky> it has to bring all sub mirrors in sync with eachother
[19:13:50] <WickedWicky> that's kinda normal for whatever mirroring you use
[19:13:55] <WickedWicky> SVM will do the same
[19:14:09] <BatonT> if only i had more sata ports
[19:14:36] <WickedWicky> resilvering is a fancy word for resyncing/syncing
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[19:14:51] <nachox> nod
[19:15:00] <BatonT> and/or the extra sata card i baught actually worked (solaris dosnt even get to grub when card has drives plugged into it, but i can hotplug drives fine)
[19:15:01] <jamesd> the story of my life.. wait till you price out  4x sata port cards that are supported on ultra sprac.. $130... pci-x
[19:15:25] <bobbyz> BatonT:  http://www.supermicro.com/products/accessories/addon/AoC-SAT2-MV8.cfm  I'm loving that card.  8 ports and I got it for under $100
[19:15:33] <jamesd> er s/sprac/sparc/
[19:15:39] <BatonT> just wish the nvidia sata chipset would get native driver support
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[19:15:53] <WickedWicky> I thought this was done in ON70?
[19:16:00] <jamesd> it should.. that is what sun is using on the ultra 20
[19:16:01] <BatonT> well im on ON70 atm
[19:16:55] <BatonT> bobbyz: yeah i dont have PCIX though  i already have a dual port intel gigabit PCIX running in a PCI slot..  so pci bus has gotta be over utilised
[19:17:47] <jamesd> BatonT: i dont have a pcix slot either but i do have a 66mhz 64bit pci slot for it.. so it should get  60% or so of the performance.
[19:17:52] <Triskelios> BatonT: if your NVIDIA chip uses AHCI it should work
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[19:18:42] <BatonT> whats the commnand to see list of hotplug devices?
[19:19:12] <Triskelios> cfgadm
[19:19:15] <nachox> cfgadm
[19:19:33] <bobbyz> BatonT: if you decide you are interested in one, http://www.provantage.com/supermicro-aoc-sat2-mv8~7SUPM0X9.htm has a good price.  I found a couple of cheaper prices, but they didn't seem to be from very reliable sellers.  Provantage has lots of good user ratings
[19:19:53] <BatonT> bobbyz: im in australia though
[19:19:57] <bobbyz> oh  :)
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[19:21:58] <BatonT> i have this 4 port LSI sas controller sitting at work from a dell 1950  it looks like its pci express (although it wasn't mounted in a slot)  but it looks like the sas connector is a multilane or something
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[19:22:21] <BatonT> that would probably work alright (it is just a controller, no raid)
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[19:24:42] <nachox> with zfs who cares
[19:25:31] <BatonT> how do i see what driver my nvidia sata is using then?
[19:26:13] <nachox> prtconf?
[19:29:12] <bobbyz> or modinfo
[19:33:13] <BatonT> pci-ide  is all i see
[19:33:31] <bobbyz> prtconf -D
[19:34:43] <BatonT>         pci-ide, instance #1 (driver name: pci-ide)
[19:34:43] <BatonT>             ide, instance #2 (driver name: ata)
[19:34:43] <BatonT>                 cmdk, instance #0 (driver name: cmdk)
[19:35:21] <nachox> if you're using it in legacy mode, it is perfectly possible
[19:36:03] <Triskelios> check if your chip (scanpci) supports AHCI
[19:36:07] <BatonT> mm ok then
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[19:37:22] <BatonT> Triskelios: eer, and i do that how?
[19:37:37] <Triskelios> look up the specs/manual?
[19:37:55] <idnar> can anyone recommend a supported SATA PCI or PCIe card with more than 2 ports?
[19:38:22] <bobbyz> idnar: http://www.supermicro.com/products/accessories/addon/AoC-SAT2-MV8.cfm      http://www.provantage.com/supermicro-aoc-sat2-mv8~7SUPM0X9.htm
[19:38:33] <Triskelios> most things by Silicon Image or Marvell...
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[19:38:50] <nachox> marvell is still closed right?
[19:38:55] <idnar> bobbyz: those are PCI-X, aren't they?
[19:39:05] <bobbyz> yeah, but pci-x is backwards compatible with pci
[19:39:25] <WickedWicky> on a scale from 1 to 10 where 10 is screwed till the point you wish you didnt exist... when I accidently labeled the wrong disk, how screwed am I?
[19:39:39] <idnar> interesting, I thought it only worked the one way (plugging a PCI card into PCI-X)
[19:40:16] <bobbyz> nah, I've got some pci-x cards hanging out of pci slots  :)  it just runs with the pci bus width instead of pci-x
[19:40:26] <BatonT> idnar: so do i...
[19:40:36] <bobbyz> no different than if it were a pci card you tossed in there
[19:40:52] <idnar> yeah, so I see
[19:41:33] <bobbyz> someone in here (can't remember who) referred me to that super-micro card.  It's based on the marvel hercules 2 chipset that the x4500 uses.  It runs like a champ
[19:41:49] <BatonT> ahhhh
[19:42:11] <BatonT> bobbyz: don't spose you know of a PCIe version anywhere?
[19:42:19] <bobbyz> not off the top of my head, no
[19:43:11] <idnar> bobbyz: thanks for the info
[19:43:34] <Triskelios> WickedWicky: well, you should be okay if you can guess what the old label was
[19:43:45] <bobbyz> idnar: np.  The only annoyance is having all 8 ports on the end of the card as opposed to the side.  Aside form that, it's marvelous
[19:43:46] <Triskelios> WickedWicky:  (guess correctly)
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[19:44:23] <Triskelios> WickedWicky: maybe there's a backup label (my guess is all backups are replaced when you change it though)
[19:45:06] <nachox> i think so too
[19:45:19] <WickedWicky> that's just freaking briliant
[19:46:03] <nachox> maybe you have an old copy of the output of prtvtoc?
[19:46:06] <bobbyz> WickedWicky: I think gpart handles solaris labels
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[19:46:25] <bobbyz> I'ved used it before on non-solaris partition problems and it works great
[19:46:26] <WickedWicky> what basicly happened is that i labeled my root disk
[19:46:35] <WickedWicky> which also contained a slice dedicated to my zfs pool
[19:46:46] <nachox> ouch
[19:46:53] <WickedWicky> I dont care for reinstalling but i do care for the 600GB on mp3s in that ZFS pool
[19:47:14] <nachox> as long as they are mounted you should be able to make a backup
[19:47:52] <WickedWicky> I was rebooting to the latest onnv-gate
[19:48:33] <WickedWicky> ah well, I have 20mbps downstream, I should be able to get most of the mp3s I listen to back soon
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[19:49:43] <WickedWicky> good time to kick out all the ATA crap as well
[19:49:47] <bobbyz> WickedWicky: I just read a forum post about some software called Stellar Phoenix.  It looks like they have a demo that runs on solaris and handles ufs.  If it gives you anything verbose in terms of what it thinks the old labeling was, you might be okay
[19:49:53] * WickedWicky tries to look positive at life ;)
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[19:50:40] <WickedWicky> heya cmihai
[19:50:42] <nachox> ok, parted does not recognize ufs filesystems
[19:50:43] <cmihai> Hi
[19:51:54] <bobbyz> gpart handles ufs though.  I think trying gpart and then Stellar Phoenix would be a good start
[19:54:06] <WickedWicky> let's see
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[19:59:19] <Triskelios> would be worth looking for the signature of the beginning of the slice yourself
[20:00:13] <bobbyz> yeah, good call.  Zfs writes a pretty unique signature doesn't it?
[20:00:18] <CIA-21> vk199839: PSARC/2006/662 Make err/warn part of Solaris's libc, 6495220 add err() et al. to libc
[20:00:19] <CIA-21> mh27603: 6594536 Fix for 6587576 broke SPARC.
[20:02:04] <nachox> you dont even need the full label info, you need to know where zfs starts
[20:07:13] <WickedWicky> I just called a friend of mine, he has the data I need most (Ministry of Sound and Gatecrashers)
[20:07:31] <WickedWicky> so I guess this is a good moment to make my machine a SATA station and ditch the single PATA disks
[20:07:40] <WickedWicky> good moment to make ZFS mirrors as well
[20:07:59] <WickedWicky> instead of 7 single ATA disks in a pool, its kinda asking for problems
[20:10:49] <nachox> i'm guessing you were not mirroring in that pool :P
[20:11:18] <BatonT> hmm interactive performance on this recently installed box is still crap (like it was on old install)
[20:11:27] <BatonT> sometimes shell dosnt even respond for a bit
[20:11:42] <WickedWicky> nachox: no :P
[20:12:15] <nachox> ok, too many single points of failure
[20:14:17] <BatonT> hmmm i think this usb keyboard is causing some issues for this server
[20:14:57] <BatonT> almost like its sending too many events or something causing poor performance
[20:15:27] <WickedWicky> nachox: it basicly was ZFS learning/testing that ran a bit out of hand ;-)
[20:17:31] <nachox> WickedWicky, i just used files, much safer :P
[20:18:14] <nachox> but of course you can never say you learnt something untill you royally screw something using it
[20:18:44] <BatonT> mmm!
[20:18:51] <BatonT> well im sure sick of rebuilding my solaris box
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[20:19:52] <WickedWicky> nachox: this was a "done once, I know what it will do, thank you" moment :P
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[20:37:02] <BatonT> what the hell..   just as a resliver completed...  it has started again!
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[20:39:29] <nachox> 3rd time's a charm :P
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[20:40:39] <jbk> did you take any snapshots?
[20:41:02] <BatonT> ugh.. i wanna shut the system down to move the drives around
[20:41:11] <BatonT> and i just waited another hour before going to bed to do this
[20:41:17] <BatonT> its now 4:40am
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[20:41:22] <BatonT> i shouldnt have even bothered
[20:43:28] <nachox> go to sleep!
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[20:46:19] <tsp> WickedWicky: heh, I once did a dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/hda bs=1024k count=10 instead of sda
[20:46:53] <tsp> took me 3 days to get everything back - I backed up everything, then realized after reboot that I forgot to backup something important so had to run all these tools
[20:51:41] <WickedWicky> I just cut my losses and drink an extra coffee while Azureus and ncftp are doing their job
[20:51:50] <WickedWicky> I can cry about it but that wont do me any good
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[21:03:37] <idnar> data loss is never fun :/
[21:04:29] <BatonT> friggin zfs... trying to shut down system
[21:04:38] <BatonT> but the resliver is making it take ages
[21:04:51] <BatonT> been trying to shut down for least 15min now
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[21:05:21] <nachox> BatonT, your pc is in your room and is so noisy you cant sleep? :P
[21:05:31] <BatonT> no
[21:05:40] <BatonT> i cant leave it all open and goto bed
[21:05:44] <BatonT> cause cat will get into computer
[21:05:53] <BatonT> so i have to least close it u
[21:05:54] <BatonT> p
[21:06:11] <BatonT> and i have a drive outsdie system etc..
[21:06:15] <nachox> because it is warm and the cat is cold?
[21:06:27] <BatonT> no cause cat is a bastard and wants to get into everything
[21:06:33] <nachox> hahaha
[21:07:13] <BatonT> anyhow  i cant understand why this system is soooo slow running solaris
[21:07:23] <BatonT> dont know enough to try and debug the issues
[21:14:47] <tsp> BatonT: what are its specs?
[21:21:05] <BatonT> dual core amd 1gb ram
[21:21:24] <BatonT> an F revision one
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[21:26:45] <nachox> hmm, 1gb of  ram is not that much for zfs
[21:26:59] <BatonT> yeah im getting more for it
[21:27:08] <BatonT> just another 1gb for now
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[21:27:38] <BatonT> hopefully 2gb modules will come down and i'll be able to get some of them for it too
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[21:40:35] <palowoda> BatonT: The nvidia sata when native in build 72: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/on/flag-days/71-75/
[21:40:45] <palowoda> s/when/went
[21:41:58] <palowoda> And 2G modules are down around 89.00 these days.
[21:42:51] <BatonT> palowoda: geeze... well  i should have held off reinstalling till then..
[21:43:12] <BatonT> i thought i checked the flag-days, guess i missed that one
[21:43:56] <palowoda> It think it was updated a day or two ago.  So it's not like everyone knew.
[21:44:02] <BatonT> ahh
[21:44:08] <BatonT> i checked that page 2days ago
[21:44:13] <BatonT> i think
[21:44:28] <palowoda> I did too. That is why I was suprised also.
[21:45:42] <BatonT> guess i'll be trying my first bfu or live upgrade or whatever in a week or so
[21:47:12] <palowoda> 71 and 72 are are going to end up coming fast after the log jam of build 70.  At least there is a lot of good changes coming.
[21:47:30] <BatonT> i do wonder what is with all those broken links on the flag days page
[21:48:38] <palowoda> Most likely website problems.  By the time you see the changes in heads up most of the stuff has been done.
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[21:51:35] <palowoda> And my cat tends to walk on the keyboards when she is hungry.  Which I kick her outside.
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[21:56:20] <palowoda> Her latest trick is to run into the office and dig her claws into my chair, which I can lift the chair off the ground via the cat.  Amazing what they do for food.
[21:58:36] <BatonT> geee
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[22:03:26] <BatonT> well no point waiting for latest reslivering of 3-way mirror to finish whilst installing 3 zones...  so im off to bed!
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[22:18:39] <tsp> What happened to the date command? It was printing in a more readable format (something like Saturday, august 18, 2007....) but something changed it into the unix cryptic format again
[22:19:03] <tsp> and I can't seem to figure out what - probably between S10 and B69 somewhere
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[22:21:04] <kjetilho> what is unix cryptic format?
[22:22:41] <nachox> ??
[22:22:41] <tsp> Sat Aug 18 13:22:19 PDT 2007
[22:23:01] <nachox> kjetilho, meaning?
[22:23:32] <nachox> ohh
[22:23:35] <kjetilho> you think that is cryptic? :-)
[22:24:43] <tsp> my other box is printing
[22:24:46] <tsp> Saturday, August 18, 2007  1:24:04 PM PDT
[22:25:01] <kjetilho> ugh, cryptic AM/PM time
[22:25:11] <nachox> lol
[22:25:28] <kjetilho> quick -- what is 12 AM in the night or in the day?
[22:25:43] <kjetilho> who can tell without thinking about it?
[22:25:46] <tsp> heh
[22:25:49] <nachox> it is not even important
[22:26:12] <oxygene> kjetilho: midnight - for some weird reason, they count "12, 1, 2, 3, .."
[22:26:13] <tsp> I don't like the am/pm time, but I want to know why date is printing like that on my B66 vmware box, but not on the B69 sparc
[22:26:57] <nachox> maybe you have diferent locales?
[22:27:14] <tsp> locales would make that much of a difference?
[22:27:41] <tsp> where do I set my default locale? Or find it
[22:27:42] <kjetilho> yes, try "env LC_TIME=de_DE date"
[22:27:56] <kjetilho> cat /etc/default/init
[22:28:16] <kjetilho> or in your own .bashrc (or similar)
[22:28:49] <tsp> ah, LC_TIME=en_CA.ISO8859-1
[22:29:05] <nachox> damn i'm too cool :P
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[22:30:53] <tsp> ack, the only speech dirver in solaris is freetts
[22:31:00] * tsp can't even get it to talk :)
[22:32:14] <nachox> orca?
[22:32:54] <tsp> no, test-speech
[22:33:01] <tsp> my U5 would die if I launched orca on it
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[22:39:40] <newpers> is opensolaris capable of running xen images (hypervisor) yet?
[22:40:12] <nachox> check the xen related blogs
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[22:45:14] <devans> Anyone available for a network question? (Should be simple)
[22:45:34] <kjetilho> don't ask to ask
[22:46:35] <devans> I have an e1000g connection that should be running at 1gb but drops to 100mb after several seconds. (opensol_68)
[22:47:24] <idnar> 12 am is midnight, because the morning begins at the beginning of the hour, hence it is "AM"
[22:48:46] <devans> in /var/adm/messages: NOTICE: e1000g0 link up, 1000 Mbps, full duplex, then 6 seconds later, NOTICE: e1000g0 link up, 100 Mbps, full duplex
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[22:51:28] <kjetilho> devans: that's very strange, never seen anything like that.  is this connected to a switch with management?
[22:51:56] <devans> unfortunately, no.  Just a dumb switch
[22:52:44] <kjetilho> do you get connectivity during those 6 seconds?
[22:52:47] <devans> it is an integrated nic on an intel DQ965GF motherboard.
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[22:53:40] <devans> I don't actually know.  I believe this occurs during starting, let me review logs.
[22:55:09] <devans> Yes the link does go down, 3 seconds after the initial link comes up.
[22:56:53] <[ade]> 'ebes. I'm hunting down a compiler bug; anyone got a CC newer than nv_64 willing to try a one-liner? template<typename T> struct Example { static const unsigned int s = sizeof(T*); } ; class A; Example<A> s;
[22:58:02] <devans> kjetilho: Here is the full line of the link going down, perhaps the ID is of some use: Aug 16 19:19:47 solaris-devx mac: [ID 486395 kern.info] NOTICE: e1000g0 link down
[22:58:23] <kjetilho> try it with a different switch
[23:00:27] <devans> Don't have one here at the moment, but will bring it into the office and try on the switches there.  I do know that the switch works, as I have a winxp box that runs at full speed on the switch.
[23:01:56] <kjetilho> okay, look for similar reports on bugs.opensolaris.org ?
[23:11:49] <devans> couldn't find anything in the bugs, can I force the network card to only negotiate at 1000mbps?
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[23:13:33] <kjetilho> devans: yes, via ndd, but I don't know exactly how.
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[23:14:51] <devans> kjetilho: thx, I'll do a little man reading and see if I can figure it out.
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[23:37:48] <kito> is there a way to determine the time of last shutdown?
[23:38:35] <Chipdancer> last | grep system\ down | head -1
[23:40:37] <kito> cheers
[23:41:56] <bda> Or uptime and a little math. ;-)
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[23:42:50] <nachox> can anyone see the ksh93 integration jive forum? i think it's somewhat broken
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[23:43:36] <Chipdancer> bda: doesn't take into account if the system was just rebooted or has been in an offline state for sometime
[23:44:32] <bda> Chipdancer: Winking thingy implies a facetious demeanor, sir.
[23:44:41] <Chipdancer> bda :)
[23:46:08] *** jcsmith has quit IRC
[23:51:01] <coffman> hey there
[23:51:04] <coffman> just curios
[23:51:13] <coffman> when did b70 came out?
[23:51:24] <Tpent1> about 12 hours ago i think
[23:51:29] <coffman> k
[23:53:19] <coffman> did i bitched about the download speed? :P
[23:53:32] <coffman> i mean its not that bad as on netbeans
[23:53:44] * Tpent1 heads back to bed as he was awake way too early
[23:54:38] <coffman> Tpent1: hf
[23:58:04] <WickedWicky> can somebody please flash my DVD-RAM player with clue support?
[23:58:32] *** Red_Cloud has quit IRC





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