[00:00:21] <Odin-LAP> nrubsig: I see.
[00:00:38] <Tpenta> nrubsig: you need to read "A Hat Full of Sky" and "Wintersmith" too
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[00:01:16] <comay> nrubsig: it's one of the sun sustaining managers.  in any case, you don't really need that - just filing a request in request-sponsor
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[00:02:05] <richlowe> nrubsig: if you're complaining about the interest-list stuff, I can give you a bug ID that you can ask someone on SWAN to comment on your behalf.
[00:02:08] <nrubsig> Tpenta: yes, but I need some $$$$$ first.
[00:02:13] <richlowe> nrubsig: they can't give you anything other than the bits I wrote, however.
[00:02:35] <Tpenta> nrubsig: crivens :-D
[00:02:46] <nrubsig> comay: ok
[00:02:51] <nrubsig> Tpenta: crivens=?
[00:02:52] <richlowe> nrubsig: ask alanc, or comay or someone to comment CR 6488448 "bugs.opensolaris.org interest-list notifications are worse than useless"
[00:03:07] <richlowe> it's it bugtraq_exte/other, but I filed it, so claims of it being completely confidential are crap.
[00:03:10] <Tpenta> you said you read the wee free men
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[00:05:32] <nrubsig> Tpenta: yes
[00:05:37] <nrubsig> Tpenta: the german translation
[00:06:26] <minerale> alanc: ok, I give up, if you see anyone who's got a mac and is running solaris on parallels, ask them if they could make a copy of image (or just the xorg.conf)
[00:07:02] <Tpenta> oh ok
[00:07:13] <Tpenta> so what was the general exclamation in german?
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[00:09:55] <nrubsig> Tpenta: you mean the "drink&fight&fight&drink" thing ?
[00:10:26] <Tpenta> there is a word they use which is generally used for dismay, exclamation, ...
[00:10:56] <quants> angst?
[00:11:11] <Tpenta> IN the english translation of the book, the word is "Crivens"
[00:11:19] <nrubsig> "Schlimm, schlimm, schlimm, schlimm, ..."
[00:11:34] <nrubsig> er
[00:11:38] <nrubsig> "Oh, Schlimm, schlimm, schlimm, schlimm, ..."
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[00:11:58] <PerterB> minerale: what are you after? I run Nevada under Parallels
[00:12:03] <Tpenta> that soudns more like the translation of "waily waily, waily"
[00:12:54] <minerale> perterb: well, after a vanilla install the resolution is too high, I tried creating a config file and manually specifying the resolution but to no avail
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[00:15:26] <PerterB> minerale: http://pastebin.ca/320960 - the only bit slightly unusual are the modeline definition and the "Display" section that uses it
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[00:19:22] <pitty> I have a x4100 w/ hardware mirroring, is it possible to take those drives and boot them off a x4100 m2?
[00:20:13] <quasi> pitty: I can't see why not - it is the same pos controller
[00:21:07] <pitty> i have problems booting up when i place it another drive
[00:21:13] <pitty> s/drive/server
[00:21:41] <pitty> i was wondering any meta data is written to the hardware controller
[00:21:56] <pitty> localizing it to the hw platform
[00:22:16] <quasi> I doubt it, but I'm not sure
[00:24:09] <coffman> hm
[00:24:28] <coffman> an x4100m2 is a slightly different plattform
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[00:25:16] <quasi> yes, but both are with that lowcost lsi junk controller
[00:25:20] <Stric> gen: 2.13 GiB)
[00:25:23] <Stric> sorry
[00:25:36] <jmcpBris> quasi: I hardly think a SAS hba is lowcost junk
[00:26:04] <quasi> jmcpBris: this one is
[00:26:29] <quasi> jmcpBris: only supports raid 1 on one set of disks
[00:27:27] <quasi> jmcpBris: you can't enable raid on a drive that has already been partitioned as it will steal a small part of the disk killing your partitions
[00:27:40] <Stric> v440 has a "1 mirror set only" lsi scsi controller
[00:27:55] <Stric> quasi: oh.. the v440 can do that at least..
[00:28:27] <quasi> Stric: yeah, and so does the v20/40 controller
[00:28:43] <coffman> for what i have zfs?
[00:28:58] <Stric> parse error near line 1
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[00:29:49] <coffman> and realy, there should be no meta data on the controllery
[00:32:28] <pitty> hmmm.. its weird, even when i put 'em into a x4600, it resolves to pxe boot automatically - usually i will have to hit f12 or the like to force a pxe boot
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[00:38:03] <sommerfeld> pitty: Is it possible you need to do more of a reset/power cycle after insertion for the BIOS to recognize that the disk is present and bootable?
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[00:38:47] <sommerfeld> oh, hw mirroring: yeah, there's at least some metadata on that controller IIRC
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[00:43:56] <lloy0076> What's the packet filtering on Solaris like?
[00:44:24] <jamesd> like ipf
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[00:46:14] <nrubsig> richlowe: ping!
[00:46:21] <minerale> right now ifconfig shows only loopback up, how do I bring up eth0?
[00:46:21] <nrubsig> richlowe: email from linda received.
[00:48:52] <richlowe> wow, that's pretty good.
[00:48:57] <richlowe> thanks. :)
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[00:52:04] <sommerfeld> minerale: ethernet interfaces are not named ethN on solaris.  exact name depends on the driver used.
[00:52:37] <sommerfeld> you'll need to do an "ifconfig <ifname> plumb" to connect ip to a given driver.
[00:52:51] <sommerfeld> ifconfig -a plumb will try all network drivers..
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[01:14:40] <lloy0076> Gawd, there's set mathematics on the discuss list.
[01:14:43] <lloy0076> My brain hurts.
[01:17:39] <dlg> lo jmcpBris
[01:19:09] <jmcpBris> hi dlg, one-n-all
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[01:25:11] <onbot> commit by Blake Jones:  PSARC/2006/061 xmemfs EOF; 6379911 Remove support for xmemfs from Solaris
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[01:44:11] <alanc> Xbot says: commit by alanc to XW_S10U4:   6488392: PSARC 2006/609: Xserver provider for DTrace
[01:44:33] * alanc is too lazy to make a real Xbot
[01:44:48] <Timmins> Hi. I'm trying to compile OpenSolaris' pstack and libproc on Solaris 10 AMD64 with Sun Studio 10, but no matter what I can't get debug symbols in libproc. The pstack binary does have symbols. Does anyone maybe have any ideas as to why? (-g is used)
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[01:53:11] <Timmins> no tricky issues with building debug versions of libraries as opposed to binaries?
[01:53:43] <Gman> richlowe, dave jone's talk was pretty good, scarey, but man, he needs dtrace ;)
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[01:54:07] <jmcpBris> Timmins: you need Studio 11 to build any component of OpenSolaris
[01:56:13] <Timmins> Well, it does build fine. Just no debug symbols. What requires Studio 11?
[01:57:06] <movement> Gman: he's been using systemtap
[01:57:19] <hile_> heya jmcp
[01:57:31] <Gman> movement, yeah
[01:57:37] <jmcpBris> Timmins: ages ago there was a flag day saying that if you wanted to build ON then you need Studio11. libproc is part of ON.
[01:57:38] <jmcpBris> hi hile_
[01:57:39] <Gman> movement, didn't give any systemtap examples in his talk though
[01:57:55] <movement> well, your point still stands ;)
[01:58:18] <sommerfeld> uh, "jmcpBris" ?
[01:58:28] <jmcpBris> sommerfeld: I'm north
[01:58:45] <dlg> jmcpBris: out at uq at all?
[01:58:52] <jmcpBris> dlg: not this trip, sorry
[01:58:57] <dlg> oh well
[01:58:59] <dlg> c'est la vie
[01:59:04] <jmcpBris> maybe next time
[01:59:09] <jmcpBris> not sure when that might be, though
[01:59:20] <dlg> you know im going to make you sit in front of a solaris box and show me a few things
[01:59:29] <jmcpBris> yes
[01:59:33] <sommerfeld> ah, short for Brisbane.
[01:59:42] <dlg> :D
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[02:00:32] <sommerfeld> ("Bris" has a decidedly different meaning in other contexts...)
[02:00:33] <richlowe> jmcpBris: you do not *need* Studio 11.  Everything should be buildable with gcc beyond one recent bug I can think of.
[02:00:42] <richlowe> jmcpBris: "Studio 11" if Studio, but not *just* Studio 11.
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[02:01:15] <jmcpBris> richlowe: niggle niggle niggle
[02:01:18] <Timmins> Is there a minimum gcc version?
[02:01:27] <richlowe> jmcpBris: accurate accurate accurate
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[02:05:50] <edwardocallaghan> Hello all
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[02:16:54] <alanc> [xwin-discuss] X Consolidation Source update for Nevada Build 56 posted
[02:17:27] <Gman> sweet
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[02:17:47] <alanc> sadly, Xorg 7.2 still not done
[02:17:55] <alanc> so it's still 6.9
[02:18:10] <Gman> heh, was talking to daniel about that
[02:18:41] <alanc> yeah - he and ajax are down partying at lca instead of building tarballs to get the release out
[02:18:50] <edwardocallaghan> Yes they do need to upgrade X
[02:18:51] <Gman> i actually haven't seen ajax here
[02:19:27] <Gman> daniel was hungover most of yesterday
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[02:21:54] <alanc> I'm sure he's enjoying the change from the finnish winter
[02:22:54] <alanc> getting the TX module building with 7.2 is really the last thing stopping me from putting the current RC in Nevada as is
[02:23:29] <alanc> so we should get 7.2ish soon, even if 7.2 itself isn't quite out
[02:24:03] <Gman> how many packages have you ended up creating?
[02:24:43] <alanc> sticking with the same Solaris package layout for now
[02:25:04] <Gman> ugh, so much for modularization ;)
[02:25:23] <Gman> [though i sympathise with all your work over the last couple of months]
[02:25:44] <alanc> not sure there's much need to break down the Solaris packages further
[02:26:05] <alanc> the good part of modularization will be not having to wait for another full Xorg release to get driver updates
[02:26:28] <Gman> yeah
[02:26:29] <alanc> though we had sort of patched in some of those before
[02:27:10] <alanc> we can always subdivide the Solaris packages later if we want
[02:27:53] <alanc> but since I'm also backporting this to S10U4, keeping the packages the same makes that easier
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[02:32:14] <alanc> hmm, the on gate closure heads up is on http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/on/flag-days/56-60/ but the link doesn't work yet (though it just went out in e-mail a couple of minutes ago)
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[02:33:24] <alanc> now richlowe's got me being on-heads-up-bot...
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[02:34:02] <movement> btw I may be retiring onbot for CIA's bot now they've got an admin interface for it
[02:34:31] <richlowe> alanc: which?
[02:34:34] <richlowe> movement: how?
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[02:35:02] <alanc> "Summary: we've got two big projects (Xen phase 1 [direct boot] and IP instances) integrating in the next 24 hours, and to minimize risk for each of them, we're limiting putbacks so they can build and test without having to merge smaller putbacks."
[02:35:03] <edwardocallaghan> Guys, you know the Solaris hardware checking tool that use to be around, is it still maintained ?
[02:35:16] <richlowe> alanc: about damn time.
[02:35:25] <richlowe> movement: you too, for that matter.
[02:35:26] <movement> richlowe: all commits are already going through CIA
[02:35:27] <alanc> yeah - they just put out a new version of the hardware check not too long ago
[02:35:37] <richlowe> movement: Yeah, I knew that.
[02:35:40] <movement> richlowe: (ahem) yeahg
[02:35:57] <edwardocallaghan> Where abouts is it, I forgot ?
[02:36:25] <alanc> http://www.sun.com/bigadmin/hcl/hcts/device_detect.html
[02:37:26] <edwardocallaghan> Thanks
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[02:37:57] <movement> now, in fact
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[02:39:25] <CIA-18> opensolaris: movement:a test
[02:41:26] <movement> hmm, it's supposed to turn off the "opensolaris" bit
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[02:53:51] <alanc> ah, the heads up link works now, though the full message doesn't tell you much more than the summary I pasted earlier
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[02:56:39] <edwardocallaghan> Dell have great build Q, see this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XztRFwwJD_k
[02:57:12] <edwardocallaghan> Its there assembly line in action
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[02:59:39] <edwardocallaghan> lol
[02:59:42] <edwardocallaghan> Its a joke
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[03:12:50] <sahafeez> driving down the I15 63m south of vegas. how geeky is this?
[03:14:14] <Error_e^ipi> watch the road asshole
[03:15:13] <sahafeez> i am not driving myself.
[03:15:21] <Error_e^ipi> oh, ok\
[03:15:23] <hile_> funny i never heard him say that he was operating or in actual physical control of the motor vehicle
[03:15:30] <Error_e^ipi> well, continue then
[03:15:30] <richlowe> "driving"
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[03:15:35] <richlowe> otherwise he would merely be travelling.
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[03:15:36] <richlowe> or in transit.
[03:16:42] <edwardocallaghan> I though that tool has a ISO cd version ?
[03:16:53] <edwardocallaghan> The hardware checking one
[03:18:04] <sahafeez> hum, if i did not say "i am driving" then one could view it as if i was just in a car that was driving. ah well. english sucks
[03:21:09] <Stric> sahafeez: I've been ircing from one of these boats: http://tomas.ogren.pp.se/gallery/umerodd2006/img_7497  .. how's that for geekyness ;)
[03:21:44] <sahafeez> waiting on my cell phone to pull up the image..done..
[03:21:57] <AbeFroman> what kind of phone do you have?
[03:22:10] <sahafeez> yah. that is just plan wrong. you should be drinking beer and having a hot chick with you
[03:22:33] <Stric> sahafeez: I was drinking beer at least.. but the chick shared boat with another guy.. :P
[03:23:27] <Stric> sahafeez: eventhough it said "maximum capacity: 1 person or 120 lbs (55kgs)"  ;)
[03:23:39] <Error_e^ipi> which one trumps the other?
[03:23:48] <Stric> 2 grown people could still share one such boat..
[03:24:07] <Error_e^ipi> can you cram 2 60lb people in, or is 1 300lb person okay?
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[03:24:30] <Error_e^ipi> there's got to be an order of rules on that one
[03:24:42] <sahafeez> just driving past whiskey petes'
[03:24:55] <Error_e^ipi> sahafeez: you must really not like money
[03:25:04] <Error_e^ipi> data over cellphone = expensive
[03:25:12] <Stric> not that expensive..
[03:25:13] <sahafeez> unlimiited
[03:25:19] <sahafeez> for $20 p/m
[03:25:58] <Stric> I think my telco charges by traffic, but caps at around $1.5/day
[03:26:33] <sahafeez> hum. i want to get the verzion stuff - it is quite fast but i need a phone that works in the EU so..
[03:27:05] <sahafeez> hum. wonder how skype sounds.
[03:29:19] <Error_e^ipi> skype-y
[03:29:20] <Error_e^ipi> ?
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[03:29:43] <sahafeez> just called my friend in new deli ... seems to work.
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[03:34:55] <quants> skype is nasty use freeworlddialup
[03:36:59] <quants> it sounds way better
[03:39:22] <sahafeez> worked fine from my car driving down the road to my friends cell phone in india.
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[03:51:48] <edwardocallaghan> Any one like Astronomy here ?
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[03:57:28] <jbk> does setec astronomy count? :)
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[03:58:59] <l-fy> morning people
[04:00:59] <quants> jbk: Root?
[04:01:11] <quants> jbk: CV?
[04:02:26] <l-fy> did someone had ever used n1 system provisioning?
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[04:08:50] <l-fy> hi gm152
[04:08:53] <l-fy> hi Gman
[04:09:02] <Gman> hey
[04:09:17] <l-fy> sun rulez
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[04:10:38] <Gman> yes indeed it does :)
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[04:10:59] <l-fy> Gman > i'm trying to use n1 provisioning system
[04:11:14] <l-fy> i have to design a cluster capable to carry 2000 servers
[04:13:04] <edwardocallaghan> Right off to bed...
[04:13:09] <edwardocallaghan> Night guys
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[04:20:37] <l-fy> guys i need some help with sun
[04:20:46] <l-fy> i know is not open solaris and i appologize for that
[04:21:15] <l-fy> the question is, how do i find the license of an open source software made by solaris, in my cse n1 provisioning system?
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[04:32:25] <Triskelios> is it possible to use the older Xen binaries on a newer on build?
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[04:34:40] <jamesd_> not likely since its written by linux folks and they don't beleve in sable ABI's
[04:35:10] <richlowe> ...
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[04:44:14] <l-fy> what is software entitlement?
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[04:50:51] <l-fy> ok
[04:51:01] <l-fy> i'm completly lost with sun licensing system
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[05:03:06] <boyd> Afternoon all
[05:03:13] <boyd> Anyone got experience with Ultra45s?
[05:03:26] <jamesd__> no, but i would like some
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[05:06:31] <boyd> :)
[05:06:47] <boyd> I'm trying to work out how to get it to drive out of the DVI port at OBP time
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[05:10:55] <Timmins> hello again. I'm switched to Sun Studio 11 (from 10), but I still can't seem to build a libproc I can debug in dbx. dbx says "no debugger info." I'm compiling on Solaris 10 AMD64. Has anyone encountered something like this before?
[05:11:11] <Timmins> (everything's compiled with -g and with no optimization)
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[05:20:16] <Timmins> is there a better place for these types of questions? or am I somehow being obviously stupid?
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[05:26:12] <boyd> It's pretty quiet in here ATM. You may be able to try #solaris
[05:26:54] <Timmins> thanks
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[05:43:52] <steleman> hi richlowe
[05:48:12] <Error_e^ipi> w00t, looks like the OpenSolaris KDE project is officially approved
[05:48:23] <boyd> God, what a marathin that was
[05:48:26] <boyd> marathon
[05:48:30] <steleman> :-)
[05:48:40] <richlowe> boyd: it was?
[05:49:22] <boyd> compared to the threads for many other projects that one seems to have been much more wide-ranging
[05:49:36] <Error_e^ipi> heh, no it was downright peachy... everyone jumped on board & we all sang campfire songs together
[05:49:49] <steleman> let's have a group hug
[05:49:54] <Error_e^ipi> lol
[05:49:55] * steleman ducks
[05:50:06] <richlowe> I guess I must have not read the worse bits.
[05:50:28] <boyd> It wasn't the worst. The Extended partitions one is the longest I can remember
[05:50:50] <steleman> boyd: you must have missed last summer's Thread Of Doom
[05:50:51] <richlowe> well that one was awfully specified, wasn't it?
[05:51:00] <richlowe> didn't it say one thing, and intend to do something else?
[05:51:17] <boyd> steleman: Maybe.. I read -discuss more now than I did then. I think it must be because of the brain damage :)
[05:51:42] <boyd> richlowe: Yeah, and personally I think that what it is going to do is a bit awful.
[05:51:43] <steleman> boyd: that one made me filter opensolaris-discuss for two weeks
[05:51:48] <boyd> :)
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[05:51:56] <boyd> steleman: What was it about again
[05:51:57] <boyd> ?
[05:52:17] <steleman> boyd: companion cd
[05:52:24] <boyd> Ah yes
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[07:21:10] <MikeTLive> NEOSUG 1/31 at SunBurlington http://www.sun.com/neosug
[07:23:18] <Error_e^ipi> hmm... no vancouver SUG
[07:23:23] * Error_e^ipi thinks about starting one
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[10:32:16] <raph_ael> hello
[10:33:32] <Error_e^ipi> what up
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[10:46:39] <ssiinnttaaxx> hi
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[10:57:40] <gallium> hi
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[11:32:08] <nightswim> interesting
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[11:39:31] <Snake007uk> morning
[11:41:19] <gallium> mornin'
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[11:45:24] <jnvilo> hi, i am trying to install solaris but it won;t see the cd
[11:56:13] <lloy0076> jnvilo: That's no good.
[11:56:37] <lloy0076> jnvilo: Do you know whether any other type of bootable CD works in the CDROM/DVD reader you're using?
[11:59:38] <jnvilo> lloyd0076: thanks but found out from the #solaris that i had to type : stop a
[11:59:44] <jnvilo> then: boot cdrom
[12:00:13] <lloy0076> jnvilo: Ah, ok. Obviously some type of OpenBoot architecture?
[12:01:37] <jnvilo> lloy0076: i have  no clue, this is my first time on solaris :) , until today i've only taken care of our redhat clusters
[12:01:53] <lloy0076> heh
[12:02:48] <jteo> you mean a sparc machine. ;)
[12:03:11] <jnvilo> yeps its a sparc 450
[12:03:23] <lloy0076> Yes, a Sparc machine.
[12:03:32] <lloy0076> They've got OpenBoot. x86's have Grub.
[12:03:45] <jnvilo> i installed solaris a few months ago on a vmware and it was quiet straightforward
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[12:07:40] <gallium> can someone please explain why i cannot install sol10x86 on a non-primary partition?
[12:08:16] <gallium> is this fixed in one of the nevada builds?
[12:08:36] <lloy0076> gallium: It's not supported as of yet.
[12:08:44] <lloy0076> gallium: I can't offer an explanation apart from that.
[12:09:03] <lloy0076> gallium: Just recently, a new project was voted into existence to allow this.
[12:09:13] <gallium> wohoo.
[12:09:32] <gallium> its not as if grub doesn't support this... weird.
[12:09:39] <lloy0076> gallium: It's not grub's problem.
[12:09:43] <lloy0076> gallium: It's the actual OS itself.
[12:10:15] <lloy0076> gallium: Apparently, the OS will need to be reworked to be able to read the VARIOUS ways one can make entended bootable records.
[12:10:22] <gallium> ok, thought grub wasn't quite ofay with ufs on non-primary.
[12:10:28] <lloy0076> gallium: (of which there isn't a single standard btw)
[12:11:11] <lloy0076> gallium: Grub doesn't really care. Its job is simply to plonk a kernel bootstrap image into memory and set it off...so if it can see a UFS partition on an extended, it's fine. I know that it can.
[12:11:25] <gallium> lloy0076, any timelines for ths?
[12:11:52] <lloy0076> gallium: No, sorry. You'll need to talk to the project leads. I'm just a mailing list junkie.
[12:12:01] <gallium> OK :-) Thanks.
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[12:14:45] <lloy0076> gallium: Although I think I'm with you and hope it's sooner rather than later :P
[12:16:39] <gallium> its a pain in the rear as i have 4 pcs partitioned this way and linux has been fine with this partitioning setup since rh 6.2 :-)
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[12:17:29] <lloy0076> gallium: Linux has always been used to having to coexist in bung hardware.
[12:17:30] <gallium> calumb, since this is a useability issue, can you please fix? ;-)
[12:17:42] <gallium> *runs*
[12:18:19] <calumb> gallium: usability folk just tell other people what to fix :)
[12:18:34] <gallium> calumb, hence my question.... :-)
[12:18:35] <lloy0076> gallium: The more I look at the original 8088 based XT architecture, the more I see how horrid it is.
[12:18:53] <gallium> lloy0076, same issue on my w1100z workstation! :)
[12:19:35] <gallium> lloy0076, does that classify as "bung h/w", heh
[12:19:41] * gallium quite likes his w1100z
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[12:25:59] <gallium> has anyone played with logical domains on a T1?
[12:26:11] <gallium> I haven't got a chance to upgrade the firmware yet.
[12:26:55] <lasseoe> don't you need additional software that's not yet released?
[12:28:41] <gallium> a firmware upgrade, yes
[12:30:25] <Doc> i need to steal my T1000 back at some stage and play with them
[12:31:02] <gallium> i haven't played with a t1000 only have a t2000.
[12:31:15] <gallium> they're a nice size
[12:31:40] <Doc> i installed the ldom firmware months ago, downloaded a version of solaris that supported them
[12:31:48] <Doc> and then realised i had no idea what i was doing and gave up
[12:32:27] <lloy0076> Doc: Can you get arrested for stealing your own equipment back?
[12:32:55] <Doc> given that right now i'd need to break into another company's offices to get it, i'd suspect "yes"
[12:33:04] <lloy0076> ouch
[12:33:39] <Doc> one of our support partner companies has it on loan
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[12:33:57] <Snake007uk> guys, i know this "may" be off topic, just wondering why sun hasnt used EFI firmware on its Opteron SUn boxes so it could use something like openboot? something similar to what apple have done?
[12:35:04] <lloy0076> Snake007uk: Possibly because the users of Opteron boxes are likely to have had experience with GRUB.
[12:35:22] <Snake007uk> but openboot is SOOOoo cool
[12:35:23] <Snake007uk>  :)
[12:35:32] <lloy0076> Snake007uk: And you can install OpenSolaris on any random X86 hardware within reason.
[12:35:41] <Snake007uk> yeah suppose so
[12:36:07] <lloy0076> Snake007uk: But OpenBoot is good
[12:36:38] <Snake007uk> i only really started appreciating it more when i stopped using it LOL
[12:36:50] <PerterB> is OpenBoot supported by all the OSes that Sun say will run on their Opterons?
[12:37:09] <Snake007uk> i mean you can get all the information you need so easily, however i think Grub could have those features implemented?
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[12:37:53] <darrenm> Snake007uk: the likely reason is because Sun wants operating systems other than Solaris to run on our kit
[12:38:05] <darrenm> and not all operating systems that customers need to run today support EFI boot
[12:38:15] <Snake007uk> yeah but then, you could always have OS support mode in EFI
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[12:38:33] <darrenm> BIOS legacy mode you mean ?
[12:38:38] <darrenm> yes I guess we could
[12:38:43] <Snake007uk> yeah something like that i read
[12:39:13] * lloy0076 sigh
[12:39:24] <lloy0076> I don't want to upgrade my damned BIOS to run Solaris.
[12:39:41] <lloy0076> That's probably the main reason why it's not been done.
[12:39:42] <darrenm> I don't work in a hardware group so I can't comment on what there plans are but I suspect that would be the route we would take because we wouldn't want to stop people being able to run older releases of Solaris - where BTW older includes Solaris 10 - and Windows XP etc just so we can ship EFI
[12:39:45] <Snake007uk> who said upgrade
[12:40:09] <lloy0076> Snake007uk: You mean, implement OpenBoot in software....
[12:40:15] <lloy0076> Snake007uk: When Grub's already working?
[12:40:38] <lloy0076> Let me be argumentative here -- hasn't Sun got better things to do than fix what isn't broken?
[12:40:39] <lloy0076> :P
[12:40:40] <PerterB> it does seem like a lot of engineering effort required for not much payback
[12:40:55] <Snake007uk> i think im not explaining correctly
[12:41:01] <lasseoe> It is a lot of work, I agree with tha
[12:41:04] <lasseoe> that
[12:41:15] <lasseoe> however, the BIOS/iLOM/eLOM thing is a horrid experience
[12:41:22] <lasseoe> especially if you have to manage a lot of them
[12:41:35] <darrenm> and just replacing the BIOS with EFI won't actually fix that!
[12:41:38] <lloy0076> lasseoe: Yes, but Solaris isn't the dominant OS on x86 architecture...
[12:41:44] <Snake007uk> EFI is new bios replacement, it support leagcy bios mode (so in theory any os could run on it without any problem) i think Sun could in theory ontop EFI supply openboot features, or add open boot features to Grub
[12:41:45] <lloy0076> lasseoe: There's another CRAPPY OS that is.
[12:41:54] <lasseoe> Yes I realise that
[12:42:07] * Snake007uk wonders what he has started ......
[12:42:35] <lloy0076> lasseoe: Until Microsoft decide that the BIOS is crap and Hoopla (Vista's replacement) can't cope because of it, I doubt Intel or AMD are going to really bothere about changing it.
[12:43:21] <lloy0076> I really don't see Intel or AMD removing the BIOS and pissing off all the desktop users in the world. Truly. Sorry...
[12:43:23] <lloy0076> Reality guys.
[12:43:31] <lplatypus> Intel/AMD are not involved with the BIOS
[12:43:36] <dlg> i want more ofw
[12:43:55] <lloy0076> lplatypus: Substitute: EVIL BIOS MAKERS
[12:44:00] <darrenm> Yes they are
[12:44:13] <lasseoe> lloy0076: I'm not saying should should go out of their way ot switch to OBP, but coming from a SPARC env with OBP, it's a nightmare to work with these new boxes
[12:44:14] <darrenm> whats more EFI the BIOS replacement was an Intel creation
[12:44:34] <darrenm> what specicially do you miss from obp ?
[12:44:44] <lloy0076> lasseoe: Coming from a crappy Intel background, I find OpenBoot confusing...but more powerful...
[12:45:29] <lloy0076> (darrenm's question is more valid - I'm in the mood to start a religious war :P )
[12:45:30] <lasseoe> darrenm: I find normal BIOS's to be way too slow and barely works over serial
[12:46:25] <lasseoe> I assume a better LOM would be easier to implement if the system had OBP
[12:46:32] <lasseoe> I could be wrong here though.
[12:46:55] <lplatypus> a BIOS feature that I miss in obp is the VESA frame buffer :P  it means that linux on sparc usually can't do graphics
[12:46:58] <darrenm> the LOM capability on Sun's SPARC machines isn't part of OBP and is often very separate from them
[12:47:00] <lasseoe> if I am, not I'd like to know why ALOM was't "ported" to the Galaxy series :)
[12:47:07] <darrenm> some times even being a comletely separate card
[12:47:11] <lasseoe> darrenm: yes I realise that much
[12:47:26] <Snake007uk> EFI allows OBP to be implemented correct ? if so... dont you think OBP is a very good boot/hardware manager?
[12:47:34] <darrenm> I don't think BIOS vs OBP vs EFI makes the LOM part that different
[12:47:46] <darrenm> OBP is a horrible boot manager
[12:47:49] <darrenm> its a nice cli
[12:47:56] <darrenm> for debugging in forth
[12:48:05] <Snake007uk> yeah
[12:48:16] <Snake007uk> but booting isnt nothing special i am sure tht could easily be improved
[12:48:16] <lloy0076> I don't want to debug in FORTH.
[12:48:20] <darrenm> and a reasonable, via deathly slow, console system for use with direct attached serial console
[12:48:21] <lloy0076> I want to boot a system :P
[12:48:39] <Snake007uk> lloy0076, then dont press antying
[12:48:44] <Snake007uk> and it will boot automatically :p
[12:48:51] <darrenm> indeed so for no developers OBP vs BIOS+Grub shouldn't make that much difference
[12:49:02] <darrenm> btw Grub is comming to SPARC too I believe!
[12:49:09] <lplatypus> oh no
[12:49:21] <lplatypus> why?
[12:49:27] <lloy0076> darrenm: Now they're crestfallen! You did have to tell those poor chooks????
[12:49:34] <Snake007uk> it would make sense to have one boot manager
[12:49:45] <darrenm> why is grub bad ?
[12:49:53] <darrenm> grub with live upgrade is wonderful
[12:49:54] <lasseoe> I have no issues with grub.
[12:50:21] <Snake007uk> live upgrade?
[12:51:08] <lloy0076> Snake007uk: As opposed to dead upgrade.
[12:51:35] <darrenm> Snake007uk: man live_upgrade
[12:51:56] <darrenm> basically make a copy into another slice, do the upgrade on that, and reboot
[12:52:03] <darrenm> if it all goes wrong boot back into the other be
[12:52:10] <darrenm> be - boot environment
[12:52:33] <darrenm> with OBP you have to manually setup nvaliases to boot all the alternate root file systems
[12:52:42] <darrenm> with Grub they appear on the menu automatically
[12:52:53] <Doc> you normally dont need nvalias
[12:53:10] <tsoome> there are aliases for internal disks
[12:53:11] <Doc> setenv boot-device disk0:d  (for the first disk, slice 3)
[12:53:21] <Snake007uk> oh ok  i seee
[12:53:22] <lloy0076> Anyway, off to play Diablo II.
[12:53:29] <lloy0076> I have Baal to find!!!!
[12:53:40] <Doc> we did a good booklet on live upgrade a while back - let me try and find it
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[12:54:11] <Doc> http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/howtoguides/liveupgradehowto.jsp
[12:54:25] <darrenm> Doc: yeah but the point is in Grub I get a menu entry that is the name of the boot environment that the human admin choose - ie it is descriptive
[12:54:49] <Doc> darrenm: true.
[12:54:54] <darrenm> for the disk0:{a,b,c...} you have to remember or document elsewhere which slice is which lu BE
[12:55:20] <darrenm> now consider once we have ZFS boot and those live upgrade BEs are just ZFS filesystems in the pool cloned from each other.....
[12:55:23] <Doc> yah.. nvalias can do the documentation (as i'm guessing you were getting at)
[12:55:54] <darrenm> yes but it is a manual step to do the nvalias disk0:d snv_54
[12:56:03] <Doc> eg, one of my customers names their devices  rootdisk_20070101A (patch set from 01/01/2007, environment A)
[12:56:15] <lasseoe> Doc: that's a good idea
[12:56:38] <darrenm> I agree a good idea, but if you had grub and were using live ugprade you would get that "for free" ;-)
[12:57:00] <Doc> darrenm: so why haven't you ported grub to sparc/obp yet? :)
[12:57:11] <lasseoe> or told someone to :P
[12:57:24] <darrenm> I'm not doing it but it is in the progress of being done as part of the larger ZFS root on SPARC
[12:57:58] <darrenm> at least so I've been told by engineers working on the ZFS root - it is possible they could have changed their minds but that was the last I'd heard
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[13:09:05] <tsoome> damn solaris installer
[13:09:07] <Snake007uk> darrenm, what do you "do" at sun
[13:09:30] <Snake007uk> yeah sun installer needs update :)
[13:09:49] <Odin-> Isn't that what Caiman is supposed to do?
[13:10:00] <tsoome> stupid bitch will not unmount /a if I will not choose a upgrade...
[13:10:41] <gallium> i had a hell of a time with the installer on a bootable cd with a flar
[13:10:41] <Snake007uk> tsoome, cant u force umount
[13:11:29] * tsoome is going to blow existing metadevs and slices
[13:12:29] <darrenm> Snake007uk: security stuff - I'm a Sr Staff Engineer in the Solaris Engineering team responsible for security features
[13:12:59] <Snake007uk> darrenm, i see, so if something gets hacked u get the stick :p
[13:13:09] <tsoome> ah, darren:) I have a question for You:)
[13:13:12] <darrenm> nope
[13:13:17] <darrenm> security features
[13:13:33] <gallium> darrenm, so are you re-vamping PAM ?
[13:13:36] <darrenm> not security vulnerability tracking and fixing - that is done by a different group
[13:13:37] <Snake007uk> darrenm, uk or US?
[13:13:39] <tsoome> can I now get an cert from sun.com for a elfsign;)
[13:14:01] <darrenm> tsoome: yes submit a request we can issue them now
[13:14:08] <tsoome> ok
[13:14:12] <Snake007uk> whats elfsign ?
[13:14:22] <darrenm> gallium: what excactly is wrong with PAM that makes you think it needs s re-vamp ?
[13:14:25] <tsoome> man elfsign;)
[13:14:44] * kirma notes that in.tftpd has been "featurised" (with addition of OACK packet geeneration) so that it doesn't work with old PXE bootloaders anymore
[13:14:49] <darrenm> Snake007uk: I'm in the UK I was in the US for 5 years before that and was with Sun in the UK for 4 years before that
[13:14:56] <kirma> changed between sol8 and sol10
[13:15:05] <Snake007uk> oh, where are sun based in UK? guilford?
[13:15:12] <gallium> darrenm, needs some cleanup with its modules and pam_mkhomedir / pam_netgroup  etc.
[13:15:26] <gallium> or should i say, pam_access, please
[13:15:32] <darrenm> Junction 4a off the M3 - opposite side of the motorway to fleet
[13:15:45] <tsoome> someone should remove fixed nss db list from /bin/passwd ;)
[13:15:56] <darrenm> gallium: cleanup ?  pam_mkhomedir not likely to be shipped
[13:16:11] <darrenm> pam_netgroup aka pam_list aka pam_access aka pam_listfile - on my todo list
[13:16:36] <darrenm> tsoome: it isn't that easy in fact it is very very difficult since that would require a writable nsswitch
[13:16:43] <darrenm> I've tried!
[13:16:50] <Snake007uk> darrenm, too far :) i like central london :)
[13:16:53] <darrenm> turns out it is a really hard problem to solve
[13:17:01] <darrenm> Snake007uk: we have 2 offices in London as well
[13:17:07] <PerterB> an "official" pam_access would be nice... I did a quick hack'n'slash port of the Linux one, but just the bare minimum to extricate it from their lib framework
[13:17:12] <darrenm> and I'm currently at neither of them nor am I in Fleet
[13:17:17] <gallium> darrenm, problem i have without pam_mkhomedir (and I know about script option) is that, should i want to externalise the homedirectory attribute to an ldap directory, I need to do two binds (1 in pam_ldap and 1 in the script) which is wasteful instead of filtering the info down through pam.
[13:17:18] <darrenm> I'm at home in Reading
[13:17:21] <Snake007uk> darrenm, :)
[13:17:46] <darrenm> gallium: the whole point of PAM was so that Solaris didn't need to ship every possible thing like this
[13:17:57] <darrenm> if you need pam_mkhomedir thats fine you use it
[13:18:29] <gallium> darrenm, problem is sun don't support it :)
[13:18:35] <darrenm> we have had very long and detailed discussions about pam_mkhomedir in the past and we haven't had any complelling reason why Sun needs to ship it in their OpenSolaris distro
[13:18:49] <gallium> i just gave you one - scalability.
[13:19:04] <darrenm> gallium: so you don't run a single bit of software or home grown script that Sun or some other vendor supports ?
[13:19:25] <darrenm> but what business problem does having to do that ldap bind actually cause you in reality ?
[13:19:29] <gallium> darrenm, no :)
[13:19:33] <darrenm> is it actually a serious problem
[13:19:38] <darrenm> gallium: I don't believe oyu
[13:19:51] <PerterB> PAM doesn't seem to be the right place for that anyway... surely a helper program you can call from /etc/profile is cleaner?
[13:19:52] <gallium> darrenm, i'm telling you - this is for who i work at.
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[13:20:29] <darrenm> so there are no applications on these systems that neither Sun nor some ISV provides support for ? and not a single home written script ?
[13:20:50] <darrenm> the point I'm trying to get across is why do you need pam_mkhomedir to be supported by Sun ?
[13:21:49] <darrenm> PerterB: in part I agree, but I also thing that the whole problem is ofen being solved in a strange way when you need to create a home dir locally but somehow every single other thing about that account is already setup in LDAP.
[13:21:58] <gallium> darrenm, because its part of the "security" stack and our risk mgmt team won't allow it to run on tier 1 without "certification and support". I have my opinion on this. :)
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[13:22:17] <darrenm> so what is the real problem being solved here ?
[13:22:30] <darrenm> how is it that users are deployed in LDAP yet they have no home dir ?
[13:22:43] <darrenm> what if users login to multiple different systems, are they supposed to have a different home dir on each of them ?
[13:23:14] <gallium> well, unless you want SIM to provision all of that to hundreds of machines during account creation...
[13:23:15] <PerterB> darrenm: nah, I had a similar requirement at my last place... No NFS home directories, and account provisioning was done at the LDAP level, and yes, users end up with a home directory on every server they have access to, but that was the policy
[13:23:34] <darrenm> Why no NFS home dirs ?
[13:23:47] <darrenm> and how is a different home dir on every server good for users ?
[13:23:58] <PerterB> because they had an "NFS is evil" policy :)
[13:24:04] <darrenm> oh dear
[13:24:09] <tsoome> stupid ones;)
[13:24:14] <tsoome> it happens.
[13:24:21] <darrenm> NFS can be deployed securely
[13:24:29] <gallium> this is for admins... and nfs is not available in tier 1 according to our standards.
[13:24:32] <darrenm> did this site happen to have Active Directory by any change ?
[13:24:39] <gallium> no
[13:24:46] <gallium> using SunDS
[13:25:02] <PerterB> it wasn't about security, it was about external dependancies
[13:25:13] <darrenm> huh ?
[13:25:21] <darrenm> LDAP as an external depend is okay but NFS is not ?
[13:25:35] <tsoome> :D
[13:26:08] <PerterB> hey, I didn't make the policy! don't give me a hard time about it... but there was a budget for a resilient LDAP infrastructure but not one for a resilient set of NFS servers
[13:26:11] <darrenm> gallium: when you say tier 1 you are talking about DMZ-like systems - very restricted access and not something end users login into just system admins
[13:26:14] <tsoome> same is here. https for exchange owa is okay, but imaps is banned.....
[13:26:31] <darrenm> I'm not given you a hard time I'm just trying to understand why people do this type of deployment
[13:26:48] <gallium> darrenm, yes, precisely... and we still need to externalise auth for compliance and logging reasons.
[13:27:03] <gallium> darrenm, otherwise we'd just use local acct. this is a nazi environment :)
[13:27:24] <darrenm> gallium: what do you use for deploying the users in to LDAP ?
[13:27:43] <gallium> darrenm, SIM
[13:27:57] <darrenm> SIM ?  Sun Identity Manager ?
[13:28:00] <gallium> yes
[13:28:04] <gallium> what else? :)
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[13:28:22] <darrenm> just checking, TLA space is too small for on collisions ;-)
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[13:28:38] <darrenm> why not have the identity manager deploy the users home dirs then ?
[13:29:04] <darrenm> or is there a policy that the home dir only exist when the user first logs in and it can't be precreated ?
[13:29:10] <gallium> darrenm, because there's hundreds of hosts with no shared homedir for security reasons.
[13:29:20] <darrenm> so
[13:29:23] <gallium> do you want to have SIM doing micro-provisioning? :)
[13:29:35] <gallium> its slow enough with 160 provisioning points.
[13:29:43] <darrenm> identity manager can contact every host and do the home dir creation and still deploy the accounts themselves into LDAP
[13:30:19] <gallium> there are 2 firewalsl between SIM and the hosts.
[13:30:24] <gallium> do you want to open all that up?
[13:30:26] <darrenm> btw don't try the "security reason" tatic because it doesn't work ;-) NFS can be secured providing you are willing to use Kerberos
[13:31:07] <darrenm> I still don't get why you must have Sun ship pam_mkhomedir because you choose this deployment architecture
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[13:31:19] <darrenm> there is a cost for everything we develop and have to support
[13:31:20] <gallium> darrenm, yes agree with respect to NFS. But there's no _need_ to do so and have yet another dependency.
[13:31:26] <lasseoe> gallium: did you get pam_mkhomedir to work on Solaris ?
[13:31:37] <gallium> yes, i have made a pkg
[13:31:44] <darrenm> so instead you create a different dependency on pam_mkhomedir and how it works
[13:31:47] <lasseoe> uuhh.. any chance I could hae a copy? :)
[13:31:53] <darrenm> you didn't remove a dependency you just changed it
[13:32:06] <gallium> darrenm, not if its included in solaris :)
[13:32:34] <darrenm> including things in Solaris has a cost
[13:32:37] <Doc> bugtraq over nfs over isdn?
[13:32:40] <darrenm> a cost that Sun alone bears
[13:32:41] <Doc> you're a sick person darren
[13:32:53] <darrenm> Doc: yep! needed it when I was doing on call
[13:34:30] <darrenm> it might seem a trivial bit of code but we have to consider the full life cycle of everything we do and we need resources to do it.  Given a choice between pam_mkhomedir and other very high priority projects things like pam_mkhomedir filter to the bottom, particularly given that the whole point of Sun inventing PAM in the first place was so that we didn't have to include things like this in Solaris until we had the resources to do so, yet
[13:34:40] <darrenm> note I'm not saying no to it
[13:34:46] <gallium> sure, everything has a cost. Customers mucking around because of a missing component also has a cost. We pay sun for a service. :)
[13:34:51] <darrenm> I'm saying ENORESOURCE or RESOURCE else where
[13:34:59] <gallium> darrenm, understand
[13:35:10] <darrenm> right you pay sun for service not for new feature development ;-)
[13:35:40] * andersmo doesn't think it's Sun's job to bend over backwards because some customers insist on doing stuff their own way - except if the support contract is expensive enough, of course. ;)
[13:35:43] <gallium> darrenm, we pay for annual support which gives upgrades which pays for features :)
[13:35:58] <darrenm> now if you personally are prepared to do all the work to get pam_mkhomedir up to scratch - including documentation and packaging and building in the ON consolidation  - then I'll sponsor the ARC review and the putback
[13:35:58] <gallium> so indirectly that's not true
[13:36:27] <gallium> ARC review?
[13:36:34] <darrenm> gallium: I wish the internall accounting worked that way - sadly it doesn't but I'm not at liberty to say how it does work.
[13:36:37] <Doc> didnt casper write a 3 line automount map to do the same thing as pam_mkhomedir ?
[13:36:53] <darrenm> http://opensolaris.org/os/community/arc/
[13:37:09] <gallium> ah, thanks
[13:37:16] <darrenm> Doc: yes Casper write an automount map - and no running automount doesn't require you use NFS!
[13:37:53] <darrenm> ARC review is basically: does this fit the architecture of Solaris, does it conflict with something else in a bad way, is it complete, what commitment is the Sun product going to have to this interface
[13:38:09] <darrenm> anything visible to users,admins, developers gets ARC review for Solaris and many many other Sun products
[13:39:10] <gallium> how do you get stuff added to the companion CDs?
[13:39:40] <gallium> I'd be more than happy to donate a proper pkg for it.
[13:40:20] <darrenm> http://opensolaris.org/os/project/companion/
[13:40:29] <darrenm> putting it on the companion CD does not make it supported by Sun
[13:41:02] <Cyrille> the ARC review also cares about which other interfaces the product uses and their various commitment levels.
[13:41:19] <gallium> right, hence at least I want to make it available for free without support to people like lasseoe who could live with the risk of no support and may find it useful.
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[13:41:58] <darrenm> If you provide sparc and x86 packages I'll put a copy of them in the opensolaris.org security community pages on PAM if you like
[13:42:27] <bougie> hello :p
[13:42:44] <gallium> darrenm, thanks. I might just take you up on that offer.
[13:42:55] <gallium> hi bougie
[13:43:41] <jteo> intriguing. ;)
[13:43:57] <gallium> darrenm, you may also want to consider JDS logins in cached mode without access to any backend services. :-)
[13:44:18] <darrenm> gallium: don't understand that last comment
[13:45:02] <gallium> darrenm, ok, usecase. I have a tadpole laptop using JDS. Login the office against ldap. Take it walk abouts, login again using same cached credential without ldap service as the creds are cached.
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[13:45:24] <gallium> darrenm, does that make sense?
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[13:45:31] <darrenm> how is that related to pam_mkhomedir ?
[13:45:40] <gallium> darrenm, this is different topic. :)
[13:45:46] <darrenm> which topic ?
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[13:46:14] <gallium> cached JDS login capability
[13:47:23] <darrenm> when "going walkabout" does that involve a complete shutdown and restart (suspend/resume is different) ?
[13:47:47] <gallium> it may, or alternatively the screensaver may be locked after the laptop resumes from hibernate.
[13:48:02] <gallium> same pam route is taken, technically in both cases.
[13:48:35] <darrenm> yes but the big difference is what data is available in nscd ;-)
[13:48:45] <darrenm> I think this is something to talk to the sparks project about. see:
[13:48:46] <darrenm> http://opensolaris.org/os/project/sparks/
[13:49:07] <darrenm> one of the engineers on that project and I have had a very similar discussion in the past
[13:49:36] <gallium> darrenm, a friend of mine is luke howard of PADL... Similar capability is documented here :  http://www.padl.com/OSS/pam_ccreds.html
[13:49:50] <darrenm> yes I'm ware of the PADL stuff
[13:50:43] <gallium> ah, great. sparks looks exciting.
[13:51:06] <darrenm> see also: http://opensolaris.org/os/project/winchester/ and http://opensolaris.org/os/project/reno
[13:51:12] <darrenm> which are nameservice related as well
[13:52:16] <gallium> ldap attribute mapping would be useful. not everyone has luxury of using sunds.
[13:52:27] <gallium> looks like there's alot of focus on this...
[13:52:30] <gallium> great
[13:54:11] <_syphilis_> sparks? that's never a real place name
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[13:56:06] <darrenm> why does it need to be a place name ?
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[13:56:41] <gallium> darrenm, are you working on all three projects?
[13:56:52] <darrenm> I'm not working directly on any of them
[13:57:17] <darrenm> I've been quite involved in reno but only a distant outsider on sparks and not really looked much at winchester
[13:57:26] <darrenm> I've got friends who are working on all three of them though
[13:57:42] <darrenm> My focus is crypto framework, zfs-crypto, and lofi crypto
[13:57:49] <_syphilis_> darren: isn't that the naming scheme for software projects?  or lakes or something?
[13:58:40] <darrenm> naming is completely and utterly random
[13:58:53] <darrenm> upto whom ever creates the project to suggest a name
[13:59:05] <darrenm> some teams use a theme some don't even use codenames at all
[13:59:22] <darrenm> for example the name of the project to add crypto functionality to ZFS is.....
[13:59:25] <darrenm> zfs-crypto
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[13:59:28] <darrenm> :-)
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[14:00:19] <gallium> where are the crypto keys stored?
[14:00:46] <tsoome> in your secure keystore;)
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[14:01:32] <gallium> tsoome, you mean on the same physical disk as the zfs data? :)
[14:02:25] <tsoome> why?
[14:03:14] <gallium> I said that sarcastically ;)
[14:03:42] <tsoome> there is a solaris cryptographic framework
[14:04:06] <tsoome> you can have different kind of devices...
[14:04:29] * tsoome is working with smartcard based one....
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[14:06:40] <gallium> that would work nice with a sunray javacard.
[14:08:07] <gallium> can i plug in a certificate authority behind the crypto framework or is it built in?
[14:08:55] <tsoome> SCF is based on pkcs#11
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[14:20:14] <cmihai> Bah, the Java in SXCR 54 is really broken. Doesn't work with Tarantella or Cisco ASDM... pff
[14:20:29] <cmihai> Hell, even Sun SDM borks.
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[14:30:12] <cmihai> Any java guys? How can I set the memory for java apps
[14:30:15] <cmihai> to say 512M
[14:30:28] <trygvis> java -X
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[14:31:33] <cmihai> For applets in firefox and stuff
[14:31:40] <darrenm> gallium: see http://opensolaris.org/os/project/kmf/ which recently integrated
[14:32:23] <nachox> damn, Stroustrup keeps writing papers and books, i wonder, has anyone told him his "the c++ programming language" book just ucks?
[14:32:44] <nachox> ::P
[14:33:06] <gallium> darrenm, thanks for the link.
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[14:49:26] <osdummy> When would putpmsg fail in this fashion "putpmsg(6, 0xFEDFF95C, 0xFEDFF948, 0, 0x0004)      Err#12 ENOMEM" even though we have plenty of memory?
[14:52:35] <Berny> hmm, has anyone any expirience with brownie raid controllers? the one i have here just says "rom error"...
[14:52:51] <Berny> .oO(not even google seems to know anything about that :-\)
[14:54:22] <jteo> eventually my gmail box will overflow. -sigh-
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[14:59:47] <nachox> how can you fill more than 2gb when most of tha mail you get is text?
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[15:05:02] <jteo> nachox: because eventually i will have too much mail from mailing lists. I'
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[15:05:06] <jteo> I'm extrapolating.
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[15:19:00] <nachox> jteo: set it to use pop3 and eventually flush the contents, compress and forget :P
[15:19:17] <jteo> nachox: true. :)
[15:20:16] <Berny> bugger
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[15:27:59] <sickness> i'm back
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[15:29:59] <nachox> jteo: BUT if youre really going to forget, just delete them and save space ;)
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[15:41:58] <pogma> SMF question, if I am making, for example, a package for mysql, and I want to add svcs support, what should I set the fmri to? I'm thinking application/mysql and then putting everything in an instance name='MyCorpMysql5027'
[15:42:38] <pogma> Does this seem reasonable, what, in general should pakcagers do with fmri that other packagers may also be using?
[15:42:59] <movement> your instance should be stock-symbol yes
[15:44:30] <movement> well, that depends, could you run multiple mysql's with this service?
[15:45:16] <quants> wow sun's docs are way to explanation heavy
[15:45:17] <pogma> simulataneously? only if the conf files have been edited
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[15:48:46] <movement> pogma: then you should probably put your stock symbol in the /service/ name and use 'default'
[15:48:51] <movement> see http://www.sun.com/bigadmin/content/selfheal/sdev_intro.html
[15:48:56] <Doc> quants: and this is a bad thing?
[15:49:34] <quants> Doc: some what...
[15:49:40] <pogma> movement: Is that really aimed at packagers, it seems to be more aimed at those who have unique to the corp services
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[15:50:42] <pogma> Mycorp,application/mysql does not make as much sense to me as network/mysql - we are not mysql a.b.
[15:50:53] <quants> oh I found a question the other day
[15:50:56] <pogma> s/network/application/
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[15:51:25] <quants> SELinux is the NSA's version of MACs for Linux
[15:51:28] <darrenm> the network vs application split is strange
[15:51:57] <quants> trusted BSD is a port OF SELinux for Free BSD
[15:52:14] <quants> so what is trusted Solaris?
[15:52:52] <quants> RBAC is obviously better than the sudo we use
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[15:53:00] <darrenm> quantis: trusted solaris was created by Sun before Linux ever existed never mind SELinux
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[15:53:15] <darrenm> see: http://opensolaris.org/os/community/security/projects/tx/
[15:53:31] <quants> Doc: doesn't say anyhting at all toward my question
[15:53:40] <darrenm> and if you want comparison info between Solaris Trusted Extentions and SELinux see http://blogs.sun.com/gfaden/
[15:53:48] <quants> darrenm: sorry Doc
[15:53:58] <darrenm> trusted BSD is NOT a port of SELinux to BSD
[15:54:39] <quants> darrenm: really?
[15:54:45] <darrenm> yes readlly
[15:55:00] <darrenm> trusted BSD, trusted Solaris, and TX are all VERY VERY different to SELinux
[15:55:13] <darrenm> I need to go out for a bit but if you are still around when I come back I'll explain why
[15:55:24] <darrenm> in the mean time look at Glenn Faden's blog it has a great comparions
[15:55:42] <quants> k
[15:56:11] <quants> "Mandatory access control modules based on the framework supporting a variety of access control models, including fixed and floating label Biba integrity policies, the MLS confidentiality policy, Type Enforcement, and other customized policies designed for common FreeBSD deployment scenarios. In addition, the SELinux FLASK and Type Enforcement implementations will be provided via an SEBSD module, providing access to the higher level FLASK service abstra
[15:56:23] <quants> www.trustedbsd.org
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[15:58:17] <Doc> MAC. we should put something like that into Solaris
[15:58:24] <Doc> ohh.. wait...
[15:58:29] <quants> "SEBSD is a port of NSA's FLASK/TE implementation in SELinux to run on FreeBSD as a plug-in module to the TrustedBSD MAC Framework, as well as the policy files and necessary adaptations of FreeBSD's userland applications. At the time of this writing, the SEBSD module can be attached to the kernel and run in enforcing mode using a sample policy; many but not all relevant userland applications have been updated to properly interact with FLASK security con
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[15:59:05] <quants> Doc: no I know sol has something like this
[15:59:36] * steleman gives up
[16:00:40] <quants> steleman: ?
[16:00:49] <steleman> quants: n/m
[16:01:55] <quants> ah ha "However, it says nothing about Sun's current offering, Solaris Trusted Extensions." that is what I wanted to know?
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[16:02:27] <quants> what evolution happened here?
[16:02:40] <sickness> http://www.opensolaris.org/jive/thread.jspa?threadID=20364&tstart=0 <- omgomg can't wait to try XP inside XEN on solaris dom0 =)))
[16:03:21] <pogma> movement: Okay, if I buy that I need Mycorp,application/mysql, for a postfix package, we should still use /network/smtp and define a differrently named instance, right? Which is why I get confused about mysql...
[16:04:10] <quants> wow there are manuals for tsol!
[16:05:49] <quants> http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/coll/175.12
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[16:06:54] <lasseoe> yes so?
[16:07:19] <movement> pogma: well, if you had it all in a directory or using config files not in the standard place you'd use a different instance
[16:07:28] <quants> lasseoe: I'm figuring someone else might find it interesting too
[16:07:35] <movement> pogma: but really it's best asking smf-discuss with some more details
[16:07:50] <pogma> okay, thanks
[16:08:03] * pogma goes to sign up for mailing list :)
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[16:09:18] <pogma> haha - http://lists.cat.org.au/mailman/listinfo/smfdiscuss
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[16:10:06] <movement> yeah, not that one :)
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[16:11:54] <quants> trusted JDS!
[16:11:58] <quants> too sweet
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[16:14:51] <tek-ops> I'm curious of the best way to accomplish server virtualization under opensolaris
[16:15:33] <tek-ops> a few of the virtual servers I'd like to run from the opensolaris box would include some linux and some windows machines
[16:15:55] <tek-ops> woudl vmware be the best solution is this scenario?
[16:16:02] <tek-ops> s/woudl/would
[16:16:09] <movement> right now? probably
[16:16:24] <tek-ops> you say right now... is there a project I should be watching?
[16:16:57] <movement> xen
[16:17:09] <tek-ops> xen will include windows support?
[16:18:19] <lasseoe> yes I believe so
[16:18:28] <movement> eventually, if you have the right hardware
[16:18:39] <movement> actually I'm not sure on the current status of vmware host support for solaris
[16:19:10] <tek-ops> but from the Xen project page, i interpretted the reference to Windows XP usage as it would work but can't be done due to licensing
[16:19:21] <tek-ops> as in it won't be done... I must be misreading it
[16:19:50] <movement> what bit?
[16:20:19] <tek-ops> the end of the third paragraph, I'm refering to www.cl.cam.ac.uk/research/srg/netos/xen/
[16:21:43] <movement> ah
[16:21:48] <movement> that's about a paravirtualised windows
[16:22:01] <movement> xen runs a fully-virtualised windows (HVM) but it needs h/w support
[16:22:33] <tek-ops> alright
[16:23:31] <tek-ops> so, assuming I have appropriate hardware, I will be able to do a windows 2003 install in a similar manor as I would on VMWARE?
[16:24:26] <sickness> what was that command to see cpu specs?
[16:24:36] <tek-ops> oooh, ok, with hardware virtualization, what's exactly what I'm looking to do, should I redirect my questioning to a Xen specific channel?
[16:24:39] <sickness> not isainfo
[16:24:44] <pogma> movement: mail sent, thanks again
[16:24:47] <tek-ops> cat /proc/cpuinfo ?
[16:24:52] <tek-ops> I'm more of a linux person
[16:24:52] <sickness> the other one, maybe it started with p?
[16:24:57] <sickness> tek-ops: under opensolaris
[16:25:55] <lasseoe> ness: psrinfo -v
[16:25:57] <pogma> heh, I should spell-check my emails :(
[16:25:58] <lasseoe> sickness
[16:26:29] <tek-ops> thank you all for your help
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[16:27:44] <sickness> lasseoe: yeah, that one!
[16:27:59] <sickness> lasseoe: but I see that looking at the dmesg line about processor features is more verbose...
[16:28:00] <thomsog> hello all, could someone tell me why nightly runs check_fnames and what action to take if I have forbidden names please
[16:28:11] <jteo> psrinfo -v
[16:28:22] <lasseoe> sickness: uhm.. yes, probably
[16:28:23] <sickness> one think that I can't see is if this particular athlon64 socketAM2 does support virtualization extensions
[16:28:35] <sickness> it should, since it's AM2 and all the am2 should...
[16:28:38] <lasseoe> doesn't isainfo give you that?
[16:29:39] <sickness> uhm, yeah isainfo -x
[16:29:56] <sickness> but I don't know what's the name for that :/
[16:30:04] * tsoome is away - bbl - [AcidJazz - Log ON]
[16:31:11] <quasi> amd64: cx16 sse3 sse2 sse fxsr amd_3dnowx amd_3dnow amd_mmx mmx cmov amd_sysc cx8 tsc fpu (x2200)
[16:31:18] <quasi> amd64: sse2 sse fxsr amd_3dnowx amd_3dnow amd_mmx mmx cmov amd_sysc cx8 tsc fpu (v40z)
[16:32:10] <quasi> if you're right, then the cx16 bit must be it
[16:33:16] <sickness> yeah
[16:33:20] <sickness> lemme check...
[16:34:20] <sickness> nope
[16:34:42] <sickness> it should be svm for amd and vmx for intel :/
[16:37:51] <sickness> http://www.crc.id.au/fedora-core-6-xen-and-asterisk/
[16:37:58] <sickness> http://www.broermann.com/howto_amd_hvm.html
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[16:51:34] <sickness> http://ian.blenke.com/vbox/virtualbox/linux/vt/svm/xen/hvm/virtualization/limitations/virtualbox-limitations.html <- interesting post...
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[17:06:15] <calum_> sr4 gone tits up again?
[17:06:24] <calum_> oops, wrong channel :)
[17:08:15] <jteo> ;)
[17:10:37] <rodrickbrown> where is update_drv usually located?
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[17:26:26] <tsoome> its /usr/sbin
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[18:44:29] <nachox> hmm, it seems like xfs is being ported to freebsd
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[18:49:49] <alanc> but freebsd has had X Font Server for years...
[18:50:02] <alanc> oh, you mean that silly filesystem that reused the acronym
[18:50:07] <alanc> 8-)
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[18:54:58] <nachox> yep, hopefully it will also be released under a more permisive licence
[18:55:21] <Error_e^ipi> more permissive than BSD?
[18:56:24] <nachox> no, more permisive that it's current gpl variation
[18:57:30] <Error_e^ipi> IIRC it was BSD
[19:00:28] <nachox> also freebsd7 itself looks promising
[19:00:48] <Error_e^ipi> it's got dtrace, and zfs
[19:00:50] <Error_e^ipi> heh
[19:01:01] <CosmicDJ> they're still porting xfs? ;)
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[19:05:33] <CosmicDJ> I'd rather wait for zfs on *bsd *cogh*
[19:05:39] <CosmicDJ> +u
[19:06:53] <nachox> and openbsm and new trustedbsd features
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[19:32:12] <minerale> I must have done something wrong during installation, wrong layout maybe? Shift 2 gives me " not the (at) symbol, how do I change the layout ?
[19:32:36] <minerale> perterb: by the way were you able to get the sound working on parallels?
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[19:36:59] <tomww> what is the way to configure jumpstart to choose xorg automaticly instad of going interactive?
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[19:39:00] <PerterB> minerale: didn't try :)
[19:41:12] <minerale> I was impressed that flash came preinstaled - wow
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[19:42:02] <minerale> I'm guessing that sun worked out the licensing -- what else comes with Nevada? (licensed, that is, mp3? mpeg? dvds?)
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[19:45:29] <laca> minerale: mp3 yes, dvds, mp4 no
[19:46:33] <laca> realplay comes with nevada too, btw
[19:49:16] <lasseoe> hm
[19:50:00] <lasseoe> I'm using Emulex FC HBA's with the older lpfc driver, how the heck do I find out which devices (cXtXdXsX) correspond to which WWN ?
[19:50:12] <lasseoe> the device names don't actually have the WWN in them
[19:50:20] <lasseoe> and luxadm doesn't work with the lpfc driver :(
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[20:17:41] <minerale> perterb: what keyboard layout did you use ( and where do you et it) my layout is off, i my @ and " locations are switched and I don't have the pipe delimiter
[20:18:42] <alanc> heh - shift 2 as " reminds me of the old Apple ][ keyboard
[20:20:45] <PerterB> that xorg.conf I pasted for you yesterday has Option "XkbLayout"  "gb" which might not be what you want :)
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[21:32:50] <kimc> running apache2 shipped with b_54.. what would be an ownership to set a directory to for apache to be able to access it ?
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[21:37:06] <lasseoe> whichever it is httpd is
[21:42:28] <TBCOOL> hrm.. why is kbd -t reporting my PS/2 connected keyboard type as 'USB keyboard'? <_<
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[21:46:18] <alanc> because virtual keyboard makes PS/2 keyboards appear as USB
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[21:46:35] <alanc> so that the keycodes don't all change if you hotplug a USB one in too
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[21:46:59] <TBCOOL> I see
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[21:48:00] <kimc> lasseoe: dont know which user httpd is running as..
[21:49:13] <lasseoe> kimc, man ps :)
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[21:53:27] <andrei> hi there
[21:53:53] <jamesd__> andrei, hi.. when are you going to release  vmware server for solaris :-)
[21:54:03] <Kitty> why do you need it ?
[21:54:05] <Kitty> you got xen ?
[21:54:10] <Kitty> pffft, some people are never happy
[21:54:32] <jamesd__> Kitty, vmware is smoother and better user interface,  xen takes a phd to setup  and isn't stable.
[21:54:45] <andrei> jamesd: I can't say anything
[21:54:50] <TBCOOL> oh welp, gotta file some bugs anyways. setting kbd-type to swedish makes non-alphanumeric keys non-functional in console. and half the time usb doesn't work, with the dmesg containing stuff about missing start of frame packets..
[21:54:54] <Kitty> xen is very stable thanks :p
[21:54:55] <TBCOOL> but now.. coffee
[21:55:03] <Kitty> and yes, I like the fact its a sod to setup
[21:55:08] <delewis> Xen also requires a custom kernel
[21:55:08] <Kitty> keeps morons out of the market
[21:55:33] <andrei> jamesd: has anyone tried running vmware server for linux under brandz?
[21:56:14] <jamesd__> andrei, no, its not possible because  vmware requires kernel modules and solaris just emulates a kernel and can not load modules.
[21:56:27] <delewis> brandz doesn't even do that :-)
[21:56:29] <jamesd__> er solaris brandz emulates a kernel
[21:56:38] <delewis> it just remaps Linux system calls to Solaris system calls
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[21:57:00] <andrei> jamesd: vmware's kernel modules are open source
[21:57:18] <hspaans> delewis: like freebsd does?
[21:57:25] <andrei> jamesd: I know that freebsd folks ported them to freebsd at some point
[21:57:26] <delewis> hspaans, yes
[21:57:39] <delewis> except you do get the advantages of zones which FreeBSD does not provide.
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[21:58:32] <andrei> jamesd: getting the network stuff done is not going to be trivial
[21:59:06] <andrei> but I'm sure there are opensolaris people who could help with that
[21:59:41] <andrei> btw, when is sxcr b55 coming out?
[22:00:13] <hspaans> !lart php5 on sol10
[22:05:51] <jamesd__> i would guess soon,  probably early next week..
[22:06:36] <hspaans> b55b or b55c? ;-)
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[22:14:52] <richlowe> sigh.
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[22:25:05] <quants> I don't know many admins who would enjoy scrolling through all of this basic descriptive talk just to pick out the useful bits
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[22:26:04] <alanc> there are useful bits?
[22:26:10] <quants> the way they hide the usful information under broad heading is also annoying
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[22:27:03] <quants> sun docs need to be rewritten
[22:27:07] <quants> badly
[22:27:18] <alanc> talk to the documentation community on opensolaris.org
[22:27:37] <quants> alanc: docs.sun.com
[22:28:03] <hspaans> and what should be improved?
[22:28:15] <alanc> docs.sun.com is read-only, the writers who can change it are in the opensolaris documentation community
[22:28:39] <quants> less talk more to the point, stop hiding stuff under vauge titled sections
[22:29:06] <PerterB> yeah, damnit... stop explaining how stuff works and do more simple-minded hand holding!
[22:29:19] <quants> I might seggest a what you need to know in the beginning
[22:29:40] <quants> then work to more advanced topics as you go
[22:30:25] <quants> simple-minded is not the same thing as getting the job done
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[22:31:06] <quants> I'm trying real hard not to get sidetracked by all the "oh ww" you can do that too?
[22:31:25] <PerterB> and you feel the step by step "tasks" guides in the documentation don't get the job done?
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[22:31:32] <quants> man the lag is killing me
[22:33:07] <quants> PerterB: I've had to dig about a lot just to find the right section for RBAC setup
[22:33:32] <quants> I've been told not to use smc at all
[22:33:33] <sommerfeld> RBAC in particular needs a lot of documentation work.
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[22:33:54] <quants> I'm trying to learn the right way
[22:34:46] <PerterB> ok, I'd have to agree with that... I find the RBAC documentation pretty unapproachable too
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[22:35:05] <elektronkind> I've found it hard to maintain RBAC stuff without having to go in and edit foo_attr files directly, or even map out their inter-relationship in my head.
[22:35:22] <PerterB> but overall, I'd rate Sun docs as well above average in the IT world
[22:36:04] <PerterB> (oh, aside from the blatant innacuracies in the sol8 LDAP docs)
[22:36:50] <quants> I'm not looking to suck sun's dick here, docs or otherwise
[22:37:15] <quants> if it works great, if not it's nothing against sun
[22:37:31] <quants> if nobody says anything, nothing gets fixed
[22:37:53] <hspaans> thats true
[22:38:02] <quants> smc needs work, or tore out
[22:39:00] <PerterB> tear it out, I say :)
[22:39:56] <lasseoe> they'll just replace it, with jmc - java management console ;-P
[22:40:03] <andersmo> I've generally found sun's docs to be pretty decent, once you find what you're looking for. Finding what you really want to find can be tricky, though, the search engine on docs.sun.com isn't exactly my favourite. =)
[22:40:04] <quants> "Note ?  "
[22:40:06] <quants> The roleadd command is more limited than the Solaris Management Console GUI or command-line interfaces. After running the roleadd command, you must run the usermod command to assign the role to a user. And, the user then must set the password for the role, as shown in How to Assign a Role to a Local User.
[22:40:47] <andersmo> But then again, I'm often happy with manpages explaining the file formats, a root shell, and vi. =)
[22:41:02] * andersmo is a simple soul.
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[22:41:05] <quants> no tmention their funny def for operator
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[22:41:43] <quants> andersmo: you and ever other admin I know
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[22:42:10] * quants comes from OpenBSD where man pages are king
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[22:45:13] <quants> wow you can reduce root to a role that's sweet
[22:45:20] <andersmo> man pages are overall pretty good in solaris as well.
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[22:45:39] <Viking667> so are the pdf docs...
[22:45:54] <hspaans> andersmo: no, they explain things. to make users ask questions
[22:45:57] <quants> blek
[22:46:11] <Viking667> I've got used to vi, finally, though I have to remember to forget about vim-isms
[22:46:47] <quants> Viking667: everyone should upgrade to vim
[22:49:31] <PerterB> hmmph... I got bitten by vim the other day, it has different undo behaviour
[22:50:04] <Viking667> PerterB: hrm?
[22:50:15] <Viking667> oh. vi. one undo. That's it.
[22:50:20] <Viking667> Vim can be configurable.
[22:50:31] <Viking667> ...which has saved my canned ass many a time.
[22:50:45] <PerterB> I don't want to configure it, I have known how vi works for 20 years :P
[22:51:13] <hspaans> then fix the other problem, the one between chair and keyboard ;-)
[22:51:27] <quants> lol
[22:51:33] <PerterB> yeah thanks... I'll get right on that
[22:52:03] <quants> old people never want to change
[22:52:15] <tomww> heh
[22:52:17] <PerterB> young people want to change for the sake of it
[22:52:22] <hspaans> s/old//
[22:52:29] <quants> indeed
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[22:53:12] <hspaans> peterb: so MCSE is something for young people? ;-)
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[22:53:15] <PerterB> to be fair, my real complaint was really that "vi" on OS X is really "vim"
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[22:53:32] <quants> hahha
[22:53:45] <PerterB> hspaans: I thought MCSE was for people who couldn't get a proper job?
[22:54:12] <quants> or who need job security
[22:55:14] <hspaans> *g*
[22:55:27] <richlowe> PerterB: yeah, I'm fine with vim, I'm fine with vi, but asking for one and getting the other makes me livid.
[22:55:52] <Stric> vim in vi-compatible is pretty vi:ish
[22:55:53] <PerterB> right
[22:56:21] <PerterB> it's like asking for Emacs and getting micro-Emacs
[22:56:28] <PerterB> or vice versa
[22:56:39] * Stric has no clue how to see that comparison ;)
[22:56:43] <quants> nano
[22:56:53] <Volkodav> MCSE=Microsops Certified Solitare Expert
[22:56:56] <Stric> asking for pico and you get nano..? ;)
[22:56:58] <PerterB> Stric: I was just stirring really
[22:56:59] <richlowe> it's right up there with "Linux distributions that think ed(1) is optional"
[22:57:16] <PerterB> richlowe: really?
[22:57:37] <quants> ed commands are for the lazy
[22:57:48] * Stric hasn't really found any usage for ed(1) in his 10+ years of unix/linux experience
[22:57:59] <quants> :q!
[22:58:00] <PerterB> quants: or for the terminally challenged
[22:58:07] <quants> lol PerterB
[22:58:14] <Stric> PerterB: ex works pretty good then
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[23:02:11] <quants> roleadd -c "Primary Administrator" -g priadmin -m /home/priadmin -u 666 -s /bin/csh -P ????? "Primary Administrator"
[23:02:25] <PerterB> Stric: I once wrote a system that relied heavily on ed, but that was more than 10 years ago on a system where everything else that was useful was unbundled
[23:02:35] <quants> is this right? help for ???
[23:02:54] <quants> http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/816-4557/6maosrjfk?a=view
[23:03:12] <quants> so nobody else needs to go hunt it down too
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[23:10:31] <quants> ah ha /etc/security/pro* |grep Pri
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[23:12:19] <quants> grrr UX: roleadd: ERROR: invalid syntax.
[23:12:39] <quants> can't use ""s?
[23:13:49] <quants> nope
[23:14:02] <quants> wtf am I doing wrong?
[23:14:17] <quants> roleadd -c Primary\ Administrator -g priadmin -m /home/priadmin -u 666 -s /bin/pfsh -P Primary\ Administrator Primary\ Administrator
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[23:15:59] <quants> if their docs are this wrong, and you need to depend on smc to get something this basic to run sol is in the shitter
[23:16:02] <lasseoe> you can have a rolen with spaces in it
[23:16:13] <lasseoe> err you can't have a role with spaces in it
[23:17:06] <lasseoe> roleadd -c Primary\ Administrator -g priadmin -m /home/priadmin -u 666 -s /bin/pfsh -P Primary\ Administrator priadmin
[23:17:07] <quants> what then should be the rolename?
[23:17:30] <quants> ah I'll try
[23:17:39] <lasseoe> not sure -P "Primary Administrator" will work either
[23:17:48] <Qapf> im getting horrible sustained performence on my zfs pool, like 5mb a second, does anyone have a link to a good doc on trying to hunt down io bottlenecks in solaris?
[23:17:55] <quants> nope
[23:18:19] <quants> does not function
[23:18:30] <lasseoe> quants: try changing -P to something else
[23:18:38] <lasseoe> without a whitespace
[23:18:42] <quants> you can't
[23:18:57] <sommerfeld> Qapf: offhand I don't have a link, but there are a bunch of things I'd check first.
[23:19:00] <quants> cat /etc/security/pro* |grep Pri
[23:19:46] <sommerfeld> Qapf: if you're seeing high cpu utilization, use one of the kernel profiling recipies in lockstat(1m) to see what part of the kernel is sucking up time.
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[23:20:42] <Qapf> sommerfeld,  ok
[23:20:53] <lasseoe> quants: does the priadmin group exist?
[23:21:06] <Qapf> thanks
[23:21:20] <sommerfeld> on sparc hardware using IDE disks, there's a bug (now fixed in Nevada) which causes really sucky ZFS write performance
[23:21:23] <quants> # roleadd -c Primary\ Administrator -g priadmin -m /home/priadmin -u 666 -s /bin/pfsh -P Primary\ Administrator priadmin
[23:21:26] <quants> UX: roleadd: ERROR: invalid syntax.
[23:21:29] <quants> usage:  roleadd [-u uid [-o] | -g group | -G group[[,group]...] |-d dir |
[23:21:31] <quants>                 -s shell | -c comment | -m [-k skel_dir] | -f inactive |
[23:21:34] <quants>                 -e expire | -A authorization [, authorization ...] |
[23:21:37] <quants>                 -P profile [, profile ...] | -K key=value ] login
[23:21:38] <quants>         roleadd -D [-g group | -b base_dir | -f inactive | -e expire
[23:21:41] <quants>                 -A authorization [, authorization ...] |
[23:21:44] <quants>                 -P profile [, profile ...]]
[23:22:39] <quants> yes lasseoe
[23:22:42] <PerterB> sommerfeld: is that uata fix back in again now? (it went in then got withdrawn as I remember)
[23:23:08] <quants> priadmin::666:
[23:23:09] <Qapf> sommerfeld,  is there a tool in solaris similar to hdparm of linux where i can poke drives, run smart tests and whatnot?
[23:23:26] <lasseoe> quants: ahh
[23:23:31] <Stric> smartctl can do s.m.a.r.t
[23:23:41] <Qapf> ahh, thank you
[23:23:44] <jamesd__> Qapf, smartctl == smarttools exists on   blastwave.org
[23:23:49] <lasseoe> quants: roleadd -c "Primary Administrator" -g priadmin -m -d /home/priadmin -u 666 -s /bin/pfsh -P "Primary Administrator" priadmin
[23:25:25] <sommerfeld> Qapf: other disk tests can be run using format(1m)
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[23:27:05] <lasseoe> quants: works for me
[23:27:15] <quants> lasseoe:  that helps
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[23:28:22] <quants> oh quotes
[23:28:37] <sommerfeld> PerterB:  first landed in snv_48 (and backed out from it); corrected fix landed in snv_52
[23:28:51] <PerterB> cool, ta
[23:29:39] <PerterB> (I had been sort of putting off BFU-ing my X1's until I looked into that)
[23:29:58] <richlowe> Hm, and now all the case material links in the arc caselog vanished.
[23:30:03] <richlowe> at least for 2007.
[23:30:05] <quants> UX: roleadd: ERROR: Unable to create the home directory: Operation not applicable.
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[23:31:04] <lasseoe> the automounter controls /home
[23:31:28] <quants> oh crap export ok
[23:32:00] <PerterB> ah... the "ed" conversation earlier made me google for this: http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=767 ... they don't make them like that any more (thank god)
[23:32:43] <quants> YEAH!
[23:33:05] <quants> lasseoe: thank you that was sick hard
[23:35:32] <lasseoe> np
[23:36:01] <quants> usermod -u UID -R rolename
[23:36:18] <quants> # usermod -u 100 -R priadmin
[23:36:20] <quants> UX: usermod: ERROR: Invalid syntax.
[23:36:43] <quants> Is the UID of the user.
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[23:37:07] <quants> ah rolename
[23:37:12] <quants> nm
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[23:38:11] <quants> # usermod -u 100 -R "Primary Administrator"
[23:38:13] <quants> UX: usermod: ERROR: Primary Administrator is not a valid role name.  Choose another.
[23:38:14] <lasseoe> usermod -R priadmin myuser
[23:38:19] <quants> good god!
[23:39:11] <quants> that worked
[23:39:22] <quants> the docs are fucked seriously
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[23:43:10] <quants> thank you again lasseoe
[23:43:16] <lasseoe> no problem
[23:43:38] <quants> lasseoe: do you tour the andies in your off days?
[23:43:39] <quants> ;)
[23:44:30] <lasseoe> no I just kill people
[23:44:33] <quants> whatis pf* shell?
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[23:46:12] <quants> omg it's like they _want_ to distract you w/ cool new features in the docs
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[23:46:39] <quants> For information about the Solaris Cryptographic Framework, see Chapter 13, Solaris Cryptographic Framework (Overview). To administer the framework, see Administering the Cryptographic Framework (Task Map).
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[23:50:39] <quants> now a semantic question is priadmin any different than root?
[23:51:09] <quants> how is root as a role any diff than priadmin?
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[23:56:38] <quants> oh the docs are for sol10?
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[23:59:43] <Stric> depends on what docs you're looking at





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