April 13, 2012 
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April 13, 2012 [00:03:12] *** kcj has joined #haiku[00:03:36] *** [r4] has quit IRC[00:08:32] *** Carbamide has quit IRC[00:15:48] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[00:19:45] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[00:19:45] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[00:22:10] *** bryan_w has joined #haiku[00:23:35] *** Huggy has quit IRC[00:45:29] *** aldeck has quit IRC[00:46:18] *** jayrulez has quit IRC[00:56:59] *** jayrulez has joined #haiku[00:57:41] <CIA-37> haiku.master: mmu_man * hrev44014 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=599f30f :[00:57:41] <CIA-37> Fix building the m68k kernel[00:57:41] <CIA-37> * Restructured the vm support code to align with the changes done to other archs.[00:57:41] <CIA-37> * Not completely finished, but the kernel loads and panics. I had this sitting on the disk anyway.[00:57:41] <CIA-37> * Only support 040 for now, 030 will need to be added back.[00:57:41] <CIA-37> * This commit is dedicated to Jack Tramiel who passed away away last sunday:[00:57:41] <CIA-37> http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2012/04/09/computer-legend-and-gaming-pioneer-jack-tramiel-dies-at-age-83/[01:18:07] *** MatthewH12 has quit IRC[01:19:28] *** swarfega is now known as swarfega|away[01:21:20] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[01:26:55] *** jayrulez has quit IRC[01:28:45] <CIA-37> haiku.master: mmu_man * hrev44015 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=3f551e5 :[01:28:45] <CIA-37> Expose the connected status[01:28:45] <CIA-37> * Since we won't always have a client, expose the connected status from the HWInterface to other classes.[01:28:45] <CIA-37> Currently only used to simulate DPMS state.[01:28:45] <CIA-37> * Cleanup.[01:29:56] *** jayrulez has joined #haiku[01:30:07] *** Pinaraf has quit IRC[01:32:17] *** Mrgoomba909 has joined #haiku[01:32:27] <Mrgoomba909> Hello everyone![01:32:39] <Beretta021> yo yo[01:33:40] <Mrgoomba909> Just looking for a good OS, came across haiku... And when i saw an IRC channel, I instincively joined[01:33:48] <Mrgoomba909> Haha...[01:36:00] <Skipp_OSX> this is a channel for Japanese poetry[01:36:09] <Skipp_OSX> no, I'm just messing with you :)[01:36:33] <Mrgoomba909> Haha.. For a second i actually was wondering if i was in the wrong place[01:37:00] <Skipp_OSX> although sometimes people do wander here looking for advice on how to make a haiku poem...[01:37:00] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[01:37:12] *** markos_ has quit IRC[01:37:51] *** Disreali has quit IRC[01:37:52] <Mrgoomba909> Well, it's a pretty big IRC host, this isn't thefirst time i've come across a channel hosted on freenode...[01:38:30] <Skipp_OSX> well, Haiku certainly is an OS, and we like to think that it is good[01:38:31] <Mrgoomba909> So i wouldn't be surprised in that happening[01:38:31] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[01:39:34] <Mrgoomba909> Yeah, i'm looking through the website right now[01:39:47] <Mrgoomba909> Looks pretty good to me :D[01:40:18] <Beretta021> I'm just monitoring haiku development :)[01:40:35] <Beretta021> i like it :)[01:41:27] <Mrgoomba909> Thats cool...[01:42:17] <Skipp_OSX> Mrgoomba909, well, you can download a nightly image and give a quick test run in a VM very easily[01:42:29] *** Dane_ has joined #haiku[01:42:36] <Skipp_OSX> there are even VMware images available[01:42:36] <Dane_> boink[01:42:40] <Dane_> Howdy all[01:42:44] <Skipp_OSX> he Dane_[01:42:49] <Beretta021> hm nightly :)[01:42:51] <Dane_> Hi Skipp_OSX[01:43:09] <Dane_> Hey, anyone know what it means when an app won't open because of "missing symbol"?[01:43:09] <Beretta021> o/ Dane_[01:43:14] <Dane_> Beretta021 Hey[01:43:24] <Mrgoomba909> Hello Dane_[01:43:27] <Skipp_OSX> Dane_, yes, it means that it is looking for a .so file and not finding it.[01:43:38] <Dane_> ah[01:43:39] <Dane_> ok[01:43:43] <Beretta021> lib misling probably[01:44:00] <Skipp_OSX> Dane_, can you be more specific or was that just a general question?[01:44:14] <Dane_> Skipp_OSX SoundPlay won't open on new install of Haiku[01:44:18] <Dane_> "missing symbol"[01:44:25] <Skipp_OSX> hmmm, that sounds bad[01:44:37] <Dane_> tried several different versions/installs of it[01:44:41] <Mrgoomba909> I see it says that the *minimum* memory is 128MB; would you be able to tell me how it performs with 512 MB?[01:45:01] <Beretta021> Dane_: did you tried winamp like app?[01:45:26] <Beretta021> i can't remember the name[01:45:27] <Dane_> Mrgoomba909 referring to Haiku? It should do fine[01:45:36] <Skipp_OSX> Dane_, I'll try it later on tonight and report a bug if I can't figure out the problem.[01:45:43] <Dane_> Skipp_OSX Thanks![01:45:53] <Dane_> Beretta021 The default audio player does fine[01:45:59] <Skipp_OSX> Mrgoomba909, you can do 512MB in a VM no problem[01:46:02] <Beretta021> :)[01:46:23] <Skipp_OSX> Mrgoomba909, if you are browsing the web with Web+ it is going to be a bit slow, but for basic stuff it will work[01:46:40] <Skipp_OSX> of course on real hardware it would be faster theoretically[01:46:57] <Beretta021> i tried on real hw[01:47:01] <Beretta021> it's not bad[01:47:08] * Dane_ is running on real hw here[01:47:23] <Dane_> Just testing it now so jury is still out, but so far, so good.[01:47:35] <Mrgoomba909> Real hardware will always outperform Virtual hardware[01:47:51] <Skipp_OSX> well, real hardware with 512MB of RAM might not...[01:48:11] <Skipp_OSX> considering that little RAM probably indicates a P3 era computer or worse.[01:48:17] <Beretta021> Dane_: in which way do you boot haiku?[01:48:28] <Mrgoomba909> *most of the time[01:48:40] <Dane_> Beretta021 Straight off the hard drive[01:48:40] <Mrgoomba909> Just out of curiosity-- what do you use haiku for; like on a daily basis? (if you do)?[01:48:53] <Dane_> Mrgoomba909 Pretty nearly, yes.[01:49:04] <Beretta021> i think[01:49:07] <Beretta021> bootloader[01:49:09] <Beretta021> which?[01:49:37] <Dane_> bootloader I guess...I boot right off a partition on the hard drive from cold and dark startup of computer[01:49:59] <Beretta021> ok[01:50:40] <Beretta021> misunderstand :D[01:51:19] <Beretta021> and my english on tarzan level :)[01:51:53] <Dane_> heh[01:52:21] <Mrgoomba909> So, wikipedia says that "haiku is designed to start up where BeOS left off"-- so out of curiosity-- is haiku Built off of BeOS? Or built from the ground up? (am i making sense?)[01:52:45] <scgtrp> it doesn't use any of the beos code, if that's what you're asking[01:53:39] <Skipp_OSX> Mrgoomba909, you are making sense, it is a complete rewrite minus a couple of apps that got open sourced before BeOS was sold off.[01:53:49] <Mrgoomba909> Yeah that's what i was asking...[01:54:09] <scgtrp> it's a different os that happens to look and work very similar to beos[01:54:11] <Skipp_OSX> Tracker ( the file manager ) and Deskbar ( kind of like Taskbar on Windows ) come from BeOS[01:54:21] <scgtrp> oh, really? didn't know that[01:54:42] <Skipp_OSX> yes, they were open sourced[01:55:20] *** Disreali has quit IRC[01:55:25] <Skipp_OSX> but 99% of the code is original[01:56:10] <Skipp_OSX> Charts, Clock, and a couple demo apps are also from BeOS because they were released as sample code[01:56:32] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[01:56:43] <Beretta021> i found somwhere the history od desktop develpment[01:56:55] <Beretta021> it's good[01:56:56] <DHowett> god[01:57:03] <DHowett> this makes me want to get out my R5 media[01:57:09] <DHowett> and take a trip down memory avenue.[01:58:39] <Dane_> Haiku's file system is WICKED fast![01:58:45] <Dane_> It copies files like the wind.[01:59:55] <Skipp_OSX> bbl[01:59:56] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[02:00:05] *** oco2 has quit IRC[02:01:16] <Dane_> bbl[02:01:17] *** Dane_ has quit IRC[02:03:54] *** markos_ has joined #haiku[02:13:14] *** luroh has quit IRC[02:14:04] *** Dane_ has joined #haiku[02:14:12] <Dane_> re[02:14:39] <Beretta021> wb :)[02:14:42] <Dane_> tx[02:17:30] *** P4R4N01D1 is now known as P4R4N01D[02:17:33] *** P4R4N01D has quit IRC[02:17:49] *** P4R4N01D has joined #haiku[02:25:20] *** Tzibu has quit IRC[02:25:48] *** juaa_ has joined #haiku[02:25:59] *** jua_ has quit IRC[02:27:46] *** hamishm has quit IRC[02:28:00] *** synchris has quit IRC[02:28:24] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[02:37:21] <Dane_> hmm... Tracker won't "kill"[02:39:11] *** sethman895 has quit IRC[02:39:25] *** Dane_ has quit IRC[02:43:24] <Mrgoomba909> I'll be back a bit later[02:43:37] <Mrgoomba909> Bye[02:43:44] *** Mrgoomba909 has quit IRC[02:48:26] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[02:56:46] <Xeon3D> I know the feeling :D[03:00:47] *** Disreali has quit IRC[03:11:26] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[03:15:43] *** jstressman has quit IRC[03:15:53] *** Disreali has quit IRC[03:16:03] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[03:16:06] *** falktx_ has quit IRC[03:21:10] *** Disreali has quit IRC[03:21:23] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[03:25:42] *** dr_evil_ has quit IRC[03:25:43] *** Disreali has quit IRC[03:25:54] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[03:27:35] *** dr_evil has joined #haiku[03:30:39] *** Disreali has quit IRC[03:30:52] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[03:34:48] <dreamed> http://uploads.neatorama.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/nickleback-500x243.jpg[03:36:02] *** jstressman has joined #haiku[03:37:15] <Disreali> dreamed: lol[03:38:24] <dreamed> I was amused.[04:04:27] *** Premislaus has quit IRC[04:17:50] *** bbjimmy has joined #haiku[04:25:59] *** ubuntu-test has quit IRC[04:27:02] *** Disreali has quit IRC[04:35:33] *** jprostko has quit IRC[04:37:58] *** synchris has joined #haiku[04:38:01] *** synchris has joined #haiku[04:40:19] *** bbjimmy has quit IRC[04:44:02] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[04:48:21] *** mpartipilo has joined #haiku[04:49:28] *** jprostko has joined #haiku[05:07:54] *** Advant has quit IRC[05:14:21] *** sethman895 has joined #haiku[05:15:12] <CIA-37> haiku.master: jscipione * hrev44016 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=766c289 : (log message trimmed)[05:15:12] <CIA-37> Put the InfoView in the main OpenGLView. [2 commits][05:15:12] <CIA-37> Take the InfoView out of the tabView and put it above the tabView[05:15:12] <CIA-37> in the OpenGLView. Change the format to a slightly altered version[05:15:12] <CIA-37> from what kallisti5 recommended. The width and height of the tabView[05:15:13] <CIA-37> are controlled by M's so if you change your font size it will fit[05:15:14] <CIA-37> accordingly. Therefore the window dimensions are sane defaults yet[06:01:49] *** jrabbit has quit IRC[06:03:21] *** sethman895 has quit IRC[06:11:39] *** papasmurf has quit IRC[06:20:02] *** jrabbit has joined #haiku[06:24:54] *** bryan_w has quit IRC[07:05:45] *** [r4] has joined #haiku[07:28:25] *** adamk_ has quit IRC[07:33:45] *** jprostko has quit IRC[07:50:14] *** duvjones has joined #haiku[08:01:59] *** ashish__ has joined #haiku[08:02:54] *** markos_ has quit IRC[08:05:42] *** Tzibu has joined #haiku[08:14:21] *** Smartnow has quit IRC[08:25:19] *** jayrulez has quit IRC[08:43:43] *** P4R4N01D has quit IRC[08:44:13] *** scgtrp has quit IRC[08:44:53] *** scgtrp has joined #haiku[09:02:27] *** markos_ has joined #haiku[09:03:50] *** adev has joined #haiku[09:04:22] <arfonzo> SMCollins: I've managed to compile qupzilla 1.2.0[09:04:52] <arfonzo> it runs, but laughably. :([09:09:13] *** swarfega|away is now known as swarfega[09:19:49] *** Cobi has quit IRC[09:21:03] *** arfonzo has quit IRC[09:23:32] *** arfonzo has joined #haiku[09:28:34] *** P4R4N01D has joined #haiku[09:29:31] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[09:38:37] *** J-Ho has joined #haiku[09:49:07] *** P4R4N01D1 has joined #haiku[09:49:18] *** P4R4N01D has quit IRC[09:51:16] <CIA-37> haiku.master: jscipione * hrev44017 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=7e76e3c : (log message trimmed)[09:51:16] <CIA-37> Nip this M thing in the bud.[09:51:16] <CIA-37> Multiply StringWidth("M") * the number of M's needed and then[09:51:16] <CIA-37> tweak to get it to fit well at different font sizes. Turns out[09:51:16] <CIA-37> it fits the same most of the time. Tested at font size 12pt, 8pt,[09:51:17] <CIA-37> and 18pt.There are issues with BStringColumn at 18pt not[09:51:18] <CIA-37> adjusting to the font size correctly but this is a different bug.[09:57:01] *** kcj has quit IRC[09:57:29] *** Cobi has joined #haiku[10:04:22] *** P4R4N01D1 has quit IRC[10:27:34] *** bjw has quit IRC[10:28:05] *** tqh has joined #haiku[10:32:20] *** P4R4N01D has joined #haiku[10:36:12] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[10:36:51] *** tqh has quit IRC[10:37:20] *** tqh has joined #haiku[10:44:47] *** P4R4N01D has quit IRC[10:46:06] *** tqh has quit IRC[10:47:42] *** [r4] has quit IRC[10:49:52] <CIA-37> haiku.master: jscipione * hrev44018 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=a32d58a :[10:49:52] <CIA-37> Update the layout of 3drendering a bit.[10:49:52] <CIA-37> Butt the capabilities and extensions views right up against[10:49:52] <CIA-37> the edges of the tab view. This gives a bit more room for the[10:49:52] <CIA-37> columns inside.[10:49:59] *** Huggy has joined #haiku[10:56:49] *** ashish__ has quit IRC[11:18:09] *** hamishm has joined #haiku[11:19:42] *** adamk_ has joined #haiku[11:42:06] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[11:43:11] *** P4R4N01D has joined #haiku[11:45:42] *** nsuperbus has quit IRC[11:47:42] *** mmadia has quit IRC[11:49:08] *** js has quit IRC[11:49:12] *** js has joined #haiku[11:51:55] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[12:07:56] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[12:15:46] *** falktx has joined #haiku[12:19:07] *** _marc` has quit IRC[12:27:47] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[12:34:20] *** Smartnow has joined #haiku[12:56:43] *** mpartipilo has quit IRC[13:09:43] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[13:16:30] *** falktx has quit IRC[13:40:28] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[13:45:37] *** tqh has joined #haiku[13:45:51] *** tqh has quit IRC[13:51:41] *** PasNox has quit IRC[14:03:32] *** papasmurf has joined #haiku[14:05:54] *** geist has quit IRC[14:10:08] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[14:25:37] *** synchris has quit IRC[14:26:49] *** Advant has joined #haiku[14:26:49] *** Advant has joined #haiku[14:36:16] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[14:36:20] *** Forca has joined #haiku[14:42:54] *** Megaf_ has joined #haiku[14:43:01] *** Megaf_ has joined #haiku[14:44:17] *** Premislaus has joined #haiku[14:44:21] *** markos_ has quit IRC[14:45:59] *** Megaf has quit IRC[14:55:48] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[14:56:49] *** Megaf__ has joined #haiku[14:56:54] *** Megaf_ has quit IRC[14:57:38] *** Anarchos has joined #haiku[14:58:47] *** markos_ has joined #haiku[14:59:34] <Anarchos> how to launch the tests during the build ?[15:00:22] *** synchris has joined #haiku[15:00:22] *** synchris has joined #haiku[15:12:10] *** falktx has joined #haiku[15:13:02] *** negusnyul has joined #haiku[15:30:56] *** Megaf__ is now known as Megaf[15:31:18] <Premislaus> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSZKqI_bbzI&feature=related :)[15:34:49] *** unthdarr has joined #haiku[15:35:41] *** Luko has joined #haiku[15:37:10] <Anarchos> Premislaus: i can not see youtube at work :([15:37:31] <Premislaus> Anarchos: Ennio Morricone - Best of Dollars Music[15:45:15] <Luko> hi[15:46:18] <Premislaus> hi[15:47:01] *** reavengrey has joined #haiku[15:47:21] <reavengrey> Hi,[15:47:34] <reavengrey> Can I compile a linux app from source[15:47:39] <reavengrey> and have it run under haiku?[15:48:07] <reavengrey> For example, if I build the appropriate libs, etc and I try to build the main app, will it run after being built?[15:48:31] <reavengrey> Please answer at your own pace :)[15:49:03] <hamishm> sure[15:49:15] <hamishm> it's the 'build the appropriate libs' part that might get tricky[15:49:22] <Premislaus> Luko: As there computer case? I do not know if it is good in English...[15:49:29] <reavengrey> Ah, I see what you're saying then[15:49:34] <reavengrey> Thanks all :)[15:49:42] <hamishm> depending on the dependencies of the app, you might need to do some porting work[15:50:14] <reavengrey> But if say, an app only uses POSIX api calls, or some standard/common libs like OpenGL, etc[15:50:25] <reavengrey> Base APIs, nothing like GNOME dependencies[15:50:30] <reavengrey> It should be ok?[15:51:17] <arfonzo> yes reavengrey[15:51:18] <hamishm> yup[15:51:20] <Anarchos> reavengrey: you have to compile it on haiku but yes[15:51:30] <reavengrey> K, right thanks then :)[15:51:56] <arfonzo> you can ask here for help reavengrey, I've found a lot of help to compile stuff here when I run into troubles.[15:52:07] <reavengrey> Ah, even better :>[15:52:19] <Premislaus> reavengrey http://translate.google.pl/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=pl&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fhaiku-os.pl%2Fnode%2F1380%23comment-3771[15:52:33] <reavengrey> For now I'm just looking into haiku though, haven't even installed it yet -- checking it out :)[15:53:14] <arfonzo> sure, I would reccommend trying it in a VM before committing a physical machine to it--that's just my opinion, tho.[15:53:29] <reavengrey> *nod*, thanks :O[15:54:08] <Anarchos> arfonzo: i have a full haiku computer for years[15:54:34] <Anarchos> arfonzo: i never get big troubles, only when the file system was not mature years ago[15:54:51] <arfonzo> Anarchos: cool, are you running a nightly hrev at the moment?[15:55:52] <Anarchos> my rev dates from january i think[15:55:56] <reavengrey> Until Open Office is able to 100% produce MS Office documents with the same robustness will non-windows userspace distributions of FOSS kernels be able to call themselves completely viable work environments[15:56:00] <Anarchos> but i plan to update it this night :)[15:56:04] <reavengrey> Open Office still has a way to go[15:56:34] <reavengrey> Most people who dual boot a free OS and windows only use the windows installation for MS Office[15:56:41] <arfonzo> Anarchos: cool. You have missed a few months of nightlies that caused a lot of b+tree invalid issues, so good. :)[15:56:44] *** Carbamide has joined #haiku[15:56:56] <Anarchos> arfonzo: maybe i won't update it then :D[15:57:16] <arfonzo> Anarchos now it's fixed. I can't be 100%, but the issue is fine for me here, apparently.[15:57:30] <Anarchos> arfonzo: was axel faulty ?[15:57:46] <arfonzo> I'm not sure who or what axel is, sorry.[15:59:57] <arfonzo> reavengrey: I personally run Windows on my physical machine, and linux/unix/haiku VMs within that. Avoids the whole dual-boot issue altogether.[15:59:58] *** J-Ho has left #haiku[16:00:57] <Anarchos> arfonzo: i have dual boot win7/haiku[16:01:18] <Anarchos> arfonzo: axel Dörfler is one of the main developer of haiku[16:02:15] <arfonzo> ah, well I guess someone was "faulty", heh. From what I understand the FS did not read/write properly the nodes and it caused corruption.[16:03:03] <arfonzo> Anarchos: isn't it annoying to keep booting up different OSes and environments? How often do you do this?[16:06:36] *** markos_ has quit IRC[16:08:27] <Anarchos> arfonzo: no i have to hit space bar, or let win7 boot after 5 s[16:13:28] <Anarchos> arfonzo: you never used a boot menu ?[16:14:52] *** Luko has quit IRC[16:15:01] <arfonzo> I do, but I never dual boot. :)[16:15:12] <arfonzo> it's not the menu, it's the fact of needing to dual boot, that's annoying.[16:16:58] <Anarchos> arfonzo: ok :)[16:18:38] *** Advant has quit IRC[16:19:02] <Anarchos> arfonzo: matter of taste :)[16:20:18] <arfonzo> it certainly is.[16:20:56] <arfonzo> do you use haiku "most of the time" as your primary OS then Anarchos?[16:25:55] *** markos_ has joined #haiku[16:29:27] <Anarchos> arfonzo: yes[16:37:56] *** Anarchos has quit IRC[16:42:35] *** nantralien has joined #haiku[16:50:58] *** jayrulez has joined #haiku[16:53:54] *** falktx has quit IRC[16:58:38] *** arjen_ has joined #haiku[16:58:53] *** unthdarr has quit IRC[17:04:07] *** Cobi has quit IRC[17:29:37] *** nantralien has quit IRC[17:33:41] *** mmu has joined #haiku[17:34:49] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[17:39:55] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[17:45:16] *** falktx has joined #haiku[17:49:15] *** [JJ]Albert has joined #haiku[17:49:23] *** unthdarr has joined #haiku[17:49:55] <[JJ]Albert> Yo![17:52:39] <SMCollins> YO[17:54:29] <[JJ]Albert> Darn, bye.[17:54:30] <[JJ]Albert> :p[17:54:44] <[JJ]Albert> And also... Have an awesome stupendous time![17:54:52] <[JJ]Albert> or whatnot...[17:54:53] *** [JJ]Albert has quit IRC[17:57:26] *** abhiin1947 has joined #haiku[17:58:55] *** Forca has quit IRC[18:04:09] *** Megaf has quit IRC[18:08:49] *** pulkomandy has joined #haiku[18:08:59] *** vezhlys has joined #haiku[18:11:45] *** fhein has joined #haiku[18:17:21] *** abhiin1947 has quit IRC[18:26:12] *** Tzibu_ has joined #haiku[18:27:39] *** Tzibu has quit IRC[18:28:49] *** Luko has joined #haiku[18:33:56] *** Megaf has joined #haiku[18:40:26] *** sanketp_ has joined #haiku[18:41:29] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[18:43:55] *** Lelldorin1 has joined #haiku[18:45:53] *** Disreali has quit IRC[18:46:04] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[18:50:24] *** Disreali has quit IRC[18:50:35] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[18:50:54] *** adev has quit IRC[18:53:16] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[18:54:57] *** Disreali has quit IRC[18:55:10] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[18:55:56] *** Hubert_ has joined #haiku[18:58:04] <arfonzo> Hi all, I'm just compiled qupzilla 1.2.0, it's a hack job. If anyone wants to test it, I've posted it here: http://art.poorcoding.com/haiku the package is here: http://art.poorcoding.com/pub/code/haiku/ports/arfonzo-qupzilla-1.2.0-20120413.zip[18:59:14] *** luroh has joined #haiku[18:59:30] *** Disreali has quit IRC[18:59:43] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[19:04:34] *** Disreali has quit IRC[19:04:46] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[19:09:08] *** Disreali has quit IRC[19:09:18] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[19:12:01] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[19:14:33] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[19:16:18] <Premislaus> arfonzo a native port please[19:16:29] *** geist has joined #haiku[19:16:29] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o geist[19:18:03] <arfonzo> heh[19:18:48] *** Alam_Squeeze has quit IRC[19:20:54] <Premislaus> BTW good job ;)[19:21:53] <Premislaus> http://dooble.sourceforge.net/ another good web browser[19:22:17] *** Beretta021 has quit IRC[19:22:34] <Premislaus> designed for privacy, safe[19:22:36] *** Beretta021 has joined #haiku[19:24:12] <arfonzo> Premislaus: I don't know what a native port means, sorry. :( I'm not really a developer.[19:25:26] <Premislaus> arfonzo Did you same a port of QT? or http://qt-haiku.ru/ ??[19:25:51] <arfonzo> sorry? What do you mean?[19:27:32] <arfonzo> I did compile a qt4.8.0 package, if that's what you mean, yes. And I have compiled qupzilla against this. I should have mentioned that.[19:28:07] <Premislaus> Where did you get QT in Haiku?[19:28:20] <Premislaus> ok[19:28:20] <Premislaus> :)[19:28:23] <Hubert_> arfonzo: native=in Haiku API[19:29:35] <Luko> i will be happy when someone compile qt4 and put to some ftp to download for us (others who have problem to compile it)[19:29:51] <arfonzo> you can get my testing QT 4.8.0 here: http://art.poorcoding.com/pub/code/haiku/ports/Qt4Haiku_4.8.0_27Mar2012_min.zip[19:29:53] <Hubert_> maybe with Alpha4[19:30:03] <arfonzo> I could caution you to use the binaries from the official sites instead, guys.[19:30:16] <Luko> arfonzo, its run OK on lastest nightly builds[19:30:17] <Luko> ?[19:30:43] <Luko> when yes then lot of thanks to you[19:30:44] <Premislaus> arfonzo upload it on haikuware.com[19:31:03] <Luko> i have problem to compile of qt4 some problem to compile a webkit[19:31:23] <arfonzo> luko: i'm using it on hrev44002 here, SMCollins is using another hrev also[19:31:32] <Luko> wau.. great[19:31:35] <arfonzo> Luko: there are still QT binaries on qt-haiku.ru[19:31:45] <Luko> can i use apps from qt-haiku on this qt4 ?[19:31:48] <arfonzo> i recommend you use those, not mine. They are older but far more tested.[19:32:06] <arfonzo> Unknown, you find out and let me know, heh.[19:32:17] <Luko> problem is that qt4 from qt-haiku.ru is compiled on older nightly buidls ,there is problem with layout API[19:32:28] <arfonzo> Premislaus: I am cautious of uploading anything that might proclaim I know what I'm doing.[19:32:54] <arfonzo> Luko: I can't guarantee that is fixed, I compiled from nightly from qt-haiku.[19:33:03] <Luko> i think QT4 is good library, there is not better for easy to get on haiku alien aplications.. but i still prefer a native Haiku API like Premislaus[19:33:36] <SMCollins> everybody would prefer native applications[19:33:40] <Luko> :)[19:34:10] <arfonzo> lol, I was not going to even try to answer that request. Wish I could help, but this is about the extent of my skill, sorry.[19:34:21] <Luko> i think qt apps working on haiku better than on original linux distro with wunningkde4[19:34:41] <Luko> running kde4 *[19:35:42] <Luko> maybe someone with skill port a KOffice to Haiku[19:36:57] <SMCollins> calligra would be better[19:37:23] <arfonzo> QupZilla 1.2.0 just crashed on me. :)[19:37:37] <SMCollins> same here arfonzo, no better or worse then before though[19:37:50] <Premislaus> Qt integrates well with the appearance of Haiku, hmm, but probably making QT for Haiku is harder than learning of Haiku API?[19:37:55] <arfonzo> well, it scores 50 points or so more on html5test.com, as we saw before, so that's something, at least.[19:38:21] <arfonzo> so if anything, at least the experience, when NOT crashing, is better :)[19:38:25] <Luko> i read something about QT5 and that have new webkit2[19:38:49] <arfonzo> Luko: I am trying (poorly) to get qtwebkit 2.2.0 compiling[19:38:58] <SMCollins> as I understand it, theres much similarity between the haiku/qt api's.[19:39:05] *** Lelldorin1 has quit IRC[19:39:07] <arfonzo> webkit2, is definitely not happening soon for haiku, I don't think.[19:40:31] *** jprostko has joined #haiku[19:42:49] <arfonzo> but if someone could maybe help me with some qtwebkit / qt build stuff, I could at least get a newer qtwebkit that can be built against qupzilla in haiku, for example. Kinda shooting in the dark here.[19:43:23] <Hubert_> at this point qt 4.7.3 is sufficient for most applications[19:43:56] <Hubert_> Haiku does not have to rush to version 4.8[19:44:17] *** Disreali has quit IRC[19:44:33] <SMCollins> 4.8 would be nice becuase we can get suppot for html5 video[19:45:09] <SMCollins> and since 4.8 is already available[19:45:12] <Hubert_> but Qt 4.8 have Qt Platform Abstraction, good for ports[19:46:45] <Hubert_> important to the applications worked perfectly, the version of Qt does not interest me so much[19:46:56] <SMCollins> Hubert: well there is already a qt 4.8 port[19:47:16] <SMCollins> theres a couple of piece missing however[19:47:33] *** ziomatto has joined #haiku[19:48:59] *** arjen_ has quit IRC[19:50:37] <Hubert_> couple of piece missing = port may work unstable or incorrectly, unfortunately:/[19:50:39] *** oco2 has joined #haiku[19:51:45] <SMCollins> actually, aside from a few bugs in the qtwebkit port "on both 4.7 and 4.8 hrevs" the pieces missing are things like qtmultimedia backend etc[19:54:45] *** reavengrey has left #haiku[19:54:56] <Premislaus> http://byuu.org/articles/qt[19:56:07] <Premislaus> http://danielkitta.org/blog/2010/02/25/why-i-hate-qt/[19:59:19] <Premislaus> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOCeiAYzuo8&feature=player_embedded O.o xD hit on this summer[19:59:25] <SMCollins> most of the complaints seem to center around windows, and "bloat" which is neither here nor their, users don't care to much about bloat, as long as the application works.[20:03:54] <Premislaus> you know, some time ago I installed a program to manage my woman's phone, the program is written in the net and requires a Core 2 Duo...[20:04:31] <Premislaus> terribly slow running[20:04:43] <Premislaus> i have Athlon 64[20:05:24] *** Skipp_OSXI has joined #haiku[20:05:47] <Premislaus> why I love Haiku, because it is lightweight, optimized, native[20:05:58] <Premislaus> easy to use[20:07:32] <Luko> haiku needs apps. only how get apps is write new native or easest way is port. we can have only free source code to port.. only source is linux apps ... gtk3 is horrible C lib and QT is nice maybe slowly but easy to port.. gtk needs a X server libs[20:07:53] <Premislaus> has a great interface and usablity[20:08:32] <Luko> only gtk apps who i like is HomeBank, Pidgin AND xCHAT[20:08:49] <Premislaus> gimp is written in gtk?[20:08:54] <Luko> and libreoffice.. but libreoffice needs another item with name java[20:08:59] <Luko> i dont like gimp[20:09:02] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[20:09:13] <SMCollins> QT apps run pretty much like native apps on haiku in my experience, actually the qupzilla and arora browsers run circles around bezilla and webpositive[20:09:19] *** jprostko has quit IRC[20:09:32] <SMCollins> Libre office has huge depdency issues[20:09:41] <Luko> people dont like qt becouse have bad experience with KDE4[20:09:44] <Premislaus> wonderbrush is cool, pity that is not developed[20:09:54] <Luko> but qt is good[20:10:13] <Luko> more people dont ude KDE4 but use qtapps with anouther WM / DE[20:10:18] <Luko> use *[20:10:28] <Premislaus> Luko gtk + java, terrible performance[20:10:36] <Luko> brrr.. true[20:11:06] <SMCollins> wonderbrush is a great application[20:11:20] <Luko> it is and Pencil is too good[20:11:48] <Premislaus> sometimes I read Phoronix tests, performance differences between the environments in Linux are large[20:11:49] <Luko> app who i love in haiku is Clockwerk[20:11:53] <SMCollins> I've used it a few times, about a year ago my wife wanted to do a dinosuar train cake, but all the images we found had copyright image and the baker would print them, wonderbrush made it very easier to obscure the trade mark[20:12:06] <SMCollins> how do you use clockwerk ?[20:12:17] <Luko> only for creating simple videos[20:12:32] <Luko> but i have sometimes problem with fast play video[20:12:48] <Luko> very simply videos[20:13:57] <SMCollins> honestly, I just boot into windows and pop into adobe software to do videos, haiku tools aren't nearly ready[20:14:21] <Luko> look[20:14:22] <Luko> http://tinyurl.com/d33tbuy[20:17:11] *** ziomatto has quit IRC[20:20:18] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[20:21:10] *** dcase has joined #haiku[20:22:14] <Premislaus> BTW Windows 3.1 is now 20 years old[20:22:56] <SMCollins> I don't miss windows 3.1 even a little bit[20:23:00] <Premislaus> http://www.pcworld.com/article/253287/windows_31_twenty_years_later.html[20:23:05] <SMCollins> bsod[20:23:08] <SMCollins> not missed[20:23:40] *** synchris has quit IRC[20:28:14] <jayrulez> Syllable made an RC...[20:28:53] <SMCollins> Syllable ?[20:29:23] <jayrulez> yea, that OS[20:29:35] <SMCollins> I thought the project was pretty much dead ?[20:29:45] <jayrulez> I thought that too[20:29:50] <Premislaus> Syllable sucks, Haiku rulez! in May should be Haiku alpha 4[20:30:11] <Skipp_OSXI> haha[20:30:42] <jayrulez> It failed at boot when I installed in virtual box, though it booted from the CD[20:31:14] <jayrulez> Syllable + followers have very strong opinions of Haiku[20:31:21] <SMCollins> hey Skipp![20:31:39] <SMCollins> isn't syllable a linux kernel based os ?[20:31:51] <jayrulez> yes and no[20:32:09] <jayrulez> they have 2 versions, desktop and server, server is based on linux kernel, desktop is not[20:33:02] <SMCollins> AtheOs pretty much eh ?[20:33:28] <Premislaus> https://www.haiku-os.org/community/forum/syllable_vs_haiku#comment-19194[20:33:39] <Premislaus> https://www.haiku-os.org/community/forum/red_programming_language_haiku#comment-21960[20:33:42] <Premislaus> etc.[20:34:34] <Skipp_OSXI> Alpha4 is overdue... although there is one more patch I'd like to get in if possible beforehand[20:36:42] <SMCollins> Kallisti elevated a few tickets as blockers iirc[20:41:54] <jayrulez> I think the intention is to have Alpha4 ready for the GSOC students[20:42:10] <Luko> does alpha 4 have 3d support for radeon hd gfx?[20:42:44] <SMCollins> radeon_hd accelerated graphics are a way off[20:48:30] *** HaikuUser has joined #haiku[20:51:03] *** HaikuUser has quit IRC[20:51:59] *** falktx_ has joined #haiku[20:52:12] *** falktx has quit IRC[20:56:30] <Skipp_OSXI> Luko, kallisti5 could answer that[20:57:24] *** falktx__ has joined #haiku[20:57:25] <Skipp_OSXI> but, there is Mesa, there is Radeon 3d, and I assume that the latter uses the former[20:58:12] *** falktx_ has quit IRC[20:59:50] <Skipp_OSXI> Premislaus, interesting forum posts. I assumed that something must have been up with Syllable with Syllable Server being Linux based, but I had no idea it was that bad.[21:00:00] *** sanketp_ has quit IRC[21:00:18] *** unthdarr has quit IRC[21:01:02] <Premislaus> BTW nice music compositor http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erik_Satie#Media[21:01:02] <SMCollins> kallisti5 just started flushing out a basic ring buffer, I'd say 3d accell is a good way down the road[21:02:12] <Skipp_OSXI> listening[21:02:20] <Skipp_OSXI> and looking at http://www.ohloh.net/p/Syllable it does look pretty flat[21:03:54] <SMCollins> syllable, its pretty dead right now[21:05:31] <Skipp_OSXI> thus dies yet another BeOS replacement along with Zeta, and Blue Eyed OS[21:05:52] <SMCollins> lets not curse haiku[21:06:56] <Skipp_OSXI> on the contrary, it shows that Haiku, despite taking the more difficult and time-consuming approach has persevered where as others that took shortcuts fell down.[21:07:27] <SMCollins> this is also true[21:07:33] <jayrulez> Skipp_OSXI: I thought Syllable came from ATheos came from Amiga?[21:08:23] <Skipp_OSXI> jayrulez, well, it does, and technically it is it's own OS, but it was "inspired" by BeOS as well.[21:08:31] <juaa_> jayrulez, correct except the last part[21:08:39] <Skipp_OSXI> It used BFS I believe for instance[21:08:43] <juaa_> (AtheOS didn't come from Amiga)[21:09:04] <Skipp_OSXI> right AtheOS was an original creation of a single developer IIRC[21:09:38] <juaa_> yeah[21:09:40] <juaa_> like SkyOS[21:09:43] <juaa_> which disappeared, too[21:09:45] <Premislaus> Haiku slowly, but firmly committed to the goal.[21:09:51] <Premislaus> day-to-day[21:09:54] *** Hubert_ has quit IRC[21:10:32] <Skipp_OSXI> right, which, looking at the current rate or progress, it is amazing to me that it has come as far as it has in the time it has existed.[21:10:55] <SMCollins> skipp its already better then the beos it intended to replace[21:10:58] <Skipp_OSXI> either progress was much faster initially or my perception is skewed.[21:11:05] <Premislaus> 10 years is not enough for such a large open source project[21:11:11] <Skipp_OSXI> SMCollins, in many ways yes[21:11:30] <juaa_> it works very well for daily use, I've been using Haiku pretty much exclusively for quite a while now[21:11:36] <juaa_> (at home at least ;)[21:11:56] <jayrulez> What makes it even more amazing is the small amount of developers that work/ed on it[21:11:57] <Skipp_OSXI> Although there are a few aspects that BeOS has that Haiku doesn't, mostly old stuff though that is not relavant today.[21:12:33] <Skipp_OSXI> Floppy support, modem support, SCSI drivers, parallel printer support, that kind of thing[21:12:59] <Premislaus> Where Was Linux after 10 years? And how much they had support of volunteers and companies?[21:13:02] <SMCollins> some of that stuff isn't worth the squeeze except for nostalgic purposes[21:13:15] <Skipp_OSXI> PPC support...[21:13:49] <Skipp_OSXI> well, it is more like, if somebody with the talent and motivation comes along, great, if not, oh well.[21:14:01] <jayrulez> I only see a floppy when I'm at work[21:14:08] <juaa_> Premislaus, linux was pretty huge after 10 years already, but had lots of commercial support[21:14:15] <Premislaus> I had a whole chapter in a book on how to install Red Hat[21:14:37] <SMCollins> Skipp_OSXI: there is no point in scsi/parrellel support at all, both are very long depricated technologys[21:14:41] <Premislaus> bbl[21:14:46] <SMCollins> to edge case to bother with[21:14:54] <Skipp_OSXI> Linux was bigger in 2001 than Haiku was in 2011 for sure, because it found a niche in the server market.[21:15:10] <Skipp_OSXI> SMCollins, yup, that's true[21:15:15] <juaa_> but even now, after over 20 years and its huge number of contributors, Linux is not nearly as nice as Haiku already is as a desktop OS.. ;P[21:15:25] <Skipp_OSXI> SMCollins, well, at least as far as the SCSI support in BeOS was[21:15:43] <SMCollins> scsi = replaced with sata[21:16:01] <SMCollins> outside of some oldschool sever useage, its pretty much dead[21:16:10] <juaa_> I'd like to have a driver for my catweasel floppy controller on Haiku.. maybe they give out hardware specs, I need to ask some day.[21:16:33] <Skipp_OSXI> actually SCSI is very much used in servers today, but, still, that is belaboring the point[21:16:43] <Skipp_OSXI> There is no good reason for Haiku to have SCSI support[21:16:51] <SMCollins> exactly,[21:17:12] <Skipp_OSXI> So yeah, Haiku is pretty much a really good BeOS R6[21:17:18] <SMCollins> yep[21:17:19] <Skipp_OSXI> with some legacy dropped[21:17:34] <SMCollins> beos was all about eliminating legacy bloat[21:17:47] <Skipp_OSXI> yes and no[21:17:57] <juaa_> except a few issues, Haiku the OS itself runs mostly fine, what I need now (and work on) is more applications ;P[21:18:17] <Skipp_OSXI> yes in that it was original and had some advanced concepts at the time[21:18:41] <Skipp_OSXI> no because the UI is pretty much a copy of Windows and Mac at the time without any huge innovations[21:18:58] <Skipp_OSXI> It didn't invent any new GUI concepts really[21:19:16] <juaa_> the Interface Kit was already behind times even back then, API-wise ;P[21:19:30] <juaa_> But that can be fixed in the future.[21:19:42] <SMCollins> I'm not to worried about the gui looking similar[21:19:45] <Skipp_OSXI> juaa_, it is being fixed now :)[21:20:06] <Skipp_OSXI> The whole Layout API brings the Interface Kit forward a couple notches.[21:20:23] <SMCollins> how far off is the layout api[21:20:49] <Skipp_OSXI> SMCollins, it is pretty solid, but needs someone to polish it and make it public[21:21:02] <juaa_> definitely, and the Layout-API is pretty good, without it making interfaces wouldn't be much fun[21:21:16] *** juaa_ is now known as jua_[21:21:39] <Skipp_OSXI> make methods virtual, fix a few niggling issues, standardize which functions are public, that kind of thing[21:21:44] <jua_> Hmh, this weekend I should finally have some Haiku-time again... So I can either work on that one kernel patch or my other thing... hmm.[21:22:34] *** Pinaraf has joined #haiku[21:22:37] <Skipp_OSXI> The layout api is used in almost all Haiku original apps so, it is already very much a part of Haiku[21:23:00] *** Hubert_ has joined #haiku[21:23:29] <SMCollins> kernel patch is my vote[21:23:32] <Skipp_OSXI> and aldeck is working on adding it to Tracker[21:24:04] <jayrulez> How is the kernel?[21:24:25] <SMCollins> jayrulez: in what way do you mean ?[21:24:27] <Skipp_OSXI> I made an attempt to convert Deskbar but there were issues and I decided to shelve that project for now.[21:25:09] <jua_> Would there be an advantage to use the layout API in tracker instead of its already built-in layouting?[21:25:10] <Skipp_OSXI> The kernel is good, stable, works for the most part. Certainly there are some improvements that could be made.[21:25:28] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, well, you could do a lot more stuff much easier.[21:25:56] <Skipp_OSXI> snap to grid, different icon sizes and options, more localization stuff, etc.[21:26:13] <jua_> What I'd wish for is adding the multi-column view from Tracker and the toolbar view from Mail as standard components ;P[21:26:21] <SMCollins> snap to grid would be nice[21:26:26] <Skipp_OSXI> I mean you could do that stuff without the layout api, but it would be really tough[21:26:37] <Skipp_OSXI> with the layout api's it would be trivial[21:27:07] <Skipp_OSXI> create a new GridView, set the spacing, add the icon views to it, done.[21:27:26] <jua_> The layout API needs better docs though, e.g. I have not yet really figured out how it handles the "weighs" you can give to columns and rows.[21:27:49] <Skipp_OSXI> You want a different grid spacing? easy, you want to change the column count, easy[21:27:50] <jua_> Another thing I'm not sure is what AddGlue() does[21:28:02] <jua_> all those things are not documented ;P[21:28:17] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, add Glue() makes the elements in a group but right up next to each other[21:28:21] <Skipp_OSXI> AddGlue()[21:28:30] <Skipp_OSXI> yes, the documenation sucks[21:28:34] <jua_> hmmh[21:29:02] <Luko> SMCollins, very nice function have ReactOS. arange icons[21:29:27] <Skipp_OSXI> butt right up...[21:29:50] <Skipp_OSXI> Luko, Haiku has that too[21:29:53] *** MatthewH12 has joined #haiku[21:30:09] <Skipp_OSXI> You can arrange by name, modified date, etc.[21:30:23] <Skipp_OSXI> but you can't snap to grid right now, everything can be moved anywhere.[21:30:45] <Skipp_OSXI> it's all freeform[21:31:11] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, as far as weights goes, me neither[21:31:35] <Skipp_OSXI> I think that sets spacing on individual columns or something[21:32:17] <jua_> yeah it modifies which columns or rows get more space than others when the view is resized[21:32:35] <jua_> but the beahviour is a little weird.. in the end I just set it to 10 on some column and left others on 1, and that worked the way I wanted it to ;P[21:33:18] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, I feel you. I've done similar tricks b4, although I am really starting to get the hang of it.[21:33:52] <Skipp_OSXI> You pretty much just have to look at examples and try stuff until you figure it out since the documentation is not going to help.[21:37:23] <SMCollins> yeah, the icon bazzar gets annoying[21:38:41] <Skipp_OSXI> well, Tracker is not an original app to Haiku so that explains it's peculiarities.[21:39:26] <Skipp_OSXI> also reveals a frightening look at what the BeOS source code looked like.[21:39:29] <jua_> then again, it's one of the most solid and complete parts of Haiku ;)[21:40:06] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, well, other than the fact that it doesn't use the Layout APIs yes.[21:40:26] <Skipp_OSXI> which aldeck will hopefully rectify[21:42:08] *** Skywaker has joined #haiku[21:42:08] *** Luko has quit IRC[21:42:26] <Skipp_OSXI> At some point I'd really like to refactor Deskbar to make it faster, more reliable, and more flexible so that I can rework it to use the layout kit and add some nice features as well.[21:42:36] <Skipp_OSXI> err layout API I mean[21:42:52] *** Hubert_ has quit IRC[21:43:18] <Skipp_OSXI> I began adding scrolling support but ran into issues.[21:43:34] <jua_> after creating my first deskbar replicant I noticed that since they're add-ons, the simply take the whole deskbar down with them when they crash... I like the idea of replicants, but I'm not sure that that was a good design decision...[21:43:57] <Skipp_OSXI> I have 2 options there, add scrolling support to BMenuBar so that every app has it, or implement it just in Deskbar...[21:45:03] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, yes, but it wouldn't have to if the add-ons were put in their own threads and isolated.[21:45:30] <Skipp_OSXI> a crashing replicant would just take down the replicant, not all of Deskbar[21:45:53] <Skipp_OSXI> would be nice if someone would tackle that task.[21:46:41] <jua_> it would have to be a separate team, not just thread[21:47:26] <Skipp_OSXI> adding scrolling support to BMenuBar would be the more proper way to do it, but, involves navigating a thorny mess of backwards computability issues, where as doing it in Deskbar would involve duplicating functionality.[21:47:56] <Skipp_OSXI> backwards compatibility I mean...[21:48:32] <SMCollins> create a virtual deskbar mode[21:48:43] <Skipp_OSXI> hmmm?[21:48:58] <SMCollins> well, it'd be the old deskbar running inside the new one[21:49:19] <Skipp_OSXI> I am not sure that I follow you.[21:49:36] <SMCollins> also since every application from my observation has its info in its application signature, detection should be easy enough[21:49:59] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, why would it need to be a separate team and not just running in a different thread?[21:50:13] <SMCollins> create the new and improved deskbar, but allow the old deskbar to run inside of it and when a application with a r4 r5 signature pops up, just run it in the old deskbar[21:50:42] <Skipp_OSXI> SMCollins, you are talking about add-ons here right?[21:51:13] <SMCollins> well, i geuss you could create a add-on[21:51:20] <SMCollins> old deskbar[21:51:46] <Skipp_OSXI> SMCollins, I really don't understand what you are talking about. I can detect a signature sure, but the rest I don't understand.[21:52:48] <SMCollins> i'll catch you later on it, my heads a fuzzy mess right now[21:53:07] <Skipp_OSXI> You can run BeOS apps in the current Deskbar just fine, it handles their B_CMAP8 icons, they run in a team, they have the same app flags.[21:53:23] <jua_> Skipp_OSXI, threads of the same team live in the same address space. If one thread goes wrong, it can overwrite data of all other threads in the team. To secure a replicant from crashing the deskbar, the replicant needs to have its own address space (i.e. own team)[21:53:56] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, couldn't you isolate the address space of a thread? no?[21:54:18] <Skipp_OSXI> is a team like a UNIX process?[21:54:59] <kallisti5> SMCollins: 3drendering... it's a very long road[21:55:07] <kallisti5> *hardware 3drendering that is[21:55:28] <Skipp_OSXI> hey kallisti5[21:55:34] <kallisti5> hello, hello[21:55:39] <Skipp_OSXI> You see my latest changes to 3drendering?[21:55:44] <kallisti5> ooh. right[21:55:50] <jua_> Skipp_OSXI, then it wouldn't be a thread anymore :) and yes, "team" on Haiku is like "process" on most unixes[21:55:50] <kallisti5> it looks a little strang :)[21:56:09] <Skipp_OSXI> but but, I made it like how you said...[21:56:21] <Skipp_OSXI> with a few embellishments of my own naturally.[21:57:05] <kallisti5> SMCollins: Let me grab a screenshot[21:57:08] *** Hubert_ has joined #haiku[21:57:25] <Skipp_OSXI> jua_, okay, well, then yes, you could put add-ons in their own teams[21:57:39] <Skipp_OSXI> I guess that was not the intent of how they were designed though[21:57:57] <Skipp_OSXI> and that wouldn't work. They probably rely on the fact that they have access to the same address space as Deskbar[21:58:36] <SMCollins> kallisti5: i figured you were a good ways off, ring buffer is like step one[21:58:39] <Skipp_OSXI> but it would make it possible to load gcc2 add-ons to a gcc4 Deskbar...[21:58:40] <kallisti5> Skipp_OSXI: http://pub.haikungfu.net/screenshots/glinfo_1.png[21:58:55] <kallisti5> SMCollins: yeah.. there is all kinds of fencing I don't even understand[21:59:00] <Skipp_OSXI> kallisti5, yup, okay, what is wrong with it?[21:59:07] <kallisti5> SMCollins: a ring buffer is just easy enough to wrap my head around[21:59:14] <kallisti5> SMCollins: the Mesa -> version float is strange[21:59:37] <SMCollins> well, its a first step, plus theres all the card function to like, 3d mode clocks etc[22:00:02] <Skipp_OSXI> hmmm, the vesa version doesn't line up with GLUT API version, it does on mind[22:00:05] <Skipp_OSXI> mine[22:00:19] <Skipp_OSXI> but, I am on gcc2 so the string is different[22:00:24] <SMCollins> kallisti5: fencing ?[22:00:32] <Skipp_OSXI> I could just put those 4 in a GridView, easy fix.[22:00:55] <Skipp_OSXI> kallisti5, anything else wrong?[22:02:37] <Skipp_OSXI> I did notice that the alert dialog has it's icons way up at the top, I could make the gears match that I suppose[22:03:15] *** Megaf has quit IRC[22:06:07] *** Skywaker has quit IRC[22:10:46] <Skipp_OSXI> and stop calling me SMCollins :)[22:12:00] <Premislaus> i am back :)[22:18:14] <Skipp_OSXI> I'll tweak it some more tonight, rename it GLInfo and put it in src/tests/kits/opengl/glinfo. That should make Axel happy.[22:20:03] *** falktx__ has quit IRC[22:20:17] *** falktx__ has joined #haiku[22:23:00] *** falktx__ has quit IRC[22:23:00] <kallisti5> Skipp_OSXI:[22:23:07] <kallisti5> i'll call you what I want :P[22:23:16] <kallisti5> http://pub.haikungfu.net/screenshots/glinfo_1.png << icons in this screenshot as well[22:23:20] *** Skipp_OSXI is now known as Skipp_OSX[22:23:33] <kallisti5> Trying to get some icons for each OpenGL renderer[22:23:41] <kallisti5> white == software[22:23:42] <SMCollins> whats that 3 d icon ?[22:23:53] <kallisti5> green == nvidia[22:23:55] <kallisti5> red == radeon[22:23:58] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, yeah, I see that, I was wondering what that was...[22:24:08] <jua_> kallisti5, which multi-column view do you use there?[22:24:19] <Skipp_OSX> do those pop up that dialog with different info?[22:24:20] <kallisti5> jua_: that's Skipp_OSX 's handy work[22:24:31] <kallisti5> Skipp_OSX: just hdiv icons[22:24:36] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, Intel = blue[22:24:39] <kallisti5> oohhhh[22:24:42] <Skipp_OSX> just sayin'[22:24:42] <kallisti5> good idea[22:24:54] <kallisti5> doing that now[22:24:54] <Skipp_OSX> other than that, I like it![22:24:59] <Skipp_OSX> :)[22:25:00] * kallisti5 isn't a great artest[22:25:07] <jua_> Skipp_OSX, so then the question to you, which multi-column-view is that? ^^[22:25:08] <kallisti5> if you guys want better... go ahead :P[22:25:08] * Skipp_OSX is not[22:25:27] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, they look nice to me[22:26:41] <Skipp_OSX> I really hate Deskbar icons at 16x16 now... they look so blocky[22:27:25] <Premislaus> good news AMD cut prices - http://www.kitguru.net/components/graphic-cards/jules/amd-preps-price-cuts-as-two-tribes-go-to-war/[22:27:27] <SMCollins> I like them at this size, but the replicants just seem out of proportion[22:27:49] <jua_> something I'd like to see in Deskbar is that it'd show the full window title in a tooltip when you mouse-over the items... since I have Tracker and Pe to showing the full path in the window title[22:27:53] *** falktx__ has joined #haiku[22:28:12] <Skipp_OSX> jua_, yes, I'd like that too, it is on the list.[22:28:23] <Skipp_OSX> I am almost sure I know how to do it.[22:28:29] <SMCollins> on a 1280x1024 monitor at least http://www.youporn.com/watch/376003/only-big-cock-in-her-ass/?from=vbwn[22:28:37] <Premislaus> kallisti5: Will be very difficult to take the first 3D driver?[22:28:41] <SMCollins> wtf[22:28:44] <Skipp_OSX> I just have to figure out which menu item the mouse is over and pass that info to the menu to display to tooltip.[22:28:47] <Premislaus> hehe[22:28:51] <SMCollins> http://www.filedump.net/dumped/screenshot31334348888.png[22:28:53] <kallisti5> Premislaus: each one will be difficult[22:29:09] <Skipp_OSX> SMCollins, I am not clicking on that first link[22:29:14] <SMCollins> yes please don't[22:29:16] <Premislaus> right[22:29:17] <SMCollins> wtf[22:29:38] <kallisti5> SMCollins: o.o[22:29:56] * SMCollins is yelling at someone brb[22:30:14] <Premislaus> SMCollins: already looking[22:30:21] <kallisti5> at least #haiku is logged :P[22:30:55] <Premislaus> nice girl :)[22:31:01] <kallisti5> oyi[22:31:53] <SMCollins> jesus do I need to password lock every pc in the building[22:33:30] <SMCollins> anyways, I like skipps deskbar mods[22:33:49] <Skipp_OSX> or actually the reverse, the menu has to figure out which menu item the mouse is over and grab it's name so as to SetTooltip() since the Menu is derived from BView and thus can receive mouse events where the menu item cannot.[22:33:49] <Premislaus> SMCollins: Do you have a link to the HD version?[22:34:18] <SMCollins> I'm not even sure where that link came from[22:34:37] <SMCollins> obviously someone was searching youporn when I took off earlier[22:34:44] <Skipp_OSX> Premislaus, please don't comment on that link here, if you want to PM SMCollins fine, but not in this channel[22:34:52] <Premislaus> ok[22:35:11] <Premislaus> sorry[22:35:27] <SMCollins> sorry I didn't notice it when I pasted. I thought it had copied the link from filedump[22:38:01] *** Megaf has joined #haiku[22:39:30] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, post a screenshot of the Intel icon when you are done with it for me.[22:40:41] *** pulkomandy has quit IRC[22:41:29] <kallisti5> k[22:42:22] *** mmu has quit IRC[22:44:09] <Skipp_OSX> I'm trying to find the rgb value for the Intel logo and am having some trouble.[22:44:26] <kallisti5> http://pub.haikungfu.net/screenshots/renderericons.png[22:44:34] <kallisti5> yeah.. rgb isn't exact[22:44:51] <kallisti5> Icon-o-matic really doesn't let you enter rgb values][22:45:44] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, would cmyk work?[22:45:49] <kallisti5> nope[22:45:53] <kallisti5> no direct color values[22:46:00] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, how do you pick a color?[22:46:04] <kallisti5> wait![22:46:08] <kallisti5> you can double click on it[22:46:16] <kallisti5> ok. i can take hex color values[22:46:24] <Skipp_OSX> rgb I assume[22:46:30] <kallisti5> yeah.. or html[22:47:44] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, try #4369c3[22:48:18] <Skipp_OSX> could be slightly off but should be close enough[22:49:34] <kallisti5> eeh[22:49:38] <kallisti5> think it's ok as-is?[22:49:42] <Skipp_OSX> by html I assume you mean CSS which uses rgb[22:49:59] <kallisti5> that color is real close to desktop color[22:50:02] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, well, that's the official color more or less, just being pedantic.[22:50:23] *** Dane_ has joined #haiku[22:50:23] *** martinhpedersen has quit IRC[22:50:28] *** Dane_ is now known as Dane__[22:50:33] <Dane__> bonk[22:51:11] <Dane__> Hey, can anyone think of a reason why, after running ftpd from Terminal in Haiku, it wouldn't show up in the list of running apps in ProcessController?[22:52:17] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, use #2c00fc, that is their old color[22:52:35] <Skipp_OSX> it's a much darker blue[22:53:46] <kallisti5> Skipp_OSX: checking[22:54:34] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[22:55:11] <Dane__> Skipp_OSX SoundPlay seems like it's better with the latest build of Haiku...works for me now.[22:55:26] *** martinhpedersen has joined #haiku[22:55:27] *** duvjones has quit IRC[22:55:47] <kallisti5> Skipp_OSX: that works[22:55:55] <kallisti5> little dark.. but makes more sense[22:56:54] <jua_> SoundPlay works on Haiku? I never got it too work...[22:59:19] <Skipp_OSX> yeah, it's the old color, but whatever[22:59:32] <Skipp_OSX> still recognizable as Intel[23:00:04] <Skipp_OSX> Pentium III Intel Inside logo color[23:00:08] <mmadia> v4.7.2 (or .3?) works. Somewhere in 4.9.x, SoundPlay started using some private headers, which aren't supported in Haiku.[23:00:32] <Dane__> mmadia sounds about right[23:00:36] <Skipp_OSX> mmadia, sorry to dupe a bug, someone asked me about it and I told him I'd investigate.[23:00:53] <mmadia> no skin off my back :)[23:01:01] <Skipp_OSX> no harm done, it added some details and was closed as duplicate right away[23:01:05] <jayrulez> how do I maximize a window in haiku to use all of the screen?[23:01:23] <mmadia> and besides, sooner or later everyone will file a duplicate ticket or whatnot.[23:01:30] <Dane__> jayrulez closest you can come is the overlapping boxes button in the yellow tab[23:01:57] <Skipp_OSX> jua_, apparently you have to use an older 4.7.x version[23:01:57] <Dane__> First drag window to the upper right corner of screen, then hit the button.[23:02:03] <Carbamide> It's interesting to me how Windows and Linux users tend to use windows.[23:02:50] <Skipp_OSX> jayrulez, you don't unless the app supports that specially, like Charts, ShowImage, Web+[23:03:59] <jayrulez> Ok. I have seen, thought I was missing something[23:04:14] <Skipp_OSX> terminal too[23:04:31] <Skipp_OSX> jayrulez, no, that's how it works, if you are familiar with MacOS it works the same way.[23:04:51] <Skipp_OSX> Only in Lion was universal full screen support added.[23:05:24] <jayrulez> I've never used MacOS[23:05:46] <Skipp_OSX> jayrulez, well, that's where the Zoom button comes from[23:05:50] <kallisti5> Skipp_OSX: eeh.. the darker blue sucks as well[23:05:56] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, shoot[23:06:06] <kallisti5> I think we are just going to tell intel to change their colors ;P[23:06:16] <jayrulez> what zoom button?[23:06:24] <Dane__> Skipp_OSX And for most apps, that just stretches them into rather uselessly large blocks of mostly empty space in Lion...though it sure comes in handy for big complex programs like Logic Pro![23:06:40] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, well, they did to the Haiku desktop color background :)[23:07:17] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, old logo: http://news.softpedia.com/newsImage/Intel-Packs-40-Percent-More-Transistors-then-the-Competitors-2.jpg/[23:08:09] <CIA-37> haiku.master: kallisti5 * hrev44019 http://cgit.haiku-os.org/haiku/commit/?id=2813a3e :[23:08:09] <CIA-37> icons: Add some GL renderer icons[23:08:09] <CIA-37> * Just some examples[23:08:09] <CIA-37> * Trying to identify drivers without using[23:08:09] <CIA-37> trademarks, etc.[23:08:09] <CIA-37> * Feel free to improve if your icon-o-matic[23:08:09] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, new logo: http://ieeenano2011.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Intel-Logo.jpg[23:08:10] <CIA-37> skills are better then mine :P[23:08:36] <jua_> Hmh, especially now that I see it again, their old logo was certainly nicer than their new one.[23:08:50] <jua_> At least I like it a lot more.[23:09:47] *** Dane__ has quit IRC[23:10:39] <Skipp_OSX> jua_, they probably spend $10M on it[23:10:44] <Premislaus> nice icons :)[23:11:08] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, screenshot?[23:12:32] <Skipp_OSX> the old logo reminds me of Pentium II days, the new logo with Core Duo+[23:12:59] <jua_> yeah, maybe it's just memories.[23:13:51] *** Carbamide has quit IRC[23:14:05] <Skipp_OSX> and the Pentium IV they had some orange thing going on I never cared for.[23:14:42] <Skipp_OSX> Pentium III was green, that was okay[23:22:08] *** Megaf has quit IRC[23:26:19] <Premislaus> Is there a benchmark for Haiku?[23:26:39] <Premislaus> Because these do not work - http://haikuware.com/directory/view-details/utilities/system-system-information/bebench and http://haikuware.com/directory/view-details/utilities/system-system-information/berometer[23:28:54] <mmadia> are there tickets for those programs not working?[23:29:10] <mmadia> and does installoptionalpackage beoscompatibility help?[23:30:09] <Premislaus> I think that was the ticket, but probably closed already[23:31:34] *** mek8630 has joined #haiku[23:31:41] <Premislaus> there is http://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/5146[23:36:27] <kallisti5> Skipp_OSX: http://pub.haikufire.com/screenshots/renderericons.png[23:36:33] <kallisti5> forgot to post.. sorry :)[23:36:48] *** fhein has quit IRC[23:36:57] <Premislaus> I once wrote to the Geekbench authors, could compile your program to the new releases of Haiku. But replied me, not earned previously...[23:37:52] <mmu_man> nice ones[23:38:08] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[23:38:24] <mmu_man> kallisti5: which color would you use for WebGL ? :D[23:42:05] <Premislaus> Maroon?[23:42:37] <Premislaus> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d4/Maroon.svg/600px-Maroon.svg.png[23:42:59] <Premislaus> :>[23:46:21] <kallisti5> mmu_man: pretty simply[23:46:24] <kallisti5> *simple[23:46:37] <kallisti5> my icon-o-matic skills are a little weak[23:46:45] *** Megaf has joined #haiku[23:47:04] <kallisti5> Thought of making one for the "Legacy Software Rasterizer" with a crack in it[23:47:19] <kallisti5> but that may show my gcc2 opinion a little too much ^_^[23:48:46] <mmu_man> kallisti5: well mine aren't better but I managed to make a Links2 icon :p[23:49:18] <kallisti5> ahhh.. i noticed that one.[23:49:20] <kallisti5> nice! :)[23:49:31] <mmu_man> still some shadow issues[23:49:46] <mmu_man> Premislaus: indeed, that's almost the color of the HTML5 logo[23:50:45] *** adev has joined #haiku[23:51:06] <Premislaus> nice webgl examples - http://www.ibiblio.org/e-notes/webgl/webgl.htm[23:51:21] <Premislaus> http://www.ibiblio.org/e-notes/webgl/deflate/grasshoper.html[23:51:41] <mmu_man> hmm epiphany doesn't support WebGL :p[23:52:07] <mmu_man> hmm iceweasel neither[23:52:14] <mmu_man> I probably miss the needed libs anyway[23:52:45] <mmu_man> I installed half the nvidia driver and blacklisted it in favor of Nouveau even though it's more buggy[23:52:53] <Premislaus> just do not know why I do not have acceleration( firefox, windows, radeon hd)[23:53:26] <Skipp_OSX> kallisti5, looks nice![23:53:57] <Skipp_OSX> Premislaus, why maroon?[23:54:54] <mmu_man> I need to finish 2D stuff before anyway[23:55:08] <mmu_man> Skipp_OSX: because, http://www.w3.org/html/logo/[23:55:13] <Premislaus> I associate this color. http://pl.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Plik:WebGL_logo.png&filetimestamp=20101224113524[23:55:48] <Premislaus> I do not know if it is good written in English...[23:56:50] <Skipp_OSX> Premislaus, I have never in my life seen that logo before[23:57:12] *** mmu has joined #haiku[23:57:24] <Skipp_OSX> but, apparently it is a thing, okay maroon it is[23:58:45] <mmu> ouch, Nouveau crashed again :-[23:58:48] <Premislaus> mmu_man http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=nouveau_linux_stable&num=1[23:59:04] <mmu> *stable* ? ROTFL[23:59:30] <mmu> the publish date is wrong[23:59:40] <mmu> it can't be anything else than April, 1st