November 12, 2019 
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November 12, 2019 [00:03:41] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@cpe-67-253-141-249.rochester.res.rr.com> has joined #openindiana[00:08:41] *** CME <CME!~CME@2a02:810a:8c80:3301:ba27:ebff:fe8d:4857> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[00:09:09] *** CME_ <CME_!~CME@ip5f5b13b8.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de> has joined #openindiana[00:09:30] *** CME_ is now known as CME[01:44:02] <rennj> zfs has needs![01:44:44] <rennj> probably shouldnt do the hardware raid1, but zfs software raid1....[01:46:52] <Reinhilde> yus[03:31:05] <rennj> https://github.com/jclulow/illumos-kvm/ punks[03:31:26] <rennj> amd support over intel for the future...[04:19:21] *** panorain <panorain!~panorain@airstream-farmers-pppoe-10-ws-216.direct.airstreamcomm.net> has joined #openindiana[05:23:56] *** popgreen <popgreen!~panorain@airstream-farmers-pppoe-10-ws-216.direct.airstreamcomm.net> has joined #openindiana[05:37:10] *** popgreen <popgreen!~panorain@airstream-farmers-pppoe-10-ws-216.direct.airstreamcomm.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[06:02:37] *** _Tenchi_ <_Tenchi_!~phil@d-207-255-80-203.paw.cpe.atlanticbb.net> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[06:22:51] *** popgreeny <popgreeny!~panorain@airstream-farmers-pppoe-10-ws-216.direct.airstreamcomm.net> has joined #openindiana[06:23:54] *** panorain <panorain!~panorain@airstream-farmers-pppoe-10-ws-216.direct.airstreamcomm.net> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[06:25:30] *** popgreeny <popgreeny!~panorain@airstream-farmers-pppoe-10-ws-216.direct.airstreamcomm.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[06:27:06] *** panorain <panorain!~panorain@airstream-farmers-pppoe-10-ws-216.direct.airstreamcomm.net> has joined #openindiana[08:19:04] *** tsoome <tsoome!~tsoome@148-52-235-80.sta.estpak.ee> has quit IRC (Quit: tsoome)[09:03:26] *** tsoome <tsoome!~tsoome@148-52-235-80.sta.estpak.ee> has joined #openindiana[09:08:23] <mnowak_> rennj, never use ZFS on top of HW RAID, ZFS itself has RAID-like features[09:08:40] <rennj> no shit[09:08:43] <rennj> really?[09:08:54] <rennj> how interesting[09:09:05] <rennj> why do you thin i said it[09:19:17] <panorain> openindiana is the closest distribution to Solaris.[09:26:33] <rennj> yeah sure..smartos is[09:26:56] <rennj> and even than..so what..[09:39:53] *** fling is now known as infernorion[09:40:17] *** infernorion is now known as fling[11:30:02] *** vesper <vesper!~ves@66-206-23-8.static.hvvc.us> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[11:31:17] *** vesper11 <vesper11!~ves@66.206.23.8> has joined #openindiana[11:50:15] <tsoome> zfs and hw raid is a bit tricky issue.[11:55:30] <rennj> no its nots, disable and jbod[11:55:47] <rennj> best practices..you know like l2arc and zil[11:56:01] <rennj> planning on your hybrid storage[12:13:26] <tsoome> clients have raid arrays, you do not build jbods there:)[12:22:59] <rennj> yeah in 2005[12:26:59] <tsoome> no, today.[12:27:22] <rennj> the ZoL code base truly platform-agnostic some day[12:27:49] <rennj> if you buy hardware raid knowing you going to run zfs on it, well thats on you[12:28:08] <rennj> JBOD is just flip a setting anyway[12:28:40] <rennj> buy a sun thumper/x4500 yeah in 2005[12:29:14] <tsoome> todays all flash arrays are something different than jbod connected to your server.[12:32:19] <rennj> the array cabinets work different how?[12:34:14] <rennj> fc-al loop of 255 drives sdd or hd...you would either do software or hardware raid on with some volume manager[12:43:20] <tsoome> I do not think anyone is using fc-al loops to connect drives today:)[12:45:22] <tsoome> and despite all the fancy tech, you can still see checksum errors on your luns:)[12:55:08] <rennj> emc sells plenty of fibre channel gear im sure[12:58:50] <tsoome> fc frontend and fc backend are different things.[13:00:27] <rennj> your thinking das while im thinking san..is the problem with jbod/raid foo[13:00:41] <rennj> das,nas,san..doesnt matter is my point[13:00:54] <rennj> ive dealt with all that crap[13:02:11] <rennj> old sun ssa100 arrays which ran veritas[13:02:27] <rennj> because sun didnt have raid software or volume managers...[13:02:35] <rennj> so vxvm and vxfs[13:02:49] <rennj> those where scsi-fc[13:03:37] <tsoome> yep.[13:08:14] <rennj> d1000,sena gear huge step up of scsi[13:08:42] <rennj> get yourself a nice e3500 coffee table art piece[13:11:06] <rennj> just like nvme will be the move[13:15:18] <rennj> and lets not forget NVME-oF fibre fiber...french[13:16:02] <rennj> extending pcie over fiberchannel...[13:17:04] <toasterson> rennj (IRC): extending a proven attack surface over a network what could possibly go wrong :)[13:17:08] <rennj> 100% NVMe and NVMe-oF performance[13:17:32] <rennj> my storage bucket got owned[13:21:14] <rennj> my storage offsite secure miles away from my computers....hmmm fiber[13:21:55] <rennj> vdi to all the luser/users...cut down on the data theft[13:22:31] <toasterson> well vpn will do just fine aswell :)[13:23:10] <rennj> when you are the guy racking and stacking the equipment[13:23:23] <rennj> what tech did the CTO choose[13:40:21] *** psydroid <psydroid!psydroidma@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-odnfmblxnmbcfzzu> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[13:47:56] *** arnoldoree <arnoldoree!~arnoldore@ranoldoree.plus.com> has joined #openindiana[14:28:09] *** tsoome <tsoome!~tsoome@148-52-235-80.sta.estpak.ee> has quit IRC (Quit: tsoome)[14:56:07] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@cpe-67-253-141-249.rochester.res.rr.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[15:02:43] *** psydroid <psydroid!psydroidma@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-kixxqbpzpkbnsvsd> has joined #openindiana[15:45:11] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has joined #openindiana[16:25:57] *** tsoome <tsoome!~tsoome@148-52-235-80.sta.estpak.ee> has joined #openindiana[16:41:02] *** phobos <phobos!~phobos@unaffiliated/phobos-anomaly/x-6744724> has joined #openindiana[16:46:55] *** phobos <phobos!~phobos@unaffiliated/phobos-anomaly/x-6744724> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[16:59:51] *** tsoome <tsoome!~tsoome@148-52-235-80.sta.estpak.ee> has quit IRC (Quit: tsoome)[17:03:05] *** fling <fling!~fling@fsf/member/fling> has left #openindiana[17:33:01] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[17:49:19] *** lopta <lopta!~ball@75.61.90.157> has joined #openindiana[18:00:27] *** _Tenchi_ <_Tenchi_!~phil@207.255.80.203> has joined #openindiana[18:00:31] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has joined #openindiana[18:06:02] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[18:11:21] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has joined #openindiana[21:19:04] *** lopta <lopta!~ball@75.61.90.157> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[21:19:08] *** ESol5 <ESol5!~a@unaffiliated/asol5> has joined #openindiana[21:33:45] <ESol5> hi I cannot seem to update/upgrade...sudo pkg update gives an error on the latest iso I burned to dvd[21:33:57] <ESol5> i can pastebin the error[21:34:42] <ESol5> File "/usr/lib/python3.5/vendor-packages/pkg/client/bootenv.py", line 339, in get_be_list[21:34:42] <ESol5> raise RuntimeError("nobootenvironments")[21:34:42] <ESol5> RuntimeError: nobootenvironments[21:34:52] <ESol5> im running live....these were the last 3 lines[21:36:49] <ESol5> pkg install tells me insufficient disk space also...Most linux distros allow running live unmodified and will update/install just fine. Many BSD's are also read-only and prevent updating/installing. Is this by design, or for lack of devs?[21:48:19] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[21:49:45] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has joined #openindiana[21:50:06] *** tsoome <tsoome!~tsoome@148-52-235-80.sta.estpak.ee> has joined #openindiana[22:20:18] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[22:24:17] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has joined #openindiana[22:36:08] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[22:45:32] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has joined #openindiana[22:57:36] *** Kurlon_ <Kurlon_!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-04.gwi.net> has joined #openindiana[23:01:05] *** Kurlon <Kurlon!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-03.gwi.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)[23:02:21] *** Kurlon_ <Kurlon_!~Kurlon@bidd-pub-04.gwi.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[23:17:56] *** arnoldoree <arnoldoree!~arnoldore@ranoldoree.plus.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[23:24:30] <rennj> "nobootenvironments" beadm part of pkg update[23:26:50] *** CompanionCube <CompanionCube!znc@sortix/rw-citizenship/companioncube> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[23:30:51] <rennj> ESol5, https://wiki.openindiana.org/oi/Installing+a+binary+build+of+onnv_145[23:30:55] <rennj> something like that[23:31:03] <rennj> beadm create nightly && beadm mount nightly /mnt/x[23:31:37] <rennj> probably first part of live.iso issue...when it goes to create new bootenv[23:31:41] <ESol5> ty ill look into it[23:32:25] <ESol5> like now, cuz im live[23:32:35] <rennj> https://pasteboard.co/Hhq8gOv.png oi beadm/pkg update[23:33:08] <rennj> see it create a new bootenv updates that...leave the old bootenv, so you can boot into it, in case something goes wrong[23:33:15] <ESol5> are you on for the coming few mins/hour? im tryuing it now[23:33:26] <rennj> not going to work live[23:34:11] <rennj> why not just run the installer?[23:34:11] <ESol5> aha! i figured this was too good to be true...i had asked for using it as a standard live session, like many linux distros do correctly[23:34:32] <ESol5> youm ust be the 7th person asking me that in the last hour[23:34:57] <rennj> you can run stuff live[23:35:22] <rennj> just not the pkg foo.[23:35:35] <rennj> because the zfs beadm/bootenv[23:35:42] <rennj> it wants to create[23:36:55] <ESol5> OI seems easier to fix than the other bsd's that prevent installing...OI seems to only need extra space...like if I could use something like ramdisk_size= (for linux kernel) or cowsize (ill check the exact name) for archlinux boot param to choose/increase the virtual disk size of the live session...[23:37:10] <ESol5> OI might be usable at least to install new sw[23:37:58] <ESol5> i am zfs noob btw, so i hear it might create issues for suspend/resume, which is the other thing I would hack at if I could to improve OI[23:38:25] <ESol5> so said igor, dilos lead dev[23:39:53] <ESol5> so i do exec your two messages that start with beadm and probably earlier? or no?[23:40:00] <ESol5> so do i*[23:41:16] <ESol5> sorry nothing to execute in that probably line - but its still confusing to me...[23:41:32] <ESol5> fyi: beadm create nightly[23:41:32] <ESol5> Unable to create nightly.[23:41:32] <ESol5> No such BE.[23:42:47] <ESol5> and /the second command/ : beadm mount nightly /mnt/x[23:42:47] <ESol5> nightly does not exist or appear to be a valid BE.[23:42:47] <ESol5> Please check that the name of the BE provided is correct.[23:43:01] <rennj> those where examples[23:45:36] *** alanc <alanc!~alanc@inet-hqmc02-o.oracle.com> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[23:46:04] *** alanc <alanc!~alanc@inet-hqmc02-o.oracle.com> has joined #openindiana[23:46:04] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o alanc[23:51:12] <ESol5> rennj: so that link is dated 2010, and its first line that you copied here failed...can I stop trying the rest?[23:52:39] <ESol5> i also dont underst why you sent that pasteboard, other than it shows how zfs prepares the next updated boot env when you pkg update so you can reboot into it[23:52:48] <ESol5> is that it?[23:54:11] <ESol5> I think the ideal at this point might be a boot parameter to make the filesystem gb's larger but Ive never seen this in any bsd/solaris boot screen...[23:58:24] *** _0x5eb_ <_0x5eb_!~seb@seb-hpws2.elen.ucl.ac.be> has quit IRC (Quit: Goodbye!)[23:59:40] *** _0x5eb_ <_0x5eb_!~seb@seb-hpws2.w1.tele.crt1.net> has joined #openindiana[23:59:58] <rennj> since you want in-memory os why not just run smartos than..its designed to run from ram