[00:00:06] <dlg> thats the cat saying hi
[00:00:16] <jbk> afternoon
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[00:02:07] <solaara_> bye all
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[00:36:31] <axisys> how do I boot sparc in debug mode
[00:36:56] <axisys> when I boot from cdrom I get this The file just loaded does not appear to be executable.
[00:37:10] <axisys> is it boot -kv ?
[00:37:36] <axisys> {0} ok boot -kv
[00:37:36] <axisys> Boot device: /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@0,0  File and args: -kv
[00:37:36] <axisys> Short disk read
[00:37:36] <axisys> The file just loaded does not appear to be executable.
[00:37:45] <axisys> anyother debug option?
[00:37:50] <axisys> i have the cdrom inside too
[00:37:55] <axisys> cannot boot even from cdrom
[00:38:18] <jmcp> axisys: try  boot /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/sd@0,0
[00:38:35] <jmcp> what you need is the correct bootpath, rather than a debug option
[00:40:07] <axisys> i just tried boot /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@6,0:f -s
[00:40:16] <axisys> did not see your comment
[00:40:24] <axisys> i will try yours as soon as that fails
[00:40:26] <jmcp> oh, sorry - you wanted cdrom
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[00:40:35] <axisys> jmcp: either way
[00:40:36] <jmcp> try "sd@6,0" instead of "disk@6,0"
[00:40:41] <axisys> wow.. that worked
[00:40:43] <axisys> cool
[00:40:48] <axisys> cdrom that is
[00:41:13] <jmcp> and here's why: the disk@ alias in obp doesn't seem to get mapped properly back to sd
[00:41:24] <jmcp> axisys: an e450 or u60/u80 system?
[00:41:36] <axisys> e250
[00:42:06] <tomww> it's been since ages, that the names in solaris an OBP for disk/sd have been different :-)
[00:42:15] <jmcp> axisys: yeah, same basic hardware
[00:42:17] <tomww> somewhat confusing :-)
[00:42:22] <axisys> jmcp: yep
[00:42:27] <jmcp> axisys: obp 3.x is the best you'll get, sorry
[00:42:41] <axisys> jmcp: so once that is successful I will try disk as u suggested
[00:42:48] <axisys> jmcp: heh
[00:42:52] <jmcp> actually, I suggested "sd" not disk
[00:42:53] * jmcp shrugs
[00:43:08] <axisys> oh ok
[00:43:26] <axisys> well I am guessing it is the same reason i could not booot from disk
[00:43:47] <axisys> i guess I have to redefine my devaliases
[00:43:56] <jmcp> axisys: possibly
[00:44:51] <axisys> http://rafb.net/p/FoqLvb10.html
[00:45:01] <axisys> oops pasted twice
[00:45:27] <axisys> let me go back to ok prompt and then reboot using full disk device path
[00:46:26] <axisys> trying this now {0} ok boot /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@0,0 -s
[00:47:34] <axisys> Rebooting with command: boot /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@0,0 -s
[00:47:34] <axisys> Boot device: /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@0,0  File and args: -s
[00:47:34] <axisys> Short disk read
[00:47:35] <axisys> The file just loaded does not appear to be executable.
[00:47:53] <axisys> hmm.. did not like the disk.. how do I make sure that the device path is correct?
[00:47:59] <axisys> set-defaults ?
[00:49:35] <jmcp> show-devs
[00:49:48] <jmcp> do you have a disk @ target 0 ?
[00:51:32] <axisys> jmcp: here are show-devs and devalias http://rafb.net/p/rfmlAs92.html
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[00:53:36] <axisys> jmcp: yes http://rafb.net/p/UjHR0a13.html
[00:55:55] <jmcp> axisys: so you should be able to run "boot cdrom" and boot ok off the cdrom. that's good
[00:56:15] <axisys> yes
[00:56:20] <jmcp> for booting off disk ... what's the output of "printenv boot-device" ?
[00:57:03] <axisys> boot-device           disk net
[00:57:21] <Doc> http://blogs.adobe.com/genesisproject/Windows-iPhone.jpg
[00:57:22] <jmcp> then you need to rearrange your alias for "disk"
[00:57:33] <jmcp> axisys: sorry, no you don't
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[00:57:43] <jmcp> axisys: your "bootdiska" and "bootdiskb" aliases need changing
[00:57:55] <jmcp> Doc: that's evil
[00:59:04] <axisys> jmcp: i dont use them
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[00:59:13] <jmcp> nowurries then
[00:59:49] <axisys> but boodting from `disk' still fails :-(
[01:00:27] <CIA-27> mp153739: PSARC/2006/690 Kerberos client configuration improvements, 6496710 enable dns_lookup_kdc by default, 6499339 krb zero conf needs better realm lookup logic, 6523887 krb should support client side referrals, 6528391 krb5.conf should not be delivered in a misconfigured state
[01:00:28] <sommerfeld> Doc: saw that sort of thing last time I flew home through Heathrow -- one of the flight information displays kept displaying a 90-degree-rotated Windows advertisement every few minutes
[01:00:28] <CIA-27> ek110237: 6498144 ::kmastat could be even easier to read, 6580855 spa_scrub() should be called with spa_namespace_lock held, not the config lock
[01:00:29] <CIA-27> fw157321: 6587389 prtdiag -v Formatting issues (fix ELF versioning)
[01:00:57] <jmcp> axisys: try changing disk to /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/sd@0,0  instead
[01:01:04] <jmcp> a foible of obp3.x iirc
[01:01:25] <Doc> sommerfeld: yah.. in general it's old news (our train timetable displays often bluescreen or return DHCP errors), but an ad for apple?
[01:01:57] <sommerfeld> yeah, you'd think they'd have a "don't use the competitor" clause there
[01:03:03] <axisys> jmcp: http://rafb.net/p/4VLDBk98.html
[01:03:45] <sommerfeld> "just this once, build the sign out of a mac mini.."
[01:04:18] <jmcp> axisys: weird ... which path worked for you before?
[01:04:58] <axisys> jmcp: for disk none has been working since this morning
[01:05:29] <axisys> jmcp: set-defaults did not help either
[01:05:44] <axisys> how to reset to correct device path ?
[01:06:29] <jmcp> you need to find the correct device path, then type         devalias disk correctdevicepath
[01:06:31] <axisys> this is the only thing worked.. which is cdrom
[01:06:33] <axisys> {0} ok boot /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@6,0:f -s
[01:07:18] <axisys> there is no way to reset the device path besides guessing and what devaliad/show-devs tell ya?
[01:08:41] <jmcp> there's a difference between resetting the obp variable, and finding out what to set it to
[01:08:42] <jmcp> setenv auto-boot?=false    then    reset-all     then     probe-scsi-all
[01:09:25] <axisys> cool..
[01:09:31] <axisys> resetting..
[01:11:03] <axisys> jmcp: http://rafb.net/p/t9ZlBr41.html
[01:12:21] <jmcp> axisys: was it booting ok before today?
[01:12:58] <axisys> jmcp: yes for few yrs actually
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[01:13:42] <axisys> i may have to reseat the disk .. who knows
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[01:14:33] <jmcp> axisys: how about boot /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/sd@0,0:a ?
[01:15:37] <axisys> jmcp: cannot open boot device
[01:15:49] <jmcp> :(
[01:15:54] <jmcp> I'd be re-seating it at this point
[01:16:31] <axisys> {0} ok boot /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@8,0:a -s
[01:16:31] <axisys> Boot device: /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@8,0:a  File and args: -s
[01:16:32] <axisys> Fast Data Access MMU Miss
[01:16:44] <axisys> that is aliased as disk1
[01:16:52] <jmcp> are you sure that this system actually boots?
[01:17:33] <axisys> jmcp: 100%
[01:17:41] <axisys> jmcp: check this out
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[01:17:49] <richlowe> So, what did you do that made it cease booting?
[01:17:55] <jmcp> do you have media in the cd to boot from? would be worthwhile booting to single user off it, and then examining the disks
[01:17:56] <axisys> jmcp: after reset-all .. now boot cdrom -s works just fine
[01:18:11] <axisys> booting from cdrom now
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[01:20:37] <axisys> jmcp: u gonna like this
[01:20:38] <axisys> jmcp: http://rafb.net/p/ouTBdj83.html
[01:20:55] <jmcp> good
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[01:21:10] <jmcp> now look at the vtocs and see what's there
[01:22:13] <axisys> http://rafb.net/p/rchYSl98.html
[01:22:27] <axisys> i will try to mount root slice.. to check for fsck issue
[01:23:01] <axisys> # mount /dev/dsk/c0t0d0s0 /a
[01:23:01] <axisys> WARNING: Error accessing ufs log for /a; Please run fsck(1M)
[01:23:01] <axisys> mount: I/O error
[01:23:01] <axisys> mount: cannot mount /dev/dsk/c0t0d0s0
[01:23:13] <jmcp> ha!
[01:23:50] <axisys> however I can mount the second disk fine
[01:23:51] <axisys> mount /dev/dsk/c0t8d0s0 /a
[01:23:55] <Triskelios> told you the disk was bad. time to run format's 'analyze'
[01:24:24] <axisys> Triskelios: :P
[01:24:37] <axisys> i have two disk mirrored
[01:24:46] <jmcp> no you don't :-)
[01:24:47] <axisys> second disk root mounts fine
[01:26:26] <axisys> jmcp: i will go ahead and try to boot from second disk
[01:26:51] <axisys> second disk: /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/sd@8,0
[01:26:57] <axisys> according to format
[01:28:32] <axisys> jmcp: so what would be the OBP boot path?
[01:28:44] <axisys> /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/sd@8,0 OR /pci@1f,4000/scsi@3/disk@8,0
[01:28:47] <axisys> ?
[01:29:21] <jmcp> the second
[01:29:36] <axisys> cool ... invoked that already.. excellent!
[01:29:45] <axisys> looking good so far
[01:30:28] <axisys> jmcp: oops
[01:30:56] <axisys> jmcp: http://rafb.net/p/HcMcmO37.html
[01:31:47] <jmcp> try adding :a to the boot path
[01:31:48] <axisys> jmcp: do I need to installboot ?
[01:31:53] <axisys> jmcp: ok
[01:31:58] <jmcp> this is mirrored with vxvm, right?
[01:32:34] <axisys> jmcp: svm
[01:32:44] <axisys> same error
[01:33:10] <jmcp> it really does look like you're hosed. As richlowe asked, what happened which stopped this from booting?
[01:33:56] <axisys> jmcp: so i could run an upgrade to fix the os and not loosing data ?
[01:34:53] <jmcp> what's installed at the moment
[01:34:53] <jmcp> ?
[01:35:34] <axisys> i am some netcool application installed on the ZFS partition
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[01:35:40] <axisys> i have that is
[01:35:46] <nachox> evening
[01:36:53] <axisys> jmcp: slice 7 is zfs http://rafb.net/p/rchYSl98.html
[01:37:23] <axisys> 0 - ufs, 1 - swap, 6 - metadb and 7 - zfs
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[01:37:34] <jmcp> so you should be able to zpool import once you've got a booted system
[01:38:19] <axisys> so I could upgrade from sol 10 u3 to sol 10 u3 w/o loosing data.. i am almost positive
[01:38:29] <axisys> i will take a brk and then give that a try
[01:38:34] <jmcp> it's worth a try
[01:38:58] <axisys> the e250 does not have a dvd .. so i need to point it to my jumpstart server for the upgrade
[01:39:05] <axisys> dvd reader that is
[01:39:32] <axisys> i will let u guys how that goes.. thanks a lot
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[01:49:07] <lloy0076> If I create a pool configuration, where the pool contains a min processors of 1 and max processors of 1, and the default pool configuration says there can be a min of 1 processor and max of 65535 processors (!)....
[01:49:35] <lloy0076> ...I take it that the single processor pool will only use one but that the other default pool can use ALL the CPUs including the one that the single processor pool is on.
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[01:51:10] <nachox> there is surprisingly little news about niagra 2 today
[01:51:41] <jmcp> was there an announcement?
[01:51:47] <richlowe> jmcp: No.
[01:52:13] <nachox> only a thereg news
[01:52:32] <nachox> http://www.theregister.com/2007/08/06/niagaraii_out_sun/
[01:52:52] <sommerfeld> http://money.cnn.com/2007/08/06/technology/sun_microsystems.reut/index.htm?source=yahoo_quote predicts an announcement tomorrow
[01:53:04] * jmcp loves predictions
[01:54:03] <lloy0076> They look nice (and expensive).
[01:54:37] <jmcp> lloy0076: new tech generally is expensive
[01:55:03] <nachox> premium with a big P
[01:55:08] <flyingparchment> curious, Linux df considers 2290522200 kb to be 2.2T, but solaris considers it 2.1T
[01:55:23] <alanc> Niagara 1 wasn't that expensive
[01:55:43] <flyingparchment> (linux seems to be in the wrong here, it's 2.13TB)
[01:55:59] <richlowe> 2.1 looks more accurate to me.
[01:56:27] <nachox> no, niagra 1 was affordable
[01:56:45] <nachox> well, is
[01:57:36] <lloy0076> Define 'affordable' - do you mean affordble by someone with no job or affordable for someone with the assets of a Bill Gates?
[01:57:49] <jmcp> lloy0076: businesses
[01:58:28] <nachox> a startup should be able to buy a niagra1 based box
[01:58:44] <nachox> without any VC :P
[02:00:18] <CIA-27> johansen: 6565894 sata drives are not identified by si3124 driver, 6566207 si3124 driver loses interrupts.
[02:00:54] <alanc> Sun has sold video cards that cost more than the entry level of Niagara 1 servers did
[02:01:13] <alanc> but then Sun has sold video cards that cost more than a new car...
[02:01:29] <nachox> the high end neptune based card probably costs more than a niagra box
[02:01:55] <jbk> neptune?
[02:01:58] <jbk> i thought those were $500
[02:02:57] <nachox> i was thinking more along the 1000 for the entry level, i'm not sure now, maybe you're right
[02:03:28] <palowoda> Did all those SATA bugs just get integrated into a build?  I'm interested in 6566207.
[02:04:21] <sommerfeld> Palowoda: 6566207 should be in snv_71 (assuming it doesn't get backed out..)
[02:04:30] <palowoda> very cool.
[02:04:53] <jbk> hmm looks like you were right...
[02:05:05] <jbk> could have sworn i saw it mentioned for $500 somewhere..
[02:08:35] <nachox> http://store.sun.com/CMTemplate/CEServlet?process=SunStore&cmdViewProduct_CP&catid=173648
[02:09:15] <palowoda> I'm looking forward for some business to put the new T2 processor in one of those new low powered lightbulbs controlling the amount of photons based on ambient light.   Thus the volume will go up and the price should be reasonable by the 4th quarder.
[02:09:49] <palowoda> quater.
[02:10:04] <jbk> i wish i could work on the T2's
[02:10:26] <jbk> but i think that's gonna require switching jobs :)
[02:10:46] <nachox> same here
[02:11:38] <jbk> this place kinda didn't tell me the whole truth before i accepted it
[02:11:50] <nachox> ??
[02:12:14] <jbk> i tried asking about standards, roadmaps, etc.
[02:12:34] <sommerfeld> i never expect to learn the whole truth during the interview process.  but i do expect the high order bits to be vaguely accurate
[02:12:38] <jbk> they didn't mention they were planning to phase out every application in this division, to be replaced by one giant application running on a bunch of linux boxes
[02:12:52] <jbk> just 'oh yeah, we have both solaris and linux'
[02:13:21] <jbk> and the application is being developed by a group outside of IT that doesn't want to follow any of the rules or use any of the IT infrastructure (can you say hardcoded IP addresses?)
[02:14:40] <palowoda> Err Linux developers hardcode IP address?
[02:14:42] <nachox> jbk, can you say "i will have to deal with lots of random crap derived from bad coding and unproper testing" ? :P
[02:15:27] <jbk> but on the plus side, they move a lot slower than my old job, which is nice in the sense that they're not constantly cutting corners on everything to try to meet always impossible deadlines, with the operations people left to clean up the mess while those responsible for the mess have no accountability and don't get woke up in the middle of the night :)
[02:15:37] <sommerfeld> jbk: your best hope is that the giant app will follow the path of the Vasa: roll over and sink soon after it's put into production.
[02:15:42] <jbk> not that that was ever a constant problem at my old employer :P
[02:16:24] <Tempt> Man, why would anyone with an existing Solaris investment (and therefore skills) deploy an application on penguinOS? That's just stupid.
[02:16:31] <Tempt> Might as well deploy it on Windows for all the good it'll do.
[02:16:42] <jbk> well i'm hoping either to transfer to another group internally after a while, or stay long enough that it won't look like job hopping if i leave
[02:16:55] <jbk> well they have solaris, linux, and aix
[02:17:13] <jbk> and outside of this division, things are a bit different
[02:17:22] <nachox> Tempt, management
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[02:17:53] <Tempt> You've got a good reason to get out; get out while you can. Before you've got a failed project to sully your reputation.
[02:18:11] <jbk> *shrug* it won't be a reflection on me if it fails
[02:18:12] <Tempt> RedHat buying greasy drinks for your management again.
[02:18:28] <nachox> Tempt, i know one big company that is phasing out newish AIX boxes that work fine because management gave the order to use opensource apps whenever possible
[02:18:38] <jbk> no idea
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[02:19:08] <jbk> though there is an amusing rumor from my old employer about such things :)
[02:19:26] <Tempt> nachox: You should name them for extra humiliation.
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[02:19:28] <jbk> though it was dealing with storage, not OS
[02:19:44] <nachox> Tempt, i cant, NDA
[02:20:23] <jbk> basically the story goes that in exchange for buying several million in storage (new vendor, untested), some vp got to golf with tiger woods
[02:20:40] <jbk> problem was, that whole untested part :)
[02:20:53] <nachox> hahaha
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[02:20:54] <jbk> turns out they had a _slight_ bug
[02:21:06] <jbk> active/passive array connected to a fc fabric
[02:21:13] <jbk> and when you'd fail over controllers
[02:21:22] <jbk> the passive controller would log out and then back into the fabric
[02:21:45] <jbk> which, if you're paying close attention, means that for a small period, the array is completely logged out of the fabric
[02:21:46] <jmcp> that can get nasty
[02:21:51] <jbk> well
[02:22:17] <Tempt> That's quite funny, really.
[02:22:20] <jbk> the 4.4.4 storage foundation kit had a bug which allowed things to magically work
[02:22:25] <Tempt> Must be remarkably shitty hardware.
[02:22:25] <jbk> 4.4.6 fixed it :)
[02:22:36] <jbk> and veritas doesn't like it when all the paths to it's disk go away :)
[02:22:46] <sommerfeld> lots and lots of stuff works purely by accident
[02:22:53] <jbk> well to top it off, the vendor denied for 6-9 months that it was their issue
[02:22:54] <nachox> it is, but sounds like something you could fix with an updated firmware
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[02:23:14] <jbk> sun, to their credit, came out and proved what the issue was
[02:23:15] <Tempt> And let me guess, you can't out the storage vendor?
[02:23:38] <jbk> and we found out later that the vendor knew of the issue all along
[02:23:41] <sommerfeld> jbk: which is to say we proved that the array let go with both hands at the same time?
[02:23:51] <jbk> yes
[02:24:11] <jbk> Tempt: i probably could, i never signed any NDAs
[02:24:31] <nachox> usual behaviour, deny the problem exists and fix it in a firmware update masked as something else
[02:24:34] <Tempt> Were they a big name in the storage marketplace? If not, it probably doesn't matter.
[02:24:45] <jbk> well we even reasonably believed it wasn't a solaris issue -- EMC & hitachi all worked fine
[02:24:58] <jbk> Tempt: well yes, but not for block-based storage
[02:25:09] <jbk> which should be enough to figure it out :)
[02:25:15] <jbk> they have supposedly fixed the issue
[02:25:16] <nachox> HP?
[02:25:30] <jbk> hp just resells hitachi's (or did at least)
[02:25:53] <Tempt> No, HP has the EVA line of storage at least.
[02:26:09] <Tempt> And they were reselling the DEC vintage stuff (StorageWorks) for aaaages.
[02:26:29] <jmcp> jbk: HP is very keen to point out that they have an almost-equal engineering relationship with HDS, instead of being "merely" an OEM
[02:26:43] <jbk> haha
[02:26:46] <Tempt> Indeed.
[02:26:51] <nachox> they do the same with itanic <wink>
[02:26:58] <Tempt> Then why don't they ditch their own storage?
[02:27:07] <jbk> in theory, perhaps
[02:27:20] <jbk> but there's a saying about the difference between theory and practice :)
[02:27:53] <jbk> the HP techs were far less trained than the hitachi guys, and HP for several pulled some crap
[02:28:24] <Doc> yes and no
[02:28:26] <nachox> moral of the story: buy from hitachi? :)
[02:28:35] <jbk> we had to pay 3x what it'd cost us to buy the array from hitachi to get it from HP
[02:28:35] <sommerfeld> jbk: so, in looking at a list of Tiger's corporate sponsors:  they bought the disk arrays from Target? :-)
[02:28:35] <Doc> the thing with HP is that they actually have their own firmware
[02:28:50] <jbk> just to get a hack that allowed more than 7 luns/target on hp-ux
[02:28:56] <nachox> sommerfeld, hehehe
[02:29:28] <jbk> sommerfeld: this was a few years ago :)
[02:29:33] <Tempt> Hitachi storage is fine stuff; low stress. Why mess with something that works?
[02:30:15] <jbk> it worked well for us
[02:30:25] <jbk> at least before we had a dedicated storage team
[02:30:32] <jbk> then they needed better 'tools' that EMC supposedly has
[02:30:37] <Doc> i supported the Sun HDS boxes for about 4 years... they are nice systems
[02:30:38] <jbk> but that's another story :)
[02:30:55] <jbk> i liked being able to carve my own storage
[02:30:56] <Tempt> EMC has many tools
[02:31:01] <Tempt> Complete and utter tools
[02:31:32] <jbk> the hitachi guys were pretty cool about it
[02:31:55] <jbk> 'if you want us to do it, just call and we'll come out, or here's how you do it if you want to do it yourself'
[02:32:00] <jbk> took about 10 minutes to learn
[02:32:07] <jbk> at least on the 7700s
[02:32:22] <moazamraja> netapp! :P
[02:32:38] <jbk> :)
[02:32:45] <Tempt> jbk: The joy of "storage navigator"? <g>
[02:33:02] <jbk> moazamraja: i'm neither confirming nor denying that
[02:34:16] <nachox> ouch, netapp? really?
[02:34:47] <Tempt> He's neither confirming nor denying that.
[02:34:58] <Tempt> I wouldn't be surprised if NetApp did that though.
[02:35:13] <Tempt> They seem to have major patches released every thirty seconds.
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[02:35:48] <Doc> netapp are still around?
[02:36:07] <jmcp> Doc: yeah
[02:36:13] <Tempt> Sadly, yes.
[02:36:15] <jmcp> I got an offer from them a few months back
[02:36:33] <Tempt> They deserve to die in a fire
[02:36:38] <Doc> jmcp: not in support by any chance?
[02:36:46] <jbk> i sense... anger
[02:37:07] <jmcp> Doc: yes, actually ... from a certain ex-Sun person
[02:37:14] <jmcp> and I'm sure you know who I mean
[02:37:15] <Doc> heh.. Mark V?
[02:37:18] <jmcp> indeed
[02:37:33] <Doc> no better reason to say no :)
[02:37:34] <Tempt> Haha.
[02:37:38] <Tempt> That's quite funny.
[02:37:51] <jmcp> Tempt: you know him too?
[02:38:06] <Doc> jmcp: you know kevin pinkerton from canberra?
[02:38:24] <jmcp> yeah
[02:38:29] <jmcp> good bloke
[02:38:36] <jmcp> I taught him SGR in Singapore a few years back
[02:38:45] <Doc> he works for cisco now
[02:38:48] <jmcp> aha
[02:38:51] <jmcp> when did he leave?
[02:39:11] <nachox> which reminds me, remember the company i said was leaving aix? guess what they use for storage? :P
[02:39:26] <Doc> month or so ago
[02:39:32] <jbk> sharks?
[02:39:44] <Tempt> RedHat and NetApp seem to have some sort of back scratching arrangement
[02:41:51] <jbk> i need to start thinking about a new project to work on...
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[02:43:06] <jbk> as i think the current one i'm doing should hopefully be winding down pending some final testing...
[02:45:34] <jbk> wonder how e^ipi's been doing on the libc_i18n stuff..
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[02:57:59] <moazamraja> i dunno, netapp works great for me
[02:58:14] <jbk> i think they work well for nas
[02:58:53] <moazamraja> that's what we use em for
[02:59:13] <FunkyELF> so I was reading... belenix isn't installable?
[02:59:18] <FunkyELF> its just a live cd?
[02:59:39] <nachox> both i think
[03:00:16] <CIA-27> willard: PSARC/2007/126 Turgo Platform SW Support, 6538562 Need Turgo platform support in ON
[03:01:01] <nachox> Turgo?
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[03:52:36] * jbk drops a pin
[03:53:38] <Tempt> clink
[03:58:00] <jmcp> jbk: don't tread on it
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[04:00:59] * dlg yawn
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[04:30:27] <sbahra> how do i reboot into cd with a sun blade again?
[04:31:29] <jbk> boot cdrom
[04:31:30] <dlg> get to ofw
[04:31:32] <dlg> boot cdrom
[04:31:40] <sbahra> no, from solaris itself
[04:31:57] <sbahra> There was a command where I can specify default action on boot.
[04:32:00] <wesolows> reboot -- cdrom may work
[04:32:10] <jmcp> wesolows: gday, how's SF today?
[04:32:12] <sbahra> Hmmm, I'll give that a shot. Thanks.
[04:32:19] <wesolows> jmcp: chilly
[04:32:26] <jmcp> we had a cold morning here
[04:32:31] <jmcp> had to put socks on!
[04:32:40] <wesolows> sbahra: I think those options are only passed to the kernel, but I don't really remember.  It's worth a try, I guess.
[04:32:54] <wesolows> jmcp: wow, that is cold
[04:33:12] <jbk> hehe
[04:33:54] <jmcp> :-)
[04:36:28] <richlowe> I think that would work.
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[05:00:18] <CIA-27> eh146360: 6543948 system hangs during reboot/init 6
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[05:27:08] <jbk> hmm.. has anyone thought about adding profile shell support to bash & zsh (only because they're also shipped with solaris)?
[05:32:17] <EchoBinary> anyone know of any good tutorials on how to set up NFS shares on an OpenSolaris NFS server?
[05:32:28] <EchoBinary> (besides google - ive been googling for a while)
[05:32:35] <EchoBinary> ;)
[05:32:49] <jbk> try sharemgr :)
[05:33:13] <jamesd_>  if you are using ZFS    zfs set sharenfs=rw  poolname/filesystem
[05:33:14] <jbk> how recent is the build you're running?
[05:33:29] <jbk> or go the easy route that jamesd_ said :)
[05:34:12] <EchoBinary> hmm cool :)
[05:34:26] <dlg> boot cdrom
[05:34:29] <dlg> oops
[05:34:31] <dlg> wrong window
[05:50:05] <EchoBinary> jamesd_: once that is set up, im getting an error  permission denied from an ubuntu client on the same network
[05:50:20] <Tempt> dlg: haha. Jumpstart it next time.
[05:50:43] <dlg> it was an up enter
[05:50:44] <jamesd_> echo are you root trying to write a file?
[05:50:59] <dlg> does anyone have any spare xfps they can give me?
[05:51:28] <Tempt> xfps?
[05:51:29] <EchoBinary> no, im root trying to mount the share
[05:51:46] <dlg> Tempt: 10Gb optics
[05:51:49] <dlg> like sfps
[05:51:50] <Tempt> Aah.
[05:52:00] <Tempt> X form pluggable?
[05:52:12] <dlg> something like that
[05:52:35] <jamesd_> EchoBinary, paste the last lines of dmesg on each box.. if there is anythig interesting,  like rpc errors.
[05:56:14] <EchoBinary> Aug  5 00:23:14 tesla nfs: [ID 434519 kern.warning] WARNING: NFS server initial call to localhost failed: I/O error
[05:56:14] <EchoBinary> Aug  5 00:23:47 tesla last message repeated 1 time
[05:56:27] <EchoBinary> now thats interesting  it is a zfs raidz2
[05:56:31] <EchoBinary> i am now scrubbing the zpool
[05:56:45] <EchoBinary> (that was on the server)
[05:57:24] <EchoBinary> nothing in the client regarding rpc, or nfs, last messages are regardiong VMWare
[05:57:29] <EchoBinary> on the client
[05:57:34] <jamesd_> its not a ZFS error.. its nfs that has the problem.
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[05:57:43] <EchoBinary> ahh
[05:57:43] <EchoBinary> ok
[05:58:17] <jamesd_> EchoBinary, try adding  -overs=3  to the mount command
[05:58:32] <EchoBinary> on the linux mount command?
[05:58:53] <jamesd_> yeah
[05:59:10] <EchoBinary> no dice
[06:00:19] <CIA-27> dm120769: backout 6367770/6588702/6588839: needs work
[06:03:52] <jbk> hmm.. close..
[06:06:42] <jbk> though i seemed to have implemented more features than existed in the current sparc disassembler :)
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[06:15:08] <jamesd_> run   /etc/init.d/nfs.client  start
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[07:00:18] <CIA-27> cg149915: 6508863 no audio support for Ferrari 5000 using Realtek ALC883, 6588838 audiohd AUDIO_GETDEV output doesn't match man page / not consistant with other drivers
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[07:55:20] <WickedWicky> god morning all
[07:55:43] <Gekkko> morning.
[07:56:10] <jmcp> gday gday
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[07:56:23] <WickedWicky> hey Gekkko, jmcp :)
[07:56:26] <WickedWicky> how's life?
[07:56:27] <Gekkko> the iPhone has been hacked to use any SIM now :D
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[07:56:42] <Gekkko> their reign of terror ends.
[07:57:08] <WickedWicky> AT&T is gonna love that I guess
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[07:57:37] <jmcp> Gekkko: url?
[07:57:46] <Gekkko> www.apcmag.com
[07:57:52] <Gekkko> first story on the list i presuem
[07:58:09] <jmcp> neat
[07:58:39] <e^ipi> aww, my libc_i18n.a won't build in to ON
[07:58:41] <e^ipi> :(
[07:58:55] <jmcp> e^ipi: why not?
[07:59:07] <e^ipi> *shrug*
[07:59:14] <e^ipi> you assume nightly gives sensible errors
[07:59:32] <WickedWicky> coffee and then to the office
[07:59:37] <WickedWicky> see you all later :)
[07:59:48] <WickedWicky> e^ipi: I gave up on that (the sensible errors)
[08:00:00] <WickedWicky> take care now!
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[08:22:20] <jmcp> hi Chipdancer
[08:22:25] <Chipdancer> hi
[08:22:28] <Chipdancer> been busy cleaning today
[08:23:50] <jmcp> :(
[08:25:00] <Gekkko> no CDE on OpenSolaris?
[08:25:11] <jmcp> Gekkko: it's still there
[08:25:18] <jmcp> but you have to explicitly select it
[08:25:37] <Gekkko> oh I see.
[08:25:50] <Gekkko> on that note, I shall begin the slow venture of donwloading SXCE
[08:26:13] <Gekkko> and this, this is just weird http://www.kernelthread.com/publications/gbaunix/
[08:26:26] <e^ipi> no, there's no CDE in opensolaris
[08:26:35] <e^ipi> in much the same way there's no GNOME or KDE in Linux
[08:26:46] <e^ipi> sun's opensolaris distros ship with CDE
[08:27:35] <jmcp> e^ipi: your pedantry is in better form than mine
[08:28:27] <e^ipi> it's an important distinction
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[08:28:36] <e^ipi> despite Ian Murdock's incompetence
[08:29:16] <Doc> but i read on the website how solaris 10 is opensourced!
[08:29:40] <e^ipi> chunks of it are
[08:29:55] <mlh> send me a T2 please kthxbye
[08:30:10] <e^ipi> buy one, they're under 10k
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[08:30:13] <jmcp> e^ipi: I know, I know ....
[08:30:20] <MousePad> I wish solaris had pf instead of ipfilter
[08:30:36] <mlh> or iptables
[08:30:45] <e^ipi> isn't one of the SoC students porting pf over?
[08:31:23] <dlg> mlh: take that back
[08:31:28] <Doc> eipi: realistically nothing in S10 is opensourced (beyond the opensource stuff that's included in it... if that makes sense)
[08:31:34] <mlh> heh too easy
[08:32:42] <jmcp> MousePad, mlh: so what's wrong with ipfilter?
[08:33:54] <Gekkko> fucking vegetarians.
[08:33:57] <Gekkko> all they do is complain at me.
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[08:34:06] <e^ipi> meat eaters do it to
[08:34:10] <e^ipi> *too
[08:34:16] <Gekkko> these ones complain about anemia
[08:34:19] <Gekkko> meat eaters dont have anemia.
[08:34:28] <e^ipi> spinach is full of iron
[08:34:38] <noyb> jmcp: I'll guess...  when you have a set of rules that you're comfy with, then it's a tedious burden to read the man and do the work to translate the rules into the new format...
[08:34:39] <e^ipi> except for the retarded ones, vegetarians don't get anemic either
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[08:35:38] <e^ipi> in much the same way that vegetarians don't get scurvy
[08:35:43] <e^ipi> and usually meat eaters don't either
[08:37:00] <MousePad> jmcp: nothing wrong with ipfilter, pf is just better
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[08:37:30] <jmcp> MousePad: why
[08:38:00] <MousePad> jmcp: it's got a few features extra that are useful to me, such as route-to
[08:38:14] <jmcp> glad to hear you've got an actual reason
[08:38:15] <MousePad> Which ipfilter didn't have when I last used it before I switched to pf :)
[08:38:20] <Doc> "Animals eat other animals. It's nature."   "No it isn't. We taught a lion to eat tofu!"
[08:38:21] <jmcp> how long ago was that?
[08:38:29] <jmcp> Doc: you hippie!
[08:38:30] <MousePad> Hmm at least 3 years
[08:38:35] <Tempt> Man.
[08:38:37] * jmcp rolls eyes
[08:38:38] <Tempt> Lion eating tofu.
[08:38:44] <Tempt> (meat flavoured tofu)
[08:38:57] <Doc> (for those that haven't watched Futurama, you should!)
[08:39:02] <WickedWicky> lol
[08:39:10] <mlh> 10kUSD I spose.  not too much AUD
[08:39:29] <MousePad> jmcp: they're both fine. Th eother pf feature I use extensively is the altq traffic-shaping stuff
[08:40:06] <e^ipi> lions don't have a moral sense & we don't hold them to moral standards
[08:40:19] <jmcp> I'm hesitant to continue to believe that X is better than Y when I haven't evaluated Y in several years, and I know that both have active developers
[08:40:32] <e^ipi> plus they're felines, which don't have any choice in the matter, their bodies can't process vegetable matter well enough to survive
[08:40:41] <MousePad> jmcp: fine - but freebsd has ipfw, ipf, pf and you can choose
[08:40:46] <MousePad> solaris only has one
[08:40:57] <e^ipi> that said, everyone ought to be free to choose whichever moral standards they want
[08:41:08] * Tempt refuses to be influenced by the vegetarian propaganda machine.
[08:41:15] <Tempt> More meat for the meat-eaters!
[08:41:20] <e^ipi> there you go
[08:41:21] <dlg> MousePad: i remember some guy posted to a freebsd list saying "im using all 3 filters at once, why does performance suck?"
[08:41:29] * MousePad cooks Tempt an ostrich steak
[08:41:35] <Tempt> Hmm.
[08:41:43] <Tempt> Haven't tried ostrich before (not a local meat). Any good?
[08:42:06] <kohju> someone help me?, I want to change caps_lock key to left_control on SXCE69. please, tell me where I need to change?
[08:42:55] <Doc> do you have a pair of plyers?
[08:43:38] <jmcp> pliers, surely
[08:43:40] <quasi> Tempt: it is fairly good, but not sensational
[08:43:47] <jmcp> kohju: man xmodmap
[08:43:48] <WickedWicky> I see it's sense day today :P
[08:43:49] <Trisk[laptop]> kohju: Option "XkbOptions" "ctrl:swapcaps" if you use Xorg
[08:43:55] <Doc> hey, i failed english, ok?
[08:44:10] <Gekkko> I don't think it's a good idea to use a download manager that opens 20 sockets.
[08:44:11] <Gekkko> am I right?
[08:44:13] * Trisk[laptop] uses ctrl:nocaps - both keys are Ctrl!
[08:44:42] <Tempt> jmcp: And don't call him Shirley
[08:44:43] <Tempt> heh.
[08:44:54] <jmcp> Gekkko: what's wrong with opening 20 sockets?
[08:44:57] <jmcp> Tempt: of course
[08:45:06] <Gekkko> jmcp: I don't know, that's why I was asking
[08:45:07] <dlg> jmcp: ulimits!
[08:45:08] <jmcp> Tempt: Doc can do that in photoshop
[08:45:17] <WickedWicky> this is such a damn waste. pretty face in front of me and at the same time looking so dumb
[08:45:18] <jmcp> Gekkko: why do you think it might be bad?
[08:45:18] <Gekkko> or stating a true or false >->
[08:45:21] <kohju> Thanks, in /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[08:45:21] <kohju>  ?
[08:45:26] <Gekkko> jmcp: socket limit?
[08:45:28] <jmcp> kohju: yes
[08:45:37] <jmcp> Gekkko: huh?
[08:45:42] <Gekkko> no idea.
[08:45:51] <Gekkko> I'm probably getting mixed up with ftp
[08:45:55] <Tempt> If you open too many sockets you'll run out
[08:46:03] <Tempt> And you'll have to refill the socket tank.
[08:46:41] <jmcp> and just watch out in case you run out of tokens to put into the ring, too
[08:46:54] <Tempt> Man, running out of tokens sucks.
[08:46:55] <WickedWicky> which you'll feel in your wallet looking at the price for sockets per liter
[08:47:03] <Tempt> Almost as much as when you unplug a cable and the token falls out
[08:47:10] <jmcp> hmmm are liters lighter than litres?
[08:47:11] <Tempt> Always takes hours to find it again
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[08:47:35] <WickedWicky> jmcp: liters is the dutch wor for litres, and potheads as we are, I supose so
[08:47:48] <jmcp> WickedWicky: what, you can't spell in French? geez!
[08:47:50] <jmcp> :-)
[08:47:57] <WickedWicky> non!
[08:48:04] <Tempt> WickedWicky: I thought you were in the US...
[08:48:07] <WickedWicky> yes
[08:48:11] <WickedWicky> you all think that
[08:48:16] <Tempt> Awww, he didn't bite.
[08:48:49] <WickedWicky> I am more in a tease mood than biting today
[08:49:44] <WickedWicky> maybe,  one day, I will live in CA or something. Marry a cute brunette and have children
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[08:51:18] <WickedWicky> even though I dont see the children part happen
[08:51:23] <oxygene> e^ipi: couldn't you just run "make" in the right directory after setting up the environment with bldenv?
[08:51:35] <Tempt> Shack up with a couple of cute brunettes and outsource the children bit?
[08:52:07] <WickedWicky> no, just ban them from the WickedWicky-platform all together
[08:52:10] <e^ipi> oxygene: it needs a successful build first, but yeah, that's the next step
[08:52:26] <WickedWicky> screwing is designed for fun, not for reproducing
[08:52:34] <Tempt> Hence outsource it.
[08:52:43] <Tempt> Get someone else to take care of the problem.
[08:52:52] <Tempt> I understand India is cranking out children fast enough to supply half the world.
[08:52:59] <WickedWicky> noone screws with my missus but me! :P
[08:53:01] <Gekkko> yeah
[08:53:06] <Gekkko> more than China by 2015
[08:53:17] <kohju> Thanks a lot! it changed!
[08:53:22] <Tempt> They should follow China's lead now before it's too late. Oh, hang on, ...
[08:53:23] <WickedWicky> oh
[08:53:23] <WickedWicky> fosters
[08:53:23] <WickedWicky> yea we could do that
[08:53:34] <WickedWicky> but.. I am not a big fan of children all together
[08:53:45] <Tempt> Neither am I
[08:53:50] <Tempt> I look forward to being old.
[08:53:52] <WickedWicky> imagine they'll look and act like me :s
[08:53:58] <Tempt> I can have a stick to beat children and small animals
[08:54:10] <Tempt> I want a nice lawn just to I can tell the neighbourhood children to go away
[08:54:14] <Tempt> "get offa my lawn!"
[08:54:26] <WickedWicky> haha
[08:54:31] <Gekkko> don't beat small animals
[08:54:34] <Gekkko> beat larger onces than you
[08:54:48] <WickedWicky> but only when you know they eat tofu
[08:54:52] <WickedWicky> or you might run in problems
[08:54:53] <Tempt> Yeah.
[08:55:32] <WickedWicky> so it's not just a matter of morals, it's a matter of survival against bigger animals than you
[08:55:58] <Tempt> Nah, I can't let go of the happy though of clearing children and small animals off my lawn.
[08:56:07] <Tempt> A hockey stick might be ideal.
[08:56:36] <WickedWicky> try stabbing them to bleeding with a spoon
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[08:57:15] <e^ipi> did you know that a child can drown in a bucket of water?
[08:57:24] <e^ipi> to think, all this time i've been wasting water in the bathtub
[08:57:25] <WickedWicky> from hear saying, yes
[08:59:36] <jmcp> Doc: http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/get-on-the-floor/2007/08/07/1186252689985.html
[08:59:41] <jmcp> @ Epoque in Cammeray
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[09:00:56] <e^ipi> "beer cafe" ?
[09:01:07] <e^ipi> wouldn't that just be a pub?
[09:01:42] <WickedWicky> well, you dont buy coffee in a coffee shop  here either
[09:02:09] <WickedWicky> and people going to a "smart shop" arent very smart either
[09:02:09] <WickedWicky> so
[09:02:16] <WickedWicky> god knows what a beer cafe sells
[09:04:06] <sunmaster> Hello all together, What is the best way to discover the list of packages which are required to build the ON consolidation?
[09:05:00] <e^ipi> onbld and spro
[09:05:05] <jmcp> e^ipi: they do food too
[09:05:14] <e^ipi> jmcp: pubs here do food as well
[09:05:17] <jmcp> WickedWicky: in this case, Belgian beer in the correct glasses
[09:05:17] <Doc> jmcp: yah.. saw that
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[09:05:36] <e^ipi> shitty pub food, given... but it's just like normal food, only more deep-fried
[09:05:52] <jmcp> actually Epoque's food is pretty good
[09:06:05] <jmcp> <50% is deep fried
[09:06:12] <Doc> yah.. i go there for the food - not anything else
[09:08:38] <Tempt> Mmm
[09:08:39] <Tempt> Beer.
[09:09:37] <Tempt> Where can I get my hands on a decent POWER machine. I want to get myself a look at this new AIX 6 everyone's banging on about.
[09:09:44] <e^ipi> ebay?
[09:09:49] <Tempt> Nah
[09:09:57] <Tempt> Nothing in ebay in .au
[09:09:57] <e^ipi> AIX6 only runs on POWER4  or higher though
[09:10:04] <e^ipi> so my 44p isn't sufficient
[09:10:05] <Tempt> Hence *decent* POWER machine
[09:10:07] <jmcp> Tempt: I think libkeiser has a few in his barn^Whome DC
[09:10:11] <WickedWicky> jmcp: where is this? I'm game
[09:10:13] <Tempt> I already have an 8way 604e
[09:10:19] <Tempt> I need something new and shiny.
[09:10:30] <Tempt> Do they do workstations anymore?
[09:10:42] <e^ipi> yeah, you can get POWER5 workstations
[09:10:45] <jmcp> WickedWicky: what, libkeiser's stuff? somewhere in NY state, I think
[09:10:49] <WickedWicky> no
[09:10:50] <e^ipi> if you've got the cash, that is
[09:10:50] <Tempt> Ideal.
[09:10:52] <Tempt> Gimmeh!
[09:10:57] <WickedWicky> the proper beer in proper glasses
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[09:13:26] <Tempt> IntelliStation POWER 285 Express. That seems to be what I need. Now, how do I get my greasy fingers on one.
[09:13:50] <WickedWicky> by donating heaps of cash
[09:13:52] <jmcp> WickedWicky: yeah, it does add a certain something to the experience
[09:13:59] <jmcp> and on that note, I'm outta here for a while
[09:14:04] <WickedWicky> be good
[09:14:09] <jmcp> as if :-)
[09:14:13] <WickedWicky> lol
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[09:17:14] <Tempt> List price for the entry level POWER5 box is $US3000
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[09:17:59] <e^ipi> not bad, actuall
[09:18:02] <e^ipi> *actually
[09:18:09] <Tempt> Oh, $US3717
[09:18:32] <Tempt> that gets you 1.9Ghz POWER5+, 1Gb of RAM, 2 x 72 spindles in a 1RU box
[09:19:02] <Gekkko> ..
[09:19:12] <Gekkko> that's expensive, and seemingly slow.
[09:19:30] <Gekkko> what's the advantage over x86?
[09:19:33] <Gekkko> at  3ghz.
[09:19:46] <e^ipi> x86 doesn't run AIX
[09:19:55] <e^ipi> cleaner ISA
[09:19:58] <palowoda> That is an advantage.
[09:20:22] <palowoda> For x86.
[09:20:24] <e^ipi> dev. workstations for developers writing code for giant POWER machines
[09:21:00] <moazamraja> writing code AIX boxes?
[09:21:01] <moazamraja> wow.
[09:21:08] <moazamraja> you must enjoy cobol also.
[09:22:02] <e^ipi> just saying... there are advantages to non-x86 architectures
[09:22:14] <Tempt> Yeah, they aren't x86.
[09:22:19] <Tempt> That's a good start.
[09:22:34] <moazamraja> bitter. bitter.
[09:22:40] <Gekkko> e^ipi: wasn't saying there wasn't
[09:22:45] <quasi> like the niagra II that sun will be announcing today - nice procs
[09:22:50] <Gekkko> I'm not fanboi'ing over x86 either
[09:22:51] <e^ipi> i've got a blade1k sitting at a Fedex depot somewhere for me
[09:22:54] <Gekkko> I could have said SPARC.
[09:22:58] <moazamraja> $3,717, you can grab a Sun T1000 for that kinda money.
[09:23:12] <e^ipi> i was gone for 5 days and then it was a holiday
[09:23:19] <moazamraja> and hell, blade2ks can be had for a few hundred bucks
[09:23:22] <moazamraja> $300-$500
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[09:23:53] <quasi> moazamraja: they seem a lot more expensive than that going by ebay pricing
[09:24:15] <moazamraja> i bought mine on ebay
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[09:24:20] <moazamraja> 'twas about $300, but i got a great deal
[09:24:34] <e^ipi> i paid $50 for my POWER3 machine
[09:24:39] <moazamraja> 2gb RAM, 1 CPU (900hz), 73gig FCAL or whatever it uses internally
[09:24:46] <Tempt> It's probably worth the $50, too ;)
[09:24:52] <e^ipi> yeah, it was
[09:24:53] <palowoda> heh
[09:24:58] <quasi> I'm seeing prices well above $1k for sb2000s
[09:25:20] <e^ipi> and it came stuffed with telephony equipment worth a few hundred bucks too
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[09:25:31] <Tempt> Mmm, dee-licious telephony.
[09:25:32] <e^ipi> so whenever I get around to ebaying them, it'll pay for itself a few times over
[09:25:40] <Tempt> Turn it into a PABX or something
[09:25:41] <e^ipi> and then i'll get drunk
[09:25:42] <Tempt> run *
[09:25:52] <e^ipi> nah, i'd rather just sell it and get shitfaced
[09:26:03] <Tempt> Running short on liquor money?
[09:26:06] <palowoda> Sell it for 25.00.
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[09:27:11] <e^ipi> no, not running short, but it's easy to budget free money for booze
[09:27:28] <e^ipi> much easier than budgeting earned money
[09:27:33] <moazamraja> why, why, why must 'CSI: Miami' suck so bad..
[09:27:41] <e^ipi> moazamraja: because it's a spinoff
[09:28:00] <palowoda> moazamraja: They use the same color scheme everytime.
[09:28:34] <moazamraja> what I wanna know is, it's supposed to be Miami, so how come they have so many white people on the show?!?!?
[09:28:41] <moazamraja> I mean, c'mon, have they BEEN to miami?
[09:29:05] <palowoda> Hey if they go bankrupt than you can get all those great LCD monitors on ebay for cheap. :)
[09:29:11] <moazamraja> I grew up there, and lemme tell you, most white people left back in the 80s and early 90s
[09:29:26] <moazamraja> i have my share of LCD panels already :/
[09:29:45] <MousePad> Damn I love netbeans.
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[09:30:04] <e^ipi> and i love coffee beans
[09:30:23] <BLERGH> anyone knows why I get this error when running bfu?
[09:30:23] <BLERGH> Creating bfu execution environment ...
[09:30:23] <BLERGH> cp: cannot access /export/build/onnv-gate/public/bin/i386/fastfs
[09:30:23] <BLERGH> cannot copy /export/build/onnv-gate/public/bin/i386/fastfs
[09:30:23] <BLERGH> bfu aborting
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[09:30:46] <Tempt> moazamraja: Because the audience loves seeing little white models shaking their cute arses and silicone boobs at a camera?
[09:30:54] <moazamraja> Tempt: white guys? wow.
[09:31:09] <moazamraja> MousePad: yay! finally, someone on #opensolaris says pro-NB stuff.
[09:31:39] <e^ipi> moazamraja: on the netbeans team i take it?
[09:31:41] <Tempt> Geez, IBM gets pretty rude here: http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/migratetoibm/sun.html
[09:31:50] <MousePad> Since 5.0 it's just got better and better
[09:32:22] <palowoda> Have to admit netbeans has changed quite a bit.
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[09:32:42] <moazamraja> e^ipi: at one time in my life, yes :)
[09:33:01] <palowoda> You seen Arun's mashup netbeans screencast.
[09:33:36] 
[09:33:51] <moazamraja> palowoda: i saw the first part, but didn't go thru the whole thing
[09:34:01] <moazamraja> i worked on some RoR samples for NB
[09:34:05] <moazamraja> Ruby On Rails
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[09:34:13] <palowoda> The last one #5 on google maps was good.
[09:34:47] <palowoda> You can still do mashups with ror.
[09:34:56] <moazamraja> my sample video sucked :(
[09:35:18] <moazamraja> i couldnt edit/clip the video/audio and had to do the whole thing in 1 big long session
[09:35:42] <moazamraja> that and recording it while in a hotel room in prague didn't help
[09:37:25] <Gekkko> why does everyone say Solaris has no chance
[09:37:26] <Gekkko> >_>
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[09:37:50] <e^ipi> Gekkko: wishful thinking?
[09:37:53] <e^ipi> *shrug*
[09:37:58] <palowoda> Because HUPX is more popular.
[09:38:14] <moazamraja> Gekkko: typically ppl who are anti-Sun, have a vested interest in some other OS, or have not really used Solaris....
[09:38:41] <quasi> Gekkko: the competition is getting scared
[09:39:03] <palowoda> First they laugh at you.
[09:40:03] <Gekkko> I said this in ##linux quite some time ago: Solaris > Linux
[09:40:06] <Gekkko> flamefest lol
[09:40:19] <Gekkko> they couldn't win the argument though, I got 3 people to get the DVDs LOL
[09:41:28] <palowoda> Sun should deliver OpenSolaris DVD's like AOL use to do with their dialin magazine inserts.
[09:41:34] <moazamraja> palowoda: yes.
[09:41:52] <moazamraja> well..., kinda ;P
[09:42:01] <palowoda> Couldn't hurt.
[09:43:08] <moazamraja> I recommended to someone that Sun should have free Solaris 10/11 DVDs and NetBeans/Sun Studio/JES DVDs at every lobby of all Sun buildings through-out the world
[09:43:18] <moazamraja> and let anyone walk in and just take a set
[09:43:23] <palowoda> Worldwide that is.  Some just complain too much the download speeds make it a pain.
[09:43:36] <moazamraja> helps in places like china, india, etc., where the download speed is an issue
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[09:45:13] <MousePad> moazamraja: the free shipping for Ubuntu Linux definitely helped get it to #1 spot
[09:45:32] <palowoda> I swear a "Flood the market with Solaris Express DVD's" might be more effiective than Indiana.
[09:46:04] <moazamraja> indiana might surprise folks though, depending on how well the desktop is
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[09:46:18] <MousePad> It can backfire though, look at AOL
[09:46:28] <moazamraja> MousePad: definitely, but the upside is that Ubuntu is also a good product
[09:46:33] <moazamraja> which AOL..., is not.
[09:46:36] <Gekkko> what's Indiana
[09:46:41] <palowoda> Don't ask.
[09:46:43] <Cyrille> oh dear, here we go
[09:46:54] <palowoda> It's a state.
[09:47:10] <cmihai> It's a University
[09:47:16] <moazamraja> Gekkko: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/indiana/
[09:47:16] <moazamraja> done.
[09:47:20] * MousePad has glassfish working nicely on FreeBSD, yay
[09:47:27] <moazamraja> y'all need to learn the power of URLs.
[09:47:27] <cmihai> All lies.
[09:47:41] <cmihai> Power doesn't come from URLs...
[09:47:45] <cmihai> power comes from lying :-]
[09:47:46] <moazamraja> i've had Glassfish working on OS X for ages, runs purty well
[09:47:49] <moazamraja> heh
[09:48:08] <MousePad> moazamraja: me too, but OS X is *supported*
[09:48:18] <Gekkko> I want to make a distribution of OpenSolaris in under 100mb
[09:48:19] <MousePad> FreeBSD never is...
[09:48:33] <Gekkko> Is it easy to compile a custom Solaris kernel?
[09:48:34] <MousePad> Gekkko: bootable flash stick version?
[09:48:43] <Gekkko> MousePad: yeah
[09:48:44] <cmihai> Gekkko: what for? It's not a RTOS that you'd want to run on some embedded application anyway
[09:48:45] <Gekkko> heard of Puppy Linux?
[09:48:51] <cmihai> Heard of 4GB sticks?
[09:48:56] <cmihai> They're like 30$ now
[09:49:00] <Gekkko> cmihai: I like small.
[09:49:10] <palowoda> I have solaris running on a 4G usb stick.
[09:49:11] * MousePad has an 80GB USB drive that fits in shirt pocket :)
[09:49:22] <cmihai> MousePad: we all have iPods, get over it :P
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[09:50:58] <Gekkko> oh shit
[09:51:03] <Gekkko> I just realised I have no blank DVDs
[09:51:04] <Gekkko> gah
[09:51:06] <trochej> I don't have one
[09:51:15] <cmihai> Gekkko: what do you need DVDs for anyway
[09:51:41] <Gekkko> to burn opensolaris?
[09:51:54] <cmihai> That's what JumpStart is for silly :-)
[09:52:09] <cmihai> And if you already have a Solaris, that's what LiveUpgrade is for :D
[09:52:11] <Gekkko> wtf is that
[09:52:12] <Gekkko> >_>!
[09:52:26] <Gekkko> Solaris is so damn flexible I don't see it coming.
[09:52:34] <cmihai> Riiiight.
[09:52:44] <cmihai> JumpStart is for Solaris what IgniteUX is for HP-UX...
[09:52:47] <Gekkko> oi, I'm used to the Linux "My way or no way."
[09:53:28] <cmihai> JumpStart is for Solaris what KickStart is for Linux, RIS / Windows Deployment Services for Windows..
[09:53:35] <cmihai> Are any of these ringing a bell?
[09:53:39] <Gekkko> >_>
[09:53:41] <cmihai> Is that hamster running?
[09:53:46] <Gekkko> only the last.
[09:53:56] <Gekkko> oi, I don't have much experience in systems deployment
[09:54:01] <Gekkko> ie, none/
[09:54:06] <cmihai> .....right.
[09:54:24] <Gekkko> dude, do you know how old I am?
[09:54:24] <cmihai> Anyway, no DVD == easy fix.
[09:54:27] <Gekkko> >_>
[09:54:30] <cmihai> Got 2 computers and a network?
[09:54:35] <Gekkko> cmihai: of course.
[09:54:42] <cmihai> Got VMware ServeR?
[09:54:46] <cmihai> It's free.
[09:54:47] <Gekkko> yes.
[09:54:50] <cmihai> Great.
[09:54:51] <Gekkko> I have workstation
[09:54:56] <cmihai> Whatever
[09:55:19] <cmihai> Install Solaris using the ISO, make a JumpStart server and net boot the target machine and do a network install.
[09:55:26] <cmihai> You might as well do FLAR
[09:55:40] <palowoda> And prep for LiveUpgrade.
[09:55:43] <Gekkko> FLAR = ?
[09:56:16] <cmihai> Flash archive
[09:56:22] <cmihai> And I don't mean Adomedia
[09:56:28] <cmihai> Adobe/Macromedia.
[09:56:46] <cmihai> And palowoda is right, make sure you create a /altroot for LiveUpgrade.
[09:56:58] <moazamraja> jumpstart can be a pain
[09:57:12] <Gekkko> I should probably just get a DVD
[09:57:14] <cmihai> Gekkko: LiveUpgrade http://unixsadm.blogspot.com/2007/08/liveupgrade-sxce.html
[09:57:18] <Gekkko> learn how to use Solaris for about a week
[09:57:21] <moazamraja> and you need another machine on the network to do it
[09:57:22] <Gekkko> then work on that.
[09:57:23] <cmihai> You need the DVD anyway.
[09:57:32] <moazamraja> which doesn't necessarily help if you are just starting to learn about solaris
[09:57:36] <Gekkko> cmihai: the DVD, not the iso
[09:57:45] <cmihai> moazamraja: we've alredy established he's got a second machine.
[09:58:01] <cmihai> Gekkko: you realize a iso is one step away from becoming a DVD right?
[09:58:10] <Gekkko> ... yes
[09:58:15] <cmihai> moazamraja: bah, nothing like a crash course to get you started.
[09:58:17] <Gekkko> but a DVD is something you can hold.
[09:58:27] <cmihai> And shove up your ass..
[09:58:32] <cmihai> I mean, in the dvd rom.
[09:58:42] <MousePad> And toss ninja-style at your evil cow-orkers
[09:58:59] <cmihai> Besides, the fact that you're 13 doesn't really matter.
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[09:59:15] <Gekkko> I'm not 13
[09:59:16] <Gekkko> 15.
[09:59:21] <cmihai> Same difference.
[09:59:26] <Gekkko> don't say there's no difference, because there most certainly is
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[10:00:13] <Gekkko> MousePad: always fun to have a CD fight :P
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[10:00:37] <Pietro_S> g' morning
[10:00:46] <palowoda> I guess at 15 you can learn Solaris in a week.
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[10:01:47] <Gekkko> sarcasm or serious?
[10:01:52] <cmihai> palowoda: yeah, they tend to be pretty slow at 15.
[10:01:53] <Gekkko> I'm hoping sarcasm.
[10:02:19] <Gekkko> Why are you attacking me cmihai?
[10:02:35] <Gekkko> I'm trying to learn and you put me down before I even get the chance to attempt to learn Solaris.
[10:03:04] <cmihai> Eh?
[10:03:07] <cmihai> Did I do that?
[10:03:25] <Gekkko> you called me slow >_>
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[10:03:43] <cmihai> Well, you are slow for missing the point.
[10:04:00] <Gekkko> I don't have expertise in systems deployment
[10:04:00] <WickedWicky> slow can be good at times
[10:04:06] <Gekkko> of ANY OS.
[10:04:17] <cmihai> Not unless you're trying to get some hick girl pregnant...
[10:04:26] <Gekkko> ...
[10:04:27] <cmihai> Gekkko: right. So?
[10:04:36] <cmihai> God, what's wrong with you people?
[10:04:47] <cmihai> Nobody was born knowing Solaris. They _learned_ it.
[10:04:59] <Gekkko> and I'm willing to learn.
[10:05:03] <lloy0076> Theoretically, if Sun open sources all of Java, then I can "borrow" documentation from its Javadoc...
[10:05:37] <lloy0076> ...I've implemented something that uses an architecture similar to JCA (it's not cryptographic but the idea of providers and such is almost the same) and I want to, errr, borrow its documentation :P
[10:05:55] <cmihai> Sun already open sourced all _their_ Java
[10:06:00] <moazamraja> Gekkko: don't listen to the troglodytes, install from DVD if you wish
[10:06:06] <moazamraja> it's a good way to start
[10:06:12] <cmihai> It's the 3rd parties that don't like the idea.
[10:06:17] <cmihai> Hence the rewriting and such.
[10:06:17] <palowoda> lloy0076: You mean you want to redistribute it?
[10:06:17] <Gekkko> :)
[10:06:20] <cmihai> moazamraja: oh get a life
[10:06:24] <Gekkko> I plan to try both ways.
[10:06:25] <moazamraja> cmihai: not allowed
[10:06:35] <moazamraja> cmihai: violates my employment contract
[10:06:46] <lloy0076> palowoda: Well, not really. I want to borrow the words describing some of the architecture...
[10:06:51] <cmihai> Gekkko: look, do a JumpStart, it involves doing a regular install in VMware anyway
[10:06:55] <cmihai> It's good practice.
[10:07:21] <Gekkko> the other PC is a 700mhz with 196mb
[10:07:22] <Cyrille> actually he might even stop there and use his VM for playing with Solaris.
[10:07:23] <cmihai> And a nice way to see what makes Solaris... Solaris.. not just glance around customizing Gnome
[10:07:28] <moazamraja> eventually.
[10:07:28] <Gekkko> It doesnt run VMWare nicely.
[10:07:30] <cmihai> Gekkko: ah, here is where you give up.
[10:07:49] <Gekkko> I don't give up >_>
[10:07:52] <Cyrille> it won't run OpenSolaris nicely either with that RAM.
[10:07:53] <Gekkko> I'm pretty patient.
[10:08:02] <Gekkko> Cyrille: that's for network installing.
[10:08:07] <Gekkko> not for actually running Solaris.
[10:08:09] <Cyrille> ah right, sorry.
[10:08:12] <lloy0076> Anyway, I'm waffling. It's the end of the day at work and I should go home :P
[10:08:13] <Gekkko> the pc to run solaris is 3ghz, 1gb ram
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[10:08:27] <Gekkko> I should say x86 P4.
[10:08:40] <cmihai> It won't Actually, Solaris won't even install without a minimum of 256 RAM
[10:08:43] <palowoda> lloy0076: Never thought about the copyrights on some of the documentation.  If JCA went GPL etc.
[10:08:53] <cmihai> 512 for PXE
[10:09:24] <moazamraja> Gekkko[PDA]: dell has a Athlon X2 Dual Core machine with 2GB of RAM right now, for $399.
[10:09:36] <Gekkko> $399 US?
[10:09:42] <lloy0076> palowoda: Indeed, it's an odd one and *usefully* Sun don't put any obvious copyright, reserve notice or license on the documentation I have my eyes on (http://java.sun.com/javase/6/docs/technotes/guides/security/crypto/CryptoSpec.html).
[10:09:51] <Gekkko> I'll look into it at a later date, short on cash right now
[10:10:03] <lloy0076> palowoda: So, I assume they own the copyright but it's not clear what they'll let you do with it :P
[10:10:21] <Pietro_S> Gekkko: then I suggest you to install xfce, gnome is a bit ram hungry ...
[10:10:34] <palowoda> lloy0076:  Best bet is ask on some of the java forums.  Might get more of an authorive answer there.
[10:10:43] <Gekkko> Pietro_S: CDE is less ram hungry than XFCE?
[10:10:53] <Gekkko> or even no WM at all.
[10:10:58] <Gekkko> just pure terminal goodness.
[10:10:59] <lloy0076> Indeed; anyway, off I go!
[10:11:02] <lloy0076> Ciao!
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[10:11:04] <Pietro_S> Gekkko: but CDE is ugly!
[10:11:22] <moazamraja> Gekkko: where are you located?
[10:11:31] <moazamraja> (generally)
[10:11:39] <Gekkko> Australia
[10:11:44] <moazamraja> oh, oops :)
[10:11:53] <Gekkko> Pietro_S: It reminds me of Windows 3.11
[10:11:58] <moazamraja> if you were nearby, I could scrounge up some installable solaris machine
[10:12:02] <Pietro_S> if you don't use any xfce panels plugins I guess CDE and xfce will eat similiar amout of ram
[10:12:09] <Gekkko> lol moazamraja, it's fine.
[10:12:21] <Gekkko> Pietro_S: if Openbox is available, I'll probably use that
[10:12:25] <Gekkko> or just JDS on my P4.
[10:12:28] <Tempt> If he wanted a machine to screw around with, he could go to the next computer market/swap meet and spend $AU200 and get something workable
[10:12:46] <Gekkko> Tempt: I can get any of them free off my mate
[10:12:53] <Tempt> Well, get installing.
[10:13:17] <Gekkko> his dad works for a steel mill, and his boss is an absolute idiot.  A hard drive died in their server so he threw it out, the whole tower.  My mate's dad took it home
[10:13:20] <Gekkko> installed a new hdd.
[10:13:25] <moazamraja> i'm always on this channel when everyone logged in is from EU/Australia
[10:13:38] <Tempt> Decent machine?
[10:13:39] <Gekkko> lol where you from moazamraja
[10:13:42] <Cyrille> must have something to do with time, or something.
[10:13:47] <Gekkko> Tempt: I think it was an Intel Xeon
[10:13:56] <Gekkko> they aren't good at telling me details.
[10:14:09] <Gekkko> he _does_ work at a steel mill for a reason :P
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[10:15:00] <moazamraja> Gekkko: I'm in santa clara, ca
[10:15:02] <moazamraja> (usa)
[10:15:48] <Tempt> I've seen all sorts of machines go into dumpsters
[10:15:50] <Gekkko> I know where that is >_>
[10:15:51] <Gekkko> lol
[10:15:53] <Tempt> Six vaxes one afternoon
[10:15:58] <Gekkko> :O
[10:16:03] <Gekkko> I don't see anythiing good go into dumpsters
[10:16:11] <Tempt> Followed by about 6 racks of the storage that went with them
[10:16:13] <Gekkko> I'm not afraid of dumpster surfing, it's in my job description
[10:16:32] <cmihai> Tempt: oh my, if it was DEC StorageWorks... that's heavy ass stuff
[10:16:36] <Tempt> I really couldn't see any point in rescuing the vaxes though. I called the one vax-head I know and they didn't have room
[10:16:47] <cmihai> Eh
[10:16:50] <Tempt> cmihai: It wasn't storageworks. I probably would have ratted the storageworks for useful bits.
[10:17:02] <cmihai> Not much useful bits..
[10:17:09] <Tempt> I'm not talking Alpha, I'm talking VAX.
[10:17:09] <cmihai> It's packed with 4GB disks :P
[10:17:18] <cmihai> Yeah, I know.
[10:17:37] <mustang> tempt: what flavour vaxen ?
[10:17:39] <Tempt> Seen StorageWorks packed with 18s.
[10:17:44] <Tempt> mustang: Old? Beige?
[10:17:50] <Gekkko> 4GB disks are useful for simple systems like a MAME machine
[10:17:51] <Tempt> mustang: I'm not a VAX expert...
[10:18:06] <mustang> fair enough.
[10:18:11] <Tempt> I got my tape library by making sure I got first pickings over a dumpster run
[10:18:16] <cmihai> Probably MicroVAX III stuff
[10:18:22] <mustang> friend of mine died lately. big dec fan.
[10:18:31] <mustang> I have many vaxen and pdp11s to sort through.
[10:18:37] <mustang> perhaps I could borrow your dumpster?
[10:18:38] <palowoda> You can barely get a movie on 4Gs these days.
[10:18:49] <Tempt> That scored me two FCAL JBODs, a 2xDLT8000 tape library, a pile of 18Gb disks, a NetApp filer head and a few SS20s
[10:18:58] <asyd> :s "
[10:18:59] <asyd> oups
[10:19:11] <Tempt> It wasn't MicroVAX, it was Big Hulking VAX of Doom VAX
[10:19:12] <Gekkko> palowoda: depends on if you like DivX or not
[10:19:13] <Gekkko> :P
[10:19:16] <mustang> cute. filer useful, or do you need a vfiler license to get it to do anything useful to you ?
[10:19:30] <Tempt> I stripped the filer head for parts.
[10:19:37] <Gekkko> palowoda: you can fit every Sega Genesis game in under a gig.
[10:19:51] <Tempt> I really didn't have any need for the filer, and it didn't have any disks
[10:20:03] <palowoda> Doesn't matter 500G drives are 99.00 these days. No big deal.
[10:20:10] <Tempt> However, the quad fast ethernet cards inside were very handy.
[10:20:16] <mustang> fair enough.
[10:20:35] <Tempt> If there was a VAXstation or MicroVAX or something Alpha based, I would have grabbed it.
[10:21:14] <moazamraja> i let a Foundry ServerIron switch go to the trash the other day :(
[10:21:21] <moazamraja> I shoulda totally put it in the back of my car
[10:21:23] <Tempt> Machines Tempt is looking for: Alpha capable of running OpenVMS; POWER4 or better RS6000/pSeries
[10:21:46] <moazamraja> but I figured, "ehh, I can get a gigabit switch for like $50-$100, why would I want this honking thing?"
[10:22:01] <moazamraja> it was 100mbit, but a boatload of ports, blades, etc.
[10:22:55] <Tempt> Probably could have ebay'd the blades
[10:24:16] <cmihai> Tempt: trying to run AIX 6.1? :-)
[10:25:56] <palowoda> moazamraja: Yeah you can get 8 port GigE switches that go on sale at Fry's for 49.00 about once a month.
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[10:28:24] <moazamraja> palowoda: true..., but what my network engineer friend was saying was that the 'real' 100mbit cisco/foundry switches are much nicer in terms of configurability and even throughput speeds
[10:29:01] <Tempt> cmihai: Correct!
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[10:29:30] <Gekkko> why AIX?
[10:29:47] <Tempt> Why not? I like UNIX, AIX is (sort-of) UNIX.
[10:29:49] <palowoda> moazamraja: I love Foundry Big Iron but for round the house 24 ports for 150.00 just can't be beat.
[10:30:10] <Tempt> palowoda: Gimmeh Cisco or gimmeh nuthin'.
[10:30:33] <palowoda> Tempt: you do a lot of auction shopping?
[10:30:36] <trochej> Can anyone give me dig wojslaw.pl , dig d-net.com.pl and dig eltekenergy.pl?
[10:30:38] <Gekkko> Tempt: but what makes you want to try AIX?
[10:30:39] <st3fan> foundry switches are really worth it
[10:30:50] <st3fan> not for home, unless you run a datacenter at home maybe :)
[10:30:52] <Tempt> Gekkko: I've done AIX 4.3.3 before
[10:30:56] <Tempt> Gekkko: It didn't hurt too much.
[10:31:03] <moazamraja> palowoda: agreed
[10:31:08] <cmihai> AIX is pretty neat.
[10:31:09] <Gekkko> but what's interesting abot it
[10:31:13] <Tempt> it's also a marketable skill
[10:31:15] <moazamraja> i just want a switch that can do aggregation of ports
[10:31:17] <cmihai> 6.1 is even better, it's a Solaris clone ;P
[10:31:29] <cmihai> moazamraja: you can do trunking with Solaris :P
[10:31:31] <Tempt> I don't have complete faith in Sun's direction with Solaris, so I'd like to have a backup plan.
[10:31:52] <Tempt> cmihai: Add a stack of quad gig cards to your server and trunk 'em up?
[10:31:57] <cmihai> Yep
[10:32:11] <dlg> mmmgig
[10:32:16] <moazamraja> Tempt: and your backup plan is AIX?! holy shit.
[10:32:21] <moazamraja> i mean, DAMN.
[10:32:28] <cmihai> moazamraja: ehem, reality check.
[10:32:30] <Tempt> I'm running my home systems on 100Mbit but I have gigabit crossover links for NFS
[10:32:36] <Tempt> moazamraja: Australian market
[10:32:41] <moazamraja> i suppose
[10:32:43] <Tempt> moazamraja: Defence etc are big AIX shops
[10:32:50] <moazamraja> don't know much about aus
[10:32:59] <moazamraja> defense here in US is alot of solaris, even irix
[10:33:00] <palowoda> 100mbit is so old.
[10:33:06] <Tempt> moazamraja: It's Solaris first, AIX|HPUX second. IRIX is almost non-existant, commercial use of the BSDs is almost non-existant
[10:33:11] <cmihai> moazamraja: there isn't that big a difference between AIX and Solaris you know. I terms of market share or the fact they're UNIX
[10:33:34] <moazamraja> marketshare wise, i believe aix is much lower
[10:33:36] <MousePad> "UNIX"(tm), that's what my Mac and Windows NT are hey?
[10:33:56] <Gekkko> hmm
[10:33:59] <Tempt> I don't want to work with MacOS, Windows or PenguinOS
[10:34:04] <Gekkko> can AIX run in VMWare?
[10:34:10] <moazamraja> no aix for x86.
[10:34:11] <Tempt> So I might as well keep my other skills fresh
[10:34:14] <Tempt> Gekkko: POWER only.
[10:34:19] <moazamraja> they said they would make it, eons ago, then they never did.
[10:34:24] <cmihai> moazamraja: so? You can get a RS/6000 cheap.
[10:34:36] <cmihai> Just make sure it's Power 4 if you want to run the latest and greatest (6.1 beta)
[10:34:37] <Tempt> IBM's been working hard on moving Linux shops over to AIX here
[10:34:42] <moazamraja> cmihai: i'm answering Gekkkos question. calm down.
[10:34:43] <Gekkko> Tempt: can't VMWare emulate POWER?
[10:34:52] <cmihai> Gekkko: silly rabbit...
[10:34:57] <Gekkko> >_>!
[10:34:57] <Tempt> cmihai: You need a reasonably recent RS/6000 to run 5.1 or better as well.
[10:35:02] <cmihai> Not really.
[10:35:08] <Gekkko> nothing can emulate a POWER CPU?
[10:35:13] <Tempt> vmware is an x86 only thing.
[10:35:28] <Gekkko> qemu?
[10:35:29] <Tempt> PearPC will emulate PowerPC
[10:35:34] <Tempt> But only for MacOS
[10:35:55] <seanmcg> qemu ?
[10:35:57] <cmihai> Qemu can emulate a PREP machine.
[10:36:00] <cmihai> But it won't run AIX.
[10:36:20] <palowoda> Why would some want to emulate AIX?
[10:36:47] <Tempt> Because they didn't have money/room/power for an RS/6000 or pSeries?
[10:36:52] <moazamraja> i ran AIX back in the early 5.x and late 4.x days, it had great storage management, that's about all I liked about it
[10:36:57] <moazamraja> well, and it ran fine, no major crashes.
[10:37:21] <cmihai> It's funny, but AIX has a pretty good management console too, wdm. It's basically a functional SMC :-]
[10:37:32] <palowoda> Tempt: I thought you can get them for 50.00 on ebay.
[10:37:37] <Tempt> Besides, if Sun starts chasing this Indiana will be Solaris idea, AIX will have a better userland ...
[10:37:54] <Tempt> palowoda: Nope, not for anything decent.
[10:38:07] <moazamraja> "indiana will be solaris" ? haven't heard that before
[10:38:15] <palowoda> Ah got it.  For AIX you need something decent.
[10:38:39] <Tempt> For example, my 8 way J50 is only supported to AIX 5.0
[10:38:58] <palowoda> How much are they on Ebay?
[10:39:06] <cmihai> palowoda: Europe or US?
[10:39:09] <Tempt> palowoda: They never turn up in Australia, so no idea.
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[10:40:17] <palowoda> cmihai: How about Wong, I'll translate it.
[10:41:09] <Tempt> I'd pay a reasonable amount for a decent small POWER5 box to add to my machine army.
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[10:41:33] <Tempt> and if someone local was working on Polaris, I'd probably give them the 8 way J50
[10:41:58] <cmihai> Eh, tried it once.
[10:42:03] <cmihai> Gave up fast :-)
[10:42:09] <palowoda> I thought Polaris was EOL'ed?
[10:42:30] <Tempt> Whatever; Solaris/POWER
[10:43:40] <moazamraja> wasnt the blastwave dude working on Polaris
[10:43:41] <cmihai> Tempt: expect to pay some 2000$ for a Power 4 :-)
[10:44:04] <moazamraja> I had a PPC 604 (motorola powerstack) machine that run Solaris 2.5, ages ago. gave it away
[10:44:12] <Tempt> cmihai: No way ...
[10:44:20] <Gekkko> no emulator runs AIX
[10:44:23] <Gekkko> nasty.
[10:44:24] <Tempt> cmihai: I've seen dual POWER4 go for $1000
[10:44:25] <palowoda> moazamraja: That was Dennis and it's out of his hands in into the shit pile right now.
[10:44:39] <Tempt> Gekkko: No emulator runs HPUX or IRIX either. Deal with it.
[10:44:48] <Tempt> Gekkko: The emulator kiddies aren't using UNIX.
[10:44:53] <Gekkko> I am dealing with it.
[10:45:24] <moazamraja> Gekkko: learn Solaris, once you're good at it, you can easily move around to almost any Unix
[10:45:26] <Tempt> I'm sure someone must have released a VAX emulator by now though.
[10:45:32] <cmihai> They did.
[10:45:35] <moazamraja> i work with 2-3 unixes, it's not that big of a deal
[10:45:37] <cmihai> Only runs BSD :P
[10:45:42] * Tempt sighs
[10:46:03] <Gekkko> moazamraja: I'm already more than comfortable using Linux
[10:46:08] <Gekkko> but Linux isn't Solaris, or UNIX
[10:46:13] <Tempt> anyway, I'm thinking about working for IBM, so I might be able to snag a POWER box while I'm there
[10:46:18] <Gekkko> still better than 0 knowledge
[10:46:28] <moazamraja> Gekkko: you'll be fine with Solaris, it's not that huge of a jump
[10:46:53] <Gekkko> I'm not saying it is
[10:47:02] <moazamraja> load up the same shell you're used to in linux, bring over your .bashrc (you're fav shell IS bash, right? ;) )
[10:47:11] <cmihai> Ugh
[10:47:37] <Gekkko> I'd rather learn the shell on Solaris
[10:47:38] <Gekkko> :P
[10:47:41] <cmihai> Yeah, change the root shell to bash, alias ls to gnu ls, add purple colors and you have yourself a nice Gentoolaris
[10:48:00] <cmihai> Add portalis while you're at it :-)
[10:48:11] <Gekkko> it exists?
[10:48:47] <palowoda> Barney is purple it can't all be that bad.
[10:49:49] <Tempt> From a typical Linux user perspective not much changes
[10:49:52] <Tempt> It's still GNOME
[10:49:59] <Tempt> you can still point-and-click your way through most shit.
[10:50:09] <Tempt> If there was a GUI frontend for blastwave.org the deal would be done
[10:50:39] <moazamraja> nothing wrong with a shell with some colors to it
[10:51:15] <moazamraja> http://lego.unixville.com/~moazam/shell.png   <-- the way it should be.
[10:51:15] <tsoome> admn, if you wanna get linux, then get linux, no need to mimic solaris to be linux
[10:51:51] <moazamraja> you know...some of us have had colored shell prompts and file completion on Solaris/SunOS BEFORE we ever tried Linux.
[10:52:02] <moazamraja> it's not like we just learned this 'feature' from linux
[10:52:47] <Gekkko> I don't care what  shell I use
[10:52:50] <Gekkko> as long as it works >_>!
[10:54:20] <Tempt> moazamraja: Pretty Colours!
[10:55:49] <Tempt> moazamraja: http://mexico.purplecow.org/tmp/my_prompt_of_doom.jpg
[10:55:52] <Tempt> beat that for ugly!
[10:56:06] <asyd> ouaah
[10:56:11] <Gekkko> looks mexican
[10:56:32] <moazamraja> contacting....
[10:56:59] <quasi> Tempt: what a waste of screen space
[10:57:02] <moazamraja> holy SHIT.
[10:57:05] <moazamraja> that's a prompt.
[10:57:06] <Gekkko> my prompt is simple
[10:57:09] <moazamraja> g'DAMN
[10:57:25] <Gekkko> user@stasi /usr/bin $
[10:57:27] <Tempt> quasi: Screen space is cheap, shocking EVERYONE with that prompt is worth it.
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[10:57:32] <Gekkko> with the first part in blue, directory in green
[10:57:51] <nightswi1> it's not even showing the return code of the exiting program
[10:57:54] <nightswi1> what a shitty prompt!
[10:58:25] <Tempt> I don't even really use that one so much anymore.
[10:58:35] <quasi> Tempt: you're not shocking me - it takes a wee bit more than some senseless playing with PS to do that
[10:59:15] <Tempt> frankly, user@host:/path $ is getting more common
[10:59:38] <Gekkko> what's wrong with common?
[10:59:42] <Gekkko> it's better than simply: #
[10:59:45] <Gekkko> # is boring.
[10:59:58] <Tempt> # is short and to the point.
[11:00:07] <Tempt> # reminds you that you're not $
[11:00:10] <Gekkko> I like knowing what directory I'm in
[11:00:20] <Gekkko> and that I'm not on a shell
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[11:04:09] <cmihai> hostname% ftw!
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[11:06:17] <Tempt> Gekkko: Write a prompt that updates a marquee scroller on the bottom line of the display with RSS feeds. Have it scroll every time you get a new prompt.
[11:06:37] <Gekkko> sounds cool
[11:06:53] <Gekkko> and kinda useful really
[11:07:00] <Gekkko> if you live on the command line
[11:07:03] <Tempt> I remember seeing someone's prompt that had free disk space and everything in it.
[11:07:20] <Tempt> I think we worked out every time he hit enter it forked over 45 proceses
[11:07:25] <Tempt> processes
[11:07:26] <Gekkko> Tempt: was it your screenshot that showed all those windows in screen?
[11:07:49] <Gekkko> with the red theme
[11:08:02] <Tempt> Yep.
[11:08:23] <moazamraja> Tempt: that's like Gnome...but at the command line.
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[11:09:10] <Gekkko> Tempt: how'd you get screen to show all the windows at the bottom like that?
[11:09:19] <Tempt> Gekkko: Just /msg'd it to you.
[11:09:36] <Gekkko> I noticed after :P
[11:10:00] <Tempt> moazamraja: He did it mostly for a laugh. Just leaning on enter drove the run queue up in seconds!
[11:10:50] <moazamraja> Tempt: i wonder if Gnome folks did it for a laugh also :(
[11:10:57] <Tempt> Sadly, not.
[11:11:00] <moazamraja> everytime someone logs in, gnome forks a billion processes
[11:11:09] <moazamraja> *click* ooh! more processes!
[11:11:42] <Tempt> Gekkko: In screen, ^A : nethack on
[11:12:03] <Gekkko> oh?
[11:12:36] <Tempt> Livens up the messages a bit.
[11:12:41] <Gekkko> I fear to say anything for I'll probably look stupid :P
[11:12:47] <Gekkko> I have nethack on
[11:12:50] <Gekkko> i know what it is
[11:12:57] <Gekkko> but C-a c creates a new screen
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[11:13:07] <Gekkko> C-a n, next screen, etc
[11:13:14] <Gekkko> oh shit
[11:13:18] <Gekkko> C-A
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[11:13:25] <Gekkko> not C-a...
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[11:14:36] <Atomdrache> Network administration question.  How do I set up a DHCP server in Solaris 9?
[11:15:17] <Atomdrache> I've got a box with one interface pointing upstream at a router, and another connected via cable to a switch.  What do I need to do to make this box act as a DHCP server for this subnet?
[11:15:55] <Gekkko> back to my question from before, is it easy to compile an OpenSolaris kernel?
[11:16:07] <Gekkko> or is it completely pointless
[11:16:43] <Tempt> Atomdrache: The easy way is to compile the ISC DHCPD
[11:16:58] <Tempt> Atomdrache: Or you can deal with the Solaris DHCP if you like. I believe there's a cutesy GUI, info @ docs.sun.com
[11:17:18] <Tempt> Gekkko: Oh, we all compile kernels daily with newer and better CFLAGS
[11:17:38] <cmihai>  /usr/sadm/admin/bin/dhcpmgr
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[11:17:50] <Atomdrache> I'm looking around docs.sun.com and I can't even see how to start the GUI.
[11:17:51] <Gekkko> Tempt: that's not why I was wondering about the kernel
[11:18:09] <cmihai> Atomdrache: http://www.sun.com/bigadmin/features/articles/jumpstart_x86_x64.jsp#i5 - read about DHCP here
[11:18:10] <Gekkko> probably should enquire as to the size of the kernel once compiled?
[11:18:15] <Atomdrache> Man page for dhcpconfig is a huge rat's nest and appears to only be a small part of this.  It does not help that I really don't know what I'm trying to do.
[11:18:24] <Atomdrache> I'll take a look at that.
[11:18:35] <cmihai> It has screenshots, it's a Java GUI, as simple as it gets.
[11:19:18] <Atomdrache> It is.  I just don't know how to start it.
[11:19:48] <Atomdrache> Oh, dhcpmgr.
[11:20:06] <cmihai> Atomdrache: I gave you full path... read a few lines up
[11:20:17] <Atomdrache> Oh.  Didn't see that.
[11:21:30] <dlg> neptune hurt my baby dell
[11:21:33] <cmihai> Atomdrache: unless you feel man enough to take dhcpconfig(1M) head on.
[11:22:27] <Gekkko> brb dinner's up
[11:22:29] <Atomdrache> That'd run a lot faster on this box, but...no, considering my present knowledge of networking, I think I'll opt for the Graphical Wuss Interface :3
[11:23:14] <Atomdrache> (to its credit, it seems to load a lot faster than the Solaris Management Console.)
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[11:30:16] <oxygene> Gekkko: it's not easy to compile the opensolaris system - as for the size, what do you mean? there's not much to change in the way it builds
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[11:31:32] <Atomdrache> Ah...looks like DHCP's up.
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[11:31:45] <Atomdrache> Is it hard to set up a Solaris 9 DNS server?
[11:32:23] <Tempt> No.
[11:32:24] <oxygene> hm.. I was just about to write something like this, but with an @sun.com domain, it has even more effect: http://www.opensolaris.org/jive/message.jspa?messageID=143793&tstart=0
[11:32:29] <Tempt> Same as any other server running bind
[11:32:34] <Gekkko> oxygene: ok
[11:34:28] <Atomdrache> Where should I look to figure out how to do that?
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[11:40:08] <Tempt> Atomdrache: The bind docs?
[11:40:17] <Tempt> Atomdrache: Or O'Reilly's "DNS and BIND" book?
[11:41:52] <Atomdrache> All the good bookstores are closed, so I guess the former :3
[11:42:07] * Atomdrache tries the named man page.
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[11:51:20] <Tempt> hmm, new prompt developed to replace old one which was getting a bit much. One liner short and with more information!
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[11:58:16] <Gekkko> DVD part 1 of 3 is almost complete, 80%
[11:58:47] <Atomdrache> Tempt:  Where's the Solaris-relevant BIND documentation?
[11:59:04] <Atomdrache> I don't really know which man pages to look at.
[11:59:12] <Atomdrache> Google doesn't seem to help much either.
[11:59:19] <Tempt> There really isn't any Solaris specific stuff for BIND
[11:59:24] <Tempt> It's pretty normal
[11:59:46] <Tempt> There's been a few security gotchyas lately though, so you might as well build a fresh one from source
[11:59:49] <Atomdrache> What I have found so far are examples of writing gnarly named.conf files from scratch.
[11:59:50] <Tempt> (it builds easily)
[12:00:08] <Tempt> Well, configuring bind usually involves writing gnarly named.conf files from scratch
[12:00:13] <Tempt> You want GUI DNS? Use Windows.
[12:00:32] <Atomdrache> Perhaps I am approaching this wrong.
[12:01:08] <Gekkko> lol
[12:01:13] <Gekkko> I wrote a named.conf from scratch
[12:01:15] <Gekkko> that was amusing.
[12:01:24] <Atomdrache> I need to be able to set up an NFS net-booting server, but the guy in charge of the DNS/DHCP machine is not around and won't be for quite some time, and I don't have access to that machine.
[12:01:27] <Gekkko> took me days >_>
[12:01:37] <Atomdrache> But I need access to a DHCP server for whatever reason to set this up.
[12:02:04] <Atomdrache> So it might be helpful, so I am informed by people who know what they are doing, to have all this on a seperate subnet with its own DHCP server.
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[12:02:15] <Tempt> Are we all using the same bind?
[12:02:22] <Atomdrache> Yes, we are.
[12:02:43] <Tempt> "Days" is not a word I'd use with setting up bind, except the time I had to clean up a nameserver with over 300 domains on it.
[12:02:52] <Tempt> And that time was all spent redelegating domains
[12:03:24] <Atomdrache> Well, the problem is I don't know much about setting up networks.  I've never done this.  So I don't know what all needs to be in place for there to be a router between this and the main network which does DHCP, DNS, and whatever else I need for these machines to have proper internet connectivity and human-readable hostnames that people outside the subnet can see.
[12:03:43] <Tempt> Okay.
[12:03:48] <Tempt> Why is this on a seperate subnet?
[12:03:58] <Atomdrache> I do not fully understand the reasons, to be honest.
[12:04:16] <Tempt> What are you setting up?
[12:04:33] <Atomdrache> A server I mean to use for a network OS installation.
[12:04:45] <Atomdrache> Which, for whatever reason, requires adjustments to be made to the DHCP server.
[12:05:16] <Atomdrache> Except I won't be able to do that unless I want to wait about two weeks to pester somebody who doesn't have time for it.
[12:05:43] <Gekkko> Tempt: I was talking learning from scratch
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[12:05:54] <Gekkko> and not knowing what the domains I needed to add until a day after
[12:05:59] <lloy0076> Anyone got Solaris running on one of these Intel Core 2 Quad Cores?
[12:06:16] <Atomdrache> So right now I am trying to understand the basic idea of what it is I am trying to do.
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[12:07:41] <Atomdrache> I want to have the machines in this room behind a router, with a seperate DHCP server from the rest of the network, because the DHCP server upstream is not available for what I need to do.  So I've got the outgoing cable to the main router on one ethernet interface, and a cable to the switch here on the other.
[12:08:42] <Atomdrache> I have set up the DHCP service on here, and other machines on the subnet can see its IP address.  So what else needs to be running for those machines to be able to function normally, i.e. connect to the internet?
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[12:08:57] <Gekkko> Intel Core 2 Quad Cores?
[12:09:01] <Gekkko> that's just fucktastic.
[12:09:09] <Gekkko> Core 2 Quad Core.
[12:09:10] <Gekkko> lol
[12:10:37] <Tempt> Okay, what are you using as a router?
[12:11:29] <Atomdrache> A SPARCstation-20 running Solaris 9 with a QFE card on the sbus.
[12:11:47] <Tempt> Okay, so it won't behave like a router, but a gateway
[12:11:54] <Atomdrache> Perhaps that is a better word for it.
[12:11:57] <Tempt> You should just need to configure dhcp and make sure it only yaks on one interface
[12:12:04] <lloy0076> Yes, it's a bizarre naming scheme to say the least
[12:12:07] <Tempt> and make sure the DHCP server gives the right IP as a default gateway
[12:12:07] <Atomdrache> I've done that so far.
[12:12:15] <Atomdrache> Err...the first part.
[12:12:18] <Tempt> and use the same old DNS
[12:12:27] <Tempt> and make sure IP forwarding is enabled
[12:12:30] <Atomdrache> How do I make sure that's working right?
[12:12:33] <Tempt> test it
[12:12:36] <Tempt> (derr!)
[12:12:43] <Atomdrache> I worded that wrong.
[12:12:50] <Tempt> Really.
[12:12:52] <Tempt> If it works, it works.
[12:12:56] <Tempt> If it doesn't, troubleshoot it
[12:13:07] <Atomdrache> How do I tell this machine to give the right IP as a default gateway, and how do I correctly enable IP forwarding?
[12:13:31] <Atomdrache> I was fairly sure I enabled IP forwarding, but I can't even ping the old DNS machine's IP address from inside the subnet.  So apparently I have not configured IP forwarding.
[12:13:57] <nayyares> i am new to solaris, i want to read the kernel logs, nothing i have find in /var/log/syslog ?
[12:14:31] <Tempt> The IP is configured in your DHCP server configs
[12:14:45] <oxygene> Gekkko: that reads "Core2" (cpu family) "QuadCore" (ie 4 cores) - they were annoying enough with "core duo" and "core2 duo" already
[12:14:45] <Tempt> (I'm not quite sure off the top of my head, I'd have to check)
[12:14:57] <Tempt> nayyares: /var/adm/messages
[12:14:58] <Atomdrache> I sort of selected an IP arbitrarily.
[12:15:07] <Gekkko> oxygene: yeah :-/
[12:15:15] <Tempt> The default gateway should be the IP of your gateway box (ss20)
[12:15:31] <Atomdrache> I set this on the other machines?
[12:15:42] <Tempt> So imagine your household network is on 192.168.1/24 and your SS20's address is 192.168.1.10
[12:15:56] <Tempt> and your private network is on 192.168.2/24 and your SS20's address is 192.168.2.10
[12:16:10] <Tempt> Your DHCP server should give out addresses in 192.168.2/24 with a default gateway of 192.168.2.10
[12:16:11] <Atomdrache> I don't quite follow.  What's 192.168.1/24 mean?
[12:16:18] <Tempt> Your SS20's default gateway should be ...
[12:16:19] <Tempt> oh.
[12:16:20] <Tempt> Ummn.
[12:16:36] <Atomdrache> Specifically, the /24 part.
[12:16:39] <Tempt> You probably want your housemate who sysadmins stuff to give you the five minute network lecture
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[12:17:23] <Tempt> the /24 means a netmask of 255.255.255.0 and an address range of .1 to .254
[12:17:41] <Atomdrache> For irrelevant reasons, if I ask him for a network lecture in his current mood he'll probably throw the nearest dead laptop at my head.  It is not advisable.
[12:18:03] <nayyares> Tempt: one more stupid question !, what if the screen/gui is locked by a user and it need password to activate, but i want to login from my user?
[12:18:32] <Tempt> nayyares: Find the user and ask them to log out, or get someone with root access to kill their session
[12:18:37] <Atomdrache> Otherwise, I'd ask him about all this.  He would know--he's worked at ISPs for years.
[12:18:51] <Tempt> Okay.
[12:18:54] <Tempt> Just take it slowly.
[12:19:03] <Gekkko> gtg ttyl.
[12:19:04] <Tempt> What IP range are you using for your own little network?
[12:20:06] <Atomdrache> The router is assigned 10.207.2.176 by the upstream router (DHCP is told always to give it this), and its qfe1 interface which talks to the subnet has 192.168.1.1.
[12:20:13] <Atomdrache> I don't know about the IP range.
[12:20:20] <Tempt> cool.
[12:20:24] <Atomdrache> But I told it to let there be 20 addresses,
[12:20:25] <nayyares> Tempt: is there any key combinations to kill that session and start new one ! i d'nt have root access.
[12:20:31] <Tempt> Make sure your interface has a netmask of 255.255.255.0
[12:20:36] <Atomdrache> from...I think 192.168.1.2 to 192.168.2.22.
[12:20:39] <Atomdrache> It does.
[12:20:54] <Tempt> Which means you've got 192.168.1.1 to 192.168.1.254
[12:21:20] <Tempt> And you should tell your DHCP to give 192.168.1.1 as a default gateway.
[12:21:33] <Atomdrache> How do I do that?
[12:22:03] <Tempt> You read the docs for the dhcp server. I haven't touched Solaris' dhcpd in some time, so I'd have to check myself.
[12:24:24] <Tempt> To be honest, I'd just plug a machine in and see what happens. It's not like you're going to break anything at home
[12:24:41] <Atomdrache> Eww...I wonder which will make sense first, Google or the rat's nest known as man dhcpconfig.
[12:24:47] <Atomdrache> I've got some machines plugged in.
[12:24:54] <Atomdrache> One next to this is currently acting as a test subject.
[12:25:23] <Tempt> just muck through the GUI configs
[12:25:33] <Tempt> I think it defaults to getting it right anyway
[12:25:36] <Atomdrache> If I try to ping outside the subnet (by address, since DNS isn't up again yet), it tries to use itself as a gateway.
[12:25:57] <Atomdrache> I've been poking around the DHCP administration GUI, and I haven't had any luck in finding where to set the default gateway.
[12:26:17] <Atomdrache> I used it to assign some addresses, and that was progess.
[12:27:41] <Atomdrache> That's the name.  DHCP Manager.
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[12:29:39] <trochej> http://www.flickr.com/photos/trochej/1037540709/
[12:29:55] <Atomdrache> Maybe it's /etc/gateways.
[12:30:07] <nayyares> is there any test based browser in core installation?
[12:30:18] <nayyares> *test/text
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[12:30:31] <Tempt> it isn't gateways
[12:31:09] <Atomdrache> Ech.
[12:31:42] <cmihai> nayyares: you can use telnet
[12:31:46] <Tempt> Let me have a look
[12:32:00] <cmihai> GET / HTTP/1.1
[12:32:31] <cmihai> Or install lynx / elinks / links / links2, or ssh -X from a machine with GUI
[12:33:13] <Tempt> (from dhcpconfig)
[12:33:44] <nayyares> cmihai: it is a production server and i have to test a webclient on it.
[12:33:49] <Atomdrache> I'll see what I can do with that.
[12:34:13] <Gekkko> http://www.newsvine.com/_news/2007/08/07/882261-teen-murdered-dad-lived-in-filthy-home
[12:34:27] <nayyares> cmihai: servers are installed with core setup.
[12:34:28] <Atomdrache> Ack.
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[12:34:41] <cmihai> Never a good idea ;-)
[12:34:46] <Atomdrache> Says it can't create a network macro because the network already exists.
[12:34:49] <cmihai> Oh well, what exactly do you need to test?
[12:35:00] <Tempt> Atomdrache: crap ..
[12:35:00] <Atomdrache> (using the -N and -t options, that is)
[12:35:24] <nayyares> i want to test the jboss management console that run in browser
[12:35:49] <cmihai> You need a Java enabled browser, nothing you can solve with a text based browser.
[12:35:58] <cmihai> You need Firefox, you can ssh -X to the machine...
[12:36:08] <cmihai> Now being a core install, it's your problem to install the stuff :-]\
[12:36:19] <cmihai> I hardly ever do core installs, it's such a pain.
[12:36:22] <nayyares> :D
[12:36:50] <nayyares> cmihai: then i should install firefox with jave support on server !
[12:36:52] <Atomdrache> I also somehow expect a dhcpd.conf to be somewhere, but I can't find one.
[12:36:58] <nayyares> *java
[12:37:04] <cmihai> nayyares: what's the problem?
[12:37:12] <cmihai> Apart from the fact you'll die trying to solve depends by hand?
[12:37:30] <cmihai> A server can have EVERYTHING installed, as long as it's not RUNNING constantly, it's not an issue.
[12:37:54] <cmihai> So it's generally a good idea to do a Full Install + OEM... well, maybe not JES, but all you really save is space.. 5$ worth :P
[12:37:59] <nayyares> cmihai: in fact i have to ask os people to do it for me and it will take alot of time :D
[12:38:38] <cmihai> I can't really see why you'd need to test it with a browser on the server, but if you do, that's pretty much the way to do it.
[12:39:09] <cmihai> And unless it's something like a DHCP server, tell those lazy bums to do full installs from now on :P
[12:39:59] <Tempt> Atomdrache: fire up the GUI
[12:40:00] <nayyares> our AS is not allowed to communicate with workstations :D for port 80 so i cant test it from workstation, i have to find out the way !
[12:40:01] <Tempt> in the macro tab
[12:40:12] <Tempt> There's a router line item
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[12:41:32] <cmihai> nayyares: eh, you could do PAT or proxy or something, but that's just wrong :P
[12:41:37] <Atomdrache> Labeled router?
[12:41:38] <Atomdrache> I don't see it.
[12:41:50] <cmihai> Atomdrache: use the damn GUI, it's all there.
[12:41:58] <Tempt> click on your network first
[12:42:08] <Tempt> If it isn't there I can't help you any further with dhcp...
[12:42:20] <Atomdrache> Under the "macros" folder in the macros tab?
[12:42:54] <Tempt> I'm running 10
[12:42:57] <Tempt> maybe it's different
[12:43:00] <nayyares> cmihai: i have just joined this company last week, d'nt want to to fired unless get my first salary :D
[12:43:07] <Tempt> I don't have a 9 box around here
[12:43:32] <cmihai> nayyares: oh, then skip the crazy proxy / PAT part mkey? :-]
[12:43:51] <Atomdrache> There.
[12:43:57] <cmihai> Hell, if it's a test machine just reinstall or ask them to strap on a Full Install there.
[12:43:59] <Atomdrache> It was pretty well buried in there, but I think I found it.
[12:44:00] <cmihai> You can strip it down later.
[12:44:14] <Tempt> Atomdrache: w00t
[12:44:15] <cmihai> (but all you'd gain is a few gb of space.. 1-2)
[12:44:40] <Atomdrache> /etc/inet.d/dhcp restart?
[12:44:45] <cmihai> nayyares: if they have JumpStart + Flar you could have one up and running in 20 minutes :-)
[12:44:58] <cmihai> Atomdrache: Solaris 9 you say?
[12:45:00] <nayyares> cmihai: its a production one
[12:45:01] <Atomdrache> Yes.
[12:45:01] <cmihai> Yeah.
[12:45:10] <Atomdrache> I found and added the router line.
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[12:45:19] <Atomdrache> Err...yeah, okay.  I misread something.
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[12:46:04] <nayyares> cmihai: what is the command to list all packages installed in box? (again i am a duck to solaris)
[12:46:14] <Tempt> quack
[12:46:21] <cmihai> nayyares: pkginfo
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[12:47:22] <Tempt> Atomdrache: You realise that hosts on the other network will need to know how to find your network, right?
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[12:47:40] <Atomdrache> Yes.  So how should I go about that?
[12:47:46] <Tempt> static routes on the other hosts
[12:47:52] <Atomdrache> Also it doesn't seem to work quite right.
[12:47:55] <Tempt> or run a routing protocol
[12:48:06] <Atomdrache> Used to say host unreachable when I tried to ping out of the subnet.
[12:48:19] <Tempt> That's because the host doesn't know how to send packets back to you
[12:48:26] <Atomdrache> Ah.
[12:48:42] <Atomdrache> So would I be able to fix this at the router?
[12:48:52] <Tempt> Not your gateway
[12:49:01] <Atomdrache> Err...yeah, at the gateway.  No?
[12:49:02] <Atomdrache> Hmm.
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[12:49:08] <Tempt> No, not your gateway
[12:49:21] <Tempt> The OUTSIDE hosts need to know how to get YOUR hosts.
[12:49:49] <Tempt> They don't know that 192.168.1.whatever lives behind 10.whatever on their subnet, they'll try to just use the default gateway they already have
[12:50:03] <nayyares> cmihai: what is the command line name for mozilla browser, package is installed !
[12:50:10] <Tempt> mozilla
[12:50:12] <Tempt> (duh)
[12:50:20] <nayyares> o.O
[12:50:28] <Atomdrache> So does the upstream gateway/router have to be set up to redirect traffic to 192.168.1.x to this subnet?
[12:50:29] <cmihai> nayyares: grep mozilla /var/sadm/install/contents
[12:50:39] <cmihai> grep packagename /var/sadm/install/contents lists all files it contains
[12:50:41] <nayyares> command not found ! $mozilla
[12:50:46] <cmihai> It's not in PATH
[12:50:55] <cmihai> Do the grep thing, look for stuff in a /bin
[12:51:16] <Atomdrache> I'm seeing hints around of setting up NAT.  Is that what I need to do?
[12:52:41] <Tempt> Atomdrache: No.
[12:52:51] <Tempt> Atomdrache: You just need to slip a route into your upstream router
[12:53:03] <Atomdrache> Okay, so I need to get hold of the guy in charge of the upstream router.
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[12:53:18] <Tempt> Yep.
[12:53:19] <Atomdrache> Hopefully I've done enough of the rest of the work that that'll be fairly quick.
[12:53:21] <Tempt> Your angry housemate
[12:53:32] <Atomdrache> I also have exactly one day.  He leaves again after tomorrow.
[12:53:45] <Tempt> You'll need to have your IP address, your netmask and .. well, beer helps
[12:53:54] <Atomdrache> I think he likes gin :3
[12:54:04] <Atomdrache> The IP of the router inside the subnet?
[12:55:59] <Atomdrache> Looks like I can SSH from one of the client machines to the router, and from there to machines outside the subnet.  I guess that's a good sign.
[12:56:03] <Tempt> Just make sure you've got all your information.
[12:56:24] <Atomdrache> I've got all the information about the things I screwed with.  Should be straightforward.
[12:56:45] <Tempt> Excellent.
[12:57:18] <Atomdrache> Then I can experience the joy of trying to do a network-install of NetBSD onto a SPARCstation IPX.
[12:57:19] <Tempt> He only needs to know your IP range and your IP address on his network
[12:59:29] <Atomdrache> Sounds fairly simple.
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[13:09:44] <Tempt> Atomdrache: For your next trick, get an old Cisco and configure it up
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[13:15:45] <nayyares> is there any package to install for enhanced facilities in vi editor, as default vi is very crapy in solaris :-|
[13:16:10] <trygvis> nayyares: blastwave.org has vim
[13:16:11] <Berny> get vim from blastwave?
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[13:16:40] <cmihai> nayyares: no, the default vi is... vi in Solaris.
[13:16:45] <quasi> SPRO has vim as well
[13:16:48] <cmihai> The default "vi" is NOT vi in "yourOS"
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[13:17:05] <Berny> hehe spro has xemacs as well :>
[13:17:13] <cmihai> heh, yeah
[13:17:14] <trygvis> cmihai: it is still very crappy compared to vi in "yourOS"
[13:17:25] <cmihai> Eh, use ed(1) :-]
[13:17:28] <trygvis> :P
[13:17:46] <Atomdrache> Tempt:  I think I have enough things to do to keep myself amused for the time being :3
[13:17:48] <Berny> ed is fine
[13:17:50] <quasi> trygvis: no, sun vi is stock vi - not vim as you'll see in most other places pretending to be vi
[13:17:57] <Berny> if you have no real terminal ;-)
[13:18:06] <cmihai> Or nvi or elvis or whatever
[13:18:07] <trygvis> quasi: no shit
[13:18:32] <quasi> trygvis: and it works just fine as it is
[13:18:37] <Atomdrache> (e.g. what I mean to do with a DHCP server I can set up to allow network installations--I wish myself good luck in getting that to work on the first try)
[13:19:01] <nayyares> ufff, vi is an issue in solaris o.O
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[13:19:08] <quasi> Atomdrache: what do you want to do network installs of? solaris?
[13:19:15] <Berny> oh well Atomdrache just tick the dhcp box to be on in the routers web config ;-P
[13:19:26] <trygvis> quasi: yes, but it still sucks compared to vim
[13:19:29] <Atomdrache> NetBSD.  Seems a good choice for an old IPX.
[13:19:39] <Atomdrache> Also a SS630MP.
[13:19:53] <quasi> trygvis: nah, when you get used to it, it works just fine
[13:20:08] <Berny> who needs cursor keys?
[13:20:24] <quasi> trygvis: only if you stay in insert mode, then vi is a bit picky
[13:20:37] <Berny> who needs mor then i, d, x, w, q and s anyway?
[13:20:38] <Atomdrache> Though I eventually mean to do network installations of Solaris 11, when that's out.
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[13:20:48] <Atomdrache> For my SXCE boxes.
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[13:21:42] <Tempt> Berny: J
[13:22:48] * nayyares is afraid of Berny old editing love !
[13:23:35] <Tempt> What's wrong with vi?
[13:23:38] <Tempt> it works
[13:23:44] <Tempt> always there
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[13:23:54] <trygvis> indeed
[13:23:57] <cmihai> Eh, it's different on most platforms
[13:24:02] <cmihai> Even Bill Joy doesn
[13:24:05] <cmihai> 't use vi anymore :-)
[13:24:05] <Tempt> aix, hpux, irix, linux, *bsd, riscos, sinix, dynix
[13:24:07] <cmihai> he uses ed(1)
[13:24:14] <cmihai> It's always there :D
[13:24:48] * Atomdrache is pleased to see that this computer doesn't have nano.  Now that would be vile.
[13:25:03] <cmihai> Bah
[13:25:19] <cmihai> I hate nano / pico just as much as I hate the purple cow and colored ls / make output
[13:25:26] <Tempt> purple cow?
[13:25:29] <Atomdrache> I know a guy who writes C code and web pages with nano.  I think he does it just to be contrary.
[13:25:33] <WickedWicky> Milka!
[13:25:37] <Tempt> What is wrong with Purple Cows?
[13:25:38] <cmihai> Tempt: nano is a trademark Gentoo editor
[13:25:42] <WickedWicky> nothing!
[13:25:46] <cmihai> They're Gentoo's logo
[13:25:47] <WickedWicky> Milka chocolate for the win!
[13:26:01] <Tempt> I've had purplecow.org longer than gentoo has been around
[13:26:07] <Tempt> Can I fsck with them legally?
[13:26:09] <cmihai> lol
[13:26:15] <WickedWicky> Tempt: that old?
[13:26:20] <cmihai> purple cow.org? :-\
[13:26:26] <cmihai> What is this, Cow Parade?
[13:26:36] <WickedWicky> moo-eh, I am a cownadian
[13:26:42] <Tempt>  /whois tempt
[13:26:57] <cmihai> I... see
[13:27:09] * cmihai takes a step back
[13:27:13] <WickedWicky> lol
[13:27:35] <Tempt> I don't want my "brand" associated with PenguinOS
[13:28:13] <cmihai> Well, technically speaking, if you want me to be a SOB...
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[13:28:18] <cmihai> Gentoo is not a PenguinOS
[13:28:20] <cmihai> GentooBSD!
[13:28:27] <Tempt> Okay.
[13:28:32] <cmihai> That should get you puking purple.
[13:28:40] <Tempt> I don't want my "brand" associated with fsckin' ricerOS
[13:29:06] <Atomdrache> Perhaps I'm out of the loop, but...what's with the purple?
[13:29:20] <cmihai> Purple Haze :D
[13:29:53] <cmihai> Hendrix baby, Hendrix!
[13:30:00] <Atomdrache> Hendrix pertains to purple cows and Linux somehow?
[13:30:14] <WickedWicky> today it does
[13:30:16] <Tempt> Oh, it's Sun purple
[13:30:43] <quasi> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CowParade
[13:30:53] <Atomdrache> Oh, that dark shade of purple on the diamond logos of beige SPARCstations?
[13:31:50] <Tempt> or the front of Sun Fire machines
[13:31:53] <Atomdrache> quasi:  Now you are just being silly =P
[13:31:58] <Tempt> or other random sun boxes.
[13:32:00] <cmihai> Or SGI Indigo
[13:32:10] <Tempt> No, that's SGI purple ;)
[13:32:13] <Atomdrache> I think part of the case of my E450 sports it, too.
[13:32:25] <cmihai> quasi: we had that here recently
[13:32:29] <Tempt> The 450 is a bit of a cow too
[13:32:31] <cmihai> it was full of fucking purple cows everywhere
[13:32:32] <Tempt> Mooooooo
[13:32:40] <Tempt> Mooooooooooooooooo
[13:32:54] <quasi> cmihai: misplaced paste - I just tried to fake it by saying nothing ;=
[13:33:23] <Tempt> Moooooo
[13:33:31] <Atomdrache> Enterprise 450s, Linux, Sun purple, cows, and Hendrix.  ...THIS MEANS SOMETHING, MAN :O
[13:33:55] <cmihai> And SGI Indigo!
[13:34:38] <Atomdrache> In on it, of course.  Blatant enough to name a workstation after it.
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[13:40:06] <nayyares> there is no such file in /var/sadm/message in my machine O.O
[13:40:36] <Cyrille> and no /var/adm/messages either?
[13:41:14] <nayyares> Cyrille: :D yeah i left *s !
[13:41:30] <Cyrille> and put one too many in sadm...
[13:41:44] <nayyares> Cyrille: :D hahahhahahhahaha
[13:43:20] <nayyares>  /var/adm/messages is empty, does it mean its not enable , for kernel logs, where i can check it?
[13:44:31] <Cyrille> dmesg
[13:44:48] <Cyrille> man syslog
[13:45:06] <Cyrille> sorry, man syslogd
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[14:08:01] <nayyares> the /etc/syslog.conf is properly configured but still /var/adm/messages is empty O.O
[14:09:17] <hile_> Did you hup syslogd?
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[14:09:33] <hile_> and are you sure that syslog.conf is correct?
[14:10:05] <nayyares> hile_: yeah i have checked it, with manual page, its prety fine
[14:10:56] <nayyares> the /etc/init.d/ there is'nt any daemon for syslog ?
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[14:11:58] <hile_> svc:/system/system-log:default
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[14:16:14] <jmcp> nayyares: do you have any other messages files, eg /var/adm/messages.0 ?
[14:17:07] <nayyares> jmcp: nope
[14:17:21] <jmcp> it's possible that there's been nothing worth logging
[14:17:31] <nayyares> sorry : yeah yeah
[14:17:54] <jmcp> nayyares: how long has the system been up?
[14:18:13] <nayyares> i have /var/adm/messages.0 *.1 etc.
[14:18:33] <nayyares> it has been 140 days :)
[14:18:51] <jmcp> ah
[14:19:11] <jmcp> ok, clue me in here -what's the problem, exactly?
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[14:20:16] <WickedWicky> jmcp: he expected his messages to be filled
[14:20:28] <nayyares> in fact , messages file is empty while other messages.0 and rest are old one
[14:20:29] <jmcp> oh, right
[14:21:22] <jmcp> nayyares: I've often had systems where nothing got logged for weeks - because there was nothing to log
[14:21:23] <Doc> nice... http://immike.net/blog/2007/08/06/single-line-of-html-crashes-ie-6/
[14:22:43] <nayyares> but i have restarted jboss several time on this machine, i thought i must have some thing about it o.O
[14:22:57] <jmcp> jboss will have its own logging system somewhere
[14:23:02] <jmcp> like tomcat has its own logging
[14:23:05] <jmcp> ditto for apache
[14:23:29] <nayyares> yeah it has, but i thought kernel must have notice this thing !
[14:23:51] <jmcp> why should it? it's an application
[14:24:04] <jmcp> as far as I know most app servers don't have kernel interaction except for syscalls
[14:25:37] <WickedWicky> jboss writes its log file to $JBOSS_HOME/logs/server.log
[14:26:19] <WickedWicky> it uses log4j to be precise and does not interact with syslog, unless java gets killed due to OOM
[14:26:28] <nayyares> yeah that is log is written , but i was assuming that my restart scripts have been noticed by kernel, WickedWicky
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[14:26:46] <WickedWicky> nayyares: wont happen :)
[14:26:54] <kaiwai> WickedWicky: it could happen :)
[14:27:02] <jmcp> kaiwai: no, it won't
[14:27:20] * kaiwai wonders what they're talking about
[14:27:31] <WickedWicky> unless you configure jboss to use one of the local facilities of syslogd, it wont
[14:27:36] * nayyares was wrong in his dreams !
[14:27:39] <WickedWicky> kaiwai: alcohol and women, what else?
[14:27:51] <kaiwai> ah, well
[14:27:54] * kaiwai sits in the corner
[14:28:11] <kaiwai> btw, what is the "Turgo Platform SW Support"?
[14:28:12] <jmcp> kaiwai: nayyares was wondering whether restarting jboss would force something to get sent to syslogd, to which the answer is no
[14:28:37] <richlowe> kaiwai: support for the Turgo platform
[14:28:51] <kaiwai> I assume thats a Sun platform
[14:29:14] <richlowe> Yes.
[14:29:22] <kaiwai> ah, spiffy
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[14:40:43] <Vanuatoo> Is it planned to release Solaris 10 update 4 this month?
[14:40:48] <cmihai>  Yes...
[14:40:55] <cmihai> Should be any day now...
[14:41:16] <Vanuatoo> Polishing new dvd for it... :D
[14:41:21] <cmihai> Well, tomorrow to be exact.
[14:41:25] <cmihai> Let's how it's not late. Again.
[14:41:39] <jmcp> Vanuatoo: some time this month is the best that I can say
[14:41:59] <Vanuatoo> So it'll be 8/07 not 7/07
[14:42:05] <cmihai> Well, duh :P
[14:42:19] <jmcp> Vanuatoo: yup
[14:42:27] <cmihai> Your best bet is to install u3 and leave a /altroot ready for LU :P
[14:42:40] <kaiwai> hmm berry danish
[14:42:52] * sle is waiting for the new SPARC processors
[14:43:10] <kaiwai> sle: the SPARC64 IV?
[14:43:18] <sle> hopefully they'll push down the prices for the T1000
[14:43:21] <Vanuatoo> Sun device detection tool told me that both of my network cards are not supported along with integrated intel audio. Have to sit on fedora here :(
[14:43:32] <sle> kaiwai: both the Rock and the T2
[14:43:55] <kaiwai> ah
[14:43:59] <kaiwai> good for servers
[14:44:04] <Vanuatoo> It would be great to give times also in GMT when doing annoucments
[14:44:05] <sle> depending on the workload
[14:44:19] <sle> we love our T2000, but it's not a solution to everything
[14:44:23] <kaiwai> sle: true, true - SPARC64's are pretty good too
[14:45:11] <quasi> sle: the next gen for t2000 seems to fix a fair number of its issues
[14:45:19] <sle> though, if anything, i love Sun for how well they integrate in a LOM
[14:45:37] <kaiwai> the Intel ones should be nice though
[14:45:41] <sle> i might be able to get more performance for cost with dell
[14:45:50] <kaiwai> CSI should improve scalability in intel processors
[14:45:57] <Gekkko[PDA]> wee
[14:45:58] <sle> but when stuff hits the fan, i much rather be trying to fix a sun fire
[14:46:12] <kaiwai> sle: not all intel machines are shit box dells
[14:46:15] <quasi> sle: rarely if you factor in the cost of cooling, power and maintenance
[14:46:32] <sle> heh, we get those for free ;)
[14:46:37] <Gekkko[PDA]> 88 hours and SXCE completes xD
[14:46:42] <Gekkko[PDA]> 8*
[14:46:57] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: SXCE completes?
[14:47:02] <kaiwai> you downloading it?
[14:47:07] <Gekkko[PDA]> yes
[14:47:13] <kaiwai> ah, over dial up?
[14:47:34] <Gekkko[PDA]> no.
[14:47:38] <Gekkko[PDA]> lol
[14:47:47] <sle> hey, i did that with solaris 8
[14:47:48] <Gekkko[PDA]> 2gb = 8 hours
[14:47:49] <kaiwai> I assume if it is taking that long, it must be
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[14:48:09] <sle> and back then there was so sun downloader, so i couldnt resume
[14:48:09] <Gekkko[PDA]> 70kb/s isn't dialup
[14:48:18] <Gekkko[PDA]> but it does suck.
[14:48:18] <Stric> close enough :P
[14:48:22] <kaiwai> hmm, kinda sucks
[14:48:27] <kaiwai> and I whine about 200KB/s
[14:48:34] <Gekkko[PDA]> ..
[14:48:43] <kaiwai> mind you, I'd whine if it were 800KB/s
[14:48:45] <Gekkko[PDA]> i usually get 20kb/s
[14:49:14] <sle> sun's servers are peered at some point in calren's network
[14:49:23] <sle> so we can manage to saturate fast ethernet
[14:49:25] <Gekkko[PDA]> i opened 20 sockets to get 70kb/s
[14:49:36] <kaiwai> damn, where are you Gekkko[PDA] ?
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[14:49:58] <Gekkko[PDA]> my connection is bugged.
[14:50:05] <richlowe> kaiwai: for reference, by the time the local bandwidth is enough to make you happy, the remote b/w starts sucking.
[14:50:09] <richlowe> you'll never be happy.
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[14:50:41] <Gekkko[PDA]> it's not about where i am
[14:50:56] <kaiwai> richlowe: is it possible to be happy?
[14:50:57] <Stric> Gekkko[PDA]: if you have a high latency connection, then up your tcp windows
[14:51:08] <Gekkko[PDA]> severe lag, no banfdwidth while downloading lol
[14:51:30] <Gekkko[PDA]> Stric: it's ADSL.
[14:51:42] <Gekkko[PDA]> 30 ping, 20kb/s
[14:51:46] <Gekkko[PDA]> ...
[14:51:53] <Gekkko[PDA]> 30ms ping*
[14:51:55] <Stric> high latency to the other side
[14:52:27] <delewis> anyone seen an issue with zones on Solaris 10 (or perhaps an Express release) where any uid is mapped to nobody when mounting an NFS export?
[14:52:37] <delewis> can't find much on SunSolve.
[14:52:37] <Gekkko[PDA]> it's not latency, my connection wsas good until they chang2ed the system
[14:52:55] <Gekkko[PDA]> billing system
[14:52:59] <Stric> since tcp throughput is limited by for instance tcp window size/roundtriptime
[14:53:23] <Stric> http://www.acc.umu.se/~maswan/linux-netperf.txt
[14:53:46] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: you in pakistan or afghanistan?
[14:54:11] <Stric> delewis: nfsv4?
[14:54:15] <delewis> mounting the export in the zone with vers=3 works fine.
[14:54:21] <delewis> vers=4 maps everything to nobody, though.
[14:54:30] <Gekkko[PDA]> kaiwai: funny.
[14:54:33] <delewis> figured someone around here might know of a magic patch I can install. :-)
[14:54:42] <Gekkko[PDA]> kaiwai: Australia.
[14:54:45] <Stric> delewis: different v4 domains or whatever it's called is my un-educated guess
[14:54:57] <Gekkko[PDA]> the lag just vanished, not good...
[14:54:58] <delewis> Stric, shouldn't be a problem.
[14:55:02] <Stric> Gekkko[PDA]: ah. then you do have a high latency connection to the world.
[14:55:21] <Gekkko[PDA]> Stric: 20kb/s to local people
[14:55:37] <Gekkko[PDA]> not just US, etc
[14:55:48] <delewis> anyway to check if the domain is a problem?
[14:56:04] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: well, having lived over there, its close enough to a third world telephone network
[14:56:38] <Gekkko[PDA]> lol kaiwai, Tempt will probablpy argue against that
[14:56:59] <Gekkko[PDA]> it's sparsity = price
[14:57:07] <Gekkko[PDA]> probl.ems, etc
[14:57:26] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: mate, we're talking about a country with 20million who can't be bothered investing in a fibre to the US - NZ has 1/5 the population and paid for 1/2 of the cable -
[14:57:48] <Gekkko[PDA]> they hate us.
[14:57:54] <Gekkko[PDA]> :P
[14:58:28] <kaiwai> na, just Telstra screwing the aussie into the ground, but the averag aussie too dumb to realise that just beacuse teltra is australia doesn't make them a nice company
[14:58:39] <kaiwai> *australian
[14:58:52] <Gekkko[PDA]> kaiwai: CEO is a fscking American >.>
[14:59:06] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: its majority aussie owned
[14:59:17] <Gekkko[PDA]> i know that
[14:59:31] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: and aussies have some sort of attachment to 'aussie icons' like telstra and qantus, no matter how shit their service is
[14:59:33] <Gekkko[PDA]> but the ceo is amerrican, hes dirty
[14:59:47] <Gekkko[PDA]> kaiwai: noone likes telstra
[14:59:54] <Gekkko[PDA]> don't be daft.
[14:59:56] <Gekkko[PDA]> lol,
[15:00:10] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: then people would be leaving them in droves, which they're not
[15:00:34] <Gekkko[PDA]> look at the alternatives >.>
[15:00:48] <kaiwai> kinda like Sun's attachment with having a large number of programmers in america given the cost of employment
[15:00:49] <Gekkko[PDA]> ADSL2 will be great
[15:01:15] <jmcp> kaiwai: there you go again, frothing at the mouth with no clue about what you're saying
[15:01:21] <kaiwai> Gekkko[PDA]: still waiting for the roll out here, should be by the end of this year - mind you, I'm connected to the exchange at 6.2Mbps, so no complain here
[15:01:22] <kaiwai> *complaint
[15:01:33] <kaiwai> jmcp: regarding what?
[15:01:55] <Gekkko[PDA]> brb
[15:01:58] <jmcp> kaiwai: Sun's software engineering staff
[15:02:15] <kaiwai> jmcp: it took them a while to branch out and realise that there is a world beyond the US
[15:02:38] <Cyrille> define while
[15:02:54] <hile_> kaiwai, as much as it's contrary to your genetic makeup, please try not to be an ass
[15:03:09] <nayyares> i have connect to my server with ssh -X option but when i run jconsole it give me error that " No X11 DISPLAY was set" ?
[15:03:20] <kaiwai> Cyrille: when sun was losing money and shrinking in terms of revenue for example
[15:04:15] <Gekkko[PDA]> back
[15:04:30] <oxygene> kaiwai: some parts of sun still haven't realized this
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[15:05:00] <Gekkko[PDA]> theres Sun in Sydney :)
[15:05:11] <kaiwai> oxygene: true; some are still living in the 80s when there were $14,000 workstations, Windows NT was a joke, and regean was president
[15:05:21] <jmcp> Gekkko[PDA]: and since I left Sydney, there's no longer any software engineering there :-)
[15:05:39] <kaiwai> jmcp: where abouts are you now?
[15:05:43] <jmcp> Brisbane
[15:05:47] <jmcp> back home
[15:05:56] <kaiwai> ah, nice - all the kiwi dole bludgers up there :P
[15:06:26] <Gekkko[PDA]> I just want a nice solid vjob
[15:06:46] <Gekkko[PDA]> so i dont have to think hypothetically.
[15:06:49] <Gekkko[PDA]> >.>
[15:06:55] <jmcp> a virtual job?
[15:07:20] <Gekkko[PDA]> job*
[15:07:28] <Gekkko[PDA]> nice typo.l
[15:07:33] <Gekkko[PDA]> typo...
[15:07:42] <Gekkko[PDA]> fucking onscreen kbd.
[15:08:28] <Gekkko[PDA]> MyKbd Atomik it's called, in qwerty format, which isn't default
[15:11:06] <Tempt> Moooooo
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[15:14:55] <Gekkko[PDA]> boo?
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[15:15:36] <WickedWicky> no
[15:15:37] <WickedWicky> mooo
[15:15:39] <WickedWicky> purple cows
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[15:19:05] <kaiwai> lol
[15:19:10] <kaiwai> well, that tickled me pink
[15:19:18] <Gekkko[PDA]> <.<
[15:19:36] <WickedWicky> ask Tempt for more info regarding purple cows
[15:19:41] <kaiwai> florida theme park for Jesus freaks is going through tough times - where is the moral majority I hear republicans rant on about?
[15:20:03] <WickedWicky> they have their own theme park?
[15:20:04] <Gekkko[PDA]> lol
[15:20:06] <WickedWicky> wtf?
[15:20:56] <kaiwai> yeap
[15:21:00] <kaiwai> only in america - as they say
[15:22:23] <FrostCS> Please either change the room's topic to the actual range of discussion, or stick to the topic. I can vouch for 90% of the people in here in saying that we don't want to hear about politics or religion.
[15:22:58] <kaiwai> FrostCS: hmm, ok - but other topics are ok?
[15:23:09] <oxygene> hmm.. licensing? ;)
[15:23:29] <FrostCS> How about sticking with OpenSolaris topics?
[15:23:37] <Gekkko[PDA]> lol Anthony Mundine could be permablind in one eye
[15:23:40] <Gekkko[PDA]> HAHAHAHA
[15:23:44] <kaiwai> hmm, OpenSolaris touches so many different topics though!
[15:23:45] <jmcp> Gekkko[PDA]: you heard the man
[15:23:54] <jmcp> kaiwai: religion and politics are generally not two of them
[15:23:57] <FrostCS> Political and Religion discussion is equal to flame-baiting.
[15:24:00] <jmcp> FrostCS: thanks
[15:24:12] <kaiwai> ok :-( *kawai hides in the corner*
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[15:26:33] <Tempt> Hey, Frosty.
[15:26:36] <Tempt> Been a while.
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[15:27:01] <FrostCS> Morning Tempt, yea, haven't been home much.
[15:27:15] <Tempt> Still doing that contract in the city?
[15:27:47] <FrostCS> I have to go back again sometime.. but finished the first part of it
[15:28:07] <Tempt> Aah well, the profit will get you a step closer to that hammock.
[15:28:36] <FrostCS> heh, quite a few :-)
[15:28:44] <FrostCS> (steps that is)
[15:28:55] <kaiwai> FrostCS: lots of long hours?
[15:29:20] <FrostCS> kaiwai, I wish
[15:29:37] <FrostCS> Just decent pay.
[15:29:45] <kaiwai> ah
[15:29:51] <kaiwai> idle hands are the devils playground
[15:30:08] <bda> eee. EEE. "Spook Country" shipped.
[15:30:10] <Gekkko[PDA]> brb
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[15:30:17] <Tempt> Devil must consider you a veritable set of monkey-bars and a swingset, kaiwai
[15:31:10] <kaiwai> Tempt: :P
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[15:55:46] <WickedWicky> name me a fancy shiny looking terminal I can use under X
[15:56:09] <Tempt> rxvt
[15:56:31] <WickedWicky> let's see
[15:56:46] <seanmcg> normal xterm becomes 'shiny' under compiz :)
[15:58:45] <kaiwai> fancy and shiny are relative terms
[15:59:10] <richlowe> why in the world would a terminal need to be shiny?
[15:59:30] <Tempt> I can think of lots of things that would make a terminal shiny
[15:59:42] <timeless> but why would you want any of them?
[15:59:44] <Tempt> And given I work mostly from a terminal, a good, fast, shiny terminal would have appeal
[15:59:54] * timeless prefers dull terminals
[15:59:57] <timeless> monochrome
[16:00:11] <richlowe> I'm fine with color, but I can't figure out where shiny would come in.
[16:00:58] <Tempt> Colour makes terminals better
[16:01:14] <WickedWicky> colour makes looking at terminals more fun
[16:01:17] <Tempt> Or at least a few different attributes - normal, bright, underline, reversed
[16:01:47] <Tempt> You know what would be cool?
[16:01:51] <Tempt> An X aware screen
[16:02:01] <Tempt> Just attach it to your session and instant tabbed terminal
[16:02:06] <Tempt> tear off windows
[16:02:31] <Tempt> scrollback, cut/paste, logging
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[16:07:19] <Tempt> WickedWicky: Keep us posted on your terminal quest
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[16:08:09] <quasi> mmmmm, http://blogs.sun.com/innovation/entry/a_system_on_a_chip
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[16:08:49] <quasi> "will be shipping with s10U4"
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[16:09:00] <WickedWicky> Tempt: trying Eterm now
[16:09:10] <WickedWicky> it blaats about built-in screen support
[16:09:14] <WickedWicky> let's see what that means
[16:09:18] <Tempt> Cool. Let's see.
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[16:15:48] <WickedWicky> check this
[16:15:51] <WickedWicky> http://www.eterm.org/docs/view.php?doc=man
[16:16:04] <WickedWicky> The protocol should be either screen (the default) or twin. If user, host, and/or port are specified, an ssh connection is made to the remote server using the given login information. The default is to create/attach to a local session.
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[16:17:05] <Tempt> Question is, will it compile?
[16:17:30] <WickedWicky> trying
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[16:20:04] <Pietro_S> WickedWicky: follow SFE - especially SFEeterm.spec file ;-)
[16:20:18] <Tempt> URL?
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[16:24:11] <Pietro_S> Tempt: http://pkgbuild.sourceforge.net/spec-files-extra/
[16:24:33] <Tempt> cheers
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[16:25:00] <Tempt> It looks like it'll be a pain to compile otherwise
[16:25:08] <kaiwai> grrr
[16:25:58] <Tempt> http://cuddletech.com/download/index.shtml
[16:26:03] <Tempt> packages from benr
[16:26:33] <kaiwai> man it sucks, no KDE i386 packages
[16:28:35] <Pietro_S> Tempt: I doubt it, because there is not patch associated with spec file
[16:29:33] <Pietro_S> Tempt: sorry, you were right gcc is used to compile :-( and therefore no patch ...
[16:30:09] <Tempt> I'm not getting into compiling this one
[16:30:12] <Tempt> Too much effort
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[16:35:51] <Pietro_S> to turn it being suncc compatible or compiling at all?
[16:36:36] <sle> pkgsrc might make it easier
[16:40:05] <Pietro_S> pkgtool --download build -v SFEeterm.spec, isn't as hard
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[16:41:53] <kaiwai> hmm, I find it doesn't work
[16:42:04] <kaiwai> well, JDS doesn't compile either
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[16:42:42] <Pietro_S> kaiwai: what error message?
[16:42:49] <bda> grr. Sun breaking patchdiag download *again*.
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[16:43:01] <kaiwai> you when it compiles it goes FAILED
[16:43:10] <kaiwai> then the big report at the end it has heaps of FAILED
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[16:43:16] <kaiwai> some don't compile at all
[16:43:30] <kaiwai> some of the links for downloading sources are also broken too
[16:43:31] <Pietro_S> give me few mins I'll try it
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[16:48:58] <Pietro_S> kaiwai: installed without any problems
[16:49:20] <kaiwai> Pietro_S: what version - 2.18 ?
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[16:50:22] <Pietro_S> version 0.9.4 of eterm
[16:50:51] <kaiwai> Pietro_S: oh, I was talking about JDS :P
[16:51:04] <Pietro_S> 2.18 that should be gnome version or what?
[16:51:18] <kaiwai> 2.18 branch of JDS (GNOME 2.18)
[16:52:32] <Pietro_S> kaiwai: even on 2.18 it compiles, but I doubt that there are any changes/problem with version of gnome with compiling
[16:52:58] <Pietro_S> did you run right env script for your shell?
[16:52:59] <kaiwai> no, I'm talking about compiling GNOME 2.18
[16:53:43] <e^ipi> carrying a blade1k up 3 flights of stairs is hard
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[16:53:55] <kaiwai> damn - they pretty heavy
[16:53:56] <Pietro_S> sry that I was out of range ...
[16:54:02] <e^ipi> heavy little buggers they are
[16:54:15] <kaiwai> Blade 100 was pretty heavy too when I had the pleasure of unpacking one
[16:54:16] <Tempt> 35-38kg
[16:54:44] <delewis> a Blade 100? heavy?
[16:54:46] <kaiwai> is that the test 'if it can kill someone when thrown out the window' test?
[16:54:52] <delewis> are you gumby?
[16:54:55] <e^ipi> the 100 is light
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[16:55:11] <richlowe> delewis: I'm assuming he's meaning to type 1000
[16:55:14] <WickedWicky> w00ts0rs
[16:55:23] <Tempt> w00ts0rs?
[16:55:32] <richlowe> delewis: since the weight is about right, for the 1000.
[16:55:34] <richlowe> (says sunsolve)
[16:55:45] <delewis> richlowe, I thought that, but he did say 'too', which indicates some sort of distinction is being made.
[16:56:07] <kaiwai> well, when I had one I was alot shorter/weaker
[16:56:10] <richlowe> hrm, reading it, it does seem that way.
[17:00:32] <CIA-27> daemon@elpaso: Added tag onnv_71 for changeset 57cc010c0779
[17:00:33] <CIA-27> acruz: 6411807 exec_method drops errno when juggling errors, Contributed by Madhav Chauhan
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[17:03:39] <kaiwai> hmm, so onnv_71 is closed
[17:03:52] <richlowe> as of 11PM PDT last night, yeah.
[17:04:05] <kaiwai> is there going to be a build?
[17:04:55] <e^ipi> no, just to annoy you
[17:05:03] <moazamraja> re
[17:05:18] <kaiwai> of course :)
[17:05:53] <richlowe> builds deliver to RE the week after they close, they tend to be available internally to Sun within a week after that.
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[17:06:03] <richlowe> they hit sdlc between 1 and two weeks after *that*
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[17:07:12] <Cyrille> and people start complaining about how it doesn't have colour ls and apt-get and virtual terminals and ... the minute after *that* ;-)
[17:08:04] <kaiwai> hmm, I don't understand about colour ls or apt-get but virtual terminals are useful though
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[17:08:08] <Tempt> oh noes
[17:08:13] <Tempt> no colour ls
[17:08:15] <Tempt> the horrors
[17:08:28] <richlowe> Cyrille: it does have color ls though!
[17:08:33] <Cyrille> note that I didn't comment on the usefulness or lack thereof of any of the above features.
[17:08:34] <richlowe> Cyrille: if you use the one in /usr/gnu
[17:08:42] <richlowe> so that's one complaint down.
[17:08:55] <Cyrille> yes but sh doesn't have tab completion!
[17:09:04] <Cyrille> (also known as "sh is sh, not bash")
[17:09:19] <Cyrille> and root doesn't have /root!
[17:09:24] <Cyrille> the list is endless ;-)
[17:09:37] <kaiwai> well, the root one does make sense
[17:09:42] <Cyrille> see?
[17:09:43] <kaiwai> all that shit polluting the /
[17:10:46] <FrostCS> and I have no C:/  !!!
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[17:11:01] <Berny> heyho frosty
[17:11:08] <FrostCS> Hiyas Berny
[17:11:22] <Berny> how's things?
[17:11:29] <Pietro_S> kaiwai: how it is possible? when I su ~ is parsed as home dir of user from which I su-ed ...
[17:11:36] <kaiwai> FrostCS: more to the point, where is my DF0 and DF1 !
[17:11:49] <FrostCS> Berny, hectic :-) How about you?
[17:12:20] <Berny> calming down... moving to new home completed... first day back at work...
[17:12:31] <Berny> though i now live in a rough area :-\
[17:13:01] <FrostCS> Berny, better carry your piece around with you
[17:13:30] <Berny> left my car at the train station, took train to old ~ to pick up missys car... police called someone smashed one of my car windows, helped himself to a new mobile navigator... etc
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[17:13:47] <Berny> hi stevel
[17:14:06] <FrostCS> Berny, hrm sounds like a good neighborhood!
[17:15:07] <kaiwai> I've been in worse neighbourhoods
[17:15:20] <Berny> besides it happened in a multi-storey car park, cams all over the place
[17:15:35] <Berny> no recording though... all cams just go onto a live monitor
[17:15:44] <FrostCS> Berny, cameras don't help if it's the security guard who lifted it :-P
[17:15:51] <Berny> that in the booth seems to just wait until all's over and then calls police
[17:15:54] <stevel> morning berny
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[17:16:11] <richlowe> stevel: can we fix the bridge to push the tag when it happens, rather than on next putback?
[17:16:16] <richlowe> stevel: or is there a reason you changed it to do that?
[17:16:58] <kaiwai> how's stable is the latest snapshot?
[17:17:43] <FrostCS> crashes all the time, max uptime of 3 minutes
[17:17:53] <kaiwai> lol
[17:18:13] <stevel> richlowe: hrm probably.  right now it (the tag) happens in one of the gate biweekly_build scripts that dmarker owns and doesn't do the push to follow it.  i'll check the script and see if dmarker is okay with it
[17:18:18] <stevel> (can't see why he wouldn't be)
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[17:25:36] <e^ipi> cheetah+ is a III-Cu chip, yes?
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[17:26:48] <richlowe> I think so, Yes.
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[17:27:40] <kaiwai> anyone know of a good second hand tadpole laptop reseller?
[17:28:03] <e^ipi> ebay
[17:28:18] <kaiwai> I'll give it ago
[17:29:26] <kaiwai> hmm, good selection
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[17:32:04] <kaiwai> $1200 for a sparcbook 6500
[17:32:33] <asyd> really ?
[17:32:55] <kaiwai> well, thats the 'buy now' price
[17:32:56] <asyd> config?
[17:33:02] <kaiwai> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tadpole-SPARCle-650SX-SPARC-Laptop-Solaris-9_W0QQitemZ190138723413QQihZ009QQcategoryZ20328QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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[17:33:58] <Tempt> a SPARCle went in Australia for $850 last year.
[17:34:07] <Tempt> The only recent SPARC laptop I've seen in australian ebay.
[17:34:19] <kaiwai> true, its a pretty niche/specialised product
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[17:34:54] <Tempt> I haven't seen any naturetech laptops going at all
[17:35:55] <kaiwai> yeah, they're a nice laptop - its too bad that brand new they're really expensive
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[17:37:09] <Tempt> The naturetech meso 999 looks nifty.
[17:38:43] <kaiwai> it'll cost a small fortune
[17:39:50] <Tempt> I wonder what they charge for their sunray stuff
[17:40:06] <kaiwai> you looking at sunnytechus?
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[17:40:21] <Tempt> err, no.
[17:40:28] <Tempt> www.naturetechws.com
[17:40:44] <kaiwai> ah
[17:41:16] <coffman> Tempt: i belive accutech is nicer
[17:41:38] <Tempt> Oh, I'm just browsing around, not spending.
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[17:42:11] <kaiwai> hmm, that just sucks - no pricing
[17:44:06] <kaiwai> oh well, obviously they don't want to sell a product
[17:44:09] <Tempt> Apparently 90% of the SPARC laptop market is military anyway.
[17:44:28] <e^ipi> someone help me out with something... this blade1k doesn't output anything to the framebuffer & this is what I get on the console: http://pastebin.ca/648755
[17:44:39] <coffman> kaiwai: there is a list around
[17:44:42] <e^ipi> and then it hangs there & won't do anything
[17:44:52] <coffman> i think jamesd has it on his blog
[17:44:57] <Tempt> That's on serial, right?
[17:45:10] <e^ipi> Tempt: yeah, serial port A
[17:45:29] <Tempt> Hmmm
[17:45:36] <Tempt> And that's it? Nothing else at all?
[17:45:39] <e^ipi> nope
[17:45:48] <e^ipi> just sits there all lit up with the fans going
[17:45:58] <Tempt> Fans going or fans roaring?
[17:46:04] <e^ipi> just going, lightly
[17:46:18] <Tempt> Have you opened it up yet?
[17:46:38] <coffman> well, the sparc laptops are so expensive cause of the millitary obligations, the special plastic that shilds is alone 60 % of the price or so
[17:46:39] <jamesd_> break out, and run  reset the obp .. i forget the command   i always use stop-n on a keybard
[17:46:40] <e^ipi> i pulled the side panel off to take down some part numbers
[17:47:25] <Tempt> jamesd_: stop-n went out of fashion with usb keyboards.
[17:47:41] <Tempt> If you've just shipped it, make sure everything is seated properly.
[17:47:51] <richlowe> from memory, there's some evil trick with the power button to simulate stop-n
[17:47:55] <Tempt> Including the CPUs. use the included torque wrench to make sure they're torqued in properly
[17:47:58] <Tempt> richlowe: Correct. It's in the doco.
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[17:55:12] <Tempt> anyway, heading off to sleep for the night.
[17:55:15] <Tempt> See you all tomorrow.
[17:56:00] <kaiwai> see ya
[17:56:03] <kaiwai> have fun
[17:56:04] <Tempt> e^pi: Don't forget to torque those CPUs down (the tool hides in the green plastic thing between the disk bays), make sure your RAM is seated and no cards have wobbled loose. A loose UPA card can give the most amazing screwups.
[17:56:08] <Tempt> Night all.
[17:57:14] <kaiwai> good night temp
[17:57:16] <kaiwai> *tempt
[17:57:46] <Shiv_> About pkgbuild: How to change basedir in the SFE compliant spec  files? (Only Solaris.inc has it and changing here doesn't take effect).
[18:00:41] <CIA-27> an207044: 6354418 ??? entries hang around for long time
[18:02:35] <sickness> i'm back
[18:02:56] <jamesd_> damm call a doctor, the sickness is back
[18:03:33] <kaiwai> hmm, reminds me of the song, 'doctor, doctor, give me the news, I've got a bad case of loving you...."
[18:04:23] <gdamore> looking for reviewers for my changes to make qfe layered on top of hme (small changes really): http://cr.opensolaris.org/~gdamore/qfe/
[18:05:00] <gdamore> this makes qfe a GLDv3 driver, by the way, and part of ON open source, rather than a separate binary deliverable.
[18:06:09] <kaiwai> gdamore: was it originally a seperate download?
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[18:07:19] <gdamore> not a separate download, but a separate consolidation.
[18:07:35] <gdamore> so it was included with SXCE/SXDE, but not Belenix/Nexenta, IIUC.
[18:08:02] <PerterB> and works on x86 now? (I only see a prototype_sparc in there)
[18:08:25] <gdamore> no.
[18:08:32] <gdamore> that's a much different problem.
[18:08:53] <kaiwai> ah
[18:08:53] <gdamore> and, i'm not sure whether I will *ever* get around to it.  x86 demand for it is "limited".
[18:08:58] <PerterB> fair enough
[18:09:03] <kaiwai> hows the i11n translation going to for libc?
[18:10:08] <e^ipi> well
[18:10:23] <kaiwai> *gives e^ipi a hug of encouragement*
[18:10:26] <e^ipi> it failed to build in to libc this morning because of symbol collisions
[18:10:32] <laca> Shiv_: what exactly are you trying to do?
[18:11:01] <e^ipi> hmm... okiedokie
[18:11:46] <e^ipi> now the blade1k goes as far as "configuring the machine", gives me a question mark, and then resets
[18:12:19] <kaiwai> e^ipi: checked your blog - you're going well, thanks for your contribution to Solaris
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[18:17:16] <Shiv_> Laca: Am back
[18:18:23] <Shiv_> Laca: I wanted the files to get installed at /usr/gnu or /usr/local instead of /usr as the base dir.
[18:19:18] * timeless chuckles at the "oh, by the way, i have a sparc disassembler" message to soltools in response to the guy working on one
[18:19:34] <laca> Shiv_: basically, you just need to %include usr-gnu.inc after Solaris.inc
[18:20:09] <oxygene> timeless: that's funny as long as neither party is a sun employee
[18:20:19] <laca> Shiv_: SFEindent.spec is a good example
[18:20:32] <timeless> oxygene: they're both sun ..
[18:20:40] <timeless> at least, afaict
[18:21:07] <oxygene> timeless: then it probably fits right in the osol/ppc and bluetooth efforts
[18:21:19] * oxygene should stop being so cynical
[18:21:40] <Shiv_> Laca: Am checking it out
[18:23:12] <richlowe> timeless: one is, one isn't.
[18:23:13] <richlowe> I think.
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[18:28:10] <gnut> hi all
[18:28:33] <gnut> what can I do to alleviate the load on my cpu when mpstat reports that I'm having a ton of involuntary context switches
[18:28:40] <gnut> this seems to happen when I use firefox
[18:28:49] <Shiv_> Laca: Got it.
[18:29:00] <gnut> could it be my video drivers are not right? ati vs radeon?
[18:29:53] <Shiv_> Laca: When do you use _basedir and when is _prefix to be used ?
[18:30:35] <Shiv_> Laca: _prefix & _basedir are the same as long as subdir is the empty I suppose.
[18:30:39] <wesolows> gdamore: why the change to hme.h?  Also, I don't see the fix for 6589668 anywhere.
[18:31:55] <wesolows> gdamore: I didn't review all the packaging stuff; I was only interested in the driver itself, which I'm still trying to understand - I guess the qfe device must present four attachment points itself, and qfe used to attach to each of them?  I was expecting the new qfe to be a nexus driver that would present hme attachments points.
[18:32:12] <wesolows> Anyway, thanks for doing this.
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[18:36:19] <laca> Shiv_: yes, correct
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[18:39:09] <tomww> Shiv_: for relocateable packages I try to make SUNW_Basedir as long as possible (altough this is not really related to you question before :-)
[18:39:18] <tomww> hi laca :-)
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[18:40:10] <Shiv_> tomww: Didn't get your point. What do you mean by *as long as possible* ?
[18:40:32] <laca> hey tomww
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[18:40:56] <Shiv_> tomww: I suppose, Relocatable => incase of a existing package is the same path prompt the user !?
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[18:43:10] <gnut> wow
[18:43:32] <gnut> dtrace is awesome.. now i know that firefox is going through a heck of a lot of involuntary context switches
[18:43:41] <tomww> Shiv_: I tried to package glassfish, I want glassfish to be placed in e.g. /var/appserver/glassfish as well as in /opt/myjavaappserver/somewhereelse and if the basedir is  "short" is alternate location can be given at installtime
[18:43:46] <gnut> for some reason, it's not able to finish what it has to do in the time quantum allocated to it.
[18:43:58] <gnut> mabye it's the network driver or the video driver?
[18:44:10] <tomww> all with the same packages
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[18:45:32] <Shiv_> tomww: 1binary => installing in 2 places? How & where to specify short/long?
[18:45:41] <gdamore> wesolows: it looks like i should remove hme.h from the active list.
[18:46:01] <tomww> Shiv_: I came to this SUNW_Basedir because i read _basedir in you post and if you build a package, you might think about relocation to other paths based on users choice :-)
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[18:46:33] <gdamore> and you're right, the fix for 6589968 is MIA from the review.  I need to figure out why, just a sec.
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[18:48:46] <gdamore> fixed... i think I made the fix to different workspace. :-(
[18:48:50] <gdamore> forgot to merge it in here.
[18:48:53] <gdamore> reload the webrev.
[18:50:13] <tomww> Shiv_: a binary might go e.g. into /zfs/customer1/bin and into /zfs/customer2/bin  so while building the package the SUNW_Basedir should still be /usr  (the normal install would be /usr/bin)
[18:50:43] <tomww> Shiv_: but relocating is somewhat placing with fire or so :)
[18:50:54] <tomww> *playing
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[18:52:56] <Shiv_> tomww: I got the idea of why & what it is. Need to try it out. The rpm spec seems to be slightly different (http://www.rpm.org/max-rpm-snapshot/s1-rpm-reloc-prefix-tag.html)
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[18:54:20] <delphi1000> hi
[18:54:24] <delphi1000> everyboyd
[18:54:29] <delphi1000> busy?
[18:54:37] <kaiwai> hmm, not too bad
[18:54:42] <jamesd_> wow is there more than one boyd?
[18:54:57] <delphi1000> sorry,make a mistake
[18:55:34] <delphi1000> i'm using the solaris express,
[18:55:37] <jamesd_> relax, i'm just picking fun at you :-)
[18:55:51] <Shiv_> Laca: How to use %if %build_l10n ?
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[18:56:16] <delphi1000> do you wanna localized the os?
[18:56:31] <Shiv_> Laca: I see it used for conditional creation of locale packages, but where is the check being done?
[18:56:53] <Shiv_> Laca: Or rather where is the parameter being set/unset?
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[18:57:52] <delphi1000> laca
[18:58:02] <tomww> Shiv_: IIRC the paramter is set from "outside", which means when calling pkgtool/pkgbuild
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[19:00:35] <CIA-27> kcpoon: 6390413 Server panic on sctp connection attempt, 6547084 sctp_timer assertion(O) for SCTPS_BOUND connection, 6588386 SCTP does not handle "ifconfig down" interface properly, 6589066 SCTP may call upper layer's disconnecting function multiple times
[19:00:37] <CIA-27> ps57422: 6562672 kadmind vulnerable to buffer overflow [ MITKRB5-SA-2007-005 ]
[19:00:46] <Pietro_S> laca, Shiv_ and other spec gurus: can you look at OSOLxfce-mcs-plugins.spec (xfce repository), I can't find where variable mcsplugins.version is defined
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[19:01:02] <Shiv_> The "--with-build-l10n" option ? I see it as a comment in Solaris.inc
[19:01:42] <Pietro_S> that spec file is somehow strange 'Version:' tag is missing and mcsplugins.version is used in Url: tag
[19:02:16] <Shiv_> I was a noob at the start of the IRC session and now I am a Guru ;-)
[19:02:41] <delphi1000> hi buddy
[19:02:50] <delphi1000> can you tell me what is noob?
[19:03:07] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: Where is the xfce repository? Can you provide the URL
[19:03:08] <kaiwai> noob - newbie
[19:03:19] <kaiwai> a person who is new to something
[19:04:01] <Pietro_S> http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/xfce/
[19:04:29] <delphi1000> i knew newbie
[19:04:39] <delphi1000> noob is a strange word.
[19:05:11] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: considering your mails in desktop-discuss you are not noob in spec files ...
[19:05:57] <delphi1000> i found a bug when installating solaris express on vmware 6
[19:06:13] <TomJ> delphi1000: 32bit or 64bit?
[19:06:16] <TomJ> 64bit wont work at all for me
[19:06:19] <TomJ> 32bit worked ok
[19:06:29] <delphi1000> just 32 bit
[19:06:43] <delphi1000> but it is a very big bug.
[19:06:48] <TomJ> what happened?
[19:07:03] <delphi1000> if you install vmware tools,
[19:07:31] <delphi1000> after installing solaris with gnome.
[19:07:52] <kaiwai> hmm, dragonflybsd looks neat
[19:08:27] <delphi1000> you choose 1280*1024 in vmware tools settings,
[19:08:50] <delphi1000> when you log in again,
[19:09:03] <delphi1000> you will found all the strings are missing
[19:09:10] <TomJ> the 'strings' ?
[19:09:21] <delphi1000> the name of button.
[19:09:24] <TomJ> oh
[19:09:36] <delphi1000> in login window
[19:09:52] <TomJ> well i dont know if that counts as a bug in opensolaris
[19:09:58] <TomJ> more likely in vmware's handling of opensolaris
[19:10:27] <Pietro_S> delphi1000: with dtlogin or gdm? You can ty to switch them
[19:10:45] <delphi1000> gdm
[19:11:23] <delphi1000> cde was also reproducible.
[19:11:27] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: mcsplugins.version seems to be coming from the "%use mcsplugins = xfce-mcs-plugins.spec"
[19:11:31] <laca> Pietro_S: at the top of that spec file, it says %use mcsplugins = xfce-mcs-plugins.spec
[19:11:36] <laca> heh
[19:11:44] <laca> Shiv_: we're on the same page
[19:11:47] <e^ipi> w00t... this machine boots now
[19:11:48] <e^ipi> sortof
[19:11:55] <Shiv_> Yeah :)
[19:12:21] <laca> Pietro_S: so yeah, %{mcsplugins.version} is %version in xfce-mcs-plugins.spec
[19:13:37] <delphi1000> who can you tell me which network adapter should i choose.
[19:14:01] <delphi1000> i wanna install it in my laptop.
[19:14:15] <delphi1000> i mean solaris
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[19:14:59] <Shiv_> Laca: Where are the values to the if condition parameters set?
[19:15:04] <Pietro_S> ah, so it add all variable from base-specs and allow access to them
[19:15:48] <laca> Shiv_: which if condition?
[19:16:26] <Pietro_S> laca: but where it find that such spec file is located in base-specs dir?
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[19:16:38] <WickedWicky> heya ll
[19:17:02] <laca> Pietro_S: pkgtool copies it to packages/SPECS
[19:17:18] <delphi1000> ok
[19:17:23] <laca> based on the specdirs setting in .pkgtoolrc
[19:17:56] <laca> Pietro_S: pkgbuild always looks for it in packages/SPECS
[19:18:30] <Shiv_> Pietro_S, can you try the how-to document I have written, available for download at http://opensource.shivakumar.info
[19:18:40] <Pietro_S> ahh, nasty things for parsing :-(
[19:19:36] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: did you recieve my PM?
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[19:20:18] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: Oh, will respond.
[19:21:36] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: I just asked because if you are not registered at freenode you can't recieve PM ...
[19:22:29] <Shiv_> Got the PM
[19:22:31] * delphi1000 slaps Pietro_S around a bit with a large trout
[19:22:51] <gdamore> hmmm.... fma just started going bonkers on my nxge now.
[19:23:00] <gdamore> once i started using the second port at the same time.
[19:23:19] <gdamore> oops... wrong window.
[19:23:23] <Shiv_> Laca: About the if condition.
[19:24:07] <Shiv_> Laca: xfce base spec had this "%if %svn_build" for conditionally setting some parameters.
[19:25:01] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: It's here  --with foo, --without foo ...
[19:25:32] <Pietro_S> pkgtool --with foo will define variable %foo
[19:25:37] <laca> Shiv_: appears to be defined in include/prod.inc
[19:25:58] <Shiv_> Laca: You mean "--with-foo" as a command line argument to pkgbuild ?
[19:26:39] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: I hope so, but I never try it, most of variables are defined in other spec files
[19:27:53] <Shiv_> Laca: "--without-foo" is either redundant or it will undefine(override) if defined in the spec file. Is this correct?
[19:28:36] <laca> it defined _without_foo
[19:28:41] <laca> s/defined/defines
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[19:29:11] <laca> this is rpmbuild's behaviour actually, it's not my invention
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[19:30:19] <laca> Shiv_: basically whichever you use depends on whether you want the default to be "with" or "without" foo
[19:31:40] <Shiv_> Laca: Ah ! So, I just use one default behaviour and use a suitably named variable (with or without) as the case may be.
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[19:32:45] <Shiv_> Laca: Running the spectool on the xfce spec says "%if: invalid boolean expression"
[19:33:04] <laca> hmm...
[19:33:05] * laca tries
[19:33:07] <Shiv_> Laca: This is the command I tried "spectool eval %version ./OSOLxfce-mcs-plugins.spec"
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[19:34:33] <laca> comes back as %version for me, which means version is not defined! Pietro_S: this is a bug!
[19:35:15] <laca> Shiv_: are you using pkgbuild 1.2.0?  (pkgbuild --version)
[19:35:42] <e^ipi> hmm... how do i tell this machine to use the damned framebuffer instead of outputting display to serial console
[19:35:43] <Shiv_> Yes.
[19:35:56] <Shiv_> Laca: Does it use SUNWpcre ?
[19:36:07] <laca> no
[19:36:50] <laca> > spectool eval %version OSOLxfce-mcs-manager.spec
[19:36:50] <laca> 4.4.1
[19:36:54] <laca> this works for me
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[19:38:13] <Shiv_> Laca: I had some space constraints a few days back and had removed a few packages from SXDE.
[19:38:16] <Pietro_S> laca: nice to hear so my simple spec parser this time work as it should
[19:38:50] <Shiv_> Laca: The packages I removed are surely not required for me except for one
[19:39:19] <Shiv_> Laca: the SUNWpcre which is the perl compatible regular expressions that seems to be used by many softwares.
[19:42:33] <e^ipi> this is kinna obnoxious... this machine has a framebuffer
[19:42:37] <e^ipi> 2, in fact
[19:42:50] <e^ipi> neither one displays anything
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[19:49:44] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: Are you the author of spectool ?
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[19:52:15] <lloy0076> I think people would be less demanding if one made them pay for OpenSolaris than if they got it for free :P
[19:52:32] <oxygene> lloy0076: as usual ;)
[19:52:59] <oxygene> after all, people use windows or mac os
[19:53:08] <lloy0076> Seriously, it's like: "It doesn't work for my case, and BECAUSE I PAID NOTHING, YOU _HAVE TO_ FIX IT!".
[19:53:21] <wesolows> that's not a problem, it's a killfile entry
[19:53:29] <lloy0076> heh
[19:53:42] <oxygene> wesolows: not enough disk space, sorry
[19:53:52] <wesolows> oxygene: whitelist, then
[19:53:58] <oxygene> that might be more feasible
[19:54:03] <flyingparchment> lloy0076: you expect a vendor to fix your problem because you paid.  you expect volunteers to fix it because they enjoy it.  (that's why free software works, right?)
[19:54:21] <lloy0076> Yes, exactly.
[19:54:32] <gdamore> wesolows: did you see my response to your comments?
[19:54:42] <lloy0076> I'm just reading one of the threads on osol-discuss and I really feel like labeling its major contributor a troll.
[19:54:44] <wesolows> gdamore: Yes, that seems better now.
[19:54:49] <oxygene> flyingparchment: yeah, volunteers enjoy fixing problems - just as people expect "computer nerds" to enjoy answering stupid questions on the latest windows-misbehaviour *sigh*
[19:55:10] <flyingparchment> lloy0076: posting on -discuss is a good sign someone is a troll.
[19:55:15] <wesolows> gdamore: Is my supposition about attachment points for qfe correct, then?
[19:55:15] <flyingparchment> lloy0076: esp. if they're the OP..
[19:55:31] <lloy0076> That's probably a little unfair; I should try my usual tactic of: "Would you like me to translate the thread into Swahili seeing you don't seem to understand English?".
[19:55:34] <oxygene> "oh, you _don't_ like spending two days reinstalling my whole system with its 200 apps (all of them mission critical, eg. spider solitaire)? how odd, I thought you're into that computer thing?"
[19:55:38] <wesolows> lloy0076: Who's our major contributor?
[19:55:56] <wesolows> lloy0076: Somewhere I have a list of putbacks by name, but there are a number of people near the top.
[19:55:59] <Trisk[laptop]> laca: if I want to add -L/usr/gnu/lib to the LDFLAGS in a spec file, how do I make sure it works for amd64 and sparcv9?
[19:56:18] <lloy0076> wesolows: I mean a contributor to a mailing list discussion; not code.
[19:56:37] <wesolows> lloy0076: Oh...so a non-contributor then.
[19:56:51] <richlowe> wesolows: but we're all community, so mail is contribution too!, etc.
[19:56:54] <wesolows> Perhaps even an anti-contributor, since time spent by others reading mail reduces time for coding.
[19:56:57] <richlowe> except of course, actual development.
[19:57:04] <richlowe> because the last thing we'd want opensolaris to be is a fucking development project.
[19:57:07] <richlowe> apparently.
[19:57:10] <lloy0076> heh
[19:57:12] <wesolows> indeed
[19:57:25] <wesolows> richlowe: I'm about to launch a broadside at the SCA. :-)
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[19:57:46] <lloy0076> (software contributor agreement I presume)
[19:57:47] <wesolows> Launched!
[19:58:02] <WickedWicky> richlowe: you're talking about this "My solaris machine thinks it's a big network" stupid annoying thread?
[19:58:15] <lloy0076> Yes, that thread.
[19:58:24] <richlowe> I'm not, I'm talking about the general attitude to all of this.
[19:58:42] <richlowe> if one thread, or one list, was the only problem, I'd be damn happy. :)
[19:58:46] <kaiwai> WickedWicky: the one with the really long and unpronouceable name?
[19:58:54] <wesolows> So why are you guys still reading that list?
[19:58:56] <sommerfeld> wesolows: better than a broadside at the society for creative anachronism ...
[19:59:06] <WickedWicky> kaiwai: *Knight of Ni voice* the same
[19:59:07] <wesolows> sommerfeld: Indeed; I have nothing against that SCA. :-)
[19:59:14] <richlowe> sommerfeld: they wouldn't appreciate a broadside.
[19:59:22] <richlowe> sommerfeld: slightly too recent a thing, I think.
[19:59:23] <wesolows> richlowe: True; too modern.
[19:59:28] <kaiwai> WickedWicky: Ni Ni Ni Ni! :0
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[19:59:40] <kaiwai> now get me some shrubbery
[19:59:45] <WickedWicky> a what?
[20:00:04] <WickedWicky> a nice one.. but not too expensive
[20:00:27] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: not laca is
[20:00:39] <CIA-27> ek110237: 6588264 zpool_get_errlog() can attempt to calloc size 0, 6589250 zfs_vfsops.h comments about NFSv3's filehandles is out of date
[20:01:36] <moazamraja> oh great. opensparc.net is 'down' with a ghetto ass page saying that the hosting provider has disabled the account because of over-use of bandwidth
[20:02:01] <kaiwai> anyone with a copy of the CODEC pack?
[20:02:04] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: This sentence made me ask "nice to hear so my simple spec parser this time work as it should"
[20:02:09] <sommerfeld> moazamraja: hahaha
[20:02:41] <moazamraja> "This Account Has Exceeded Its CPU Quota"
[20:02:50] <moazamraja> my effing POS x2100 has more 'CPU quota'!!!
[20:03:06] <kaiwai> hmm, too many porn movies being rendered, reduce the number
[20:03:08] <sommerfeld> wesolows: I haven't seen your broadside yet, but IMHO a contributor agreement is a good idea.  but it should be with opensolaris, not with sun.
[20:03:40] <sommerfeld> most importantly, it allows shit to flow back upstream if someone contributes something they don't actually have rights to contribute.
[20:03:47] <wesolows> sommerfeld: Well, I could see that having some modest value, but we'd need someone to be a party to it.
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[20:04:14] <kaiwai> sommerfeld: something along the ideas of which those things contributed are legally allowed to - to avoid copyright working being submitted - I assume?
[20:04:19] <wesolows> Except that copyright law already allows for that - the person who does so is guilty of a crime and liable for damages.
[20:04:54] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: I made one in ruby, just to get all dependencies for some package (recurent deps)
[20:06:06] <kaiwai> well, to trace back submissions to make finding the bad apple easier
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[20:07:13] <sommerfeld> kaiwai: if we forbade copyrighted work from being submitted to opensolaris we'd have nothing.
[20:07:32] <sommerfeld> kaiwai: the issue is whether the copyright in the work permits opensolaris and folks downstream to redistribute it.
[20:07:44] <wesolows> Right, that's silly.  Besides, everything is copyrighted by default, and the only way to avoid copyright is to place work in the public domain.  Guess what?  That means you can't enforce the terms of an open source license.
[20:08:06] <TomJ> open source licenses are unenforceable?
[20:08:29] <wesolows> kaiwai: That problem is not helped by a CA, but by maintenance of putback logs and so forth.  It's necessary technically and just happens to be useful legally.
[20:08:58] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: but lately it grows a bit - sqlite database so finding dependecies is very fast also special version handling which even allow to work with version of svr4 package
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[20:09:16] <wesolows> TomJ: No.  The problem is that only the copyright holder can issue a license.  No one holds copyright to works in the public domain.  So no one could issue (or enforce) licenses to works in the public domain.
[20:09:32] <wesolows> TomJ: My point was that copyright is essential to the existence of Open Source.
[20:09:55] <TomJ> ah, so public domain + license = unenforceable,  so all OSS has to be copyrighted?
[20:09:58] <oxygene> wesolows: "place work in the public domain" doesn't even work everywhere
[20:10:03] <gdamore> wesolows: what supposition about attachment points do you refer to?
[20:10:30] <oxygene> TomJ: "public domain" and "license" are incompatible
[20:10:33] <gdamore> ah found it.  yes, your supposition is correct.
[20:10:36] <TomJ> ok understood
[20:10:47] <wesolows> gdamore: That qfe devices present 4 attachment points, and that you are essentially attaching hme at those points now, rather than qfe presenting a single attachment point and needing a nexus driver (qfe) to present attachment points for hme.
[20:10:48] <gdamore> each qfe device presents 4 attachment points, devinfo node names "qfe".
[20:10:54] <wesolows> That's it, thanks.
[20:11:01] <oxygene> TomJ: there's no-one who can issue such a license (as the author disclaimed all rights), and there's no reason for anybody to feel bound by it (because PD allows for everything)
[20:11:04] <wesolows> Now your change makes sense to me. :-)
[20:11:13] <gdamore> there is no nexus.  its just a PCI bridge with 4 hme chips behind it.
[20:11:19] <gdamore> (transparent PCI bridge)
[20:11:34] <wesolows> Huh, so qfe was never necessary at all.
[20:11:41] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: I do not understand ruby. Is it a webapp or stand alone script (like shell/perl).
[20:11:41] <richlowe> The key to understanding this, is that qfe(7D) is basically a dumb marketing gimmic.
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[20:11:45] <richlowe> once you nderstand that, the rest falls into place.
[20:11:47] <gdamore> no, it wasn't.
[20:11:50] <gdamore> what a waste.
[20:11:54] <gdamore> it was a marketing gimmick.
[20:11:58] <wesolows> Sigh.
[20:12:03] <TomJ> out of interest, how does one actually put something in the public domain?  I mean, legally, what's the definition of that?   I must publish the words "this is public domain" ?   just wondering what happens if someone says it's PD then changes their mind, how you would prove whether it was or wasnt
[20:12:18] <wesolows> TomJ: Great question - for a lawyer. :-)
[20:12:27] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: Check PM
[20:12:34] <TomJ> yeah just musing :)
[20:12:35] <oxygene> TomJ: "this is public domain", stripping off all copyright notices.. and then anybody who has a file with these terms should be able to rely on them
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[20:12:57] <jamesd> gdamore, in what version is it best to play with trunking, now that i have a  pci qfe (blade 1500)   and a  sbus qfe for my u2.  and a managed  100mbit switch to play with it all.
[20:13:21] <oxygene> TomJ: it's similar to how licensing works - if I license some code under GPL today and you download it, and tomorrow I publish it under some other license, you still have a GPL'd version of it and I can't take it away from you
[20:13:26] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: I have no pm from you ...
[20:13:49] <TomJ> oxygene: yeah makes sense
[20:14:16] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: it's standalone scripting language as perl/python with additional framework for web applications
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[20:14:45] <Pietro_S> that framework is named Ruby on Rails
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[20:15:10] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: The PM window had got opened when you initiated it. It is still open in my irc client.
[20:15:20] <gdamore> jamesd: you need either my qfe patch (not committed yet), or you can use snv_70 (when it comes out) and do update_drv -a -i '"SUNW,qfe"' hme
[20:15:29] <gdamore> (after pkgrm'ing SUNWqfed and rebooting)
[20:15:29] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: Anyway, why bother another parser when spectool is available?
[20:15:44] <Shiv_> Pietro_S: It could have been extended...
[20:15:49] <laca> Trisk[laptop]: sorry, i was away
[20:16:09] <laca> if you don't do anything special, your spec file will only build 32-bit
[20:17:09] <jamesd> gdamore, is that documented somewhere?  i will put it on the back burner, currently working on moving  450GB of data form my desktop to a  500GB sata drive on a remote system.. its a slow process on XP
[20:17:15] <Pietro_S> Shiv_: because when I started I didn't know about it
[20:17:18] <laca> if you have separate sections for building 32-bit and 64-bit, you can use conditionals like "%ifarch sparcv9 amd64" do something in the 64-bit version only
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[20:19:14] <WickedWicky> laca: can I make pkgbuild follow and compile dependencies to a certain package or do I have to compile the dependencies by hand?
[20:19:27] <lloy0076> I don't believe it - I've managed to get JBoss Seam to work.
[20:19:51] <WickedWicky> laca: example: Eterm depends on SFElibast and SFEimlib2, is there a way to tell pkgbuild to follow these dependencies?
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[20:21:20] <laca> WickedWicky: not in the current version, sorry
[20:21:25] <laca> but working on it
[20:21:39] <WickedWicky> when you need a tester, let me know :)
[20:21:47] <Trisk[laptop]> laca: okay, I currently have an SDL-related library using a base-spec but it seems to set arch to amd64 when building for %arch_sse2
[20:23:07] <laca> huh? that sounds like a bug in x86_sse2.inc or something
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[20:37:54] <chris_d> Does anyone know how to specify the location of the ZIL in Build 69?
[20:38:28] <Pietro_S> laca: I look at spectool.pl source, it would be nice if it was able to eval more than 1 variable (I'll try to code it), what format you would prefer? spectool block_eval "%version %url %name" 1.spec 2.spec?
[20:38:56] <sommerfeld> chris_d: if you mean the ZFS separate intent log: http://blogs.sun.com/perrin/
[20:39:41] <laca> Pietro_S: i think you can do that with spectool eval
[20:39:44] <laca> you can pass any string into it
[20:39:59] <sommerfeld> chris_d: looks something like: zpool add <pool> log mirror <deva> <devb>
[20:40:19] <chris_d> Thanks.
[20:40:35] <laca> Pietro_S: yes, this worked:  spectool eval '%name - %version' *.spec
[20:40:44] <Trisk[laptop]> laca: oh well, worked around the problem since I found gnu_lib_path which does what I was trying to do
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[20:41:04] <Pietro_S> laca: thanks
[20:41:14] <KuArZo> hi
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[20:43:06] <KuArZo> i have a error activating postgres version_82
[20:43:38] <chris_GR> Hey everyone, does anyone has experience with the latest xen bits?
[20:44:36] <chris_GR> been trying to install xen on svn_69 on an opteron system : xen panics on boot
[20:44:49] <chris_GR> any sage advice? :)
[20:45:27] <KuArZo> no, my core2 install without problem
[20:45:38] <sommerfeld> use snv_66; the snapshot may be closely tied to build 66
[20:46:16] <KuArZo> sommerfeld you can help me to activate postgres?
[20:46:21] <sommerfeld> no
[20:46:26] <Pietro_S> laca: is there any way how to use newline '\n' as delimiter? spectool eval '%name \n %version' OSOLthunar.spec doesn't work
[20:46:27] <sommerfeld> don't know anything about it
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[20:47:41] <chris_GR> KuArZo: Just install the packages and change the menu.lst , that's all?
[20:48:34] <palowoda> Postgres works just fine in build 69.  Just make sure you have /usr/postgres/8.2/bin in your postgres account path and initdb like the smf message indicates.
[20:48:34] <laca> Pietro_S: try putting an actual line break in '...'
[20:49:08] <KuArZo> palowoda if my problem is not postgres
[20:49:12] <chris_GR> sommerfeld: Do you mean the build 66 image with xen pre-enabled from opensolaris.org?
[20:49:15] <KuArZo> work excelent
[20:49:27] <KuArZo> my problem is run on boot time
[20:50:23] <sommerfeld> chris_GR: yes
[20:51:03] <palowoda> KuArZo: Haven't seen a run on boot time problem.
[20:51:57] <palowoda> KuArZo: I put my boots on and ran around the house 3 times.
[20:52:29] <chris_GR> sommerfeld: I see, ty ... was hoping for xen on build 69
[20:53:23] <palowoda> No new features until after 70 is what I read.
[20:53:34] <Pietro_S> laca: '%name ...\n %version" nor '%name ...[enter]... %version" don't work
[20:54:19] <palowoda> Xen would be one big feature.
[20:54:48] <chris_GR> Indeed :) my thanks, gonna go for the 66
[20:55:01] <Pietro_S> laca: got it somehow "%version[enter]%name" works
[20:58:11] <movement> chris_GR: Xen itself? what messages do you get?
[20:59:43] <chris_GR> movement: Just panics when i select to load it from grub, want me to paste some of the messages?
[20:59:53] <movement> privately, please.
[21:00:19] <CIA-27> ahl: 6546290 /opt/SUNWdtrt/tst/common/predicates/tst.predcache.ksh : could not unload dtrace, 6573659 removing a USDT provider can undermine pid probes, 6576041 ERROR: /opt/SUNWdtrt/tst/common/usdt/tst.dlclose1.ksh stdout mismatch, 6581257 dtrace_lookup_by_type() can fail spuriously, 6582425 tst/common/usdt/tst.forker.ksh can hang
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[21:07:26] <palowoda> Interesting tidbit about OpenSolaris. http://blog.postful.com/2007/03/20/joyent-textdrive-accelerator-review/
[21:12:45] <kaiwai> hmm
[21:12:55] <kaiwai> won't be too long till Sun buys it out :)
[21:13:14] <chris_GR> hehehehe
[21:14:04] <kaiwai> not that its a bad thing - better to purchase something thats proven to work than risk investing into vapourware
[21:15:39] <kaiwai> hmm, now, if I had a spare $20billion I'd be happy
[21:17:13] <kaiwai> I think james shat himself when I said I'd be happy to pay for driver development for my webcam
[21:17:53] <palowoda> kaiwai: You assume somebody wants to look at you.
[21:18:10] <EchoBinary> a spare $20 bil wouldnt make me happy
[21:18:27] <chris_GR> Sure makes for a good headstart :)
[21:18:38] <EchoBinary> cant buy happiness
[21:18:50] <EchoBinary> but with that much - ill bet you can rent it for a long time
[21:19:27] <chris_GR> with $20 bil at least you can choose your own type of misery
[21:19:44] <kaiwai> palowoda: true, but there are desperate people out there - heck, there are people who want to go and see Balmer speak abouot IT - so there is hope for me after all
[21:19:45] <EchoBinary> is that anything like the choose your own adventure books i read as a kid?
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[21:20:13] <chris_GR> I dont know were they miserable?
[21:20:39] <EchoBinary> when you chose poorly, yes
[21:21:04] <palowoda> kaiwai: Don't worry Ekiga will get around to getting some of the webcam stuff fixed eventually.
[21:21:50] <kaiwai> palowoda: na, its a driver issue, the webcam in my laptop is one of those 'kinda uvc compliant' things that needs a firmware uploaded
[21:22:06] <kaiwai> james.d suggested I approach sun for support
[21:22:45] <palowoda> Hell there is only one app to take advantage of webcam on solaris right now.
[21:24:03] <kaiwai> flash webcam doesn't work?
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[21:25:35] <kaiwai> that is, in the case of youtube, it can't access the webcam via their flash tool?
[21:25:48] <palowoda> I didn't even know Solaris users where using webcams for something useful.
[21:27:10] <Trisk[laptop]> palowoda: I'm buying two webcams to test usbvc with
[21:27:13] <kaiwai> well, Indiana is meant to be a 'user friendly' Solaris, which will mean that there will be those wanting to do youtube submissions, internet sex - the usual stuff
[21:27:32] <Pietro_S> laca: spectool eval "%changelog" OSOLthunar.spec, doesn't work - %changelog isn't variable?
[21:27:53] <laca> no it isn't
[21:27:58] <Trisk[laptop]> hm, looks like Flash does actually try to look for a camera, so it might work (since the interface is supposed to be v4l2 compatible iirc)
[21:28:02] <laca> i don't think you can get it with spectool currently
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[21:30:32] <Trisk[laptop]> kaiwai: incidentally, what webcam hardware did you have?
[21:31:23] <axisys> should I be able to start the install from cdrom 1 (sol 10 u3) and then point to nfs for the rest ?
[21:31:45] <kaiwai> its a ricoh R5U870
[21:31:50] <axisys> I know the other option is jump from net.. but the network has been flaky..
[21:31:59] <Trisk[laptop]> kaiwai: heh, same as my laptop then
[21:32:04] <kaiwai> its 'built into' my laptop - its a dv6209tx
[21:32:05] <axisys> so hoping after the first cdrom it will act better
[21:32:16] <kaiwai> http://bugs.opensolaris.org/view_bug.do?bug_id=6586592
[21:32:21] <kaiwai> linux driver that needs porting
[21:32:24] <Trisk[laptop]> kaiwai: yup, a bunch of VAIO and HP laptops use those or similar
[21:32:42] <Trisk[laptop]> I saw that CR before ;)
[21:32:51] <kaiwai> yeap, so I've sent a request off to the engineer on how much it would cost me to pay Sun to support it
[21:33:06] <Trisk[laptop]> mine is a not-quite-UVC firmware, though =\
[21:33:19] <kaiwai> hopefully once I get a price I'll pass the hat around for a collection
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[21:34:10] <Trisk[laptop]> well, unfortunately I paid $45 for two UVC cameras just now
[21:34:10] <kaiwai> Trisk[laptop]: I guess if you email him as well, along with other people who want support - it should elevate the priority
[21:34:33] <kaiwai> I'd prefer using the one built in - I paid for it, I might as well use it
[21:34:40] <Trisk[laptop]> ditto
[21:37:32] <kaiwai> oh well, good night
[21:37:36] <kaiwai> I need some sleep
[21:42:53] <WickedWicky> so do I
[21:43:06] <chris_GR> My thanks for the help , gbye
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[21:44:01] <WickedWicky> have a great day/evening all
[21:44:03] <WickedWicky> be good
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[22:00:34] <CIA-27> ts143224: 6570668 iSCSI delete_008 modify_001 modify_003 failing with TPGT has no ip-addr errors create_009 failing, 6575041 iSCSI TM set statSN to 0 on a Task Management Abort Task Response
[22:00:37] <CIA-27> seb: PSARC 2007/311 EOF of Mobile IP, 6479886 mipagent and related kernel interfaces should be removed, 6511070 mobile IP code in onnv is in dubious state., 6574880 route is missing the FIXEDMTU, VIRTUAL, and DUPLICATE interface flags
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[22:00:59] <wesolows> DEATH TO MIP!!!  Huzzah!
[22:02:04] <coffman> is it normal for a zone to not react at a "init 5" or "init 6"?
[22:02:11] <coffman> i mean nothing
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[22:02:26] <sommerfeld> is there a more stable URL to the project-creation-policy than: http://mail.opensolaris.org/pipermail/ogb-discuss/2007-May/000437.html ?
[22:02:33] <movement> sommerfeld: yes...
[22:02:36] <oxygene> wesolows: hmm.. and I just learned about it in one of my university courses ;-)
[22:02:47] <movement> http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/ogb/policies/project-instantiation.txt
[22:03:03] <comay> coffman: from the global zone, can you see what processes are (still) running in the zone?
[22:03:07] <sommerfeld> actually "DEATH TO HALF-IMPLEMENTED MIP THAT DOESNT WORK AND NOBODY USES"
[22:03:29] <wesolows> movement: thanks
[22:03:59] <wesolows> sommerfeld: That, and death to all consumers of anything in the cmd/agents directory
[22:04:48] <sommerfeld> that would be "DEATH TO MIB"
[22:04:56] <wesolows> It would indeed.
[22:05:36] <wesolows> We might actually be close now to removing all that.
[22:05:43] <richlowe> do it, do it!
[22:06:00] <wesolows> richlowe: I think mdlogd still uses it.
[22:06:20] <richlowe> yow.
[22:06:23] <wesolows> But it is itself Obsolete, so perhaps it could be removed.  If not, reimplementing the trap stuff in terms of SMA would not be too hard.
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[22:06:41] <wesolows> I don't think there are any more consumers now, and I've been itching to nuke that for 2 years now.
[22:07:01] <wesolows> We've notified customers at least 3 separate times now. :-)
[22:07:52] * wesolows goes back to read his SEA EOF ARC case
[22:08:14] <coffman> comay: yes  http://rafb.net/p/BXSN5F26.html
[22:08:20] <hile_> wesolows, SEA ?
[22:08:54] <wesolows> oh, right, WBEM.  Sigh.  The thing I long to forget.
[22:09:11] <comay> coffman: it looks like a zone that's running sysidconfig.  what happens if you connect to the zone's console?
[22:09:19] <richlowe> wesolows: kill that, too.
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[22:09:41] <wesolows> richlowe: I'd be happy to see you file a case EOF'ing it. :-)
[22:10:14] <coffman> comay: oh hack
[22:11:55] <elektronkind> web-based enterprise mess-up
[22:12:33] <coffman> comay: next time i should look right :P
[22:12:37] <hile_> the hell do you have against SEAM, richlowe?
[22:12:38] <coffman> comay: thx dude
[22:12:48] <coffman> totaly forgot that
[22:13:33] <coffman> this gets big letters in my guide: "DO A ZLOGIN -C ON YOUR ZONE AFTER INSTALL!"
[22:14:02] <quasi> coffman: you could just copy in a sysidcfg file before the first boot
[22:15:14] <coffman> quasi: yep, thats would be it
[22:23:15] <richlowe> hile_: SEAM and SEA aren't the same thing.
[22:23:22] <sickness> [hal-9000.sick-net]$ prstat -s rss
[22:23:23] <sickness>    PID USERNAME  SIZE   RSS STATE  PRI NICE      TIME  CPU PROCESS/NLWP
[22:23:26] <sickness>   1098 sickness 3590M 1525M sleep   59    0   0:13:43 3.7% firefox-bin/9
[22:23:28] <sickness> lol :)
[22:23:41] <richlowe> hile_: SEA is distilled evil, SEAM is krb5 with some extra bits and a funny name.
[22:23:46] * coffman slaps sickness
[22:23:51] <coffman> bad boy!
[22:24:01] <sickness> sorry =)
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[22:35:38] * comay thinks folks are confusing/conflating projects, mailing lists and community groups
[22:37:11] <richlowe> Yes.
[22:37:26] <movement> comay: doesn't help that there's bizarre rules on what each entity can or can't do
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[22:37:37] <richlowe> implementation artifacts, in part.
[22:37:56] <movement> right. but some of it is policy from my skimming of ogb lists etc.
[22:38:17] * coffman hugs comay
[22:38:18] <richlowe> I had hoped someone would propose rectifying some parts of that.
[22:38:19] <sommerfeld> implementation artifacts of the opensolaris.org webapp, even.
[22:38:54] <richlowe> the webapp and reality rarely agree.
[22:39:49] <Gman> confusing? no way!
[22:40:32] <richlowe> Hey Gman.
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[22:54:56] <postwait> I'm looking for some online material that says Sun's Directory Server is Free to use for commerical use.
[22:55:01] <postwait> Anyone know where I could find that?
[22:55:20] <postwait> It's super clear that I can "download" it for free... but I'd like to actually run it too ;-)
[22:55:26] <holcomb> heh
[22:56:39] <postwait> holcomb: did you already ask that?
[22:56:51] <holcomb> no
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[23:53:36] <moazamraja> does the latest Solaris 10 allow me to jumpstart with ZFS boot....or at least ZFS filesystems?
[23:53:46] <richlowe> no.
[23:54:01] <richlowe> well, you could use a script post-installation to create zfs filesystems, I guess.
[23:55:05] <moazamraja> i c





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