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[00:18:10] <mmu_man> oh my...
[00:18:34] <stargater> god?
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[00:20:26] <mmu_man> #  ifdef HAVE_SECTION_QUOTES
[00:20:26] <mmu_man> #   define __sec_comment "\"\n\t#\""
[00:20:32] <mmu_man>  /* Tacking on "\n\t#" to the section name makes gcc put it's bogus section attributes on what looks like a comment to the assembler.  */
[00:20:38] <mmu_man> ugly bogly
[00:20:55] <mmu_man> plus on m68k # isn't a comment char, it's | (god knows why)
[00:20:58] <mmu_man> no wonder it stops there :)
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[00:22:24] <stargater> oh oh
[00:23:40] <miqlas> Hello!
[00:23:50] <stargater> hello miqlas
[00:24:35] <miqlas> I1m working on my new webpage...
[00:24:40] <miqlas> Lot of suck.
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[00:26:38] <stargater> :-)
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[00:36:35] <stargater> _miqlas_: good job
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[01:27:08] <mmu_man> ok, seems I have to patch gas to pass that one
[01:27:11] <mmu_man> :^)
[01:27:14] <brycegroff> mmu_man when you asked yesterday about creating an elf loader for m68k, was that for the boot process
[01:27:29] <mmu_man> both
[01:27:36] <mmu_man> it's almost the same for boot and kernel
[01:28:07] <brycegroff> i see
[01:30:33] <brycegroff> looks a bit over my head :)
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[02:07:10] <mmu_man> ok I should zz while gcc builds again
[02:10:39] <DeadYak> sleep well :)
[02:10:41] * DeadYak plops mmu_man
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[03:17:36] <mmu_man> grmbl
[03:18:04] <mmu_man> build failed...
[03:34:10] <tombhadAC> mmu_man, still here?
[03:35:09] <mmu_man> ..
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[03:37:05] <tombhadAC> ive made an patch against configure.in and rerun autoconf (2.61) but now the patch is very large ...
[03:37:26] <mmu_man> ... autocrap :)
[03:37:56] <mmu_man> that's cause you don't have the same version as the one used to generate the one in svn
[03:38:04] <mmu_man> it's ugly
[03:38:57] <mmu_man> n8
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[05:55:58] * JonathanThompson notes McDonalds has apparently branched off into customer IQ tests involving Chicken McNuggets
[06:07:09] *** procton_ has joined #haiku
[06:08:58] <myrkraverk> JonathanThompson, oh, I've felt for some time that when IQ > n, customer goes somewhere else ;)
[06:10:36] <JonathanThompson> Laziness/desperation can lower IQ, I suppose :)
[06:11:11] <JonathanThompson> At least at the nearest one to me (a few blocks away) they have a dollar menu, and 4 McNuggets are $1, and the 20 piece is $6.99.
[06:12:17] <myrkraverk> JonathanThompson, yes, they try to fool the customer, every chance they get ;-P
[06:13:05] * myrkraverk promptly goes afk
[06:15:36] <umccullough> JonathanThompson, it probably cost an extra $2 for the guy in the back to make sure all 20 are in the same box
[06:15:46] <JonathanThompson> Could be :P
[06:15:57] <umccullough> he probably has to count them 10 times to be sure
[06:16:25] <JonathanThompson> Perhaps what I did tonight (the 5 packs of 4) saved them from needing to count more than a set of fingers on one hand could handle :P
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[06:22:32] <helf> sup
[06:22:36] <scanty> hey helf.
[06:22:52] * JonathanThompson lobs helf at scanty and scanty at helf, thereby causing a singularity in the space-time continuum
[06:23:13] <helf> ...and it begins
[06:23:15] <helf> ;)
[06:23:16] <JonathanThompson> Did you guys synchro-join from BeShare?  You both showed up within seconds of each other.
[06:23:16] <scanty> well, if the universe is destroyed, I don't know about it yet.
[06:23:19] <helf> hiya jt, scanty
[06:23:26] <scanty> nah, AIM.
[06:23:33] <helf> i havent used beshare in ages
[06:23:37] <JonathanThompson> Well, that makes sense :P
[06:23:42] <scanty> I was getting too many messages from people I didn't want to talk to.
[06:23:45] <scanty> so I figured fuckit.
[06:23:46] <scanty> and came here
[06:23:56] <helf> and was greeted by you
[06:23:57] <helf> :P
[06:23:57] <JonathanThompson> Where nobody knows your name, and nobody cares :P
[06:23:59] <helf> "damnit!"
[06:24:00] <helf> ;)
[06:24:10] <helf> so hows it going, jt?
[06:24:15] <scanty> helf, did I show you the photo from my birthday?
[06:24:17] <JonathanThompson> Oh, it goes.
[06:24:30] <helf> scant : nope
[06:24:40] <JonathanThompson> Still working that contract, and they do things that make me go "hmmm..." and reconsider long-term options, if offered.
[06:24:53] <scanty> http://ttl.nonlogic.org/eli/incoming/beer_champion.jpg
[06:24:59] <helf> lol jt
[06:25:12] <JonathanThompson> Like the QA guy today had me going "WTF?" as he stated he'd filed 2 bugs today, no point in filing any more than that, because they'd never get fixed.
[06:25:19] <JonathanThompson> Never mind how many he found, he was only going to file 2.
[06:25:36] <umccullough> what a tard
[06:25:37] <JonathanThompson> That's the sort of shit I have to deal with that doesn't make sense.
[06:25:41] <helf> lol
[06:25:52] <JonathanThompson> Oh, and my former manager visited :)
[06:25:55] <helf> thats.. really sad
[06:25:57] <umccullough> ask him if they pay him only enough money for him to spend ;)
[06:25:58] <helf> scanty : awesome :D
[06:26:13] <JonathanThompson> I greeted him with "Hey, I've been fixing all the bugs you left!" and he decided to make it a short conversationj :P
[06:26:15] <scanty> yes, I'm the conolly station beer squad #1 runner up.
[06:26:29] <scanty> (that's why there's trophies there)
[06:26:36] <helf> heh
[06:26:36] <JonathanThompson> (Sadly, I was being perfectly honest)
[06:27:03] <helf> of course :)
[06:27:10] <helf> since mormons are not allow to lie ;)
[06:27:14] <helf> allowed
[06:27:15] <JonathanThompson> :)
[06:27:17] <scanty> i can't wait to port my NES emulator to PSP
[06:27:32] <JonathanThompson> Technically, all Christians should never lie, helf :)
[06:27:38] <helf> technically :)
[06:27:45] <JonathanThompson> Same with all jews, too (gotta include scanty, ya know!)
[06:27:50] <helf> btw, jt, i keep noticing something weird
[06:27:57] <JonathanThompson> Only something?
[06:27:59] <JonathanThompson> Not everything?
[06:28:07] <scanty> yeah but I'm a dirty zionist-occupier jew.
[06:28:12] <helf> all the mormons thats pay me for stuff in the computer center always have PERFECTLY crisp bills. like i swear they just printed them
[06:28:16] <pyCube_> cool
[06:28:23] <helf> hey cube@
[06:28:26] <helf> !!
[06:28:27] * JonathanThompson gets setup to print scanty a shirt that says that for when he's visiting the homeland
[06:28:42] <scanty> haha
[06:28:52] <JonathanThompson> helf, my best guess is they just got there from the bank :P
[06:28:59] <pyCube_> hi helf
[06:29:02] <JonathanThompson> That's the most logical explanation.... but it STILL is odd.
[06:29:06] <helf> but everytime?
[06:29:08] <helf> heh
[06:29:09] <JonathanThompson> (If that's 100% of the time)
[06:29:14] <helf> i swear it is
[06:29:31] <helf> scanty is an anti-semetic jew
[06:29:38] <scanty> I'm still pissed I didn't get the "I got stoned in gaza" shirt when I was there.
[06:29:47] <helf> jt, my engine is going out ^_^ gotta get a new car. mines not worth the money to fix
[06:30:01] * JonathanThompson keeps in mind he may "break the test" with something he checks in, merely because if something goes wrong, the code he wrote actually reports an error outside the method
[06:30:03] <scanty> helf, I'm sure I'm antisemitic.
[06:30:18] <JonathanThompson> I'm sure you are, scanty :P
[06:30:21] <helf> sure, correct my spelling
[06:30:27] <scanty> i'm wearing a fucking IDF shirt in that photo.
[06:30:34] <JonathanThompson> IDF?
[06:30:45] <scanty> Israel Defence Force.
[06:30:48] <pyCube_> i am unsemitic
[06:30:53] <helf> heh
[06:30:54] <scanty> I mean, Zionist Occupier Army
[06:30:54] * umccullough gets ready to launch 10 vms on the laptop
[06:30:57] <JonathanThompson> Ok, good thing I didn't assume I knew what that stood for :P
[06:31:09] <helf> yeah, yreally
[06:31:24] <helf> I should boot up beos :)
[06:31:28] <helf> is haiku usable yet?
[06:31:30] <pyCube_> why?
[06:31:33] <pyCube_> heh
[06:31:38] <pyCube_> helf: so, whats new?
[06:31:39] <JonathanThompson> Depends on your definition, helf.
[06:31:40] <helf> for old times sake ;)
[06:31:57] <JonathanThompson> If you want to test it and report bugs, and be online short periods of time with hardware that's supported, sure :)
[06:32:06] <JonathanThompson> But, it's still not self-hosting.
[06:32:09] <helf> pycube, other than my van engine about to explode, me not being able to go on my vacation and getting warned if i get in trouble once more im fired.. not a lot :)
[06:32:20] <helf> i finally sold my spitfire
[06:32:27] <pyCube_> helf: eesh.. what are you getting in trouble for?
[06:32:30] <JonathanThompson> Too much fire being spit out?
[06:32:33] <helf> :P
[06:32:43] <helf> pycube : having too much fun on the job
[06:32:44] * JonathanThompson wonders if it's for staring down breasts as they lean over
[06:32:54] <helf> jt : they havent caught me on that yet
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[06:33:16] <JonathanThompson> Either that, or they are doing it for fun.
[06:33:23] <JonathanThompson> Don't know what to tell you there.
[06:33:28] <helf> I think the new director of the place hates me :)
[06:33:37] <JonathanThompson> Why wouldn't he? :)
[06:33:38] <scanty> well, we hate you.
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[06:33:41] <helf> she
[06:33:42] <helf> :)
[06:33:42] <JonathanThompson> (Or she, you didn't say which)
[06:33:43] <umccullough> that's usually a recipe for... moving on
[06:33:48] <helf> I loe you too, eli
[06:33:56] <helf> love
[06:34:01] <helf> wb cube
[06:34:04] <scanty> i know, everybody loves me ;)
[06:34:13] <pyCube_> me?
[06:34:15] <JonathanThompson> What, they love to throw deadly objects at you? :)
[06:34:53] <pyCube_> helf: I am headed back to california, it seems
[06:34:59] <umccullough> is it bad when you defrag an HD and end up with less contiguous free space than you started with?
[06:35:00] <helf> moving?
[06:35:04] <pyCube_> yeah
[06:35:05] <scanty> i'm the fun loving hardware hacker everyone loves to love.
[06:35:07] <JonathanThompson> Well, the highlight of my day today was getting home from work, and in the elevator to my floor, getting a good nuzzle/licking from a small dog with a foot fetish, onto feet in sandals.
[06:35:17] <helf> speaking of which
[06:35:27] <helf> scanty, i need your hacking skills to overclock my NeXT :)
[06:35:32] <pyCube_> was offered a job.. plan on accepting it, given that the details are within reason
[06:35:35] <scanty> oh yeah.
[06:35:41] <scanty> what do I have to do again?
[06:35:44] <helf> i just remembered about that
[06:35:46] <scanty> solder some bridges?
[06:35:47] * JonathanThompson awaits tales of flaming Cubes, not counting pyCube_'s smoking
[06:35:56] <helf> solder a wire or two, a bus frequency double and something else
[06:36:12] <helf> *doubler
[06:36:16] <helf> clock doubler
[06:36:19] <JonathanThompson> Have you got RAM and a CPU capable of running that fast, helf?
[06:36:20] <helf> something like that
[06:36:21] <scanty> 'k
[06:36:22] <helf> ill have to dig it up
[06:36:24] <scanty> hopefully I don't fuck it up.
[06:36:27] <helf> :P
[06:36:28] <helf> yeah
[06:36:32] <scanty> I don't wanna be pissing in the wind
[06:36:38] <umccullough> given how rare NeXT machines are - is it really worth overclocking one?
[06:36:41] <JonathanThompson> Especially near a high-tension wire :P
[06:36:42] <helf> jt : well, its not really doubled. i forget what it does. but it just ups to the speed to 50mhz instead of 33
[06:36:54] <pyCube_> heh
[06:36:57] <pyCube_> man
[06:36:58] <helf> umccullough, i have two now
[06:37:00] <scanty> sounds like some PLL action.
[06:37:01] <JonathanThompson> Still, a major increase, if it doesn't melt down :)
[06:37:02] <pyCube_> dont mess with your next
[06:37:12] <helf> scanty, yeah
[06:37:27] <helf> aw, c'mon :P
[06:37:39] * JonathanThompson wonders if the 68K processor will then dissipate as much waste heat as a modern x86
[06:37:55] <helf> 50mhz with 50mhz scsi bus AND 50mhz memory bus has got to be faster than 33 ;)
[06:37:56] <umccullough> speaking of waste heat...
[06:37:57] <scanty> big aluminium heatsink to save the day.
[06:38:08] <pyCube_> you dont want to end up with a "Previously a NeXT"
[06:38:09] <helf> ill hook up a fan and real heatsink
[06:38:15] <umccullough> i changed the cheap-ass PSU in one of my machines and it uses 10W less power at full load now
[06:38:28] <JonathanThompson> Good, those virtual heat sinks were running on empty, helf :P
[06:38:28] <scanty> wow a whole 10W
[06:38:29] <umccullough> and it runs cooler :)
[06:38:33] <helf> heh
[06:38:34] <umccullough> scanty, that's a lot
[06:38:44] <umccullough> 10%!
[06:38:49] <helf> 33mhz 040 -> 50mhz doesnt create much heat
[06:38:52] <scanty> oh, you didn't mention it was a 100W PSU
[06:38:54] <umccullough> considering i didn't change anything other than the PSU
[06:39:04] <umccullough> scanty, i'm talking about power usage at the wall
[06:39:19] <helf> overclocking the NeXT speeds up EVERYTHING. even my video hardware will be running faster
[06:39:19] <scanty> still, 10W doesn't cost you a lot of money.
[06:39:31] <helf> which means faster DPS rendering ^_^
[06:39:32] <umccullough> scanty, my power bill at $566 last month
[06:39:38] <helf> holy fuck
[06:39:38] * JonathanThompson would love a supercomputer that was capable of running off the power produced by a standard solar calculator's solar cell
[06:39:43] <scanty> jesus christmas.
[06:39:46] <helf> 566??
[06:39:48] <scanty> WTF are you running in your house?
[06:39:57] * JonathanThompson awaits the $666 bill announcement from umccullough
[06:39:58] <umccullough> PG&E put me in the 5th tier
[06:39:59] <pyCube_> jeepers creepers
[06:40:02] <helf> how many machines do you run??
[06:40:14] <JonathanThompson> He's trying to give you competition, helf :)
[06:40:15] <umccullough> at the moment, only 4... cuz i shut most of them down ;)
[06:40:19] <helf> that s200 bucks less than i make a month
[06:40:27] <helf> heh
[06:40:34] <umccullough> power is expensive here in california
[06:40:37] <helf> I've goten rid of most of my mahchines, jt :P
[06:40:50] <umccullough> i've got some 30-odd machines sitting in this room...
[06:40:53] <helf> down to my two NeXTs, this laptop, another laptop and a few x86 machines and my ss20
[06:40:59] <scanty> what abou the even machines? ^_^
[06:41:00] <helf> and another laptop
[06:41:01] <JonathanThompson> I'm contemplating getting a Mac Mini, though until I find out whether or not they decide to renew my contract another month makes a difference.
[06:41:06] <umccullough> scanty, another 30 of those :D
[06:41:09] <helf> oh, and an old ibm xt
[06:41:12] <scanty> hehe
[06:41:14] <helf> original :P
[06:41:19] <scanty> only one machine runs fulltime in my house.
[06:41:24] <helf> and. um.. a trs-80 m100
[06:41:25] <scanty> completely un-necessarily.
[06:41:34] <helf> and some pdas..
[06:41:39] <scanty> this piece of crap I turn on and off at will
[06:41:44] <JonathanThompson> This machine hasn't been rebooted in something over 30 days now.
[06:41:44] * helf thinks he is forgetting some
[06:41:47] <scanty> makes too much damne dnoise.
[06:41:48] <helf> oh, a g4 mac
[06:41:55] <umccullough> anyhow, 10W is a huge decrease in power usage for changing just the PSU on a machine that uses ~100W otherwise
[06:42:02] <JonathanThompson> helf, you need one machine to keep a database of all your other machines :)
[06:42:16] <umccullough> i went from a generic 300W PSU to an Antec 350W psu
[06:42:33] * JonathanThompson wonders if the Tandy Model 100 is capable of that task
[06:42:36] <umccullough> and it produces a lot less heat also...
[06:42:41] <helf> i yanked my trs-80 m100 out of its bag a few days. hadnt turned it on in a year. batteries are still working fine :P gotta love a computer that has run off the same set of 4xAAs for over 4 years
[06:42:45] <scanty> yeah don't exepct high efficiencies from generic PSUs.
[06:42:50] <scanty> ther'es a reason brand name PSUs cost more.
[06:42:56] <scanty> becaus ethey net you like 90% efficiency.
[06:43:00] <scanty> which is awesome.
[06:43:05] <helf> very awesome
[06:43:15] <helf> i need to hack up a new psu for my NeXTs.
[06:43:16] <JonathanThompson> As old and warn as my current PSU is, I wonder what it achieves.
[06:43:25] <JonathanThompson> That, and it isn't exactly the most modern these days.
[06:43:25] <umccullough> i'm happy to get an 80% efficiency PSU ;)
[06:43:30] <helf> both of my NeXTs PSUs are 16 years old
[06:43:37] <JonathanThompson> (Not even counting the lightning strike that overloaded it in 2002)
[06:43:41] <umccullough> most generics are 70% or less
[06:43:46] <scanty> anything 75% and above are fairly decen numbers for SMPSUS
[06:43:50] <helf> wait, you are STILL on that dual p2??
[06:43:56] <JonathanThompson> Dual p3.
[06:44:01] <helf> whatever
[06:44:10] <scanty> first SMPSU I built does about 80%
[06:44:21] <umccullough> hmm.. that reminds me
[06:44:30] <JonathanThompson> Though considering I make my living writing software, and need to keep up with what's being used, it's dangerous to push this thing much more.
[06:44:34] <umccullough> i want to see what this dual-P3 PowerEdge 4200 uses
[06:44:38] <scanty> could've been more if I used SMT components and improved the coil-diode-FET path.
[06:44:39] <helf> my turbo color will soon be able to do remote X sessions, rdesktop, vnc, and connect to gmail via mail.app ^_^
[06:44:41] <umccullough> two redundant 700W PSUs
[06:45:02] <umccullough> and 6 SCSI U2W drives on a backplane
[06:45:03] <helf> jt, get something new, mr. money bags
[06:45:32] <helf> i wonder what my mono NeXT draws. ancient PSU, scsi hdd, the mono crt draws its power from the main psu..
[06:45:48] <scanty> the crt doesn't have it's own PSU?
[06:45:50] <JonathanThompson> helf, assuming the warnings I get about my contract being up for renewal, blah blah blah aren't a problem, I'll probably get a Mac Mini 2 Ghz to tide me over until I get the dual Xeon system.
[06:45:59] <helf> :)
[06:46:06] <helf> scanty, nope. it gets it from the computer
[06:46:07] <scanty> are you sure about that?
[06:46:09] <umccullough> i suspect the CRT uses a pass-thru cable
[06:46:13] <helf> it does
[06:46:15] <helf> well
[06:46:16] <helf> no
[06:46:17] <scanty> since CRTs need a couple kV
[06:46:20] <umccullough> which means it has its own
[06:46:32] <helf> well
[06:46:33] <umccullough> most CRTs use 70W or more by themselves
[06:46:42] <scanty> probably using a uc3843 and acustom wound xfmr
[06:46:52] * JonathanThompson pets his power-hungry 19" monitor
[06:46:54] <umccullough> my 21" CRT uses ~100W
[06:47:02] <helf> the crt has one cable going to the computer. the keyboard/mouse, audio plugs into the crt, the crt has power/data/video linesi n the custom vieo cable
[06:47:14] <helf> *video
[06:47:15] <scanty> yeah but you need an insane flyback to generate the HV rails needed to drive the CRT.
[06:47:19] <helf> my typing is getting worse
[06:47:20] <scanty> eventhough the current is low.
[06:47:37] <helf> it runs well :)
[06:47:38] *** Begasus has joined #haiku
[06:47:45] <helf> begasus!
[06:47:52] <JonathanThompson> He's baaaaaaccccccckkkkkkkkk!
[06:47:53] <helf> i really like the design
[06:48:00] <helf> its nice and clean when it comes to cables
[06:48:01] <Begasus> helf, !
[06:48:07] <scanty> might even use a forward converter
[06:48:08] <Begasus> morning peeps
[06:48:09] <scanty> who knows.
[06:48:25] <helf> and i have a 11' video cable for it, so i could stick the NeXT on a bookshelf or something and just have the crt on my desk
[06:48:30] <scanty> I try not to dabble over 200V
[06:48:33] <JonathanThompson> This morning I was having a dream that amongst other things, had me walking through train cars that were folding theatres on wheels for kids.
[06:48:47] <helf> oookaaay
[06:48:52] <helf> hows it going, be? :)_
[06:49:09] * JonathanThompson wonders if helf has a crappy client without autocompletion via tab
[06:49:16] <helf> yep
[06:49:20] <Begasus> fine here thnx helf ... how's it been there?
[06:49:25] <helf> you said that last time i was on
[06:49:26] <helf> im used blackened
[06:49:38] <helf> begasus, pretty good! i havent been on in ages
[06:49:52] <Begasus> yeah .. haven't seen you in a while ;)
[06:49:53] <JonathanThompson> Yeah, well, it's been a long day of pondering stupid insanities, helf :)
[06:49:58] <helf> heh
[06:50:11] <helf> i could log on with bitchx. i forgot its on my shell
[06:50:12] <scanty> let's see... I've had 5mg of benzos today.
[06:50:16] <JonathanThompson> "Why report more than 2 bugs, since they'll not be fixed anytime soon anyway!"
[06:50:17] <scanty> I should have been sleeping hours ago.
[06:50:30] <helf> scanty, ive yet to have any drug make me sleepy
[06:50:42] <helf> begasus, i forget to log in :) i should do it more often
[06:50:45] <Begasus> should be still sleeping here :P
[06:50:46] <scanty> helf, if you never took benzos before
[06:50:53] <pyCube_> helf: eat a bunch of mushrooms
[06:50:55] <scanty> I guarantee you will be sleeping after 1 or 2 mg.
[06:50:57] <helf> heh
[06:51:01] <helf> doubt it! :P
[06:51:03] <helf> mail me one
[06:51:08] <helf> ill try it out
[06:51:15] <JonathanThompson> However, scanty is a drug addict, so it doesn't phase him much :)
[06:51:18] <helf> lol
[06:51:29] <scanty> yeah, drugs don't phase me anymore.
[06:51:30] <helf> wait, what is benzos short for?
[06:51:35] <scanty> benzodiazepienes
[06:51:52] <helf> i dont think ive had that before
[06:51:55] <helf> who knows
[06:51:58] <helf> mail me a pill
[06:52:02] <scanty> xanax, klonopin, ativan, serax, etc.
[06:52:07] <JonathanThompson> Jagged little pill?
[06:52:08] <helf> OH
[06:52:13] <helf> ive had xanax
[06:52:18] <helf> didnt do a thing to me
[06:52:31] <JonathanThompson> Spelled in such a way you can write and say it backwards without confusion :)
[06:52:36] <helf> my sister gave me one one night i was over there and wasnt at all tired
[06:52:37] <helf> and she anted to go to bed
[06:52:45] <helf> :P
[06:52:49] <scanty> I had 4mg klonopin before class today.
[06:53:00] <scanty> and 2mg xanax just now.
[06:53:06] <helf> also, all the so called "energy" things dont affect me
[06:53:10] <scanty> I doubt I will be tired.
[06:53:19] <scanty> also, when on vicodin, they tell you not to have it with alcohol
[06:53:24] <scanty> like it makes any difference.
[06:53:38] <helf> hm
[06:53:47] <scanty> damn, I sound like a drug addict.
[06:53:52] <helf> my friend hasnt been online in ages and hasnt tried calling me like he always does
[06:53:59] * JonathanThompson reminds those online of his previous post
[06:54:01] <pyCube_> man.. that stuff is pretty bad for you
[06:54:17] <helf> scanty, you ARE one ;)
[06:54:29] <helf> pycube, what? the energy garbage?
[06:54:46] <pyCube_> pills
[06:54:49] <scanty> if you want energy, take 200mg modafinil when you wake up, and 200 more before bed.
[06:54:50] <helf> oh
[06:54:58] <scanty> guarantee you'll be up at least two days.
[06:54:58] <pyCube_> and that energy crap.. heh
[06:55:01] <helf> wtf is modafinil?
[06:55:13] * helf wants to try it and prove scanty wrong
[06:55:15] <JonathanThompson> A scanty-enabler, helf :P
[06:55:18] <helf> heh
[06:55:21] <scanty> it's a special drug that affects the brain, and they don't know exactly how it works.
[06:55:26] <scanty> but it promotes wakefulness
[06:55:30] <helf> i doubt itll keep me up
[06:55:33] <scanty> they generally give it to narcoleptics.
[06:55:33] <helf> ^_^
[06:55:40] <scanty> but I have terrible sleep issues.
[06:55:43] <scanty> so I get it
[06:55:46] <JonathanThompson> Always fun when something is prescribed that seems to work, but they can't tell you why, because they don't know...
[06:55:47] <helf> send me some
[06:55:48] <helf> :P
[06:55:50] <scanty> so I can stay awake and alert during the day.
[06:55:51] <pyCube_> theres a reason your body say, "dude! i am tired!"
[06:56:05] <helf> pycube : because its a prty pooper
[06:56:21] <scanty> i don't get tired.
[06:56:22] <JonathanThompson> All parties have some poop sooner or later, helf.
[06:56:29] <helf> heh
[06:56:32] <pyCube_> scanty: maybe its all the pills
[06:56:35] <scanty> seriously though, modafinil actually works.
[06:56:40] <helf> crap, i have to be up in 6 hours
[06:56:51] * JonathanThompson warms up the nail gun to tuck in helf
[06:56:55] <scanty> pyCube_, I dunno, I went two months this summer with no meds at all
[06:57:00] <scanty> and still suffered from sleep problems
[06:57:05] <helf> modafinil, is that the stuff that lets you "go without sleep" supposedly with no side affects, other than lost of coherent thought? :P
[06:57:14] <pyCube_> sleeps problems < sleep problems + pills
[06:57:15] <JonathanThompson> I tend to be able to sleep less when the days are longer.
[06:57:29] <scanty> helf, I've never lost coherent thought whilst on it.
[06:57:30] <scanty> so I dunno
[06:57:35] <helf> when the days get shorter
[06:57:36] <JonathanThompson> Or rather, I won't have much choice.
[06:57:39] <scanty> but maybe it does different thins to different people.
[06:57:41] <helf> i tend to be MORE awake all the time
[06:57:50] <helf> like right now. i got up at 6am, im still wide awake
[06:58:06] <JonathanThompson> It gets rather annoying when you're waking up at 5 a.m. or before, even though you didn't want to.
[06:58:14] <helf> heh
[06:58:17] <scanty> i just never get tired at night.
[06:58:20] <scanty> it's really weird.
[06:58:25] <helf> yeah, i wake up more at night
[06:58:28] <scanty> i'm going to have a sleep study done though.
[06:58:33] <JonathanThompson> Or before that time, when I lived in Indiana that didn't observe Daylight Savings Time.
[06:58:41] <scanty> to make sure something is seriously not wrong with me.
[06:58:43] <JonathanThompson> Take good notes, scanty :P
[06:58:48] <scanty> haha JT
[06:58:51] <helf> i love being awake and doing stuf at night
[06:58:57] <scanty> JT: they observe DST in indiana now.
[06:59:16] <JonathanThompson> Scary, that: I move out, and shortly after, they finally decide to implement it all over.
[06:59:21] <helf> i'd seriously like a 3rd shift jo
[06:59:22] <helf> job
[06:59:24] <JonathanThompson> There's been a part that was always on CST.
[06:59:39] <JonathanThompson> You may have to settle for a 3rd shift Jo, helf.
[06:59:45] <helf> not all of indiana didnt observe dst
[07:00:00] <helf> as long as its a josaphene or something :P
[07:00:01] <pyCube_> i am hoping i can get sleep patterns adjusted for a semi-normal work day
[07:00:03] * JonathanThompson slaps helf for not making a logical statement knowingly, not
[07:00:10] <helf> heh
[07:00:19] <helf> wait
[07:00:20] <helf> omg
[07:00:22] <pyCube_> i am way used to not even starting work till 10pm or so
[07:00:23] <scanty> i wish I had a sleep pattern
[07:00:26] <helf> "doesnt not not observe dst
[07:00:29] <helf> or sometihng
[07:00:30] <helf> shutup
[07:00:31] <pyCube_> scanty: heh.. yeah, exactly
[07:00:35] <helf> im losing thought patterns
[07:00:47] <umccullough> it's not as if it isn't not all right to not make double negative comments
[07:00:48] <pyCube_> helf: az doesnt mess with all that dst nonsense
[07:00:55] <JonathanThompson> Could you restate your stateless state of confusion, helf? :)
[07:00:57] <helf> dst blows
[07:01:01] <helf> heh
[07:01:13] <helf> I hate double negations
[07:01:20] <pyCube_> i love them
[07:01:22] <helf> I hear them all day long
[07:01:27] <JonathanThompson> They're so positvely negative, helf :)
[07:01:28] <pyCube_> theyre a lot of fun
[07:01:51] <pyCube_> whats hilariou is when people get all bent out of shape about them
[07:01:54] <helf> i wont never not not not say that again
[07:01:55] <pyCube_> hilarious too
[07:02:04] <helf> i dont get bent out of shape, it just annoys me :)
[07:02:04] <JonathanThompson> Around here, locals talk about "U-Dub" as though it's perfectly logical to use that.
[07:02:12] <pyCube_> like being all "letter of the law"ish about grammar
[07:02:13] <scanty> listen, you either speak proper english or you don't.
[07:02:38] <helf> at least people are consistent with the negatives when they do it
[07:02:45] <JonathanThompson> The first few times, I thought I wasn't hearing them speak correctly, as though they were mumbling near the end.
[07:02:48] <umccullough> i don't not speak proper english :)
[07:02:49] <pyCube_> its about communicating an idea.. most double negs are super obvious in intended meaning
[07:03:02] <scanty> yeah bu tthey sound stupid.
[07:03:13] <JonathanThompson> What's ironic is the lazy speech in reference ot a university, of course :)
[07:03:14] <pyCube_> if the thought is transmitted succesfully, its "proper grammar"
[07:03:19] <helf> no its not
[07:03:31] <helf> its "well, i got my point across while butchering the said language"
[07:03:33] <pyCube_> scanty: thats a social rule, not a linguistic reality
[07:03:34] <helf> :P
[07:03:43] <scanty> no, it's proper communication.
[07:03:44] <JonathanThompson> What helf typed :P
[07:03:54] <pyCube_> scanty: "proper" according to who?
[07:04:04] <pyCube_> and in what era?
[07:04:10] <pyCube_> all that is social nonsense
[07:04:15] <helf> is not
[07:04:16] <JonathanThompson> Granted, all human-spoken languages are always in a state of flux.
[07:04:21] <scanty> ugh.
[07:04:21] <pyCube_> toolas for drawing lines around classes
[07:04:24] <scanty> I'm not even getting into this.
[07:04:31] <helf> the rule sets evolve, but they do help to keep the language understandable by a large protion of speakers
[07:04:31] <scanty> such a a pointless argument.
[07:04:38] <scanty> there's a way to speak proper english, and there isn't.
[07:04:48] <pyCube_> according to somebody
[07:04:52] <scanty> if you want to sound professional in a professional environment, you won't use double negatives
[07:04:56] <scanty> and make yourself sound like an idiot.
[07:04:59] <JonathanThompson> Well, americans don't get taught it by default unless perhaps they go to England :P
[07:05:08] <pyCube_> its not a real property of anything other than social rules
[07:05:27] <helf> lol jt
[07:05:44] <JonathanThompson> It's so true, though: in England, a rubber isn't something you put on your peter.
[07:05:48] <pyCube_> scanty: double negs dont sound any more idiotic than a british person sounds distinguished
[07:05:48] <scanty> yeah, and rules are stupid.
[07:05:49] <JonathanThompson> You use it on paper.
[07:05:50] <scanty> apparently.
[07:06:03] <scanty> tha'ts just your opinion.
[07:06:05] <helf> wont never not do that!
[07:06:07] <pyCube_> no its not
[07:06:08] <umccullough> perhaps it's really a not pointful argument
[07:06:10] <helf> hyuk
[07:06:15] * JonathanThompson imagines what sort of weird image that could create, something substituting words just right
[07:06:16] <scanty> yeah it is.
[07:06:24] <scanty> since I disagree, it's your opinion.
[07:06:25] <scanty> end of story.
[07:06:38] <scanty> the earth is flat, too.
[07:06:42] <pyCube_> social constructs are such that in the usa, if you want your radio add to sound classy, you hire a brit to read it
[07:06:45] <helf> I KNEW IT
[07:07:08] <scanty> and the sun revolves round the earth.
[07:07:15] <JonathanThompson> Hey helf, if two Wongs get married, chances are they won't have a Wright child, because according to genetics, two Wongs don't make a Wright :P
[07:07:24] <helf> oh god
[07:07:28] <helf> lol
[07:07:46] <helf> reading your brains output is higlhy amusing
[07:07:59] <helf> highly
[07:08:01] <helf> MOST AMUSING
[07:08:57] <JonathanThompson> Sunday morning I had a dream where someone presented a math problem, filled in coefficients from 8-25, and explained it related to eating coffee cake, and taking a bit more off of it each time in some ratio.
[07:09:06] <helf> eetret
[07:09:08] <helf> woops
[07:09:18] <pyCube_> scanty: i dont understand what is opinion about stating that "idioticness" and "properness" have more to do with social/cultural imposed rules than they do with communication
[07:09:22] <JonathanThompson> helf ?
[07:09:24] <Begasus> bbl
[07:09:40] *** Begasus has quit IRC
[07:09:41] <helf> sorry, thought my ssh session had frozen, just lag
[07:10:17] <scanty> I don't know what you're getting at right now.
[07:10:22] * JonathanThompson wonders what dream interpreters or psychiatrists would make out of doing math on coffee cakes in dreams
[07:10:23] <scanty> I disagree with you, let's just leave it at that.
[07:10:29] <pyCube_> i mean, you cant "sound like an idiot", you can only be heard as an idiot
[07:10:40] <scanty> go read any nonfiction book, or technical text and you won't encounter any imporper english.
[07:10:51] <umccullough> eh?
[07:10:54] <JonathanThompson> Well, ideally that'd be true...
[07:10:57] <scanty> and don't give me the "but who's to say what is proper" bullshit.
[07:11:01] <scanty> because that's a silly argument.
[07:11:04] <pyCube_> why?
[07:11:10] <pyCube_> why is it silly?
[07:11:26] <scanty> dude, I'm done.
[07:11:29] <pyCube_> i dont really understand what youre actually diagreeing with
[07:11:33] <pyCube_> sheesh.. ok
[07:11:34] <scanty> I have stated my opinions
[07:11:39] * JonathanThompson has read too many non-fiction and technical articles that made him cringe and a bit confused from butchery of any accepted language
[07:11:54] <pyCube_> that country folk are idiots because they dont speak like you want them to?
[07:12:01] <helf> oh, turst me, you CAN "sound" like an idiot. I have to help people all day long at work that 'sound' like idiots
[07:12:28] <helf> heh
[07:12:29] <scanty> I don't want anything from anyone.
[07:12:36] <scanty> if you live in this country, you should speak the language properly.
[07:12:38] <scanty> that's all.
[07:12:43] <pyCube_> according to somebody
[07:12:50] <JonathanThompson> What about employers?  Don't you want your paychecks? :)
[07:12:53] <scanty> speaking properly and communicating are two different things entirely.
[07:13:09] <helf> heh
[07:13:24] <helf> woo, getting a 2gb scsi drive for my NeXT for 15 bucks
[07:13:31] <helf> one thats tested and we KNOW works with it
[07:13:39] <pyCube_> i am just saying that the only idiotic sounds sentences are the ones that make no sense whatsoever.. truely grammatical/syntactical nightmares
[07:13:39] * JonathanThompson wonders if he'd be better understood via telepathy than by writing or speech
[07:13:43] <umccullough> helf shouldn't someone be paying YOU to take it?
[07:13:44] <scanty> 2gb... wow you can fit like 7 mp3s on that.
[07:14:06] <scanty> pyCube_, yes, as you say, "according to someone"
[07:14:07] <umccullough> wow, what 7 MP3 files fill up 2gb?
[07:14:14] <JonathanThompson> And I remember using that size of drive in CD-ROM premastering, and thinking, "Wow, we can put 3 images on that!"
[07:14:14] <helf> well, finding drives that work in black hardware without a ton of fiddling is a pain in the arse
[07:14:33] <scanty> umccullough, a couple of 2 hour DJ sets at 320Kbps maybe.
[07:14:33] <JonathanThompson> These days, you may not fit one OS on it :P
[07:14:46] <pyCube_> scanty: no,, like chomsky's "Colorless green dreams sleep furiously".
[07:14:49] <helf> NS or OS take like 100mb :P
[07:14:54] <pyCube_> er
[07:15:03] <pyCube_> not
[07:15:10] <umccullough> haiku fits in 100mb :)
[07:15:25] <helf> his envious, clear, deams sleep soundly. makes sense :)
[07:15:30] <helf> dreams
[07:15:31] <JonathanThompson> As long as you don't add in SeaMonkey :)
[07:15:34] <helf> heh
[07:16:00] <helf> im starting fresh on my color next. openstep 4.2 + updates + all the apps i actually use and gcc and a few other things.. should run about 1.2-1.3gb
[07:16:13] <scanty> gcc what version? ^_^
[07:16:16] <JonathanThompson> I wonder how much of memory usage I see for that is from leaks, how much from heap fragmentation, and how much is silly long-term caching.
[07:16:38] <pyCube_> scanty: anyway.. i am not suggesting writing encyclopedias in arkansasish.. functional properness makes sense
[07:16:41] <helf> someone finally got openssh server working and ported over some newer mail related things so SSL works over pop3 and imap :)
[07:16:55] *** kokito has quit IRC
[07:17:06] <scanty> heh i heard mmu_man is porting haiku to m68k
[07:17:13] <scanty> maybe you have it on your next someday, helf
[07:17:30] <helf> jt: my NeXT has 128mb of ram, even with a crap load of apps running and the machine being on for weeks.. ill have like 60mb of free ram. iv eyet to max out my ram
[07:17:37] <helf> that'd be cool
[07:17:57] <scanty> helf, you can't max out your ram because there's only 3 or 4 apps you can run :P
[07:17:59] * JonathanThompson laughs at the gushing over Time Machine's incremental backup feature, when in reality, the only really BIG thing is that Time Machine has made it easy for anyone to backup regularly
[07:18:01] <helf> shorlty ill also be able to stream music off the web among other things :)
[07:18:09] <helf> ha, scanty :P
[07:18:18] <scanty> it's got a DSP I hope?
[07:18:19] <helf> i have over 50 programsi nstalled. lol. including mathematica
[07:18:22] <helf> yes
[07:18:26] <helf> a motorola 56000
[07:18:32] <scanty> ok because I don't htink the '040 has a  FPU even
[07:18:36] <helf> oit does
[07:18:37] <JonathanThompson> Ah, Mathematica could max out your RAM usage.
[07:18:42] <scanty> ah
[07:18:46] <helf> jt, ive rarely used it
[07:18:50] <pyCube_> thats one app i have yet to actually see/use
[07:18:51] <scanty> maybe the 020 doesn't then
[07:18:55] <helf> the 040 is a decent cpu
[07:19:04] <JonathanThompson> Of course, first you need to know how to do things in it to have it accomplish that :)
[07:19:04] <scanty> 060 even more so.
[07:19:18] <helf> i wish they had made a 060 next
[07:19:35] <helf> you could theoretically stick a 060 in a current next
[07:19:44] <scanty> is the bus on the 68k 24 or 32 wide?
[07:19:45] <JonathanThompson> helf, I set before you a challenge to accomplish with Mathematica as your only tool: create something that generates mazes randomly :)
[07:19:49] <pyCube_> i bet you could even get a kitten in a next
[07:19:54] <helf> have some sort of glue between it and the systme translating a few differing opcodes back and forth
[07:20:00] <pyCube_> theoretically of course
[07:20:06] <helf> i hate you :P
[07:20:09] <JonathanThompson> 32 wide, scanty.
[07:20:10] <helf> scanty, 32
[07:20:19] <helf> its a proper 32bit cpu ;)
[07:20:43] <scanty> is a long 32 or 16 bits wide?
[07:20:47] <JonathanThompson> Just not superscalar.
[07:20:54] <JonathanThompson> 32 bits, purely, scanty.
[07:20:58] <helf> yeah
[07:21:05] <helf> its not superscalar? is the 060?
[07:21:17] <JonathanThompson> I don't know: does it matter, if you couldn't get one? :)
[07:21:32] <scanty> i always thought longs were 16 bits wide on 68k
[07:21:33] <scanty> oh well
[07:21:40] <scanty> fuck motorola
[07:21:49] <scanty> and their crackhead architectures.
[07:21:55] <scanty> PPC nuff said.
[07:22:06] <pyCube_> heh
[07:22:23] <helf> the 060 is superscalar
[07:22:31] <helf> 68k is an awesome arch
[07:22:33] <pyCube_> i am glad i know nothing about all that hw stuff
[07:22:38] <helf> :P
[07:22:49] <pyCube_> electricity and such
[07:22:51] * helf hugs his 68k powered equipment
[07:22:52] <scanty> 65c816 blows 68k out of the water.
[07:23:05] <scanty> 68k only had higher clock speed
[07:23:06] <scanty> big shits.
[07:23:11] <helf> 65c816 blows the 68k, you mean ;)
[07:23:48] <helf> would be interesting to see a 65816 'updated' a bit and running much faster
[07:23:49] <scanty> 68k blows you mean :P
[07:23:57] <helf> your mind
[07:23:58] <helf> ^_^
[07:23:58] <scanty> I want to see the proper 32-bit 65xxx
[07:23:59] <umccullough> now children...
[07:24:05] <helf> make one scanty
[07:24:08] <scanty> there was one, but it never made production.
[07:24:10] <helf> go grab and FPGA
[07:24:14] <scanty> I could do it on a FPGA
[07:24:15] <JonathanThompson> Too bad the 65c816 had an 8 bit data base.
[07:24:16] <helf> *an
[07:24:32] <JonathanThompson> And a duplexed address bus, too.
[07:24:35] <JonathanThompson> (IIRC)
[07:24:39] <helf> 65c816 = 8/16bit bastard child, 68k = 32bit clean
[07:24:45] <helf> what trumps what? :P
[07:25:17] <helf> 68k = 120mhz and up... specially if you count coldfusion cpus in the 68k line
[07:25:40] <helf> er
[07:25:41] <helf> coldfire
[07:25:43] <helf> ^_^
[07:25:45] <scanty> nah, 65816 had 16bit A, X, Y,SP, and ALU
[07:26:06] <helf> "5" registers?
[07:26:35] <scanty> yeah and a dead simple ISA.
[07:26:42] <JonathanThompson> helf, doing a quick Wiki hit, the 68060 was superscalar, just barely, but the 68040 wasn't.  Yes, it was pipelined, but not supercalar.
[07:26:48] <JonathanThompson> +s
[07:27:08] <helf> jt, ah ok
[07:27:22] <scanty> can we at least all agree that the 6502 was better than the z80 :D
[07:27:26] <helf> 060 had onpar performance with the early pentium cpus
[07:27:29] <JonathanThompson> And it seems the article states the 68040 had heat issues :)
[07:27:32] <helf> scanty, agreed :)
[07:27:35] <JonathanThompson> Are you SURE you want to push one hard? :)
[07:27:45] <helf> heh
[07:27:46] <helf> well
[07:28:00] <helf> it is the only cpu ive ever had that required a heatsink while running at 25mhz..
[07:28:14] <helf> my p5 ran without anything just fine ^_^
[07:28:19] <helf> *p75
[07:28:32] <helf> my P5s run hot as shit :P
[07:28:39] <helf> (pentium pros)
[07:28:58] * JonathanThompson remembers his first Pentium Heater experience via work
[07:29:00] <umccullough> not even a heatsink?
[07:29:19] <helf> umc, yeah, ran ok without anything on it
[07:29:20] <scanty> i don't htink my usparc-iii have active cooling.
[07:29:40] <helf> my sparcstation20s supersparc chips get HOT
[07:29:44] <helf> they run at 75mhz
[07:30:05] <helf> scanty, the original 68000 was 16/32bit
[07:30:12] <helf> 16bit ALU and bus
[07:30:28] <scanty> see, when I think of 68k, I only think of sega genesis.
[07:30:38] <scanty> and since SNES was way better
[07:30:47] <scanty> I'm partial to 65c816 :)
[07:30:49] <helf> i LOVE my snes
[07:30:50] <helf> :P
[07:30:52] <helf> i can tell
[07:30:59] <helf> the 6502 was a great little chip
[07:31:06] <scanty> i have to get the damn 4.5mm security bit to fix my SNES
[07:31:20] <umccullough> scanty, i need one too :P
[07:31:22] <scanty> i'm going to do a 6502 in verilog one day.
[07:31:25] <JonathanThompson> scanty: the entire symbol table for 65c816 opcodes only takes exactly 768 bytes, uncompressed, not using spaces :)
[07:31:26] <helf> mine has that blasted color problem
[07:31:31] <helf> where the crystal gets too hot or something
[07:31:33] <JonathanThompson> After all, all opcodes were 3 characters long in the assembly.
[07:31:38] <scanty> helf, yeah, black and white only?
[07:31:42] <helf> yeah
[07:31:44] <helf> after awhile
[07:31:45] <scanty> yup
[07:31:50] <scanty> faulty colourburst crystal.
[07:31:55] <scanty> if you leave it in the freezer over night
[07:32:00] <scanty> you'll get colour again for a few hours.
[07:32:05] <helf> well, i leave it on my hardwood floor
[07:32:12] <helf> stays color through a few hours of playing
[07:32:16] <scanty> but the proper fix is to get a new 3.5795454545454545454545454..... xtal
[07:32:26] <helf> like im gonna do that :P
[07:32:31] <umccullough> that looks like a familiar freq.
[07:32:41] <helf> ntsc halved
[07:32:44] <scanty> umccullough, yeah, that's the NTSC colourburst.
[07:32:44] <helf> i think
[07:32:48] <helf> or something
[07:32:49] <helf> waht is it?
[07:32:50] <helf> oh
[07:32:54] * JonathanThompson hands helf a t-shirt that says, "I'm a cheapskate and would rather have b/w graphics than spend a few bucks"
[07:32:59] <umccullough> scanty, i mean i think it's the same freq used for directv smartcard reader/writers ;)
[07:33:10] * umccullough goes to check
[07:33:11] <helf> jt : damn straight :P
[07:33:11] <scanty> ah
[07:33:25] <scanty> yeah, they can only cut xtals so accurately.
[07:33:42] <JonathanThompson> Of course, I'm using as my main machine something from (mostly) 1999....
[07:33:44] <helf> walk into radioshack " i need an xtal with a freq of 3.579545454545454545454.." "uuhh.." "you dont have that?!?!"
[07:34:07] <scanty> walk into radio shack and ask for a reisistor.
[07:34:12] <helf> jt, i mostly use my NeXT still
[07:34:14] <JonathanThompson> The big difference is that I have to worry about bills, while helf still lives at home :)
[07:34:15] <helf> 1991... ;)
[07:34:17] <scanty> if you're lucky you get those annoying blue 1% reistors.
[07:34:23] <scanty> which you can't read the colour code on to save your life.
[07:34:28] <helf> jt, i have bills. twit :P
[07:34:34] <helf> heh
[07:34:38] <JonathanThompson> Are you renting an apartment yet, helf?
[07:34:53] <helf> no
[07:34:55] <helf> screw that
[07:34:56] <helf> :P
[07:35:02] <JonathanThompson> See?  You're the twit without bills :P
[07:35:05] <helf> i dont make enough
[07:35:08] <helf> i have SOME bills ^_^
[07:35:15] <scanty> i live at home still and I got lots of bills
[07:35:24] <helf> cell, landline, cable tv, insurance.. etc
[07:35:25] <scanty> phone, health insurnace, credit cards, school loans, etc.
[07:35:26] <JonathanThompson> Yeah: you have to feed your high-risk car insurance pool :)
[07:35:32] <helf> bank loan
[07:35:33] <helf> heh
[07:35:35] <helf> silence
[07:35:36] <helf> :P
[07:35:45] <helf> i want a diesel rabbit as my next car :)
[07:35:57] <helf> insurance on that aught to be 100 buck sfor full coverage :D
[07:36:02] <scanty> nah just get a mercedes turbodiesel.
[07:36:02] * JonathanThompson hands helf a rabbit with a bad leg and a gas engine and tells him, "Make do with it!"
[07:36:08] <scanty> drive in style, and fill up at burgerking.
[07:36:11] <helf> heh
[07:36:15] <helf> bleh
[07:36:18] <helf> i dont like those
[07:36:22] <scanty> should change the hoses though.
[07:36:23] <helf> even if they are a dime a dozen
[07:36:26] <umccullough> scanty, yep - got a few of those xtals lying around ;)
[07:36:36] <scanty> cool
[07:36:47] <scanty> they're fairly comon frequency.
[07:37:02] <scanty> or at least they used to be.
[07:37:06] <umccullough> dishnet uses 3.68
[07:37:13] <umccullough> i have both
[07:37:14] <JonathanThompson> helf, I can see it now, if mmu_man actually successfully completes the 68K port of Haiku, you'll be running it on your boxes :)
[07:37:18] <umccullough> er...cuz they're useful ;)
[07:37:24] <helf> jt, at least one box
[07:37:25] <scanty> hehe
[07:37:26] <helf> heck
[07:37:33] <helf> ill let him borrow my mono station for testing :P
[07:37:38] <helf> barrow
[07:37:43] <helf> borrow
[07:37:46] <helf> ...
[07:37:48] * JonathanThompson wonders how many GL Teapots such a beast will do per second
[07:37:49] <scanty> yeah I hope it works in 240V land.
[07:37:58] <helf> with a step converter ^_^
[07:38:18] <helf> wtf is with the UK and 240v
[07:38:21] <helf> nothing needs 240v
[07:38:30] <helf> if it does, itll just step it up
[07:38:36] <helf> 240 = crazy
[07:38:37] <JonathanThompson> helf, Saturday night (late) I made the day of a cashier/clerk at the local Albertson's grocery store.
[07:38:47] <scanty> it's not just the UK
[07:38:49] <scanty> it's most of europe.
[07:38:50] <helf> what did you do?
[07:38:52] <helf> i know
[07:39:05] <scanty> 120V tickles.
[07:39:08] <scanty> 240 just plain hurts.
[07:39:12] <JonathanThompson> I walked in, she was stocking something, and turned briefly to me, and asked, "May I help you find anything?" I asked, "Which aisle are the cat stretchers in?"
[07:39:21] <helf> ive had 120 run thorugh me. wasnt that bad
[07:39:27] <helf> lol
[07:39:37] <helf> not had 240v yet..
[07:39:41] <JonathanThompson> I've had 240 go through me from a function generator I was working on, didn't feel good :)
[07:39:47] <helf> though if i get the machine i want, ill have to run 240 to my room
[07:40:00] <scanty> what machine is this?
[07:40:13] <helf> symbolics 3600.. :]
[07:40:15] <scanty> washing machine?
[07:40:27] * helf loves LISP
[07:40:39] <helf> even if i barely know it and suck at it
[07:40:48] <helf> i wouldnt mind an XL1200
[07:40:52] * JonathanThompson gives helf a shot of novocaine so he can LISP correctly
[07:40:53] <scanty> cantchu just get a LISP interpreter for your PC
[07:40:54] <helf> but i want the original ;D
[07:40:59] <umccullough> helf, easiest way to get electronic components is digikey, btw
[07:41:05] <helf> scanty, that takes all the fun out of it
[07:41:11] <scanty> yeah but they got a 20 dollar limit
[07:41:16] <scanty> or else they charge your more money.
[07:41:17] <umccullough> they do?
[07:41:18] <helf> umc, i get digikeys catalog for some reason already :P
[07:41:19] <umccullough> that's new :P
[07:41:24] <scanty> so if you only need a few things, go with jameco.
[07:41:30] <umccullough> mouser or jameco :)
[07:41:37] <scanty> umccullough, really, i've been ordering with digikey for years... and they always had a limit.
[07:41:41] <helf> i have no idea why i get digikeys cat
[07:41:47] <scanty> mouser's pretty good they usually stock everything.
[07:41:53] <helf> i need to get into hardware more
[07:41:53] <JonathanThompson> Hey helf, what are you going to major in at college, other than girls?
[07:41:54] <umccullough> scanty, strange - i guess it was back in 2001 when i last ordered shit from them
[07:42:01] <scanty> oh hehe
[07:42:05] <helf> jt, dunno
[07:42:08] <umccullough> or maybe i always ended up getting $20 or more worth of shit
[07:42:16] <scanty> if you get free samples from TI, they ususally come from digipee
[07:42:19] <helf> i never get any girls. so i doubt ill major in that :P
[07:42:38] <helf> unless you meant majoring in rejection
[07:42:49] <umccullough> i once got a shitload of free samples from maxi - rs232 controllers and shit
[07:42:51] <JonathanThompson> Perhaps you'll mount a study on mounting that mountain and wind up on top of the reason you're winding up on bottom with nobody on top, helf :)
[07:42:57] <helf> heh
[07:43:05] <scanty> yeah maxim/dallas are really cool about samples.
[07:43:12] <umccullough> maxim, right
[07:43:19] <scanty> they make nice SMPS controllers too, but they are annoying to work with
[07:43:26] <scanty> because they have two feedback loops to deal with
[07:43:27] <umccullough> complete with spec sheets - it was a PHAT envelope!
[07:43:28] <JonathanThompson> Maxim needs a new competitor named "Minum"
[07:43:30] <scanty> and you have to lay it out really carefully.
[07:43:57] <scanty> yeah, I get engineering catalog things from maxim every month
[07:44:02] <scanty> good article in this issue about SMPSUs
[07:44:03] <helf> I was looking at some circuit diagrams.. after figuring out what all the symbols meant.. its not hard to read at all
[07:44:24] <JonathanThompson> The fun part comes in figuring out all the details of how to create circuits that do what you want.
[07:44:30] <helf> heh
[07:44:30] <helf> yeah
[07:44:33] <JonathanThompson> And the higher the speed of the signals, the more fun that gets.
[07:44:42] <umccullough> actually, the fun part is etching boards! :D
[07:44:46] <JonathanThompson> (Frequency)
[07:44:58] <scanty> hehe I still work point to point
[07:45:01] <helf> ill stick to wirewrapping :P
[07:45:01] <umccullough> just need a good laser printer and some muriatic acid ;)
[07:45:21] <JonathanThompson> And somewhere to make a mess of the air quality and dump the waste :)
[07:45:23] <scanty> my nixie clock is all point to point.
[07:45:27] <scanty> even the SMPSSU
[07:45:31] <scanty> SMPSU*
[07:45:42] <umccullough> bah muriatic acid is what they use to clean concrete tools
[07:45:43] <helf> oh man, i have a pic of a wirewrapped video board for a lisp machine
[07:45:46] <helf> its crazy
[07:45:53] <helf> it look sos nice too
[07:45:54] <JonathanThompson> Super Messy Poor State University, scanty? :)
[07:46:01] <scanty> yes :)
[07:46:21] <helf> like 100+ ICs on one board. all wirewrapped
[07:46:27] <JonathanThompson> umccullough, but what about the metal you etch away? :)
[07:46:35] <scanty> http://ttl.nonlogic.org/eli/incoming/nixpsu_board.png
[07:46:44] <scanty> all short wires are on the bottom of the board.
[07:46:48] <scanty> usually I wire on top
[07:46:55] <scanty> but in this case, I had to make everything short and thick
[07:46:58] <scanty> so you dn't see anything on top
[07:47:47] <scanty> here's some topside: http://ttl.nonlogic.org/eli/incoming/nixie_board_new.png
[07:47:56] <helf> crap, its almost 1am
[07:47:58] <helf> i need to go
[07:48:05] <JonathanThompson> Bye helf, sleepyhead :)
[07:48:22] <helf> scanty, ill send you some pics of the machine later
[07:48:23] <scanty> seeeya helf.
[07:48:26] <scanty> cool
[07:48:37] <umccullough> JonathanThompson, you mean the copper?
[07:48:44] <helf> also, enjoy these fun filled pics of my trinitron + me bored + strong magnets ;)
[07:48:45] <JonathanThompson> Yes, that...
[07:48:54] <umccullough> JonathanThompson, what's wrong with copper?
[07:48:57] <helf> http://helf.freeshell.org/crt_mags/
[07:49:14] <JonathanThompson> Well, where do you dump it?
[07:49:29] <scanty> see, I wouldn't do that do a CRT,
[07:49:32] <scanty> at least not my own.
[07:49:35] <umccullough> hmm... on the ground, down the drain...does it matter? ;)
[07:49:45] <scanty> i tall ends up in our drinking water anyway.
[07:49:52] <helf> scanty, its almost dead anyways
[07:49:53] <scanty> which is why I only drink spring waters :)
[07:49:56] <helf> :P
[07:49:59] <JonathanThompson> I expect sewage treatment centers wouldn't appreciate that in a big bunch :)
[07:50:00] <helf> might as well enjoy it
[07:50:02] <umccullough> copper isn't exactly the worst thing in the world
[07:50:13] <scanty> hehe too much copper can be toxic for you
[07:50:25] <scanty> most metals are like that actually
[07:50:26] * JonathanThompson wonders what keeps the copper on the board until it's etched off
[07:50:27] <umccullough> JonathanThompson, it's basically dissolved anyway
[07:50:47] <helf> I hear mercury is a good painkiller
[07:50:56] <umccullough> good question - i don't know what they use to copper-clad a copper-clad board :D
[07:51:01] <scanty> it's copper plated expoxy-glass I think
[07:51:15] <umccullough> how does the copper stick?
[07:51:21] <helf> magick
[07:51:28] <scanty> no idea
[07:51:35] <scanty> I haven't much experience in etching PCBs
[07:51:42] <umccullough> i know if you heat it up too much with a soldering iron, it comes off
[07:51:45] <helf> ok, night all
[07:51:49] <scanty> maybe some kind of electroplating business.
[07:51:52] <scanty> seeya helf.
[07:51:52] *** rhu has quit IRC
[07:51:53] * JonathanThompson sends helf some Z's
[07:52:16] <JonathanThompson> And if he were Canadian, it'd be some Zed's :)
[07:52:24] <scanty> eheheh
[07:53:00] <scanty> i have to setup mips toolchain this weekend
[07:53:01] * JonathanThompson has had several people ask, "Are you Canadian?"
[07:53:06] <scanty> I hate building gcc.
[07:53:18] <scanty> and friends.
[07:53:18] <JonathanThompson> It's much more fun to crash it :)
[07:53:50] <umccullough> i'm going to sleep i think
[07:54:01] <scanty> seeya, umccullough
[07:54:01] <JonathanThompson> Don't dream about things I'd dream about, umccullough :)
[07:54:04] <scanty> sleep well
[07:54:05] <JonathanThompson> Might scare you silly.
[07:54:12] <umccullough> 10 virtual machines is more than this laptop can handle :(
[07:54:35] <scanty> probably I'll take off too.
[07:54:40] <scanty> I got a game of punch-out to play
[07:54:44] <scanty> on my PSP :)
[07:54:52] <JonathanThompson> Seeya, scanty.
[07:54:57] <scanty> g'nite
[07:54:58] <JonathanThompson> Knock your lights out :P
[07:55:05] <scanty> hehe hopefully
[07:55:12] <scanty> if it hits me back, surely I will sleep :)
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[09:29:21] <plfiorini> hi
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[09:42:42] <plfiorini> DaaT!!
[09:43:44] <DaaT> plfiorini!!
[09:43:51] <DaaT> how's it going?
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[09:53:23] * DaaT pokes slaad
[09:53:43] <slaad> Heyoo.
[09:53:57] <DaaT> how goes it down under?
[09:54:16] <slaad> Not too bad.
[09:54:23] <slaad> The Wife(tm) is away for the weekend.
[09:54:27] <slaad> So coding, here I come \o/
[09:54:31] <DaaT> uh oh
[09:54:43] <DaaT> ah, you'll be partying hard I see
[09:54:47] <slaad> Yup!
[09:54:48] <DaaT> :P
[09:54:51] <DaaT> crazy man
[09:55:03] <DaaT> hey, you hit a couple of homeruns back in september
[09:55:09] <slaad> Woo!
[09:55:10] <DaaT> way to go !
[09:55:14] <slaad> I've not played my Wii for ages :(
[09:55:21] * DaaT slaps slaad
[09:55:24] <DaaT> shame on you!!
[09:55:29] <DaaT> now go sit in the corner
[09:55:30] <slaad> I know.
[09:55:40] <DaaT> been playing Call of Duty 3
[09:55:51] <DaaT> and today, Metroid Prime 3 COMES OUT HERE IN PT!!!
[09:56:05] <slaad> PT?
[09:56:15] <slaad> How is COD3? I'm wary of ports.
[09:56:36] <DaaT> Portugal *slap*
[09:56:41] <DaaT> cod3 is fun
[09:56:49] <DaaT> not the best of games I guess, but it's fun
[09:57:11] <DaaT> and even if the controls aren't up to metroid's level (from what I read), it's still quite precise in aiming
[09:57:27] <slaad> Oh, right!
[09:57:34] <slaad> It's not out here until the 11th or something, here.
[10:03:47] <slaad> Dinner tiem.
[10:08:41] <DaaT> enjoy
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[10:17:26] <DaaT> bbl
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[15:10:37] <helf_> hey evil
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[15:17:44] <mmu_man> ...failed Link generated/objects/haiku/m68k/release/system/libroot/libroot.so ...
[15:17:45] <mmu_man> ...skipped libbe.so for lack of libroot.so...
[15:17:54] <mmu_man> \o/
[15:17:59] <mmu_man> means everything compiles
[15:18:29] <DeadYak> yay
[15:18:38] <DeadYak> what's wrong with linking?
[15:18:52] <helf_> hey dead
[15:19:06] <helf_> who was it thats thinking about a 68k port of haiku?
[15:19:09] <DeadYak> thinking?
[15:19:18] <helf_> or working on one
[15:19:21] <DeadYak> mmu_man
[15:19:36] <helf_> mmu_man, ill lend a NeXT to the cause :)
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[15:21:08] <DeadYak> helf_: which chip did those use?
[15:21:11] <helf_> A specced out NeXTStation Turbo Color
[15:21:19] <DeadYak> helf_: 030/040?
[15:21:20] <helf_> 030 or 040 varying from 25 to 33mhz
[15:21:22] <DeadYak> ah
[15:21:45] <helf_> non turbos use a 25mhz 030 or 040, turbos use a 33mhz 040 and some have a turbo chipset with a 25mhz 040
[15:22:06] <helf_> turbo chipset = 128mb of ram instead of just 64 and its 72pin edo
[15:22:37] <helf_> It is amazing just how useful NeXTs, Atari Falcon, Amigas still are :)
[15:25:27] <mmu_man> helf_: nice :)
[15:25:52] <mmu_man> DeadYak: many broken stuff still
[15:26:08] <mmu_man> seems there is an off by one in the underscore count on syscalls
[15:26:54] <helf_> anyways, if needed, i can let whoever borrow a turbo color. either have 64 or 128mb of ram and a 2 or 4gb scsi hdd and i can probably send it with a cd drive. ill also send the video adapter for normal VGA (has to support sync on green though)
[15:27:49] <mmu_man> hmm having a problem with syscall generation:
[15:28:58] <mmu_man> moveq.l #n,%d0 but cpp takes #n literaly as "output n quoted"
[15:29:14] <mmu_man> giving moveq.l "192"n%d0 :^)
[15:29:23] <mmu_man> giving moveq.l "192";%d0 :^)
[15:29:26] <mmu_man> whatever
[15:29:44] <mmu_man> hmm I could trick it with lea...
[15:29:47] <helf_> oh, wow, i totally missed what you said earlier when i asked who was working on the 68k port..
[15:30:04] <DeadYak> I did wonder about that :P
[15:30:11] * IcePic tries to connect "moveq" with syscall generation. ;)
[15:30:17] <helf_> it was outside my scroll buffer and i didnt bother looking :)
[15:30:40] <helf_> moveq... now thats an instruction ive not seen in a loong time.
[15:30:44] <helf_> :)
[15:30:49] <mmu_man> brb
[15:30:57] <helf_> this brings back palmOS memories
[15:31:40] <helf_> when changing something to 7000 or 7001 (moveq #0/1, d0) cuased programs to become registered or to take any given serial code.. ;)
[15:33:53] <mmu_man> ah found a workaround
[15:34:00] <mmu_man> #define IMM #
[15:34:06] <mmu_man> move.l IMM n,%d0
[15:34:14] <helf_> Be awesome to one day be able to run Haiku on Amigas, Ataris, 3b1/3b2s, Vaxen, NeXTs.. :D
[15:34:22] <mmu_man> need to avoid moveq, we have more than 128 syscalls :)
[15:34:29] <helf_> what is your current platform target for the port, mmu_man ?
[15:34:48] <mmu_man> Atari Falcon
[15:34:53] <mmu_man> as I have an amu for that with mmu
[15:34:56] <mmu_man> ARAnyM
[15:35:02] <mmu_man> I have a real Mac LC III though
[15:35:11] <helf_> oh ok
[15:35:25] <helf_> but yeah, ill lend the NeXT some time if needed/wanted. brb
[15:39:35] <mmu_man> ahh, I was wondering...
[15:39:53] <mmu_man> I dopn't need _ mangling on m68k :)
[15:41:22] <mmu_man> what you get copy-pasting x86 code :)
[15:42:03] <mmu_man> yes \o/
[15:42:07] <mmu_man> many less unresolved
[15:42:10] <mmu_man> ok, shower now
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[15:44:46] <mmu_man> (.text+0x0): multiple definition of `memcpy'
[15:44:48] <mmu_man> hmm
[15:44:49] <mmu_man> oh well
[15:44:54] <mmu_man> . ° o O
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[16:03:51] <mmu_man> re
[16:08:52] <dr_evil> so?
[16:24:00] <mmu_man> ah, seems ppc idn't have asm memcpy
[16:24:06] <mmu_man> need to find which file to remove
[16:24:44] <mmu_man> #if !defined(ARCH_x86)
[16:24:47] <mmu_man>  /* do not build for for arches that have overridden this with an assembly version */
[16:24:58] <mmu_man> ugh, not as clean as what I've seen so far
[16:26:17] <mmu_man> ok, I'll #if 0 out the asm one for now
[16:26:34] <mmu_man> still lot of missing math stuff, will take time to sort out
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[16:49:27] <mmu_man> re :)
[16:50:56] * disdfsdf senses a instability in the force
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[16:53:37] <Ketsuban> mmu_man: I think you should be focusing on making Haiku run on a Megadrive. :P
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[16:57:25] <helf_> heh
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[17:06:08] <mmu_man> Ketsuban:  lol
[17:06:21] <mmu_man> hmm ok I need -DMIT_SYNTAX there...
[17:06:51] <mmu_man> or MOTOROLA_SYNTAX ?
[17:06:56] <mmu_man> one of them anyway
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[17:08:58] <mmu_man> hmm doesn't seem to work
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[17:11:17] <mmu_man> is it me or SubDirCcFlags doesn't work ?
[17:14:26] <mmu_man> hmm ah it's for a .S
[17:14:54] <mmu_man> SubDirAsFlags :)
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[17:17:55] <mmu_man> yes \o/
[17:17:58] <mmu_man> that was it
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[17:44:40] <mmu_man> hmm I've got enough of that glibc braindeadness for today :)
[17:45:45] * DeadYak pets mmu_man
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[17:52:19] <mmu_man> back to kernel stuff
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[18:56:05] <mmu_man> re
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[19:26:30] <DaaT> hey Atomozero
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[19:48:24] <helf_> hey DaaT
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[19:58:31] <DaaT> hi helf_
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[19:59:39] <stargater> Hi
[19:59:49] <helf_> hi stargater
[19:59:52] <helf_> hows it going, DaaT ?
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[20:00:11] <DaaT> well, started working 11 hours ago and i'm still going strong
[20:00:15] <DaaT> soooo...
[20:00:22] <DaaT> and i'm working tomorrow at 8am
[20:00:24] <DaaT> sooooooooooooooooooooo...
[20:00:25] <DaaT> :D
[20:00:31] <DaaT> and how are things over there?
[20:01:11] <helf_> heh, pretty good. on the look out for a new ride. my current one is about to die and not worth the money to fix
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[20:11:14] <DaaT> that's cool
[20:11:55] 
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[20:18:52] <urnenfeld> gde eto fyysik? moskva?
[20:19:24] <fyysik> Tartu, Estonia/Estland urnenfeld
[20:20:11] <urnenfeld> tak ti ne russkiy fyysik?
[20:20:19] <fyysik> heh, and someone probably is living at Costa Del Sol or such...
[20:20:25] <fyysik> russkij
[20:20:42] <urnenfeld> me?.... a Costa Dorada :)
[20:20:48] <urnenfeld> tam bil?
[20:21:30] <fyysik> urnenfeld - k sozhleniju voonsche v Ispanii ne byl, hotja OCHEN HOCHU
[20:22:18] <fyysik> mozhet v sledujuschem godu v Barcelona, urnenfeld
[20:23:39] <urnenfeld> fyysik: skoro tam ya zhibu, 100 km yug Barcelonu. no ti Estonia rodilis?
[20:24:12] <fyysik> urnenfeld - da, jescho v SSSR
[20:24:16] <fyysik> USSR
[20:25:02] <urnenfeld> skoro=>nedaleko....
[20:25:05] <fyysik> urnenfeld - a u tebja roditeli "respublikanskije russkije deti-ispancy"?
[20:25:14] <urnenfeld> heh tut mi skazhem URSS fyysik :P
[20:25:39] <urnenfeld> ne ya ispaneys, no leto 2003 v moskve uchil
[20:25:43] <fyysik> Clidren refugees to USSR from republican Spain?
[20:25:48] <fyysik> aaa
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[20:26:39] <urnenfeld> oh ti eto znaesh... "los niños de la guerra" Stalin mi dolzhen.... "to thank?"
[20:26:59] <fyysik> urnenfeld - dovolno mnogo bylo bezhencev refugees is anti-Franko borcov v Rossii/URSS - i ih deti i vnuki potom vozvraschalis v Ispaniju
[20:28:32] <fyysik> yup/da
[20:30:33] <urnenfeld> vlagodarim stalinu... ne znayu kak pravilno:P
[20:31:20] <fyysik> blarodarim Stalina "we say thank you, Stalin" ili blagodarja Stalinu - "Thanks to Stalin"
[20:31:43] <urnenfeld> :) spasibo fyysik
[20:32:11] <fyysik> ne za chto:)
[20:32:22] <fyysik> np
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[20:39:06] <fyysik> ty developer, urnenfeld?
[20:43:16] <urnenfeld> da,v Haiku bluetooth seychas
[20:43:28] <fyysik> cool
[20:44:02] <urnenfeld> dolgo budet :)
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[20:45:49] <kokito> good morning folks
[20:50:28] <urnenfeld> hi kokito!
[20:50:49] <kokito> hola colega :)
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[20:53:14] <Stargater> re
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[21:43:58] <ddew|bofh> g'evening
[21:44:18] * JonathanThompson lobs a leopard review at ddew|bofh
[21:44:30] * ddew|bofh has already pwny Leopard :P
[21:44:35] <ddew|bofh> *pwnt
[21:45:04] <ddew|bofh> had it running, fully supported, on my hackintosh over 12 hours before the official release
[21:45:30] <ddew|bofh> surprisingly excellent os
[21:45:31] * JonathanThompson hands ddew|bofh a pirate's hat and a sword to go along with his peg leg
[21:46:00] <helf_> fully supported?
[21:46:11] <helf_> hw accelerated video?
[21:46:15] <ddew|bofh> so now the only things keeping me back from getting a mac are lack of bios and fanbois
[21:46:26] <ddew|bofh> hw accelerated video, yes
[21:46:37] <ddew|bofh> grabbed the kexts from tiger
[21:48:55] <helf_> so they already cracked the protection stuff?
[21:48:57] <helf_> wow..
[21:48:57] * JonathanThompson notes that "Time Machine" may be the hard drive seller's best new Mac friend
[21:49:10] <helf_> i had 10.4.7 running on my pc. it wasnt very good on my hardware :P
[21:49:16] <AlienSoldier> osx as always been relativly good if not for the ridiculous cpu use and footprint
[21:49:27] <helf_> videos wouldnt play, accessing dvd drive was buggy, no hardware acceled video
[21:49:35] <ddew|bofh> that's made the os fairly crap imo
[21:49:49] <helf_> hey AlienSoldier
[21:49:55] <AlienSoldier> hi helf
[21:50:11] <ddew|bofh> leopard is quite decent actually and after using it for an hour i didn't want to kill myself because of finder :)
[21:50:27] <ddew|bofh> looks ok too
[21:50:32] <helf_> heh
[21:50:39] <helf_> i dont mind finder
[21:50:41] * JonathanThompson wonders how many other reasons ddew|bofh has to kill himself that are still left
[21:50:46] <helf_> i havent used osx in ages though.
[21:50:50] <ddew|bofh> way too many ;)
[21:50:55] <helf_> heh
[21:51:02] <helf_> the nextstep finder is nice
[21:51:08] <helf_> isnt the osx one about the same?
[21:51:14] <ddew|bofh> roughly
[21:51:27] <ddew|bofh> just slightly less awesome and way more annoying
[21:51:52] <ddew|bofh> they've gone spatial everything so windows pop up all over the place
[21:51:55] <ddew|bofh> *grr*
[21:52:09] <AlienSoldier> helf_ still using the next box a lot?
[21:54:04] <helf_> AlienSoldier : just bought a color turbo :D
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[21:54:57] <AlienSoldier> will you install shiny Haiku 68k on it? :)
[21:55:12] <helf_> when ported :) ill install it on my mono turbo :P
[21:55:17] * helf_ loves his NeXTs
[21:56:02] <ddew|bofh> that's one of the most awesome thing about haiku. it's portability
[21:56:29] <ddew|bofh> can't wait for the day when my imacs run Haiku :)
[21:56:48] <AlienSoldier> imac are tailor made for haiku
[21:56:53] <helf_> :)
[21:56:57] <helf_> i cant wait till it runs on NeXTs
[21:56:58] <ddew|bofh> g3 imacs that is
[21:57:03] <helf_> ill even lend mine for testing :P
[21:57:12] <ddew|bofh> like hell you will ;)
[21:57:26] <helf_> i would :)
[21:57:27] <AlienSoldier> and unlike x86 pc, most did keep their mac around
[21:58:02] <AlienSoldier> a yellow imac would be even more well fit :)
[21:58:05] <ddew|bofh> i just like the looks of my imac, it's really crap hardware wise
[21:58:14] <ddew|bofh> mine's tangerine'
[21:58:25] <ddew|bofh> that's _almost_ yellow :P
[22:00:17] <helf_> AlienSoldier, i'm buying an LCD for my NeXT turbo color tonight and an optical mouse :) my 16 year old next will have optical, a good LCD and be running lots of new software in about 2 weeks :)
[22:00:20] <helf_> not bad for such an old machine
[22:00:43] <ddew|bofh> how quick is it and how much ram?
[22:00:54] <helf_> 33mhz 040 with 128mb of edo
[22:00:57] <helf_> 60ns edo
[22:01:00] <AlienSoldier> today i stress test the haiku USB2.0 stack in my boned R5, seem fine so far, only got an error i might have got from HD to HD anyway
[22:01:15] <helf_> pretty fast. the DPS is hardware accelerated, and it uses a moto 56000 dsp
[22:01:20] * JonathanThompson wonders when helf_ will be doing POVRay runs on his previOS NeXT
[22:01:41] <helf_> heh
[22:01:52] <helf_> im not too interested in 3D rendeirng
[22:01:53] <AlienSoldier> helf_ will you integrate that to original casing or just "plug" them as is
[22:01:54] <ddew|bofh> sounds like a fun machine :)
[22:01:55] <helf_> *rendering
[22:02:29] <helf_> AlienSoldier, as is. both are black though :) im not butchering up any of my working neXT hardware. if my mono crt dies, i might fit an LCD into it
[22:02:57] <ddew|bofh> a mono lcd naturally :P
[22:03:25] <helf_> mono nexts power LCDs well enough :) no need for a mono one ;)
[22:03:50] <ddew|bofh> yeah, but a mono lcd works with the theme :P
[22:04:19] <helf_> anyways, im about to upgrade my color to a bigger hdd with a fresh install of openstep 4.2 + a bunch of new programs. a guy on my NeXT forum has finished porting a lot of stuff like the latest OpenSSL and penSSH suite
[22:04:24] <helf_> *OpenSSH
[22:04:27] <helf_> :D
[22:04:31] <ddew|bofh> cool
[22:04:55] <helf_> he figured out how to get everything working with imap/pop3 servers that require SSL..
[22:04:58] <AlienSoldier> would a SSD work into a next
[22:05:25] <helf_> Do they have scsi compatible ones?
[22:05:40] <helf_> could probably get one to work. have to do custom fstab entries and such...
[22:05:43] <AlienSoldier> no idea, probably
[22:06:18] <helf_> I get like 2mb/s off my scsi drive. not a very fast bus
[22:06:26] <AlienSoldier> i guess once those 64G SSD are given away, i will put one in my A1200
[22:06:54] <helf_> heh
[22:07:13] <AlienSoldier> perhaps the 32G will come free sooner
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[22:07:32] <AlienSoldier> but not many bought those
[22:08:02] <helf_> I'm going to try and get a 15k rpm scsi drive working in my NeXT
[22:08:22] <ddew|bofh> aw man, those are _loud_
[22:08:27] <ddew|bofh> pretty fast though
[22:08:30] <helf_> maybe the 2ms avg will make up for the bus speed limit :)
[22:09:53] <AlienSoldier> i'm personally doen with motor based HD, i'm also done with the 3.5 form factor.  My 500G should last me long enough that alternative will be cheap enough by then
[22:10:12] <helf_> actually, part of the speed problem with NeXTs is that they didnt implement something right in their scsi drivers or something. i forget what it was. its like its only synchronous or something
[22:10:18] <ddew|bofh> NAS+SAS ftw :P
[22:10:40] <helf_> heh
[22:11:05] <helf_> network stuff is pretty slow too :) the NeXT only has a 10mbit ethernet adapter
[22:11:34] <ddew|bofh> how's th expansion slots in a next?
[22:11:53] <helf_> the nextstations dont have any
[22:12:00] <helf_> the cubes use a proprietary "nextbus"
[22:12:05] <ddew|bofh> i lucked out on my sgi, it's got an ISA-slot with a very rare NIC
[22:12:40] <helf_> cube cases have 4 slots. one is ID 0 and the motherboard sits there. the others are ID 1,2,3.. usually for expansion cards. lots of neat hardware made for cubes though
[22:12:45] <helf_> cool
[22:12:48] <AlienSoldier> i wonder if those selling their nic on ebay, mention them as "very rare: :P
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[22:13:02] <helf_> anyone want a sparcstation 20?
[22:13:05] <ddew|bofh> well they are very rare :)
[22:13:34] <helf_> 6gb (i think) scsi hdd, 256mb ram, ZX framebuffer, HME 100mbit ethernet card, 13w3 to vga adapter, dual supersparc 75mhz with external 1mb of cache each...
[22:13:41] <ddew|bofh> and you have to hack tge irix kernel to get the card working
[22:14:54] <AlienSoldier> i no longuer take orphan computer that don't replace my main one, 2 pc is enought around here now
[22:15:11] <ddew|bofh> doesn't pretty much every UltraSparc have tons of cache?
[22:15:45] <ddew|bofh> if the machine's in .se i'd gladly take it off your hands :)
[22:15:57] <helf_> hm
[22:16:04] <helf_> se is for sweden?
[22:16:06] <helf_> i dont remember
[22:16:08] <ddew|bofh> yup
[22:16:17] <helf_> im in the usa
[22:16:22] <helf_> dunno what shipping would cost :P
[22:16:27] <ddew|bofh> hehe
[22:16:37] <ddew|bofh> _way_ more then it's worth :P
[22:16:44] <helf_> probably :)
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[22:16:48] <helf_> its worth like 20 bucks
[22:16:48] <helf_> max
[22:16:49] <helf_> :P
[22:16:49] <AlienSoldier> shipping is the mind killer
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[22:17:06] <ddew|bofh> i have a couple of ss4 and ss5 here, way excellent machines
[22:17:11] <Ingenu_> night
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[22:17:31] <helf_> wow, its amazing how much misinformation there is on the web about jsut about anything. noone checks their facts before spewing garbage.. *sigh*
[22:17:53] <dr_evil> yes I always notice that, too helf_
[22:18:01] <helf_> some guy claiming "all neXTs have intel i860 "dsps" ".. er, nope, sorry. only dimension cubes have those :) and the i860 isnt a dsp :P
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[22:18:21] <helf_> oh well, i gotta run. later
[22:18:24] <ddew|bofh> tata
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   October 26, 2007  
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