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[00:01:52] <coffman> seems like the font render errors are not utf8 related
[00:02:32] <sahafeez> 36C
[00:02:37] <sahafeez> toasty
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[00:08:01] <Pietro_S> huh, when do you synchonize clocks of your servers? I did ntpdate just after reboot, but it looks like not enough for long uptime servers :-(
[00:08:10] <twincest> ntpd
[00:08:51] <nachox> ntpd is an ntp server right?
[00:08:57] <iron_angel> and client.
[00:09:02] <twincest> it's both
[00:09:07] <iron_angel> Also, you can cron ntpdate if that's not to your liking
[00:09:11] <twincest> you can use it as a client to keep the clock synced at all times
[00:10:09] <Pietro_S> actually I'm I bit worry to call ntpdate often because it makes big mess in openafs client ...
[00:11:13] <delewis> ntpdate is considered obsolete.
[00:11:17] <delewis> use ntpd
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[00:14:54] <Pietro_S> thanks for new information (at least for me), does ntpd allow to change time 'fluently' - for example by 50ms diff?
[00:15:15] <delewis> http://www.ntp.org/ntpfaq/NTP-s-config.htm#AEN2691
[00:16:09] <nachox> Pietro_S: what on openafs relies on an accurate date?
[00:16:30] <delewis> basically, ntpdate has no way of calculating the clock drift over a number of time requests. xntpd records this and will use the information to set a more accurate time.
[00:16:59] <delewis> that way, you don't get "huge" jumps when setting your time.
[00:17:18] <iron_angel> Kerberos?
[00:17:49] <Pietro_S> nachox: it's not on accurate time, but it's on *server nods* time ...
[00:18:10] <nachox> it's used for the heartbeats?
[00:18:40] <delewis> yeah, Kerberos requires accurate time between the KDC and slaves, and so fourth.
[00:18:50] <delewis> its a security precaution.
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[00:18:51] <Pietro_S> we use kerberos+openafs combo, but afs is more weaker for time changes than kerberos...
[00:19:25] <nachox> why not just nfs? because you distribute the files across many nodes?
[00:19:53] <Pietro_S> 20k nodes ...
[00:21:09] <EchoBinary> are there different raidz levels? or is it just .. raidz?
[00:21:16] <twincest> EchoBinary: there's also raidz2
[00:21:23] <twincest> (which is the raidz version of raid-6, two parity disks)
[00:21:31] <EchoBinary> ahh gotcha
[00:22:07] <EchoBinary> i hear there is a raidz growth feature in the works, is this true, does anyone know?
[00:22:10] <trygvis> how bad is this error: "corrupt label - label checksum failed"
[00:22:25] <EchoBinary> (apparently its not poss to currently grow a raidz zpool)?
[00:23:48] <Gman> richlowe, fucker! I just dialled into the conference call and recorded off that!
[00:24:40] <nachox> Gman: ??
[00:24:57] <Gman> nachox, he was giving me grief on scrollback for the poor recording quality
[00:25:15] <nachox> joking i assume
[00:26:21] <Gman> almost certainly
[00:30:39] <nachox> trygvis: http://wallaby.cs.man.ac.uk:8888/ab2/coll.47.11/TROUBLESHOOT/@Ab2PageView/3725;td=5?
[00:31:23] <trygvis> yeah, just read that one. but as the last step is "Restore the data from your backup." I assume I'm fucked
[00:31:37] <vmlemon> Just wondering, is this normal to see in df -h, or is it a bug? /dev/dsk/c0d0s0        9.9G  8192E     0K   100%    /
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[00:49:47] <EchoBinary> whats the default window manager in opensolaris? or is it command line?
[00:50:08] <nachox> none
[00:50:12] * carbon60 just bought a crackberry
[00:50:15] <nachox> there is no default
[00:50:21] <carbon60> Anyone use an SSH client from a crackberry?
[00:50:56] <twincest> EchoBinary: the default desktop is solaris express is gnome (cde is also available).  belenix uses kde i think.  others probably vary
[00:50:59] <EchoBinary> gotcha, so its command line?
[00:51:01] <EchoBinary> ahh ok
[00:51:10] <twincest> some have no gui, like schillix
[00:51:22] <EchoBinary> is there a more minimalist desktop available for solaris?
[00:51:36] <twincest> sure, all the common WMs should work
[00:51:38] <hali> XFCE is nice
[00:51:39] <twincest> xfce is popular
[00:51:42] <EchoBinary> yeah
[00:51:54] <EchoBinary> im using xubuntu now
[00:52:18] <EchoBinary> going to be switching for the purposes of running a zfs network filestore with 4 1TB drives
[00:52:26] <EchoBinary> hoping to use raidz2
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[00:52:40] <twincest> raidz2 on 4 disks?  why don't you just use raid10?
[00:52:58] <EchoBinary> am a noob re: raidz, opensolaris, and raid in general
[00:53:09] <EchoBinary> also wanting to maximize storage
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[00:53:12] <twincest> raidz2 on 4 disks will give you 2 disks of usable space and use 2 for parity
[00:53:15] <EchoBinary> and grow the array in the future
[00:53:20] <EchoBinary> hmm
[00:53:21] <twincest> raidz (= raid5) will give 3 disks capacity and 1 parity
[00:53:38] <twincest> raid10 (stripe + mirror) will also give 2 disks usable and 2 spare (mirrors), but will be faster than raidz2
[00:53:45] <EchoBinary> ah gotcha
[00:53:48] <hali> you can't grow zfs raidz/z2 volumes yet
[00:53:52] <EchoBinary> yes i know
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[00:54:03] <EchoBinary> but ive heard that that capability is in the works, yes?
[00:54:29] <hali> the only benefit is that you can have any two drives fail, with raid10 you can have two drives fails, as long as they are in different disk pairs
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[00:54:45] * dlg miss jmcp
[00:54:56] <EchoBinary> hmmm
[00:54:59] <nachox> what happened to him?
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[00:56:54] <EchoBinary> replaces by a very small shell script?
[00:57:27] <EchoBinary> replaced*
[00:58:07] <EchoBinary> is it indeed true that raidz growth is in the works?
[01:04:04] <twincest> i wish mysql would ship 32-bit client with a 64-bit server
[01:04:12] <twincest> having to install both to use the 32-bit client is a pain
[01:05:31] <vmlemon> Just wondering, has anyone ever seen something like this happen with 'df -h': /dev/dsk/c0d0s0        9.9G  8192E     0K   100%    / ?
[01:05:44] <twincest> vmlemon: did you just delete a large file?
[01:05:48] <vmlemon> No
[01:06:08] <vmlemon> I ran out of free space whilst installing a package, and found that I got that when doing a df -h
[01:06:37] <vmlemon> The drive is only 80GB, though which makes me wonder
[01:06:40] <nachox> that happened to me with a patch today :P
[01:06:47] <EchoBinary> i imagine d0 = disk 0, and s0 = slice 0
[01:06:53] <EchoBinary> whats c0?
[01:06:57] <vmlemon> Controller 0
[01:06:58] <twincest> controller 0
[01:06:59] <EchoBinary> ahh
[01:07:01] <EchoBinary> cool
[01:07:06] <twincest> t0 is target 0 for non-IDE disks
[01:07:10] <twincest> (c0t0d0s0)
[01:07:21] <vmlemon> I wonder why 8192E is listed, unless there's a bug
[01:07:26] <twincest> so t1d0 is target 1, LUN 0.  (normal disks are always LUN 0)
[01:07:40] <vmlemon> I certainly don't have exabytes of space, though
[01:07:47] <EchoBinary> its a trap!
[01:07:48] <twincest> vmlemon: i've seen that before with UFS logging but i'm not certain what causes it
[01:08:23] <vmlemon> Maybe Sun has a new method of magically giving people additional storage space when they run out? ;)
[01:08:38] <sfire||mouse> vmlemon: thumperfs?
[01:08:47] <vmlemon> No, bog standard UFS
[01:09:05] <vmlemon> As created by the Solaris installer
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[01:10:05] <vmlemon> I had to expand the slice to 10GB from the rather useless default of 5GB, after installation, since I eneded up running out of space
[01:10:22] <EchoBinary> so is it possible to switch a raidz to a raidz2?
[01:10:39] <twincest> no (afaik)
[01:12:40] <EchoBinary> hmm
[01:12:41] <vmlemon> I guess I'll have to reboot into SUM, and then expand the slice and FS
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[01:22:57] <richlowe> Gman: wha?
[01:24:45] <richlowe> Gman: Oh, hey, tim blamed you first.
[01:24:50] <richlowe> Gman: I just agreed. ;)
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[01:32:29] <sahafeez> ok, not really a solaris question but does anyone know why xorg.conf would ignore the vsync/hsync settings in the file and try to bring up a mode beyond what is set
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[01:36:50] <twincest> panic[cpu0]/thread=fffffe800000bc80: BAD TRAP: type=e (#pf Page fault) rp=fffffe800000ba40 addr=fc8 occurred in module "genunix" due to a NULL pointer dereference
[01:36:53] <twincest> :-(
[01:36:59] <sporq> pwnd!
[01:38:10] <iron_angel> ouch
[01:40:53] <twincest> S10 too
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[01:43:11] <iron_angel> That sounds rather like some kind of hardware issue.
[01:43:53] <twincest> could be, it's a new system
[01:45:51] <iron_angel> Check the RAM, I'd say. X86 or SPARC?
[01:45:58] <twincest> x86
[01:46:13] <twincest> wonder if there's a pxe-able memtest86
[01:46:51] <iron_angel> I think so, yes.
[01:49:50] <iron_angel> http://thumper.fastcoder.net/wiki/PXE_Booting
[01:50:03] <iron_angel> expects a Linux bootserver, but of course Solaris works too.
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[01:51:28] <twincest> hm, i should probably install the current QFS patch too
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[02:06:53] <richlowe> twincest: stack, etc?
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[02:07:11] <richlowe> it's generally worth searching b.o.o for reasonably relevent stack frames.
[02:07:20] <twincest> http://rafb.net/p/htEyqM46.html < not very interesting
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[02:07:42] <richlowe> ah.
[02:08:25] <twincest> hmm, memtest doesn't want to run on serial console
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[02:27:45] <twincest> is there any way to test memory from within solaris?
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[02:56:06] <EchoBinary> ask it what it was searing 2 weeks ago
[02:56:15] <EchoBinary> wearing*
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[03:22:22] <kimc> hopefully there will be an HA application module for smtp soon..
[03:22:46] <kimc> such as Postfix :)
[03:23:13] <Stric> smtp pretty much has HA built-in..
[03:23:22] <Stric> just get two mx:es and you're set
[03:23:56] <kimc> is that for sendmail ?
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[03:27:10] <Stric> it's for any smtp server
[03:27:37] <dlg> smtp is fault tolerant
[03:27:49] <dlg> people have been building reliable systems for years
[03:27:50] <Stric> the MX dns record says who to hand over mail to.. if you have multiple, smtp engines will try the next one if the first fails
[03:28:15] <Stric> and if they have the same priority, you've got a load balancer
[03:28:42] <dlg> and if you have some basic failover in the same priority mxes, you have a HA setup
[03:28:57] <dlg> can i invoice you now?
[03:29:12] <kimc> it dons't quite work that way..
[03:29:29] <kimc> can i invoice you yet ?
[03:29:42] <Stric> yeah, send a bill for asking questions.. ;)
[03:29:51] <kimc> ok chief :)
[03:29:53] <twincest> Stric: "training"
[03:29:59] <Stric> twincest: aah
[03:30:04] <twincest> :)
[03:30:18] <twincest> oh i solved that adaptec problem. need to force 160M/s in the bios
[03:30:34] <Stric> need to do the same on AIX boxen
[03:30:53] <Stric> unfortunately, U160 has some disadvantages over U320 more than "just speed"
[03:31:06] <Stric> better design, can handle luns >2TB etc
[03:31:33] <kimc> the 'failover' at the smtp protocol level isn't the same thing as having HA failover for the daomon under HA
[03:31:52] <Stric> no, but it's HA for smtp
[03:32:09] <kimc> do you mean its all you've got ?
[03:32:11] <twincest> Stric: hm.  sounds annoying.  (fortunately this lun is fairly small)
[03:32:47] <Stric> twincest: U320 is also packetized.. meaning the "command channel" is running at full speed.. in U160, there is a separate command channel running at 8MHz or so
[03:33:06] <Stric> kimc: What are you trying to achieve?
[03:34:23] <kimc> HA in the same context as HA is already implemented for mysql and apache and samba and ..
[03:34:54] <Stric> so you want a "HA addon" instead of "native HA" ?
[03:35:26] <kimc> nope I want the same thing
[03:35:51] <kimc> I guess you're calling it 'native'
[03:36:28] <Stric> since smtp has HA built-in in the system, there is usually no need to make additional work other than just adding a few more servers
[03:36:30] <kimc> if a daemon running smpt stops running I want it to failover
[03:37:05] <kimc> its not the same thing.. not making 'just more work'
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[03:37:49] <kimc> the 'HA' action 'built-in' isnt the same thing
[03:38:19] <kimc> its not as simple as reducing the argument to 'just more work'
[03:38:32] <Stric> well.. it should be dead-simple to implement.. point MX at two machines.. one running, one not.. the second one checks if the first one is alive every now and then.. and when it's not, start up its smtpd..
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[03:38:51] <Doc> depends what you mean by "smtp"
[03:39:12] <Doc> if you just mean gateway, then sure - just use MX. but if you're talking the actual mail server it's a bit different...
[03:39:15] * Stric is talking about smtp the standard
[03:39:28] <kimc> yeah I know what you're saying and MX failover and all is not what I'm talking about
[03:39:37] <Doc> os that's like saying "failover is TCP is easy!"
[03:39:43] <kimc> right
[03:39:51] <kimc> exatcly right
[03:39:52] <Doc> err... s/is/for/
[03:40:34] <Doc> it's statement which may or may not be correct, based on context, but either way is completely unhelpful
[03:40:35] <kimc> yeah the smtp daemon stops running and then what
[03:40:50] <Stric> then other machines will automatically contact the other
[03:40:59] <Stric> you don't have to do anything
[03:41:59] <kimc> ok so you're saying that the Sun HA agent concept has no application for a mail server right ?
[03:42:08] <cypromis> it has
[03:42:12] <cypromis> for suns mailserver
[03:42:12] <Stric> I have no clue about Sun HA agent.
[03:42:16] <cypromis> works pretty great
[03:42:23] <kimc> thank you
[03:42:44] <Stric> cypromis: as in iplanet something or sendmail?
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[03:42:47] <kimc> Stric: thank you
[03:42:48] <Doc> if you're running a mail server, you want HA.
[03:42:59] <kimc> you want it
[03:43:02] <Doc> if you're running a gateway, you want to buy IronPort.
[03:43:19] <Doc> but if you're too cheap to do that, then you just need MX records pointing to multiple unix boxen
[03:43:39] * Stric runs a few mail servers with no HA.. since if a machine goes down, there is no rush to fix it other than mail not getting through..
[03:43:52] <Stric> stuff won't get lost etc
[03:43:55] <kimc> not getting through..
[03:44:32] <Doc> stric: yup. same story with all services - it's a business decision how long you can live without it, and thus what level of redundency (including HA) you need to build in
[03:44:39] <kimc> i don't know what the distinction is for smpt vs http vs smb via samba
[03:45:13] <Stric> kimc: one major distinction is that for http/smb, you point at a single machine.. if that doesn't work, you're screwed
[03:45:44] <Doc> basically what it comes down to is that when they invented SMTP, they got it right
[03:45:45] <Stric> for smtp, you (admin) can tell dns that you have 10 mail servers.. if the first 5 are down, hotmail will still deliver correctly to you
[03:46:07] <Doc> stric: actually, it probably wont.  hotmail's retry stuff is pretty bogus
[03:46:14] <Doc> well, it'll get through... eventually
[03:46:30] <Stric> hotmail was just an example as a random external mail service
[03:46:37] <Stric> s/as/of/
[03:47:00] <Stric> (maybe not the best example since they have extreme amounts of mail and thus isn't playing as nice as the others)
[03:47:21] <kimc> the original question was whether the necessary agent or modules whatever existed to achieve the same level of HA for smpt as there is for web and database and crypto and DNS and more..
[03:47:34] <Doc> then the answer is YES
[03:47:48] <kimc> oh ?
[03:48:09] <Stric> 03:42 (cypromis) it has
[03:48:10] <Stric> 03:42 (cypromis) for suns mailserver
[03:48:32] <Doc> and it would be trivial to setup most any other mailserver as well
[03:48:34] <kimc> it doesn't appear to say that here: http://www.sun.com/featured-articles/2007-0627/feature/index.jsp?intcmp=hp2007jun27_cluster_read
[03:49:01] <Doc> doesnt say the pope is a catholic there either
[03:49:53] <kimc> DOC what you're saying is: 'SMTP already does it well enough throught the protocoal' and i just don't agree with that
[03:50:14] <Doc> no, that's not what i'm saying
[03:50:37] <Stric> That's what I'm saying :)
[03:50:43] <Doc> there are 3 "types" (very broadly speaking) of modules for Sun Cluster
[03:50:54] <Doc> those that come with the product (on that list)
[03:50:56] <kimc> ok Stric.. the you're wrong :)
[03:51:01] <Stric> no I'm not
[03:51:06] <Doc> those that are readily available for other products
[03:51:09] <kimc> uh huh..
[03:51:20] <Doc> and generic agents that can be modified in minutes to work with other products
[03:51:27] <Stric> maybe it's not the specific implementation you (think you) want, but it sure is a HA type of implementation
[03:51:33] <Doc> eg, i have written an "xmaze" agent for Sun Cluster. took me about 2 minutes
[03:51:38] <kimc> oh Ok then you're saying: 'If you have the money you just buy your way out the problem'
[03:51:50] <Stric> No I'm not
[03:51:55] <Doc> kimc: your real problem is that you're mixing terms
[03:51:58] <Doc> you dont HA a protocol
[03:52:02] <Doc> you HA a service
[03:52:22] <Doc> so you dont HA SMTP, or TCP, or even HTTP - which is what you repeatedly keep asking
[03:52:31] <Doc> you HA a mail server, or a web server, or a database
[03:52:46] <Doc> in the case of a mail server sun cluster works well and (generally) very easily
[03:53:20] <Doc> in the case of a mail gateway there is no need for sun cluster - as RFC821/2821 (the SMTP rfc) includes enough "smarts" to route around a problem
[03:53:21] <Stric> What I'm saying is that instead of having two machines up and running, but with one of them having their service shut down.. I say have them both on and SMTP the protocol will HA SMTP the service for you.
[03:53:40] <Doc> stric: did you actually read what i said?
[03:53:49] <Doc> how do you have your mail store on both machines at the same time?
[03:53:50] <kimc> my terms are that you need the ability to sense a failure of SMTP the same way a failure is sensed for any other HA-protected service
[03:54:43] <kimc> not reliablity realized thorugh the purchase of some software that 'has it handled'
[03:54:44] <Doc> stric: you're looking at a tiny, trivial part of the problem - being the mail gateway. you're ignoring the hard part - the mail store/pop server/imap server/etc
[03:54:55] <Stric> Doc: Yep
[03:55:13] <Doc> kimc: i have been involved in more than one major Sun Cluster setup for mail
[03:55:26] <Doc> not to mention that all of Sun's internal mail servers are HA clustered with Sun Cluster
[03:56:06] <Doc> if you're not willing to believe that, or want specifics/etc then this is not the forum for that - go and talk to Sun
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[03:58:56] <kimc> ok there Doc, if you think you can want resort to 'shout me down' mode go ahead
[03:59:59] <Stric> You make interesting conclusions all the time it appears ;)
[04:00:20] <Doc> i'm only shouting because i've said the same thing about 5 times and youapparently haven't heard it yet...
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[04:01:10] <kimc> you can shout all you want but i dont happen to agree with you
[04:01:19] <kimc> ok ?
[04:01:31] <Stric> The great thing about the internet is that you don't have to agree with everyone
[04:01:38] <Doc> ahh.. so you're a Sun Cluster Certified Engineer who's been working with the product for > 5 years too, are you?
[04:02:07] <palowoda> Stric: Everyone else is a dog. :-)
[04:02:38] * Stric bites palowoda in the leg
[04:02:39] <Doc> ok.. 5th hit on google - "Configuring Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.3 With Sun Cluster 3.1" - http://www.sun.com/bigadmin/features/hub_articles/message_srvr_cluster.pdf
[04:03:11] <kimc> you can go the ultimate distance and propose: 'If you don't agree with me then you're arguing with SUN' but i still don't think you're correct
[04:03:44] <Stric> So what is correct?
[04:03:47] <Doc> ok, which parts of what i've said are not correct?
[04:04:15] <kimc> i dont know what kind of mailserver is eralized when you run 'Sun Jave Messaging Server 6.3 blah/..'
[04:04:17] <Doc> after i give you a good explaination of how things work you can't just come back with "you're wrong!" without looking like an idiot
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[04:04:30] <Doc> eralized?
[04:04:57] <kimc> i don;t need an 'explanaiton' of how a mail server works thanks
[04:05:22] <Doc> ahh fuckit.. i've met chimps with higher IQs than you...  time for ignore
[04:06:11] <kimc> i just don't agree with your proposal that the failover provisions built-in to the smtp protocol are good enough, it needs real HA failover
[04:06:18] <Reidms-420R> Hi- I need to update to 67(while running-DVD drive has a bug where it can only read <3.8gb, can some one point me to a guide?  I have not seen but a vague one on the forum
[04:06:42] <kimc> good job Doc
[04:06:51] <Doc> ok.. i'm going to say this one more time
[04:07:01] <kimc> pleae save it
[04:07:41] <Doc> Sun Cluster.   Supports Failing Over.  Mail Servers.  Between.  Nodes.  This functionality.  Does not. AT ALL. Rely on any.  Built-in. "failover provisions".  In the.  SMTP. Protocol
[04:08:04] <Stric> You forgot the last .
[04:08:09] <palowoda> Reidms: What bug?
[04:08:52] <Doc> stric: good point, although i rarely use .'s in IRC :)  just thought that if i talked slow enough kimc might get it
[04:09:03] <Reidms-420R> I forgot the number but it is a Toshiba drive that came in a lot of 220R and 420R
[04:09:41] <palowoda> Oh so it's related to the hardware model only, becuase I just upgraded two systems to 67.
[04:09:43] <Doc> upgrade the firmware
[04:09:49] <Doc> ie, the DVD firmware
[04:09:58] <Doc> is the problem that you cant boot from the DVD drive?
[04:10:31] <kimc> oh ok i get it, so if I want it its with a certain JAVA-based application.. not industry standard mail server software software right ?
[04:10:52] <Doc> no. Sun Cluster can be configured to failover basically any application
[04:11:03] <kimc> thanks for being you Doc
[04:11:11] <Doc> the Sun mail server is not written in Java (despite the name - blame marketing)
[04:11:22] <Reidms-420R> Correct Doc
[04:11:30] <Reidms-420R> SD-M1401
[04:11:37] <Doc> there's a firmware upgrade - to version 1501 from memory
[04:12:45] <Doc> actually.. probably not 1501 - i might have got the model and the firmware confused
[04:12:45] <Reidms-420R> The latest is 1009
[04:12:49] <kimc> ok so whatever its written in.. its not the standard smtp software which is sendmail
[04:12:50] <palowoda> Just curious what program do you use to upgrade firmware on a DVD?
[04:13:14] <Reidms-420R> suns little tool palowoda- i forgot the name
[04:13:21] <Doc> kimc: that's like saying the standard car is a holden
[04:13:34] <palowoda> Let me show you my little tool.  hehe
[04:13:39] <Reidms-420R> optdload
[04:13:56] <Doc> you want patch 111649
[04:14:18] <Reidms-420R> I did 111649-04
[04:14:21] <palowoda> Must be a sparcy thing.
[04:14:54] <Doc> kimc: and for what it's worth, sendmail is an MTA (Mail Transfer Agent), not a mail server
[04:15:27] <Stric> with a really crappy config system
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[04:15:38] <Reidms-420R> Is there any other way to upgrade besides using media?
[04:15:53] <Doc> sendmail plays only a small part in the entire "Mail Server" picture. it transfers messages from one how to another, and that's all. it generally doesnt look after delivering them to a users mailbox, and certainly doesn't look after the user actually reading the message
[04:16:18] <kimc> no its like saying that the standard for smb is sambe and the standard web server software is apache and the 'standard' database software is mysql/Postgres and the standard DHCP software is ISC DHCP.. all these have provisions for running Sun's HA modules as described at: http://www.sun.com/featured-articles/2007-0627/feature/index.jsp?intcmp=hp2007jun27_cluster_read
[04:16:25] <palowoda> net install. with iso local image mount.
[04:16:28] <Doc> and, although you could cluster the Sendmail side of things very easily, you wouldnt
[04:16:45] <kimc> whats the diffence
[04:16:48] <kimc> ?
[04:17:09] <Doc> you're not going to like it, but the difference is that SMTP has built-in failover at the protocol level
[04:17:28] <Stric> ;)
[04:17:33] <kimc> you wouldn't do it for sendmail/Postfix because of what?
[04:17:53] <Doc> because you'd just run sendmail/postfix on two boxes, and setup MX recods to point to both
[04:18:06] <Doc> so that the sender would try one, and if that was down/broken/etc they would automatically try the second
[04:18:26] <kimc> oh ok because its already in the SMTP scheme of things and if that doesn't work well enough for you tought..
[04:18:27] <Doc> what's more, these two boxes could be in different parts of the word, which is difficult to do with cluster
[04:18:54] <kimc> ah ok
[04:18:55] <Doc> kimc: then you could use the Sun Cluster generic module to cluster them with minimal effort
[04:18:58] <Stric> kimc: "if that doesn't work well enough" .. it works better than any semi-automagic failover
[04:19:05] <Doc> although realistically, most ppl would stick a load balaner in front of them
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[04:19:34] <lloy0076> The Google Widget Toolkit's shell uses SWT :(
[04:19:43] <kimc> so Sun HA is more than automagic no?
[04:19:50] <Doc> kimc: i have some clue in this area - i work for a company that makes high-perforance SMTP mail boxes
[04:19:55] <Doc> kimc: hell no
[04:20:18] <Doc> at the end of the day, failover HA (which is what Sun Cluster does) is a kludge
[04:20:32] <Stric> instead of doing native smtp failover
[04:20:36] <Doc> and I can say that with >10 years experience with working with Failover HA
[04:20:40] <kimc> mot people don't have handy 'load balancer' device ready to un-crate and bolt into the rack
[04:20:55] <Doc> exactly, so they just setup multiple MX records
[04:20:56] <Stric> that's why the protocol has it built-in
[04:21:05] <kimc> Doc: what company is that?
[04:21:21] <Doc> kimc: try this... on a unix box type    /usr/sbin/nslookup -q=mx sun.com
[04:21:46] <Doc> see the "mail exchange" entries there? they are what we're talking about - even Sun does it that way!
[04:21:47] <kimc> i hear you: don't question my anymore i'm plugged in
[04:21:55] <Doc> kimc: IronPort (aka Cisco)
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[04:23:08] <kimc> alright Doc so if there were HA support for Postfix it'd compete with other much more expensive commercial offerings
[04:23:29] * Stric sighs
[04:23:56] <richlowe> isn't ironport's big win, the anti-spam thingummy?
[04:24:01] <richlowe> or am I thinking of someone else.
[04:24:18] <Doc> the reason sun doesn't produce a customer module for PostFix is because you could configure the generic agent to do it in about 5 seconds
[04:24:46] <Doc> richlowe: originally it was high performance MTAs. now the main interest is anti-spam/etc, but there's still a bit of both
[04:24:53] <kimc> thanks Doc can you describe how to do it ?
[04:24:58] <Doc> sure. rtfm
[04:25:16] <kimc> hmm.
[04:25:21] <Doc> give me a moment, i'll even find you the exact manual
[04:25:30] <Stric> and in related news, http://www.regdeveloper.co.uk/2007/06/29/sun_makes_clusters_open_source/
[04:25:45] <Stric> (which is actually on-topic for this channel)
[04:26:03] <kimc> well if you can do it in 5 seconds i figured you could prolly describe how in 15 or 20 :)
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[04:27:47] <kimc> i'd like one of those ironport machines
[04:28:56] <palowoda> Stric: It should read Sun makes clusters open source in a year and and a half. Hows that for PR?
[04:29:25] <Stric> palowoda: that would probably be bad PR.
[04:29:44] <palowoda> Bad as AVS?
[04:29:49] <kimc> rather have an smtp daemon proteced with the newly opensourced Opensolaris HA cluster system though.. Postfix would be my favorite
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[04:30:31] <Doc> kimc: http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-6555/6mluf1gbd?a=view
[04:31:23] <Doc> search docs.sun.com or google for SUNWscgds and you'll find lots more (gds is the Generic Data Service)
[04:32:09] <Doc> it comes with a thing called Agent Builder that asks you to fill in a few basic details, and then create a module for you
[04:32:14] <Doc> anyway, gone...
[04:32:37] <kimc> ok thanks Doc thats helpful.. I'll check it out.. you're the man
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[04:37:56] <tjl30> hello
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[04:47:43] <lloy0076> Hibernate has every piece of wonderful documentation in the world...except for advice on how to actually install it sensibly.
[04:47:45] <lloy0076> :(
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[04:48:40] * lloy0076 hmmm
[04:48:47] <lloy0076> And now it's decided to work but I don't know *why*
[04:50:02] <lloy0076> Ah, it wants Java 1.5/
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[05:00:40] <CIA-19> nick.smallbone at gmail dot com: testing
[05:01:15] <FrostCS> 1-2-3
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[05:09:46] <rawn027> i am having some issues compiling software on developer express edition
[05:09:53] <rawn027> same issues on opensolaris nv66
[05:11:17] <rawn027> make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `libreadline.a'
[05:11:26] <rawn027> that is the error i get when trying to compile readline
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[05:15:10] <SunTzuTech> is /usr/ccs/bin in your path?
[05:15:28] <rawn027> no, lemme add that real quick :)
[05:15:49] <rawn027> what file woudl you recommend adding that to, .bash_profile?
[05:17:36] <SunTzuTech> probably.  i don't use bash
[05:18:27] <rawn027> sounds good, readline just compiled... now on to ruby. hopefully all will be well
[05:19:06] <rawn027> damn, no dice
[05:19:17] <rawn027> I refuse to install gcc!
[05:19:29] <rawn027> there has to be a way to get ruby to compile without gcc
[05:19:58] <rawn027> make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `eval.o'
[05:24:18] <rawn027> anyone here using ruby in solaris?
[05:24:50] <SunTzuTech> gcc is already installed in /usr/sfw/bin
[05:26:25] <Tempt> I'd swear I've built Ruby without resorting to gcc
[05:26:36] <EchoBinary> using which instead?
[05:26:47] <Tempt> SUNWspro
[05:26:56] <rawn027> what is SUNWspro?
[05:27:07] <axisys> rawn027: sun c
[05:27:20] <rawn027> I am running the Solaris Express Developer Edition 05/07
[05:27:32] <rawn027> I think that equates to NV 64a
[05:27:34] <axisys> rawn027: u want to get the sun studio 12
[05:27:39] <rawn027> I have that already
[05:27:50] <rawn027> I am using the machine headless right now,  is that ok?
[05:27:53] <axisys> rawn027: use that to compile instead of gcc
[05:28:00] <rawn027> im not using gcc
[05:28:09] <rawn027> i do not have gcc on my system
[05:28:11] <rawn027> i am sure of it
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[05:28:21] <axisys> rawn027: CC=/opt/SUNWspro/bin/cc ./configure
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[05:28:39] <rawn027> do i need to export CC?
[05:28:40] <Tempt> You on SPARC or x86?
[05:28:42] <rawn027> x86
[05:28:45] <rawn027> core 2 duo
[05:28:52] <axisys> rawn027: u could if u want
[05:29:54] * Tempt untars ruby ...
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[05:31:01] <rawn027> Tempt: still no go, same error
[05:31:58] <Tempt> What's the error, anyway?
[05:32:32] <rawn027> make: Fatal error: Command failed for target `eval.o'
[05:32:44] <Tempt> http://www.sun.com/123
[05:32:55] <Tempt> Grab shared shell and then I can watch where it goes wrong.
[05:33:00] <rawn027> ok
[05:33:09] <axisys> Tempt: cool.. can I watch it too ?
[05:33:10] <Tempt> (man, that's a handy tool)
[05:33:21] <axisys> Tempt: yep
[05:33:25] <Tempt> shared shell supports multiple participants, so I can't see why not.
[05:33:43] <rawn027> thats awesome
[05:34:20] <rawn027> ...loading
[05:34:27] <Tempt> I just did a ./configure ; make ; make install
[05:34:29] <axisys> rawn027: is that ok i if i watch it?
[05:34:34] <rawn027> yeah
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[05:34:40] <rawn027> this will be a learning experiance for us all :)
[05:34:45] <axisys> yep
[05:34:47] <Tempt> And it is working fine.
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[05:35:00] <Tempt> So if anyone wants SPARC binaries, I can tar up /opt/PCOWruby for you ...
[05:35:06] <axisys> Tempt: u exported CC and add it to the PATH as well?
[05:35:19] <rawn027> added what to my path
[05:35:34] <Tempt> Let's just wait until we've got a shell.
[05:35:37] <rawn027> that is my path
[05:35:38] <axisys> /opt/SUNWspro/bin and /usr/ccs/bin
[05:35:41] <rawn027> "/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/ccs/bin"
[05:35:50] <axisys> Tempt: yep
[05:35:52] <rawn027> k
[05:36:17] <Atomdrache> Whoever had the suggestion that sound would work under OSS in Nexenta if I got a sound card that wasn't crap:  You were correct :D
[05:36:22] * Atomdrache does a little dance
[05:36:28] <Tempt> That was me.
[05:36:40] <Tempt> Congratulations on your non-crap soundcard purchase!
[05:36:43] <Atomdrache> I thought it might be, but I don't remember names so well sometimes.
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[05:38:40] <Tempt> What sound card did you get, anyway?
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[05:40:06] <Tempt> rawn027: How are you going with Shared shell?
[05:40:41] <rawn027> my monitor wont come back up
[05:40:49] <rawn027> is there a way to force X to restart thru a shell?
[05:41:14] <Tempt> /etc/init.d/dtlogin stop
[05:41:17] <Tempt> sleep 60
[05:41:21] <Tempt> /etc/init.d/dtlogin start
[05:41:47] <rawn027> whats the sleep for :)
[05:41:54] <Stric> pkill Xsun
[05:41:59] <Tempt> because dtlogin can often use a little time to settle.
[05:42:00] <Atomdrache> Umm...let me look at the box.
[05:42:11] <Atomdrache> CMI8738 or something like that.
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[05:42:40] <rawn027> the box just shutdown :-P
[05:42:43] <rawn027> lol
[05:42:49] <Tempt> errr.
[05:42:50] <Tempt> That's odd.
[05:42:55] <rawn027> yeah
[05:43:07] <Tempt> anyway, this should get it to compile if you have Sun CC installed:
[05:43:15] <Tempt> (assuming bash as a shell)
[05:43:30] <rawn027> yeah bash is my shell
[05:43:39] <Tempt> export CC=/opt/SUNWspro/bin/cc ; export PATH=$PATH:/opt/SUNWspro/bin:/usr/ccs/bin
[05:43:54] <rawn027> ok i will try that
[05:44:03] <rawn027> i still wanna see how to do this shared shell thing too :0
[05:44:11] <Tempt> But yeah, shared shell is awesome.
[05:44:18] <rawn027> do you need my IP or anything?
[05:44:23] <Tempt> and it's java, so you can run it on windows any everything.
[05:44:28] <Tempt> Nope, it connects through Sun's servers.
[05:44:44] <axisys> rawn027: just generate a invite key
[05:46:24] <rawn027> ok does this give you full shell access? lol or just read?
[05:46:56] <rawn027> Invite Key: 6HX-QEV-TCK
[05:46:57] <Tempt> starts off with view-only
[05:47:40] <Tempt> connecting ...
[05:48:00] <rawn027> axisys: still want in?
[05:49:53] <axisys> oops yep
[05:50:12] <rawn027> LXY-5X7-JGD
[05:51:06] <axisys> rawn027: i am in as iqbala
[05:51:26] <rawn027> axisys: thats pretty hott isnt it
[05:56:00] <axisys> rawn027: yep..
[06:07:08] <sahafeez> 5 hours left on a dl of 67. sucks
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[06:31:33] <rawn027> good news, solaris 10 is installing on my box :)
[06:31:37] <rawn027> now its bedtime
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[06:35:25] <Venker> hi there
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[06:36:51] <Venker> I'm searching for a Ultrasparc Rescue LiveCD to recover a SunOS system
[06:37:13] <Venker> is possible to use a Opensolaris one successfully?
[06:37:31] <Zephiris> Hm, does anyone know much about the port API? ._.
[06:37:32] <Venker> such as marTux or Belenix
[06:37:41] <Venker> or something like that
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[06:41:28] <Auralis> just use the install cd, and boot it into single user mode
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[06:43:56] <Venker> ok thanks
[06:44:59] <Venker> the firmware "help boot cdrom" command didn't say nothing more about user modes
[06:45:21] <jbk> boot cdrom -s
[06:45:28] <Venker> good :)
[06:45:38] <Venker> thanks a lot
[06:46:10] <twincest> isn't there a "single user shell" option on the sparc install menu?
[06:46:32] <Venker> I didn't see that
[06:46:53] <Venker> could be because of the wrong terminal emulation
[06:47:23] <Venker> I'm using an old HP serial console
[06:48:45] <jbk> heh i wonder if it's the ones used at my old job
[06:48:52] <jbk> there was one console
[06:49:01] <jbk> that somehow, the language had been changed to german :)
[06:49:50] <Venker> well, it's better than russian  :D
[06:50:24] <jbk> well considering all the stuff was highly abbreviated
[06:50:26] <jbk> not really :)
[06:50:49] <Venker> cyrillic console has to be very freaky
[06:51:14] <jbk> haha on an unrelated note, someone just pasted this in another channel, amusing (and non-obscene): http://img.4chan.org/b/src/1183264928746.jpg
[06:52:08] <Venker> xDDD
[07:04:12] <Chihan> xDDD?
[07:09:04] <Venker> I mean 'lol'
[07:14:38] <Chihan> You mean "XD"?
[07:16:56] <Reidms-420R> ...
[07:17:09] <Reidms-420R> That photo is kinda creepy...
[07:17:10] <Reidms-420R> lol
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[07:40:24] <sahafeez> ugh 8 hours left for dl of b67. this sucks. its sun cuz i have 10mbits down
[07:40:56] <pfn> it's not distributed via bittorrent?
[07:40:57] <pfn> sucky
[07:41:43] <pfn> hmm, how do I create new services for smf?  svccfg import x?
[07:43:06] <pfn> where x is an xml file describing the service?
[07:43:06] <jbk> yes
[07:43:18] <pfn> jbk so any clue why pam_ldap won't allow anonymous binds for looking up account info?  you mentioned some ldap control restricting access?
[07:44:28] <jbk> well
[07:44:31] <jbk> how it does it
[07:44:52] <pfn> http://paste.hanhuy.com/solarisPamLdapLog
[07:44:58] <pfn> oh, and that's a log of access on my ldap server
[07:45:01] <jbk> if no bind was done as the user
[07:45:01] <pfn> when this occurs
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[07:45:36] <jbk> you are using sun's ldap server right?
[07:45:37] <Doc> sahafeez: umm.. hint: there's a bit more to any connection on the internet than the two end-points
[07:45:41] <pfn> jbk no
[07:45:46] <jbk> oh
[07:45:46] <pfn> jbk I use openldap
[07:45:51] <jbk> that's probably your problem :)
[07:45:56] <jbk> how it's implemented on sun is
[07:46:01] <jbk> it uses an ldap control
[07:46:05] <jbk> to get the account status
[07:46:10] <jbk> locked, etc.
[07:46:19] <pfn> hmm, it does a query for shadowFlag
[07:46:19] <jbk> i think it's called account_usable
[07:46:28] <pfn> at least from what I see from my ldap log
[07:46:39] <jbk> it's probably querying it earlier to see what controls are supported
[07:46:51] <jbk> and if not supported, not bothering to try to get the info from the control
[07:47:46] * pfn ponders trying to add shadowFlag for shits and giggles
[07:48:02] <jbk> that has nothing to do with it
[07:49:15] <jbk> try this
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[07:49:50] <jbk> ldapsearch -b '' -h <name of ldap server> -s base '(objectclass=*)'
[07:50:03] <jbk> there should be an attribute called 'supportedcontrols' or something close to that
[07:50:31] <jbk> if '1.3.6.1.4.1.42.2.27.9.5.8' isn't one of the listed values, passwordless logins (i.e. ssh-keys) aren't going to work
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[07:50:53] <pfn> http://paste.hanhuy.com/openldapControls
[07:51:10] <pfn> hmm, looks like no
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[07:51:27] <jbk> i wouldn
[07:51:36] <jbk> 't be surprised if it's supported in a later version
[07:51:47] <jbk> but sun added it specifically to their ldap server to address the issue
[07:53:45] <pfn> I'm on openldap 2.3.34
[07:53:46] <pfn> so quite recent
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[08:00:02] <pfn> Further testing indicates it actually does work, and ssh keys can be made to work by just skipping libpam_ldap.so in /etc/pam.conf with a specific sshd-keygen account sections.
[08:00:05] <pfn> hmm
[08:00:07] <pfn> I wonder how that's handled
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[08:00:34] <jbk> my guess is though is that if you try to disable the account in ldap
[08:00:40] <jbk> it'll still work via a key
[08:01:03] <pfn> well, since I don't have that control anyway, it makes no difference
[08:01:09] <jbk> so you can't really disable an account from logging in via an ssh-key short of deleting the account
[08:01:15] <pfn> in that case, I can do what I do with all other user accounts, set them to an invalid shell
[08:01:18] <pfn> e.g. /sbin/nologin
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[08:02:36] <pfn> or /bin/false
[08:06:20] <pfn> sshd-pubkey in pam.conf does it
[08:09:33] <pfn> I can't believe no one actually documents this... I guess not many people run solaris + pam_ldap against non-sun DS
[08:10:42] * pfn tosses it in his pastebin
[08:10:43] <pfn> http://paste.hanhuy.com/solarisPamLdapSshPubkey
[08:11:12] <pfn> the pam keys aren't even documented (discovered via the use of 'strings sshd | grep sshd')
[08:11:59] <pfn> pam key = pam service name
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[08:21:40] <pfn> [pfnguyen@ares ~]$ sudo umount x86
[08:21:40] <pfn> umount: /home/pfnguyen/x86: device is busy
[08:21:44] <pfn> I hate mounting shit sometimes
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[08:25:24] <Tempt> fuser ...
[08:28:53] <pfn> yeah, I'm doing fuser, nothing's showing up
[08:29:09] <pfn> [pfnguyen@ares ~]$ sudo /sbin/fuser -a x86
[08:29:09] <pfn> x86:
[08:30:19] <Tempt> Bummer.
[08:30:38] <Tempt> Talking about LDAP, is there an official blueprint or recommended deployment guide for LDAP auth on Solaris 10+?
[08:31:34] <pfn> Tempt, man ldaplist gives a list of all the expected containers
[08:31:43] <jbk> try ldaplist passwd
[08:31:59] <Tempt> I'm talking about serverside as well.
[08:32:08] <pfn> tempt that would be server side...
[08:32:11] <Tempt> The last time I looked at this was with Sol9, and obviously things have changed.
[08:32:19] <pfn> things have changed?
[08:32:20] * pfn shrugs
[08:32:27] <Tempt> (and I'm perfectly happy using Sun's LDAP server)
[08:32:30] <jbk> well depending on your patchlevel
[08:32:31] <pfn> I'm a newbie to opensolaris, just recently installed sxde 64a in a VM
[08:32:42] <pfn> and I've recently configured ldap auth on it
[08:32:55] <jbk> somewhere in there 'ldap2' support (binding as the user's dn) was added
[08:33:02] <pfn> [pfnguyen@vsol ~]$ ldaplist passwd pfnguyen
[08:33:02] <pfn> dn: uid=pfnguyen,ou=People,dc=HanHuy,dc=com
[08:33:17] <jbk> you can also do ldaplist -l ....
[08:33:18] <pfn> (vsol = virtual solaris... creative, huh)
[08:33:28] <Tempt> jbk: I gather there isn't a shipped copy of ds5 anymore?
[08:33:38] <jbk> not w/ sol10
[08:33:41] <jbk> just 9
[08:33:44] <jbk> i believe
[08:34:08] <jbk> but you can always just download the packages
[08:34:15] <Tempt> jbk: So just deploy "Sun Java ONE Enterprise iPlanet Netscape Directory Server" and go for it?
[08:34:44] <pfn> [pfnguyen@ares ~]$ sudo umount boot
[08:34:45] <pfn> umount: /home/pfnguyen/boot: device is busy
[08:34:46] <pfn> sunofabitch
[08:34:58] <pfn> (boot and x86 are boot_archive and x86.miniroot-safe)
[08:35:08] <pfn> mounted loop so I can see what they look like
[08:35:22] <pfn> (ares happens to be a linux box)
[08:35:29] <Tempt> Hmm.
[08:35:50] <Tempt> umount -f?
[08:36:01] <jbk> fuser -ck ?
[08:36:26] <pfn> nada
[08:36:35] <Tempt> umount -f FTW!
[08:36:44] <pfn> linux doesn't implement umount -f...
[08:36:45] <pfn> stupid huh
[08:36:51] <Cuchullain> Hmmm.... can something like iostat report which processes are doing the IO?
[08:36:58] <pfn> at least I don't think so
[08:37:04] * pfn shrugs
[08:37:13] <pfn> [root@ares pfnguyen]# umount -f boot
[08:37:13] <pfn> umount2: Device or resource busy
[08:37:13] <pfn> umount: /home/pfnguyen/boot: device is busy
[08:37:31] <pfn> I guess there's a umount -l
[08:37:33] * pfn tries that
[08:38:15] <pfn> Cuchullain, there's something in dtracetoolkit, I think?
[08:38:42] <Tempt> I thought they would have worked out umount -f on linux by now.
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[08:40:26] <Cuchullain> pfn : cheers - I might check that out if I don't find what I'm looking for... it's at the back of my head.
[08:40:45] * Cuchullain hasn't played with dtrace yet
[08:41:08] <Tempt> Cuchullain: www.brendangregg.com
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[08:44:41] <pfn> I guess I should learn to use lofi instead
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[08:45:54] <Tempt> lofi is pretty easy
[08:46:10] <Tempt> lofiadm -a $FILENAME
[08:46:15] <Cuchullain> Damn - I was thinking of fsstat
[08:46:28] <Cuchullain> Tempt - cheers - investigating now
[08:47:40] <Cuchullain> iosnoop ftw!
[08:47:47] <Tempt> Indeed.
[08:48:20] <pfn> that's a dtrace script, right?
[08:48:26] <Cuchullain> yup
[08:48:27] <cmihai> duh
[08:50:26] <pfn> that's what I thought, heh
[08:51:26] <Tempt> Damn, I think I'm going to have to get more RAM before I fire up too many more zones full of stuff on this box.
[08:51:30] <Tempt> Time to schedule that outage.
[08:52:58] <cmihai> Tempt: would be a lot more fun if Containers had LiveMigration :-)
[08:53:06] <cmihai> Like with VMware Infrastructure HA :-]
[08:53:11] <cmihai> (or Xen)
[08:53:45] <cmihai> Of course, due to design that might be a little harder to achive :-]
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[08:55:41] <e^ipi> let's find out if the year-old sun labs Solaris/PPC code drop will boot on my rs/6000
[08:56:15] <Tempt> e^ipi: Do it!
[08:57:04] <Tempt> Sun appear to have fixed their slow download problem, DSEE.6.0.Solaris-Sparc-full.tar.gz came in at 814.4Kb/sec
[08:58:04] <emergo> anyone here running opensolaris on an macbook ?
[08:58:05] <emergo> Apple MacBook Core 2 Duo 2.16GHz/2GB/160GB/SuperDrive - Black
[08:58:52] <cmihai> "Black"
[08:59:05] <cmihai> Aren't you just showing your e-pen15 around?
[08:59:08] <Tempt> You pay extra for the Black.
[08:59:13] <cmihai> Duh
[08:59:41] <emergo> Tempt: :-) seriously ?
[08:59:58] <emergo> ha ha
[09:00:01] <Tempt> Only Apple could get away with that.
[09:00:10] <emergo> well they could
[09:00:23] <e^ipi> emergo: yeah, it's $50 or so more for the exact same config, but in black
[09:00:26] <Tempt> "If you don't want a fucking white pansy laptop, pay another $AU100 and you can have it in black"
[09:00:43] <Tempt> Thus cementing Apple as a wanker-brand in the minds of all.
[09:00:45] <cmihai> So, can't you spray paint the fucker
[09:01:06] <cmihai> Apple is just overpriced garbage.
[09:01:23] <e^ipi> it's just plain lowest-bidder PC parts
[09:01:48] <emergo> so true, so true. Well give me an alternative to run opensolaris on an I look it up. which isn't an overpriced garbage (and wireless will work) Toshiba ?
[09:02:12] <e^ipi> Acer, oddly, has some fabulously well-supported laptops
[09:02:20] <e^ipi> or some lenovo configs
[09:02:33] <emergo> e^ipi: lenovo  ?
[09:03:05] <cmihai> There's some pretty nice Acers out there
[09:03:06] <Tempt> Is Acer still crankin' out those Ferrari style laptops?
[09:03:16] 
[09:03:19] <e^ipi> emergo: IBM's laptops were sold to another company
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[09:03:28] <e^ipi> and now they're lenovo
[09:03:47] <cmihai> Hell, now GeForce 8600 (DirectX) NVIDIA card is something :-]
[09:03:55] <emergo> e^ipi: ah
[09:03:56] <cmihai> Price is also good.
[09:03:59] <cmihai> Little over 1000$
[09:04:00] <pfn> I dunno, a macbook is pretty reasonable for the price
[09:04:10] <cmihai> And it's got that new Intel Santa Rosa platform
[09:04:11] <pfn> $1200 is a decent price for a core2duo, 1gb, etc.
[09:04:26] <cmihai> That's 2 GB :P
[09:05:07] <emergo> pfn: but how well would opensolaris run on it !
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[09:05:45] <cmihai> It's also got a nice design
[09:06:10] <e^ipi> cmihai: yeah, emo girls will sleep with you if you have one
[09:06:27] <e^ipi> which is the only real reason anyone buys one
[09:06:39] <cmihai> Nah, I hate Macs ;-)
[09:06:44] <Tempt> I thought the emo girls put out to anyone who buys them a drink?
[09:06:50] <e^ipi> cmihai: are you an emo girl?
[09:07:28] <pfn> emergo, I think it'd run very well... minus power management and any proprietary hardware stuffs
[09:07:42] <pfn> no bluetooth, etc.
[09:07:53] <emergo> cmihai: U are using the acer inspire ?
[09:08:11] <cmihai> http://global.acer.com/products/notebook/as5920g.htm -> Getting one as soon as the T7300 pops up here
[09:08:17] <Tempt> /opt/ds6/bin/dsadm exited with unexpected error code 11
[09:08:18] <Tempt> com.sun.directory.common.slapx.AdmCmdErrorException: /opt/ds6/bin/dsadm create -p 3998 -P 3999 --pwd-file /var/tmp/ads23533.tmp /opt/var/dscc6/dcc/ads
[09:08:21] <cmihai> I can only get T7100 with 2MB cache now.
[09:08:22] <Tempt> (and they wonder why we hate Java)
[09:08:25] <cmihai> I'm waiting for the 4MB cache version
[09:10:47] <emergo> ok, you need the video part
[09:11:09] <pfn> Tempt, that's nothing to do with java, just shitty code
[09:11:42] <cmihai> Besides, I can't find a single other laptop with such a video card
[09:12:01] <emergo> cmihai: ok, but what about price
[09:12:04] <pfn> emergo, with what video card?
[09:12:13] <cmihai> emergo: a bit over 1000$
[09:12:24] <pfn> the macbook comes with intel integrated graphics
[09:12:33] <pfn> sucky if you're looking for something beyond basic
[09:12:35] <Gropi> Tempt: is dsadm written in Java?
[09:12:47] <cmihai> emergo: the version with T7100 CPU, 2GB RAM, 160GB disk and 8600 GT is 1600$
[09:12:53] <Tempt> Something in there is obviously java.
[09:13:09] <Tempt> Since when was it okay not to write sensible exception handlers and rely on java exploding to describe the problem, huh?
[09:13:12] 
[09:13:18] <emergo> $
[09:13:21] <cmihai> Eh? :-)
[09:13:44] <cmihai> What, are you from UK or something
[09:13:46] <emergo> eh ? that would be canada ? you talkin canadian dollara
[09:13:51] <pfn> Tempt, blame that on the programmers, not the language
[09:13:52] <emergo> Norway
[09:13:57] <cmihai> Nah ma, USD
[09:14:17] <cmihai> I tested the T7100 laptop, performance is awesome
[09:14:24] <Tempt> pfn: Oh, I'll happily blame both.
[09:14:28] <Tempt> pfn: It makes it easier.
[09:14:35] <cmihai> Design is pretty good. I just can't take buying a laptop with 2MB cache per CPU
[09:14:40] <emergo> cmihai: with opensolaris or windows ?
[09:14:42] <Tempt> There must be something magical about java that encourages sloppy code.
[09:14:43] <cmihai> I'll wait for 4MB cache and that's that :-)
[09:15:02] <emergo> cmihai: when ?
[09:15:03] <cmihai> emergo: it's a Santa Rosa platform, should work well with OpenSolaris. NVIDIA card too.
[09:15:04] <pfn> tempt it lowered the price of admission for "enterprise programmers"
[09:15:27] <emergo> cmihai: santa rosa I dont know (yet)
[09:15:30] <cmihai> emergo: they're already out, they just need to enter stores around here.
[09:15:50] <Tempt> Indeed.
[09:15:56] <cmihai> emergo: Santa Rosa - same as new MacBooks
[09:16:11] <pfn> cmihai, macbook pro
[09:16:13] <pfn> not macbooks
[09:16:24] <emergo> ok
[09:16:26] <cmihai> whatever
[09:16:52] <Gropi> Tempt: http://forum.java.sun.com/thread.jspa?threadID=5167154&tstart=225
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[09:17:28] <emergo> pfn: but the problem as you said is "some" hardware wont work... in linux or opensolaris like bluetooth(i dont care)... but wireless didnt work for my powerbook either so I hated it ...
[09:17:31] * Tempt isn't in the mood for webforums today.
[09:18:11] <Gropi> your are welcome
[09:18:27] * dlg bore
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[09:21:58] <pfn> Tempt, sounds like your question is anwered there, though...
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[09:24:03] <pfn> ok, time to figure out how to make my own miniroot boot from cd
[09:24:04] <pfn> http://paste.hanhuy.com/screenshot/solarisCdromBoot
[09:24:52] <Tempt> pfn: Nah, I'm using an 8 char passwd
[09:24:59] <Tempt> pfn: I might scratch the host and start again.
[09:25:04] <pfn> Tempt, with no numbers?
[09:25:07] <cmihai> pfn: you are aware that VMware can take screenshots too? :-)
[09:25:15] <pfn> cmihai, I don't know, it can?  heh
[09:25:26] <cmihai> Sigh :-)
[09:25:36] <pfn> I only started using vmware like the day before yesterday
[09:25:52] <pfn> and the only reason I tried to use vmware is so that I can boot sxde
[09:25:55] <pfn> heh
[09:25:57] <Tempt> pfn: No numbers, this is a weak little test install, not a production deployment.
[09:26:06] <cmihai> VM - Capture Screen :-)
[09:26:10] <cmihai> It can also do movies heh
[09:26:15] <pfn> handy
[09:26:18] <cmihai> You know, just the VM framebuffer :-]
[09:26:21] <pfn> I should consider that next time
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[09:27:12] <pfn> looks like there's no keyboard shortcut to do that, though
[09:27:25] <pfn> cmihai, I have like a .2second window of opportunity to get the screenshot
[09:27:41] <emergo> pfn: how much does the macbook pro cost in the us then ? here I have to pay 2300$ for the one I mentioned
[09:27:43] <trochej> cmihai: It's actually not movies, but the recording of the execution path, I believe :)
[09:28:15] <pfn> emergo expensive, 1800-2500 or so depending on model
[09:28:30] <pfn> cmihai, so alt-prtscrn is much easier to capture what I want
[09:28:37] <pfn> either that, or use wink and set it to capture until it hits
[09:30:26] <Tempt> Why the hell should it demand that DSCC is deployed in the global zone. That's just wrong.
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[09:37:36] <emergo> pfn:
[09:37:47] <emergo> pfn:
[09:37:48] <emergo> pfn: 13" Black/2GB/160GB/SuperDrive
[09:37:57] <trochej> The meeting yesterday was really boorish
[09:38:15] <emergo> pfn: 2375$
[09:40:32] <e^ipi> emergo: now price out the lower down model upgraded to the same specs
[09:40:38] <e^ipi> ( the high-end white one )
[09:40:44] <e^ipi> it'll be about $50 or so cheaper
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[09:42:03] <emergo> e^ipi: ok, but I look at the acer Acer Aspire 5920G/Core 2 Duo T7300, 15,4"/2GB/160GB/Geforce 8600/BT/Vista HP, and its only 2000$
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[09:42:50] <e^ipi> acer's probably also got a well supported wifi card in it
[09:42:56] <e^ipi> which the macbook won't
[09:43:58] <emergo> e^ipi: exactly, but the macbook pro has an 2.16mhz processor and I this says T7300, not sure how to compare that
[09:46:02] <e^ipi> 2.0ghz
[09:50:43] <pfn> emergo, 13"?  that's not a macbook pro
[09:51:08] <pfn> macbook pro is 15" and 17"
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[09:54:44] <sickness> morning all
[09:55:07] <e^ipi> what up
[09:56:50] <Tempt> mornin'.
[09:56:55] <Tempt> How's that zpool crankin'?
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[10:03:00] <emergo> pfn: 13,3"
[10:03:36] <emergo> pfn: http://www.mpx.no/aspx/loginVnet.aspx?ReturnUrl=%2faspx%2fprodukt%2fprdinfovnet.aspx%3fplid%3d80463&plid=80463
[10:07:34] <sickness> Tempt: mine? all good :)))
[10:08:09] <Tempt> Excellent, excellent.
[10:08:16] <Tempt> filled with top quality pr0n yet?
[10:08:22] <e^ipi> evidently i have absolutely no idea how to set up a netboot server
[10:08:35] <e^ipi> the instructions, they do nothing...
[10:09:00] <Tempt> Aah, c'mon, 'tis easy.
[10:09:03] <Tempt> Want a hand?
[10:09:06] <sickness> eheh, well still not filled, just like half a terabyte of pr0n :P
[10:09:17] <e^ipi> erm, i'm not sure...
[10:09:17] <Tempt> sickness: That's a pretty good effort.
[10:09:26] <Tempt> e^ipi: Netboot for jumpstart, right?
[10:09:43] <e^ipi> no, netboot to get a solaris kernel booting on a powerpc machine
[10:09:54] <Tempt> Oh.
[10:09:57] <Tempt> Interesting.
[10:10:17] <Tempt> How do they retrieve netboot?
[10:10:18] <Tempt> tftp?
[10:10:30] <e^ipi> yeah
[10:11:46] <Tempt> So you've got tftp up, obviously. Uses rarp for reverse lookups?
[10:11:47] <e^ipi> the instructions that managed to sneak out of sun labs before they clamped down on openness tell me to set /etc/ethers, /etc/bootparams and /etc/hosts up, get tftpd, in.bootparamd & in.rarpd running
[10:12:01] <Tempt> That's pretty much it.
[10:12:06] <e^ipi> so I did that & the machine isn't pulling down the kernel
[10:12:12] <Tempt> Do an arp -a and make sure the entry is populated.
[10:12:27] <e^ipi> yep
[10:12:31] <sickness> I'll have to wait the 1tb drives to get cheaper before filling it :P
[10:12:31] <sickness> eheh tnx
[10:12:34] <Tempt> And you can run tftpd in debug mode and it will print all the requests that it gets.
[10:12:51] <Tempt> sickness: sata750     1.11T  1.61T      4     14   594K  1.02M
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[10:12:53] <e^ipi> Tempt: at the moment it's a SMF service
[10:13:00] <Tempt> svcadm disable
[10:13:04] <Tempt> run it by hand. SRSLY.
[10:13:18] <Tempt> in.rarpd -d
[10:13:31] <Tempt> in.tftpd -d
[10:13:32] <e^ipi> yeah, rarpd is running by hand
[10:14:19] <Tempt> Last time I had to debug this I used a third-party tftpd I think.
[10:14:29] <sickness> vintage      852G  1.50T      0      3  22.3K  47.9K
[10:14:33] <Tempt> Don't forget you can always truss tftpd.
[10:14:38] <sickness> anyway, zpool output is wrong on sizes
[10:14:48] <Tempt> sickness: Gives you an idea though.
[10:14:49] <sickness> vintage             638G  1.09T
[10:15:02] <Tempt> sata750/video          2.7T   809G   1.6T    34%    /video
[10:15:02] <sickness> zfs list is ok with data size
[10:15:26] <sickness> maybe zpool doesn't look at metadata but just at raidz2 I don't know...
[10:15:33] <sickness> yeah
[10:16:04] <Tempt> pretty sure bootparamd will take a -d for debug as well
[10:16:14] <sickness> vintage/pr0n           1.7T   455G   1.1T    29%    /home/sickness/pr0n
[10:16:58] <Tempt> haha
[10:17:00] <Tempt> That's all class.
[10:17:07] <Tempt> That's also a lot of pr0n.
[10:17:11] <e^ipi> Tempt: yeah, they're all running in debug mode
[10:17:20] <e^ipi> no output though, so it could very well be the client
[10:17:27] <Tempt> Could be.
[10:17:38] <Tempt> If you don't get something from rarp it isn't getting an address, and hence is .. dead.
[10:17:54] <e^ipi> well, my DNS server is not the solaris box
[10:17:59] <e^ipi> it's my router
[10:18:21] <e^ipi> erm, DHCP server... not dns
[10:19:04] <pfn> emergo that's a macbook, not a macbook pro
[10:19:18] <Tempt> Ummn
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[10:19:24] <Tempt> Most DHCP servers won't do the job here.
[10:19:38] <Tempt> DHCP != rarp; DHCP != bootparams
[10:19:57] <Tempt> I wouldn't think an RS/6000 of that vintage would talk DHCP
[10:20:06] <pfn> Tempt, dhcp is a superset of bootp
[10:20:13] <pfn> rather, dhcp supercedes bootp
[10:20:38] <pfn> I was under the impression that dhcp is backward compatible with bootp
[10:21:21] <Tempt> dhcp is a subset of bootp
[10:22:18] <Tempt> Honestly, when you're trying to netboot machines, you don't want to mess around too much unless you're fond of work.
[10:22:36] <Tempt> For most OpenFirmware netboots, you need rarp, rpc.bootparams, tftp.
[10:22:51] <Tempt> Things are different on newer implementations but not on RS/6000s.
[10:22:58] <pfn> perhaps so
[10:23:00] <Tempt> Perhaps a newer pSeries.
[10:23:13] <Tempt> And neither DHCP nor bootp is used here.
[10:23:22] * pfn hasn't done any netboot work since his sun 3/60
[10:23:25] <Tempt> bootp != bootparams
[10:23:32] <pfn> since then it's only been pxe
[10:23:38] <Tempt> And it hasn't hcanged that much since your sun 3/60 ;)
[10:23:43] <pfn> hmm, for some reason I thought bootp is bootparam
[10:23:52] <Tempt> bootp = "boot protocol"
[10:24:01] <Tempt> bootparams = "RPC boot parameters"
[10:24:11] <pfn> indeed, so it's a different beast
[10:24:42] <Tempt> example bootparams config line: classic root=10.0.10.170:/global/jumpstart/classic rootopts=:vers3 swap=10.0.10.170:/global/jumpstart/classic/swap ns=none:none(255.255.0.0) domain=mexico.purplecow.org dump=: gateway=10.0.10.2:255.255.0.0
[10:28:23] <e^ipi> yeah, looks roughly like what i've got
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[10:35:13] <e^ipi> nope, it's the client
[10:35:20] <e^ipi> the mac boots off it just fine
[10:46:46] <e^ipi> bleh, looks like it's not even trying to get an address
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[12:16:42] <Tempt> Anyone awake for a stupid question?
[12:17:13] <Tempt> Exception in thread "main" org.postgresql.util.PSQLException: ERROR: incompatible library "/opt/opennms/lib/iplike.so": missing magic block
[12:17:15] <Tempt> Missing magic block?
[12:19:35] <vmlemon> Any ideas as to why my machine would decide to randomly reboot itself without warning, after starting Amarok?
[12:19:57] <PerterB> Tempt: http://tinyurl.com/2tvq3f
[12:21:01] <Tempt> Thanks!
[12:21:27] <Tempt> crap, looks like I need to switch to an earlier postgres.
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[12:22:31] <techNiKal> hi i am using Persario 900 (pp2140) series and it cannot detect my vert and horizsync what can i do ?
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[12:22:37] <techNiKal> it flickers the screen
[12:23:31] <Tempt> You'd think there would be an easy way of disabling this magic block.
[12:23:56] <PerterB> yeah, it does look a little kludgey
[12:24:39] <iron_angel> techNiKal: well, you can specify them manually. What sort of monitor is it?
[12:25:09] <techNiKal> laptop
[12:25:20] <iron_angel> ok, what's the maximum resolution?
[12:26:06] <techNiKal> above 1024 but i cannot remember exactly i am now on other machine
[12:26:10] <techNiKal> i need to reinstall it
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[12:26:34] <iron_angel> 1280x1024?
[12:27:04] <iron_angel> If it is, specifying "HorizSync       30 - 70" and "VertRefresh    50 - 100" should be close enough.
[12:27:45] <Fish> hello
[12:29:08] <techNiKal> well iron_angel can you tell me which kdm should i use XSun or Xorg in this case ?
[12:29:17] <techNiKal> and if XSun what is the file name to configure it
[12:31:07] <iron_angel> On x86, you want to use xorg about 99% of the time.
[12:31:15] <iron_angel> So /etc/X11/xorg.conf, it should be.
[12:31:33] <techNiKal> and if it is XSun just for information ? if you know ?
[12:32:18] <Tempt> PerterB: Thanks mate, a quick rebuild of iplike and we're all good so far.
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[12:35:40] <iron_angel> I don't recall offhand
[12:35:40] <iron_angel> oh.
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[12:45:53] <rawn027> hey all
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[12:47:25] <rawn027> is there a reason why my mouse doesnt work in solaris?
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[12:48:07] <rawn027> is there a way I can break into a console? The GUI is not useable. I think its my xorg.conf file
[12:50:36] <rawn027> what is the difference from Xorg window server and Xsun, does one work better than the other?
[12:51:22] <asyd> depend of the arch and video card
[12:51:42] <rawn027> i have x86
[12:51:43] <iron_angel> On SPARC, you want Xsun, on x86/amd64 you want Xorg 99% of the time.
[12:51:45] <rawn027> with nvidia card
[12:51:52] <asyd> definitively xorg
[12:51:57] <iron_angel> Then yeah, you want Xorg, and nVidia's driver.
[12:52:03] <rawn027> is there an easy way to troubleshoot my mouse?
[12:52:14] <rawn027> Xoorg is working just fine with the right res but my mouse doesnt work
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[13:06:54] <rawn027> can someone paste their mouse section in their open solaris instlal
[13:06:57] <rawn027> of xorg.conf?
[13:08:42] <Zephiris> Is anyone familiar with port_associate() and the like? ~_~
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[13:45:17] <vmlemon> Hi, how can I recover the data from my user slice, since I can't mount either the system or home/user slices as read-write?
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[14:13:21] <tecNikal> hi i m trying to install on presario 900 laptop solaris 10 11/06 and once the first cd is over and it is loading the services
[14:13:43] <tecNikal> suddenly it start to show all flood of exception and all the things keep on coming
[14:13:46] <tecNikal> until restart
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[14:22:17] <sickness> i'm back
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[14:30:29] <Zephiris> Is anyone familiar with the port events API?
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[15:45:39] <twincest> i want to reboot a SCSI device.  how do i unconfigure it so solaris doesn't get confused?  cfgadm?
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[15:51:45] <Stric> cfgadm -la;cfgadm -c unconfigure cX::....
[15:51:59] <twincest> thx
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[16:43:42] <Zephiris> I don't suppose anyone's around yet who is familiar with the port events API?
[16:43:56] <twincest> a little
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[16:44:27] <tecNikal> hi does solaris 10 support usb ?
[16:44:30] <tecNikal> 1.0 ?
[16:44:50] <dlg> yes
[16:45:12] <tecNikal> dlg: how it doesnot detect it in my laptop
[16:45:19] <tecNikal> even an external hard disk
[16:45:20] <coffman> tecNikal: usb 1.0 and 2.0
[16:45:21] <dlg> dunno
[16:45:26] <dlg> computers are complicated machines
[16:45:27] <tecNikal> i am using 11/06
[16:45:39] <tecNikal> anyway to make it work ?
[16:45:43] <coffman> tecNikal: which chipset?
[16:46:06] <tecNikal> compaq presario amd xp 1000
[16:46:11] <dlg> there's only 4
[16:46:11] <tecNikal> presario 900
[16:46:12] <Zephiris> twincest: I've been getting a bit finicky behavior with my code. ._. I'm trying to adapt wine to use it, but it's giving some bizarre problems between mangling the 'user' input, and often not dispatching any events if the file descriptor isn't a pointer (but corrupting user even worse if it is).
[16:46:15] <dlg> 3 real ones
[16:46:59] <coffman> tecNikal: chipset, not the notebook, im not going to google for you :P
[16:47:19] <tecNikal> no idea
[16:47:27] <tecNikal> its a laptop and i dont know how to dismantle it
[16:47:48] <coffman> tecNikal: basicly every ohci conform chipset should work.
[16:47:55] <coffman> tecNikal: look in the specs
[16:48:09] <twincest> Zephiris: do you have any test case?
[16:48:14] <coffman> tecNikal: also you should check in your bios setings
[16:48:38] <tecNikal> give me 5 minutes i am reinstallng it i will come back to you
[16:48:50] <coffman> tecNikal: you could also pastebin "scanpci -vv" and "dmesg"
[16:49:16] <tecNikal> ok i will as soon as my 5th cd get installed
[16:49:33] <Zephiris> twincest: Like a distilled one? Not exactly. I've been trying to follow examples/guides, but either it never dispatches events, or so badly corrupts the 'user' input that it crashes, depending on how things are passed to port_associate(). ^^;
[16:50:35] <twincest> i have never seen that
[16:53:05] <Zephiris> If I pass integers to the descriptor and user options, it never dispatches (and user is incorrect after bogus checks). If I pass pointers to both, it dispatches, but the user value is off randomly into millions, overflows.
[16:53:50] * Zephiris is glad she wasn't testing it on gamin or fam first...-_-
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[16:55:04] <trx> hi all, my /var/dt/Xerrors is full of the following:
[16:55:29] <trx> error (pid 562): server open attempt #1 failed for :0, giving up
[16:55:42] <trx> error (pid 562): server open attempt #2 failed for :0, giving up
[16:56:01] <trx> error (pid 585): server open attempt #3 failed for :0, giving up
[16:57:04] <trx> error (pid554): Server unexpectedly died
[16:57:09] <trx> then starts again from #1
[16:57:28] <trx> any idea's where to start fixing this error / what it could be / how i could get solaris to give me more info?
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[17:02:20] * Zephiris mumbles, was making such good process on fixing wine for Solaris, too.
[17:03:11] * sporq burps
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[17:04:53] * coffman wonders what are the impacts of disable wbem:default
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[17:05:38] <trx> anyone have any idea's what could be the cause of my /var/dt/Xerrors posted above?
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[17:14:50] <oxygene> Zephiris: fixing wine for solaris?
[17:14:59] <Zephiris> Yeah?
[17:15:09] <oxygene> Zephiris: what do you have to fix?
[17:15:10] <boro> trx: try to run it under truss or dtrace
[17:16:07] <Zephiris> It won't compile with SunCC, doesn't use Solaris port event API, and gets various minor problems that aren't there on the same version for Linux, that I have yet to trace because gcc produces horrifically bad debugging code. ^^;
[17:16:12] <trx> *newbie* please expand
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[17:17:48] <oxygene> Zephiris: oh. sunCC.. good luck ;)
[17:18:06] <boro> trx: does the file mention Xorg ?
[17:18:22] <Zephiris> oxygene: I already have it most of the way or so. ;p
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[17:19:10] <Zephiris> There's mostly just one big hairy carbuncle in the way, due to apparently complete "I pretend this doesn't exist, LALALAL!" on wine code's part. ^^;
[17:19:11] * oxygene moves away from sunpro
[17:19:28] <oxygene> no use for that in a free osol distro
[17:19:44] <Zephiris> Why not?
[17:20:46] <trx> boro: nowhere in the Xerrors file does it mention Xorg
[17:22:00] <tecNikal> coffman: now i have opened the bios setting what options you would like to know about
[17:22:10] <tecNikal> i am the same guy just now asking you abut the usb proble
[17:22:13] <tecNikal> problem
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[17:22:38] <tecNikal> i have problem with my external drive as well as wireless network adapter from aztech
[17:23:03] <boro> try to run just /usr/X11R6/bin/Xorg -verbose 10
[17:24:15] <boro> trx: do you connect to your display remotely ?
[17:24:51] * Zephiris perhaps sees nothing wrong with absurdly good compiler and debugger with no charge. o-0
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[17:27:49] <trx> boro, have not tried
[17:27:58] <trx> i will try running with verbose 10 first
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[17:31:16] <trx> OK... just run /usr/X11R6/bin/Xorg via SSH
[17:31:29] <trx> and my screen attached to my solaris box has just loaded X without a problem
[17:31:34] <trx> now displaying login screen!
[17:31:46] <trx> so why wouldnt it start when it boots up??
[17:32:11] <trx> maybe its running the sun X server instead (does that sound likley/possible? / would it cause a problem)
[17:32:27] <trx> is there any way to tell what it's trying to run at startup
[17:32:28] <trx> ??
[17:32:33] <boro> trx: Xorg via Ssh ? strange
[17:33:04] <trx> i ran the xorg command via SSH
[17:33:09] <trx> (as root)
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[17:33:29] <trx> and it loaded on my main screen (the one thats physically connected to my solaris box, not the pc on which i have an ssh session)
[17:33:30] <boro> so you are starting X on a remote machine ?
[17:33:44] <trx> no
[17:34:06] <trx> i am just using ssh as a way to type commands to my solaris box
[17:34:25] <trx> instead of scrambling behind my desk to find the keyboard on the solaris box :P
[17:34:33] <boro> errr and where do you connect by ssh from ? ssh localhost ?
[17:34:43] <boro> aha
[17:34:51] <trx> no from another pc on my lan
[17:35:14] <trx> the problem i am trying to fix, is that when i start my solaris box up, X does not start
[17:35:32] <boro> you can select between Xorg and Xsun with kdmconfig
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[17:35:41] <trx> sweet
[17:35:53] <trx> i will give that a try and hopefully its just Xsun being gay
[17:36:05] <trx> are there any advantages to running Xsun over Xorg?
[17:36:31] <boro> i am not fully competent about this, but it think there's more development and itnerest in Xorg
[17:36:49] <boro> that's why it's beeing used also on solaris lately
[17:36:57] <trx> looks like i was already running Xorg
[17:37:09] <boro> more hardware support, guess and many fancy functioins
[17:37:52] <trx> no problems
[17:38:03] <trx> i think its just a missconfigured x server then
[17:38:13] <boro> maybe
[17:38:26] <trx> and as i know a little about Xorg from my linux work i should be able to work it out
[17:38:33] <boro> Xorg -configure
[17:38:39] <trx> yup :)
[17:38:53] <trx> i was just thrown off the scent as in solaris everything is in different places etc
[17:38:54] <boro> watch out where new file is placed and try to copy it to /etc/X11
[17:38:58] <boro> under name xorg.conf
[17:39:24] <trx> will do... i think it mentioned something like that in kdmconfig
[17:39:35] <boro> yeah
[17:39:53] <boro> it was probably dtlogin trying to connect to unstarted Xorg
[17:40:01] <boro> that logged those messages
[17:40:18] <trx> cool :)
[17:40:51] <vmlemon> Is it possible to mount a USB Mass Storage device whilst in Single User Mode?
[17:41:06] <coffman> tecNikal: maybe usb legacy, maybe if all your usb ports are active
[17:41:44] <vmlemon> I can't write to my system partition either, so it presents a slight problem
[17:41:53] <vmlemon> *system or user partitions
[17:41:55] <boro> vmlemon: i thing it is possible, just try format -e to find out, if the disk was found and is visible
[17:42:11] <boro> thing->think
[17:42:15] <vmlemon> It doesn't appear in the dmesg, for some reason
[17:42:26] <vmlemon> Unless that's normal
[17:42:56] <tecNikal> coffman: the usb legacy was disable now i have enable
[17:43:05] <tecNikal> do you think that can be the problem ? coffman
[17:43:30] <tecNikal> coffman: what does usb legacy means by the way ?
[17:43:32] <coffman> tecNikal: leave it on disable
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[17:43:45] <tecNikal> oO
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[17:43:51] <tecNikal> ok what does that means actually ?
[17:44:08] <coffman> tecNikal: its only about keyboards in bios etc, if you atach a usb keyboard
[17:44:15] <twincest> how do i list usb devices connected?  (e.g. type, vendor/model etc)
[17:44:18] <tecNikal> ok
[17:44:42] <tecNikal> ya how do i list usb devices and how they are abriviated in solaris 10 ?
[17:44:59] * iron_angel kicks Xsun.
[17:45:18] <iron_angel> Why in the known universe can this friggin' Expert3D not emit a 1600x1200 signal that my LCD likes?
[17:45:45] <coffman> tecNikal: put the output of "scanpci -vv" and "dmesg" in a pastebin and post it here
[17:46:02] <boro>  twincest: prtconf -vv
[17:46:20] <twincest> hm.  i was hoping for something more terse than prtconf :)
[17:46:27] <tecNikal> coffman: the system is still not up i have put it on failsafe and now it is trying to make the boot_archive
[17:46:40] <coffman> ugh
[17:46:41] <boro> twincest: i wold like something like lsusb too ;)
[17:46:53] <trx> boro : Xorg -configure 'Missing output drivers. Configuration failed
[17:46:54] <coffman> tecNikal: come back if you have it running :P
[17:47:07] <trx> which is strange... as its worked before then just sudenly stopped a few days ago
[17:47:15] <tecNikal> coffman: it will for sure i did it before but this is not the way to make the thing rite ?
[17:47:27] <trx> im gonna try Xsun.. see if theres any luck, as i just need to get into it asap
[17:47:33] <tecNikal> is there any place i can find drivers ? for usb and wireless ?
[17:47:38] <tecNikal> for solaris 10 ?
[17:47:45] <tecNikal> AZTECH
[17:48:31] <iron_angel> Hmm... Google for it, but I'd be surprised if you do find anything.
[17:48:53] <boro> trx: ok , ant, btw, try to run pkgchk to check, if any files are missing
[17:49:01] <coffman> tecNikal: for masstorage and such you dont need any drivers.
[17:49:27] <tecNikal> for wireless ?
[17:49:33] <coffman> tecNikal: for the wlan usb im not sure, vendor doesnt help, find out wich chipset they use on the device
[17:50:07] <Pietro_S> tecNikal: for wireless you can use ndiswrapper, which allow you to use windows wifi driver, but latestest version works only in sxce
[17:50:14] <tecNikal> so there are two problem first make the usb work and then look for the wireless or all problem solve by checking the chipset coffman
[17:50:15] <coffman> tecNikal: basicly, if it does not work with the integrated drivers, you might can get it to work, but it will suck
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[17:50:54] <tecNikal> coffman: suck in what sense ? speed ?
[17:51:15] <tecNikal> Pietro_S: sxce is different from solaris 10 11/06 i really dont know about it
[17:51:52] <coffman> tecNikal: no wpa, unstable - such things
[17:52:17] <tecNikal> ok
[17:52:22] <coffman> tecNikal: wich solaris version you install?
[17:52:33] <Pietro_S> sxce is latest opensolaris, see topic for more info ...
[17:52:34] <tecNikal> solaris 10 11/06
[17:52:45] <vmlemon> format -e detects it, but it seems as if there's nowhere satisfactory to mount it
[17:52:50] <tecNikal> what is the difference from the sun solaris ?
[17:52:58] <trx> boro : will do, thanks
[17:53:10] <coffman> tecNikal: hmpf, thats not the best for wifi support
[17:53:14] <iron_angel> tecNikal: Tech support, and newer features. SXCE calls itself Solaris 11 internally.
[17:53:44] <tecNikal> wow but it is not from SUN it is from the community rite ?
[17:53:53] <boro> vmlemon: try to mount it mount -F pcfs /dev/dsk/cxtydzp0:c /mnt/somewhere
[17:53:54] <coffman> tecNikal: also this the opensolaris channel, i would advice you to install latest sxce
[17:54:08] <tecNikal> ok
[17:54:28] <boro> vmlemon: sorry, use /dev/rdsk for p0
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[17:54:49] <Pietro_S> me too, (right now I'm sitting at sxce 65b notebook- with wifi working ;-)
[17:54:55] <coffman> tecNikal: the new wifi stack is in sxce since b63 or so, we are now at 67, so its pretty new
[17:54:57] <iron_angel> tecNikal: it's from Sun based on code released to, and contributed by, the community.
[17:55:05] <boro> vmlemon: ups, /dev/dsk
[17:55:10] <trx> Shit!
[17:55:11] <iron_angel> Though I'll admit I've never tried SXCE on x86, just SPARC.
[17:55:41] <iron_angel> I'm debating goting through the pain of getting b67 and updating my systems.
[17:55:43] <trx> boro : most of the files on my system have a file size and checksum that is apparently 'unexpected' by pkgchk
[17:55:47] <trx> is that normal?
[17:55:53] <trx> am running nv_62
[17:56:09] <coffman> iron_angel: had that fun last evening :P
[17:56:56] <iron_angel> coffman: it's the download times, and the fact that one image invariably misdownloads!
[17:57:23] <iron_angel> Of course, I could probably just get the DVD, NFS it out from my U60 or U80, and install there...
[17:57:34] <iron_angel> Only the U2 lacks a DVD drive, and it's not running SXCE yet.
[17:57:49] <iron_angel> (because b60 acted really odd on it, but that may have been a fluke).
[17:58:26] <tecNikal> Pietro_S: where i can download and get further info about it
[17:58:34] <tecNikal> opensolaris shows many options
[17:58:46] <tecNikal> i am really blur about it
[17:59:30] <tecNikal> are you talking about nevada ?
[17:59:30] <boro> trx: strange
[17:59:46] <trx> yeah...
[17:59:56] <trx> i think im gonna export my ZFS tree
[18:00:03] <vmlemon> I finally managed to get as far as "NOTICE: mount: not a UFS magic number (0x0) mount /dev/c2t0d0p0 is not this fstype"
[18:00:04] <trx> and install the latest beta
[18:00:19] <vmlemon> I take it that it needs -F pcfs
[18:01:17] <boro> mount -F pcfs
[18:01:22] <tecNikal> thanks coffman and Pietro_S i will try to download and make it work so there is no way a normal solaris will work over my amd xp machine :s
[18:01:46] <boro> vmlemon: unless you previsiously formatted it with ufs
[18:02:07] <vmlemon> mount: I/O error
[18:02:18] <vmlemon> Very descriptive message, not
[18:02:23] <boro> try fdisk /dev/rdsk/cx...p0
[18:03:29] <vmlemon> Shows one Active Win95 FAT32 partition
[18:03:34] <vmlemon> Which looks good
[18:04:25] <boro> ok
[18:04:31] <boro> now but try it like this ;)
[18:04:51] <boro> mount -F pcfs /dev/rdsk/cxtydzp0:c /mnt/somewhere
[18:05:01] <boro> with the collon and c(C)
[18:05:02] <vmlemon> It's going to be used to move some files to my Linux box, but should I reformat it in UFS?
[18:05:14] <vmlemon> Or should I keep it FAT32 for now?
[18:05:22] <boro> vmlemon, no, linux has bad support for ufs
[18:05:25] <vmlemon> OK
[18:05:57] <iron_angel> Anyone know if there's a way to convince an Expert3D to generate semi-arbitrary display modes?
[18:06:02] <Pietro_S> tecNikal: see topic or opensolaris.org/sxce_dvd
[18:06:16] <iron_angel> My LCD doesn't care for any of its listed 1600x1200 modes, but the panel does support it.
[18:06:28] <iron_angel> I suppose I could switch to the Creator3D, but that's a lot slower.
[18:06:38] <vmlemon> Woot! I finally got it mounted, after all the stress and hassle
[18:07:17] <vmlemon> Seems really unintuitive, from the view of a Linux user
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[18:08:09] <boro> vmlemon: maybe, but i wrote the ":c" immediately in the beginning ;) probably you've overlooked it
[18:08:51] <vmlemon> It's took me almost a whole hour, just to get the damn thing mounted :(
[18:09:12] <boro> don't worry, to me it took even more
[18:09:25] <vmlemon> Not being able to write to the FS only hinders things, as does the really nasty deletion and arrow key handling
[18:09:26] <boro> i considered myself really stupid because of this
[18:09:46] <boro> mounting of usb mass storages
[18:10:00] <boro> there would be another way
[18:10:37] <vmlemon> I managed to wreck my system subpartition by resizing it, without accounting for my /export/home, and now I need to salvage my stuff in ~, before reinstalling
[18:10:38] <boro> use whole disk for fat32 without the partition
[18:11:01] <boro> vmlemon: crossing fingers with this
[18:11:12] <boro> now running to the gym, so bye
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[18:11:24] <sickness> :(
[18:13:33] <Pietro_S> iron_angel: try a bit lower Hz than in list ... 59Hz - refresh rate should works and your eyes won't catch difference (on LCD) ;-)
[18:14:26] <iron_angel> Ah, I can do that? Cool.
[18:15:42] <iron_angel> bah, didn't work.
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[18:16:13] <iron_angel> seems to only want to let me use 1600x1200x60 and 1600x1200x75, neither of which work.
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[18:16:26] <iron_angel> Of course, I'm using a 13W3 -> VGA adapter, which probably doesn't help.
[18:20:08] <Pietro_S> try 50 Hz
[18:20:49] <Pietro_S> yep, adapter or cable can be problematic ...
[18:21:33] <iron_angel> ouch, nope, it tells me I'm using a mode that the *card* can't support when doing that.
[18:22:15] <iron_angel> Rats. Maybe I'll move the 1600x1200 panel over to the U60, or move its XVR-500 into the U80.
[18:22:46] <Pietro_S> did you try to hardcode it in X config?
[18:25:46] <iron_angel> Hmm... Lemme see about that... Where's that kept, BTW?
[18:27:29] <iron_angel> hmm, actually, after comparing benchmarks, perhaps I ought to move the XVR-500...
[18:28:29] <Pietro_S> I don't know from head where it is in sunX but /etc/X(something) should be guess ...
[18:28:59] <coffman> iron_angel: on a digital display you would want a dvi connection
[18:29:19] <iron_angel> coffman: well, *yes*. But the only card I have with DVI is a broken XVR-100.
[18:29:22] <iron_angel> XVR-1000 rather
[18:29:42] <coffman> sucks
[18:30:02] <iron_angel> indeed.
[18:30:16] <coffman> iron_angel: instead you could get a sunray with dvi :P
[18:30:24] <iron_angel> Well, I suppose I could :)
[18:31:17] <iron_angel> I think I'll cut both of these boxen back to dual-head, and KVM them. Too bad my Sun KVM seems fracked.
[18:32:04] <iron_angel> so I'll have to have keyboards squidded all over :/
[18:32:17] <coffman> i really need to wonder how that stupid isps only use the dial in as verify for the acount settings#
[18:32:26] <coffman> gar such things piss me of
[18:34:13] <trx> ARGHH!!!
[18:34:16] <coffman> hmm, do my neighbours like faster dsl? or some playboy.de fun? i tink yes
[18:34:27] <trx> my 20 meg BBAND should have been activated 2 days ago! :(
[18:34:31] <trx> still on 1 :(
[18:35:53] <coffman> trx: feel with you, had orderd 6mbit instead of 2mbit, 3 days ago it should have been there, now the online panel says on the 4.
[18:35:57] <coffman> sux
[18:38:12] <trx> i have been told mine has been upgraded three times, by three different people, working for the same company
[18:38:15] <trx> and still no fecking change
[18:38:34] <trx> no wonder people illegally unlimit their cable modems...
[18:38:52] <trx> they are probably paying customers of a faster service who just got fed up of waiting for it ;P
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[18:39:23] <coffman> oO
[18:39:32] <coffman> trx: you can unlimit them?
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[18:40:00] <coffman> cable modems always seem strange to me...
[18:40:14] <trx> yeah, cable is basically a big LAN
[18:40:41] <trx> you can sniff a MAC address of another customer who has a faster service, and hack your cable modem to use that mac
[18:41:19] <trx> as long as you use a mac address of someone who is served by a different gateway of the cable network (otherwise the two would conflict if the original customer came online) you can get their service speeds
[18:41:28] <trx> v illegal tho, dont do it... bad, disclaimer, etc :P
[18:41:52] <coffman> always thought cable uses some quite secure protocol
[18:41:56] <vmlemon> DOCSIS?
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[18:42:27] <coffman> duno, i read some stuff time ago.
[18:42:36] <vmlemon> I know that there was a case of people using IPX and AppleTalk having their printers printed to, by another customer
[18:43:18] <coffman> in germany most people got dsl via there telefon lines anyways
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[18:43:42] <coffman> and we got flat rates :P
[18:43:50] <vmlemon> Only a handful of towns and cities can get cable here, now, although it was possible to get it everywhere, a few years ago
[18:44:08] <vmlemon> They ripped out all the infrastructure, as far as I know
[18:44:13] <trx> you in the UK?
[18:44:16] <vmlemon> yes
[18:44:18] <trx> same
[18:44:37] <coffman> ic
[18:44:44] <trx> was in manchester, just moved upto camberley this week
[18:45:13] <vmlemon> I hear that the sole cable company really sucks, now
[18:45:16] <trx> been on hold to virgin media for aaaages now
[18:45:38] <trx> the reports on the web say that once you get the correct service the speed is amazing
[18:45:50] <vmlemon> Isn't it heavilly throttled and capped?
[18:45:50] <trx> its just the customer service / getting it in the first place :P
[18:46:44] <vmlemon> I've found BT to be good for ADSL, although I can't get the full "up-to-8Mbps" speed, since I don't live close enough to the exchange
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[18:47:31] <trx> yeah i was on BT back home
[18:47:38] <trx> but only got 1Meg due to line noise
[18:47:48] <vmlemon> After a few hours of struggling, I'm finally gzip+tarring my ~
[18:48:13] <coffman> in germany they replacing the old connection points and bring them closer to the homes
[18:48:34] <coffman> i hope i can get some vdsl with 30mbit soon :P
[18:48:46] <vmlemon> I just hope I have enough space on my USB drive, although /export/home was just under 400MB, last time I checked
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[18:49:54] <vmlemon> Yay, it's finally done, although some files couldn't be added, since they were unreadable
[18:50:15] <Zephiris> *fef* Does anyone around know how to do port event API thing yet? ^^;
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[19:09:14] <movement> Zephiris: you mean event ports?
[19:09:40] <m0le> Hey everyone, I hate to bother you all but a quick question if someone has the link on adding the ports system to open solaris? I lost my link =(
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[19:11:19] <Zephiris> movement: Er, sure. o-o The Apache stuff said port events, anyway.
[19:12:16] <vmlemon> Wasn't there talk of open sourcing (parts of) CDE at one point?
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[19:12:45] <iron_angel> Hmm...
[19:13:00] <iron_angel> Well, Motif is open-sourced already. I wonder who else has a stake in the matter?
[19:13:14] <iron_angel> I can't quite imagine SGI caring much, but what of HP and IBM?
[19:13:15] <vmlemon> Didn't HP work on part of it?
[19:13:24] <iron_angel> CDE was descended from their VUE, so yeah.
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[19:21:10] <iron_angel> Oh, I had forgotten I can set resolution from within OBP... Must tru that.
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[19:26:34] <edwardocallaghan> Hi
[19:27:13] <edwardocallaghan> Whos around?
[19:28:16] <quasi> not me
[19:28:41] <edwardocallaghan> Hi
[19:28:56] <edwardocallaghan> ?HAve not seen you around for ages
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[19:29:09] <edwardocallaghan> then again I have not beem around
[19:29:46] <edwardocallaghan> Lissen I got a bit of a prob with SXDE on a mates computer
[19:29:57] <edwardocallaghan> with regards to the res of the screen
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[19:30:46] <edwardocallaghan> the box has a nvidia FX5700 card and the res was fine in the install but the desktop is at 640x480
[19:31:36] <edwardocallaghan> been trying to play with /etc/X11/xorg.conf with no luke, could anyone give me a hand please ?
[19:31:59] <edwardocallaghan> How do I enable DCC ?
[19:35:03] * iron_angel tries to figure out X-y stuff now, too... In particular how the SMF-based X config works and how to do Xinerama on SPARC.
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[19:37:31] <edwardocallaghan> Is this IRC dead at the moment ? { ping } ?
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[19:38:47] <iron_angel> it's alive, mostly...
[19:38:58] <iron_angel> You want DDC, right? Hmm... I can't recall.
[19:39:11] <iron_angel> Don't have and SXCE x86 machine here anywhere :/
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[19:46:53] <edwardocallaghan> Hi
[19:47:36] <edwardocallaghan> Well the installer detected the X settings fine but on reboot i have a desktop with 640x480
[19:47:50] <edwardocallaghan> and nothing fits on the screen..
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[19:48:03] <edwardocallaghan> so i can't see some parts of things
[19:48:58] <iron_angel> Hmm... Well, /var/log/Xorg.0.log should give you some clue as to why.
[19:50:42] <edwardocallaghan> I was looking, not that I can see
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[19:51:06] <edwardocallaghan> my clue is its trying to use a high refresh and so the res is low ?
[19:51:22] <edwardocallaghan> the vnidia driver is being used..
[19:51:36] <edwardocallaghan> vidia
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[19:56:07] <edwardocallaghan> ok I should goto bed now
[19:56:25] <edwardocallaghan> i'll pop around when you lads wake up
[19:56:32] <edwardocallaghan> good night..
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[20:07:01] <iron_angel> Ok, screw this. I'll wait for the Blade2k to arrive, redistribute cards, get SXCE b67, then reinstall across the board :P
[20:07:16] <iron_angel> adding in the blastwave stuff will take no time flat thanks to Squid :P
[20:07:33] <iron_angel> BTW, does anyone here run SXCE on an Ultra 2?
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[20:16:24] <vmlemon> Is it generally a bad idea to use ZFS for the system partition?
[20:16:33] <vmlemon> Despite the current lack of boot support
[20:17:00] <oninoshiko> i dont think so
[20:18:40] <tecNikal> sxce 67 does it support usb and wireless ?
[20:18:55] <iron_angel> USB yes, Wireless yes to a point.
[20:19:06] <iron_angel> USB has been supported since Solaris 8.
[20:19:15] <tecNikal> it is a wireless usb
[20:19:18] <tecNikal> Aztech
[20:19:35] <tecNikal> but it doesnot even recognize in my desktop usb 1.0
[20:19:36] <tecNikal> :s
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[20:29:40] <iron_angel> hmm, actually that reminds me, if I slap a USB card that works into an Ultra, I bet I can use a USB keyboard.
[20:29:51] <iron_angel> And if I can, that makes the KVM issue a *lot* easier.
[20:32:26] <oninoshiko> KVMs are for wussies... use serial
[20:33:11] <iron_angel> heh.
[20:33:21] <iron_angel> Well, not so good when I want X :P
[20:33:59] <oninoshiko> well... X11 *IS* a networking protocol...
[20:34:08] <oninoshiko> : is being evil
[20:34:20] <iron_angel> <grin>
[20:34:26] <e^ipi> i've a couple machines without framebuffers
[20:34:39] <e^ipi> ethernet + serial is all you really need
[20:34:53] <iron_angel> I'll probably end up using the SS10 over serial, and maybe the U10 too.
[20:34:54] <e^ipi> well, and electricity
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[20:35:20] <iron_angel> The U10 is gimp, so I probably won't use it for workstationy things. The U60, 80 and B2k, OTOH...
[20:35:22] <oninoshiko> maybe A/C depending on your climate
[20:35:26] <vmlemon> What about SSH?
[20:35:41] <e^ipi> i live in northern canada...
[20:35:44] <iron_angel> That too, true.
[20:35:45] <e^ipi> cooling.... is not a problem
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[20:36:08] <oninoshiko> then there you go... you guys build a boat outta ice in WWII
[20:36:22] <e^ipi> wouldn't surprise me
[20:36:23] <iron_angel> running headless seems like a waste of a perfectly good XVR-500, though.
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[20:37:11] * oninoshiko frowns
[20:38:01] <oninoshiko> lets try that again
[20:44:02] <coffman> iron_angel: you can, did this, any ohci conform card should do - i had one with a nec chipset
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[20:44:40] <iron_angel> coffman: coolness. I have quite a few NEC-chipset cards.
[20:44:51] <iron_angel> If they're actually EHCI cards, is that supported?
[20:45:12] <coffman> ehci is usb 2.0?
[20:45:19] <iron_angel> yep.
[20:45:23] <coffman> should do
[20:45:27] <coffman> so was mine
[20:45:30] * iron_angel nodnods.
[20:45:31] <iron_angel> cool.
[20:45:34] <oninoshiko> should be... the USB wasnt what gave me fits on my laptop
[20:46:30] <coffman> iron_angel: i would get ride of the u10
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[20:46:56] <iron_angel> Well, other than the fact that the IDE is obviously pants...
[20:47:09] <iron_angel> I'll probably sell it. Or trade for a working U60 motherboard.
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[20:47:16] <coffman> iron_angel: when is remember right i had isuess under xsun... but you might want to try it anyways
[20:47:41] <iron_angel> Well, mine's a Creator3D model, and I have an Elite3D I could toss into it too.
[20:47:47] <iron_angel> But it's running Linux for now.
[20:48:00] <iron_angel> The 2, 60 and 80 are the ones I consider more useful.
[20:48:36] <coffman> the u10 is running linux?
[20:49:00] <iron_angel> yep.
[20:49:30] <coffman> good, if it would be a u2,u60 or u80 it would be a crime
[20:49:39] <iron_angel> heh :)
[20:50:21] <iron_angel> I considered making the U2 into a Linux/SPARC dev box, just because it has 2 CPUs, and I still might if I can revive the second U60, but not for now.
[20:50:31] <iron_angel> Although, BrandZ would make that irrelevant :P
[20:50:46] <coffman> there is not brandz for sparc
[20:51:40] <iron_angel> Aw, rats.
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[20:51:47] <iron_angel> Well, there is Qemu :P
[20:52:12] <iron_angel> but if I'm going *that* route, I'll run the emu session on the B2k, if it ever gets here.
[20:53:33] <coffman> iron_angel: i would consider getting an x64 machine :P
[20:53:47] <iron_angel> heh.
[20:53:58] <iron_angel> I've got one actually, but it's running Gentoo.
[20:54:17] <iron_angel> I might try it on my laptop, though, that's x64 technically.
[20:54:25] <iron_angel> Or maybe I'll pick up an Ultra 20.
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[21:09:15] <Pietro_S> hmm, how do you browse samba shared dirs? (I know that nautilus has support for it, but I'm in xfce so I would like another way)
[21:10:11] <iron_angel> well, there used to be xfsamba in XFCE3... lemme see...
[21:11:13] <iron_angel> foo, seems thunar doesn't do that...
[21:11:22] <iron_angel> I use XFCE, but not much smb stuff.
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[21:12:50] <Pietro_S> yep thunar doesn't do that stuff and mounting samba filesystem is not aviable yet :-(
[21:13:13] <iron_angel> hmm.
[21:13:14] <coffman> Pietro_S: did you build xfce by urself? or did you use the binaries? wich version of solaris you run?
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[21:15:09] <Pietro_S> coffman: I used spec files, 65b(still)
[21:15:22] <Pietro_S> and vermilion 67 I guess ...
[21:15:39] <coffman> Pietro_S: ic, thunar works? the background also?
[21:16:51] <Pietro_S> everything works, but right now I need to copy something from samba server ... and sharing same directory with samba and nfs is *not* safe
[21:17:09] <e^ipi> so turn off samba
[21:17:12] <e^ipi> it's crap
[21:17:27] <e^ipi> NFS is far superior in every way
[21:18:08] <coffman> Pietro_S: there is http://www.obdev.at/products/sharity/index.html
[21:18:16] <Pietro_S> not in 1 important way - it's not as friendly for windows users (and I need it for bro and father )
[21:19:39] <Pietro_S> coffman: thanks, downloading
[21:20:18] <coffman> Pietro_S: its not os, but the freeware is oki, you can also get a free version if you are a student or such
[21:20:20] <iron_angel> Also, there is MS services for Unix, which might help with letting the Windows boxen speak NFS
[21:20:45] <coffman> iron_angel: sfu's nfs is crap
[21:21:10] <coffman> and smb/cifs is not that bad
[21:21:39] <iron_angel> this is true, mostly.
[21:21:49] <oninoshiko> well it *IS* better then a poke in the eye with a sharp stick (bearly)
[21:22:00] <iron_angel> As an NFS server it's worthless, but as a client it seems OK for V2/V3.
[21:22:03] <iron_angel> Not V4 of course.
[21:22:12] <iron_angel> Only good V4 clients are Linux and Solaris AFAIK.
[21:23:01] <coffman> linux a good nfs client? uhm uhm
[21:25:05] <e^ipi> iron_angel: solaris and AIX are the only decent v4 clients
[21:25:18] <iron_angel> Hmm.
[21:25:20] <e^ipi> OSX is a decent v3 client
[21:25:27] <iron_angel> Haven't tried AIX's v4 client.
[21:25:45] <iron_angel> I do have a fair few boxen at work running Linux that use it just fine, though, even with krb5.
[21:28:52] <vmlemon> I've just hit a major problem whilst reinstalling Solaris, in that it cannot install the boot blocks
[21:29:09] <vmlemon> Now that the installation is finished, is there a way to install them?
[21:30:10] <oninoshiko> coffman : what is wrong with the linux NFS client?
[21:32:17] <estibi> oninoshiko: try to unmount unavailable NFS mount point
[21:32:26] <coffman> oninoshiko: im not willing to speak about :P
[21:32:54] <iron_angel> estibi: ack, I'll admit that's a rather significant, well... it's not a bug, because it's that way on purpose... Misfeature.
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[21:34:43] <estibi> AFAIR the best way is to reboot linux machine ...
[21:35:52] <e^ipi> iron_angel: umount -f /*SHOULD*/ work
[21:35:59] <e^ipi> it doesn't, of course, but it should
[21:36:08] <estibi> :)
[21:37:26] <estibi> and NIS+ and NFSv4 in linux is crap
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[21:40:50] <tomww> vmlemon: which HW, sparc/x86 ?
[21:41:10] <vmlemon> x86
[21:41:23] <vmlemon> I've found something on the OpenSolaris forums, though
[21:42:06] <vmlemon> Looks like I'll have to reinstall it, again
[21:42:15] <tomww> you should have a look at grub installing its Masterbootrecord, and the stage1/stage2 files
[21:43:02] <vmlemon>  /dev/dsk/c0d0s2 was mentioned, although I only had one big partition
[21:43:25] * oninoshiko gets annoied at the FS used for DVDs
[21:43:30] <vmlemon> UDF?
[21:43:42] <oninoshiko> yes
[21:44:12] <tomww> s2 sould start at the same cylinder inside the solaris-fdisk-partition as slice s0 does, so s0 and s2 are both usable for the grub install
[21:44:49] <vmlemon> From what I gather, you're supposed to have the slice 2/overlap slice
[21:44:58] <vmlemon> Even if you create a larger slice
[21:45:19] <oninoshiko> if i want to write an 8G file to the thing it shoul let me (DL-DVD_
[21:45:24] <vmlemon> At least according to what I'm reading at the moment
[21:45:37] <tomww> slice s2 normally stgarts a cylinder 0 and ends at the last cylinder of the solaris-fdisk-partition
[21:46:16] <vmlemon> I'm puzzled now, so slice 2 is supposed to be some odd capsule over the other slices?
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[21:46:21] <oninoshiko> but NOOOO insted i had to split the file, now anytime i want access to it, i have to cat it back together
[21:46:22] <dmesg> hi dudes
[21:46:46] <dmesg> what do i need to build a opensolaris web mail server?
[21:47:07] <dmesg> postfix cyrus squirrelmail?
[21:47:23] <oninoshiko> dmesg installations media and an internet connection?
[21:47:28] <tomww> vmlemon: yes. think of it if you "dd" the whole disk to another, you would use s2 for that. normally noone uses this to put a filesystem on it, because it would overwrite other slices data
[21:48:00] <dmesg> oninoshiko so is the same as any other nix?
[21:48:26] <vmlemon> I normally use the autopartition option, although it's useless as it creates too small a root slice
[21:48:34] <oninoshiko> squirrelmail is not on the installation media, and i think sendmail is the default MTA
[21:48:48] <dmesg> ahh :S
[21:48:57] <iron_angel> You could indeed use sendmail instead of postfix if you wanted to, though.
[21:49:28] <oninoshiko> or you install postfix, or even qmail if it makes you happy
[21:49:46] <vmlemon> So, at the partitioner, I keep the "overlap" slice, and build around it?
[21:50:14] <dmesg> ok
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[21:51:03] <tomww> vmlemon: if you boot from DVD, select the shell instad of installation, you could try grub-install with some parameters
[21:51:57] <tomww> vmlemon: yes, s2 normally is left at the default. if not, you have to look for another slice starting at cylinder zero to have the grub-files installed by hand
[21:51:58] <vmlemon> I'm just at the partitioning tool now, and I feel as if I've already wasted enough time on the last semi-installation
[21:52:08] <oninoshiko> dmesg : lemme see if i can find you packaged bins...
[21:52:31] <vmlemon> So, both slices 0 and 2 are 76324?
[21:52:41] <vmlemon> Or do I need to adjust for anything?
[21:52:57] <dmesg> oninoshiko ok
[21:53:34] <tomww> vmlemon: you have no swap slice?
[21:53:42] <vmlemon> No
[21:53:46] <vmlemon> Just root
[21:53:55] <vmlemon> and that pesky overlap slice
[21:54:06] <tomww> hmmm. the only chance to get a swap is on antoher disk...
[21:54:28] <Auralis> overlap represents the entire disk, it is not a real slice
[21:54:29] <vmlemon> I didn't select swap last time, when I autopartitioned, that said
[21:54:44] <vmlemon> As far as I know, it just used a swap file on /
[21:54:52] <tomww> I would do this:
[21:55:05] <tomww> S0 for "/" size 15GB
[21:55:13] <tomww> S1 for swao size 1GB
[21:55:21] <tomww> S2 at the default, whole disk
[21:55:40] <tomww> optional: S3 for "/altroot" size 15GB
[21:55:54] <tomww> S6 for "/space" the rest of the disk
[21:56:23] <tomww> after install, you would re-use /space for a zfs pool and create extra filesystems to be mounted where you need them.
[21:56:28] <vmlemon> I managed to burn through the 5GB root with utility packages last time, even after resizing it twice
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[21:56:58] <tomww> the optional S3 would be a alternate boot-envorinment, so you can do liveupgrade with a copy from S0 to S3, upgrade into S3 and reboot into S3
[21:57:03] <vmlemon> I'm trying to get a comfortable configuration, so I don't end up completely tanking the OS, after installing packages
[21:58:03] <tomww> your "/" including /var /opt ... might be okay with 10-15GB size  (usually filled with 6-8 GBs system/apps)
[21:58:04] <oninoshiko> dmesg : http://blastwave.org/packages.php/postfix
[21:58:07] <vmlemon> Of course, there's /export/home, which I'd rather store on root
[21:59:15] <tomww> vmlemon: export/home - you should remove this and store all you personal files into the zfs pool (create as many separate filesystems as you need, and mount them all over the directory-tree as needed)
[21:59:40] <oninoshiko> dmesg : http://blastwave.org/packages.php/cyrus_imapd
[21:59:41] <vmlemon> I suppose I could give root about 30GB, and then use the rest of the disk for ZFS
[22:00:12] <vmlemon> I do have a shockingly high "burn rate" though, package wise
[22:01:14] <dmesg> oninoshiko let me take a look thanks :D
[22:02:19] <vmlemon> So, / is 30 GB, and I've got the overlap in slice 2
[22:02:30] <oninoshiko> those two should be what you need... as far as squirralmails goes, just get it from squirrelmail.org... its just a couple of php scripts anway
[22:03:24] <tomww> vmlemon: what kind of upgrades do you plan for this install? should this install life long or do you plan to reinstall it frequently?
[22:04:11] <vmlemon> I'm trying Solaris for 5 months, and I want to actually enjoy the experience, as opposed to being annoyed by constant breakage and crashes induced by lack of space
[22:04:42] <dmesg> oninoshiko yeah i think with that is ok :) thanks a lot :)
[22:04:55] <vmlemon> I've already reinstalled it about 4 times, so far
[22:05:16] <oninoshiko> np
[22:05:21] <oninoshiko> i live to server
[22:05:24] <oninoshiko> err serve
[22:06:05] <vmlemon> How would I account for ZFS in the partitioning tool?
[22:06:13] <vmlemon> Just create a new partition?
[22:06:33] <iron_angel> yeah, then use zpool to add it.
[22:07:11] <vmlemon> Still have to give it a mount point?
[22:07:42] <e^ipi> no, zfs takes care of that
[22:07:45] <vmlemon> OK
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[22:07:48] <tomww> vmlemon: I use two root-environments, each 11GB in size, filled with 7GB, for the last 2 years. all my data an doptional software goes into ZFS.
[22:07:49] <e^ipi> unless you set mountpoint=legacy
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[22:10:26] <dmesg> oninoshiko: :)
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[22:12:27] <vmlemon> So, before I commit, I have S0 - / (30725), S1 for ZFS (45575), and finally S2 - overlap (76325)
[22:12:43] <vmlemon> I think that'll work
[22:13:24] <bqscott> sounds reasonable to me
[22:16:05] <bqscott> does anyone have experience doing a PXE install of Solaris from a non-Solaris TFTP/NFS server?
[22:16:58] <bqscott> since I can't run the Solaris_10/Tools/setup_install_server script, I hacked together my own PXE install environment
[22:17:29] <bqscott> but pxegrub is giving me a "Error 13: Invalid or unsupported executable format" when I try to boot the kernel
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[22:37:09] <rawn027> Tempt: hey
[22:37:22] <rawn027> how is everyone doing
[22:37:42] <rawn027> im trying to get my mouse working on Solaris 10
[22:37:46] <rawn027> version 11/06
[22:37:51] <rawn027> on x86 arch
[22:38:00] <ShadowHntr> it is a generic mouse
[22:38:01] <ShadowHntr> usb
[22:38:02] <ShadowHntr> ps/2
[22:38:20] <rawn027> its actually a USB mouse but its wireless (i dont think that matters) it worked in opensolaris
[22:38:33] <ShadowHntr> just make sure it's synced up with the receiver
[22:38:46] <rawn027> yeah the mouse part is fine
[22:38:50] <ShadowHntr> perhaps if you had a PS/2 adapter for it and tried it there
[22:38:59] <rawn027> works like a champ when plugged into my laptop
[22:39:37] <rawn027> is there any other mouse input other than /dev/mouse
[22:39:41] <GeneralDelta> Hello all!  I'm trying to setup Qemu on Solaris Express b67 per the instructions on: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/qemu/host/BuildingQEMU/
[22:39:42] <GeneralDelta> When I enter the " ./configure --prefix=/tmp/qemu --target-list=i386-softmmu " in the terminal I get the error: ERROR: "gcc" either does not exist or does not work
[22:39:42] <GeneralDelta> gcc was installed with the system in: /usr/sfw/bin, however if you issue gcc as a command you get: gcc: command not found
[22:39:42] <GeneralDelta> I can enter " cd /usr/sfw/bin " and then " ./gcc -v " and I get:
[22:39:43] <GeneralDelta> Reading specs from /usr/sfw/lib/gcc/i386-pc-solaris2.11/3.4.3/specs
[22:39:44] <GeneralDelta> Configured with: /builds2/sfwnv-gate/usr/src/cmd/gcc/gcc-3.4.3/configure --prefix=/usr/sfw --with-as=/usr/sfw/bin/gas --with-gnu-as --with-ld=/usr/ccs/bin/ld --without-gnu-ld --enable-languages=c,c++,f77,objc --enable-shared
[22:39:48] <GeneralDelta> Thread model: posix
[22:39:50] <GeneralDelta> gcc version 3.4.3 (csl-sol210-3_4-20050802)
[22:39:52] <GeneralDelta> So I su-ed into root and entered " ln -s ./gcc /usr/bin/gcc "
[22:39:53] <GeneralDelta> At this point gcc does not respond as a command.  So I changed directory to /usr/bin/ and I entered " ./gcc -v " and I got: ./gcc: Number of symbolic links encountered during path name traversal exceeds MAXSYMLINKS
[22:39:56] <GeneralDelta> Any help getting GCC to work correctly would be well appreciated.
[22:41:14] <GeneralDelta> :-) took me a moment to get all that typed! ;-)
[22:41:27] <fedorared> Sounds like /usr/sfw/bin is not on your PATH.
[22:41:34] <GeneralDelta> yeah
[22:41:57] <pfn> that wasn't obvious?
[22:42:00] <Pietro_S> GeneralDelta: gcc depends on other tool in /usr/sfw/bin
[22:42:02] <GeneralDelta> I tried " echo $path " and I didn't get any thing other than  a blank lind return
[22:42:13] <fedorared> $PATH
[22:42:16] <pfn> GeneralDelta, you're a complete newb, right?  :)
[22:42:20] <Pietro_S> for example ld, gar and so on ...
[22:42:30] <rawn027> pfn: rofl
[22:42:36] <pfn> I'm amazed you managed to figure out gcc was in /usr/sfw/bin
[22:43:07] <pfn> GeneralDelta, PATH=/usr/sfw/bin:$PATH ./configure ...
[22:43:30] <rawn027> GeneralDelta: you could put that into your .bash_profile if you are using bash
[22:43:34] <rawn027> so it is always set
[22:44:20] <GeneralDelta> that's a cool idea rawn
[22:44:47] <pfn> ok... so, how do I specify the root device when booting up the kernel?  is it set in boot_archive?
[22:45:32] <GeneralDelta> I have a questions though, if usr/sfw/bin is my working directory shouldn't it recognize gcc as a command without having to type ./gcc?
[22:45:40] <rawn027> GeneralDelta: do you use bash?
[22:45:45] <rawn027> all shells have a similar file
[22:45:51] <GeneralDelta> yes, I use bash
[22:46:04] <rawn027> back to my issue: does anyone have any idea about my mouse or should i just switch back to opensolaris
[22:46:15] <rawn027> I wanted to figure out why ruby wont compile
[22:46:19] <rawn027> on opensolaris
[22:46:25] <pfn> GeneralDelta, no, because UNIX's, by default, do not include . in the path
[22:46:26] <fedorared> GeneralDelta: It would if .  was on the PATH.
[22:46:27] <pfn> it's "unsafe"
[22:46:36] <pfn> or "insecure"
[22:47:23] <rawn027> yeah, never use . in your path EVER
[22:47:50] <GeneralDelta> k, so because the working directory is not on the path it does not know to attempt to execute the file even though you are in the directory...  is that a correct understanding?
[22:47:53] <oninoshiko> is not really, as long as its at the end of the path -.-
[22:48:09] <pfn> oninoshiko, it helps mitigate the problem, doesn't really solve it
[22:48:10] <rawn027> GeneralDelta: no
[22:48:26] <rawn027> GeneralDelta: the PATH is where your system looks when you type in a non-fully qualitied command
[22:48:39] <rawn027> so if i type "ls" it will search your PATH for the ls command
[22:48:44] <oninoshiko> you mean that 1/2 the users are morons and run programs without have any idea what they do?
[22:48:45] <rawn027> finds it in /bin/ls then runs that
[22:48:57] <GeneralDelta> yeah
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[22:49:08] <rawn027> try the which command some time
[22:49:12] <rawn027> which cc
[22:50:06] <rawn027> pfn: do you think I am doing the right thing and using Xorg instead of Xsun?
[22:50:09] <GeneralDelta> so which tells you which path the command you didi which for is being used
[22:50:21] <rawn027> GeneralDelta: exactly
[22:50:24] <pfn> rawn027, I wouldn't know
[22:50:28] <pfn> I don't run X
[22:50:44] <rawn027> pfn: how would I setup solaris to not boot up X
[22:50:51] * pfn shrugs
[22:50:56] <pfn> don't install X  ;-)
[22:50:59] <pfn> was my answer
[22:51:02] <rawn027> lol ok thx
[22:51:05] <GeneralDelta> thank you every one, I'm going to see if I can figure this out now :-)
[22:51:14] <rawn027> GeneralDelta: good luck
[22:52:08] <oninoshiko> rawn027 : i would use xorg unless i have a spacific reason to use xsun
[22:52:24] <rawn027> oninoshiko: I am running xorg right now and my usb mouse doesnt work
[22:53:30] <pfn> hmm, why is /platform/i86pc/boot_archive 84mb while the files inside it are only 15mb or so?
[22:55:43] <oninoshiko> rawn027 : hmm thats odd... but i wouldnt expect switiching X implementations to help
[22:55:59] <rawn027> yeah has to be something with my config
[22:56:03] <rawn027> but it seems perfect
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[23:06:31] * oninoshiko binds BSD
[23:06:58] * oninoshiko laughs hystaricly
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[23:13:38] <pfn> nothing in /usr/sfw is referred at boot, is it?
[23:13:49] <pfn> need to move stuff to another fs, my root fs is too full
[23:14:06] <rawn027> I figured out why ruby wouldnt compile on Solaris, for all you that are here from last night
[23:14:14] <rawn027> the problem was that I was using SunStudio 12
[23:16:19] <pfn> as opposed to gcc?
[23:16:36] <rawn027> i didnt want to use gcc
[23:16:41] <rawn027> not a big fan of gcc on solaris
[23:17:14] <rawn027> so now im going to try and run open solaris nevada 67 and try it with SunStudio 11 on there
[23:17:20] <rawn027> hopefully it will work so i have a mouse
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[23:22:14] <Pietro_S> hmm, does anyone know how I can enlarge/zoom video in mplayer? (installed from spec files)
[23:23:29] <vmlemon> X11 started working instantly on first boot, however my mouse doesn't seem to function
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[23:32:04] <vmlemon> I'd logged out, and then rebooted, and I am still unable to use the mouse in X11
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[23:34:46] <emergo> anyone here running logitech 5000pro ? I plugged it in but now driver loaded ( it seems ) and I mean that ive read it is in opensolaris
[23:42:32] <CSFrost> heh, I just got home and saw rawn027's comment abount ruby not compiling.. it *WILL* compile with Sun Studio, for those that might have been left confused by his statements.
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[23:47:39] <twincest> su(1m) says it will start the shell specified in the user's passwd entry by default.  but it doesn't, it starts sh, unless i do "su -".  why is that?
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[23:49:51] <fedorared> Because - means the environment is changed to that user. Should be described in the man page.
[23:50:10] <twincest> i know.  but it doesn't say that - is required to start the user's shell.
[23:50:49] <fedorared> shell is a part of your environment.
[23:51:19] <twincest> then why does the manual page say it will start the user's login shell, when it doesn't?
[23:52:14] <twincest> ah! wait
[23:52:28] <twincest> it does start the login shell, but it sets $PS1 to '#'
[23:52:31] <twincest> confusing :)





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