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[00:22:12] <kheera> FauxFaux: better?
[00:22:37] <FauxFaux> Yes.
[00:23:09] <FauxFaux> Projectproperties -> java build path -> add (external) jars.
[00:25:28] <kheera> ok great. so now I can add libraries thanks.
[00:26:16] <kheera> so abstractaplicationcontext is a part of spring framework... so I should just download the .jars for spring and add that folder in the build path?
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[00:45:42] <Aperion> I know this may be offtopic for this chan, but does any one know if/where there is a room for CDT?
[00:45:52] <rcjsuen> Aperion: There isn't one.
[00:45:55] <Aperion> ehhh, err room = chan
[00:45:59] <rcjsuen> you can ask here or the ~forums
[00:45:59] <Arbalest> http://www.eclipse.org/forums/
[00:47:08] <Aperion> thanks I will check out the forums to see if there in an answer there
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[01:15:16] <deSilva> and it wasn't off-topic either
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[02:32:53] <rhk> is there a zip archive of the entire galileo update site?
[02:34:07] <rhk> or, is there a way to set up a private mirror of the update site?
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[02:34:48] <rcjsuen> I know you can mirror the SDK, I imagine you can mirror the other stuff too.
[02:36:25] <rhk> is there a tool for that or something? or just a url to fetch with wget/curl/rsync?
[02:38:10] <rcjsuen> duno the details myself, just from experience i've seen internal mirrors
[02:38:25] <rcjsuen> i saw it at Versant and seeing it now at IBM
[02:39:02] <rhk> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Platform-releng-faq#How_can_I_run_the_update_manager_from_a_command_line_to_mirror_a_remote_site.3F
[02:43:28] <rhk> hmm. there is no startup.jar thoughj
[02:45:25] <rcjsuen> that's been replaced by the launcher jar
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[02:54:52] <rhk> not seeing a launcher jar either :)
[02:55:18] <rhk> more googling
[02:55:42] <rcjsuen> rhk: did you look in the plugins/ folder
[02:55:52] <rhk> I used fine
[02:55:54] <rhk> er find
[02:56:01] <rhk> find -name "launcher*jar"
[02:56:01] <rcjsuen> find | grep launcher?
[02:56:28] <rhk> ahh more there
[02:56:45] <rhk> org.eclipse.equinox.launcher....
[02:59:55] <rhk> grr. it fails, then tells me to look in a non-existent log file to find out why. more googling.
[03:09:46] <rhk> ok, found the rsync script, modified it since it is ancient and only had callisto, and running it now.
[03:11:52] <EricInBNE> does anyone know about OSLC and mylyn?
[03:12:16] <EricInBNE> what is the fastest way if I want to connect a mylyn connector to an arbitrary issue management system.
[03:12:31] <EricInBNE> (eg. one for which no mylyn connector exists)
[03:14:06] <rhk> I seem to remember reading a few blog posts about that topic a few months back
[03:15:03] <rhk> http://wiki.eclipse.org/Mylyn/Incubator/Generic_SQL_Connector
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[04:18:47] <Aperion> Does any one here know how to get CDT preprocessor defines in CDT to include a valid c style string that includes "'s ?
[04:19:18] <Aperion> there was a forum topic askign about this but there were no responces: http://www.eclipse.org/forums/index.php?t=msg&goto=233043&S=7700f2dfa609ffad4513ee285444a28c
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[08:41:21] <danlucraft> help.eclipse.org has been offline for a while now. Is there anyone we should ping?
[08:41:41] <danlucraft> an alternative source of the eclipse javadocs would be nice too
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[09:07:03] <persicsb> hi all! how can I reset my perspective to it's initial layout (created by createInitialLayout() ) programmatically?
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[09:21:21] <|eagles0513875|> hey guys im having a strange issue for some reason eclipse isnt finding my jre and jdk which i have installed hence failling to load the ide. how can i remedy the situation
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[12:19:47] <ecfuser86868> Hi
[12:20:15] <ecfuser86868> How is work?
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[14:17:04] <rcjsuen> eagles0513875: Did you get Eclipse to start?
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[14:24:38] <thana> hi
[14:24:56] <thana> does somebody know whats up with http://help.eclipse.org ?
[14:25:05] <thana> i don't have access t the swt api docs...
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[14:44:23] <philk__> should my DS component directly extend Thread or rather have a field that instantiates an extended version of Thread?
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[14:57:13] <rmrfslash> Visual Paradigm is telling me to install JDT from eclipse.org however, there are several components in the JDT project. Does anyone have VP installed? Do I need the Core components, APT, ?
[14:59:37] <erdal> philk__: i think this is a general question: composition pattern vs. inheritance pattern
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[15:00:40] <rcjsuen> I'm not sure I'd extend Thread directly.
[15:00:54] <philk__> erdal: yeah I know...
[15:01:13] <philk__> rcjsuen: I have seen it hundreds of times and wonder myself if its a good idea
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[15:01:31] <rcjsuen> I'm guilty as charged, did it in a project in...2006.
[15:01:37] <rcjsuen> in hindsight probably shouldn't have
[15:01:42] <rcjsuen> but that wasn't exposed as API
[15:01:46] <rcjsuen> so I don't feel _that_ bad ;p
[15:01:59] <philk__> rcjsuen: what were the problems afterwards? Why wouldnt you do it again?
[15:02:52] <erdal> indeed, i would not extends Thread at all, but instead have a Runnable be assigned to a thread instance
[15:02:59] <rhk> I've been using new Thread(new Runnable() { ... }) lately
[15:03:18] <rcjsuen> philk__: I just don't want ppl calling start() stop() and other Thread methods "randomly".
[15:03:24] <erdal> rhk, that is what i am saying :-)
[15:03:25] <rcjsuen> to put it simply, I don't wanna expose Thread's API
[15:03:28] <rhk> usually with whatever data the thread needs in final's in the function
[15:04:22] <rhk> if I need lots of code in the Runnable, then I make an inner class for it
[15:04:40] <rhk> I'm not sure I like it much better this way though
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[15:09:08] <philk__> rhk, erdal, rcjsuen: the Thread in question here is one, that cannot even be interrupted using the Java interrupt() method as it is neither sleep nor waiting. Its blocked by a OS system call (Win32 WaitForSingleObject using JNA). The code in question is this one: http://pastebin.com/m4a4a5d5a
[15:10:01] <rhk> you're using WaitForSingleObject from java? eww. :)
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[15:10:58] <philk__> rhk: sure, its an JNA powered bundle specifically for Win32
[15:11:13] <nitind> JNA?
[15:11:18] * erdal is not familiar with win32 programming
[15:11:32] <philk__> rhk: unless Java implements Memory Mapped Files, one has to resort to JNI/JNA
[15:11:42] <philk__> nitind: Java Native Access
[15:11:56] <philk__> nitind: you can basically call library functions without using JNI yourself
[15:11:57] <erdal> though, jna is great and easy to use
[15:11:59] <rhk> wouldn't that be great if java supported real stuff like that?
[15:12:12] <rhk> jna looks nice. I haven't used it yet.
[15:12:53] <philk__> rhk: JNA its very powerful. Regarding Memory Mapped Files or shared memory, I am not sure if that is supported on other OSes
[15:13:06] <rhk> philk__: it is
[15:13:27] <philk__> rhk: why does java then come without an API for using them, I wonder...
[15:13:32] <rhk> philk__: mmap() was in posix long before ms stole it
[15:13:42] <nitind> Different than java.io.RandomAccessFile
[15:13:44] <nitind> ?
[15:14:18] <philk__> anyway that was more a question about extending Thread or using a Runnable
[15:14:26] <philk__> nitind: yes, totally different!
[15:14:36] <rhk> nitind: memory mapped files are like having a buffer in memory that is all swap memory, where the swap memory is a file you select
[15:15:20] <nitind> What about MappedByteBuffer?
[15:15:35] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: no i havent gotten eclipse to start yet and i have no idea wtf to do. i have the jre and jdk installed
[15:15:49] <eagles0513875> what file can i delete to basically remove its previous configuration
[15:15:53] <philk__> rhk: although its implementation dependend if the memory mapped file is actually backed up by the swap file or not
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[15:16:06] <rhk> nitind: that looks more like it
[15:16:12] <philk__> nitind: no, you cannot specify a filename
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[15:16:45] <philk__> nitind: ah ok... using nio
[15:16:49] <rhk> uses FileChannel.map
[15:16:55] <rhk> never used that
[15:16:58] <philk__> I will try to use it... sec
[15:17:25] <rcjsuen> eagles0513875: Perhaps you should start from the beginning and describe your OS / eclipse version / java version / etc
[15:17:41] <nitind> eagles0513875: You're sure you can run the "java" executable yourself, by itself, as a test?
[15:17:53] <rhk> philk__: but you've got more than a memory mapped file going on here. you also have an event or two for communication
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[15:18:53] <rhk> philk__: so it looks like this code exposes start(), join(), etc as part of it's contract anyway, right?
[15:18:55] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: win 7 64bit latest eclipse version as well as the latest java version
[15:19:00] <eagles0513875> nitind: what do you mean
[15:19:07] <philk__> rhk: right, there is more going on there...
[15:19:12] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: btw it was working fine before in reinstalled windows
[15:19:31] <rhk> philk__: and this object will be an osgi service
[15:19:39] <rcjsuen> well, a lot can happen between installing an OS ;)
[15:19:44] <rhk> it's not consumed by the real service, or embedded
[15:19:46] <rcjsuen> you reinstalled Win 7 or you _upgraded_ to Win7?
[15:20:00] <rcjsuen> eagles0513875: he means, can you just run 'java' from the command line
[15:20:05] <philk__> rhk: it exposes start(), it should not really expose join(). But it also exposes interrupt() since I need a special operation here
[15:20:09] <nitind> eagles0513875: Can you run the java.exe itself?
[15:20:16] <rcjsuen> i.e. you should do a sanity test and confirm Windows is aware of it, and is on the %PATH%
[15:20:25] <rhk> philk__: I think I would not extend Thread for this
[15:20:33] <eagles0513875> nitind: im the admin of this pc if that is what you mean
[15:20:43] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: i see it installed in the program files folder
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[15:20:44] <philk__> rhk: the object itself should not be an OSGi service, rather the subclass of it
[15:20:56] <rcjsuen> That doesn't verify the command line bit.
[15:20:58] <nitind> eagles0513875: I'm not asking you if you think you should be able to, I'm asking you to go verify that so it can be ruled out.
[15:20:59] <rhk> philk__: since it's abstract, yes
[15:21:19] <eagles0513875> will test now
[15:21:20] <philk__> rhk: so rather use a Thread object and implement a Runnable?
[15:21:35] <nitind> Any reason not to use Jobs?
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[15:22:00] <philk__> nitind: yes, its a POJO
[15:22:06] <Woef> I have an issue when trying to build an eclipse RCP product, it says it has problems reading the jar file it built containing my plugin, any ideas how to debug that kind of error ?
[15:22:18] <philk__> nitind: it should not have any dependencies on Eclipse or even OSGi
[15:22:50] <nitind> philk__: Well that hardly sounds fun.
[15:22:52] <philk__> nitind: also the object waits for system events
[15:23:05] <eagles0513875> nitind: and rcjsuen its throwing an except but the message in the exception is unknown method and source?
[15:23:24] <nitind> eagles0513875: What's throwing an exception?  When you do what?
[15:23:32] <rhk> philk__: I would recommend never to use INIFINITE for a timeout, btw
[15:23:47] <eagles0513875> im in the src folder for some java classes i have created for practice ill pastebin the output
[15:23:51] <philk__> nitind: oh it is fun, cause around the object I have contructed an OSGi service component and 2 listeners. One for the EventAdmin and one for LogService
[15:24:22] <rhk> philk__: for my code, I use the longest acceptable delay for when you want to shut down the service, then repeatedly poll using that interval
[15:24:28] <nitind> philk__: That sure sounds like a dependency on OSGi.
[15:24:54] <philk__> rhk: in Win32 thats common practice. Otherwise you waste CPU cycles. To terminate the blocking method you signal its object that its waiting for.
[15:25:07] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: and nitind: http://pastebin.com/m7b0cdc54
[15:25:11] <rcjsuen> I guess if it throws exceptions then it at least kind of sounds like the JVM runs.
[15:25:19] <philk__> nitind: but this dependency is not imposed by the component itself
[15:25:34] <rcjsuen> Ignoring the fact that that isn't the proper way to start Java programs.
[15:25:42] <rcjsuen> what does 'java -version' show
[15:25:50] <rcjsuen> and 'java -d64'
[15:25:54] <rhk> philk__: the fact that it's common practice doesn't make it right :) that's why so many win32 apps just hang sometimes.
[15:26:10] <nitind> eagles0513875: Was this a reinstall to go from 32-bit to 64-bit?
[15:26:18] <eagles0513875> 64 to 64
[15:26:51] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: java -d64 doesnt work
[15:26:55] <rhk> philk__: doesn't win32 have an OutputDebugString function?
[15:26:58] <erdal> eagles0513875: this is realyy right: java BeerSong.java
[15:27:02] <rcjsuen> so what is the output of java -version
[15:27:08] <erdal> you should compile it, first
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[15:27:16] <eagles0513875> and the other command im running 1.6.0_17
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[15:27:20] <eagles0513875> erdal: with javac right
[15:27:37] <erdal> then just use java BeerSong
[15:28:27] <erdal> eagles0513875: it just says that it cannot find class java in package BeerSong
[15:28:40] <nitind> eagles0513875: It sounds like BearSong is in the package chapter1, which means you have to run it as "chapter1.BeerSong".  The VM takes the class name and finds it on the classpath.  It's not for you to directly say it's in a particular .class or .jar file.
[15:28:58] <rcjsuen> I would like to see the entire output of that command invocation.
[15:28:59] <nitind> class name != file name
[15:30:41] <eagles0513875> http://pastebin.com/m301df654
[15:30:51] <eagles0513875> im not really used to compiling stuff off the command line :(
[15:31:33] <nitind> eagles0513875: You didn't specify a classpath that includes the parent directory of "chapter1".
[15:31:34] <rcjsuen> I was referring to the full output of 'java -version' by the way, to be clear.
[15:31:59] <erdal> eagles0513875: do a "cd ..", then rerun the command
[15:31:59] <eagles0513875> nitind: im in the directory where it is
[15:32:03] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: will do it now
[15:32:13] <rcjsuen> And do you still have the Eclipse zip file? What is its name?
[15:32:40] <nitind> eagles0513875: It's looking for a folder named "chapter1" with a file named BeerSong.class, in the classpath.
[15:32:49] <eagles0513875> ya i do rcjsuen http://pastebin.com/m41d8f276
[15:33:12] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: eclipse-java-galileo-SR1-win32
[15:33:17] <rcjsuen> okay
[15:33:20] <rcjsuen> so that's a 32-bit build
[15:33:22] <rcjsuen> and you have a 64-bit JVM
[15:33:25] <rcjsuen> they do not match
[15:33:28] <nitind> Woah, hang on.  That's only going to work with a 32-bit JVM.
[15:33:31] <rcjsuen> even if Eclipse did find the JRE
[15:33:36] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: i had 64bit jvm and jre before
[15:33:38] <rcjsuen> you will fail "later" in the startup process
[15:33:43] <rcjsuen> to be clear
[15:33:50] <rcjsuen> your _Eclipse_ is a 32-bit build
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[15:33:55] <eagles0513875> is there a 64bit one
[15:34:00] <rcjsuen> Based on the output you provided us you have a 64-bit JVM, that seems correct.
[15:34:36] <rhk> it seems like that's the type of thing the launcher could sort out and display a better error message.
[15:34:43] <eagles0513875> ok will get 64bit version of eclipse
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[15:35:00] <nitind> eagles0513875: Not on Windows, you'll have to get the base Eclipse and add what you need using the built-in support.
[15:35:13] <rcjsuen> rhk: Yes, I am curious as to why Eclipse is saying it cna't find a JRE/JDK.
[15:35:19] <rcjsuen> bcuz it appears to be on the %PATH%
[15:35:20] * rcjsuen shrugs.
[15:35:38] <eagles0513875> then can anyone explain to me why prior to reinstalling why it was working before 32bit eclipse with 64bit jvm jre
[15:35:57] <rhk> I've been avoiding 64 bit windows, because I know how much of win32 was dependent on the size of a pointer being 32 bits
[15:36:08] <rhk> and I'm sure there are still issues
[15:37:01] <eagles0513875> thing is i need 64bit for my hard ware and amount of ram i have
[15:38:15] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: what you saying is i need to switch to the 32bit jre and jdk
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[15:38:27] <rhk> eagles0513875: you'll need to get the "platform" build, then install features on top of it
[15:38:27] <rcjsuen> We are saying a) get a 32-bit JRE/JDK to work with your 32-bit download
[15:38:30] <rcjsuen> or b) get a 64-bit Eclipse
[15:38:38] <rcjsuen> Up to you to decide.
[15:38:47] <eagles0513875> is there evene such a thing as 64bit eclipse O_o
[15:39:08] <rcjsuen> ~sdk-dl
[15:39:08] <Arbalest> Looking for different versions (including past and developmental releases) and/or platforms for the Eclipse SDK or any of the base Eclipse bundles? See http://download.eclipse.org/eclipse/downloads/
[15:39:11] <rhk> eagles0513875: there isn't a full SDK package for windows 64 bit
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[15:39:29] <rhk> eagles0513875: but there is a platform build under "other downloads"
[15:39:41] <rcjsuen> rhk: we do have Eclipse SDK/Classic builds for 64-bit win :o
[15:39:42] <rhk> eagles0513875: platform is just the core base IDE without language support
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[15:39:52] <eagles0513875> ok
[15:39:55] <rcjsuen> 	Windows (x86_64) (Supported Versions)
[15:39:56] <rcjsuen> (http)
[15:39:56] <rcjsuen> 	163 MB	eclipse-SDK-3.5.1-win32-x86_64.zip
[15:40:10] <rhk> rcjsuen: oh. didn't see that
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[15:40:36] <rhk> ahh, it's just not linked on the main download page
[15:40:47] <eagles0513875> ya
[15:41:02] <eagles0513875> rcjsuen: whats the link to it if you dont mind me  askin
[15:41:15] <rcjsuen> rhk: yeah, there was a big discussion about the linking thing
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[15:41:20] <rcjsuen> eagles0513875: Did you look at what Arbalest said above?
[15:42:01] <rhk> rcjsuen: 64 bit windows is going to start getting more common now that windows 7 is out
[15:42:14] <rcjsuen> well for the 64-bit win case
[15:42:17] <rhk> rcjsuen: and because windows 7 doesn't suck as bad as vista
[15:42:19] <rcjsuen> Eric Rizzo opened a request
[15:42:29] <eagles0513875> thanks found it
[15:42:32] <eagles0513875> found it
[15:42:40] <rcjsuen> ~293969
[15:42:43] <Arbalest> Bug 293969 - https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=293969 - EPP / package content / 1.3.0 - PC / Windows XP - NEW / normal / - Assignee: epp.packager-inbox - Add Windows 64 bit support
[15:42:47] <eagles0513875> btw speaking of 64it guys
[15:43:02] <eagles0513875> before windows update decided to restart my machine i had it up for 8 days stright no reboots
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[15:43:45] <rhk> eagles0513875: you must not have had to install any software or updates :)
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[15:43:59] <eagles0513875> i have a few
[15:44:04] <eagles0513875> then some for office 07
[15:44:07] <eagles0513875> its super stable
[15:44:07] <rhk> automatic updates nearly guarantees a reboot once a month :)
[15:44:29] <eagles0513875> rhk: i changed it to notify me of updates but not install them so i can tell em to be installed myself
[15:44:34] <rhk> but it happens at night when you're not looking :)
[15:44:41] <eagles0513875> ya but it hasnt yet
[15:44:41] <eagles0513875> hehe
[15:44:44] <rhk> eagles0513875: that's my preferred method too
[15:44:48] <keya> Hello.  Is it possible to disable the 'drop' feature in SWT Browser.  If I drop any resource in to it, it displays me the contents.  I don't want it to do so,  Any ideas?
[15:45:17] <eagles0513875> 8gb of ram with lots of ff tabs open music foler open media player windows live messenger irc open and skype only using 37% of my 8gb when i start im using only 21% or so
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[15:46:53] <rhk> eagles0513875: sounds like my linux machine at home - but add in quad core :)
[15:47:30] <eagles0513875> it is a quad core rhk a q9550
[15:47:31] <eagles0513875> hehe
[15:47:42] <eagles0513875> i think they based the i7s of that proc
[15:47:51] <eagles0513875> i7s have same amount of cache as well as l3
[15:47:54] <rhk> gotta love quad core + 8G ram
[15:47:54] <eagles0513875> and hyper threading
[15:47:58] <eagles0513875> hahah ya
[15:48:02] <eagles0513875> it my gaming machine
[15:48:06] <eagles0513875> only reason to be on windows
[15:48:42] <nitind> Some hardware only works on Windows for now.
[15:48:45] <rhk> rcjsuen: that bug nails this
[15:49:19] <eagles0513875> ya i use kubuntu nitind and no hardware issues all works out of the box
[15:49:51] <nitind> eagles0513875: The touch panel on my T91MT has no driver so far.
[15:50:08] <eagles0513875> touch screen?
[15:50:20] <nitind> eagles0513875: Yes.  True, it's an extreme example.
[15:50:33] <eagles0513875> nitind: what distro kubuntu or the ubuntu line
[15:50:44] <philk__> rhk: yes Win32 has an ODS function. My bundle makes the output of this function visible to Java programs
[15:50:55] <rhk> philk__: nice
[15:51:01] <nitind> eagles0513875: I mean as of last week, no driver existed.  Anywhere.  Haven't looked around today.
[15:51:22] <eagles0513875> nitind: can point ya in the right direction on ubuntu give me a min
[15:51:52] <nitind> eagles0513875: With the limited space on the SSD, I will be sticking with the included Win7.  But thanks for the offer.
[15:52:12] <eagles0513875> nitind: you need wacom support on nix if you want to get ur touch screen working
[15:52:42] <nitind> eagles0513875: Not an active digitizer; not Wacom.
[15:52:51] <eagles0513875> ok
[15:53:02] <eagles0513875> i love linux and osx those are the only 2 os's i woudl be on if i wasnt a gamer
[15:53:12] <eagles0513875> once i get my own place all my machines in the house will run linux
[15:53:17] <nitind> Could use some more keys on a MacBook Pro, though.
[15:53:18] <rhk> nitind: looks like the digitizer is a generic hid device. it won't take long to get a driver for that
[15:53:41] <philk__> rhk: and if you have OSGi running (with DS) you get the ODS functions text reported as log entry and as an event (if evenAdmin is avail)
[15:53:56] <philk__> rhk: I will blog about this soon and put the code on github
[15:54:03] <rhk> philk__: that sounds like a really handy general purpose bundly
[15:54:06] <rhk> er bundle
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[15:57:34] <rhk> nitind: http://forum.eeeuser.com/viewtopic.php?pid=671031
[15:57:37] <Neldo> does anybody know a site to check out in which plugin-jar to find which class and interface?
[15:58:02] <rhk> nitind: the last comment (in french) details a modification that a user made to use the evtouch driver on the T91MT
[15:58:54] <nitind> rhk: I appreciate the digging, but I'm sticking with Win7 on it.  I can get hardware accelerated h.264 decoding with its GPU, even 1080p at a moderate bit-rate.
[15:59:32] <rhk> nitind: I've got an eebox b202 at home that I dual boot. it's the only windows box in the house :)
[15:59:50] <rhk> nitind: and I have more computers than people in my house
[16:00:02] <nitind> rhk: I try not to admit that myself.
[16:00:20] <rhk> own your geekiness
[16:01:43] <eagles0513875> lol
[16:01:51] <eagles0513875> i admit im a nerd lol im a comp sci major lol
[16:02:39] <rcjsuen> rhk: I have computers equal to the people...but I live alone ;)
[16:02:54] <rhk> I've got a wife and two kids :)
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[16:09:24] <philk__> rhk: have you worked with java.nio before? Does it provide an "Event" channel?
[16:09:40] <philk__> rhk: then I could ditch the JNA stuff in my thread
[16:10:02] <rhk> philk__: I've not used java.nio yet, but I probably will be later this week :)
[16:10:29] <rcjsuen> Don't think there's an "event" channel
[16:10:35] <rcjsuen> well, depends what "event" means
[16:10:37] <rhk> philk__: I'll be exposing data from a high-speed A/D card
[16:11:07] <philk__> rcjsuen: event in the case of a Win32 Event
[16:11:17] <philk__> rcjsuen: created by CreateEvent
[16:11:30] <rhk> philk__: but you specifically need a win32 event, since that's what OutputDebugString does
[16:11:31] <philk__> rhk: thats interesting. How will you expose that? Using JNI?
[16:12:25] <rhk> philk__: I'm using cards from Measurement computing (www.mccdaq.com), and they have a decent DLL that interfaces to the boards
[16:12:54] <rhk> My current code uses JNI, and I was considering switching to JNA
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[16:13:12] <philk__> rhk: JNA is really good
[16:13:36] <philk__> rhk: together with COM4J I am now able to control Windows Mobile devices from Java
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[16:13:41] <rhk> I've only implemented the single-read functions so far. the scanned read commands require allocating a buffer using their dll, and using an accessor function to read from that buffer
[16:14:52] <eagles0513875> rhk: when would multithreading come in useful in java
[16:14:57] <rhk> I'll be using a background scan probably at 10KHz across 16 channels, 16 bits per channel, so it'll be pushing about 320KB/sec
[16:15:09] <rhk> 320KB isn't that bad
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[16:15:28] <rhk> eagles0513875: eclipse uses threading extensively
[16:15:40] <eagles0513875> what i mean is in ones own program
[16:15:44] <rhk> eagles0513875: it compiles your code in the background
[16:16:05] <eagles0513875> rhk: not getting my question across right here
[16:16:20] <rhk> eagles0513875: I use threads whenever I have code that needs to run, but I don't want the user interface to hang waiting for it
[16:16:34] <eagles0513875> ok what type of programs then would warrent that
[16:16:47] <rhk> eagles0513875: so the user clicks a button, it grays out, and the code runs in a thread. when the code completes, the button would be re-enabled. (as an example)
[16:16:49] <philk__> rhk: I had this "their dll allocates the buffer" problem recently too with RAPI
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[16:17:13] <eagles0513875> ahhh gotcha
[16:17:22] <eagles0513875> rhk: for instance would it be useful to thread a chat room?
[16:17:37] <rhk> philk__: I think it uses GlobalAlloc internally
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[16:18:29] <rhk> eagles0513875: networking code that has more than a single connection can benefit from threads, yes, but only if it needs to be high performance, which usually means server-side.
[16:18:49] <rhk> eagles0513875: so writing a chat server might benefit from threads, but probably not much.
[16:19:02] <eagles0513875> what im going to work on once i finishes school is a chat room
[16:19:12] <eagles0513875> so im guessing woudl need to write a front end and a back end for it to run
[16:19:20] <rhk> eagles0513875: if you have lots and lots of connections, then a thread per connection would be bad.
[16:19:20] <eagles0513875> btw 64bit fixed the problem
[16:19:38] <eagles0513875> what if i thread the backend and leave the front end unthreaded
[16:19:58] <eagles0513875> for instance in my chat room i wanna include a webcam feature im guessing that would need to be threaded?
[16:21:15] <rhk> eagles0513875: for the front-end, having a thread do the network I/O and feed data to the UI "foreground" thread is not a bad model.
[16:21:56] <eagles0513875> i have yet to learn about threading and currently the chat room is on hold due to classes kicking my backside
[16:21:57] <rhk> eagles0513875: as with any question about progrmaming, the answer to "should I use threads?" has to be "it depends"
[16:22:01] <eagles0513875> ill bbl
[16:23:26] <rhk> philk__: I'm pretty sure mccdaq uses GlobalAlloc because it has to lock the buffer into RAM so it can use DMA (not all boards use DMA/scatter-gather/etc, but some do)
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[16:26:14] <maxr> Anyone here who is experienced in using OSGi with DS?
[16:26:30] <rhk> maxr: there are a few...
[16:26:45] <rhk> maxr: it's best just to ask a question. it might get an answer :)
[16:26:47] <rcjsuen> Best to just ask the question.
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[16:32:19] <maxr> ok rhk :) is there any assertation that my @Activate method will run before the component is inject into other components or is it only asserted that it will run after all its mandatory references has been resolved?
[16:34:14] <magnet> 2nd
[16:34:29] <rhk> it's a good thing the osgi specs are available free online, unlike the SAE specs I usually need.
[16:34:30] <magnet> As soon as all mandatory references are resolved
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[16:34:59] <magnet> And if you have a 1..n cardinality, activate may be called after the first reference is passed
[16:35:00] <rhk> maxr: that's one I don't know off the top of my head :)
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[16:35:45] <rhk> wow, so activate is far less useful that it should be
[16:36:03] <magnet> rhk, it would also be less useful the way around
[16:36:07] <magnet> +other
[16:36:18] <rhk> how so?
[16:36:41] <rhk> hmm. I think I see the issue.
[16:37:07] <rhk> it's really only a notification of activation, not intended for any sort of initialization
[16:37:07] <magnet> Multiple references always are dynamic, so you shouldn't make assumptions on whether all the referenced services are present when the activate method is called
[16:37:27] <magnet> the initialization is still the Java constructor
[16:37:38] <magnet> activate means that your service is able to be referenced
[16:38:33] <magnet> I know it bit me the first time I tried playing with it, but after some time using it I believe it's working the Right Way(tm)
[16:39:43] <rhk> I had always assumed that activate would be called before any outside calls to your service could be made.
[16:40:09] <rhk> what about deactivate? will your service be required to process calls to it's methods after deactivate is called?
[16:40:16] <magnet> It is called before any outside call :)
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[16:40:45] <maxr> magnet: Does that mean that a reference can be injected into a component before that reference has been activated?
[16:41:30] <magnet> maxr, no. Activate is called by the DS framework after it creates the object. But a reference might be passed to you before activate is called
[16:42:08] * rhk is reading the Service Compendium doc now
[16:42:15] <magnet> rhk, I don't know if it's required. I'd say it's up to you. Deactivate is called when you stop the bundle containing the service
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[16:43:08] <magnet> activate/deactivate are very similar to the start and stop methods on the BundleActivator
[16:43:09] <maxr> magnet: I have a component CommunicationService that uses a service MirrorRegistry that is injected into my CommunicationService before MirrorRegistry has been activated. The problem is that my CommunicationService tries to run methods on my MirrorRegistry before I have actually set it up
[16:43:36] <maxr> Is that consistant behaviour?
[16:44:12] <magnet> maxr, seems weird
[16:44:35] <maxr> that's what I thought as well
[16:44:42] <magnet> maxr, in my experience you may get a MirrorRegistry before the CommunicatonService's activate method has been called, but not the other way around
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[16:45:45] <maxr> yeah, and I would have thought that no one else could use it's services before it has been activated.
[16:46:15] <rhk> that was my understanding as well, but now I'm not so sure
[16:46:21] <maxr> humm, could it be because the reference is Dynamic?
[16:46:23] <magnet> maxr, I try to avoid relying on activate() to set up my components. Initialization in a default constructor. Mandatory references on any required service
[16:46:48] <magnet> maxr, yes if you set it to dynamic you have to manage synchronization on your own
[16:47:19] <maxr> ok, so basically that could be the problem
[16:47:24] <maxr> I will try to change it
[16:47:26] <rhk> section 112.3.3 "Once all the references of a component are satisfied, a component configuration can be activated and therefore bound to target services."
[16:47:49] <rhk> (r4.cmpn.pdf)
[16:48:19] <rhk> to me that says that if it's doing what you say it is doing, then it's not in compliance to the spec, and should be reported as a bug
[16:48:44] <magnet> rhk, are you using 3.5.1? There were some changes between 3.5.0 and 3.5.1
[16:49:01] <rhk> eclipse 3.5.1? yes
[16:49:19] <magnet> yeah, eclipse/equinox :)
[16:49:29] <maxr> I get the same behaviour with a Static reference as a dynamic one
[16:49:32] <magnet> I mean org.eclipse.equinox.ds
[16:50:02] <maxr> rhk: agree
[16:51:06] <magnet> oh I meant to ask maxr about his equinox version :)
[16:51:15] <maxr> "...can be activated and therefore bound to target services" does that meen can be activated and then.... ?
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[16:51:34] <maxr> magnet: ah sorry, hang on a sec
[16:52:08] <maxr> magnet: org.eclipse.osgi_3.5.1.R35x_v20090827
[16:52:17] <maxr> 3.5.1
[16:52:24] <magnet> well maybe it's a bug
[16:52:47] <magnet> that's the problem with informal specs, it's subject to interpretation
[16:52:50] <maxr> do you think that would be a bug in equinox or ds?
[16:52:58] <magnet> equinox.ds
[16:53:01] <maxr> yeah possibly
[16:53:10] <maxr> org.eclipse.equinox.ds_1.1.1.R35x_v20090806
[16:53:36] <maxr> yeah because that order should be completely up to ds right?
[16:53:55] <magnet> yes
[16:54:11] <magnet> or service hooks
[16:54:18] <maxr> going to see they have any newer version of
[16:54:23] <maxr> of ds
[16:54:31] <magnet> I run the same version
[16:54:36] <maxr> but DS is the serivce hook here is it?
[16:54:48] <maxr> ok, and you haven't had that problem?
[16:55:10] <maxr> I seem to get it consistently when I run the framework
[16:55:10] <magnet> maxr, I don't experience it, but I'm not relying on activate methods. I'm barely using them at all
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[16:55:51] <maxr> ok. I could do the initialization in the constructor i guess
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[16:56:11] <maxr> I just thought it would be nice to leave it up to the framework
[16:56:37] <magnet> Well unless the initialization is costly, I think it's better to have it in the constructor
[16:56:48] <magnet> Best practices say your services should be POJOs as much as possible
[16:57:10] <magnet> So you can change framework if you need it
[16:57:58] <rhk> hmm. if a service needs to allocate and release a resource, say opening a file, then it needs to have a clear place to put the release.
[16:58:05] <maxr> I suppose. The thing is that i set up a threadpool that want to shutdown when i stop the component
[16:58:19] <rhk> exactly
[16:58:25] <maxr> rhk: exactly
[16:58:43] <maxr> :)
[16:59:17] <rhk> philk__: I finally caught up to your blog post from 3 days ago about OutputDebugString :)
[16:59:46] <rhk> maxr: that's what I have used activate/deactivate for in the past
[17:00:04] <philk__> rhk: ok... pushing the code to github right now
[17:00:37] <maxr> rhk: have you ever had these problems in the past?
[17:00:50] <rhk> maxr: no
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[17:04:31] <maxr> rhk: have you had problems with the framework setting up and destroying components for you?
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[17:04:58] <maxr> it could be because of some runtime exeptions in the activate methods i guess
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[17:07:53] <philk__> rhk: code is now up at http://github.com/pke/OutputDebugString-Monitor
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[17:09:49] <philk__> rhk: of course it could be even more finegrained... there could be a core bundle and one for log and eventadmin
[17:09:57] <maxr> ah, but see when I put my initialization in the constructor rather than activate mehtod it will try to run services on it before all my MirrorRegistry's mandatory references are set
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[17:12:35] <rhk> maxr: that just seems wrong. your service shouldn't receive calls until it has it's mandatory refs. have you verified that the refs are defined as mandatory for sure?
[17:12:47] <realazthat> quick q: is it possible to open a project without copying it into a workspace?
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[17:13:40] <rhk> philk__: perhaps a debug message listener service that is provided to this one?
[17:14:02] <rhk> realazthat: yes. you can change the location of the project when you create it
[17:14:17] <rhk> realazthat: or import without copying, I believe there is a checkbox for that
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[17:14:27] <realazthat> great
[17:14:28] <realazthat> ty
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[17:14:38] <realazthat> I'll read up the rest
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[17:14:46] <philk__> rhk: its in there... the MonitorComponent consumes Listener
[17:14:48] <rhk> philk__: doh. looked at the code, and you have that.
[17:14:55] <rhk> awesone
[17:14:59] <rhk> er awesome
[17:15:14] <philk__> rhk: its just purely DS and no listener management on my side
[17:15:41] <philk__> rhk: I think to maybe split out the EventAdmin and LogService Listeners into own bundles
[17:15:53] <rhk> philk__: yeah
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[17:16:37] <rhk> philk__: doesn't the call to locateServices() need a fully qualified name?
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[17:17:09] <philk__> rhk: but on the other hand, its only one more (optional) import... but as an example for how to design OSGi bundles it might be a good idea to have everything in its own bundle
[17:17:24] <philk__> rhk: no, locateService needs the name you specified in the DS xml
[17:17:42] <philk__> rhk: it can be anything you want
[17:17:44] <rhk> philk__: so maybe "Listener" isn't the best name then :)
[17:18:29] <philk__> rhk: why not? It references Listener services
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[17:19:02] <rhk> is that name exposed externally? in other words, can I plug in my own Listener objects to this service from outside?
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[17:19:31] <rhk> oh I see
[17:19:32] <rhk> nevermind
[17:19:49] <rhk> the reference is named Listener
[17:19:58] <philk__> rhk: yes :)
[17:20:08] <philk__> rhk: and yes, you can plug in your own listeners
[17:20:18] <philk__> rhk: check out the LogServiceListener.xml
[17:20:26] <rhk> looking at that right now
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[17:23:20] <rhk> philk__: interesting design putting Monitor in the exposed package. so it's usable as  "library" by non-osgi code, or as a service
[17:23:45] <philk__> rhk: that was the idea. Thats why the MonitorComponent is internal
[17:24:12] <rhk> philk__: that's how I usually write my components too. interface exposed, component in internal
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[17:24:38] <rhk> philk__: for some of them I make a separate interface-only bundle too, if I intend to have multiple implementations
[17:24:40] <philk__> rhk: yes me too. Unfortunatly here I needed to export the class itself
[17:25:38] <rhk> are you using a modified copy of jna?
[17:25:48] <philk__> rhk: which DS reference policy do you prefer for single references? 1..1 static or 1..1 dynamic?
[17:26:14] <philk__> rhk: yes its a modified Version of Kernel32 as stated here: http://wiki.github.com/pke/OutputDebugString-Monitor
[17:27:33] <rhk> philk__: are you going to submit those changes to the JNA project? do they even take code submissions?
[17:28:00] <philk__> rhk: yes, I have already developer access there
[17:28:07] <rhk> cool
[17:28:15] <philk__> rhk: but their source code layout is not Eclipse friendly
[17:28:24] <rhk> figures :)
[17:28:27] <philk__> rhk: they generate all MANIFEST files manually
[17:28:50] <rhk> I've used mostly 1..1 static, I think
[17:29:05] <philk__> rhk: so I have to find a way to import the project into Eclipse without destroying their project structure and apply the changes
[17:30:24] <rhk> tricky
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[17:39:41] <philk__> rhk: i just modified the file in a text editor... lol
[17:39:58] <philk__> is there a Mylyn connector for the issue tracker at java.net?
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[17:41:32] <rhk> philk__: looking back at a few of my components, I've rarely used 1..1, and when I did (in the one I looked at) it was dynamic
[17:42:31] <rhk> but in that component I had another ref that was 0..n dynamic, so the whole thing had to be dynamic really
[17:43:05] <philk__> rhk: using 1..1 static would further simplify the code used in the sample listeners... a simple context.locateService and skip the AtomicReference
[17:43:24] <rhk> I created my thread in activate() and stopped and joined in deactivate() in that one
[17:44:33] <philk__> PrakashGR: nice to see you here! What do you think about the posting I made http://philondev.blogspot.com/2009/12/toggle-commands-toggle-other.html ? Do you think thats a good way to toggle contributions?
[17:45:06] <philk__> rhk: as you can see, I cannot use the usual Thread.join() method in my case. I have to rely on a different mechanism
[17:45:13] <rhk> yeah
[17:45:36] <philk__> rhk: but its working great. I will provide a unit test that calls OutputDebugString using JNA to prove the concept :)
[17:46:14] <rhk> might not hurt to expose that in the bundle as well
[17:46:29] <rhk> then it's all in one place, in a nice simple bundle
[17:47:36] <PrakashGR> philk__: yes, thats the way to make it
[17:48:02] <philk__> rhk: sure, I will provide that with the bundle... extension to Kernel32 interface... however... do you know how I could reuse the INSTANCE variable of Kernel32 when extending it?
[17:48:06] <philk__> PrakashGR: thanks!
[17:48:14] <philk__> PrakashGR: your post gave me a good start
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[17:48:23] <PrakashGR> philk__: :-)
[17:48:27] <rhk> philk__: I've not used JNA yet :)
[17:48:49] <PrakashGR> philk__: Is your blog under EPL?
[17:49:20] <PrakashGR> philk__: Basically, I want to publish in my blog and give a link to the original entry
[17:49:50] <philk__> PrakashGR: sure, its EPL
[17:58:16] <PrakashGR> philk__: http://blog.eclipse-tips.com/2009/12/toggle-commands-toggle-other.html there you go. Thanks!
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[18:02:47] <philk__> PrakashGR: you are welcome! Hope it gets wide spread... what do you think? Would the toggle property tester make it back into the Eclipse code base?
[18:03:33] <PrakashGR> philk__: You can raise a bug
[18:04:08] <philk__> PrakashGR: ok
[18:04:44] <PrakashGR> philk__: if the contributed code is generic in nature + if there are real usecases we can take it
[18:05:17] <philk__> PrakashGR: use case is given by the blog post, and its fairly generic
[18:05:46] <philk__> how can I write a unit test for OSGi bundles? The "Junit Plugin Test" has dependencies on the workbench IDE
[18:06:06] <PrakashGR> philk__: raise a bug, Paul can suggest whether it can be taken or not
[18:06:12] <rhk> philk__: I've used a fragment for that
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[18:07:52] <philk__> rhk: and which run-config?
[18:08:40] <rhk> I think I just ran it was "junit test case" or something (no osgi)
[18:09:09] <rhk> then inject whatever you need into the service manually
[18:09:37] <rhk> on that note, I'd change your monitor component to use bind, instead of locateService
[18:10:36] <philk__> rhk: the problem is the normal junit test case does not find the other bundles
[18:11:01] <philk__> rhk: why use bind and maintain yet another list?
[18:11:22] <rhk> philk__: because then you can inject rather than pull from the context
[18:12:14] <philk__> rhk: i know but you would have to maintain a list of all references yourself...
[18:12:20] <rhk> yes
[18:12:32] <rhk> 1..n dynamic :)
[18:12:49] <rhk> removes the dep on osgi too
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[18:13:31] <philk__> rhk: yes thats the only benefit to remove the dependency... *but* the MonitorComponent is already a component and only supposed to be used inside an OSGi context so I think thats ok
[18:13:57] <rhk> philk__: yeah, but it makes it harder to unit test.
[18:14:14] <philk__> rhk: the component? yes, thats true :)
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[18:24:46] <philk_> how can I get a list of all currently running threads?
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[18:28:01] <mikee805> Hi, does anyone know if you can use the egit plugin with an existing git repo? or do you have to create an jgit repo in eclipse?
[18:28:46] <rcjsuen> Pretty sure you can clone an existing repository.
[18:29:29] <mikee805> but can you commit to an existing one?
[18:30:38] <rcjsuen> I cloned the egit repo and committed to it locally, so I guess "yes".
[18:31:07] <mikee805> interesting
[18:31:33] <mikee805> i was hoping the other way around commit to the local (existing repo) from eclipse
[18:31:44] <mikee805> I was trying to follow this http://github.com/guides/using-the-egit-eclipse-plugin-with-github blog post
[18:32:09] <mikee805> but the current build of the plug in does not seem to work
[18:32:23] <rcjsuen> 0.3.1 is a long time ago I think.
[18:32:23] <philk_> why does Eclipse does not import static imports on ctrl+O?
[18:32:38] <mikee805> yeah
[18:32:49] <mikee805> they are on 0.6.0, which I have
[18:33:03] <rcjsuen> mikee805: You could try asking on the EGit ~forums it is active (by my definition).
[18:33:03] <Arbalest> http://www.eclipse.org/forums/
[18:33:29] <mikee805> yeah I tried on there too no responses yet so I thought I would give it a shot here
[18:33:34] <mikee805> cover all the bases :P
[18:35:17] <rcjsuen> yeah the team > share wizard has changed quite a bit
[18:35:20] <rcjsuen> i think it's a table now or something
[18:36:12] <mikee805> the problem is at that step, you dont get a choice of using an using (searching for) an existing repo
[18:36:15] <mikee805> only creating one
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[18:37:45] <rcjsuen> yes that seems to match what i recalled
[18:38:08] <rcjsuen> i used the import wizard to clone the egit repo i think
[18:38:17] <mikee805> I also dont get the git menu item seen in the blog post
[18:38:33] <mikee805> I tried that too, I created a project checked into the existing repo then imported it
[18:38:44] <mikee805> the team menu still only has share
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[18:39:01] <mikee805> it does not remember where it came from
[18:39:09] <rcjsuen> i mean in the import wizard there is a specific git wizard i think
[18:39:19] <mikee805> yes
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[18:40:03] <mikee805> you can import just fine from there but you still cant commit your changes back to the repo you imported from as far as I can tell
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[18:40:13] <rcjsuen> Think that worked for me
[18:40:20] <rcjsuen> Unless I was trying it in anothe rworkspace where I cloned from the CLI
[18:40:36] <mikee805> under team can you commit it back?
[18:40:45] <rcjsuen> I committed in Eclipse for sure anyway
[18:41:03] <mikee805> yeah
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[18:42:06] <philk__> rhk: added some unit tests and exposed the OutputDebugString function from the core bundle as you suggested
[18:42:25] <philk__> rhk: http://github.com/pke/OutputDebugString-Monitor/tree/master/bundles/
[18:43:02] <philk__> rhk: what kind of listener management would you suggest for dynamic bind? A HashSet would be good enough?
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[18:44:56] <mikee805> do you if you can pull from other egit/jgit instances?
[18:45:01] <rhk> philk__: I think listenerShouldBeCalled() might be a race to see if the onDebugString gets called.
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[18:46:34] <rcjsuen> Don't really recall doing that. I had to resort to the CLI in many instances.
[18:47:09] <mikee805> yeah, it looks that way.
[18:47:18] <rhk> philk__: I've just used ArrayList, but HashSet should be ok. add/remove are uncommon operations for me, so performance wasn't imperative for them. I'll probably go back later and use that array method that's in org.eclipse.core.runtime.ListenerList
[18:47:44] <philk__> rhk: yes I thought so first too. But there could be another monitor (i.e DebugView from sysinternals.com) running that will grab the ODS... since the system only fires the events once its not clear who will get notified first. So the unit test is just happy *if* it gets some output and checks the one it gets.
[18:47:56] <mikee805> if we could stay completely with in eclipse it might be fine, I will have to setup a test between two instances of eclipse and see if they share between each other.
[18:48:53] <rhk> philk__: it does seem like the backing method for ODS is only intended for a single listener
[18:49:46] <rhk> philk__: but I was more referring to the fact that the listener might never be called, even though that's what the test is for :)
[18:50:29] <rhk> philk__: maybe just a Thread.sleep() after calling ODS, before the stop
[18:51:28] <rhk> philk__: or better yet, set a flag in the onDebugString() method that is checked after monitor.stop
[18:51:47] <rhk> would need an inner class or at least a field for that
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[18:52:03] <honk__> rhk: yes, I saw the ListenerList, but I would like not to depend on anything *eclipse*
[18:52:10] <rcjsuen> mikee805: From what others have told me you have to use the CLI. For instance, you can't even make a patch in Eclipse.
[18:52:25] <mikee805> really! sigh ok
[18:52:33] <rhk> honk__: for my use, I re-implemented the same technique, but without a lot of the extra bits :)
[18:52:35] <mikee805> I am trying to do an evaluation for my team
[18:52:44] <rhk> honk__: it's a basic array list implementation, really
[18:52:47] <rcjsuen> they don't have a merge/diff algorithm
[18:53:11] <rcjsuen> ~tell mikee805 about 297636
[18:53:13] <Arbalest> mikee805: Bug 297636 - https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=297636 - EGit / JGit / unspecified - PC / Windows XP - NEW / enhancement / - Assignee: egit.core-inbox - Create Patch via EGit
[18:53:15] <rhk> bbiab. lunchtime
[18:53:16] <mikee805> but the cli commands work the git repo created in eclipse?
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[18:53:32] <disappearedng_> Is there a way to force eclipse to compile and run every time I make an edit?
[18:53:39] <rcjsuen> I think so. I only looked at it briefly. And I know absolutely nothing about Git. ;)
[18:53:50] <rcjsuen> i only tried a few random commands
[18:54:06] <honk__> rhk: ok, I will look into that changing the locateService to an internal synchronized list
[18:54:12] <mikee805> ok thanks everyone for your help, I seem to have my answers now
[18:54:13] <rcjsuen> disappearedng_: I don't think so, that'd probably use up a lot of cpu cycles.
[18:54:34] <rcjsuen> And I presume by "edit" you meant "save".
[18:54:35] <disappearedng_> well I am seeing the problem that my edits are not compiled
[18:54:39] <disappearedng_> I don't mean save
[18:55:37] <honk__> rhk: I would then make the addListener method just synchronized?
[18:55:43] <rcjsuen> well, if you don't _save_, the compiler will just pick up the original file that's on disk I would think?
[18:55:55] <rhk> honk__: yup
[18:55:56] <disappearedng_> well I am using another editor to edit the source code
[18:55:58] <disappearedng_> you see,
[18:56:09] <disappearedng_> so now I have to force a refresh everytime, then run
[18:56:30] <honk__> rhk: and since DS will not inject the same listener twice I will not have to check for duplicates already in the list
[18:56:36] <rhk> gotta let the jeep warm up before I go :)
[18:56:39] <rcjsuen> there's an auto refresh setting in the prefs tho that's based on a polling scheme
[18:56:53] <rcjsuen> rhk: "warm up", how cold over there?
[18:57:40] <disappearedng_> rcjsuen where might I find that?
[18:57:42] <rhk> rcjsuen: 29F today, which is actually warm out, but I've been cold all morning, so I figured I'd get it warmed up
[18:57:49] <rcjsuen> disappearedng_: I mean in the Eclipse preferences
[18:57:53] <rcjsuen> oic
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[18:58:29] <rcjsuen> rhk: it's about negative mid-10s here, which i guess is about 5 F or so
[18:58:33] <rhk> it's chilly under my desk (maybe 65F or so right now)
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[18:59:24] <rhk> rcjsuen: it's a small office building, so I can just walk out and start the car, and right back in. it's maybe 50 ft away, so warming it up is easy
[18:59:39] <rcjsuen> yeah my car's parked pretty close to the door too :)
[18:59:44] <rcjsuen> tho today i came to work and forgot my badge ;(
[18:59:52] <rcjsuen> waited around, no one showed up (i come in early)
[18:59:57] <rcjsuen> drove back home to get it and back to work ;p
[19:00:04] <rhk> my desk is about 10 ft from the door too, so it's quick
[19:00:32] <rhk> that sucks
[19:00:57] <honk__> rhk: how would I call the protected "activate" method of the Component?
[19:01:11] <honk__> rhk: I could use reflection
[19:01:30] <rcjsuen> rhk: I'm only 5 or 6km from work so oh well *shrugs*
[19:01:36] <rhk> honk__: or don't bother making it protected
[19:01:44] <rcjsuen> As Forrest Gump would say, shit happens :)
[19:02:04] <rhk> rcjsuen: my work pc is a notebook, and I've left it at home before.
[19:02:12] <rhk> rcjsuen: and I have a 30 minute drive to work
[19:02:26] <rhk> bbiab
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[19:09:03] <SniperFodder> Is there a way to assign working sets to perspectives, and automatically add a project to a working spec, depending on which perspective is active?
[19:10:05] <rcjsuen> Don't think so.
[19:10:42] <SniperFodder> damn XD
[19:10:45] <SniperFodder> oh well
[19:10:46] <SniperFodder> lol
[19:12:17] <rcjsuen> you could use a resource listener i suppose
[19:12:33] <SniperFodder> resource listener?
[19:12:50] <rcjsuen> projects are from the resource APIs
[19:12:57] <rcjsuen> there is a resource listener for monitoring resource changes
[19:13:08] <SniperFodder> hrm, so basically write my own plugin to handle it?
[19:13:17] <rcjsuen> tho i'm not sure it makes sense for working sets to be tied to perspectives
[19:13:24] <rcjsuen> Right
[19:13:33] <SniperFodder> well what's a working set supposed to represent?
[19:13:35] <rcjsuen> There's nothing stopping someone from making a C project in the Java perspective.
[19:13:47] <rcjsuen> whatever the user wants to throw in there
[19:13:53] <SniperFodder> ah
[19:14:06] <SniperFodder> well I basically have the CDT installed on my java installation
[19:14:24] <SniperFodder> and so I was using working sets to seperate the projects out, C++ from Java projects
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[19:14:52] <SniperFodder> that way if I'm in my java persepective, I only see my java projects
[19:18:49] <rcjsuen> I'd probably just use different workspaces myself.
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[19:19:03] <rcjsuen> well, unless my Java projects talk to the C projects using JNI or whatever
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[20:00:06] <philk_> rhk: in regard to DS using locateServices has its pros... the services will not be instantiated before you need them. If you use dynamic binding method they will be handled to you right away or am I mistaken?
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[20:04:26] <rhk> philk_: that makes sense, but I don't know if that's how it works
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[20:35:32] <philk_> rhk: i need to investigate that further... anyway... I added process module informations to the LogServiceListener
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[20:37:16] <philk_> rhk: this could also be configurable using ConfigAdmin, or rather have Monitor resolve the process name for you already or else the EventAdminListener would have to do that again, and duplicate code.
[20:39:54] <rhk> philk_: could have a syslog-based backend for linux too :) and whatever mac uses
[20:40:44] <philk_> rhk: thats true
[20:41:36] <philk_> rhk: we would then have a syslog.core bundle, and syslog.win32 and syslog.linux for linux derivates
[20:41:59] <philk_> rhk: which one would be instantiated could be delegated to a DS factory
[20:42:37] <philk_> should an EventObject class generate its content lazy in its getter methods?
[20:44:55] <rhk> I haven't used EventAdmin yet
[20:47:02] <philk_> rhk: its a Java EventObject
[20:47:28] <rhk> oh
[20:48:02] <rhk> the listener then has to use instanceof and such
[20:49:22] <philk_> rhk: Actually it uses the concreate implementation... look at the new code at the hub
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[20:51:14] <benc1> I have a window in eclipse that looks weird maybe because my screen hight is not enough
[20:51:20] <benc1> is there anything I can do to fix it?
[20:51:47] <benc1> there is a select box that doesn't show the select options. It looks like it's collapsed
[20:51:57] <rhk> philk_: where is DebugStringEvent defined?
[20:52:15] <rhk> philk_: looks like it's missing on the commit :0
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[21:13:49] <philk_> rhk: hmm interesting... I did a git commit -a
[21:14:14] <multiHYP> is it possible to download and get a local copy of swt and/or jface documentation apis?
[21:18:49] <philk_> rhk: ok, check again please... I do not know why git commit -a did not work
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[21:45:44] <rcjsuen> one way would be to get the SDK and from there extract the javadocs from the platform docs jar file
[21:47:01] <multiHYP> hi rcjsuen, i have a different version than the one inside sdk though
[21:47:19] <rcjsuen> You could download an older SDK I suppose
[21:47:26] <rcjsuen> or check out the branch from CVS and gen the javadocs yourself
[21:47:45] <multiHYP> i need to get couple of java docs for specific libraries because I will be offline during christmas, but still need to program some stuff
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[21:48:44] <multiHYP> oh yeah, i remember having had the cvs once, but any tutorials i could use to add cvs of eclipse swt and/or jface to my eclipse cvs plugins?
[21:49:38] <rcjsuen> Not sure I completely follow.
[21:50:11] <multiHYP> oh i need to be a member
[21:50:33] <multiHYP> want to add these inside cvs plugin in the repository list, don't have membership though
[21:50:46] <multiHYP> also, is jface part of org.eclipse as well?
[21:50:47] <rcjsuen> there's an anonymous login
[21:52:32] <multiHYP> ok see, do i need to have had installed the "Platform plugin developer guide" to have these docs already in eclipse?
[21:56:01] <rcjsuen> yes, but it sounds like your SDK version differs from your SWT version
[21:57:42] <multiHYP> yes, i don't even know if there is an eclipse version with swt3-5-1.jar out yet, besides its a hassle to reinstall things...
[21:57:52] <multiHYP> my eclipse is uptodate though
[21:58:10] <rcjsuen> 3.5.1 is out, so yes there's a 3.5.1 jar
[21:58:19] <multiHYP> i need to get swt docs now, and possibly jface libs and docs as well, just in case
[21:58:43] <multiHYP> no, i mean an eclipse sdk with 3.5.1 inside it
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[21:59:06] <multiHYP> i got the swt.jar separately, i usually keep a libraries folder external for all my needs
[21:59:14] <rcjsuen> there is also a 3.5.1 SDK build
[21:59:39] <multiHYP> ok, well how can i attach source to the one i already have manually?
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[22:00:07] <multiHYP> because they don't seem to offer it as a jar or zip on eclipse.org/swt
[22:00:19] <multiHYP> the docs i mean
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[22:01:33] <rcjsuen> I don't think we do separate javadoc downloads.
[22:01:54] <multiHYP> so the only option is to get a whole new version of eclipse?
[22:02:30] <multiHYP> but, this way i would be always dependent on the eclipse plugin folders for my libraries, which is bad...
[22:03:18] <rcjsuen> well, i presented other options such as checking out a specific branch/tag of CVS which would match your target
[22:03:22] <rcjsuen> javadoc doesn't really change much
[22:03:31] <rcjsuen> unless you're talking 3.x to 3.6
[22:03:32] <rcjsuen> er
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[22:03:33] <rcjsuen> 3.x to 3.7
[22:03:35] <rcjsuen> damnit
[22:03:37] <rcjsuen> 3.x to 3.y
[22:03:41] <benc1> how do I solve gui problems under karmic?
[22:04:11] <rcjsuen> benc1: That's a rather vague question.
[22:04:41] <multiHYP> yes, thanks, i see if i can get cvs working, seems best options as you said
[22:05:44] <rhk> benc1: ~faq
[22:05:45] <Arbalest> Please see the FAQs http://wiki.eclipse.org/IRC_FAQ - http://wiki.eclipse.org/Category:FAQ - http://wiki.eclipse.org/The_Official_Eclipse_FAQs
[22:05:47] <benc1> rcjsuen: I'm trying to create a new android project under eclipse. There is a select box and I can see that the options are there but its height is small
[22:06:04] <benc1> rcjsuen: and I can't choose any option
[22:06:12] <rcjsuen> Did you try resizing the dialog?
[22:06:14] <rhk> oh, different problem :)
[22:06:17] <rcjsuen> this sounds vaguely familiar
[22:06:22] <rcjsuen> and i think was closed as NOT_ECLIPSE ;p
[22:06:24] <benc1> rcjsuen: yes. still doesn't work
[22:06:30] <rcjsuen> Screenshot?
[22:06:41] <rcjsuen> altho i alrdy have a guess at what it is
[22:06:41] <benc1> rcjsuen: a sec
[22:06:59] * rcjsuen guesses it's a combo box that's disabled and can't be clicked.
[22:07:29] <rhk> does sound familiar
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[22:07:55] <rcjsuen> well we'll see once we have the pix :)
[22:08:16] <benc1> rcjsuen: http://imagebin.org/76404
[22:08:28] <benc1> rcjsuen: the 'Build Target' select
[22:08:37] <rcjsuen> I haven't seen this one.
[22:09:24] <rcjsuen> It may still be worth trying the GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS=true workaroudn tho
[22:09:29] <rcjsuen> rhk: I was thinking of ~295203 but maybe not.
[22:09:31] <Arbalest> Bug 295203 - https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=295203 - Platform / SWT / 3.5.1 - PC / Linux - NEW / normal / - Assignee: platform-swt-inbox - [GTK2.18] Text boxes with no search suggestions are disabled
[22:10:03] <benc1> ronghail: weird. someone suggested to move the window down and the enlarge it up and it works
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[22:10:41] <ech0s7> hi
[22:10:55] <ech0s7> in my web dynamic project i get this warning: Description	Resource	Path	Location	Type
[22:10:56] <ech0s7> Classpath entry /usr/share/java/mysql-jdbc/mysql-connector-java-bin.jar will not be exported or published. Runtime ClassNotFoundExceptions may result.
[22:10:59] <ech0s7> why ?
[22:11:01] <ech0s7> how can i fix ?
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[22:12:57] <multiHYP> which one is the main eclipse sdk docs folder on the cvs? i am now under /cvsroot/eclipse/head
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[22:14:26] <rhk> benc1: what resolution is that screen?
[22:14:38] <benc1> 1024*768
[22:14:53] <nitind> ech0s7: Go to the project's Java EE Module Dependencies property page.
[22:14:59] <rhk> what's your system font size?
[22:15:30] <ech0s7> thanks nitind !
[22:15:32] <rcjsuen> multiHYP: I'm not sure we check javadoc into CVS.
[22:15:42] <multiHYP> boah
[22:15:49] <rhk> benc1: I think the problem is that it's limiting the dialog to the screen size, and that dialog doesn't grow a scrollbar if needed, since it's usually small
[22:15:53] <multiHYP> why did i set up cvs then?
[22:16:23] <benc1>  rhk: it's a bug
[22:17:07] <rcjsuen> multiHYP: I was suggesting you check out SWT and JFace from CVS and then generate the javadocs from them.
[22:17:36] <multiHYP> oh ok, do they have the docs in them?
[22:18:47] <rcjsuen> I know JFace doesn't include the javadocs in the CVS module anyway.
[22:19:37] <multiHYP> so where can i get the docs for Jface, is not urgent, but you know..
[22:19:57] <rcjsuen> I was suggesting you _generate_ them.
[22:20:12] <rcjsuen> Tho it seems you've never generated javadoc before.
[22:20:20] <rcjsuen> javadoc takes java source code and creates the HTML files
[22:21:00] <multiHYP> oh okay, i did before, now i understand what you meant though
[22:21:05] <nitind> multiHYP: Is there some reason you're not working with the eclipse-SDK download?  They're already primed for use in there.
[22:21:11] <multiHYP> thats a pain, hasn't anyone done it for me?
[22:21:27] <rcjsuen> most ppl just take the docs from the SDK instead of generating I would think
[22:21:44] <multiHYP> i can't find the docs inside my sdk
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[22:21:58] <multiHYP> or do you mean to generate it myself again?
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[22:23:13] <nitind> multiHYP: If you have the SDK, it's browseable in the built-in help in the same way that doc for the JRE is browseable on java.sun.com.  Otherwise it's provided through hover information, pop-ups, and the JavaDoc View.
[22:23:28] <rcjsuen> the location of the javadocs is addressed in the ~dev-faq i believe, if you want the raw html
[22:23:29] <Arbalest> Writing Eclipse plug-ins / RCP apps and don't know where to turn? See these FAQs - http://wiki.eclipse.org/Eclipse_Plug-in_Development_FAQ - http://wiki.eclipse.org/The_Official_Eclipse_FAQs - http://wiki.eclipse.org/RCP_FAQ / Or look at EclipseCon talks/tutorials - http://www.eclipsecon.org/
[22:23:50] <multiHYP> well i bring that up and search for api docs, but nothing remotely looking like an api shows up!
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[22:24:34] <multiHYP> Workbench User Guide
[22:24:34] <multiHYP> Java development user guide
[22:24:35] <multiHYP> C/C++ Development User Guide
[22:24:35] <multiHYP> CDT Plug-in Developer Guide
[22:24:35] <multiHYP> Mylyn WikiText User Guide
[22:24:35] <multiHYP> Subclipse - Subversion Eclipse Plugin
[22:24:36] <multiHYP> Tasks User Guide
[22:24:38] <multiHYP> Usage Data Collector
[22:25:03] <multiHYP> this is what i have, but i don't know where the heck is swt or jface, btw jface seems to have a lot of dependencies else where
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[22:26:01] <nitind> multiHYP: You're missing the Platform SDK feature, I think.  You should have something similar to http://help.eclipse.org/galileo/topic/org.eclipse.platform.doc.isv/reference/api/overview-summary.html there with it installed.
[22:26:18] <multiHYP> it looks like someone has taken the whole eclipse platform api specification out, because i have had a bookmark of it that leads to nowhere as well!
[22:26:40] <nitind> What?
[22:27:23] <multiHYP> multiHYP: ok see, do i need to have had installed the "Platform plugin developer guide" to have these docs already in eclipse? 21:02
[22:27:45] <multiHYP> i wish nitind would say that much earlier
[22:29:34] <multiHYP> where do i get this, because obviously it isn't inside my version of eclipse
[22:30:19] <nitind> multiHYP: Same place you get everything else, the update site for the corresponding simultaneous release.  Which should already be set in there, so go to Help->Install New Software...
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[22:31:33] <multiHYP> ok thanks everybody
[22:31:36] <multiHYP> bye
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[22:55:02] <wt> install new software dialogbox buttons cannot be click. i had to place focus on the button and then press enter. i'm using the latest Eclipse Java EE IDE for Web Developers. Eclipse Java EE IDE for Web Developers.
[22:55:15] <wt> i'm running it on opensuse 11.2 linux
[22:55:27] <wt> is this a bug that anybody has encountered or is it just me???
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[22:59:16] <wt> hello?? anybody can help out with my issue???
[22:59:59] <rcjsuen> wt: Linux?
[23:00:09] <wt> yes 32bit linux
[23:00:22] <rcjsuen> whoops
[23:00:25] <rcjsuen> right, you said so alrdy :(
[23:00:36] <rcjsuen> wt: your problem is addressed in the faq, see channel topic
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[23:01:00] <wt> rcjsuen: where do i get the faq?
[23:01:14] <wt> ok, i see it now
[23:01:15] <wt> thakns
[23:01:26] <rcjsuen> okilydokily
[23:01:29] <koltroll> I think I got a quite straight forward question; how can I set up a project where I work completly remote, against a ftp?
[23:01:31] <rcjsuen> in the future you can also try typing /topic
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[23:01:46] <koltroll> I tried
[23:02:11] <koltroll> * I tried some various things, but none that succeeded
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[23:10:28] <ahughes> what get's me is that eclipse 'knows' that the 'resource is out of sync with the filesystem' but chooses to do nothing about it... just throw an error.
[23:13:44] <NoobFukaure> what if you wanted to keep the changes in the workspace?
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[23:13:55] <NoobFukaure> like something else deleted the file without your permission or mangled it
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[23:21:16] <rcjsuen> wt: Any luck with your buttons problem?
[23:24:53] <wt> rcjsuen: still the same problem
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[23:25:05] <rcjsuen> wt: What did you try
[23:25:13] <wt> some buttons work some dont....usually it's the buttons on the side that does not work
[23:25:23] <wt> bottom buttons seems to work ok with the click of the mouse
[23:25:45] <rcjsuen> wt: i mean to say, did you try the workaround?
[23:25:47] <wt> what i tried is, opened up the install new software dialog box
[23:25:55] <wt> no i havent
[23:26:02] <deSilva> well duh
[23:26:19] <wt> i'll havent finished reading the faq yet...sorry :(
[23:26:22] <rcjsuen> wt: Did you find the FAQ though?
[23:26:24] <rcjsuen> wt: look at 3.8
[23:26:33] <wt> yes...i found the faq
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[23:32:26] <wt> rcjsuen: it works, thanks
[23:32:38] <wt> strange, i'm running kde and not gnome.
[23:32:44] <rcjsuen> doesn't matter
[23:32:45] <wt> i thought gtk is only used in gnome
[23:32:47] <rcjsuen> you're still using gtk+
[23:32:54] <rcjsuen> someone on GNOME can run Qt apps if they wanted
[23:33:01] <wt> ok
[23:33:17] <rcjsuen> qt/gtk+ is just a widget toolkit (well, qt is more than that but anyway...)
[23:33:29] <wt> ok
[23:33:43] <rcjsuen> if you ever wondered why Eclipse doesn't really look like a KDE app
[23:33:45] <rcjsuen> now you know ;)
[23:33:48] <ahughes> NoobFukaure, that's what file locks are for.... every O/S has locking on files.
[23:34:07] <NoobFukaure> ahughes: not all eclipse resources are files
[23:34:42] <rcjsuen> not necessarily local files anyway
[23:35:11] <ahughes> well I hop "out of sync with filesystem" errors aren't linked tho things that are not files :)   anyway.. I'm over my bitching quota for one day... I don't want to eat into tomorrows quota or I will have nothing to do. :)
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[23:36:00] <rcjsuen> always good to have something to bitch about
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