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[20:05:32] <rcjsuen> emoffatt: It worked for me anyway. I have pushed both commits to R4_development.
[20:12:52] <emoffatt> kk thanks
[20:16:42] <emoffatt> rcjsuen: what's the 'wooops' comment all about on ~354491
[20:16:43] <Arbalest> Bug 354491 - https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=354491 - Platform / UI / 3.7 - All / All - RESOLVED / FIXED / normal / - Assignee: remysuen - Workspace failed to start due to Problems View getting activated outside SWT Display Thread
[20:16:51] <rcjsuen> paulweb515_: Do you think enabledWhen is working for org.eclipse.ui.handlers?
[20:16:59] <rcjsuen> emoffatt: I wrote my "fixed" comment with setting to RESOLVED/FIXED.
[20:17:28] <emoffatt> ah...I'm just having 'trust issues' with GIT :)
[20:40:24] <tschindl> emoffatt: saw your eclipsecon europe submissions on eclipse 4
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[20:40:40] <tschindl> I've also filed 2 and i think one of ours is overlapping
[20:41:45] <tschindl> my talks are
[20:41:47] <tschindl> http://www.eclipsecon.org/europe2011/sessions/eclipse-4-application-platform-not-commonly-know-features-new-platform
[20:42:04] <tschindl> http://www.eclipsecon.org/europe2011/sessions/state-eclipse-4-what-happened-41-and-whats-cooking-42
[20:43:00] <emoffatt> tschindl: cool, let me look
[20:43:45] <emoffatt> I was thinking of stealing one of your non-SWT demos for use in my 'where are we going' talk
[20:44:26] <tschindl> in the last years Boris and me always gave a Overview Talk "Retrospective & Future"
[20:44:39] <tschindl> my proposal for this year would be
[20:45:00] <tschindl> a) "Retrospective & Future" on the e4 project
[20:45:20] <tschindl> b) A special talk on the Eclipse Application Platform
[20:45:40] <tschindl> c) A talk on future stuff to expect from Eclipse 4 SDK
[20:46:17] <tschindl> I'd like to go deep into the EAP in http://www.eclipsecon.org/europe2011/sessions/eclipse-4-application-platform-not-commonly-know-features-new-platform
[20:46:44] <emoffatt> putting both retrospective and future in one (25 min) talk is going to be tight
[20:46:46] <tschindl> with context functions, addition of annotations, letting the ui translate by google
[20:47:00] <emoffatt> that sounds really cool
[20:47:28] <emoffatt> I was more focused on the UI bits (do we need perspectives?...)
[20:48:04] <emoffatt> I'd like to see that talk...
[20:48:22] <emoffatt> what do you mean when you refer to the EAP ?
[20:48:36] <emoffatt> the base framework for e4 RCP apps ?
[20:48:39] <tschindl> Eclipse Application Platform
[20:48:46] <tschindl> yes this is the common term
[20:48:57] <emoffatt> beauty
[20:48:59] <tschindl> Boris, Ian and me came up with this last year
[20:49:38] <tschindl> see this http://borisoneclipse.blogspot.com/2010/07/eclipse-40-overview.html
[20:49:39] <emoffatt> do you think I should re-target one of my talks or should we just reference each others and make sure we don't cover too much of the same ground ?
[20:50:26] <tschindl> i think it would make sense to re-target one of the talks and to the general overview together
[20:51:06] <tschindl> btw I'm on the programm committee :-)
[20:51:10] <emoffatt> sounds good (always take the recommendations of people on the submissions committy
[20:52:53] <emoffatt> so I'd likely want to retarget the 'what's in it for me' rather than the 'where are we going' one, is that OK
[20:53:04] <tschindl> +1
[20:53:26] <emoffatt> beauty, should I do the re-targetting and add you or vice versa ?
[20:53:46] <tschindl> what ever you want
[20:54:14] <emoffatt> I should do it I guess just to be sure that I count as two submissions (better chance of getting travel agreement)
[20:55:26] <emoffatt> do you want to do a joint BOF loosely around 'where are we going' ? You have some really neat stuff that I want to get the release train folks thinking about
[20:55:37] <tschindl> yes of course
[20:56:14] <emoffatt> excellent...so far it appears that the M1 release hasn't gone up in smoke :)
[20:57:01] <emoffatt> there is an interesting thread from one of the groups basically saying 'wtf, my M1 is based on Eclipse 4, what's up with that?' :)
[20:57:44] <emoffatt> ...and rcjsuen nicely posted the various meeting notes where it was decided...
[20:58:18] <emoffatt> in any case I'll make the changes...let me know if you want any other revisions once you see it
[21:00:01] <emoffatt> tschindl: on a side note...do *you* use Eclipse 4.x as your dev environment yet ? ;)
[21:00:51] <tschindl> well for my OSS projects for other projects we currently use 3.6.2
[21:01:28] <emoffatt> ah, I guess the business world is still reality based...
[21:01:54] <tschindl> emoffatt: where's this thread 'wtf, my M1 is based on Eclipse 4, what's up with that'
[21:01:59] <rcjsuen> I would like my bank to be based on reality.
[21:02:24] <tschindl> we plan to run our big RCP product in the next few months as a test on 4.1
[21:02:40] <emoffatt> it's on the 'cross platform' list
[21:03:00] <tschindl> and next year with 4.2 we'd like to switch it over into the E4 stream
[21:03:44] <tschindl> hm looks that's one of lists I'm not subscribed to
[21:04:01] <emoffatt> wow...that would be great ! We already get questions about 'what have other folks done with this'
[21:04:43] <emoffatt> do far all we've got is kizby and Stephan's (?) work
[21:05:09] <emoffatt> s/do/so/
[21:05:20] <tschindl> well we have the french guys who wrote an app for Airbus
[21:06:00] <emoffatt> that's who I was calling 'stephan' but to be honest I can't remember his name :(
[21:06:48] <emoffatt> do you know anyone that knows HTML5 ?
[21:07:07] <emoffatt> I guess I should be asking the Orion folks :)
[21:08:27] <emoffatt> tschindl: just a heads up that the work for making some of the 'standard' views available for E4 RCP apps has been de-scoped due to other commitments
[21:09:05] <tschindl> emoffatt: i know html5 very well
[21:09:41] <emoffatt> Want to try doing an HTML5 renderer set (if you don't have one already :) )
[21:09:43] <tschindl> on the "standard" views stuff I have not really a problem with that because I'm a RCP guy anyways
[21:09:50] <tschindl> not yet
[21:09:57] <tschindl> i only have swing and javafx
[21:09:58] <yarthorn> emoffatt: rcjsuen has anyone tried the Juno M1 EPP packages? They look really ugly, I think they are missing some CSS
[21:10:19] <tschindl> I'm currently working a lot with javafx
[21:10:25] <emoffatt> it was more that some of those views might be useful components even for custom RCP apps
[21:10:32] <tschindl> which provides everything i ever wanted to have
[21:10:41] <tschindl> i know
[21:10:59] <emoffatt> but it's just as likely that we'd have to re-tool them in any case to support...er...HTML5
[21:11:05] <tschindl> I need to plan my work schedule and what things I'm going to work on in the next months
[21:12:01] <tschindl> high on my list is "native" support for editors in EAP
[21:12:02] <emoffatt> I'm still tinkering with the idea of trying to split the various JFace viewers away from being directed at a particular widget but it's a background task
[21:12:35] <emoffatt> yes, I saw the need to capture EditorDescriptor...in the model
[21:12:53] <emoffatt> sounds good (dont forget 'content types' :) )
[21:13:53] <emoffatt> BTW, I have a patch from Dean (our new member) that changes the 'derived' flag to true for all of our transient attributes (to keep the deep copy away from them)
[21:14:29] <emoffatt> perhaps once 4.1.1 goes out we should take a look at the model to see what we need
[21:15:30] <emoffatt> up until then we're trying to work on a single branch so we're only committing stuff appropriate for 4.1.1, after it goes out we'll likely make a specific branch for 4.1.2 work
[21:18:19] <tschindl> emoffatt: I saw that patch
[21:18:46] <tschindl> just give me a date and we can make a call on the model stuff
[21:19:02] <tschindl> I'll create a extra bug for the editor work
[21:27:39] <emoffatt> sure, once we get back into the flow (i.e. patios close :) ) we can set it up during an e4 call
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[21:58:17] <emoffatt> tschindl: BTW I think there's a typo in your submission 'Not commonly know features of the new platform' should likely be 'Not commonly know*N* features of the new platform'
[21:59:13] <tschindl> thanks fixed
[22:02:00] <rcjsuen> yarthorn: I didn't know it was available for dl
[22:02:14] <rcjsuen> yarthorn: oh i saw those links from DW and ignored them
[22:02:18] <rcjsuen> yarthorn: i see i should've _read_ them
[22:02:42] <rcjsuen> yarthorn: i'll verify on my computer and then open a bug
[22:11:40] <emoffatt> tschindl: should I just title my talk 'Eclipse 4: A Retrospective' and fill in the details with stuff about general architecture... ?
[22:15:37] <yarthorn> emoffatt: see ~355002
[22:15:38] <Arbalest> Bug 355002 - https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=355002 - EPP / java-package / unspecified - PC / Windows 7 - NEW / normal / - Assignee: epp.packager-inbox - EPP packages need styling
[22:16:03] <yarthorn> Question in there about what EPP packages should do for an XMI file, if anything
[22:17:07] <emoffatt> yarthorn: not quite sure I understand...the XMI refers to the UI model, not the CSS AFAIK
[22:17:40] <emoffatt> ...and that comes from 'platform' (which is why we branched it I think(
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