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[00:21:16] <bomb> TEttinger: what resources
[00:21:32] <bomb> jlink --add-module java.base --output mytinyjre
[00:26:22] <TEttinger> oh uh
[00:26:44] <TEttinger> I just don't have any idea how to use jlink and last I tried google wasn't helping
[00:26:55] <TEttinger> does it work on an application?
[00:26:58] <bomb> this code is all you need
[00:27:08] <bomb> yes?
[00:27:21] <bomb> a gui program made with SWT
[00:27:21] <TEttinger> I mean do you run jlink on your app jar
[00:27:59] <bomb> no it just shits JRE in the folder, then you can create an EXE using Launch4j to run your jar using the custom JRE
[00:28:07] <TEttinger> ah ok
[00:28:13] <bomb> or even freaking bat/sh would work
[00:28:26] <TEttinger> huh, I thought there was moduleinfo.java stuff to deal with
[00:28:46] <bomb> then you can use 7zip to put your dir into a single LZMA-compressed EXE
[00:29:00] <bomb> end result = 10MB!
[00:30:23] <bomb> java.base probably covers all your needs 99% of the time. it has everything: https://docs.oracle.com/javase/10/docs/api/java.base-summary.html
[00:30:38] <bomb> if you need Swing, for example
[00:30:55] <bomb> jlink --add-module java.base,java.desktop --output mytinyjre
[00:33:08] <bomb> for this app i use base, desktop, sql, sql.rawset modules. and it's all 17MB when compressed with LZMA
[00:33:40] <TEttinger> this seemed to do it here "C:\Program Files\Zulu\zulu9.0.4.1\bin\jlink.exe" --module-path "C:\Program Files\Zulu\zulu9.0.4.1\jmods" --add-modules java.base --output baseOnly9
[00:33:49] <TEttinger> it complained without --module-path
[00:34:48] <TEttinger> that looks like the just java.base directory is 35 MB, like you said
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[00:35:06] <bomb> can you add zulu jdk's bin to environment vars?
[00:35:33] <bomb> it did weird stuff when i tried to run jlink.exe directly
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[00:42:29] <bomb> btw SWT is not a good framework. going outside of the JVM is risky business in Java programs
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[03:54:45] <TEttinger> hmm. libgdx seems to need java.base,java.desktop for modules when using lwjgl2
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[05:03:05] <krysanto> hello i keep getting an error when i try to launch the desktop version of my game
[05:03:11] <TEttinger> hello
[05:03:13] <krysanto> https://pastebin.com/rhbY7byZ
[05:04:15] <TEttinger> looks like gradle is having an error
[05:04:17] <krysanto> im using intellij idea and set sourceCompatibility to 1.8 in build.gradle of core, desktop and android
[05:04:50] <TEttinger> are you running with the gradle task desktop:run ?
[05:06:00] <krysanto> no im using the launcher configuration i got from https://libgdx.badlogicgames.com/documentation/gettingstarted/Running%20and%20Debugging.html#running-desktop-project-in-intellij-android-studio
[05:08:49] <krysanto> executing the task run via gradle triggers the same error
[05:08:51] <krysanto> https://pastebin.com/EQLdAcdA
[05:09:10] <TEttinger> what gradle version are you using? the pastebin showed almost all of the calls were in internal gradle code, so something is still using gradle. you can find out your version by looking in gradle/wrapper/gradle-wrapper.properties
[05:09:54] <TEttinger> no no, desktop:run
[05:09:55] <krysanto> im using 4.6
[05:10:15] <TEttinger> or whatever module your desktop is called, maybe lwjgl or lwjgl3
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[05:12:26] <TEttinger> hm, wat... run works for me, I thought it didn't... I'm also not using 4.6 yet
[05:29:49] <TEttinger> waaaait woah whaaaaat
[05:29:50] <TEttinger> at com.android.build.gradle.BasePlugin.lambda$configureProject$1(BasePlugin.java:436)
[05:30:25] <TEttinger> that's the android plugin... try desktop:run , seriously. I think "run" will run all targets
[05:30:32] <TEttinger> ^ krysanto
[05:30:59] <TEttinger> I've only tried this on a desktop-only project, but I have others I can try
[05:31:26] <krysanto> im running this in the desktop project
[05:31:34] <krysanto> local gradle wont work for me either
[05:31:39] <TEttinger> oh don't do that
[05:31:51] <TEttinger> run from the root
[05:32:03] <TEttinger> project root
[05:32:40] <krysanto> same error message
[05:38:03] <krysanto> executing the task in a clean project works
[05:38:15] <krysanto> i feel rly stupid to not think of that
[05:38:22] <krysanto> thanks friend
[05:39:20] <krysanto> should i file a bug report though?
[05:47:28] <TEttinger> uhh I don't think we even know what the problem was
[05:48:36] <TEttinger> it's something weird that may have just been a misconfig or typo in some file in the non-clean project. if the clean project is fine that the gdx setup is fine, but I think this may be good to be aware of if it happens again
[05:48:50] <TEttinger> mostly it's a bad error message, but that's the google android plugin's fault
[05:49:36] <krysanto> it happened on a clean ubuntu 18.04 java 8 environment with a clean project
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[05:51:59] <TEttinger> hmmm
[05:54:11] <TEttinger> I get no issues with "..\gradlew run" on windows when I run from my desktop project, but if I run "gradlew run" from the root it tries to run android, desktop, and HTML targets all at once. "gradlew desktop:run" from root works fine, only launches desktop
[06:28:39] <krysanto> maybe i fucked something up thanks anyway
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[07:29:37] <bomb> i want a free, open-source AOT compiler for Java XD
[07:32:38] <jayhost> You can't use java 9's?
[07:42:17] <TEttinger> linux only
[07:42:44] <TEttinger> RoboVM, als
[07:42:47] <TEttinger> also
[07:43:59] <TEttinger> how goes jayhost?
[07:45:02] <TEttinger> also bomb, libgdx seems to need java.base,java.desktop for modules when using lwjgl2
[07:45:09] <TEttinger> not sure about lwjgl3
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[08:09:18] <bomb> TEttinger: interesting. can you add lwjgl separately?
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[08:21:42] <TEttinger> you mean a project with just lwjgl, bomb?
[08:22:14] <bomb> yep. using just java.base
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[08:42:48] <TEttinger> I can run an LWJGL3 app just fine with only java.base, but it gives me this weird semi-error even though it runs fine:
[08:42:49] <TEttinger> java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: sun/misc/Unsafe
[08:43:01] <TEttinger> [LWJGL] [MemoryAccessor] Unsupported JVM detected, this will likely result in low performance. Please inform LWJGL developers.
[08:43:34] <bomb> ehh
[08:44:08] <TEttinger> about the same FPS too
[08:44:15] <TEttinger> so it isn't giving low perf
[08:44:37] <TEttinger> (might be a bit better in the one with the "unsupported JM")
[08:44:39] <TEttinger> JVM
[08:45:16] <bomb> if it somehow runs, why the heck libgdx requires java.desktop?
[08:58:41] <bomb> TEttinger: use -G option when using jlink to strip debug symbols
[08:59:01] <bomb> java.base zulu 10 jre is 30MB now
[08:59:11] <TEttinger> only lwjgl2 requires desktop
[08:59:19] <TEttinger> due to AWT classes in lwjgl2
[08:59:24] <TEttinger> neat
[09:02:46] <bomb> TEttinger: add --compress=2 and it's 21MB now
[09:06:59] <TEttinger> huh, my zulu 10 jre is still 35 MB without compress
[09:08:31] <bomb> TOO MUCH
[09:09:12] <TEttinger> so how does the self extracting thing work?
[09:09:30] <TEttinger> do you get it to launch javaw.exe with your target jar?
[09:10:40] <bomb> 7zip's self extractor just extract files
[09:11:07] <TEttinger> can you get it to launch the jar or...
[09:11:08] <bomb> i will write an innosetup script to extract the jre and jars into temp file and run the javaw and your jar
[09:11:31] <TEttinger> hm, should it extract each time?
[09:11:39] <TEttinger> seems like it would hurt startup time
[09:12:34] <TEttinger> still so far this is great
[09:12:48] <bomb> just a few seconds. but for normal games and applications you'd want to extract once and use it every time
[09:14:24] <TEttinger> so 7z compressed java.base jdk 10 is 13MB for me
[09:14:35] <TEttinger> that's pretty great
[09:16:51] <TEttinger> 11.1 ! forgot -G
[09:17:07] <TEttinger> about 11MB is about the size of this game...
[09:19:07] <TEttinger> game is about 22MB now woo
[09:19:15] <TEttinger> thanks bomb, this helps a bunch
[09:21:16] <bomb> did you do --compress=2 too?
[09:27:22] <TEttinger> yep
[09:27:46] <TEttinger> 11.1 with 7z base only compress=2 -G
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[09:55:34] <bomb> TEttinger: have innosetip installed. i'll provide you scripts within hours ^_^
[09:56:54] <TEttinger> hm wha?
[09:57:09] <TEttinger> I think I've used innosetup before, don't recall much about it
[09:57:32] <bomb> how do you normally package your games?
[09:57:50] <TEttinger> I usually make libs! but I should get to packaging soon
[09:58:24] <TEttinger> I've had a devil of a time getting ProGuard to work
[09:59:00] <TEttinger> I wound up using a tool called JarShrink that just uses Java 8+'s built in jdeps executable to find what classes are imported in a jar
[09:59:27] <TEttinger> jarshrink itself is a 35 kb jar
[09:59:32] <TEttinger> teensy tiny
[09:59:54] <TEttinger> I had to recompile it because it found jdeps in a brittle way
[10:00:21] <TEttinger> but, jarshrink got one of these heavy jars from 23 to 11 MB
[10:01:26] <bomb> speaking of shrink, this is the command i use
[10:01:30] <bomb> jlink -v --strip-debug --no-man-pages --no-header-files --exclude-jmod-section=man --exclude-jmod-section=headers --compress=2 --class-for-name --output zulu10-base --add-modules java.base
[10:01:53] <TEttinger> wowza
[10:04:25] <bomb> then i'll use launch4j to create an EXE that runs javaw with your jar
[10:04:37] <TEttinger> my jar???
[10:04:47] <bomb> then i'll use innosetup to create silent (OR LOUD) installer for the entire package
[10:04:54] <bomb> OUR JARS
[10:04:54] <TEttinger> my jar isnae ready capn!
[10:05:04] <bomb> kek
[10:05:43] <bomb> launch4j is not required for macOS, Linux, FreeBSD distribution
[10:05:54] <bomb> and innosetup is not needed for Steam or Windows Store distribution
[10:06:44] <bomb> if you're going to publish your game on Windows Store, install Visual Studio and Windows 10 SDK. we'll use their packager for the store!
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[10:46:39] <bomb> is H2 a good database engine? i need an sqlite-like engine
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[11:33:35] <jayhost> Tettinger : Goes alright, how about yourself, I'll try to be on more.
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[11:46:55] <blahblah> hello all!
[11:53:34] <blahblah> here is my small proof-of-concept of using distance field fonts: https://pastebin.com/UuapCE14
[11:53:59] <blahblah> when adjusting the smoothing correctly, I can render the font correctly at many different scale
[11:54:22] <blahblah> but how do you determine the smoothing factor? It's very different values depending on the level of zooming
[12:01:12] <blahblah> at the moment I adjust it manually, by looking at the rendering of the font, but how do you determine the proper smoothing value to use programmatically?
[12:04:20] <blahblah> if you run my code, you can use ctrl+mouseWheel to zoom in/out the text, and using just mooseWheel will increase/decrease the smoothing, and you can use -/+ to adjust the smoothing step, the bigger the value the smaller the smoothing step
[12:04:57] <blahblah> s/mooseWheel/mouseWheel/
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[12:14:16] <Tomski> blahblah: you pass in the scale
[12:14:55] <Tomski> Which is based on texels you are rendering at compared to the pixel size you generated the font at
[12:15:23] <Tomski> Why are you doing that file handle thing for eclipse?
[12:15:30] <Tomski> Just set the working directory properly on your run configuration
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[12:29:40] <blahblah> Tomski: ok this was a remnant of an old problem I've been having, but it seems it's not needed anymore, thanks for pointing it out!
[12:30:24] <blahblah> Tomski: about fonts, my problem is depending on the scale, I need to adjust the smoothing differently
[12:31:22] <blahblah> but can't figure out how to adjust it programmatically
[12:31:42] <blahblah> how do I know the correct smoothing to apply for a given scale?
[12:32:37] <Tomski> The right smoothing value for crisp fonts is 0.25f / (spread * scale)
[12:32:38] <Tomski> From the docs
[12:34:37] <blahblah> guess it went over my head when I read it the first time, so many things I don't fully grasp in there
[12:34:42] <blahblah> thanks!
[12:43:00] <blahblah> mmmh so I guess Arial is not crisp at all
[12:47:07] <blahblah> well it seems to work reasonnably well, except for size < 11
[12:48:27] <blahblah> mmm in the formula 0.25f / (spread * scale), is the scale the value I used along with spread at font generation time, or my actual scale that depends on the zoom level in app?
[12:49:12] <blahblah> or both?
[12:50:21] <Tomski> Scale depends on the size you are rendering in game
[12:50:32] <Tomski> Its the size in game compared to size at generation time
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[18:40:19] <Crigges> Hello, Iam currently trying to use a PBO to load pixel data from a ByteBuffer into a Texture. My code currently uses glTexSubImage2D() which is too slow. So far Iam trying to adapt the example explained here: http://www.songho.ca/opengl/gl_pbo.html But it uses glMapBuffer() and I wasn't able to find a libgdx compliant for it. Is there any example code how to use a PBO in libgdx?
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[19:27:07] <Tomski> Crigges: not available on gles
[19:27:15] <Tomski> Unless extension is there
[20:05:15] <Crigges> okay thx
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[20:22:01] <grim002> so I'm creating several effects based on fading rather than clearing the previous image (motion trails) but I was never able to integrate it properly into my isometric scene due to depth issues
[20:22:49] <grim002> that lead me to place rain effects on a different screenspace-rendered pass which was easy to fade/blur independently
[20:23:52] <grim002> but recently I found a way to keep motion trails in a way that respects the depth buffer and works with translucent and additive surfaces
[20:24:49] <grim002> so now everything gets motion blur
[20:25:44] <grim002> will be fun to have motion blurred raindrops that physically exist in the world and can react to forces
[20:26:24] <grim002> could make a spell that summons rain, then sucks all the raindrops in to a ball of water
[20:26:28] <[twisti]> sounds pretty laggy
[20:26:44] <grim002> which part?
[20:27:23] <[twisti]> physically existing rain drops
[20:27:43] <grim002> with CPU-controlled projectiles, yes, that would be impractical
[20:28:10] <grim002> it takes about 16,000 to 32,000 raindrops to saturate the game area with believable rain
[20:28:36] <grim002> fortunately with transform feedback I can use over 1 million particles before any hint of lag starts up
[20:28:59] <[twisti]> cool
[20:29:07] <grim002> the main problem with that approach is spawning droplets when rain hits the ground
[20:29:21] <grim002> geometry shaders are kinda slow when they have to spawn new particles
[20:29:56] <grim002> the effect is too cool to pass up on though
[20:30:54] <grim002> I don't know why more modern AAA games don't have heavy use of GPU controlled particles
[20:31:14] <[twisti]> pics or it didnt happen imo
[20:31:17] <grim002> I mean, they have them, but they don't abuse them to create cool effects
[20:31:45] <grim002> or attempt much in the way of GPU side physical interaction with the environment
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[20:33:00] <grim002> if I cover the entire screen in opaque particles (1 million+) you won't see anything but a bunch of colored balls, but the framerate improves because it's occluding the rest of the scene from rendering
[20:33:45] <grim002> if I cover the entire screen with 1 million+ additive particles, it can start to lag, because it's hitting the fill rate limit with so many extra pixels onscreen
[20:34:13] <grim002> transform feedback is so fast that GPU particles are basically free, even with some physics applied
[20:34:45] <grim002> I can't create a scenario where the particles themselves are the source of any slowdown
[20:35:39] <grim002> and that's just with OpenGL 3.3, more indies should use it
[20:35:56] <grim002> doesn't require OpenGL 4+ like many fancy features
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[21:07:41] <blotunga> re
[21:08:31] <blotunga> any news on when 1.9.9 might show up?
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   May 21, 2018  
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