[00:06:50] <GabydeWilde_> can 2 torrents use the same foldername?
[00:07:05] <kjetilho> sure
[00:07:11] <GabydeWilde_> ty
[00:07:24] <GabydeWilde_> can there be subfolders in the folder?
[00:07:48] <kjetilho> as long as the filenames don't overlap, it should be fine
[00:08:07] <GabydeWilde_> what if they share 1 file name?
[00:08:25] <kjetilho> then that file will be a mix
[00:08:45] <GabydeWilde_> still no problem if the file is the same?
[00:09:01] <kjetilho> I think that is a problem, but... :-)
[00:09:58] <Switeck> If you finish 1 torrent first and check that the files actually match there may not be a problem.
[00:10:14] <GabydeWilde_> To be clear: I want to update a torrent archive, see if we can go beyond static archives :)
[00:11:07] <GabydeWilde_> Say version 1 if 50 GB and version 2 is 51 GB.
[00:12:06] <GabydeWilde_> many users would have version 2 up and running really quickly.
[00:13:22] <GabydeWilde_> of course having a torrent file for part 1 in the 2nd archive would be no problem at first.
[00:13:39] <GabydeWilde_> it gets annoying if there is a part 10
[00:14:26] <GabydeWilde_> can a magnet uri also be a file?
[00:14:39] <GabydeWilde_> like a short cut
[00:20:18] <GabydeWilde_> I just grasped it would of course be no problem including all previous torrents in the new torrent. doh..
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[00:21:13] <zelia5> erm, a bit of a newbie question, i want to make my utorrent download from a tracker, which has restricted access only for a foreign country, i have a web proxy so i can browse from it, but how do i use my bandwidth, but send the tracker updates trough the proxy, simply said - how do i configure utorrent to do that... not to download and ack trough the proxy, only ack...
[00:21:17] <Switeck> I've have downloaded numerous series where I initially got them as individual torrents then later got the 1-x combined torrent.
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[00:24:01] <The_8472> GabydeWilde_> still no problem if the file is the same? <- if they're byte-identical it should be ok
[00:24:26] <GabydeWilde_> great :)
[00:25:04] <Switeck> a problem occurs if you're trying to download 2 overlapping torrents at the same time, they could have file access (locking!) issues.
[00:25:25] <GabydeWilde_> what will happen in case of locking?
[00:25:35] <The_8472> that's up to the client
[00:25:47] <GabydeWilde_> no big issue I imagine?
[00:25:55] <The_8472> not really, no
[00:27:05] <The_8472> you shouldn't download 2 torrents to the same file at once if you can avoid it though
[00:27:07] <The_8472> it's inefficient
[00:27:16] <Switeck> one or both of the torrents could stop
[00:27:25] <Switeck> because they get an access denied on one of the files.
[00:28:52] <GabydeWilde_> can add a bit of description to have peeps set a "do not download" flag :)
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[00:33:08] <Switeck> that can work, just remember edge piece overlap
[00:33:23] <Switeck> Even when set to "do not download" edge pieces still GET downloaded.
[00:34:31] <TheSHAD0W> They have to be, in order to verify the hashes.
[00:35:00] <TheSHAD0W> BitTornado loads those fragments in a temporary storage area.
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[01:08:49] <The_8472> <Switeck> because they get an access denied on one of the files. <- that should only happen if you try to do it with 2 clients. within 1 process that shouldn't happen
[01:09:15] <Switeck> it does with uTorrent
[01:09:28] <TheSHAD0W> Disable Windows Indexing Agent, then reboot.
[01:09:32] <TheSHAD0W> Then it'll work properly.
[01:09:47] <Switeck> not enabled
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[01:10:25] <The_8472> well, in Az we have an option to allow shared file access
[01:11:56] <Switeck> The 2 torrents may be 'blissfully unaware' they're doing the same file/s...so some parts no doubt would get downloaded twice even if everything else worked ok
[01:12:42] <The_8472> we also have something (crude) to fix that ^^
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[01:45:46] <r2wj> http://anomos.info/wp/2010/02/08/anomos-0-9-released-public-tracker-up-and-running/
[01:45:48] <r2wj> <_<
[01:55:34] <Switeck> A HTTPS tracker is "nothing new"
[01:55:46] <Switeck> So I'm trying to find a couple details to this...
[01:58:28] <r2wj> not just https
[01:58:32] <r2wj> onion routed file transfers
[01:58:51] <Switeck> "Anomos is a modification of the popular BitTorrent peer-to-peer file sharing protocol which adds layers of cryptography to create a network which is completely secure and anonymous. In this system, nobody besides the trusted central tracker is able to know who is transferring any file being tracked."
[01:59:13] <TheSHAD0W> ...
[01:59:17] <K`Tetch> so, how are the peers finding eeach other/
[01:59:22] <Switeck> going to be somebody paying big for all that bandwidth!
[01:59:29] <TheSHAD0W> If you have the crypto to hide xfers, you could make it so not even the central tracker knows.
[02:00:42] <The_8472> that's called i2p
[02:00:51] <The_8472> idk why people always try to reinvent the wheel
[02:01:54] <TheSHAD0W> Because it's fun!
[02:02:19] <The_8472> only if you end up with a round wheel
[02:02:34] <TheSHAD0W> Bah.
[02:02:35] <The_8472> and one that doesn't require more than 2-3 baby skins to be built
[02:02:56] * TheSHAD0W uses trochoidal rollers
[02:03:39] <The_8472> are those omnidirectional wheels?
[02:03:50] <TheSHAD0W> No...
[02:04:17] <The_8472> then i'm not familiar with the term
[02:04:31] <TheSHAD0W> Take a triangle.
[02:05:06] <TheSHAD0W> Then use a compass to draw an arc from one point to another using the third as the center.
[02:05:10] <TheSHAD0W> Do that for all 3 sides.
[02:05:18] <r2wj> the tracker
[02:05:20] <TheSHAD0W> Then use that as the cross-section for a rod.
[02:05:23] <r2wj> generates paths between peers
[02:05:41] <TheSHAD0W> It is possible to roll an object on those as well as you could a cylinder.
[02:07:18] <The_8472> oh, like the inner part of a wankel engine?
[02:07:31] <TheSHAD0W> Something like that, yes.
[02:07:34] <TheSHAD0W> Similar concept.
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[03:33:09] <buddyq> i downloaded a dmg with file + key. But how do I find the key? When I double click on the dmg, the program installer opens.
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[15:09:20] <n215> hi
[15:10:59] <n215> I have a torrent with couple udp and http trackers do I get seeder and leecher information (like how many people is seeding/leeching) from torrent or from trackers ?
[15:12:26] <The_8472> tracker(s)
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[15:29:39] <n215> http://tracker.addr/scrape?info_hash=8001badf6f3f664d70cd9fcc17201254841c474f is this supported on opentracker?
[15:34:06] <The_8472> scrapes are supported by opentracker, yes
[15:35:08] <n215> http://tracker.addr/scrape this works fine
[15:35:17] <The_8472> oh
[15:35:23] <The_8472> wait, wrong format
[15:35:40] <The_8472> you're not supposed to send the hex representation of the infohash. use the url_encoded 20 byte binary representation
[15:38:52] <n215> weird looking characters right I see from scrape right?
[15:39:53] <The_8472> uh, what?
[15:41:27] 
[15:41:54] <n215> this is url_encoded info hash right ?
[15:42:14] <n215> looks like 20 bytes
[15:42:52] 
[15:44:54] <The_8472> that's not url-encoded
[15:46:04] <n215> thats what /scrape shows me
[15:49:20] <The_8472> yes, but what scrapes shows you is bencoded, not url-encoded
[15:49:24] <The_8472> i suggest you read the spec
[16:00:50] <n215> thank you, I understand what you were talking about
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[21:09:34] <pevangelista> hello!
[21:09:41] <Switeck> hi
[21:11:01] <pevangelista> I have a question that may be silly... I don't know =P
[21:11:30] <Switeck> ask anyway
[21:11:31] <pevangelista> The Client doesn't need to send a BitField if it has no pieces, right?
[21:12:09] <pevangelista> So, suppose I am the Client and I don't have any pieces, and I just exchanged handshakes
[21:12:30] <pevangelista> What am I supposed to do if I receive a message requesting a piece?
[21:13:05] <pevangelista> I think I can broaden this question to "What am I supposed to do if I receive a message requesting a piece I don't have?"
[21:13:37] <pevangelista> Should I ignore it?
[21:14:20] <Switeck> yes
[21:15:37] <mpl> I guess it could be the right time to send a choke if you haven't already (in the case where you absolutely have no pieces)...
[21:18:20] <pevangelista> Ah, I see. Thanks!
[21:19:14] <The_8472> not necessary
[21:19:25] <The_8472> the default state after handshaking is choked and not interested
[21:19:37] <The_8472> thus receiving a request means the other client is ill-behaved
[21:19:41] <The_8472> you may disconnect it if you want
[21:27:55] <alus> even if the peer is interested and unchoked, receiving a request for a piece you don't have is cause for disconnection
[21:28:11] <pevangelista> I was thinking about that
[21:28:23] <alus> it means they have some view of your haves that is not correct, or they have a bug
[21:28:32] <alus> well, probably both
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[21:29:07] <The_8472> fail-fast generally is a good idea
[21:29:17] <The_8472> it forces people to fix their bugs
[21:29:20] <pevangelista> Should I extend this behavior to all messages out of place?
[21:29:35] <The_8472> yes
[21:29:40] <pevangelista> hum, ok!
[21:29:42] <pevangelista> thanks!
[21:30:17] <The_8472> well, except for concurrency issues
[21:30:37] <The_8472> i.e. if you previously unchoked a peer, choke it now and it sends a request
[21:30:44] <The_8472> while it hasn't recieved the choke
[21:31:12] <The_8472> in that case you just ignore it since it was legit
[21:31:39] <pevangelista> I was thinking if I received an interested message right after the handshake. No one is supposed to be interested in me if I don't have any pieces
[21:32:04] <The_8472> yeah, that shouldn't happen
[21:33:08] <A9> The_8472: I have a behavioral question for you.
[21:33:11] <scottwolchok> IMHO it would not be a bad idea to be prepared for arbitrary behavior from peers.
[21:33:16] <A9> If you have a moment.
[21:34:01] <The_8472> scottwolchok, then they'll never fix their bugs
[21:34:30] <scottwolchok> The_8472: they'll never fix their bugs anyway if they're malicious
[21:34:35] <scottwolchok> I didn't say you should *tolerate* it
[21:34:48] <The_8472> in that case you have another reason to disconnect it
[21:34:57] <The_8472> A9, waiting for your question ^^
[21:36:14] <A9> The_8472: I understand that per BEP 21 it instructs clients which are partially seeding to always send event=paused, but just for the sake of my understanding, I assume this doesn't apply to when the torrent should be stopping.
[21:36:16] <The_8472> scottwolchok, as i said earlier. imo fail-fast (within reason) is preferable
[21:36:44] <The_8472> should be stopping?
[21:37:01] <A9> If you hit stop on the torrent in the client
[21:37:06] <A9> and it's partial seeding
[21:37:12] <A9> do you send event=stopped
[21:37:22] <The_8472> ah, yes
[21:37:26] <A9> (I believe that would make the most sense)
[21:37:48] <The_8472> if it's stopping it's not a partial seed anymore
[21:38:01] <The_8472> "it MUST send an event=paused parameter in every announce while it is a partial seed."
[21:45:56] <A9> Thanks, just thought I'd double check I wasn't crazy. :P
[21:52:43] <The_8472> alus, does anyone even read the emails to editor (at) bittorrent org?
[21:53:10] <alus> The_8472: hm. an excellent question
[21:53:22] <alus> I know Dave used to, but obviously not anymore
[21:53:30] <alus> The_8472: maybe email hydri about it
[21:53:33] <The_8472> because the BEP BEP states you should be sent there ^^
[21:53:46] <The_8472> new BEPs i mean
[21:53:53] <The_8472> i did and never got a response
[21:54:12] <hydri> The_8472: I have read that email, and it's starred.. (which mean I shouldn't forget about it)
[21:54:21] <hydri> sorry for the delay..
[21:54:38] <hydri> I'll try to put it up today.
[21:55:33] <The_8472> ^^
[21:55:49] * The_8472 just finished implementing it
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[22:03:48] <hydri> cool
[22:04:48] <The_8472> speaking of BEPs... alus, gogo... implement #32 :P
[22:09:23] * alus looks around for piles of money
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[22:10:51] * The_8472 makes cardboard boxes to live in out of dollar notes
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[22:36:02] <burris> here's the ISR for the sound card driver I'm using, I bet you can't guess what line its bombing out on:  http://codepad.org/yjcaGC37
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