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[00:25:19] <herzen> az_ordog_maga: is there any reason why you don't just run WinXP inside vbox on Solaris?
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[01:09:43] <ianj|arc> it appears the mplayer2 package in sfebuild is missing some dependency information
[01:09:56] <ianj|arc> not a huge problem; just wanted to make a note.
[01:18:38] <herzen> ianj|arc: yes, I noticed that ffmpeg (!) didn't get included as a dep, because I named it incorrectly in the spec
[01:19:49] <herzen> I rebuilt it though, so the newest version in the repo should be OK
[01:27:21] <ianj|arc> ah OK
[01:27:27] <ianj|arc> I installed it last night
[01:27:30] <ianj|arc> when did you update it?
[01:28:51] <ianj|arc> (got the update now)
[01:29:24] <ianj|arc> does it need gcc/runtime as well?
[01:30:44] <herzen> yes, but g++/qt should pull that in
[01:30:52] <ianj|arc> ohh.
[01:31:06] <ianj|arc> I am not using smplayer.
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[01:31:23] <ianj|arc> so it seems installing mplayer2 without the qt frontend causes gcc/runtime to be missed
[01:32:48] <herzen> oh, sorry, I have Qt on my brain ATM
[01:32:57] <ianj|arc> :P
[01:34:08] <herzen> I meant ffmpeg should cause runtime/gcc to get pulled in
[01:35:18] <ianj|arc> ohh.
[01:35:39] <ianj|arc> yeah, ffmpeg has a lot of dependencies...
[01:35:50] <ianj|arc> I ended up building it and then finding it in the public repo the next morning
[01:36:33] <herzen> "pkg contents -H -t depend -o fmri <package name>" lists dependencies, BTW. somebody told me about that recently.
[01:37:44] <ianj|arc> ah, nice
[01:37:54] <ianj|arc> I'd just been digging through the manifests
[01:38:26] <herzen> I found it impossible how to figure out how to do that from the man page.
[01:38:44] <ianj|arc> the built-in web server works
[01:39:10] <ianj|arc> or pkgrecv if you have no GUI, I suppose.
[01:40:04] <herzen> yes. and you can also do "pkg contents -m <package name> | grep depend"
[01:40:21] <herzen> the '-m' prints out the raw manifest
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[01:41:12] <ianj|arc> nice.
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[02:09:51] <gnomad> does anyone know if the in-kernel CIFS server comes by default in openindiana 151b?
[02:12:17] <ianj|arc> that's been default for a while, hasn't it?
[02:12:21] <ianj|arc> (I haven't used it though)
[02:12:48] <gnomad> I'm just coming back to indiana after some time in Nexenta
[02:13:12] <ianj|arc> cool
[02:13:25] <ianj|arc> I just upgraded my desktop from Solaris 11 Express to OOI 151 last night
[02:13:28] <ianj|arc> *OI
[02:13:32] <ianj|arc> really impressed so far.
[02:13:48] <gnomad> my system disk with nexenta died, and I'm playing with OI now...
[02:14:16] <ianj|arc> I haven't run into any new bugs, noticed a number of improvements in the default config, and the branding is very tastefully done.
[02:15:07] <gnomad> so, when I zpool import my data, I'm getting a "smd add share failed"
[02:15:08] <ianj|arc> "openindiana" is a mouthful, but the "oi" logo is classy
[02:15:45] <gnomad> is there a way to quickly check if the in-kernel cifs bits are installed?
[02:16:10] <miine> ianj|arc: new oi logo?
[02:16:35] <ianj|arc> well, it's been the same since at least 148
[02:16:50] <miine> oh my god...
[02:17:08] <ianj|arc> but I've been using S11X until last night so I got the ugly Oracle "O in a red box"
[02:17:57] <gnomad> ok. I think I need to do  "pkg install storage-server" for the cifs bits...
[02:18:17] <miine> if at least the "oi" in a sun would be the official logo. but that openindiana with the ellipse doesn't stand for anything...
[02:19:11] <ianj|arc> I usually just plaster the Sun ambigram all over everything anyway
[02:19:21] <ianj|arc> but I think the "oi" in an ellipse looks good.
[02:20:28] <miine> nope. does it look like "rock solid server"?
[02:20:50] <ianj|arc> heh, I don't know
[02:20:54] <ianj|arc> I'm using it for a desktop
[02:23:17] <ianj|arc> OK, only issue so far... the GUI has locked up completely twice and had to be restarted.
[02:23:44] <miine> "i don't know" -> doesn't look like rock solid server. to begin with: the font is to fragile and it would end at the meaningless name...
[02:24:58] <ianj|arc> the only font I would rather have for it, really, is the font Sun used, but that is probably copyrighted.
[02:29:07] <miine> ianj|arc: for generating bitmap graphics the designer will license it and generate different sized logos with clear background for composing. wouldn't cost that much...
[02:30:29] <miine> ianj|arc: but that marketing stuff is not the top priority... otherwise the name wouldn't be a reference for insiders...
[02:30:50] <ianj|arc> I　 hate marketing anyway :P
[02:31:18] <ianj|arc> the clean, understated approach is refreshing
[02:31:47] <miine> ianj|arc: no - its a good thing done right.
[02:37:15] <richlowe> but doing it right isn't traditional.
[02:39:14] <miine> richlowe: "doing right" in sense of understanding human perception etc.
[02:41:28] <gnomad> damn, that pam passwd stuff gets me every time.
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[02:47:44] <herzen> ianj|arc: Arora built with gcc works now, after I added a patch to Qt that is used for the Sun Studio build
[02:47:53] <ianj|arc> OK
[02:47:55] <herzen> you can get it from the new testing repo if you like
[02:48:01] <ianj|arc> hmm, another question about packages, while we're at it...
[02:48:12] <herzen> I wonder if some Qt settings can be tweaked to make it look more Gnome-like
[02:48:17] <ianj|arc> it seems MP3 support doesn't come with 151.
[02:48:22] <ianj|arc> what's the package name to install it?
[02:49:15] <herzen> libmad
[02:50:33] <herzen> I guess ffmpeg uses its own internal mp3 decoder, since it doesn't link to libmad
[02:51:31] <herzen> but mpd does use that
[02:51:46] <ianj|arc> right
[02:51:52] <ianj|arc> ffmpeg seems to be pretty much self-contained
[02:52:02] <ianj|arc> but I'm trying to put my music back into Rhythmbox
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[02:52:23] <herzen> yeah, except for exotic codecs like schroedinger
[02:52:38] <ianj|arc> yeah
[02:52:43] <herzen> also, it gets its H.264 encoder from libx264
[02:52:58] <ianj|arc> huh, "no updates necessary for this image" when I try to install libmad
[02:53:02] <ianj|arc> it must come from something else.
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[02:53:09] <ianj|arc> oh right
[02:53:10] <ianj|arc> fluendo.
[02:53:12] <ianj|arc> d'oh
[02:53:30] <herzen> does Rhythmbox use gstreamer?
[02:53:38] <ianj|arc> yes
[02:54:22] <herzen> there's a spec at SFE for gstreamer-plugins that includes just about everything, but it doesn't build ATM because no one is maintaining it
[02:54:30] <ianj|arc> ugh
[02:54:36] <ianj|arc> well, I have the whole fluendo pack
[02:54:44] <ianj|arc> so I'll throw it at oi_151 and see what happens.
[02:55:37] <herzen> you're set I guess, if you have the fluendo stuff. that's more correct anyway IMO, then using the SFE gstreamer-plugins package
[02:56:04] <ianj|arc> the only problem with fluendo is that they offer their stuff as SysV packages... but that took 30 seconds to fix
[02:56:37] <herzen> but you should check out gmpc (Gnome Music Player Client). I think it's better than Rhythmbox.
[02:56:57] <ianj|arc> I've thought about setting up an mpd server
[02:57:31] <herzen> nothing to it. just configure it so it knows where the music directory is, and then run it as an ordinary user.
[02:57:50] <ianj|arc> that would also work because I'm going to grab a more current Mac desktop soon and I want to easily share the same music library between it and my Sun box
[02:58:03] <ianj|arc> although I'm not sure what I think of the Mac OS X mpd client yet.
[02:58:20] <herzen> I have no idea
[02:58:27] <ianj|arc> I think there's only one
[02:58:44] <ianj|arc> if I don't like it I guess I can mess around with it
[02:59:21] <ianj|arc> hm, gmpc isn't localized.
[03:00:40] <herzen> why is that a problem?
[03:02:23] <ianj|arc> I run my system in Japanese
[03:02:33] <ianj|arc> not the biggest problem in the world, but I'm just making mental notes.
[03:02:59] <herzen> you're Japanese?
[03:03:03] <ianj|arc> no
[03:03:35] <ianj|arc> I use the language, though.
[03:03:39] <herzen> oh. I studied Japanese for a while
[03:03:50] <ianj|arc> cool
[03:04:26] <ianj|arc> I try to avoid unnecessary exposure to English because I live in the US and it surrounds me every time I walk out the door
[03:05:37] <ianj|arc> fortunately Solaris/OI is very well-localized.
[03:05:45] <herzen> it's funny how people with unusual habits get attracted to OI/Solaris
[03:05:49] <ianj|arc> haha
[03:06:17] <ianj|arc> I guess you have to be a little unusual to end up in the circumstances that make you want to use Solaris on a home machine
[03:06:22] <ianj|arc> particularly as a desktop
[03:06:46] <herzen> I've been doing it since I learned about OpenSolaris, almost three years now
[03:07:03] <ianj|arc> cool
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[03:07:13] <herzen> sonata is a mpd that has Japanese localization. I think it uses Python. it's also in the repo
[03:07:22] <ianj|arc> cool
[03:07:24] <ianj|arc> nice name too
[03:07:26] <herzen> a mpd *client*
[03:07:27] <ianj|arc> and I think I've heard of it
[03:07:44] <ianj|arc> I've been on and off with Solaris as a desktop
[03:07:50] <ianj|arc> I have some Macs too, but they're kind of old
[03:08:04] <herzen> one cool thing about mpd is that you can switch clients when you get bored with one
[03:08:10] <ianj|arc> there is some stuff I don't like the Solaris pickings for, though... I don't like OpenOffice, for example
[03:08:28] <ianj|arc> or stuff I need/want a commercial solution for
[03:08:40] <ianj|arc> some people run Windows VMs for that, but I don't want Windows in my house
[03:08:57] <miine> speaking about desktops: could I connect with a SunRay to oi or do I have to pay Oracle for that?
[03:08:58] <herzen> I can stand it if it's in a VM
[03:09:16] <ianj|arc> I used to play with it in VMs occasionally just as a curiosity
[03:09:33] <ianj|arc> but now I have a job where I use a Windows machine, so I don't even want to see it unless I'm getting paid
[03:09:37] <herzen> I hardly use it now
[03:10:00] <herzen> so you want an office suite that's at the level of Microsoft Office, but you want it to be free?
[03:10:08] <ianj|arc> I don't care if it's free
[03:10:13] <herzen> oh
[03:10:15] <ianj|arc> I just want it to be good and run on my OS
[03:10:28] <ianj|arc> there are a few Mac offerings I like.
[03:10:31] <alanc> miine: you have to pay Oracle for the Sun Ray server software - it's always been an add-on product, not part of the OS
[03:10:41] <herzen> write a letter to Bill Gates, asking him to port Office to Unix ;)
[03:10:54] <ianj|arc> haha
[03:10:55] <miine> alanc: ah ok. so not one buying from ebay for cheap...
[03:10:56] <ianj|arc> that's okay
[03:11:05] <ianj|arc> what I'm going to do is buy one of those new i7 Mac Minis
[03:11:10] <ianj|arc> it will sit right on top of my Ultra 24
[03:11:32] <ianj|arc> I like a bit of variety anyway
[03:11:53] <miine> I'm trying to use 10.7 in VBox...
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[03:11:58] <ianj|arc> good luck
[03:12:02] <ianj|arc> do share if you get it to work
[03:12:18] <ianj|arc> I got my hands on it for the first time last week in a store because all of my Macs right now are 32-bit and won't run it
[03:12:45] <ianj|arc> oh herzen, I like the look of sonata... very clean-looking interface.
[03:12:53] <miine> ianj|arc: 10.6 works fine with a Null-power kext...
[03:13:04] <ianj|arc> right
[03:13:06] <ianj|arc> but that's 10.6
[03:13:21] <ianj|arc> Apple tends to make changes between major version bumps that break such work-arounds
[03:13:24] <ianj|arc> good luck though
[03:13:34] <miine> ianj|arc: my MacMini won't run 10.7 too. but don't want to buy a new one...
[03:13:48] <ianj|arc> I'm OK with buying a real Mac because I have a long history on Macs and I know I'll use it enough to justify it
[03:14:23] <miine> if I would have enough money I would like to do that too... :-(
[03:14:51] <ianj|arc> I was all bent out of shape about having to blow money on a Mac Pro at various points in the past, but now I have a nice big tower from Sun and I don't care if my Mac is like that anymore
[03:15:29] <ianj|arc> I was waiting for them to update the Mac Mini because I didn't want to blow $600 on last-generation tech
[03:15:50] <miine> I just need 10.7 for "playing" around and testing some stuff. otherwise 10.6 is fine for me...
[03:16:05] <miine> I even think that the 10.7 GUI is going the wrong direction...
[03:16:10] <ianj|arc> I don't need 10.7 for anything in particular, but my newest Mac is now five years old
[03:16:22] <ianj|arc> and it's a laptop, and I hate using laptops unless I'm taking one somewhere
[03:16:35] <ianj|arc> so I'll buy a new Mac and it will happen to come with 10.7.
[03:16:45] <miine> I never thought that at some point I would like OI's GNOME more than a Mac. But that day might come in a not so distant future...
[03:16:54] <ianj|arc> I'm not sure I can say that
[03:16:59] <ianj|arc> it is still kind of Windows-like
[03:17:24] <ianj|arc> it is beautiful and works pretty well overall, but I don't like how all the windows are just kind of out there on their own
[03:17:41] <ianj|arc> even with a new Mac, though, I still have a lot of business on an OI desktop machine.
[03:18:10] <miine> having that "candy" stuff on every application (like the new address book) - I just don't like it.
[03:18:38] <ianj|arc> oh yeah, I hate that too
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[03:18:38] <herzen> ianj|arc: I'm glad you like sonata. I guess I'll have to try it out.
[03:18:38] <ianj|arc> but I don't use that many Apple apps on my Macs
[03:18:38] <ianj|arc> so it won't really affect me
[03:18:50] <ianj|arc> I use Apple Mail and the calculator and that's about it :P
[03:19:11] <ianj|arc> I bring my own text editor, web browser, etc. etc.
[03:19:32] <ianj|arc> Calendar is terribly ugly in 10.7 but I'll never see it so it's whatever
[03:19:46] <miine> ianj|arc: TextMate?
[03:19:47] <ianj|arc> I'm not in the iCloud.
[03:19:50] <ianj|arc> BBEdit
[03:20:18] <ianj|arc> BBEdit has been my text editor since before I even knew what to do with a UNIX shell prompt
[03:20:34] <ianj|arc> way back in Mac OS 9-land.
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[03:21:34] <miine> before I forget. the worst thing is that "iTunes" look of XCode. it's a slap in the developers face...
[03:22:07] <ianj|arc> oh, I noticed that when I was building localizations into an application last week
[03:22:10] <ianj|arc> it is pretty weird
[03:22:24] <ianj|arc> but I don't intend to do much OS X development, so... yeah
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[03:23:13] <ianj|arc> I mostly want to use my Macs to browse the web, do content creation, consume media, and interface with the Sun and SGI machines where I do my heavy lifting
[03:23:20] <miine> once they were proud of overlapping many windows in a single application. it's like M$ was always right about having only one per app...
[03:23:52] <ianj|arc> oh yeah, I am a diehard fan of many-windowed, palette-having applications
[03:24:11] <ianj|arc> that approach is still alive in Mac OS X, although less common
[03:24:44] <ianj|arc> the whole full-screen app thing in 10.7 makes me cringe, but unless I decide to trigger it, I'll never see it, so oh well
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[03:25:11] <miine> is there a way to login into a different application than the gnome desktop? like opening a rdp session to a windows server?
[03:25:36] <ianj|arc> if you turn off gdm you can put whatever you want in your .xinitrc
[03:25:52] <ianj|arc> as long as a window manager gets launched somewhere along the way
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[03:26:16] <miine> how to do per-user?
[03:26:35] <ianj|arc> .xinitrc goes in your homedir
[03:26:48] <ianj|arc> well, yeah... disabling gdm is system-wide
[03:26:49] <miine> ah ok. thanks. will try that.
[03:26:56] <ianj|arc> but you could disable gdm and give everyone their own .xinitrc.
[03:27:05] <ianj|arc> if you really want to do that
[03:27:34] <ianj|arc> just make it launch twm and an X11-based RDP client, I guess
[03:27:38] * ianj|arc cringes
[03:30:10] <miine> will make my customer happy. so the oi server will replace a windows client too...
[03:30:55] <ianj|arc> good, then
[03:30:59] <miine> but I hope they don't power it off out of habbit :D
[03:31:02] <ianj|arc> it is still an unsavory task, but done for a positive end.
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[03:31:45] <miine> hope that at the end of the transition I could switch them from exchange server to simple imap. they have only email anyway...
[03:31:54] <ianj|arc> ew exchange
[03:31:57] <ianj|arc> good luck
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[04:15:27] <herzen> ianj|arc: you can use /usr/g++/bin/qtconfig to make Qt mimic GTK+
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[04:32:42] <sivanov_> can i use IP over FC with qlt?
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[05:08:47] <gnomad> I'm a big os x fan these days as well, and I must say this is the first time I have considered *not* upgrading.
[05:15:33] <Shadow__X> gnomad: really? how come
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[05:17:05] <gnomad> changes things I use a lot (spaces, expose) and supposedly makes things tight with only 2 GB of RAM
[05:17:37] <gnomad> I have one of the MB Pro's can can only use 3 GB when you have 4 GB installed, so I've never been inclined to bump up my ram.
[05:18:38] <gnomad> nonetheless, I am currently in the process of cleaning up my machine in preparation for the upgrade  -- I do a fresh install on every new version
[05:19:59] <Shadow__X> ah ok
[05:20:21] <Shadow__X> i use spaces and expose too. Just played with a new mb air those things are so thin and light
[05:20:35] <gnomad> I'm tempted to upgrade, but I'm just far too fond of my 17" matte screen, and I can't afford a direct replacement.
[05:21:05] <Shadow__X> you can get matte in a 15inch
[05:21:22] <gnomad> I think even in 13 these days.
[05:21:26] <Shadow__X> but even the highest 15 is 1680x1050
[05:21:41] <gnomad> that's what I have now in 17" and I find it works well.
[05:21:54] <Shadow__X> oh
[05:22:04] <Shadow__X> i thought all the 17s where wuxga 1920x1200
[05:22:35] <Shadow__X> you could get a mb air 13 with an i7 and it will be leaps and bounds faster than your older mbp
[05:22:36] <gnomad> I have the last gen where 1920x1200 was an optional upgrade
[05:22:41] <gnomad> indeed.
[05:22:43] <Shadow__X> but the 13 has 1440x900
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[05:23:14] <Shadow__X> it would appear in my market the 13 mbp does not have matte as an option
[05:23:17] <gnomad> I have been thinking about a base 13" MB Pro and then maxing out the ram
[05:23:35] <Shadow__X> the mb air is soooo thin and light
[05:24:35] <gnomad> what I *really* want is a machine without the optical drive but with built-in ethernet and firewire
[05:24:57] <gnomad> *sigh*
[05:24:57] <Shadow__X> you could get a 13 and do optibay
[05:25:43] <gnomad> yeah... I'd like to have both a SSD for speed and a rotating HD for capacity.
[05:26:06] <Shadow__X> http://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/DDAMBS0GB/
[05:26:21] <Shadow__X> i would shop around i am not sure is 75 bucks is a good price but still you can do it
[05:26:48] <gnomad> yup
[05:27:44] <Shadow__X> i am split between wanting a nice 15 inch fully maxed out mbp and loving how nice the 13 mb air is
[05:27:58] <Shadow__X> its soo thin
[05:28:17] <gnomad> heh, get both!
[05:28:21] <Shadow__X> and using it on my lap was more comfortable than my 2008 unibody macbook
[05:28:25] <Shadow__X> :)
[05:29:45] <gnomad> I must say, I'm surprised there hasn't been more coverage on the Air about how much the price dropped and performance improved.  Supposedly it's a real screamer
[05:30:08] <Shadow__X> i breifly played with on today and it seemed quick
[05:30:25] <Shadow__X> the ssd really makes a difference but having a better cpu helps too
[05:30:49] <gnomad> thing is, for the most part, I'm still quite happy with my 5 year old Core 2 Duo.
[05:31:41] <Shadow__X> i have my 2008 mb unibody and a 2010 mini base model and they are good
[05:31:53] <Shadow__X> but i definitely would appreciate the speed bumps
[05:31:57] <gnomad> I have *never* used a single machine, particularly a laptop, for so long
[05:32:24] <Shadow__X> hmmm in your case you should probably do a ssd as a boot drive and it will speed it up again
[05:32:34] <Shadow__X> everyone should have atleast one ssd
[05:32:37] <Shadow__X> soo fast
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[05:33:40] <gnomad> oddly enough, the only speed-related issue I've had has been recent versions of Safari.
[05:34:07] <gnomad> Switching to Chrome fixed that problem.
[05:34:24] <Shadow__X> i have noticed a difference between first gen c2d and penryn ones
[05:34:32] <Shadow__X> but it also depends on what you work on
[05:34:34] <gnomad> it's not a processing issue, Safari just seems to want to grind continuously to disk.
[05:35:02] <Shadow__X> when i first got this mac mini i had issues with multitasking, the stock drive is too slow
[05:35:14] <gnomad> I'm doing micro-controller development at the moment, and 10,000 lines is a lot of code.
[05:35:19] <Shadow__X> after 8gb of ram and a new ssd those issues went clean away
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[05:35:30] <gnomad> compile times are a non-issue.
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[05:54:03] <gnomad> so, is there any word of an estimated release date for OI 151?
[05:54:36] <alanc> there was a 2-6 week estimage in the recent announcement I thnk
[05:54:47] <gnomad> ok.
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[07:08:40] <richlowe> time to find a way to break X subtly in revenge.
[07:09:04] <richlowe> alanc: still can't find where this section actually originates.
[07:11:21] <alanc> I've never actually looked at that code
[07:11:43] <alanc> of course, I've never looked at most of the freetype code either, and here I am pushing through a new release to break all your fonts
[07:12:24] <alanc> freetype: choose your fonts broken, or jailbroken
[07:22:31] <richlowe> alanc: which code?
[07:22:44] <richlowe> alanc: I was just meaning I should find a way to consume you with puzzlement for an evening or more.
[07:22:51] <alanc> the linker code
[07:22:56] <richlowe> You should!
[07:23:00] <richlowe> it's educational!
[07:23:07] <alanc> I'm certain
[07:24:23] <alanc> wonderful release notes for freetype 2.4.6 - "Various stroking glitches has been fixed." - users get so unhappy when their stroking is glitchy, but it's usually not freetype they blame for that
[07:24:32] <richlowe> though it's kind of like an abattoir, in that sometimes you really don't want to know where your binaries ultimately come from.
[07:24:43] <richlowe> also, ankle deep in blood.
[07:25:30] <alanc> well, when you have to sacrifice a small animal for every bug fix, the blood does build up
[07:26:12] <alanc> I wonder if Oracle has the same prohibitions against substutiting interns for animal sacrifices that Sun did...
[07:26:40] <gnomad> doubt it
[07:29:59] <richlowe> movlpd %xmm0 (%rsp)
[07:30:08] <richlowe> movq (%rsp), %rcx
[07:30:20] <richlowe> gotta wonder why you'd go via the stack
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[08:21:21] <sivanov_> what program to use to measure memory speed under solaris?
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[09:34:39] <leoric> Hello. I have question about mounting  swap on tmp in default config. Is it safe?  I've just filled /tmp on my test box with dd, after this system hanged (processes could not fork()), so I had to reset the system. But what will prevent casual user from filling /tmp and bringing system down?
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[09:37:27] <tsoome> 2 things
[09:37:28] <lblume> leoric: If you don't trust your users, you can restrict the size of swap. See mount_tmpfs(1M)
[09:37:56] <tsoome> give enough swap and limit /tmp if needed
[09:38:32] <leoric> Yes, I know. But having no limit on /tmp by default is at least strange...
[09:38:46] <tsoome> and third one is educate users. /tmp is not for huge files, its quick storage for small files
[09:39:09] <lblume> *shrugs* a lot of the default for swap on Solaris have been carved in stone during the 80's, and nobody dares modify them.
[09:40:31] <tsoome> even in huge shell server in university environment we had no problem with filled up /tmp, except for very few cases
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[09:41:28] <tsoome> the thing is, if user home is limited, but there is need for space for larger files, you can provide such place to push people to use it instead of /tmp
[09:42:06] <lblume> Anyhow, a full /tmp is barely better than full memory, too many things depend on it.
[09:42:17] <tsoome> limiting /tmp is nice to prevent virtual memory to be filled up, but if your /tmp is full, its still problem
[09:42:30] <tsoome> lots of things *will* break.
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[09:42:49] <tsoome> so the key question is, how to train users not to fill it up
[09:44:14] <lblume> Issues I've had with it were not on interactive, users could not be blamed, sadly.
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[09:44:32] <leoric> I can't trust our users: they are casual students in terminal classes... And some of them may have strange passion to bring down the system... No, it's not a big problem, I'll just limit /tmp, but I was just surprised:
[09:44:32] <leoric> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/tmp/garbage # forgot that it is swap and wished to test multipath
[09:44:32] <leoric> and later couldn't even ssh to the test box. On FreeBSD at least filling /tmp doesn't break system down. However, there are stranges with mpt
[09:45:33] <tsoome> yes, it can be problem, you also can mount /tmp from disk and not tmpfs at all
[09:46:23] <tsoome> but nevertheless, it will only solve the potential issue of filled vmem, but again, if your /tmp is full, you will see lots of broken apps
[09:48:18] <lblume> chmod 000 /tmp
[09:48:22] <lblume> :-D
[09:48:23] <tsoome> what we did in university, was hat we set quota for homes big enough to let them to download common size files, so they had the temporary space and didn't had to find clever ways to get files downloaded anyhow
[09:49:13] <lblume> Just mount /tmp to a real FS with user quota
[09:49:32] <tsoome> that can help as well
[09:50:09] <tsoome> but then you still need to make sure your tmp is larger than user count * quota
[09:51:29] <lblume> And run it in a zone, of course, so users just can't take the system down.
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[09:52:17] <az_ordog_maga> aloha
[09:52:22] <tsoome> the default unix logic is to give people reasonable freedom, you can set severe limits if needed still
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[09:55:04] <leoric> I would be happy to run it in zone, but SRSS doesn't work in zone. And I don't remember why we didn't run user environments in zone.
[09:55:36] <tsoome> also at least some apps/apis honor TMPDIR environment variable, so you can "redirect" /tmp (and close it for users ), but thats not too reliable way.
[09:56:11] <lblume> Yeah, I thought about that, but /tmp is hardcoded in too many places. You really can't move it.
[09:57:05] <tsoome> so, if you are really concerned, put /tmp on real disk and maybe apply quotas (there is no quota support on tmpfs)
[09:57:22] <lblume> And don't forget /var/tmp
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[09:58:31] <tsoome> yep, /var/tmp is already on disk (to provide shared permanent storage), and may be abused as well.
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[10:30:52] <richlowe> Occaisionally, I think about how much I'd love to have variant symlinks
[10:30:55] <richlowe> as, I believe DFBSD does
[10:31:08] <richlowe> then link /tmp -> '$HOME/tmp'
[10:31:16] <richlowe> (and /var/tmp, and...)
[10:34:44] <tsoome> well, yes and no
[10:35:11] <tsoome> similar issue as with ~/.profile hell they have created - the user support will be busy.
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[10:36:02] <lblume> Give iMacs to users and be done with them?
[10:36:14] <tsoome> that too
[10:36:21] <tsoome> :D
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[10:52:27] <sh4rm4> hi.. i'm searching the solaris libc source code. someone suggested that openindiana forked it
[10:52:47] <sh4rm4> cant find a link on the homepage though
[10:52:56] <sh4rm4> to anything that looks like a repo
[10:57:30] <nettezzaumana> sh4rm4: type to browser openindiana.org and then hit enter
[10:58:24] <nettezzaumana> sh4rm4: then by fast on text and sentence "OpenIndiana is a robust enterprise operating system, based on illumos and .." turn on your brain and click on *illumos
[10:59:15] <nettezzaumana> sh4rm4: and on illumos site click on bloody illumos gate: Source
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[11:32:04] <eto> hey guys is there a way in setup to zap whole drive?
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[11:33:53] <eto> nevermind, isntall took care of that
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[12:02:06] <tsoome> happy http://www.sysadminday.com/ :P
[12:05:30] <lblume> I think it should start at 5pm with a beer.
[12:05:49] * lblume goes back to ponder over his RHEL boxen.
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[13:12:20] <az_ordog_maga> aloha
[13:14:02] <Shadow__X> tsoome: good stuff
[13:14:12] <tsoome> :P
[13:14:41] <Shadow__X> its funny how quickly people forget how much hard work goes into what they normally take for granted
[13:14:49] <Shadow__X> until something goes wrong of course
[13:14:53] <Shadow__X> then they are up in arms
[13:15:14] <tsoome> as usual.
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[13:43:52] <az_ordog_maga> if i installed the opensolaris can i upgrade to openindiana?
[13:44:06] <az_ordog_maga> anybod some experience with this process?
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[14:00:33] <Gugge> az_ordog_maga: first hit on http://www.google.dk/search?q=upgrade+to+openindiana+from+opensolaris is to the openindiana wiki
[14:00:47] <az_ordog_maga> thx
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[14:03:37] <az_ordog_maga> http://wiki.openindiana.org/oi/Installing+or+Upgrading#InstallingorUpgrading-UpgradingfromOpenSolaris
[14:03:44] <az_ordog_maga> good
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[14:35:35] <eto> i forgot where gnuls is located
[14:35:40] <eto> has anybody clue?
[14:36:05] <tsoome> echo $PATH
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[14:37:27] <eto> tsoome: /usr/bin:/bin:/home/eto/bin
[14:37:32] <chrisridd> et0: /usr/gnu/bin/ls ?
[14:37:36] <eto> i need to flesh it out
[14:37:42] <chrisridd> s/et0/sto/
[14:37:44] <eto> chrisridd: thank you
[14:38:00] <tsoome> heh
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[14:40:43] <eto> also where can i define default path for each user?
[14:40:52] <eto> i mean something like login.conf
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[14:41:46] <eto> bedsides .profile
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[14:46:12] <tsoome>  /etc/default/login
[14:47:22] <tsoome> the default setup is fucked as for some reason they did set up those ~/.profile files violating system configuration and common sense.
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[15:41:05] <chrisridd> Are there any logadm experts in the house?
[15:50:14] <EisNerd> damn
[15:50:37] <EisNerd> my osol system refuses to boot after upgrade to oi 148
[15:50:38] <docsteel> EisNerd: What the Fuck have you done with dione?
[15:50:58] <EisNerd> pygrub refuses to work
[15:51:03] <EisNerd> damn python hack
[15:51:20] <docsteel> paste me the /boot/grub/grub.cfg
[15:51:35] <docsteel> Have the same problem with the Debian Xen Machines
[15:52:39] <EisNerd> http://pastebin.com/VjFZipn6
[15:53:35] <docsteel> hm...looks okay to me
[15:56:22] <lennard> does grub have ISADIR without further config?
[15:57:31] <EisNerd> someone here who could help me creating a static boot config without pygrub
[15:58:10] <lennard> I only have a grub2 config around somewhere
[16:07:37] <EisNerd> uhm could I import an existing rpool on a oi livecd or do I have to do it in special way
[16:08:24] <docsteel> import should work iirc
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[16:15:22] <EisNerd> shit someone must have tried to start the machine in parallel
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[16:16:14] <docsteel> EisNerd: not me
[16:16:50] <docsteel> anyone with VPN Access
[16:16:57] <docsteel> i see 2 vpn logins
[16:17:58] <EisNerd> docsteel: how could I see this
[16:18:59] <docsteel> I will check who
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[16:19:17] <EisNerd> that was me
[16:19:21] <docsteel> ups sry
[16:19:47] <docsteel> wait a second
[16:20:41] <docsteel> EisNerd: you are also logged in to saturn?
[16:20:46] <EisNerd> yes
[16:20:48] <docsteel> okay
[16:21:59] <docsteel> EisNerd: see query
[16:22:11] <EisNerd> is there anything more to revive a damaged pool than zpool import -F
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[16:51:58] <EisNerd> is there another way to read the bootfs flag from a pool as zdb
[16:52:13] <EisNerd> (and prtconf -v on a successfull booted system)
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[17:10:55] <|AbsyntH|> <tsoome> happy http://www.sysadminday.com/ :P
[17:10:55] <|AbsyntH|> <lblume> I think it should start at 5pm with a beer.
[17:10:55] <|AbsyntH|>  it's 17:08 "I'm late / I'm late / For a very important date. / No time to say "Hello." / Goodbye. / I'm late, I'm late, I'm late. "  damn it!
[17:12:28] <bradend> "There can't be a crisis next week. My schedule is already full." - Kissinger
[17:12:47] <bradend> Words for a Sysadmin to live by.
[17:13:45] <bdha> Heh.
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[17:15:37] <lblume> |AbsyntH|: But the beer?! Where is the beer?!
[17:17:03] <|AbsyntH|> sounds like the Schrödinger's beer
[17:18:40] <lblume> ... you can't know if it's stale or not before opening the box, or something?
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[17:27:31] * |AbsyntH| take a beer for lblume ...the cat is died :)
[17:28:05] <lblume> Not drowned inside my beer mug, hopefully?
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[17:29:50] <|AbsyntH|> nope...it has tried to steal the beer
[17:30:59] <lblume> that is a most heinous crime that deserves the stronget punishment.
[17:32:02] <bradend> Well, the cat is indeed dead.
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[17:33:08] <|AbsyntH|> it has not suffered… a lot
[17:33:34] <lblume> Well, do better next time.
[17:34:01] <lblume> I *think* it's time to go home and check what beer bottles are left in my fridge....
[17:34:10] <bradend> Get more beer on the way home!
[17:34:13] <miine> can I determine on a file (or missing of it) inside a zone if that zone has already has been booted and applied the sysidcfg ?
[17:34:41] <|AbsyntH|> prosit lblume !
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[19:32:46] <miine> hmm. still wondering how to check if svc.configd has applied sysidcfg. I need to check that from the global zone and the zone to check is not booted yet...
[19:33:46] <miine> anyone?
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[19:47:21] <tsoome> check if /var/log/sysidconfig.log is there?
[19:47:34] <tsoome> from zone root
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[19:48:46] <tsoome> if you have unconfigured zone around, check which .files you have in its  /etc
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[20:07:36] <miine> tsoome: sorry, was just away.
[20:08:29] <miine> tsoome: thanks. will look if /var/log/sysidconfig.log will also tell me if it succeeded or not (currently patching puppet's solaris provider)
[20:10:38] <tsoome> sysidcfg used to depend on some files in /etc as well, but I can't recall the details, would need to digg more in jumpstart example post install scripts etc, also ipkg systems may have some changes
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[20:13:00] <miine> tsoome: I will check if the logfile is there: if not, the zone needs to be bootstrapped for puppet. if that fails I will rename the logfile so I know on a further run that the zone still needs to be bootstrapped ...
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[20:15:21] <tsoome>  /etc/.sysIDtool.state is the file
[20:15:31] <tsoome> sysidtool service is depending on it
[20:16:09] <miine> tsoome: perfect! many thanks!
[20:16:23] <tsoome> also /etc/.UNCONFIGURED will trigger sysidconfig start
[20:17:06] <tsoome> check sysidtool* method scripts
[20:17:41] <miine> do you use puppet (and zones)?
[20:18:06] <richlowe> do you mean "use puppet to create zones?"
[20:18:16] <tsoome> our production systems use zones a log, but on s10
[20:18:21] <tsoome> a lot*
[20:18:30] <richlowe> 'cos I don't, because bdha had said it was a pain in the ass and/or flaky
[20:18:43] <richlowe> and I'm fundamentally easy to anger.
[20:18:50] <miine> yep. I'm questioning because how would you like to have bootstrapping them?
[20:19:49] <tsoome> its possible to feed sysidcfg to zones as well, to automate first boot
[20:20:27] <miine> what puppet misses is: setting the pkg providers (for puppet pkg, if needed with certs/keys), installing the puppet pkg, calling puppet...
[20:20:31] <richlowe> tsoome: wouldn't be easy to arrange that via puppet.
[20:20:43] <tsoome> no idea, never seen puppet:)
[20:20:51] <richlowe> miine: adding providers -> exec {}
[20:21:01] <richlowe> miine: calling puppet -> write an easy SMF service
[20:21:14] <richlowe> installing the puppet pkg, find a fixed copy of the pkg provider, then..
[20:21:29] <richlowe> (I have a "fixed" one on github, but it's only marginally tested)
[20:21:32] <richlowe> I mean, I'm using it.
[20:21:40] <richlowe> but I didn't really see whether it worked, if that makes sense.
[20:22:03] <richlowe> must be a better way of phrasing that.
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[20:22:13] <miine> richlowe: exec wouldn't work, because it should be run after booting the zone first time (if successfully sysidcfged...)
[20:22:45] <miine> so it needs to be in the zone provider. the manifests don't know of those internal states...
[20:26:05] <miine> I will try an exec solution. but I fear that might have negative side effects (calling it every time etc. and the publisher isn't available...)
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[20:27:59] <miine> at least I've added filesystems to the provider...
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[21:28:12] <jkimball4> where does libDtSvc.so come from?  not seeing it in repo
[21:28:21] <jkimball4> trying to install citrix receiver for solaris
[21:28:32] <jkimball4> all was going well
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[21:40:34] <jkimball4> added .1 and it turned up
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[22:24:42] <alanc> libDtSvc would be a cde library
[22:25:06] <alanc> which means using binary packages from opensolaris since sources aren't available
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[22:55:19] <mnaser> Is there any io monitoring utilities for ZFS (not globally, but for a specific volume)
[22:55:46] <bdha> fsstat
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[22:57:00] <mnaser> i kinda need to store this data historically, any suggested tool or should i poll fsstat and store the data?
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[23:30:59] <phretor_> does anybody see any issues in this configuration? I'd like to connect two mirrored system drives via USB. The first issue that I foresee is that the mirrored pool may not be bootable. Or is it?
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[23:34:08] <tsoome> why are you doing that?:)
[23:34:35] <Alasdairrr> you can installgrub on both drives
[23:34:51] <tsoome> you have to;)
[23:35:03] <phretor_> tsoome: because I can't get the damn eSATA ports to work :)
[23:35:15] <tsoome> i see
[23:35:49] <tsoome> at least you got some reason;)
[23:36:05] <phretor_> tsoome: actually, it should work. The si3124 should support the sil3132 chip, it's in pure AHCI mode. I'm suspecting it's SATA-to-eSATA cable which isn't working.
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   July 29, 2011  
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