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[10:26:12] <ioso> helo
[11:08:32] <ioso> any xenserver guy here?
[11:16:54] <Rienzilla> just ask
[11:30:14] <ioso> have 2 nics bonded and one of them showing only 10mb/s
[11:30:49] <ioso> then bond is operating on 10mb/s only
[11:30:49] <Rienzilla> that might be just a quirk in the ui? How's the performance?
[11:31:07] <ioso> vm showing 10mb/s
[11:31:22] <Rienzilla> otherwise, possibly the negotiation of the link is failing?
[11:33:13] <ioso> also mac of bonded netowrk is not vissible in switches
[11:39:56] <Rienzilla> did you enable bonding on the switch as well?
[11:41:02] <ioso> bonding on switch? no probably
[11:41:52] <Rienzilla> the switch needs to know that two links are bonded too
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[13:43:59] <tabularasa> morning peeps
[13:53:15] <ioso> morning
[14:16:06] <tabularasa> no, i'm not
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[14:17:50] <tabularasa> yeah, i don't do much XenServer
[14:20:09] <ioso> ok
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[15:10:28] <borei> good morning everybody
[15:10:53] <borei> can somebody gimme headsup where to download free license ?
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[15:13:28] <borei> is there such ?
[15:13:31] <jduggan> borei: for what?
[15:13:37] <jduggan> xenserver?
[15:13:42] <borei> yup
[15:14:03] <borei> i stopped one of the VM and can't start it now
[15:14:15] <borei> getting warning aabout license
[15:14:28] <jduggan> you just sign up to citrix.com, in xencenter you go to help and licensing then there's some drop down for getting license
[15:14:43] <jduggan> it opens IE with a form to fill in and 5minutes later you get an email with a .lic file
[15:14:58] <borei> thanks, will try
[15:15:04] <jduggan> then go about to help->licensing and select activate
[15:15:08] <jduggan> browse to .lic..
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[16:14:24] <borei> got new license, vm started, thanks for help
[16:14:41] <kdavy_> morning
[16:17:43] <ScottCochran> morning!
[16:21:15] <borei> is there expiration date for free license ?
[16:21:23] <borei> or it's gonna run forever ?
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[16:28:12] <kdavy_> borei, you have to renew it every year
[16:28:37] <borei> ok, not a big deal
[16:29:24] <kdavy_> yeah, might wanna set yourself a reminder to do it a couple weeks in advance. sometimes citrix licensing is down for maintenance on weekends
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[16:32:02] <jduggan> guys - any of you know if its possible to use something like nlite to slipstream xentools into an installer cd?
[16:32:49] <tabularasa> heh, good question.. i'm sure you CAN, not sure if it will work.
[16:33:27] <jduggan> yea
[16:33:36] <jduggan> i was hoping someone here might have done it before i bother trying
[16:33:46] <jduggan> i seem to have issues with SBS server in xen 5.5 and 5.6
[16:33:51] <jduggan> during the installer
[16:34:00] <kdavy_> jduggan, i heard of people deploying xentools via group policy
[16:34:06] <jduggan> i noticed its not on the list of supported OSs
[16:34:19] <jduggan> even though its fundamentally just 2008 x64
[16:34:42] <tabularasa> SBS is the suck
[16:34:53] <jduggan> tabularasa: maybe so
[16:34:54] <jduggan> :)
[16:35:00] <jduggan> i get some weird issues with SBS
[16:35:01] <jduggan> like
[16:35:06] <jduggan> the screen will lock up
[16:35:08] <kdavy_> i think by "Supported OS" citrix mostly means the kernel, so SBS should be no different from any other Windows Server
[16:35:16] <tabularasa> agreed
[16:35:20] <jduggan> i cant force shutdown
[16:35:21] <kdavy_> at least when it comes to xenserver
[16:35:32] <jduggan> i have to destroy_domain -domid N
[16:35:35] <jduggan> then reset power state
[16:35:46] <jduggan> i had a weird issue also
[16:35:48] <jduggan> in xencenter
[16:35:52] <jduggan> two vms
[16:35:56] <kdavy_> jduggan, that's not normal...
[16:36:04] <jduggan> when i clicked the console tab, the consoles were the same
[16:36:17] <jduggan> one vm was a frozen up sbs mid installation
[16:36:22] <jduggan> the other was a regular customers vm
[16:36:33] <jduggan> and the console of the frozen sbs was showing the console of the running vm
[16:36:47] <jduggan> kdavy_: yea for sure, always on SBS to
[16:39:36] <kdavy_> i dont touch SBS
[16:39:45] <jduggan> i dont like touching it
[16:39:51] <jduggan> but alas
[16:39:58] <jduggan> ;P
[16:40:01] <kdavy_> alas, that's what she said
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[16:43:37] <kreign> morning.
[16:43:53] <kreign> SBS is anathema to sanity
[16:44:06] <kreign> we hates it
[16:44:27] <kdavy_> kreign, is there anything you don't hate?
[16:44:32] <kdavy_> aside from whiskey of course
[16:46:20] <kreign> kdavy, haha
[16:46:39] <kreign> kdavy, come now I"m not that dissatisfied. :)
[16:46:51] <kreign> kdavy, have you ever met anyone who -likes- SBS?
[16:46:57] <kreign> I mean, someone who's employable
[16:46:57] <kdavy_> nope
[16:47:00] <kdavy_> nope
[16:47:30] <jduggan> its just cost
[16:47:33] <jduggan> i dont like it
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[16:53:17] <kdavy_> i honestly don't even like Windows Server Standard
[16:53:42] <kdavy_> sometimes i need a feature and it's just not there, have to reload everything on enterprise
[17:11:24] <kreign> kdavy, such as?
[17:13:41] <kdavy_> kreign, failover clustering for example
[17:13:47] <kreign> ah
[17:13:52] <kreign> yeah might be an issue.
[17:14:01] <kreign> upgradable installs would be ince.
[17:14:02] <kreign> nice
[17:14:09] <kreign> I don't see why they don't just SKU everything
[17:14:24] <kreign> ie at a granular level
[17:15:42] <kdavy_> like Oracle? :)
[17:15:56] <kdavy_> no thanks
[17:21:27] <kreign> hmm true.
[17:21:41] <kreign> tho I didn't say they had to be difficult and/or assholes about it. ;)
[17:27:07] <Tenju> yeah is monday!!!
[17:27:14] <Tenju> its *
[17:27:16] <kdavy_> is that a good thing?
[17:27:32] <Tenju> the delusional part of me things so
[17:27:39] <Tenju> omg
[17:27:44] <Tenju> i can't type today
[17:27:47] <Tenju> thinks*
[17:31:59] <kreign> omg brain hurts today.
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[17:34:25] <Tenju> i want to know who was the genius at citrix that said " Lets make and annoying Welcome screen like Microsoft for XenDesktop 5"
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[17:41:30] <gblfxt> get-xasession only in 4.5?
[17:51:20] <tabularasa> gblfxt: yeah, i think so
[17:51:27] <tabularasa> query user still exists
[17:54:07] <gblfxt> basically gotta switch to Get-WmiObject Win32_PerfRawData_CitrixICA_ICASession?
[17:54:48] <gblfxt> or their a more detailed query user now?
[17:54:52] <tabularasa> no
[17:54:55] <tabularasa> :)
[17:56:28] <tabularasa> http://community.citrix.com/display/ocb/2010/05/05/XenApp+6+SDK+-+Commands
[17:56:52] <tabularasa> looks like it is there
[17:57:05] <gblfxt> nice, thanks for pointer! :)
[17:57:42] <tabularasa> yup
[17:59:20] <gblfxt> looks like i just need to add the 6.0 cmdlets :D
[18:01:06] <tabularasa> yup yup
[18:01:14] <tabularasa> good to know too... i'll have to add that to my template
[18:05:28] <jduggan> do you guys have any multi-tenant farm setups? or do you do per customer farms?
[18:06:04] <kdavy_> multi-tenant
[18:06:24] <jduggan> i take it you isolate terminal servers per customer though?
[18:06:28] <kdavy_> nope
[18:06:32] <tabularasa> yes, i do
[18:07:07] <kdavy_> isolation is done by very strict security on local xenapp boxes and on the network/auth level
[18:07:13] <jduggan> kdavy_: what do you do with respect to domains?  multi domain forests?
[18:07:18] <jduggan> or one generic domain
[18:07:25] <tabularasa> 1 domain
[18:07:29] <kdavy_> jduggan, one generic domain with OU per customer
[18:07:35] <tabularasa> yeah, using UPN auth
[18:07:46] <jduggan> makes sense
[18:07:52] <jduggan> i think we'll look at this route
[18:07:54] <tabularasa> we are actually migrating from this to seperate domains/farms per customer
[18:08:04] <jduggan> tabularasa: how big a setup?
[18:08:09] <kreign> fun word for the day that pretentious programmer types use entirely too damn much: "instantiate"
[18:08:39] <tabularasa> jduggan: ours isn't too big, but we decided it would be easier to manage and still profitable to make dedicated environments
[18:08:55] <kreign> kdavy, why do you put everything in their own OU on the same domain?
[18:08:56] <jduggan> the problem i have with multi tenant is problems affecting all customers, would kill our helpdesk if there was a problems so for ease of management we just split it out
[18:09:11] <tabularasa> which is our issue as well
[18:09:19] <tabularasa> so, when you take down the file server, it only affects 1 customer, not all
[18:09:20] <kdavy_> kreign, for group policy separation
[18:09:30] <kreign> that was moreso a question wrt "why just one domain"
[18:09:34] <kreign> I'm with jduggan on this one.
[18:09:38] <jduggan> but from a cost point of view its cheaper to have one set of licensing costs and wack it all on one farm
[18:09:46] <kdavy_> tabularasa, yeah we have a different route. everything is clustered and redundant
[18:09:48] <tabularasa> why not 1 domain?  sub domains are a freaking nightmare
[18:09:52] <jduggan> but i think we have to be realistic
[18:10:03] <tabularasa> kdavy_: yeah, we just didn't have the skills to support it adequatly..
[18:10:15] <kreign> the HA bit helps
[18:12:40] <kdavy_> we split everything out in order to support the workload. file servers are 4 different physical machines with 6 cluster services, same with sql, exchange etc
[18:13:05] <kdavy_> the general idea is that even downtime or failover of one cluster node shouldn't affect more than a third of clients
[18:13:15] <kreign> hmm
[18:13:21] <gblfxt> one domain, seperated by ou, one fs mirrored for failover
[18:13:29] <kreign> I'd still be concerned with AD shitting itself.
[18:14:11] <kreign> and/or overlooked replication issues
[18:14:40] <kdavy_> replication issues? explain
[18:17:30] <kreign> eh may not be as much an issue with 2k8
[18:18:15] <kreign> just seems to complicate things like upgrades. I've seen too many instances with something like exchange upgrades where OUs are only partially replicating or the like.
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[18:18:45] <kreign> it's a single logical data structure, so it'd be nice to have a bit more levity for redundancy
[18:18:51] <kreign> granted I don't know how your stuff is set up, so...
[18:18:54] <tabularasa> they need to hurry up and get the ability to migrage XenApp sessions between servers
[18:19:05] <tabularasa> that'd be sick
[18:22:23] <kdavy_> kreign, there is no domain replication or no servers on customer sites. everything is in our datacentersw
[18:23:44] <kdavy_> the only replication is between the four domain controllers that are controlled by us
[18:25:10] <kdavy_> as far as things like Exchange upgrades, yes there is a certain risk, but that risk would be there even in a multi-domain forest
[18:26:53] <kreign> kdavy, but it's a "all our customers are down while we fix this" vs. "one of 30 customers is down"
[18:27:12] <tabularasa> risk/reward
[18:27:18] <tabularasa> its as simple as that
[18:28:22] <kdavy_> kreign, according to your logic every customer should be on a different XenServer pool and on a different SAN as well
[18:29:07] <kdavy_> investing more $$$ into making the core infrastructure more resilient is better than hosting every client on the bare minimum and putting out fires all the time
[18:29:48] <kreign> true enough
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[18:36:28] <gblfxt> have many customers using 3 monitors?
[18:37:22] <tabularasa> a couple
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[18:40:11] <gblfxt> had trouble w 2 monitors in 4.5, must be a config issue
[18:41:01] <kdavy_> gblfxt, what kinda trouble - it couldnt full screen?
[18:41:35] <tabularasa> multimonitor support is fantastic in XA6
[18:41:46] <gblfxt> can only move app around certain areas of each monitor
[18:41:52] <tabularasa> yeah, needed more video memory
[18:41:58] <tabularasa> you can control that in a citrix policy
[18:42:02] <kdavy_> yep, google MaxLVBMem
[18:42:24] <gblfxt> kdavy, nice, ill look that up...  thanks!
[18:42:38] <kdavy_> in citrix policy you can only control it up to 8192k - above that you'll have to edit the registry key and lock it down manually
[18:49:47] <tabularasa> Much easier to do in XA6
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[18:55:06] <gblfxt> yes, we still got about 1/2 our systems still in 4.5... :( working on migrating the rest of those....
[18:55:54] <gblfxt> licensing is the difficult part of migrating, lol
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[19:22:52] <Elias_Rus> hi guys
[19:23:34] <tabularasa> whats going on
[19:24:43] <kdavy_> hey Ilya
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[20:01:28] <Elias_Rus> kdavy, hey hey
[20:03:09] <kdavy_> anything fun going on?
[20:06:36] <mnemon> hmmh, running xenapp 6 and for some reason OSX clients get additional windows login screen before they're able to use any of the published applications, any ideas why?
[20:07:44] <kdavy_> mnemon, hm. so users have to log in twice as opposed to once, or once as opposed to not at all?
[20:08:12] <tabularasa> mnemon: what gateway are you using?
[20:08:19] <tabularasa> CSG, AGEE, Direct ?
[20:08:23] <mnemon> secure gateway
[20:08:48] <mnemon> kdavy_: twice, once when setting up client, second time when starting and application
[20:09:14] <mnemon> *an application
[20:11:04] <mnemon> 2008R2 servers/domain
[20:11:52] <tabularasa> that makes no sense, but i don't know how the OSX client works
[20:12:21] <mnemon> yeah ... windows clients work just fine
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[20:15:03] <kdavy_> i've only used the WI with mac client - and it just works
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[20:40:10] <gblfxt> we use CSG, to get macs to work right, had to disble the quality connection thing... :-/
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[20:40:57] <tabularasa> Does OSX work with AGEE ?
[20:41:46] <kdavy_> there is an AG plugin for OSX
[20:41:53] <kdavy_> maybe that's what is needed
[20:41:59] <kdavy_> http://www.citrix.com/english/ss/downloads/details.asp?downloadId=1857838&productId=15005
[20:42:06] <tabularasa> shouldn't be if hes using CSG, right?
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[20:43:22] <kdavy_> this could be relevant: http://forums.citrix.com/message.jspa?messageID=1435568
[20:43:39] <gblfxt> ah, we disabled session reliability in order for osx to work right with CSG... :(
[20:44:03] <kreign> ohhh fun. 611 days up time for XS 5.5
[20:44:09] <kreign> that's gotta be right at about the release date.
[20:44:12] <kdavy_> kreign, upgrade it!
[20:44:27] <tabularasa> session reliability sucks anyway
[20:44:51] <kreign> kdavy, any overt reasons to upgrade 5.5 to 5.6fp1 if there are no problems or desired features? :P
[20:45:02] <kreign> probably a kernel exploit or three...
[20:45:18] <kreign> kdavy, yet another one of those standalone XS hosts
[20:45:21] <kdavy_> bragging rights?
[20:46:00] <kreign> urg I hate that.
[20:46:15] <kdavy_> also, at some point you're gonna have to upgrade for one reason or another, and since you can't jump versions when upgrading, it'll take longer
[20:46:30] <kdavy_> 5.5 -> 5.6 -> 5.6 FP1 -> 5.7 or whatever chain
[20:46:53] <kdavy_> all possible problems with each subsequent upgrade in the chain can also layer on top of each other
[20:47:13] <jduggan> easier to export and reimport no
[20:47:19] <kreign> yeah
[20:47:24] <kreign> I do that for a new install anyway.
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[20:47:28] <kdavy_> if there's extra hardware and enough time, yes
[20:47:36] <kreign> only 'release upgrades' I'm fond of are Debian's
[20:47:51] <ruinah_> hey guys, question about CAG and Android devices. Anyone have experience in them?
[20:48:01] <kdavy_> you're not fond of that video of upgrading from DOS 5 to Windows 7?
[20:48:08] <tabularasa> ruinah_: yeah
[20:48:22] <tabularasa> kdavy_: thats a funny video
[20:49:18] <ruinah_> I have a CAG VPX 5.0 and upgraded to the latest Cag over the weekend. 5.01 i think it was. WI is 5.4. I'm trying to get Receiver working on my Droid 1. If I use firefox and browse to my WI site from a Motorola Xoom, I can logon and it works great. Can't get receiver to work by itself though.
[20:50:15] <ruinah_> configuring Receiver on either device won't publish the apps list. Complains about SSL. Our cert is from Verisign and i have the intermediate certs installed. The SSL checker website shows everything is green and good to go.
[20:50:16] <tabularasa> i *think* you need to add a policy for that
[20:50:36] <tabularasa> REQ.HTTP.HEADER User-Agent CONTAINS CitrixReciever
[20:50:53] <kdavy_> i think you need to sell the Xoom and get an iPad
[20:50:58] <jduggan> lol
[20:51:16] <ruinah_> lol at kdavy_
[20:51:21] <ruinah_> the Xoom is awesome though.
[20:51:29] <kdavy_> so is ipad :-P
[20:51:39] <ruinah_> @tabularasa - where do I put that policy? Is that in the CAG somewhere?
[20:51:44] <tabularasa> yes
[20:51:48] <tabularasa> is this standard or EE ?
[20:52:06] <ruinah_> @kdavy_ - we've had both so far. i don't dislike the ipad. Pres and CEO both are android junkies though.
[20:52:34] <ruinah_> I think it's Standard. I couldn't figure out where the heck the versioning is in this version. They changed stuff up a lot here in VPX 5
[20:53:10] <tabularasa> http://support.citrix.com/proddocs/index.jsp?topic=/receiver-ios-4-2/mobile-receiver-admin-config-agee.html
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[21:47:34] <Elias_Rus> folks does anyone any software to record RDP/ICA session exept citrix smartauditor
[21:48:04] <kreign> Elias_Rus, uh doesn't that get logged to eventlog?
[21:48:26] <Elias_Rus> I need to record screens
[21:48:35] <Elias_Rus> to capture screens
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[21:49:26] <Elias_Rus> like http://www.observeit-sys.com
[21:50:48] <gazzo> :o)
[21:51:26] <kdavy_> Elias_Rus, a webcam and a mirror behind a user?
[21:51:58] <Elias_Rus> how about a large enterprise ?
[21:52:16] <kdavy_> http://www.tsfactory.com/ or observe-it
[21:52:18] <Elias_Rus> with 500 servers and 50 IT guys
[21:52:20] <kdavy_> but we don't use either
[21:53:22] <Elias_Rus> I found http://www.balabit.com/network-security/scb
[21:54:20] <kdavy_> hmm, i'd be careful putting a proxy gateway in front of your systems
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[21:54:55] <kdavy_> even if it does HA, all the connections will have to go through it so it's a point of failure
[22:03:08] <Elias_Rus> balabit looks more interesting
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[22:10:14] <tabularasa> man, i lost the link that showed me how to created a customized repeater plugin install
[22:13:16] <kdavy_> Elias_Rus, balabit doesn't support ICA
[22:14:02] <tabularasa> ah, i found it
[22:14:38] <Elias_Rus> kdavy, RDP/ICA it doesn't metter
[22:15:32] <kdavy_> Elias_Rus, i thought you needed "software to record RDP/ICA session exept citrix smartauditor"
[22:16:04] <Elias_Rus> yep
[22:16:55] <Elias_Rus> on a terminal server I can install ica client
[22:18:03] <Elias_Rus> just found the latest balabit version supports ICA
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[22:53:59] <proprietarysucks> 500 servers and 50 it guys?
[22:54:12] <proprietarysucks> you seriously have 1 it guy for every 10 machines?
[22:55:00] <kdavy_> proprietarysucks, how many engineers does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
[22:55:00] <proprietarysucks> we have around 500 here and 2 guys
[22:55:24] <gblfxt> looks like you just missed him to pose your question
[22:55:30] <kdavy_> he works for a bank though. out of those 50 IT guys, 25 are probably dedicated to security alone
[22:55:56] <gblfxt> at a bank? probably 20 are IT managers
[22:56:10] <kdavy_> yeah, which leaves 5 people doing the actual work :)
[22:56:34] <kdavy_> out of those two are trainees and one is about to retire
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[23:17:32] <kreign> kdavy, :-o you've got a 1:50 admin:server ratio?
[23:18:44] <kdavy_> kreign, i wasnt talking about myself
[23:18:49] <kreign> oh
[23:18:52] <kdavy_> i have no idea what our ratio is
[23:19:39] <kreign> who's 10:1?
[23:19:40] <kdavy_> especially considering a lot of our guys are only responsible for one or two servers, in addition to helpdesk stuff
[23:19:45] <kreign> that's koosky
[23:19:48] <kdavy_> kreign, Elias_Rus is 10:1
[23:19:49] <kreign> kooshy
[23:20:01] <kreign> kdavy, huh.
[23:20:16] <kdavy_> 1:10 whatever
[23:21:15] <gblfxt> physical systems or vm's?
[23:21:24] <kdavy_> no clue
[23:22:03] <kreign> is there any sort of 'established industry standard' for that kinda thing?
[23:22:11] <kdavy_> doubt it
[23:22:22] <gblfxt> no, i think its situational, i hope there is no standard
[23:22:30] <kdavy_> though ITIL might have some general guidelines for enough vs. not enough
[23:22:40] <kdavy_> based on service levels
[23:23:09] <kreign> yeah
[23:23:17] <proprietarysucks> the standard is really based on what you need to do with those machines
[23:23:45] <proprietarysucks> if we have 200 nodes that are all the same that's different than having 10 sun fire boxes, 20 windows boxes, 2 domain controllers, 40 debian boxes, etc
[23:23:47] <kdavy_> and how diverse the environment is
[23:23:50] <kdavy_> yea
[23:24:00] <kreign> I administered a 50 node OM cluster about 8 years ago... took a couple hours a month, maybe, just to make sure jobs didn't get stuck...
[23:24:09] <kdavy_> Amazon EC2 admins have it easy
[23:24:14] <kdavy_> and Azure ones as well
[23:24:35] <proprietarysucks> yeah. also it's not linear because for me managing 20 nodes that are the exact same is roughly the same amount of work as 200 nodes that are the same
[23:24:53] <proprietarysucks> since I use puppet, mcollective, and experience to minimize the work
[23:25:23] <proprietarysucks> unless we're talking windows which has a lot of time consuming crappy tasks that are difficult to properly automate
[23:25:36] <proprietarysucks> such as proper update management
[23:25:59] <proprietarysucks> so in short, there is no standard. however in almost every case 1 to 10 is very bad
[23:26:27] <kdavy_> 1:10 could also be very good, from an admin point of view :)
[23:26:40] <gblfxt> not if he meant physical machines, that could be 1 admin to 100 vm's
[23:27:07] <kdavy_> no, they have people that deal purely with physical, as well as people that deal purely with VMs
[23:27:16] <proprietarysucks> that's true. I never count vms differently than physical machines personally
[23:27:22] <kreign> proprietarysucks, I'd say it's a bit less than that for 200 unique, honestly... assuming you don't have to deal w/ the hardware :)
[23:27:28] <kreign> at 200 nodes most of your time is probably spent on hardware.
[23:27:40] <kreign> proprietarysucks, I'm not familiar with mcollective. what is it?
[23:27:53] <kdavy_> i don't even count physical ones, since the dom0 is in essence just another VM
[23:28:05] <proprietarysucks> it's a application stack that leverages message queing to perform functions on nodes
[23:28:05] <kdavy_> everything else is infrastructure + hardware
[23:28:28] <proprietarysucks> it also leverages puppet's 'facter' program to inventory and act based on that inventory
[23:28:54] <kreign> huhhh proprietarysucks how unique are your hosts?
[23:29:24] <proprietarysucks> so you can for example quickly and easily say 'on every node that is in europe that has more than 8 gb of ram that is linux that doesn't have myrpm.rpm installed that has an uptime of less than 4 hours run this: x'
[23:29:56] <proprietarysucks> or, 'tell me what vlan all my r610s are on, except for the ones that roger is logged into'
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[23:30:50] <proprietarysucks> we have a few hundred that are identical, probably a hundred somewhat uniques, and then sprinkles of total one-offs
[23:31:22] <proprietarysucks> small company growing to mid you know? built from the ground up and has not yet gone through complete "uniforming" where it could
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[23:40:39] <kreign> urg. is there a derogatory term yet for over-engineering something for the sole apparent purpose of complexity?
[23:41:24] <kdavy_> kreign, the US Government?
[23:41:43] <gblfxt> GUI?
[23:41:57] <kreign> kdavy, I wonder if has something to do with growing up in a soviet country
[23:42:10] <kreign> because no right-thinking capitalist would design shit like this.
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[23:43:17] <kreign> marxist rig?
[23:43:19] <kreign> IDFK
[23:44:45] <gblfxt> try getting to a command line on osx, eisier to ssh from another machine
[23:46:09] <kdavy_> gblfxt, um... drag the Terminal app onto your dock?
[23:46:52] <kreign> "LiveCD"
[23:46:55] <gblfxt> kdavy, you say tomato? O.o
[23:47:20] <kdavy_> tomato?
[23:47:26] <kreign> no it's tomato
[23:47:31] <kreign> not tomato
[23:47:32] <gblfxt> :)





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