April 14, 2011 
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April 14, 2011 [00:10:17] *** impy has quit IRC[00:10:37] *** impy has joined #haiku[00:19:38] *** kirilla has joined #haiku[00:22:00] *** gabrielh has quit IRC[00:37:46] *** Geoz|lap has joined #haiku[00:40:48] *** Geoz has quit IRC[00:46:47] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[00:55:25] <CIA-81> Haiku: kirilla * r41248 /haiku/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Make IconView icon_size:able. Adapt DataTranslations. Disable DataTranslation's info button on list deselection.[00:55:46] *** freakazoid0223 has joined #haiku[01:00:17] *** peerkoel has quit IRC[01:03:34] *** plfiorini has quit IRC[01:04:34] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[01:05:08] *** peerkoel has joined #haiku[01:15:36] *** augiedoggie has joined #haiku[01:18:27] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[01:27:04] *** diver has quit IRC[01:30:51] *** cprodescu has quit IRC[01:33:28] *** DBAlex has quit IRC[01:35:42] *** Geoz|lap is now known as Geoz[01:35:43] *** Geoz has joined #haiku[01:36:05] *** Stellar has quit IRC[01:44:48] *** IIsi50MHz has joined #haiku[01:48:22] *** Will07c5 has quit IRC[01:50:05] *** fengshaun has joined #haiku[01:52:23] *** yourpalal has quit IRC[01:55:03] *** Pinaraf has quit IRC[01:55:54] *** kirilla has quit IRC[01:55:56] <stpere> haha! I brought a mango for the break today[01:56:05] <stpere> it was quite an elaborate snack :P[01:56:23] <stpere> but tomorrow, I'm considering bringing that pineapple[01:59:06] *** xspager has joined #haiku[01:59:37] *** xspager has quit IRC[02:00:05] <IIsi50MHz> lol[02:00:52] *** xspager has joined #haiku[02:01:31] *** mmadia has quit IRC[02:10:07] *** tidux has joined #haiku[02:10:26] *** xspager has quit IRC[02:12:21] <AlienSoldier> stpere not something i would bring outside the house, probably the most messy fruit to have[02:12:54] <tidux> how do you get syslog output when the monitor doesn't work?[02:13:17] <AlienSoldier> i planted one, about 17 inch now, it have a hard time, i think they need a big drought period[02:13:27] <tidux> I'm having a driver issue (identical to Ticket 7441 - listdev makes me suspect it's the same netbook model)[02:14:09] <stpere> AlienSoldier: after the 15 minutes break is over, I would almost be ready to eat it[02:14:59] <AlienSoldier> i peel them with a knife and then eat it like corn[02:15:42] <AlienSoldier> then you run after the closest guy around to clean your hand :)[02:16:02] <augiedoggie> tidux: boot with the safe video option enabled, or ssh to the machine, or enable serial debugging, or ...[02:16:40] <stpere> lol[02:16:42] <tidux> ok in that case I think I'm making my bootable media wrong[02:16:57] <stpere> AlienSoldier: now I see what you say it's messy :)[02:17:01] <tidux> because I take the anyboot image and dd it directly to /dev/sdb (my SDHC slot)[02:17:02] <stpere> why*[02:17:03] *** IIsi50MHz has quit IRC[02:17:16] <tidux> I don't get a boot menu[02:17:25] <tidux> or if I do, it goes so quickly that I can't see it[02:17:27] <augiedoggie> hold down shift before it starts[02:17:33] <tidux> THANK YOU[02:17:38] * tidux IRC hug[02:17:59] *** tidux has quit IRC[02:18:12] <stpere> augiedoggie: ooooohhh :)[02:18:39] <augiedoggie> ?[02:18:47] <augiedoggie> because of the hug?[02:19:02] <stpere> yeah, I'm silly.. sory[02:19:30] <AlienSoldier> stpere keep the kernel and plant it, aswome looking plant. you need to open it on the flat part (finally a use for flat screwdriver) and let it sit in a bit of water covered with a kleenex[02:19:57] *** IIsi50MHz has joined #haiku[02:20:06] <stpere> wait..[02:20:41] <stpere> the flat part of the kernel (the greenish leaves?)?[02:21:11] <AlienSoldier> i was refering to the mango, not the pineapple[02:21:27] <stpere> oh! right[02:21:39] <stpere> ah yes, next time I will :)[02:21:54] <AlienSoldier> i have both, pineapple and mango :) i collect tropical tree[02:22:04] <AlienSoldier> and yes i have no room left :P[02:22:15] <stpere> haha[02:22:30] <stpere> I have two "useless" rooms in my place[02:22:43] <stpere> well, atm.. some girl might move in.. so.. :P[02:38:29] <OmniMancer> :P[02:44:08] *** Geoz has quit IRC[02:47:43] *** hololeap has joined #haiku[02:49:15] *** oxoocoffee has joined #haiku[02:59:31] <AlienSoldier> anyone interested in doing a soundblaster card driver?[02:59:44] * AlienSoldier is thinking about starting a bounty[03:06:42] *** kurain has joined #haiku[03:13:49] *** cherrypie has joined #haiku[03:25:54] *** Nozy has quit IRC[04:10:43] *** yourpalal has joined #haiku[04:11:25] *** xspager has joined #haiku[04:17:22] *** trn has quit IRC[04:25:39] *** Senryu_user has joined #haiku[04:25:54] *** Senryu_user has quit IRC[04:33:52] *** asb has quit IRC[04:37:02] *** xspager has quit IRC[04:37:55] *** yourpalal has quit IRC[04:42:31] *** NeonLicht has quit IRC[04:43:29] *** NeonLicht has joined #haiku[04:52:27] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[04:53:25] *** asb has joined #haiku[04:58:31] *** Nozy has left #haiku[05:09:03] *** Stellar has joined #haiku[05:12:55] *** MAX2 has quit IRC[05:14:18] *** asantoni has joined #haiku[05:20:27] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[05:21:54] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[05:22:34] *** Will07c5 has joined #haiku[05:27:11] *** fengshaun has quit IRC[05:27:27] *** fengshaun has joined #haiku[05:29:14] *** duvjones has joined #haiku[05:32:52] *** oxoocoffee has quit IRC[05:36:21] *** kurain has quit IRC[06:04:00] *** Tilduke has quit IRC[06:04:20] *** Qoph418 has joined #haiku[06:09:49] *** sotrud_nik has joined #haiku[06:10:08] <sotrud_nik> hi[06:13:27] *** freakazoid0223 has quit IRC[06:16:04] <Qoph418> ello[06:19:29] *** Qoph418 has quit IRC[06:40:08] *** trn has joined #haiku[06:46:28] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[06:52:14] *** fengshaun has quit IRC[07:03:05] *** GeorgeZZ has joined #haiku[07:05:19] *** GeorgeZZ has left #haiku[07:29:21] *** Kernel86 has quit IRC[07:30:16] *** GeorgeZZ has joined #haiku[07:30:21] *** GeorgeZZ has left #haiku[07:31:52] *** home-alone has joined #haiku[07:32:18] *** Kernel86 has joined #haiku[07:32:35] <home-alone> hi ! can haiku be installed as only OS on a 9 year old pc...???[07:32:44] <augiedoggie> sure[07:34:15] <home-alone> is it has its boot loader ...???[07:34:36] <augiedoggie> yes, it has a basic boot manager[07:35:45] <home-alone> does grub works for it[07:36:01] <augiedoggie> you can chainload haiku from grub[07:36:24] *** asantoni has quit IRC[07:36:39] <home-alone> and one more quesiton please , what is the phlosophy/aim behind haiku OS[07:36:45] <augiedoggie> but if Haiku is your only os on the machine you'll probably want to stick to the Haiku boot mananger[07:37:19] <augiedoggie> http://haiku-os.org/about[07:37:39] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[07:38:29] <home-alone> thank you for your kind answers I really appriciate that . and i reall wish a gud luck to this OS[07:39:50] *** home-alone has quit IRC[07:40:20] *** aggabee has joined #haiku[07:41:08] *** hololeap has quit IRC[07:41:24] *** aggabee has quit IRC[07:42:41] *** kurain has joined #haiku[07:51:37] *** kPb_in_ has joined #haiku[07:54:47] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[07:54:47] *** kPb_in_ is now known as kPb_in[08:00:07] *** Tilduke has joined #haiku[08:01:31] *** IIsi50MHz has quit IRC[08:02:46] *** kPb_in_ has joined #haiku[08:05:49] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[08:05:49] *** kPb_in_ is now known as kPb_in[08:08:30] *** Nozy has quit IRC[08:46:56] *** hololeap has joined #haiku[08:52:04] *** Pinaraf has joined #haiku[08:52:18] *** Will07c5_ has joined #haiku[08:55:35] *** Will07c5 has quit IRC[09:01:51] *** P1ersson has quit IRC[09:07:03] *** DrHouse|Hyperion has quit IRC[09:07:56] *** phoudoin has joined #haiku[09:07:56] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o phoudoin[09:08:03] *** DrHouse|Hyperion has joined #haiku[09:09:06] <phoudoin> hi[09:13:21] *** phoudoin has quit IRC[09:16:01] *** phoudoin has joined #haiku[09:16:01] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o phoudoin[09:16:04] *** P1ersson has joined #haiku[09:16:13] <phoudoin> hi[09:16:35] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[09:17:10] *** Pinaraf has quit IRC[09:18:19] *** adominguez has joined #haiku[09:20:19] <kurain> hey phoudoin[09:20:36] <phoudoin> hi[09:20:55] <phoudoin> what up kurain[09:21:19] <kurain> :), just reply to your "hello"[09:22:17] <phoudoin> oh thanks[09:22:53] <kurain> you are welcome[09:24:03] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[09:25:43] <sotrud_nik> phoudoin, hi[09:28:53] <phoudoin> hi sotrud_nik[09:30:53] *** phoudoin has quit IRC[09:31:20] *** phoudoin has joined #haiku[09:31:20] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o phoudoin[09:34:01] *** phoudoin has quit IRC[09:50:43] *** P1ersson has quit IRC[09:51:06] *** P1ersson has joined #haiku[09:57:43] *** P1ersson has quit IRC[10:02:23] *** P1ersson has joined #haiku[10:06:56] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[10:08:46] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[10:09:34] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[10:10:37] *** singingBird has joined #haiku[10:12:12] *** J-Ho has joined #haiku[10:14:56] <singingBird> its really great i could install on my IBM thinkpad; just yesterday and i have got bootman also up and running ; i did not get sounds ; my ram is 256 i hope its not sufficient to run smoothly[10:17:48] *** helf has quit IRC[10:19:22] <singingBird> how to test my sound working or not[10:21:24] <HeTo> your hope isn't fulfilled since you can run smoothly on 256 MiB of RAM :-)[10:22:02] <HeTo> you could see in the Media preferences if the sound card shows up there[10:30:24] <singingBird> thanks[10:32:13] <singingBird> i am new to Haiku[10:43:12] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[10:44:55] *** deesharpe has quit IRC[10:53:23] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[10:54:32] *** AlexFera has joined #haiku[10:56:25] *** alexixor has joined #haiku[10:57:55] <alexixor> morning all[10:58:49] *** TomManAway is now known as TomMan81[11:00:36] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[11:02:52] *** alexixor has left #haiku[11:03:18] *** alexixor has joined #haiku[11:14:21] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[11:15:03] *** hololeap has quit IRC[11:15:48] *** brobostigon has joined #haiku[11:31:14] <CIA-81> wxWidgets Toolkit for Haiku: siarzhuk * r40 /wx/trunk/readme-haiku.txt: 2.8.11 -> 2.8.12[11:31:45] *** sotrud_nik has left #haiku[11:32:10] *** ukev has joined #haiku[11:32:23] *** kPb_in has joined #haiku[11:35:16] *** sotrud_nik has joined #haiku[11:37:11] *** 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#haiku[12:56:48] *** P1ersson has quit IRC[12:58:35] *** P1ersson has joined #haiku[13:01:05] *** alexixor has left #haiku[13:07:29] <CIA-81> Haiku: kirilla * r41249 /haiku/trunk/src/preferences/datatranslations/ (4 files):[13:07:29] <CIA-81> Move the info button's general informative text to the main view, and set as[13:07:29] <CIA-81> intro screen. Remove About window. Fix memory leak of config views. Replace the[13:07:29] <CIA-81> info BAlert's tab characters with a single space for more consistent spacing.[13:14:50] *** The123king has quit IRC[13:16:00] *** The123king has joined #haiku[13:29:08] *** trn has joined #haiku[13:34:27] *** sotrud_nik has left #haiku[13:41:51] *** HaikuBuntu has joined #haiku[13:45:47] *** ereslibre has joined #haiku[13:55:50] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[14:07:56] *** ereslibre has quit IRC[14:08:26] *** ereslibre has joined #haiku[14:08:30] *** ereslibre has joined #haiku[14:09:11] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[14:10:48] *** alexixor has joined #haiku[14:13:00] *** GedMurphy has joined #haiku[14:13:00] *** GedMurphy has joined #haiku[14:20:54] *** Nozy has quit IRC[14:21:27] *** tim has joined #haiku[14:21:53] <tim> hello[14:25:16] *** phoudoin has joined #haiku[14:25:16] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o phoudoin[14:25:18] <phoudoin> hi[14:25:38] *** HaikuBuntu has quit IRC[14:25:44] <tim> irc is near enough dead :/[14:26:57] *** r15h4b has joined #haiku[14:27:04] <phoudoin> tim: uh?[14:27:20] <tim> no one talking apart from you[14:27:39] *** r15h4b has quit IRC[14:27:41] <tim> what hardware is haiku compatible with[14:27:46] <phoudoin> well, sure, when nobody talk nobody... talk.[14:28:13] <phoudoin> tim: x86 pentium based PCs.[14:28:19] <tim> ive tried putting it on my netbook but stays on the load up screen[14:28:59] <OmniMancer> tim: may i respond in the form of a question?[14:29:05] <phoudoin> which load up screen : the one with the logo and icons, or the boot loader one, with textual menu?[14:29:19] <tim> logo and icons[14:30:24] <phoudoin> which icon(s) are light up when it stop moving?[14:30:33] <OmniMancer> tim: what is the exact position in universally absolute co-ordinates of every subatomic particle composing the planet earth?[14:30:43] <phoudoin> (usually it's the 3 first ones)[14:31:08] *** tim has quit IRC[14:31:30] *** escoloader has left #haiku[14:31:39] <phoudoin> OmniMancer: *universally* absolute co-ordinates is a system contested by several alien species...[14:31:46] <phoudoin> :-)[14:31:52] <OmniMancer> :P[14:32:15] <OmniMancer> I am demonstrating a question that is extremely complicated and timeconsuming to answer[14:32:28] <phoudoin> not at all[14:32:34] <phoudoin> the answer is... 42.[14:33:34] <phoudoin> It's well known now that 42 is the answer to this kind of question.[14:34:26] <phoudoin> You may dislike the answer, though, but hey, not the fault of the people answering.[14:34:48] <OmniMancer> :P[14:34:56] <OmniMancer> it is also known that this answer is not useful[14:35:47] <Teknomancer> meanwhile, in the 8th dimension OmniMancer is a frog who doesn't ask such questions but is happy waiting for the princess[14:35:52] <phoudoin> back to usual program... tim, try to reboot your netbook and keep pressed a shift key. It should present you the boot loader menu, where you could enable output syslog on screen option, which could help better to understand where it stop booting.[14:37:07] <phoudoin> OmniMancer: knowing the exact position in universally absolute co-ordinates of every subatomic particle composing the planet earth wont be more useful than 42.[14:37:32] <OmniMancer> no[14:37:46] <OmniMancer> but anyway :P[14:41:37] *** dflemstr has joined #haiku[14:42:45] <phoudoin> except for fueling an infinite improbability drive, which anyone sane will want one day to become a reality. So let's keep trying to find extremely complicated and timeconsuming answer in hope one day humanity make IID travel a reality[14:43:50] <alexixor> yo 2 all[14:44:25] <phoudoin> tim: at which icon step does it stop (looks at http://www.haiku-os.org/files/images/installation_guide/1-boot-splash.png for comparaison)?[14:44:29] <phoudoin> hi alexixor[14:45:21] <alexixor> does anybody know if beam supports IMAP folders?[14:45:35] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[14:46:34] <phoudoin> tim: did you try to follow the hints from this document: http://www.haiku-os.org/get-haiku/installation-guide ?[14:47:12] <phoudoin> tim is probably rebooting...[14:48:15] <alexixor> i get redirection error when trying to access www.haikuware.com[14:49:08] <alexixor> it works now[14:49:27] <alexixor> probably some browser cache thing[14:49:58] *** dru_ has joined #haiku[14:57:50] *** ereslibre_laptop has joined #haiku[14:58:49] *** ereslibre has quit IRC[15:01:55] *** alexixor has left #haiku[15:04:43] *** dsharpe has joined #haiku[15:09:06] *** PasNox_ has joined #haiku[15:11:19] *** PasNox_ has quit IRC[15:12:31] *** alexixor has joined #haiku[15:23:41] *** GedM has joined #haiku[15:25:45] *** cherrypie has quit IRC[15:26:36] *** GedMurphy has quit IRC[15:27:27] *** WebDawg has quit IRC[15:28:16] *** helf has joined #haiku[15:31:06] *** _marc` has quit IRC[15:34:38] *** WebDawg has joined #haiku[15:36:26] *** The123king has quit IRC[15:37:36] *** The123king has joined #haiku[15:37:39] *** Geoz has quit IRC[15:37:39] *** Geoz has joined #haiku[15:38:02] *** helf has quit IRC[15:38:48] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[15:48:05] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[15:49:36] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[15:51:32] *** negusnyul has joined #haiku[15:54:34] *** oZ] has joined #haiku[15:54:35] *** peerkoel has quit IRC[15:57:53] *** duvjones has quit IRC[16:01:07] *** kPb_in has quit IRC[16:07:44] *** peerkoel has joined #haiku[16:09:44] *** alexixor has left #haiku[16:12:48] *** kurain has quit IRC[16:16:35] *** alexixor has joined #haiku[16:16:45] *** HeTo_ has joined #haiku[16:18:54] *** kirilla has joined #haiku[16:24:14] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[16:26:20] *** kirilla has quit IRC[16:31:56] *** kurain has joined #haiku[16:33:41] *** AlexFera has joined #haiku[16:34:05] *** impy has quit IRC[16:34:57] *** impy has joined #haiku[16:36:22] *** HeTo_ has quit IRC[16:37:59] *** fleximus has joined #haiku[16:42:39] *** brobostigon has quit IRC[16:44:37] *** Chat2825 has joined #haiku[16:45:07] <Chat2825> :)[16:45:11] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[16:45:38] *** Chat2825 is now known as T03Y[16:46:12] <T03Y> :)[16:49:41] *** T03Y has quit IRC[16:56:06] *** elliottcable is now known as ec|detached[17:00:03] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[17:04:23] *** duvjones has joined #haiku[17:04:37] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[17:07:01] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[17:12:28] *** fleximus has quit IRC[17:12:55] *** oxoocoffee has joined #haiku[17:13:39] *** xliebex has joined #haiku[17:14:03] *** J-Ho has left #haiku[17:14:51] *** HeTo_ has joined #haiku[17:16:46] *** Jessica_lily has quit IRC[17:18:12] *** xliebex is now known as Jessica_Lily[17:20:10] *** lollo64it has quit IRC[17:22:37] *** _marc` has quit IRC[17:34:15] *** lollo64it has joined #haiku[17:36:07] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[17:36:22] *** Drakevr has quit IRC[17:47:06] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[17:47:31] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[17:49:39] *** _arjen_ has joined #haiku[17:51:57] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[17:52:21] *** Peterbilt has joined #haiku[17:53:29] <Peterbilt> Hello. Do you know when Alpha 3 comes out?[17:53:39] <kurain> no idea[17:55:08] <phoudoin> the joke these days is that anyone downloading a nightly is releasing his own Alpha 3 :-)[17:56:26] <phoudoin> the issue is that all people skilled enough to handle a new release are either busy IRL or involved in GSoC.[17:56:28] <phoudoin> Or both.[17:56:44] <phoudoin> Hence why we didn't yet release the Alpha3.[17:57:22] <phoudoin> But seriously, try a nighlty, it's a very stable build already.[17:57:36] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[17:59:53] <alexixor> is the mail client stable yet?[17:59:53] <kurain> great[18:06:27] *** Tilduke_ has joined #haiku[18:07:09] *** Drakevr has joined #haiku[18:07:16] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[18:07:21] <phoudoin> alexixor: I can't comment on mail in nightly as I don't use it, but indeed large changes to mail system were done recently, so some issues are possible[18:08:10] *** Tilduke has quit IRC[18:08:19] *** kurain has quit IRC[18:08:59] <phoudoin> an alternative, then, will be replacing it (mail_daemon, libmail.so, add-ons/mail_daemon/* and Mail app) with an older revision from before the redesign.[18:09:19] <alexixor> I have a 4GB gmail account with lots of "labels", folders in IMAP, and it never manages to finish[18:09:36] <alexixor> does beam support IMAP folders?[18:09:48] <phoudoin> with old mail kit or new one?[18:09:57] <alexixor> new[18:12:05] <phoudoin> Can't say, really. If Beam rely on mail kit, it could with all issues still pending with the IMAP protocol add-on, if it rely on his own mail system, dunno.[18:19:28] *** oxoocoffee has quit IRC[18:19:46] <alexixor> I also have this infuriating bug with my nic. It is a marvel yukon and it stops receiving data. there is a bug about this #4239[18:20:05] <alexixor> But sometimes I get days of uptime[18:25:06] *** lollo64it has quit IRC[18:27:25] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[18:28:42] <phoudoin> alexixor: with which Haiku revision?[18:29:58] <alexixor> a cpuple of week ago[18:30:05] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[18:30:19] <alexixor> but i see now that there are some updates from upstream bds drivers merged[18:30:26] <alexixor> *bsd[18:32:25] *** trn has quit IRC[18:32:57] *** vooshy has joined #haiku[18:32:59] *** trn has joined #haiku[18:38:21] *** alexixor has left #haiku[18:38:21] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[18:39:59] *** ziomatto has joined #haiku[18:45:17] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[18:49:09] *** IIsi50MHz has joined #haiku[18:51:15] *** _marc` has quit IRC[18:51:32] *** _marc` has joined #haiku[18:51:42] *** Disreali has joined #haiku[18:57:23] *** lollo64it has joined #haiku[19:00:51] *** ukev has quit IRC[19:01:00] *** NeonLicht has quit IRC[19:01:13] *** NeonLicht has joined #haiku[19:01:29] *** ukev has joined #haiku[19:07:22] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[19:17:17] *** ukev has quit IRC[19:17:56] *** ukev has joined #haiku[19:32:33] *** GedM has quit IRC[19:35:17] *** PasNox has quit IRC[19:35:20] *** PasNox_ has joined #haiku[19:41:52] *** Xbertl has joined #haiku[19:43:22] *** jrabbit has quit IRC[19:45:52] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[19:48:06] <CIA-81> Haiku: kirilla * r41250 /haiku/trunk/ (7 files in 4 dirs):[19:48:06] <CIA-81> Show localized app names. Show reboot count-down in bold type. Layout changes to[19:48:06] <CIA-81> support multiline strings, and for this purpose adding a BTextView derivate[19:48:06] <CIA-81> which enforces its height. (I did look at BTextView itself, but it wasn't[19:48:06] <CIA-81> obvious to me how approach it.) Making use of the IconView class.[19:51:15] <IIsi50MHz> kirilla++[20:00:11] *** Pinaraf has joined #haiku[20:06:33] *** oxoocoffee has joined #haiku[20:13:19] *** jrabbit has joined #haiku[20:16:03] *** fengshaun has joined #haiku[20:21:41] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[20:26:26] *** oxoocoffee has quit IRC[20:32:04] *** oxoocoffee has joined #haiku[20:33:49] *** adominguez has quit IRC[20:35:21] *** ana_s has joined #haiku[20:36:26] <Peterbilt> I have a question about drivers.[20:36:41] <Peterbilt> Are BSD-drivers and Linux-drivers the same?[20:37:03] *** ereslibre_laptop has quit IRC[20:37:23] <Peterbilt> I hear that BSD-drivers are modified to run on Haiku. Why not use Linux-drivers? Linux supports a lot of hardware.[20:37:33] <Peterbilt> Yes, this is a n00b-question.[20:38:36] *** [r4] has joined #haiku[20:41:41] <scgtrp> Peterbilt: different (and rapidly changing) kernel API[20:42:21] *** brechtm has joined #haiku[20:45:11] <PulkoMandy> yes, rapidly changing is the main problem[20:45:15] *** vision2 has joined #haiku[20:45:29] <PulkoMandy> linux drivers get rewritten every month, we don't want to follow that[20:45:39] <PulkoMandy> also, the code in BSDs is much more clean and easier to read[20:45:41] <Pinaraf> and licensing perhaps ?[20:45:49] <PulkoMandy> that too yes[20:46:07] <vision2> linux drivers change alot ?[20:46:10] <Pinaraf> PulkoMandy: good luck to write clean and easy to read drivers for some incredibly stupid x86 stuff....[20:46:27] <Pinaraf> vision2: the linux kernel has no stable API inside[20:46:37] <PulkoMandy> the BSD compatibility is only for network cards[20:46:43] <PulkoMandy> this is not x86 related as far as I know[20:46:57] <Pinaraf> the communication with userland is done through a stable ABI/API, but inside, for drivers, there is no compability garantee[20:46:57] <vision2> Yeah I knew they change it alot I figured they just recompiled the driver for it[20:47:13] <Pinaraf> vision2: that's for minor changes[20:47:17] <vision2> ah[20:47:28] <Pinaraf> for important changes (quite often), you must patch the driver[20:47:36] <vision2> so creating a linux drive compatability layer is dangerous[20:48:41] <Pinaraf> is almost impossible[20:52:57] <vision2> I had that feeling, so what would be better is to rip out tue useful info from the drivers and then write Haiku specific drivers ?[20:53:15] <PulkoMandy> yes, if you have time to do it[20:53:23] <PulkoMandy> and then... the linux code is usually unreadable[20:53:25] <vision2> or ability[20:53:49] <vision2> linux code is unreadable ?[20:54:14] <PulkoMandy> the code for drivers yes[20:54:22] <PulkoMandy> other parts may (or may not) be cleaner[20:55:38] <vision2> is it obscured or just poorly written ? bad coding style etc ?[20:55:56] *** Qeos has quit IRC[20:56:12] <PulkoMandy> poorly written, maybe there is too much people working on the same files[20:56:15] *** Nico-izo has joined #haiku[20:56:21] <PulkoMandy> it's usually quite hard to follow the logic[20:56:31] *** Qeos has joined #haiku[20:57:22] <Pinaraf> PulkoMandy: depends heavily on the team, yeah[20:57:31] <Pinaraf> I contributed to a linux ACPI driver[20:57:36] <Pinaraf> it is quite clean and logical[20:57:43] *** yourpalal has joined #haiku[20:57:58] <vision2> I have noticed most of the code in haiku is well written and easy to understand[20:57:59] <Pinaraf> the "framework" for ACPI/WMI drivers does work quite well... (ok, it's still ACPI behind)[20:58:31] <PulkoMandy> yes, not everything is the same :)[20:58:54] <Pinaraf> BTW, will haiku support suspend to ram one day ?[20:59:06] <PulkoMandy> patches welcome :)[20:59:23] <PulkoMandy> but I think we feel more like doing a good session management system[20:59:34] <Pinaraf> no, thanks, I don't want to be bald...[20:59:45] <PulkoMandy> as booting is quite fast anyway :)[21:00:10] <vision2> well, I think windows suspend just goes to some harddisk state IIRC[21:00:21] <Pinaraf> vision2: nop, that's hibernation[21:04:03] *** ukev has quit IRC[21:04:25] <Peterbilt> Thanks to all who answered my question about Linux drivers. But... Can you tell me why Linux drivers change all the time?[21:04:27] *** ukev has joined #haiku[21:04:46] <scgtrp> because the developers change the API often[21:05:47] <Peterbilt> why would they do that, then? Microsoft lets you use the same drivers for Vista and 7, they don't change it that often..?[21:05:58] <scgtrp> because they can[21:06:15] <scgtrp> (i don't really know)[21:06:28] <Peterbilt> You mean that changing the API often is a sleazy marketing trick or something? What's the gain?[21:06:33] <Peterbilt> oh.[21:07:19] <scgtrp> "linux 2.6.39: now with improved foobar()! you don't want your drivers using an outdated foobar(), do you? upgrade today!"[21:09:27] <phoudoin> that would be linux 2.6.39-4[21:09:42] <phoudoin> that would be linux 2.6.39.4[21:10:17] *** P1ersson has quit IRC[21:10:23] <phoudoin> and linux 2.6.39.7 will be when major drivers have upgrade.[21:10:23] <brechtm> is there a diff tool like kompare or meld for haiku?[21:10:31] <phoudoin> Yep[21:10:38] <phoudoin> wait a minute...[21:11:17] <PulkoMandy> Peterbilt: it's a state of mind[21:11:27] <phoudoin> It's called PonpokoDiff : http://code.google.com/p/ponpokodiff/[21:11:36] <PulkoMandy> linux is an os made to try things around and see if it can work[21:11:56] <PulkoMandy> it's not meant for industrial quality or consumer satisfaction[21:12:08] <PulkoMandy> so if they need to add a parameter to a method, they do it[21:12:11] <brechtm> phoudoin: thanks![21:12:21] <PulkoMandy> in windows you get a new method with "ex" appended to the name[21:12:39] <brechtm> phoudoin: is it stable?[21:12:45] <PulkoMandy> in BeOS/Haiku, people thought about it beforehand and added some slots to add methods in existing classes without breakage[21:12:57] <PulkoMandy> so we can keep comatibility while adding stuff[21:13:01] <vision2> Theres that thinking ahead thing[21:13:18] <phoudoin> brechtm: dunno. There is also another one from BeOS era, which should still work, but I fail to remember his name...[21:13:23] *** oZ] has quit IRC[21:13:40] <vision2> I view linux as a system built entirely in hindsight if what your saying is true. Whereas Windows defines the features and Haiku/Beos sort of were forward looking[21:14:21] <phoudoin> using a generic message support also help a lot.[21:14:25] <PulkoMandy> BeOS had various compatibility breakage in early versions[21:14:34] <PulkoMandy> they decided to avoid that after getting the problem :)[21:16:32] *** oZ] has joined #haiku[21:17:22] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[21:20:08] <phoudoin> brechtm: sorry, can't remember how the name of this BeOS graphical diff viewer...[21:20:08] *** dru_ has quit IRC[21:20:28] *** pulkomandy has joined #haiku[21:22:27] <brechtm> phoudoin: that's OK... I'll have a look on bebits[21:22:48] *** Peterbilt has quit IRC[21:22:52] <brechtm> but Ponpokodiff seems to do the basic job... would like it to use a monospaced font though[21:23:56] <brechtm> phoudoin: perhaps you're thinking of the one included in MoleSVN?[21:25:08] *** P1ersson has joined #haiku[21:26:28] <phoudoin> nope[21:26:30] <Pinaraf> pulkomandy: that's not really true for the windows/linux thing (I don't know the BeOS sideenough)[21:26:40] <phoudoin> in fact I didn't know there was one[21:26:56] <Pinaraf> consider windows and their... 6 NDIS version ? or is it more ?[21:27:09] <pulkomandy> yes of course, depends[21:27:14] <phoudoin> brechtm: Pe have .patch syntax highlighting, too, but it's not a side-by-side diff viewer[21:27:17] <Pinaraf> for the sake of compatibility, they have to keep several NDIS interface in the kernel[21:27:19] <pulkomandy> on windows there are dll with versionning too[21:27:20] <Pinaraf> that's a nightmare[21:27:23] <pulkomandy> for directx for example[21:27:32] <Pinaraf> while Linux folks say "ok, drop old one"[21:27:41] <pulkomandy> I didn't say the windows way is good[21:28:26] <Pinaraf> hopefully :)[21:28:31] <pulkomandy> but that's it, they keep all the versions and it's one way to stay compatible[21:28:47] <pulkomandy> linux just breaks things, so at a given point of time it is clean (hm...)[21:29:08] <pulkomandy> but a lot of embedded stuff still use 2.4 kernels because going to something more modern is too much work[21:29:22] <Pinaraf> pulkomandy: and because 2.6 got some additionnal weight[21:29:33] <Pinaraf> 2.6 can't be stripped enough to fit on a floppy disk[21:29:40] <Pinaraf> it still means something for embedded[21:29:42] <pulkomandy> who cares about floppies ? :)[21:29:55] <pulkomandy> embedded is about flash memories nowadays[21:30:01] <pulkomandy> but yes, it's also one reason[21:30:10] <Pinaraf> yeah, but the sizes are somehow similar[21:30:22] <Pinaraf> if you want a kernel + userland on a 2MB flash memory[21:30:28] <Pinaraf> better try 2.4[21:35:23] <phoudoin> that the price for having more stuffs in module, too[21:35:37] *** fengshaun has quit IRC[21:35:55] * vision2 reading about linux kernel[21:36:17] <phoudoin> weird idea ;-)[21:36:30] <vision2> definatley a disorganized from what I can see[21:36:53] <vision2> With the lack of central planning and design its easy to see how it got this way.[21:39:58] <phoudoin> on its defense, linux code is 20 years old.[21:40:46] *** yourpalal has quit IRC[21:42:35] *** yourpalal has joined #haiku[21:42:46] <vision2> Well, they should have organized it years ago, To me it looks like a exscuse. they need some leadership to clean it up and set design goals.[21:43:50] *** P1ersson has quit IRC[21:44:32] *** phoudoin has quit IRC[21:46:47] *** P1ersson has joined #haiku[21:46:57] *** diver has joined #haiku[21:47:24] <pulkomandy> they don't want it[21:47:58] <pulkomandy> it's also what's good with linux, with a very open policy, anyone can get a patch upstreamed, and there is a lot of work going on it[21:48:09] <pulkomandy> if they were too strict there would be more forks and that's all[21:52:59] *** ukev has quit IRC[21:53:30] *** dflemstr has quit IRC[21:59:27] *** AlienSoldier has joined #haiku[22:02:54] *** lollo64it has quit IRC[22:05:03] <vision2> Linux is a fork, it has zero direction and no cohesive design. thats not how you engineer good products.[22:05:36] *** oxoocoffee has quit IRC[22:06:06] *** oxoocoffee has joined #haiku[22:07:15] *** J-Ho has joined #haiku[22:10:26] *** yourpalal_ has joined #haiku[22:10:36] <oZ]> A fork?[22:10:57] *** yourpalal has quit IRC[22:16:20] *** lollo64it has joined #haiku[22:17:29] *** oZ] has quit IRC[22:21:29] *** dflemstr has joined #haiku[22:22:06] <Ingenu> .[22:22:21] *** brechtm has left #haiku[22:27:23] *** _marc` has quit IRC[22:29:06] *** fengshaun has joined #haiku[22:29:16] *** negusnyul has quit IRC[22:29:25] <vision2> maybe a spoon ?[22:30:56] *** [r4] has quit IRC[22:32:34] <CIA-81> wxWidgets Toolkit for Haiku: siarzhuk * r41 /wx/trunk/ (include/wx/haiku/font.h src/haiku/font.cpp): more adequate implementation of wxFont wrapper. Some features are still not implemented.[22:47:28] *** brianb_ has joined #haiku[22:50:03] *** brianb has quit IRC[22:50:51] *** TomMan81 is now known as TomManAway[22:54:16] *** vooshy has quit IRC[23:04:04] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[23:04:15] *** The123king has quit IRC[23:10:40] *** ziomatto has quit IRC[23:13:33] <NeonLicht> thought it was a knife.[23:18:04] <vision2> Sprok FTMFW[23:24:11] *** Xbertl has quit IRC[23:25:45] *** freakazoid0223 has joined #haiku[23:31:34] *** pulkomandy has quit IRC[23:35:34] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[23:39:26] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[23:41:26] *** backb0ne_ has joined #haiku[23:45:17] *** backb0ne has quit IRC[23:48:26] *** dsharpe is now known as deesharpe[23:50:57] *** backb0ne has joined #haiku[23:54:22] *** backb0ne_ has quit IRC[23:59:56] *** michael has joined #haiku