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[09:25:01] <Weltraumschaf> good morning
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[11:02:05] <jenkinsci_builds> Starting build 548 for job jenkins_main_trunk (previous build: FAILURE -- last SUCCESS #510 15 days ago)
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[11:41:22] <paseante> hi
[11:41:35] <paseante> I'm a Jenkins newbie
[11:42:03] <paseante> how could I replicate the way that unit tests results are presented at
[11:42:03] <paseante> http://ci.jenkins-ci.org/job/jenkins_main_trunk/546/testReport/?
[11:42:07] <paseante> is that a plugin?
[11:45:29] <drulli> The test report is not a plug-in, it's a core feature
[11:45:43] <drulli> What do you mean with replicate?
[11:46:40] <paseante> drulli: imitate
[11:46:49] <paseante> a core feature? nice
[11:55:01] <Nick_Stolwijk> Are you using a Maven build?
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[11:56:39] <ojii> hi everyone
[11:56:46] <Nick_Stolwijk> Hi
[11:56:52] <olamy> morning
[11:57:01] <ojii> I have a build that just hangs for 1.5 hours now (usually takes 2 minutes to build), clicking the 'x' does not stop it though
[11:57:12] <ojii> how can I kill that build?
[11:57:26] <ojii> (see: http://ci.django-cms.org/job/django-cms/131/)
[11:59:08] <paseante> Nick_Stolwijk: nope
[12:00:07] <Nick_Stolwijk> That way is the easiest, it just picks it up. ;) What kind of build are you using, and what kind of unit test framework?
[12:07:50] <paseante> Nick_Stolwijk: we are starting the project, we have chosen cmake and google test
[12:08:07] <paseante> so we use a custom build in Jenkins
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[12:13:13] <Nick_Stolwijk> paseante: Hmm, I know the test view of Jenkins reads the xml output of Junit and TestNG. As far as I know GoogleTest is not (yet) supported. I don't know how hard it will be to write that support.
[12:15:30] <stigkj> paseante: it seems GoogleTest can output JUnit style xml output: http://code.google.com/p/googletest/issues/detail?id=30
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[12:16:23] <Nick_Stolwijk> Then it will be easy to integrate into Jenkins. Just enable the "Publish JUnit test result report" and point it to the right files.
[12:18:10] <stigkj> paseante: http://code.google.com/p/googletest/wiki/AdvancedGuide#Generating_an_XML_Report
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[12:21:02] <paseante> that is very cool
[12:21:05] <paseante> everything fits
[12:21:11] <paseante> like a children's puzzle
[12:22:05] <Nick_Stolwijk> Those can be hard. ;)
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[12:36:51] <jenkinsci_builds> Project jenkins_main_trunk build #548: UNSTABLE in 1 hr 34 min: http://ci.jenkins-ci.org/job/jenkins_main_trunk/548/
[12:36:52] <jenkinsci_builds> Kohsuke Kawaguchi: [FIXED JENKINS-8579] defined a mechanism to replace some of the key UI text.
[13:01:54] <ojii> so what can I do when the 'stop/cancel' button for a build doesn't work?
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[14:00:35] <anr78> A job on my ubuntu machine runs a shell command where it calls a python script that uses the subprocess module. If subprocess uses 'shell=True', stuff fails. If I logon to the machine myself and compile from the workspace stuff works. Any ideas?
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[14:18:30] <stigkj> anr78: so your build does not run "thruogh" java?
[14:20:38] <stigkj> What I meant was that when Hudson runs your build, it runs the commands through Java's exec. Might be the source of the problem...
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[14:25:43] <anr78> stigkj: yeah, figured it was something like that, but how to solve it, I wonder.
[14:26:19] <stigkj> not that into python?why do you need shell=True?
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[14:32:45] <anr78> stigkj: it was because of a problem in dos, so I've reverted that commit and will try to work around it in windows instead. just curious if anyone knew why it happened.
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[15:19:33] <koenHuybrechts> hi all
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[15:24:31] <ojacobson> Anyone know where the source for http://wiki.jenkins-ci.org/display/JENKINS/Jenkins+Maven+Repository+Server lives?
[15:24:46] <ojacobson> I'd like to patch it to support lastStable and lastSuccessful as well as specific build numbers
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[15:29:35] <Nick_Stolwijk> ojacobson: I can't find it also, maybe e-mail the maintainer?
[15:29:49] <ojacobson> Ok, so long as it's not just me not knowing something obvious :)(
[15:29:52] <ojacobson> I had a look through github
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[15:33:12] <jieryn-w> ojacobson: you should patch it to be a generic MRM for all created artifacts
[15:33:22] <ojacobson> hm?
[15:33:30] <ojacobson> Back up and describe the limitation?
[15:33:43] <ojacobson> (I already want it to also serve upstream artifacts, so I might understand you already)
[15:33:46] <jieryn-w> so that jenkins can serve as an maven repository manager for all created artifacts
[15:34:06] <jieryn-w> i think that it's neat that the artifacts produced by jenkins can be served as-if-from a maven repository
[15:34:22] <jieryn-w> but it would be far more useful to be able to serve *all* artifacts it has produced from a top level location
[15:34:31] <ojacobson> A maven repo is easy to create
[15:34:38] <ojacobson> so that shouldn't be hard to add
[15:34:52] <ojacobson> If I get patchin' I'll definitely keep that in mind :)
[15:34:57] <jieryn-w> the plugin you're describing creates a very specialized and very tiny MRM
[15:35:06] <jieryn-w> like nexus
[15:35:07] <jieryn-w> or archiva
[15:35:09] <ojacobson> yeah
[15:35:22] <jieryn-w> so i'm saying, instead of doing it per-job, as it does now, have it work per-jenkins
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[15:40:12] <jieryn-w> so jenkins could act as a limited MRM :)
[15:40:18] <jieryn-w> no deployment to it, but it could serve
[15:40:53] <jieryn-w> i think it would fall under the other set of plugins like turning jenkins into a hadoop machine
[15:47:01] <jieryn-w> ojacobson: https://github.com/magnayn/Jenkins-Repository
[15:47:11] <jieryn-w> i don't know why it wasn't forked into jenkinsci org
[15:47:26] <magnayn> Because it's not stable yet..
[15:48:37] <ojacobson> magnayn: oh, hi :)
[15:48:47] <magnayn> :-)
[15:48:49] * ojacobson forks, gets to hacking on
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[15:49:05] <magnayn> my IRC had fallen behind a bunch of windows
[15:49:07] <jieryn-w> any intention to have generic MRM ?
[15:49:19] <magnayn> MRM ?
[15:49:21] <jieryn-w> per-jenkins instead of just per-job ?
[15:49:33] <jieryn-w> maven repository manager
[15:49:39] <jieryn-w> like nexus, or archiva, or artifactory
[15:49:50] <ojacobson> A top-level whole-instance (read-only) repository
[15:50:02] <jieryn-w> populated by the junk built by jenkins
[15:50:07] <magnayn> well, you could - I can tell you why I was motivated to write it..
[15:50:13] <jieryn-w> i'm all ears :)
[15:50:15] <ojacobson> Please :)
[15:50:28] <ojacobson> I already think it was a brilliant idea, regardless of motivation
[15:50:43] <magnayn> In our builds, we were trying to do a chain of "build product" then "do integration test" then "do customer tests for x,y,z,"
[15:50:53] <magnayn> problem is - how do you get the build artifacts up the chain
[15:51:00] <magnayn> traditional solution = upload them to nexus
[15:51:11] <magnayn> however, this gets horrid when you have multiple branches on the go..
[15:51:26] <magnayn> I.E: private developer branch is also 1.0-SNAPSHOT
[15:51:27] <ojacobson> 2.5-mybranch-SNAPSHOT lol
[15:51:34] <ojacobson> (which is a giant merge hazard)
[15:51:36] <magnayn> *exactly*
[15:51:50] <magnayn> short of updating every darn pom for every branch...
[15:52:01] <magnayn> So - if the downstream job is aware of the upstream job
[15:52:11] <magnayn> you can, say, add to the maven commandline
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[15:52:51] <magnayn> and you're done
[15:53:00] <jieryn-w> yep
[15:53:09] <jieryn-w> it's slicker than eel in a bucket of shit
[15:53:31] <magnayn> Only slight problem at the moment is I can't get ${UPSTREAM_BUILD_NUMBER} - it's not in the env, and you can't easily adjust the env to include it (this is for embedded maven jobs)
[15:53:42] <magnayn> KK's token stuff is probably the answer to that though
[15:54:11] <magnayn> Nice side benefit is I can 'git merge _doodad_'
[15:54:26] <magnayn> then use my local commit ID to make my local repo have all the correct built artifacts
[15:54:35] <magnayn> so I don't even need to compile in order to run tests :)
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[15:55:40] <jieryn-w> well, i think it just needs to be http://jenkins/job/yada/${UPSTREAM_BUILD_NUMBER}/repo  or some other way of putting /repo in there
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[15:56:11] <jieryn-w> but if the plugin could handle http://jenkins/repo    and list all artifacts .... heaven
[15:56:37] <magnayn> well, it's bound to jenkins/plugins/repository, but that's basically it
[15:57:10] <magnayn> Do you need it to be in the /job namespace?
[15:57:12] <jieryn-w> i mean, if there were a synthetic repo for each build job
[15:57:17] <jieryn-w> which is how i think it works today
[15:57:28] <jieryn-w> but i really want to use it as per-jenkins, all built artifacts inside this /repo
[15:58:17] <jieryn-w> and then as artifacts left jenkins control, e.g. via auto purge old jobs, those built artifacts would expire also
[15:58:45] <magnayn> the repository plugin gives you that - http://jenkins/plugin/repository/yada/Build/${UPSTREAM_BUILD_NUMBER} is a maven repo for all the artifacts build from yada in build ${UPSTREAM...}
[15:59:05] <ojacobson> Problem is you need N <repository> stanzas for N projects
[15:59:05] <jieryn-w> yah, i don't want to have to know all that yada/Build/${}
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[15:59:21] <ojacobson> and you need to update them all every build, if you just want the latest (though if I can get lastStable and lastSuccessful working, that'll be solved :)
[15:59:33] <jieryn-w> http://jenkins/plugin/repository  should be the unification of all previosu build artifacts
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[16:00:03] <ojacobson> Doing a monolithic repos has some edge cases
[16:00:18] <ojacobson> (i.e. two builds with the same groupId:artifactId:version:packaging tuple - which one wins? :)
[16:00:18] <magnayn> @jieryn-w: it is... accessable via build/commit or build/buildnumber...
[16:00:32] <jieryn-w> i think we should get all the awesome support jenkins gives us for lastBuild lastSuccess etc, but also want to see unified all artifacts known to jenkins
[16:00:35] <magnayn> @ojacobson - I'm interested in this too..
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[16:00:47] <jieryn-w> i think we have a miscommunication
[16:01:06] <magnayn> I think you need a virtual repository for the 'chain' of builds
[16:01:17] <jieryn-w> i don't want to even think about specific builds at all
[16:01:28] <jieryn-w> i just want all artifacts built by jenkins available from a single url
[16:01:40] <jieryn-w> in maven repository format
[16:01:58] <magnayn> E.g: In my example, if I were building "customer X", I should be able to have a URL that contains a merged repository, in precidence order, of all the upstream builds...
[16:02:25] <magnayn> @jieryn-w: Ah! Understood. Yes, that could be achieved pretty easily..
[16:02:59] <jieryn-w> ok cool - :) i don't want to sacrifice the per-job repo, i think that is freaking awesome, but i think we can expand this repository plugin to encompass all jenkins built objects that jenkins knows about :)
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[16:03:11] <jieryn-w> and it could act as a non-deployable MRM
[16:03:28] <magnayn> Would it be sufficient to only include artifacts from the most recent successful builds ?
[16:03:32] <jieryn-w> ok - this is one of the best plugins i've seen in a long while :)
[16:03:53] <magnayn> or would it need older ones as well ?
[16:04:02] <magnayn> e.g: Project X builds artifact A, B, C
[16:04:07] <magnayn> then next build it only has A,B
[16:04:08] <jieryn-w> i think whatever jenkins is tracking, via it's saved builds (non-discarded) should be in there
[16:04:59] <magnayn> yeah.. promoted is another axis too
[16:05:03] <jieryn-w> so if i go into http://jenkins/plugins/repository/job/yadayada/Build/${} it should be consistent with http://jenkins/plugins/repository and then drilling down to yadayada
[16:05:59] <magnayn> presumably if that was the last successful build though
[16:06:06] <jieryn-w> right
[16:07:13] <magnayn> it's definitely doable (I may look this afternoon) - only slight performance worry is if you had thousands of builds, what traversing the whole tree might look like
[16:07:31] <magnayn> (as in if it'd get slow)
[16:07:46] <magnayn> but I don't think it should
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[16:09:23] <jieryn-w> hopefully it will only build the directory it is being requested to serve
[16:09:45] <jieryn-w> altho.. damn, i see your point
[16:09:56] <magnayn> you need to track back through the builds
[16:10:14] <magnayn> build 100 may be @ 1.0-SNAPSHOT, and 101 @ 1.1-SNAPSHOT..
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[16:13:00] <jieryn-w> and if user browses to /repository/org/jvnet/
[16:13:26] <jieryn-w> have to build the whole list of artifacts
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[16:14:14] <Sid_> hello
[16:14:55] <Sid_> can anybody explain me what does it mean if the bar under a current build turns red and it seems that nothing happens anymore?
[16:15:01] <jieryn-w> maybe it would be better to get a build wrapper or something along those lines and track when artifacts are created, and just symlink them into $JENKINS_HOME/plugins/repository/
[16:15:36] <Sid_> normally such build lasts 30s and the current build has not finished after 25min - after 10min the bar turned red and I couldn't find anything about red bars
[16:15:36] <jieryn-w> what page are you on, Sid_ ?
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[16:15:46] <magnayn> you could... I'm going to try doing it as a vritual list and see if it'll fly
[16:15:47] <rpetti> Sid_: The job has been running much longer than previous ones.
[16:15:49] <jieryn-w> usually this indicates a hung build
[16:16:03] <magnayn> caching will help if it's slow
[16:16:15] <Sid_> ok I feared that
[16:16:59] <Sid_> when can a build hang? Do I find some output about the reasons?
[16:19:35] <jieryn-w> go into the console
[16:19:44] <jieryn-w> so click the #123 link
[16:19:51] <jieryn-w> on the left is a console
[16:19:53] <jieryn-w> click it
[16:19:56] <jieryn-w> review output
[16:20:24] <Sid_> ah ok
[16:20:28] <Sid_> found it
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[17:47:14] <nano-> Any idea why the sonar jenkins plugin wants to run maven even if I checked the box that I don't use maven 2 in my project?
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[17:47:42] <nano-> "Check if this project is NOT built with maven 2"
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[17:48:08] <Nick_Stolwijk> As far as I know the current Sonar implementation can only work with Maven. They are busy with Ant and other tooling support.
[17:48:21] <nano-> ah.. cool.
[17:48:45] <nano-> seems like a cool project, but i guess i have to wait then.
[17:49:09] <Nick_Stolwijk> If you fill in all the fields it will try to build your project with maven 2 and do the reporting. Is that an option?
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[17:55:12] <larrys> Sonar 2.6 supports ant
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[17:55:32] <larrys> http://www.sonarsource.org/sonar-2-6-adds-continuous-inspection-support-for-ant-community/
[17:55:49] <larrys> So you might be able to use it outside of the sonar plugin
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[18:15:28] <banoss> hi all. Anyone see jobs kick off but a completely empty console log and the build then sits there forever?
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[18:52:40] <abayer> Reminder everyone - governance meeting coming up in a little over an hour: http://wiki.jenkins-ci.org/display/JENKINS/Governance+Meeting+Agenda for the current agenda.
[18:53:29] <rtyler> ruh roh
[18:53:33] <rtyler> somebody should tweet that
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[18:56:37] <abayer> btw, rtyler, you're not on IM atm. =)
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[18:57:33] <rtyler> I know
[18:57:35] <rtyler> jeez
[18:57:35] <aheritier> If I'm not too asleep I'll try to be here
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[18:57:51] <aheritier> (Already 1AM here)
[18:58:35] <aheritier> Someone is leading the Jira split ??
[18:58:38] <rtyler> aheritier: have some more coffee! :D
[18:58:45] <aheritier> I saw no news/changes about that
[18:59:00] <abayer> aheritier: I forgot to ask you if you were still wiling to do it before you left for Vietnam. =)
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[18:59:36] <aheritier> rtyler: I'm not sure to find some in the hotel :-)
[18:59:39] <abayer> huh, this is interesting: http://javacruft.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/jenkins-for-ubuntu-call-for-testing/
[19:00:28] <aheritier> abayer: If everyone is waiting for someone else :-)
[19:00:35] <abayer> =)
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[19:01:45] <aheritier> for now we decided to split it only in 3 jira ?
[19:01:59] <aheritier> core + plugins + infra
[19:02:07] <abayer> Well, four - current SECURITY, and those three from the current JENKINS.
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[19:02:16] <rtyler> where's robobutler
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[19:03:16] <aheritier> abayer: right
[19:03:19] <Squee-D> Hey guys.
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[19:03:53] <Squee-D> Heard kohsuke and (abayer?) on changelog, nicely done
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[19:04:23] <abayer> thanks =)
[19:04:45] <Squee-D> didn't expecr Kohsuke's voice to be so deep
[19:04:56] <Squee-D> you musta felt a bit girly alongside that :D
[19:05:05] <rtyler> kohsuke is a tall guy
[19:05:06] <abayer> =P
[19:05:14] <rtyler> tallfolk tend to have deeper voices
[19:06:04] <Squee-D> its a eugenism, the smarter a person, the more they sound like sheldon or leonard
[19:06:06] <rtyler> anyhoo, where's that damned robobutler
[19:06:12] <Squee-D> in my mind
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[19:09:13] <cowboyd> anybody using the EC2 plugin with chef ?
[19:10:05] <rtyler> no, but I did stay at a holiday inn express last night
[19:11:32] <evilchili> think I just uncovered a bug in the trigger parameterized builds plugin
[19:11:49] <evilchili> two triggers for the same job but with different parameters only triggers the first one
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[19:15:05] * rtyler grumbles
[19:15:07] <cowboyd> and another random question: how do you register a BuildListener
[19:15:53] <cowboyd> and another related question: is there a way to get notified when Cloud nodes are provisioned and de-provisioned?
[19:16:47] <abayer> cowboyd: doesn't look like there is at the moment, but that seems like a really good feature to add. Could you open a bug?
[19:17:03] <cowboyd> abayer: which question were you answering?
[19:17:10] <abayer> The last.
[19:17:43] <cowboyd> cool, I will do that.
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[19:21:30] <cowboyd> what about registering a BuildListener?
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[19:24:14] <rtyler> huh
[19:24:21] <rtyler> somebody freenode lost robobutler's registration
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[19:25:20] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o robobutler
[19:25:29] <rtyler> #startmeeting Quick Test
[19:25:30] <robobutler> Let the Jenkins meeting commence!
[19:25:30] *** robobutler changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Quick Test)"
[19:25:34] <rtyler> #endmeeting
[19:25:35] *** robobutler changes topic to "Jenkins CI: http://jenkins-ci.org | Paste: http://jenkins.pastebin.com | Log: http://echelog.matzon.dk/?jenkins | Twitter: http://twitter.com/jenkinsci | Identi.ca: http://identi.ca/group/jenkinsci | Committers should have voice"
[19:25:35] <robobutler> Meeting ended Wed Mar  2 18:24:51 2011 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://www.jenkins-ci.org/meetings/ . (v 0.1.4)
[19:25:35] <robobutler> Minutes:        http://meetings.jenkins-ci.org/jenkins/2011/jenkins.2011-03-02-18.24.html
[19:25:35] <robobutler> Minutes (text): http://meetings.jenkins-ci.org/jenkins/2011/jenkins.2011-03-02-18.24.txt
[19:25:35] <robobutler> Log:            http://meetings.jenkins-ci.org/jenkins/2011/jenkins.2011-03-02-18.24.log.html
[19:25:39] <rtyler> there we go
[19:25:43] <rtyler> back in action
[19:25:46] <jieryn-w> going to clear those?
[19:25:50] <rtyler> meh
[19:26:31] <jieryn-w> it's not if, but how many, people mail the list about an empty meeting minutes :)
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[19:36:46] <aheritier> back
[19:36:51] <aheritier> abayer: around ?
[19:36:58] <aheritier> Thus about Jira.
[19:37:18] <aheritier> I prepare a page about the change ?
[19:37:22] <abayer> Sounds great to me.
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[19:37:35] <aheritier> I don't think it will be difficult
[19:37:43] <aheritier> the only chnage I see is about the bot
[19:38:02] <abayer> That and actually moving all the issues. =)
[19:38:20] <aheritier> On jira part the only annoying thing is to create components in the new plugins project
[19:38:32] <aheritier> bulk move will do the job
[19:38:55] <abayer> We can probably use the bot's logic to automate the component creation.
[19:39:12] <aheritier> I agree
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[19:40:26] <rtyler> hmm, does the "Use Custom Workspace" field accept tokens, say from the build's parameters?
[19:42:39] <mindless> dunno, haven't tried
[19:43:15] <rtyler> I'd really like to set up some fancy pipelines
[19:43:24] <rtyler> so I can re-use "jobs" as subroutines of sorts
[19:43:31] <rtyler> passing the workspace from one jerb to the next
[19:44:12] <ccutrer> ok, homestar :)
[19:44:28] <abayer> kohsuke: yt?
[19:45:09] <abayer> ?if neither Dean nor Kohsuke is around for the governance meeting, that's going to be anoying. =)
[19:45:17] <rtyler> kohsuke: aufwachen!
[19:45:18] <jieryn-w> rtyler: what will happen when you start meeting again and there's already file name in place ?
[19:45:57] <aheritier> abayer: you'll be the king tonight
[19:46:06] <aheritier> or the dictator, like you prefer :-)
[19:46:27] <abayer> I prefer the term Much Beloved Leader For Life.
[19:46:29] <rtyler> jieryn-w: the hour/minute UTC are embedded in the filename
[19:46:47] <jieryn-w> ah, nice
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[19:47:07] <rtyler> we can have meetings like all dayum day with robobutler
[19:47:55] <rtyler> that is
[19:48:00] <rtyler> if kohsuke and hare_brain show up
[19:48:13] <jieryn-w> hare_brain is dean yu?
[19:48:21] <rtyler> yassir
[19:48:37] <rtyler> abayer: are you sure you told anybody about it? or reminded them at least? :P
[19:48:41] * rtyler didn't see any emails on the list
[19:48:45] <abayer> ?I'm fairly sure I didn't remind anyone. =)
[19:48:49] <rtyler> haha
[19:48:54] <rtyler> is kohsuke still in .jp?
[19:49:00] <abayer> No, remember?
[19:49:08] <rtyler> oh right
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[19:49:16] <rtyler> he has to be back so sacha can feed him
[19:49:21] <rtyler> call him up or something
[19:49:26] <rtyler> we have 2/3 of the board
[19:49:27] <abayer> Ok, now just Kohsuke. I'll text him.
[19:50:42] <hare_brain> I'm not late am I? I thought we were starting at 11.
[19:50:51] <abayer> Nope, I was just getting nervous. =)
[19:51:02] <hare_brain> Watching the Apple event. ;)
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[19:52:31] <rtyler> hare_brain: I've gone ahead and set the appropriate op flags, you should be op when you rejoin as well
[19:52:43] <hare_brain> rtyler: thanks
[19:52:45] <aheritier> yes there is no live :(
[19:53:02] <aheritier> I forgot this keynote. damned
[19:53:10] <hare_brain> aheritier: Yeah, I'm wondering why they didn't do that this time as well.
[19:53:22] <hare_brain> I'm just watching a live blog feed.
[19:53:40] <aheritier> hare_brain: me too. It's weird
[19:54:08] <abayer> I think it's 'cos they weren't sure ahead of time whether Jobs would do it.
[19:54:32] <hare_brain> I can't imagine that they would make a decision to stream or not based on his presence or absence.
[19:54:41] <hare_brain> But that's me.
[19:54:46] <abayer> =)
[19:54:52] <abayer> brb
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[19:55:25] <abayer> Adium is wonderful, but if you leave a channel window open long enough, it gets icky.
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[19:58:44] <mindless> abayer: how can i merge commits from svn branch to master branch in git?
[19:59:02] <mindless> someone committed on master branch, so it stopped auto-updating from svn
[19:59:08] <mindless> but i want to migrate this plugin to github now
[19:59:20] <abayer> mindless: git pull ?rebase origin (whatever the svn branch is called)?
[19:59:59] <rpetti> is the svn branch still getting updated?
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[20:00:06] * kohsuke2 is attending the governance meeting today with a different account
[20:00:11] <abayer> =)
[20:00:28] <mindless> rpetti: yes, looks up to date
[20:00:47] <aheritier> kk.clone() ?
[20:00:47] <rpetti> you should just be able to merge from it as you would a regular branch, then
[20:01:14] <mindless> yes, but that requires knowing how to do that ;-)
[20:01:30] <mindless> abayer: got conflicts on that cmd since the l10n commit was done separately in github and svn
[20:01:43] <abayer> Ah. Well, then you could cherry-pick individual commits.
[20:01:51] <abayer> rtyler: begin the meeting!
[20:01:57] <kohsuke2> +1
[20:02:12] <mindless> abayer: kthx
[20:02:24] <fcamblor> hi there :-)
[20:02:31] <aheritier> mindless: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/629048/git-svn-dcommit-error-restart-the-commit
[20:02:37] <fcamblor> looks like I'm like the compiler : JIT :-)
[20:02:37] <aheritier> I'm using often this article
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[20:02:45] <abayer> ?I can't remember how to prod robobutler into starting the meeting. =)
[20:02:55] <rtyler> #startmeeting March 2nd Governance Meeting
[20:02:55] <robobutler> Let the Jenkins meeting commence!
[20:02:55] *** robobutler changes topic to " (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
[20:03:11] <rtyler> #topic Discuss what updates should be made to Copyright on source code
[20:03:11] *** robobutler changes topic to "Discuss what updates should be made to Copyright on source code (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
[20:03:16] <kohsuke2> Where was the documentation for that robot?
[20:03:25] <rtyler> http://meetbot.debian.net/Manual.html
[20:03:37] <abayer> #info First of all, agendas will be up at http://wiki.jenkins-ci.org/display/JENKINS/Governance+Meeting+Agenda - feel free to add items to future agendas.
[20:03:50] <kohsuke2> rtyler: thanks
[20:04:27] <abayer> And I'll give a quick update on the logo contest as well.
[20:04:51] <kohsuke2> re: copyright source code, I guess some of it has to wait until the final org is settled
[20:05:09] <abayer> #info http://wiki.jenkins-ci.org/display/JENKINS/Copyright+on+source+code is our current info.
[20:05:28] <kohsuke2> In the mean time, I guess we'll need to say that "we need you to sign CLA when we are ready, and it'll be something like the one from Apache"
[20:05:38] <abayer> +1
[20:05:50] <aheritier> +1
[20:05:55] <jieryn-w> +1
[20:05:56] <rtyler> abayer: should that page list licensing of dependencies as well?
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[20:06:00] <abayer> I'm fine with an informal agreement for the moment, given that there's nothing formal to agree with. =)
[20:06:02] <eric_n_dfw> +1
[20:06:10] <abayer> rtyler: I don't think so. That's a separate matter.
[20:06:13] <rtyler> kay
[20:06:48] <kohsuke2> I think it's http://www.apache.org/licenses/cla-corporate.txt and http://www.apache.org/licenses/icla.txt (thanks to hare_brain)
[20:07:10] <Squee-D> Do core contributions add you to a list of attributions?
[20:07:16] <abayer> #agreed New contributors to core will be asked to informally agree to sign a future CLA, likely to be similar to Apache's, once a formal system is in place.
[20:07:31] <hare_brain> #idea Provide a link the the Apache CLA on the Copyright wiki so people can see where we're going
[20:07:34] <kohsuke2> "list of attributions"?
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[20:07:44] <abayer> hare_brain: +1
[20:07:44] *** ChanServ sets mode: +v kutzi
[20:08:00] <aheritier> hare_brain: +1
[20:08:04] <abayer> #action hare_brain to update the copyright wiki entry with the above. =)
[20:08:08] <hare_brain> LOL
[20:08:08] <Squee-D> hare_brain: +1
[20:08:24] <fcamblor> +1
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[20:08:44] <kohsuke2> Would this also be the right place to say that we can merge changes from Oracle Hudson?
[20:09:08] <hare_brain> Is that a statement or a question?
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[20:09:43] <makeusabrew> hi!
[20:09:51] <kohsuke2> I guess the right thing to say there is that the code contains stuff that's copyrighted and CLAed materials to Oracle?
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[20:10:10] <Squee-D> kohsuke MIT only attributes efforts of the <copyright holders> - so it should be clear in the CLA (which i guess is another topic) that attribution will be informal?
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[20:10:34] <kohsuke2> hare_brain: I wrote a question whether a statement should be added to a Wiki page, I guess
[20:10:50] <hare_brain> kohsuke2: Gotcha
[20:10:57] <hare_brain> (BTW, I don't have edit permissions on that page.)
[20:10:57] <abayer> And yeah, that would be the right palce for that.
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[20:11:13] <abayer> me neither. =)
[20:11:18] <kohsuke2> fixing
[20:11:24] <hare_brain> So, I'm nothing close to a lawyer, but here's how I understand things to be:
[20:11:49] <kohsuke2> fixed
[20:11:49] <hare_brain> As long as the source from Oracle Hudson is MIT licensed, we can take it, because of its license.
[20:12:14] <hare_brain> Whoever merges it into Jenkins needs to attribute it to Oracle in the commit message.
[20:12:18] <abayer> Yup.
[20:12:23] <kohsuke2> Yes.
[20:12:24] <hare_brain> That's how I understand the Apache CLA covers this case.
[20:12:34] <aheritier> Sonatype contributed code is also under MIT ?
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[20:12:46] <abayer> Unless they changed the license, yeah.
[20:12:47] <hare_brain> We'll have to look at the files to be sure.
[20:13:09] <hare_brain> And they'd better have a clear attribution after all the stuff they were saying about unclear IP.
[20:13:34] <kohsuke2> For plugins, are there anything we should add?
[20:13:47] <kohsuke2> #idea should we say we highly recommend adding <license> in POM?
[20:14:01] <abayer> Yeah, I think that'd be good.
[20:14:09] <aheritier> +1
[20:14:18] <aheritier> I think we should at least for core
[20:14:26] <kohsuke2> Maybe down the road some mechanical check can be added?
[20:14:30] <Squee-D> Please shoot me down if it's way too off topic, but i figure that ongoing core contributors will appreciate attribution. to me that's why most FOSS licences have 'maintain attribution/copywrite" clauses. So wouldn't it be worthwhile adding a contributions readme for a full list of participants?
[20:14:35] <jieryn-w> a la rat plugin
[20:14:40] <aheritier> we may use the license plugin also to verify if the header is set everywhere
[20:14:58] <jieryn-w> checkstyle has the same capability
[20:14:59] <kohsuke2> aheritier: core already has <license>, if not explicitly it definitely inherits.
[20:15:04] <aheritier> jieryn-w: kohsuke yes there is a plugin for that
[20:15:07] <aheritier> to check and fix
[20:15:25] <aheritier> kohsuke2: ok. I didn't see.
[20:15:46] <kohsuke2> Squee-D: I think we do encourage people to put attribution in the copyright header of the source files.
[20:15:59] <kohsuke2> But I guess you are suggesting we should start a separate file that lists the names
[20:16:14] <fcamblor> looks like Sonatype guys are commiting with MIT : https://github.com/hudson/hudson/blob/1fade2d2567831c1c7e6d0ef602903e424fbf44a/hudson-test-harness/src/test/resources/logback-test.xml
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[20:16:59] <Squee-D> kohsuke I am, but that does make sense what you're already doing, just saying it might want to be adressed when you adress the CLA.
[20:17:17] <kohsuke2> OK. Shall we note that and move on?
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[20:17:30] <kohsuke2> ... to the next topic?
[20:17:43] <fcamblor> https://github.com/hudson/hudson/commit/1fade2d2567831c1c7e6d0ef602903e424fbf44a#diff-10
[20:17:43] <abayer> +1
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[20:18:09] <kohsuke2> #topic  the stable-branch/endorsed-release discussion
[20:18:14] <kohsuke2> or maybe I don't hae that karma
[20:18:30] <abayer> rtyler!
[20:18:34] <abayer> #chairs
[20:18:35] <rtyler> wut
[20:18:42] <rtyler> #chairs abayer,kohsuke2
[20:18:48] <rtyler> #topic  the stable-branch/endorsed-release discussion
[20:18:48] *** robobutler changes topic to "the stable-branch/endorsed-release discussion (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
[20:18:53] <kohsuke2> Thanks
[20:19:33] <rtyler> #chair abayer kohsuke2
[20:19:33] <robobutler> Current chairs: abayer kohsuke2 rtyler
[20:19:36] <rtyler> #chair hare_brain
[20:19:36] <robobutler> Current chairs: abayer hare_brain kohsuke2 rtyler
[20:19:52] <kohsuke2> My recollection is that people are very happy with the idea but we haven't settled on particular approach
[20:19:55] <Squee-D> robobutler is brilliant.
[20:19:55] <robobutler> Squee-D: Error: "is" is not a valid command.
[20:20:03] <Squee-D> well almost
[20:20:06] <rtyler> hah
[20:20:07] <kohsuke2> :-)
[20:20:30] <hare_brain> There used to be a link to an "older but stabler" build. Why did that go away?
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[20:21:04] <kohsuke2> because I think I just stopped doing that.
[20:21:10] <kohsuke2> But I think we should resurrect that
[20:21:31] <aheritier> kohsuke2: The question is which rithm the stable branch may have and how it could be managed ?
[20:21:34] <rtyler> what was the criteria for updating those links?
[20:21:44] <aheritier> rtyler: Good question
[20:21:51] <rtyler> heh
[20:21:55] <aheritier> what is a stable branch/product ?
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[20:22:20] <aheritier> AFAIK Jenkins isn't released if there are failures in automated tests
[20:22:25] <kohsuke2> #info The model behind "older but stable" was that I picked a bit old but stable-looking release in retrospect
[20:22:40] <Squee-D> what about the LTS model?
[20:22:45] <kohsuke2> It was planned to update about every once in 3/6 months
[20:22:54] <abayer> #idea Every X weeks, the core devs vote as to whether to promote a release from a few weeks earlier to be the new "stable" release.
[20:22:57] <hare_brain> Here at Yahoo, we have the concept of stable/current/test for our packages. "test" means a release is still being tested. "current" means the group feels that it's ready to be used in production environments. "stable" means it
[20:23:04] <kohsuke2> aheritier: yes, if there are test failures, it won't ship
[20:23:06] <hare_brain> it's been running in production for at least 6 months.
[20:23:14] <Squee-D> where the changelog is where you decide to pick a stable release that you're willing to run a side branch with specific fixes.
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[20:23:26] <Squee-D> alongside the continuous improvement main branch
[20:23:26] <kohsuke2> hare_brain: that sounds similar to Debian
[20:23:30] <aheritier> and could we use community votes ?
[20:23:37] <hare_brain> Yeah, I'm pretty sure we stole that idea. :)
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[20:24:12] <hare_brain> So questions I'd ask about a "stable" Jenkins are:
[20:24:13] <abayer> aheritier: I was suggesting core devs (or plugin devs) just to keep the vote manageable.
[20:24:23] <hare_brain> Does it lag several months behind?
[20:24:48] <hare_brain> Is the version that's on stable sequential or does it skip?
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[20:24:55] <Squee-D> Is the LTS approach too painful to manage?
[20:24:59] <kutzi> IMO the best way for more stable releases is to massively increase the automated test coverage
[20:25:08] <aheritier> abayer: core and plugins dev are probably using more often recent releases than older ?
[20:25:08] <abayer> hare_brain: I'd say it lags behind, and it skips.
[20:25:19] <abayer> kutzi: +1
[20:25:21] <Squee-D> stable releases are not as valuable to me, as an end user, as "marked to be maintained" releases
[20:25:21] <hare_brain> Do major bug fixes get merged into that release? That's a huge infrastructure and process undertaking.
[20:25:24] <abayer> aheritier: True.
[20:25:31] <kohsuke2> On top of abayer's "Every X weeks, the core devs vote as to whether to promote a release from a few weeks earlier to be the new "stable" release.", I'd also like to propose that we consider doing patch releases off that release
[20:25:31] <abayer> hare_brain: ?1 on that, personally.
[20:25:56] <rtyler> kohsuke2: 1.386.1 ?
[20:26:00] <abayer> hare_brain, kohsuke2: rather, I'm ?1 on anything other than showstoppers.
[20:26:02] * kohsuke2 asked the same question as hare_brain
[20:26:24] <kohsuke2> rtyler: yeah, 1.X.1, 1.X.2, ... for stable releases until we nominate next 1.Y as stable
[20:26:35] <jieryn-w> sounds like tons of work
[20:26:42] <hare_brain> That's my concern as well.
[20:26:49] <rtyler> stable branches are always extra work :P
[20:26:50] <kohsuke2> Yes, it could be. Hence I said we should "consider"
[20:26:56] <abayer> And that's my rationale for ?1. =)
[20:27:03] <eric_n_dfw> my client was within a day of switching us to TeamCity or Cruise/Go a few months ago when deadlocks were killing us.   +1 for patch builds
[20:27:09] <aheritier> and I saw in the meeting note the question about code review
[20:27:30] <aheritier> could we consider to put in stable branch only a code which were reviewed by several devs ?
[20:27:35] <kohsuke2> But while it's a lot of work, it seems to be valuable, too.
[20:27:42] <abayer> I'd prefer to crowdsource/do validation tests to determine the stable release, with x.1 releases for *only* showstoppers like eric_n_dfw's deadlock problem.
[20:27:45] <Squee-D> really? People will choose jenkins in critical environments only with a critical support branch
[20:27:46] <abayer> (I remember that one)
[20:27:47] <hare_brain> We maintain a private fork, so we rely on the community ratings to decide when to merge a new version in. So in a sense, we're already picking a "stable" for ourselves.
[20:27:56] <kohsuke2> aheritier: Yes, we want to control what changes can go in there.
[20:28:14] <Squee-D> LTS's do not need anything but support for "continues to function as specced
[20:28:44] <abayer> Squee-D: Yeah, that's the sort of thing I'm talking about.
[20:28:45] <jieryn-w> i think having a stable branch that isn't sponsored by people using jenkins in critical environments -- that is, new blood doing the work -- there's no way current devs are going to be able to support it
[20:28:48] <Squee-D> It's harder work for plugin dev's no? to support the 'stable' releae.
[20:29:14] <jieryn-w> it also steals thunder from people testing the new release
[20:29:14] <kohsuke2> I think if we limit ourselves to small number of important fixes backported from the main release line, maybe the overhead can be managed?
[20:29:28] <jieryn-w> why jump to latest when i can just use stable and not put any effort in
[20:29:30] <abayer> Squee-D: I actually see the stable release as a positive for plugin devs - if they don't *need* a new change in core, they can just always build against the last stable.
[20:29:36] <kohsuke2> jieryn-w: stealing thunder from the main release line is indeed one of the downside.
[20:29:38] <Squee-D> I would have thought so, but i certainly havent been following the code-commits
[20:29:52] <Squee-D> abayer thats a good point
[20:30:27] <Squee-D> I think your small teams, like ours, will all still run with the "agile" branch
[20:30:37] <aheritier> could we also use statitics of deployment to know who is using what ?
[20:30:47] <abayer> Basically, I think we should provide a "known quantity" release that's blessed by the community/devs, and we should backport fixes for showstopper bugs to it on a limited basis, when possible.
[20:30:47] <kohsuke2> Yes, we can
[20:30:47] <aheritier> perhaps it could help to define what as stable
[20:30:55] <Squee-D> but i really wouldn't blame enterprise users from dropping jenkins if it didnt have a stable branch.
[20:30:56] <abayer> aheritier: Yup - we'll actually have new census data available today.
[20:30:56] <hare_brain> aheritier: + 1
[20:31:15] <aheritier> s/as/was
[20:31:24] <kohsuke2> abayer: OK, that line of thinking is close to what I'm saying
[20:31:45] <abayer> For example, I can tell you that there are over 6500 installs of Hudson/Jenkins which were last seen at version 1.395. =)
[20:31:58] <hare_brain> Out of how many?
[20:32:09] <Squee-D> 6501
[20:32:16] <aheritier> abayer: +1with your point of view
[20:32:30] <eric_n_dfw> We're still at 1.393
[20:32:46] <abayer> Almost 23k seen hitting jenkins-ci.org/hudson-labs.org's usage-stats in Feb - that's only versions 1.368 and later.
[20:33:17] <kohsuke2> #info so sounds like a consensus is around voting/blessing a release as stable, then produce patch releases only with important bug fixes
[20:33:24] <eric_n_dfw> +1
[20:33:28] <Squee-D> +!
[20:33:34] <Squee-D> +1
[20:33:43] <hare_brain> So roughly 25% on something recent.
[20:34:00] <kohsuke2> #info we are also mindful that we aren't entirely sure how much work this entails
[20:34:23] <abayer> #idea Every?3? months, community/devs bless a 2+ month old release as the "known quantity" release. Until the next "known quantity" release, it'll be possible for absolutely critical bug fixes to core to be backported and a new version of the known quantity re-released.
[20:34:41] <abayer> hare_brain: actually, that's 25% on *one* specific version. =)
[20:34:47] <kutzi> +1
[20:35:11] <kohsuke2> How about 6 months? Would that be too long?
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[20:35:21] <aheritier> kohsuke2: I think
[20:35:27] <rtyler> that's really long in Jenkins-time
[20:35:27] <kohsuke2> hare_brain: how frequent do you integrate?
[20:35:30] <kutzi> I would it may even younger than 3 month
[20:35:31] <Squee-D> I for one trust agile processes and trust my backups, so update our jenkins install as often as i can. But for the sake of the jenkins project's continuing popularity think it's a good thing.
[20:35:32] <abayer> There were something like 4k last seen on 1.396 or later, and I can't remember how many on other versions.
[20:35:34] <aheritier> 3 monthes is what we see in general
[20:35:41] <hare_brain> kohsuke2: Roughly once a quarter
[20:35:42] <abayer> I like 3month rotations.
[20:35:56] <abayer> Once a quarter, decent window of time for determining how stable a candidate release is.
[20:36:02] <kohsuke2> OK. So shall we start with 3 months and se e how that goes?
[20:36:04] <hare_brain> More frequently if a release fixes a lot of bugs, or has something interesting.
[20:36:08] <hare_brain> We try not to cherry pick changes.
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[20:36:22] <Squee-D> +1
[20:36:30] <hare_brain> +1 for 3 months
[20:36:37] * rtyler likes 3 months as well
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[20:37:10] <kohsuke2> #agreed we'll start with 3 month cycle for stable release and see how that goes
[20:37:11] <eric_n_dfw> 3 months is fine with me
[20:37:12] <abayer> Ok. Next step is scoping out the work involved.
[20:37:23] <abayer> Which we can do on the mailing list.=)
[20:37:31] <kohsuke2> I wanted to talk a bit about what kind of changes we want to backport
[20:37:41] <abayer> 'k.
[20:37:48] <kohsuke2> like "preferrably no API change"
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[20:38:04] <kohsuke2> or "only backport a fix after it's released in the main line"? would that be too much?
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[20:38:18] <abayer> #action A thread on the mailing list to talk about what work will be done to get the stable release stuff in place (update center changes, qualification process, etc)
[20:38:23] <aheritier> kohsuke2: Yes it is mandatory in bug fixes for the stable bracnh
[20:38:26] <abayer> kohsuke2: strong +1 for that.
[20:38:33] <abayer> Backports only.
[20:38:40] <Squee-D> +1 kohsuke
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[20:38:53] <Squee-D> abayer is that a +1.999~ ?
[20:39:00] <kohsuke2> Are people agreeing to "after it's released in the main line" part?
[20:39:02] <aheritier> +1 to backport only something released (tested in real life)
[20:39:04] <hare_brain> #idea changelog entries that are marked "major bug" as candidates for backporting?
[20:39:05] <kohsuke2> Or just "backport only part"
[20:39:18] <Squee-D> kohsuke yeas to "mainline" - that is what a backport is no?
[20:39:33] <kohsuke2> hare_brain: yes. but there aren't that many of those
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[20:39:41] <kohsuke2> Does that mean we've been pretty stable?
[20:39:54] <eric_n_dfw> +1 to mainline  tested live --> stable
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[20:40:06] <Squee-D> Are there metrics for 'stability' ?
[20:40:28] <Squee-D> perhaps automation of such metrics are really a first step?
[20:40:31] <rtyler> community ratings, bug reports for a release
[20:40:42] <kohsuke2> #idea I think the stable release line would be good release train to tie in the "community acceptance test" effort
[20:41:16] <hare_brain> The only problem I have with the community ratings, is that the bug reports seem to carry forward, and it's not clear that a bug was actually introduced with that release. That's just when someone reported it.
[20:41:25] <kohsuke2> put another way, for example, if we start this effort, could Yahoo shift some of what it did internally to this release line?
[20:42:06] <abayer> kohsuke2: Could CloudBees as well for Nectar? =)
[20:42:09] <Squee-D> hare_brain could its inclusion in stability reporting wait for a dev to identify when it was introduced? Are most of these things identifiable with bisect?
[20:42:33] <kohsuke2> abayer: Yes, I'd be obviously spending my efforts/time into that branch
[20:42:36] <aheritier> hare_brain: I'm preparing the proposal to split  Jira
[20:42:42] <aheritier> thus will have versions in Jira now
[20:43:11] <abayer> Oh, yeah.
[20:43:19] <jieryn-w> well, still no project split yet
[20:43:33] <hare_brain> kohsuke2: We can certainly take our internal feedback and contribute that to the assessment of the stability of a release.
[20:43:38] <abayer> #action aheritier working on proposal for actually splitting JENKINS JIRA into core/infra/plugins.
[20:43:39] <kohsuke2> I think voting to pick a stable release would be reasonable and community rating would be a good input, if not a definitive input
[20:44:11] <abayer> Everyone ok with aheritier leading the JIRA split stuff? We'll need to give him admin on JIRA to actually do it, obviously.
[20:44:24] * rtyler nods
[20:44:39] <kohsuke2> We'll have a chance to see the proposal before it happens, right?
[20:44:49] <abayer> Oh yeah.
[20:44:53] <aheritier> kohsuke2: yes it's done for that
[20:44:54] <eric_n_dfw> +1
[20:45:00] <kohsuke2> +1
[20:45:03] <redsolo> +1
[20:45:05] <jieryn-w> +1
[20:45:06] <aheritier> but if someone else want to lead it :-) feel free !!
[20:45:08] <abayer> I'm just taking advantage of a sucker, er, um, I mean, volunteer. =)
[20:45:13] <jieryn-w> heh
[20:45:35] <aheritier> :-)
[20:45:50] <kohsuke2> OK, so in the interest of time, maybe the next topic?
[20:45:59] * redsolo can help out with the jira stuff..
[20:45:59] <kohsuke2> Did the release discussion come to a conclusion?
[20:46:15] <kohsuke2> I guess we have a consensus, and action to work out details?
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[20:46:38] <aheritier> redsolo: ok, I note. I'll send an email on the dev list before the end of the week
[20:46:50] <aheritier> kohsuke2: yes
[20:47:08] <abayer> Yup.
[20:47:13] <kohsuke2> #topic Update on the long-term governance plans / progress on umbrella organisation
[20:47:13] *** robobutler changes topic to "Update on the long-term governance plans / progress on umbrella organisation (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
[20:47:23] <kohsuke2> #topic Update on the long-term governance plans
[20:47:23] *** robobutler changes topic to "Update on the long-term governance plans (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
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[20:47:40] <kohsuke2> I guess this one is to abayer?
[20:47:46] <abayer> Here's my update: I haven't done anything. I suck and have been busy. =)
[20:48:04] <rtyler> #agreed abayer sucks, and has been busy
[20:48:06] * rtyler ducks
[20:48:11] <kohsuke2> Anything we can help to make a progress there?
[20:48:28] <kohsuke2> Perhaps even just some bullet points?
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[20:48:33] <aheritier> :-)
[20:48:38] <abayer> If we can  come up with questions we need answered, that'd help.
[20:48:59] <kohsuke2> OK
[20:49:06] <jieryn-w> there was chatter about going to apache ... is that ruled out?
[20:49:17] <kohsuke2> #topic progress on umbrella organisation
[20:49:18] *** robobutler changes topic to "progress on umbrella organisation (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
[20:49:21] <abayer> No, it is not ruled out.
[20:49:24] <kohsuke2> That's a question for this topic, I guess
[20:49:33] <kohsuke2> I can report an update on this
[20:49:34] <abayer> kohsuke2: any news from SFC?
[20:49:48] <kohsuke2> #info we've applied to SFC, and we are still not hearing back
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[20:49:57] <kohsuke2> #action kohsuke to ping SFC on our current status
[20:50:05] <kohsuke2> I also think I should write to SPI
[20:50:23] <kohsuke2> (acryonym could be wrong but it's the foundation that has PostgreSQL)
[20:50:41] <kohsuke2> http://www.spi-inc.org/
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[20:51:08] <kohsuke2> Apache isn't ruled out either, but I think we are still hoping that SFC would take us
[20:51:17] <kohsuke2> I think that's the current status
[20:51:23] <abayer> While my personal first choice would be to go to Apache over SFC or SPI, I'm perfectly fine with SFC as first option.
[20:51:27] <Squee-D> SFC?
[20:51:42] <kohsuke2> http://sfconservancy.org/
[20:51:47] <abayer> But if we don't get into SFC, I really think Apache is far and away the best option on the table, and I really think it can work nicely.
[20:52:02] <Squee-D> Apache Foundation has a lot of clout to its name alone.
[20:52:40] <kohsuke2> When this was discussed there certainly was a strong support for that from many
[20:53:00] <kohsuke2> Ready to move on to logo contest?
[20:53:20] <aheritier> I agree to try SFC before Apache to have less changes in the comunity if possible
[20:53:36] <kohsuke2> +1
[20:53:39] <aheritier> yes logos !!
[20:53:43] <kohsuke2> #topic updates on logo contest
[20:53:43] *** robobutler changes topic to "updates on logo contest (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
[20:53:54] <kohsuke2> abayer?
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[20:54:00] <aheritier> (damned I forgot to ask to my kids to draw something)
[20:54:11] <abayer> #info I extended the logo submission deadline through friday, 'cos I got a bunch over the weekend and into Monday.
[20:54:39] <abayer> #info this weekend, I'll be putting up a post on jenkins-ci.org with all the entries, and a poll for everyone to vote for their favorite.
[20:54:46] <kohsuke2> Any place where we can see the current submissions?
[20:54:51] <hare_brain> That eps that was sent to the mailing list reminded me of the Pringles guy.
[20:55:08] <eric_n_dfw> true
[20:55:20] <hare_brain> abayer: How many submissions have you received?
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[20:55:29] <abayer> Something like 10, I think?
[20:55:33] <Squee-D> Im working on one :D
[20:55:37] <kohsuke2> Maybe a Wiki page?
[20:55:49] <Squee-D> but i suck more than abayer. Probably not busier tho.
[20:56:13] <kohsuke2> Shall we still try 99designs, or are we comfortable picking from what's submitted?
[20:56:27] <abayer> Yeah, I'll put 'em on the wiki in their original forms, and on the blog in png format for easy viewing.
[20:56:34] <abayer> One of the options on the poll will be "none of the above".
[20:56:37] <hare_brain> Maybe an option in the poll should be "None of he above"
[20:56:38] <hare_brain> LOL
[20:56:40] <abayer> If that wins, we go to 99 designs. =)
[20:56:42] <Squee-D> Can the vote include [x] try 99designs
[20:56:51] <Squee-D> make it explicit..
[20:56:52] <aheritier> abayer: hare_brain +1
[20:56:54] <kohsuke2> #info 99designs start from $300 and we don't have to pay if we don't pick it
[20:56:59] <abayer> Squee-D: That works for me.
[20:57:04] <abayer> Oh! New topic!
[20:57:06] <abayer> Trademark!
[20:57:12] <abayer> #topic Trademark!
[20:57:12] *** robobutler changes topic to "Trademark! (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
[20:57:23] <abayer> kohsuke2: Have we started the ball rolling on that yet?
[20:57:35] <kohsuke2> I'm afraid not.
[20:57:41] <kohsuke2> Let's see, where am I on it
[20:57:43] <abayer> For now, I'm perfectly happy with fronting the cash for the fees.
[20:57:48] <abayer> We can fundraise to pay me back later.
[20:58:24] <kohsuke2> I think I had an AI to find the difference between the registration that costs a few $100s vs a registration that costs a few Ks.
[20:58:42] <abayer> (assuming we're talking a couple thousand bucks max, not something more like $10k)
[20:58:53] <kohsuke2> The main difference, as far as I can tell, is whether we get to see some human being doing it.
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[20:59:35] <abayer> Yeah. How about we deputize to CloudBees' people to do the research for us as to what the best option is? I'm perfectly fine with donated labor from them - I just want to make sure it's not CloudBees actually paying for the trademark registration.
[21:00:00] <kohsuke2> And there's still an offer on the table for CB to donate the cost for the registration.
[21:00:41] <abayer> I don't feel comfortable taking actual money donations until we have a legal structure.
[21:00:46] <kohsuke2> But there's no "people doing the research" though. I believe CB only have a lawyer it can pay to have a research/registration done
[21:00:54] <abayer> Ah.
[21:01:15] <abayer> Let's take this offline and talk about it in person tonight?
[21:01:23] <aheritier> (We should ask to Oracle they did that few times ago :-D )
[21:01:27] <kohsuke2> I think earlier suggestion from hare_brain was to get some writing that it won't own the trademark
[21:01:35] <kohsuke2> "it" = CB
[21:01:58] <kohsuke2> Does that ease the concern enough, or not?
[21:01:59] <aheritier> (Sorry it's 3AM here)
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[21:02:15] <abayer> #action kohsuke and abayer to talk tonight about trademark stuff and get the ball rolling.
[21:02:24] <abayer> And one last topic - trying to wrap up.
[21:02:24] <kohsuke2> The issue is that otherwise it's hard to make a progress
[21:02:28] <kohsuke2> Sounds good
[21:02:33] <abayer> #topic Next meeting.
[21:02:33] *** robobutler changes topic to "Next meeting. (Meeting topic: March 2nd Governance Meeting)"
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[21:02:45] <kohsuke2> How about 2 weeks from now?
[21:02:47] <abayer> #info Let's go bi-weekly - next meeting in two weeks, Wed, March 16th
[21:02:49] <abayer> jinx!
[21:03:01] <kohsuke2> +1
[21:03:04] <aheritier> yes it is enough
[21:03:07] <hare_brain> I was going to suggest whenever we have a stable release. ;)
[21:03:35] <kohsuke2> Is this time OK?
[21:03:38] <rtyler> heh
[21:03:47] <kohsuke2> I hate to keep aheritier up at 3am
[21:03:59] <abayer> #idea Tentative agenda items: JIRA split proposal discussion, update on trademark.
[21:04:04] <hare_brain> This time on the 16th specifically won't work for me.
[21:04:09] <abayer> He's in vietnam at the moment. =)
[21:04:15] <kohsuke2> Ah
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[21:04:38] <kohsuke2> hare_brain: any other time of that day?
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[21:05:22] <aheritier> no problem I'll be back in EU
[21:05:32] <hare_brain> I'll be away from an internet connection all morning. Any time after 1pm will be fine, if that works for other people.
[21:05:41] <hare_brain> Otherwise, another day that week, at 11 is fine.
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[21:05:57] <abayer> 1pm is 10 CET?is that too late for our Euros?
[21:06:14] <aheritier> abayer: for me it's goot
[21:06:33] <abayer> aheritier: given that I've put you up as an agenda item, that's good. =)
[21:06:47] <kohsuke2> Any objection to March 16th 1pm PST / 10pm CET / 9pm GMT?
[21:06:51] <aheritier> :-D
[21:06:59] <abayer> +1 for me.
[21:07:02] <hare_brain> Other option is to just have the meeting at 11 on the 16th and I'll pass on any comments I have about the agenda to abayer or kohsuke ahead of time.
[21:07:02] <aheritier> +1
[21:07:14] <redsolo> What happened to Internet time?
[21:07:21] <kohsuke2> #agreed March 16th 1pm PST / 10pm CET / 9pm GMT
[21:07:27] <hare_brain> Great. Thanks folks.
[21:07:43] <kohsuke2> OK, I think we declare a victory for the day
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[21:07:55] <hare_brain> I'm declaring lunchtime. :)
[21:08:00] <kohsuke2> #endmeeting
[21:08:01] *** robobutler changes topic to "Jenkins CI: http://jenkins-ci.org | Paste: http://jenkins.pastebin.com | Log: http://echelog.matzon.dk/?jenkins | Twitter: http://twitter.com/jenkinsci | Identi.ca: http://identi.ca/group/jenkinsci | Committers should have voice"
[21:08:01] <robobutler> Meeting ended Wed Mar  2 20:07:17 2011 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://www.jenkins-ci.org/meetings/ . (v 0.1.4)
[21:08:01] <robobutler> Minutes:        http://meetings.jenkins-ci.org/jenkins/2011/jenkins.2011-03-02-19.02.html
[21:08:01] <robobutler> Minutes (text): http://meetings.jenkins-ci.org/jenkins/2011/jenkins.2011-03-02-19.02.txt
[21:08:01] <robobutler> Log:            http://meetings.jenkins-ci.org/jenkins/2011/jenkins.2011-03-02-19.02.log.html
[21:08:07] * jieryn-w claps
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[21:08:12] <abayer> And remember that you can add agenda items to http://wiki.jenkins-ci.org/display/JENKINS/Governance+Meeting+Agenda. =)
[21:08:47] <hare_brain> I'm done with my action item. :)
[21:10:03] <Squee-D> That was great guys. I'm glad i finally got to come along to one. I'm fascinated with how large FOSS can be managed with minimal pain.
[21:10:20] <abayer> ?I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say we're "managing" it. =)
[21:10:53] <redsolo> abayer: i know youve been busy, but have you looked at that jira plugin for finding dups?
[21:11:12] <abayer> Ah, no, I haven't. Sorry. I'll try to do that today.
[21:11:58] <abayer> btw redsolo, are you supporting your plugins at Jenkins rather than the Oracle Hudson JIRA etc?
[21:12:10] <Squee-D> well i'm a coder, there have been points in my career when i get promoted to middle-management and i have to ask to be demoted plz.k.thx. The idea of self managing teams clearly appeals. But it still needs co-ordination.. I <3 meetbot. and foundations that want to help. really interesting.
[21:12:30] <redsolo> absolutely... i havent updated them because.......
[21:12:50] <abayer> redsolo: no worries, just wanted to add your plugins to the list jieryn-w has. =)
[21:13:01] <redsolo> please do so....
[21:13:24] <redsolo> i love the things that oracle guy has done on the hudson wiki saying that plugins are dead, etc.
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[21:14:09] <Tartarus> hm?  Do we need to do something to say we're maintaining a plugin w/ jenkins?
[21:14:24] <rtyler> Tartarus: are you maintaining a plugin?
[21:14:35] <Tartarus> yes
[21:14:51] <Tartarus> http://wiki.jenkins-ci.org/display/JENKINS/Lab+Manager+Plugin
[21:15:02] <abayer> We're just keeping track of who's said they're going with the Jenkins JIRA/wiki rather than Oracle Hudson's.
[21:15:26] <rtyler> Tartarus: you should have +v when you rejoin
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[21:15:33] <Tartarus> We're migrating to jenkins as soon as we can and I've already poked it with current jenkins, still works
[21:15:37] <Tartarus> thanks :)
[21:16:44] <abayer> Does anything ever actually happen in the Oracle #hudson channel now?
[21:16:49] <rtyler> no
[21:16:55] * rtyler is still lurking around there
[21:17:46] <eric_n_dfw> Anyone here use the SauceLabs plugin and know if it supports their new SauceConnect2 (WebDriver/Selenium2) stuff?
[21:17:56] <rtyler> IIRC kohsuke2 wrote that .. :)
[21:18:32] <abayer> eric_n_dfw: Not sure if there's a reason it wouldn't since it's really just a wrapper around an SSH tunnel and some log parsing to get the video etc.
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[21:19:08] <abayer> The plugin doesn't actually do anything Selenium-y itself.
[21:19:12] <evilchili> dashboards still refer to "hudson jobs list" in 1.397
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[21:19:23] <evilchili> is there a place these should be logged?
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[21:22:32] <eric_n_dfw> yeah - that was my thought too.   I'm not the one here that's been doing the SauceLabs stuff - one of my peers has a script they're using to fire up the tunnel and asked about it.  I'll play with it and see.
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[21:22:48] <eric_n_dfw> unrelated question....
[21:22:59] <eric_n_dfw> anyone here using EC2 slaves in a VPC ?
[21:23:51] <eric_n_dfw> I've never used VPC and was wondering if there's anything special that I'll need to add to the EC2 plugin to start AMI's in one.
[21:24:33] <eric_n_dfw> we hope to convince my client's network/security team to hook up to a VPC for some proof of concept devops work
[21:28:00] <eric_n_dfw> I take the silence as a no :)
[21:28:12] <eric_n_dfw> I'll ping the dev list
[21:37:21] * olamy oups I missed the meeting
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[21:45:04] <Tartarus> yay, policykit 0.100 (and since 0.97) shadow support looks to work rather than just pam
[21:45:05] <Tartarus> ga
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[21:46:24] <aheritier> kohsuke2: abayer : Can you give me admin rights (at least temporary) on jira to let me study its current settings
[21:49:00] <aheritier> I will go to sleep a little bit. Let me know tomorrow. I would like to check we won't have a surprise with something I didn't think about (permissions, notifications, workflows .....)
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[21:54:15] <dbarbato> Evening all, I'm hoping that someone can help me.
[21:54:23] <dbarbato>  I'm trying to get Jenkins working on a windows 2008 server.
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[21:54:53] <dbarbato> I've followed the guide to get it running as a service, however when it starts up as a service I'm getting a time out error
[21:57:05] <dbarbato> I've tried deleting the service from the service manager and doing it by hand. It all works until I start the jenkins service and I get a time out again.
[21:57:42] <dbarbato> It's a vanilla 2008 server with nothing else on it
[21:57:50] <dbarbato> I'm hoping someone can provide a couple of pointers
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[21:58:52] <dbarbato> if anyone has any ideas, that'd be appreciated
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[22:01:38] <dbarbato> I did find a couple of problems with something similar on the help pages, but there were no replies
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[22:20:06] <olamy> there isn't any plugin to report maven invoker plugin test number/success/failure etc ... ?
[22:20:21] <olamy> aheritier ^ ?
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[22:32:12] <jenkinsci_builds> Starting build 549 for job jenkins_main_trunk (previous build: UNSTABLE -- last SUCCESS #510 16 days ago)
[22:41:21] <jieryn-w> redsolo: ok, i have marked you as jenkins @ http://goo.gl/rPmmo -- thanks!
[22:41:29] <jieryn-w> Tartarus: you too?
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[22:46:08] * Tartarus opens
[22:46:45] <Tartarus> yes, lab manager plugin is jenkins not sun-hudson
[22:46:57] <Tartarus> er, oracle-hudson :)
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[22:49:42] <dbarbato> does anyone have Jenkins working on a winblows 2008 server?
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[22:59:22] <evilchili> mindless ? i'm trying to concoct a method of having a downstream project force a build of an upstream project, if the upstream project doesn't have archived artifacts matching a set of build parameters
[22:59:32] <evilchili> any idea how i might go about it?
[22:59:55] <mindless> ??
[22:59:59] <evilchili> yes, i know
[23:00:00] <evilchili> :)
[23:00:14] <mindless> well
[23:00:32] <mindless> parameterized-trigger plugin can trigger builds on failure
[23:00:50] <mindless> so you might be able to trigger a job if this job fails due to copyartifact build step failure
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[23:01:01] <mindless> ..would trigger on other failures too, but..
[23:01:13] <evilchili> yeh
[23:01:52] <evilchili> i've just been informed $engineers need to be able to specify specific branches in the git repo to build against, but that would require artifacts from another job built against the same branch
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[23:03:57] <evilchili> but we dont' want to have to rebuild the entire dependency chain every time, if we don't have to (ie if we have archived artifacts from a previous build with those parameters)
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[23:10:22] <jenkinsci_builds> Yippie, build fixed!
[23:10:23] <jenkinsci_builds> Project jenkins_main_trunk build #549: FIXED in 38 min: http://ci.jenkins-ci.org/job/jenkins_main_trunk/549/
[23:10:23] <jenkinsci_builds> Alan Harder: latest parent
[23:10:25] <jenkinsci_builds> Starting build 550 for job jenkins_main_trunk (previous build: FIXED)
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[23:16:15] <cowboyd> abayer: finally got the ticket created. http://issues.jenkins-ci.org/browse/JENKINS-8938
[23:16:26] <cowboyd> How do these things generally get prioritized?
[23:16:33] <jenkins-admin> JENKINS-8938:Ability to Register a Listener for when Cloud nodes are created and destroyed (Open) http://jenkins-ci.org/issue/8938
[23:16:51] <cowboyd> that was awesome.
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[23:35:32] <jieryn-w> it's kind of wild wild west
[23:35:41] <jieryn-w> if you want it, you build it -- generally
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[23:48:00] <jenkinsci_builds> Project jenkins_main_trunk build #550: UNSTABLE in 37 min: http://ci.jenkins-ci.org/job/jenkins_main_trunk/550/
[23:48:00] <jenkinsci_builds> Alan Harder: use configured ant for test so it works when ant is not in path
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