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[01:22:27] <Koper`> Hi..
[01:23:24] <Koper`> How do private trackers work? They add some sort of information to the tracker URL.. For example, http://tracker.bittorrent.com/AAF22BA194C
[01:23:42] <Koper`> But how do they usually generate that info? It changes for each torrent, but it's always the same if I download the torrent twice
[01:24:12] <Koper`> Let's say that it's an hash of my password + the torrent id, for example, that would explain how it doesn't change.. But then, when I connect to the tracker, how can they reverse the hash?
[01:24:16] <Koper`> ie, how can they know who I am ?
[01:25:37] <TheSHAD0W> I think there are several ways they do it.
[01:25:59] <TheSHAD0W> There's no real standard for it.
[01:26:39] <Koper`> well, can you tell me just a couple of working examples ?
[01:27:24] <TheSHAD0W> Nope.
[01:27:37] <Koper`> Guess what I'm gonna ask next!
[01:27:49] <TheSHAD0W> It's not part of the BitTorrent spec, it's been kludged in by private tracker owners.
[01:27:59] <TheSHAD0W> We really don't have any details.
[01:29:11] <Koper`> Well the bittorrent spec itself is very ambiguous and not really formal, in fact from my understanding the real bittorrent protocol is dictated by what the clients do in the real world
[01:29:49] <TheSHAD0W> There are extensions that aren't very standard, but the base spec is fairly down pat.
[01:29:53] <TheSHAD0W> See bittorrent.org.
[01:35:19] <TheSHAD0W> Reboot!
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[01:37:30] <deltab> Koper`: it could be something like  torrent-id + user-id + hash(torrent-id + user-id)
[01:38:25] <Koper`> torrent id is the info_hash which is already part of the protocol
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[01:38:30] <Koper`> the user id is in there, then there is that hash
[01:38:45] <Koper`> it contains the password for sure, what i don't understand is how can it be different for each torrent
[01:39:01] <Koper`> Maybe it's something stupid like password_hash ^ info_hash (^ is XOR)
[01:39:24] <Koper`> security through obscurity, to avoid people taking the hash and using it for a different torrent
[01:39:45] <deltab> no need if you make the torrent id part of the hash
[01:40:16] <deltab> user-id + hash(torrent-id + user-id + secret)
[01:40:49] <Koper`> hm.. That actually makes sense
[01:40:50] <Koper`> Thanks
[01:41:13] <Koper`> This way if someone has the hash he/she cannot use it for another torrent
[01:41:52] <deltab> nor can they generate another hash without the secret
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[01:48:33] <deltab> Koper`: or to hide the user id, they can encrypt  torrent-id + user-id
[01:48:49] <deltab> and decrypt it when it's received
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[02:39:50] <Koper`> Anyways
[02:40:08] <Koper`> I tried to create a torrent tracker that actually always sends the same response, which is:
[02:40:10] <Koper`> d15:warning message39:this is an example of a warning message8:intervali10e12:min intervali5e8:completei1000e10:incompletei500ed7:peer id10:01234567892:ip9:127.0.0.94:porti6668eee
[02:40:20] <Koper`> uTorrent refuses it saying that it's invalid, I don't understand why
[02:40:58] <Koper`> oh, got it
[02:45:17] <Koper`> Anyways, this one SHOULD be correct: d15:warning message39:this is an example of a warning message8:intervali10e12:min intervali5e8:completei1000e10:incompletei500e5:peersd2:ip9:127.0.0.94:porti6668eee
[02:45:22] <Koper`> And yet it says it has no "peers" field
[02:46:17] <TheSHAD0W> peers should be a list or a string, not a dict.
[02:46:28] <TheSHAD0W> Actually, a list of dicts.
[02:49:16] <Koper`> OHH
[02:49:17] <Koper`> Thanks
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[02:49:31] <Koper`> I misread the spec..
[02:50:10] <Koper`> Also another thing, it says that in dictionaries keys must be sent in alphabetical order for some reason.. For example that example above would be invalid because the key "warning message" comes before "complete"
[02:50:25] <Koper`> Do i actually need to respect that? uTorrent doesn't complain
[02:50:35] <TheSHAD0W> You ought to.
[02:51:07] <Koper`> Bram Cohen was probably drunk that night
[02:51:08] <Koper`> =p
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[03:06:08] <The_8472> no, it has a purpose
[03:06:29] <The_8472> just because you don't understand it doesn't mean it's non-existent ^^
[03:07:25] <TheSHAD0W> It means bencode(bdecode(x)) == x.
[03:07:48] <TheSHAD0W> Which can be important when you're working with sha(x).
[03:10:34] <The_8472> shhh, you're giving all our secrets how to make clients non-breaky away!
[03:10:42] <klapaucjusz> Hmm, this means that my DHT is broken.
[03:13:58] <klapaucjusz> http://trac.transmissionbt.com/ticket/2767
[03:14:10] <klapaucjusz> I'm an idiot.
[03:19:53] <The_8472> most bdecoders are like browsers... trying to make sense of the garbage others send
[03:24:24] <klapaucjusz> It would actually take a particularly bloody-minded decoder to reject unsorted dictionaries.
[03:29:08] <The_8472> it's called enforcing standards. fail-fast behavior would have caused you to realize your issue far sooner
[03:29:23] <The_8472> but people somehow don't do fail fast
[03:29:58] <The_8472> because the others don't do it either, and so if you do it users come and complain "bwahhh, but client X can somehow handle it!"
[03:31:50] <The_8472> btw, aren't you using transmission's bencoder?
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[03:40:36] <The_8472> hah, ipv4 is drawing its last breaths. the ICANN is freeing up some reserved address blocks ^.^
[03:40:36] <klapaucj1sz> No, I'm not using Transmission's bencoder.
[03:41:03] <klapaucj1sz> The DHT is a stand-alone library, which is used by Transmission, Hekate, and by the standalone binary.
[03:41:14] <klapaucj1sz> So it has its own bencode formatter and parser.
[03:41:18] <klapaucj1sz> Both of which are buggy.
[03:41:34] <klapaucj1sz> Link?
[03:42:04] <The_8472> http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5735
[03:44:01] <klapaucj1sz> Hmm.
[03:44:29] <klapaucj1sz> I don't see where it says that.
[03:44:49] <klapaucj1sz> Class E is still reserved.
[03:46:00] <klapaucj1sz> 223.255.255.0/24 is no longer reserved, but that's just a /24.
[03:46:40] <klapaucj1sz> Ah, nets 14, 24, 39 and 128.
[03:46:52] <klapaucj1sz> 14, at least, is old news.
[03:47:15] <The_8472> 14.0.0.0/8, 128.0.0.0/16, 191.255.0.0/16, 223.255.255.0./24, 24.0.0.0/8, 39.0.0.0/8 are freed now
[03:48:00] * klapaucj1sz is tempted to make a Slashdot submission.
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[03:50:30] <TheSHAD0W> Should.
[04:04:50] <klapaucjusz> http://ipv6.pastebin.com/d52ade66b
[04:06:00] <klapaucjusz> Imprimatur?
[04:06:31] <TheSHAD0W> That'll work.
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[04:08:38] <klapaucjusz> Done.
[04:09:05] <TheSHAD0W> Found and kicked.
[04:09:21] <deltab> Koper`: requiring the same order means that two encoders, given the same input, will produce the same output
[04:11:15] <deltab> so they'll have the same hash
[04:11:42] <deltab> ... as TheSHAD0W mentioned
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[14:12:45] <Koper`> I have another question
[14:13:10] <Koper`> Compressing the HTML response of the tracker with gzip is probably counter productive right?
[14:13:47] <Koper`> Since the long part of the message is the list of peers, which is in "compact" mode, ie 4 byte for the ip and 2 for the port.. Compressing that costs CPU and probably will only reduce its size by 1-2%
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[14:19:17] <kjetilho> depends on what your limited resource is, I guess
[14:23:33] <DWKnight> tracker announce replies aren't html
[14:25:07] <DWKnight> some trackers will attempt to gzip replies and will only send replies gzipped when there is actual benefit to do so
[14:25:16] <DWKnight> bandwidth-wise anyway
[14:28:00] <DWKnight> even P3-500 generation systems have enough cpu to gzip responses like that
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[14:47:10] <Koper`> I meant HTTP not HTML
[14:48:52] <DWKnight> the rest of what I said still applies
[14:49:18] <DWKnight> considering where the current bottlenecks lie, it's trivial to gzip when appropriate
[14:51:24] <DWKnight> I personally consider "when appropriate" to be "when you actually compress beyond the difference in headers
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[15:34:52] <The_8472> using minimal http headers can probably save more space in many cases
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[17:51:35] <phpwner> why my torrents not download? open ports and tracker updating
[17:51:42] <phpwner> plenty of seeders
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