September 14, 2016 
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ZZZzzz…)[01:14:38] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[01:15:37] *** yuung <yuung!~jmarinell@72.34.110.10> has joined ##OpenGL[01:17:10] *** bookmark <bookmark!~IceChat77@173-169-112-35.res.bhn.net> has joined ##OpenGL[01:18:32] *** fqtw_ <fqtw_!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[01:19:55] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.58.248> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[01:20:57] *** CapsAdmin <CapsAdmin!~CapsAdmin@ti0115a400-1989.bb.online.no> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[01:21:43] *** fqtw__ <fqtw__!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[01:22:26] *** flavi0 <flavi0!~anon@unaffiliated/flavi0> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[01:23:57] *** przm <przm!~przm@ool-44c79cfa.dyn.optonline.net> has joined ##OpenGL[01:24:06] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.58.248> has joined ##OpenGL[01:28:03] *** przm <przm!~przm@ool-44c79cfa.dyn.optonline.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[01:34:17] *** descender <descender!~heh@2406:3003:200b:c6:e546:3a83:3de9:14d6> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[01:34:53] *** Coldseeker <Coldseeker!~Frosty@adsl-per-2-85.ozonline.com.au> has joined ##OpenGL[01:36:12] *** bjz <bjz!~bjz@pa49-199-193-237.pa.vic.optusnet.com.au> has joined ##OpenGL[01:37:31] *** swnc <swnc!~swnc@port-92-204-6-186.dynamic.qsc.de> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[01:40:33] <Codex_> hmm, passing mat4 matrix as uniform array seems to be kinda difficult :-)[01:40:50] <Codex_> somehow it keeps failing :-)[01:41:17] *** Joefish <Joefish!~Joefish@p5B1216A8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[01:41:50] <Codex_> comment out *m from the shader, and it works ok (but without the matrix)[01:45:19] *** Guest95748 <Guest95748!~quassel@pD9F9005A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[01:45:46] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has joined ##OpenGL[01:49:24] *** bjz <bjz!~bjz@pa49-199-193-237.pa.vic.optusnet.com.au> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[01:50:42] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[01:56:44] *** fqtw__ <fqtw__!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[01:57:39] <slime> what's your code?[01:59:15] *** Lunatrius <Lunatrius!~Lunatrius@77.38.21.26> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[01:59:36] *** Lunatrius <Lunatrius!~Lunatrius@77.38.21.26> has joined ##OpenGL[02:00:22] *** fqtw_ <fqtw_!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[02:01:22] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[02:02:03] *** indefini <indefini!~chris@240d:1a:1ca:ac00:3602:86ff:fe47:864b> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[02:03:31] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has joined ##OpenGL[02:04:04] *** cam_y <cam_y!~cam_y@209-234-175-138.static.twtelecom.net> has quit IRC ()[02:04:40] *** anli_ <anli_!~anders@217-211-66-29-no23.tbcn.telia.com> has joined ##OpenGL[02:08:30] *** MrFlibble <MrFlibble!MrFlibble@90.196.207.27> has quit IRC (Quit: MrFlibble)[02:10:06] *** SoNik_ <SoNik_!~SoNik_@ppp091138138104.dsl.hol.gr> has joined ##OpenGL[02:10:51] *** anli_ <anli_!~anders@217-211-66-29-no23.tbcn.telia.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[02:12:12] *** carado <carado!~carado@2a01:e34:ec1e:2390:8341:b3f5:2d6:41fa> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[02:12:23] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[02:12:57] <Codex_> slime: http://codepad.org/m3Tpa8Jh[02:13:18] <Codex_> I've pretty much tried everything :-)[02:13:34] <Codex_> that std::cout shows good looking matrices..[02:13:41] <slime> glUniformMatrix4fv(loc, 1, GL_FALSE, ptr); should be glUniformMatrix4fv(loc, v.size(), GL_FALSE, ptr);[02:13:50] <slime> er wait[02:13:56] <slime> well, you can just replace that loop with that[02:14:18] <Codex_> yes, I had that approach first[02:14:28] <Codex_> changing it to this version didn't help with the problem :-)[02:15:02] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has joined ##OpenGL[02:15:26] <slime> http://hastebin.com/burugojela.cpp[02:15:30] <slime> what's your shader code?[02:15:59] <Codex_> its lines 1..17[02:16:19] <Codex_> if I change line 13 to remove the *m, it'll work fine[02:16:40] *** yuung <yuung!~jmarinell@72.34.110.10> has quit IRC (Quit: Lost terminal)[02:16:46] <Codex_> with the matrix, it'll just disappear from the screen[02:16:48] <slime> have you verified your matrix data you send to the shader?[02:17:15] <Codex_> yes, I have two different matrices, and they're identity matrix, and some z-rotation matrix.[02:17:28] <Codex_> but the numbers look ok at the std::cout[02:18:36] *** CapsAdmin <CapsAdmin!~CapsAdmin@ti0115a400-1989.bb.online.no> has joined ##OpenGL[02:19:09] *** slime <slime!~slime73@blk-215-81-93.eastlink.ca> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[02:20:11] <Codex_> line 28 had some GL_FALSE which might be wrong, but I've tried GL_TRUE and it didn't help :-)[02:20:35] *** pril <pril!~userid@unaffiliated/pril> has quit IRC ()[02:21:16] *** slime <slime!~slime73@blk-215-81-93.eastlink.ca> has joined ##OpenGL[02:21:31] <Codex_> glGetError gave just 0 after that call[02:23:24] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[02:24:13] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has joined ##OpenGL[02:42:26] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.58.248> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[02:54:54] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has joined ##OpenGL[02:57:03] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[03:02:52] *** Birchy <Birchy!~Birchy@178-164-108.52.3p.ntebredband.no> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)[03:05:20] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@AReims-652-1-76-199.w86-192.abo.wanadoo.fr> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[03:05:56] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@AReims-652-1-76-199.w86-192.abo.wanadoo.fr> has joined ##OpenGL[03:10:32] *** glYoda <glYoda!~MTLYoda@c-50-137-137-82.hsd1.or.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: glYoda)[03:10:52] *** fqtw <fqtw!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[03:12:41] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[03:13:16] *** fqtw_ <fqtw_!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[03:13:44] *** fqtw__ <fqtw__!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[03:14:22] *** NateRiver <NateRiver!~IceChat9@softbank126093098229.bbtec.net> has joined ##OpenGL[03:16:19] *** fqtw <fqtw!~me@x590e06d4.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[03:28:34] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@162.242.94.233> has joined ##OpenGL[03:28:35] *** indefini <indefini!~indefini@124x35x243x164.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp> has joined ##OpenGL[03:28:44] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@162.242.94.233> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[03:30:23] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@162.242.94.233> has joined ##OpenGL[03:34:03] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[03:36:30] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:5c20:2a22:c264:98a1> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[03:40:11] *** upgrdman <upgrdman!~upgrdman@blender/artist/upgrdman> has joined ##OpenGL[03:40:21] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[03:41:29] *** Zerflag <Zerflag!~zerflag@216-19-179-103.dyn.novuscom.net> has joined ##OpenGL[03:43:40] *** xaxxon <xaxxon!~xaxxon@c-24-18-184-142.hsd1.wa.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)[03:44:57] *** therue <therue!~therue@1-162-75-104.dynamic.hinet.net> has joined ##OpenGL[03:46:55] *** Zerflag <Zerflag!~zerflag@216-19-179-103.dyn.novuscom.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[03:49:15] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@162.242.94.233> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. 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##OpenGL[07:32:12] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[07:53:11] *** Guest65200 <Guest65200!~SorcererX@cm-84.212.210.160.getinternet.no> has quit IRC (Quit: brb)[07:53:53] *** SorcererX <SorcererX!~SorcererX@cm-84.212.210.160.getinternet.no> has joined ##OpenGL[07:58:58] *** anli <anli!~anli@gn62-116-231-34.business.gavlenet.com> has joined ##OpenGL[07:59:06] <anli> Can I do polyhedron subtraction with three.js?[08:02:12] *** karab44 <karab44!~karab44@unaffiliated/karab44> has joined ##OpenGL[08:15:45] <Stragus> Perhaps #javascript would know? Doesn't seem related to OpenGL[08:15:51] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[08:16:09] *** Codex_ <Codex_!~terop@91-157-91-164.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[08:16:46] *** Arch1eN <Arch1eN!~Arch1eN@77.79.228.134> has joined ##OpenGL[08:16:53] <btipling> there's also #gamedev[08:20:23] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[08:21:06] *** stelarcf_ <stelarcf_!~stelarcf@178.138.34.53> has joined ##OpenGL[08:26:52] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host55-255-dynamic.30-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has joined ##OpenGL[08:28:19] *** upgrdman <upgrdman!~upgrdman@blender/artist/upgrdman> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[08:32:28] *** carado <carado!~carado@2a01:e34:ec1e:2390:8341:b3f5:2d6:41fa> has joined ##OpenGL[08:34:58] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[08:36:07] *** sandeepkr_ <sandeepkr_!~sandeepkr@111.235.65.5> has joined ##OpenGL[08:37:04] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[08:39:14] *** wolfcub <wolfcub!~henrique_@177.55.194.98> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[08:39:26] *** kuldeep <kuldeep!~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[08:39:45] *** sandeepkr <sandeepkr!~sandeepkr@103.49.155.114> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[08:40:48] <dahlia> so in webgl on ios 10 if I have alpha set to 0.0 then everything renders black[08:40:54] *** sandeepkr_ <sandeepkr_!~sandeepkr@111.235.65.5> has quit IRC (Max SendQ exceeded)[08:41:22] *** sandeepkr_ <sandeepkr_!~sandeepkr@111.235.65.5> has joined ##OpenGL[08:41:23] <dahlia> if I clamp alpha from 0.01 to 1.0 then it works like other OSs/browsers[08:41:46] *** sandeepkr_ <sandeepkr_!~sandeepkr@111.235.65.5> has quit IRC (Max SendQ exceeded)[08:42:59] <dahlia> the alpha parameter for gl_FragColor[08:43:56] <dawik> dahlia: what is your glClearColor ?[08:44:04] <dawik> maybe it shouldn't matter[08:44:21] *** neure <neure!~tsuorant@46.163.250.82> has joined ##OpenGL[08:44:23] <dahlia> it should be a light blue[08:44:34] <dahlia> default sky color[08:44:50] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[08:44:54] *** kuldeep <kuldeep!~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka> has joined ##OpenGL[08:45:00] <dahlia> everything worked fine before ios 10 upgrade[08:46:45] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[08:47:41] *** kuldeep <kuldeep!~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka> has quit IRC (Max SendQ exceeded)[08:48:20] *** kuldeep <kuldeep!~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka> has joined ##OpenGL[08:48:59] *** stelarcf_ <stelarcf_!~stelarcf@178.138.34.53> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[08:50:21] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[08:50:45] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[08:51:36] *** robot-beethoven <robot-beethoven!~robot-bee@c-73-65-29-166.hsd1.mn.comcast.net> has joined ##OpenGL[08:54:49] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host55-255-dynamic.30-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[08:55:45] *** Codex_ <Codex_!~terop@91-157-91-164.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has joined ##OpenGL[08:58:41] *** Vag <Vag!~Vag@ppp-2-85-27-198.home.otenet.gr> has quit IRC (Quit: Linkinus - 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ZZZzzz…)[10:19:31] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[10:22:29] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[10:23:29] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[10:26:27] *** fkaa <fkaa!~tundmatu@c83-254-208-131.bredband.comhem.se> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[10:27:03] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has joined ##OpenGL[10:27:04] *** fkaa <fkaa!~tundmatu@c83-254-208-131.bredband.comhem.se> has joined ##OpenGL[10:27:29] *** Serpent7776 <Serpent7776!~Serpent77@90-156-68-175.internetia.net.pl> has joined ##OpenGL[10:30:11] *** zerd <zerd!~quassel@bat.slash.no> has joined ##OpenGL[10:31:33] *** bjz <bjz!~bjz@14-201-215-168.tpgi.com.au> has joined ##OpenGL[10:33:12] *** flavi0 <flavi0!~anon@unaffiliated/flavi0> has joined ##OpenGL[10:33:45] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[10:35:30] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[10:37:17] *** zerd <zerd!~quassel@bat.slash.no> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[10:41:23] *** zerd <zerd!~quassel@bat.slash.no> has joined ##OpenGL[10:41:27] *** ertesx <ertesx!~never@p5485F766.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[10:42:24] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[10:42:51] *** rellla_ is now known as rellla[10:43:09] *** Zerflag <Zerflag!~zerflag@216-19-179-103.dyn.novuscom.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[10:43:21] *** Pseudocrat <Pseudocrat!~quassel@unaffiliated/pseudocrat> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[10:45:02] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[10:45:30] *** ertes <ertes!~never@pD9FCB383.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[10:46:39] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[10:51:42] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[10:51:43] *** bjz <bjz!~bjz@14-201-215-168.tpgi.com.au> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[10:52:44] *** bjz <bjz!~bjz@14-201-215-168.tpgi.com.au> has joined ##OpenGL[10:55:26] *** svp <svp!~svp@unaffiliated/svp> has joined ##OpenGL[10:57:38] *** robot-beethoven <robot-beethoven!~robot-bee@c-73-65-29-166.hsd1.mn.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[10:59:02] *** Beetny <Beetny!~Beetny@14-202-48-200.tpgi.com.au> has joined ##OpenGL[10:59:08] *** bjz <bjz!~bjz@14-201-215-168.tpgi.com.au> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[10:59:10] *** bjz_ <bjz_!~bjz@14-201-215-168.tpgi.com.au> has joined ##OpenGL[11:06:16] <Curious_> Can't find the glsl specification entry for the definition of / for integer types. Can anyone point me to that?[11:06:42] <Yaniel> what about them?[11:06:52] <Curious_> I need the definition of /[11:07:07] <Curious_> The division operator for integer types.[11:07:18] <Yaniel> ah[11:08:01] *** fqtw_ <fqtw_!~me@x590c71e2.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[11:08:44] <Curious_> Since the modulus operator is undefined for negative numbers I need to define my own mod function and for that I need the division operator to be truncated towards 0[11:09:44] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@AReims-652-1-76-199.w86-192.abo.wanadoo.fr> has joined ##OpenGL[11:09:52] *** nolash <nolash!~nolash@ip5f5bd522.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[11:10:15] <Stragus> I believe it's always truncated toward zero if the divisor is positive[11:10:18] <dawik> abs(mod(X, n)) ?[11:10:51] <dawik> sorry, mod((absX), n) ?[11:10:56] <dawik> damnit[11:11:03] * dawik flees with tail between his legs[11:11:16] <Curious_> I need to be sure that's why I'd like to find the definition of the specification[11:11:25] *** fqtw <fqtw!~me@x590c71e2.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[11:11:58] *** fqtw_ is now known as fqtw[11:12:11] <Curious_> mod(abs(-1), 4) = 1 which is wrong, it should be either -1 or 3[11:12:20] *** nolash <nolash!~nolash@ip5f5bd522.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de> has joined ##OpenGL[11:12:43] <Stragus> If you do the abs() trick, you would need to store the sign, you could use sign()[11:14:45] <Curious_> Hmm ya that might work. But with % instead of mod() because mod() is not defined as I need it to[11:16:10] *** Zerflag <Zerflag!~zerflag@216-19-179-103.dyn.novuscom.net> has joined ##OpenGL[11:16:42] <Stragus> I don't like how sign() is defined to return 0 for zero input values, sounds like extra instructions (unless there's a hardware "sign" instruction, no such thing on Nvidia)[11:17:21] <Curious_> Why extra instructions?[11:17:59] <Stragus> foo = ( bar < 0 ? -1 : 1 ); is more efficient than the alternative with a zero special case[11:18:22] <Curious_> I don't think sign() has any ? :[11:18:27] <Curious_> It should be branchless[11:18:58] <Yaniel> isn't a certain bitmask + shift even more efficient[11:19:08] <Curious_> Exactly Yaniel[11:19:11] <Yaniel> actually the shift is probably enough[11:19:40] <Stragus> Nvidia hardware has the equivalent of a "copysign" instruction, not "sign" with a 0.0 special case[11:21:23] <Curious_> But the real question is: Why doesn't the standard define the division operator anywhere. I'm confused[11:23:15] <Curious_> If they don't define it explicitly then I guess it's implementation defined which isn't very convenient.[11:23:54] <Stragus> Do you need to compute % by a constant?[11:24:21] <ratchetfreak> Stragus: you could also use masks: foo = bit_cast_to_float(bar&0x80000000 | bit_cast_to_int(1.0f));[11:24:32] <Curious_> Not just a constant but what did you want to suggest Stragus?[11:25:18] <Stragus> Just asking because integer divisions/modulos are turned into long sequences of operations anyway (no hardware instruction)[11:25:32] <Stragus> When using a constant, there are shortcuts[11:25:41] <Curious_> What shortcuts?[11:25:55] <ratchetfreak> modulo math shortcuts[11:26:02] <Stragus> Equivalent sequences of operations which are specific to the modulo constant[11:26:51] <haasn> Bleh. I'm suffering from a problem where uploading 4K-sized 10-bit textures will take longer than usual every few seconds[11:27:07] <Stragus> A compiler like gcc is smart enough to generate them for compilation-time constants, but I wouldn't put much faith in GLSL compilers[11:27:30] <haasn> Most of the time it completes in some 2000μs or so, but every now and then it jumps up to 10-20 ms[11:27:42] <haasn> For a few frames[11:28:08] <Stragus> haasn: Are you updating existing and already allocated textures?[11:28:10] <haasn> I wonder why it works fine most of the time but predictably and regularly gets slow[11:28:30] <haasn> Stragus: yes[11:28:51] <Curious_> haasn what is the language you use?[11:29:05] <haasn> C; I'm using a PBO for the transfers although the issue happens even without the use of PBO[11:29:18] <haasn> (it's just slower in general without the PBO, but it still spikes every few seconds)[11:29:20] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[11:29:24] <haasn> The odd thing is that nvidia-smi shows no change in GPU usage during this time[11:29:37] <haasn> I wish I could introspect what it's doing. Maybe it's running out of memory and forcing a cache clean of something?[11:30:08] <Stragus> Are the textures in use while you update them? Have you tried cycling between textures, each frame?[11:30:10] <Curious_> If your memory is changing all the time[11:31:00] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has joined ##OpenGL[11:31:07] <Curious_> Sounds like cache trashing ya[11:31:21] *** telex <telex!teletype@freeshell.de> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[11:31:35] <Curious_> thrashing*[11:31:41] <haasn> Stragus: You mean allocating multiple GL textures and cycling through them, rather than re-using the same one?[11:31:57] <haasn> And yes, I have a loop that does: 1. upload new texture, 2. render this texture to screen, 3. block for vsync[11:32:39] *** telex <telex!teletype@freeshell.de> has joined ##OpenGL[11:33:10] <Stragus> haasn: But do you use a cycle of textures or not? Or does "block for vsync" mean glFinish()?[11:33:17] <haasn> I don't use a cycle of textures[11:33:17] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has joined ##OpenGL[11:33:20] <neure> you should[11:33:34] <neure> CPU cant start to modify texture until GPU is finished using it[11:33:56] <neure> so CPU has to wait for frame 1 to be complete before it can start uploading to the texture[11:33:57] <Stragus> Or it can start by making extra copies, keeping both the old and new data, cleaning up later[11:34:50] <Yaniel> one does not simply make extra copies of 4K textures[11:34:52] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[11:34:54] <Yaniel> they aren't exactly small[11:35:56] <haasn> Stragus: “block for vsync” means glx_swap_buffers[11:36:01] <haasn> I do not call glfinish or waitvsync[11:36:02] <Curious_> Am I misunderstanding something? You are just uploading 4k texture to the GPU without changing the textures on the CPU right?[11:36:26] <neure> why would anyone do that?[11:36:29] <haasn> Curious_: the contents of the texture change per frame (coming from CPU)[11:36:36] <Yaniel> knowing haasn I'd expect this to be a case of streaming video frames from the CPU[11:36:39] <Stragus> haasn: So the drivers will still buffer 2-3 frames of work, that's not waiting for vsync[11:36:49] <neure> haasn, do you use PBO?[11:37:06] <haasn> neure: yes, although PBO makes the average upload time shorter, it does not prevent the massive spikes every few seconds[11:37:22] <neure> which OS and GPU?[11:37:40] <haasn> Linux 4.7.3, GTX 970, nvidia drivers 370.28[11:37:42] <Stragus> You should use a cycle of textures to avoid forcing the drivers to maintain multiple copies of your texture (because it's currently in use)[11:38:04] <haasn> Stragus: Alright. I'll try that and report back, I suppose[11:38:06] <neure> well you already use PBO, im not sure if using multiple texture objects helps[11:38:12] <haasn> Stragus: Any idea how many textures I should try with?[11:38:23] <Stragus> haasn: 3 ideally[11:38:31] <neure> do you cycle PBO?[11:38:35] <neure> do you orphan PBO?[11:38:36] <haasn> neure: Yes but it doesn't help[11:38:40] <haasn> orphan?[11:38:56] <haasn> I can't measure a difference between using 1 PBO and using multiple PBOs at all[11:39:09] <neure> haasn, https://www.opengl.org/wiki/Buffer_Object_Streaming[11:39:51] <neure> can you use persistently mapped PBO?[11:40:11] <neure> do you map your buffer or use buffer(sub)data?[11:40:32] *** doomlord <doomlord!~textual@host81-147-72-23.range81-147.btcentralplus.com> has joined ##OpenGL[11:40:40] <haasn> https://0x0.st/SOS.txt this is the upload code, in case it helps[11:41:26] <Curious_> goto O.o why[11:41:59] <haasn> seems like it's done with MapBufferRange[11:42:16] <Yaniel> Curious_: linux kernel style[11:44:52] <haasn> neure: I can try persistent mapping, sure[11:45:03] <haasn> just trying to sort what I try in what order because I need to hack the code[11:45:18] <neure> mapping stuff over and over again may be expensive and cause some sort of trashing[11:45:21] *** grim001 <grim001!~grim001@ip70-173-217-35.lv.lv.cox.net> has joined ##OpenGL[11:45:31] <neure> that is why persistent mapping may help[11:45:50] <neure> oh, you used bufferdata[11:46:11] <neure> it is possible that the GL driver attempted to outsmart you by creating buffer shadow copies internally[11:46:17] <Stragus> Mapping buffers is better for performance[11:46:25] <neure> this requires driver to do memory management, which eventually can cause fragmentation[11:46:51] <neure> yes, i would expect persistently mapped buffer to avoid memory management that can otherwise lead to fragmentation[11:47:02] <Curious_> That "memcpy_pic" sounds like a spikey operation to me[11:47:10] <Stragus> Wouldn't have to be persistently mapped, as long as it's mapped write-only[11:47:46] *** d4rkforc1 is now known as d4rkforce[11:48:53] <haasn> memcpy_pic is basically a wrapper around memcopy[11:49:25] <Curious_> This will block the process for quite a while for a 4k texture you know[11:49:43] <Curious_> And since it doesn't happen every frame you will see the spike every now and then because of that[11:50:07] <haasn> I don't follow - why doesn't it happen every frame?[11:51:01] <Curious_> This operation is on the CPU so just put timing around it to see how much it costs and print it to the console[11:51:16] <haasn> Alright[11:52:46] <exDM69> haasn: sooo... you're having performance issues... what kind of performance are you actually getting?[11:52:59] <exDM69> how many gigabytes per second can you upload?[11:53:03] <haasn> exDM69: skipped frames[11:53:06] <haasn> I haven't measured that[11:53:34] <exDM69> haasn: skipped frames are an issue with opengl, unfortunately... you can't completely avoid it but you can mitigate it with glSyncXXX[11:53:35] <Curious_> And to your question: It doesn't happen every frame because your data isn't available every frame. You skip memcpy_pic in this case ofc.[11:54:29] <exDM69> haasn: don't use the texture before glTexSubImage has completed...[11:54:41] <haasn> but I do measure the time it takes to run the gl_pbo_upload_tex function I showed. I'm measuring it using GL_TIME_ELAPSED[11:55:20] <haasn> Most of the time this returns 2000μs but every now and then it spikes up to 10,000 - 20,000μs and performance suffers for a bit[11:55:27] <haasn> (multiple framedrops in rapid succession)[11:55:49] <haasn> the two happen at the same time, leading me to believe the slow uploads are what's causing the performance issue. But it could of course also be the other way around[11:56:00] *** Nach0z <Nach0z!~nach0z@unaffiliated/nach0z> has joined ##OpenGL[11:56:23] <exDM69> well you could try using MAP_BUFFER_PERSISTENT (and optionally COHERENT) to improve the performance[11:56:30] <exDM69> but you can't make it stall-free[11:56:38] <exDM69> because OpenGL kinda sucks[11:56:54] *** slidercrank <slidercrank!~slidercra@unaffiliated/slidercrank> has joined ##OpenGL[11:57:16] <exDM69> the only thing you can do is add a sync point after glTexSubImage and not use the texture before it's completed[11:57:25] <exDM69> perhaps add a bit of pipelining by using multiple PBOs[11:57:31] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@89.121.200.106> has joined ##OpenGL[11:58:04] <haasn> Curious_: hmm, I wrapped the memcpy_pic call in time_us(); and printed their difference: https://0x0.st/SO1.txt[11:58:06] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@AReims-652-1-76-199.w86-192.abo.wanadoo.fr> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[11:58:35] <haasn> that does look rather odd[11:59:13] <exDM69> haasn: I think that's happening because the driver needs to allocate a new buffer for you because using the old one is not finished yet[11:59:23] <exDM69> this might mean page faults and you're spending a lot of time in the kernel[12:00:23] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[12:00:31] <exDM69> now go and do the following: 1) use many PBOs in a round robin manner 2) add that sync point 3) if this doesn't help, start persistently mapping the buffers to stop spending time in the kernel[12:01:14] <exDM69> if your texture is BIG, you can also try to add some pipelining by uploading it in two or more parts...[12:01:15] <haasn> I already use multiple PBOs (see the #define PBO_BUFFER_COUNT), 2 was the current value but I tried setting it to 8 with no difference[12:01:35] <haasn> I'll try adding the sync point[12:01:39] <haasn> (How many PBOs would you use?)[12:01:50] *** CoolerExtreme is now known as Cooler[12:02:00] <exDM69> for just one texture? I'd have 3 persistently mapped PBOs[12:02:47] <haasn> I'm not entirely sure what you mean by glTexSubImage[12:02:48] <exDM69> if you are using the same PBOs for a lot of different textures, then I'd use something like 8 PBOs of about 2 megs each and upload textures piece by piece[12:02:51] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[12:03:03] <exDM69> gl_upload_tex calls glTexSubImage, right?[12:03:06] <Curious_> Ya the suggestion by exDM69 to tile the texture into different parts sounds like a good idea[12:03:09] <haasn> I'm uploading multiple planes per frame, each plane has its own set of PBOs (as defined by this code)[12:03:14] <haasn> there are 3 planes in total[12:03:23] <haasn> and each plane has its own texture[12:03:32] <Curious_> The major problem here seems to be on the CPU side[12:03:40] <haasn> gl_upload_tex: https://0x0.st/SOj.txt[12:04:05] <haasn> ah, glTexsubImage2D[12:04:44] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has joined ##OpenGL[12:04:46] <exDM69> Curious_: no, it seems like a memory issue, not a CPU issue when memcpy_pic is showing inconsistent perf[12:05:01] <Curious_> Ya a memory issue on CPU side[12:05:19] <Curious_> memcpy is expensive for huge chunks[12:05:36] <exDM69> memcpy is pretty darn fast, you should be hitting about 20-50 GB/s[12:05:56] <exDM69> and less expensive for larger chunks when cache prefetching comes into play[12:06:03] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[12:06:27] <haasn> (I measured my memcpy bandwidth a while ago, incidentally: https://0x0.st/SOe.png)[12:06:59] <haasn> oh, the memcpy result isn't even on that graph. But anyway, a large buffer (4K) should be at 10 GB/s or so[12:07:21] <exDM69> that's 4k resolution and not 4 kilobytes, right?[12:07:25] <haasn> yeah[12:07:54] <exDM69> haasn: have you been looking at CPU perf counters for cache misses, page faults, etc?[12:08:36] *** Zerflag <Zerflag!~zerflag@216-19-179-103.dyn.novuscom.net> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[12:09:26] <exDM69> anyway, your best bet is to add some latency hiding and start uploading a few frames before you need it[12:09:43] <haasn> For reference: each frame is about 32 MB in size, and at 60 frames per second that's ~2 GB/s of bandwidth needed to sustain a memcpy on the CPU[12:10:03] <exDM69> yeah, that's completely a non-issue here[12:10:03] <haasn> uploading frames in advance would be possible, they're decoded much earlier than they're rendered[12:10:37] <exDM69> you should be able to upload 8...16 GB/s[12:11:08] <exDM69> but the best clue here is the erratic timing of memcpy_pic...[12:11:23] <haasn> nvidia-smi says 5.0 Gt/s[12:11:28] <haasn> GT/s*[12:11:30] <haasn> not sure if that's relevant[12:13:18] <haasn> If I use GL_MAP_UNSYNCHRONIZED_BIT, would that give me a visual indication if I'm re-using the buffer too soon?[12:13:22] <haasn> Or would that explode in other ways[12:13:53] <exDM69> no, probably not[12:13:59] <exDM69> don't do that, sounds like a silly idea[12:14:03] *** Codex_ <Codex_!~terop@91-157-91-164.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[12:14:16] <exDM69> your best bet is using MAP_PERSISTENT_BIT[12:14:37] <exDM69> that should completely get rid of any page faults and time spent in the kernel[12:15:14] *** CrizMobius <CrizMobius!~CrizMobiu@176.56.245.118> has joined ##OpenGL[12:16:00] <exDM69> ... which seem to be your issue based on the timings you provided[12:16:21] *** fergal <fergal!~fergal@62.6.144.251> has joined ##OpenGL[12:18:36] *** bjz_ <bjz_!~bjz@14-201-215-168.tpgi.com.au> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[12:21:13] <haasn> exDM69: I'm still trying to do this: “2) add that sync point” <- but I'm not sure what you meant by glSyncXXX. I can't find any function named like that on https://www.opengl.org/sdk/docs/man/[12:21:24] *** doomlord <doomlord!~textual@host81-147-72-23.range81-147.btcentralplus.com> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[12:22:36] *** bjz <bjz!~bjz@104.222.140.47> has joined ##OpenGL[12:24:39] *** Salvakiya <Salvakiya!~Salvakiya@host109-154-253-144.range109-154.btcentralplus.com> has joined ##OpenGL[12:28:54] *** TechnoCrunch <TechnoCrunch!~Tech@101.100.137.146> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[12:30:09] *** jakeio <jakeio!~jakeio___@212.250.101.210> has joined ##OpenGL[12:32:12] <Cooler> uh[12:32:18] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[12:32:27] <Cooler> why i am i banned from #vulkan?[12:32:45] <Cooler> do i need to login or something?[12:32:51] *** Drakon_ is now known as Drakon[12:33:02] <jakeio> Hey, I'm having an issue on Ubuntu 16.04 with LWJGL 2 (legacy), attempting to use GLSL 3.30 - my CPU is Intel i7-6500U (HD 520 graphics); however, being told this in an error: "GLSL 3.30 is not supported. Supported versions are: 1.10, 1.20, 1.30, 1.00 ES, and 3.00 ES"[12:33:06] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has joined ##OpenGL[12:33:25] <Cooler> still says i am banned[12:33:34] <Cooler> can someone ask the ops over there?[12:34:51] <haasn> exDM69: Hmm. I tried mapping persistently instead but I'm getting an INVALID_OPERATION OpenGL error, qapitrace calls it “failed to map buffer”[12:35:05] <haasn> https://0x0.st/SO_.txt[12:35:10] <haasn> I'm creating the buffers like this[12:36:15] <exDM69> haasn: did you create your buffer with that bit passed to glBufferStorage?[12:36:24] *** therue <therue!~therue@1-162-75-104.dynamic.hinet.net> has joined ##OpenGL[12:36:46] <haasn> I don't seem to call glBufferStorage at all[12:37:02] <exDM69> you probably use the old glBufferData call?[12:37:08] <exDM69> http://docs.gl/gl4/glFenceSync here's your sync function[12:37:08] <haasn> yes[12:37:39] <exDM69> haasn: https://www.opengl.org/registry/specs/ARB/buffer_storage.txt and here's the docs for peristent/coherent etc buffers[12:40:53] <Cooler> anyone?[12:41:20] <exDM69> Cooler: have you identified yourself to NickServ?[12:42:41] <jakeio> Any help with my GLSL issue would be greatly appreciated.[12:43:06] <haasn> Hmm[12:43:42] <haasn> if I do it like this: https://0x0.st/SO9.txt the calls succeed; the first memcpy completes in 5000μs, then it blocks for a long time and segfaults[12:43:43] *** kasper^ <kasper^!~safaf@79.117.201.60> has joined ##OpenGL[12:43:44] <haasn> fun[12:43:44] <exDM69> jakeio: what version is the GL context you created?[12:43:59] <jakeio> Should be 3.3, let me check though.[12:44:18] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@162.242.94.233> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[12:44:38] <exDM69> jakeio: is your gpu/driver supposed to support that version? what does glxinfo say?[12:45:00] *** descender <descender!~heh@2406:3003:200b:c6:e546:3a83:3de9:14d6> has joined ##OpenGL[12:45:11] <exDM69> haasn: you use the same PBO again?[12:45:25] <haasn> exDM69: in theory[12:45:28] <exDM69> haasn: did you check that it's no longer used by the GPU/DMA (with glSync?)[12:45:33] <jakeio> glxinfo says I have OpenGL core 3.30[12:45:41] <haasn> No, not yet[12:45:56] <exDM69> haasn: you *must* use sync objects with persistently mapped buffers[12:46:09] <Cooler> exDM69, yes[12:46:15] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[12:46:25] <exDM69> Cooler: I don't know who are ops in ##vulkan...[12:46:46] <haasn> exDM69: so something like GLsync fence = glFenceSync(something); memcpy(); glClientWaitSync(fence) ?[12:46:59] <haasn> or should the glTexSubImage2D be part of it?[12:47:34] *** fkaa <fkaa!~tundmatu@c83-254-208-131.bredband.comhem.se> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[12:47:46] <haasn> I guess having the memcpy be part of it makes little sense[12:47:59] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has joined ##OpenGL[12:48:00] <haasn> since the CPU won't jump ahead of time either way[12:48:05] <exDM69> haasn: you need to know when glBufferSubData is done[12:48:49] <exDM69> haasn: wither use glClientWaitSync to wait, or glGetSync to see if it's done and if it isn't use another buffer or try again later[12:48:57] <jakeio> edenist, glGetVersion says "3.0 Mesa 11.2.0"[12:49:04] <haasn> wait, glBufferSubData? I don't use that at all[12:50:32] <jakeio> brb 1 sec[12:50:40] *** jakeio <jakeio!~jakeio___@212.250.101.210> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[12:50:53] <exDM69> haasn: oh sorry, glTexSubImage[12:51:06] *** jakeio <jakeio!~androirc@genld-219-248.t-mobile.co.uk> has joined ##OpenGL[12:51:11] <jakeio> Back.[12:51:12] *** DolpheenDream <DolpheenDream!~DolphinDr@pool-74-98-212-98.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[12:51:45] *** DolpheenDream <DolpheenDream!~DolphinDr@pool-74-98-212-98.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[12:51:56] <exDM69> jakeio: well you found your isse...[12:52:03] <exDM69> issue[12:52:05] *** fkaa <fkaa!~tundmatu@c83-254-208-131.bredband.comhem.se> has joined ##OpenGL[12:52:12] <exDM69> you need GL 3.3 for GLSL 330[12:52:39] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[12:53:04] <jakeio> I tried 3.00 and it didnt eork.[12:53:10] <jakeio> Work*[12:53:41] <exDM69> that's because there isn't such a version of GLSL[12:53:49] <exDM69> it's 150 or something for GL 3.0 (don't ask me why)[12:54:11] <jakeio> Ok...[12:54:51] *** descender <descender!~heh@2406:3003:200b:c6:e546:3a83:3de9:14d6> has quit IRC (Quit: ...)[12:55:06] *** descender <descender!~heh@116.86.42.112> has joined ##OpenGL[12:55:41] <haasn> exDM69: Hmm. I added the fence and it still segfaults[12:55:54] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[12:56:08] <haasn> what's odd is that memory usage increases very rapidly as this happens[12:56:17] <haasn> while it's frozen[12:56:36] <haasn> https://0x0.st/SOV.txt[12:56:38] <haasn> maybe I did something wrong[12:56:58] <exDM69> your fence is in the wrong place[12:57:07] <exDM69> and used *very* incorrectly[12:57:47] <exDM69> you need to make sure that glTexSubImage is finished...[12:58:05] <exDM69> your memcpy doesn't affect the sync *at all*[12:58:05] <haasn> gl_upload_tex is what calls glTexSubImage[12:58:16] <exDM69> and you call glFenceSync before it...[12:58:26] <exDM69> perhaps you should take a break and actually study what it does...[12:59:04] *** indefini <indefini!~indefini@124x35x243x164.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[12:59:08] <Cooler> oh the problem was i was trying to join #vulkan instead of ##vulkan[12:59:16] <exDM69> haasn: http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1020791/Approaching-Zero-Driver-Overhead-in <<--- here's a GDC talk about this[12:59:37] <haasn> Oh, I remember watching that[12:59:48] *** BlackFox <BlackFox!~BlackFox@ip-6317.proline.net.ua> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[13:00:51] <haasn> Anyway, this persistent map stuff seems to be beyond my ability to implement; I'll make a note for it and let somebody who actually understands this code do it[13:01:02] <haasn> I'm just a user trying to copy/paste together code snippets until the performance issue is gone[13:01:35] <haasn> thanks for the pointer at any rate[13:02:42] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[13:04:38] <haasn> Btw: if the issue is not using persistent buffers, I wonder why it still happens in the non-PBO case. Is that just because there's only one texture, instead of multiple?[13:05:07] <exDM69> using many textures would also be a good idea[13:05:18] <haasn> Using multiple textures is something I know how to implement[13:05:19] <haasn> I'll try that instead[13:06:50] *** FrancoGP <FrancoGP!~quassel@58-7-17-190.fibertel.com.ar> has joined ##OpenGL[13:06:50] <bookmark> can i get the character number of a segfault with gdb?[13:07:23] <bookmark> like line number then where on the line ?[13:07:38] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has joined ##OpenGL[13:07:43] <exDM69> bookmark: say "bt" for backtrace[13:08:04] <exDM69> if you don't get line numbers, then you've not compiled your app with debug symbols (CFLAGS+=-g -ggdb)[13:12:16] <bookmark> yeah i have the line number i just dont see much wrong on it[13:13:20] *** AfroThundr <AfroThundr!~AfroThund@c-73-200-98-32.hsd1.md.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[13:13:25] *** stelarcf <stelarcf!~stelarcf@92.81.115.213> has joined ##OpenGL[13:14:35] <jakeio> exDM69 thanks, btw![13:15:17] <exDM69> bookmark: ah! I don't think that info is stored in the debug data[13:15:23] <exDM69> bookmark: split your line to smaller pieces[13:17:31] *** fkaa <fkaa!~tundmatu@c83-254-208-131.bredband.comhem.se> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[13:18:57] *** fkaa <fkaa!~tundmatu@c83-254-208-131.bredband.comhem.se> has joined ##OpenGL[13:20:49] <haasn> exDM69: btw, assuming I restructure my code to use multiple textures and upload them sufficiently in advance of when they're used, should the driver be smart enough to figure out that it should reuse buffers instead of making shadow copies on its own?[13:21:07] <haasn> I can definitely restructure that part of the code base, since it's hidden behind abstractions I understand[13:21:32] *** swnc <swnc!~swnc@port-92-204-97-78.dynamic.qsc.de> has joined ##OpenGL[13:21:40] <haasn> and if that would help either way, then I might just go for that approach[13:21:55] <Yaniel> if the textures always have the same size, it should be smart enough AFAIK[13:23:18] <exDM69> haasn: drivers are pretty smart but not smart enough to rely on[13:23:22] *** xCrypto <xCrypto!~xCrypto@drmons0544w-142177154202.dhcp-dynamic.FibreOp.ns.bellaliant.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)[13:23:33] <exDM69> haasn: just allocate *enough* resources ahead of time and use them wisely[13:24:42] *** razieliyo <razieliyo!~razieliyo@unaffiliated/razieliyo> has joined ##OpenGL[13:27:09] *** jakeio <jakeio!~androirc@genld-219-248.t-mobile.co.uk> has quit IRC (Quit: AndroIRC - Android IRC Client ( http://www.androirc.com ))[13:28:08] *** xCrypto <xCrypto!~xCrypto@drmons0544w-142177154202.dhcp-dynamic.FibreOp.ns.bellaliant.net> has joined ##OpenGL[13:30:18] *** delicado2 <delicado2!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has joined ##OpenGL[13:30:18] *** swnc <swnc!~swnc@port-92-204-97-78.dynamic.qsc.de> has quit IRC (Changing host)[13:30:18] *** swnc <swnc!~swnc@unaffiliated/swnc> has joined ##OpenGL[13:32:17] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[13:36:32] *** Codex_ <Codex_!~terop@91-157-91-164.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has joined ##OpenGL[13:37:17] *** notadeveloper__ <notadeveloper__!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[13:40:32] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[13:41:38] *** stelarcf <stelarcf!~stelarcf@92.81.115.213> has quit IRC (Quit: stelarcf)[13:42:02] *** stelarcf <stelarcf!~stelarcf@92.81.115.213> has joined ##OpenGL[13:43:31] *** delicado2 is now known as delicado[13:47:12] *** Ploppz <Ploppz!~ploppz@2001:700:303:b:f3ce:ca7c:3834:8e44> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 1.5)[13:47:27] <haasn> Hmm. Using multiple textures and PBOs didn't seem to have any measurable effect, the upload timing histogram is virtually identical[13:47:31] *** DolpheenDream <DolpheenDream!~DolphinDr@pool-74-98-212-98.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net> has joined ##OpenGL[13:47:41] <haasn> (Just using N textures and rotating between them per frame)[13:48:09] *** Xophosaurus <Xophosaurus!~yay@CPE20aa4b7a4083-CM34bdfa8af4b7.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com> has quit IRC ()[13:50:12] <haasn> Maybe I should also ask on nvidia's bug report forum, since it's technically their driver exhibiting this behavior, they hold the keys to the black box[13:50:24] <haasn> Although it might just be easier to switch to vulkan instead of investing this amount of effort into OpenGL[13:53:38] <zgreg> haasn: vulkan seems to be a bit overkill for what you're doing[13:53:50] <Yaniel> I'd disagree[13:54:09] <Yaniel> it seems like a perfect match[13:54:15] <haasn> I'm pretty sure the number of hacks mpv has to work around OpenGL timing bugs and other issues numbers in the double digits these days[13:54:25] <Matthijs> Would you say Vulkan is 'better' than OpenGL? I know it can be more performant, but other than that?[13:54:25] <zgreg> because timing and buffer usage is so critical?[13:54:30] <zgreg> well, maybe, yeah[13:55:35] <Yaniel> it's supposedly more predictable[13:55:44] <Yaniel> sure, there's a lot more boilerplate[13:55:45] <zgreg> Matthijs: you get much better control over basically everything. on the other hand, you need to write more code and possibly different code paths depending on what the GPU supports[13:55:47] *** carado <carado!~carado@2a01:e34:ec1e:2390:8341:b3f5:2d6:41fa> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[13:56:01] <Matthijs> So just different usecases[13:56:32] <Yaniel> yes[13:56:42] <Yaniel> (wow, someone actually got it immediately)[13:56:51] <haasn> Apparently vulkan fixes the disgusting statefulness of the OpenGL API[13:56:59] <Yaniel> that too[13:57:16] <Yaniel> it replaces the ton of global state with a ton of user structs[13:57:25] <zgreg> different GPUs have different hardware. so vulkan implementations usually provide somewhat different command queues with differetn feature sets[13:57:31] <haasn> the whole glActivateFoo(); glBindFoo(); etc. nonsense makes OpenGL code incomprehensible compared to regular C[13:57:47] <haasn> Especially since I never know which operations depend on what activation state[13:57:59] <haasn> It makes code diving and trying to figure this stuff out much harder than it needs to be :([13:58:08] <Yaniel> you'll love vulkan then[13:58:31] <Yaniel> it's like struct Foo { <50 lines> } a; vkFoo(a)[13:59:09] <zgreg> just saying, the low-level-ness can bite you back[13:59:43] <zgreg> e.g. nvidia IIRC provides a number of queues that support everything, while AMD provides separate queues for graphics, compute and copies[13:59:54] <haasn> I wonder if Vulkan is old enough to have usable introductions or books or whatever written about it these days? I'd love to play around with it and maybe write a proof-of-concept vo_vulkan that would get an image on the screen[14:00:07] <Yaniel> still more predictable than GL[14:00:11] <Yaniel> which does... something[14:00:12] <haasn> But reading specs is not for me, and I also know next to nothing about OpenGL, so ideally I'd love an introduction that starts from scratch[14:00:22] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[14:00:30] <Yaniel> haasn: there's a bunch of examples on github[14:00:39] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has joined ##OpenGL[14:00:42] <Yaniel> and also http://learnvulkan.com/[14:01:01] <Yaniel> sorry, https://vulkan-tutorial.com/[14:01:03] *** stelarcf <stelarcf!~stelarcf@92.81.115.213> has quit IRC (Quit: stelarcf)[14:01:12] <haasn> The ones I saw were 2000 lines of highly interlinked code with no clear structure[14:01:13] <Yaniel> that was the one that has been actually published[14:01:18] <haasn> Interesting, thanks[14:01:26] *** stelarcf <stelarcf!~stelarcf@92.81.115.213> has joined ##OpenGL[14:01:54] <Yaniel> yeah most have their own fancy C++ wrappers around the API before even getting started[14:02:05] <zgreg> I don't get it why they do that[14:02:24] <zgreg> Vulkan is a C API, so C is still the natural language for a tutorial[14:03:12] <dawik> C++ is perverse[14:03:18] * dawik flees[14:03:46] * Bloodust runs after[14:03:52] <zgreg> I mean... take a look at that confusing VDeleter mess: https://vulkan-tutorial.com/Drawing_a_triangle/Setup/Base_code[14:05:44] <Matthijs> To each their own.[14:06:10] <Yaniel> ah, the good ol' C++ Cancer[14:06:14] <zgreg> the point is, the tutorial should teach Vulkan, not how to manage resource with C++[14:06:30] <Yaniel> a close relative of Enterprise Java[14:07:37] *** carado <carado!~carado@bea44-1-78-193-226-57.fbxo.proxad.net> has joined ##OpenGL[14:14:44] *** GinoManWorks <GinoManWorks!~GinoMan@50.251.53.110> 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<btipling> well[16:03:47] <btipling> managing resources with C++ (or whatever language) is a big part of the vulkan api yes[16:04:07] <btipling> 3d math is 3d math regardless of the api[16:04:44] <btipling> all graphics apis are for the most part about how to manage resources (and state) across the gpu isn't that so?[16:06:02] <btipling> the (insert vulkan, opengl, metal, direct3d) part of gpu programming is really the easiest part of this imo, as you just read the documentation or look at other people's code[16:07:03] <btipling> it's the math that's the big learning curve, where if you're starting from zero knowledge (you know basic arithmetic) you need like years[16:08:02] <btipling> if you know the math, who gives a shit about the api, it's trivial in comparison[16:09:07] <Yaniel> would still be nice to not have to reverse-engineer your tutorial's helper classes to figure out how the API is actually supposed to be used[16:09:11] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[16:09:23] <btipling> yeah I agree ^^[16:09:37] <btipling> that's really annoying, just make them as simple to read as possible[16:10:10] <Yaniel> it would be perfectly fine to just divide stuff into some functions[16:10:42] <Yaniel> let the people who are using C++ and want to go all RAII figure that part out by themselves (though the are supposed to know it already)[16:12:12] *** notadeveloper__ <notadeveloper__!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[16:12:30] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[16:14:30] *** irrenhaus3 <irrenhaus3!~xenon@HSI-KBW-046-005-253-022.hsi8.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de> has joined ##OpenGL[16:15:24] *** therue <therue!~therue@1-162-75-104.dynamic.hinet.net> has quit IRC (Quit: therue)[16:15:56] <btipling> yep[16:17:00] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[16:19:05] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has joined ##OpenGL[16:20:27] *** Mysoft <Mysoft!~user@unaffiliated/mysoft> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[16:21:56] *** noidea <noidea!~noidea@82.79.210.134> has joined ##OpenGL[16:21:56] *** noidea <noidea!~noidea@82.79.210.134> has quit IRC (Changing host)[16:21:56] *** noidea <noidea!~noidea@unaffiliated/no-idea/x-0944443> has joined ##OpenGL[16:24:35] *** FrancoGP <FrancoGP!~quassel@58-7-17-190.fibertel.com.ar> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[16:25:55] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has joined ##OpenGL[16:30:37] *** Matthijs <Matthijs!~quassel@unaffiliated/matthijs> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[16:35:34] *** kasper^ <kasper^!~safaf@79.117.201.60> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[16:36:55] *** ertes <ertes!~never@p5485F766.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[16:37:10] *** ertes <ertes!~never@p5485F766.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[16:38:56] *** anli <anli!~anli@gn62-116-231-34.business.gavlenet.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[16:41:45] *** Codex_ <Codex_!~terop@91-157-91-164.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[16:49:08] *** pazul <pazul!~pazul@ptr-2hj4tbi3h8zz81s2j7xokbjug.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[16:50:01] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has joined ##OpenGL[16:50:26] *** t4nk112 <t4nk112!ad1fc45e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.31.196.94> has joined ##OpenGL[16:50:41] *** Blibno <Blibno!ad1fc45e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.31.196.94> has joined ##OpenGL[16:51:19] *** fqtw_ <fqtw_!~me@x4db07b2c.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[16:52:04] <dau> hi, I have problems understanding why my transform feedback code works although it shouldnt. Having two transform feedback objects and with each a VBO associated via glBindBufferBase(), I bind the first TFO when I do the first feedback operation that reads data from VBO1 and outputs data to VBO2.[16:52:30] <dau> when I afterwards call glGetBufferSubData() with GL_TRANSFORM_FEEDBACK_BUFFER, I get the output values that I expect[16:52:51] *** tristanseifert <tristanseifert!~tristanse@nat-165-91-12-210.tamulink.tamu.edu> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[16:53:10] <Blibno> Hey everyone! I've got a for loop in a glsl shader, and inside that loop is a condition that's supposed to cause the code to set a value and break out early. I understand that it might not help performance as it runs every iteration anyway, but it is in fact producing the wrong result. If I remove the break, and allow the value to get set multiple times, then I get the correct behavior. Why might this be happening?[16:53:25] <dau> the thing is now that it retrieves the same values when I bind the TFO that the other VBO (where the data is read from) is associated with.[16:53:48] *** Nach0z <Nach0z!~nach0z@unaffiliated/nach0z> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[16:53:51] <dau> so I wonder how glGetBufferSubData determines where it fetches the data from[16:54:40] *** fqtw <fqtw!~me@x590c71e2.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[16:54:42] *** t4nk112 <t4nk112!ad1fc45e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.31.196.94> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[16:54:57] *** Nach0z <Nach0z!~nach0z@unaffiliated/nach0z> has joined ##OpenGL[16:55:07] <dau> I assumed it is determined by a previous call to glBindTransformFeedback(), where a TFO is bound which is associcated with a specific array buffer[16:55:09] <Blibno> here is the relevant shader code in an image https://i.gyazo.com/14ec8d8cecea513b2f7319af1ec3989a.png[16:55:39] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[16:55:59] *** monsterjamp <monsterjamp!uid156866@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pgkhrpaxfkqmgqxt> has joined ##OpenGL[16:58:20] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has quit IRC (Quit: groton)[16:59:43] *** matpow2 <matpow2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has joined ##OpenGL[16:59:46] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has quit IRC (Read error: No route to host)[17:00:35] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[17:02:23] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[17:03:33] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has joined ##OpenGL[17:04:50] *** nine_milli <nine_milli!~nine_mill@32.211.52.104> has quit IRC (Quit: nine_milli)[17:05:29] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@89.121.200.106> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[17:05:39] *** matpow2 <matpow2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)[17:05:49] *** ImQ009 <ImQ009!~ImQ009@unaffiliated/imq009> has joined ##OpenGL[17:05:56] *** Ryp <Ryp!~ryp@laf94-4-88-190-202-176.fbxo.proxad.net> has joined ##OpenGL[17:06:09] *** fqtw_ is now known as fqtw[17:07:48] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[17:08:16] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has joined ##OpenGL[17:09:01] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@89.121.200.106> has joined ##OpenGL[17:12:33] *** Th30n <Th30n!~Th30n@93-136-14-170.adsl.net.t-com.hr> has joined ##OpenGL[17:13:32] *** ImQ009 <ImQ009!~ImQ009@unaffiliated/imq009> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[17:16:05] *** xaxxon <xaxxon!~xaxxon@c-24-18-184-142.hsd1.wa.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)[17:18:57] *** quickbrownfox <quickbrownfox!~henrique_@186.194.99.248> has joined ##OpenGL[17:22:17] *** wolfcub <wolfcub!~henrique_@177.55.194.98> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[17:22:52] *** kasper^ <kasper^!~safaf@79.117.201.60> has joined ##OpenGL[17:23:16] *** indefini <indefini!~chris@240d:1a:1ca:ac00:3602:86ff:fe47:864b> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)[17:29:44] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has joined ##OpenGL[17:29:51] *** therue <therue!~therue@1-162-75-104.dynamic.hinet.net> has joined ##OpenGL[17:31:47] *** kasper^ <kasper^!~safaf@79.117.201.60> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[17:34:48] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[17:35:15] *** vijai <vijai!vijai@gateway/shell/openshells.net/x-zhabjspaqrxapiom> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[17:36:06] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[17:37:14] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[17:40:22] *** svp <svp!~svp@unaffiliated/svp> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[17:41:12] *** Xeronate <Xeronate!~Xeronate@rrcs-74-62-109-222.west.biz.rr.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[17:41:17] *** ImQ009 <ImQ009!~ImQ009@unaffiliated/imq009> has joined ##OpenGL[17:42:57] <flavi0> if I zero out a texture by binding to a fb attachment and glClear, and want to access it via image load/store thereafter, is GL_SHADER_IMAGE_ACCESS_BARRIER_BIT the right barrier to use in between? or maybe GL_TEXTURE_UPDATE_BARRIER_BIT or GL_FRAMEBUFFER_BARRIER_BIT? reading the desriptions I suppose it should be the first. I need one in either case, or don't I?[17:45:52] *** vijai <vijai!vijai@gateway/shell/openshells.net/x-yvrvldktmwqeaazg> has joined ##OpenGL[17:46:03] <flavi0> for GL_SHADER_IMAGE_ACCESS_BARRIER_BIT: Additionally, image stores and atomics issued after the barrier will not execute until all memory accesses (e.g., loads, stores, texture fetches, vertex fetches) initiated prior to the barrier complete.[17:46:24] *** jakeio <jakeio!~Sam@host86-132-91-161.range86-132.btcentralplus.com> has joined ##OpenGL[17:46:35] <flavi0> so in that sense the glClear would be a memory access operation initiated prior to the barrier I guess.[17:47:18] <jakeio> Anyone know how to get debug logging working on LWJGL 2 (my PC is using OpenGL version 3.0)?[17:52:32] *** Ryp <Ryp!~ryp@laf94-4-88-190-202-176.fbxo.proxad.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[17:55:05] *** Joefish <Joefish!~Joefish@p5B1202AB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[17:55:26] *** ArkaZeen <ArkaZeen!~ArkaZeen@rn-nat-129-97-131-0.dynamic.uwaterloo.ca> has quit IRC ()[17:55:50] *** Joefish <Joefish!~Joefish@p5B1202AB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[17:56:28] *** CrizMobius <CrizMobius!~CrizMobiu@176.56.245.118> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[17:57:46] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[17:58:57] *** ejb <ejb!~ejb@unaffiliated/ejb> has joined ##OpenGL[17:59:25] *** rawrawrer <rawrawrer!~rawrawrer@c58-111-144-57.thorn2.nsw.optusnet.com.au> has quit IRC (Quit: rawrawrer)[17:59:33] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[18:01:19] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@89.121.200.106> has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!)[18:02:56] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has joined ##OpenGL[18:05:42] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[18:07:39] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[18:07:44] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has joined ##OpenGL[18:09:26] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[18:13:20] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has quit IRC (Quit: Bye!)[18:13:39] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has joined ##OpenGL[18:16:33] *** joshsyn <joshsyn!~swoorup@106-69-224-41.dyn.iinet.net.au> has joined ##OpenGL[18:19:41] *** DrGonzo <DrGonzo!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[18:21:55] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[18:24:35] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[18:27:45] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[18:31:39] *** Serpent7776 <Serpent7776!~Serpent77@90-156-68-175.internetia.net.pl> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[18:32:08] *** lpapp <lpapp!~lpapp@mail.polatis.com> has joined ##OpenGL[18:32:08] *** lpapp <lpapp!~lpapp@mail.polatis.com> has quit IRC (Changing host)[18:32:08] *** lpapp <lpapp!~lpapp@kde/lpapp> has joined ##OpenGL[18:32:10] *** lpapp <lpapp!~lpapp@kde/lpapp> has left ##OpenGL[18:38:27] <Blibno> Am I correct in assuming that using "break" in a for loop inside of glsl on modern hardware should work exactly as it does in C++ in terms of how the data is modified? (I am aware of the perfomance implications)[18:39:07] <Xeek> I didn't know break modified data :-\[18:39:46] <Blibno> by "how the data is modified" I mean that the final values of whatever data was modified in the loop - sorry that was worded terribly[18:40:19] *** konom <konom!~tamatias@141.15.138.77.rev.sfr.net> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[18:40:42] <bookmark> i build a function and use return to be sure[18:40:52] <Blibno> wow I need to proofread what I write. Jeez. I mean specifically that after calling break, the variables inside the loop will stop being modified by the loop. In my particular case it seems a bool is toggled more often than it should be.[18:41:16] <Blibno> I did make a test case, and my problem is that it works fine on nvidia and intel, but the amd version is horrendous and unpredictable[18:41:26] *** bzzt_ploink <bzzt_ploink!~bzztploin@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/bzztploink> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[18:41:59] <Xeek> Blibno: sounds rediculous to me, but I'm new to glsl and if it's true I'm pretty grossed out :-)[18:42:30] <bookmark> anyone know how to get a backtrace to actually print the line its complaining about?[18:42:35] *** bzzt_ploink <bzzt_ploink!~bzztploin@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/bzztploink> has joined ##OpenGL[18:42:37] <Xeek> Blibno: I guess you're saying for loops are broken with AMD hardware[18:43:08] <Xeek> bookmark: I dont think he said anything was complaining[18:43:08] <Blibno> That's what it feels like, but I'm not pompous enough to assume that I'm not doing something wrong :P[18:43:24] <bookmark> ?[18:43:35] <bookmark> no im asking question[18:43:43] <Xeek> bookmark: I assumed you asked a question related to Blibno's issue[18:43:48] <bookmark> nah[18:43:55] <bookmark> related to my own[18:44:09] <Xeek> bookmark: ah ok, I never saw your question so your pronounds have me thrown[18:44:30] <Blibno> it's terribly terribly frustrating though the only way I can get the results I'm looking for is to remove the break, and write the loop in such a way that it would be very easy to unroll.[18:44:32] <Xeek> bookmark: I dont see your question anywhere within the past 2 hours[18:44:47] *** neure <neure!~tsuorant@a88-112-89-144.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has joined ##OpenGL[18:45:02] <Xeek> Blibno: could be a code issue, but we haven't seen it so *shrugs*[18:45:28] <Blibno> https://i.gyazo.com/14ec8d8cecea513b2f7319af1ec3989a.png there it is[18:45:36] <Xeek> while() { switch() { break .... Obviously the break isn't going to get you out of while, it's going to get you our of switch. SO I can see how that could make your issue[18:45:53] <bookmark> well i have a crash when i'm trying to make skeleton animations on the cpu side, and i just want to know how to make gdb print out what part of the line it has a problem with[18:46:00] <bookmark> its more of a c+[18:46:10] <bookmark> its more of a c++ thing i guess[18:46:25] <Blibno> I was wondering if breaks inside of if-else might be the issue too[18:46:26] <Xeek> oh I dunno. I use visual studio for coding and debugging.[18:46:51] <bookmark> maybe i could try windbg[18:47:14] <Xeek> Blibno: break should stop the for right there.[18:47:50] <Blibno> that's what I assumed, and in fact what it does on intel and nvidia[18:48:07] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[18:48:22] <Blibno> return is giving me a similar behavior too. I ended up switching to toggling a bool to make everything more explicit and contained[18:48:37] <Xeek> google reveals other complaints of break not working as expected on all hardware[18:48:45] <Xeek> but I assume you knew that :-\[18:49:11] <Blibno> but I've run much bigger tests to see exactly what's happening by outputting debug colors, and it is working very very oddly[18:49:28] <Blibno> Oh I have, the best lead I had was someone complaining about a similar issues, updating drivers and it going away[18:49:42] *** MrFlibble <MrFlibble!MrFlibble@90.196.207.27> has joined ##OpenGL[18:49:45] <Blibno> needless to say I updated my drivers and kept my fingers crossed the whooole time lol[18:50:33] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[18:50:38] <Blibno> this is for a ray marcher, and I need to break out at that point to collect information about surface normals[18:51:29] <Blibno> so I do actually need real branching otherwise it's far too complex to use in real time[18:52:41] *** slidercrank <slidercrank!~slidercra@unaffiliated/slidercrank> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[18:53:42] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!c351a8d8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.195.81.168.216> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[18:55:59] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@162.242.94.133> has joined ##OpenGL[18:56:04] <Blibno> I'm trying to ray march clouds for a real time game and I need it to be very very quick, but if I can't break out there I can't get surface normals so the clouds look fairly flat. (The code I posted was a simplified version of this for finding bugs) https://i.gyazo.com/10491f6dcf94a3a08fa32f1a93b0d86d.gif[19:00:22] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[19:00:24] *** BilboTheHobbit <BilboTheHobbit!~Emma@112.10.170.31> has joined ##OpenGL[19:00:29] *** xaxxon <xaxxon!~xaxxon@c-24-18-184-142.hsd1.wa.comcast.net> has joined ##OpenGL[19:00:56] *** xCrypto <xCrypto!~xCrypto@drmons0544w-142177154202.dhcp-dynamic.FibreOp.ns.bellaliant.net> has quit IRC (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)[19:03:04] *** xCrypto <xCrypto!~xCrypto@drmons0544w-142177154202.dhcp-dynamic.FibreOp.ns.bellaliant.net> has joined ##OpenGL[19:03:04] <anli_> I thought everything would be scaled when I moved the near clipping plane[19:03:30] <anli_> Like that is the plane that is where viewport is calculated[19:03:49] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[19:05:55] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has quit IRC (Quit: Bye!)[19:10:04] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[19:12:28] *** DrGonzo <DrGonzo!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[19:13:15] *** ronaldsmazitis <ronaldsmazitis!~quassel@46.109.139.95> has joined ##OpenGL[19:15:57] <anli_> Ah, now I see it, the near clipping plane does play that role, but the fov setting will keep the object the same size[19:16:10] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[19:16:39] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has joined ##OpenGL[19:16:53] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has joined ##OpenGL[19:18:39] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@2a02:2f0e:c2f0:17b2:224:d7ff:feb5:311c> has joined ##OpenGL[19:22:08] *** joshsyn <joshsyn!~swoorup@106-69-224-41.dyn.iinet.net.au> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[19:23:27] *** BearishMushroom <BearishMushroom!~BearishMu@90-231-174-194-no159.tbcn.telia.com> has joined ##OpenGL[19:23:27] *** SHC <SHC!~quassel@117.213.108.108> has joined ##OpenGL[19:24:36] *** flavi0 <flavi0!~anon@unaffiliated/flavi0> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[19:26:32] *** pazul <pazul!~pazul@ptr-2hj4tbi3h8zz81s2j7xokbjug.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[19:27:07] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[19:28:37] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@AReims-652-1-76-199.w86-192.abo.wanadoo.fr> has joined ##OpenGL[19:29:06] *** GarrettShields <GarrettShields!~GarrettSh@CPE3497f6605400-CMbc14013107e0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com> has joined ##OpenGL[19:31:07] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[19:31:16] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[19:31:47] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@2a02:2f0e:c2f0:17b2:224:d7ff:feb5:311c> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[19:33:59] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has joined ##OpenGL[19:34:01] *** notadeveloper__ <notadeveloper__!~letsmakej@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has joined ##OpenGL[19:34:59] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[19:35:02] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[19:35:26] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[19:35:42] <btipling_> multiplying a translation matrix by a basis vector is really easy to visualize, and then doing that visualization for each of the basis vectors kind of shows what transformations do, rotation matrixes as well, but when it comes to a projection forget about it[19:36:00] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has joined ##OpenGL[19:36:19] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has joined ##OpenGL[19:36:48] <btipling_> since multiplying matrices is a dot product operation, being able to visualize the transformation is an interesting way to also understand a dot product in geometry too[19:36:58] <btipling_> It's kind of fun to learn this stuff[19:37:53] *** pazul <pazul!~pazul@ptr-2hj4tbi3h8zz81s2j7xokbjug.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[19:40:08] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@82.78.127.69> has joined ##OpenGL[19:41:55] *** kmnt <kmnt!~k@69.63.37.65> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[19:42:51] *** neure <neure!~tsuorant@a88-112-89-144.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[19:44:50] <notadeveloper> how can i return a value from glsl[19:44:57] <notadeveloper> glsl -> program[19:45:15] <notadeveloper> is that even possible?[19:47:07] <notadeveloper> ?enum1[19:48:24] <notadeveloper> ?[19:49:16] *** neure <neure!~tsuorant@a88-112-89-144.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has joined ##OpenGL[19:51:12] *** delicado <delicado!~delicado@112.198.77.242> has quit IRC ()[19:51:30] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[19:52:05] <notadeveloper> thanks[19:52:46] *** descender <descender!~heh@116.86.42.112> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[19:54:12] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@82.78.127.69> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[19:54:53] <Stragus> notadeveloper: You can write to some buffer and copy that buffer/texture/whatever back to the CPU[19:55:11] *** ravior <ravior!~ravior@82.78.127.69> has joined ##OpenGL[19:55:13] <Stragus> If you do that, only copy to the CPU 2 frames after the data has been written[19:55:13] <notadeveloper> hmmm[19:55:22] <notadeveloper> ok[19:55:28] <notadeveloper> wow[19:55:39] <Stragus> Keep in mind that the call will be blocking unless using PBOs or such[19:55:49] <notadeveloper> i guess blizzard has some cool drawing engines to do that[19:55:54] *** Fr0stBit <Fr0stBit!~theartist@62.1.207.59.dsl.dyn.forthnet.gr> has joined ##OpenGL[19:56:03] <Stragus> To do what?[19:56:13] <Fr0stBit> Helloo o/[19:56:14] <notadeveloper> do what you initially said[19:56:34] <Stragus> The strategy is usually to do everything on the GPU, including fancier tricks you would be tempted to do on the CPU[19:56:46] <notadeveloper> ok[19:57:10] <notadeveloper> it must be a hard task when wow launched[19:57:13] <notadeveloper> or everquest[19:57:23] *** glYoda <glYoda!~MTLYoda@c-50-137-137-82.hsd1.or.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[19:57:28] <Fr0stBit> Does adding two rotations described by euler angles angle by angle does the same as composing a 4x4 matrix for each rotation and multipling them?[19:58:48] *** Cooler <Cooler!~CoolerExt@117.204.116.120> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[20:00:00] <notadeveloper> haha i guess i need a state machine for my first problem[20:00:06] <btipling_> Stragus regrading "everything on the GPU" wouldn't you precalculate your transformation matrix on the cpu instead of doing that multiple times unnecessarily on the GPU?[20:00:15] *** glYoda <glYoda!~MTLYoda@c-50-137-137-82.hsd1.or.comcast.net> has joined ##OpenGL[20:00:22] *** bookmark <bookmark!~IceChat77@173-169-112-35.res.bhn.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[20:00:38] <Stragus> Of course, btipling. I meant "everything on the GPU" as in "don't return results from the GPU to the CPU"[20:01:03] <btipling_> Fr0stBit I would think so, think about rotating just by x, and plug in a simple value[20:01:09] <btipling_> and doing it twice[20:01:11] <notadeveloper> i dont know how to program a state machine though[20:01:12] <btipling_> I'm not sure tbh[20:02:28] *** bookmark <bookmark!~IceChat77@173-169-112-35.res.bhn.net> has joined ##OpenGL[20:02:30] <btipling_> yeah reading from the GPU seems unwanted unless you're doing OpenCL/Cuda stuff[20:03:33] <bookmark> testing does anyone copy this?[20:03:39] <btipling_> yes we copy[20:03:44] <bookmark> cool[20:03:49] <bookmark> my version of glsl saya opengl does not supportattributes of type int. what can i use in place of that? or what versionswill support that?[20:04:05] <bookmark> saya = says[20:04:31] <btipling_> notadeveloper a state machine is just a high level abstract idea[20:04:48] <bookmark> i need an attribute of type int or there abouts[20:04:52] <btipling_> you could program it with a class or with a struct and some functions[20:05:14] <notadeveloper> what is high level abstract?[20:05:22] <notadeveloper> please explain[20:05:24] <btipling_> it's a way to think about a problem[20:05:34] <btipling_> without writing code[20:05:43] *** pazul <pazul!~pazul@ptr-2hj4tbi3h8zz81s2j7xokbjug.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[20:05:52] *** svp <svp!~svp@unaffiliated/svp> has joined ##OpenGL[20:05:58] <btipling_> like think about adding by a fixed value[20:05:58] <notadeveloper> cool thanks[20:06:07] <Stragus> bookmark: What do you need the int for?[20:06:09] *** oftc_ftw <oftc_ftw!~oftc_ftw@unaffiliated/oftc-ftw/x-3443471> has joined ##OpenGL[20:06:17] <btipling_> you could call that an accumulator[20:06:21] <btipling_> but you're just doing basic addition[20:06:23] <notadeveloper> so now i wanna loop through glenable to see and get all the server states enabled[20:06:34] <notadeveloper> and enable them accordingly[20:06:35] <btipling_> accumulator is the high level abstract idea, but the implementation is just adding two variables[20:06:41] *** derhass <derhass!~derhass@dslb-094-222-156-248.094.222.pools.vodafone-ip.de> has joined ##OpenGL[20:06:58] <notadeveloper> now im really confused cause i dunno when to enable or disable them properly[20:07:05] <notadeveloper> and get all the enabled states[20:07:09] <notadeveloper> to disable them[20:07:17] <notadeveloper> thanks btipling_[20:07:41] <Stragus> You are supposed to track your state rather than do this...[20:07:43] *** Joefish <Joefish!~Joefish@p5B1202AB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 1.5)[20:07:52] <notadeveloper> suppose>[20:08:01] *** Joefish <Joefish!~Joefish@p5B1202AB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[20:08:05] <notadeveloper> why is this[20:08:27] <Stragus> Yes, you remember if depth testing is enabled rather than asking GL, it's far more efficient[20:08:28] <notadeveloper> to know when to disable them i guess[20:08:51] <btipling_> notadeveloper are you already pretty good with math?[20:09:07] <notadeveloper> btipling_, ill worry about math later[20:09:17] <notadeveloper> right now i got to many stuff to accomplish[20:09:34] <btipling_> it must be hard to learn programming, 3d math and a gpu api all at once[20:09:47] *** neure <neure!~tsuorant@a88-112-89-144.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[20:09:54] <notadeveloper> yes it is[20:09:55] <btipling_> I'd start with one, and then progress to the next thing[20:10:05] <notadeveloper> i forgot my math stuff[20:10:17] *** svp <svp!~svp@unaffiliated/svp> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[20:10:26] <notadeveloper> i mean its abit fragmented when i try to remember it[20:10:32] <Stragus> You can learn the math and GL together... but you better at least know programming[20:10:52] <notadeveloper> oh[20:10:53] *** bookmark <bookmark!~IceChat77@173-169-112-35.res.bhn.net> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:11:00] <notadeveloper> im not developer though[20:11:21] *** bookmark <bookmark!~IceChat77@173-169-112-35.res.bhn.net> has joined ##OpenGL[20:11:24] <notadeveloper> late[20:11:27] <btipling_> but opengl is a programming topic for developers[20:11:43] <btipling_> what are you trying to accomplish?[20:12:03] <notadeveloper> developer for me has a team and do mostly all from scratch[20:12:17] <notadeveloper> btipling_, i dont know[20:12:23] <notadeveloper> but thanks you two[20:12:23] <btipling_> :|[20:12:39] <btipling_> np, good luck[20:13:21] <notadeveloper> i need a miracle[20:13:22] <notadeveloper> lol[20:13:28] <btipling_> you can buy them[20:14:29] <notadeveloper> it must be earned i think[20:15:56] <derhass> miracles are currently out of stock[20:16:06] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:16:31] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has joined ##OpenGL[20:21:38] *** kmnt <kmnt!~k@69.63.37.65> has joined ##OpenGL[20:23:33] *** Arch1eN <Arch1eN!~Arch1eN@77.79.228.134> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:23:33] *** t0by <t0by!~t0by@host197-65-dynamic.44-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it> has joined ##OpenGL[20:30:21] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[20:31:09] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:31:13] *** notadeveloper__ <notadeveloper__!~letsmakej@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[20:31:13] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[20:31:35] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has joined ##OpenGL[20:32:09] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[20:33:15] *** nolash <nolash!~nolash@ip5f5bd522.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)[20:34:38] *** bogdan_ag <bogdan_ag!5f4df5bd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.77.245.189> has joined ##OpenGL[20:35:01] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:35:23] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[20:37:07] *** bogdan_ag <bogdan_ag!5f4df5bd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.77.245.189> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[20:37:23] <bookmark> so i have skelanims in glsl but im trying to get them on the cpu side, however they look slightly deformed. here is my function: http://codepad.org/P9EIL669 could it be something to do with divide by w?[20:37:37] <bookmark> she's extra tall[20:37:44] *** ender_ray <ender_ray!5f4df5bd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.77.245.189> has joined ##OpenGL[20:37:45] <bookmark> for whatever reason[20:38:01] *** Th30n <Th30n!~Th30n@93-136-14-170.adsl.net.t-com.hr> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[20:38:15] <bookmark> i know its sloppy but its a work in progress[20:39:11] <bookmark> i want them on the cpu so i can run collisions[20:39:11] *** ejb <ejb!~ejb@unaffiliated/ejb> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[20:40:00] <bookmark> any ideas?[20:40:27] <derhass> bookmark: why would you devide by w?[20:41:17] <bookmark> i dont know im grasping at straws so to speak[20:41:48] <Stragus> The perspective divide is to project on a 2D surface, you don't need that if you want the animations to do physics/collision/whatever[20:41:49] <bookmark> i mean the bones are supposed to be model matrices[20:42:07] <bookmark> right[20:42:26] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[20:42:35] <bookmark> i could post a video the collisions work but she's like really tall[20:43:33] <btipling_> is it skewed tall[20:43:42] <btipling_> like just wrong in the y dimension?[20:43:46] <btipling_> or is it scaled wrong entirely[20:43:54] <bookmark> ill post a video[20:43:55] <btipling_> like all dimensions are off by s[20:46:06] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:46:28] <ender_ray> Hey guys. Any chance you could help me with a problem (an advice on what to do would be great).[20:46:34] <ender_ray> Situation: I have a very old project(Opengl ES mini game) that has has support for android native and windows(visual studio - debugging purposes).[20:46:39] <ender_ray> The latest nVidia drigers caused the windows program to hang while loading the libEGL.dll that this old project has.[20:46:44] <ender_ray> I want to find an Opengl ES version that will load. I tried looking into PVRFrame's libs but they don't seem to work.[20:46:46] <ender_ray> Sorry if i'm wasting your time but i could use an advice.[20:47:00] <bookmark> https://youtu.be/5iPHBonKB94[20:47:01] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has joined ##OpenGL[20:47:08] *** nolash <nolash!~nolash@ip5f5bd522.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de> has joined ##OpenGL[20:48:15] *** ejb <ejb!~ejb@unaffiliated/ejb> has joined ##OpenGL[20:48:42] <btipling_> the model doesn't seem skewed[20:48:54] <bookmark> the whit model[20:49:09] <btipling_> oh[20:49:14] <btipling_> yes that's skewed[20:49:33] <Stragus> ender_ray: You shouldn't provide any libEGL.dll, Nvidia drivers provide their own libEGL shared library[20:49:37] <bookmark> collisions are working nicely on her though[20:49:47] <Stragus> Unless that libEGL.dll is some kind of wrapper translating EGL calls into GL?[20:50:04] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:50:27] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[20:52:00] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has joined ##OpenGL[20:54:10] *** carado <carado!~carado@bea44-1-78-193-226-57.fbxo.proxad.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[20:54:28] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[20:55:06] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[20:56:33] *** nikki93 <nikki93!~nikki93@1.186.105.7> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[20:58:53] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[20:59:15] *** notadeveloper__ <notadeveloper__!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has joined ##OpenGL[20:59:20] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[21:00:05] <ender_ray> Stragus: yes. it's a wrapper. the project has no implementation for gl. porting it would take time.[21:00:56] *** vassagus <vassagus!~vassagus@186.4.2.162> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:02:20] *** vassagus <vassagus!~vassagus@186.4.2.162> has joined ##OpenGL[21:02:29] <ender_ray> i have libEGL.dll and libGLES_CM.dll that emulates android on windows.[21:03:18] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:03:29] <ender_ray> but this has stopped working on latest nvidia drivers. rollback driver works, but i'd like another solution ( that is not porting the game). is there any solution?[21:04:03] <Stragus> I would be curious what the code or the EGL wrapper might be doing wrong[21:04:27] <ender_ray> hangs on run. i've no ideea how to debug it[21:04:29] <Stragus> I have seen archaic code that was using display lists break on latest drivers a few times[21:04:36] <derhass> And I'm curious why you need a wrapper at all and can't use native GLES[21:05:07] <ender_ray> how can i use that? project is in visual studio.[21:05:11] <ender_ray> android jni[21:05:32] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[21:05:38] <notadeveloper__> stargus hi[21:05:55] <bookmark> ah ha[21:05:58] *** ratchetfreak <ratchetfreak!~ratchetfr@ptr-2hj4tbosgukoekshehhss3wcq.ip6.access.telenet.be> has joined ##OpenGL[21:06:07] <derhass> ender_ray: just use nvidia's DLLs?[21:06:08] <bookmark> its those 1.0 need mult by weight[21:06:15] *** vassagus <vassagus!~vassagus@186.4.2.162> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:06:51] <notadeveloper__> is it better to keep track of state than injection[21:07:28] *** Salvakiya <Salvakiya!~Salvakiya@host109-154-253-144.range109-154.btcentralplus.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[21:07:38] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~notadevel@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has joined ##OpenGL[21:07:45] *** notadeveloper__ <notadeveloper__!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[21:07:49] *** vassagus <vassagus!~vassagus@186.4.2.162> has joined ##OpenGL[21:08:02] *** notadeveloper <notadeveloper!~letsmakej@2602:306:bd2a:a160:59c4:815b:67cb:ddf4> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[21:09:53] <bookmark> great now the model just vanishes[21:15:26] <bookmark> i guess ill throw on an animation and see what happens at that time[21:15:47] *** BlackFox <BlackFox!~BlackFox@ip-6317.proline.net.ua> has joined ##OpenGL[21:17:28] *** ShadowIce <ShadowIce!~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[21:23:09] <bookmark> how do i dele a buffer? i think i might be running out of space or something[21:23:37] <bookmark> she disappear after like 40 seconds[21:24:02] <bookmark> wait buffer is overwritten hmmm[21:26:20] *** carado <carado!~carado@2a01:e34:ec1e:2390:8341:b3f5:2d6:41fa> has joined ##OpenGL[21:26:33] *** vassagus <vassagus!~vassagus@186.4.2.162> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:27:35] *** vassagus <vassagus!~vassagus@186.4.2.162> has joined ##OpenGL[21:28:15] *** shingshang <shingshang!~shingshan@115-64-27-246.static.tpgi.com.au> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[21:29:04] *** vijai <vijai!vijai@gateway/shell/openshells.net/x-yvrvldktmwqeaazg> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[21:29:44] *** BilboTheHobbit <BilboTheHobbit!~Emma@112.10.170.31> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[21:30:21] *** tambre <tambre!~tambre@dfe0-d576-1aa3-c489-a980-8a3e-07d0-2001.dyn.estpak.ee> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)[21:31:12] *** ronaldsmazitis <ronaldsmazitis!~quassel@46.109.139.95> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[21:31:13] *** therue <therue!~therue@1-162-75-104.dynamic.hinet.net> has quit IRC (Quit: therue)[21:31:49] *** lahwran <lahwran!~lahwran@python/site-packages/lahwran> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:31:52] <dahlia> bookmark: https://www.opengl.org/sdk/docs/man2/xhtml/glDeleteBuffers.xml[21:32:27] *** ahuillet <ahuillet!~ahuillet@2a01:e34:ec9c:92c0:21f:c6ff:fe3e:1ecf> has joined ##OpenGL[21:33:35] *** SHC <SHC!~quassel@117.213.108.108> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:34:08] *** reBrain <reBrain!~reBrain@unaffiliated/rebrain> has joined ##OpenGL[21:37:08] *** pril <pril!~userid@unaffiliated/pril> has joined ##OpenGL[21:37:21] *** Th30n <Th30n!~Th30n@93-136-14-170.adsl.net.t-com.hr> has joined ##OpenGL[21:37:45] *** glYoda <glYoda!~MTLYoda@c-50-137-137-82.hsd1.or.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: glYoda)[21:38:07] *** Th30n <Th30n!~Th30n@93-136-14-170.adsl.net.t-com.hr> has quit IRC (Client Quit)[21:38:33] *** glYoda <glYoda!~MTLYoda@c-50-137-137-82.hsd1.or.comcast.net> has joined ##OpenGL[21:38:43] *** carado <carado!~carado@2a01:e34:ec1e:2390:8341:b3f5:2d6:41fa> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[21:39:21] *** vijai <vijai!vijai@gateway/shell/openshells.net/x-bzdluirosddhkmah> has joined ##OpenGL[21:40:36] *** SwiftMatt <SwiftMatt!~Objective@162.242.94.133> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[21:40:37] *** cantstanya <cantstanya!~chatting@2001:41d0:8:c6c::1> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 1.5)[21:40:46] <bookmark> fixed it[21:41:09] <bookmark> it was the extra call to genbuffers on the rebuffer function[21:41:39] *** cantstanya <cantstanya!~chatting@unaffiliated/cantstanya> has joined ##OpenGL[21:41:51] <bookmark> split it to its own function with no genbuffers[21:42:55] *** slidercrank <slidercrank!~slidercra@unaffiliated/slidercrank> has joined ##OpenGL[21:43:48] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[21:44:37] *** ejb <ejb!~ejb@unaffiliated/ejb> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[21:47:09] *** carado <carado!~carado@2a01:e34:ec1e:2390:8341:b3f5:2d6:41fa> has joined ##OpenGL[21:47:41] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has quit IRC (Quit: groton)[21:48:43] *** reBrain <reBrain!~reBrain@unaffiliated/rebrain> has left ##OpenGL ("Leaving")[21:49:47] *** Joefish_ <Joefish_!~Joefish@p5B121A14.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has joined ##OpenGL[21:49:50] <ender_ray> the lib i use: http://www.megafileupload.com/7x3w/opengl.zip[21:50:48] *** tristanseifert <tristanseifert!~tristanse@128.194.3.4> has joined ##OpenGL[21:51:25] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@AReims-652-1-76-199.w86-192.abo.wanadoo.fr> has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)[21:51:28] *** DrGonzo <DrGonzo!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has joined ##OpenGL[21:52:17] *** Joefish <Joefish!~Joefish@p5B1202AB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[21:52:59] *** ronaldsmazitis <ronaldsmazitis!~quassel@46.109.139.95> has joined ##OpenGL[21:53:04] *** Blibno <Blibno!ad1fc45e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.31.196.94> has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed)[21:53:05] *** DrBenway <DrBenway!~DrBenway@190.18.153.73> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)[22:01:13] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[22:01:23] *** KAHR-Alpha <KAHR-Alpha!~Alpha@AReims-652-1-76-199.w86-192.abo.wanadoo.fr> has joined ##OpenGL[22:01:31] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has joined ##OpenGL[22:08:02] *** flavi0 <flavi0!~anon@unaffiliated/flavi0> has joined ##OpenGL[22:08:41] <btipling_> bookmark that was the problem that resulted in skewing?[22:08:48] *** ejb <ejb!~ejb@unaffiliated/ejb> has joined ##OpenGL[22:10:43] <bookmark> the skewing was the 1.0 needed to be multiplied by the weight[22:10:59] <bookmark> since temp1 was added to cache[22:11:21] <bookmark> it resulted in 2.0[22:11:30] <bookmark> or something[22:11:47] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.74.206> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[22:13:22] <bookmark> sorry cant type too well i have an injured hand[22:14:48] *** mat^2 <mat^2!~Mathias@130.226.161.124> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[22:14:59] *** khlorghaal <khlorghaal!~quassel@76-202-65-254.lightspeed.brbnca.sbcglobal.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)[22:15:46] *** flavi0 <flavi0!~anon@unaffiliated/flavi0> has quit IRC (Quit: Lost terminal)[22:15:50] *** flavi0_ <flavi0_!~anon@21.130.90.92.rev.sfr.net> has joined ##OpenGL[22:19:53] *** razieliyo <razieliyo!~razieliyo@unaffiliated/razieliyo> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[22:24:33] *** BusFactor1 <BusFactor1!~textual@S0106a0639172137a.cg.shawcable.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[22:26:31] *** Kingsqueee <Kingsqueee!~kingsley@d154-20-149-39.bchsia.telus.net> has joined ##OpenGL[22:29:22] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has joined ##OpenGL[22:32:37] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.2.233> has joined ##OpenGL[22:36:51] *** GarrettShields <GarrettShields!~GarrettSh@CPE3497f6605400-CMbc14013107e0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[22:38:50] *** GarrettShields <GarrettShields!~GarrettSh@CPE3497f6605400-CMbc14013107e0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com> has joined ##OpenGL[22:38:52] *** tm6041 is now known as tm604[22:40:01] *** stefkos <stefkos!~stefkos@82.177.144.226> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[22:40:25] *** ejb <ejb!~ejb@unaffiliated/ejb> has quit IRC (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)[22:41:05] *** ImQ009 <ImQ009!~ImQ009@unaffiliated/imq009> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[22:42:25] *** Fr0stBit <Fr0stBit!~theartist@62.1.207.59.dsl.dyn.forthnet.gr> has quit IRC (Quit: WeeChat 1.5)[22:50:42] *** t4nk508 <t4nk508!ad1fc45e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.31.196.94> has joined ##OpenGL[22:51:03] *** fqtw_ <fqtw_!~me@x4db07b2c.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[22:51:43] <t4nk508> Hello - does anyone know what determines the precision of floating point values returned by a texture sample when using a linear mag filter?[22:52:33] <foobaz> driver and hardware[22:52:46] <t4nk508> is there any way to specify?[22:53:31] *** ejb <ejb!~ejb@unaffiliated/ejb> has joined ##OpenGL[22:54:19] *** fqtw <fqtw!~me@x4db07b2c.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)[22:58:32] <btipling_> bookmark have you done any lighting work?[22:58:40] <btipling_> oh I hope your hand gets better[22:58:45] <btipling_> I like the videos on your youtube[22:58:49] <btipling_> I subbed[22:58:58] <btipling_> I'm a big fan of gamedev youtube videos :P[22:59:44] <bookmark> um... i did some dynamic lighting in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vW9th1b2O3c[23:00:21] *** zagabar <zagabar!~zagabar@unaffiliated/zagabar> has joined ##OpenGL[23:00:40] <bookmark> and but mostly im going to use 4k lightmaps for world shadowing[23:01:37] <btipling_> oh[23:01:49] <btipling_> how do you do your model animation? is that a library or something you wrote yourself?[23:02:12] *** t4nk508 <t4nk508!ad1fc45e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.31.196.94> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[23:02:18] <bookmark> i use maya for animation and lightmapping[23:02:25] <btipling_> but I mean in opengl[23:02:29] <bookmark> zbrush for some moddeling[23:02:35] <btipling_> you had some code you had to write[23:02:37] <btipling_> to make that work right[23:03:00] <btipling_> that video looks like it's multiplayer, you've been writing netcode too?[23:03:02] <bookmark> yeah its skeletal that i came up with myself[23:03:05] <btipling_> it's pretty cool[23:03:10] <bookmark> yeah[23:03:12] <btipling_> is that open source?[23:03:17] <bookmark> nah[23:03:20] <btipling_> ah ok[23:03:29] <btipling_> looks really awesome[23:03:34] <btipling_> how long did it take you?[23:04:20] <bookmark> maybe later cuz now im starting a hentai game tooo haha. I think one will be open source but not sure which ye.t[23:04:34] <bookmark> ive been working on that game about 6 years[23:05:04] <bookmark> lol[23:05:13] <btipling_> wow[23:05:24] <btipling_> nice[23:05:28] <bookmark> yeah bbobies[23:05:32] <btipling_> I mean 6 years[23:05:36] <btipling_> not the other thing :P[23:05:37] <bookmark> yeah[23:06:08] <bookmark> the hard part is using non deprecated code to try and stay modern[23:06:14] <dawik> boobies are the best[23:06:19] *** kunalk <kunalk!~kunalk@223.186.45.156> has joined ##OpenGL[23:06:40] <bookmark> boobies in a game is gonna be great[23:06:46] <kunalk> :D[23:07:02] *** fqtw__ <fqtw__!~me@x4db18f86.dyn.telefonica.de> has joined ##OpenGL[23:07:20] <bookmark> but cant post that to youtube probably[23:07:30] <btipling_> well I felt a little weird opening your video at work in an open office enviornment :P[23:07:44] *** flavi0_ <flavi0_!~anon@21.130.90.92.rev.sfr.net> has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)[23:07:45] <btipling_> you can post it if it's not nude[23:08:20] <bookmark> yeah i ight just show like some ik physics or something[23:08:29] <bookmark> might[23:08:39] <btipling_> have a "clothes" mode[23:08:50] <btipling_> requires two textures I guess[23:09:20] <btipling_> I don't want to look at any hentai but I like seeing game dev videos[23:09:36] <btipling_> like opengl game dev, not unity or unreal videos[23:09:50] *** fqtw_ <fqtw_!~me@x4db07b2c.dyn.telefonica.de> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[23:09:51] <bookmark> yeah im doing itfor the challenge[23:10:36] *** stelarcf <stelarcf!~stelarcf@92.81.115.213> has quit IRC (Quit: stelarcf)[23:11:18] <btipling_> yep me too[23:11:31] <bookmark> coding on ASgame now is just a lot of content creation and AI programming so its getting boring[23:11:40] *** hl <hl!~hl@unaffiliated/hl> has quit IRC (Quit: Quit)[23:12:22] *** jakeio <jakeio!~Sam@host86-132-91-161.range86-132.btcentralplus.com> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[23:12:42] *** hl <hl!~hl@unaffiliated/hl> has joined ##OpenGL[23:14:14] <bookmark> and i cant figure out timing stuff[23:15:00] <bookmark> like if my frame rate spikes then the players might move too fast or jump too high[23:15:23] <bookmark> its annoyingly difficult to control[23:15:35] *** kunalk <kunalk!~kunalk@223.186.45.156> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[23:16:05] <bookmark> but ill make some time for that once my hand heals[23:17:31] *** Curious_ <Curious_!~chatzilla@dslb-188-107-142-250.188.107.pools.vodafone-ip.de> has quit IRC (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 48.0.2/20160823121617])[23:19:02] <dahlia> bookmark: measure time between updates and use that to know how far to move[23:19:42] <dahlia> position += velocity * time[23:20:13] <bookmark> what about something like a jump that has to overcome gravity[23:20:24] <dahlia> what about it?[23:20:47] <bookmark> i dunno physics just leaves me confused[23:20:54] <Stragus> bookmark: Flow should be totally independent from the frame rate[23:21:10] <bookmark> well ideally no shit[23:21:11] <Stragus> Accumulate the flow of time and decide how many "ticks" to process before rendering each frame[23:21:35] *** Codex_ <Codex_!~terop@91-157-91-164.elisa-laajakaista.fi> has joined ##OpenGL[23:21:41] <bookmark> ok[23:21:59] <dahlia> gravity is usually what.. 9.8 m/s/s ? cant remember[23:22:22] <Codex_> ok, skeletal anim code done: http://tpgames.org/bone.png[23:22:31] <dahlia> so ya if you jump up you decelerate[23:23:24] <bookmark> node based nice[23:25:34] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.2.233> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)[23:26:37] <bookmark> but should a jump carry more velocity than standard movement?[23:26:50] *** quickbrownfox <quickbrownfox!~henrique_@186.194.99.248> has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)[23:27:19] *** groton <groton!~groton@unaffiliated/groton> has quit IRC (Quit: groton)[23:27:21] <bookmark> and its just one frame when their launshing?[23:27:31] <bookmark> launching[23:27:35] *** ibouvousaime <ibouvousaime!~ibouvousa@41.83.57.154> has joined ##OpenGL[23:28:25] <Stragus> A human jump has a strong acceleration but it doesn't last very long[23:29:05] *** MoZu4k__ <MoZu4k__!~MoZu4k@c-50-142-183-133.hsd1.tn.comcast.net> has joined ##OpenGL[23:34:31] *** MoZu4k__ <MoZu4k__!~MoZu4k@c-50-142-183-133.hsd1.tn.comcast.net> has quit IRC (Quit: MoZu4k__)[23:35:39] <btipling_> for a multiplayer game wouldn't you do the physics server side[23:36:34] <btipling_> seems like an exploit, or at least potentially users may see different things[23:36:42] <Stragus> Depends. For best responsiveness, you might want each client to compute their own stuff and reach the same results, especially for non-gameplay-affecting physics[23:37:18] <btipling_> right for non-gameplay stuff do that client side[23:42:13] *** notadeveloper_ <notadeveloper_!~notadevel@107-210-170-22.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)[23:46:12] *** bookmark <bookmark!~IceChat77@173-169-112-35.res.bhn.net> has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)[23:48:15] *** anli_ <anli_!~anders@217-211-66-29-no23.tbcn.telia.com> has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)