February 25, 2014 
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February 25, 2014 [00:00:31] *** Cian has quit IRC[00:08:40] *** luroh has quit IRC[00:09:14] *** jua_ has quit IRC[00:12:51] *** hmstrmn has quit IRC[00:12:59] *** stippi has quit IRC[00:13:38] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[00:20:13] *** poxip has quit IRC[00:21:42] *** jua_ has joined #haiku[00:25:31] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[00:25:41] *** gbonvehi- has joined #haiku[00:26:21] *** gbonvehi- has quit IRC[00:27:23] *** gbonvehi has quit IRC[00:28:57] *** gbonvehi has joined #haiku[00:32:19] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[00:35:16] *** slubman has quit IRC[00:36:02] *** slubman has joined #haiku[00:38:30] *** kcj has joined #haiku[00:39:04] *** gbonvehi has quit IRC[00:39:05] *** gbonvehi has joined #haiku[00:50:46] *** Martini_ has joined #haiku[00:51:42] *** Martini_ has quit IRC[00:52:52] *** Blub\0 has joined #haiku[00:55:27] *** Blub\w has quit IRC[00:56:23] *** Xenmen has joined #haiku[01:06:26] *** bitkid_ has quit IRC[01:10:17] *** daniele_athome has quit IRC[01:16:14] *** orealis has quit IRC[01:17:02] *** orealis has joined #haiku[01:48:15] *** Diver has quit IRC[01:53:02] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[01:57:14] *** mattlacey has joined #haiku[02:05:18] *** Negr0 has quit IRC[02:05:42] *** jua_ has quit IRC[02:08:49] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[02:09:50] *** kcj has quit IRC[02:10:35] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[02:16:51] *** Barrett has quit IRC[02:32:19] *** irker-600 has joined #haiku[02:32:49] <irker-600> pdziepak-github.nfs4_attr: [5 commits] https://github.com/pdziepak/Haiku/compare/7cca381[02:32:49] <irker-600> 996c494: attribute_overlay: Do not require get_vnode_name() hook[02:32:50] <irker-600> 2cadf56: attribute_overlay: Fix NULL dereference[02:32:50] <irker-600> a0d8b49: attribute_overlay: Save modified attributes[02:32:51] <irker-600> b6fa76f: attribute_overlay: read_dir: Handle multiple entries properly[02:32:51] <irker-600> 7cca381: attribute_overlay: Ignore errors at creating _HAIKU directory[02:38:46] *** subcritical has quit IRC[02:50:05] *** bbjimmy has joined #haiku[03:52:26] *** bbjimmy has quit IRC[03:53:28] *** mmadia has quit IRC[04:01:32] *** pdziepak has quit IRC[04:04:23] *** oco2 has quit IRC[04:15:11] *** BitPuffin has quit IRC[04:18:34] *** kcj has joined #haiku[04:39:14] <bbjimmy__> nicj bbjimmy[04:39:31] *** bbjimmy__ is now known as bbjimmy[04:57:49] *** kcj has quit IRC[05:01:37] *** kcj has joined #haiku[05:04:11] *** _marc` has quit IRC[05:17:39] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[05:20:40] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[05:21:17] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[05:21:40] *** Vidiot_X has joined #haiku[05:27:59] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[05:30:53] *** Vidiot_X has joined #haiku[05:34:23] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[05:42:34] *** Vidiot_X has joined #haiku[05:48:50] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[05:51:10] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[05:51:17] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[05:51:47] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[06:19:02] *** bitkid has joined #haiku[06:49:03] *** Vidiot_X has joined #haiku[06:49:08] *** Paradoxon has joined #haiku[07:11:20] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[07:14:00] *** mattlacey has quit IRC[07:15:07] *** LadySerena has quit IRC[07:15:21] *** Diver has joined #haiku[07:27:43] *** Paradoxon has quit IRC[07:33:39] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[07:42:27] *** cb88 has joined #haiku[08:01:36] *** daniele_athome has joined #haiku[08:13:41] *** HeTo has quit IRC[08:22:44] *** FreeFull has quit IRC[08:26:45] *** puckipedia|away is now known as puckipedia[08:28:26] *** arselinux has quit IRC[08:29:00] *** _marc` has quit IRC[08:32:03] *** Luko has joined #haiku[08:34:15] *** puckipedia is now known as puckipedia|away[08:35:03] *** Luko has quit IRC[08:39:44] *** humdinger has joined #haiku[08:41:35] *** louisdem has joined #haiku[08:44:10] *** HeTo has joined #haiku[08:48:44] <louisdem> Hello, people! :)[08:49:03] <louisdem> I need help on how to use Pootle...[08:49:39] <humdinger> hi louisdem! what's the problem?[08:51:07] <louisdem> Hi humdinger! I don't really understand how it works, I mean how do you translate such things as %something%[08:51:17] <humdinger> you don't :)[08:51:32] <humdinger> these are variables that are replaced in-code.[08:51:42] <louisdem> or when the suggestions get reviewed and by whom[08:52:03] <humdinger> reviews are done by the language manager.[08:52:30] <louisdem> My thinking exactly, but I've seen some of these %somevariable% translated so...[08:52:38] <louisdem> ok[08:52:51] <humdinger> That would be an error.[08:52:58] <humdinger> Do you have an example?[08:53:02] <humdinger> just to be sure[08:53:10] <louisdem> yes,[08:53:24] <louisdem> %inaccessible% was translated to %inacessíveis%[08:53:26] <louisdem> ...[08:53:46] <humdinger> in AboutSystem?[08:53:51] <louisdem> I guess now I'll have to correct those[08:54:02] <louisdem> no, in zip-o-matic[08:55:43] <humdinger> I don't see %inaccessible% there, but anyway, wherever there's a %variable or %variable%, it mustn#T be translated.[08:56:14] <louisdem> ok, my mistake, sorry. thanks, humdinger[08:56:15] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[08:56:20] <humdinger> np[08:56:22] <louisdem> gotta go now, bye.[08:56:27] <humdinger> cya[08:58:33] *** louisdem has quit IRC[09:04:48] *** humdinger_ has joined #haiku[09:04:56] *** humdinger has quit IRC[09:11:15] *** Vidiot_X has joined #haiku[09:21:45] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[09:27:21] *** puckipedia|away is now known as puckipedia[09:36:19] *** Ptrus has quit IRC[09:36:46] *** Ptrus has joined #haiku[09:43:30] *** _3dEyes has joined #haiku[09:45:05] *** stippi has joined #haiku[09:45:05] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[09:45:55] <humdinger_> hi stippi![09:46:39] <humdinger_> stippi: say, the destination folder in PackageInstaller is ignored, right?[09:46:45] <humdinger_> or is that a bug?[09:48:15] <PulkoMandy> I'd say the package script may or may not use it[09:48:40] <humdinger_> I'm not sure...[09:49:07] <humdinger_> Gobe e.g. is installed to /system/non-packaged.[09:49:10] *** anoopcs has joined #haiku[09:49:17] <humdinger_> That can't come from the pkg[09:50:00] <humdinger_> I dunno... are all pkgs made by PackageInstaller to install in non-packaged?[09:50:42] <PulkoMandy> the path is patched on the fly to add non-packaged as needed[09:50:49] <humdinger_> Then maybe only the choice between ~/config and /system could be offered,[09:50:59] <humdinger_> instead of "other" which opens a file panel,[09:51:08] <PulkoMandy> no, the patching happens only if you try to install there[09:51:10] <humdinger_> which suggests that i can install wherever i want.[09:51:22] <PulkoMandy> if you select /boot/apps, it should install there without changing the path[09:51:33] <humdinger_> then it's a bug... :)[09:51:55] <PulkoMandy> well, as I said, I think it depends on the package script that's inside the pkg[09:52:00] <PulkoMandy> it may ignore the path you set[09:52:07] <PulkoMandy> or use it only for some files[09:52:22] <PulkoMandy> for example, it's common for screensavers to install the screensaver itself in the screensaver dir[09:52:30] <puckipedia> humdinger_: packages can use relative paths (relative to the destination folder) and absolute paths[09:52:36] <PulkoMandy> but they can still use the path for other files (sourcecode, documentation, whatever)[09:53:29] <humdinger_> well...[09:53:38] <puckipedia> Blame the creator of the .pkg[09:53:49] <humdinger_> I really don't want anyone to waste more time on that pkg crap...[09:54:16] <humdinger_> still, it's a bit stupid if the GUI suggests something that isn't respected after all...[09:54:48] <puckipedia> It is respected, sometimes[09:54:55] <humdinger_> :P[09:55:28] <puckipedia> Actually, I might make a command line .pkg extractor that has an override for absolute paths[09:55:57] <humdinger_> I'd be OK if pkgs were always installed in either ~/config/non-packages or /system/non-packaged.[09:56:25] <humdinger_> why offer the option to install in ~/ when that may or may not work?[09:56:29] <puckipedia> The problem is, the packages can use every path, if they all used relative paths, the hacks above weren´t even needed[09:59:05] <humdinger_> i wanted to update the user guide page on PackageInstaller, but it's a bit stupid to tell the user she can install anywhere, when in fact she may not. Depending on the pkg and having no clue where it ends up until the installation is complete.[09:59:35] <puckipedia> That has to be improved, yeah[10:00:17] *** stargater has joined #haiku[10:01:05] <PulkoMandy> would it be possible to detect if the package uses relative paths?[10:02:19] <puckipedia> yep[10:02:30] <puckipedia> All paths don´t start with /[10:03:03] <humdinger_> Can't we just always put it in ~/config/non-packages or /system/non-packaged ?[10:04:41] <puckipedia> You should be able to, although you might need to use some tricks for that[10:04:55] <stippi> humdinger_: Which destination folder?[10:05:13] <humdinger_> stippi: in PackageInstaller "Install in:"[10:05:24] <puckipedia> (if it is relative you need to place it in the non-packaged apps folder probably)[10:06:07] *** puckipedia is now known as puckipedia|away[10:06:43] <stargater> moin[10:06:53] <stippi> humdinger_: The path is definitely respected as far as PackageInstaller goes. But you can link the exact package you are observing problems with and I can have a look.[10:07:21] <humdinger_> stippi: it's the Gobe Trial[10:08:00] *** puckipedia|away is now known as puckipedia[10:08:14] <stippi> humdinger_: That's the one I tested with. It definitely should respect the path you pick.[10:08:23] <humdinger_> mompl[10:08:25] <stippi> Maybe I broke something later on.[10:08:47] <stippi> Before I started work on PackageInstaller, selecting the path manually was actually the only way to get it installed at all.[10:09:06] <stippi> What I changed is what the default path is.[10:09:24] <stippi> Instead of defaulting to nothing, it defaults to /boot/system/non-packaged/apps.[10:09:29] *** anoopcs has quit IRC[10:09:52] <humdinger_> After choothing "Other" and selecting "home", there's still the default non-packaged folder in the pop-up[10:10:14] <stippi> humdinger_: Then I may have broken something.[10:10:17] <stippi> Let me check...[10:11:30] <humdinger_> BTW, personally, I'd prefer to have ~/config/...... as default in PackageInstaller and HaikuDepot.[10:11:43] <humdinger_> makes finding the stuff you have installed yourself easier.[10:11:52] <stippi> Hm. I implemented B_CANCEL for detecting when the user cancelled the file panel. It's where it resets to the previous destination.[10:12:20] <stippi> humdinger_: One should be able to pick it, I guess.[10:12:35] <stippi> And I think apps are too hard to find.[10:12:40] <humdinger_> yes.[10:12:57] <stippi> /boot/apps was appealing.[10:14:10] <PulkoMandy> humdinger_: having libs in ~/config/lib doesn't work very well currently[10:14:22] <PulkoMandy> the compiler doesn't look there[10:14:41] <humdinger_> PulkoMandy: teach him! :)[10:14:58] <PulkoMandy> and yes, having a way to see all apps would be nice - I used to have the deskbar "Applications" open as a tracker window, with big icons[10:15:02] <PulkoMandy> now I can't do this anymore[10:15:21] <PulkoMandy> so I have to add apps manually to Launchbox instead[10:15:36] <PulkoMandy> (and that isn't as conveniently movable and resizeable)[10:15:57] <stippi> PulkoMandy: I think the problem is Tracker.[10:16:18] <stippi> If you think about it, why should Tracker try to store the view settings *with* the folder?[10:16:43] <stippi> What if two users use the machine, one wants that folder with big icons, the other as a list?[10:16:45] <PulkoMandy> yes, that's already in the TODO list for multiuser support[10:17:45] <stippi> For somethings, meta data are great. For example, the playing time of a song is correct, also the track number and artist.[10:18:12] <stippi> The rating however, is something that actually depends on the user. Why should two users using a machine not be able to rate a song differently?[10:18:34] <puckipedia> Just take the average ;)[10:18:45] <stippi> Pretty much all apps on Haiku don't care about this difference.[10:19:40] <stippi> And its hard to get right. Maybe user B enjoys all the work user A has already put into rating songs...[10:20:35] <PulkoMandy> we could make the attributes have an user Id as part of the key - but I guess that's a BFS2 thing[10:20:37] <stippi> But maybe such a problem should be solved differently, on the application level, with something like "Import ratings"...[10:21:05] <puckipedia> PulkoMandy: Yeah, sounds like something that has to be added in BFS2[10:21:11] <puckipedia> Global + User-specific keys[10:21:16] <stippi> PulkoMandy: I am thinking more along the lines of, some attributes should be stored with the file, and some shouldn't.[10:22:09] <PulkoMandy> stippi: yes, I think both are useful[10:22:32] <PulkoMandy> there are other interesting questions, like, when copying the files to external media, do you want to export your ratings with it?[10:22:52] <stippi> If you store something with the file, it may get out of sync. For example, think about image size being stored as attributes with an image file. But then you crop the image and that particular app does not store the image size as attributes and now the attribute is out of sync with the file contents.[10:23:18] <stippi> But if you store some info outside of the file entirely, it may become stale...[10:23:51] <stippi> So having that "separate" from the file actually be a part of the file system layer would be nice.[10:24:19] <PulkoMandy> yes, I don't think there is a sane and fast way to disconnect this completely from the FS[10:25:11] <stippi> But now "the file system" is actually a mix of many file systems, bind mounts, package fs, bfs, shine through folders ...[10:26:17] <stippi> Maybe there should be another FS layer at the top which is the "final view on the file system". And that would handle features like adding attributes to read-only locations in the sub-layers...[10:26:32] <stippi> (per user)[10:27:06] <stippi> Maybe that still wouldn't provide the benefits I am hoping it would. I am probably forgetting something.[10:27:15] <PulkoMandy> I would rather let each filesystem handle that[10:27:43] <PulkoMandy> when you mount something read-only, I think you expect attributes to also be read-only[10:27:56] <stippi> How would a read-only package fs mount point know where it can store some user attribute at a writeable location in another fs mount?[10:28:28] <PulkoMandy> the package fs already knows which package each file belongs to[10:28:34] <PulkoMandy> (and exports this as an attribute)[10:28:46] <PulkoMandy> so it could write the attributes in the package file, or next to it[10:29:00] <stippi> Maybe it makes sense to put this in Tracker. After all, you wouldn't expect to be able to move something on a read-only volume, so the separately stored info can't go stale.[10:29:37] <stippi> PulkoMandy: I am concerned more about the virtual locations in the FS that don't even come from packages.[10:30:31] <PulkoMandy> the virtual folders?[10:30:46] <PulkoMandy> they seem to be implemented only in Tracker/Deskbar[10:30:54] <stippi> Yeah.[10:30:55] <PulkoMandy> at least bash doesn't conside them as directories[10:31:04] <PulkoMandy> just a file with a list of dirs in it[10:31:06] <stippi> Ok.[10:31:18] <stippi> Anyone read that article: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/01/bitrot-and-atomic-cows-inside-next-gen-filesystems/[10:31:20] <PulkoMandy> http://paste.debian.net/83955/[10:32:12] <PulkoMandy> I think the plan for virtual folders was to use the first (or first writable) dir from the list for writes[10:33:01] <PulkoMandy> but, this may not be fery useful - it's only for changing the directory itself: adding new files, or changing attributes[10:33:25] <PulkoMandy> the files that are already part of the virtual dir actually live on some other FS, be it BFS or PackageFS (or another)[10:33:51] <PulkoMandy> so, as long as the virtual thing can forward the attribute changes to the underlying FS, and both BFS and PackageFS can handle it in some way, we would be safe[10:38:27] *** gordonjcp has joined #haiku[10:39:50] *** Xenmen has quit IRC[10:39:55] *** secris has joined #haiku[10:41:28] *** secris has quit IRC[10:44:59] *** stippi has quit IRC[10:53:30] *** humdinger_ has quit IRC[10:58:14] *** bernte has joined #haiku[11:02:20] *** BitPuffin has joined #haiku[11:11:25] *** Luko has joined #haiku[11:11:41] <bernte> I still have a BeBox lying around here in London for pickup ...[11:12:07] <gordonjcp> bernte: oo[11:12:12] <gordonjcp> bit far for me[11:12:34] <bernte> Too heavy to build a package.[11:12:55] <gordonjcp> bernte: if you really really can't get rid of it, I could send a minion ;-)[11:13:11] <gordonjcp> I'm trying to have fewer crappy old computers in my house just now though :-D[11:13:28] <bernte> gordonjcp, me, too! ;-)[11:13:31] <gordonjcp> bernte: what spec, and how much do you want for it?[11:13:58] <bernte> gordonjcp, BeBox-133 - not clue about the spec or if it even works ... for free :-)[11:15:42] <bernte> Of course, I hope that whoever takes it will put some TLC into it.[11:17:30] *** Gedrin2 has joined #haiku[11:18:08] *** Gedrin has quit IRC[11:18:08] *** Gedrin2 is now known as Gedrin[11:18:32] <gordonjcp> bernte: try asking on #london-hack-space, apparently[11:18:56] <bernte> gordonjcp, thanks ... will have a look.[11:20:05] *** kcj has quit IRC[11:20:48] *** bliss-sid has joined #haiku[11:21:28] *** stippi has joined #haiku[11:21:28] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[11:21:38] *** bliss-sid has quit IRC[11:46:29] <puckipedia> Hmm, BeShare doesn't build here[11:48:10] <puckipedia> (cast from volatile long int* to long int*)[11:49:34] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[11:52:42] *** bernte has quit IRC[11:53:36] <stippi> puckipedia: That would be some access to the atomic functions. It changed from taking vint32 to int32[11:55:32] <puckipedia> yep[11:55:40] <puckipedia> It seems the problem is in MUSCLE code[11:55:57] <OmniMancer> why would they be changed away from volatile :([11:56:04] <puckipedia> It uses vint32 on BeOS 5, and int32 on others[11:56:32] <puckipedia> (B_BEOS_VERSION_5)[11:59:19] <PulkoMandy> OmniMancer: it turns out volatile is useless for this[11:59:28] <PulkoMandy> it makes them slower, and doesn't fix the problem it tried to[12:05:13] *** bernte has joined #haiku[12:12:22] *** subcritical has joined #haiku[12:26:00] *** stargater has quit IRC[12:31:54] *** rimio has quit IRC[12:32:11] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[12:34:29] <OmniMancer> PulkoMandy: ah[12:39:30] *** karanp has joined #haiku[12:40:50] <karanp> Hi, I am interested in participating in GSoC this summer. I am interested in the UI development ideas posted in the webpage.[12:41:20] <karanp> I have all the skill sets mentioned there. I have build GUIs both in python n Qt (C++)[12:43:18] <puckipedia> According to the GSoC site, "Registration opens on March 10, 2014, 7 p.m. UTC."[12:44:58] <karanp> Yes, I was actually looking for bugs regarding UI...it is not mentioned on the page as it is for others[12:46:02] *** nighty^ has joined #haiku[12:46:04] <puckipedia> There's this search: https://dev.haiku-os.org/query?status=assigned&status=in-progress&status=new&status=reopened&component=%5EUser+Interface&col=id&col=summary&col=status&col=owner&col=type&col=priority&col=milestone&order=priority[12:46:31] <puckipedia> Which will search the Haiku bugtracker for User Interface issues[12:51:29] *** rimio has joined #haiku[12:53:15] *** freedomrun has joined #haiku[12:53:28] *** orealis has quit IRC[12:54:14] *** orealis has joined #haiku[13:05:12] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[13:07:57] *** kkux has quit IRC[13:07:58] <PulkoMandy> karanp: hi, depends what you mean by UI. I think most of our tasks won't be only writing user interface code, but some could be made to fit[13:10:29] <PulkoMandy> be careful of not making your project too small by restraining it to only User Interface - I think some of our ideas (Preflet refactoring, calendar app, for example) need to be extended and researched to become good proposals[13:14:48] *** ALB has joined #haiku[13:15:12] *** ALB is now known as Guest40234[13:16:37] <Guest40234> Hey[13:16:46] <Guest40234> i want to contribute to haiku...i know C/C++ and Qt..and i am interested in OS...is there anyone i can contribute to haiku?[13:18:28] <gordonjcp> Guest40234: hi[13:18:36] <Guest40234> gordonjcp: hi[13:18:39] <gordonjcp> Guest40234: there's an article on the wiki about what you can do to get started[13:18:49] <Guest40234> i read that[13:18:50] <puckipedia> Qt will not be so useful in Haiku[13:19:14] <Guest40234> puckipedia: i read about Qt porting and all so i mentioned it[13:19:30] <PulkoMandy> well, Haiku itself does not use Qt[13:19:41] <Guest40234> anyways...atleast i can use C++[13:19:50] <gordonjcp> Guest40234: you could get yourself a build environment set up, and try building Haiku from source[13:20:01] <gordonjcp> then pick a bug you like the look of, and see if you can fix it ;-)[13:20:23] <gordonjcp> https://dev.haiku-os.org/wiki/EasyTasks[13:20:24] <Guest40234> gordonjcp: ok i can do that...thanks[13:20:55] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[13:21:03] *** HaikuUser is now known as Styrbjorn[13:22:26] <Guest40234> i can do even those on which work has already been done?[13:25:33] <PulkoMandy> well, if they show on the list, it means there's at least some work left to do[13:26:17] <Guest40234> PulkoMandy: ok..thanks for replying[13:29:41] *** Styrbjorn has quit IRC[13:30:59] <karanp> PulkoMandy, i understand that UI will come with a backend with a logic of its own[13:33:12] <karanp> PulkoMandy, I have experience of designing and building an application from scratch. It involved machine learning and image processing algorithms[13:34:34] <Guest40234> karanp: i am sorry to jump in but i am interested in image processing and machine learning ...is there any projects related to that??[13:35:27] <karanp> I am also a student wanting to participate in GSoC[13:36:12] *** _marc` has quit IRC[13:36:27] <Guest40234> karanp: so since when have u been working with Haiku?[13:36:30] *** _3dEyes has quit IRC[13:37:08] <karanp> Guest40234, I haven't. I want to.[13:37:32] <Guest40234> karanp: cool[13:37:45] <PulkoMandy> karanp: ok, I just want to make this clear because I think the Ideas List may be a bit misleading about this - we don't want to miss good students because of that :)[13:43:19] <karanp> PulkoMandy, We can discuss in detail so as to come up with a more specific proposal. I can mail you my skill set for the same.[13:43:35] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[13:50:36] <PulkoMandy> karanp: we expect this to happen on the mailing lists[13:50:52] <PulkoMandy> http://www.freelists.org/list/haiku-development[13:51:08] <PulkoMandy> or here over IRC[13:51:43] <PulkoMandy> this allows you to get input from more members of the Haiku community, to make a better proposal[13:52:12] <PulkoMandy> and don't worry too much about other students stealing ideas, we usually notice that by ourselves[13:54:59] *** Styrbjorn has joined #haiku[13:57:22] *** shahhena95 has joined #haiku[13:59:09] <Guest40234> PulkoMandy: IF possible can guide me a bit...i was interested to work on media section of haiku..especially adding the subtitle support[14:00:41] <PulkoMandy> well, this one involves modifying Haiku itself, so a first step is compiling Haiku yourself and checking that the resulting system cal boot (on a virtual machine or real hardware)[14:01:13] <PulkoMandy> then, you can start looking around the sourcecode (probably in src/kit/media and src/apps/mediaplayer) to see what needs to be done[14:01:19] *** Diver has quit IRC[14:01:41] <PulkoMandy> we have quite complete guides on getting started with building Haiku: http://www.haiku-os.org/guides/[14:02:04] <Guest40234> ya i saw that...and have already started with that[14:07:23] *** pdziepak has joined #haiku[14:10:44] *** Guest40234 has quit IRC[14:10:49] *** poxip has joined #haiku[14:11:13] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[14:11:52] *** ALB_ has joined #haiku[14:12:14] *** shahhena95 has quit IRC[14:21:26] *** e1z0 has quit IRC[14:21:26] *** e1z0 has joined #haiku[14:27:55] *** Ashutosh has joined #haiku[14:28:55] *** Ashutosh has quit IRC[14:29:36] *** BitPuffin has quit IRC[14:29:55] *** ashpra has joined #haiku[14:34:56] *** bernte has quit IRC[14:37:20] *** Diver has joined #haiku[14:37:44] *** Diver has quit IRC[14:38:04] *** valeriusL has quit IRC[14:38:04] *** Diver has joined #haiku[14:39:48] *** Paradoxon has joined #haiku[14:40:10] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[14:40:22] <HaikuUser> hay[14:41:13] <Paradoxon> Hi[14:41:41] <HaikuUser> Who is to say that there is no general nature of library names?[14:41:47] <HaikuUser> translate by google...[14:41:49] <HaikuUser> :][14:43:05] <HaikuUser> mam aplikacje, która używa libjpeg.so.8.0 a w haiku mam libjpeg.so.9.0 co skutkuje tym, że aplikacja się nie uruchamia[14:43:11] <HaikuUser> ah[14:43:24] <HaikuUser> I have applications that uses libjpeg.so.8.0 and haiku have libjpeg.so.9.0 which results in that the application does not start[14:43:36] <HaikuUser> this is madness ;][14:43:45] *** anurag_goel_ has joined #haiku[14:43:58] <HaikuUser> why libjpeg.so.9.0[14:44:03] <puckipedia> Well, it is newer[14:44:09] <HaikuUser> why not libjpeg.so[14:44:28] <puckipedia> I think it is due to the package management[14:44:33] <puckipedia> it may be*[14:45:19] <PulkoMandy> not only[14:45:35] <HaikuUser> With this approach, every year will need to compile the application to adapt it to libraries in ststemie[14:45:45] <PulkoMandy> it depends on the lib[14:46:05] <PulkoMandy> the version number is changed only when there is incompatible API changes[14:46:26] <PulkoMandy> so, we could keep the same name, your application would start, and then it would crash because the APIs inside the lib have changed anyway[14:46:47] <PulkoMandy> and, we have a way to avoid this since early BeOS versions: use translators instead of using libjpeg directly[14:46:51] *** bernte has joined #haiku[14:47:07] <puckipedia> And, you can define dependencies[14:47:16] <PulkoMandy> there is nothing more we can do about it, it's JPEG group decision to not have stable APIs[14:49:19] <HaikuUser> so we have garbage like everywhere[14:50:36] <PulkoMandy> again, we have a solution for this: use translators[14:51:14] *** anurag_goel_ has quit IRC[14:51:39] *** anurag_goel has joined #haiku[14:52:57] <HaikuUser> for example: we have 3 applications each using a different version, which means that we have to install 3 versions of libraries for these applications[14:53:19] <Paradoxon> no the 3 just just translators ;)[14:54:02] <PulkoMandy> we have 3 (and a lot more) applications using the translator API, which is stable for years[14:54:11] <PulkoMandy> and we can replace the JPEG translator when we update the lib[14:54:14] <PulkoMandy> everything keeps working[14:54:17] <puckipedia> Literally years[14:54:26] <PulkoMandy> and we can even add support for PNG, or whatever format comes next[14:54:28] <PulkoMandy> sorry[14:54:31] <puckipedia> BeOS came out in 199x or something, and the translator API has existed since then[14:54:32] <PulkoMandy> s/years/decades[14:54:32] <PulkoMandy> :)[14:55:09] <Paradoxon> But you could try to make a link to this lib[14:55:12] <Paradoxon> somethimes it works[14:55:31] <PulkoMandy> that being said, we do support having multiple versions of the lib installed[14:55:46] <PulkoMandy> so you can still make a package for the old libjpeg, or bundle it with your app[14:55:58] <PulkoMandy> if you really don't want to use the Haiku API, and use the mad Linux way instead[14:58:19] *** ALB_ has quit IRC[14:59:45] <HaikuUser> chce nauczyć się api haiku, ale intryguje mnie ilość aplikacji, które wymagają starych bibliotek, mimo że ma się nowsze wersje[14:59:53] <HaikuUser> wants to learn api haiku, but it intrigues me the number of applications that require the old library, even though it is a later version[15:00:29] <anurag_goel> hello everyone.[15:00:51] <anurag_goel> i am one of the aspirant of Gsoc 2014.[15:00:58] <PulkoMandy> welcome :)[15:01:16] <anurag_goel> i wanted to contribute my sincere efforts in this org.[15:02:05] <anurag_goel> so i have read all the things which mentioned over the haiku site.[15:02:41] <PulkoMandy> that's a good start[15:02:46] <HaikuUser> and is there anyone with Polish[15:03:12] <anurag_goel> i have also gone through the ideas page and one of the project looks interesting to me is Modular edit view (BIG)[15:03:54] <anurag_goel> right now i working on ubuntu linux environment.[15:04:32] <PulkoMandy> that should work[15:04:40] <anurag_goel> can you please guide to install haiku working env.?[15:04:46] <PulkoMandy> you can set up a virtual machine and try running Haiku on it[15:05:02] <PulkoMandy> or dedicate a partition to it on a real hard drive, if you have space for that[15:05:27] <PulkoMandy> the http://www.haiku-os.org/guides/ page has some documentation[15:05:39] <PulkoMandy> (mostly the "Installing" section, at this point)[15:06:15] *** valeriusL has joined #haiku[15:07:17] <anurag_goel> okay , thanks!![15:08:48] <anurag_goel> i will configure the whole dev env. and get back to you once i will configure it[15:09:10] <HaikuUser> or know when you will be handling the intel HD audio ICH 7 ??[15:20:43] <anurag_goel> PulkoMandy: is there any priority on the projects listed on ideas page?[15:22:16] *** stippi has quit IRC[15:22:34] *** valeriusL has quit IRC[15:26:43] *** stippi has joined #haiku[15:26:43] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[15:29:46] <PulkoMandy> anurag_goel: not really[15:30:44] <PulkoMandy> our goal is to get new contributors, so just pick something you feel more confortable with[15:31:03] <anurag_goel> so all projects all equally important and i am free to choose project of my choice . right?[15:31:45] <PulkoMandy> yes[15:32:39] *** valeriusL has joined #haiku[15:32:44] <umccullough> you are also free to propose your own project :)[15:32:46] <PulkoMandy> all these projects are on our "nice to have" list, but you can even come up with your own idea[15:32:54] <PulkoMandy> (this is what I did in 2009 as a student)[15:33:23] <anurag_goel> good to hear that[15:33:38] <PulkoMandy> what matters to us is not really the idea you build on, because our goal is to get long-term contributors[15:33:40] *** Blub\0 is now known as Blub\w[15:33:57] <PulkoMandy> so, just pick something you're confortable with, and show us your skills at handling it[15:35:02] <PulkoMandy> you'll notice our ideas have short descriptions and are quite open ended, this is on purpose, we expect you to build from them and make your own proposal[15:36:01] <HaikuUser> where is this ideas page?[15:36:14] <umccullough> HaikuUser, are you a gsoc student?[15:36:37] <HaikuUser> no[15:36:46] <umccullough> https://www.haiku-os.org/community/gsoc/2014/ideas[15:36:53] *** Paradoxon has quit IRC[15:37:20] <HaikuUser> thx[15:37:45] <umccullough> i asked because it should be linked from google-melange, and wanted to make sure the link wasn't broken[15:40:39] *** ashpra has quit IRC[15:41:04] <anurag_goel> surely, once i get comfortable with the working env.[15:41:22] <anurag_goel> I can make a significant contribution in it.[15:50:35] *** bbjimmy has quit IRC[15:51:07] *** Blub\0 has joined #haiku[15:51:26] *** bernte has quit IRC[15:51:56] *** bbjimmy has joined #haiku[15:52:22] *** Blub\w has quit IRC[16:03:05] *** nclandrei has joined #haiku[16:03:21] <nclandrei> hi![16:03:35] <nclandrei> is this the right place to talk about GSoC projects? (-:[16:03:37] <puckipedia> Yes[16:04:24] <puckipedia> This is one of the right places, probably the one with the quickest responses[16:04:33] <nclandrei> I would be very interested in applying for 2 of your projects, if possible[16:04:44] <nclandrei> Updating mail and Calendar application[16:04:58] <puckipedia> Don't ask me, ask one of the admins[16:05:01] <PulkoMandy> :)[16:05:08] <puckipedia> Like him[16:05:15] <nclandrei> and I wanted to get hands-on advice regarding a good application[16:05:17] <nclandrei> oh sorry then[16:05:34] <PulkoMandy> well, I guess you have looked at our "students" page already?[16:05:47] <PulkoMandy> http://www.haiku-os.org/community/gsoc/2014/students[16:05:52] <nclandrei> yes, of course[16:06:19] <nclandrei> I wanted to ask you if you could give me some advice other than the ones found there, like what to do prior the application period[16:06:39] <nclandrei> I am currently documenting regarding the possibilities[16:06:57] <nclandrei> to accomplish the 2 projects I've just mentioned[16:07:30] <PulkoMandy> well, Haiku is an operating system, setting it up can be a bit more complicated than just getting an application running[16:07:36] <umccullough> let's add some admins to the channel ;)[16:07:56] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o umccullough[16:07:59] <PulkoMandy> so starting to play with it (in a VM or on real hardware) is a good start, if you didn't know it before[16:08:08] *** stippi has quit IRC[16:08:09] *** umccullough sets mode: +o PulkoMandy[16:08:15] <nclandrei> wel I have it already on a virtual machine[16:08:19] <nclandrei> I've managed to set it up[16:08:21] <PulkoMandy> ok[16:08:36] <puckipedia> Nightly, I guess?[16:08:51] <PulkoMandy> so, for the "Mail" project, you will have to recompile Haiku, so get the sources and start playing with them[16:09:19] <PulkoMandy> maybe locate Axel's "IMAP rewrite" work (I don't remember where he hosted that) and see what's the status of it[16:09:29] *** umccullough sets mode: +v pfoetchen[16:09:36] *** umccullough sets mode: +v pdziepak[16:09:43] *** umccullough sets mode: +v xyzzy[16:09:47] <PulkoMandy> and, remember we expect you to submit a code sample as part of your application - this may require some work before you even get selected[16:09:57] <nclandrei> okay then[16:09:59] <nclandrei> I have understood[16:10:05] *** umccullough sets mode: +v kallisti5[16:10:09] *** stippi has joined #haiku[16:10:09] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[16:10:12] <PulkoMandy> for the "Calendar" app, have a look at the linked apps in the idea, and see how they could be improved[16:10:14] *** umccullough sets mode: +v js[16:10:18] *** umccullough sets mode: +v hamishm__[16:10:33] *** umccullough sets mode: +v Diver[16:10:53] <PulkoMandy> maybe do some mockups of how a good Calendar app should look like, see what's available on other OSes, and decide wether the apps we linked can be used as a base or if it's better to start from scratch[16:11:29] <nclandrei> so I should submit a sample of code before the application period?[16:11:31] <nclandrei> or during it?[16:12:08] *** bbjimmy has quit IRC[16:12:12] <PulkoMandy> well, as part of your proposal[16:12:28] <PulkoMandy> we have no problem with students getting work done before the official start date[16:12:31] <umccullough> or any time really, when you submit the proposal, you can link to whatever contribution you have made[16:12:33] *** bbjimmy has joined #haiku[16:12:38] *** humdinger has joined #haiku[16:12:49] <PulkoMandy> (so don't hesitate to use the extra time)[16:12:54] *** umccullough sets mode: +v humdinger[16:14:32] <PulkoMandy> also note that patches submitted to the bugtracker usually need some iterations of review / fixing before we decide to commit them, so it's better if you start early, and show you were able to comply with all the rules and get your patch (or patches) commited[16:15:20] *** umccullough sets mode: +o kallisti5[16:20:55] <nclandrei> okay then[16:20:58] <nclandrei> thank you very much[16:28:25] *** DKnoto has joined #haiku[16:28:28] *** nclandrei has quit IRC[16:29:34] *** anurag_goel has quit IRC[16:30:57] *** ctrl has joined #haiku[16:32:52] *** anurag_goel has joined #haiku[16:36:14] *** ctrl has quit IRC[16:43:32] *** Paradoxon has joined #haiku[16:53:22] *** _marc` has quit IRC[16:59:22] *** DaQatz_ has quit IRC[17:07:05] *** Xenmen has joined #haiku[17:12:36] *** Xenmen has quit IRC[17:13:58] *** anurag_goel has quit IRC[17:14:48] *** Paradoxon has quit IRC[17:23:42] *** Paradoxon has joined #haiku[17:32:14] *** bbjimmy has quit IRC[17:37:01] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[17:39:50] *** LadySerena has joined #haiku[17:40:56] *** FreeFull has joined #haiku[17:47:53] *** Martini_ has joined #haiku[17:56:18] *** fhein has joined #haiku[17:59:09] <irker-600> haiku.master: korli * hrev46925 [1 commit] http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=8b804bc+%5E99d23e5[17:59:10] <irker-600> 8b804bc: findutils: use the HaikuPorts package.[18:01:40] *** JoFo has quit IRC[18:04:36] *** yano has quit IRC[18:08:33] <scanty> any progress on webkit/x86_64?[18:09:33] *** umccullough sets mode: +o mmu_man[18:10:37] <puckipedia> PulkoMandy: ^[18:10:57] <PulkoMandy> no[18:11:22] <scanty> 'k thanks.[18:12:42] *** navneet_ has joined #haiku[18:13:21] *** leszek has joined #haiku[18:13:23] *** humdinger has quit IRC[18:16:43] *** poxip has quit IRC[18:17:14] <navneet_> Hi.. am gsoc aspirant .. i want to disscuss a project[18:21:44] *** yano has joined #haiku[18:22:15] <navneet_> is there anyone?[18:22:15] *** Dane_ has joined #haiku[18:22:25] <Dane_> mmu_man[18:23:11] <puckipedia> navneet_: Ask one of the OPs or voiced people[18:23:49] <PulkoMandy> well, there is[18:23:51] <PulkoMandy> just ask :)[18:25:07] <navneet_> i wanted to do one of the proposed projects in haiku..[18:25:21] <navneet_> how should i approach[18:28:32] <PulkoMandy> coming here is a good start[18:28:46] <PulkoMandy> I guess you've read our "students" page already?[18:29:32] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[18:30:37] <PulkoMandy> well, anyway, a good start is running Haiku (on real hardware or a VM) and playing a bit with it[18:31:00] <PulkoMandy> and, depending on the idea(s) you plan to work on, trying to compile haiku from sources[18:31:30] <PulkoMandy> and, our application process requires you to submit a patch to Haiku or the app you plan to work on, so, start working on that if possible[18:32:24] <PulkoMandy> also start researching and thinking about your proposal. You may have noticed the ideas in our list are short and open-ended, we expect you to build on them (or on your own idea) to create a more complete and detailed proposal[18:32:43] <PulkoMandy> the template on the "students" page should give you a better idea what to do[18:34:00] <navneet_> i was thinking of building calender application[18:34:15] <navneet_> this is easy one and i think i can do it..[18:34:19] <umccullough> you are the second one to mention that today :)[18:34:39] <umccullough> keep in mind, the "easy" ones are going to have a lot of students proposing to do them[18:35:12] <navneet_> :umccullough okiee.[18:35:41] *** leszek_ has joined #haiku[18:35:52] <navneet_> so i should i be creating strong proposal on that or choose another project on that[18:36:07] * Dane_ wonders if Haiku's instability in accessing CD/DVD drives might be a good prospect for GSOC[18:36:21] *** leszek has quit IRC[18:36:26] *** leszek_ is now known as leszek[18:37:31] *** poxip has joined #haiku[18:37:33] <PulkoMandy> navneet_: yes, just copypasting the proposal won't make it, even though it looks easy, it needs as much research as the others[18:38:10] <PulkoMandy> what are good calendar apps on other systems? what features should we have? how do we share data with some other systems? what would the UI look like?[18:39:08] <umccullough> by all means, submit a proposal for it, but maybe also submit an alternate proposal for another project as well just in case[18:40:03] *** navneet__ has joined #haiku[18:40:13] *** navneet_ has quit IRC[18:40:15] *** JoFo has joined #haiku[18:41:39] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[18:44:03] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[18:44:24] *** Martini_ has quit IRC[18:45:53] *** BitPuffin has joined #haiku[18:48:04] *** vongrippen has quit IRC[18:48:09] <navneet__> yeah calender application might look easy but getting through all the details is a good ask.. i have gone through todays logs and yeah saw people intrested in it.. still i will create a strong proposal on this[18:48:18] *** Guest503 has quit IRC[18:48:20] *** vongrippen has joined #haiku[18:48:34] *** soakbot has joined #haiku[18:50:21] <navneet__> Is it necessary to have for acceptance in gsoc to contribute to haiku.. i have already contributed to some other open source community like django and duckduckgo[18:51:10] <PulkoMandy> we require you to submit at least one patch[18:51:40] <PulkoMandy> this is to make sure you have reasonable knowledge of C++, and you are able to follow our coding guidelines and patch-review workflow[18:52:13] <PulkoMandy> adding pointers to the work you did elsewhere to your proposal is good, but doesn't remove the need for at least one patch to Haiku[18:56:21] <navneet__> okiee i got it..[18:56:48] *** anurag_goel has joined #haiku[18:58:10] <anurag_goel> i have successfully install the haiku as virtual machine on ubuntu.[18:59:29] <anurag_goel> now is their any user guidance so that i get familiar with all haiku components?[19:03:23] <navneet__> :PulkoMandy hi would u like to guide me solving a ticket[19:03:48] <PulkoMandy> we expect you all to be able to do that on your own[19:04:21] <PulkoMandy> anurag_goel: we have an user guide, which is linked on the desktop - this works mostly like any other operating system, so you shouldn't get lost[19:05:01] <PulkoMandy> navneet__: the tickets are at http://dev.haiku-os.org/ , create an account there, have a look at existing tickets (both open and closed ones) to see how it goes[19:05:13] <PulkoMandy> and, grab the sourcecode and start working with it[19:06:56] <navneet__> :PulkoMandy where i can find the source code[19:07:08] *** valeriusL has quit IRC[19:07:15] <PulkoMandy> these links are easy enough to find[19:07:28] *** luroh has joined #haiku[19:07:37] <PulkoMandy> I'm not goingto write your application :)[19:09:06] *** waddlesplash has joined #haiku[19:18:58] *** waddlesplash has quit IRC[19:20:19] *** poxip has quit IRC[19:20:19] *** freedomrun has quit IRC[19:20:33] *** arfonzo has quit IRC[19:21:47] *** JoFo has quit IRC[19:22:54] *** stippi has quit IRC[19:22:55] *** valeriusL has joined #haiku[19:23:15] *** arfonzo has joined #haiku[19:23:29] *** LadySerena has quit IRC[19:23:45] *** stippi has joined #haiku[19:23:45] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[19:23:55] *** kkux has joined #haiku[19:25:39] <umccullough> navneet__, anurag_goel, these pages contain enough info that you should be able to locate the haiku source code build your own haiku image, and begin modifying/adding to it hopefully: http://www.haiku-os.org/guides/building[19:26:14] <umccullough> if you want to write apps for haiku, there is an entire section on our website dedicated to development, etc.[19:26:24] <umccullough> there are also "3rd party" mailing lists to help with writing applications for haiku[19:28:33] *** Paradoxon has quit IRC[19:30:52] *** prOSy has joined #haiku[19:33:48] *** jua_ has joined #haiku[19:34:31] *** LadySerena has joined #haiku[19:34:32] *** LadySerena has joined #haiku[19:35:53] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[19:40:38] *** navneet__ has quit IRC[19:40:54] *** poxip has joined #haiku[19:42:16] *** tgkokk has joined #haiku[19:44:11] *** idefix_gromit has joined #haiku[19:44:39] *** oco2 has joined #haiku[19:50:51] *** Cian has joined #haiku[19:54:33] *** secris has joined #haiku[19:55:23] *** slubman has quit IRC[19:55:56] <secris> How do I get rid of the clock that is created by the clock demo app?[19:57:47] <puckipedia> Right click it?[19:58:23] <secris> nothing[19:58:34] <puckipedia> does it have a small hand icon in the bottom right/left?[19:58:59] <secris> no[19:59:35] <puckipedia> Let me just boot into my Haiku VM[20:00:07] <puckipedia> Does it have a title "Clock" above the clock?[20:00:07] <secris> you may never be rid of them lol I have been trying for an hour[20:00:41] <secris> under demos clock[20:00:41] <puckipedia> Also, in the bottom right of the clock frame for me there's a very very small hand icon[20:00:43] <puckipedia> right click that[20:01:45] <secris> I did the drag it to your desktop to try it then couldn't get it to go away so I rebooted thinking that would kill it now there is no little hand[20:02:08] <puckipedia> yep[20:02:11] <puckipedia> ugh[20:02:53] <puckipedia> okay[20:02:57] <puckipedia> Open a terminal[20:03:01] <puckipedia> (apps -> Terminal)[20:03:17] <secris> done[20:03:41] <puckipedia> then enter: "kill Tracker; rm ~/config/settings/Tracker/tracker_shelf"[20:03:48] <puckipedia> without the '"' of course[20:04:15] <puckipedia> Your desktop should disappear (+ bg image)[20:04:26] *** Styrbjorn has quit IRC[20:04:31] <puckipedia> Then, under deskbar menu (leaf), press "Restart Tracker"[20:04:33] <idefix_gromit> secris: do you have the "Show replicants" option in Deskbar activated? (See http://www.haiku-os.org/docs/userguide/en/gui.html#replicants .)[20:04:48] <secris> that fixed it thanks[20:05:15] <secris> idefix_gromit: before I rebooted unchecking that hid them now it does not[20:06:39] *** DKnoto has quit IRC[20:09:08] *** navneet has joined #haiku[20:10:33] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[20:11:52] *** cb88 has quit IRC[20:13:43] *** leszek has quit IRC[20:19:25] *** valeriusL has quit IRC[20:21:22] *** slubman has joined #haiku[20:21:45] *** slubman has quit IRC[20:21:59] *** prOSy has quit IRC[20:23:58] *** navneet has quit IRC[20:24:00] *** slubman has joined #haiku[20:24:53] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[20:25:25] <Anarchos> What are the function i can use to do some debug printing (aka print_hex_dump_bytes in linux) ?[20:28:27] *** puckipedia is now known as puckipedia|away[20:30:10] *** bebop-haiku has joined #haiku[20:30:20] *** valeriusL has joined #haiku[20:31:47] *** puckipedia|away is now known as puckipedia[20:32:46] *** JoFo has joined #haiku[20:34:12] <Luko> hi folks[20:36:29] <Luko> haiku on 3tb disk is posible (16gb for haiku) and gpt p.table?[20:37:27] *** Cian has quit IRC[20:37:38] <Luko> +efi boot scheme not mbr?[20:37:38] *** Cian has joined #haiku[20:37:39] <puckipedia> GPT is supported afaik[20:37:49] <Luko> windows installed[20:37:51] <puckipedia> For booting on UEFI, you need to use CSM[20:37:59] <Luko> not linux i want say dont have grub[20:38:08] <puckipedia> And then use grub or something to chainload[20:38:20] *** kcj has joined #haiku[20:38:40] <Luko> its posible to load with ntldr to chainload another system from widnows[20:38:43] <Luko> ?[20:38:46] <puckipedia> Not AFAIK[20:39:03] <puckipedia> Quite surely not with UEFI[20:39:11] <Luko> in past time i can load open bsd from ntldr in winxp[20:39:28] <Luko> shi. efi[20:39:58] <Luko> i know that i can use msdosgpt[20:40:00] <puckipedia> That was on BIOS[20:40:04] <Luko> biosgpt part[20:40:32] <Luko> but this is only for 2tb +700gb partitioning, when i use efi i can have 2,7tb part[20:41:02] <Luko> ok i give for haiku extra 80gb sata disk :D[20:41:43] *** PasNox has quit IRC[20:42:26] *** comrad has joined #haiku[20:42:26] *** comrad has joined #haiku[20:43:42] *** NumberNoid has joined #haiku[20:44:02] <puckipedia> Luko: If you install Haiku on GPT, and enable BIOS support in your UEFI BIOS, it should work[20:44:05] *** Paradoxon has joined #haiku[20:45:07] *** axeld has joined #haiku[20:45:07] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o axeld[20:45:30] <Luko> puckipedia, ok that prblem is not with install to disk but boot it?[20:45:38] <Luko> boot manager ?[20:45:53] <puckipedia> Luko: In your UEFI, disable SecureBoot and set boot mode to UEFI/BIOS[20:46:04] <puckipedia> It hsould then be able to boot a boot manager from the MBR[20:46:14] <puckipedia> Not quite sure, never tried[20:46:24] <Luko> i have set on my AMD Gigabyte board UEFI bios and Legacy[20:46:24] <Cian> that works on 95% of machines, not the last 5% though[20:46:54] <puckipedia> Luko: Yeah, it should be able to boot Haiku installed to the MBR[20:47:17] <Luko> and boot sequence i dont have set (UEFI first, Legacy first, only uefi), this i have disabled[20:47:37] <Luko> better will be use extra disk[20:47:47] <puckipedia> Doesn't matter[20:48:00] <Luko> with MBR parti scheme[20:48:20] *** Ptrus has quit IRC[20:48:55] <Luko> hey and i want ask but i dont know where. ATi Radeon cards are suported , and how AMD APUs?[20:49:11] *** Ptrus has joined #haiku[20:49:20] *** poxip has quit IRC[20:49:21] <Luko> i see one line in haiku source[20:49:21] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[20:49:40] <Luko> about added APU id[20:50:04] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[20:50:23] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[20:50:23] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[20:55:08] *** JoFo has quit IRC[20:55:27] *** AlienSoldier has joined #haiku[20:58:36] <ddavid123> Intel HD audio is not working on my HP G71-34CL notebook.[20:58:45] <ddavid123> known issue>[20:58:49] <ddavid123> ?[21:00:23] <Diver> ddavid123: check HDA component in Trac https://dev.haiku-os.org/query?status=!closed&component=Drivers%2FAudio%2FHDA[21:03:03] *** secris has quit IRC[21:04:26] <irker-600> haiku.master: jscipione * hrev46926 [9 commits] http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=e9a0833+%5E8b804bc[21:04:26] <irker-600> a3dc72e: ScreenSaverSettings: Silly indentiation fix[21:04:27] <irker-600> 6d55c2c: ScreenSaver: check function return values for success[21:04:27] <irker-600> 4116ae4: ScreenSaverSettings: check find_directory return value[21:04:28] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[21:04:28] <irker-600> d960838: ScreenSaverRunner: clarify some comments[21:04:28] <irker-600> 84466ce: ScreenSaverRunner: check return value of methods[21:04:28] <irker-600> 06f133c: ScreenSaverRunner: treat load_add_on return value like an image_id[21:04:29] <irker-600> 94f8ac8: ScreenSaverRunner: print errors to stderr instead of stdout.[21:04:30] <irker-600> 9d312ae: ScreenSaverSettings: Check that name is valid[21:04:30] <irker-600> e9a0833: ScreenSaverRunner: Fix segmentation fault loading bad screen saver.[21:04:31] <irker-600> ...[21:05:21] *** Vidiot_X has joined #haiku[21:05:24] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[21:09:35] *** tgkokk has quit IRC[21:09:46] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[21:10:09] *** Styrbjorn has joined #haiku[21:11:51] *** DaaT has joined #haiku[21:12:20] <DaaT> evening[21:13:06] <ddavid123> Diver: I left a coment in that ticket. Thanks![21:13:37] <Diver> ddavid123: so did it work for you in A4.1?[21:14:05] <ddavid123> if my memory serves me correctly, yes[21:14:13] <ddavid123> i believe so[21:14:31] *** valeriusL has quit IRC[21:14:36] <ddavid123> becaue I remember watching youtube videos with ubertuber with sound![21:14:46] <Diver> you could try to extract hda driver then[21:15:00] <ddavid123> extract?[21:15:29] <Diver> i mean use the one from A4 if it works[21:15:29] <ddavid123> from hpkg file?[21:15:56] <ddavid123> i would have to redownload ir[21:15:57] <ddavid123> it[21:16:19] <Diver> you'll have to blacklist the one from haiku*.hpkg then[21:16:47] <ddavid123> Would I put it in /boot/system/non-package or /home/config/non-package[21:17:00] <Diver> doesn't matter[21:17:09] <ddavid123> yea, /system is read only[21:17:13] <Anarchos> ddavid123 personnally, i prefer /home/config/non-package[21:17:19] <ddavid123> Me too[21:17:26] <Anarchos> ddavid123 it reminds me the good old /home/config/ folder[21:17:27] <Diver> yup[21:17:47] <ddavid123> Don't get me started! lol[21:18:49] <ddavid123> Could haikudepot be configured to copy the hpkg files to /home/config instead of /system?[21:19:19] <ddavid123> That way when you reinstall the os your apps are still there[21:19:33] <ddavid123> when installing I mean[21:20:28] *** navneet has joined #haiku[21:21:30] <puckipedia> You can just copy the packages over[21:21:58] *** stargater has joined #haiku[21:23:35] <ddavid123> What happenis if there is a newer version of a package in the repo that is copies to /home/config? Would the PM know to install the new version and remove the old or would you have two version of the same package?[21:24:19] <ddavid123> one in /system and another in /home/config[21:24:43] <puckipedia> IDK[21:24:55] <puckipedia> Never actually used haikudepot[21:25:47] <umccullough> puckipedia, i've actually chainloaded haiku from ntldr :)[21:25:53] <puckipedia> umccullough: On UEFI?[21:26:00] <umccullough> no, sorry, just bios[21:26:10] <umccullough> it's also a bit messy[21:26:31] <umccullough> requires taking the bootblock from the haiku partition and saving it as a file on c:\ and then telling ntldr to boot it[21:26:39] *** Necrosan has joined #haiku[21:26:40] *** Necrosan has joined #haiku[21:26:41] *** Necrosan has joined #haiku[21:26:57] <ddavid123> Say I copied Ubertuber hpkg to /home/config and then reinstalled Haiku leaving the /home directory intact. When I reinstall Haiku and forget about Ubertuber in /home/config and install a newer verion in /system with HaikuDepot, would I have two versions installed?[21:27:10] *** valeriusL has joined #haiku[21:27:32] <umccullough> yes, but in different locations[21:27:40] <umccullough> assuming you mean /boot/home/config/packages[21:27:45] <ddavid123> yes[21:27:54] <puckipedia> You can also just reinstall the Haiku packages[21:27:59] <umccullough> just like having the same command in /boot/home/config/bin and /boot/system/bin[21:28:29] <puckipedia> mmu_man made a script for automatically updating Haiku: https://gitorious.org/haiku/haiku/source/5143323fb69e0c6e6adae3a2e67ce0720e01af56:3rdparty/mmu_man/scripts/myupdate.sh[21:29:03] <ddavid123> I have noticed that with everything installed to /system/packages every time I reinstall I must reinstall all my apps too.[21:30:34] <ddavid123> unless I move them to /home/config/packages. But if I did that over a period of time I would have a multiple of versions of the same packages and mainaining them would become tiring[21:31:01] <puckipedia> ddavid123: See the script above, it will updaet Haiku without replacing /system[21:31:30] <ddavid123> is it stable and fairly reliable?[21:32:35] *** bebop-haiku has quit IRC[21:32:55] <ddavid123> Done. Thanks for your help![21:33:27] <puckipedia> ddavid123: Well, sort of[21:33:39] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[21:33:40] <puckipedia> Updating an OS while running it mostly works[21:34:09] <puckipedia> It does force you to reboot[21:34:41] *** kneekoo has quit IRC[21:35:13] <Anarchos> puckipedia we should design an OS upgradable wihtout shutdown :)[21:35:21] <puckipedia> That's almost impossible[21:35:40] <puckipedia> I would say, queue for installation on reboot[21:35:51] <puckipedia> It only takes a second to move the packages[21:35:54] <ddavid123> Nice script dude![21:36:22] <puckipedia> Tell that to mmu_man![21:37:17] <ddavid123> Nice updater untill PM can do it[21:37:20] <ddavid123> I noticed on my System 76 Sable Complete it only takes 5 seconds to install[21:37:20] <ddavid123> haiku[21:37:21] <ddavid123> On a virtualbox install at that[21:39:53] *** Luko has quit IRC[21:40:38] *** nathanhi has quit IRC[21:40:45] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[21:40:57] *** stippi has quit IRC[21:41:13] *** kneekoo has joined #haiku[21:42:30] <ddavid123> The script, it only works wiith the nightlies? you could not upgrade Alpha 4.1 to latest nightly?[21:42:31] <Cian> completely different system layout amongst other reasons why not[21:42:32] <Anarchos> puckipedia almost impossible but not impossible[21:42:44] *** stippi has joined #haiku[21:42:45] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[21:42:46] <puckipedia> ddavid123: yep[21:43:11] <umccullough> Anarchos, i can think of far more important things for someone to put effort into :P[21:43:24] *** Sir_Designer has quit IRC[21:45:13] *** Guest92010 has joined #haiku[21:45:15] *** Guest92010 has quit IRC[21:45:27] <Anarchos> umccullough sure. But guys must have dreams to be truly human[21:45:53] <ddavid123> I will have to thank mmu_man for making my life easier[21:46:29] *** Not-002 has joined #haiku[21:46:29] <Not-002> [haikuports] korli pushed 1 commit to master [+2/-1/±1] https://bitbucket.org/haikuports/haikuports/commits/[21:46:32] <Not-002> [haikuports] korli 9d4da0d - gawk: added 4.1.0 recipe. * updated 3.1.8 recipe in case it's needed.[21:46:53] *** navneet has quit IRC[21:47:08] *** Guest68960 has joined #haiku[21:47:30] <irker-600> haiku.master: korli * hrev46927 [1 commit] http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=211f2ed+%5Ee9a0833[21:47:30] <irker-600> 211f2ed: Add gawk package for x86, x86_64 and x86_gcc2.[21:47:34] *** Guest68960 has quit IRC[21:47:34] *** Guest68960 has joined #haiku[21:47:50] *** Guest68960 is now known as nathanhi[21:48:02] <ddavid123> Running Haiku and listening to batman begins film score on Pandora on my roku. Life is good![21:50:47] *** axeld has quit IRC[21:51:15] *** puckipedia is now known as puckipedia|away[21:51:53] *** anurag_goel has quit IRC[21:54:15] *** Luko has joined #haiku[21:58:38] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[22:00:06] *** bbjimmy has joined #haiku[22:01:42] *** JoFo has joined #haiku[22:02:22] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[22:03:44] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[22:03:46] *** bebop-haiku has joined #haiku[22:04:41] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[22:06:30] <Paradoxon> What is faster the stl set<BMessage *> or BList with type cast for running through this list several times[22:06:33] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[22:06:33] *** ddavid123 has joined #haiku[22:07:06] *** puckipedia|away is now known as puckipedia[22:07:16] *** mareklug has joined #haiku[22:07:16] <puckipedia> Paradoxon, try the BObjectList[22:07:31] <irker-600> haiku.master: jscipione * hrev46928 [1 commit] http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=e9dcbbe+%5E211f2ed[22:07:31] <irker-600> e9dcbbe: ScreenSaver: pass in true to get a preview[22:08:00] <Paradoxon> nice a new api one?? or did i missed BeOS API?[22:09:03] <puckipedia> idk, but it is BList but with built in type safety[22:09:19] <puckipedia> You can even pass it where a BList is expected[22:10:19] <puckipedia> It´s a templated BList[22:10:47] <Paradoxon> oh nice so i dont need to rewrite my app..[22:12:21] <Paradoxon> but i figuerd out that i was using BList and set template to pass the same kind of data... so its really not consisten so it makes sens to go by BOjectList thanks..[22:12:28] <Paradoxon> the best from both worlds :-D[22:12:45] *** Vidiot_X has joined #haiku[22:13:07] *** luroh has quit IRC[22:13:54] <Skipp_OSX> BObjectList is new to Haiku[22:14:10] <Skipp_OSX> not in BeOS[22:14:54] *** anurag_goel has joined #haiku[22:15:10] <Paradoxon> just read that its from opentracker .. :)[22:15:14] <Paradoxon> so i guess so[22:15:16] <Paradoxon> but nice one[22:15:29] <Paradoxon> so it will be fast du iterate through the whole list??[22:15:39] <HAIKU-Buildbot> build #807 of x86-Linux-host is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://mmadia.dyndns.org:8010/builders/x86-Linux-host/builds/807[22:16:48] <Paradoxon> and cloning the List will copy only the list if it contains pointer else it will copy all data or? Did i missinterpreted the commentary??[22:18:07] *** fhein has quit IRC[22:18:42] <Anarchos> Paradoxon what are you writing as an app ?[22:19:25] <Paradoxon> i try to get my verry verry old map kind of "up to date" and then bring it at least to an alpha stage..[22:19:42] <Paradoxon> really old one started to write it for Zeta..[22:20:21] <Paradoxon> http://www.projectconceptor.de/ProjectConceptor-0.0.6-33-x86_gcc2.hpkg[22:20:33] *** stippi has quit IRC[22:20:37] <Paradoxon> website is only up again since 5 days or so..[22:21:00] <Paradoxon> the hpkg is just "hacked" toghere... needs a lot of polsihing..[22:21:29] <irker-600> haiku.master: korli * hrev46929 [1 commit] http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=91e3737+%5Ee9dcbbe[22:21:30] <irker-600> 91e3737: gawk: use the HaikuPorts package.[22:21:52] <Paradoxon> but if you want to try go ahead - you can also fill out some bug reports at https://code.google.com/p/projectconceptor/issues/list[22:22:00] *** idefix_xifedi has quit IRC[22:22:01] <Paradoxon> but development will be horrible slow..[22:22:22] <Paradoxon> not enought time ;-)[22:22:32] *** Styrbjorn has quit IRC[22:23:08] <Paradoxon> ok i need to sleep[22:23:09] <Paradoxon> n8[22:23:27] *** Paradoxon is now known as Paradoxon_away[22:26:18] *** kcj has quit IRC[22:30:47] *** ddavid123 has quit IRC[22:35:02] <irker-600> haiku.master: stippi * hrev46930 [1 commit] http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/log/?qt=range&q=792a46d+%5E91e3737[22:35:02] <irker-600> 792a46d: PackageInstaller: Unbreak selecting custom install folders.[22:35:47] *** mareklug has quit IRC[22:39:20] <Cian> can runConfigure take further arguments?[22:39:42] <puckipedia> yep[22:39:57] <puckipedia> Just add it to the command[22:40:17] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[22:41:54] *** idefix_gromit has left #haiku[22:54:25] *** pdziepak has quit IRC[23:00:51] <Luko> where is in haiku stored config folder ~/vim for VIM ?[23:00:52] *** comrad has quit IRC[23:02:32] <jua_> I'm not a vim user, but take a look in home/config/settings, it might be in there[23:03:23] <Luko> thx, works[23:06:57] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[23:06:58] *** anurag_goel has quit IRC[23:07:00] <puckipedia> yep it is there[23:09:05] *** NumberNoid has quit IRC[23:17:32] *** arselinux has joined #haiku[23:25:28] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[23:26:16] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[23:27:33] *** Gedrin has quit IRC[23:29:08] *** JoFo has quit IRC[23:29:55] *** JoFo has joined #haiku[23:33:08] *** pdziepak has joined #haiku[23:37:02] *** DaaT has quit IRC[23:40:43] *** Vidiot_ has joined #haiku[23:42:05] *** Vidiot_X has quit IRC[23:43:36] *** poxip has joined #haiku[23:44:37] *** daniele_athome has quit IRC[23:46:41] *** daniele_athome has joined #haiku[23:49:55] *** umccullough sets mode: +o Skipp_OSX[23:50:09] *** umccullough sets mode: +v mmu_man[23:50:11] *** puckipedia is now known as puckipedia|away[23:50:20] *** umccullough sets mode: +v jua_[23:50:58] *** umccullough sets mode: +v pdziepak[23:54:52] *** Cian has quit IRC