March 2, 2010 
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March 2, 2010 [00:01:54] *** PathagenX has joined #haiku[00:02:42] *** nickfromdc has joined #haiku[00:03:29] <PulkoMandy> no[00:03:35] <PulkoMandy> ask dancxjo for that[00:04:58] *** nickfromdc has quit IRC[00:05:24] *** OmniMancer1 has quit IRC[00:07:11] *** LinuxKeitaro has joined #haiku[00:10:03] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[00:10:44] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[00:19:50] *** Kernel86_ has joined #haiku[00:19:50] *** Kernel86 has quit IRC[00:21:31] *** ziomatto has quit IRC[00:22:43] *** cpr420 has joined #haiku[00:24:54] *** Nozy has quit IRC[00:24:54] *** Nozy1 has joined #haiku[00:27:38] *** luroh has quit IRC[00:27:43] *** Andrius has quit IRC[00:30:44] <CIA-50> augiedoggie * r613 /haikuporter/trunk/haikuporter:[00:30:44] <CIA-50> Changed the location that the licenses folder is copied to when building a package.[00:30:44] <CIA-50> Fixes automatic packaging of software like subversion which contain custom licenses.[00:31:38] *** Colin_Finck has quit IRC[00:37:00] *** MarkTraceur has joined #haiku[00:39:41] *** largo has quit IRC[00:41:32] *** m_ has joined #haiku[00:44:42] *** Nozy1 has quit IRC[00:44:58] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[00:47:31] <AlienSoldier> mmadia are you the one that run haiku inc now?[00:48:03] *** Xbertl has quit IRC[00:48:17] <mmadia> one of the people, yes.[00:49:10] <AlienSoldier> ok, will the site eventually have a fund level meter eventually?[00:49:29] <AlienSoldier> just asking as i sent the money i talked about the other day[00:49:57] <mmadia> yes, urias noticed it just before. thank you :)[00:50:18] <mmadia> i'm hoping that we'll have one, but for now i've other things to focus on.[00:50:39] <AlienSoldier> sure, in anycase that would need to be automatic i guess[00:50:56] <mmadia> in a way, i was hoping that more developers would've submitted contract proposals -- but it's been quiet so far.[00:51:51] <AlienSoldier> i guess it's easier to submit this for a whole project (like a web browser) instead of few fix there and there[00:53:11] <AlienSoldier> mmadia was the stippi fund already gathered or was it part of the new collection initiative[00:53:29] <DraX> i feel like webkit may be big shoes to follow[00:53:46] <mmadia> We were willing to pay out of pocket, if no one donated.[00:53:53] <AlienSoldier> yes, but Stippi can eat Chuck Noriss alive[00:54:24] *** largo has joined #haiku[00:54:25] *** LinuxKeitaro has quit IRC[00:55:05] <stippi> AlienSoldier: Don't make fun of Chuck! I am afraid of him. I mean it![00:55:28] <mmlr_mc> mmadia: can one get paid for already done stuff, like the udf and anyboot things?[00:55:35] <mmadia> we are also willing to consider less rigid proposals -- we're mostly concerned with purchasing development time.[00:55:47] *** michaelvo has quit IRC[00:57:01] <mmadia> mmlr_mc : i don't feel comfortable replying to that :([00:57:14] *** PacoLinux has quit IRC[00:57:43] <AlienSoldier> mmlr_mc only if you can show us you can beat Chuck Norris :P[00:58:04] <DraX> stippi: have you looked into getting the webkit layout tests running?[00:58:16] <stippi> DraX: Not yet.[00:58:19] <mmlr_mc> mmadia: the thing is, it's really hard to estimate time consumption[00:58:39] <stippi> DraX: Maxime already started work on that back then, but I haven't even read the code yet.[00:58:48] <mmlr_mc> I mean when I'm sitting down to fix or implement something then I just invest the time[00:59:07] <mmlr_mc> and then it takes as long as it takes[00:59:23] <mmlr_mc> it's rather hard for me to come up with a proposal for such a thing[00:59:54] <mmadia> yeah, that is an issue the BOD talked about ---[01:00:04] <AlienSoldier> mmlr_mc you have a netbook, i guess taking a small part liek the overlay driver that is still not working would be easier :)[01:00:11] <AlienSoldier> *like[01:00:14] <stippi> yeah, that's difficult. When I made the proposal, I've had already done significant research to have at least an idea.[01:00:31] <mmadia> how to balance a proposal of things the developer is allowed to work on and what not.[01:00:40] <stippi> I mean an idea about how much I could possibly get done in a month.[01:00:55] <mmadia> we really don't want to go in the direction of X,Y,Z must be done 100% or you won't get paid.[01:01:37] <AlienSoldier> done 100% for me is a bounty[01:01:43] <mmadia> and at the other end, we can't allow the contractor to work on anything the want (eg, translations or some non-dev task)[01:02:12] <mmlr_mc> what about just general haiku dev time?[01:02:24] <mmlr_mc> as in hunting bugs, rewriting stuff here and there[01:02:27] <mmadia> that's what we're leaning towards.[01:02:47] <mmlr_mc> the measurability is the issue I guess[01:03:27] * mmlr_mc found a bug in the mbr boot code used in the anyboot case[01:03:29] <mmadia> but one issue is being able to evaluate if the contractor is indeed putting the time in --- this is one of the reasons why the BOD wants to limit the possible contractors to developers with commit access[01:03:52] <mmlr_mc> yeah I understand that[01:04:04] <mmlr_mc> "bug hunting: ehm 5h"[01:04:19] <mmadia> this way, their work won't be hindered by needing people to commit patches and the commit list could help to evaluate the output.[01:04:59] <AlienSoldier> one thing is sure i will not give more this month :)[01:05:03] <mmadia> yeah, and for bugs that take a long time and produce little code, the contractor needs to express that situation :|[01:05:36] <mmlr_mc> that's the usual case though[01:05:52] *** LinuxKeitaro has joined #haiku[01:06:18] <mmlr_mc> at least for the harder bugs that are remaining it's often difficult/timeconsuming to find a cause[01:06:51] <mmlr_mc> I mean I've just debugged that mbr code by reading and verifying it[01:06:59] <DraX> is bug busting a desireable funded project?[01:07:23] <mmlr_mc> took me about 1.5h[01:07:26] <mmadia> definitely. we'd just need the contractor to express it in the commit message or something.[01:07:46] <DraX> FreeBSD uses a lot of annotations in commit messages for that sort of thing[01:08:49] <DraX> Sponsered by: ...[01:12:50] <saivert> time to document some PS3 hypervisor functions[01:13:04] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[01:13:43] *** Nozy has quit IRC[01:14:33] <DraX> mmadia: might be useful to have a list of possible projects that the inc would sponser[01:14:52] <DraX> mmadia: freebsd has a general purpose Idea list that it uses for SoC and for just general ideas[01:15:10] <mmadia> DraX : Haiku Development. :)[01:15:35] *** _arjen_ has quit IRC[01:15:57] <DraX> ?[01:16:20] <DraX> http://www.freebsd.org/projects/ideas/ideas.html[01:18:54] <mmadia> DraX : ehh.. since our pool of possible contractors is small, we'd rather the developer come up with possible tasks that they're motivated to do.[01:23:34] <AlienSoldier> i know it's pretty impossible to say when R1 will be there, but i wonder how much money it woul dtake to be able to give a date :)[01:24:11] <AlienSoldier> i guess with 100,000 it could be only 4 month away?[01:26:29] <AlienSoldier> perhaps a $1 challenge to all those that found BeOS interesting once could allow to reach that value.[01:27:01] *** stippi has quit IRC[01:29:12] <DraX> heh[01:30:55] <AlienSoldier> at just $1, even other OS user could give something, just to put pressure on those OS to catchup[01:31:09] <helf|laptop> :p[01:31:51] <helf|laptop> AlienSoldier, have you played Grandia II?[01:31:56] <helf|laptop> for the DC[01:32:00] <helf|laptop> I'm contemplating buying it[01:32:07] <AlienSoldier> yes, but not much[01:32:20] <helf|laptop> Like it any?[01:32:28] <AlienSoldier> at teh time i decided to put time in sky of acadia[01:32:55] <helf|laptop> I have that one[01:32:57] <AlienSoldier> it felt good, but not as impressive as Grandia 1 felt on the saturn[01:33:13] *** Barrett_ has quit IRC[01:34:11] <AlienSoldier> that is the kind of game i keep for when i am disabled :), last time i played a long game was shenmue II and i finished it because i was not able to sit (hemroid)[01:34:15] <mmadia> fwiw, with the R1Alpha1 commemorative CD's, a bit over $1,000 was raised too[01:34:42] <AlienSoldier> 1000 with just the CD, that is impressive[01:34:54] <mmadia> yeah :)[01:39:34] <AlienSoldier> helf|laptop i have very little interest for game lately (it come and go). only game i think i would walk 10 mile just to play is super meat boy, can't wait for that one[01:40:20] <DraX> mmadia: that's just 10 peple buying the $100 version when the cds weren't being made right ;)[01:43:06] *** l_n has joined #haiku[01:43:57] <l_n> mmadia: you get commit access?[01:44:10] <mmadia> yes.[01:44:31] <l_n> congrats.[01:44:38] <mmadia> DraX : iirc, it was close to 70 orders. we made $15.01 on each disc.[01:45:55] <Kokito> IIRC, last year the CD was selling at a rate of about 20/month[01:48:07] <l_n> i want to order [1-3] small mug(s).[01:48:24] <l_n> if i could get the large mug with the small mug graphic, i would be doubly happy.[01:48:25] <CIA-50> anevilyak * r35715 /haiku/trunk/src/kits/tracker/PoseView.cpp: (log message trimmed)[01:48:26] <CIA-50> Add an extra sanity check to Tracker's automatic text clipping extraction when[01:48:26] <CIA-50> drag and dropping text files: before it would blindly read the entirety of the[01:48:26] <CIA-50> file's text contents regardless of size, which probably led to more than a few[01:48:26] <CIA-50> nasty surprises when someone attempted to drag very large (i.e. multimegabyte)[01:48:26] <CIA-50> text files. We now clamp the amount of data we read to 64KB. Though it's[01:48:26] <CIA-50> debatable if this feature is at all useful, since it may potentially be better[01:48:42] <helf|laptop> AlienSoldier, yeah, same :) my inner gamer shows up in fits and spurts[01:49:01] <helf|laptop> ill go months without playing a video game then ill play through half my n64 collection in a week[01:50:24] <l_n> do any of you collect old ibm hardware?[01:50:39] <helf|laptop> what type?[01:50:47] <CIA-50> mmlr * r35716 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/AnybootImage: Add missing dependency that would cause the MBR not to be rebuilt on changes.[01:50:52] <DraX> i collect model Ms[01:50:54] <l_n> helf|laptop: System/36[01:51:04] <l_n> no terminal. one twinax cable.[01:51:05] <helf|laptop> I have two IBM Model M keyboards, two AT plug IBM XT keyboards and an original IBM XT with keyboard nad color crt and working 20mb hdd[01:51:15] <helf|laptop> nope[01:51:19] <helf|laptop> I'm mostly into 68k machines[01:51:45] <helf|laptop> Right now I've spent most of my collecting energy on my NeXT. I'm hoping to expand at some point.[01:51:59] <l_n> i don't have the extra cash for a twinax terminal, so i need to get rid of the dust collector in the garage.[01:52:13] <l_n> i also have an atari 2600 with a few games[01:52:17] <helf|laptop> how big is it and where are you? :p[01:52:17] <l_n> collecting dust.[01:52:44] <helf|laptop> I drove ~750 miles one way to pick up an IRIS 3130.. so im not afraid of trips :p[01:52:47] <l_n> helf|laptop: let me see if i can find a picture of the particular s/36 i have[01:52:50] <helf|laptop> ok[01:54:56] <AlienSoldier> i need to eventually refurbish the switchs on my 2600 and the joysticks[01:55:24] <AlienSoldier> i don't really have good game that said, only combat and pitfall i would call good[01:55:31] <helf|laptop> heh[01:55:41] <helf|laptop> I think those are the only two good games for the 2600[01:55:45] <helf|laptop> oh, and custards last stand[01:55:46] <helf|laptop> ;D[01:56:18] <helf|laptop> I wish I had more cash to blow on my vintage computer collection[01:56:28] *** OmniMancer1 has joined #haiku[01:56:44] <AlienSoldier> hehe, well there is many other good ones, frozbyte and teh one with the 2 shooting cowboy[01:56:56] <helf|laptop> I /really/ want an atari falcon, amiga 4k T, sharp x68k, symbolics XL1200[01:57:15] <helf|laptop> wasnt there a qbert for the 2600?[01:57:18] <l_n> i wish i had a symbolics or lispm myself[01:57:19] <helf|laptop> or am i thinking of the coleco?[01:57:25] <DraX> i want an amiga, and a symbolics, but i'd never actually use them[01:57:28] <DraX> so really a bad idea[01:57:31] <helf|laptop> yeah[01:57:32] <helf|laptop> pretty much[01:57:33] <helf|laptop> :p[01:57:34] <l_n> helf|laptop: yeah, i think so.[01:57:44] <AlienSoldier> what is the symbolic?[01:57:50] <l_n> helf|laptop: it's a 5363, i think.. with 5 1/4" floppy and tape drive[01:57:51] <helf|laptop> hell, I'm staring at an IRIS 3130 of which theres probably 100 left functioning that ill never use.[01:57:57] <l_n> AlienSoldier: it's a lisp machine[01:58:06] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[01:58:06] <AlienSoldier> nice[01:58:07] <l_n> everything from the proc to the os is lisp[01:58:09] <helf|laptop> but it was $50 + gas + new transmission, so worth it ;D[01:58:22] <helf|laptop> lisp machines are my most favorite computer design.[01:58:50] <helf|laptop> I have an Apple IIci that would make a good host for a MacIvory. But to set it up with that I'd have to spend about $1100 :([01:59:46] <DraX> mmm Zmacs[02:00:47] <helf|laptop> AlienSoldier, lispms are the epitomy of single user computer :p you have full access to pretty much everything at all times. you can even change system code on the fly[02:01:47] <AlienSoldier> helf|laptop have they made one on some of those FPGA board? i guess they could be very powerfull made that way[02:01:56] *** michaelvo has joined #haiku[02:02:23] <helf|laptop> no idea[02:03:48] <helf|laptop> l_n, does the s/36 work?[02:04:16] <DraX> i think one of the (many) reasons the lisp-machine died is that they found a better way to implement a tagged language without needing a cpu that supported tagged architecture[02:05:11] <helf|laptop> I wonder if current computers would be more stable if tagged arch was still in use[02:05:26] <DraX> i don't see how that would effect stability[02:05:46] <DraX> it's really just a feature for supporting dynamic languages[02:07:27] <DraX> it'd make implementing precise gc easier[02:08:34] <AlienSoldier> helf|laptop you could always get this instead of a 4000 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vn4ZzLH6MpE&feature=player_embedded[02:09:56] *** raichoo has joined #haiku[02:10:29] <Skipp_OSX> DraX knows what I think the reason they died is =][02:10:44] *** raichoo is now known as _raichoo_[02:10:51] *** _raichoo_ is now known as raichoo[02:12:08] *** oco has quit IRC[02:17:16] <Skipp_OSX> so for $150 you can have a small Amiga 500... okay, I can see it[02:17:34] <helf|laptop> AlienSoldier, forgot about those :p[02:19:19] <CIA-50> mmlr * r35717 /haiku/trunk/src/tools/anyboot/anyboot.cpp:[02:19:19] <CIA-50> Add a CHS conversion function. It is not used though as we can't generally make[02:19:19] <CIA-50> valid CHS addresses due to not knowing the geometry of the target device[02:19:19] <CIA-50> beforehand. So it's mostly just for completeness...[02:19:52] *** mmadia has quit IRC[02:20:09] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[02:22:44] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[02:22:46] *** jmelesky has quit IRC[02:24:07] *** OmniMancer1 has quit IRC[02:25:24] *** OmniMancer1 has joined #haiku[02:25:26] *** raichoo has quit IRC[02:26:00] <CIA-50> mmlr * r35718 /haiku/trunk/src/bin/writembr/mbr.S:[02:26:01] <CIA-50> * The MBR boot code did execute the check for disk extensions with the wrong[02:26:01] <CIA-50> magic code. This would lead to them not being detected on systems where the[02:26:01] <CIA-50> BIOS (rightfully) returns an error in this case. Since the CHS fallback can't[02:26:01] <CIA-50> work it would then fail with "Missing Operating System".[02:26:02] <CIA-50> * Fixed a typo, an 80 char limit violation.[02:26:02] <CIA-50> * Automatic whitespace cleanup.[02:26:31] <AlienSoldier> Skipp_OSX that new one is AGA, so it's more a 1200[02:27:06] <Skipp_OSX> AlienSoldier, ahh, uhm, forgive me but I have never used an Amiga so I have no idea what the difference is[02:27:13] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[02:27:47] <AlienSoldier> Skipp_OSX ESC is 64 color, AGA is 256, plus many other small difference[02:28:00] *** michaelvo has quit IRC[02:28:30] <AlienSoldier> the chip allowed for lot more bandwith[02:29:12] <Skipp_OSX> AlienSoldier, ahhh I see[02:30:51] <AlienSoldier> Skipp_OSX there is another amiga project called the Natami that go even over this, not recreating existing amiga but expending on the chipset[02:33:00] <Skipp_OSX> AlienSoldier, I don't understand... I never do[02:33:44] <AlienSoldier> Skipp_OSX http://www.natami.net/concept.htm[02:34:53] <Skipp_OSX> AlienSoldier, no I understand what just not way[02:34:54] <Skipp_OSX> why[02:35:20] <AlienSoldier> why they build this?[02:35:22] <Skipp_OSX> I guess people must have really loved Amiga OS[02:35:27] <AlienSoldier> yep[02:36:03] <AlienSoldier> but the amiga hardware mostly[02:36:17] <AlienSoldier> if we can separate the 2[02:36:33] <AlienSoldier> for me it always was a continum[02:37:07] *** PathagenX has quit IRC[02:37:22] <jmayfield> agnus[02:37:43] <Skipp_OSX> but the hardware is a 68k motorola chip which is common as dirt[02:37:55] *** JonathanThompson has joined #haiku[02:38:09] <jmayfield> the amiga was about the custom chipset, not the lame-o 68k cpu[02:38:11] <Skipp_OSX> along with graphics that I am sure were impressive in the 80's but today are anemic[02:38:20] * JonathanThompson poits helf|laptop[02:38:32] <helf|laptop> no shit :p[02:38:39] <Skipp_OSX> I remember playing a lot of games on my PC in the 80s on a 286 with EGA graphics[02:38:43] <helf|laptop> its been 20s[02:38:45] <Skipp_OSX> and a SOUNDBLASTER![02:38:47] <helf|laptop> :p[02:38:48] <JonathanThompson> jmayfield: for the day, the 68K CPU wasn't lame-o[02:39:09] <jmayfield> JonathanThompson, sure.. but its not what made the amiga the amiga..[02:39:14] <JonathanThompson> Sadly, Motorola didn't ramp up speeds long-term as quickly as Intel did with the x86 architecture.[02:39:21] <Skipp_OSX> at the time I didn't think it was so bad but today I could never play those games...[02:39:35] <JonathanThompson> I won't argue that one: it was all the special ASICs that made it, combined with software that used them properly.[02:39:38] <helf|laptop> they werent good games then[02:39:48] <helf|laptop> i love old games :[02:39:49] <jmayfield> the brilliance of the amiga (and c64) is what it did with piddly amounts of mhz[02:39:50] <helf|laptop> :P[02:39:54] <Skipp_OSX> So I guess I get it, but it seems you could just emulate the games[02:40:00] <JonathanThompson> Hardware without software to make good use of it = fail.[02:40:19] <Skipp_OSX> I don't really see what the rest is worth, I mean, I would say recreate the rest on something modern[02:40:26] <Skipp_OSX> but recreate what exactly? where is the charm?[02:40:27] <jmayfield> amiga without custom chipset == an atari (/me gags)[02:40:32] <JonathanThompson> Of course, the Commodore 64 disk drive was a prime example where they screwed the pooch by getting fancy.[02:40:43] <helf|laptop> the ingenuity that went into the creation of the hardware[02:41:07] <JonathanThompson> The primitive Apple 2 drive controller with the Apple DOS and then ProDOS blew away what the C64 could do with its intelligent drives.[02:41:13] *** hdanak has quit IRC[02:41:16] <Skipp_OSX> helf|laptop, well if that is the case than there is nothing to recreate because we have much less elegant, but much more powerful hardware today[02:41:18] <jmayfield> JonathanThompson, hey, the 1541 is an amazing piece of HW, if a little slow.. nothing a good cart couldnt fix[02:41:36] <JonathanThompson> All because it was more direct: it made no practical difference that the C64 drive offloaded CPU time from the main CPU, because the main CPU was I/O bound :p[02:42:06] <JonathanThompson> So there was no real disadvantage in practice with all low-level decoding done in software on the Apple 2 :p[02:42:28] <jmayfield> JonathanThompson, but.. but.. the 1541 could sing![02:42:47] <JonathanThompson> So could an Apple 2 drive with the right joke software :p[02:43:13] <JonathanThompson> At least, it did a good steam locomotive impersonation ;)[02:43:49] <Skipp_OSX> I suppose I could see having one around just to pay games[02:44:12] <Skipp_OSX> play[02:44:35] <helf|laptop> emulators are great tho[02:44:38] <jmayfield> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnMgmlKi_o[02:44:46] <helf|laptop> but i like having original hardware[02:45:33] *** Darknesss has joined #haiku[02:47:16] <Skipp_OSX> helf|laptop, that is a cool hack[02:56:48] <Skipp_OSX> okay, well, gotta go[02:57:10] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[03:00:42] *** Darknesss has quit IRC[03:01:11] *** OmniMancer1 has quit IRC[03:01:55] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[03:02:53] *** SiCuTDeUx_ has joined #haiku[03:03:52] <l_n> helf|laptop: the s/36 boots and the 7 segment display shows normal.[03:04:02] <l_n> dunno about passwords or software viability.[03:04:17] <helf|laptop> hm[03:04:41] <helf|laptop> I wonder how much it would cost to ship[03:04:47] <helf|laptop> have you asked in #classiccmp ?[03:04:52] <helf|laptop> someone in there might be closer and interested[03:05:12] <l_n> didn't know there was such a channel.[03:05:31] <l_n> the thing weighs about 100 lbs (haven't actually weighed it)[03:06:16] <helf|laptop> I'd love to add it to my collection :p where did you say you are located again?[03:06:39] <helf|laptop> ive been sitting here reading the wiki page for them. ive seen them before but never paid much attetion[03:07:11] <l_n> helf|laptop: tennesee[03:07:17] <l_n> near knoxville[03:08:49] *** PathagenX has joined #haiku[03:09:50] <helf|laptop> oh jeez, thats just 3 hours or so from me[03:09:54] <helf|laptop> I'm in gadsden[03:09:56] <helf|laptop> AL[03:11:21] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[03:13:04] <l_n> helf|laptop: 59N -> 75N it looks like[03:14:41] *** hdanak has joined #haiku[03:15:17] *** largo has quit IRC[03:19:26] <helf|laptop> l_n, its tempting, but i dunno what I'd do with it besides take it apart for fun. Tried putting it on craigslist or ebay?[03:24:09] <l_n> i've seen them on ebay parted out for ~$80/card[03:24:13] <l_n> so i may do that.[03:24:48] <helf|laptop> good lord[03:25:16] <helf|laptop> i want the cpu board[03:25:17] <helf|laptop> ;P[03:34:52] <l_n> webpositive just sent me to the debugger.[03:35:53] <l_n> malloc() error it seems..[03:36:57] <l_n> BPrivate::hoardHeap::findAvailableSuperblock ()[03:38:46] *** hoelzro has joined #haiku[03:38:53] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[03:39:38] *** aldeck has quit IRC[03:41:13] <l_n> http://cgi.ebay.com/IN-18-NIXIE-TUBES-Lot-of-6-FULLY-TESTED-NEW_W0QQitemZ290393257886QQcategoryZ4193QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp4340.m8QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DMW%26its%3DC%26itu%3DUCC%26otn%3D20%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D8199964814813108465 <-- wow. that's old.[03:41:21] <l_n> and i should've tinyurl'ed that[03:43:06] *** LeandroLuiz has quit IRC[03:43:53] *** hoelzro has quit IRC[03:45:38] *** SiCuTDeUx__ has joined #haiku[03:48:28] <saivert> l_n: nice.. but 200 V?[03:48:28] *** Advant has quit IRC[03:48:36] <saivert> you can't run them on anything less?[03:48:37] *** SiCuTDeUx_ has quit IRC[03:49:02] *** Advant has joined #haiku[03:50:17] <l_n> i just thought it was interesting that tubes are still sold.. i know nothing much more about them[03:50:23] *** SiCuTDeUx__ has quit IRC[03:52:18] <saivert> NIXIE tubes predated the 7 segment LED modules[03:52:22] <saivert> just shows a single digit[03:52:37] <saivert> the other tubes are either used as transistors or triodes[03:52:40] <l_n> oh.. they're for displaying data[03:53:48] <saivert> here is a clock using nixie tubes for display: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-84v-QVdk2k[03:53:56] <saivert> pretty awesome and old-school[03:54:16] *** PathagenX has quit IRC[03:58:30] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[04:01:34] *** largo has joined #haiku[04:02:34] *** jmayfield_ has quit IRC[04:03:44] <largo> as a side test I booted the PC-BSD 8.0 live-dvd to test the wifi... and after mucking around with the wifi for a bit got the same hard freeze.[04:04:07] <largo> which seems to reaffirm that it's the atheroswifi driver.[04:05:15] <CIA-50> scottmc * r614 /haikuports/trunk/dev-util/git/git-1.7.0.1.bep: Re-added the slashes and split the make line so that it is easier to read.[04:09:30] *** hdanak has quit IRC[04:10:07] *** PathagenX has joined #haiku[04:11:02] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[04:11:06] <Skipp_OSX> hello[04:20:22] <CIA-50> scottmc * r615 /haikuports/trunk/app-arch/zlib: Removing incorrect zlib directory[04:23:51] *** PathagenX has quit IRC[04:27:31] *** Barrett has quit IRC[04:30:25] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[04:31:26] <l_n> largo: could it be the particular card your ath chipset is in? (i.e. do you have another to test it with)[04:31:32] <l_n> Skipp_OSX: hi.[04:32:24] <helf|laptop> nixie tubes![04:32:31] <helf|laptop> nixie tubes make killer clocks[04:32:56] <largo> l_n: this is the only atheros chipset card I have... although I was considering picking up a PCIe version with a slightly newer chipset (5418 vs the 5416 in this one).[04:33:14] <largo> just to see if it made a difference.[04:33:23] *** Barrett has quit IRC[04:34:10] <largo> the only other wifi I have is a linksys USB dongle on my gf's laptop.[04:34:59] <largo> and unfortunately she's making me watch "Tooth Fairy" with her... so no troubleshooting for a bit. ;)[04:39:44] *** SiCuTDeUx_ has joined #haiku[04:54:16] *** hUMUNGUs has quit IRC[04:56:14] *** mmlr_mc has quit IRC[05:00:24] <l_n> after watching people do stupid things in traffic today, i've decided i want a sticker for my car that simply says, "Don't be That Guy."[05:00:56] <l_n> unfortunately, smart-ass stickers on vehicles do nothing to make people think while operating a vehicle.[05:06:08] *** hUMUNGUs has joined #haiku[05:12:03] *** bjl- has joined #haiku[05:13:31] <l_n> helf|laptop: nixie clocks are damned expensive...[05:16:44] <Skipp_OSX> anybody got bone for BeOS?[05:17:59] <bjl-> as in "I've got a bone to pick with"?[05:19:32] <Skipp_OSX> bjl-: hehe, no, as in the better networking that came out slightly after the end of BeOS[05:20:05] <bjl-> aah =][05:23:46] <helf|laptop> I do[05:24:48] <Skipp_OSX> helf|laptop: can you make it Interweb accessible somehow?[05:26:36] <helf|laptop> hold on a sec[05:31:47] *** hdanak has joined #haiku[05:44:05] <l_n> hrm.. i probably should have mentioned webkit in that memo to leavengood.. eh, he'll figure out wtf i was rambling about.[05:45:09] <DraX> l_n: memo?[05:46:30] *** Disreali has quit IRC[05:46:55] <helf|laptop> DraX, memoserv service probably[05:48:07] <l_n> yep[05:48:46] <l_n> this has to be the *worst* we're-selling-used-crap site i've seen.. impossible to sort through. -> http://www.73.com/a/0063.shtml[05:50:50] <l_n> there's an 'IBM Fluorescent Lamp' on that page.[05:51:59] *** prOSy has joined #haiku[05:52:28] <helf|laptop> lol[05:55:07] <l_n> i think i'm just going to strip that s/36 and sell the parts on ebay.[05:55:44] <l_n> freight for the whole damn thing would be ridiculous. (and i'm too lazy to palletize it.[05:55:46] <l_n> )[05:55:54] <helf|laptop> :p[05:56:11] <helf|laptop> id pick it up but i dont need to[05:56:25] <l_n> s/need/want/ :P[05:56:33] <helf|laptop> :p[05:56:59] <l_n> i don't *need* a c-64, but i want one. my wife says no on the grounds that it would become another dust collector.[05:57:10] <helf|laptop> lol[05:57:20] <helf|laptop> i want a SIDstation[05:57:42] <l_n> even though the c-128 was more functional, there was nowhere near the amount of software written for the 128 as there was for the 64[05:57:51] <l_n> SIDstation?[05:58:03] * l_n visits the almighty wikipedia.[06:00:27] <helf|laptop> er[06:00:29] <helf|laptop> not the sidstation[06:00:31] <helf|laptop> the hardsid[06:00:45] <helf|laptop> http://www.hardsid.com/[06:00:50] <helf|laptop> holds up to 6 SIDs[06:01:17] <helf|laptop> works with either the 6581 or 8580 SIDs and any mixture of the two[06:01:43] <helf|laptop> hardsid.com[06:02:34] <l_n> interesting...[06:03:01] <helf|laptop> check out the videos of it in action[06:03:50] *** AlexFera has joined #haiku[06:06:32] <l_n> sleep time...[06:07:12] *** l_n has quit IRC[06:12:45] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[06:19:57] *** aschueler has joined #haiku[06:28:14] *** Nozy1 has joined #haiku[06:28:14] *** Nozy has quit IRC[06:30:32] *** Nozy1 has quit IRC[06:30:35] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[06:34:53] *** prOSy has quit IRC[06:36:37] *** Nozy has quit IRC[06:43:19] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[06:50:06] *** AlexFera has quit IRC[06:50:41] *** largo has quit IRC[06:56:34] *** marmida has left #haiku[07:15:44] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[07:17:43] *** largo has joined #haiku[07:17:52] <largo> woohoo!! :D[07:18:37] *** Stellar has quit IRC[07:20:25] <largo> http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2009-October/012804.html[07:20:34] <largo> that seems to be the problem here.[07:20:44] <largo> disabling SMP makes everything run perfectly.[07:21:05] <largo> I've been surfing the web and downloading and installing packages etc for half an hour now without a freeze.[07:21:05] *** Stellar has joined #haiku[07:21:49] <largo> installed BeZillaBrowser, which every other time I'd tried it in the past locked up the system hard partway through.[07:21:52] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[07:22:01] <largo> then installed Vision (which I'm chatting from now) etc.[07:25:58] <CIA-50> augiedoggie * r616 /haikuporter/trunk/haikuporter:[07:25:58] <CIA-50> Add support for multi line commands when building packages.[07:25:58] <CIA-50> Should have been part of r612.[07:29:31] *** Andrius has joined #haiku[07:39:19] *** Kokito has quit IRC[07:39:35] *** fhein has joined #haiku[07:44:44] *** jmayfield_ has joined #haiku[07:48:25] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[08:11:21] *** jmayfield_ has quit IRC[08:15:25] *** stargater has joined #haiku[08:15:42] <stargater> good morning[08:17:18] <largo> morning :)[08:25:00] *** diogen has joined #haiku[08:25:26] *** jmayfield_ has joined #haiku[08:25:40] *** e-jones has joined #haiku[08:28:57] *** joeyadams has joined #haiku[08:36:00] *** fhein has quit IRC[08:50:21] *** linkslice has joined #haiku[08:50:55] <linkslice> sorry if this is answered elsewhere, but what is a good laptop to run haiku on? wireless?[08:51:08] *** AlienSoldier has quit IRC[08:54:26] *** joeyadams has quit IRC[08:56:41] <stargater> asus eeepc ? = colin have one too[08:57:26] <stargater> i think a aspire from acer run haiku too[08:57:35] <stargater> 10"[09:02:34] <MarkTraceur> Is there a USB installer?[09:04:58] <stargater> i think, or usb cdrom[09:13:56] *** PathagenX has joined #haiku[09:20:38] *** linkslice has quit IRC[09:34:59] <saivert> need to run it from ROM[09:35:03] <saivert> like in the old days[09:35:11] <saivert> OS shall be on a ROM chip[09:39:33] *** stargater has quit IRC[09:40:50] *** jmayfield_ has quit IRC[09:57:05] *** jmayfield_ has joined #haiku[09:58:42] *** bjl- has quit IRC[10:05:59] *** ver has joined #haiku[10:07:59] <ver> is there a trick to getting jam to use my cross compiler? it's just using 'cc'. i didn't think i'd need to override environment variables :/[10:13:55] <ver> which doesn't fly either (generated/cross-tools/i586-pc-haiku/bin/ar: ./libgcc.a: No such file or director)[10:15:43] *** J-Ho has joined #haiku[10:17:15] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[10:29:09] *** Begasus has joined #haiku[10:29:29] <Begasus> moin[10:29:44] <surrounder> hey Begasus[10:29:57] <Begasus> hey surrounder[10:30:43] *** waveshaper has joined #haiku[10:37:54] *** cpr420 has quit IRC[10:39:17] <waveshaper> the whole multithreaded use in beos and haiku must have a huge effect on everything and how it all feels and looks without doubt. just the tiny visual thingie from soundplay refreshes so neat in the deskbar. its like every refresh is less tearing, no flickering, chopping, etc[10:46:50] <ver> this is crazy, this is nowhere remotely near compiling, and i can't see any way it can, the toolchain doesn't even install the headers anywhere, and the default gcc flags don't look anywhere for them apparently... does nobody cross compile haiku anymore? is the guide out of date, and the readme files referencing it?[11:04:20] *** bicyclerepairman has quit IRC[11:04:47] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[11:08:15] *** Hugen has joined #haiku[11:13:54] *** stippi has joined #haiku[11:13:55] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o stippi[11:14:30] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[11:18:53] *** brobostigon has joined #haiku[11:21:16] *** diogen has quit IRC[11:25:44] *** PathagenX has quit IRC[11:28:56] *** voodoor has joined #haiku[11:29:08] *** MarkTraceur has left #haiku[11:32:32] *** SiCuTDeUx has quit IRC[11:34:35] <voodoor> 2 out of my 4 Haiku test machines have been unable to boot gcc2hybrid nightlies from last few days when then previously booted fine- whats happened? One machine doesn't even get as far as showing the Haiku boot logo despite having ticked all safe mode options and another gets half way through the boot process then stalls[11:36:43] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[11:37:25] <voodoor> I suppose I'd need to monitor the serial output to see whats going wrong. Anyone else had trouble booting recent builds?[11:40:18] <voodoor> Is there a mirror of the haiku-files nightly builds?[11:43:17] <voodoor> The last nightly that booted on my main machine (a core 2 duo desktop) was from 24th Feb[11:43:55] <voodoor> Somewhere between 24th and 27th things went titsup[11:45:15] *** voodoor has quit IRC[11:49:44] *** LinuxKeitaro has quit IRC[11:50:23] *** petterhj has joined #haiku[12:14:30] *** hoelzro has joined #haiku[12:21:57] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[12:32:48] *** stargater has joined #haiku[12:32:51] <stargater> hi[12:47:17] *** hoelzro has quit IRC[12:55:12] *** timezer0 has quit IRC[12:56:20] *** lorglas has joined #haiku[12:57:44] *** timezer0 has joined #haiku[12:59:46] *** brobostigon has quit IRC[13:00:38] *** sprma has joined #haiku[13:01:34] *** VinDuv_ has joined #haiku[13:06:18] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[13:13:46] <stargater> hi sprma[13:14:47] *** mmlr_work has joined #haiku[13:17:01] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[13:19:09] *** aldeck_penguin has joined #haiku[13:19:55] *** AlexFera has joined #haiku[13:21:00] *** aldeck_penguin is now known as aldeck[13:21:21] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o aldeck[13:24:59] *** stargater has quit IRC[13:26:25] *** SiCuTDeUx_ has quit IRC[13:27:02] *** mmu_man has joined #haiku[13:27:02] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mmu_man[13:29:38] *** AlexFera has quit IRC[13:31:17] *** mmu_man has quit IRC[13:34:47] <Xeon3D> btw, Portuguese is fully translated atm.[13:35:32] <Xeon3D> on HTA that is. I just wish it would send an email once new phrases / apps are localized.[13:36:47] *** petterhj has quit IRC[13:38:41] *** VinDuv_ has quit IRC[13:41:37] *** Hugen has quit IRC[13:42:23] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[13:44:02] *** hmt has joined #haiku[13:44:26] <hmt> Do you need to run any command to install Haiku libs?[13:45:33] *** AlexFera has joined #haiku[13:46:03] <hmt> I copied the libdvdcss libs into /boot/common/libs, tried rebooting but still no protected DVD playback under VLC. Maybe VLC (the one in optinal) doesn't support dvdcss?[13:46:39] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[13:52:50] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[13:56:09] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[13:56:58] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[13:58:11] <AlexFera> is there a way to set up a pppoe connection under haiku?[13:59:44] *** Barrett has quit IRC[14:00:02] *** DDevine has joined #haiku[14:00:14] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[14:00:49] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[14:02:08] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[14:02:36] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[14:02:58] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[14:03:26] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[14:06:19] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[14:08:44] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[14:16:01] *** W_Blas has joined #haiku[14:21:16] *** hdanak has quit IRC[14:26:58] *** Animal-X has joined #haiku[14:27:37] <CIA-50> bonefish * r35719 /buildtools/trunk/jam/jcache.c: Don't use unknown strings as fprintf() format.[14:28:43] *** aldeck is now known as aldeck_work[14:37:55] *** SiCuTDeUx has joined #haiku[14:45:11] *** knottnhupfer has joined #haiku[14:58:30] *** hmt has quit IRC[14:59:09] *** e-jones has quit IRC[15:04:26] *** genki has joined #haiku[15:07:19] *** hdanak has joined #haiku[15:28:59] *** Barrett has quit IRC[15:29:50] *** DmitryM has quit IRC[15:31:04] *** DmitryM has joined #haiku[15:31:34] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[15:37:06] *** cizra has quit IRC[15:37:36] *** cizra has joined #haiku[15:38:13] <CIA-50> mmadia * r35720 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/ (ImageRules OptionalPackages):[15:38:13] <CIA-50> Moved the optionalpackage P7zip's code for creating expander.rules into a new[15:38:13] <CIA-50> rule AddExpanderRuleToHaikuImage.[15:39:36] <CIA-50> mmadia * r35721 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/ (OptionalPackageDependencies OptionalPackages): Added XZ-Utils as an optional package.[15:40:23] *** BGA has joined #haiku[15:41:39] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o BGA[15:46:57] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[15:46:57] *** fhein has joined #haiku[15:51:03] *** W_Blas has quit IRC[15:55:56] *** Kroki has joined #haiku[15:58:34] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[16:06:16] *** PacoLinux has joined #haiku[16:07:39] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[16:10:09] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[16:18:22] *** mmlr_work has quit IRC[16:19:51] *** mmadia has quit IRC[16:20:09] *** J-Ho has left #haiku[16:21:23] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[16:26:07] *** mmadia has quit IRC[16:27:10] *** GeneralMaximus has joined #haiku[16:28:22] *** genki has quit IRC[16:43:38] <CIA-50> scottmc * r617 /haikuports/trunk/dev-lang/yasm/ (yasm-0.7.1.bep yasm-0.8.0.bep): Updated yasm to 0.8.0[16:53:22] *** [Katisu] has quit IRC[16:53:36] *** Barrett has quit IRC[16:54:00] *** knottnhupfer has quit IRC[16:54:16] *** mmlr_mc has joined #haiku[16:59:59] <largo> So I'll do a little more reading on what Lock Order Reversals are today and then file the bug report on the atheroswifi lockup that appears to be caused by them (as I've been running for over 10 hours now with no freezes or crashes since disabling SMP).[17:02:57] *** waveshaper has quit IRC[17:03:31] <mmlr_mc> lock order reversals wouldn't necessarily be cured by disabling SMP though[17:03:46] <mmlr_mc> race conditions would fit better[17:04:09] <mmlr_mc> or interrupt issues, they're common with freebsd wifi drivers[17:06:21] *** lorglas has quit IRC[17:08:52] *** The123king has joined #haiku[17:11:25] <largo> mmlr_mc: ah... I was just going by what that earlier bug report said... http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2009-October/012804.html[17:11:59] <largo> the details of this stuff are beyond my skill level. :)[17:13:29] <mmlr_mc> ah, with that background it can of course be very well the case[17:13:54] <mmlr_mc> so it looks broken in freebsd already[17:14:10] <mmlr_mc> just mentioning the others to be more likely if it was haiku specific[17:14:32] *** Kokito has joined #haiku[17:15:03] <largo> gotcha.[17:15:58] <largo> it would be something I'd -love- to get fixed. :D as in the meantime it's cutting me down from 8 cores to 1. not that I really need the 8 cores in Haiku right now... nor all 6GB of my RAM.... but it's the principle of knowing you've got that much more horsepower so to speak, and not having access to it. ;)[17:16:51] *** tqh has joined #haiku[17:17:17] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[17:28:05] *** hoelzro has joined #haiku[17:32:15] *** surrounder has quit IRC[17:38:48] *** impulse has quit IRC[17:44:07] *** impy has joined #haiku[17:49:13] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[17:49:18] *** surrounder has joined #haiku[17:49:20] *** [Katisu] has joined #haiku[18:06:03] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[18:09:28] *** sprma has quit IRC[18:10:39] *** jmelesky has joined #haiku[18:13:39] *** brobostigon has joined #haiku[18:14:28] *** AlienSoldier has joined #haiku[18:14:52] *** GeneralMaximus has quit IRC[18:18:43] *** hoelzro has quit IRC[18:23:33] *** mmlr_mc has quit IRC[18:26:12] *** tgunr has quit IRC[18:26:52] *** tgunr has joined #haiku[18:29:59] *** MrSunshine has joined #haiku[18:30:12] *** Ingenu_ has joined #haiku[18:31:46] *** timezer0 has quit IRC[18:33:14] <CIA-50> mmadia * r35722 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/OptionalPackages: Corrected the XZ-Utils expander rules[18:33:22] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[18:33:24] *** Ingenu_ is now known as Ingenu[18:34:08] *** timezer0 has joined #haiku[18:36:21] <CIA-50> mmadia * r35723 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/ImageRules:[18:36:21] <CIA-50> Expander checks B_USER_DATA_DIRECTORY and B_COMMON_DATA_DIRECTORY for[18:36:21] <CIA-50> expander.rules, not B_COMMON_ETC_DIRECTORY.[18:37:00] <The123king> tqh: about that BeWine code or whatever, why don't you just zip it and post it on the forums? I'd do something with it myself but i know hardly any C (just enough to read it and make sense of basic stuff)[18:40:13] <tqh> Easier for me to just send it to someone interested.[18:44:14] *** diogen has joined #haiku[18:44:32] *** joeyadams has joined #haiku[18:46:51] <CIA-50> bonefish * r35724 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/arch/x86/arch_vm_translation_map.cpp: Extended assert output.[18:47:05] <The123king> make a post on Haikuware, you might get a developer take it up from there[18:47:26] <CIA-50> bonefish * r35725 /haiku/trunk/src/system/kernel/slab/MemoryManager.cpp: More debug output.[18:48:50] *** vooshy has joined #haiku[18:49:51] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[18:51:06] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[18:51:13] *** aldeck_work has quit IRC[18:56:32] *** michaelvo has joined #haiku[18:57:37] <MrSunshine> hmm, anyone alive in here that knows the freebsd compat layer? :)[18:59:56] *** Xbertl has joined #haiku[19:01:01] *** Andrius has quit IRC[19:07:53] *** aschueler has quit IRC[19:10:14] <CIA-50> bonefish * r35726 /haiku/trunk/ (6 files in 5 dirs): (log message trimmed)[19:10:14] <CIA-50> Boot loader (x86 mmu.cpp):[19:10:14] <CIA-50> * Made the page table allocation more flexible. Got rid of sMaxVirtualAddress[19:10:14] <CIA-50> and added new virtual_end address to the architecture specific kernel args.[19:10:14] <CIA-50> * Increased the virtual space we reserve for the kernel to 16 MB. That[19:10:14] <CIA-50> should suffice for quite a while. The previous 2 MB were too tight when[19:10:15] <CIA-50> building the kernel with debug info.[19:13:00] *** andreas_dr has joined #haiku[19:13:55] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[19:18:10] *** michaelvo has quit IRC[19:21:31] *** SiCuTDeUx has quit IRC[19:23:51] *** Andrius has joined #haiku[19:24:36] *** Grunt_ has joined #haiku[19:24:37] *** aschueler has joined #haiku[19:30:42] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[19:33:48] *** helf has quit IRC[19:36:04] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[19:41:40] <CIA-50> axeld * r35727 /haiku/trunk/src/preferences/screensaver/ScreenSaverWindow.cpp:[19:41:41] <CIA-50> * Fixed #4339 - I did not use stimut's patch (but thanks a lot, I wouldn't even[19:41:41] <CIA-50> have started looking into it without it!), but solved it a bit differently by[19:41:41] <CIA-50> moving the state saving into the destructor, and removing the tab in question[19:41:41] <CIA-50> manually afterwards.[19:41:41] <CIA-50> * Automatic whitespace cleanup.[19:44:48] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[19:46:40] *** miqlas has joined #haiku[19:50:04] *** diogen has quit IRC[19:54:42] *** aschueler has quit IRC[19:59:01] *** brobostigon has quit IRC[20:04:02] *** humdinger has joined #haiku[20:04:05] *** dakdagi has joined #haiku[20:11:00] *** dakdagi has quit IRC[20:15:47] <kallisti5> looks ok to me as well[20:16:12] <kallisti5> crap.. was looking at something that was said a few days ago.. ignore![20:20:04] <largo> I hate trying to ignore something after one has piqued my curiosity. ;)[20:24:17] *** idefix_xifedi has quit IRC[20:25:57] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[20:31:51] *** Ingenu has joined #haiku[20:33:48] *** genki has joined #haiku[20:37:12] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[20:44:47] <largo> anyone here familiar with getting Japanese working on Haiku?[20:45:15] <largo> I have the VLGothic fonts in... so I can see Japanese (for the most part).[20:45:46] <largo> but I don't see an input method installed, nor an easy way to get one... Canna? Anthy?[20:46:42] <largo> http://www.haiku-os.org/blog/koki/2008-05-08/anthy_ported_to_haiku_binary_available_on_bebits[20:46:47] * largo starts reading there....[20:47:19] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[20:47:54] <Kokito> largo, Canna is included in Haiku[20:48:31] <Kokito> you just need to move it from /boot/optional/system/add-ons/input_server/methods to /boot/system/add-ons/input_server/methods to enable it[20:48:59] <largo> Kokito: ah, thank you. :)[20:49:02] * largo tries that out...[20:49:48] <Kokito> to toggle input methods, use Alt-Space[20:50:22] <Kokito> largo, Anthy has also been ported to Haiku, but I have not used it much[20:51:43] *** Skipp_BeOS has joined #haiku[20:51:45] <Skipp_BeOS> hello[20:52:17] <largo> Kokito: thank you :)[20:52:59] <Skipp_BeOS> largo: is your nick from Monkey Island?[20:53:13] <Skipp_BeOS> well, MI2 to be exact[20:53:41] <largo> Skipp_BeOS: nope... originally from the old BubbleGum Crisis (or Crash?) anime series.[20:54:05] <largo> started using it back around 1996 or so I think.[20:55:15] <Skipp_BeOS> okay, well, this was just a pitstop for me, just testing bone[20:55:25] *** Skipp_BeOS has quit IRC[20:57:33] *** Skipp_OSX has joined #haiku[20:57:38] <Skipp_OSX> okay, back on a real OS[20:58:18] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[21:00:14] <DraX> heh, didn't realize that the webkit svn repo was hosted on haiku, that's pretty neat[21:00:17] *** ziomatto has joined #haiku[21:04:35] *** aschueler has joined #haiku[21:04:36] *** joeyadams has quit IRC[21:08:46] <Skipp_OSX> DraX: is that for just the WebKit port for Haiku or for the whole shebang?[21:11:14] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[21:11:37] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[21:12:44] *** BGA has left #haiku[21:13:29] <tqh> the port. Don't think the real webkit would dare that[21:13:38] *** dakdagi has joined #haiku[21:14:33] <Skipp_OSX> tqh: so it is really just a dogfood kind of thing[21:15:14] <tqh> afaik mmlr wanted to test running a few things on Haiku, so he setup svn and a few services to test.[21:15:39] <tqh> and off they went...[21:15:52] *** stargater has joined #haiku[21:15:57] <stargater> hi[21:16:46] <largo> welcome back stargater[21:18:28] <stargater> thx largo[21:19:16] *** idefix_xifedi has quit IRC[21:20:44] *** miqlas has quit IRC[21:21:16] <Begasus> re[21:21:57] *** OmniMancer has quit IRC[21:22:10] <stargater> hi Begasus[21:22:34] <Begasus> hi stargater[21:23:58] *** peerkoel has quit IRC[21:27:17] *** Begasus has quit IRC[21:29:13] *** tgunr has quit IRC[21:32:02] *** luroh has joined #haiku[21:34:17] *** humdinger has quit IRC[21:35:27] <mmadia> largo : are you in Haiku now?[21:35:29] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[21:36:14] *** tqh has quit IRC[21:36:57] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[21:37:00] *** peerkoel has joined #haiku[21:39:53] *** jan__64 has joined #haiku[21:43:06] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[21:45:09] *** Skipp_OSX has quit IRC[21:50:13] *** yourpalal has joined #haiku[21:52:07] *** tqh has joined #haiku[21:56:36] *** OmniMancer has joined #haiku[21:57:35] *** jan__64_ has joined #haiku[21:58:55] *** mmadia has quit IRC[22:00:54] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[22:01:10] *** jan__64 has quit IRC[22:04:56] *** The123king has quit IRC[22:05:13] *** Kroki has quit IRC[22:05:38] *** Kroki has joined #haiku[22:08:19] *** Grunt_ has quit IRC[22:09:07] <CIA-50> tqh * r35728 /haiku/trunk/src/add-ons/kernel/bus_managers/acpi/tables/tbutils.c: Reverting r35592, that checked that it was a valid 32 bit physical address, now that #5449 is fixed. (So we use the ACPICA code without modifications).[22:12:36] *** oco has joined #haiku[22:13:30] *** andreas_dr has quit IRC[22:13:32] *** PathagenX has joined #haiku[22:13:37] *** mmlr_mc has joined #haiku[22:13:45] <Kokito> PulkoMandy, is it required/preferred that new translations be submitted via Trac?[22:13:55] <mmadia> stargater : do you have any binaries for lava?[22:15:13] <stargater> mmadia, you from osdrawer ?[22:15:30] <mmadia> no, but plfiorini mentioned it to me.[22:15:42] <stargater> ah ok[22:15:48] <stargater> yes i have[22:15:54] <stargater> but it not finish[22:16:02] <stargater> we need a svn[22:16:22] <stargater> so osdrawer is it[22:16:41] <mmadia> *nods* i was just curious. it sounds nice.[22:16:48] <DraX> lava?[22:17:24] <tqh> must be very hot stuff :)[22:17:27] <stargater> its a team maui project, in the last 2 year but not full time workin on it, only in a free time[22:17:48] <mmadia> it seems to be for disc burning[22:18:28] *** idefix_xifedi has quit IRC[22:18:46] *** helf has joined #haiku[22:19:19] <ver> is there an issue with terminal or VTs in the latest SVN, or is it just my installation?[22:20:06] <ver> (opening a terminal works, shows a prompt, and then exits)[22:20:16] <mmadia> what're you seeing ver? there are some instabilities in the kernel/vm.[22:20:49] <ver> ahh is it a new threading model? i heard somebody mentioning that yesterday.[22:21:30] <mmadia> afai understand, it's more of code refactoring.[22:22:54] *** luroh has quit IRC[22:23:16] *** idefix_xifedi has joined #haiku[22:23:31] <ver> hmm, that's cool. i just wanted to check if net server was actually active, and if the 'ipv4' add-on is in use. i was looking through the source and it looks .. well, incomplete. particularly the ipv4 module. a lot of the functions look stubbed :/[22:25:30] *** fhein has quit IRC[22:28:16] *** luroh has joined #haiku[22:28:24] <ver> but yeah, the new svn seems to install a lot faster than r1a1 :p[22:28:27] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[22:28:52] <ver> could be my biased imagination though...[22:29:15] <tqh> Ingo has been tuning Haiku a lot, build times has gone down a lot since a1[22:29:30] <ver> for sure, it builds very quickly for me[22:30:04] *** leszek has joined #haiku[22:30:46] <leszek> hi[22:30:50] <largo> mmadia: yes, I'm in Haiku now. :D[22:30:52] <largo> OS Uptime [Haiku]: 15 hrs 39 mins 4.742 secs[22:31:01] <ver> i'd like to spruce up the guide or make a new guide specifically for cross compiling. i hit several snags which had my pulling my hair out, it took me 5-6 hours to finally get it to compile.[22:31:14] <mmadia> largo : can you pastebin the output of `listdev` ?[22:31:22] <largo> once I disabled SMP the atheroswifi has been working fine. as per http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2009-October/012804.html[22:31:30] <largo> sure.[22:31:44] <leszek> is it normal that when I set permissions for a text file to read only stylededit ignores it stores changes in the file ?[22:32:06] <ver> leszek: it should at least give you a warning/error :/[22:32:25] <leszek> it does not , rev. 33109[22:32:28] *** timezer0 has quit IRC[22:32:42] <ver> So you open a file, THEN set it to read only, then save it?[22:33:07] <largo> http://pastebin.com/c1Y8fMRQ[22:33:51] <largo> mmadia: ^^[22:34:09] <leszek> ver, open write something in, close everything, set permission to read only, reopen in stylededit , edit text and save ALT+S[22:34:19] <leszek> no error no warning ist just saves the changes[22:34:25] *** timezer0 has joined #haiku[22:34:29] <leszek> vi btw. in terminal works fine[22:34:30] <mmadia> thanks largo. i wanted to pass this onto colin.[22:34:38] <largo> thanks. :)[22:34:49] <largo> let me know if you need anything else.[22:34:51] <ver> works fine as in; it doesn't save changes?[22:34:56] <leszek> yes[22:35:00] <leszek> it gives a warning[22:35:04] <ver> and this is a bfs partition?[22:35:05] <leszek> that the file is read only[22:35:09] <leszek> yes it is[22:35:52] <ver> that's a tough one. i mean you're logged in to the system as baron which is the unix version of 'root'[22:36:09] <leszek> I know[22:36:34] <ver> so any application which doesn't explicitly check file access modes won't notice, an attempt to write will never return an error unless there's a medium problem (disc full, disc being eaten by nuclear ants, etc.)...[22:36:36] <leszek> but it should at least give a warning like vim does, and shouldn't write the file right away[22:36:43] <ver> and legally you can't make a file un-writable by baron[22:36:52] <ver> i'm inclined to agree[22:37:08] <ver> i'm just trying to figure out HOW without resorting to an elaborate stat() function[22:37:20] <leszek> otherwise permissions will loose its meaning[22:37:33] <ver> well, the meaning of the permissions are within the scope of multiple users[22:37:42] <leszek> yeah mostly[22:37:45] <ver> i don't think the meaning has meant anything for the owning user/group, merely implicit[22:38:10] <leszek> but if you have important documents its also good to set them readonly if you don't want them to be overwritten by mistake[22:38:42] <leszek> ver, user /group might be interesting if you transfer files to linux/unix machines[22:38:59] <leszek> I think it saves those attributes[22:39:03] <ver> it isn't very interesting, it just leaves unresolved uid/gid[22:39:18] <leszek> and btw. its also important for poorman to have permissions set the right way[22:39:49] <ver> well using permissions still doesn't seem correct, even if it is how unix does things[22:40:22] <ver> because like i pointed out before, you can't deny a write because of permissions...[22:40:34] <ver> i think a 'read only' file attribute would be better :)[22:40:44] <ver> besides, it's less code to write in.[22:41:26] <leszek> hmm...[22:41:39] <ver> i mean you can't deny a write to baron[22:42:08] <ver> my point is how, in a multiuser setting, would you set a file such that a user would be warned that it is read only?[22:42:27] <ver> if it was relying on the file mode, you couldn't do it without making it prohibitively read-only to that user.[22:42:48] <leszek> ver, I clearly think it is a bug, because vim and Pe don't write to this file if its set to read only[22:43:03] <leszek> it should be consistent[22:43:07] <ver> i agree[22:44:24] *** PasNox has joined #haiku[22:46:22] <ver> relevant code is in trunk/src/apps/stylededit/StyledEditWindow.cpp Line ~825[22:47:21] <ver> the check is very simple :) if it can open the file to write, it does, and writes to it. really, i can't argue with the logic there either :P[22:51:35] *** genki has quit IRC[22:52:01] *** largo has quit IRC[22:56:36] *** idefix_xifedi has left #haiku[23:00:04] *** tqh has quit IRC[23:01:04] *** petterhj has joined #haiku[23:05:40] *** Ingenu_ has joined #haiku[23:07:51] *** Nozy has joined #haiku[23:08:15] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[23:08:44] <DraX> stippi: is the work you started on getting cairo port working again available?[23:09:33] *** Ingenu_ is now known as Ingenu[23:09:57] *** stargater has quit IRC[23:10:57] <ver> leszek: pretty quick and dirty patch, 5 lines. interestingly enough, when a file's mode is 000, you can still OPEN the file :p[23:11:27] <leszek> ;)[23:14:54] *** jan__64_ has quit IRC[23:16:02] <ver> now we'll see if haiku accepts it, hehe[23:17:16] <ver> what do you guys think of Clockwerk?[23:17:18] <mmlr_mc> note that you're the root user by default, so it's not really unexpected that you can open any file with any mode[23:17:22] *** Barrett has joined #haiku[23:17:35] <ver> mmlr_mc: not at all[23:18:17] <leszek> ver, never really tested clockwerk, only started it once. Does not make sense if I cannot save anything[23:18:41] <ver> can't save anything?[23:19:27] <ver> it doesn't let you save your work? that's pretty ridiculous.[23:20:07] <HeTo> the modes should still be checked for the root user[23:20:14] <leszek> let me test it again :P[23:20:20] <HeTo> so that you can write-protect files to prevent accidental modifications[23:20:38] *** VinDuv has joined #haiku[23:21:47] *** VinDuv has quit IRC[23:21:54] <ver> well my patch does such a check, but access() returns OK, since ... well, nobody can tell root what it can't do :p[23:23:01] *** stargater has joined #haiku[23:23:02] <stargater> re[23:23:13] *** dakdagi has quit IRC[23:23:51] <stippi> DraX: I can send you a patch, if you like.[23:24:20] <CIA-50> zooey * r35729 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/ImageRules:[23:24:20] <CIA-50> * fixed copy'n'paste bug in comment[23:24:20] <CIA-50> * automatic whitespace cleanup[23:24:33] <DraX> stippi: seems worth while to at least have it available if anyone wants to pick up that torch. i know urias was looking into it, and was able to get cairo to build but didn't know how to fix the test-runner[23:25:22] <stippi> Urias should have my patch, though. I've send it to the haiku-porters list.[23:25:30] *** ziomatto has quit IRC[23:25:44] <stippi> The build of the tests is exactly what I got stuck on.[23:26:13] <stippi> The only the linking part. It wouldn't link since I couldn't figure out how to make it link against libstdc++ and libsupc++.[23:26:39] <DraX> ahh[23:27:50] <CIA-50> zooey * r35730 /haiku/trunk/build/jam/ (OptionalPackageDependencies OptionalPackages): (log message trimmed)[23:27:50] <CIA-50> Fix #5499 for real:[23:27:50] <CIA-50> * the optional package ICU-devel now explicitly installs the appropriate[23:27:50] <CIA-50> symlinks for the development libraries as required (for both standard[23:27:50] <CIA-50> and hybrid builds)[23:27:51] <CIA-50> * ICU-devel now depends on Development (more indicative than required, but[23:27:51] <CIA-50> I think it makes sense)[23:28:37] *** Stellar has quit IRC[23:28:44] *** Animal-X has quit IRC[23:29:23] *** Stellar has joined #haiku[23:36:28] *** largo has joined #haiku[23:37:07] <ver> leszek: i don't see anything in poorman which suggest it works differently than stylededit on saving, which operation gives you a warning/error when you save in poorman?[23:37:16] *** aschueler has quit IRC[23:38:03] <leszek> ver, I don't have any problem with poorman[23:38:14] *** Kroki has quit IRC[23:39:05] *** miqlas has joined #haiku[23:39:08] <ver> no i mean you said it was important in poorman to have permissions set properly[23:39:20] <ver> i'm saying how can you make it complain about permissions?[23:39:42] <ver> i want to see how poorman does a permission check, and use that as a template for stylededit, but from what i can tell they work the same way.[23:40:18] <leszek> try lookup the code of Pe instead of poorman[23:40:30] <ver> alright[23:41:36] *** PulkoMandy has quit IRC[23:42:17] *** PulkoMandy has joined #haiku[23:45:25] *** vooshy has quit IRC[23:45:37] <ver> hmm, Pe isn't part of the Haiku svn root[23:45:56] <mmadia> nope. it's hosted on BerliOS[23:47:42] *** mmadia has quit IRC[23:52:01] <ver> ... hm, it looks about the same.[23:52:30] *** Ingenu has quit IRC[23:54:20] *** mmadia has joined #haiku[23:54:59] *** Andrius has quit IRC[23:55:15] <ver> yech[23:55:35] <ver> nevermind, it DOES munge stat() :/